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Jagsbch
05-26-2005, 09:32 AM
Who is going to have a better season? :bomb:

gwallaia
05-26-2005, 09:35 AM
This poll depends on who's message board you post on. Don't be surprised if you are the only one who votes for Byron. Try this same poll on the Jag message board and you'll feel a lot better.

texasguy346
05-26-2005, 09:44 AM
I've got to go with David. Byron may have to start the year off without Fred, and could be without him all year. Carr has DD, and Morency should provide a little help when DD gets dinged up. Having a good running game will go along way in how well a QB will perform. IMO The Texans still have the edge when it comes to WRs, and any QB that has AJ making catches for him has a good chance of having a very good season. We still have Gaffney, Bradford, and Armstrong. The addition of Mathis only strengthens our WR depth as we still have Starling who performed well at times last year. The Jags WRs will need to become more consistent, and Williams will need to show he was worth a 1st Round pick last year. Jones could be a very good WR, or he could be just another combine champion.

Jagsbch
05-26-2005, 10:01 AM
This poll depends on who's message board you post on. Don't be surprised if you are the only one who votes for Byron. Try this same poll on the Jag message board and you'll feel a lot better.


Actually this poll is going just as I expected... :fishing: :drool:

I think that Having Jimmy to throw too, is a better option than AJ, Jimmy proved that much last year, remember the poll I started? How AJ went to the Pro Bowl ahead of Jimmy is beyond me. It made it all too clear in my eye's that performance on the field is not the criteria the NFL uses to send players to the Pro Bowl~!! :brickwall

I think Byron is far and away a better QB than Carr, I will be willing top go as far as saying that Byron will have a better season than Peyaton this year. Byron is just as tough as Carr, having proved that with a broken leg in college.

Just keep the poll rolling, not that I don't have confidence in Carr, it's just that I hold Byron in the highest esteem. I think that our division has the best QB's of any division in this league. :highfive:

TexanDave
05-26-2005, 10:03 AM
Did you vote twice? :rolleyes:

FILO_girl
05-26-2005, 10:10 AM
This poll depends on who's message board you post on. Don't be surprised if you are the only one who votes for Byron. Try this same poll on the Jag message board and you'll feel a lot better.

They have one. Viking, bch, whatever you call him...must not like what was said over there. :rolleyes:

TexanFanInCC
05-26-2005, 10:25 AM
Actually this poll is going just as I expected... :fishing: :drool:

I think that Having Jimmy to throw too, is a better option than AJ, Jimmy proved that much last year, remember the poll I started? How AJ went to the Pro Bowl ahead of Jimmy is beyond me. It made it all too clear in my eye's that performance on the field is not the criteria the NFL uses to send players to the Pro Bowl~!! :brickwall

I think Byron is far and away a better QB than Carr, I will be willing top go as far as saying that Byron will have a better season than Peyaton this year. Byron is just as tough as Carr, having proved that with a broken leg in college.

Just keep the poll rolling, not that I don't have confidence in Carr, it's just that I hold Byron in the highest esteem. I think that our division has the best QB's of any division in this league. :highfive:


Jimmy Smith is already near the twighlight at his career. Andre Johnson is clearly a better option to throw to. hes bigger, stronger, proly more athletic, and definitely younger.

TexanFanInCC
05-26-2005, 10:28 AM
this is my non-bias opinion....david carr has the edge over byron leftwich. carr has never lost a game to byron. carr is clearly more gifted physically, not to mention, he has waaaaay more mobility than leftwich. carr may also be more durable than leftwich. leftwich is too injury prone, and being a pocket QB like himself doesnt help matters. the only thing that byron has working for him is an established team with a stellar defense that allows him to get more snaps bc they keep the opposing offense off the field. carr's recieving core is also alot better than the jags. your best reciever is already fixing to get to the downhill of his career. he can still be a great performer, but AJ is definitely the better guy at this point and the WR depth of the texans is way better. If our offensive line can actually protect david carr instead of giving up 6 sacks per game (as was the case versus the stinking browns last yr.), then carr should put up some pretty solid numbers.

Fiddy
05-26-2005, 10:35 AM
the only thing that byron has working for him is an established team with a stellar defense that allows him to get more snaps by keeping the opposing offense off the field.Yeah, Leftwich doesnt win the Bills game and the Broncos game if it isn't for your defense.

