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GP
12-25-2012, 12:20 PM
Does Kubiak need to let Matt stand and watch? I think he does.

I think it needs to be for his own good. Not as punishment. Not to shame him. But as an effort to make him watch instead of being caught up in the same cycle of lack of forward progress that he's been caught up in since the two OT games. I think those games zapped his mental reserve, if you will.

Let the guy watch, make him witness another QB and see the game as it happens instead of being in the heat of the battle every snap. Then plug him into the game after the half. Get that whole team settled down, because I think the team is taking a bit of a hit to their psyche because of Schaub right now.

Playoffs
12-25-2012, 12:23 PM
No.

He's the best QB on the team.

GP
12-25-2012, 12:27 PM
Plus, he'll be "coaching up" Yates, which MIGHT make Schuab more receptive to his own teachings.

Sometimes being placed into the role of "teacher" makes you re-think things yourself. It can remind you of your own failures to do what you're teaching others to do or not to do. You know what I am saying? If I am teaching people how to do something, in terms of how to use technology, and it dawns on me--during that part of the lesson--that I'm not doing, in my own life, what I am teaching others to do for themselves...it tends to creep in and become a bit of a changing moment for me. I have to reconcile that I am not doing as I say.

Just a thought.

It sure seems like Matt has been way WAY lost since the two OT games.

GP
12-25-2012, 12:28 PM
No.

He's the best QB on the team.

But not even for a half? And not as a way to create a QB controversy.

Really it's just 30 minutes of time to reflect and to see things from a different angle. I think the guy is sort of dealing with vertigo right now, he doesn't know what is up and what is down.

And I think it's messing with the heads of every single player on this team not named JJ Watt and Andre Johnson.

Norg
12-25-2012, 12:29 PM
Not just NO BUT HELL NO !!!!

We are playing for a BYE and HFA throught ...Time is not the time to change QB's and go with Yates ...Yates are u kidding me and i think hes good but come on man

ILL SAY AGAIN WE ARE PLAYING FOR BYE !!!!!!!!!!!!!

This is a big game from here on out we gotta live or die with Schaub get over it haters

4 good or bad all our questions and answers will come to light come playoffs

IlliniJen
12-25-2012, 12:35 PM
This is a crucial game for us to get a first round bye and home field or nothing. You don't sit your starting QB in a game like that. You don't sit your starting QB in the last game before you head into the playoffs with so much at stake.

What sort of xmas weed are you smoking that this even was a kernel of an idea?

Showtime100
12-25-2012, 12:40 PM
No. That would disrupt the offense even more to say nothing of the big slimy can of worms/media fodder it would open up heading into the playoffs.

The way I see it is if it's broke, don't make it even broker. :gamer: :D

GP
12-25-2012, 12:42 PM
This is a crucial game for us to get a first round bye and home field or nothing. You don't sit your starting QB in a game like that. You don't sit your starting QB in the last game before you head into the playoffs with so much at stake.

What sort of xmas weed are you smoking that this even was a kernel of an idea?

Ya know, you make those same derisive comments in game day threads and then disappear when we end up being proven right.

Selective posting is a nasty habit, Jen.

Just think about it, and try to not be insulting for once in your life. OK? OK.

I haven't seen anything of Schaub since the last OT game he played that tells me Schaub is capable of gutting this out by just hanging in there. In fact, his pattern has been that he's going to try and force MORE things which means a complete meltdown of Matt Schaub Schitty Throw (patented and copyrighted, btw) of epic proportions.

There is no pressure on a guy like Yates if he knows he's only managing the game for ONE HALF versus the Colts. Big damn deal. It gives Matt a breather and conveys to him that he needs to slow it down and think a little.

That's why I voted the way I did. I'd like someone to offer more than just 'He's our best QB" argument. So far, I see nothing BUT that. And truthfully, he's running neck and neck with Yates right now in my book.

mussop
12-25-2012, 12:43 PM
No.

He's the best QB on the team.

All I know is he played like a scared little school girl in that last game. If at the first sign of pressure he fetals up against Indy his ass needs to be pulled. Kubiak needs to get in his ear and ask him how bad he wants to win. You can say what you want about the blocking up front in the Minnesota game, Schaub packed it in. He played like a :kitten:.

GP
12-25-2012, 12:44 PM
No. That would disrupt the offense even more to say nothing of the big slimy can of worms/media fodder it would open up heading into the playoffs.

The way I see it is if it's broke, don't make it even broker. :gamer: :D

Well, we could always have the team's officials lie and say he had a slight problem with his heartbeat like we did with Foster.

I mean, seriously, I don't buy that load of crap from the Texans for one second. He was benched for his fumble. Period. The cover story is to save face in the media.

So, you might be right. They would have to find a convenient excuse as to why they sat Schaub, otherwise it would be bad P.R. and we know the Texans cannot endure THAT! LOL. No sir, that would be outlandish to do so.

Gotta' keep a good face before the media, that's always been the McNair way...even if it means choking on our own vomit along the way.

Wolf
12-25-2012, 12:50 PM
But not even for a half? And not as a way to create a QB controversy.

Really it's just 30 minutes of time to reflect and to see things from a different angle. I think the guy is sort of dealing with vertigo right now, he doesn't know what is up and what is down.

And I think it's messing with the heads of every single player on this team not named JJ Watt and Andre Johnson.


No and it would create a controversy in someone's mind. It wold be an unnecessary distraction when this is the last thing a team needs on the last week of the season and right before the playoffs

Norg
12-25-2012, 01:00 PM
so your saying if we get a big enough lead by the 2nd half u want us to sit our starters is that what your saying ...????

GP
12-25-2012, 01:21 PM
No and it would create a controversy in someone's mind. It wold be an unnecessary distraction when this is the last thing a team needs on the last week of the season and right before the playoffs

Well then, if the NFL world is THAT small of a place...I need to find a new sport to follow.

I just don't see how a very plainly stated position wouldn't be respected.

I guess image is everything. Which explains why this team can't get over the top.

Can I ask one thing: Tell me what series of possessions since the OT games you've seen of Schaub that tells you he's got this under control and can continue 'as is'? Not being snarky. I genuinely want to know reasons or examples.

NitroGSXR
12-25-2012, 01:26 PM
On Sunday, TJ was in for two plays... and he fumbled on both of them. He has a QB rating of 11. ELEVEN!

I'm not even going to dignify this absurd poll with a vote.

Wolf
12-25-2012, 01:45 PM
Well then, if the NFL world is THAT small of a place...I need to find a new sport to follow.

I just don't see how a very plainly stated position wouldn't be respected.

I guess image is everything. Which explains why this team can't get over the top.

Can I ask one thing: Tell me what series of possessions since the OT games you've seen of Schaub that tells you he's got this under control and can continue 'as is'? Not being snarky. I genuinely want to know reasons or examples.
Team is struggling right now. You ride with the horses the got you there at this point.

Tj isn't the answer. What has he shown? This team has average high 20s in points through out the season. Yeah we scored 6 points last week ,which surprised the **** out of me. Anyway nothing against TJ but I honestly haven't seen anything but admiral job last year to holding the fort down.


Reminds me of the joke.

What is the most popular player on the team?

The back up QB

IlliniJen
12-25-2012, 02:04 PM
Ya know, you make those same derisive comments in game day threads and then disappear when we end up being proven right.

Selective posting is a nasty habit, Jen.

Just think about it, and try to not be insulting for once in your life. OK? OK.

I haven't seen anything of Schaub since the last OT game he played that tells me Schaub is capable of gutting this out by just hanging in there. In fact, his pattern has been that he's going to try and force MORE things which means a complete meltdown of Matt Schaub Schitty Throw (patented and copyrighted, btw) of epic proportions.

There is no pressure on a guy like Yates if he knows he's only managing the game for ONE HALF versus the Colts. Big damn deal. It gives Matt a breather and conveys to him that he needs to slow it down and think a little.

That's why I voted the way I did. I'd like someone to offer more than just 'He's our best QB" argument. So far, I see nothing BUT that. And truthfully, he's running neck and neck with Yates right now in my book.

It's selective posting because I can't read everything on this board, but your posts are usually the most depressing chicken-little threads ever created. But if I point that out, I'm calling you a bad fan, right? Regarding any of that: put on your big girl panties and learn to cope. I don't think you're a ****ty fan, you're just a whiny one who runs around with your hair on fire when the team plays bad. That is a sucky attitude. People can be down about the team and point out flaws, but some people take it way overboard, and come off like doomsday loons regarding this team. That's the bucket I put you in. Sorry dude.

http://i3.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/000/243/561/afc.gif

Threads like this is why 99.9999% of fans are unqualified to do anything but WATCH football.

