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Marcus
10-12-2012, 09:52 PM
From the NFL network -

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap1000000079704/article/is-andre-johnson-declining-for-houston-texans

The Houston Texans' offense is known for its "Big Three" ... but is that really the case anymore?

Quarterback Matt Schaub is playing at an All-Pro level, and Arian Foster is entrenched as the NFL's preeminent workhorse back. Wide receiver Andre Johnson is supposed to complete this trinity. He hasn't carried his share of the weight through five games.

Johnson was largely neutralized Monday night by the New York Jets' Antonio Cromartie, a good, but not great, cornerback. NFL.com and NFL Network's Michael Lombardi wrote in his latest "Front Office View" column that Johnson "does not look like the same player."

Wrote Lombardi: "Johnson cannot run, burst or make sharp cuts, which has been the case since his hamstring injury."

Johnson's decreased production supports Lombardi's opinion. Through Week 5, Johnson has 17 receptions for 286 yards and two touchdowns. By way of comparison, here was Johnson's statline through five games in 2009, the last time he played 16 games: 28 receptions, 437 yards and four touchdowns.

Johnson still can produce, but at 31, it's fair to wonder if his best days are behind him.

Now granted, these are just opinions from the NFL network, but over the years, Mike Lombardi has been pretty fair with the Texans. But I myself was kinda surprised that Schaub couldn't find AJ on a night when Revis wasn't playing.

rmartin65
10-12-2012, 09:58 PM
Its fair. In my eyes, AJ is not even close to the receiver he was in the past. The injuries he has suffered (and the resulting surgeries) have really taken their toll.

He is still a good receiver, just no longer great.

Cjeremy635
10-12-2012, 10:08 PM
From the NFL network -

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap1000000079704/article/is-andre-johnson-declining-for-houston-texans



Now granted, these are just opinions from the NFL network, but over the years, Mike Lombardi has been pretty fair with the Texans. But I myself was kinda surprised that Schaub couldn't find AJ on a night when Revis wasn't playing.

As much as it sucks to admit it, he's right to a degree. Big players show up in big games and 'Dre all but disappeared on Monday night. Those 2 gimme balls he dropped should have never happened. That was him, not Schaub. 'Dre looked pretty frustrated with the way that he was being covered. He was looking defeated after one play where he was in the back of the end zone. He should have made adjustments to his game since Cromartie had a good game plan coming in.

I'm not saying he doesn't have anything left in the tank, but he is on the decline. He's 31 and that's no spring chicken in professional football. Losing a step at his position is detrimental to his game & the team. I'm not saying bench him, but we better have his heir apparent on the roster or draft him next year.

Texans_Chick
10-12-2012, 10:11 PM
Mike Lombardi said that.

The next time he gets something right about the Texans will be his first time.

He's a generalist that has a terrible feel for the Texans...often what he writes is completely off base.

As for these comments, I'm not sure how he can judge that from the games to date. The Texans haven't had to target AJ much because they've had so many leads, playing against bad offenses that they need to take few risks against. They are also not playing him as many snaps, working the new guys in.

So that combo of things means few needs to unleash AJ this season so far. There was a little bit in the Denver game, mostly because they were facing the Peyton, wanted to get some points on the board, maybe take a few more risks.

beerlover
10-12-2012, 10:19 PM
Instead if blaming Andre or any particular player it sure seems Texans have yet to find their rhythm. This offense is pedicated on timing & so far either teams have found a way to be desruptive or it's still early in the season. Watch the film it doesn't lie, can anyone say this is a well oiled machine? The defense has played ahead of schedule now without Cushing this will cause a drop off on defense, so I'm hoping the offense regains both timing & rhythm Andre included.

TdotTexas2Step
10-12-2012, 10:25 PM
In my opinion, Lombardi's right, Andre definitely isn't the same, and probably will never be what he was.

But that doesn't matter, because we're 5-0 still.

Andre has given us his entire NFL career, years of spectacular seasons of the best WR in the league. And now it's the rest of the team's turn to carry him, and that's what's been happening so far.

Andre's more frustrated about it than anyone else, you can see it on his face. He'll likely continue to decline. But you can guarantee he'll have something special left in the tank for when it matters most this season.

Hervoyel
10-12-2012, 10:26 PM
I think it's hard to say what's going on. I certainly don't think Lombardi has the necessary information to say AJ is in decline. Enough to suggest it's possible? Sure. As as has been pointed out the team just doesn't rely on him the way they once did but when he's needed he's been there, at least up until this year. This year he's mostly been quiet and we can't say yet whether it's because of AJ or because of the way the games are shaking out. The Texans seem to be trying to keep him healthy for the stretch run and they seem to be doing it by using all their other weapons. I don't see what's wrong with that other than that it creates the situation we're in now where everyone wants to know what's wrong with AJ.

rolyat93
10-12-2012, 10:27 PM
FINALLY. I was waiting for Lombardi to anti-jinx him. First he called the D soft last year, now he'll say "Dre is done, it's time.

Texn4life
10-12-2012, 10:32 PM
Doc called this one as soon as he found out the procedure that Andre was having done. He said that there was a good chance he would never get his explosion back.

Cjeremy635
10-12-2012, 10:49 PM
Doc called this one as soon as he found out the procedure that Andre was having done. He said that there was a good chance he would never get his explosion back.

He had a vasectomy? :htown2atx:

TheIronDuke
10-12-2012, 10:51 PM
If his production doesn't improve, would the FO be justified in asking him to take a pay cut next season? For a team with salary cap issues it'd be hard to continue paying him at an elite level when his play on the field doesn't translate....

Ryan
10-12-2012, 10:54 PM
If his production doesn't improve, would the FO be justified in asking him to take a pay cut next season? For a team with salary cap issues it'd be hard to continue paying him at an elite level when his play on the field doesn't translate....


No they wouldn't. Until they find someone even close to his talent level he is the best we have. And please don't say Lestar Jean.

ThaShark316
10-12-2012, 10:59 PM
Instead if blaming Andre or any particular player it sure seems Texans have yet to find their rhythm. This offense is pedicated on timing & so far either teams have found a way to be desruptive or it's still early in the season. Watch the film it doesn't lie, can anyone say this is a well oiled machine? The defense has played ahead of schedule now without Cushing this will cause a drop off on defense, so I'm hoping the offense regains both timing & rhythm Andre included.

Schaub has been money thus far, so I won't say a word about the pass game. I think the run game averaging less than 4 yards a carry is the biggest "problem" right now. There hasn't been much to bicker about when it comes to throwing the ball, but running the football is not top notch currently.

As the season wears on, the run game will get better, and the offense will kill ever more. This is why good teams don't peak in October.

Scooter
10-12-2012, 11:00 PM
Doc called this one as soon as he found out the procedure that Andre was having done. He said that there was a good chance he would never get his explosion back.

i seem to remember that as well. andre opted for the short term fix with a reduced effectiveness long term. he certainly has looked a lot slower and shows zero explosion. what i'm having more trouble with is he doesnt seem like himself in less physical ways, almost looking dejected out there. he even said as much week 1 if i remember correctly.

False Start
10-12-2012, 11:08 PM
I don't care what writers say,especially Lombardi. Dre is still better than a majority of the WRs in the NFL. Has he lost a step? Sure. Hes still one bad dude though. He is and always be my football player ever.

http://i265.photobucket.com/albums/ii202/J4103V/AJtransparent3-1.png

Playoffs
10-12-2012, 11:12 PM
Andre was targeted 10, 4, 4, 6, 6 times so far with 2 red zone targets and one conversion for a TD.

His total targets are down from his average weeks 2-5, which is likely a result of defenses taking away AJ in favor of our TEs whose targets are up this year on average, and Kevin Walter, who has almost twice as many targets as this time last year.

We'll see how the next games go.

Marcus
10-12-2012, 11:22 PM
If his production doesn't improve, would the FO be justified in asking him to take a pay cut next season? For a team with salary cap issues it'd be hard to continue paying him at an elite level when his play on the field doesn't translate....

No they wouldn't. Until they find someone even close to his talent level he is the best we have. And please don't say Lestar Jean.

If you don't think Rick Smith has the stones to make AJ the next salary cap casualty, you must not remember what he did with Demeco Ryans.

infantrycak
10-12-2012, 11:36 PM
AJ has dropped passes worth 120+ yds and 2 TD's so far, i.e. enough to close the gap on the stats Lombardi is using. That is where he has been off and it doesn't have anything to do with his legs or age. Throughout his career he has hit these little dropsy streaks and then he snaps out of it and starts making circus catches.

CloakNNNdagger
10-12-2012, 11:37 PM
Doc called this one as soon as he found out the procedure that Andre was having done. He said that there was a good chance he would never get his explosion back.

i seem to remember that as well. andre opted for the short term fix with a reduced effectiveness long term. he certainly has looked a lot slower and shows zero explosion. what i'm having more trouble with is he doesnt seem like himself in less physical ways, almost looking dejected out there. he even said as much week 1 if i remember correctly.



As I've posted before, the semitendinosus muscle which was released, may be small but it has been shown to contribute to explosiveness and stability of the knee.

Here are comments I posted in the past week.:

Besides significantly limiting the plays that they target him, if you notice his routes are essentially avoiding acute cuts/curls/change of direction. They are straight-line or gentle angles. In their game play plans they are definitely showing sensitivity to avoiding moves that will encourage recurrence of hamstring, knee and ankle problems, while trying to further protect him from further aggravating his ongoing groin problem.

If you've watched AJ carefully this year, he has basically run straight line routes or routes with gently angles. You haven't seen his signature sharp curl back or acute cut angle routes. In this last game, he was ahead of his defender going down the sideline and Schaub threw short. AJ was looking back (as was the defender) and was fully aware that it was falling short right into the hands of the defender. Yet he made no attempt to stop acutely to go back for the ball to break up a potential interception.........an over the back move that he has always been known for in the past. And this is only one of many examples. All of these observations go to the question of knee stability, something that I voiced concern over following his injuries last year, specifically with the decision made to surgically clip the partially torn semitendinosus hamstring muscle (a small muscle shown to contribute to knee stability and explosiveness), in order to be able to get him back on the field for the playoffs. He appears to be avoiding maneuvers that require heavy side-to-side stresses on his knees. It seems like game planning for AJ is being designed to exactly use only certain types of routes.......again to avoid exposing his knee instability problem and its limitations, at the same time trying to protect him from major re-injury.

