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Luv_ya_blue
12-11-2012, 08:24 AM
I realize that there are already a gazillion threads about other people's views on the game last night--so, what the heck, let's add one more.

1.) I'm a Texans fan through and through, first and foremost--so please don't flame me if you don't agree. These are only my thoughts; my views and $17 will get you a grande mochacino at Starbucks. I realize that many will disagree, and that's cool. Just show me where there's a breakdown in my logic.

2.) Let's start at the top: KUBIAK
Kubes has a reputation for trying to out think the entire room. Well, tonight he met his match. This was supposed to be a battle of wits, it resembled more of the Wizard vs the Nitwit! Kubiak has proved that HE isn't ready to coach at the next level. He had the opportunity of his coaching career to roll into Foxboro and steam roll one of the best coaches (and teams) in modern history. Kubiak is heralded by many to be an offensive jugernaut, but I feel (and have felt for sometime now) that Kubiak can't get out of his own way. All coaches try to do different things from week to week; keep the other guy on their toes. Problem I see is that it seems more like Kubes doesn't really know what he wants to do from week to week. Seems like it's his own guys that are kept off-balance. Let's face it guys, when the commentators can predict the play before it happens and says, "You could almost see that one coming..." it's pretty sad.

3.) Next on the agenda: SCHAUB
Plenty have criticized Matt for quite a long time now for not being clutch. It's no secret that I'm not a huge Schaub fan. He is not an elite QB and never will be. Does he put up big number? Yes. Does he do it impressively? Absolutely not! Elite QB's can do it against elite defenses. When it's the 4th qtr, THEY want the ball. You can look into their eyes and they exude confidence. The only thing that Schaub exudes is MY NEED for a valium! I've watched him for the past 3 yrs throw pass after pass after pass: behind receivers, off their shoe tops, and over their heads--only to have receivers make spectacular catches that made him look like a hero. I've always suspected that Matt would run into some big problems with well orchestrated defenses; and he is. I attribute his success much more due to his weapons than his own ability. He wasn't even really being pressured that much last night imo, and he looked unsteady and indecisive.

4.) Next up: D-LINE
Do we even have one?? I mean come on fellas--JJ can't do this crap all by himself! Barwin = SUCKS! Antonio is lukewarm & cold running water at best. Nobody else does ANYTHING! I understand that JJ makes the other guys look "less than," but for pete's sake--didn't we sign NFL caliber linemen?? Aren't we paying them? Isn't this their job? JJ draws a double team and nobody can shuck a block?! That's not gonna cut it in the playoffs against quality teams that are better than us. Seems like the loss of Cushing was infinetely more impactful than we anticipated. Or at least it's more than I anticipated. I saw us as a well oiled machine, and that we'd be able to overcome one player. Seems that his leadership on the field really is indespensable.

5.) The saddest corner of the roster: SPECIAL TEAMS
We suck! Plain and simple! We make some of the most horendous decisions of any team that I watch week-in and week-out. We give up too many big plays. Period. We don't block. We don't tackle (except Brahma). We don't hit the gaps...because there are no gaps to hit. This is the only area of the Texans that I truly have nothing good to say.

6.) Just say it: SECONDARY
We've been getting TORCHED. When we go up against top tier QBs, they don't even have to work that hard to make us look like the Four Stooges! Brady, Rodgers & Manning (yeah, yeah I know we got the W vs Denver) ate us alive! Yes I know that injuries played a part in where we are today--but it seems like that bug gets us every single year.

7.) And yes, I'm gonna go there: WADE
If I get flamed it's gonna be here I suspect. I have been so pleased with what Wade has done with our D, ever since he got here. But for the last 4 games or so, it seems as if he's getting out coached. His schemes seem unoriginal and very much lacking. I realize that he lost a key player in Cushing; but the way folks talked about Wade--he would take us to the Super Bowl even if all he had was practice squad scrubs! Well, evidently not! There's no doubt that Wade is one of the top defensive minds in the game, but his D isn't getting it done down the stretch. Yes, I know that wins are wins--but anyone with an eye for football can tell that despite those wins, there are GLARING holes in our defense that it seems as if he's ill-equipped to fill. The last few weeks Wade's defensive plans have looked very VANILLA. It almost seems like he's playing catch-up from jump. I believe that the hurry-up offense is one of his biggest hinderances. No. I believe that the hurry-up offense is gonna be our demise, IF Wade can't get things figured out. The hurry-up is the cure for the crafty / tricky schemes and blitz packages. They don't have time to get set up and don't have time to develop. Our defense is set up for success based on pressuring the QB--and the hurry-up package combined with a QB w/a quick release pretty much renders our defense average at best, and ineffective at worst. The times that we get pressure on the QB is when they hold the ball too long.

In CONCLUSION:
There are other things that I could point out, just as all the rest of you could. These are my points and jmo.

There's no doubt in my mind that we ARE one of the best teams in the league. Not because of our record--but because I believe that we DO have two of the best coaches around (Kubiak on O and Wade on D), but the question is: CAN WE OVERCOME OUR WEAKNESSES that have become glaring to the entire football world? We can't afford to hang our hats on the fact that we might get lucky in the playoffs by drawing homefield advantage. It's not enough! We've got the Colts for 2 of the next 3 weeks--and they are RED HOT! The old "we'll bounce back after a terrible loss" doesn't work in the PLAYOFFS, guys. We've gotta bounce first! Can we do it? I believe that we can and I hope that we will.