Is Schaub perfect? No. Is he elite? No. Is NOW, right NOW, the correct time to try and make a switch to a different QB? Hells no. Crack rock smokin'.

We are 13-3. If you took your idea of benching Schaub to any professional NFL player, coach or commentator, you would be laughed at, and rightfully so. Your idea seems punitive, nothing more. It will teach him nothing, we will learning nothing new about Yates, and the team would scratch its head and wonder what the hell is going on.

There is NOTHING positive with doing something like this. Our team is experiencing some issues, not just with QB play, but all over the field, and you don't pull some idiotic move like benching your starting QB in order to "fix" something. The only fix is people playing better, both in individual effort, and as a group. Our OL is the most troubling issue right now, not the QB. QBs don't function well behind a shaky OL. The running game can't get going behind that OL. And what is Kubes doing? Running Foster up the gut into the backs of an OL that isn't getting any push or opening any holes.

And how, exactly, does benching Schaub fix any of those issues? I think our team is probably reeling a little bit from our recent troubles, and doing anything that hurts the morale of this team and makes them question the sanity of the coaching staff (aside from Kubiak's horrible playcalling) would make everyone in the country point at us and laugh like we just pissed ourselves while standing outside a restroom.

Schaub is not the QB we want...very few teams have the QB they want, but he's the QB we have and can be successful if other aspects of the game are working well. The basic fundamentals of the game call for a good OL with the ability to establish the run in order to open up the passing game. If that's working, QBs have an easier job, and Schaub is one of those guys who HAS to be comfortable and get in his rhythm to be effective. Do I like this limitation of us and the way he stiffens up and forces things when the OL/RBs aren't effective early? Hell no. We've seen that if we start off slow and we have issues getting a rush going, we will likely lose if going against a team that can score. We can't play from behind if we haven't put up over 20 points already.

But that unfortunate situation has happened only 3 times so far this season, with a few wins that presented a challenge due to our D falling down a bit. So to change things with the very last game meaning so much to our team, you go with your best chance of winning, and in 13 instances we won with Schaub and only lost 3 times. You make the smart play. Like, for instance, if you're on the goal line, you should PROBABLY run the damn ball to get the TD. Unless you're Kubiak. But I digress.

You don't set yourself on fire, run around like a chicken with your head cut off and burn everything to the ground in the face of adversity. Damn. Half the league would love to have Schaub as their QB. That doesn't make him great or elite, but that means we're heading to the playoffs once again. If Schaub starts stumbling next year, then there might be a time to see Yates to mix things up. I'm far more concerned with our line play on both sides of the ball.

Thorn
12-25-2012, 02:07 PM
I voted option 3 because we should be able to beat the Colts either way. If we can't, then it doesn't matter. If I was the head coach, I wouldn't sit Matt, and you can bet he will start and play to the very end no matter what the score. The offense is going backwards at exactly the wrong time here, while the defense seems to be at least stablized or slightly improving.

Defense does win championships, but not against Manning or Brady. You need both to beat those guys.

Texecutioner
12-25-2012, 02:08 PM
On Sunday, TJ was in for two plays... and he fumbled on both of them. He has a QB rating of 11. ELEVEN!

I'm not even going to dignify this absurd poll with a vote.

Have to agree with ya on this one.

Why in the hell would we put our starting QB on the sidelines to embarrass him like that and take away his confidence and the team's confidence in him right before the playoffs?? That would break our entire team apart and have everyone questioning the future of this team. The Texans are 12-3 with the best record in the NFL other then the Falcons with Matt Schaub. GP, I love you man but this is by far one of the craziest things you have ever suggested and a total knee jerk reaction especially after by your own admission yates looked horrible in pre season. You're completely giving up on our season when we're having the best season we've ever had. I'll enjoy it while I still have a chance to.

Lurvinator11
12-25-2012, 02:12 PM
This is a dumb question.

It would be one thing if we were already out of the playoffs, and had big questions about the future. We aren't. We are playing for the #1 seed, and will have a home playoff game, and maybe more. If anything, let Schaub play so he can feel comfortable with himself.

The guy played a bad game. His worst of the season. What would that do to his moral if he were to be benched? Mentally, he wouldn't be the same. Let him play, and he could possibly go in to the playoffs feeling better about his ability.

Although, if he were to play a bad game, I wouldn't doubt his ability to get his head back in the game anyway. He is a mentally tough QB, and is a good leader.

Seriously, this entire board has been acting like we are outside of the playoff bubble with a huge scenario to get in. The sky is not falling. It is not.

JCTexan
12-25-2012, 02:21 PM
Put me in the "This is a stupid idea" group. This team is playing for the #1 seed. Benching Schaub and playing Yates for even a half can ruin the Texans Super Bowl chances this season (#3 seed would mean traveling to NE for the divisional round). This has to be the craziest idea I've heard...

eriadoc
12-25-2012, 02:25 PM
Not a chance. This is an important game. If HFA was locked up, then I would want Yates to start because I would want him to get reps just in case. But HFA is on the line, so you play the best QB on the roster. Schaub may not be the best QB in the NFL, but he's the best one on the roster.

Now, if they come out and jump up 28-3 at the half, then Yates in the second half might be good.

DocBar
12-25-2012, 08:39 PM
Not one of your better ideas, GP. I understand the sentiment, but I don't think you thought this one out, fully.

We're in the last game of the season, playing for HFA. Ya dance with the one who brung ya. Hopefully, we win get our 1st win, ever, in Indy. This is the time to do it. They look to be tough for the next 15 years, or so.

Rey
12-26-2012, 08:43 AM
I"m not a big fan of Schaub as a starting QB at this point, but it is what it is. He's the starter..Kubiak is the coach.

I don't want either one of them relieved of their duties at this point in the year. They need to figure this **** out for the play-offs.

Hervoyel
12-26-2012, 08:52 AM
I want the Texans to go in another direction and am not a fan of Matt Schaub. Doesn't matter though because I don't want change for change's sake and insofar as the 2012 season is concerned we live or die with Matt Schaub. Yates isn't going to pull a Colin Kaepernick on us and come out and win games. He's not that good. He's more mobile (That's a +), less experienced (BIG -) version of the guy he'd be replacing.

Nope. We need to start looking for a QB...... after the season is over. Not right now.

That's how I see it at least.

amazing80
12-26-2012, 08:58 AM
At this point you gotta ride Matt to the end. :cool:

TheRealJoker
12-26-2012, 09:10 AM
You don't sit your QB when you have Homefield Advantage throughout on the line.

Hervoyel
12-26-2012, 09:30 AM
Stuff....funny picture.....more stuff......

Schaub is not the QB we want...very few teams have the QB they want, but he's the QB we have and can be successful if other aspects of the game are working well. The basic fundamentals of the game call for a good OL with the ability to establish the run in order to open up the passing game. If that's working, QBs have an easier job, and Schaub is one of those guys who HAS to be comfortable and get in his rhythm to be effective. Do I like this limitation of us and the way he stiffens up and forces things when the OL/RBs aren't effective early? Hell no. We've seen that if we start off slow and we have issues getting a rush going, we will likely lose if going against a team that can score. We can't play from behind if we haven't put up over 20 points already.

But that unfortunate situation has happened only 3 times so far this season, with a few wins that presented a challenge due to our D falling down a bit. So to change things with the very last game meaning so much to our team, you go with your best chance of winning, and in 13 instances we won with Schaub and only lost 3 times. You make the smart play. Like, for instance, if you're on the goal line, you should PROBABLY run the damn ball to get the TD. Unless you're Kubiak. But I digress.

You don't set yourself on fire, run around like a chicken with your head cut off and burn everything to the ground in the face of adversity. Damn. Half the league would love to have Schaub as their QB. That doesn't make him great or elite, but that means we're heading to the playoffs once again. If Schaub starts stumbling next year, then there might be a time to see Yates to mix things up. I'm far more concerned with our line play on both sides of the ball.


Took me to that place....

http://www.terezowens.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/schaub-2.jpg

Because he's the QB Houston deserves, but not the one it needs right now. So we'll hate him. Because he can take it. Because he's not our hero. He's a watchful guardian. A slow-footed protector. A Dork Knight.

powda
12-26-2012, 09:37 AM
Took me to that place....

http://www.terezowens.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/schaub-2.jpg

Because he's the QB Houston deserves, but not the one it needs right now. So we'll hate him. Because he can take it. Because he's not our hero. He's an watchful guardian. A slow-footed protector. A Dork Knight.