After 5 weeks, FootballOutsiders has him at only 28th in WR ranking, with Walter right there with him at 29th. (No other Texans receivers are ranked in the top 93) http://www.footballoutsiders.com/stats/wr


I am certainly in no way advocating that we cast AJ aside. I am only saying that in order to be valuable, he may need to play within certain parameters due to presence of some physical limitations and for purposes of minimizing risk of re-injury. To date, his play and the play-calling seems to be consistent with the observations.

Kthx
10-12-2012, 11:58 PM
AJ has dropped passes worth 120+ yds and 2 TD's so far, i.e. enough to close the gap on the stats Lombardi is using. That is where he has been off and it doesn't have anything to do with his legs or age. Throughout his career he has hit these little dropsy streaks and then he snaps out of it and starts making circus catches.

I know at least one of those TD drops was the result of the CB covering him hitting the ball with his foot and knocking it out of his hands at the last second. Either way I hope you are right, it seems like some of the drops this year are throws that Jacoby could have caught. AJ just looks different out there, his body language, some of the things hes said, hes just down on himself. Hope hes a Texan till he retires though, I wasn't happy with getting rid of Meco and I wouldn't be happy with cutting AJ either, money and cap room is one thing but players notice how you treat your former all-stars who have lost a step.

Lucky
10-13-2012, 12:21 AM
I expect Andre to bounce back in a big way against the Pack. Part of that is Andre. Part is the Pack pass defense.

PapaL
10-13-2012, 12:26 AM
He's been MIA...sucks but gotta call a spade a spade. All his greatness in years past has zero bearing on what he's done this year.

Lucky
10-13-2012, 12:36 AM
He's been MIA...sucks but gotta call a spade a spade. All his greatness in years past has zero bearing on what he's done this year.
He had a pretty good game on opening day.

The Pencil Neck
10-13-2012, 12:37 AM
I've been saying that Andre just isn't Andre this year. He's definitely lost a step. But he's big enough, strong enough, and smart enough to still beat cornerbacks. Usually.

But I think it's eating at him. I think he's starting to lose confidence and he's starting to press. That's why he's dropping passes he normally would have caught.

We need one or two of the young receivers to step up and start producing to pull up the slack. I think this offense could be insanely good if we could see that happen.

MEGA SWATT
10-13-2012, 12:41 AM
I think it's hard to say what's going on. I certainly don't think Lombardi has the necessary information to say AJ is in decline. Enough to suggest it's possible? Sure. As as has been pointed out the team just doesn't rely on him the way they once did but when he's needed he's been there, at least up until this year. This year he's mostly been quiet and we can't say yet whether it's because of AJ or because of the way the games are shaking out. The Texans seem to be trying to keep him healthy for the stretch run and they seem to be doing it by using all their other weapons. I don't see what's wrong with that other than that it creates the situation we're in now where everyone wants to know what's wrong with AJ.

Agreed. The Texans don't need to ride AJ like they stole him to win games. This just means your team is better and hopefully he will be healthy for the post season.

PapaL
10-13-2012, 12:50 AM
He had a pretty good game on opening day.

This is true however Kendall Wright has more catches and yards.

Let that sink in. Kendall. Wright.



His peers in yardage right now are:

Jordy Nelson - 5 games
Lance Moore - 4 games
Kendall Wright - 6 games
AJ - 5 games
Santonio Holmes - 4 games
Dez Bryant - 4 games
Andre Roberts - 5 games

Marcus
10-13-2012, 01:04 AM
I am certainly in no way advocating that we cast AJ aside. I am only saying that in order to be valuable, he may need to play within certain parameters due to presence of some physical limitations and for purposes of minimizing risk of re-injury. To date, his play and the play-calling seems to be consistent with the observations.

I'm uneasy, for the lack of a better word, about the fact that the offense is limited somewhat by AJ's apparent limitations in his route running. And I can certainly see why AJ would be bothered by the kid gloves treatment. I never realized it was that bad.

Wolf6151
10-13-2012, 01:30 AM
AJ has not looked like the AJ of 5 yrs. ago, with that said I expect him to go off on the Packers for 130 yds..

Brisco_County
10-13-2012, 01:30 AM
This is true however Kendall Wright has more catches and yards.

Let that sink in. Kendall. Wright.


And their rushing total sucks.

I expected Andre to permanently lose a step after the muscle tear, but there are other factors involved here. One is the fact that Schaub's options have improved. Another is that Andre hasn't shaken some rust off. During the Monday night game, his legs weren't the problem when he dropped passes. His hands were. He'll get that fixed.

beerlover
10-13-2012, 01:46 AM
Schaub has been money thus far, so I won't say a word about the pass game. I think the run game averaging less than 4 yards a carry is the biggest "problem" right now. There hasn't been much to bicker about when it comes to throwing the ball, but running the football is not top notch currently.

As the season wears on, the run game will get better, and the offense will kill ever more. This is why good teams don't peak in October.

there is no "on the money" when the timing is off that is my point. Not just on Andre or Schaub, the OL or opposing teams defensive scheming the mis-direction is not so mis-direction anymore, teams are picking up on it & the throws are under pressure & sooner than planned. Maybe the cb's recognize the play so they engage & lock on sooner extending the play? Probably a combination of all the above but the game plan must adjust to allow structure to flow smoother. Like Kubiak said, he's got to find a way to get Andre the ball more, so look for it. Plus if you can't hurt the other team throwing it teams will stack the box & take away the run.

TheMatrix31
10-13-2012, 04:55 AM
Andre Johnson is still, at worst, 1c best WR in the league.

Rey
10-13-2012, 05:01 AM
Andre Johnson is still, at worst, 1c best WR in the league.

Some would argue 1d.

Don't look now, but Green in cincy is pretty damn good.

stingray
10-13-2012, 05:25 AM
My top 10 in order.

1. Calvin Johnson- Having a down year but still the best, no doubt.
2. Larry Fitzgerald- Still producing with inept qb's.
3. A.J. Green- The only guy that rivals Calvin in talent.
4. Roddy White- Still the best reciever in Atlanta.
5. Andre Johnson-Fading? or just not putting up numbers due to running game
6. Reggie Wayne- Back to stud #'s with a solid Qb.
7. Victor Cruz- Many thought he was a one hit wonder, but still producing.
8. Wes Welker- As consistent as they come.
9. Percy Harvin- Elite talent, becoming an elite Wr.
10. Brandon Marshall- Back with Cutler and putting out stud #'s.

Honorable mention: Dwayne Bowe, Julio Jones, Mike Wallace, Marques Colston, Hakeem Nicks (Would be in top 10 if not injured so much).

ObsiWan
10-13-2012, 08:57 AM
As I've posted before, the semitendinosus muscle which was released, may be small but it has been shown to contribute to explosiveness and stability of the knee.

Here are comments I posted in the past week.:

I am certainly in no way advocating that we cast AJ aside. I am only saying that in order to be valuable, he may need to play within certain parameters due to presence of some physical limitations and for purposes of minimizing risk of re-injury. To date, his play and the play-calling seems to be consistent with the observations.

Alright Doc, I'm sure there is credence to your diagnosis but I don't think that's why they aren't throwing to Andre as in years past. I think it's as simple as this:

The "engine" that powers the 2012 edition of the Texans' offense is the running game, not the passing game as in years past. Back in 2009 & 2010 when Schaub kinda HAD to pass he averaged 298 & 273 yds/game, respectively. This year he's averaging 231 yds/game. And Schaub's QB rating is still up around 99-100 so it's not like he sucks.

Given that Foster, so far, is averaging over 100 yds/game plus whatever Tate gets to chip in (25-25 yds maybe) why pass?

I just think Kubiak has taken a lesson from Parcells: build a formidable running game and a strong defense. Let that running game grind down the opposing defense and pass just often enough to keep them from piling 8-9 guys in the box. Depend on your strong D to give you the ball back with 3-&-outs or turnovers and get back to work grinding the down with your running game.

I don't think there's much wrong with A.J. I think his numbers are down due to the success of Foster, Tate, and the O-line.

Thoughts?

Blake
10-13-2012, 09:07 AM
This is true however Kendall Wright has more catches and yards.

Let that sink in. Kendall. Wright.



What does that have to do with the price of watermelon in Africa?

Buffi2
10-13-2012, 10:43 AM
I think what concerns me more than the speed and route running - or lack thereof - is the dropped passes. Now, that is so not Andre. I thought it was because they were holding him out of practices so much that the chemistry between he and Schaub was disappearing

GP
10-13-2012, 10:49 AM
Man, the guy has one "off" game and he's hot mess all of a sudden?

I guess we forget the Broncos game when he caught a crucial pass late in the game to extend the dive and burn a ton more clock for us.

Cromartie did a great job of defending him, that doesn't make AJ a lesser WR.

He's going to bust off a big game. I'm not saying he is the same guy as pre-2011, but guys come on...he's still got enough goods to be lethal out there. His double move is still catching DBs unaware.

robroy72
10-13-2012, 11:08 AM
Its fair. In my eyes, AJ is not even close to the receiver he was in the past. The injuries he has suffered (and the resulting surgeries) have really taken their toll.

He is still a good receiver, just no longer great.

He can't blame the surgeries for the uncharacteristic drops; the one against the Jets was incredible.

I think Andre plays alot on confidence; right now, he's lacking in that department. He and Schaub will have to play through this; he may not get back to being the Andre of years gone by due to the reasons the Doc posted above; he can still be a formidable weapon.

DexmanC
10-13-2012, 11:13 AM
What does that have to do with the price of watermelon in Africa?

The same thing it has to to with the price of watercress sandwiches in River Oaks?