FILO_girl
05-26-2005, 10:36 AM
Carr will always have a leg up on Byron, HE CAN RUN!
ROFLMMAO!

They had a thread over at Jag central that Lefty was being traded to the Texans awhile back. *pause for the laughter to subside*
http://www.jaguars.com/mb/default.aspx?f=6&p=1&m=409784 (other thread is gone due to cleanup, and so are my posts on the above thread. THAT is funny!). Wish they still had the original thread.

Anyway, I had told them we didn't need an anchor here, we needed wheels. They believe he has wheels. Funny lot, they are. :homer:

ojthecat
05-26-2005, 10:40 AM
Hey Jagsbch, I have one word for you and both of your Jag lovin friends.

SCOREBOARD :survivor:

Jagsbch
05-26-2005, 10:41 AM
Jimmy Smith is already near the twighlight at his career. Andre Johnson is clearly a better option to throw to. hes bigger, stronger, proly more athletic, and definitely younger.

How you can say AJ is clearly a better option to throw too is beyond me. Jimmy did more to help the Jags win last season than AJ did for the Texans. The only thing clear is that you were not paying attention. Everything your are saying was said and proved wrong last season, and now that Jimmy has three excellent WR's to help take the heat off of his back, and a OC who is going to untie Byrons hands, the sky is the limmit for both Jimmy and Byron this season.

TexanFanInCC
05-26-2005, 10:44 AM
so ur sayin that u would rather have jimmy over AJ??

Jagsbch
05-26-2005, 10:47 AM
Hey Jagsbch, I have one word for you and both of your Jag lovin friends.

SCOREBOARD :survivor:

Look the Jaguars have always been known for their playing down to teams, Texans pretty much proven this Reality. For some reason the Jags have had a rough time getting it up for the Texans, Maybe we feel sorry about how the whoel Tony deal went down, or we just want to make our division look tough, or who knows, but I suspect this reality will be a thing of the past. I just love how you all gloat about us playing down to you, I guess I won't feel bad smacking you all around when we sweep you all this season, but don't feel bad we will be sweeping the entire division. :drool:

Jagsbch
05-26-2005, 10:51 AM
so ur sayin that u would rather have jimmy over AJ??

2005 season... Absolutely~!! Jimmy is not only still playing in his prime, but the way he has taken our younger WRing corp under his belt makes his asset to the team a priceless one :piano: ~!!

TexanFanInCC
05-26-2005, 10:53 AM
take a look at AJ's numbers during the last 4 weeks of 2004...

week 14 vs colts...3 rec. 34 yds.
week 15 at bears...2 rec. 31 yds.
week 16 at jags...4 rec. 46 yds.
week 17 vs browns...2 rec. 13 yds.

if david carr would have thrown to him the same amount of times he did in the earlier part of the season, AJ could have finished with 90+ catches and nearly 1500 yds. too bad our o-line stank late last yr.

TexanFanInCC
05-26-2005, 10:55 AM
Look the Jaguars have always been known for their playing down to teams, Texans pretty much proven this Reality. For some reason the Jags have had a rough time getting it up for the Texans, Maybe we feel sorry about how the whoel Tony deal went down, or we just want to make our division look tough, or who knows, but I suspect this reality will be a thing of the past. I just love how you all gloat about us playing down to you, I guess I won't feel bad smacking you all around when we sweep you all this season, but don't feel bad we will be sweeping the entire division. :drool:

spoken like a true homer....

its not our faults that yall play down to teams....it just means that ur team has some issues. :dangit:

and theres no way that yall are going to sweep indy.

ArlingtonTexan
05-26-2005, 10:55 AM
How you can say AJ is clearly a better option to throw too is beyond me. Jimmy did more to help the Jags win last season than AJ did for the Texans. The only thing clear is that you were not paying attention. Everything your are saying was said and proved wrong last season, and now that Jimmy has three excellent WR's to help take the heat off of his back, and a OC who is going to untie Byrons hands, the sky is the limmit for both Jimmy and Byron this season.

The numbers between the two are almost equal. Jimmy Smith has been 75-80 catch, 1100 yard machine over his career. That said, I am still looking for the 3 good WRs to help him. Wilford made two exciting catches and nothing else. Matt Jones is a big time project. Reggie Williams had the worse season for any WR who was a clear starter on his team. Smith is descending and AJ assending. Age alone make AJ a more attractive commodity.