Lmao

2012Champs
12-26-2012, 10:17 AM
Matt gets the start but if he stinks it up like he has the last few games in the first quarter we go with Yates in the second. Home field advantage is a big deal.



I dont care how Matt is playing if you put yates in your chance drop to nearly 0

Maddict5
12-26-2012, 10:18 AM
Took me to that place....

http://www.terezowens.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/schaub-2.jpg

Because he's the QB Houston deserves, but not the one it needs right now. So we'll hate him. Because he can take it. Because he's not our hero. He's a watchful guardian. A slow-footed protector. A Dork Knight.

ha.. eventhough im not as down on schaub as others, thats pretty funny! at least something good came from this thread

like others, i just voted no since there wasnt any 'this is a retarded idea' option

thunderkyss
12-26-2012, 10:59 AM
All I know is he played like a scared little school girl in that last game. If at the first sign of pressure he fetals up against Indy his ass needs to be pulled. Kubiak needs to get in his ear and ask him how bad he wants to win. You can say what you want about the blocking up front in the Minnesota game, Schaub packed it in. He played like a :kitten:.

Eh... sort of. I agree his play left a lot to be desired, but I think the thing to fix it is to put the game in his hands & let him know it'll be in his hands throughout the play offs. The game plan from here on out should be pass heavy. Don't sorry about balance. Quick easy passes, a few screens, a run here & there. Keep it up through the first three qtrs. Then run the crap out of it in the fourth.

amazing80
12-26-2012, 11:04 AM
Eh... sort of. I agree his play left a lot to be desired, but I think the thing to fix it is to put the game in his hands & let him know it'll be in his hands throughout the play offs. The game plan from here on out should be pass heavy. Don't sorry about balance. Quick easy passes, a few screens, a run here & there. Keep it up through the first three qtrs. Then run the crap out of it in the fourth.

Schaub is not good enough to execute that game plan

Rey
12-26-2012, 11:08 AM
Eh... sort of. I agree his play left a lot to be desired, but I think the thing to fix it is to put the game in his hands & let him know it'll be in his hands throughout the play offs. The game plan from here on out should be pass heavy. Don't sorry about balance. Quick easy passes, a few screens, a run here & there. Keep it up through the first three qtrs. Then run the crap out of it in the fourth.

Sorry, but heck no.

The solution is to look for even more balance and hope the OL can go into beast mode in the running game.

We are not winning anything by having Matt Schaub throw 40 times/gm.

thunderkyss
12-26-2012, 11:45 AM
Sorry, but heck no.

The solution is to look for even more balance and hope the OL can go into beast mode in the running game.

We are not winning anything by having Matt Schaub throw 40 times/gm.

I don't know that he'll necessarily have to throw it 40 times a game. When the game is over, the numbers will balance out. Get a big lead (points come out of the passing game), then run the heck out of it.

Right now we're asking him to be our safety valve. If the run game doesn't keep us on schedule, we're asking Matt to get us out of third & long. He's not that guy.

Schaub is the single most important guy on this team offensively. He's a rhythm passer. We need to get him into a rhythm & keep him there as long as possible. If he turns it over, the defense will bail us out. This part of the plan is no different than us going 3 & out, or failing to gain more than 30 yards on offense (given our poor starting position).

His best game this year was Denver. He was 17 of 30 for 295 yards. We ran the ball 34 times with Tate & Foster for 152 yards.

2012Champs
12-26-2012, 12:01 PM
Sorry, but heck no.

The solution is to look for even more balance and hope the OL can go into beast mode in the running game.

We are not winning anything by having Matt Schaub throw 40 times/gm.



This year we are 2-0 when Schaub has 40+ attempts 5-0 with 35+ attempts

Rey
12-26-2012, 12:43 PM
This year we are 2-0 when Schaub has 40+ attempts 5-0 with 35+ attempts

We're also 7-0 when he has 31 or fewer attempts.

I'll give you three guesses on the three games he barely missed your 35+ mark, but they were all losses...hint, hint....Probably not converting third downs and being pulled before the game was over had something to do with him just missing your mark...

And the 2 games where he has 40+ attempts were both overtime games.

Rey
12-26-2012, 12:47 PM
I don't know that he'll necessarily have to throw it 40 times a game. When the game is over, the numbers will balance out. Get a big lead (points come out of the passing game), then run the heck out of it.

Right now we're asking him to be our safety valve. If the run game doesn't keep us on schedule, we're asking Matt to get us out of third & long. He's not that guy.

Schaub is the single most important guy on this team offensively. He's a rhythm passer. We need to get him into a rhythm & keep him there as long as possible. If he turns it over, the defense will bail us out. This part of the plan is no different than us going 3 & out, or failing to gain more than 30 yards on offense (given our poor starting position).

His best game this year was Denver. He threw the ball 17 times for 295 yards. We ran the ball 34 times with Tate & Foster for 152 yards.

Sounds to me like you have a gripe with the playcalling. It's not an issue of how often we throw for you, but when we throw...You want us to throw it more early...

I can get behind that...

Kubiak has done that a bit this year though...Come out throwing the ball a bunch. You are right, we look like a better team when that happens.

2012Champs
12-26-2012, 12:54 PM
We're also 7-0 when he has under 31 or fewer attempts.

I'll give you three guesses on the three games he barely missed your 35+ mark, but they were all losses...hint, hint....Probably not converting third downs and being pulled before the game was over had something to do with him just missing your mark...

And the 2 games where he has 40+ attempts were both overtime games.



Do you know how many attempts Matt had in the OT against Jacksonville? 14 which means he posted 41 in reg. In the lions game he had 10 attemps putting him at 38 for reg. Point being is that we certainly can win with Schaub and 40 attempts. In truth if we get to 40ish attempts its typically not because of Schaub so that does put us in a bad spot but 40 attempts doesnt equal a loss and the numbers show it for this season


my guess on the lower end attempt games our running game was working, on the mid games the running game wasnt the best and/or we got behind, on the 35+ games it would also be running games/d issues

Rey
12-26-2012, 01:02 PM
Do you know how many attempts Matt had in the OT against Jacksonville? 14 which means he posted 41 in reg. In the lions game he had 10 attemps putting him at 38 for reg. Point being is that we certainly can win with Schaub and 40 attempts. In truth if we get to 40ish attempts its typically not because of Schaub so that does put us in a bad spot but 40 attempts doesnt equal a loss and the numbers show it for this season

So many things wrong with your post.

The first point about OT is that we were in shootouts in both and both those teams had a chance to win in OT....If that in your mind equals some kind of formula for success I don't know what to tell you.... It means that we were forced to throw the ball around because we had to. Not because that is what the game plan called for. And in both of those games the other teams had opprotunities to win in OT because of Schaub throwing the ball around so much. If you think that is a recipe for success then you don't know what you are watching. The reason that the numbers show it is because those teams (two non-play off teams) failed to capitalize when we gave them an opprotunity...Or you could give credit to the defense for making stops when they needed it...

2012Champs
12-26-2012, 01:36 PM
So many things wrong with your post.

The first point about OT is that we were in shootouts in both and both those teams had a chance to win in OT....If that in your mind equals some kind of formula for success I don't know what to tell you.... It means that we were forced to throw the ball around because we had to. Not because that is what the game plan called for. And in both of those games the other teams had opprotunities to win in OT because of Schaub throwing the ball around so much. If you think that is a recipe for success then you don't know what you are watching. The reason that the numbers show it is because those teams (two non-play off teams) failed to capitalize when we gave them an opprotunity...Or you could give credit to the defense for making stops when they needed it...



Usually in OT both teams have a chance to win as typically in OT the score is pretty close from the get go. Also I think FG gave the other team a chance to win not just Schaub. Point being we can and have won with 40 attempts with Schaub. Use whatever other monday morning view you want and the fact remains we won both games with Schaub throwing 40+ times something you said we simply cant do.

Rey
12-26-2012, 01:43 PM
Point being we can and have won with 40 attempts with Schaub against two non-playoff teams in OT

Fixed it.

If we face teams like the Jags and the Lions in the play-offs I'll feel a little better about us winning with Schaub thrwoing it 40+ times.

2012Champs
12-26-2012, 01:47 PM
Fixed it.

If we face teams like the Jags and the Lions in the play-offs I'll feel a little better about us winning with Schaub thrwoing it 40+ times.



As was your first post that started this, it is simply your opinion

Rey
12-26-2012, 01:56 PM
As was your first post that started this, it is simply your opinion

Thanks for pointing that out.

2012Champs
12-26-2012, 02:06 PM
Thanks for pointing that out.



