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Perki-Perk
12-31-2012, 12:41 PM
Has anyone else noticed the body language of most of the players, with the exception of JJ Watt and K Jax, and maybe a couple of others?

To me, and it may just be me, it seems they have given up on their coaches.

I have to imagine, as it's frustrating for fans, they players have to be tired of the 3rd and long draws and screens, the not going for it on fourth when trailing, and the overall bad playcalling.

As a business manager, I would think Mr. McNair would have to look at that as well as the bigger picture and not just the record.

Will one and done this year be acceptable to Mr. McNair?

Will he still think we are on the right track?

I have tried to stick with Kubiak and Shaub...but they just don't seem to be the ones that can get us over the hump.

For the last 10 years, I didn't expect much as a fan, but I still had a great time rooting and enjoyed our wins. For the last 3, it has just been heartbreaking. We have the talent, I know this for certain, but we are missing some key ingredients to be a contender. Heart, intensity, and even courage seem to be lacking on 70% of the team.

I know these players used to play their hearts out for Kubes...but it just doesn't look or feel that way anymore.

I hope Bob McNair makes the right decision if we get bounced from the first round this year and realized he needs to capitalize on his current stock of assets and find better management.

Thoughts?

amazing80
12-31-2012, 12:45 PM
Honestly when I watch I see the offensive players disgusted with the play calling and the qb play...the expressions by Aj and Foster are clear as day to me

Perki-Perk
12-31-2012, 01:38 PM
Honestly when I watch I see the offensive players disgusted with the play calling and the qb play...the expressions by Aj and Foster are clear as day to me

See, I notice that too. It's like they are in the huddle and Shaub calls the play and they trot out all depressed, like, "Really?"

You also notice, that when something big is drawn up, they come out more excited. You can see it in their body language.

I also think the defense has gotten to the point to where they are trying to force that fumble or make the big play everytime because of our offensive ineptitude, which is why they've looked subpar.

There is something mentally wrong with this team right now and it starts at the top.

I think they "Kubiak ass chwing" was a farce, and never really happened." He's so, "Aw Shucks" and it sickens me when it comes to coaching. I'd love to keep Kubiak and Wade as coordinators, but it'd be demoralizing to for Kubes to get demoted, but may be a wake up call. If I was McNair, I would have Have swapped Wade and Kubiak's responsibilities after the New England blow out.

We have gotten this way as a society though, where we except mediocrity and how dare you call out failure or you are not a fan at all. It's sad, but that's where we're headed as a country, and as a people.

texanhead08
12-31-2012, 01:41 PM
When is the last time the defense forced a turnover other than the one we had taken away yesterday.

thunderkyss
12-31-2012, 01:43 PM
:tinfoil:

mike moffat
12-31-2012, 01:51 PM
Everything here is true. Kube needs a phone call today. Don't wait to lose next Saturday.

texanhead08
12-31-2012, 01:52 PM
Demps got benched for giving up a big play in the last Colts game, and he did the same **** yesterday.

thunderkyss
12-31-2012, 01:56 PM
Demps got benched for giving up a big play in the last Colts game, and he did the same **** yesterday.

He's got to be getting a kick-back. If he ends up on the Colts next year (ala Jacoby Jones), I swear I'm going to blow a gasket.

srrono
12-31-2012, 02:02 PM
1 thing I have noticed as far as our DEF drop off is guys are not running to the ball. I see a lot of guys standing watching others make plays. At the start of the season it seemed like everyone was running to the ball. Group tackling all the time, now 1 guy misses a tackle its a long gain with guys just watching.

Say Watt
12-31-2012, 02:15 PM
Honestly when I watch I see the offensive players disgusted with the play calling and the qb play...the expressions by Aj and Foster are clear as day to me

Agree completely. Rep to you and the OP as well.

I was telling my friends the same thing yesterday. They just look totally deflated like they know what Kubiak is doing isn't going to work. I don't remember when it was, or even what quarter, but I remember there being a running play on 1st or 2nd down and the defense had stacked the box. Everyone and their mother KNEW the Texans were running the football. There was no question about it. And just the way the offense ran, it looked like they were in slow motion just running through the motions knowing the play would fail. Schaub couldn't audible out of it (because apparently he isn't allowed to) and sure enough Arian was stopped for a loss. It was pathetic.

So yeah, I agree. This team has quit IMO, but our team is full of choir boys who won't stand up and say anything.

Say Watt
12-31-2012, 02:17 PM
1 thing I have noticed as far as our DEF drop off is guys are not running to the ball. I see a lot of guys standing watching others make plays. At the start of the season it seemed like everyone was running to the ball. Group tackling all the time, now 1 guy misses a tackle its a long gain with guys just watching.

I might be doing the same thing if I was risking life and limb for a coach that doesn't even have enough faith in his team to watch a ****ing field goal.

DX-TEX
12-31-2012, 02:19 PM
Agree completely. Rep to you and the OP as well.

I was telling my friends the same thing yesterday. They just look totally deflated like they know what Kubiak is doing isn't going to work. I don't remember when it was, or even what quarter, but I remember there being a running play on 1st or 2nd down and the defense had stacked the box. Everyone and their mother KNEW the Texans were running the football. There was no question about it. And just the way the offense ran, it looked like they were in slow motion just running through the motions knowing the play would fail. Schaub couldn't audible out of it (because apparently he isn't allowed to) and sure enough Arian was stopped for a loss. It was pathetic.

So yeah, I agree. This team has quit IMO, but our team is full of choir boys who won't stand up and say anything.

Goes hand in hand with Lance Z latest:

http://blog.chron.com/fantasyfootball/2012/12/the-offense-is-very-much-broken-and-kubiak-cant-rely-on-the-system-he-has-to-fix-it/

When the Texans had a ground game and defense like they had last year, they could simply impose their will on the Bengals and even the Ravens in the playoffs. T.J. Yates wasn’t ready to win on the road in Baltimore, but the Texans did what they needed to on both sides of the ball thanks to the ground game and the defense. Those elements aren’t the same this year so the entire idea of “imposing your will” has to be shelved. It’s no longer about “the system,” coach. It’s about putting the pieces together and crafting a gameplan that causes concern on that other sideline.

Hervoyel
12-31-2012, 02:20 PM
When is the last time the defense forced a turnover other than the one we had taken away yesterday.

Ok, when was the last time the offense got out in front of somebody and made the other teams offense start taking chances to get back in a game? Find an opportunistic defense and they're usually playing for a team that's playing from in front. As we stopped getting all over people from the opening kickoff we stopped getting as many turnovers. Conversely as we began falling behind in games suddenly we were the ones getting taken advantage of in this regard.

Say Watt
12-31-2012, 02:21 PM
Goes hand in hand with Lance Z latest:

http://blog.chron.com/fantasyfootball/2012/12/the-offense-is-very-much-broken-and-kubiak-cant-rely-on-the-system-he-has-to-fix-it/

Rep to you. That is a fantastic read. Honestly, I think LZ would make a better head coach than Gary Kubiak.

Wolf6151
12-31-2012, 02:39 PM
McNair needs to have a come to Jesus meeting with Kubiak today. He needs to stick his foot up Kube's ass.

markn
12-31-2012, 02:41 PM
This is a great thread with a very good post to start it off. LZ's blog entry linked above is also very illuminating. Kudos.

As a business manager, I would think Mr. McNair would have to look at that as well as the bigger picture and not just the record.

Will one and done this year be acceptable to Mr. McNair?

Will he still think we are on the right track?


I think the answers to those questions are partly addressed by the preceding statement. Bob is a business manager; and regardless of how we feel about the current regime he's got to be happy with the way the business is going: full stadium, waiting list for season tickets, merchandise through the roof and one of the most highly rated franchises by value in world sport. I know Mr McNair says all the right things in public about wanting a championship team, but I don't think he's going to risk everything else he's got by making radical changes to a successful business.