I'm not calling for anyone to be fired or replaced. I'm calling for the baddest boys on the block to GET TO WORK and
GET US A CHAMPIONSHIP!!!

:texflag:

HJam72
12-11-2012, 08:39 AM
I don't think this team can beat an elite QB in the playoffs, so I'm kind of in it-doesn't-matter-anyway mode. Having said that, I don't see where Indy is so hot (yet). They could still beat us in their house, though, and I can just see NE getting the tie-breaker over us. That's OK, because it will look better if we lose to them in NE, instead of in our house.

I have no faith whatsoever that this team can beat Brady, Manning, Manning, Brees, Rodgers, etc. Next year, that will include Luck; enjoy your next 15 years... :tiphat:

EllisUnit
12-11-2012, 08:52 AM
Disagree .... his receivers put up big numbers by adjusting to his under-thrown, overthrown, and errant passes. Sure he gets the stat line and people love to use those stats to defend him, but the eye test shows you that Matt is an incredibly inaccurate QB who makes poor throws and poor decisions.

This franchise should have QB as priority #1 next year either in the draft to develop for a year then hand over the reigns or in FA to take control from camp.

Ummmm that's exactly what he said if u had continued to read....

Cerberus
12-11-2012, 08:57 AM
Disagree .... his receivers put up big numbers by adjusting to his under-thrown, overthrown, and errant passes. Sure he gets the stat line and people love to use those stats to defend him, but the eye test shows you that Matt is an incredibly inaccurate QB who makes poor throws and poor decisions.

This franchise should have QB as priority #1 next year either in the draft to develop for a year then hand over the reigns or in FA to take control from camp.

When it comes down to it, I really think there are only two 'elite' QB's in the NFL and that would be Peyton Manning and Tom Brady. Sure you could make an argument for Aaron Rodgers, Drew Brees, Eli Manning, and a couple others, but I think only Manning and Brady are truly elite in the sense they can do what Manning is doing in Denver. A QB that immediately makes everyone else on the team better. With that said, Schaub is not an elite QB, but for those wishing him to be replaced: be careful what you wish for, you just might get it.

Speedy
12-11-2012, 01:33 PM
Not saying there aren't some problems because there are, and I'm as upset/pissed as anyone else about last night's performance, but at the end of the day this team's only 2 losses this season are to 2 pretty damn good football teams with 2 pretty damn good QBs.

GP
12-11-2012, 01:41 PM
Not saying there aren't some problems because there are, and I'm as upset/pissed as anyone else about last night's performance, but at the end of the day this team's only 2 losses this season are to 2 pretty damn good football teams with 2 pretty damn good QBs.

Agreed. In fact, those two QBs just generally play lights-out anytime they face what they deem to be very tough competition. They get caught up in trap games all the time, such as the Patriots taking the Cardinals too lightly.

And the Patriots have not won their three remaining games yet.

I will enjoy the drama of the final three weeks. It's coming down to the wire, and makes for good entertainment. I expect the Texans to get a whole new attitude because of this loss. Win out, and bring the Pats back to Reliant for the AFCC game. With a whole different outcome. You can't make better TV programming than that right there. Right?

EllisUnit
12-11-2012, 01:48 PM
Agreed. In fact, those two QBs just generally play lights-out anytime they face what they deem to be very tough competition. They get caught up in trap games all the time, such as the Patriots taking the Cardinals too lightly.

And the Patriots have not won their three remaining games yet.

I will enjoy the drama of the final three weeks. It's coming down to the wire, and makes for good entertainment. I expect the Texans to get a whole new attitude because of this loss. Win out, and bring the Pats back to Reliant for the AFCC game. With a whole different outcome. You can't make better TV programming than that right there. Right?

I agree a rematch in the playoffs between us and the pats after last night would be epic. Kinda glad we lost TBH I like our chances of beating the pats more once than twice. And the next time we play will matter more than last nights game. We will see them again and beat them when it counts !!!!

Luv_ya_blue
12-11-2012, 02:46 PM
Not saying there aren't some problems because there are, and I'm as upset/pissed as anyone else about last night's performance, but at the end of the day this team's only 2 losses this season are to 2 pretty damn good football teams with 2 pretty damn good QBs.
And that's part of the problem...
It's not just our defense.
It's our offense too. We couldn't move the ball. Schaub is responsible for moving the ball and he didn't get it done. He was as flat as a pancake. Devoid of enthusiasm like Rodgers...Brady...Manning...or any of the rest. Rodgers does the "discount double check" when he scores a TD. What would Schaub's be? A curtsy!

Agreed. In fact, those two QBs just generally play lights-out anytime they face what they deem to be very tough competition. They get caught up in trap games all the time, such as the Patriots taking the Cardinals too lightly.

And the Patriots have not won their three remaining games yet.

I will enjoy the drama of the final three weeks. It's coming down to the wire, and makes for good entertainment. I expect the Texans to get a whole new attitude because of this loss. Win out, and bring the Pats back to Reliant for the AFCC game. With a whole different outcome. You can't make better TV programming than that right there. Right?

