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Rey
12-24-2012, 01:08 PM
i.e. a colloborative effort So now it just comes down to common sense then. Since the GB game where it was effective i've seen teams routinely make it part a huge part of their strategy to shoot someone in the "A" gap between Meyers & Smith & blow up whatever we're trying to.

With the Packers it was mostly Matthews with a little bit of AJ Hawk
With the Patriots is was mostly Mayo
With the Vikings if i recall i saw it a little with harrison smith & some other guy.

So the question is do some here really believe that schaub himself is purposely not adjusting protection to account for a blitzer coming right in front of him over the center or is it reasonable to assume that between meyers and smith, someone's missing an assignment? I only say this b/c a lot of the times, those guys are coming in fairly clean which would lead me to think that there's some confusion up front with the line.

My opinion is that there's absolutely no way a qb doesn't account for a blitzer coming up the middle....that's pretty much the holy trinity of the pocket b/c no qb like being pressured up the middle like that unless they have a screen called.

Like I said, we don't know and can't know unless we are in those meeting rooms and on the practice field. Normally you wouldn't want a guy coming right up the middle free, but there are some cases where you'd have a rb pick that guy up. Could be the o line not reading it correctly...could be they are overloading somewhere...could be a bad protection call...


I have no idea.

What I do know is that Matt doesn't handle pressure in his face well at all. I mean...no qb likes pressure in their face, but some handle it better than others...Matt is pretty much useless with any kind of pressure from the inside...no side step...very little maneuverability, doesn't have the arm to consistently throw accurately from awkward positions and on the run.

And the o line is not blameless at all. Just saying that it's not a crime to acknowledge that he has some pretty stark limitations to his game.

Uncle Rico
12-24-2012, 01:58 PM
texans should give me a tryout, i can throw a football over those mountains, plus i dont get scary feet and ball up when a defender puts a hand on me!!

seriously. get mike vick here ASAP.

DocBar
12-24-2012, 02:15 PM
It'll be interesting to see what Smithiak thinks of Keenum's progress.

I agree with a lot of the posts about the OL not playing well. It takes time for them to gel and Kubiak's been mixing and matching all season long.
I've never been a fan of OL rotations.

C Madd
12-24-2012, 02:28 PM
texans should give me a tryout, i can throw a football over those mountains, plus i dont get scary feet and ball up when a defender puts a hand on me!!

seriously. get mike vick here ASAP.

I'm all for it. You looked pretty accurate here.

http://gifsoup.com/webroot/animatedgifs/137930_o.gif

ObsiWan
12-24-2012, 02:40 PM
You brought up the point that the Texans could tank for the next few years and secure a number one draft pick. I countered that the Texans pretty much sucked up until a few years back. Why didn't we get that elite QB then?
NO gets Brees. Denver gets Manning. Giants get younger Manning. Packers get Rodgers. San Fran has two pretty damn good QB's, how did that happen?
Heck, even Washington gets RG III..

Let's review the draft picks we got during those years. And let's assume that a QB of the caliber you specified would HAVE to be drafted in the first round OR that we'd have to give up our first round picks for two years in succession (that's what trading up would have cost) to grab such a quality QB.

2008 - Duane Brown
2009 - Brian Cushing
2010 - Kareem Jackson
2011 - J.J. Watt
2012 - Whitney Mercilus

Which two of those guys are you willing to give up? And who was out there that we would have drafted or traded to get.

Before you list Peyton, think about how much he would have cost salary cap-wise. I don't know for sure, but I doubt we could have paid Duane Brown and Foster if we had Peyton's salary on our books.

Don't get me wrong, I'm all for upgrading the QB spot. What sane fan wouldn't be? But I'm like Tex. All this "we need to replace Schaub" yelling without specifying WHO or laying out a PLAN is just whining.

Only the backwards possuM has even bothered to make a list of prospects in the upcoming draft. I'll give him credit for that. I'd like to see some of the draftniks comment on his selections, since I'll admit I don't study college ball like those guys.

And I'd take a Russell Wilson or Kapernick(sp?) type to groom for a year or two and then let him start.

Comments, folks??

mussop
12-24-2012, 03:14 PM
i.e. a colloborative effort So now it just comes down to common sense then. Since the GB game where it was effective i've seen teams routinely make it part a huge part of their strategy to shoot someone in the "A" gap between Meyers & Smith & blow up whatever we're trying to.

With the Packers it was mostly Matthews with a little bit of AJ Hawk
With the Patriots is was mostly Mayo
With the Vikings if i recall i saw it a little with harrison smith & some other guy.

So the question is do some here really believe that schaub himself is purposely not adjusting protection to account for a blitzer coming right in front of him over the center or is it reasonable to assume that between meyers and smith, someone's missing an assignment? I only say this b/c a lot of the times, those guys are coming in fairly clean which would lead me to think that there's some confusion up front with the line.

My opinion is that there's absolutely no way a qb doesn't account for a blitzer coming up the middle....that's pretty much the holy trinity of the pocket b/c no qb like being pressured up the middle like that unless they have a screen called.


My god you are all over the place trying to make excuses for Schuab. Look it's simple. Schaub is well versed in this offense and runs it well enough for the team to win many games. I don't think any reasonable person will argue differently. And yes the OL had breakdowns and were largely responsible for Schaubs crappy play. And yes even elite QB's don't play as well when pressured. Only an insane person would say different.

The problem is that if any part of the offense breaks down, the OL, the running game or the WR,s dropping passes, Schaub doesn't have the ability to make a play on his own. There almost a ZERO percent chance of anything positive happening.

Here's where you come back with "only the elites can do that" crap. No! Not true. Schaub is exceptionally horrible under pressure. He does it every game. The slightest hint of pressure and he's throwing the ball away. Most of the time he's just a simple side step or step up from extending the play. And most of the time if he were able to do that there are open guys. Those few plays every game are huge opportunities that are being wasted.

Obviously there is no one that could replace him at this moment. However the sooner Kubiak pulls his head out of his ass (just like McNair made him do with his defensive coordinators) and start looking for someone that can take this team to the next level. The sooner he will find one. Until then we will win a lot of game but never be serious Super Bowl contenders.

Schaubs lack of mobility and inability extend any plays is going to handcuff this team against top competition. To many things are going to have to fall in line for us to ever even make it to the Super Bowl. The good thing is we are a young team so there is time to Find our QB. The bad news is Kubiak is loyal to a fault and Schaub isn't going to improve in his biggest area of weakness.

ObsiWan
12-24-2012, 03:15 PM
You lose any cred when you mention Yates. I'm tired of talking about him or even discussing his name. He's back up. He'll always be a back up. Get over it and accept it or go root for another team, because Schaub isn't going anywhere any time soon. You say you agreed with what I just wrote, but then start bringing up a sorry ass 6th rounder who played like trash at this time last season, so you're a total contradiction to even suggest Yates. I'm all for hearing about other guys in the up coming drafts. I'd like to find a Schaub replacement for the future, but I want a guy who looks like a can't miss where the margin of error on the guy is very slim. You want a guy that can be an average starter at best if he hits his peak completely. It is no point in me discussing QB's with you because you aren't even suggesting anything that has value to the discussion at this point.

I'm on your side of this "discussion" but that "can't miss" statement is a slippery slope. No way Wilson lasts to the 3rd round or Tom Brady lasts until the 6th round or San Diego gives up on Drew Brees for Phillip Rivers (yeah, in hindsight that was stupid) if folks knew then what they know now. No way Ryan Leaf or Jamarcus Russell or Vince Young go so high if folks knew then what they know now.

I know what you mean, you want, we all want, a QB with a great football IQ (at least that's first on my list), accuracy, good-to-great arm strength and accuracy to go with it, and above average mobility. And lastly, maybe more important that some others, a "find a way to win" mentality that infects every other member of the offense.

Case Keenum showed that in college. Can it transfer to the NFL? Who knows. Is yates that guy? I haven't really seen it in him.

I'm pretty sure these aren't the last two QBs Smithiak will target. The search is on-going.

Texecutioner
12-24-2012, 03:21 PM
texans should give me a tryout, i can throw a football over those mountains, plus i dont get scary feet and ball up when a defender puts a hand on me!!

seriously. get mike vick here ASAP.

Yeah, because that has worked out so well for Philly. :vincepalm:


Good lord this has become the worst board in the NFL over night. A guy who has had two horrible back to back seasons is now the guy that should replace Schaub. Wow.

mussop
12-24-2012, 03:34 PM
Really I wouldn't mind seeing us draft any of these guys to push Yates for the backup sopt.
Tyler Wilson, QB, Arkansas
Height: 6-3. Weight: 220.
Projected 40 Time: 4.80.
Projected Round (2013): 1-2.
Wilson completed 62 percent of his passes for 3,387 yards, 21 touchdowns and 13 interceptions in 2012.

Tyler Bray*, QB, Tennessee
Height: 6-6. Weight: 210.
Projected 40 Time: 4.82.
Projected Round (2013): 1-3.
12/1/12: Bray had a bunch of uneven games this year. He was repeatedly been hurt by dropped passes, but also had some shaky decision-making. The junior completed 59 percent of his passes this season, collecting 3,612 yards, 34 touchdowns and 12 interceptions.

Landry "Lance" Jones, QB, Oklahoma
Height: 6-4. Weight: 216.
Projected 40 Time: 4.81.
Projected Round (2013): 1-3.
12/1/12: Jones has completed 66 percent of his passes for 3,745 yards, 27 touchdowns and nine interceptions.

Tajh Boyd*, QB, Clemson
Height: 6-1. Weight: 225.
Projected 40 Time: 4.63.
Projected Round (2013): 1-3.
12/1/12: Boyd has completed 67 percent of his passes this year for 3,550 yards, 34 touchdowns and 13 interceptions. He has run for 706 yards (492 net) and nine touchdowns, too.

Ryan Nassib, Syracuse
Height: 6-2. Weight: 229.
Projected 40 Time: 4.80.
Projected Round (2013): 2-3.
12/1/12: Nassib has completed 63 percent of his passes for 3,619 yards, 24 touchdowns and nine interceptions this year. He has displayed intelligence and accuracy this season.


Mike Glennon, QB, N.C. State
Height: 6-6. Weight: 232.
Projected 40 Time: 4.61.
Projected Round (2013): 2-3.
12/1/12: Glennon has completed 57 percent of his passes for 3,648 yards, 30 touchdowns and 14 interceptions. He has played better than his numbers indicate.

Aaron Murray*, QB, Georgia
Height: 6-1. Weight: 211.
Projected 40 Time: 4.81.
Projected Round (2013): 2-4.
12/1/12: Murray has completed 67 percent of his passes in 2012 for 3,201 yards, 30 touchdowns and seven interceptions

E.J. Manuel, QB, Florida State
Height: 6-5. Weight: 234.
Projected 40 Time: 4.61.
Projected Round (2013): 3-4.
12/1/12: Manuel is one of the most improved draft prospects in the nation. His accuracy and field vision have really made strides from 2011. He is elevating from a game manager to a play-maker. Manuel has completed 67 percent of his passes for 2,972 yards, 22 touchdowns and 16 interceptions this season. He has run the ball well for the Seminoles also.

Zac Dysert, QB, Miami of Ohio
Height: 6-4. Weight: 228.
Projected 40 Time: 4.79.
Projected Round (2013): 3-5.
12/1/12: Dysert has completed 63 percent of his passes for 3,483 yards, 25 touchdowns and 12 interceptions in 2012.

Colin Klein, QB, Kansas State
Height: 6-5. Weight: 226.
Projected 40 Time: 4.72.
Projected Round (2013): 5-7.
12/1/12: Klein has been one of the best players in college football this season. He has been a superb play-maker who has carried the Wildcats to a great season.

Klein's completed 67 percent of his passes for 2,306 yards, 14 touchdowns and six interceptions this year. The senior has also ran for 20 touchdowns. He ran for 1,141 yards and 27 touchdowns in 2011 while throwing for 1,918 yards with 13 touchdowns and six interceptions.

All of these guys have good potential. Kubiak is supposed to be a QB guru. Obviously the list will shrink after the interviews, workouts and combine. But this is a pretty talented group with a lot of natural ability and good size/measureables. Don't get me wrong they all have their faults and there isn't any obvious franchise types but A few of these guys with the right coaching could turn out to be pretty dam good.

coon
12-24-2012, 03:47 PM
Yeah, because that has worked out so well for Philly. :vincepalm:


Good lord this has become the worst board in the NFL over night. A guy who has had two horrible back to back seasons is now the guy that should replace Schaub. Wow.

Relax man the board is fine, I am pretty sure most of us don't want a turnover prone Vick.

Also we don't need a fast Qb than can run, that is just a plus. To me, mobility isn't being able to scramble for 50 yards, it's being able to slide and shift in the pocket and escape it from time to time with the intention to throw it. Mobility is about crafty movement and shiftiness not speed. In the 2013 draft, the only Qb's I think are really worth drafting are Geno Smith, Ryan Nassib, and Aaron Murray. None of them are worth a first rounder to me, I would spend a late second rounder on Geno Smith, Ryan Nassib, and Aaron Murry in that order. I think they all are better prospects than Yates, though i like Keenum alot. The fact that Keenum wasn't drafted makes me skeptikal though since NFL GM's are smarter than I.

Ryan
12-24-2012, 03:59 PM
By the way this thread reads, I certainly wouldn't think we are 12-3 right now.

ObsiWan
12-24-2012, 04:00 PM
All of these guys have good potential. Kubiak is supposed to be a QB guru. Obviously the list will shrink after the interviews, workouts and combine. But this is a pretty talented group with a lot of natural ability and good size/measureables. Don't get me wrong they all have their faults and there isn't any obvious franchise types but A few of these guys with the right coaching could turn out to be pretty dam good.

At the risk of turning this into a draft thread, I'm curious if this guy
E.J. Manuel, QB, Florida State
Height: 6-5. Weight: 234.
Projected 40 Time: 4.61.
Projected Round (2013): 3-4.
12/1/12: Manuel is one of the most improved draft prospects in the nation. His accuracy and field vision have really made strides from 2011. He is elevating from a game manager to a play-maker. Manuel has completed 67 percent of his passes for 2,972 yards, 22 touchdowns and 16 interceptions this season. He has run the ball well for the Seminoles also.

Is the guy I saw leading the Seminoles a year or so ago. He was outstanding! I don't really watch college ball, but I couldn't change the station when he was on the field. I don't remember him looking like he was 6-5 though...

Hervoyel
12-24-2012, 04:13 PM
Let's review the draft picks we got during those years. And let's assume that a QB of the caliber you specified would HAVE to be drafted in the first round OR that we'd have to give up our first round picks for two years in succession (that's what trading up would have cost) to grab such a quality QB.

2008 - Duane Brown
2009 - Brian Cushing
2010 - Kareem Jackson
2011 - J.J. Watt
2012 - Whitney Mercilus

Which two of those guys are you willing to give up? And who was out there that we would have drafted or traded to get.

Before you list Peyton, think about how much he would have cost salary cap-wise. I don't know for sure, but I doubt we could have paid Duane Brown and Foster if we had Peyton's salary on our books.

Don't get me wrong, I'm all for upgrading the QB spot. What sane fan wouldn't be? But I'm like Tex. All this "we need to replace Schaub" yelling without specifying WHO or laying out a PLAN is just whining.

Only the backwards possuM has even bothered to make a list of prospects in the upcoming draft. I'll give him credit for that. I'd like to see some of the draftniks comment on his selections, since I'll admit I don't study college ball like those guys.

And I'd take a Russell Wilson or Kapernick(sp?) type to groom for a year or two and then let him start.

Comments, folks??

It's funny how there's always a cap reason why we can't do what's sitting right in front of us but someone else always manages to make that move. Denver signed Manning and they're not a shell of a team because of it.

76Texan
12-24-2012, 04:52 PM
It's funny how there's always a cap reason why we can't do what's sitting right in front of us but someone else always manages to make that move. Denver signed Manning and they're not a shell of a team because of it.

From what I read, the Broncos had the second most to spend in cap space before the deal.

The numbers show that they are the biggest spender this year on salary.

One of things that helped them came from the Cutler's trade where they received 3 or 4 extra picks.

When they cut Orton, somebody picked him up, taking them off the hook.

From their MB, I gather that they have been benefiting from younger players working "on the cheap".

Right now, they are trying to figure out how they can resign some of their players next season, what cuts they might have to make, etc.

76Texan
12-24-2012, 05:01 PM
At the risk of turning this into a draft thread, I'm curious if this guy


Is the guy I saw leading the Seminoles a year or so ago. He was outstanding! I don't really watch college ball, but I couldn't change the station when he was on the field. I don't remember him looking like he was 6-5 though...

I haven't watched him play this year.
Wasn't all that impressed with him the year before.

I watched a bunch of QBs in 2011, but I haven't zeroed in on the position this year, just a few games here and there.

For me, Geno Smith (WV) is probably the top choice.

After that it's somewhat of a toss-up with Barkley (USC) and Wilson (Ark).

The next group may consist of Bray, Jones, and a few more names.

There could be anywhere between 5 to 7 taken in the first two rounds.

mussop
12-24-2012, 05:23 PM
At the risk of turning this into a draft thread, I'm curious if this guy


Is the guy I saw leading the Seminoles a year or so ago. He was outstanding! I don't really watch college ball, but I couldn't change the station when he was on the field. I don't remember him looking like he was 6-5 though...

Yes that's him. You know how college listings are. They are always inflated. I've seen him listed anywhere from 6'3" to 6'5" and from 230 lbs to 245lbs. Probably on the low end of those measurements but he's by no means a little guy.

Uncle Rico
12-24-2012, 05:26 PM
I'm all for it. You looked pretty accurate here.

http://gifsoup.com/webroot/animatedgifs/137930_o.gif

mmm hmmm if i could go back in time ..... i'd take state.

ralph
12-24-2012, 05:27 PM
At the risk of turning this into a draft thread, I'm curious if this guy


Is the guy I saw leading the Seminoles a year or so ago. He was outstanding! I don't really watch college ball, but I couldn't change the station when he was on the field. I don't remember him looking like he was 6-5 though...

Depends what game you watched. He was injured for a few games last year (Oklahoma, Clemson, WF).

He is not someone you want to draft. I have watched every college snap he has ever taken. Not smart enough to be a good college QB let alone NFL. FSU fans are not missing him.

mussop
12-24-2012, 05:27 PM
I haven't watched him play this year.
Wasn't all that impressed with him the year before.

I watched a bunch of QBs in 2011, but I haven't zeroed in on the position this year, just a few games here and there.

For me, Geno Smith (WV) is probably the top choice.

After that it's somewhat of a toss-up with Barkley (USC) and Wilson (Ark).

The next group may consist of Bray, Jones, and a few more names.

There could be anywhere between 5 to 7 taken in the first two rounds.

I've never been impressed with Barkley. Have a feeling he's going to really slide Down draft boards after workouts.

mussop
12-24-2012, 05:30 PM
Depends what game you watched. He was injured for a few games last year (Oklahoma, Clemson, WF).

He is not someone you want to draft. I have watched every college snap he has ever taken. Not smart enough to be a good college QB let alone NFL. FSU fans are not missing him.

Most of this is true but he has qualities that will intrigue NFL teams. The combine will be real important for him and most of this years crop as car as that goes.

Uncle Rico
12-24-2012, 05:33 PM
Yeah, because that has worked out so well for Philly. :vincepalm:


Good lord this has become the worst board in the NFL over night. A guy who has had two horrible back to back seasons is now the guy that should replace Schaub. Wow.

slow down partner, vick was a victim of a beautiful team implosion this year, wasnt all his doing. when he took the job from kevin kolb everyone sure was excited. vick was back, and better than! and now ... he stinks again! yay! we dont want the mean doggy killer here, 'he's not texan material'

i do know this: shanahan/kubiak's offensive scheme historically has been run by a mobile and above average scrambling quaterback. from steve young, john elway, jake plummer. and now the shifty matt schaub. hmmmm somebody in that list doesnt belong. but hey what do i know im the noob here who doesnt know what he's saying, i mean i havent even figured out all the badass emoticons to the side yet, really creative!

its just depressing to a cetain extent that our qb is the scary Matt Schaub. <sigh> at least he's better than john skelton i guess, and he does beat up on the scrubby teams pretty good.

Premier
12-24-2012, 05:34 PM
Yeah, because that has worked out so well for Philly. :vincepalm:



this seems to be the only excuse to help schaubs case when comparing 2 qbs.. they play in 2 completely different schemes. you dont think vick can roll out and hit a wide open receiver..? vicks mobility in the texans system could open things up for both the pass and run game. that PA stretch would be a deadly play because safeties would have to make snap decisions about whether to, support the run, pick up streaking receivers, or spy on the qb, by the time they decide, im sure vick could already have made a play.. then vice versa, i dont see a scenario where matt schaub is successful in Philly. vick would do work in this sytem.. unless youre one of those guys that will respond with "vicks not smart enough to qb this system.."

coon
12-24-2012, 06:18 PM
I haven't watched him play this year.
Wasn't all that impressed with him the year before.

I watched a bunch of QBs in 2011, but I haven't zeroed in on the position this year, just a few games here and there.

For me, Geno Smith (WV) is probably the top choice.

After that it's somewhat of a toss-up with Barkley (USC) and Wilson (Ark).

The next group may consist of Bray, Jones, and a few more names.

There could be anywhere between 5 to 7 taken in the first two rounds.
76, what do you think of Ryan Nassib? I actually like him as much as any other Qb in this draft. Good physical tools, decent athlete, and most importantly for me, he is a very sharp kid. He was even a 2012 National Football Foundation National Scholar-Athlete. He is the kind of guy I'm talking about when I say we should take a shot on a kid in the 2nd or 3rd round because he has a chance to develop into something special. I would be interested in your take on him, if you have one yet, since I actually agreed with most your assessments on Qb's prior to the 2012 draft.

srrono
12-24-2012, 06:29 PM
I started a thread about this before i seen this one but here is what i said.

I like everyone else am hoping the Texans get it together and win a superbowl or at least make a strong run. If not QB may be where change is needed.
I heard a caller on the radio speak on this today.
OAK paid two #1 picks for Palmer. (very high)
What is the value of Schaub? #1? 2 #2's? a #2 & #3?
If the Texans could trade him for maybe a #1 or two #2 picks then turn around and sign Alex Smith in the off season would you do it?
I see Alex Smith fitting the HOU system. Smith is 3 years younger at 28 also has more mobility.
Smith Signed a three-year, $24 million contract. Talking heads say he will be cut in off season. Smith would cost about half the price as Schaub.
Schuab Signed a five-year, $66.15 million contract.
NFL QB landscape
I am not sure what teams could be interested in Schaub maybe:
ARZ
KC
JAG
OAK
CLE
BUF
NYJ

With the extra cap savings and draft pick or picks this would help fill other positions of need on the team.

GP
12-24-2012, 06:32 PM
I started a thread about this before i seen this one but here is what i said.

I like everyone else am hoping the Texans get it together and win a superbowl or at least make a strong run. If not QB may be where change is needed.
I heard a caller on the radio speak on this today.
OAK paid two #1 picks for Palmer. (very high)
What is the value of Schaub? #1? 2 #2's? a #2 & #3?
If the Texans could trade him for maybe a #1 or two #2 picks then turn around and sign Alex Smith in the off season would you do it?
I see Alex Smith fitting the HOU system. Smith is 3 years younger at 28 also has more mobility.
Smith Signed a three-year, $24 million contract. Talking heads say he will be cut in off season. Smith would cost about half the price as Schaub.
Schuab Signed a five-year, $66.15 million contract.
NFL QB landscape
I am not sure what teams could be interested in Schaub maybe:
ARZ
KC
JAG
OAK
CLE
BUF
NYJ

With the extra cap savings and draft pick or picks this would help fill other positions of need on the team.

1. Kubiak will never trade Schaub. Not even possible with Kubiak here as HC.

2. No way would we trade him to the Jags.

3. What team out there would want him with his inability to (a) run one yard, (b) get around in the pocket more than 12% of the times he's hurried, and (c) inability to be consistently GOOD.

4. Please do not EVER mention Alex Smith as a guy who could be our QB. I'd rather have Schaub, and right now I don't want Schaub.

mussop
12-24-2012, 06:59 PM
I started a thread about this before i seen this one but here is what i said.

I like everyone else am hoping the Texans get it together and win a superbowl or at least make a strong run. If not QB may be where change is needed.
I heard a caller on the radio speak on this today.
OAK paid two #1 picks for Palmer. (very high)
What is the value of Schaub? #1? 2 #2's? a #2 & #3?
If the Texans could trade him for maybe a #1 or two #2 picks then turn around and sign Alex Smith in the off season would you do it?
I see Alex Smith fitting the HOU system. Smith is 3 years younger at 28 also has more mobility.
Smith Signed a three-year, $24 million contract. Talking heads say he will be cut in off season. Smith would cost about half the price as Schaub.
Schuab Signed a five-year, $66.15 million contract.
NFL QB landscape
I am not sure what teams could be interested in Schaub maybe:
ARZ
KC
JAG
OAK
CLE
BUF
NYJ

With the extra cap savings and draft pick or picks this would help fill other positions of need on the team.


Get ready for the Alex smith sucks and isn't in Schaubs class responses.

Rey
12-24-2012, 08:11 PM
I keep reading that kubiak won't ever replace schaub as long as he's healthy and I don't buy that...

If Matt plays well in the play offs that's good for us. We should all be happy.

If he plays like crap, you can't roll that guy out there next year and put sprinkles on it and call it a brownie.

otisbean
12-24-2012, 09:15 PM
I'll pose the same question to you that i've posed to others in here and have seemingly gotten no credible response back. Regarding the bolded above, name a qb outside of the top 5 that isn't bothered by pressure.

You guys love to sit up here & make these blanket generalizations about Schaub's ability & the sad thing is, you don't even realize that the same is true for every other qb in the league. Hell, even the elite have issues dealing with pressure at times. Did you happen to see Brady in his last 2 SB appearances & in that Baltimore playoff game a few years back? What about "Matty ice" in the playoff game against the packers in 2010? Hell, There's a 2 time SB winning qb in NY that has looked like a complete clown the last few games b/c he's been under constant pressure.

but for some strange reason folks here think that Schaub is supposed to handle it 100% better than even the elite do & all we need to do is go out & get a more mobile qb & we'll be good. Clearly some of you haven't been watching college / NFL football for very long.

Yes, a qb who's a little more mobile might've been able to make a few more things happen, but the rule proven in the NFL over the last 6789 years is that a qb under pressure is a qb that's going to have trouble making plays & moving the offense period. This is b/c pressure usually results in moving guys off of their spot & jacks up the timing of the play. This obviously affects traditional pocket passers like schaub more than mobile qb's but with mobile qb's, accuracy is usually what's compromised the most when they're under pressure...so for every play they may make there's usually a bad play right around the corner. How many mobile qb's do u have to see come thru the league for this to be written in stone is up to you.

#2, there's a reason why they say "a running game is a qb's best friend". Pretty self explanatory if you understand the game... Keeps the pressure off the qb opens up passing lanes, controls the clock etc. Yesterday, between Foster & Tate, we rushed for a whopping 32 yds...nuff said.

You add in the dropped passes & you've got a recipe for a what schaub did yesterday.

If we all agree that Schaub isn't elite (which you guys say you do) why get so pissed off & call for the guys head when he doesn't do "elite" qb things?

I'm not sure where in my post "I called for his head", and I wasn't pissed off when I wrote my post, actually I was semi defending him. It's just my opinion that he doesn't deal with pressure well, and you're right most QBs don't, but it clearly effects some more than others and I would put Schaub in this category. Look I like the guy and I want him to do well. IMHO the way to help him succeed is to keep his pocket clean.

Hervoyel
12-24-2012, 11:42 PM
QB's get too much blame and too much credit. We all know this. Nobody is saying that isn't the case. This TEAM does not play well when it is under the spotlight, or when its facing a legitimate contender (which they very much want all of us to believe they are).

They lose their focus, make mental errors, and generally just fall apart. Why is that? What causes that to happen? Nobody that I have read posting has denied that this happens. I can go back to Gary Kubiak's first year here and rattle off the games where this has happened over and over again. It's not something we are arguing about because it has happened consistently.

So what's going on? Where do we look for answers to this?

We look at the leaders and traditionally that's your GM. your Head Coach, and your QB. Sorry but that comes with the territory. Maybe it isn't fair but that's how it works. Where do we look? We look "up".

Mr teX
12-25-2012, 12:10 AM
My god you are all over the place trying to make excuses for Schuab. Look it's simple. Schaub is well versed in this offense and runs it well enough for the team to win many games. I don't think any reasonable person will argue differently. And yes the OL had breakdowns and were largely responsible for Schaubs crappy play. And yes even elite QB's don't play as well when pressured. Only an insane person would say different.

The problem is that if any part of the offense breaks down, the OL, the running game or the WR,s dropping passes, Schaub doesn't have the ability to make a play on his own. There almost a ZERO percent chance of anything positive happening.

Here's where you come back with "only the elites can do that" crap. No! Not true. Schaub is exceptionally horrible under pressure. He does it every game. The slightest hint of pressure and he's throwing the ball away. Most of the time he's just a simple side step or step up from extending the play. And most of the time if he were able to do that there are open guys. Those few plays every game are huge opportunities that are being wasted.

Obviously there is no one that could replace him at this moment. However the sooner Kubiak pulls his head out of his ass (just like McNair made him do with his defensive coordinators) and start looking for someone that can take this team to the next level. The sooner he will find one. Until then we will win a lot of game but never be serious Super Bowl contenders.

Schaubs lack of mobility and inability extend any plays is going to handcuff this team against top competition. To many things are going to have to fall in line for us to ever even make it to the Super Bowl. The good thing is we are a young team so there is time to Find our QB. The bad news is Kubiak is loyal to a fault and Schaub isn't going to improve in his biggest area of weakness.


As usual, you overstate your case with no real evidence to back anything up you say or you just completely omit or casually dismiss something that more often than not is key for most, if not all qbs to have success ..........that and your reading comprehension skills still suck.

For instance...almost zero chance of anything positive happening when he's under pressure? Really? Watch the games dude, more often than not, schaub makes his fair share of "positive" plays when he's under pressure. Hell in this very thread, someone has gifs of him side-stepping and throwing 20+ yards down the field in the denver and baltimore games.

The other thing is, what the hell do u mean by make a play on his own? Dude, He's a traditional pocket passer. The biggest plays he can make are by throwing the ball downfield if he's got time to do so.....or by getting the ball into his closest playmaker's hands if he doesn't have time to.............which he does very well evidenced by him being one of the least sacked qb's in the league.

& Newsflash dude, were a legit superbowl contender right now....even with the crappy immobile schaub.

i just really question whether some of you have been watching NFL football for more than a year with some of the suggestions in here...

TEAMS win championships. and as of now, outside of JJ Watt, this TEAM is having major issues.

htownfan32
12-25-2012, 12:34 AM
Honestly?

Alex Smith is better at being mediocre than Matt Schaub. And I think better at being mediocre would go a big way towards helping us win. The only thing is, with the way Schaub's been pressured, I can't fully blame him for crappy play.

Texecutioner
12-25-2012, 02:04 PM
QB's get too much blame and too much credit. We all know this. Nobody is saying that isn't the case. This TEAM does not play well when it is under the spotlight, or when its facing a legitimate contender (which they very much want all of us to believe they are).

They lose their focus, make mental errors, and generally just fall apart. Why is that? What causes that to happen? Nobody that I have read posting has denied that this happens. I can go back to Gary Kubiak's first year here and rattle off the games where this has happened over and over again. It's not something we are arguing about because it has happened consistently.

So what's going on? Where do we look for answers to this?

We look at the leaders and traditionally that's your GM. your Head Coach, and your QB. Sorry but that comes with the territory. Maybe it isn't fair but that's how it works. Where do we look? We look "up".

Well Herv, I know what your opinions are on a lot of things, but doesn't a lot of this seem familiar? Take your criticisms of Schaub away for a minute because I know how you feel there, but where else does this point towards when the majority of the offense s struggling all of a sudden and playing uninspired?? It points towards the HC. I started a thread a few weks ago after the NE game and felt like we would be in a better position to win in the playoffs after that loss, because I felt that the loss could really be a wake up call. If that didn't happen, I stated it would be because of poor coaching then. That's the coach's job to fix those mistakes in practice and to formulate new strategies for a team's weaknesses. All I see is a lack in creativity in how our offense is moving. I see problems all over the offense which starts with the O line. Can Kubiak fix this stuff and get it turned around? Sure, but only time will tell if that happens.

IlliniJen
12-25-2012, 02:07 PM
Well Herv, I know what your opinions are on a lot of things, but doesn't a lot of this seem familiar? Take your criticisms of Schaub away for a minute because I know how you feel there, but where else does this point towards when the majority of the offense s struggling all of a sudden and playing uninspired?? It points towards the HC. I started a thread a few weks ago after the NE game and felt like we would be in a better position to win in the playoffs after that loss, because I felt that the loss could really be a wake up call. If that didn't happen, I stated it would be because of poor coaching then. That's the coach's job to fix those mistakes in practice and to formulate new strategies for a team's weaknesses. All I see is a lack in creativity in how our offense is moving. I see problems all over the offense which starts with the O line. Can Kubiak fix this stuff and get it turned around? Sure, but only time will tell if that happens.

You know what I worry about most? We get home field/bye and what happens? We come off a two-week bye like we ALWAYS do, sluggish and unprepared for at least a half. I don't see how it would be different in the playoffs.

I've harped on Kubiak's lack of preparing this team for YEARS. YEARS. For longer than Thorn's been alive. He's our biggest threat to team play in the playoffs if we get the bye, not the other team we go up against.

Texecutioner
12-25-2012, 02:14 PM
You know what I worry about most? We get home field/bye and what happens? We come off a two-week bye like we ALWAYS do, sluggish and unprepared for at least a half. I don't see how it would be different in the playoffs.

I've harped on Kubiak's lack of preparing this team for YEARS. YEARS. For longer than Thorn's been alive. He's our biggest threat to team play in the playoffs if we get the bye, not the other team we go up against.

Totally agreed Jen. I'm aware of your opinions on Kubiak and I've always felt the same. My biggest fear is Kubiak. Not the other team. I just have to hope that our players can rise to the occassion on their own and play their best game without the motivation from their HC. It's possible, but it's a much stronger challenge.

mussop
12-25-2012, 02:22 PM
Well Herv, I know what your opinions are on a lot of things, but doesn't a lot of this seem familiar? Take your criticisms of Schaub away for a minute because I know how you feel there, but where else does this point towards when the majority of the offense s struggling all of a sudden and playing uninspired?? It points towards the HC. I started a thread a few weks ago after the NE game and felt like we would be in a better position to win in the playoffs after that loss, because I felt that the loss could really be a wake up call. If that didn't happen, I stated it would be because of poor coaching then. That's the coach's job to fix those mistakes in practice and to formulate new strategies for a team's weaknesses. All I see is a lack in creativity in how our offense is moving. I see problems all over the offense which starts with the O line. Can Kubiak fix this stuff and get it turned around? Sure, but only time will tell if that happens.

All very good points.

Texecutioner
12-25-2012, 02:31 PM
All very good points.

Well that is where I think you're misdirecting your complaints Mussop. I understand that you value a mobile QB as well as I, but we've had Schaub for years and you have not had a problem with him not being mobile all these years. He is who he is. He'll need strong protection man. Kubiak needs to make sure our offense is ready. That's his baby. Our Oline has played pretty well all season considering the injuries. We're supposed to be this power running game and we haven't been lately even with all these RB's on our roster. If our running game can't do what it is supposed to do, then Kubiak needs to figure out some new plays and some trickery to fool other teams so their defenses can't get after schaub as easy. Maybe we should be passing to set up the running game instead of the the running game to set up the play action. You've got to change things up when you're struggling across the board like we currently are.