Say Watt
12-31-2012, 02:47 PM
Ok, when was the last time the offense got out in front of somebody and made the other teams offense start taking chances to get back in a game? Find an opportunistic defense and they're usually playing for a team that's playing from in front. As we stopped getting all over people from the opening kickoff we stopped getting as many turnovers. Conversely as we began falling behind in games suddenly we were the ones getting taken advantage of in this regard.

Nailed it again, Herv. You are exactly correct. Too many people just look at stats instead of watching football games. Most turnovers are a result of offenses getting too risky. And how do you make offenses get risky? By putting the freaking ball in the freaking end zone!

We aren't getting turnovers because we simply aren't scoring the football. Teams are able to play conservative most of the game because they know eventually this team is going to give up a big play or two and our offense can't score to save their lives.

Simply pathetic.

GuerillaBlack
12-31-2012, 02:49 PM
Agree completely. Rep to you and the OP as well.

I was telling my friends the same thing yesterday. They just look totally deflated like they know what Kubiak is doing isn't going to work. I don't remember when it was, or even what quarter, but I remember there being a running play on 1st or 2nd down and the defense had stacked the box. Everyone and their mother KNEW the Texans were running the football. There was no question about it. And just the way the offense ran, it looked like they were in slow motion just running through the motions knowing the play would fail. Schaub couldn't audible out of it (because apparently he isn't allowed to) and sure enough Arian was stopped for a loss. It was pathetic.

So yeah, I agree. This team has quit IMO, but our team is full of choir boys who won't stand up and say anything.

Yeah their expresions were pretty bad. Especially the one where AJ facepalmed and OD was also looking all confused. The body language has been terrible since the NE game. The last time I have seen this team all smiles was the Thanksgiving game. Everyone looks pissed off, on both offense and defense. Kubiak is a crappy playcaller. Its so easy to call out the plays when you watch them since they are so predictable. I don't know if Schaub isn't allowed to audible, or just isn't capable, too. It was pretty sad seeing a rookie audible out of plays and carve the defense up a bit.

Perki-Perk
12-31-2012, 02:55 PM
Yeah their expresions were pretty bad. Especially the one where AJ facepalmed and OD was also looking all confused. The body language has been terrible since the NE game. The last time I have seen this team all smiles was the Thanksgiving game. Everyone looks pissed off, on both offense and defense. Kubiak is a crappy playcaller. Its so easy to call out the plays when you watch them since they are so predictable. I don't know if Schaub isn't allowed to audible, or just isn't capable, too. It was pretty sad seeing a rookie audible out of plays and carve the defense up a bit.

I think what really sold me on it was when AJ just let the ball sail through his arms. I had my feelings, had my beliefs but the fan in me kept overlooking them. When AJ non chalantly attempted to catch that sure fire TD, I just knew this team was done playing for Kubiak. Being a "contender" and then being blown out by the likes of Rodgers and Brady because of coaching ineptitude has to be disheartening.

I've also seen some terrible to almost biased officiating against the Texans since the Lions game. Some of it has been downright terrible. I'll have to watch again with out my battle red glasses on, but I don't think the league fancies the Texans much.

Say Watt
12-31-2012, 02:58 PM
Yeah their expresions were pretty bad. Especially the one where AJ facepalmed and OD was also looking all confused. The body language has been terrible since the NE game. The last time I have seen this team all smiles was the Thanksgiving game. Everyone looks pissed off, on both offense and defense. Kubiak is a crappy playcaller. Its so easy to call out the plays when you watch them since they are so predictable. I don't know if Schaub isn't allowed to audible, or just isn't capable, too. It was pretty sad seeing a rookie audible out of plays and carve the defense up a bit.

Agreed. Rep to you as well.

I just don't understand what McNair isn't seeing. He obviously must really hate football, because there is no way he has been watching this team the last few years.

Go research my posts. You might also have to look under the name ckw, but I have been calling for Kubiak's head since 8-8 round 2. The guy simply does not have "it". He is too busy staring at his playbook hoping for that "eureka" moment that never comes. I got back on the bandwagon to be a good Texans fan midway through last season. I figured ok, all Kubiak needed was a good defensive coach. I'll give him a chance.

So surely now that we have a great defensive coach, surely the offense is going to keep playing well, putting up 25 per game, and we would be a legit Super Bowl contender. Wrong!!!

Same problems. Defense quit playing out of their mind and what does the offense do? Nothing.

This team has given up on Gary. Now it is time Bob does the same thing.

Say Watt
12-31-2012, 03:01 PM
I think what really sold me on it was when AJ just let the ball sail through his arms. I had my feelings, had my beliefs but the fan in me kept overlooking them. When AJ non chalantly attempted to catch that sure fire TD, I just knew this team was done playing for Kubiak. Being a "contender" and then being blown out by the likes of Rodgers and Brady because of coaching ineptitude has to be disheartening.

I've also seen some terrible to almost biased officiating against the Texans since the Lions game. Some of it has been downright terrible. I'll have to watch again with out my battle red glasses on, but I don't think the league fancies the Texans much.

What makes me the maddest is the talent on this football team on BOTH SIDES of the ball. Arian, AJ, OD, Watt, JoJo, Kareem, Manning, Barwin (at least he looked talented last year and before the injury two years ago), Duane Brown, Myers, Antonio, etc.

What has happened? Well, the OP told us what happened, and I couldn't agree more.

thunderkyss
12-31-2012, 03:03 PM
McNair needs to have a come to Jesus meeting with Kubiak today. He needs to stick his foot up Kube's ass.

So I've been saying for years, that Kubiak is only part of a group think here. He doesn't make decisions, he influences the group. Probably wins out most of the time. But it's always "their" decision.

With that in mind; knowing Gary, McNair, Rick, & Cal (probably Wade as well, I don't know) get together every morning & talk about this team, what could Gary have possibly been telling him these last 9 weeks.

I think Bob is as savy as we are, he knows more about football than he had in the past. I'm sure he had questions about the Texans declining performance despite our wins.

Surely, Kubiak talked about some of the injury issues & pointed out that we're getting some of the young guys ready for the play-offs. Ben Jones, Derek Newton, Brandon Brooks.... defensively, I have to believe he fell on the sword there, like he should. This offense needs to start fast, score early & often for the defense to do what they were put together to do.

But over the last three weeks, surely Gary told Bob that we would win 2 of the three.

So McNair is going to ask him what happened & what is he going to do to fix it by Saturday.

What could Gary possibly tell him?

Perki-Perk
12-31-2012, 03:04 PM
Agreed. Rep to you as well.

I just don't understand what McNair isn't seeing. He obviously must really hate football, because there is no way he has been watching this team the last few years.

Go research my posts. You might also have to look under the name ckw, but I have been calling for Kubiak's head since 8-8 round 2. The guy simply does not have "it". He is too busy staring at his playbook hoping for that "eureka" moment that never comes. I got back on the bandwagon to be a good Texans fan midway through last season. I figured ok, all Kubiak needed was a good defensive coach. I'll give him a chance.

So surely now that we have a great defensive coach, surely the offense is going to keep playing well, putting up 25 per game, and we would be a legit Super Bowl contender. Wrong!!!

Same problems. Defense quit playing out of their mind and what does the offense do? Nothing.

This team has given up on Gary. Now it is time Bob does the same thing.

Kubiak, Shaub, Marciano and Dennison must go. I don't even know what Dennison does. Is he just there because the team is supposed to have an OC?

TJ Yates is NOT the answer either. I'm glad many of you Yates fans are not talent evaluators. The kids got spunk, but the rest of his game is junk.