Honestly, they would be great compliments to each other (Jimmy Smith and AJ), but that is not possible.

texansfan88
05-26-2005, 10:57 AM
I was objective and chose Leftwich.

His O coordinator will let him throw down field

Fiddy
05-26-2005, 10:57 AM
. . .and now that Jimmy has three excellent WR's to help take the heat off of his back. . .Ummm, yeah, uhhh....can you name me those 3 excellent WRs???


Before you answer, I think you should know:
ex·cel·lent adj.
1. Of the highest or finest quality; exceptionally good of its kind.
2. Archaic. Superior.

BringItOn
05-26-2005, 10:59 AM
For some reason the Jags have had a rough time getting it up for the Texans, Maybe we feel sorry about how the whoel Tony deal went down, or we just want to make our division look tough, or who knows, but I suspect this reality will be a thing of the past. I just love how you all gloat about us playing down to you, I guess I won't feel bad smacking you all around when we sweep you all this season, but don't feel bad we will be sweeping the entire division. :drool:

That's a pathetic, reaching excuse. The Texans haven't won against the Colts yet so does that mean we're playing down to them? I don't know what this playing down means but I do know what stinking up the place means.

TexanFanInCC
05-26-2005, 11:03 AM
How you can say AJ is clearly a better option to throw too is beyond me. Jimmy did more to help the Jags win last season than AJ did for the Texans. The only thing clear is that you were not paying attention. Everything your are saying was said and proved wrong last season, and now that Jimmy has three excellent WR's to help take the heat off of his back, and a OC who is going to untie Byrons hands, the sky is the limmit for both Jimmy and Byron this season.

If yall have 3 excellent recievers, then jimmy smith shouldnt have been used as much. reggie williams was a disappointment for the jags, and ernest wilford was only made famous bc of his week 1 catch. the reason y jimmy did more to help yall was bc yall HAD to throw to him. we had at least 4 different guys help us significantly in the passing game....jabar gaffney, corey bradford, derrick armstrong, domanick davis...yall didnt really have a recieving threat at the RB position...

TexanFanInCC
05-26-2005, 11:07 AM
we didnt have to use AJ as much, but when we HAD to go to AJ (as was the case vs. the vikes), he came up clutch (to say the least) with his 12 catches for 170 yds. and 2 TDs

Fiddy
05-26-2005, 11:10 AM
we didnt have to use AJ as much, but when we HAD to go to AJ (as was the case vs. the vikes), he came up clutch (to say the least) with his 12 catches for 170 yds. and 2 TDsAJ had one more TD and only about 100 less yards in that one game than Reggie Williams....had all season.



And Bradford is a Hall of Famer if you compare him to your "3 excellent" WRs that are gonna help Jimmy.

texasguy346
05-26-2005, 11:17 AM
And Bradford is a Hall of Famer if you compare him to your "3 excellent" WRs that are gonna help Jimmy.

That's priceless. lol:

Rosusu
05-26-2005, 11:19 AM
I will be willing top go as far as saying that Byron will have a better season than Peyaton this year.


You lost it all right there, sorry.

Jagsbch
05-26-2005, 12:17 PM
Ummm, yeah, uhhh....can you name me those 3 excellent WRs???


Before you answer, I think you should know:
ex·cel·lent adj.
1. Of the highest or finest quality; exceptionally good of its kind.
2. Archaic. Superior.

I should have said diamonds in the rough :rolleyes: Look when I said excellent I meant what is coming down the pipe, know and understand that our receiving corp is going to be one of the best in the league this season. This revelation will be all too clear when the season starts, this is why I went ahead and drew up yet another sinking sand thread.

Jaguars will make the Patriots so-called dynasty look like a fluke, by not just barely winning games week in and week out, but by crushing our opponents offensively as well as defensively~!! Crushing opponents is hardly the Patsies trait, that is why I am hardpressed to consider them a dynasty.

You have to understand that Reggie and Ernest are going into their second season, I also think that Matt is going to come out of the gate firing on all cylinders this season, any one that thinks he will be a project has no idea what they are talking about IMO. Matt is an Awesome football player, he by no means looked like a project WR in the Senior Bowl.

The stats last year do more to reflect just how aweful our OC was than anything else. Bill failed to call a game that utilized his talented on the team, that is why he was firedl, Last years statistal reality on offense is about to do a flip flop. The players are actually coming out and saying how they hated the scheme last season and how much they are looking forward to this seasons scheme.