No problem its seemed as though you might have confused fact/opinion here

We are not winning anything by having Matt Schaub throw 40 times/gm

infantrycak
12-26-2012, 02:45 PM
We are not winning anything by having Matt Schaub throw 40 times/gm.

Yeah, it sucks we are ione of 29 teams whose QBs don't throw 40 times a game and not one of the 3 whose do - none of which will be in the playoffs this season.

amazing80
12-26-2012, 02:56 PM
Usually in OT both teams have a chance to win as typically in OT the score is pretty close from the get go. Also I think FG gave the other team a chance to win not just Schaub. Point being we can and have won with 40 attempts with Schaub. Use whatever other monday morning view you want and the fact remains we won both games with Schaub throwing 40+ times something you said we simply cant do.

So youre big example of Schaub throwing a bunch and winning is vs the 9th WORSE pass defense in Jacksonville, and an average Lions defense? Throw in we had 150-200 YARDS RUSHING those days and you have exactly what we've been saying, when the run game excels Matt is ADEQUATE, when it doesn't, Matt is garbage (Packers, Patriots, Vikings)

Rey
12-26-2012, 02:59 PM
Yeah, it sucks we are ione of 29 teams whose QBs don't throw 40 times a game and not one of the 3 whose do - none of which will be in the playoffs this season.

That would seem to back up my statement. Thanks.

BTW, pay attention. I haven't once advocated having any QB throwing the ball a bunch.

Rey
12-26-2012, 03:02 PM
No problem its seemed as though you might have confused fact/opinion here

"We're not running the ball well," Kubiak said. "That was pretty obvious from early in the game. We got into more of a quick count mode, had to get rid of the ball quick because of their pressure. That's the way we had to move the ball the other night. If we run the ball, we'll have our chances to go down the field but it starts with us running it."

http://www.sbnation.com/fantasy/2012/10/18/3521318/andre-johnson-fantasy-football-texans

All these it's ok if Matt throws the ball a bunch posts are a crock of ****. That's not what we do when we are playing our best football.

2012Champs
12-26-2012, 03:26 PM
So youre big example of Schaub throwing a bunch and winning is vs the 9th WORSE pass defense in Jacksonville, and an average Lions defense? Throw in we had 150-200 YARDS RUSHING those days and you have exactly what we've been saying, when the run game excels Matt is ADEQUATE, when it doesn't, Matt is garbage (Packers, Patriots, Vikings)



Matt did post a 78.8% completion rate, even against a poor team thats pretty damn good. I think I address the running game and impact it has on our team

badboy
12-26-2012, 03:26 PM
Recently we are rotating 3 rookies (Brooks, Jones and Newton {only 17 snaps 2011} and supporting them with Harris a street free agent pick up. Not important whether we argue Briesel/Winston better, they are gone. The first three will be real good in '13.
Schaub, I would prefer someone else but there is no one better. Doesn't matter if Mannings/Rogers/Brady/Big Ben/etc are better, we cannot get them. I thought Matt would be gone in FA and was glad to see him agree to the contract he did. As I am not convinced Yates is the heir apparent nor do I know how Keenum will do, imo we should look for a future replacement for Matt. Kolb? Maybe and I was a fan in college but I say no. Draft? Not this year too much "ceiling" and not enough floor" imo. So lock in on other needs in draft 2013. Hope someone pops up like Geno Smith did but is low enough to go get in 2014. Regardless of how we finish it has been a good ride just frustrating. Barring injuries we should be stronger and deeper next season.

2012Champs
12-26-2012, 03:28 PM
http://www.sbnation.com/fantasy/2012/10/18/3521318/andre-johnson-fantasy-football-texans

All these it's ok if Matt throws the ball a bunch posts are a crock of ****. That's not what we do when we are playing our best football.




Where are all these post saying "if matt throws a bunch we are okay" ? You said we couldnt win if he throws 40 or more times and that simply isnt true. However more to your point I already said if he does throw that many times is either because the running game isnt working or we have fallen behind. Im not sure how you have become so confused. Its not a game plan to throw 40+ times and its not impossible to win if it happens either

Rey
12-26-2012, 03:30 PM
Where are all these post saying "if matt throws a bunch we are okay" ? You said we couldnt win if he throws 40 or more times....

I'm talking about play-off games and superbowls and you bring up two OT games against non-play off teams and one team fighting for the number 1 overall pick.

If you think this team can be successful with Matt throwing 40+ times, then you are wrong.

Oh yeah...IMO...

thunderkyss
12-26-2012, 03:59 PM
Sounds to me like you have a gripe with the playcalling. It's not an issue of how often we throw for you, but when we throw...You want us to throw it more early...

I can get behind that...

Kubiak has done that a bit this year though...Come out throwing the ball a bunch. You are right, we look like a better team when that happens.

I only think we need to come out throwing this game, because Matt's been struggling for a while...... except that first drive.

But I don't know if we should always do that. I was most disappointed in the Vikings game, because it never happened. The game manager never said, "We've got to step up the pace here."

I've said it before, 21-0 doesn't bother me if we've got the majority of 3 qtrs to play, unless we're playing an '85 Bears type defense. But once we get to the third qtr or so..... & you only have 6 points on the board that since of urgency should kick in.

2012Champs
12-26-2012, 04:04 PM
I'm talking about play-off games and superbowls and you bring up two OT games against non-play off teams and one team fighting for the number 1 overall pick.

If you think this team can be successful with Matt throwing 40+ times, then you are wrong.

Oh yeah...IMO...




The team can win with Schaub throwing 40+ even in a playoff game. Schaub and 40+ attempts doesnt equal an automatic loss

thunderkyss
12-26-2012, 04:10 PM
The team can win with Schaub throwing 40+ even in a playoff game. Schaub and 40+ attempts doesnt equal an automatic loss

It depends on who we're playing. If we're playing the mistake prone Andrew Luck, I like our odds. If we're playing the cold-blooded Tom Brady...... not so much.

2012Champs
12-26-2012, 04:16 PM
It depends on who we're playing. If we're playing the mistake prone Andrew Luck, I like our odds. If we're playing the cold-blooded Tom Brady...... not so much.



I like to think back to our New Orleans game last year Schaub threw 39 passes one of which was an int toward the end of the game but our D gave up 3 tds to the saints on their last 3 drives to total 4 tds in the second half. Who lost the game? The Schaub haters will say it was him and I will say it sits on both the D and Schaub. Schaub didnt decide to throw 39 times but the game just went that way

Corrosion
12-26-2012, 04:56 PM
Where's the option for "Schaub is the best QB on this roster and gives the Texans the best chance to win."


Id love to upgrade Schaub .... but the reality right now is he's the best we got.

texanhead08
12-26-2012, 05:57 PM
This thread is like the moron yelling at Schaub when we ran the ball on 2nd and 12 last week.

Schaub not playing well is still a lot better option than Mr Turnover Yates.

thunderkyss
12-26-2012, 07:38 PM
Where's the option for "Schaub is the best QB on this roster and gives the Texans the best chance to win."


Id love to upgrade Schaub .... but the reality right now is he's the best we got.

I think GP's got a valid option. What if Schaub's thing is mental & a benching is just what he needs to get his head out of his colon?

I don't know if that is the problem but it is feasible.

We may lose this next game, but if Schaub catches fire again, we're better off for it in the long run.

Corrosion
12-26-2012, 07:54 PM
I think GP's got a valid option. What if Schaub's thing is mental & a benching is just what he needs to get his head out of his colon?

I don't know if that is the problem but it is feasible.

We may lose this next game, but if Schaub catches fire again, we're better off for it in the long run.

I was talking to C&D a while ago and we were talking specifically about Schaub .... I think he's been spot on with his assessment of Schaub post injury - He aint the same guy.

The longer the game and the season go along , the worse he gets. That foot injury limited the mobility of an already limited mobility guy.

I was thinking he might have an upper body injury but after discussing it with Doc .... Its pretty obvious that the foot injury is the root of his problems.

When's the last time you saw Schaub throw a jump pass or a QB sneak ? When is the last time you saw him change direction quickly ? All of his movements are subtle and planned. He simply cant get the leverage to quickly change direction with that foot he could pre-injury.

Every fear Doc had about the injury post recovery looks proven to me. Loss of explosion , unable to change direction .... He just cant plant that foot anymore and its affected the whole of his game.

That doesnt mean I'd bench Schaub because this is the "biggest game in the history of this franchise" and Schaub gives the Texans the best chance to win.