Keenum went undrafted for a reason, so don't even go there.

We need to look at QB in one of the first 2 rounds next year, get a new coach in here, keep Shaub another year (since I believe it was 2 years guaranteed anyway) and then go from there. If I was AJ, I'd be pissed. He is such a class act and loyal dude. One of my favorite Houston Sports stars next to Hakeem and Biggio of all time. Dre deserves better and dammit, Houston fans deserve better! If we don't get it together, Watt might walk at the end of his rookie contract. I'd hate to see that because that boy is growing on me too!

Perki-Perk
12-31-2012, 03:04 PM
What makes me the maddest is the talent on this football team on BOTH SIDES of the ball. Arian, AJ, OD, Watt, JoJo, Kareem, Manning, Barwin (at least he looked talented last year and before the injury two years ago), Duane Brown, Myers, Antonio, etc.

What has happened? Well, the OP told us what happened, and I couldn't agree more.

I am the OP...I think...lol

MEGA SWATT
12-31-2012, 03:14 PM
Sadly, winning in the postseason is not needed to have a profitable franchise. It's obvious that McNair is running this literally as a business. As long as the franchise is profitable, gaining value each year and is employing great, hard working individuals like Kubiak, Phillips, our GM Smith and all the players - why mess with success? What part of "12-4 is better than last year" do you not understand?? This is his mindset.

It's obvious McNair does NOT really care about winning because he is NOT willing to make the hard decisions to catapult the Texans into a feared, legit team that can beat teams like GB, NE and close out a team like the vikings or colts to get HFA.

Say Watt
12-31-2012, 03:15 PM
Kubiak, Shaub, Marciano and Dennison must go. I don't even know what Dennison does. Is he just there because the team is supposed to have an OC?

TJ Yates is NOT the answer either. I'm glad many of you Yates fans are not talent evaluators. The kids got spunk, but the rest of his game is junk.

Keenum went undrafted for a reason, so don't even go there.

We need to look at QB in one of the first 2 rounds next year, get a new coach in here, keep Shaub another year (since I believe it was 2 years guaranteed anyway) and then go from there. If I was AJ, I'd be pissed. He is such a class act and loyal dude. One of my favorite Houston Sports stars next to Hakeem and Biggio of all time. Dre deserves better and dammit, Houston fans deserve better! If we don't get it together, Watt might walk at the end of his rookie contract. I'd hate to see that because that boy is growing on me too!

Were the Yates and Keenum comments direct at me? Because I have NEVER (at least I think never) made a comment in favor of either Yates or Keenum starting over Schaub. We'd be worse off with either of them IMO.

Other than that, I agree with the rest of your post.

Say Watt
12-31-2012, 03:16 PM
Sadly, winning in the postseason is not needed to have a profitable franchise. It's obvious that McNair is running this literally as a business. As long as the franchise is profitable, gaining value each year and is employing great, hard working individuals like Kubiak, Phillips, our GM Smith and all the players - why mess with sucess? What part of "12-4 is better than last year" do you not understand?? This is his mindset.

It's obvious McNair does NOT really care about winning because he is NOT willing to make the hard decisions to catapult the Texans into a feared, legit team that can beat teams like GB, NE and close out a team like the vikings or colts to get HFA.

I have felt like this for about 4 or 5 years now. I called him Dollar Bob for a while because of this. Due to recent success, I had relented on my criticism of McNair and Kubes but if we lose on Saturday, it will most certainly be making a comeback. I've had enough.

Perki-Perk
12-31-2012, 05:04 PM
Were the Yates and Keenum comments direct at me? Because I have NEVER (at least I think never) made a comment in favor of either Yates or Keenum starting over Schaub. We'd be worse off with either of them IMO.

Other than that, I agree with the rest of your post.

No, the Keenum and Yates statements were just in general. I replied to you simply for supporting data.

Perki-Perk
12-31-2012, 05:10 PM
Sadly, winning in the postseason is not needed to have a profitable franchise. It's obvious that McNair is running this literally as a business. As long as the franchise is profitable, gaining value each year and is employing great, hard working individuals like Kubiak, Phillips, our GM Smith and all the players - why mess with success? What part of "12-4 is better than last year" do you not understand?? This is his mindset.

It's obvious McNair does NOT really care about winning because he is NOT willing to make the hard decisions to catapult the Texans into a feared, legit team that can beat teams like GB, NE and close out a team like the vikings or colts to get HFA.

I don't know. I would think a man of McNair's stature and him seeing so much success that he would know a frozen iceberg of pooh when he sees it. I was fine with him keeping Kubiak after the 6-10 season because of the short offseason, etc and after last year it seems we all forgave Kubiak his shortcomings and made the fact that we were down to our 3rd string QB the scape goat of our failures. Now, with our starter in there and only ONE major injury, what is the excuse? What could the problem be outside of a mediocre coach taking advantage of a fairly weak schedule?

The team has lost confidence in his ability to call a game and it is quite evident. Some of them are just Bulls and will continue to go all in, but when a stellar athlete/person like AJ has seemingly given up, that is VERY telling of how the players feel about Kubiak and the coaching staff.

I don't think the D has given up on Wade, I think the D is trying to make too much happen, however, it is extremely disheartening that our OLB's don't get to the QB more with JJ getting double and triple teamed...

I don't know, I'm depressed right now and sick with a terrible loss hangover. Winning cures all they say, but the way it's been going for 7 weeks, I don't see us winning against other playoff caliber teams.

We need change (queue the Obama metaphors), but a good change. We need a respected coach that can light a fire.

People will ask questions if we fire a head coach after a 12-4 season, but if they have an oodle of knowledge about football, the question should be, "Why not sooner?"

Say Watt
12-31-2012, 05:20 PM
I don't know. I would think a man of McNair's stature and him seeing so much success that he would know a frozen iceberg of pooh when he sees it. I was fine with him keeping Kubiak after the 6-10 season because of the short offseason, etc and after last year it seems we all forgave Kubiak his shortcomings and made the fact that we were down to our 3rd string QB the scape goat of our failures. Now, with our starter in there and only ONE major injury, what is the excuse? What could the problem be outside of a mediocre coach taking advantage of a fairly weak schedule?

The team has lost confidence in his ability to call a game and it is quite evident. Some of them are just Bulls and will continue to go all in, but when a stellar athlete/person like AJ has seemingly given up, that is VERY telling of how the players feel about Kubiak and the coaching staff.

I don't think the D has given up on Wade, I think the D is trying to make too much happen, however, it is extremely disheartening that our OLB's don't get to the QB more with JJ getting double and triple teamed...

I don't know, I'm depressed right now and sick with a terrible loss hangover. Winning cures all they say, but the way it's been going for 7 weeks, I don't see us winning against other playoff caliber teams.

We need change (queue the Obama metaphors), but a good change. We need a respected coach that can light a fire.

People will ask questions if we fire a head coach after a 12-4 season, but if they have an oodle of knowledge about football, the question should be, "Why not sooner?"

I thought the short off-season was last yeah aka our first playoff season.

IMO, there was absolutely zero reason to keep Kubiak after the 6-10 season and if we lose against the Bengals at home, he should be fired this season. I know it is extremely unlikely to happen, but that doesn't mean it shouldn't.

handswarmer
12-31-2012, 05:30 PM
Different city, different board,....


same ingorance....:mariopalm:

GP
12-31-2012, 05:33 PM
I don't think McNair "knows" football.

Seriously.

I think he enjoys the pageantry surrounding it, and certainly the $$$.

But the in-depth ins and outs? He doesn't have it. And his GM is (drum roll please...) a FOK'er. Friend of Kubiak.

JJ Watt has maybe actually set this team BACK because without him, we would have cratered. There is no bigger fan of Watt than Smithiak.