I feel ya GP. But with very few exceptions: Cushing, Watt, Foster; I just don't see that "get up & stomp some tail" kind of intensity out of these guys. I mean, did losing Cushing pour cold water over our defense like it seems to have? I just don't see the "let's take up the slack and kick butt for Cush" kinda intensity. Do you? Can these guys really "get up" for a game?
I agree a rematch in the playoffs between us and the pats after last night would be epic. Kinda glad we lost TBH I like our chances of beating the pats more once than twice. And the next time we play will matter more than last nights game. We will see them again and beat them when it counts !!!!
Dude, don't try to make yourself feel better...

LAST NIGHT MATTERED!!!

Last night mattered BIG TIME. It mattered to our team. It mattered to our fanbase. It mattered to the city of Houston and the rest of the football world. Don't fool yourself Ellis--->last night mattered! "Who are the Houston Texans" is the question that was on everybody's mind coming into last night. Monday Night Football w/a national television audience, against one of the best teams in the league and we looked like a laughing stock...without exception. Remember, WE are supposed to be one of the best teams in the league. Even Kubiak didn't try to play the "it really doesn't matter and we'll get `em in the playoffs card." Home field could've been on the line last night. In fact, if we slip up and DON'T get homefield throughout--you can bet that last night's flop will be looked back on as the reason.

Yes, yes--as far as "winning in the playoffs" it matters much more. Do you think that Brady & Belicheck are saying to themselves, "Well heck boys, I sure wish the Texans would've won last night because I don't think that we can beat them TWICE!"

:vincepalm:

Double Barrel
12-11-2012, 02:49 PM
Brady and Manning will own this team in the playoffs regardless of location.

Homefield advantage is great and all, but it doesn't cover the fact that injuries have weakened this defense to the point of being ineffective against superior QBs.

And Schaub is still untested in the post-season. If it's any way to measure, his performance in prime time games gives me no reason to think he can carry this team on his back. I certainly hope to be proven wrong in that regard.

Rey
12-11-2012, 02:52 PM
Brady and Manning will own this team in the playoffs regardless of location.

Homefield advantage is great and all, but it doesn't cover the fact that injuries have weakened this defense to the point of being ineffective against superior QBs.

And Schaub is still untested in the post-season. If it's any way to measure, his performance in prime time games gives me no reason to think he can carry this team on his back. I certainly hope to be proven wrong in that regard.

Sadly...That's exactly how I feel...

Hoping for the best though...

EllisUnit
12-11-2012, 03:03 PM
And that's part of the problem...
It's not just our defense.
It's our offense too. We couldn't move the ball. Schaub is responsible for moving the ball and he didn't get it done. He was as flat as a pancake. Devoid of enthusiasm like Rodgers...Brady...Manning...or any of the rest. Rodgers does the "discount double check" when he scores a TD. What would Schaub's be? A curtsy!



I feel ya GP. But with very few exceptions: Cushing, Watt, Foster; I just don't see that "get up & stomp some tail" kind of intensity out of these guys. I mean, did losing Cushing pour cold water over our defense like it seems to have? I just don't see the "let's take up the slack and kick butt for Cush" kinda intensity. Do you? Can these guys really "get up" for a game?

Dude, don't try to make yourself feel better...

LAST NIGHT MATTERED!!!

Last night mattered BIG TIME. It mattered to our team. It mattered to our fanbase. It mattered to the city of Houston and the rest of the football world. Don't fool yourself Ellis--->last night mattered! "Who are the Houston Texans" is the question that was on everybody's mind coming into last night. Monday Night Football w/a national television audience, against one of the best teams in the league and we looked like a laughing stock...without exception. Remember, WE are supposed to be one of the best teams in the league. Even Kubiak didn't try to play the "it really doesn't matter and we'll get `em in the playoffs card." Home field could've been on the line last night. In fact, if we slip up and DON'T get homefield throughout--you can bet that last night's flop will be looked back on as the reason.

Yes, yes--as far as "winning in the playoffs" it matters much more. Do you think that Brady & Belicheck are saying to themselves, "Well heck boys, I sure wish the Texans would've won last night because I don't think that we can beat them TWICE!"

:vincepalm:

Not fooling myself by any means. I think we have the talent to beat them, we were just outcoached last night. We didn't lose due to the patriots talent, hell I wouldn't trade many of our guys for theirs.

Kubiaks inability to adjust and go outside of his comfort zone is what lost us this game. I will give him the benefit of the doubt that he won't make the same mistake twice until he proves me otherwise.

gtexan02
12-11-2012, 03:13 PM
Brady and Manning will own this team in the playoffs regardless of location.

Homefield advantage is great and all, but it doesn't cover the fact that injuries have weakened this defense to the point of being ineffective against superior QBs.

And Schaub is still untested in the post-season. If it's any way to measure, his performance in prime time games gives me no reason to think he can carry this team on his back. I certainly hope to be proven wrong in that regard.

