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badboy
12-17-2012, 11:14 PM
We have seen several mocks by our regulars in this forum and some new folks and welcome by the way. Have your thoughts changed on what positions we need to draft? What about players in draft? Who has dropped on your boards and who had risen?

Nose still remains my priority and I do not see that changing. Good news is a good one should be there in first IF Wade wants.

Ben Jones settling in at RG & surplanting Caldwell has been a pleasant surprise & has allowed Brooks a chance to remain in shadows while he does whatever he needs to do. Where would team be if Jones had not stepped up? Newton won me over and from what I see in posts others are joining me. As the right side has solidified with these two on field more together, a right side O lineman has dropped from first round to 4th on my board. I wished Wade Smith was better but I think he is still injured from last season. I next want to see Brooks step up & show he will be the answer by 2014.

WR is something I keep moving down then yanking back up. I desperately want a player to line up opposite AJ and be that WR2 that allows AJ to extend his career & eventually be his replacement. I believe most WRs don't hit their stride until second year with some exceptions. Do I risk a first or second now & hope the pick is more than just an improvement at our WR5? Do I skip WR in '13 and hope that some of the underclassmen return to college and come out in 2014 offering a better option for Texans? If Patterson, Hopkins & Woods decide to return & a few lower round guys step up + maybe a Marqis Lee declares in '14, would a better option be there in 2014 and allow Texans to go for a non-receiver in first 4 rounds now? I am looking at nose in first and Cobi Hamilton in third. Posey against Colts offered me some hope. If he and Jean can get some reps, I hope to move this position off my board. They really need to step up. Still, if Terrance Williams is there in first...argh!

LB is my second priority & despite this being a weak class, I think Texans can fill that need in third.

S will be a low priority if Quin returns and for now I think he will.

1. NT John Jenkins (my draft partner Beerlover says he drops to us or is close enough for a trade up. Hey, he picked JJ Watt.) or Luis Nix should be here. I don't want to use picks to trade up but Tate?
2. OLB Morgan Brislin could be another Mercilus and I will be surprised if Barwin comes back as he would be much more expensive than Brooks.
3A. ILB Andrew Jackson hey he can play OLB and reminds me of former Alabama Dont'a Hightower who was drafted by mmm oh yeah New England.
3b. WR (at least for now) Cobi Hamilton Arkansas. 6'2" 209 and may break into 4.4s 90/1335 14.8 5 TDs
4. OT/OG Rick Wagner
5A TE Michael Williams
5B RB Cierre Woods
5C C/OG Gabe Ikard
6. DE Kapron Lewis -Moore as Crick is looking very good & could be A. Smith's replacement. I wish I had Moore's motor. If you have watched Notre Dame this season you know what I mean. Jan 7th Alabama v. ND!
7A CB/FS Darrius Slay this dark horse could be a talent at either position and moves into #3 safety in his second year.
7B (allan ball) Ray Ray Armstrong go ahead and jeer but he probably will go as high as 5th.

aussie_texan
12-18-2012, 12:20 AM
NT is still my top priority, only real need i think. First round, really hoping for Nix from ND.

OT, i think we got our answer against the colts when newton came back and played really well, the line looked a lot better with him, so OT moves down to around 4-5th round of me but a pick is still needed because we could loose all or some of gardner, butler and harris in FA

OG, similar to OT, jones has played consistently well from the get go and i think brooks had a good game against the colts and from what kubiack said, we should see more of him in the next few weeks. so OG like OT is around the mid to late rounds.
THe only thing that concerns me is the amount of OG/OT that are finishing their contracts this year, depending how many leave and who leaves OG/OT could move up my board, but for now im looking for depth and competition not starters.

WR, was never a real priority for me and im a big fan of posey so i would like to give them (posey, martin, jean and maehl) another year before we go after the Number 1 wideout.

I started the year out thinking CB in the mid rounds to add depth but now see it as high priority (e.g. 2nd round), harris is not progressing, kjax is good but i think he needs some competition to keep him playing well and progressing, also with the amount of nickle packages we play the 3rd CB is a real importance now. mccain before his injury was also not playing as well as last year.

The big surprise for me is Safety. I have always been a big fan of demps but im starting to become a little worried with him. I see safety as high as the 3rd round. We often play 3 safeties on the field and demps is a playmaker and a ball magnet but is not consistent enough and im finding myself worried when is on the field. Consistency is the key because our DB have been playing well but given up the big play has been killing us the last few weeks. Also manning is getting a little older and is quite expensive. im not saying we get rid of him because his too good but a player to groom under him is needed and i feel demps isnt that guy. also keo is mainly a ST and isnt the future starting S for this team.

RB, may be needed if we trade Tate, but i liked grimes in the offseason and have been happy with forsett so its not a massive priority even if we loose Tate. so at most round 6.

TE, we saw when GG went down we struggled on offence, this offence plays more importance on the 2nd TE then the 2nd WR, so going after a TE early i wouldn't be mad with but i feel we need to target other positions first. but i would like some competition going into camp so i feel TE must be address somewhere in the draft.

Not concerned about DE, because if we get that NT, earl mitchell moves over to DE (if cody stays) and our starters are very good and with good back ups in jamison, crick and mitchell we should be fine.

OLB is a bit of a wildcard, i really like merciless and barwin hasnt had those nice stats like last year. if barwin leaves in FA i think and early to mid-round pick is need e.g. 2-4th round. But i think he stays to a team friendly deal and if he does a late round pick is all thats needed to add competition, also im thinking we loose nading in FA, or flat out cut him. also braman is a beast!!!!!

steelbtexan
12-18-2012, 12:27 AM
We have seen several mocks by our regulars in this forum and some new folks and welcome by the way. Have your thoughts changed on what positions we need to draft? What about players in draft? Who has dropped on your boards and who had risen?

Nose still remains my priority and I do not see that changing. Good news is a good one should be there in first IF Wade wants.

Ben Jones settling in at RG & surplanting Caldwell has been a pleasant surprise & has allowed Brooks a chance to remain in shadows while he does whatever he needs to do. Where would team be if Jones had not stepped up? Newton won me over and from what I see in posts others are joining me. As the right side has solidified with these two on field more together, a right side O lineman has dropped from first round to 4th on my board. I wished Wade Smith was better but I think he is still injured from last season. I next want to see Brooks step up & show he will be the answer by 2014.

WR is something I keep moving down then yanking back up. I desperately want a player to line up opposite AJ and be that WR2 that allows AJ to extend his career & eventually be his replacement. I believe most WRs don't hit their stride until second year with some exceptions. Do I risk a first or second now & hope the pick is more than just an improvement at our WR5? Do I skip WR in '13 and hope that some of the underclassmen return to college and come out in 2014 offering a better option for Texans? If Patterson, Hopkins & Woods decide to return & a few lower round guys step up + maybe a Marqis Lee declares in '14, would a better option be there in 2014 and allow Texans to go for a non-receiver in first 4 rounds now? I am looking at nose in first and Cobi Hamilton in third. Posey against Colts offered me some hope. If he and Jean can get some reps, I hope to move this position off my board. They really need to step up. Still, if Terrance Williams is there in first...argh!

LB is my second priority & despite this being a weak class, I think Texans can fill that need in third.

S will be a low priority if Quin returns and for now I think he will.

1. NT John Jenkins (my draft partner Beerlover says he drops to us or is close enough for a trade up. Hey, he picked JJ Watt.) or Luis Nix should be here. I don't want to use picks to trade up but Tate?
2. OLB Morgan Brislin could be another Mercilus and I will be surprised if Barwin comes back as he would be much more expensive than Brooks.
3A. ILB Andrew Jackson hey he can play OLB and reminds me of former Alabama Dont'a Hightower who was drafted by mmm oh yeah New England.
3b. WR (at least for now) Cobi Hamilton Arkansas. 6'2" 209 and may break into 4.4s 90/1335 14.8 5 TDs
4. OT/OG Rick Wagner
5A TE Michael Williams
5B RB Cierre Woods
5C C/OG Gabe Ikard
6. DE Kapron Lewis -Moore as Crick is looking very good & could be A. Smith's replacement. I wish I had Moore's motor. If you have watched Notre Dame this season you know what I mean. Jan 7th Alabama v. ND!
7A CB/FS Darrius Slay this dark horse could be a talent at either position and moves into #3 safety in his second year.
7B (allan ball) Ray Ray Armstrong go ahead and jeer but he probably will go as high as 5th.

I want to fix the offense so that they can score more than one offensive TD as they have in the past couple of games.

Patterson/Terrance Williams represent more value talent wise than any of the DT's. IMHO A WR corps of AJ/Posey/Williams/Martin/Walter would be the best in Texans history.

I also rate OT as as high need. There's a big talent gap between guys like Long/Winters/Lane Johnson in the 2nd rd and Wagner in the 4th, if he's still there. (Doubtful) Wagner isn't a good for the ZBS. Doesn't have the feet.

I will check out some of your sleeper picks. If you get time Check out some of my sleeper picks. Reid Fragel Ohio St. RT, Former TE, real physical has good feet. Malcolm Bronson He tore his ACL and should be available late in the draft. He is the nephew of Zack played for the 49ers and is from Jasper. Malcolm kept the much hearlded Janzen Jackson on the bench last yr at McNeese. Guy is a player.

Montori Hughes is another big athletic NT who got kicked out of Tennesee (Dooley) for smoking pot. But he's a player.

thunderkyss
12-18-2012, 01:30 AM
I really enjoy the mocks I read here, so please don't take this as anything other than constructive criticism.

But I think most mock drafts are too need dependent. I know there is an element in all drafts, including the actual draft. But it is rare, I think, that a team can actually say, "This is number one priority, this is number two priority, this is number three"

Case in point, we have NT at the top of a lot of mock drafts for this team, but we have one of the fiercest pass rush & a stout run defense. Only 3 rushing TDs have been given up by whatever squad Wade has put on the field this year despite facing some of the better rushers in the league. McGahee, Rice, MJD, CJ2ypc, CJSpiller, Matt Forte, Steven Riddley.......

Need yes, but to the point that we don't take the best player who happens to be a WR or OG or Safety, or ILB... I don't see it.

I'd love to have a #1a in training at WR. I'd hate to get rid of KDub but this offense would be the shiazttzz with 1st round talent lined up opposite Andre. Maybe we have that with Posey, but if that questioned isn't answered before our season is over....... let's not rule out a talented WR for the sake of a NT.

I think many people thought NT was a major need last year as well. As great a season as Nick Fairley has been having, we'd have missed out on Jj Watt.

Wolf6151
12-18-2012, 02:16 AM
Hate to burst anyone's bubble but Nix is staying at ND.
http://espn.go.com/college-football/story/_/id/8755033/top-notre-dame-irish-linemen-zack-martin-louis-nix-enter-draft

I thought he'd go before we had a chance at him but now someone else will move up and away from us in the 1st round.

Current needs as I see them:
1. DT/NT, I saw Cody getting pushed around by a single blocker in the Colts game way to often and being a 3 mil. a yr. player and FA says bye bye to me. Kawann Short-DT from Purdue, great size and strength to anchor on double teams, speed to penetrate on single blocking, agility/athleticism to play the run and pressure the QB.
2. WR, regardless of what Posey, Martin, and Jean have done this year or not done, which isn't much, we need some better WR talent. Those guys should be fighting for a roster spot next training camp. Quinton Patton-WR from La. Tech. size, great hands, decent speed, field awareness, not afraid of contact, and good routes.
3. OT/OG, I want at least 1 guy in the 2nd or 3rd round and preferably 2 that can play both positions, good quality talent that can step in if needed or fighting for a starting spot in training camp as well as a later round OG for depth. Ricky Wagner-OT from Wisconsin.
3b. OG, Gabe Jackson-OG from Miss. St. with the comp. 3rd. Back to back O-line helps solidify the line for the future and Wade Smith will be leaving after the 2013 season, maybe sooner.
4. CB, we lose McCain in FA because even mediocre CB's are expensive and Harris steps up to take his nickle spot and a draft pick steps in to fill Harris's spot as trainable and upgradeable (is that a word) depth. Johnny Adams-CB from Mich. St. he's got size, speed, athleticism, and potential to be coached up.
5. ILB, once Cushing is back and with a better NT the other 2 down ILB spot is much less important but some young athletic stable talent with potential would be nice here. Kevin Reddick-ILB from UNC or Bruce Taylor-ILB from Va. Tech. both have size and athleticism.
5b. TE, a blocking TE would be nice, our O-line needs some size up front. Michael Williams-TE from Alabama, great size but can catch as well. 6'06" and 270 lbs. would look nice lined up next to Brown or Newton.
6. FB, a real one not a converted TE with no size for lead blocking. I know we don't use one much but in goal line situations some Vontae Leach kind of size and pounding ability would be nice. J.C. Copeland-FB from LSU, a Vontae Leach clone and cheaper than Clutts.
6b. Safety, some added competition in the secondary so that guys like Demps, who I like, at least have to fight for their jobs. No one in mind right now but it's not a great year for Safety so some mid round talent will fall.
7. P, field position is so important and the ability to pin someone deep in their own territory helps your defense immensely. See Bryan Anger from Jacksonville. I like Quinn Sharp-P/K from Oklahoma St. who can also be an emergency K if needed.

aussie_texan
12-18-2012, 08:38 AM
Hate to burst anyone's bubble but Nix is staying at ND.
http://espn.go.com/college-football/story/_/id/8755033/top-notre-dame-irish-linemen-zack-martin-louis-nix-enter-draft



not happy about this!!!!!!
ill be focusing on the williams, from 'Bama and NC.

rmartin65
12-18-2012, 08:51 AM
We have seen several mocks by our regulars in this forum and some new folks and welcome by the way. Have your thoughts changed on what positions we need to draft? What about players in draft? Who has dropped on your boards and who had risen?

Nose still remains my priority and I do not see that changing. Good news is a good one should be there in first IF Wade wants.

Ben Jones settling in at RG & surplanting Caldwell has been a pleasant surprise & has allowed Brooks a chance to remain in shadows while he does whatever he needs to do. Where would team be if Jones had not stepped up? Newton won me over and from what I see in posts others are joining me. As the right side has solidified with these two on field more together, a right side O lineman has dropped from first round to 4th on my board. I wished Wade Smith was better but I think he is still injured from last season. I next want to see Brooks step up & show he will be the answer by 2014.

WR is something I keep moving down then yanking back up. I desperately want a player to line up opposite AJ and be that WR2 that allows AJ to extend his career & eventually be his replacement. I believe most WRs don't hit their stride until second year with some exceptions. Do I risk a first or second now & hope the pick is more than just an improvement at our WR5? Do I skip WR in '13 and hope that some of the underclassmen return to college and come out in 2014 offering a better option for Texans? If Patterson, Hopkins & Woods decide to return & a few lower round guys step up + maybe a Marqis Lee declares in '14, would a better option be there in 2014 and allow Texans to go for a non-receiver in first 4 rounds now? I am looking at nose in first and Cobi Hamilton in third. Posey against Colts offered me some hope. If he and Jean can get some reps, I hope to move this position off my board. They really need to step up. Still, if Terrance Williams is there in first...argh!

LB is my second priority & despite this being a weak class, I think Texans can fill that need in third.

S will be a low priority if Quin returns and for now I think he will.

1. NT John Jenkins (my draft partner Beerlover says he drops to us or is close enough for a trade up. Hey, he picked JJ Watt.) or Luis Nix should be here. I don't want to use picks to trade up but Tate?
2. OLB Morgan Brislin could be another Mercilus and I will be surprised if Barwin comes back as he would be much more expensive than Brooks.
3A. ILB Andrew Jackson hey he can play OLB and reminds me of former Alabama Dont'a Hightower who was drafted by mmm oh yeah New England.
3b. WR (at least for now) Cobi Hamilton Arkansas. 6'2" 209 and may break into 4.4s 90/1335 14.8 5 TDs
4. OT/OG Rick Wagner
5A TE Michael Williams
5B RB Cierre Woods
5C C/OG Gabe Ikard
6. DE Kapron Lewis -Moore as Crick is looking very good & could be A. Smith's replacement. I wish I had Moore's motor. If you have watched Notre Dame this season you know what I mean. Jan 7th Alabama v. ND!
7A CB/FS Darrius Slay this dark horse could be a talent at either position and moves into #3 safety in his second year.
7B (allan ball) Ray Ray Armstrong go ahead and jeer but he probably will go as high as 5th.

First off, and this is not just to badboy, it appears Nix is returning to ND- http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/college-football/news/20121217/louis-nix-notre-dame/?sct=uk_t11_a2

I am slowly becoming more comfortable with the right side of the line. I am not there 100% there yet, but I am on the way. Even if Newton and Jones prove themselves to be starters, we will need to draft a backup at both tackle and guard.

WR is a tough one to peg, I agree. However, again, I am coming to the same conclusion as you- this draft, WR is not a pressing need. AJ is having a dynamite year, even if he does not have the same explosiveness. He still has a couple good years left, we can wait to draft his replacement. The rest of the receivers do their jobs. I dont think we have one real #2 receiver, but rather a couple guys that come in depending on what is going on. Posey really impressed me last game, let's see if he can keep it up. At this rate, we may not have to draft a receiver at all this year.

ILB is a need, in my opinion. I dont think there is a coincidence that since Cushing's injury, we look weaker on D.

OLB is also a need, I think, even if Barwin re-signs. We are getting very little pass rush from the OLBs, which cant happen in a 3-4. Watt is playing out of his mind, but he needs support. Mercilus has 6 sacks, but they appear to be gimmes. Reed has 2 sacks in 11 games, Barwin has very few as well. Even if we just draft a 3rd down pass rush specialist, it needs to be addressed.

I think Quin stays as well. I dont think he would get that much money on the open market, that we are over-valuing him. He will get a raise, but it wont break the bank (though Barwin may have to walk).

1) I would be good with Jenkins. As with all NTs, there is some sizeable risk, but it really is the big whole on this team. Worth the risk, and would be BPA if available.

2) I dont know much about Breslin. Good numbers, good size, but never really stood out to me when I watched USC. I will see if I can scrounge up some more film.

3) Old Hickory, sign me up.

3) Like I said earlier, I dont know if WR is a good choice this year. I dont know if any player taken late willget any real playing time next year, and it may be better to just take one high in 2014.

4) I dont think Wagner fits the system. Good player, but for another team.

5) Michael Williams is a pretty solid pick. Blocking TE with underrated hands. I think he will be gone though.

5) Woods is a great choice. Really, the definition of a number 2 back- does everything well, nothing exceptionally so. Can be a great breather option.

5) Heck yea, boomer sooners! I dont think he declares though, he is only a Junior. I think he returns to Norman for his Senior year.

6) Lewis-Moore is a great pick. We are going to need a DE opposite Watt pretty soon, and KLM can be that guy.

7) Slay could be a good NFL player. I think Broomfield is more talented, but Slay's size might make him a better pro. Only thing is, I think I am going to address CB earlier. I am not confident in Harris at all anymore.

7) Sorry bb, I dont like this idea, unless you plan on PS-ing him, and moving him to ILB.

badboy
12-18-2012, 10:03 AM
NT is still my top priority, only real need i think. First round, really hoping for Nix from ND.

OT, i think we got our answer against the colts when newton came back and played really well, the line looked a lot better with him, so OT moves down to around 4-5th round of me but a pick is still needed because we could loose all or some of gardner, butler and harris in FA

OG, similar to OT, jones has played consistently well from the get go and i think brooks had a good game against the colts and from what kubiack said, we should see more of him in the next few weeks. so OG like OT is around the mid to late rounds.
THe only thing that concerns me is the amount of OG/OT that are finishing their contracts this year, depending how many leave and who leaves OG/OT could move up my board, but for now im looking for depth and competition not starters.

WR, was never a real priority for me and im a big fan of posey so i would like to give them (posey, martin, jean and maehl) another year before we go after the Number 1 wideout.

I started the year out thinking CB in the mid rounds to add depth but now see it as high priority (e.g. 2nd round), harris is not progressing, kjax is good but i think he needs some competition to keep him playing well and progressing, also with the amount of nickle packages we play the 3rd CB is a real importance now. mccain before his injury was also not playing as well as last year.

The big surprise for me is Safety. I have always been a big fan of demps but im starting to become a little worried with him. I see safety as high as the 3rd round. We often play 3 safeties on the field and demps is a playmaker and a ball magnet but is not consistent enough and im finding myself worried when is on the field. Consistency is the key because our DB have been playing well but given up the big play has been killing us the last few weeks. Also manning is getting a little older and is quite expensive. im not saying we get rid of him because his too good but a player to groom under him is needed and i feel demps isnt that guy. also keo is mainly a ST and isnt the future starting S for this team.

RB, may be needed if we trade Tate, but i liked grimes in the offseason and have been happy with forsett so its not a massive priority even if we loose Tate. so at most round 6.

TE, we saw when GG went down we struggled on offence, this offence plays more importance on the 2nd TE then the 2nd WR, so going after a TE early i wouldn't be mad with but i feel we need to target other positions first. but i would like some competition going into camp so i feel TE must be address somewhere in the draft.

Not concerned about DE, because if we get that NT, earl mitchell moves over to DE (if cody stays) and our starters are very good and with good back ups in jamison, crick and mitchell we should be fine.

OLB is a bit of a wildcard, i really like merciless and barwin hasnt had those nice stats like last year. if barwin leaves in FA i think and early to mid-round pick is need e.g. 2-4th round. But i think he stays to a team friendly deal and if he does a late round pick is all thats needed to add competition, also im thinking we loose nading in FA, or flat out cut him. also braman is a beast!!!!!Looks like you put some thought into your post. I've tried to mock a corner but don't see any after say mid second that thrills me. TBH I did not spend much time on college corners or safeties. Early I was going to follow U.Texas guys but that fizzled quickly. Any recommendations for late 2nd or after? I think Slay will do well at either.

Barwin, do we need an OLB that does not get to QB consistently at even a low contract? If Watt had turned out to be a normal DE, we would be a hurtin'. I say bye bye Connor and draft an OLB.

RB, if you can watch Cierre Wood when Notre Dame plays Alabama.

Scooter
12-18-2012, 10:08 AM
i think i'm about the same now as i was early in the season.

1. wide receiver. it's past time to look for the heir to andre, who significantly upgrades #2 wide receiver in the mean time. we're way too dependent on andre and multiple tightend sets to move the ball through the air because our wide receivers arent capable of consistently making plays.

2 offensive tackle. i still see newton topping out as a very good backup. if long is available, i'd make him a priority pick, even taking him in the first if he continues to climb. brooks and jones seem poised to take the OG positions, so i think we're good there, but the bookend opposite duane brown is a very big need IMO.

3 inside linebacker. brian cushing and then a lot of average players on the current squad, none of whom should be starting. this is a spot where i'd like to see us double up in the middle rounds and aim at guys who have shown ball skills in coverage. we have thumpers, but only cushing who can really be an asset when we switch to nickel.

4 nose tackle. i dont rank this as a need, but i would certainly love a franchise big body. NT i would like to see us grab as BPA - whether in the first round or 7th doesnt matter to me. i'd hate to see us bypass a better player to fill this position, but if BPA at our pick is a heavy, i hope we jump on it.

5 corner, safety, OLB. i list these as positions that could use depth, but rate them as areas that could be filled with second tier veteran free agents. i'd look for late round athletes to fill the practice squad and hope to land a gem.

badboy
12-18-2012, 11:03 AM
Hate to burst anyone's bubble but Nix is staying at ND.
http://espn.go.com/college-football/story/_/id/8755033/top-notre-dame-irish-linemen-zack-martin-louis-nix-enter-draft

I thought he'd go before we had a chance at him but now someone else will move up and away from us in the 1st round.

Current needs as I see them:
1. DT/NT, I saw Cody getting pushed around by a single blocker in the Colts game way to often and being a 3 mil. a yr. player and FA says bye bye to me. Kawann Short-DT from Purdue, great size and strength to anchor on double teams, speed to penetrate on single blocking, agility/athleticism to play the run and pressure the QB.
2. WR, regardless of what Posey, Martin, and Jean have done this year or not done, which isn't much, we need some better WR talent. Those guys should be fighting for a roster spot next training camp. Quinton Patton-WR from La. Tech. size, great hands, decent speed, field awareness, not afraid of contact, and good routes.
3. OT/OG, I want at least 1 guy in the 2nd or 3rd round and preferably 2 that can play both positions, good quality talent that can step in if needed or fighting for a starting spot in training camp as well as a later round OG for depth. Ricky Wagner-OT from Wisconsin.
3b. OG, Gabe Jackson-OG from Miss. St. with the comp. 3rd. Back to back O-line helps solidify the line for the future and Wade Smith will be leaving after the 2013 season, maybe sooner.
4. CB, we lose McCain in FA because even mediocre CB's are expensive and Harris steps up to take his nickle spot and a draft pick steps in to fill Harris's spot as trainable and upgradeable (is that a word) depth. Johnny Adams-CB from Mich. St. he's got size, speed, athleticism, and potential to be coached up.
5. ILB, once Cushing is back and with a better NT the other 2 down ILB spot is much less important but some young athletic stable talent with potential would be nice here. Kevin Reddick-ILB from UNC or Bruce Taylor-ILB from Va. Tech. both have size and athleticism.
5b. TE, a blocking TE would be nice, our O-line needs some size up front. Michael Williams-TE from Alabama, great size but can catch as well. 6'06" and 270 lbs. would look nice lined up next to Brown or Newton.
6. FB, a real one not a converted TE with no size for lead blocking. I know we don't use one much but in goal line situations some Vontae Leach kind of size and pounding ability would be nice. J.C. Copeland-FB from LSU, a Vontae Leach clone and cheaper than Clutts.
6b. Safety, some added competition in the secondary so that guys like Demps, who I like, at least have to fight for their jobs. No one in mind right now but it's not a great year for Safety so some mid round talent will fall.
7. P, field position is so important and the ability to pin someone deep in their own territory helps your defense immensely. See Bryan Anger from Jacksonville. I like Quinn Sharp-P/K from Oklahoma St. who can also be an emergency K if needed.The news about Nix surprises me as I thought he was leaving for certain. Kelly must have got him drunk and whispered in his ear. Nix almost left last year. I guess his Irish Chocolate followers convinced him to ride the wave of popularity. Wow. Jesse Williams an early guy for me has moved up & I just cannot get a good read on Sylvester. He has done well when I have focused on him but he turned 24 last month and I want to see if he can keep the weight off. He is quicker and looke good against Virginia. He also has a rep for taking plays off but I have not seen that. It is possible with Nix gone, if S.Williams has a good combine he will climb into late 20s. He is ranked 69. If I knew he would be there in second....

SHort has a rep for not playing 100% but I guess if he can his stats as he has he might be an option. This is same issue I have with Sylvester and not sure that type play translates to NFL. Whomever we draft at NT will have to play hard every play.

Playoffs
12-18-2012, 11:13 AM
Nope, I still want to trade one of our picks for Kirk Cousins.

steelbtexan
12-18-2012, 11:29 AM
i think i'm about the same now as i was early in the season.

1. wide receiver. it's past time to look for the heir to andre, who significantly upgrades #2 wide receiver in the mean time. we're way too dependent on andre and multiple tightend sets to move the ball through the air because our wide receivers arent capable of consistently making plays.

2 offensive tackle. i still see newton topping out as a very good backup. if long is available, i'd make him a priority pick, even taking him in the first if he continues to climb. brooks and jones seem poised to take the OG positions, so i think we're good there, but the bookend opposite duane brown is a very big need IMO.

3 inside linebacker. brian cushing and then a lot of average players on the current squad, none of whom should be starting. this is a spot where i'd like to see us double up in the middle rounds and aim at guys who have shown ball skills in coverage. we have thumpers, but only cushing who can really be an asset when we switch to nickel.

4 nose tackle. i dont rank this as a need, but i would certainly love a franchise big body. NT i would like to see us grab as BPA - whether in the first round or 7th doesnt matter to me. i'd hate to see us bypass a better player to fill this position, but if BPA at our pick is a heavy, i hope we jump on it.

5 corner, safety, OLB. i list these as positions that could use depth, but rate them as areas that could be filled with second tier veteran free agents. i'd look for late round athletes to fill the practice squad and hope to land a gem.

This

Obviously the Texans have trouble scoring TD's. Either this is because of Garys conservatism or lack of playmakers. I tend to think it's the latter. Add a Williams or a Patterson in the 1st rd and a Winters in the 2nd and you will start seeing 24-31 points a game instead of 14-20 points a game. This will help take pressure off of the defense.

The good thing is you still should be able to find a good NT Which I rate as a higher need than you do) and upgrade depth at ILB.

thunderkyss
12-18-2012, 12:33 PM
...and you will start seeing 24-31 points a game instead of 14-20 points a game. This will help take pressure off of the defense.


Are you talking about the Texans?

30
27
31
38
23
24
43
bye
21
13
43
34
24
14
29


We average 28 ppg.

steelbtexan
12-18-2012, 12:51 PM
Are you talking about the Texans?

30
27
31
38
23
24
43
bye
21
13
43
34
24
14
29


We average 28 ppg.

Didn't realize that, however would you consider this offense potent? Especially against playoff caliber teams? 2 offensive TD's in the last 2 wks tells me the Texans could use an upgrade at WR/OL. Either that or Gary has gone ultra conservative and lost faith in Schaub to make good decisions in the Red Zone. I know you're a stats guy TK, but sometimes stats lie.

thunderkyss
12-18-2012, 01:12 PM
Didn't realize that, however would you consider this offense potent? Especially against playoff caliber teams? 2 offensive TD's in the last 2 wks tells me the Texans could use an upgrade at WR/OL. Either that or Gary has gone ultra conservative and lost faith in Schaub to make good decisions in the Red Zone. I know you're a stats guy TK, but sometimes stats lie.

I think your point is good, the premise is the only thing I questioned.

This is a much better argument.

The only thing is that I wish Newton had never gotten hurt. Don't know where his game would be if not for that. I more or less like all the guys on our OL. Newton & Jones just need time. Myers.... well he's starting to tick me off. Smith has been playing better than I thought & I love the big guy (76).

But, I think we need to improve the pedigree of our offense. We need more 1st round pick, or more guys who expect to win. These last two seasons will help our offense with the latter.

At the same time, we're going to draft someone. I'd rather draft a 1st round offensive big ugly than a defensive big ugly. Because I want to blow people off the line. We did it with Eric & Briesel, so maybe Newton & Jones can get it done.

So I would have no problem taking an OG, targeting the veteran LG, or even a Center. If we have the opportunity to get better....

Rey
12-18-2012, 01:22 PM
Are you talking about the Texans?

30
27
31
38
23
24
43
bye
21
13
43
34
24
14
29


We average 28 ppg.

How many defensive td's in there?

I know it won't greatly change the stats, but just curious.

I know this past week we scored on ST and over the course of the year we've scored defensive td's and given the offense great field position....we've also had two overtime games which bump our point totals a little...

And then against the patriots 7 of Those points were scored by the back ups in garbage time...

I realize every team has stuff like this happen, but I would be interested if there is a stay out there for "true point production"...

beerlover
12-18-2012, 01:22 PM
If you improve the middle of this defense with an elite NT w/Cushing returning next season just how many points per game over 28 would be necessary?

With Kubiaks conservative nature I see them addressing ability to improve ball control/time of possession. In my last mock, after taking Jenkins I identified two OT's both bolstering right & left sides. As well ball control WR & blocking TE. Defensively, besides addressing nose also selected two stud LB's one inside Kiko Alonzo & one OLB in Whitney Mercilus teammate last season @ Illinois, Michael Buchanan who has ideal length 6'5" & is a bender with speed @ 245.

edit: nevermind Jenkins is returning for his Senior season @ Georgia http://blogs.ajc.com/uga-sports-blog/2011/12/30/ng-john-jenkins-changes-tune-says-hell-definitely-return-for-senior-season/?cxntfid=blogs_uga_sports_blog

Honoring Earl 34
12-18-2012, 01:33 PM
IMO ... I think you take the BPA out of these positions WR , NG , OLB , DE , TE in the 1st .

2nd rd ... the ones you didn't address plus ILB .

thunderkyss
12-18-2012, 01:58 PM
How many defensive td's in there?

I know it won't greatly change the stats, but just curious.

I know this past week we scored on ST and over the course of the year we've scored defensive td's and given the offense great field position....we've also had two overtime games which bump our point totals a little...

And then against the patriots 7 of Those points were scored by the back ups in garbage time...

I realize every team has stuff like this happen, but I would be interested if there is a stay out there for "true point production"...

I don't think we've scored many defensive TDs all year. KMart got one on Special teams, Braman got his. Kj returned one for a TD, Manning did, Jjo did (but I don't think we've scored defensively since we lost Cushing). & that's about it.

We do benefit from the short field, can't argue.

But like you said, that's the game. It's not just offense, or defense.... ST. It's a team thing.

We haven't played any top ten defenses, either points or yards. I think that may be the nugget you're looking for. & that's a concern. We did play Miami & Denver, but again, we are most definitely not the team we were back then. We played the Bears, but didn't really score much.

Denver & that defense is the team I don't want to see in the play-offs.

Honoring Earl 34
12-18-2012, 02:05 PM
I don't think we've scored many defensive TDs all year. KMart got one on Special teams, Braman got his. Kj returned one for a TD, Manning did, Jjo did (but I don't think we've scored defensively since we lost Cushing). & that's about it.

We do benefit from the short field, can't argue.

But like you said, that's the game. It's not just offense, or defense.... ST. It's a team thing.

We haven't played any top ten defenses, either points or yards. I think that may be the nugget you're looking for. & that's a concern. We did play Miami & Denver, but again, we are most definitely not the team we were back then. We played the Bears, but didn't really score much.

Denver & that defense is the team I don't want to see in the play-offs.

I think the NE vs SF game Sunday night is the new NFL . The 49ers and their vaunted defense beat NE 41 to 34 . The 85 Bears don't exist anymore and so you better be able to run with the big dogs . That's where the GB and NE games alarm me .

steelbtexan
12-18-2012, 03:06 PM
I think your point is good, the premise is the only thing I questioned.

This is a much better argument.

The only thing is that I wish Newton had never gotten hurt. Don't know where his game would be if not for that. I more or less like all the guys on our OL. Newton & Jones just need time. Myers.... well he's starting to tick me off. Smith has been playing better than I thought & I love the big guy (76).

But, I think we need to improve the pedigree of our offense. We need more 1st round pick, or more guys who expect to win. These last two seasons will help our offense with the latter.

At the same time, we're going to draft someone. I'd rather draft a 1st round offensive big ugly than a defensive big ugly. Because I want to blow people off the line. We did it with Eric & Briesel, so maybe Newton & Jones can get it done.

So I would have no problem taking an OG, targeting the veteran LG, or even a Center. If we have the opportunity to get better....

MSR

Your words are much better than mine.

Hopefully Rick/Gary/Wade truly go BPA.

Wolf6151
12-18-2012, 06:07 PM
The news about Nix surprises me as I thought he was leaving for certain. Kelly must have got him drunk and whispered in his ear. Nix almost left last year. I guess his Irish Chocolate followers convinced him to ride the wave of popularity. Wow. Jesse Williams an early guy for me has moved up & I just cannot get a good read on Sylvester. He has done well when I have focused on him but he turned 24 last month and I want to see if he can keep the weight off. He is quicker and looke good against Virginia. He also has a rep for taking plays off but I have not seen that. It is possible with Nix gone, if S.Williams has a good combine he will climb into late 20s. He is ranked 69. If I knew he would be there in second....

SHort has a rep for not playing 100% but I guess if he can his stats as he has he might be an option. This is same issue I have with Sylvester and not sure that type play translates to NFL. Whomever we draft at NT will have to play hard every play.

Here's how I evaluate the 3 guys remaining that fit our system, Jesse Williams, Sylvester Williams, and Kawann Short.

J. Williams, I see him as a guy with great strength who can hold the double teams or push a single blocker backwards and collapse the pocket though he's not a good penetrating NT because he lacks the athletic quickness. To me he's more of a traditional brickwall NT with good straight ahead speed but lacks lateral agility to make the tackle on plays that don't come right at him. Great strength, good straight line speed, poor lateral agility/quickness. He's #3 on my list.

S. Williams, I see him more as a 4-3 UT with great quickness, great swim move, great penetrating ability, lateral agility, speed, and athleticism, but he lacks some strength to hold up to double teams or collapse the pocket consistently. Luckily once he gets on an NFL strength and conditioning program he'll gain that core strength in his legs to anchor and hold up to double teams, but it might take a year. He's more of a quick penetrating NT, in our 1 gap system, that can pressure the QB. He's #2 on my list.

K. Short, he's a combo of the 2 Williams, he's got the strength in his core and legs to hold the double teams and collapse the pocket against single blockers. He's got enough quickness and lateral agility to penetrate and play the run and also has a 2nd gear when in the clear that he's got good speed and able to chase a play that doesn't come his way. S. Williams is better at penetrating, J. Williams is better at holding the LOS, while K. Short has got both skills and will get even better in an NFL program. Imagine a strong penetrating big nasty lined up next to JJ Watt, it would take 4 O-linemen to properly block them. He's #1 on my list.


As for taking plays off, I'm not to worried about it. 320 lbs. college linemen get winded and in college aren't in the best physical condition that they'll be in a year after getting drafted. The NFL level strength and conditioning programs will improve their stamina and I think our core players won't let rookies become slackers. With Watt in one ear and Antonio Smith in the other and Cushing behind him a rookie would be to scared not to give full effort.

On a personal note I sure hope Rick Smith can extend Antonio Smith 2-3 yrs. and lower his cap hit, he means so much to this team that most people don't see.

TimeKiller
12-18-2012, 07:00 PM
My biggest needs in order are:
1-CB
2-RT
3-DT
4-ILB
5-WR
6-S
7-TE/FB
8-RB
9-OLB
10-LG

steelbtexan
12-18-2012, 09:31 PM
Here's how I evaluate the 3 guys remaining that fit our system, Jesse Williams, Sylvester Williams, and Kawann Short.

J. Williams, I see him as a guy with great strength who can hold the double teams or push a single blocker backwards and collapse the pocket though he's not a good penetrating NT because he lacks the athletic quickness. To me he's more of a traditional brickwall NT with good straight ahead speed but lacks lateral agility to make the tackle on plays that don't come right at him. Great strength, good straight line speed, poor lateral agility/quickness. He's #3 on my list.

S. Williams, I see him more as a 4-3 UT with great quickness, great swim move, great penetrating ability, lateral agility, speed, and athleticism, but he lacks some strength to hold up to double teams or collapse the pocket consistently. Luckily once he gets on an NFL strength and conditioning program he'll gain that core strength in his legs to anchor and hold up to double teams, but it might take a year. He's more of a quick penetrating NT, in our 1 gap system, that can pressure the QB. He's #2 on my list.

K. Short, he's a combo of the 2 Williams, he's got the strength in his core and legs to hold the double teams and collapse the pocket against single blockers. He's got enough quickness and lateral agility to penetrate and play the run and also has a 2nd gear when in the clear that he's got good speed and able to chase a play that doesn't come his way. S. Williams is better at penetrating, J. Williams is better at holding the LOS, while K. Short has got both skills and will get even better in an NFL program. Imagine a strong penetrating big nasty lined up next to JJ Watt, it would take 4 O-linemen to properly block them. He's #1 on my list.


As for taking plays off, I'm not to worried about it. 320 lbs. college linemen get winded and in college aren't in the best physical condition that they'll be in a year after getting drafted. The NFL level strength and conditioning programs will improve their stamina and I think our core players won't let rookies become slackers. With Watt in one ear and Antonio Smith in the other and Cushing behind him a rookie would be to scared not to give full effort.

On a personal note I sure hope Rick Smith can extend Antonio Smith 2-3 yrs. and lower his cap hit, he means so much to this team that most people don't see.

Google Brandon Williams, he's #2 on my list. Big athletic guy who's only going to get better.

aussie_texan
12-19-2012, 12:09 AM
Looks like you put some thought into your post. I've tried to mock a corner but don't see any after say mid second that thrills me. TBH I did not spend much time on college corners or safeties. Early I was going to follow U.Texas guys but that fizzled quickly. Any recommendations for late 2nd or after? I think Slay will do well at either.

Barwin, do we need an OLB that does not get to QB consistently at even a low contract? If Watt had turned out to be a normal DE, we would be a hurtin'. I say bye bye Connor and draft an OLB.

RB, if you can watch Cierre Wood when Notre Dame plays Alabama.

im having the same problem about the guys after the mid 2nd round. but 2 guys i have been looking at is Travis howard from Ohio and sanders commings from georgia. To bigger type CBs you fill run lanes well. both a little suspect when deep but in the short to middle areas are quite good. travis looks like around a 3-4th round while commings a 4-5th around pick.
Havnt seen slay play yet but have read a little about him could be intriguing.

barwin is a tough one i find it hard to get rid of a guy who was our leading sack getter last year. it will come down to what value you can get in the draft and how much he wants his contract to be.

i have watched ND a bit but i focus a lot on the defence, there offence apart from eifert is pretty meh. but ill look out for wood

SAMURAITEXAN
12-19-2012, 01:01 AM
Best value(on Texans' board) player available NT, DE, ILB, OLB, OT, S positions in not particular order. Rick Smith seems to me always talk about value when they draft someone. Plus Wade's factor. Seems to me Wade has strong say in drafting player on early rounds. So, I think 1st rd goes to D as this will be Wade's second draft and he may need some more pieces of puzzle to make D more dominate. Remember, Wade had 4-3 guys and turned those players to 3-4 guys and he may want a few more 3-4 scheme suitable players from this draft. Just a thought.

Wolf6151
12-19-2012, 03:18 AM
Google Brandon Williams, he's #2 on my list. Big athletic guy who's only going to get better.

I've heard his name batted around in here a few times and just got finished watching some video on him. He seems to have good size, good strength, decent straight ahead speed, but lacks lateral athleticism/agility. He looks raw and for an NFL prospect I would expect him to dominate at his level of college football but just didn't see it. Granted it was a small sampling of video but he never just dominated against lower level talent though other teams do seem to go away from him quite often. He does play the inside run very well. I could see him being a good draft pick in the late 3rd-5th round to a team that already has an established NT and someone that can afford to let him learn and grow as a player for a couple years. He does seem to have the basics and potential to be much better. Unfortunately I don't think the Texans have that luxury unless we double up on NT in the draft. With Cody most likely leaving in FA and Mitchell not capable of handling NT by himself, I think we have to take a NT early.

beerlover
12-19-2012, 09:52 AM
it's tough picking this late to add starter quality to a team already well rounded. seems like most available now will need more practice/adjustment before PT (cb,nt) identifying bpa most ready to contribute will be a big factor even if not vaunted nt position which I was just about ready to wrap a big Texan bow on him & put under the Christmas tree.

Timekiller's list:
1-CB
2-RT
3-DT
4-ILB
5-WR
6-S
7-TE/FB
8-RB
9-OLB
10-LG

is a good list but it may be easier to find a need like #4 ILB in that late 1st early 2nd window? so would you circumvent hierarchy of needs & take Alec Ogletree, Gerogia ILB? as it shakes down he may be bpa, a player that could impact defense, next to Cushing solidify the ILB position. :barman:

rmartin65
12-19-2012, 10:00 AM
Alec Ogletree? Alex Okafor is the Texas DE.

And as we have discussed in the PMs, I am a huge fan of Ogletree.

steelbtexan
12-19-2012, 10:06 AM
I've heard his name batted around in here a few times and just got finished watching some video on him. He seems to have good size, good strength, decent straight ahead speed, but lacks lateral athleticism/agility. He looks raw and for an NFL prospect I would expect him to dominate at his level of college football but just didn't see it. Granted it was a small sampling of video but he never just dominated against lower level talent though other teams do seem to go away from him quite often. He does play the inside run very well. I could see him being a good draft pick in the late 3rd-5th round to a team that already has an established NT and someone that can afford to let him learn and grow as a player for a couple years. He does seem to have the basics and potential to be much better. Unfortunately I don't think the Texans have that luxury unless we double up on NT in the draft. With Cody most likely leaving in FA and Mitchell not capable of handling NT by himself, I think we have to take a NT early.

He can handle the 2 down run stopper role. He's got the ability to be so much more. Brandon can be a Jesse Williams type NT, maybe even better, he's got the ability. I can understand your concerns about drafting a small school guy and giving him such a prominent role right away. BTW, unlike alot of small school guys, Brandon Williams is also a high character guy, from what I've read.

steelbtexan
12-19-2012, 10:09 AM
Alec Ogletree? Alex Okafor is the Texas DE.

And as we have discussed in the PMs, I am a huge fan of Ogletree.

I'm not a fan of Ogletree is an ILB. But he would be a fit at WOLB.

Ogletree reminds me of Danielle Ellerbe. A good player, will play for 10 yrs but not be a difference maker.

rmartin65
12-19-2012, 10:15 AM
He can handle the 2 down run stopper role. He's got the ability to be so much more. Brandon can be a Jesse Williams type NT, maybe even better, he's got the ability. I can understand your concerns about drafting a small school guy and giving him such a prominent role right away. BTW, unlike alot of small school guys, Brandon Williams is also a high character guy, from what I've read.

Agree 100%

I'm not a fan of Ogletree is an ILB. But he would be a fit at WOLB.

Ogletree reminds me of Danielle Ellerbe. A good player, will play for 10 yrs but not be a difference maker.

Disagree 100%.

As I wrote in a PM to badboy and BL when trying to convince them of Ogletree's awesomeness "At 235 lbs Olgetree is a little light now... but he has a large frame. I think he could get to 245-250 without losing his athleticism. The dude is a playmaker, and great in coverage (used to be a safety). He can blitz, he can tackle, he can cover. Every time I watch Georgia he sticks out because he flat out makes plays."

I think Ogletree will be a fantastic playmaker.

This year (either his 2nd or 3rd playing ILB... in a 3-4 no less) he has 98 tackles, 8.5 TFL, 2 sacks, 1 INT, 5 breakups, and 6 hurries... in 9 games. He needs to get bigger, but I think he is perfect for the D.

steelbtexan
12-19-2012, 10:16 AM
it's tough picking this late to add starter quality to a team already well rounded. seems like most available now will need more practice/adjustment before PT (cb,nt) identifying bpa most ready to contribute will be a big factor even if not vaunted nt position which I was just about ready to wrap a big Texan bow on him & put under the Christmas tree.

Timekiller's list:
1-CB
2-RT
3-DT
4-ILB
5-WR
6-S
7-TE/FB
8-RB
9-OLB
10-LG

is a good list but it may be easier to find a need like #4 ILB in that late 1st early 2nd window? so would you circumvent hierarchy of needs & take Alex Okafor, Gerogia ILB? as it shakes down he may be bpa, a player that could impact defense, next to Cushing solidify the ILB position. :barman:

I just hope they take BPA. If they do the pick should be Patterson or Williams.

beerlover
12-19-2012, 10:19 AM
I'm not a fan of Ogletree is an ILB. But he would be a fit at WOLB.

Ogletree reminds me of Danielle Ellerbe. A good player, will play for 10 yrs but not be a difference maker.

not out of question for a top end linebacker to fit both inside or outside. Cushing was a DE @ USC then SAM LB. Started as a SAM LB for Texans in 4-3 then switched & found a home ILB in Wade Phillips 3-4.

steelbtexan
12-19-2012, 10:20 AM
Agree 100%



Disagree 100%.

As I wrote in a PM to badboy and BL when trying to convince them of Ogletree's awesomeness "At 235 lbs Olgetree is a little light now... but he has a large frame. I think he could get to 245-250 without losing his athleticism. The dude is a playmaker, and great in coverage (used to be a safety). He can blitz, he can tackle, he can cover. Every time I watch Georgia he sticks out because he flat out makes plays."

I think Ogletree will be a fantastic playmaker.

This year (either his 2nd or 3rd playing ILB... in a 3-4 no less) he has 98 tackles, 8.5 TFL, 2 sacks, 1 INT, 5 breakups, and 6 hurries... in 9 games. He needs to get bigger, but I think he is perfect for the D.

I could be underrating him due to Alabama running the ball down Georgia's throat.

rmartin65
12-19-2012, 10:22 AM
I could be underrating him due to Alabama running the ball down Georgia's throat.

Ha, Alabama runs the ball down everybody's throat.

beerlover
12-19-2012, 10:28 AM
I could be underrating him due to Alabama running the ball down Georgia's throat.

exactly & who was there making those stops? Alec had 11 tackles, 9 solo with one tkl for loss. Jenkins had 6 tackles & one sack not bad for a nose against that great OL. Jarvis also had 6 tackles with two sacks.

TimeKiller
12-19-2012, 10:29 AM
Timekiller's list:
1-CB
2-RT
3-DT
4-ILB
5-WR
6-S
7-TE/FB
8-RB
9-OLB
10-LG

is a good list but it may be easier to find a need like #4 ILB in that late 1st early 2nd window? so would you circumvent hierarchy of needs & take Alec Ogletree, Gerogia ILB? as it shakes down he may be bpa, a player that could impact defense, next to Cushing solidify the ILB position. :barman:

I just hope they take BPA.

x2 on the bpa. Lack of depth behind starting CBs, underwhelming options at nickel/dime, prevalence of spread offenses requiring nickel corners to play basically starting roles and the depth at ILB/NT isn't quite as dry as a position with a much higher impact on the game.

The only two teams to beat us? Spread offenses, great QBs. I would accept pass rusher as a need but the backend is just too thin. Teams that gave us trouble in victories? Lions? Spread 'em out. Jags? Tried to. Cutler&Marshall probably would've had a field day if not for the rain/sludge game.

beerlover
12-19-2012, 10:35 AM
x2 on the bpa. Lack of depth behind starting CBs, underwhelming options at nickel/dime, prevalence of spread offenses requiring nickel corners to play basically starting roles and the depth at ILB/NT isn't quite as dry as a position with a much higher impact on the game.

The only two teams to beat us? Spread offenses, great QBs. I would accept pass rusher as a need but the backend is just too thin. Teams that gave us trouble in victories? Lions? Spread 'em out. Jags? Tried to. Cutler&Marshall probably would've had a field day if not for the rain/sludge game.

or because he was knocked out by a LB :)

Rey
12-19-2012, 12:46 PM
If you improve the middle of this defense with an elite NT w/Cushing returning next season just how many points per game over 28 would be necessary?

With Kubiaks conservative nature I see them addressing ability to improve ball control/time of possession. In my last mock, after taking Jenkins I identified two OT's both bolstering right & left sides. As well ball control WR & blocking TE. Defensively, besides addressing nose also selected two stud LB's one inside Kiko Alonzo & one OLB in Whitney Mercilus teammate last season @ Illinois, Michael Buchanan who has ideal length 6'5" & is a bender with speed @ 245.

edit: nevermind Jenkins is returning for his Senior season @ Georgia http://blogs.ajc.com/uga-sports-blog/2011/12/30/ng-john-jenkins-changes-tune-says-hell-definitely-return-for-senior-season/?cxntfid=blogs_uga_sports_blog

Good for Jenkins.

He is a guy that might actually be able to raise his draft status.

Rey
12-19-2012, 12:51 PM
Olb is still high on my draft list. Ilb as well.

I wouldn't make any major changes to the mock I did at this point. I wouldn't mind taking a big time wr prospect, but I'm actually ok with what we have. Keshawn Martin is kind of a question mark to me though. I don't know if it's a fluke or what, but he seems to not be able to get open and he drops too many balls.

76Texan
12-19-2012, 01:09 PM
I need a refresher on the Free Agency Period, any one?

Exascor
12-19-2012, 01:21 PM
I need a refresher on the Free Agency Period, any one?It starts in mid-March. I haven't seen a 2013 calender yet though. If I had to guess I'd say the 12th.

The draft is late April so I'd guess the 25th - 27th.

Mr teX
12-19-2012, 01:43 PM
Yeah, i now think we need to go & get a tradtional NT in the 1st/2nd. I was on the bandwagon for a WR b/c i deferred to Wade's expertise saying that he could use whatever we had & turn the defense around - and he did that.

But it seems over the last few years all the blitzing we've done is b/c we're compensating for our inability to defend the run with just our front 7. The safeties have to be aggressive coming down hill to help out. & pretty much every time we've gotten beat this year and last, we've been hit on long passes for scores b/c our safeties have been to eager to come down & have been out of position.

SF was able to beat the Pats b/c they could defend the pats run game with thier front 7 and let their db's sit back and cover everything up. I don't know the percentage of teams that run the 3-4 vs. 4-3 but the way the league is going with all of these spread offenses & running qb's i think the 3-4 is about to make another return.

mussop
12-19-2012, 09:48 PM
BPA at a position of need unless there is a player so good you can't pass him up.

I'm looking at ILB'S, DT'S and CB'S first with the above in mind.

I love Kawann Short and Sheldon Richardson. They are my early fav's for our first right now. Haven't seen any ILB's that I'm in love with in the first. There are A few I like in the second and third round. Never really pay much attention to secondary because its just to difficult to really scout them on tv.

srrono
12-20-2012, 04:25 AM
I think 1st pick again will be a pass rusher. Could be a OLB,NT,DE or even a ILB with Pass rush skills all I know is Watt needs help with Pass rush.
then in no particular order:
OG our guards have been a disappointment
ILB depth and youth beside Cushing
DE eventual Smith replacement
S we may lose Quin
NT as we all know this is a weakness and could help Watt if a big NT takes up double teams
TE Daniels getting older - Casey a FA -

badboy
01-03-2013, 11:29 PM
Darrius Slay has been moving up boards and has just accepted invitation to the combine. I now have him taken at one of our 5ths. CB/S

steelbtexan
01-03-2013, 11:46 PM
BPA at a position of need unless there is a player so good you can't pass him up.

I'm looking at ILB'S, DT'S and CB'S first with the above in mind.

I love Kawann Short and Sheldon Richardson. They are my early fav's for our first right now. Haven't seen any ILB's that I'm in love with in the first. There are A few I like in the second and third round. Never really pay much attention to secondary because its just to difficult to really scout them on tv.

I'm all for BPA, It's quite obvious the offense stinks and keeping the offense on the field more would help the defense as much as anybody the Texans could pick at 27-32.

Good news is there will be a WR like Williams/Woods/Patterson available. Or an OL Like Oboushi/Cooper/Jones/Fluker or a QB like Bray/Barkley/Landry Jones should be there at 27-32. There appears to be more value on the offensive side of the ball late in the 1st rd.

Corrosion
01-04-2013, 01:27 AM
The last six weeks of this season has definately changed my thoughts on the draft .... Six weeks ago , I was on board with a top draft pick at NT/DT , now that focus has shifted to fixing a broken OL where despite Wade Smith making a probowl appearance , I think at least three positions are lacking in LG , RG and RT.

Add to the above the fact that five of the Texans top eight defensive backs will be FA's .... There are also needs at OLB & ILB due to injury and looming free agency.

These positions ....would be my focus in both FA and draft moves , I'd also like to address QB but dont see how with Schaubs contract and not having a premium pick to work with.

NT / DT has almost fallen off the radar for me , below is how I'd rank the needs going into the FA period and the draft:

OG - At least one as neither position has been particularly strong the last third of the season.

RT - Newton has been solid in pass protection but pathetic in run and screen plays. I like him as a swing tackle , not a starter.

DB - Both S and CB with so many possible free agents , you can never have engough good DB's.

ILB - James was a stop gap for a year , the depth has been hurt with injuries , both Dobbins and James are FA's. Sharpton finishing a third consecutive season on IR.

OLB - Barwin's pending FA and the lack of production from the position overall. JJ Watt needs some help up front.


QB - This would be my primary need but with Schaubs contract , a team built to win now and no premium pick or means to move up to one , its just not logical. Need to look real hard at the scrap heap of FA to find a viable plan B should Schaub continue to falter.

steelbtexan
01-04-2013, 01:43 AM
The last six weeks of this season has definately changed my thoughts on the draft .... Six weeks ago , I was on board with a top draft pick at NT/DT , now that focus has shifted to fixing a broken OL where despite Wade Smith making a probowl appearance , I think at least three positions are lacking in LG , RG and RT.

Add to the above the fact that five of the Texans top eight defensive backs will be FA's .... There are also needs at OLB & ILB due to injury and looming free agency.

These positions ....would be my focus in both FA and draft moves , I'd also like to address QB but dont see how with Schaubs contract and not having a premium pick to work with.

NT / DT has almost fallen off the radar for me , below is how I'd rank the needs going into the FA period and the draft:

OG - At least one as neither position has been particularly strong the last third of the season.

RT - Newton has been solid in pass protection but pathetic in run and screen plays. I like him as a swing tackle , not a starter.

DB - Both S and CB with so many possible free agents , you can never have engough good DB's.

ILB - James was a stop gap for a year , the depth has been hurt with injuries , both Dobbins and James are FA's. Sharpton finishing a third consecutive season on IR.

OLB - Barwin's pending FA and the lack of production from the position overall. JJ Watt needs some help up front.


QB - This would be my primary need but with Schaubs contract , a team built to win now and no premium pick or means to move up to one , its just not logical. Need to look real hard at the scrap heap of FA to find a viable plan B should Schaub continue to falter.

What do you think about using this yrs draft to fix the offense since the draft is deep on the offensive side of the ball. (Excluding QB) Then draft heavy on defense in 2014 since rookies can make an impact on defense more often than on offense. That would make the team more formidable.

Also how would you feel about Matt Flynn as a stop gap if Schaub cant get the job done? He ran the WC offense for the Packers. As an aside he's for Tyler. (Looking forward to seeing the Tyler Rose on Saturday)

What do you thnk about moving Barwin to ILB next yr? The thought of Cushing and Barwin appeals to me and the run defense would look much better.

Corrosion
01-04-2013, 02:08 AM
What do you think about using this yrs draft to fix the offense since the draft is deep on the offensive side of the ball. (Excluding QB) Then draft heavy on defense in 2014 since rookies can make an impact on defense more often than on offense. That would make the team more formidable.

For the most part , this team is built to win now. I'd like to solve as many problems as possible this offseason .... and make a real run in next years playoffs (hell this one too).

I'd like at least one guard and a RT in this offseason .... that I think fixes the offense other than the QB spot. The recievers have been open .... I think at least one of Posey or Martin makes a big step next season. Posey has been pretty solid the last few weeks and made the most of his opportunities.



Also how would you feel about Matt Flynn as a stop gap if Schaub cant get the job done? He ran the WC offense for the Packers. As an aside he's for Tyler. (Looking forward to seeing the Tyler Rose on Saturday)

Not a fan of Flynn .... I'd rathet try to get Alex Smith on the cheap. He's very much like Schaub other than the fact he can move around a bit. He ran a very similar offense in SF too .... I know most dont like him , but you cant argue with his results the past two seasons 20-5 as a starter. Tho Im sure other teams lacking at QB will be after him ..... Arizona ?


What do you thnk about moving Barwin to ILB next yr? The thought of Cushing and Barwin appeals to me and the run defense would look much better.

I dont know if Barwin stays or goes .... but if he stays , its as an OLB. If one of the OLB's was to move inside , I'd think it would be Reed as he's a more natural fit inside than Barwin who's more of a speed guy IMO.

badboy
01-04-2013, 06:39 PM
My two cents: I think Newton will be RT starter as RG develops it will help him as Wade Smith helped Brown. Let's not forget that bit of history. We run mostly to the left as we should with two pro bowlers. I think Brooks locks in RG and Jones begins to learn at backup to Myers. Wade God love him will play out LG and we draft one 2013 to replace him in '14. I have Arkansas Alvin Bailey in third. Recently I have tried to tweek my newest mock but really like it. May post when season ends, hopefully not tomorrow.

I really want to see how Ruud and Routt do. Should see a lot of the first and some of the latter.

Scooter
01-04-2013, 07:50 PM
The last six weeks of this season has definately changed my thoughts on the draft .... Six weeks ago , I was on board with a top draft pick at NT/DT , now that focus has shifted to fixing a broken OL where despite Wade Smith making a probowl appearance , I think at least three positions are lacking in LG , RG and RT.

Add to the above the fact that five of the Texans top eight defensive backs will be FA's .... There are also needs at OLB & ILB due to injury and looming free agency.

These positions ....would be my focus in both FA and draft moves , I'd also like to address QB but dont see how with Schaubs contract and not having a premium pick to work with.

NT / DT has almost fallen off the radar for me , below is how I'd rank the needs going into the FA period and the draft:

OG - At least one as neither position has been particularly strong the last third of the season.

RT - Newton has been solid in pass protection but pathetic in run and screen plays. I like him as a swing tackle , not a starter.

DB - Both S and CB with so many possible free agents , you can never have engough good DB's.

ILB - James was a stop gap for a year , the depth has been hurt with injuries , both Dobbins and James are FA's. Sharpton finishing a third consecutive season on IR.

OLB - Barwin's pending FA and the lack of production from the position overall. JJ Watt needs some help up front.


QB - This would be my primary need but with Schaubs contract , a team built to win now and no premium pick or means to move up to one , its just not logical. Need to look real hard at the scrap heap of FA to find a viable plan B should Schaub continue to falter.

right there with you, though i think our rookie guards will be significantly better next season with the amount of time they're getting now. brooks seeing the field at all this year is HUGE to me, it means kubiak has confidence that brooks is putting in the work and digesting the playbook. if he can get it going, brooks has an absolute excess of potential. wade will probably return next season and i like jones to back up the interior (or hopefully replace wade), though the next backup needs to be found. newton is the weak link and it has nothing to do with anyone around him, as you said a pretty solid swing tackle, but not a starter.

otisbean
01-05-2013, 06:27 AM
I would go BPA at a need position unless someone fell that was too good pass on (as previously stated). I think we desperately need to upgrade our OL and pass rush/LBs. I think CB and S depth is important as well.

beerlover
01-05-2013, 11:38 AM
nice extension for Schaub but writing is on the wall, if there is any chance to grab a franchise QB, if Kubiak wants to keep his job along with Rick Smith? They should take him now. this is the most drastic change IMO :kubepalm:

aussie_texan
01-05-2013, 11:04 PM
what are the peoples thoughts on fluker playing guard?
awesome at run blocking terrible at pass protection.
i was thinking play him at RG next to newton so we can run the ball better on that side and move brooks to LG who i think has been doing quite well for a rookie. Jones isnt on the same level of brooks and needs to move to back up centre and be the understudy to myers

aussie_texan
01-05-2013, 11:17 PM
and what about Larry Warford guard from kentucky, anyone got info on him??

badboy
01-05-2013, 11:25 PM
what are the peoples thoughts on fluker playing guard?
awesome at run blocking terrible at pass protection.
i was thinking play him at RG next to newton so we can run the ball better on that side and move brooks to LG who i think has been doing quite well for a rookie. Jones isnt on the same level of brooks and needs to move to back up centre and be the understudy to myersWhy not take a true OG that plays both sides each game & is proficient at both run and pass blocking? Alvin Bailey who should be available to us in third. Fluker should go before our second.
I see him more in a power blocking O but want to point our my mock partner Beerlover likes him. BL is damn good on evaluating linemen.

Texecutioner
01-05-2013, 11:26 PM
I'd love to find a QB with our first pick, but that would mainly be if we could trade up picks to get one. Not sure if this is a great QB draft. I'm not sure about drafting some 2nd or 3rd rounder, but I do think that QB is becoming a big need now.

badboy
01-05-2013, 11:33 PM
I think Yates is our best chance of replacing Schaub in 2014. None of the draft picks do much for me.

aussie_texan
01-05-2013, 11:34 PM
also didnt anyone catch that quin played a lot of nickle CB and Keo was in the game a lot more.
Still think Keo is a good special teamer and back up and certainly not a starter. maybe safety but have to become more of a priority with we play more 3 safety packages

badboy
01-05-2013, 11:38 PM
also didnt anyone catch that quin played a lot of nickle CB and Keo was in the game a lot more.
Still think Keo is a good special teamer and back up and certainly not a starter. maybe safety but have to become more of a priority with we play more 3 safety packagesI noticed Keo screwing up. I like Darrius Slay replacing him. I like Keo's efforts at combine but he sucks as an NFL player.

aussie_texan
01-05-2013, 11:41 PM
I noticed Keo screwing up. I like Darrius Slay replacing him. I like Keo's efforts at combine but he sucks as an NFL player.

yeah i have to agree. slay as the nickle CB or 3rd safety i would be happy with.

aussie_texan
01-05-2013, 11:41 PM
hopefully we keep quin. more of a priority then barwin

badboy
01-06-2013, 12:57 AM
hopefully we keep quin. more of a priority then barwinI'm down with Quin and Barwin is playing some better IF he accepts a very low deal, I could agree and open a draft pick on my board. We just need sacks from OLBs in Wade's system. Barwin has another chance to win me over. Mitchell at NT and Brandon Harris looked much better imo. I compare Harris to KJ in his second year with Jackson getting much more time on field. If Harris has same improvement next year, I'll be mucho latte happy.

Rey
01-06-2013, 01:03 AM
What do you guys think about going after mauluga?

The fans there seem convinced he won't be back, and I can understand why. But from our. Perspective, he certainly has more ability than the guys we have outside of Cushing. He will likely be cheap...he's still young and we wouldnt need him for coverage...instead of playing in a 43 he'd be in an attacking 34 which will probably play to his strengths more. Maybe with some good coaching and bring in a good system he could become a good starting lb for us. He is already pretty good against the run. Would be one less hole to fill via a high pick in the draft plus having him and Cush together again would be pretty cool.

Both Those guys are pretty athletic and like to get physical...I think it'd help our run defense out a lot.

Thoughts?

Texecutioner
01-06-2013, 01:07 AM
I think Yates is our best chance of replacing Schaub in 2014. None of the draft picks do much for me.

Well he might be our best chance at trying someone new, but replacing Schaub's offensive numbers is something I don't think that Yates will ever do consistently. You know my feelings on Yates, but if we don't go after anyone next season, then I do hope that Kubiak gives Yates a legit chance to compete for the job. I still think that Schaub will win it, but Schaub's play as of late has opened the can of worms that yates could "possibly" match what Schaub could do, or even do better perhaps. I think it's doubtful, but either way I'd absolutely hate to think of Yates being the guy going forward. I don't think he'd ever be an elite guy or high end passer in this league. I watched several young QB's really tear it up this year on teams without elite WR's, so that tells me that other QB's could possibly do that, but I don't think Yates has that ability. But going forward from now, he "might" have the ability to play better then Schaub. Earlier this season, I would have never made that statement.

badboy
01-06-2013, 10:45 PM
Well he might be our best chance at trying someone new, but replacing Schaub's offensive numbers is something I don't think that Yates will ever do consistently. You know my feelings on Yates, but if we don't go after anyone next season, then I do hope that Kubiak gives Yates a legit chance to compete for the job. I still think that Schaub will win it, but Schaub's play as of late has opened the can of worms that yates could "possibly" match what Schaub could do, or even do better perhaps. I think it's doubtful, but either way I'd absolutely hate to think of Yates being the guy going forward. I don't think he'd ever be an elite guy or high end passer in this league. I watched several young QB's really tear it up this year on teams without elite WR's, so that tells me that other QB's could possibly do that, but I don't think Yates has that ability. But going forward from now, he "might" have the ability to play better then Schaub. Earlier this season, I would have never made that statement.Yates would not have to match Schaub's numbers to successfully replace him, necessarily. I don't think Matt is going anywhere before 2014.

steelbtexan
01-06-2013, 11:28 PM
nice extension for Schaub but writing is on the wall, if there is any chance to grab a franchise QB, if Kubiak wants to keep his job along with Rick Smith? They should take him now. this is the most drastic change IMO :kubepalm:

Yep,

And if he falls to late in the 1st rd I would take a chance on Bray. He's a top 5 talent but has footwork/needs to grow up issues. But he wouldn't be there for the Texans to pick without these issues. Then try to use Tate and a 3rd to move up in the middle of the 2nd rd and draft Hopkins. Then take the Texans 2nd and pck the best OT. Winters/Pugh would be my choice. If this were to happen the Texans wouldn't be struggling to score TD's like they are now.

S is the biggest need on defense. They need to re-sign Quin and pick a S with the 3rd supp. pick. What S do you like in the 3rd rd range? I like Duke Williams/Swearinger/Shamarko Thomas. They seem like they would be good fits on Wades defense. The reason I dont rank NT as high as you do is most teams play 60% nickle so a NT wouldn't be on the field as much as a nickle S. The defense could certainly use an upgrade over Demps/Keo.

Thoughts

steelbtexan
01-06-2013, 11:32 PM
and what about Larry Warford guard from kentucky, anyone got info on him??

Great player,

Wafford is more of a fit in a power scheme like the Cowboys instead of a ZBS scheme. IMHO

Corrosion
01-06-2013, 11:53 PM
Great player,

Wafford is more of a fit in a power scheme like the Cowboys instead of a ZBS scheme. IMHO

With the possible rules changes coming .... might not be a bad idea to get some power guys.

Wolf6151
01-07-2013, 03:36 AM
Great player,

Wafford is more of a fit in a power scheme like the Cowboys instead of a ZBS scheme. IMHO

^^^This^^^

If your looking for an OG for the Texans I'd look at:
Jonathan Cooper-OG, we won't take a 1st round OG and will be gone by our pick in the 2nd.
Dallas Thomas-OG/OT, might be available in the 2nd round but doubtful.
Gabe Jackson-OG, athletic build like an OT, 2nd round, he'll be gone by our pick in the 3rd..
Cyril Richardson-OG/OT, 2nd or 3rd round pick.
Alvin Bailey-OG, possibly available in the 3rd.
Braden Hansen-OG/C, in the 4th or 5th round, 4 yr. starter at BYU.
Blaize Foltz-OG, in the 4th-6th round.

Some OT's we might convert to an OG:
D.J. Fluker-OT, great run blocker, to slow for NFL OT.
Ricky Wagner-OT, both RT and LT but I think he could be a good LG.
Kyle Long-OT/OG, lots of potential and very athletic, 2nd or 3rd round.
Xavier Nixon-OT, athletic but inconsistent, probably a good LG or swing OT in the 3rd-5th.

mussop
01-07-2013, 10:20 AM
I think Yates is our best chance of replacing Schaub in 2014. None of the draft picks do much for me.

There's more than a few quarterbacks in this upcoming draft who have more talent and potential than Yates. I will say this. They do all have question marks and Yates has time in the system which would give yates the early advantage.

So you are right in saying that Yates has the best chance at supplanting Schaub next year. If Kubiak comes to his senses and figures out that playing it safe and Starting Schaub isn't gong to cut it against the big boys he should start the process this offseason f finding a new QB.

If I were Kubiak or Smith. Whomever is in charge, I would begin looking at current backups and seeing what the value is out there. If there is none the next step would be the draft. Like you said there doesn't seem to be any safe guys in this draft so Schaub may have to suffice another year. Unless of course Yates can step up.

I would seriously consider trading our first round pick this year for a first round next year. That way when there are better prospects available we would have some good bargaining chips to maneuver up to get who we really want.

WolverineFan
01-07-2013, 11:41 AM
Still think we need to focus on defense early. Yes, we were without Cushing this year but I fully expect Brady to expose us again this weekend. We need help in the secondary.

I really like Matt Elam (S, Florida). I say let Barwin walk and re-sign Quin. Hopefully we can re-sing McCain too.

Quin can play S and some Nickel and Elam can play in those 3 Safety sets. Heavy upgrade over Demps/Keo is badly needed. I see Quin as our future FS and Elam as our future SS in that scenario. Manning has been good for us but I don't expect him to live out that contract. We need a playmaker at Safety.

TexanSam
01-07-2013, 11:59 AM
I think the Texans will probably focus on RT, LB, and NT/DE in the draft. We drafted Ben Jones and Brandon Brooks last year and I think one of them will take over the RG spot for good next season. We don't have anyone at tackle though. Newton is adequate but probably best suited as a backup.

Our LB corps just sucks now. Barwin, Reed, and Mercilus are okay and I'm fine with two of them as starters next year but ILB is a mess. We've been destroyed by injuries but even before that we had Cushing and no one. James should be let go or benched. Sharpton can't stay healthy. Dobbins is a backup. Ruud is a stop-gap solutions.

Cody and Antonio Smith are adequate starters but if someone better is available for either of their positions then they can be relegated to the bench or released.

badboy
01-07-2013, 12:52 PM
With the possible rules changes coming .... might not be a bad idea to get some power guys.Excepting Myers, I think we have an oline that can power block, just need to change the scheme. In fact, I think Newton and Brooks would do better.

coon
01-07-2013, 01:58 PM
Still think we need to focus on defense early. Yes, we were without Cushing this year but I fully expect Brady to expose us again this weekend. We need help in the secondary.

I really like Matt Elam (S, Florida). I say let Barwin walk and re-sign Quin. Hopefully we can re-sing McCain too.

Quin can play S and some Nickel and Elam can play in those 3 Safety sets. Heavy upgrade over Demps/Keo is badly needed. I see Quin as our future FS and Elam as our future SS in that scenario. Manning has been good for us but I don't expect him to live out that contract. We need a playmaker at Safety.

I like Elam too, I now would like to see us take Elam, or Vaccaro in the first, Preferably Elam. Our third safety is on the field enough to be considered a starter. Second round we could go after Margus Hunt from SMU as insurance for Barwin.

WolverineFan
01-07-2013, 03:08 PM
I like Elam too, I now would like to see us take Elam, or Vaccaro in the first, Preferably Elam. Our third safety is on the field enough to be considered a starter. Second round we could go after Margus Hunt from SMU as insurance for Barwin.

Hunt would play DE in our system. Rush LB has huge star power this year but isn't as deep as past years. I don't think we need a top guy to replace Barwin. That's why we drafted Mercilus. A guy I really like for us is Travis Long from Washington State. Could be had in the 3rd-4th round.

I would love a draft like this:
1) Matt Elam - S, Florida
2) Robert Woods - WR, USC
3) Andrew Jackson - ILB, Western Kentucky
3comp) Travis Long - OLB, Washington State
4) Kyle Long - OT, Oregon

badboy
01-07-2013, 03:28 PM
Hunt would play DE in our system. Rush LB has huge star power this year but isn't as deep as past years. I don't think we need a top guy to replace Barwin. That's why we drafted Mercilus. A guy I really like for us is Travis Long from Washington State. Could be had in the 3rd-4th round.

I would love a draft like this:
1) Matt Elam - S, Florida
2) Robert Woods - WR, USC
3) Andrew Jackson - ILB, Western Kentucky
3comp) Travis Long - OLB, Washington State
4) Kyle Long - OT, OregonAny news on the knee injury that ended Long's season? I also had him mocked until then. He played thru a torn labrum with shoulder popping out.

coon
01-07-2013, 03:31 PM
Hunt would play DE in our system. Rush LB has huge star power this year but isn't as deep as past years. I don't think we need a top guy to replace Barwin. That's why we drafted Mercilus. A guy I really like for us is Travis Long from Washington State. Could be had in the 3rd-4th round.

I would love a draft like this:
1) Matt Elam - S, Florida
2) Robert Woods - WR, USC
3) Andrew Jackson - ILB, Western Kentucky
3comp) Travis Long - OLB, Washington State
4) Kyle Long - OT, Oregon
Hunt could play either spot in our system. He is very, very athletic. Do you think Elam is substantially better that Vaccarro. I flip flop on which one of those two I prefer alot. In my mock I have Vaccaro because of his size, but my other post I say Elam. It's ridiculous.

WolverineFan
01-07-2013, 04:15 PM
Any news on the knee injury that ended Long's season? I also had him mocked until then. He played thru a torn labrum with shoulder popping out.

Haven't heard much. Supposedly won't be ready for combine but should be ready for next season.

WolverineFan
01-07-2013, 04:19 PM
Hunt could play either spot in our system. He is very, very athletic. Do you think Elam is substantially better that Vaccarro. I flip flop on which one of those two I prefer alot. In my mock I have Vaccaro because of his size, but my other post I say Elam. It's ridiculous.

Substantially better? No. They both carry a 1st round grade. My big thing with Vaccarro is that, although he may be good at everything, he's not great at anything. Elam is a playmaker. I think he's better against the run and the pass than Vaccarro. Has better ball skills too. Vaccarro has better measureables.