I applaud what Yates did last year .... but Schaub , despite his limitations is a better QB right now and make no mistake about it , this is a must win.The difference between needing two wins to reach the superbowl or needing three .... the difference between playing at home or traveling to NE or Denver for an AFC championship game.

2012Champs
12-27-2012, 07:31 AM
Yes that was proven last year wasn't it ..... oh wait ...


Yeah look at Yates numbers we won all of those games because if him or was it inspite of him? We avg something around 17 ppg and were winning so that tells me the D was keeping us in the game


Just to look at the numbers Yates was 110/189 6.83 avg 4 tds 6 ints 5 fumbles in 8 games. Of those 8 he only played a half in Jacksonvill and a series in Tenn so more like 6.75 games.

TheMatrix31
12-27-2012, 07:44 AM
Yeah, I like to entertain the notion of benching my starting quarterback in the final game of the season when we are trying to clinch the #1 seed and home-field throughout too.

Seems like a good idea.

2012Champs
12-27-2012, 09:53 AM
You keep looking at numbers ... I will keep watching football.



Oh I watched the games too. I just have to show you what he did because you think he did something greater than reality. In reality Yates for the most part played well enough to not cost us game. He wasnt the reason we won as many as we did with him playing

infantrycak
12-27-2012, 01:47 PM
Well there is a landslide if there ever has been one - and a lot of people abstained from voting because it was so stupid. Even Schaub haters thought this was a bad idea. Epic fail.

http://pic.epicfail.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/11/epic-sexy-costume-fail-wtf.jpg

ObsiWan
12-27-2012, 01:50 PM
No.

He's the best QB on the team.

^^^^
This.

'Nuff said.

Norg
12-27-2012, 01:50 PM
who ever made this thread whatever your smokin GIve me some LOL :koolaid:

ObsiWan
12-27-2012, 02:18 PM
Eh... sort of. I agree his play left a lot to be desired, but I think the thing to fix it is to put the game in his hands & let him know it'll be in his hands throughout the play offs. The game plan from here on out should be pass heavy. Don't sorry about balance. Quick easy passes, a few screens, a run here & there. Keep it up through the first three qtrs. Then run the crap out of it in the fourth.

I actually like where your head's at here. Use quick, Joe Montana/Tom Brady-like timing routes. Catch a DB playing 8-10 yds back on the WRs, call an audible that gets them the ball using a quick, two-step drop or employs WR or TE screen; whoever has the DB backing off. This should force the defense to spread out - maybe even take out an LB and bring in a CB. This is when we start to run delays/draws with Tate and Foster (notice I said Tate first).

We've been run-first all year except in obvious, OMG, catch-up situations; now is the time to switch it up completely and give the folks who might be facing us in the playoffs a whole new set of things to prep for. Hell, even run it out of the hurry-up just for grins.

So I say, why not? The regular stuff has looked pretty raggedy over the last month. Why not somethin' diff??

ObsiWan
12-27-2012, 02:20 PM
Well there is a landslide if there ever has been one - and a lot of people abstained from voting because it was so stupid. Even Schaub haters thought this was a bad idea. Epic fail.

http://pic.epicfail.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/11/epic-sexy-costume-fail-wtf.jpg

I-Cak, you owe me a cheezeburger and fries cause I just lost my lunch.
:D

Corrosion
12-27-2012, 06:52 PM
Cak that was disgusting. :mcnugget:

GP
12-27-2012, 07:32 PM
If Schaub ends up blowing this game...I'll be here to bring this poll up again.

If Schaub dominates, I'll be here to eat crow in public.

I have a bad feeling a lot of you are going to be unprepared for what happens this Sunday. Most of you pegged the Vikings game as a Texans win, very few thought we could lose that game.

I got that same hunch for this game. Just because you guys think the team is capable of sacking up and getting this game handled doesn't mean they will.

Matt's playing awful. We've never won in Indy. Ever. Luck and his crew will be gunning early, which won't help our team's confidence. Pretty much the only thing that will save us is the Colts laying down early enough, to save their star players, or the Texans catching some mistakes by a young Colts team.

I just don't think we're going to win this one. And Matt will be a large reason why. IMO.

Showtime100
12-27-2012, 09:47 PM
I-Cak, you owe me a cheezeburger and fries cause I just lost my lunch.
:D

Yeah, lol. I went blind, and just 1 second too late at that.

Texan_Bill
12-27-2012, 10:04 PM
I was talking to C&D a while ago and we were talking specifically about Schaub .... I think he's been spot on with his assessment of Schaub post injury - He aint the same guy.

The longer the game and the season go along , the worse he gets. That foot injury limited the mobility of an already limited mobility guy.

I was thinking he might have an upper body injury but after discussing it with Doc .... Its pretty obvious that the foot injury is the root of his problems.

When's the last time you saw Schaub throw a jump pass or a QB sneak ? When is the last time you saw him change direction quickly ? All of his movements are subtle and planned. He simply cant get the leverage to quickly change direction with that foot he could pre-injury.

Every fear Doc had about the injury post recovery looks proven to me. Loss of explosion , unable to change direction .... He just cant plant that foot anymore and its affected the whole of his game.

That doesnt mean I'd bench Schaub because this is the "biggest game in the history of this franchise" and Schaub gives the Texans the best chance to win.


I applaud what Yates did last year .... but Schaub , despite his limitations is a better QB right now and make no mistake about it , this is a must win.The difference between needing two wins to reach the superbowl or needing three .... the difference between playing at home or traveling to NE or Denver for an AFC championship game.

I was just talking to C&D......... literally a few minutes ago and he mentioned this convo.

At the end of the day, a limited Schaub is still better than a pretty good back-up in Yates.

Dutchrudder
12-27-2012, 10:17 PM
I think Schaub's problem might be the same as Arian's, he got paid. It's funny what tens of millions can do to people.

Texan_Bill
12-27-2012, 10:49 PM
I think Schaub's problem might be the same as Arian's, he got paid. It's funny what tens of millions can do to people.

WRONG!!!

What's wrong with the offense is multi-layered.

A) See the conversation with DOC Jean (aka CnD and Corrosion) about the LinsFranc injury for Schaub, and

B) Arian Foster is the, and I mean the last guy to let money get to his head..



Let's look instead to the O-Line...

Duane Brown (who I personal love and has done a great job "for a reach") had his worst game.... EVAH!!!

The right side of the O-Line.... While I love Eric Winston as a person, as a man, as a person that threw *GaryLynnFoundation* himself into charities that I participate in..... The Texans were right to release him...

Derek Newton will be just fine!! Ben Jones has stumbled at times (and the other RG who I'm forgetting) will be just fine..The problems have been, promidently on the right side, no??? (save the fact that I acknowledged Duane having a bad game on the left side)..........

NO WORRIES!!! WE GOT THIS!!!!

Corrosion
12-27-2012, 11:20 PM
I was just talking to C&D......... literally a few minutes ago and he mentioned this convo.

At the end of the day, a limited Schaub is still better than a pretty good back-up in Yates.

I dont disagree with that one bit .... I do think that they have to explore a better option going forward tho.

I think Schaub's problem might be the same as Arian's, he got paid. It's funny what tens of millions can do to people.


It aint money with Foster or Schaub ....


For Foster , the OL has been horrible. He's had to dodge defenders 3 yards deep in the backfield on many occasions ...


For Schaub , its a combination of poor protection and a gimp foot.

Go back and watch the past few games and you'll see what Im talkin about ....

Texan_Bill
12-27-2012, 11:24 PM
i dont disagree with that one bit .... I do think that they have to explore a better option going forward tho.




It aint money with foster or schaub ....


For foster , the ol has been horrible. He's had to dodge defenders 3 yards deep in the backfield on many occasions ...


For schaub , its a combination of poor protection and a gimp foot.

Go back and watch the past few games and you'll see what im talkin about ....


Jup!!!

infantrycak
12-27-2012, 11:28 PM
Yeah, lol. I went blind, and just 1 second too late at that.

Hey, you like plane photos. Roll with the roll.

Her canards are showing.

I don't think I have ever seen a bigger split tail.

Just pull the string and she drops her load.

Showtime100
12-27-2012, 11:32 PM
Hey, you like plane photos. Roll with the roll.

Her canards are showing.

I don't think I have ever seen a bigger split tail.

Just pull the string and she drops her load.

:spit: That's messed up. Funny as hell, but messed up. :D

infantrycak
12-27-2012, 11:35 PM
For Foster , the OL has been horrible. He's had to dodge defenders 3 yards deep in the backfield on many occasions ..