Exactly. People seem to forget that Rogers put a clinic on in Houston. Brady is still Brady outside of Mass

klockWork
12-11-2012, 04:00 PM
Wow! Where have you people been? I'm fairly new to this forum and is a huge Texans fan. So far before this game most of my posts were about the weakness of our D, Schaub unproven and overrated status, Kubiak inept play-calling, and how some of these issues will cost us games against good teams.
And all the replies to my post are something in the line of "Who cares! We won the game. Everything will be alright. You looking this game the wrong way."

For awhile I thought I was in one of those Twilight Zone episode where that guy on the plane saw a monster tearing up the wings engine and no one believes him when he tells about it.
I guess the only good thing about this lost is now I know I'm not completely delusional.

badboy
12-11-2012, 04:05 PM
I realize that there are already a gazillion threads about other people's views on the game last night--so, what the heck, let's add one more.

1.) I'm a Texans fan through and through, first and foremost--so please don't flame me if you don't agree. These are only my thoughts; my views and $17 will get you a grande mochacino at Starbucks. I realize that many will disagree, and that's cool. Just show me where there's a breakdown in my logic.

2.) Let's start at the top: KUBIAK
Kubes has a reputation for trying to out think the entire room. Well, tonight he met his match. This was supposed to be a battle of wits, it resembled more of the Wizard vs the Nitwit! Kubiak has proved that HE isn't ready to coach at the next level. He had the opportunity of his coaching career to roll into Foxboro and steam roll one of the best coaches (and teams) in modern history. Kubiak is heralded by many to be an offensive jugernaut, but I feel (and have felt for sometime now) that Kubiak can't get out of his own way. All coaches try to do different things from week to week; keep the other guy on their toes. Problem I see is that it seems more like Kubes doesn't really know what he wants to do from week to week. Seems like it's his own guys that are kept off-balance. Let's face it guys, when the commentators can predict the play before it happens and says, "You could almost see that one coming..." it's pretty sad.

3.) Next on the agenda: SCHAUB
Plenty have criticized Matt for quite a long time now for not being clutch. It's no secret that I'm not a huge Schaub fan. He is not an elite QB and never will be. Does he put up big number? Yes. Does he do it impressively? Absolutely not! Elite QB's can do it against elite defenses. When it's the 4th qtr, THEY want the ball. You can look into their eyes and they exude confidence. The only thing that Schaub exudes is MY NEED for a valium! I've watched him for the past 3 yrs throw pass after pass after pass: behind receivers, off their shoe tops, and over their heads--only to have receivers make spectacular catches that made him look like a hero. I've always suspected that Matt would run into some big problems with well orchestrated defenses; and he is. I attribute his success much more due to his weapons than his own ability. He wasn't even really being pressured that much last night imo, and he looked unsteady and indecisive.

4.) Next up: D-LINE
Do we even have one?? I mean come on fellas--JJ can't do this crap all by himself! Barwin = SUCKS! Antonio is lukewarm & cold running water at best. Nobody else does ANYTHING! I understand that JJ makes the other guys look "less than," but for pete's sake--didn't we sign NFL caliber linemen?? Aren't we paying them? Isn't this their job? JJ draws a double team and nobody can shuck a block?! That's not gonna cut it in the playoffs against quality teams that are better than us. Seems like the loss of Cushing was infinetely more impactful than we anticipated. Or at least it's more than I anticipated. I saw us as a well oiled machine, and that we'd be able to overcome one player. Seems that his leadership on the field really is indespensable.

5.) The saddest corner of the roster: SPECIAL TEAMS
We suck! Plain and simple! We make some of the most horendous decisions of any team that I watch week-in and week-out. We give up too many big plays. Period. We don't block. We don't tackle (except Brahma). We don't hit the gaps...because there are no gaps to hit. This is the only area of the Texans that I truly have nothing good to say.

6.) Just say it: SECONDARY
We've been getting TORCHED. When we go up against top tier QBs, they don't even have to work that hard to make us look like the Four Stooges! Brady, Rodgers & Manning (yeah, yeah I know we got the W vs Denver) ate us alive! Yes I know that injuries played a part in where we are today--but it seems like that bug gets us every single year.

7.) And yes, I'm gonna go there: WADE
If I get flamed it's gonna be here I suspect. I have been so pleased with what Wade has done with our D, ever since he got here. But for the last 4 games or so, it seems as if he's getting out coached. His schemes seem unoriginal and very much lacking. I realize that he lost a key player in Cushing; but the way folks talked about Wade--he would take us to the Super Bowl even if all he had was practice squad scrubs! Well, evidently not! There's no doubt that Wade is one of the top defensive minds in the game, but his D isn't getting it done down the stretch. Yes, I know that wins are wins--but anyone with an eye for football can tell that despite those wins, there are GLARING holes in our defense that it seems as if he's ill-equipped to fill. The last few weeks Wade's defensive plans have looked very VANILLA. It almost seems like he's playing catch-up from jump. I believe that the hurry-up offense is one of his biggest hinderances. No. I believe that the hurry-up offense is gonna be our demise, IF Wade can't get things figured out. The hurry-up is the cure for the crafty / tricky schemes and blitz packages. They don't have time to get set up and don't have time to develop. Our defense is set up for success based on pressuring the QB--and the hurry-up package combined with a QB w/a quick release pretty much renders our defense average at best, and ineffective at worst. The times that we get pressure on the QB is when they hold the ball too long.