IDEXAN
10-13-2012, 11:15 AM
Cromartie basically shut down AJ last week, but he did also have some help if you recall that real easy little pass that AJ dropped when he was wide on one play ?
Some WRs like Rice and T.O. play at a high level into their mid 30s, others fall off very rapidly around their 30th BD and it's looking more and more like the latter is the case for the greatest player to date to wear a Texans' uniform.
Now I sure hope I'm wrong about this, but we'll see ?

Thorn
10-13-2012, 11:21 AM
AJ has been rather luke warm this season so far, even still he's better than most recievers in the league and I'm still happy as hell he's a Texan. :)

CloakNNNdagger
10-13-2012, 11:28 AM
Alright Doc, I'm sure there is credence to your diagnosis but I don't think that's why they aren't throwing to Andre as in years past. I think it's as simple as this:

The "engine" that powers the 2012 edition of the Texans' offense is the running game, not the passing game as in years past. Back in 2009 & 2010 when Schaub kinda HAD to pass he averaged 298 & 273 yds/game, respectively. This year he's averaging 231 yds/game. And Schaub's QB rating is still up around 99-100 so it's not like he sucks.

Given that Foster, so far, is averaging over 100 yds/game plus whatever Tate gets to chip in (25-25 yds maybe) why pass?

I just think Kubiak has taken a lesson from Parcells: build a formidable running game and a strong defense. Let that running game grind down the opposing defense and pass just often enough to keep them from piling 8-9 guys in the box. Depend on your strong D to give you the ball back with 3-&-outs or turnovers and get back to work grinding the down with your running game.

I don't think there's much wrong with A.J. I think his numbers are down due to the success of Foster, Tate, and the O-line.

Thoughts?

I won't even try to argue that factors like our success with the running game and having other receiving options haven't potentially lent itself to Andre being left with less targets. However, the observation, at least to date, of his routes not being explosive and apparently significantly devoid of his signature sharp-cutting ins and outs, hitches and hooks, is none-the-less valid. These characteristic patterns in the past, allowed Andre to be "money," especially on 3rd and necessary yardage. There were times this season that the Texans needed those same important 3rd downs converted with minimal risk of turnover and seemed to shy away from what was once believed to be almost a "sure thing." The season is still young, and I have no problem if you wish to consider my observational comments "young" as well.

http://blog.meetingthemwheretheyare.com/wp-content/uploads/blog.meetingthemwheretheyare.com/2010/08/passing-tree1.jpg

http://www.top-wide-receiver-training.com/images/the_route_passing_tree.png

robroy72
10-13-2012, 11:39 AM
http://www.top-wide-receiver-training.com/images/the_route_passing_tree.png

Problem solved; route 9 it is!

SheTexan
10-13-2012, 12:03 PM
If you don't think Rick Smith has the stones to make AJ the next salary cap casualty, you must not remember what he did with Demeco Ryans.

BINGO!!

That means our team has gotta do everything in their power to make it to the top this year, if they want AJ to be there with them!! Yes, AJ needs to do his part, and I believe he will, but, his time is running out. RS will see to that. He has no loyalty when it comes to the heart and soul of our team. It's all BUSINESS to him. BUT, I guess that's his job.

As for the topic of the thread, AJ has been nothing but a CLASS act for this organization. I truly believe that WHEN the day comes that AJ believes he can no longer be a productive member of our team, he willl be the first to say so. Until then, I will continue to have faith that for this year, the best is yet to come. Kubiak, Wade, and Dennision have a plan that has been set in motion. NOW, we just gotta believe they can follow through. IMHO, they're not stressing out over AJ this early in the season. Save him for the big games, which start with the Ravens! JMO!!

rush2112mn
10-13-2012, 12:16 PM
I dont know if it has anything to do with the injuries he had over the past few years. He says that he is healthy. I heard recently he was having slight groin issue.
Look, Andre is not getting any younger. He is not the Andre we had back a few years ago.
I still think he has some good years left in him.
I think having Jean back is going to open things up for Andre. Andre likes to run the slant routes and would rather have someone else run the post routes.

Also, the Texans have such a diverse way they can attack you.....with Foster and Tate running the ball for over 50 percent of the plays
That leaves less throws to go around.
Daniels has really blown back up this year. He is playing at a probowl level I think. This is leading to less throws to Andre.
Andre is also usually taking 2 defensive players with him still I think.
So someone is going to be open or single coverage.

I know Andre can still make the big play when he is called upon.....
I hope he breaks the 10,000 yard mark Sunday......:texan::play::fans:

Thorn
10-13-2012, 12:18 PM
I hope he breads the 10,000 yard mark Sunday.

Does this mean he butters both sides of his bread?

PapaL
10-13-2012, 12:19 PM
What does that have to do with the price of watermelon in Africa?

Great insightful post.

You are the company you keep. He use to be up there with the Megatron and Fitz. Now, due to injuries age whatever, look who he is with. He's made plays 1/5 weeks. I love him as much as anyone else here but something is up.

I'm not so inclined to blame the offense. It's the same offense he's been in since Kubiak got here; now the weapons have improved. To me that means he's not always going to have a S over top because they do have to respect the run and the TE/FB catching passes.

Playoffs
10-13-2012, 12:25 PM
Teams are putting a safety over the top on Andre... that's why you see this:

RK PLAYER .................. REC TAR YDS AVG TD
10 Calvin Johnson, WR ... 29 . 43 . 423 14.6 1
11 Percy Harvin, WR ...... 38 . 48 . 407 10.7 1
12 Dwayne Bowe, WR .... 31 . 57 . 402 13.0 3

17 Torrey Smith, WR ..... 19 . 32 . 370 19.5 3

23 Larry Fitzgerald, WR .. 30 . 53 . 337 11.2 2

28 Julio Jones, WR ......... 26 . 46 . 313 12.0 4
29 Owen Daniels, TE ...... 23 . 33 . 311 13.5 3

42 Andre Johnson, WR .... 17 . 31 . 283 16.6 2

When your TE compares favorably to most of the big WR names of the year, it tells you 1) defenses are committed to taking away AJ and 2) AJ may be less able to beat double teams.

Let's see how the rest of the year shakes out before we put Andre in mothballs.

steelbtexan
10-13-2012, 12:47 PM
I won't even try to argue that factors like our success with the running game and having other receiving options haven't potentially lent itself to Andre being left with less targets. However, the observation, at least to date, of his routes not being explosive and apparently significantly devoid of his signature sharp-cutting ins and outs, hitches and hooks, is none-the-less valid. These characteristic patterns in the past, allowed Andre to be "money," especially on 3rd and necessary yardage. There were times this season that the Texans needed those same important 3rd downs converted with minimal risk of turnover and seemed to shy away from what was once believed to be almost a "sure thing." The season is still young, and I have no problem if you wish to consider my observational comments "young" as well.

http://blog.meetingthemwheretheyare.com/wp-content/uploads/blog.meetingthemwheretheyare.com/2010/08/passing-tree1.jpg

http://www.top-wide-receiver-training.com/images/the_route_passing_tree.png

I noticed on Schaubs int that AJ was running an out and up or 10 route. He rounded off the out part of the route so Cromartie didn't bite and was waiting on Schaub to throw the deep ball. AJ used to be able to go up and make plays even if he was covered. Not so much anymore.

I dont know why AJ is rounding his routes. It could be that his Hamstring/Groin/Knee/ankle injuries have caught up to him. Or it could've been that AJ just had a bad game.

But there's little doubt Gary has changed the way he's using AJ. Gary may be nursing AJ through the season so that he will be healthy for the playoffs. (Hopefully this is the case.)

76Texan
10-13-2012, 12:54 PM
OK, let's do a quick comparison here.

This year, so far, we have been targeting AJ on the average 6 times per game.
He caught 17 balls for 283 yards and 2 TDs in 5 games.

In 2010, in 13 games, AJ was target an average of nearly 11 times per game.
He caught 86 balls for 1,226 yards and 8 TDs

Similarly, in 2009, in 16 games, AJ was targeted nearly 11 time per game.
He caught 101 balls for 1,569 yards and 9 TDs.

From basic math, if AJ is being targeted as much as he did in 2009, he would end up having a better year than 2009.

Is it because that AJ can't no longer get open that we don't throw the ball to him as much? No. I rewatched the Jets game (with the all-22 and end-zone views) and this is what happened:

- On the first four pass attemptes by Schaub, AJ was double-teamed on all four.

- On the fifth pass - the TD to OD - AJ was also wide open underneath on a speed out route (that requires a hard jab step to the inside before cutting to the outside); AJ's cut was sharp and he could have gained at least 10 yards. But since O.D. was so side open deep, Schaub went to him for the TD.

- On the sixth pass, Cromartie did a good job not biting on AJ's double move; Schaub threw the ball away.

- On the seventh pass, AJ was ahead of the receiver on a shallow crossing route, but Schaub went to Foster because there was a LB in the middle of the field at the time AJ crossed the middle of the field.

- On the eight pass, Schaub threw an INT when he tried to fit the ball into double coverage. This is the exact post route that AJ had ran a couple of times earlier and the coverage was exactly the same (double-team.)

- On the ninth pass, AJ was open with a stop and go move as the CB gave him plenty of cushion; Schaub already went to Casey underneath for 5 yards.

- He was not on the field for the next pass.

- On the eleventh pass, AJ was triple-teamed on a similar post route. Schaub went to Casey for 7.

- On the twelfth pass, AJ was wide open on a deep in route, but Schaub had already decided to go quickly to Foster underneath for a 17-yd catch and run.
His sharp cut on this route cannot be denied. He got a ton of seperation from the DB. He left Cromartie in the dirt just as OD did on the TD pass. This one could have gone for at least twenty yards.

....

And so on and so on... You get the drift.

DaTruthExplodes
10-13-2012, 12:58 PM
andre has been done as a elite receiver 2 years ago.

He's been skating by on reputation alone the past couple years.

PapaL
10-13-2012, 01:28 PM
OK, let's do a quick comparison here.

This year, so far, we have been targeting AJ on the average 6 times per game.
He caught 17 balls for 283 yards and 2 TDs in 5 games.

In 2010, in 13 games, AJ was target an average of nearly 11 times per game.
He caught 86 balls for 1,226 yards and 8 TDs

Similarly, in 2009, in 16 games, AJ was targeted nearly 11 time per game.
He caught 101 balls for 1,569 yards and 9 TDs.

From basic math, if AJ is being targeted as much as he did in 2009, he would end up having a better year than 2009.

Is it because that AJ can't no longer get open that we don't throw the ball to him as much? No. I rewatched the Jets game (with the all-22 and end-zone views) and this is what happened:

- On the first four pass attemptes by Schaub, AJ was double-teamed on all four.

- On the fifth pass - the TD to OD - AJ was also wide open underneath on a speed out route (that requires a hard jab step to the inside before cutting to the outside); AJ's cut was sharp and he could have gained at least 10 yards. But since O.D. was so side open deep, Schaub went to him for the TD.

- On the sixth pass, Cromartie did a good job not biting on AJ's double move; Schaub threw the ball away.

- On the seventh pass, AJ was ahead of the receiver on a shallow crossing route, but Schaub went to Foster because there was a LB in the middle of the field at the time AJ crossed the middle of the field.

- On the eight pass, Schaub threw an INT when he tried to fit the ball into double coverage. This is the exact post route that AJ had ran a couple of times earlier and the coverage was exactly the same (double-team.)

- On the ninth pass, AJ was open with a stop and go move as the CB gave him plenty of cushion; Schaub already went to Casey underneath for 5 yards.

- He was not on the field for the next pass.

- On the eleventh pass, AJ was triple-teamed on a similar post route. Schaub went to Casey for 7.

- On the twelfth pass, AJ was wide open on a deep in route, but Schaub had already decided to go quickly to Foster underneath for a 17-yd catch and run.
His sharp cut on this route cannot be denied. He got a ton of seperation from the DB. He left Cromartie in the dirt just as OD did on the TD pass. This one could have gone for at least twenty yards.

....

And so on and so on... You get the drift.

Great write up, seriously.

Rolling coverages and double triple teaming him isn't anything new. He's dealt w this when he was our only weapon and HWSNBN was the QB yet he still made plays. Maybe before Schaub would force more balls and AJ had to make a play - but not Schaub see's someone else wide open; I don't know. All I know is that when AJ is barreling through the secondary and dragging DBs w him we are damn near unstoppable. I want THAT guy back.

run-david-run
10-13-2012, 01:53 PM
andre has been done as a elite receiver 2 years ago.

He's been skating by on reputation alone the past couple years.

And Kareem Jackson is the worst starting CB in the league....

HJam72
10-13-2012, 01:58 PM
We all have to deal with the inevitable fact that we are getting older. AJ will have to do this as well, whether now or later. It wouldn't bother me at all if we had our next great receiver in a few years and AJ was the best #2 receiver in the game for a while.

I think CnD is right and I just hope that it will heal eventually, but he won't be the GOAT forever.

Ryan
10-13-2012, 02:04 PM
andre has been done as a elite receiver 2 years ago.

He's been skating by on reputation alone the past couple years.


You mean in 2010 when he caught 1300 receiving yards on one leg? Ok then. :texanbill:

kiwitexansfan
10-13-2012, 02:25 PM
Teams are putting a safety over the top on Andre... that's why you see this:



When your TE compares favorably to most of the big WR names of the year, it tells you 1) defenses are committed to taking away AJ and 2) AJ may be less able to beat double teams.

Let's see how the rest of the year shakes out before we put Andre in mothballs.

Your argument fails on the basis that teams also put safety help over Calvin Johnson and he is #1 on your chart along with many other of the WRs on that list.

76Texan
10-13-2012, 02:39 PM
Great write up, seriously.

Rolling coverages and double triple teaming him isn't anything new. He's dealt w this when he was our only weapon and HWSNBN was the QB yet he still made plays. Maybe before Schaub would force more balls and AJ had to make a play - but not Schaub see's someone else wide open; I don't know. All I know is that when AJ is barreling through the secondary and dragging DBs w him we are damn near unstoppable. I want THAT guy back.

Well, we all saw what happened when Schaub tried to force that ball into double coverage in the Jets game.

For the most part, however, I think Matt had done a great job to find the open man rather than forcing the ball like before.

There were too many times that AJ had to win those balls in the past.
I think we don't have to do that now with a more mature Schaub.
Look at his QB rating; Schaub can find an open man most of the time.

I'd rather him go for the safe throws unless we really need him to.
So far we don't have to risk that, and it's great news!

BTW, no team has been able to stop us yet; knock on wood.
We made it hard for ourselves here and there; otherwise, it would have been a blow-out in each and every single game we've played so far.

hradhak
10-13-2012, 02:42 PM
I'd agree that AJ is probably not the best he has been. Still, even at his best AJ has never been a player that beats you every game. He's had games with huge numbers and catches and others with little.

What bothers me more at this point is that we are getting no production from our trio of #3 receivers. Martin, Jean, and Posey have done nothing to inspire confidence. Their lack of production pretty much puts it all on the TEs, AJ, and KW

kiwitexansfan
10-13-2012, 02:44 PM
I'd agree that AJ is probably not the best he has been. Still, even at his best AJ has never been a player that beats you every game. He's had games with huge numbers and catches and others with little.

What bothers me more at this point is that we are getting no production from our trio of #3 receivers. Martin, Jean, and Posey have done nothing to inspire confidence. Their lack of production pretty much puts it all on the TEs, AJ, and KW

That raises a question of how often we are in 3 or 4 WR sets, how much Schaub is targetting them, are they getting seperation etc.

There are so many factors to consider when talking about WR production.

Not to mention the fact we do like to run the ball a whole lot.

76Texan
10-13-2012, 02:46 PM
Your argument fails on the basis that teams also put safety help over Calvin Johnson and he is #1 on your chart along with many other of the WRs on that list.

I'll go watch me some Lions game to see what happens there.

For now, I remember when Orvlosky was with the Lions, he forced a lot of balls to CJ. (I remember watching those games when we first signed Orvlosky to see how he performs.)

Sometimes CJ made plays, and sometimes the defenders made plays.

rolyat93
10-13-2012, 02:46 PM
If you don't think Rick Smith has the stones to make AJ the next salary cap casualty, you must not remember what he did with Demeco Ryans.
It's not the same situation. He let Meco go because we already had Brian Cushing playing at an elite level. Who's gonna fill in for AJ? Keyshawn Martin? :vincepalm:

hradhak
10-13-2012, 02:52 PM
That raises a question of how often we are in 3 or 4 WR sets, how much Schaub is targetting them, are they getting seperation etc.

There are so many factors to consider when talking about WR production.

Not to mention the fact we do like to run the ball a whole lot.

I would argue that we don't go to 3 and 4 WR sets because Kubes has no confidence in these guys. The only time I see Martin / Jean etc out on the field is to spell AJ and KW. On some level these guys are limiting our playcalling.

run-david-run
10-13-2012, 02:53 PM
This Packers game sets up perfectly for a litmus test of sorts. Andre was rather embarrassed by Cromartie, if not in performance (haven't seen the film) at least in production.
Combine that with a (potentially) high scoring team coming in against a D that just lost Cush. I've kept myself positive by saying AJ hasn't been getting the numbers because we haven't needed him to. Now I think we need him to. If the offense is struggling, the D is getting lit up and Andre doesn't come to the rescue, we can probably call it the end of an era (not a career, calm down).

But I really think he's showing up Sunday night.

76Texan
10-13-2012, 03:06 PM
This Packers game sets up perfectly for a litmus test of sorts. Andre was rather embarrassed by Cromartie, if not in performance (haven't seen the film) at least in production.
Combine that with a (potentially) high scoring team coming in against a D that just lost Cush. I've kept myself positive by saying AJ hasn't been getting the numbers because we haven't needed him to. Now I think we need him to. If the offense is struggling, the D is getting lit up and Andre doesn't come to the rescue, we can probably call it the end of an era (not a career, calm down).

But I really think he's showing up Sunday night.

David, read my post here:

OK, let's do a quick comparison here.

This year, so far, we have been targeting AJ on the average 6 times per game.
He caught 17 balls for 283 yards and 2 TDs in 5 games.

In 2010, in 13 games, AJ was target an average of nearly 11 times per game.
He caught 86 balls for 1,226 yards and 8 TDs

Similarly, in 2009, in 16 games, AJ was targeted nearly 11 time per game.
He caught 101 balls for 1,569 yards and 9 TDs.

From basic math, if AJ is being targeted as much as he did in 2009, he would end up having a better year than 2009.

Is it because that AJ can't no longer get open that we don't throw the ball to him as much? No. I rewatched the Jets game (with the all-22 and end-zone views) and this is what happened:

- On the first four pass attemptes by Schaub, AJ was double-teamed on all four.

- On the fifth pass - the TD to OD - AJ was also wide open underneath on a speed out route (that requires a hard jab step to the inside before cutting to the outside); AJ's cut was sharp and he could have gained at least 10 yards. But since O.D. was so side open deep, Schaub went to him for the TD.

- On the sixth pass, Cromartie did a good job not biting on AJ's double move; Schaub threw the ball away.

- On the seventh pass, AJ was ahead of the receiver on a shallow crossing route, but Schaub went to Foster because there was a LB in the middle of the field at the time AJ crossed the middle of the field.

- On the eight pass, Schaub threw an INT when he tried to fit the ball into double coverage. This is the exact post route that AJ had ran a couple of times earlier and the coverage was exactly the same (double-team.)

- On the ninth pass, AJ was open with a stop and go move as the CB gave him plenty of cushion; Schaub already went to Casey underneath for 5 yards.

- He was not on the field for the next pass.

- On the eleventh pass, AJ was triple-teamed on a similar post route. Schaub went to Casey for 7.

- On the twelfth pass, AJ was wide open on a deep in route, but Schaub had already decided to go quickly to Foster underneath for a 17-yd catch and run.
His sharp cut on this route cannot be denied. He got a ton of seperation from the DB. He left Cromartie in the dirt just as OD did on the TD pass. This one could have gone for at least twenty yards.