We have been doing much more straight up blocking. I have been mentioning this for a while. When the OL comes of just shallow of perpendicular to the line they wash people wide quickly and Foster finds a cut back. They have been doing more power blocking and when they do zone blocking they come off more in a 45 degree mix - it is kind of power and kind of zone. It doesn't get the flow going the same way. This is affecting the play action as well because the defenders aren't biting near as hard when we come of in this fashion. No idea why we are doing it but those are my thoughts.

MEGA SWATT
12-27-2012, 11:39 PM
All I know is he played like a scared little school girl in that last game. If at the first sign of pressure he fetals up against Indy his ass needs to be pulled. Kubiak needs to get in his ear and ask him how bad he wants to win. You can say what you want about the blocking up front in the Minnesota game, Schaub packed it in. He played like a :kitten:.

It's psychological- he's never played in the playoffs and fears that would happen 2 yrs in a row. That's why you see NO qb sneaks. I have no doubt that he will pick it up in the last game and play inspired in the post season.

Texan_Bill
12-27-2012, 11:58 PM
We have been doing much more straight up blocking. I have been mentioning this for a while. When the OL comes of just shallow of perpendicular to the line they wash people wide quickly and Foster finds a cut back. They have been doing more power blocking and when they do zone blocking they come off more in a 45 degree mix - it is kind of power and kind of zone. It doesn't get the flow going the same way. This is affecting the play action as well because the defenders aren't biting near as hard when we come of in this fashion. No idea why we are doing it but those are my thoughts.

Alright Crhis, not all of us went to Berkley.......... At the end of the day I can not only explain a chop block, I can demostrate it.

Any takers?? (And believe me, a true "chop block") originates well above the knee******* "IT" actually originates in the chest... Jamb 'em up...If they start to beat you... Slide down and impede their (the enemy) force on my QB...

mussop
12-28-2012, 12:51 AM
Well there is a landslide if there ever has been one - and a lot of people abstained from voting because it was so stupid. Even Schaub haters thought this was a bad idea. Epic fail.

http://pic.epicfail.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/11/epic-sexy-costume-fail-wtf.jpg

:wow:Those are the biggest CAMEL TOES i have ever seen!:headhurts::mancard:

Corrosion
12-28-2012, 12:54 AM
We have been doing much more straight up blocking. I have been mentioning this for a while. When the OL comes of just shallow of perpendicular to the line they wash people wide quickly and Foster finds a cut back. They have been doing more power blocking and when they do zone blocking they come off more in a 45 degree mix - it is kind of power and kind of zone. It doesn't get the flow going the same way. This is affecting the play action as well because the defenders aren't biting near as hard when we come of in this fashion. No idea why we are doing it but those are my thoughts.

Its not a change in design or blocking scheme .... its that they are flat out beat. Gary said as much himself in a recent address to the media.


Read into that what you will .... :cool:

Corrosion
12-28-2012, 12:55 AM
:wow:Those are the biggest CAMEL TOES i have ever seen!:headhurts::mancard:

That aint no camel toe ..... thats a drooping split belly .... nasty.

Corrosion
12-28-2012, 12:59 AM
It's psychological- he's never played in the playoffs and fears that would happen 2 yrs in a row. That's why you see NO qb sneaks. I have no doubt that he will pick it up in the last game and play inspired in the post season.

We havent seen a QB sneak all season .... fear of injury is is an excuse , the real reason is that Schaub simply cannot create the necessary leverage with the foot to explode forward.


I wish it were psychological .... cause that can be fixed , that gimp foot cant.

infantrycak
12-28-2012, 01:09 AM
Its not a change in design or blocking scheme .... its that they are flat out beat. Gary said as much himself in a recent address to the media.


Read into that what you will .... :cool:

I would like to hear what you have to link or say on this. The line has been attacking the opposing DL at a much different angle and it doesn't seem to work well.

Corrosion
12-28-2012, 01:23 AM
I would like to hear what you have to link or say on this. The line has been attacking the opposing DL at a much different angle and it doesn't seem to work well.

We're use to seeing these OLmen seal defenders off from the play or turn defenders into the wash and get to the second level in effect walling off a lane. They arent able to turn defenders into those secondary blocks and get to the second level because they are not moving the defenders laterally - they are giving ground - Most notably Wade Smith and Ben Jones.

The scheme just doesnt look right when they are giving ground and they have to abandon the technique in an attempt to "power" their way into position .... which is where you got the illusion of a power scheme.


Hope that makes sense and cleared up whats going on .... ::kubepalm:

Rey
12-28-2012, 09:31 AM
If Schaub ends up blowing this game...I'll be here to bring this poll up again.

If Schaub dominates, I'll be here to eat crow in public.

I have a bad feeling a lot of you are going to be unprepared for what happens this Sunday. Most of you pegged the Vikings game as a Texans win, very few thought we could lose that game.

I predicted a loss against the Vikings. Not because of Schaub, but because of how Kubiak teams tend to play. Matt Schuab not doing well was not something I'd have predicted, but I'm not going to say I was OMG shocked.

No need for any crow eating on anyone's part regardless of outcome. I think it's just a difference of philosophies. I don't believe we can gain anything by having Matt sit. Playing him gives us our best chance to win this game and he needs to find a rhythm before the play-offs start. I don't think it'd be wise for him to be benched and the last taste left in his mouth going into the play-offs are a couple mediocre/poor games and then a benching....

This needs to be his get well game or at least a game where he doesn't suck. The O-line needs to get their shyt together with Matt in there. Receivers need to be in there with Matt.

I don't see what Matt can gain by sitting out this game. He sat out a good chunk of last year. If he didn't relfect and mentally become a better QB at that time (or any of the other numerous games he's missed) then sitting out this 1 game that we need to win certainly won't help....IMO

Rey
12-28-2012, 09:41 AM
We're use to seeing these OLmen seal defenders off from the play or turn defenders into the wash and get to the second level in effect walling off a lane. They arent able to turn defenders into those secondary blocks and get to the second level because they are not moving the defenders laterally - they are giving ground - Most notably Wade Smith and Ben Jones.

The scheme just doesnt look right when they are giving ground and they have to abandon the technique in an attempt to "power" their way into position .... which is where you got the illusion of a power scheme.


Hope that makes sense and cleared up whats going on .... ::kubepalm:


The hardest defense to block for a ZBS is a good aggressive, get up field front. Read and react defenses are easier to block because they aren't trying to get up field really and will move laterally down the line.

When you take your initial step, if that defender is coming up field, you have to hurry and get that second foot back in the ground which shortens your angle because now instead of moving laterally you have to fight that defender from getting penetration. Add to the fact that you don't have guys that are good at power blocking and it gets ugly really fast.

Maybe we've either been playing a lot of penetrating defenses, or opposing coaches have gone to that style against us to disrupt our run game. This scheme struggles tremendously with penetration whereas a more downhill scheme can get away with having guys come through sometimes.

GP
12-28-2012, 09:42 AM
I think Schaub's problem might be the same as Arian's, he got paid. It's funny what tens of millions can do to people.

I agree.

They're not lazy. They're not arrogant. But when you get a new deal, I think psychologically you know you've just completed the "hunt." You won. Reached the top.

Then you switch into preservation mode even if you're not aware of it.

Human nature, people.

Mr teX
12-28-2012, 10:11 AM
We havent seen a QB sneak all season .... fear of injury is is an excuse , the real reason is that Schaub simply cannot create the necessary leverage with the foot to explode forward.


I wish it were psychological .... cause that can be fixed , that gimp foot cant.

This makes zero sense. you need just as much if not more explosion to get out from under center when taking the snap.....with Schaub, he probably needs even more than normal b/c he's squatting so low to recieve the snap...like he's damn near sitting down under center....

ObsiWan
12-28-2012, 10:16 AM
Originally Posted by GP http://www.texanstalk.com/forums/images/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.texanstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?p=2089384#post2089384)
If Schaub ends up blowing this game...I'll be here to bring this poll up again.

If Schaub dominates, I'll be here to eat crow in public.

I have a bad feeling a lot of you are going to be unprepared for what happens this Sunday. Most of you pegged the Vikings game as a Texans win, very few thought we could lose that game.


I predicted a loss against the Vikings. Not because of Schaub, but because of how Kubiak teams tend to play. Matt Schuab not doing well was not something I'd have predicted, but I'm not going to say I was OMG shocked.

No need for any crow eating on anyone's part regardless of outcome. I think it's just a difference of philosophies. I don't believe we can gain anything by having Matt sit. Playing him gives us our best chance to win this game and he needs to find a rhythm before the play-offs start. I don't think it'd be wise for him to be benched and the last taste left in his mouth going into the play-offs are a couple mediocre/poor games and then a benching....