In CONCLUSION:
There are other things that I could point out, just as all the rest of you could. These are my points and jmo.

There's no doubt in my mind that we ARE one of the best teams in the league. Not because of our record--but because I believe that we DO have two of the best coaches around (Kubiak on O and Wade on D), but the question is: CAN WE OVERCOME OUR WEAKNESSES that have become glaring to the entire football world? We can't afford to hang our hats on the fact that we might get lucky in the playoffs by drawing homefield advantage. It's not enough! We've got the Colts for 2 of the next 3 weeks--and they are RED HOT! The old "we'll bounce back after a terrible loss" doesn't work in the PLAYOFFS, guys. We've gotta bounce first! Can we do it? I believe that we can and I hope that we will.

I'm not calling for anyone to be fired or replaced. I'm calling for the baddest boys on the block to GET TO WORK and
GET US A CHAMPIONSHIP!!!

:texflag:Good post Will now let me disagree rather than flaming you. I'm not disagreeing on how you eval that game as it was pretty accurate. First mistake (?) imo is you and others are trying to compare Schaub and Texans to elite teams like GB & NE and we just do not compare. More importantly that is okay. We are not yet deep enough to lose starters & plug in solid backups. Scurrying to find street guys like Bradie James, Ruud and Routt highlite this.

Schaub is no Aaron or Peyton or Brady but he does not have to be; see 11-2 record. He just needs his keys like AJ to do a bit better (now watch me get flamed lol) 8/95 is ridiculous from Johnson. He allowed Talib of all folks to cover him. More importantly, Walter and OD did little to help him. Why weren't plays called more for Jean deep to open up mid range for AJ? Yes Gary was outcoached but he is not first to win that distinction against Pats.

Wade's scheme calls for good Nose and very good LBs. If Cody had not hurt his back & then his ribs, he might be more solid; not good but solid. It took a bit longer for Bradie James to come on but then Cush went out. If we had Cush, our CBs would not look so off last night. Joseph is not 90% but what killed us imo was Brandon Harris. He looked like a second year KJ. I'm going positive & say he will continue like KJ in his third season next year. If we are going to allow KJ some slack why not B.Harris?

This team has done very well last two seasons with key starters injured. We just need to keep drafting well & picking up cheap FAs.

In summary, we are a good but not great team. Will we beat NE in Championship? Maybe. We need to continue to heal and not lose anyone else. Matt and Gary and Wade need to drink a beer and chill.

2013 NFL draft is looking mighty tasty; if things fall just right we can address all of our more pressing needs.

Rey
12-11-2012, 04:18 PM
Exactly. People seem to forget that Rogers put a clinic on in Houston. Brady is still Brady outside of Mass

I think people are forgetting that those weren't the only two QB's to have good days or better days than they had been having against us...

See, if we were to play Lions or Bears or teams like that again, I'm not sold that we beat them again...

If we were to play the Patriots again, I think they'd beat us again. Maybe not by that big of a margin, but I just don't see how we compete with them considering how we played last night.

Luv_ya_blue
12-11-2012, 04:45 PM
I think people are forgetting that those weren't the only two QB's to have good days or better days than they had been having against us...

See, if we were to play Lions or Bears or teams like that again, I'm not sold that we beat them again...

If we were to play the Patriots again, I think they'd beat us again. Maybe not by that big of a margin, but I just don't see how we compete with them considering how we played last night.

Let's be honest: we LOST the Detroit game.
If not for a fluke call from the refs--we're sitting at 10-3 w/2 games to play against a red hot Colts team. And you're right, if we slip a hair more we're at 9-4 after a potential loss to the Bears. But I won't balk at the Bears game--it was nasty and we fought and scrapped the whole way. Kudos to the fellas for pulling that one out.

So my question is: are we really a 9-4 team dressed in an 11-2 suit? We sure have been playing like it, imo.

disaacks3
12-11-2012, 04:46 PM
I think people are forgetting that those weren't the only two QB's to have good days or better days than they had been having against us...

See, if we were to play Lions or Bears or teams like that again, I'm not sold that we beat them again...

If we were to play the Patriots again, I think they'd beat us again. Maybe not by that big of a margin, but I just don't see how we compete with them considering how we played last night. Easy answer? We don't turn the ball over and recover the ones we force. That was an easy 21-point swing over 2 fumbles & 1 pick.

Double Barrel
12-11-2012, 05:07 PM
Wow! Where have you people been? I'm fairly new to this forum and is a huge Texans fan. So far before this game most of my posts were about the weakness of our D, Schaub unproven and overrated status, Kubiak inept play-calling, and how some of these issues will cost us games against good teams.
And all the replies to my post are something in the line of "Who cares! We won the game. Everything will be alright. You looking this game the wrong way."

For awhile I thought I was in one of those Twilight Zone episode where that guy on the plane saw a monster tearing up the wings engine and no one believes him when he tells about it.
I guess the only good thing about this lost is now I know I'm not completely delusional.

It's always been there under the surface. This forum has a long memory, which is why you see a "fire Kubiak" thread started in 2009 pop up.

For the most part, folks were willing to overlook the obvious flaws when the team is winning. But HOW they lost two games reveals some deep fundamental problems with this team. And that fresh pimp slap last night just refreshed some old nagging injuries in the fan base.

You might see a tendency for a lot more koolaide baths in the coming weeks if the team pumps out 2-3 wins. Winning is fun and sort of acts like a painkiller. But painkillers only mask. They are not a cure.

I think people are forgetting that those weren't the only two QB's to have good days or better days than they had been having against us...

See, if we were to play Lions or Bears or teams like that again, I'm not sold that we beat them again...

If we were to play the Patriots again, I think they'd beat us again. Maybe not by that big of a margin, but I just don't see how we compete with them considering how we played last night.

I agree. Last night's beat down was not that much of a surprise to those of us that have been concerned by the performances posted by some rather mediocre QBs against this defense. We have been fortunate with some gutsy performances, an offense that got hot at the right time, and some lucky breaks. But, it was never lost on the pragmatic folks that a great defense never let's a Chad Henne-type look fantastic.

Goatcheese
12-11-2012, 05:10 PM
It was a bad game, but people are really overreacting. I don't think people appreciate the role that momentum plays in competition.

The Texans came in with a plan they wanted to accomplish and they got punched in the mouth. They were reeling for a few series, but you could tell they were fighting for that momentum shifting play that could reset the fight and get things back on track.

Things just never fell into place. They got a 3rd down stop -> bogus pass interference call. They force a fumble -> they fail to cover it. They go for the throat with a deep shot at the end zone -> DB makes a great play to intercept the pass.

Sometimes things just seem to fall into place and you can't do anything wrong. You fumble the ball on the goal line and your own team recovers for a TD. A pass bounces off the intended receiver and into the hands of his team mate for a TD. The better things get, the more you build confidence and play loose and relaxed. The Pats had one of those nights.

Sometimes things just seem to fall to pieces and you can't do anything right. You break into the open only to trip over your own feet and fumble the ball. You bounce a ball off a receiver's facemask and it is intercepted for a defensive TD. The worse things get, the more you force them and the more likely things are to get worse. The Texans had one of those nights.

Both teams have been on opposites sides of that situation, sometimes within the same game.

**** happens.

Rey
12-11-2012, 06:00 PM
Easy answer? We don't turn the ball over and recover the ones we force. That was an easy 21-point swing over 2 fumbles & 1 pick.

But those things did happen. We made/didn't make the plays needed. You just pointed out three big plays...

1) three big plays is a lot.

2) even if you change those three plays we could still EASILY lose that game.

And that's whats even more disheartening.

Texans can absolutely win in the play offs, but if anyone is confident that they will win the only thing that can be based on is just a good feeling...hope...prayers...

I've yet to see any real reason to think we'd all of a sudden start to play at that level other than any given Sunday...which is code for I wish...

thunderkyss
12-11-2012, 06:13 PM
Homefield advantage is great and all, but it doesn't cover the fact that injuries have weakened this defense to the point of being ineffective against superior QBs.


So what should we do?

thunderkyss
12-11-2012, 06:22 PM
Exactly. People seem to forget that Rogers put a clinic on in Houston. Brady is still Brady outside of Mass

I don't know that anyone is forgetting. That was our first game without Cushing. Since then I don't think we've started the same 11 guys on defense for more than 2 games in a row.

I'm not forgetting anyway. I just think if we ever get our starter positions figured out, we'll be ready for the play-offs. This was Brandon Harris' second week. Merci's third week as starter. Joseph's first week back.

We're not going to see an elite QB (that hasn't thrown 18 INTs).

Our pass rush will show up against Indy. Here & in Indy.

Will they be ready at the end of the Indy game? I doubt it. But they'll have 2 weeks of practice to get ready for whichever elite QB makes it.

klockWork
12-11-2012, 06:33 PM
This game could have got a lot uglier. Belichick is known to leave his foot on the pedal. Once he realized Houston offense didn't try to make a comeback he let his foot off. I can see Pats putting up 52 pts easily.

Thorn
12-11-2012, 06:35 PM
Are we the best team in the NFL right now? No.

Are we "one of the best teams" in the NFL right now? Yes.

Doesn't mean we are good enough to win the Super Bowl, or even get there, but we are a hell of a lot better team than we were just two years ago. I'm not ready to go back into "fire Kubiak" mode just yet, and I'm not happy with how we played last night. But, it was the 3rd road game in a row so I'm gonna give them a break.

Let's see how they react to last nights loss this coming Sunday at home against Indy. That will tell us a lot.

76Texan
12-11-2012, 06:43 PM
Are we the best team in the NFL right now? No.

Are we "one of the best teams" in the NFL right now? Yes.

Doesn't mean we are good enough to win the Super Bowl, or even get there, but we are a hell of a lot better team than we were just two years ago. I'm not ready to go back into "fire Kubiak" mode just yet, and I'm not happy with how we played last night. But, it was the 3rd road game in a row so I'm gonna give them a break.

Let's see how they react to last nights loss this coming Sunday at home against Indy. That will tell us a lot.

Right now there are only two hot teams in the entire NFL.
The Pats and the Broncos.

Before the game, you can't even tell that the Pats fans were confident that they would win the game.

I visit the Broncos board and people there basically thought the same thing.
They figure the Broncos are fighting for the #2 seed, maybe even the third seed.

It's not just Texans fans that don't feel all that cheesy about their own team.

Thorn
12-11-2012, 06:54 PM
Right now there are only two hot teams in the entire NFL.
The Pats and the Broncos.

Before the game, you can't even tell that the Pats fans were confident that they would win the game.

I visit the Broncos board and people there basically thought the same thing.
They figure the Broncos are fighting for the #2 seed, maybe even the third seed.

It's not just Texans fans that don't feel all that cheesy about their own team.

I see no reason why the Texans can't win out the last three games and have home field advantage in the playoffs. Getting past Denver and/or New England in the playoffs is a different story. The defense better damn well show up those games if we plan on doing anything in the playoffs.

76Texan
12-11-2012, 07:02 PM
I see no reason why the Texans can't win out the last three games and have home field advantage in the playoffs. Getting past Denver and/or New England in the playoffs is a different story. The defense better damn well show up those games if we plan on doing anything in the playoffs.

The play-off is a whole new season.

Hopefully by then, we'll have more healthy guys:

Newton, Graham, JJo. Etc.

Routt should be well acclimated with the D and our young guys will have more experience under their bell: Jones, Brook, Harris, KMart, Jean, etc.

Our team will be better, knock on wood.

drs23
12-11-2012, 07:12 PM
Are we the best team in the NFL right now? No.

Are we "one of the best teams" in the NFL right now? Yes.

Doesn't mean we are good enough to win the Super Bowl, or even get there, but we are a hell of a lot better team than we were just two years ago. I'm not ready to go back into "fire Kubiak" mode just yet, and I'm not happy with how we played last night. But, it was the 3rd road game in a row so I'm gonna give them a break.

Let's see how they react to last nights loss this coming Sunday at home against Indy. That will tell us a lot.

Thank you grumpy old man for you insight and wisdom. Yes, it was ugly but I think we can come back and win out.

Signed :homer:

:D

thunderkyss
12-11-2012, 08:56 PM
I see no reason why the Texans can't win out the last three games and have home field advantage in the playoffs. Getting past Denver and/or New England in the playoffs is a different story. The defense better damn well show up those games if we plan on doing anything in the playoffs.

Please tell me you're not giving the offense a pass.

disaacks3
12-11-2012, 09:42 PM
But those things did happen. We made/didn't make the plays needed. You just pointed out three big plays...

1) three big plays is a lot.

2) even if you change those three plays we could still EASILY lose that game.

And that's whats even more disheartening.

Texans can absolutely win in the play offs, but if anyone is confident that they will win the only thing that can be based on is just a good feeling...hope...prayers...

I've yet to see any real reason to think we'd all of a sudden start to play at that level other than any given Sunday...which is code for I wish... He started he couldn't see a way we could really ever beat the Pats. I gave a single phase that by itself could have made a huge difference DESPITE the offensive and defensive woes. When the Texans and Patriots went in at the half, the stats were nearly identical for yards. A rematch in Reliant wouldn't be a gimme by any means.



Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk 2

Thorn
12-12-2012, 07:41 AM
Please tell me you're not giving the offense a pass.

I not giving anyone a pass, a complete team effort will be required. For now, I'm just going to stay in a holding pattern until I see what happens at the Indy game this weekend.

After that game I may put back on my "Fire Kubiak" hat, or my homer hat, or anything in between. I've been fighting a cold for a week and a half now, and I don't have the energy to be either a homer or a pain in the ass right now. LOL

thunderkyss
12-12-2012, 07:42 AM
I've been fighting a cold for a week and a half now, and I don't have the energy to be either a homer or a pain in the ass right now. LOL

Get well soon, we could use another hornery old fart around here.

:kitten:

Double Barrel
12-12-2012, 10:02 AM
So what should we do?

Play the games!!

Just understand that they will be underdogs, even with homefield advantage. Until they can prove to the world that they can rise up and beat someone like Brady in a playoff situation, there will be lingering doubts.

Any given Sunday and all that jazz. The Patriots are a great team, but not invincible. Our players could learn from last Monday (they should), and we could make some plays, get some lucky breaks, and anything can happen.

Plus, based on how rabid Texans fans were at last year's playoff game, there is certainly going to be a hostile atmosphere for any opposing team. That disrupts their timing and fires up our players. Anything is possible even when improbable.


This game could have got a lot uglier. Belichick is known to leave his foot on the pedal. Once he realized Houston offense didn't try to make a comeback he let his foot off. I can see Pats putting up 52 pts easily.

I thought the same thing. When Belichick does not like an opposing coach or team, he shows no mercy. But on Monday, I felt like the Pats knew the game was in the bag and the Texans were rolling over, so he did not have any incentive to run up the score. It looked to me that the NE offense went into a clock eating mode about halfway through the game. But I have no doubt that they would have taken a bigger lead if the Texans started scoring to make a push for a comeback.