Perki-Perk
12-31-2012, 05:36 PM
I thought the short off-season was last yeah aka our first playoff season.

IMO, there was absolutely zero reason to keep Kubiak after the 6-10 season and if we lose against the Bengals at home, he should be fired this season. I know it is extremely unlikely to happen, but that doesn't mean it shouldn't.

I didn't think I alluded to anything different... 2010 6-10, 2011 10-6, 2012 12-4, so 2012...4-12??? j/k

Yes, If we get bounced in the wild card game after winning it with a 3rd string QB last year...I hope Uncle Bob Smells something fishy...and that fishy smell...would be the rotting turd that the Texans leave on the field. IMO, anything less than the AFC Championship should be considered utter failure since, afterall, that is what we play for.

As far as that Raven fan that posted in here, your team ain't squat either and y'all have issues too. Some people are delirious and some are delusional, but at some point you either take your head out of the sand, realize your team has problems and call for them to be fixed.

Say Watt
12-31-2012, 05:45 PM
I didn't think I alluded to anything different... 2010 6-10, 2011 10-6, 2012 12-4, so 2012...4-12??? j/k

Yes, If we get bounced in the wild card game after winning it with a 3rd string QB last year...I hope Uncle Bob Smells something fishy...and that fishy smell...would be the rotting turd that the Texans leave on the field. IMO, anything less than the AFC Championship should be considered utter failure since, afterall, that is what we play for.

As far as that Raven fan that posted in here, your team ain't squat either and y'all have issues too. Some people are delirious and some are delusional, but at some point you either take your head out of the sand, realize your team has problems and call for them to be fixed.

My bad. I misread what you posted. I thought you were saying the shortened off-season was the reason for us going 6-10.

PhilpW
12-31-2012, 05:53 PM
The aggressive play calling has vanished. If we can't run Arian or Andre is covered, we're done offensively. Where are the throws to OD, and we don't even try to get another WR involved. This is not a talent issue any more. Schaub has concerns, but we don't attack teams like we did early in the year.

SheTexan
12-31-2012, 06:01 PM
I think what really sold me on it was when AJ just let the ball sail through his arms. I had my feelings, had my beliefs but the fan in me kept overlooking them. When AJ non chalantly attempted to catch that sure fire TD, I just knew this team was done playing for Kubiak. Being a "contender" and then being blown out by the likes of Rodgers and Brady because of coaching ineptitude has to be disheartening.

I've also seen some terrible to almost biased officiating against the Texans since the Lions game. Some of it has been downright terrible. I'll have to watch again with out my battle red glasses on, but I don't think the league fancies the Texans much.

Really????? You truly think AJ missed catching that ball because he was DONE playing for Kubiak?? Sorry, but that's just laughable! I've never been a huge Kubes fan, but, I've read MANY, MANY articles about how much the team backs him, and wants him to stay here. Besides, AJ would never hurt the team by deliberately, "non chalantly," not trying to catch a ball. That's not his style, and an insult to him as a player and a person!! JMO! The rest of your post I agree with, esp the officiating part. OD and Posey had so many players on them I thought they had sticky glue on their jerseys!!

thunderkyss
12-31-2012, 06:56 PM
:tinfoil:

This "players having no confidence" thing is growing legs. Pretty soon, you're going to convince yourselves of that.

I've been listening to our players all day & none of them has said anything to make me believe what is going around in this thread. I saw nothing to make me believe what you guys are selling.

:tinfoil:

You're only fooling yourselves.

Perki-Perk
12-31-2012, 07:28 PM
Really????? You truly think AJ missed catching that ball because he was DONE playing for Kubiak?? Sorry, but that's just laughable! I've never been a huge Kubes fan, but, I've read MANY, MANY articles about how much the team backs him, and wants him to stay here. Besides, AJ would never hurt the team by deliberately, "non chalantly," not trying to catch a ball. That's not his style, and an insult to him as a player and a person!! JMO! The rest of your post I agree with, esp the officiating part. OD and Posey had so many players on them I thought they had sticky glue on their jerseys!!

I've read those same articles, but I respectfully disagree. AJ catches that pass 999 times out of 999. He is that good and he is a person of amazing character, I've said somewhere else, one of my favorite Houston sports people along with Hakeem and Biggio. I don't think he "deliberately" missed the pass, and I don't think he didn't try on purpose, but sometimes, you just become mentally exhausted when you are trying to play for someone you just don't believe in anymore even though you've given your best shot time and again. There is a look of hopelessness on the Texans and it scares the crap out of me. It's something I have never seen, at least not that it was notable enough for me to remember.

Perki-Perk
12-31-2012, 07:32 PM
:tinfoil:

This "players having no confidence" thing is growing legs. Pretty soon, you're going to convince yourselves of that.

I've been listening to our players all day & none of them has said anything to make me believe what is going around in this thread. I saw nothing to make me believe what you guys are selling.

:tinfoil:

You're only fooling yourselves.

You must have been watching the last 2 Cowboys games then were they at least put up a fight...And I can't stand those bastards...but there's no way you watched Texans football and thought, "Wow! These guys are just putting forth max effort!"

Lucky
12-31-2012, 07:32 PM
AJ drops balls sometimes. He makes up for it with a big play, usually. I don't believe he's quit for a second. I don't think anyone has quit. But, there is a lot of frustration on both sides of the ball. That bye week would have been golden in that it would've give this team a little mini-camp to work through issues.

Perki-Perk
12-31-2012, 07:36 PM
AJ drops balls sometimes. He makes up for it with a big play, usually. I don't believe he's quit for a second. I don't think anyone has quit. But, there is a lot of frustration on both sides of the ball. That bye week would have been golden in that it would've give this team a little mini-camp to work through issues.

It could just be the hangover from the Loss...but I don't believe I've ever seen AJ drop something that easy to catch and that huge. One of Matt's best passes I've seen and he whiffs?? Either AJ is not the AJ we think he is, or there is something amiss down on Kirby and I know DAMN WELL that AJ is the best receiver in the league. If AJ had a QB like Stafford, there'd be no question. He constantly has to slow down to catch the long ball and then fight off the defender for the reception. AJ would have probably had a couple seasons close to 2000 yards. Even when Cotton Shaub was putting up 4500 yards a few years back, he still never really had arm strength. I mean work out your damn triceps or something..geez.

thunderkyss
12-31-2012, 07:37 PM
You must have been watching the last 2 Cowboys games then were they at least put up a fight...And I can't stand those bastards...but there's no way you watched Texans football and thought, "Wow! These guys are just putting forth max effort!"

Two plays swing our way & we win that game. Then this "effort" argument would have to wait for another day. I watched our defense contain AD like no one's done all year, especially not recently. & I watched Andre, Arian, Antonio, Kj, & Jj Watt play excellent games yesterday.

Can't tell me we lost because of effort, or because they've lost confidence in their coach.

The taking on the personality of their coach has more stick'um than this.

SheTexan
12-31-2012, 07:53 PM
Everybody in the flippin NFL wanted the Colts to win yesterday!! They LOVE to exploit a "feel good" story and, with no disrespect to Chuck Phangeo (sp), there was NO WAY IN HELL we were coming out of that game with a win!! We should have taken care of business against the Vikes, which IMHO was an easier team to beat. I've watched every damn game the Texans have ever played, and I'm not sure I've ever seen as many MISSED calls as I saw yesterday. I'm not blaming the refs entirely on our loss, but, I'm not sure that loss wasn't written in the books before the game was even played. WHY would Chuckie come back with ONE game left in the season, not a pressure game either, if not for an end of year FEEL GOOD story the NFL thrives on!! We were doomed before the game started.

handswarmer
12-31-2012, 08:44 PM
As far as that Raven fan that posted in here, your team ain't squat either and y'all have issues too. Some people are delirious and some are delusional, but at some point you either take your head out of the sand, realize your team has problems and call for them to be fixed.

Never said they were; you misunderstood my post.

Eleboration> Every fan base is calling for heads right now; now is not the time to panic. Sure I know the weaknesses of my team (Ravens) and I do not propose that all of these things will magically disappear.

The Texans have been playing poorly lately- the defense has been abused a couple of games in a row. Schaub is not playing with confidence- pressured he pulls into a shell. Kubiak has adjusted the playcalling because of this.

That being said, you have to dance with the one that brung ya.

handswarmer
12-31-2012, 08:45 PM
Everybody in the flippin NFL wanted the Colts to win yesterday!! They LOVE to exploit a "feel good" story and, with no disrespect to Chuck Phangeo (sp), there was NO WAY IN HELL we were coming out of that game with a win!! We should have taken care of business against the Vikes, which IMHO was an easier team to beat. I've watched every damn game the Texans have ever played, and I'm not sure I've ever seen as many MISSED calls as I saw yesterday. I'm not blaming the refs entirely on our loss, but, I'm not sure that loss wasn't written in the books before the game was even played. WHY would Chuckie come back with ONE game left in the season, not a pressure game either, if not for an end of year FEEL GOOD story the NFL thrives on!! We were doomed before the game started.

this has to be the funniest post I've read on here...

Say Watt
12-31-2012, 09:27 PM
I'd just like to clarify something.

I don't think much of anyone has knowingly quit on Kubiak. That is one great thing about the choir boy mentality of this team. They don't quit. But I do think they have lost faith. I honestly don't believe that they still believe in Kubiak and what he is doing. Sure, they like him plenty. How could you not? He IS a player's coach. But he is not the leader this team needs. Everyone knows the definition of stupidity is doing the same things and expecting different results. At least on offense, all we have done is the same things.

Honestly, how could the players have not lost faith by now?

Perki-Perk
12-31-2012, 09:48 PM
I'd just like to clarify something.

I don't think much of anyone has knowingly quit on Kubiak. That is one great thing about the choir boy mentality of this team. They don't quit. But I do think they have lost faith. I honestly don't believe that they still believe in Kubiak and what he is doing. Sure, they like him plenty. How could you not? He IS a player's coach. But he is not the leader this team needs. Everyone knows the definition of stupidity is doing the same things and expecting different results. At least on offense, all we have done is the same things.

Honestly, how could the players have not lost faith by now?

To further clarify, the "quit" is, to me, more of a subconscious thing. I don't think there was a secret team meeting..don't think there ever is. You know how it happens. A couple people in a private conversation questioning play calling, etc, then next thing you know one of those guys is talking to another about it. Before you know it you've become mentally drowned with negativity and voices of dissension that not even a good pep talk can clear up. The only way to fix that kind of mind set is a new culture and imo the only way to establish a new culture is by bringing in new leadership.

handswarmer
12-31-2012, 09:51 PM
Please... teams that are going to the playoffs dont "quit" on coaches....

2-14 Chiefs teams quit....Jets quit....Jags diod too....

Dishman
12-31-2012, 10:12 PM
Please... teams that are going to the playoffs dont "quit" on coaches....

2-14 Chiefs teams quit....Jets quit....Jags diod too....

Right. I don't think anyone's quit. They're just lost as hell right now. Kubiak's got to do some soul searching and find a way to get things back on track.

ObsiWan
12-31-2012, 10:28 PM
Goes hand in hand with Lance Z latest:

http://blog.chron.com/fantasyfootball/2012/12/the-offense-is-very-much-broken-and-kubiak-cant-rely-on-the-system-he-has-to-fix-it/

Thanks for the link. And Lance is definitely on point right here...

Matt Schaub has saved his worst football of the year for the end of the season. Right now, he is playing football like the guy at the Let It Ride table in Las Vegas who is playing $5 per hand. You know that guy doesn’t bet enough to win big. He won’t go completely broke because he won’t risk that last $20 bill in his pocket, but you also know that all he’s doing is killing time. He’s not really gambling to win. That’s what Schaub feels like to me right now.

The running game and the offensive line issues can’t be fixed right now. Kubiak and his crew can run more toss plays or they can run more of their gap plays, but the outside zone game, the Texans’ bread-and-butter, just isn’t going to get it done this year. This offensive line is nowhere near as effective as last year’s group was and a talent infusion is needed at two and maybe three spots. That can’t be fixed in-season, but it can be managed. Maximizing the team’s strengths and minimizing their weaknesses is on Gary Kubiak’s shoulders now and he has to rise to the occasion and find a way to win a hand with 9-10 suited.

mike moffat
01-01-2013, 12:33 AM
The aggressive play calling has vanished. If we can't run Arian or Andre is covered, we're done offensively. Where are the throws to OD, and we don't even try to get another WR involved. This is not a talent issue any more. Schaub has concerns, but we don't attack teams like we did early in the year.

I agree. And to take it a step further, I am one hell of a Kevin Walters fan. He plays with heart and damned near catches everything thrown at him.

As I've stated in other threads, I'm tired of Foster right, Foster screen and AJ prayers. Both guys are great, but when they are getting doubled, we (Kubiak) have to wake up and go to other people. Sure, Foster and Dre can take it to the house at any given time. But we have to make the other team worry about somebody else. We have some very talented weapons in our arsenal that are rusting.

thunderkyss
01-01-2013, 12:51 AM
As I've stated in other threads, I'm tired of Foster right, Foster screen and AJ prayers. Both guys are great, but when they are getting doubled, we (Kubiak) have to wake up and go to other people. Sure, Foster and Dre can take it to the house at any given time. But we have to make the other team worry about somebody else. We have some very talented weapons in our arsenal that are rusting.

If I told you Matt completed 66% of his passes for 275 yards, Andre had 12 catches for 141 yards, & Arian carried the ball 16 times for 96 yards against the hapless Colts, how would you guess the offense played?

Keep in mind, Luck only completed 50% of his passes for less than 200 yards. Vick Ballard toted the rock 27 yards for only 78 yards, & Wayne had 4 catches for 40 yards... who do you think would have won the game?

bckey
01-01-2013, 12:53 AM
Everybody in the flippin NFL wanted the Colts to win yesterday!! They LOVE to exploit a "feel good" story and, with no disrespect to Chuck Phangeo (sp), there was NO WAY IN HELL we were coming out of that game with a win!! We should have taken care of business against the Vikes, which IMHO was an easier team to beat. I've watched every damn game the Texans have ever played, and I'm not sure I've ever seen as many MISSED calls as I saw yesterday. I'm not blaming the refs entirely on our loss, but, I'm not sure that loss wasn't written in the books before the game was even played. WHY would Chuckie come back with ONE game left in the season, not a pressure game either, if not for an end of year FEEL GOOD story the NFL thrives on!! We were doomed before the game started.

The NFL also wants an AFC chamionship with the Patriots vs. Broncos. Big money and ratings for them. You can bet the calls will be in both teams favor to get them that matchup. Not saying a team can't beat em just that it will be extremely difficult. Whoever goes to New England and whoever goes to Denver will be playing the refs also.

SheTexan
01-01-2013, 09:54 AM
To further clarify, the "quit" is, to me, more of a subconscious thing. I don't think there was a secret team meeting..don't think there ever is. You know how it happens. A couple people in a private conversation questioning play calling, etc, then next thing you know one of those guys is talking to another about it. Before you know it you've become mentally drowned with negativity and voices of dissension that not even a good pep talk can clear up. The only way to fix that kind of mind set is a new culture and imo the only way to establish a new culture is by bringing in new leadership.

In that case we'd be bringing in new leadership every year! Sure, tongues wag, and negativity can always be a downer, BUT, these guys get paid MILLIONS to overcome that crap and stay with the program, whether they like it or not! I detest the management at my work, but, I am PAID to do my job, regardless! These guys are SUPPOSE to be professionals, and if they are that petty, they need to go, not the management! DON'T misunderstand me please!! I'm not defending Gary Kubiak! I wanted him gone after the 2-14 season, but, he AIN'T goin anyplace, anytime soon!! Our players need to suck it up and play the friggin game to WIN, for themselves, for the fans, and for a bigger paycheck, whichever comes first in their small beanie minds!!

PhilpW
01-01-2013, 09:56 AM
The NFL also wants an AFC chamionship with the Patriots vs. Broncos. Big money and ratings for them. You can bet the calls will be in both teams favor to get them that matchup. Not saying a team can't beat em just that it will be extremely difficult. Whoever goes to New England and whoever goes to Denver will be playing the refs also.


Anyone who disputes this, thinks the NFL is sport and not business.

Maddict5
01-01-2013, 09:57 AM
It could just be the hangover from the Loss...but I don't believe I've ever seen AJ drop something that easy to catch and that huge. One of Matt's best passes I've seen and he whiffs?? Either AJ is not the AJ we think he is, or there is something amiss down on Kirby and I know DAMN WELL that AJ is the best receiver in the league. If AJ had a QB like Stafford, there'd be no question. He constantly has to slow down to catch the long ball and then fight off the defender for the reception. AJ would have probably had a couple seasons close to 2000 yards. Even when Cotton Shaub was putting up 4500 yards a few years back, he still never really had arm strength. I mean work out your damn triceps or something..geez.

ha im loving that in a thread that features the phrase 'mcnair needs to wake up to reality' prominently that aj apparently never drops an easy ball or that hes the best wr in the league:vincepalm:

Say Watt
01-01-2013, 03:40 PM
In that case we'd be bringing in new leadership every year! Sure, tongues wag, and negativity can always be a downer, BUT, these guys get paid MILLIONS to overcome that crap and stay with the program, whether they like it or not! I detest the management at my work, but, I am PAID to do my job, regardless! These guys are SUPPOSE to be professionals, and if they are that petty, they need to go, not the management! DON'T misunderstand me please!! I'm not defending Gary Kubiak! I wanted him gone after the 2-14 season, but, he AIN'T goin anyplace, anytime soon!! Our players need to suck it up and play the friggin game to WIN, for themselves, for the fans, and for a bigger paycheck, whichever comes first in their small beanie minds!!

Yeah but even at your job, dissension can cause a decrease in productivity. That is exactly what we see right now with the Texans. It seems nobody is on the same page. The line has lost touch with Foster, and he is not finding the holes like he has in years past. Schaub seems totally out of sink and totally defeated. If anyone has to be questioning the play calling, it's him. This is especially true given the fact that Schaub is rarely, if ever, allowed to audible out of a play. If it's a run, it doesn't matter how much the defense stacks the box; we are running the ball. It has to be deflating.

I don't buy it. Just because they get paid millions doesn't mean they are above normal human emotions and reactions. Hopefully, they get it together. But I won't hold my breath.

handswarmer
01-01-2013, 06:11 PM
The NFL also wants an AFC chamionship with the Patriots vs. Broncos. Big money and ratings for them. You can bet the calls will be in both teams favor to get them that matchup. Not saying a team can't beat em just that it will be extremely difficult. Whoever goes to New England and whoever goes to Denver will be playing the refs also.

This is such Bullstarch....only fans who cannot accept that their team got beat whines about the calls, the refs or how the NFL 'wants' certain matchups for rating and $$$.

Only the networks worry about the Matchups and ratings. Anyhting else is a farce.

srrono
01-01-2013, 06:21 PM
1 thing I have noticed as far as our DEF drop off is guys are not running to the ball. I see a lot of guys standing watching others make plays. At the start of the season it seemed like everyone was running to the ball. Group tackling all the time, now 1 guy misses a tackle its a long gain with guys just watching.

Houston Texans ‏@HoustonTexans
Watt: Defense was flying around today. Practice was a lot of fun.

SheTexan
01-01-2013, 06:57 PM
This is such Bullstarch....only fans who cannot accept that their team got beat whines about the calls, the refs or how the NFL 'wants' certain matchups for rating and $$$.

Only the networks worry about the Matchups and ratings. Anyhting else is a farce.

Really!!? If I was a betting woman I'd have bet against my team when we played the Colts last week. I watched the game calm, but irritated. Where do you think "feel good" stories come from anyway? The freaking MEDIA! I accepted the loss against the Colts, knew it was coming, BUT, I didn't accept the loss against the Vikes. Our team was HORRIBLE and deserved to lose! We should have beat the Colts, PERIOD!

If you read this MB very much you will find out that these guys are hard as hell on our team! Most do NOT accept mediocre play, bad attitudes, or crappy coaching. Every game we've lost this year we played like crap on all levels of play. GB and NE made us look like Jr High kids playing ball. I have NO idea WHY we played so bad against the VIkes, but, the Colts was a dead game before the whistle was blown. JMO!!

handswarmer
01-01-2013, 07:17 PM
Really!!? If I was a betting woman I'd have bet against my team when we played the Colts last week. I watched the game calm, but irritated. Where do you think "feel good" stories come from anyway? The freaking MEDIA! I accepted the loss against the Colts, knew it was coming, BUT, I didn't accept the loss against the Vikes. Our team was HORRIBLE and deserved to lose! We should have beat the Colts, PERIOD!

If you read this MB very much you will find out that these guys are hard as hell on our team! Most do NOT accept mediocre play, bad attitudes, or crappy coaching. Every game we've lost this year we played like crap on all levels of play. GB and NE made us look like Jr High kids playing ball. I have NO idea WHY we played so bad against the VIkes, but, the Colts was a dead game before the whistle was blown. JMO!!

Apreciate your passion but you are wrong IMO.

What possible benefit would the League get from the refs blowing calls for the Colts?

Chuck Pagano's story was extraordinary in that I cannot remember a HC leaving his team because of Leukemia or cancer, leaving a first year OC and rookie QB to lead a roster that was completely turned over from a year ago.

Methinks its just jealousy but I could be wrong. ;)

Grungo_Taco
01-01-2013, 07:33 PM
Apreciate your passion but you are wrong IMO.

What possible benefit would the League get from the refs blowing calls for the Colts?

Chuck Pagano's story was extraordinary in that I cannot remember a HC leaving his team because of Leukemia or cancer, leaving a first year OC and rookie QB to lead a roster that was completely turned over from a year ago.

Methinks its just jealousy but I could be wrong. ;)

1) Why are you trolling a texans forum? ~ Perhaps to ease your own woe's? 2) You have no clue what you are talking about.. Did you see the strip-sack fumble they overturned? :goodpost:

handswarmer
01-01-2013, 10:03 PM
1) Why are you trolling a texans forum? ~ Perhaps to ease your own woe's? 2) You have no clue what you are talking about.. Did you see the strip-sack fumble they overturned? :goodpost:

Trolling? OOh, so 90's of you...

Its a discussion board, no? Why when a fan from another team comes on, everyone assumes they are hiding something about their own team? You guys crack me up...

The 'fumble' was the veritable definitin of the "Tuck Rule". The rule sucks but until its eliminated, then what transpired, is the definition of the Tuck Rule.

Thats not what cost you the game. Whining about refs is for losers....

Perki-Perk
01-02-2013, 12:41 AM
ha im loving that in a thread that features the phrase 'mcnair needs to wake up to reality' prominently that aj apparently never drops an easy ball or that hes the best wr in the league:vincepalm:

Like I said when I started this thread, these are just MY observations and the way I feel about things and I don't believe I have made a statement as a fact perse.

As far as your facepalm, if you can prove me wrong I welcome it. Other than AJ coming back from injury, when before has he dropped such easy balls? He is in stellar form at this point and that ball went through his arms like he started thinking about riding bikes or what he was going to do in the offseason. AJ, is one of, if not the best WR in the league and that is also my opinion. Calvin Johnson is indeed great, but considering who's throwing the balls, I'd take AJ receiving from any top 10 QB all day over CJ receiving from Shaub. You swap those two out, and stories would be quite a bit different.

So take you facepalm and replace it with facts before you come in here arrogantly suggesting my opinion as ludicrous.

Perki-Perk
01-02-2013, 12:47 AM
Trolling? OOh, so 90's of you...

Its a discussion board, no? Why when a fan from another team comes on, everyone assumes they are hiding something about their own team? You guys crack me up...

The 'fumble' was the veritable definitin of the "Tuck Rule". The rule sucks but until its eliminated, then what transpired, is the definition of the Tuck Rule.

Thats not what cost you the game. Whining about refs is for losers....

Besides that fumble, which does fall under the "tuck" rule and that was a heads up play by luck and nothing less, there have been a couple instances in the last few weeks where clear fumbles were whistled dead bi refs, some EXTREMELY questionable Off/Def Pass interference calls with very similar situations going against the Texans.

Now, for the record I know we all get upset about calls, and fair enough upon review I'm usually telling other fans it was legit and to chill out, but there have been some plays that were even reviewed that have still went against us. Conspiracy? I don't know, I hope not, but I do know at the minimum it is questionable.

One of the big reasons the NBA makes me mad is the ref is given so much power to completely change the momentum of the game and the NFL is becoming very much the same. Players and plays should change momentum, not some zebra who's task is to make sure the game is played fairly and does not get out of hand.

Norg
01-02-2013, 01:35 AM
they will never give up on kubes this is his team he built it from the ground up im talking about the offensive

if any thing i just see dissapointment in themselfs for just gettin beat thats all

its kinda hard for some people when u give your best 150 % yet thats not even good enough

thunderkyss
01-02-2013, 09:39 AM
This is such Bullstarch....only fans who cannot accept that their team got beat whines about the calls, the refs or how the NFL 'wants' certain matchups for rating and $$$.

Only the networks worry about the Matchups and ratings. Anyhting else is a farce.

Agreed. The good teams win in spite of bad calls. That includes the GreenBay/Seattle game earlier this year. Had the Packers been able to keep Rogers on his feet, that game wouldn't have been close & that simultaneous catch wouldn't have been an issue.

handswarmer
01-02-2013, 12:03 PM
Besides that fumble, which does fall under the "tuck" rule and that was a heads up play by luck and nothing less, there have been a couple instances in the last few weeks where clear fumbles were whistled dead bi refs, some EXTREMELY questionable Off/Def Pass interference calls with very similar situations going against the Texans.

Now, for the record I know we all get upset about calls, and fair enough upon review I'm usually telling other fans it was legit and to chill out, but there have been some plays that were even reviewed that have still went against us. Conspiracy? I don't know, I hope not, but I do know at the minimum it is questionable.

One of the big reasons the NBA makes me mad is the ref is given so much power to completely change the momentum of the game and the NFL is becoming very much the same. Players and plays should change momentum, not some zebra who's task is to make sure the game is played fairly and does not get out of hand.

I wouldn't watch the NBA if I was taking a dump and was bored so the analogy is lost on me....

PI calls are always and have always been, a subjective call- it is that referee's
opinion of the interpretation of the rule....nothing you can do about that. Plus the speed of the game is so fast, one has to make a split second decision- You ever ref a sport? I reffed Lacrosse for 10 years- talk about fast paced....

Every team's fan base has a conspiracy theory of the NFL refs against them.....

edwardc5637
01-02-2013, 12:09 PM
Honestly when I watch I see the offensive players disgusted with the play calling and the qb play...the expressions by Aj and Foster are clear as day to me

Mcnair has to see how unhappy those two are .

GP
01-02-2013, 12:27 PM
Like I said when I started this thread, these are just MY observations and the way I feel about things and I don't believe I have made a statement as a fact perse.

As far as your facepalm, if you can prove me wrong I welcome it. Other than AJ coming back from injury, when before has he dropped such easy balls? He is in stellar form at this point and that ball went through his arms like he started thinking about riding bikes or what he was going to do in the offseason. AJ, is one of, if not the best WR in the league and that is also my opinion. Calvin Johnson is indeed great, but considering who's throwing the balls, I'd take AJ receiving from any top 10 QB all day over CJ receiving from Shaub. You swap those two out, and stories would be quite a bit different.

So take you facepalm and replace it with facts before you come in here arrogantly suggesting my opinion as ludicrous.

All that poster does is agitate and piss people off. He lives for it.

So don't worry about it. I stopped quoting him months ago, because it's not worth the effort to just have him get you into a flame war. You can't fight fire with fire. You'll just wear yourself out. I have gotten to where I know which posters I can quote and which I can't. Some, you just have to NEVER quote them no matter what. It's science.

I see what you're saying and I agree. I've been seeing it for going on 6 games now. At some point, the players are going to choose to keep trying hard for the coach (even if they have a small doubt in the back of their heads) but all men have a snapping point. I think our guys are reaching theirs.

Perki-Perk
01-02-2013, 01:51 PM
I wouldn't watch the NBA if I was taking a dump and was bored so the analogy is lost on me....

PI calls are always and have always been, a subjective call- it is that referee's
opinion of the interpretation of the rule....nothing you can do about that. Plus the speed of the game is so fast, one has to make a split second decision- You ever ref a sport? I reffed Lacrosse for 10 years- talk about fast paced....

Every team's fan base has a conspiracy theory of the NFL refs against them.....

Ok, I'll be more specific.

In the Patriots game, one of our defenders ran in front of their receiver while both going after the ball and defensive PI is called. Then, the exact opposite occured and Offensive PI is called. Just stuff like that...

handswarmer
01-02-2013, 04:58 PM
Ok, I'll be more specific.

In the Patriots game, one of our defenders ran in front of their receiver while both going after the ball and defensive PI is called. Then, the exact opposite occured and Offensive PI is called. Just stuff like that...

I've been watching all the playoff teams games over the holiday- give me some references for the plays you speak of qtr clock down distance etc.....


Refs blow calls all the time....

Perki-Perk
01-02-2013, 05:03 PM
I've been watching all the playoff teams games over the holiday- give me some references for the plays you speak of qtr clock down distance etc.....


Refs blow calls all the time....

It's not enough that it happened? I don't have time to scour through 3 hours of football at the moment, but I saw it when it happened and watched the reviews and I saw the two same plays both go in the Patriots favor. It really stuck out because I thought it was a load of crap! I'm believe I'm fairly reasonable when it comes to calls, like the tuck rule, I'll give him that. Other stuff is hard to call in real time, I know that too. But when you take two of the same instances and flip them and the call both times goes to one team...that's jacked up. I'm sure there's another fan here that knows what I'm talking about and may know where to find those 2 plays better than I do.

76Texan
01-02-2013, 05:10 PM
It's not enough that it happened? I don't have time to scour through 3 hours of football at the moment, but I saw it when it happened and watched the reviews and I saw the two same plays both go in the Patriots favor. It really stuck out because I thought it was a load of crap! I'm believe I'm fairly reasonable when it comes to calls, like the tuck rule, I'll give him that. Other stuff is hard to call in real time, I know that too. But when you take two of the same instances and flip them and the call both times goes to one team...that's jacked up. I'm sure there's another fan here that knows what I'm talking about and may know where to find those 2 plays better than I do.