This needs to be his get well game or at least a game where he doesn't suck. The O-line needs to get their shyt together with Matt in there. Receivers need to be in there with Matt.

I don't see what Matt can gain by sitting out this game. He sat out a good chunk of last year. If he didn't reflect and mentally become a better QB at that time (or any of the other numerous games he's missed) then sitting out this 1 game that we need to win certainly won't help....IMO

My thoughts exactly, Rey. This ain't about whether making Schaub "stand in the corner" is the right move/punishment/motivation or whatever. Everyone, coaches on down, all three phases, needs to sharpen up their game. It's time to step-the-hell UP.

Kubiak knows this (http://www.houstontexans.com/news/article-2/Quotes-Thursday-practice/340e7ae4-0cc2-4774-b745-2909f032ada7). I hope the team is listening.
(on the importance of momentum and taking it to the next level in the playoffs) ďItís huge. I think in this league with where this franchise started and what it was trying to become and where it was trying to work to get to, they worked extremely hard. Itís in a good place right now from that standpoint, but once you get there, there is another level. There is another level that you play the game at. There is another level of expectations. There is another level of responsibility. Thatís why you see a lot of the same people in the playoffs all the time. Thatís why you look year in and year out and you see a lot of the same quarterbacks, a lot of the same players, a lot of the teams, a lot of the same organizations because they find ways to raise that level. To me thatís the next step for this organization so weíre pushing hard to be a part of that and prove that we can play at that level when the time comes.Ē

Yeah... he knows. But he and Wade can preach that message until they're blue in the face. The players have got to go thru it to really GET it. Hopefully, that happened last year when the Ravens bumped them out of the playoffs.

We'll see.

GP
12-28-2012, 10:39 AM
This makes zero sense. you need just as much if not more explosion to get out from under center when taking the snap.....with Schaub, he probably needs even more than normal b/c he's squatting so low to recieve the snap...like he's damn near sitting down under center....

Not entirely correct, IMO.

When backpedaling away from the center, Matt can (in theory) put more weight on his good foot and take a lot of stress off the bad foot. We do it all the time when we're gimpy...we'll favor one foot over the other and make it do more work in order to reduce the stress on the other foot.

I don't think backpedaling away from the center is in the same universe as driving forward and trying to push and move players (in a QB sneak situation).

In a QB sneak movement, you're having to alternate putting extremely high levels of torque on each foot as you drive forward. If he tried to only drive forward with one foot, while not putting stress on the other one, he'd get nowhere (which is why he probably doesn't do it).

The guy was immobile prior to the injury, it's plainly obvious his mobility has been reduced. I have always said, and it looks to be proven more true the past 4 weeks, that Matt Schaub is a great QB if he has time to throw and the coverage is favorable to him. When the coverage is good, when he doesn't have time to stand in one spot in the pocket, he crumbles.

He's been slowly regressing the last half of this season. We're down to ONE game to win HFA, and he's shown me no reason why he's going to snap out of his funk in THIS game. If anything, I think he's going to reach new lows in this upcoming game.

I think he'll end up getting pulled by Kubiak...partly because he'll have been struggling early on AND partly because Kubiak will be able to reason that he needs to save Schaub for the playoffs.

The guy is reaching Kris Brown syndrome levels, IMO. Unreliable in even the smallest of tasks. Even the easy throws are "off." His teammates look extremely dejected and play accordingly, btw. It's become a noose around this team's neck.

jaayteetx
12-28-2012, 10:42 AM
So many silly threads right now, I keep wanting to say "silliest thread ever" but oops, up pops another one...

coltfan123
12-28-2012, 11:06 AM
Well there is a landslide if there ever has been one - and a lot of people abstained from voting because it was so stupid. Even Schaub haters thought this was a bad idea. Epic fail.

http://pic.epicfail.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/11/epic-sexy-costume-fail-wtf.jpg

puked in my mouth a little lol

ObsiWan
12-28-2012, 11:31 AM
Not entirely correct, IMO.

When backpedaling away from the center, Matt can (in theory) put more weight on his good foot and take a lot of stress off the bad foot. We do it all the time when we're gimpy...we'll favor one foot over the other and make it do more work in order to reduce the stress on the other foot.

I don't think backpedaling away from the center is in the same universe as driving forward and trying to push and move players (in a QB sneak situation).

In a QB sneak movement, you're having to alternate putting extremely high levels of torque on each foot as you drive forward. If he tried to only drive forward with one foot, while not putting stress on the other one, he'd get nowhere (which is why he probably doesn't do it).

The guy was immobile prior to the injury, it's plainly obvious his mobility has been reduced. I have always said, and it looks to be proven more true the past 4 weeks, that Matt Schaub is a great QB if he has time to throw and the coverage is favorable to him. When the coverage is good, when he doesn't have time to stand in one spot in the pocket, he crumbles.

You should have stopped typing HERE. Your theories are based on sound logic and fairly accurate observation.

He's been slowly regressing the last half of this season. We're down to ONE game to win HFA, and he's shown me no reason why he's going to snap out of his funk in THIS game. If anything, I think he's going to reach new lows in this upcoming game.

I think he'll end up getting pulled by Kubiak...partly because he'll have been struggling early on AND partly because Kubiak will be able to reason that he needs to save Schaub for the playoffs.

The guy is reaching Kris Brown syndrome levels, IMO. Unreliable in even the smallest of tasks. Even the easy throws are "off." His teammates look extremely dejected and play accordingly, btw. It's become a noose around this team's neck.
In these last three paragraphs you're projecting your own inner fears onto the whole team. You're scared Schaub will screw the pooch.

This is time of year to really get worried that all the other teams see the same warts we fans do and will use them against us.

We get it.

The only thing that semi eases my mind is, the other teams have warts too.

Thorn
12-28-2012, 11:42 AM
You're scared Schaub will screw the pooch.
We get it.

Depending on whose pooch he screws, he could be in really big trouble. :eek:

El Tejano
12-28-2012, 11:46 AM
I happen to think dude has been worried about the DE he's playing. Freeney always used to sack him and cause a fumble, and that dude from Minn. once took out his knee.

utahmark
12-28-2012, 12:11 PM
Yes - lets sit our probowl Quarterback in the most important regular season game we have ever played. :wadepalm:

thunderkyss
12-28-2012, 12:30 PM
Yes - lets sit our probowl Quarterback in the most important regular season game we have ever played. :wadepalm:

What if his foot is the problem, as has been suggested in other threads?

What if he sits this week, allows his foot to heal. Then we have the bye next week.

Since last Sunday, that would be three weeks he'll have to "get healthy"

Of course we'd have to beat the Colts with Tj Yates, or hope the Broncos lose to the Chiefs.

However, with three weeks of rest, what if we can have a Matt Schaub that is closer to that guy that beat the Broncos earlier this season? What if he would be able to play at that level for 2 weeks. Then the extra time off before the Super Bowl allows him to recoup again?

What if sitting Matt Schaub helps us get the most ready to play Matt Schaub for the Play Offs & the Super Bowl?

Mr teX
12-28-2012, 01:47 PM
Not entirely correct, IMO.

When backpedaling away from the center, Matt can (in theory) put more weight on his good foot and take a lot of stress off the bad foot. We do it all the time when we're gimpy...we'll favor one foot over the other and make it do more work in order to reduce the stress on the other foot.

I don't think backpedaling away from the center is in the same universe as driving forward and trying to push and move players (in a QB sneak situation).

In a QB sneak movement, you're having to alternate putting extremely high levels of torque on each foot as you drive forward. If he tried to only drive forward with one foot, while not putting stress on the other one, he'd get nowhere (which is why he probably doesn't do it).

The guy was immobile prior to the injury, it's plainly obvious his mobility has been reduced. I have always said, and it looks to be proven more true the past 4 weeks, that Matt Schaub is a great QB if he has time to throw and the coverage is favorable to him. When the coverage is good, when he doesn't have time to stand in one spot in the pocket, he crumbles.

He's been slowly regressing the last half of this season. We're down to ONE game to win HFA, and he's shown me no reason why he's going to snap out of his funk in THIS game. If anything, I think he's going to reach new lows in this upcoming game.

I think he'll end up getting pulled by Kubiak...partly because he'll have been struggling early on AND partly because Kubiak will be able to reason that he needs to save Schaub for the playoffs.

The guy is reaching Kris Brown syndrome levels, IMO. Unreliable in even the smallest of tasks. Even the easy throws are "off." His teammates look extremely dejected and play accordingly, btw. It's become a noose around this team's neck.