....

And so on and so on... You get the drift.

There was one time AJ was open in the end-zone, but Schaub saw the safety getting ready to cut him off, so he went to the left side (and ended up throwing the ball away.)

On that particular play, a quick throw to AJ would have gotten the job done; however, we can't ask Schaub to be perfect.

The Pencil Neck
10-13-2012, 03:07 PM
I noticed on Schaubs int that AJ was running an out and up or 10 route. He rounded off the out part of the route so Cromartie didn't bite and was waiting on Schaub to throw the deep ball. AJ used to be able to go up and make plays even if he was covered. Not so much anymore.

I dont know why AJ is rounding his routes. It could be that his Hamstring/Groin/Knee/ankle injuries have caught up to him. Or it could've been that AJ just had a bad game.

But there's little doubt Gary has changed the way he's using AJ. Gary may be nursing AJ through the season so that he will be healthy for the playoffs. (Hopefully this is the case.)

I'll have to go back and take a look at that. I thought he was running a 12 or a 6.

Other than that, I agree with your post. I think something's wrong with AJ and I'm not sure what. And it's eating away at his confidence.

I think Schaub forces the ball to Andre because he trusts Andre and wants to get him involved. And you never know when Andre's going to make an incredible play on a ball.

I think Gary's using him differently than in the past because of whatever issue he's dealing with.

Marcus
10-13-2012, 03:16 PM
It's not the same situation. He let Meco go because we already had Brian Cushing playing at an elite level. Who's gonna fill in for AJ? Keyshawn Martin? :vincepalm:

Rick Smith could have care less who filled in for Demeco. He let him go because he thought (rightly or wrongly) his salary didn't match his skills.

And if he lets AJ go, it will be for exactly the same reason. That's what general managers do.

76Texan
10-13-2012, 03:20 PM
I'll have to go back and take a look at that. I thought he was running a 12 or a 6.

Other than that, I agree with your post. I think something's wrong with AJ and I'm not sure what. And it's eating away at his confidence.

I think Schaub forces the ball to Andre because he trusts Andre and wants to get him involved. And you never know when Andre's going to make an incredible play on a ball.

I think Gary's using him differently than in the past because of whatever issue he's dealing with.

It was a post route all the way.

I don't see anything wrong with AJ.

He has always been hard on himself.

If you catch an interview on HT.com, AJ talked about always wanting to go out there and be perfect. There was also an interview that I saw on the local news where he said the same thing.
But he has never been perfect. He dropped some balls every year.

He might be pressing a little bit and ended up dropping a few balls already this year. That's more than what normally happened with him (based on the number of balls thrown his way.)

run-david-run
10-13-2012, 03:24 PM
David, read my post here:



There was one time AJ was open in the end-zone, but Schaub saw the safety getting ready to cut him off, so he went to the left side (and ended up throwing the ball away.)

On that particular play, a quick throw to AJ would have gotten the job done; however, we can't ask Schaub to be perfect.

Very well broken down. The interception (which was a bad read and a bad throw from Matt, behind AJ when Cromartie was trailing underneath the throw) definitely made us go more conservative in the passing game. Against the Jets, that made sense, their one offensive TD came following the great field position that pick gave them.
After that, it was a matter of not letting their defense beat us when their offense couldn't. It will be very interesting to see how we do against the Packers and Ravens in this regard.

Even if it's just as a possession receiver with the occasional double move, AJ can still be a force in this league. Just ask Miami.

infantrycak
10-13-2012, 03:26 PM
andre has been done as a elite receiver 2 years ago.

He's been skating by on reputation alone the past couple years.

Horse pucky. In 2010 AJ led the league in yards per game.

In 2011 he played the 1st 3 games with Schaub. In those he was on pace to 116 rec. for 1685 yds. In the playoffs he was - 13 rec. for 201 yds.

dalemurphy
10-13-2012, 03:37 PM
Either Andre Johnson's sore/injured groin is hobbling him, or he has lost explosion for other reasons (hamstring tear and subsequent surgery, for example)...

Regardless of what the stats may or may not show, any honest view of AJ's movement this season will see he is physically quite limited. Hopefully, it is a current injury that he can recover from. Or, he will be able to rehab or strengthen whatever the lingering issues are and eventually regain most of his explosiveness. Either way, we are good. No need to lie to ourselves. He isn't right but we are 5-0 despite that.

76Texan
10-13-2012, 03:41 PM
Your argument fails on the basis that teams also put safety help over Calvin Johnson and he is #1 on your chart along with many other of the WRs on that list.

This game rewind thing is pretty good.
It has a list of all the plays that you can scroll through to pick the one you want to watch.

I watched the Lions/Vikings game, and here are some of the things I observed:

The safety broke up 3 deep passes to CJ.
The safety turned the wrong way and wasn't able to help the CB on one play (he was expecting Stafford to go to a different receiver.)
CJ ran into the zone between two safeties on one play.
Basically, if the safety(ies) play(s) it correctly, the double-team stop CJ from making plays every time.

Mac#5
10-13-2012, 03:44 PM
This is coming from the guy that call our QB Matt Shwab

76Texan
10-13-2012, 03:44 PM
Either Andre Johnson's sore/injured groin is hobbling him, or he has lost explosion for other reasons (hamstring tear and subsequent surgery, for example)...

Regardless of what the stats may or may not show, any honest view of AJ's movement this season will see he is physically quite limited. Hopefully, it is a current injury that he can recover from. Or, he will be able to rehab or strengthen whatever the lingering issues are and eventually regain most of his explosiveness. Either way, we are good. No need to lie to ourselves. He isn't right but we are 5-0 despite that.

There's no need to lie just like I didn't need to in the KW's thread.

There's nothing majorly wrong with AJ; we just haven't been targeting him as much as before, that's all.

dalemurphy
10-13-2012, 03:52 PM
There's no need to lie just like I didn't need to in the KW's thread.

There's nothing majorly wrong with AJ; we just haven't been targeting him as much as before, that's all.

"Lie"? (I'm suggesting that watching AJ without bias makes it clear he is not right. I was not suggesting anything else. As fans, we all struggle to not allow our biases to color what we are seeing)

Whether there is something majorly wrong or not, I do not know. What I do know is that he has not been able to accelerate and separate from defenders this season as he has in the past. I am not basing that on his targets. I am basing that on watching him run his routes... I don't doubt that we are targeting him less for reasons beyond his lack of explosiveness. If you watch him running in the Jets game without efforting to win an argument, you will clearly see that he is hobbled. Other games this year, it has clearly been the case as well. It has been noticeable a few times this year. Again, hopefully, it is the groin issue and nothing more.

76Texan
10-13-2012, 03:59 PM
"Lie"? (I'm suggesting that watching AJ without bias makes it clear he is not right. I was not suggesting anything else. As fans, we all struggle to not allow our biases to color what we are seeing)

Whether there is something majorly wrong or not, I do not know. What I do know is that he has not been able to accelerate and separate from defenders this season as he has in the past. I am not basing that on his targets. I am basing that on watching him run his routes... I don't doubt that we are targeting him less for reasons beyond his lack of explosiveness. If you watch him running in the Jets game without efforting to win an argument, you will clearly see that he is hobbled. Other games this year, it has clearly been the case as well. It has been noticeable a few times this year. Again, hopefully, it is the groin issue and nothing more.

Rewatch the TD against the Broncos.
The CB Tracy Porter never caugh up with AJ.
Look at the distance between them when AJ caught the ball all the way to when AJ reach the end zone.

This guy (Porter) ran a 4.37 at the combine in 2008.

Also read my break-down post for the Jets game up in this thread.
AJ made a couple of very sharp breaks (once on a speed out and another on a deep square in) and got good seperation both times.

run-david-run
10-13-2012, 04:11 PM
Rewatch the TD against the Broncos.
The CB Tracy Porter never caugh up with AJ.
Look at the distance between them when AJ caught the ball all the way to when AJ reach the end zone.

This guy (Porter) ran a 4.37 at the combine in 2008.

Also read my break-down post for the Jets game up in this thread.
AJ made a couple of very sharp breaks (once on a speed out and another on a deep square in) and got good seperation both times.

I've gone both ways on this. I don't think it's an every play thing. For instance, on OD's TD catch and run against the Titans, they showed a zoomed out replay and AJ was on the other side of the field. He smoked his corner on fly route and had an easy TD, but Schaub checked down earlier.
In the same game, his two big plays, I though he looked a little slow. I remember being surprised at how sluggish the whole play looked, even though it was a big gain.

He's not at 100%, I think it's safe to assume. But he's also not crippled or useless. He's a couple breaks away from having about 4 or 5 TDs and bunch more yards and everyone talking about how he's back to the old AJ.

For the record, those breaks being (long catch against Dolphins that went out of bounds at the 4, two sort-of-drops against the Broncos that would have been big yards and touchdowns, and 2 drops against the Jets that could have been big plays). He just needs to get his hands and his confidence back in order.

Texecutioner
10-13-2012, 04:17 PM
I think a ton of you sound like a bunch of complete fickle fans in this thread. I'd usually expect this kind of stuff out of non Texans fans who don't watch the Texans that often, but this "AJ is no more" stuff is ridiculous and laughable honestly.

Did you guys not watch the first two games of the season and also the pre season? There has been nothing wrong with AJ at all. I've noticed no difference at all. We've had a very conservative offense especially in the 2nd halves and they haven't gone to AJ nearly enough. To suggest that AJ somehow lost it after one off season is just silly. He isn't 36 years old or anything. We're a run oriented team big time, and we don't have hardly any other receiving threats outside of AJ other then Owen Daniels. In pre season AJ looked like the same beast he has always been. He did in the first game as well after the first half even when a pretty good CB was covering him.

If Kubiak wasn't so conservative and wasn't so afraid of losing leads where he just wants to run, run, run, we'd probably see a lot more of AJ. I'm not going to be bothered to much about it as of now, because we're 5-0. However I've said all season long that our offense is not near as good as people think it is this season. We can run the ball well, but the play calling hasn't been the type of play calling from a dynamic step on your throat type of play calling to do that. AJ not getting the ball as much right now also might be a good thing to some degree, because he isn't taking near as many hits as usual. Hopefully he'll be a lot more healthy by playoffs time when we'll need him the most.

CloakNNNdagger
10-13-2012, 06:45 PM
From NFL.com. (http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap1000000079915/article/andre-johnson-waits-for-his-star-turn-for-texans)

At 31, it's fair to speculate leg injuries have robbed Johnson of the explosiveness that made him a star. That said, a decline in production doesn't necessarily signal an erosion of talent.

Johnson now finds himself in an offense that prays at the altar of the run game. Arian Foster is on pace to set an NFL record for rushes in a season. That type of dedication doesn't leave a ton of opportunity for monster receiving numbers.

NFL.com and NFL Network's Ian Rapoport -- in Houston for the Texans' Week 6 matchup against the Green Bay Packers -- asked Johnson about his slow start. Johnson explained that he was shut down by the Jets because cornerback Antonio Cromartie was allowed to play under him with help over the top.

According to Rapoport, Johnson seemed resigned to that technique working.

Playoffs
10-13-2012, 07:12 PM
According to Rapoport, Johnson seemed resigned to that technique working.
It opens up other options, but I still think we'll see Matt throw into double coverage on AJ sometimes and let him go up & get it. Up to now, we haven't needed to force it into him.

Texecutioner
10-13-2012, 07:21 PM
andre has been done as a elite receiver 2 years ago.

He's been skating by on reputation alone the past couple years.

Wow. Two years ago?? You bash Schaub and now AJ?


I'm starting to wonder if you're really a fan of this team, and I've never said that to another member. I know you're new, so I'll hold off, but suggesting that AJ has been done as an elite guy for two years is something that only someone would say who barely follows the Texans. AJ looked awsome last season when he was healthy and the season before he looked damn good and played hurt the majority of the season.

76Texan
10-13-2012, 07:34 PM
According to Rapoport, Johnson seemed resigned to that technique working.[/URL]
Doc, you know that Johnson always "seemed resigned" right?

Obviously, nobody can deny Mother Nature.
The effects of multiple injuries eventually will catch up to Andre, but right now, I think he's fine.

In one of the interview, he even said that he thought he would play ten years and retire, but now that the tenth years comes, he feels like he can still play some more.

He seems like the kind of guy who will tell you whether he feels like he's starting to slow down.
At least, I hope so! :brando:

ATXtexanfan
10-13-2012, 08:10 PM
Dre is done as an elite WR. No biggie. He's still the best we have and teams know it

CloakNNNdagger
10-13-2012, 09:42 PM
For those who have pointed out that AJ has been thwarted by the CB playing under and the Safety playing over the top, he has been presented with this type of coverage from day one........and this never curtailed his performance. The thing that has changed is that the classic counter moves for this type of coverage which he successfully typically used............cutting sharply on an in or out to get away from being caught directly within the CB/Safety "sandwich", or turning back on an abrupt hitch or hook to get in front of the CB........has disappeared.

Texecutioner
10-13-2012, 09:46 PM
For those who have pointed out that AJ has been thwarted by the CB playing under and the Safety playing over the top, he as been presented with this type of coverage from day one........and this never curtailed his performance. The thing that has changed is that the classic counter moves for this type of coverage which he successfully typically used............cutting sharply on an in or out to get away from being caught directly within the CB/Safety "sandwich", or turning back on an abrupt hitch or hook to get in front of the CB........has disappeared.

Yeah, but how many other times in games would Schaub force the ball to AJ on a lot more plays allowing him to out muscle and size guys up?? I watched AJ make a ton of bad ass plays in pre season and in game 1 especially in that 2nd half. I did not see any slowing down of AJ.

You guys are forgetting that we've been holding leads over every team practically and Kubes is running the ball and we're not having to throw down the field nearly as much, because Kubes is calling a much more conservative game plan to hold the lead. AJ simply isn't being targeted as much from what I've observed. As far as AJ's physical abilities and positioning to get open, I don't see any differences here. In year's past we were always having to have shootouts with teams and playing from behind, so AJ had to do a lot more.

infantrycak
10-13-2012, 10:03 PM
I am with Tex on this one. I don't agree he hasn't been able to cut this year (maybe with a slight cautiousness against the Jets). He has jocked several DB's on wicked double moves this season. His production is down because of less targets and a hopefully very temporary case of dropsies. Without those drops he would be at 400 yds and 4 TD's. That we be a better pace than his best year and that's with lower targets.

CloakNNNdagger
10-13-2012, 10:04 PM
Yeah, but how many other times in games would Schaub force the ball to AJ on a lot more plays allowing him to out muscle and size guys up?? I watched AJ make a ton of bad ass plays in pre season and in game 1 especially in that 2nd half. I did not see any slowing down of AJ.

You guys are forgetting that we've been holding leads over every team practically and Kubes is running the ball and we're not having to throw down the field nearly as much, because Kubes is calling a much more conservative game plan to hold the lead. AJ simply isn't being targeted as much from what I've observed. As far as AJ's physical abilities and positioning to get open, I don't see any differences here. In year's past we were always having to have shootouts with teams and playing from behind, so AJ had to do a lot more.

Then I'd have to ask what happened when Cromartie intercepted the ball in front of AJ while AJ kept watching the ball which was obvious to him and everyone else that it was going to be short but didn't make any attempt to sharply stop and hook back around or go over Cromartie to try to catch or even deflect the ball. It would be hard bent to think that if he could have, he wouldn't have.

infantrycak
10-13-2012, 10:14 PM
Then I'd have to ask what happened when Cromartie intercepted the ball in front of AJ while AJ kept watching the ball which was obvious to him and everyone else that it was going to be short but didn't make any attempt to sharply stop and hook back around or go over Cromartie to try to catch or even deflect the ball. It would be hard bent to think that if he could have, he wouldn't have.

I have been saying for 4-5 years one defect in AJ's game is aggressiveness back to under thrown balls and on hook routes. He has long not done as much as he could to prevent INT's by getting in between the ball and the DB even enough to interfere.

76Texan
10-13-2012, 10:29 PM
For those who have pointed out that AJ has been thwarted by the CB playing under and the Safety playing over the top, he has been presented with this type of coverage from day one........and this never curtailed his performance. The thing that has changed is that the classic counter moves for this type of coverage which he successfully typically used............cutting sharply on an in or out to get away from being caught directly within the CB/Safety "sandwich", or turning back on an abrupt hitch or hook to get in front of the CB........has disappeared.

OK, Doc.
I've already mentioned him running the speed out and deep in routes in the Jets game with sharp cuts.

Here, I'm going to do the first half of the Dolphins game.
I will only mention certain routes that seem to be in question.

1st quarter:

11:27 AJ ran a deep out and caught the ball for 11 yards.

7:58 AJ ran an 18-yd deep comeback toward the inside (at 45%).
This is pretty much a hook/hitch type of route to beat double coverage that you were asking for.
Schaub was sacked, however.

2nd quarter:

13:53 AJ ran 23-yd deep comeback, this time, toward the side line.
Schaub was on a bootleg and couldn't set up quick enough to throw a good ball.
CB had time to react back to knock the ball away.

11:51 AJ ran a 10-yd deep in and left the CB on the ground.
However, Schaub went to OD who beat the LB right off the bat.

2:30 AJ ran a 6/7-yd quick hook.
He got separation, but Schaub was pressured and scrambled for 2.

2:03 AJ ran a 5-yd quick in.
He was also open, but Schaub went to OD right in front of him for 11.
The LB turned the wrong way.

Honestly, I don't see anything wrong with AJ.

In the Jets game, he ran more post routes to take away the double team and open it up for the other guys.
It's just different game planning.

I only hope that he doesn't suffer a groin/hamstring type of injury, that's all.

TdotTexas2Step
10-13-2012, 10:33 PM
I don't think there's anything wrong with saying our 31 year old wide receiver fresh off an injury plagued season and surgery doesn't look the same.

In fact, to say "there's nothing wrong with him" is probably the more illogical statement.

Fact of the matter is he decided to undergo a surgery that would benefit him short term and hinder him long term, and there's a chance that short term may be coming to an end.

HOWEVER, that doesn't take away from the fact that he's the best we've got, and still the guy we fans expect to be there when we need him the most.

76Texan
10-13-2012, 10:41 PM
Then I'd have to ask what happened when Cromartie intercepted the ball in front of AJ while AJ kept watching the ball which was obvious to him and everyone else that it was going to be short but didn't make any attempt to sharply stop and hook back around or go over Cromartie to try to catch or even deflect the ball. It would be hard bent to think that if he could have, he wouldn't have.

The ball just got there too quickly, Doc.
He did make the tackle right away.

Rey
10-13-2012, 10:49 PM
Against Denver Andre broke up a pass that was almost intercepted.

The pass against Miami on fourth down a few years ago where Andre reached around a guy and caught the ball was one of the best catches I've ever seen. This was the qb draw on the goal line game. Earlier on that last drive Aj made that catch on 4TH DOWN to keep the drive a live. That catch is seared in my brain and that is the catch that to me symbolizes andres greatness. That catch and the one against Arizona where he ran through the lb and safety for the TD.

imatexan
10-13-2012, 10:55 PM
Dre is done as an elite WR. No biggie. He's still the best we have and teams know it

You sound so certain of yourself, well you shouldn't be.

Andre at 75% is still an elite receiver, I thunk early on this year and off to a 5-0 start we have had no reason to rely on him so they are letting him take it a bit easier. When the time comes I have no doubt he will rise to the occasion. I agree Tex with the conservative play calling also being a factor.

O ya and that old guy is about to have 10,000 yards receiving.

Rey
10-13-2012, 11:00 PM
I haven't seen anything wring with Andre by the way. Before the game me and another poster (sorry I can't remember who it was to give proper credit) mentioned how we thought cromartie matched up well with Andre.

Cromartie can more than keep up with him speed wise, and he has the size and athleticism to challenge him for balls that are thrown his way. Cromartie would likely struggle to guard a guy like Martin who can change direction on a dime because his stride isn't as long.

As far as the drops go, andre has dropped a few catchable balls in his career. He always has. That is not new. That's not to say it's a problem, but he just drops a few easy ones every now and then.

I dint have a huge problem with any if our wrs so far. I couldn't see all the routes against the jets, but it seemed like we were running a bunch of vertical routes, or routes that were designed to go over ten yards.

I would have liked to have seen kmart used more as a short passing option like the patriots use welker. Even if he only gets 3-5 yards it still has it's purpose.

CloakNNNdagger
10-13-2012, 11:16 PM
OK, Doc.
I've already mentioned him running the speed out and deep in routes in the Jets game with sharp cuts.

Here, I'm going to do the first half of the Dolphins game.
I will only mention certain routes that seem to be in question.

1st quarter:

11:27 AJ ran a deep out and caught the ball for 11 yards.

7:58 AJ ran an 18-yd deep comeback toward the inside (at 45%).
This is pretty much a hook/hitch type of route to beat double coverage that you were asking for.
Schaub was sacked, however.

2nd quarter:

13:53 AJ ran 23-yd deep comeback, this time, toward the side line.
Schaub was on a bootleg and couldn't set up quick enough to throw a good ball.
CB had time to react back to knock the ball away.

11:51 AJ ran a 10-yd deep in and left the CB on the ground.
However, Schaub went to OD who beat the LB right off the bat.

2:30 AJ ran a 6/7-yd quick hook.
He got separation, but Schaub was pressured and scrambled for 2.

2:03 AJ ran a 5-yd quick in.
He was also open, but Schaub went to OD right in front of him for 11.
The LB turned the wrong way.

Honestly, I don't see anything wrong with AJ.

In the Jets game, he ran more post routes to take away the double team and open it up for the other guys.
It's just different game planning.

I only hope that he doesn't suffer a groin/hamstring type of injury, that's all.

I get the feeling that you feel that I'm making a case for Andre is essentially done. That is the furthest thing from what I am trying to present. He can certainly still be a very productive player on this team. But I do see some physical limitations that he is and likely will be dealing with from here on out. I will respectfully leave you to your own conclusion when you say that you don't see anything wrong with AJ. But knowing what the type of injuries he has incurred and their implications, along with what I continue to observe in general, you'll have to excuse me if I choose to believe my lying eyes.

GP
10-13-2012, 11:30 PM
To me, in the jets game...there were two passes where I think Schaub expected his WR to make a bigger effort to get to a spot on the field.

One was the AJ target where Cromartie picks it off. I will maintain that I think AJ was not running as hard as Schaub might have expected AJ to, which means Schaub was leading him a bit more than he should have. Watching that play in real time, AJ looked sluggish and wasn't (IMO) running hard enough.

A second play was a scramble by Schaub where there was tons of own field to the sideline, Schaub throws it there and Walter never really understood that's where Schaub was wanting him (Walter) to get to, to bail them out. Granted, it was busted and all players are scrambling...but still, Walter half-assed that scramble and should have known to go there and to get there quickly.

Those are the two types of plays that Owen Daniels thrives on, he's so instinctual and seems to hit overdrive very quickly. He's Schaub's most reliable receiver when it comes to bring not only in the right spot on any given situation, but also gets there quick enough to get separation to make the catch AND get crazy YAC too.

I think we'll see a "return to form" by AJ this week. He's going to want to have a do-over.

NastyNate
10-13-2012, 11:33 PM
andre has been done as a elite receiver 2 years ago.

He's been skating by on reputation alone the past couple years.

You're so wrong it hurts. It's like listening to my 6 year old try to explain theorhetical physics. :vincepalm:

76Texan
10-13-2012, 11:34 PM
I get the feeling that you feel that I'm making a case for Andre is essentially done. That is the furthest thing from what I am trying to present. He can certainly still be a very productive player on this team. But I do see some physical limitations that he is and likely will be dealing with from here on out. I will respectfully leave you to your own conclusion when you say that you don't see anything wrong with AJ. But knowing what the type of injuries he has incurred and their implications, along with what I continue to observe in general, you'll have to excuse me if I choose to believe my lying eyes.

Like I said, Doc, if the Texans had targeted AJ as many times as they did in 09 and 2010 (nearly 11 targets per game), when you pro-rate this year production (6 targets per game), he will have a better year than either of those two years (both in number of catches, number of yards, and number of TDs.)

And like I said, he's been getting open.

76Texan
10-13-2012, 11:37 PM
To me, in the jets game...there were two passes where I think Schaub expected his WR to make a bigger effort to get to a spot on the field.

One was the AJ target where Cromartie picks it off. I will maintain that I think AJ was not running as hard as Schaub might have expected AJ to, which means Schaub was leading him a bit more than he should have. Watching that play in real time, AJ looked sluggish and wasn't (IMO) running hard enough.

What are you talking about GP?

The ball was at best a hair late and quite short.
If AJ had run any harder, he would have overran the ball by a mile.

76Texan
10-13-2012, 11:43 PM
Against Denver Andre broke up a pass that was almost intercepted.

This is probably the pass to start the second half.

This one should have been a PI of 40 some yards.

AJ ran a skinny post from the slot (more like a post corner route, but not really that sharp.)

AJ beat both the corner and the safety.
The CB (#20 Adams) ran into AJ back (but he managed to stop himself before it became too obvious.)
It was enough to cause AJ to lose a bit of balance.
Also, the ball was a little short and late (or AJ was "too fast"), AJ had to wait for it.
The ball then grazed AJ's shoulder pad (as he lost some balance) such that he couldn't pull it in cleanly; the ball bounced around in the air.

The safety came, and AJ had to play defender to break up that INT.

If the CB didn't bump into AJ, that one would have been at least a 50yd completion.

DocBar
10-14-2012, 01:23 AM
AJ is looking mortal this season. Hopefully he's saving up his mojo for a major playoff push.

PapaL
10-14-2012, 01:38 AM
aj is looking mortal this season. Hopefully he's saving up his mojo for a major playoff push.

qft!

76Texan
10-14-2012, 02:17 AM
AJ is looking mortal this season. Hopefully he's saving up his mojo for a major playoff push.

What's so mortal about that double move he put on the CB on the left side line in the 4th qtr of the Tenn game? It was like 7-8 yards of separation. That, my friend, is called explosiveness.

If Schaub had not been pressured, that would have been the easiest 37-yd TD catch you've ever seen.

Oh, and AJ also had a 12yd catch called back because of a stupid call on Walter.
How can it be a crack back block when the DE jumped right over Walter to get into the backfield? Even Dan Fouts diagree with that call vehemently.

Ryan
10-14-2012, 02:52 AM
I don't think this is a good thread for week 5 honestly. I'll revisit it in February after the season is over.

guichows6
10-14-2012, 04:16 AM
http://m.nfl.com/news/0ap1000000079915/texans-johnson-waits-for-his-chance-to-return/


I pretty much agree with this article.

Aj is still a beast . A lot of you folk love the drama of the world ending, and its just not the case.

CloakNNNdagger
10-14-2012, 08:42 AM
I have been saying for 4-5 years one defect in AJ's game is aggressiveness back to under thrown balls and on hook routes. He has long not done as much as he could to prevent INT's by getting in between the ball and the DB even enough to interfere.

You're correct. We've discussed this same thing on numerous occasions. But most of these instances involved throws that were thrown short and low and away from the defender with expectations that he would comeback for the reception; not passes that he would stare down at eye level and within reach knowing that if he made no move on the ball, it would result in a sure interception.

76Texan
10-14-2012, 12:06 PM
Alright, here's a vid of an INT "allowed" by Calvin Johnson.
It's the third INT.
At the top of your screen.
The Rams were playing 2-deep, zone under.
Courtland Innegan broke off his zone to go to the side line for the INT.
Look at how CJ seems to never make an effort to come back to break up the play even though he can "clearly" see it.

Look for the vid that says Stafford nightmare first half.

http://www.nfl.com/gamecenter/2012090905/2012/REG1/rams@lions#menu=highlights&tab=analyze&analyze=playbyplay

76Texan
10-14-2012, 12:12 PM
BTW, TPN, CJ caught 6 passes for 111 yards in this game, but he never beat any double-team.

The Rams played almost exclusively cover 2 zone under.

CJ's longest gain went for 51 yards.
He ran a post route with no CB following him.
One of the safeties was occupied on the other side.
The safety on his side played deep and kept running back and back.
He had depth over CJ throughout the play, but he kept drifting back.
He played like he was satisfied to wait for CJ to catch the ball and then tackle him. :vincepalm:
The highlight vid doesn't show the whole field, but if you have NFL Game Rewind, you can see everything really well.

The rest of CJ's catches were into the void of the various zones he saw throughout the game.
(Think Richard Smith and Frank Bush defense.)

hradhak
10-14-2012, 02:51 PM
My guess is that we aren't seeing the numbers from an that we are used to is that an is getting reps. He has a history of getting injured they are pulling him for rest during drives. He may not be as fast as he was as a rookie but he's a smart runner. He can get open when he needs to. My guess we will see more of him in other games

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk 2

Double Barrel
10-16-2012, 06:24 PM
Rick Smith could have care less who filled in for Demeco. He let him go because he thought (rightly or wrongly) his salary didn't match his skills.

And if he lets AJ go, it will be for exactly the same reason. That's what general managers do.

You may be right, but I've got the feeling that Smith will be overruled by McNair when it comes to A.J.

McNair has stated on more than one occasion that Johnson will retire as a Texan. I do not get the feeling that our owner is prone to misrepresenting his thoughts, especially about something so specific.

Obviously, A.J. has to be in agreement with it, but only time will tell if Smith's ax eventually lops his head off, too.

dalemurphy
10-16-2012, 07:04 PM
You may be right, but I've got the feeling that Smith will be overruled by McNair when it comes to A.J.

McNair has stated on more than one occasion that Johnson will retire as a Texan. I do not get the feeling that our owner is prone to misrepresenting his thoughts, especially about something so specific.

Obviously, A.J. has to be in agreement with it, but only time will tell if Smith's ax eventually lops his head off, too.