What I know is that the Texans were really good in the penalty department for a long time (despite the blocks in the back on ST), but the calls went 999 degrees around in December.

thunderkyss
01-02-2013, 05:18 PM
What I know is that the Texans were really good in the penalty department for a long time (despite the blocks in the back on ST), but the calls went 999 degrees around in December.

& some of them have been doozies. The one against Brandon Harris vs Reggie Wayne..... c'mon, Reggie pushed him out of the way, BH was holding on for dear life. Had he not fought back, he'd have been on the ground & I doubt the ref would have called it.

That last one against Kj, he's got a step on the receiver, going for the ball. The receiver grabs his shoulder & pulls him back. Kj puts his hands up so the refs see him & they throw the flag on Kj... I couldn't believe that.

Same thing with LeStar Jean getting called for the Offensive PI. That was ridiculous.

76Texan
01-02-2013, 05:38 PM
& some of them have been doozies. The one against Brandon Harris vs Reggie Wayne..... c'mon, Reggie pushed him out of the way, BH was holding on for dear life. Had he not fought back, he'd have been on the ground & I doubt the ref would have called it.

That last one against Kj, he's got a step on the receiver, going for the ball. The receiver grabs his shoulder & pulls him back. Kj puts his hands up so the refs see him & they throw the flag on Kj... I couldn't believe that.

Same thing with LeStar Jean getting called for the Offensive PI. That was ridiculous.

Well, before pushing him out, Wayne grabbed and pulled Brandon Harris in, toward him, all the while hiding it from the back judge.

I detest watching the grin on Wayne's face as he fled the crime scene just as I watched the grin on Luck's face when he walked back out onto the field after that blown fumble call.

They knew they got away with favorable calls; there's no other way to explain their reaction.

handswarmer
01-02-2013, 05:52 PM
Aain, if you are whining about refs calls as to why you lost, then you didn't do enough to put yourself in a position to win.

Perki-Perk
01-02-2013, 05:53 PM
Well, before pushing him out, Wayne grabbed and pulled Brandon Harris in, toward him, all the while hiding it from the back judge.

I detest watching the grin on Wayne's face as he fled the crime scene just as I watched the grin on Luck's face when he walked back out onto the field after that blown fumble call.

They knew they got away with favorable calls; there's no other way to explain their reaction.

Maybe we're looking at a culmination of all these things bearing down on the back of the players' minds. The consistently bad calls the last few weeks, the 3rd and long draws, the predictable play calling, the not going for it while trailing in the 4th on 4th and 1, the not switching to zone coverage while getting burnt on man and no consistent pressure to the QB. I mean, as a team, it has to be on their minds, and when you are in a mental funk, regardless of how much you make (see Heath Ledger), it is a powerful thing. People underestimate the power of the mind and think just because they can flip burgers right after smoking a blunt that a football player should be able to perform with a lot of doubt on his mind. Maybe we need a team therapist?? haha

thunderkyss
01-02-2013, 10:43 PM
Aain, if you are whining about refs calls as to why you lost, then you didn't do enough to put yourself in a position to win.

hey, hey... hey now. I'm not whining. I agreed with you earlier. I feel the same way.

76 & I are just acknowledging there have been some egregious calls... that's all. Not saying that's why we lost, but we understand how someone could adopt that idea.

thunderkyss
01-02-2013, 10:50 PM
Maybe we're looking at a culmination of all these things bearing down on the back of the players' minds. The consistently bad calls the last few weeks, the 3rd and long draws, the predictable play calling, the not going for it while trailing in the 4th on 4th and 1, the not switching to zone coverage while getting burnt on man and no consistent pressure to the QB.

Some of the things you mentioned is nothing more than messageboard fodder. The playing man thing..... we play a lot of man. But the plays we got burned on, especially the big plays, weren't pure man schemes. We had a flat footed safety watching the receivers run past him on their way to a bad ass catch & run. We leave our guys on islands, but we mix in a lot of safety help & disguised coverages.

Don't listen to the guys on the radio. Zone coverages break down just as easily against guys like Brady & Rogers. They know where the holes are before the defense does (because they know which patterns are ran).

I also think a lot of the 3rd & long draws is Matt checking out of a called play. Kubiak said as much after one of the games. Matt didn't like what he saw & checked to a draw.

But mainly, I think Kubiak has been trying to keep the guys on an even keel so long, that when it's time to get emotional.... they can't.

More or less, I agree with you.

Texan_Bill
01-02-2013, 11:14 PM
.

But mainly, I think Kubiak has been trying to keep the guys on an even keel so long, that when it's time to get emotional.... they can't.
.

Totally agree with this.. While I think there is a very good attribute to keeping the team on an even keel, he needs to let them get balled out emotional!! I honsetly think this is the area where Brian Cushing is the most missed.

ObsiWan
01-03-2013, 12:08 AM
I cannot subscribe to the theory that these guys have quit; subconsciously or otherwise.

If A.J. played his heart out when we went 2-14, it defies logic that he would purposefully drop a TD pass to spite Kubiak when he finally makes it to playoffland.

If anything, they're trying too hard not to screw up. That leads to thinking about not screwing up instead of just going out and flying around. If they have to think first instead of acting on instinct, that puts them a split sec behind the other guy. ...a half step away from where they need to be. They get caught looking instead of doing. And that will get them beat.

I see this in Schaub more than anyone else.

Damn if I know what the cure for it is.

klockWork
01-03-2013, 12:33 AM
Demps got benched for giving up a big play in the last Colts game, and he did the same **** yesterday.

In the Denver game earlier he also gave up that Manning TD to Decker that spark their comeback . It was the exact same play but was on the other side of the hash mark. That guy is a HUGE liability at the safety position.

thunderkyss
01-03-2013, 12:33 AM
Damn if I know what the cure for it is.

Wining. That's the only cure. They need to get this "biggest game in Texans history" crap out of there minds & just play football.

We're guilty of the same thing here. I just saw the "The road to the play offs start today" thread & the "if we win today we'll go to the AFC Championship game. If not we're one & done" thinking we have. Winning or losing that game had nk more importance than the Patriots game. We win Saturday, we're still alive. Rinse & repeat. That's all there is to it.

handswarmer
01-03-2013, 10:44 AM
hey, hey... hey now. I'm not whining. I agreed with you earlier. I feel the same way.

76 & I are just acknowledging there have been some egregious calls... that's all. Not saying that's why we lost, but we understand how someone could adopt that idea.

Iwasn't directing the comment 'you' at you- maybe I should have wrotten 'one'.

Bad calls in every game....

handswarmer
01-03-2013, 10:46 AM
Ok, I'll be more specific.

In the Patriots game, one of our defenders ran in front of their receiver while both going after the ball and defensive PI is called. Then, the exact opposite occured and Offensive PI is called. Just stuff like that...

Watched the whole game- nothing stood out. Angles can be different so what you see is different than what the refs see......

76Texan
01-03-2013, 11:01 AM
Watched the whole game- nothing stood out. Angles can be different so what you see is different than what the refs see......

I watched each games several times.
I watch a Texans game pretty much every day besides other games I want to watch, so please understand that I have good reasons to point out unbalanced officiating.

handswarmer
01-03-2013, 11:08 AM
I watched each games several times.
I watch a Texans game pretty much every day besides other games I want to watch, so please understand that I have good reasons to point out unbalanced officiating.

Maybe you can give me a time stamp?

76Texan
01-03-2013, 11:11 AM
Maybe you can give me a time stamp?

I described some of the penalties in the other thread titled "Blame the players, not the ref". If you have NFL Game Rewind, you can pull up the play list to get to those plays very quickly.