HTown2ATX
12-12-2012, 10:11 AM
Wow! Where have you people been? I'm fairly new to this forum and is a huge Texans fan. So far before this game most of my posts were about the weakness of our D, Schaub unproven and overrated status, Kubiak inept play-calling, and how some of these issues will cost us games against good teams.
And all the replies to my post are something in the line of "Who cares! We won the game. Everything will be alright. You looking this game the wrong way."

For awhile I thought I was in one of those Twilight Zone episode where that guy on the plane saw a monster tearing up the wings engine and no one believes him when he tells about it.
I guess the only good thing about this lost is now I know I'm not completely delusional.

Naw man there is always that segment that thinks they are football know-it-all types and that by some quasi-hyperanalysis of some unseen aspect of the game and/or just pointing out some overall record like "we're still 11-2" that they are right and everyone else is wrong. I like it though cause it's funny.

Football is still a game, not astro-physics where you can't just trust your eyes sometimes. Sometimes you can in fact, trust what you are seeing on the field and what we were seeing on the field for a few games now was a porous defense giving up mammoth yards, Schaub being shaky and poor play calling (very predictable) at times.

I still think that with home field we have a shot but I temper that with how badly the Pack burned us at home. Right now we have to just wait and see.

76Texan
12-12-2012, 10:27 AM
Play the games!!

Just understand that they will be underdogs, even with homefield advantage. Until they can prove to the world that they can rise up and beat someone like Brady in a playoff situation, there will be lingering doubts.

Any given Sunday and all that jazz. The Patriots are a great team, but not invincible. Our players could learn from last Monday (they should), and we could make some plays, get some lucky breaks, and anything can happen.

Plus, based on how rabid Texans fans were at last year's playoff game, there is certainly going to be a hostile atmosphere for any opposing team. That disrupts their timing and fires up our players. Anything is possible even when improbable.




I thought the same thing. When Belichick does not like an opposing coach or team, he shows no mercy. But on Monday, I felt like the Pats knew the game was in the bag and the Texans were rolling over, so he did not have any incentive to run up the score. It looked to me that the NE offense went into a clock eating mode about halfway through the game. But I have no doubt that they would have taken a bigger lead if the Texans started scoring to make a push for a comeback.Or the Pats can start to feel the heat.
We could have made it 28-14 and then the D put on another stop, which they did.

The call goes our way, or we take advantage of a lucky bounce instead of letting it get away.

We could score another TD and it's anybody's game.

What if they didn't recover the ball in the endzone for the TD, and the ball bounced out of the endzone?
That would have resulted in a touch back and turned the ball over to us.

You need some luck in this game sometimes.
The ball bounced their way, and not ours.

thunderkyss
12-12-2012, 11:53 AM
Naw man there is always that segment that thinks they are football know-it-all types and that by some quasi-hyperanalysis of some unseen aspect of the game and/or just pointing out some overall record like "we're still 11-2" that they are right and everyone else is wrong. I like it though cause it's funny.

Football is still a game, not astro-physics where you can't just trust your eyes sometimes. Sometimes you can in fact, trust what you are seeing on the field and what we were seeing on the field for a few games now was a porous defense giving up mammoth yards, Schaub being shaky and poor play calling (very predictable) at times.

I still think that with home field we have a shot but I temper that with how badly the Pack burned us at home. Right now we have to just wait and see.

I don't think the "We're still 11-2" talk was about ignoring obvious problems. I think it was about knowing we're hurt & have been for a while, but managing to get healthy at a later date.

Like I said, these aren't excuses, because we were still winning. We're on our third string RT, we had two tightends on the roster in a three TE offense, we're starting a rookie at RG because the starter (pro bowler :boogie:) is injured.

So yeah, we're going to have trouble running the ball. Newton should be coming back this week, the guy who won the job. Ben Jones has been getting better all year (still not Vince Willfork 1 on 1 material), Graham should be back this week. Our running game will get better.

We haven't started the same two ILBs since Cushing went out in week since week 5. Jjo has been hurt all year. We're starting a guy at the nickel who hasn't seen real football playing time/speed in 3 years. Yeah, our pass defense is going to give up some yards & some touchdowns.

But Jjo is going to get better, he has to. Brandon Harris is balling, making dumb rookie mistakes, but he's all that, he's going to get better. & if one of the two don't happen, Stanford Routt is the best insurance we could have gotten. So we're going to get that figured out.

The outside pass rush has been an issue, Brooks Reed's injury has allowed us to move Barwin to the strong side & get Merci in play-off shape. Get Brooks back into that rotation & there is reason to believe that will get better.

Yet through all of that, that no good HC of ours manage to beat-up on weak teams, beat two AFC Division champs, and lead us to an 11-2 season (to this point).

17 weeks is a long time in the NFL. Many teams are not as good as they were when they started the Season. Some teams are better. We're one of the former, however, we've got time to get it back on track.

Denver, Green Bay, Chicago, Baltimore, Detroit, & New England were the games most people identified as possible losses. The Jets were another team many people didn't think we were going to beat. We are 5-2 against those teams.

Yeah we're hurt, yeah our defense isn't playing good right now, but we're 11-2 with 4 maybe 5 weeks to get it together.

We might not have the best HC, but we've got one of the best OCs in the entire league. We've got one of the best DCs in the entire league. I have no doubt they'll be ready when the real season starts.