A couple things:

1st, AJ looked much better on Monday- a sign that part of his problem was the groin injury he was battling.

2nd, AJ's contract is structured in a way that will make it difficult to dump him, i think.

Double Barrel
10-16-2012, 07:23 PM
Sorry, Marcus, but your boy Rick Smith agree with McNair:

“It’s important that Andre have one home — and that’s with the Houston Texans,” McNair said. “He’ll probably be our first Hall of Fame player. We wanted to make sure he went in as a Texan and he played his career as a Texan.”

-----------------

“This will make him a Texan for life,” general manager Rick Smith said.

Source (http://www.chron.com/sports/texans/article/Deal-makes-Texans-Johnson-highest-paid-WR-in-NFL-1694094.php)

leebigeztx
10-17-2012, 01:58 AM
They need to put the quick slant back in the offense. Its safe, get yds, and aj and schaub in a zone.

Marcus
10-17-2012, 02:56 AM
Sorry, Marcus, but your boy Rick Smith agree with McNair:

Well, from your source article, written in Aug 2010, I agree that that is what they said then. But much has changed since then. Wouldn't you agree?

We, the fans, can be as nostalgic and sentimental as we like. But general managers in a salary-cap restricted NFL are not afforded that kind of luxury. Their job is to determine "what have you done for me lately", and make the necessary, and sometimes difficult, decisions in accordance with.

For AJ's sake, I really hope they win the Super Bowl this season, because I think it will be his last season, regardless of what they said two years ago.

DexmanC
10-17-2012, 03:28 AM
Rick Smith is shrewd, cold blooded, and is feared/hated/respected by most of the players on this team. Since he came here, the Texans ceased being the easiest paycheck in the NFL. He showed what he was about this off-season.


Demeco Ryans. You've been a great leader on our ball club, so we're gonna do right by you and trade you to a team that fits your skillset.



Eric Winston. You are an overpaid tackle who spends more time on the radio and at Wingstop than working on your game. No trade. No request for a pay cut. Not gonna put ya on waivers. YOU ARE CUT!!


Bob McNair gets to be the smiling, sweet grandpa. Rick Smith is The Iceman.

Excellent front office you've built, Bob.

Norg
10-17-2012, 03:31 AM
the plan is to have AJ healthy for 16 games and playoff games .... nuff said

so i can see why we are lowing his snaps .... so thats the reality we are in


SO what do u guys want to trade AJ next year ...?????? is that what u want ????

but didnt we already give him a big contract ..... i for one want to see ANdre retire a texan but this will really hurt us since we will have 2 draft a True #1 WR with andre still on the team

TheMatrix31
10-17-2012, 04:31 AM
Andre Johnson is not retiring after this season, lol. Unless he's forced into retirement from a career-ending injury or something. Not a chance.

drs23
10-17-2012, 10:11 AM
andre has been done as a elite receiver 2 years ago.

He's been skating by on reputation alone the past couple years.

THENFL, is that you?

Double Barrel
10-17-2012, 11:07 AM
Well, from your source article, written in Aug 2010, I agree that that is what they said then. But much has changed since then. Wouldn't you agree?

We, the fans, can be as nostalgic and sentimental as we like. But general managers in a salary-cap restricted NFL are not afforded that kind of luxury. Their job is to determine "what have you done for me lately", and make the necessary, and sometimes difficult, decisions in accordance with.

For AJ's sake, I really hope they win the Super Bowl this season, because I think it will be his last season, regardless of what they said two years ago.

yeah, like I said, you could ultimately be right. It is a business at the end of the day.

However, I could also see McNair keeping A.J. as a 'legacy' player, something he would not do for any other member of the team.

Bob has a little bit of "old school" mentality to him, more than a lot of the newer owners. His loyalty to Carr, and his undying support of Kubiak, shows that he's not going to make decisions based on the public or media. He admires the stable teams that stick with head coaches for a long time. The Landry-era Cowboys, the Steelers, the Patriots.

While I would not be shocked if they release AJ someday, I also would not be surprised if they make sure that he retires as a Houston Texan.

steelbtexan
10-17-2012, 11:11 AM
AJ is a top 10-15 WR.

He's certianly still a #1.

He just needs more help on the other side. Hopefully this will be addressed in the next draft. The WR class is very deep.

Mr teX
10-17-2012, 11:12 AM
I've thought about this alot lately and I honestly think that all of the reasons cited in this thread are the reason why he hasn't really looked the same.

1.) he's just trying to make sure he gets through the season playing all 16 games this year...we had some obvious & immediate deficiencies when he went down last year. But he came back against Cincy in the playoff game and beasted.

2.) Yes, he's lost some of his explosion, but it's a combo of him getting older and the hammy injury/surgery he got last year. However, within this offense, he's still capable of putting up numbers if we target him enough. The drops i think can be explained by him just not being in the flow of the game and he's not quite used to being targeted so sporadically.

3.) I think kubes has purposely tried to go away from him a bit more with his playcalling this year in an effort to limit the focus on him. By doing so, this he's in effect trying to forces the other WR's to step up so the opposing teams have start paying more attention to those guys. rather than sitting on AJ.

I strongly believe this 3rd reason b/c we have seen OD be a focal point at times in the offense, But Walter? I don't think i've ever seen him get targeted as much as he has been this season....at least not while AJ has been on the field with him anyway. The numbers and stats presented earlier say that this is true. Everyone on here and elsewhere knew that the achilles heel to our offense was that we had no WR options outside of AJ & OD...it became more obvious when we sent JJ packing.

Marcus
10-17-2012, 11:14 AM
Andre Johnson is not retiring after this season, lol. Unless he's forced into retirement from a career-ending injury or something. Not a chance.

Who said anything about retiring?

I told SheTexan, on the day she went ballistic after learning that Rick Smith had traded Ryans, that if she hated Rick Smith now, she'll REALLY hate him next year.

AJ is a shell of his former self, but the biggest problem, is that he's being paid the type of money given to players that are in their prime, not past it. Rick Smith is going to have to tackle that problem head on.

Ryan
10-17-2012, 01:52 PM
AJ's not going anywhere, and outside of the Jets game he's looked fine to me. It's more of an issue of not looking his way and him getting heavily rotated the first 4 weeks. A lot of overreaction to a few games here in this thread.

AnthonyE
10-17-2012, 07:29 PM
I kept an eye on AJ during the GB game and I thought he had a hell of a game. He was open on plenty of routes, and had Schaub not been pressured so hard the entire game, I feel like we could AJ explode on the Packers.

Tailgate
10-17-2012, 08:04 PM
I kept an eye on AJ during the GB game and I thought he had a hell of a game. He was open on plenty of routes, and had Schaub not been pressured so hard the entire game, I feel like we could AJ explode on the Packers.

Schaub had a bad game. Credit Matthews and thier front 7, but Schaub did not get off his passes when he should have on quite a few occasions.

htownfan32
10-17-2012, 09:02 PM
Our backfield had too many green jerseys in it that night. :choke:


Matt was pressured far too much, I think. How much of it was him holding on to the ball vs. the line collapsing (I did see Duane Brown having a rough time with Clay Matthews earlier on) I'm not sure... but there is an issue there.

ajohnson80
10-17-2012, 09:39 PM
ya the oline was garbage that game..i saw one play matthews slides over right between the left guard and center and goes unblocked to take schaub out..how do you not even block that guy

Scooter
10-17-2012, 09:43 PM
ya the oline was garbage that game..i saw one play matthews slides over right between the left guard and center and goes unblocked to take schaub out..how do you not even block that guy

i would love to know what wade smith was thinking on that play. myers had a player lined up on top of him and another to his right ... wade was the only player that could've (should've) gotten matthews but for some reason wade peeled off to his left.

Vinny
10-17-2012, 10:10 PM
Mike Lombardi said that.

The next time he gets something right about the Texans will be his first time.

He's a generalist that has a terrible feel for the Texans...often what he writes is completely off base.

As for these comments, I'm not sure how he can judge that from the games to date. The Texans haven't had to target AJ much because they've had so many leads, playing against bad offenses that they need to take few risks against. They are also not playing him as many snaps, working the new guys in.

So that combo of things means few needs to unleash AJ this season so far. There was a little bit in the Denver game, mostly because they were facing the Peyton, wanted to get some points on the board, maybe take a few more risks.
I haven't read the thread but I've been talking (way before this article) about not seeing the same player who explodes out of his breaks and can create space against just about any coverage. I am not seeing that old dominant player right now....not seeing the superstar. Just a good player. I see old 2011 Anquan Boldin out there. It may be the last leg injury but he's just not the same player in my eyes. Not yet at least...perhaps he's still recovering...donno. Everyone will decline and some guys decline faster than others (more suddenly). AJ could lose a step and still be good...but I don't see a superstar when I watch him in 2012 so far.

thunderkyss
10-17-2012, 10:16 PM
From the NFL network -

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap1000000079704/article/is-andre-johnson-declining-for-houston-texans
Wide receiver Andre Johnson is supposed to complete this trinity. He hasn't carried his share of the weight through five games.



I'm blaming it on the vegan lifestyle.

:tinfoil:

Texan_Bill
10-17-2012, 10:30 PM
Mike Lombardi said that.

The next time he gets something right about the Texans will be his first time.

He's a generalist that has a terrible feel for the Texans...often what he writes is completely off base.

As for these comments, I'm not sure how he can judge that from the games to date. The Texans haven't had to target AJ much because they've had so many leads, playing against bad offenses that they need to take few risks against. They are also not playing him as many snaps, working the new guys in.

So that combo of things means few needs to unleash AJ this season so far. There was a little bit in the Denver game, mostly because they were facing the Peyton, wanted to get some points on the board, maybe take a few more risks.

I'm throwing this out there, but did Mike Lombardi get fired from a dysfunctional organization (who seriously lended himself towards that dysfunctionality) offer an opinion that the Texans were "soft"??

Is this the same guy??




AWESOME!! I totally respect this asshat's opinions on anything??? :gun:


Steph, feel free to copy and paste on his lame-ass time line!!