This whole post is....where do i begin.

Schaub's lis-franc injury happened to his right foot....which is not the foot he would use to push off from under center as a right-handed qb on a normal pass play. If a right handed qb tried to use his right foot to explode from under center it would make it very difficult...if not impossible to open up correctly with any kind of fluidity on their drops. it's like a lay-up.. If you'r going for a right-sided lay-up, you use you left foot & vice versa for a left-sided lay-up. So no, he couldn't use his other foot to explode from under center.

He'd need the explosion and torque from under center i spoke of in my initial post to gain/maintain the momentum from the initial burst from under center..this would be difficult for him....if what cloak is saying is true. Me personally i don't see much of a difference in his drops or mobility....he's slow & he's always been slow.

Your theory would actually work better with qb sneaks b/c qb's most times aren't looking to get 5 yd gains off of them. They're just looking for a few inches or so between the center & 1 of the guards to fall into so they can get down as fast as possible..there's hardly much explosion, driving torque,whatever, needed b/c they're already leaning forward when they're under center. In addition to this, most qb's stagger their feet when they're under center to help them get from under center better & if you're only looking for a few inches to a yard, that's basically a fall forward with the right avenue.

IlliniJen
12-28-2012, 02:16 PM
What if his foot is the problem, as has been suggested in other threads?

What if he sits this week, allows his foot to heal. Then we have the bye next week.

Since last Sunday, that would be three weeks he'll have to "get healthy"

Of course we'd have to beat the Colts with Tj Yates, or hope the Broncos lose to the Chiefs.

However, with three weeks of rest, what if we can have a Matt Schaub that is closer to that guy that beat the Broncos earlier this season? What if he would be able to play at that level for 2 weeks. Then the extra time off before the Super Bowl allows him to recoup again?

What if sitting Matt Schaub helps us get the most ready to play Matt Schaub for the Play Offs & the Super Bowl?

There is no official word or indication that Matt's foot is a big problem.

You can not rest him for three weeks if you do not EARN a bye week by beating the Colts.

We have to beat the Colts to put ourselves in the best position to be successful in the post season. HFA is huge for this team, probably moreso than any other team other than the Seahawks right now.

This idea of sitting Schaub unless we're winning by a good margin is just silliness. This is the game that has the most pressure this season; this is a statement game for this team. This is for HFA. This is no time for getting cute and dicking around with who sits or starts, regardless of niggling injuries or perceived weaknesses at the QB position.

thunderkyss
12-28-2012, 06:19 PM
This idea of sitting Schaub unless we're winning by a good margin is just silliness. This is the game that has the most pressure this season; this is a statement game for this team. This is for HFA. This is no time for getting cute and dicking around with who sits or starts, regardless of niggling injuries or perceived weaknesses at the QB position.

Hey, I'm just trying to support my good buddy GP..... don't want him to be the only one with his hand up.

ObsiWan
12-28-2012, 06:58 PM
Hey, I'm just trying to support my good buddy GP..... don't want him to be the only one with his hand up.

Sometimes the best way to help a buddy is to steer him away from an errant path... even though I know his heart is in the right place. GP was just trying to find SOMETHING to turn around this streak of sucky play. He thinks sitting Schaub will do it. I'm for making Schaub fight his way out of this funk. Can't do that from the bench.

CloakNNNdagger
12-28-2012, 07:42 PM
Just heard an interview of Texans QB coach Karl Dorrell. When asked about Yates, he had very noticeably luke warm responses. Then when asked about Case Keenum's progress........he just lavished it on. Paraphrased to the best of my recollection:

He has shown great grasp of the position since he came here. He previously had little experience under center. He now looks extremely comfortable under center in a short period of time. He has a remarkably strong arm, certainly strong enough for the long ball. We have elevated the takeoff of his passes, which in the NFL is very important, especially with his height.....and he has adapted to it to very well. I can hardly wait to work with him during the offseason in an even more concentrated fashion.

Rey
12-28-2012, 08:10 PM
Just heard an interview of Texans QB coach Karl Dorrell. When asked about Yates, he had very noticeably luke warm responses. Then when asked about Case Keenum's progress........he just lavished it on. Paraphrased to the best of my recollection:

He has shown great grasp of the position since he came here. He previously had little experience under center. He now looks extremely comfortable under center in a short period of time. He has a remarkably strong arm, certainly strong enough for the long ball. We have elevated the takeoff of his passes, which in the NFL is very important, especially with his height.....and he has adapted to it to very well. I can hardly wait to work with him during the offseason in an even more concentrated fashion.

Good to hear.

Thorn
12-28-2012, 08:17 PM
I would just LOVE it if Case Keenum turned out to be the real deal. Hopefully we don't have a reason to find that out until next season though.

TheMatrix31
12-29-2012, 06:52 AM
It would be awesome if Keenum is indeed that far along and we could try to trade Yates for a decent pick.

GP
12-29-2012, 10:25 AM
There have other times when I've stepped out and said ABC and everyone laughed at me and told me XYZ.

Then ABC happens...

So I'm not discouraged by the poll nor the responses.

I don't form and state opinions to see how much applause I can receive, I'm calling it how I see it...and I'm saying that Schaub is not fighting his way out of a wet paper sack. Not sure if he can tomorrow either.

It's all good. There's been a lot of unnecessary name calling against me, which IMO exposes those posters' lack of character. For those who kept it classy, Thank You.

ObsiWan
12-29-2012, 08:50 PM
There have other times when I've stepped out and said ABC and everyone laughed at me and told me XYZ.

Then ABC happens...

So I'm not discouraged by the poll nor the responses.

I don't form and state opinions to see how much applause I can receive, I'm calling it how I see it...and I'm saying that Schaub is not fighting his way out of a wet paper sack. Not sure if he can tomorrow either.

It's all good. There's been a lot of unnecessary name calling against me, which IMO exposes those posters' lack of character. For those who kept it classy, Thank You.

Like I said, I recognize Schaub's play has fallen off in recent weeks and something needs to turn that around. What that "something" might be is where we disagree.
It's all good.

HJam72
12-30-2012, 11:42 AM
There have other times when I've stepped out and said ABC and everyone laughed at me and told me XYZ.

Then ABC happens...

So I'm not discouraged by the poll nor the responses.

I don't form and state opinions to see how much applause I can receive, I'm calling it how I see it...and I'm saying that Schaub is not fighting his way out of a wet paper sack. Not sure if he can tomorrow either.

It's all good. There's been a lot of unnecessary name calling against me, which IMO exposes those posters' lack of character. For those who kept it classy, Thank You.

Thanks, prick-hole. :jk:

GP
12-30-2012, 03:06 PM
I'm the maddest I have been since the end of the 2010 season.

I've gone 2 years without totally breaking down and just being seething angry over anything that the Texans have done.

To watch this team accomplish win after win, over and over, all season long...to then see two guys--Kubiak and Schaub--basically ruin it for the other players and coaches.

What do you do when the team's ultimate "leaders," the HC and the QB merge into ONE person and melt down into a pile of piss-covered snow right before your eyes...progressively...for the last half of the season???

I don't know if Matt should have been benched. I think it would not have hurt anything for him to be sat for at least the first half, though. The game might have taken on a whole different complexion, though, had Yates been in there. At worst, it would 14-0 at half. And that's taking into consideration that we're predicting Yates couldn't lead us into FG range even one time in the first half.

But do you think so? Is it really far-fetched to think Yates would be worse than Schaub was today? I dunno. I've sensed that the HC and the QB were completely out of sync and ruining this team. It's now happened.

I'm so mad. And none of the media will take Kubiak to task. He's insulated. Nobody will disturb the Great and Powerful Oz. Just don't look him in the eyes, just ask him the easy questions. Let him say "It's on me." And move on.

Mr teX
12-30-2012, 03:09 PM
Im not even mad anymore they've been looking like this since the lions game...i've slowly been removing my feelings away from this team knowing that they're more than likely 1 and done...that way it wont hurt so bad if they do lose the first game.

Rey
12-30-2012, 03:13 PM
I'd be perfectly fine with Yates starting the first play off game. Won't happen. Schaub can still do some good things, but it's clear he has big time limitations from an ability standpoint.

eriadoc
12-30-2012, 03:15 PM
So hindsight being 20/20, should Schaub have watched from the sidelines?

THAT should be the new poll LOL.

Corrosion
12-30-2012, 03:29 PM
So hindsight being 20/20, should Schaub have watched from the sidelines?

THAT should be the new poll LOL.

He shoulda watched from his couch .... along with his OL. :texanbill: