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AndyWin
12-25-2012, 02:30 AM
Of all starting quarterbacks, I would honestly take any of the below over Schaub in a heartbeat at this point in their respective careers. Can you guys really argue Schaub over any of these guys?

None of our 12 wins stand out at all. @ Denver while they were adjusting early on. Baltimore has proven to be not as good as advertised. Same with Chicago.
Schaub will NEVER be the leader this team needs in primetime and when games matter most. If this team gets down by 2+ scores, we're fuc*ed... All of our wins come from defensive forced turnovers and scores or Arian Foster playing very well to where any QB could come in with a playaction call.

Back to that list:

Tom Brady
Peyton Manning
Big Ben
Andrew Luck
Tony Romo (pains me to even say this, but I would because he at least tries to make plays and can make plays with feet and arm)
Eli Manning
RG III
Jay Cutler (similar to Romo... at least he tries to make plays and can with feet and arm)
Matthew Stafford
Aaron Rodgers
Matt Ryan
Drew Brees
Russell Wilson
Ryan Tannehill

coon
12-25-2012, 04:19 AM
Pump the brakes there buddy, I am all for upgrading Schaub but that list does not include Tannehill, Stafford, or Cutler.

welsh texan
12-25-2012, 09:13 AM
We're in an era where there are some extremely good QB's around the league while only a few years ago we had the likes of Rex Grossman starting on good teams. That puts what you are saying into perspective somewhat.

I'd add Romo to the disagree list too, he tries to make plays when he's chasing and it hurts his team when it doesn't come off.

4 players come off your list, another 3 are rookies/second year, who's development can't be judged and suddenly you are putting Schaub in the top 10.

Even with the full crazy list you quote he's top half of the league.

Schaub is best as a game manager who can get the ball to a good set of receivers. Andre is back to his best but Walter has dropped off and there is a number of inexperienced guys at WR looking to take over the #2 role. We lost an excellent #2 TE and RZ threat in dreessen, half our Oline, it'll take time to adjust.

I'm all for looking to upgrade Schaub through the draft, even throwing fairly high draft picks at the position, but we couldn't afford Manning or Brees, I doubt we could even afford someone on Schaub's level without a bit of hometown discount.

This place has had a sky is falling mentality ever since free agency last year, I've not been able to post recently but I've been watching and its been crazy some of the **** thats being thrown about, the team has achieved everything that could have been expected of it over the regular season and they have a great chance in the playoffs.

Schaub has been a big part of that, but he's not on the level where he can throw the team on his back, when he plays well he can maximise the talent around him. So yeah, maybe he needs to play up to his own ability when the playoffs start but its too early to start slating him yet.

Premier
12-25-2012, 10:58 AM
Pump the brakes there buddy, I am all for upgrading Schaub but that list does not include Tannehill, Stafford, or Cutler.

stafford has a rocket arm, big-play ability, and is a very tough qb ...he is an absolute upgrade over schaub in every way, shape, and form.. i get cutler, hes been in shannys system before, and is a bit of a whiny *****. the jury is still going to be out on tannehill. but no to stafford, really?? i would add cam & rivers to that list as well. the sooner you embrace the fact that the texans system creates good qbs you will realize that the qbs people think perform below average elsewhere, would thrive here..

GP
12-25-2012, 11:14 AM
The title of the thread is something I have been saying a lot lately.

Our head coach was a career backup QB, who sat behind an all-world QB (Elway), holding a clipboard and eventually becoming a coach.

Now this guy has a career backup, Schaub, who is JUST like him...except now Gary gets to control Matt (a starter by Kubiak's standard) and IMO it's like the parent who lives vicariously through his son's talents.

When your HC and your QB are practically the SAME PERSON, you're screwed unless you were a great QB and your QB you're coaching is great too.

Unfortunately we have a HC who has hit his ceiling, and his QB has hit that same ceiling with him. The good news is that both of those guys got big new deals with the Texans, so we get to watch them play with one another for, oh, another 3 or 4 years. Fantastic!

klockWork
12-25-2012, 11:30 AM
Of all starting quarterbacks, I would honestly take any of the below over Schaub in a heartbeat at this point in their respective careers. Can you guys really argue Schaub over any of these guys?

None of our 12 wins stand out at all. @ Denver while they were adjusting early on. Baltimore has proven to be not as good as advertised. Same with Chicago.
Schaub will NEVER be the leader this team needs in primetime and when games matter most. If this team gets down by 2+ scores, we're fuc*ed... All of our wins come from defensive forced turnovers and scores or Arian Foster playing very well to where any QB could come in with a playaction call.

Back to that list:

Tom Brady
Peyton Manning
Big Ben
Andrew Luck
Tony Romo (pains me to even say this, but I would because he at least tries to make plays and can make plays with feet and arm)
Eli Manning
RG III
Jay Cutler (similar to Romo... at least he tries to make plays and can with feet and arm)
Matthew Stafford
Aaron Rodgers
Matt Ryan
Drew Brees
Russell Wilson
Ryan Tannehill

Agreed. I would add Philip Rivers on that list. And definitely Romo. Those two in these system playing with AJ, Foster, Daniel is a salivating scenario.
I know people here will bury guys like that because they take too much risky throws. I love QB that take risks. Sure, they would throw more ints than Schaub. Sure, they will lose us games with those kind of throws. But I could still see someone like Rivers and Romo winning more games for us than a guy with a live-to-fight-another-day approach.

If you take away Brett Favre gun-slinging mentality and put in Matt Schaub safe mental-like approach there's no way Favre is a hall-of-famer. There's no way David Tyrese get that opportunity to make that spectacular catch in the Giants SB.

As a crew in this sinking ship I rather see my captain go down in his ship while fighting off his enemies.
Sadly with Schaub, he's fighting his enemies with one foot in a lifeboat.

-"The progress of civilization through out times are made by men who take risks."

John F. Kennedy
1968


14 months later we had men on the moon.

Big Lou
12-25-2012, 11:40 AM
Can we merge all the "Shaub Sucks" threads?

Just an FYI our cap situation won't allow US to bring a big name in through trade or FA. Oh and let's remember where Shaub ranks compared to the last franchise QB we drafted. Great QB's aren't growing on trees, and anyone not named Brees, P. Manning, or Brady have serious flaws as well.

Its good to vent but let's do it with some perspective.

Wolf
12-25-2012, 11:44 AM
Lou, it seems to be the season of griping about everything. I honestly think I saw less griping 3 years ago

Either that or I learned to take a couple of breaths ,count to 10 , and relax a bit

Lucky
12-25-2012, 11:44 AM
-"The progress of civilization through out times are made by men who take risks."

John F. Kennedy


14 months later we had men on the moon.
There's something wrong with that timeline.

Schaub must play better than he did last week. That performance is unacceptable going forward. The past 5 AFC champs had a 1st round bye. This game is a must win for the Texans championship aspirations.

GP
12-25-2012, 12:00 PM
Can we merge all the "Shaub Sucks" threads?

Just an FYI our cap situation won't allow US to bring a big name in through trade or FA. Oh and let's remember where Shaub ranks compared to the last franchise QB we drafted. Great QB's aren't growing on trees, and anyone not named Brees, P. Manning, or Brady have serious flaws as well.

Its good to vent but let's do it with some perspective.

I don't think most people have pipe dreams of getting some new dazzling QB.

Rather, people are waking up and realizing that Schaub is it. He's it. That's all. Few QBs in the NFL can overcome bad OL play, a lackluster run game, or WRs dropping passes. Matt has had games where he's encountered one, or more, or all of those circumstances. He can't overcome it.

I'm at peace with it. It's terminal. Nothing we can do about it.

I think what I'm seeing is most of the long-timers here, they've seen this team at all stages...they've been in on all the conversations going all the way back to 2002 and onward...they're knowledgable enough to see the writing on the wall, and they're speaking up.

There's less hatred and anger now than there was after the 2-14 season. There's less anger and hatred and vitriol here now than there was after the 2010 season. After Carr had his one year under Kubiak here.

No, there's nothing more here--right now--than sort of that gut feeling that this team is on borrowed time. What will happen in 2013 for this team? Who knows. The hunch is that they'll make a few good draft choices, they'll get Cushing back, and yet where does it all go once the playoffs draw near next season? Probably the same outcome. Or, the Colts pass us by.

Inevitably is not my fault. Not the fault of bad fans. It is what it is.

EllisUnit
12-25-2012, 12:46 PM
Funny how fast everyone forgets Schaubs 2008 thru 2010 seasons. When we had one of the top passing teams in the league but no defense to back it up. Has schaub looked bad (as of late) hell yeah he has, but I wouldn't write him off just yet. What is he like 17-3 in his last 20 starts ? Give me a break

There's more to the story than it being just schaub who isn't playing well.

kiwitexansfan
12-25-2012, 12:47 PM
Unless your list includes more than 32 QBs, your thread title is invalid.

Kaiser Toro
12-25-2012, 12:49 PM
We are getting close to an all encompassing Schaub thread.

HJam72
12-25-2012, 12:54 PM
Unless your list includes more than 32 QBs, your thread title is invalid.

There you go. Finding somebody AVAILABLE that's better than Schaub is not a cakewalk. Maybe we draft somebody after next year. I hear this year's QBs are nothing to get excited about.

Mr teX
12-25-2012, 01:08 PM
There you go. Finding somebody AVAILABLE that's better than Schaub is not a cakewalk. Maybe we draft somebody after next year. I hear this year's QBs are nothing to get excited about.

Its not even about someone available. i think most here know deep down there's noone out in FA that's worth a damn. the problem is People see whats going this year with RG3, luck and wilson and just think that its a sinch to go out and draft a franchise altering qb and that's so far from the case.

2 of those guys went 1..2 in the draft. The other guy had every team in the league pass on him twice before he was selected. Between luck/rg3 and wilson there were 3 other qb's taken that haven't shown much of any promise that they'll be franchise altering guys.

So Where this notion comes from that its so easy to land a franchise qb in the draft is beyond me.

Big Lou
12-25-2012, 01:11 PM
I don't think most people have pipe dreams of getting some new dazzling QB.

Rather, people are waking up and realizing that Schaub is it. He's it. That's all. Few QBs in the NFL can overcome bad OL play, a lackluster run game, or WRs dropping passes. Matt has had games where he's encountered one, or more, or all of those circumstances. He can't overcome it.

I'm at peace with it. It's terminal. Nothing we can do about it.

I think what I'm seeing is most of the long-timers here, they've seen this team at all stages...they've been in on all the conversations going all the way back to 2002 and onward...they're knowledgable enough to see the writing on the wall, and they're speaking up.

There's less hatred and anger now than there was after the 2-14 season. There's less anger and hatred and vitriol here now than there was after the 2010 season. After Carr had his one year under Kubiak here.

No, there's nothing more here--right now--than sort of that gut feeling that this team is on borrowed time. What will happen in 2013 for this team? Who knows. The hunch is that they'll make a few good draft choices, they'll get Cushing back, and yet where does it all go once the playoffs draw near next season? Probably the same outcome. Or, the Colts pass us by.

Inevitably is not my fault. Not the fault of bad fans. It is what it is.

I agree.

Time to run what you brung....

Shaub is what he is but he does do some good, I think some folks are acting as if he is Gabbert or something. Shaub has his short comings for sure, but the OL and playcallling have been underwhelming as of late. We should have run somemscreens to slow down the Vikings DL. Kubiak is either holding back, or has lost his touch on offense.

GP
12-25-2012, 01:16 PM
We are getting close to an all encompassing Schaub thread.

And we know what THAT means...

:bag:

mussop
12-25-2012, 01:27 PM
Its not even about someone available. i think most here know deep down there's noone out in FA that's worth a damn. the problem is People see whats going this year with RG3, luck and wilson and just think that its a sinch to go out and draft a franchise altering qb and that's so far from the case.

2 of those guys went 1..2 in the draft. The other guy had every team in the league pass on him twice before he was selected. Between luck/rg3 and wilson there were 3 other qb's taken that haven't shown much of any promise that they'll be franchise altering guys.

So Where this notion comes from that its so easy to land a franchise qb in the draft is beyond me.

Ok you dirty little squirrel you. Show one post that suggest we need to replace Schaub with a "FRANCHISE" QB. You can't! No one thinks we're going to just be able to replace Sloth Schaub over night with a "FRANCHISE" QB.

We just want someone better than Schaub. That is no where near as hard as finding a "FRANCHISE" QB.

Norg
12-25-2012, 01:32 PM
pretty much all thoes QB;s wont be avabile

the draft clas and F/a class next year kinda sucks so right now we only hvae 3 qb's right now

Matt yates and keenum better like one of thoes 3 because thats all ur going to see right now

klockWork
12-25-2012, 01:32 PM
What is he like 17-3 in his last 20 starts ? Give me a break

There's more to the story than it being just schaub who isn't playing well.

You think teams in the playoff care about a QB with 17-3 record with zero playoff games?
The Texans are like that big kid that bully everyone at the beginning of the school year. Then words got out that bully got punked in gym class. Then later it happen again during band practice. And again while getting off the school bus. Now prom is coming up. Someone there is gonna make a statement to that punk kid by dumping a big bowl of fruit punch over his head.

That's where I stand with the Texans. When playoff comes it could get embarrassing and pathetic.

mussop
12-25-2012, 01:33 PM
I agree.

Time to run what you brung....

Shaub is what he is but he does do some good, I think some folks are acting as if he is Gabbert or something. Shaub has his short comings for sure, but the OL and playcallling have been underwhelming as of late. We should have run somemscreens to slow down the Vikings DL. Kubiak is either holding back, or has lost his touch on offense.


No doubt we are going to run with it this year AND next. Unless we win teh Super Bowl this year or Schaub suddenly starts lighting it up we need to start looking for his eventual replacement.

mussop
12-25-2012, 01:35 PM
pretty much all thoes QB;s wont be avabile

the draft clas and F/a class next year kinda sucks so right now we only hvae 3 qb's right now

Matt yates and keenum better like one of thoes 3 because thats all ur going to see right now

So you think there are no better prospects in the draft/FA than Keenam or Yates or Schaub?

Norg
12-25-2012, 01:38 PM
So you think there are no better prospects in the draft/FA than Keenam or Yates or Schaub?


not in the 3rd and 4th rounds its kinda a gamble or wash this year and thoes rounds with qb's

but we might draft a QB in the draft next year but it prob wont be in the 1st and 2nd

and thats not really gonna help our team it will be another project

Mr teX
12-25-2012, 01:38 PM
Ok you dirty little squirrel you. Show one post that suggest we need to replace Schaub with a "FRANCHISE" QB. You can't! No one thinks we're going to just be able to replace Sloth Schaub over night with a "FRANCHISE" QB.

We just want someone better than Schaub. That is no where near as hard as finding a "FRANCHISE" QB.

Lol, Most everyone here agrees that schaub is a "good" qb... so if you're looking for someone better than him and you want to upgrade from good..what would you call the next step up from good?

Great?

Elite?

Franchise altering?

Those are terms that all pretty much mean the same thing nitwit!

Rey
12-25-2012, 01:38 PM
Funny how fast everyone forgets Schaubs 2008 thru 2010 seasons. When we had one of the top passing teams in the league but no defense to back it up.

John kitna had a few seasons where he passed for a bunch of yards too.

I'm pretty sure there are a bunch of mediocre qb's that have passed for a lot of yards.

And the 17-3 stat is misleading. The team overall has gotten better. The qb is the same, maybe less mobile. What was his record the years prior?

mussop
12-25-2012, 01:53 PM
Lol, Most everyone here agrees that schaub is a "good" qb... so if you're looking for someone better than him and you want to upgrade from good..what would you call the next step up from good?

Great?

Elite?

Franchise altering?

Those are terms that all pretty much mean the same thing nitwit!

Does anyone else smell that? Smells like poo!

next step up from good is ready, ready, wait for it,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,Above average with a hint of mobility.

GP
12-25-2012, 01:55 PM
LOL. :clap:

Rey
12-25-2012, 01:59 PM
Lol, Most everyone here agrees that schaub is a "good" qb... so if you're looking for someone better than him and you want to upgrade from good..what would you call the next step up from good?

Great?

Elite?

Franchise altering?

Those are terms that all pretty much mean the same thing nitwit!

See, this is where the disconnect is.

Schaub would make a really good back up qb. Not going to take a lot of risk, not going to do anything crazy, knows what he's doing, pretty accurate with his feet set. If your starter gets hurt you aren't worried to death because you have a back up qb that can come in and do good things.....BUT, he's not a play maker. Third and longs get a lot harder...redozone offense isn't the same...you don't feel as good about how the offense will do in crunch time...

The reason people want a guy like romo over schaub is because he can make plays schaub can't. Thats it.

Decision making and all that stuff is somewhat coachable. Being mobile, having a better arm, evading defenders in the pocket, consistently being able to zip passes...you can do it or you can't...and Matt schaub can't. He never will be able to. This is his ceiling.

I think people want to see what kubiak and this offense could do with a guy with those skills. Last year we saw a glimpse of it with a fifth round rookie. And despite what everyone says, he did ok for himself.

The question is not who is better than schaub, it's who can we find with Yates like tools, but a better player.

I think if you take a guy like romo or cutler in this offense they'd do better than schaub. They have better tools. Their decisions might be more risky, but it's a trade off and you hope/think that the overall results would be better.


If you put all the qb's in the NFL in a draft and you are picking, schaub is not going in the top 15. Depending on who is picking, maybe not top 20... He'd be a starter for someone, but I almost guarantee they'd be looking for a young back up with better tools to groom.

mussop
12-25-2012, 02:03 PM
See, this is where the disconnect is.

Schaub would make a really good back up qb. Not going to take a lot of risk, not going to do anything crazy, knows what he's doing, pretty accurate with his feet set. If your starter gets hurt you aren't worried to death because you have a back up qb that can come in and do good things.....BUT, he's not a play maker. Third and longs get a lot harder...redozone offense isn't the same...you don't feel as good about how the offense will do in crunch time...

The reason people want a guy like romo over schaub is because he can make plays schaub can't. Thats it.

Decision making and all that stuff is somewhat coachable. Being mobile, having a better arm, evading defenders in the pocket, consistently being able to zip passes...you can do it or you can't...and Matt schaub can't. He never will be able to. This is his ceiling.

I think people want to see what kubiak and this offense could do with a guy with those skills. Last year we saw a glimpse of it with a fifth round rookie. And despite what everyone says, he did ok for himself.

The question is not who is better than schaub, it's who can we find with Yates like tools, but a better player.

I think if you take a guy like romo or cutler in this offense they'd do better than schaub. They have better tools. Their decisions might be more risky, but it's a trade off and you hope/think that the overall results would be better.


If you put all the qb's in the NFL in a draft and you are picking, schaub is not going in the top 15. Depending on who is picking, maybe not top 20... He'd be a starter for someone, but I almost guarantee they'd be looking for a young back up with better tools to groom.

GREAT POST REY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:perfect10:

MSR

Mr teX
12-25-2012, 02:13 PM
Does anyone else smell that? Smells like poo!

next step up from good is ready, ready, wait for it,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,Above average with a hint of mobility.

Asinine post..if your good you're already above average.

Texecutioner
12-25-2012, 02:29 PM
Funny how fast everyone forgets Schaubs 2008 thru 2010 seasons. When we had one of the top passing teams in the league but no defense to back it up. Has schaub looked bad (as of late) hell yeah he has, but I wouldn't write him off just yet. What is he like 17-3 in his last 20 starts ? Give me a break

There's more to the story than it being just schaub who isn't playing well.

Our fan base is filled with irrational fans that change their views every week. Just a few weeks ago Schaub was thought of as a great player to have on this team and people said this team was SB bound. Two losses later, Schaub is thought of as a back up despite the fact that any smart football fan couldn't name 5 QB's in the AFC that have been better then Schaub over the last few years. It doesn't matter that the O line has been atrocious in certain games and it doesn't matter that the running game hasn't done anything. It's all on Schaub, but that's how our fan base views things. Schaub isn't mobile, so everything gets blamed on him. The bottom line is that these fans that go nuts because Schaub isn't mobile weren't saying jack about this several years ago and many acted like he was a great QB. But anyone who constantly complains about Schaub not being mobile now is pretty stinking late to complain about it.

Where was the complaining about that in season two with Schaub? He didn't become non mobile over night. He has always been that way, and if he doesn't get protection he has always been ineffective. The people that see that as a problem now sound silly, because this has been an issue for years, and yet Schaub wasn't a problem then. But for some reason now Schaub is this awful QB because he isn't mobile when the Texans are 12-3. If you go back to last season before Schaub got hurt his record as a starter would have been like 18-3 or something like that. But yeah, he's a back up. Lol! So if that is the case, you'd think we could just plug anyone in here as a starter since our team is so great that we can just start a back up like Schaub and have such a good record. Funny though, because right now I see a problem with our run blocking, our pass blocking, and our WR's ability to make plays other then AJ But the only problem that these irrational fans see is Schaub. Lol!

Mr teX
12-25-2012, 02:33 PM
See, this is where the disconnect is.

Schaub would make a really good back up qb. Not going to take a lot of risk, not going to do anything crazy, knows what he's doing, pretty accurate with his feet set. If your starter gets hurt you aren't worried to death because you have a back up qb that can come in and do good things.....BUT, he's not a play maker. Third and longs get a lot harder...redozone offense isn't the same...you don't feel as good about how the offense will do in crunch time...

The reason people want a guy like romo over schaub is because he can make plays schaub can't. Thats it.

Decision making and all that stuff is somewhat coachable. Being mobile, having a better arm, evading defenders in the pocket, consistently being able to zip passes...you can do it or you can't...and Matt schaub can't. He never will be able to. This is his ceiling.

I think people want to see what kubiak and this offense could do with a guy with those skills. Last year we saw a glimpse of it with a fifth round rookie. And despite what everyone says, he did ok for himself.

The question is not who is better than schaub, it's who can we find with Yates like tools, but a better player.

I think if you take a guy like romo or cutler in this offense they'd do better than schaub. They have better tools. Their decisions might be more risky, but it's a trade off and you hope/think that the overall results would be better.


If you put all the qb's in the NFL in a draft and you are picking, schaub is not going in the top 15. Depending on who is picking, maybe not top 20... He'd be a starter for someone, but I almost guarantee they'd be looking for a young back up with better tools to groom.

Lot of good romo's extra play making ability did him against the saints this past week....chicago before that. Like i've been saying, there are pros and cons with every qb in this league outside of the top 5.

You'd love romo's mobility and strong arm until you've had enough of him running around trying to extend plays only to gets blind-sided by a defensive player, fumbles and the other team picks up and scores off it or he throws it and it gets picked........when he could've just thrown it away and lived to play another down. That kinda crap has been wearing thin on cowboys fans for years.

You'd love jay cutler's strong arm and mobility until you get tired of him making the same bone-headed throws into double and triple coverage every week and he's throwing 2-3 ints a game..when he could've just thrown it away and lived to fight another down...and then he comes to the sideline pouting and throwing guys under the bus.

And oh, You'd love alex smith strong arm and mobility until you get tired of seeing him go paralysis by analysis in the pocket, he gets sacked in the pocket and fumbles the ball...when he could've just thrown it away or run outta there and slid down.

Texecutioner
12-25-2012, 02:40 PM
See, this is where the disconnect is.

Schaub would make a really good back up qb. Not going to take a lot of risk, not going to do anything crazy, knows what he's doing, pretty accurate with his feet set. If your starter gets hurt you aren't worried to death because you have a back up qb that can come in and do good things.....BUT, he's not a play maker. Third and longs get a lot harder...redozone offense isn't the same...you don't feel as good about how the offense will do in crunch time...

The reason people want a guy like romo over schaub is because he can make plays schaub can't. Thats it.

Decision making and all that stuff is somewhat coachable. Being mobile, having a better arm, evading defenders in the pocket, consistently being able to zip passes...you can do it or you can't...and Matt schaub can't. He never will be able to. This is his ceiling.

I think people want to see what kubiak and this offense could do with a guy with those skills. Last year we saw a glimpse of it with a fifth round rookie. And despite what everyone says, he did ok for himself.

The question is not who is better than schaub, it's who can we find with Yates like tools, but a better player.

I think if you take a guy like romo or cutler in this offense they'd do better than schaub. They have better tools. Their decisions might be more risky, but it's a trade off and you hope/think that the overall results would be better.


If you put all the qb's in the NFL in a draft and you are picking, schaub is not going in the top 15. Depending on who is picking, maybe not top 20... He'd be a starter for someone, but I almost guarantee they'd be looking for a young back up with better tools to groom.

Who are these people that would want Romo over Schaub?? Any spare me with the people in here who have trashed Romo for years that would maybe say that now, because they wouldn't have said that a few weeks ago. Romo was throwing INT's earlier this season like they were hot cakes. Romo has been streaky throughout his entire career. I've always thought Romo was pretty good though and a QB that you can win with if you surround him with a ton of great players at other positions and don't expect Romo to carry the team or to win games for you a lot. If you do, then Romo will fail like he always has. He is just like Schaub in that regard. But to suggest that he somehow better is pretty silly when their numbers from year to year have been pretty even. And Romo has gotten a lot more criticism then Schaub has in his career as well. The majority of people on this site have trashed Romo. A lot of it has to do with him being a Cowboy probably, but it'sbeen the case none the less.

mussop
12-25-2012, 02:45 PM
Our fan base is filled with irrational fans that change their views every week. Just a few weeks ago Schaub was thought of as a great player to have on this team and people said this team was SB bound. Two losses later, Schaub is thought of as a back up despite the fact that any smart football fan couldn't name 5 QB's in the AFC that have been better then Schaub over the last few years. It doesn't matter that the O line has been atrocious in certain games and it doesn't matter that the running game hasn't done anything. It's all on Schaub, but that's how our fan base views things. Schaub isn't mobile, so everything gets blamed on him. The bottom line is that these fans that go nuts because Schaub isn't mobile weren't saying jack about this several years ago and many acted like he was a great QB. But anyone who constantly complains about Schaub not being mobile now is pretty stinking late to complain about it.

Where was the complaining about that in season two with Schaub? He didn't become non mobile over night. He has always been that way, and if he doesn't get protection he has always been ineffective. The people that see that as a problem now sound silly, because this has been an issue for years, and yet Schaub wasn't a problem then. But for some reason now Schaub is this awful QB because he isn't mobile when the Texans are 12-3. If you go back to last season before Schaub got hurt his record as a starter would have been like 18-3 or something like that. But yeah, he's a back up. Lol! So if that is the case, you'd think we could just plug anyone in here as a starter since our team is so great that we can just start a back up like Schaub and have such a good record. Funny though, because right now I see a problem with our run blocking, our pass blocking, and our WR's ability to make plays other then AJ But the only problem that these irrational fans see is Schaub. Lol!

Thats because when other things break down the QB needs to be able to make plays. If he can't (and Schaub can't) then he's probably not the QB to lead your team to the Super Bowl. Thats the plan right? Go to the Super Bowl?

Thorn
12-25-2012, 03:12 PM
Elite coaches are like elite QBs, there are just so very very few of them, and we haven't got either. That's also the case with most teams in the NFL, we aren't anything special, on either the good or bad side.

Texecutioner
12-25-2012, 03:24 PM
Thats because when other things break down the QB needs to be able to make plays. If he can't (and Schaub can't) then he's probably not the QB to lead your team to the Super Bowl. Thats the plan right? Go to the Super Bowl?

I keep wondering how long you've watched football with this consistent cries and screams about needing a mobile QB. Do you not know who Manning and Brady are?? They aren't mobile, and I've seen both of them play like crap when their Oline doesn't protect them over the years. The difference is that they get better protection more often then not, and of course they're better, but non mobile QB's have been successful in this league for decades, so stop with this bull**** about how we have to have a mobile QB or we have no chance. Where was all of this stuff about Schaub in week 9? Week 10? Why aren't you flying off the handle and blasting Matt Ryan?? He isn't really mobile either, but yet his team has the best record in the league now. It hasn't taken a mobile QB for them to be successful and it hasn't for the Texans this year either. But if you don't protect a non mobile QB who isn't athletic, then most likely your offense will struggle.

And another question. Do you have any idea at how our offense works?? Our offense comes and goes with the running game? If it isn't successful, our play action doesn't work so well either. Have you not seen the numbers of our running game over the last few weeks?? Why the hell aren't you complaining about our Olineman?? If they don't do their jobs to open holes iin the running game our passing game becomes a lot more predictable. That is Kubiak's offense. It is limited if our running game isn't effective, because Kubiak loves the play action and the bootlegs. It all starts up front not only for Schaub's effectiveness, but for Foster's effectiveness as well. Do yo want Foster out of here now as well since he isn't killing teams every week now? Should we can Foster?? You have to understand our offense and how it works before you can identify the issues with it, and from all of your posts I'm having a hard time feeling like you understand the structure and the design of what makes this offense successful.

Rey
12-25-2012, 03:34 PM
Lot of good romo's extra play making ability did him against the saints this past week....chicago before that. Like i've been saying, there are pros and cons with every qb in this league outside of the top 5.

You'd love romo's mobility and strong arm until you've had enough of him running around trying to extend plays only to gets blind-sided by a defensive player, fumbles and the other team picks up and scores off it or he throws it and it gets picked........when he could've just thrown it away and lived to play another down. That kinda crap has been wearing thin on cowboys fans for years.

You'd love jay cutler's strong arm and mobility until you get tired of him making the same bone-headed throws into double and triple coverage every week and he's throwing 2-3 ints a game..when he could've just thrown it away and lived to fight another down...and then he comes to the sideline pouting and throwing guys under the bus.

And oh, You'd love alex smith strong arm and mobility until you get tired of seeing him go paralysis by analysis in the pocket, he gets sacked in the pocket and fumbles the ball...when he could've just thrown it away or run outta there and slid down.

Yeah, I pretty much answered everything here in the post you quoted.

Hookem Horns
12-25-2012, 03:49 PM
To me QBs are measured in the clutch and in the playoffs. Schaub has never played in a playoff game so the jury is still out.

However if the last game which was not a playoff game but a game to lock up home field was any indication of how he will perform in the playoffs then yeah, we are in deep trouble.

Not a fan of Kubiak however name one great QB that went on to be a good coach. Both Harbaugh brothers were basically backups and not quality starters when they were starting.

EllisUnit
12-25-2012, 03:53 PM
You think teams in the playoff care about a QB with 17-3 record with zero playoff games?
The Texans are like that big kid that bully everyone at the beginning of the school year. Then words got out that bully got punked in gym class. Then later it happen again during band practice. And again while getting off the school bus. Now prom is coming up. Someone there is gonna make a statement to that punk kid by dumping a big bowl of fruit punch over his head.

That's where I stand with the Texans. When playoff comes it could get embarrassing and pathetic.

Don't really care what other teams think, fact is we don't know how schaub will play in the play offs. For all any of us know he might take it to a whole other level and be supwebowl MVP. As of now how he will perform is all opinion and nothing more.

Wolf
12-25-2012, 05:03 PM
I keep wondering how long you've watched football with this consistent cries and screams about needing a mobile QB. Do you not know who Manning and Brady are?? They aren't mobile, and I've seen both of them play like crap when their Oline doesn't protect them over the years. The difference is that they get better protection more often then not, and of course they're better, but non mobile QB's have been successful in this league for decades, so stop with this bull**** about how we have to have a mobile QB or we have no chance. Where was all of this stuff about Schaub in week 9? Week 10? Why aren't you flying off the handle and blasting Matt Ryan?? He isn't really mobile either, but yet his team has the best record in the league now. It hasn't taken a mobile QB for them to be successful and it hasn't for the Texans this year either. But if you don't protect a non mobile QB who isn't athletic, then most likely your offense will struggle.

And another question. Do you have any idea at how our offense works?? Our offense comes and goes with the running game? If it isn't successful, our play action doesn't work so well either. Have you not seen the numbers of our running game over the last few weeks?? Why the hell aren't you complaining about our Olineman?? If they don't do their jobs to open holes iin the running game our passing game becomes a lot more predictable. That is Kubiak's offense. It is limited if our running game isn't effective, because Kubiak loves the play action and the bootlegs. It all starts up front not only for Schaub's effectiveness, but for Foster's effectiveness as well. Do yo want Foster out of here now as well since he isn't killing teams every week now? Should we can Foster?? You have to understand our offense and how it works before you can identify the issues with it, and from all of your posts I'm having a hard time feeling like you understand the structure and the design of what makes this offense successful.

Also Manning and Brady can dissect a defense in less than 3seconds. They make the line better that what they are

Yep after Schaub threw for 500 + no one was posting

klockWork
12-25-2012, 06:07 PM
It's unfair how people here use the O-line to defend Schaub when he's not playing well. Our pass blocking is not as bad as people make it out to be. Schaub is getting sufficient time to throw and when there is pressure he has the responsibilty to either step up or to the side of the pocket so the defender can run by. Most pass rush is avoidable by this fundamental footwork. These are the things every QB are taught in practice.

I remember a few years ago I visited Boston and had the chance to go watch a Patriots practice. I saw Tom Brady in a pocket-practice session where the staff were rolling big medicine balls at him from many angles. He was avoiding those balls while keeping his eyes down field with just a slide of the feet here and there. Brady like Schaub is no world-class athlete with their feet. QB that aren't mobile, like Brady and Manning can erased a bad block by their lineman by using simple footwork. The problem with Schaub is he has zero pocket awareness and instinct. That's why you see him often bracing on phantom pass rush.

Schaub strenght only last 3 seconds from the snap of the ball. After that if he can't find his targets a fuse go off in his head regardless of whether there's pressure or not. You see him looking for a roll out lane. Schaub will look for a roll out lane REGARDLESS of a presence of pressure. I seen him rolled out of a three-man pass rush on max-protected. Hell, I've seen him rolled out on a two-man rush where the defense drop everyone back to prevent a a red zone TD. When a QB do that they limit themselves to viable throwing targets. They also create the illusion to the media and fans that the O-line failed on that play and that's the reason a QB failed to make a throw. "It's the O-line fault. They didn't allow him enough time. Look how the QB have to scramble from that pass rush. They broke down"

Those guys upfront are busting their butts off for that guy. They're not perfect on every pass play. And they far from bad. They sufficient for the most part and that should be enough. To have you people here bash them is disgusting. You put a QB with sound footwork and good pocket-instinct behind that line, I guarantee everyone will view our O-line in a more positive way.

If you guys are in disagreement with my assessment, I'll make a proposition for you. Show me a video of Schaub staying in a well protected pocket, standing poised waiting for his reciever to break routes and making a throw on a undesign play. Show me a video of Schaub stepping aside to avoid a pass rush, gather his feet and making a downfield throw while still in the pocket. If someone can upload that video in this forum I will paypal you a $100. You can go back to any years he played here. Hell you even can go back to when he was with the Falcon. And if you STILL in disagreement, next time you see a defense rushing only three and dropping everyone back, watch how he panics and make awkward throws or rolled out from a clean pocket. When his receiver aren't open and there's no roll out lane expect the balls to be thrown in the stands-regardless of pressure.

I wish folks here stop blaming the O-line for Schaub bad QB plays. He panic too often when his reciever are covered. And when he make a good throw within his 3 second window people are cool with that. But if his 3 second is up and there's no one open and Schaub gives up and takes a seat on defender's lap people call out our line.

This QB needs to be held accountable. So please. Stop blaming the line!!

Wolf
12-25-2012, 06:29 PM
The ol and QB go together either one can make the other great

steelbtexan
12-25-2012, 06:36 PM
I keep wondering how long you've watched football with this consistent cries and screams about needing a mobile QB. Do you not know who Manning and Brady are?? They aren't mobile, and I've seen both of them play like crap when their Oline doesn't protect them over the years. The difference is that they get better protection more often then not, and of course they're better, but non mobile QB's have been successful in this league for decades, so stop with this bull**** about how we have to have a mobile QB or we have no chance. Where was all of this stuff about Schaub in week 9? Week 10? Why aren't you flying off the handle and blasting Matt Ryan?? He isn't really mobile either, but yet his team has the best record in the league now. It hasn't taken a mobile QB for them to be successful and it hasn't for the Texans this year either. But if you don't protect a non mobile QB who isn't athletic, then most likely your offense will struggle.

And another question. Do you have any idea at how our offense works?? Our offense comes and goes with the running game? If it isn't successful, our play action doesn't work so well either. Have you not seen the numbers of our running game over the last few weeks?? Why the hell aren't you complaining about our Olineman?? If they don't do their jobs to open holes iin the running game our passing game becomes a lot more predictable. That is Kubiak's offense. It is limited if our running game isn't effective, because Kubiak loves the play action and the bootlegs. It all starts up front not only for Schaub's effectiveness, but for Foster's effectiveness as well. Do yo want Foster out of here now as well since he isn't killing teams every week now? Should we can Foster?? You have to understand our offense and how it works before you can identify the issues with it, and from all of your posts I'm having a hard time feeling like you understand the structure and the design of what makes this offense successful.

While Brady and Manning aren't Vick, Brady moves around and usually runs 3-5 times a game to pick up crucial 1st downs. Do you remember the run against the Texans for example. Manning while not a runner, he reads defenses quckly, moves around in the pocket well and has as fast of a release as anybody.

Schaub, (I was a Schaub guy) is like a sitting duck, I think the injury to his foot has changed Garys playcalling too. In 2008-2010, what do you think would've been the odds that Gary would've called atleast one QB sneak on 1st and 10 from the 1 yd line?

The OL has been terrible the past month and the right side of the OL has been bad all yr. Also Gary has failed to give Schaub the weapons he neds to take this offense to another level. Hopefully they draft a WR like Patterson, and draft another OT like Long or Winters in the 2nd rd.

Because Schaub needs all of the help he can get due to his foot injury and Schaub is going to be the Texans QB for the next 3 yrs. Just like Gary will be the Texans HC for that long, if not longer. We as Texans fans need to accept this and hope that sometime in the near future Rick/Gary will draft a franchise QB like when Rodgers was drafted while Favre was still playing.

Right now Schaub reminds me Marino at the end of his career, without Marinos arm. They dont have the mobility to even avoid the rush, much less run a true WC offense effectively.

ObsiWan
12-25-2012, 07:06 PM
Of all starting quarterbacks, I would honestly take any of the below over Schaub in a heartbeat at this point in their respective careers. Can you guys really argue Schaub over any of these guys?

Tom Brady
Peyton Manning
Big Ben
Andrew Luck
Tony Romo (pains me to even say this, but I would because he at least tries to make plays and can make plays with feet and arm)
Eli Manning
RG III
Jay Cutler (similar to Romo... at least he tries to make plays and can with feet and arm)
Matthew Stafford
Aaron Rodgers
Matt Ryan
Drew Brees
Russell Wilson
Ryan Tannehill

What team is going to let any of these guys go?
Answer: None. Not one.

So what is the point of this question?

NitroGSXR
12-25-2012, 07:16 PM
What team is going to let any of these guys go?
Answer: None. Not one.

So what is the point of this question?

I bet you half of them would be HAPPY to trade them straight up for Schaub.

ThaShark316
12-25-2012, 07:20 PM
It's unfair how people here use the O-line to defend Schaub when he's not playing well. Our pass blocking is not as bad as people make it out to be. Schaub is getting sufficient time to throw and when there is pressure he has the responsibilty to either step up or to the side of the pocket so the defender can run by. Most pass rush is avoidable by this fundamental footwork. These are the things every QB are taught in practice.

I remember a few years ago I visited Boston and had the chance to go watch a Patriots practice. I saw Tom Brady in a pocket-practice session where the staff were rolling big medicine balls at him from many angles. He was avoiding those balls while keeping his eyes down field with just a slide of the feet here and there. Brady like Schaub is no world-class athlete with their feet. QB that aren't mobile, like Brady and Manning can erased a bad block by their lineman by using simple footwork. The problem with Schaub is he has zero pocket awareness and instinct. That's why you see him often bracing on phantom pass rush.

Schaub strenght only last 3 seconds from the snap of the ball. After that if he can't find his targets a fuse go off in his head regardless of whether there's pressure or not. You see him looking for a roll out lane. Schaub will look for a roll out lane REGARDLESS of a presence of pressure. I seen him rolled out of a three-man pass rush on max-protected. Hell, I've seen him rolled out on a two-man rush where the defense drop everyone back to prevent a a red zone TD. When a QB do that they limit themselves to viable throwing targets. They also create the illusion to the media and fans that the O-line failed on that play and that's the reason a QB failed to make a throw. "It's the O-line fault. They didn't allow him enough time. Look how the QB have to scramble from that pass rush. They broke down"

Those guys upfront are busting their butts off for that guy. They're not perfect on every pass play. And they far from bad. They sufficient for the most part and that should be enough. To have you people here bash them is disgusting. You put a QB with sound footwork and good pocket-instinct behind that line, I guarantee everyone will view our O-line in a more positive way.

If you guys are in disagreement with my assessment, I'll make a proposition for you. Show me a video of Schaub staying in a well protected pocket, standing poised waiting for his reciever to break routes and making a throw on a undesign play. Show me a video of Schaub stepping aside to avoid a pass rush, gather his feet and making a downfield throw while still in the pocket. If someone can upload that video in this forum I will paypal you a $100. You can go back to any years he played here. Hell you even can go back to when he was with the Falcon. And if you STILL in disagreement, next time you see a defense rushing only three and dropping everyone back, watch how he panics and make awkward throws or rolled out from a clean pocket. When his receiver aren't open and there's no roll out lane expect the balls to be thrown in the stands-regardless of pressure.

I wish folks here stop blaming the O-line for Schaub bad QB plays. He panic too often when his reciever are covered. And when he make a good throw within his 3 second window people are cool with that. But if his 3 second is up and there's no one open and Schaub gives up and takes a seat on defender's lap people call out our line.

This QB needs to be held accountable. So please. Stop blaming the line!!

**** that, I'm blaming the line just like I'm blaming Schaub. The OL has been ass for a month...this is fact.

It's the same crap that Foster gets when he "doesn't look the same". Good God, people...this is the football, the ultimate team sport. Schaub was terrible; has been for a few games, but to pretend like the Offensive line hasn't had a hand in the offense's suck-dom is crazy.

Brisco_County
12-25-2012, 07:27 PM
I suspect that Schaub is injured right now. Possibly concussed. Something is affecting his concentration, and causing him to overreact to pursuing defenders. He is definitely not as sharp or accurate as he was in the first half of the season.

Premier
12-25-2012, 07:45 PM
I bet you half of them would be HAPPY to trade them straight up for Schaub.

lol really? name them.. which teams would trade their qb straight up for schaub.. of the teams listed in the op.. i even added 4 on the back end.. now tell us, which half of the names listed would their teams love to trade for schaub..


Tom Brady
Peyton Manning
Big Ben
Andrew Luck
Tony Romo
Eli Manning
RG III
Jay Cutler
Matthew Stafford
Aaron Rodgers
Matt Ryan
Drew Brees
Russell Wilson
Ryan Tannehill
Cam Newton
Philip Rivers
Joe Flacco
Andy Dalton

NitroGSXR
12-25-2012, 08:00 PM
lol really? name them.. which teams would trade their qb straight up for schaub.. of the teams listed in the op.. i even added 4 on the back end.. now tell us, which half of the names listed would their teams love to trade for schaub..

Anyone not named Rodgers, Brady, or P. Manning. The high draft rooks don't count. As always, it depends on the system as always but you would be lying to yourself if you don't think that these teams would perk their ears at a possible Schaub trade.

12 and 3!

The Schaub hate here is super strong.

badboy
12-25-2012, 08:01 PM
Of all starting quarterbacks, I would honestly take any of the below over Schaub in a heartbeat at this point in their respective careers. Can you guys really argue Schaub over any of these guys?

None of our 12 wins stand out at all. @ Denver while they were adjusting early on. Baltimore has proven to be not as good as advertised. Same with Chicago.
Schaub will NEVER be the leader this team needs in primetime and when games matter most. If this team gets down by 2+ scores, we're fuc*ed... All of our wins come from defensive forced turnovers and scores or Arian Foster playing very well to where any QB could come in with a playaction call.

Back to that list:

Tom Brady
Peyton Manning
Big Ben
Andrew Luck
Tony Romo (pains me to even say this, but I would because he at least tries to make plays and can make plays with feet and arm)
Eli Manning
RG III
Jay Cutler (similar to Romo... at least he tries to make plays and can with feet and arm)
Matthew Stafford
Aaron Rodgers
Matt Ryan
Drew Brees
Russell Wilson
Ryan TannehillIf the purpose of the thread is to compare QBs cool as we have done that before. However, if you want to replace Schaub as you indicate, would you not need to suggest QBs you can get? You seem to be saying you don't like your wife and you are comparing her to other guys wives that you cannot have. Eliminate them and those single women that don't want you. Basically you have to choose other teams' rejects, those that will soon be on the market as their husbands will no longer support their "high maintenance" or young sweet things coming out of school that may go with you as they have no other choice (draft).

Premier
12-25-2012, 08:06 PM
Anyone not named Rodgers, Brady, or P. Manning. The high draft rooks don't count. As always, it depends on the system as always but you would be lying to yourself if you don't think that these teams would perk their ears at a possible Schaub trade.

12 and 3!

The Schaub hate here is super strong.

youre a delusional homer.. just like everyone else who blindly suppports schaub you have to make so many factors to aid your case for him..

but ok lets have it your way, lets eliminate rodgers, brady, manning, and high draft rooks...


Big Ben
Tony Romo
Eli Manning
Jay Cutler
Matthew Stafford
Matt Ryan
Drew Brees
Philip Rivers
Joe Flacco


now answer the question.. which half of those teams would jump at the chance to have schaub over the guys listed...

NitroGSXR
12-25-2012, 08:31 PM
but ok lets have it your way, lets eliminate rodgers, brady, manning, and high draft rooks...



now answer the question.. which half of those teams would jump at the chance to have schaub over the guys listed...

ALL of them. Schaub would have them shaking in their boots during training camp if he was brought in for competition.

badboy
12-25-2012, 08:35 PM
youre a delusional homer.. just like everyone else who blindly suppports schaub you have to make so many factors to aid your case for him..

but ok lets have it your way, lets eliminate rodgers, brady, manning, and high draft rooks...



now answer the question.. which half of those teams would jump at the chance to have schaub over the guys listed...To be realistic you should look at the system QBs play in. Many of the teams represented by QBs you name chose those QBs for their system as Kubiak did with Matt.

Premier
12-25-2012, 08:35 PM
ALL of them. Schaub would give them all a run for their money.

pure fkn comedy.. shiit wreaks of a rah-rah cheerleader attitude. GAO TEXERNS. 12 AMD 3 RAHRAH STUPERBOAL BEBE!!!!!1

qqert
12-25-2012, 08:46 PM
Originally Posted by Premier
youre a delusional homer..

ALL of them. Schaub would have them shaking in their boots during training camp if he was brought in for competition.

delusion confirmed.
drew brees will be sjaking in his boots if schaub was brought in nola to compete for qb.


:clown::clown::clown:

NitroGSXR
12-25-2012, 08:47 PM
delusion confirmed.
drew brees will be sjaking in his boots if schaub was brought in nola to compete for qb.


:clown::clown::clown:

Heh heh heh. I missed Brees... but for real... all of the rest.

NitroGSXR
12-25-2012, 08:49 PM
pure fkn comedy.. shiit wreaks of a rah-rah cheerleader attitude. GAO TEXERNS. 12 AMD 3 RAHRAH STUPERBOAL BEBE!!!!!1

No. It's called trust. I trust in Schaub to get the job done. All of you are tired of him throwing the ball away. Me? I'm like... what? Did you want him to be sacked instead?

I do NOT trust Kubiak as much as I trust Schaub.

Mr teX
12-25-2012, 08:50 PM
I mean...nitro my man...can't go with ya on this one..i mean Jay Cutler & Phillip Rivers & Flacco............... maybe...but the rest.....nah.

Nawzer
12-25-2012, 09:00 PM
youre a delusional homer.. just like everyone else who blindly suppports schaub you have to make so many factors to aid your case for him..

but ok lets have it your way, lets eliminate rodgers, brady, manning, and high draft rooks...



now answer the question.. which half of those teams would jump at the chance to have schaub over the guys listed...

Why are you feeding the troll dude? I would and no doubt any other sane person would take half those QBs on that list. Big Ben, Stafford, Ryan, E. Manning, and I think even Tony Romo would be an upgrade over Schaub.

GP
12-25-2012, 09:01 PM
youre a delusional homer.. just like everyone else who blindly suppports schaub you have to make so many factors to aid your case for him..

but ok lets have it your way, lets eliminate rodgers, brady, manning, and high draft rooks...



now answer the question.. which half of those teams would jump at the chance to have schaub over the guys listed...

Based on what I have seen this last half of the season??? NONE of those teams want him.

No mobility, inability to create plays where there might be a breakdown with the original play, and too many streaky games where he just flat out disappears.

MAYBE the Raiders would be a good fit with Greg Knapp there to bring him along. Since Knapp was here in Houston and had a lot of coaching of Schaub while he was here.

Maybe the Cardinals.

But no team who is worth a ****.

The guy has cratered. I frankly have zero confidence in him. He'll likely pull out all the stops in the last game, the team will win, everything will look fine......then in the playoffs he'll piss it away.

I'm not wondering how, I'm just wondering WHEN.

NitroGSXR
12-25-2012, 09:10 PM
Why are you feeding the troll dude?

http://a.espncdn.com/photo/2009/0618/nfl_i_schaub_480.jpg

Premier
12-25-2012, 09:10 PM
Why are you feeding the troll dude? I would and no doubt any other sane person would take half those QBs on that list. Big Ben, Stafford, Ryan, E. Manning, and I think even Tony Romo would be an upgrade over Schaub.

i dont believe he is a troll, i dont doubt he is a texans fan just like every one else here. he is entitled to his opinion, were just here to debate. at the same time, im contemplating backing off my schaub arguments, its pointless. ive seen and taken mental notes of everyone who shares the same opinion as mine. i would love for all of us to be wrong about this guy... i hope the likes of texecitioner, mr. tex, nitro have a field day reposting these "hater" comments all of us have made after matt schaub is hoisting up a lombardi trophy.

Rey
12-25-2012, 09:18 PM
i hope the likes of texecitioner, mr. tex, nitro have a field day reposting these "hater" comments all of us have made after matt schaub is hoisting up a lombardi trophy.

Would love that.

Nawzer
12-25-2012, 09:19 PM
i dont believe he is a troll, i dont doubt he is a texans fan just like every one else here. he is entitled to his opinion, were just here to debate. at the same time, im contemplating backing off my schaub arguments, its pointless. ive seen and taken mental notes of everyone who shares the same opinion as mine. i would love for all of us to be wrong about this guy... i hope the likes of texecitioner, mr. tex, nitro have a field day reposting these "hater" comments all of us have made after matt schaub is hoisting up a lombardi trophy.

I would love to be proven wrong too, but I firmly believe that if the Texans are going to make any serious noise in the playoffs it'll be because of the running game and the defense. Schaub is a manager and we can't expect him to do any more than that at this point in his career. Sure he had a couple of years where he was among the league leaders in passing, but this is a passing league and those kinds of stats don't mean much to me. Kubiak's job #1 is to fix the o-line and if he can do that we should be OK.

Wolf
12-25-2012, 09:21 PM
What team is going to let any of these guys go?
Answer: None. Not one.

So what is the point of this question?
None but in the fans discussion The teams that aren't winning enough will look for the grass on the other side of the fence

76Texan
12-25-2012, 09:25 PM
How about Tom Brady being coached by a guy who never played professional football?

:toropalm:

Wolf
12-25-2012, 09:26 PM
How about Tom Brady being coached by a guy who never played professional football?

:toropalm:
And a guy that lucked out with a QB that "got it" and became on of the games best

Rey
12-25-2012, 09:28 PM
And a guy that lucked out with a QB that "got it" and became on of the games best

Maybe he deserves some credit for picking, sticking with, coaching and developing that guy?

It's not like the pats sucked when Brady was hurt that one year.

76Texan
12-25-2012, 09:31 PM
And a guy that lucked out with a QB that "got it" and became on of the games best

The guy even got fired before.
And he never ever even played QB.:mariopalm:

76Texan
12-25-2012, 09:54 PM
Maybe he deserves some credit for picking, sticking with, coaching and developing that guy?

It's not like the pats sucked when Brady was hurt that one year.

The guy was never involved with the offensive side of the ball.
In his first year back as a HC, he suddenly discovered genius and said hey I want to take that guy in the sixth round. I know QB, and I deserve credit, as in significantly; man, he may as well go to Vegas and make a killing. :wadepalm:

ObsiWan
12-25-2012, 10:31 PM
If the purpose of the thread is to compare QBs cool as we have done that before. However, if you want to replace Schaub as you indicate, would you not need to suggest QBs you can get? You seem to be saying you don't like your wife and you are comparing her to other guys wives that you cannot have. Eliminate them and those single women that don't want you. Basically you have to choose other teams' rejects, those that will soon be on the market as their husbands will no longer support their "high maintenance" or young sweet things coming out of school that may go with you as they have no other choice (draft).

This is why I asked "what's the point of this question?" No one is going to trade their guy for Schaub straight up. No one.

ObsiWan
12-25-2012, 10:35 PM
youre a delusional homer.. just like everyone else who blindly suppports schaub you have to make so many factors to aid your case for him..

but ok lets have it your way, lets eliminate rodgers, brady, manning, and high draft rooks...



now answer the question.. which half of those teams would jump at the chance to have schaub over the guys listed...

Probably none.
But our front office wouldn't "jump at the chance" to give up Schaub for any of them either.

Now if you asked the respective fan bases, you'll probably get varying answers. ...depending on how their guy did the previous Sunday.

Texan_Bill
12-25-2012, 10:40 PM
WOW!!! Just whenever I didn't think I've ever heard the "dumbest thing I've ever heard"....... Well, I just heard the dumbest thing I've ever heard!!!

:facepalm: Newbie!!!

*EDIT*
To be clear, my post was based on the OP.

ThaShark316
12-25-2012, 11:49 PM
Probably none.
But our front office wouldn't "jump at the chance" to give up Schaub for any of them either.

Now if you asked the respective fan bases, you'll probably get varying answers. ...depending on how their guy did the previous Sunday.

EVERY fan base these days are knee-jerking, prisoners of the moment. Disgusting.

Scooter
12-26-2012, 06:04 AM
Of all starting quarterbacks, I would honestly take any of the below over Schaub in a heartbeat at this point in their respective careers. Can you guys really argue Schaub over any of these guys?

None of our 12 wins stand out at all. @ Denver while they were adjusting early on. Baltimore has proven to be not as good as advertised. Same with Chicago.
Schaub will NEVER be the leader this team needs in primetime and when games matter most. If this team gets down by 2+ scores, we're fuc*ed... All of our wins come from defensive forced turnovers and scores or Arian Foster playing very well to where any QB could come in with a playaction call.

Back to that list:

Tom Brady
Peyton Manning
Big Ben
Andrew Luck
Tony Romo (pains me to even say this, but I would because he at least tries to make plays and can make plays with feet and arm)
Eli Manning
RG III
Jay Cutler (similar to Romo... at least he tries to make plays and can with feet and arm)
Matthew Stafford
Aaron Rodgers
Matt Ryan
Drew Brees
Russell Wilson
Ryan Tannehill

i'm going to skip the thread entirely and respond to the OP. you listed 14 players, so schaub is atleast a top half quarterback in your eyes. your eyes being riddled with nonsense of course. by tagging 4 rookies your prove bias or age or your madden rating - or any combination of those. only 6 of the listed qb's have had more success than schaub.

denver, indy, baltimore. so far we've beaten the 2,4,5 seeds this season. we beat the 6 seed twice last year. the only hole is against the patriots. i'd call 3-1 against playoff opponents this season meaningful.

as for what it will take to win a big game, you havent seen one yet. we havent seen foster, schaub, and kubiak in a playoff game. elway didnt win by himself. he needed terrell davis and kubiak calling the plays to make it happen. we're getting healthy at the right time, and despite armchair doomsayers, we are still the team to beat.

amazing80
12-26-2012, 08:27 AM
To me its more lack of Schaubs ability than it is coaching.

welsh texan
12-26-2012, 01:39 PM
To me its more lack of Schaubs ability than it is coaching.

I don't disagree that Schaub is limited to an extent, but he also has a lot of things that more 'talented' QB's don't have.

One thing that is being grossly disregarded in this and other threads is knowledge of the system.

There are very few QB's in the league who would be an immediate upgrade due to this, and every single QB is a product of their system to a large extent, all of their tendencies are formed by how they view their system. Just look at the transformation of Brees in NOLA, Alex Smith (seemingly a future hall of famer depending who you read on this board right now) under Harbaugh compared to any other system he's been put in (yeah, so a sure fire success in our system then).

What else does Schaub do well? On the whole he's pretty good protecting the football, he sells the fake handoff as well as anybody which helps both attacks, has great timing with his receivers on short and medium stuff, knows when to throw it away (most of the time) under pressure, doesn't try to force it if it isn't there, is a good role model for his team-mates.

Its easy to forget what we risk by moving him on. That is why Kubiak isn't about to sanction any kind of high risk change at the position, even during FA last season, when his starting QB was in traction and a genuine future HOFer was available AND Schaub only had a year on his deal, IE, about as do-able as its ever going to be, the braintrust weren't going to pull the trigger.

Why people believe that anything will be different if Alex Smith gets cut is beyond me.

Now, Schaub in prime-time is a worry, Schaub in big games worries me. But then even more distressing to me is that the team went around buying each other matching jackets and segways while verbally circle-jerking about their unanimous #1 November power rankings as if the super-bowl was already won. That worries me more than a few little improvements our QB could make.

If Schaub crumbles in big games, the rest of the team sees success as beating league also-rans when the established big boys are hovering around .500 and fully focussed on improving for when it matters.

I still have faith that they can make the necessary changes, but if this team doesn't make the AFCC game, and possibly the SB, I know where I'm coming back to with my complaints.

http://blog.chron.com/ultimatetexans/files/2012/12/Texans.Letter.Jackets-300x225.jpg

To the right we have a guy who's been to the Superbowl and failed in that game. You are #1 in power ranking in November, hardly the peak of his career and surely rather than modelling leather he should be focussed on getting there again and not getting beat this time. On the left we have a guy who's had one good season, and in a contract year is not doing as well, who has yet to actually achieve anything of note in the league. You're about to board a plane for a national stage game against a team who simply don't get beat in their stadium at this time of year, so wtf are you playing at with this ****. I hope lessons have been learned from this because those guys got embarrassed, and it'll only become more embarrassing if they don't turn it around in a few weeks time.

Double Barrel
12-26-2012, 04:17 PM
To me QBs are measured in the clutch and in the playoffs. Schaub has never played in a playoff game so the jury is still out.

Until he wins playoff games, he will be Warren Moon 2.0 in my mind. Gawdy regular season stats mean nothing in the playoffs.

The Third Man
12-26-2012, 04:22 PM
I can't wait for a new app that allows me to slap the piss out of every person that starts a dumb thread. Stop posting.

drs23
12-28-2012, 07:11 PM
It's unfair how people here use the O-line to defend Schaub when he's not playing well. Our pass blocking is not as bad as people make it out to be. Schaub is getting sufficient time to throw and when there is pressure he has the responsibilty to either step up or to the side of the pocket so the defender can run by. Most pass rush is avoidable by this fundamental footwork. These are the things every QB are taught in practice.

I remember a few years ago I visited Boston and had the chance to go watch a Patriots practice. I saw Tom Brady in a pocket-practice session where the staff were rolling big medicine balls at him from many angles. He was avoiding those balls while keeping his eyes down field with just a slide of the feet here and there. Brady like Schaub is no world-class athlete with their feet. QB that aren't mobile, like Brady and Manning can erased a bad block by their lineman by using simple footwork. The problem with Schaub is he has zero pocket awareness and instinct. That's why you see him often bracing on phantom pass rush.

Schaub strenght only last 3 seconds from the snap of the ball. After that if he can't find his targets a fuse go off in his head regardless of whether there's pressure or not. You see him looking for a roll out lane. Schaub will look for a roll out lane REGARDLESS of a presence of pressure. I seen him rolled out of a three-man pass rush on max-protected. Hell, I've seen him rolled out on a two-man rush where the defense drop everyone back to prevent a a red zone TD. When a QB do that they limit themselves to viable throwing targets. They also create the illusion to the media and fans that the O-line failed on that play and that's the reason a QB failed to make a throw. "It's the O-line fault. They didn't allow him enough time. Look how the QB have to scramble from that pass rush. They broke down"

Those guys upfront are busting their butts off for that guy. They're not perfect on every pass play. And they far from bad. They sufficient for the most part and that should be enough. To have you people here bash them is disgusting. You put a QB with sound footwork and good pocket-instinct behind that line, I guarantee everyone will view our O-line in a more positive way.

If you guys are in disagreement with my assessment, I'll make a proposition for you. Show me a video of Schaub staying in a well protected pocket, standing poised waiting for his reciever to break routes and making a throw on a undesign play. Show me a video of Schaub stepping aside to avoid a pass rush, gather his feet and making a downfield throw while still in the pocket. If someone can upload that video in this forum I will paypal you a $100. You can go back to any years he played here. Hell you even can go back to when he was with the Falcon. And if you STILL in disagreement, next time you see a defense rushing only three and dropping everyone back, watch how he panics and make awkward throws or rolled out from a clean pocket. When his receiver aren't open and there's no roll out lane expect the balls to be thrown in the stands-regardless of pressure.

I wish folks here stop blaming the O-line for Schaub bad QB plays. He panic too often when his reciever are covered. And when he make a good throw within his 3 second window people are cool with that. But if his 3 second is up and there's no one open and Schaub gives up and takes a seat on defender's lap people call out our line.

This QB needs to be held accountable. So please. Stop blaming the line!!

To the bolded, I wish I had time, I'd take that hundy. He's done it many times. Just did it against the Vikes.

As an aside and not being a grammar Nazi, just curious, is English your second langue?

drs23
12-28-2012, 07:16 PM
OP's original list is missing many names like Rivers, Flacco, Bradford, Dalton, etc. ... as well as a few back-ups I would trade Matt for in a heart beat. Matt isn't even top 20.

Why am I not surprised?

dream_team
12-28-2012, 08:58 PM
If you guys are in disagreement with my assessment, I'll make a proposition for you. Show me a video of Schaub staying in a well protected pocket, standing poised waiting for his reciever to break routes and making a throw on a undesign play. Show me a video of Schaub stepping aside to avoid a pass rush, gather his feet and making a downfield throw while still in the pocket. If someone can upload that video in this forum I will paypal you a $100. You can go back to any years he played here. Hell you even can go back to when he was with the Falcon. And if you STILL in disagreement, next time you see a defense rushing only three and dropping everyone back, watch how he panics and make awkward throws or rolled out from a clean pocket. When his receiver aren't open and there's no roll out lane expect the balls to be thrown in the stands-regardless of pressure.


I'm sure there are plenty of other examples, but this is the play that I thought of instantly.

http://youtu.be/uFuul1wBDu4

So when can I expect my $100?

Nitrofish
12-29-2012, 06:31 AM
Of all starting quarterbacks, I would honestly take any of the below over Schaub in a heartbeat at this point in their respective careers. Can you guys really argue Schaub over any of these guys?

None of our 12 wins stand out at all. @ Denver while they were adjusting early on. Baltimore has proven to be not as good as advertised. Same with Chicago.
Schaub will NEVER be the leader this team needs in primetime and when games matter most. If this team gets down by 2+ scores, we're fuc*ed... All of our wins come from defensive forced turnovers and scores or Arian Foster playing very well to where any QB could come in with a playaction call.

Back to that list:

Tom Brady
Peyton Manning
Big Ben
Andrew Luck
Tony Romo (pains me to even say this, but I would because he at least tries to make plays and can make plays with feet and arm)
Eli Manning
RG III
Jay Cutler (similar to Romo... at least he tries to make plays and can with feet and arm)
Matthew Stafford
Aaron Rodgers
Matt Ryan
Drew Brees
Russell Wilson
Ryan Tannehill

OK I know I am a bit late and perhaps this has already been said, but is it better that our so called starting career Backup QB is being coached by a backup QB who actually played as an NFL QB or a coach who never played in the league, or never played the QB position?

I think your question is hilarious because are there any former starting QB's out there coaching elite QB's? No... Is Brady/Mannings/Rodgers coaches even former players, or former QB's? No.

I am not going to argue with your list because it is pointless... even if those QB's are better than Schaub... You cannot acquire them, so why do you make comparisons and say the Texans would be better off with one of them? And adding the two rookies in that list is even funnier. Look at Cam's rookie year compared to his sophomore campaign... plenty of drop off there and RG3 and Luck have a long way to go before they are as good as Schaub and what he has accomplished in his career.

I think you Schaub haters work very hard to come up with creative ways to say the same thing over and over, and if you had thought about what you were going to post before you posted it a little while you would have realized that.

Nitrofish
12-29-2012, 06:36 AM
I'm sure there are plenty of other examples, but this is the play that I thought of instantly.

http://youtu.be/uFuul1wBDu4

So when can I expect my $100?

AWESOME! Please let us know if he keeps his word and pays up.

Goatcheese
12-29-2012, 07:23 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nHrczBeOGjY
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cSzkqchFbhM

Nitrofish
12-29-2012, 08:15 AM
Click the link to view a bunch of Schaub highlights were he debunks most of what any Schaub hater say in these posts, and a few that confirm them also, but to all of you who say Matt can't this or that... Watch and then let's hear your excuses.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cSzkqchFbhM

76Texan
12-29-2012, 11:45 AM
It's unfair how people here use the O-line to defend Schaub when he's not playing well. Our pass blocking is not as bad as people make it out to be. Schaub is getting sufficient time to throw and when there is pressure he has the responsibilty to either step up or to the side of the pocket so the defender can run by. Most pass rush is avoidable by this fundamental footwork. These are the things every QB are taught in practice.

I remember a few years ago I visited Boston and had the chance to go watch a Patriots practice. I saw Tom Brady in a pocket-practice session where the staff were rolling big medicine balls at him from many angles. He was avoiding those balls while keeping his eyes down field with just a slide of the feet here and there. Brady like Schaub is no world-class athlete with their feet. QB that aren't mobile, like Brady and Manning can erased a bad block by their lineman by using simple footwork. The problem with Schaub is he has zero pocket awareness and instinct. That's why you see him often bracing on phantom pass rush.

Schaub strenght only last 3 seconds from the snap of the ball. After that if he can't find his targets a fuse go off in his head regardless of whether there's pressure or not. You see him looking for a roll out lane. Schaub will look for a roll out lane REGARDLESS of a presence of pressure. I seen him rolled out of a three-man pass rush on max-protected. Hell, I've seen him rolled out on a two-man rush where the defense drop everyone back to prevent a a red zone TD. When a QB do that they limit themselves to viable throwing targets. They also create the illusion to the media and fans that the O-line failed on that play and that's the reason a QB failed to make a throw. "It's the O-line fault. They didn't allow him enough time. Look how the QB have to scramble from that pass rush. They broke down"

Those guys upfront are busting their butts off for that guy. They're not perfect on every pass play. And they far from bad. They sufficient for the most part and that should be enough. To have you people here bash them is disgusting. You put a QB with sound footwork and good pocket-instinct behind that line, I guarantee everyone will view our O-line in a more positive way.

If you guys are in disagreement with my assessment, I'll make a proposition for you. Show me a video of Schaub staying in a well protected pocket, standing poised waiting for his reciever to break routes and making a throw on a undesign play. Show me a video of Schaub stepping aside to avoid a pass rush, gather his feet and making a downfield throw while still in the pocket. If someone can upload that video in this forum I will paypal you a $100. You can go back to any years he played here. Hell you even can go back to when he was with the Falcon. And if you STILL in disagreement, next time you see a defense rushing only three and dropping everyone back, watch how he panics and make awkward throws or rolled out from a clean pocket. When his receiver aren't open and there's no roll out lane expect the balls to be thrown in the stands-regardless of pressure.

I wish folks here stop blaming the O-line for Schaub bad QB plays. He panic too often when his reciever are covered. And when he make a good throw within his 3 second window people are cool with that. But if his 3 second is up and there's no one open and Schaub gives up and takes a seat on defender's lap people call out our line.

This QB needs to be held accountable. So please. Stop blaming the line!!

To the bolded, I wish I had time, I'd take that hundy. He's done it many times. Just did it against the Vikes.

As an aside and not being a grammar Nazi, just curious, is English your second langue?

AWESOME! Please let us know if he keeps his word and pays up.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yk5Kif3XrZ4
First play against KC, Schaub to AJ.
The desgined route is for AJ to run to the middle of the field, but he was double-teamed.
AJ made the adjustment, and went back to the corner;
Schaub bought enough time, threw from his back foot as to avoid the pass rusher coming toward him, and bingo.

Where do I line up to collect?

C Madd
12-29-2012, 02:19 PM
If you guys are in disagreement with my assessment, I'll make a proposition for you. Show me a video of Schaub staying in a well protected pocket, standing poised waiting for his reciever to break routes and making a throw on a undesign play. Show me a video of Schaub stepping aside to avoid a pass rush, gather his feet and making a downfield throw while still in the pocket. If someone can upload that video in this forum I will paypal you a $100. You can go back to any years he played here. Hell you even can go back to when he was with the Falcon. And if you STILL in disagreement, next time you see a defense rushing only three and dropping everyone back, watch how he panics and make awkward throws or rolled out from a clean pocket. When his receiver aren't open and there's no roll out lane expect the balls to be thrown in the stands-regardless of pressure.


I'm sure there are plenty of other examples, but this is the play that I thought of instantly.

http://youtu.be/uFuul1wBDu4

So when can I expect my $100?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Na363glDoY

Goatcheese
12-29-2012, 02:44 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZomwVcGt0LE

dream_team
12-29-2012, 09:31 PM
AWESOME! Please let us know if he keeps his word and pays up.

So I noticed klockWork is posting in other threads, but appears to be ignoring this one now.

ObsiWan
12-29-2012, 09:37 PM
I'm sure there are plenty of other examples, but this is the play that I thought of instantly.

http://youtu.be/uFuul1wBDu4

So when can I expect my $100?

When...
:pigfly: :pigfly: :pigfly:

:kitten:

AndyWin
12-31-2012, 12:37 AM
As I was saying................... :)

Norg
12-31-2012, 04:35 AM
naaa we have a Super bowl winning OC coaching a Backup QB jus saying

mussop
12-31-2012, 06:48 AM
Click the link to view a bunch of Schaub highlights were he debunks most of what any Schaub hater say in these posts, and a few that confirm them also, but to all of you who say Matt can't this or that... Watch and then let's hear your excuses.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cSzkqchFbhM

how about showing some of his highlights from this year? He's not the same player he was before the injury. He's never been anything more than a system QB anyway. Not that that is a bad thing. He and the coach have known his weaknesses and have done a good job of masking them up until now. The problem now is that he doesn't have the ability that he had to move around and that is really handcuffing this offense.

Hell if you need proof look at how many times we have thrown screens or run draws on 3rd and long. It's almost a given now. Defenses have picked it up too. They know if they get ANY pressure at all on Schaub he will throw it away or dump it off immediately.

Kubiak knows not to trust Matt in those situations so he is doing what he can to work around it. If that's not the case then Kubiak is the most conservative uncreative offensive coordinator in the history of the NFL.

Surreal McCoy
12-31-2012, 07:36 AM
Just one question: How many HoF QBs have won a Super Bowl as HC?

*HoF QB is the qualifier as those are the only QBs acceptable by this board, ie Manning, Brady, or Brees, etc.

Goatcheese
12-31-2012, 07:44 AM
Kubiak knows not to trust Matt in those situations so he is doing what he can to work around it. If that's not the case then Kubiak is the most conservative uncreative offensive coordinator in the history of the NFL.

I think it's more of a lack of trust in his O-line than Schaub.

He doesn't think they can hold up when the opponent just pins their ears back.