Vinny
05-26-2005, 01:15 PM
The stats last year do more to reflect just how aweful our OC was than anything else. Bill failed to call a game that utilized his talented on the team, that is why he was firedl, Last years statistal reality on offense is about to do a flip flop. The players are actually coming out and saying how they hated the scheme last season and how much they are looking forward to this seasons scheme.So you guys hire Carl Smith...the same guy who was run practically run out of town ala Frankenstein when he was with the Saints. Have fun with run, run, sack, punt.

Blake
05-26-2005, 01:16 PM
Jaguars will make the Patriots so-called dynasty look like a fluke, by not just barely winning games week in and week out, but by crushing our opponents offensively as well as defensively~!!

Just like yall crushed opponents in last years wins?

Sep 12 @Buffalo Won 13-10...............= 3 points.
Sep 19 Denver Won 7-6.....................= 1 point.
Sep 26 @Tennessee Won 15-12..........= 3 points.
Oct 17 Kansas City Won 22-16............= 6 points.
Oct 24 @Indianapolis Won 27-24.........= 3 points.
Nov 14 Detroit Won 23-17..................= 6 points.
Dec 12 Chicago Won 22-3..................= 19 points.
Dec 19 @Green Bay Won 28-25...........= 3 points.
Jan 2 @Oakland Won 13-6..................= 7 points.

rittenhouserobz
05-26-2005, 01:32 PM
I geuss we are installing more 3 and 5 step drop passes. I think the offense will thrive this year. The Jags DL is impressive this year. I sure hope the adjustment works. I was really hoping we could have signed Orlando Pace.

WildBlackBear32
05-26-2005, 01:42 PM
quoted deleted material

Your post need more cowbell!

ojthecat
05-26-2005, 01:44 PM
quoted deleted material


It makes me laugh.

WildBlackBear32
05-26-2005, 01:44 PM
"Jimmy is not only still playing in his prime..."

I was rolling on the ground laughing at this statement.

ojthecat
05-26-2005, 01:46 PM
"Jimmy is not only still playing in his prime..."

I was rolling on the ground laughing at this statement.

Maybe they could work a deal with Denver for Rice. Then they could talk Emmit back for another year and then they might get the Fridge to come play. Wow then the Jags would be for real.

texasguy346
05-26-2005, 01:51 PM
Jaguars will make the Patriots so-called dynasty look like a fluke, by not just barely winning games week in and week out, but by crushing our opponents offensively as well as defensively~!! Crushing opponents is hardly the Patsies trait, that is why I am hardpressed to consider them a dynasty.


:rofl: Just when I thought it couldn't possibly get funnier. Seriously you've got to cut it out. I nearly fell out of my chair after reading this. I'm all for optimism, and you've got to support your team. However, when you're optimism starts to borderline on dillusion then it might be time to consider wearing the game day Jags helmet on a regular basis 24/7.

Jagsbch
05-26-2005, 02:01 PM
"Jimmy is not only still playing in his prime..."

I was rolling on the ground laughing at this statement.

How else can you explain Jimmy out playing AJ last season? :rolleyes:

Look here is the deal, Jags gave Indy all they could handle when in their transition from Cap hell as well as a New Rookie HC. Now that we are entering another 3-4 year prime mode, I hardly think that they or any one else will be able to match what we bring to the table week in and week out.

Byron has been snuffed the past few years now that he has a OC who will allow him to manange the game, this is a whole new ball game for the Jags. We are so far under the Radar that it is not even funny, this is a team about to unload both a great offense as well as a great defense on the NFL. Yes you heard it right, Great!~!!

We have the fastest tallest WR in the league, the mismatches we will create with all of our huge WR's are going to reak havoc for defenses, and our D-line is one of the best in the league, so you can forget about running the ball on us that is for sure... Man I can't wait till you all see wat is coming down the pipe...

ojthecat
05-26-2005, 02:08 PM
Man I can't wait till you all see wat is coming down the pipe...

Put down the pipe.

throwANDREtheBALL
05-26-2005, 02:13 PM
There is no way that I could go onto the JAGS board and start a thread about two guys that were obviously pretty close in talent and age and say that the Houston guy was WAY better and then keep backing up my thread with more Drunkenly-Biased points on why I was right.

I have to admire your courage, sir.

The jags are truly lucky to have you as a FAN.

AND since your points have consistenly tickled me with laughter I have to break down and say YES.

BYRON LEFTWICH IS THE BETTER QB.

AND HE WILL OUTPLAY PEYTON MANNING THIS YEAR, YOU ARE SO RIGHT.

THE JAGS WILL OUTPLAY AND DOMINATE EVERYONE ON THE FIELD AND ON THE SCOREBOARD.

Hey man, I'm no dummy, I never let my prescription of STUPID PILLS run out.

TEXANS84
05-26-2005, 02:14 PM
http://www.texanstalk.com/newspics/jagsowned.gif

Lucky
05-26-2005, 02:14 PM
Byron has been snuffed the past few years now that he has a OC who will allow him to manange the game, this is a whole new ball game for the Jags...
You seem to have a lot of confidence in Carl Smith (http://www.jaguars.com/Team/Bio/2585.asp). Considering that he hasn't been an OC since '96 with that dynamic New Orleans Saints offense. Why did Del Rio hire the USC QB coach when Norm Chow, the USC OC, was available? That's the question I'd be asking if I were a Jags fan (heaven forbid). Oh, and how is Fred Taylor's knee doing?

The poll? Based on his career record of 4-1 vs the Jags, I'll have to go with David Carr.

THEFUTURE
05-26-2005, 02:26 PM
Look the Jaguars have always been known for their playing down to teams, Texans pretty much proven this Reality. For some reason the Jags have had a rough time getting it up for the Texans, Maybe we feel sorry about how the whoel Tony deal went down, or we just want to make our division look tough, or who knows, but I suspect this reality will be a thing of the past. I just love how you all gloat about us playing down to you, I guess I won't feel bad smacking you all around when we sweep you all this season, but don't feel bad we will be sweeping the entire division. :drool:
WHAT! ummm leave the jags and their tendencies back at your own site please, yeah thanks... anyways i am here now to completly obliterate you and any chance you have of winning this arguement, kinda like the Texans verse the Kitties. I just love how you can possibly come up with one of the lamest excuses i have ever heard, sweeping the entire division? yeah good luck, you just got your butts handed to you last year by us, and dont hand me the playing down speech again, its garbage... scoring 6 points in two games is not playing down, hell for the jags i guess you should be proud of scoring 6 points. maybe you and the other 4 jag fans that decide to show up at your own stadium, missed something when the Texans walked all over you. .. Jimmy Smith better than AJ... hmmm maybe when jimmy was like in his twenties and AJ was a teenager... but jimmy smith is a 30 something player, that only gets stats cuz the rest of your WRs cant do anything on the football field... AJ on the other hand is a WR that commands double and triple teams for teams to slow him down. When AJ goes to the pro bowl, it shows that fans, coaches, and players either 2/3 or all of them agree that AJ is better than Jimmy Smith.... Byron better than David, uhhh Carr is more accurate, stronger arm, faster, smarter... doesnt say stupid lines like.."whatchu talking bout willis?"... if Slow Motion Byron Leftwich was behind our line he would have about 250 sacks, instead of davids 170

Porky
05-26-2005, 02:44 PM
the mismatches we will create with all of our huge WR's are going to reak havoc for defenses, and our D-line is

I think the word you are looking for is wreak. But, after reading your takes, the word for your posts that comes to mind is more like reek. Since I know you are a Jags fan, I'll excuse you if you don't know the meaning of either of these. If intelligence was money, you would be homeless, and begging for a dime on the side of a road somewhere.

ojthecat
05-26-2005, 02:47 PM
I say we close this thread. I mean that they wouldn't even listen to this crud on the Jags board.

Vinny
05-26-2005, 02:48 PM
Jagsbch is a good fan. He is welcome here.

TEXANS84
05-26-2005, 02:55 PM
Jimmy-1172, 6TD's
Andre-1142, 6TD's

Here's your other recievers stats:
Wilford: 271 (2TD)
Williams: 268 (1TD)

Now the Texans #2, #3, and #4 recievers:
Bradford: 399 (3TD)
Gaffney: 632 (2TD)
Armstrong: 415 (1TD)

So no wonder Reggie had nice stats, he was the only one worth throwing to.

Jagsbch
05-26-2005, 02:55 PM
Why did Del Rio hire the USC QB coach when Norm Chow, the USC OC, was available? That's the question I'd be asking if I were a Jags fan (heaven forbid). Oh, and how is Fred Taylor's knee doing?

Fred's knee is coming along according to schedule, but until he shows up there is really no telling...

Now to answer your question regarding Chow...

Remember back in the day when men were men and QB's like Marino called their own plays kind of like how Peyton does with his audibaling abilities? Well Byron used to do that back in college where ran the Fun and Gun. But when he came to the NFL Bill tried to turn him into something he wasn't. Musgrave tried to taske him out of the shot gun, and forced him to run a predictable dink and dunk offense, and offense mind you that didn't allow Byron to Audible. Well we all know what happened after that? It didn't work, then Bill started a make shift offense that was designed to run the WCO out of the Shot Gun, never been done before, and it failed miserably as our offense wound up having the worst scoring offense in Jaguar history.

Well Jack knew he needed to get a guy in here who would help cater to Byron's stle of play rather than bring a guy in who would force byron to be something he is not. Byron is a shot gun style QB, Chow does not operate his offense out of the shot gun, something woulod have to give if we brought Chow in, that is why he was never given an interview in the first place. What we needed was someone with experience and was conservatve enough to know what would and wouldn't work with an offense looking to go wide open.

Jack has a highly intelligent QB who has a rocket for an arm, what he needed was someone who could polish Byron and help him manange the game. Byron is a diamond in the rough, what bill did was cut too deep, Bill proved he had no idea how to utilize the depth of a players talents, or attack teams weakness' with play calling.

Bill never let Byron audible, but Byron managed to sneak a few audibles in regardless, Once backed in our own endzone to wind out breaking the ball out all the way to our opponents side of the field and all the other audibles went for TD's if you can believe that or not, in spite of that Bill refused to let Byron audible and it killed us.

All Jack did by bringing Carl in was to allow Byron to be all he could be, rather than a guy who would try and force Byron into his game plan. I thought it was an excelent move and so do the players who implementing Smiths game plan, they rave about the route tree and how the offensive game plan is designed with scoring on 5-7 plays rathe rathan 10-12. Jimmy went as far to say as scoring on one play~!! :drool:

So Byron pretty much dictated how Jack went about choosing an OC, We are building the team around Byron, not Chow~!! :cool:

Right now the NFL in general is completely oblivious to waht is about to take place now that Byron is playing Byrons game and not some makeshift scheme from an OC who was fired his 4 week with the Panthers...

jr0ck
05-26-2005, 03:02 PM
Crushing opponents is hardly the Patsies trait, that is why I am hardpressed to consider them a dynasty.

i can't believe everyone missed this gem...

all i can say is...

WOW

i mean it's actually easier to put on teal glasses and see the jimmy is better than AJ *cough*LOLOLOLlDlOTLOLOL*cough* right now in jags homer vision than try and see any part of this perspective. note to Jagsbch: WINNING is WINNING. not only is this what the patriots have done to solidify themselves as a dynasty, in the era of free agency mind you, but it's also what the jaguars have lacked doing against the texans in our short history. also, "playing down" to a team is not a trait asscociated with excellence, in fact it's far worse than not having enough talent to win. "playing down" to a team means you have the upper hand/advantage but don't utilize it. it's like forgetting to breathe...your fully capable but just don't. in 1337 speak, YOU PHAIL!!!

dalemurphy
05-26-2005, 03:03 PM
How else can you explain Jimmy out playing AJ last season? :rolleyes:

Look here is the deal, Jags gave Indy all they could handle when in their transition from Cap hell as well as a New Rookie HC. Now that we are entering another 3-4 year prime mode, I hardly think that they or any one else will be able to match what we bring to the table week in and week out.

Byron has been snuffed the past few years now that he has a OC who will allow him to manange the game, this is a whole new ball game for the Jags. We are so far under the Radar that it is not even funny, this is a team about to unload both a great offense as well as a great defense on the NFL. Yes you heard it right, Great!~!!

We have the fastest tallest WR in the league, the mismatches we will create with all of our huge WR's are going to reak havoc for defenses, and our D-line is one of the best in the league, so you can forget about running the ball on us that is for sure... Man I can't wait till you all see wat is coming down the pipe...


I don't know what to expect from the Jags this year... Somewhere between 6 and 11 wins is about the best I can do. I think a lot of Leftwich, though last year he really struggled down the stretch, I thought. However, I wouldn't have so much faith in Reggie Williams. Physical specimens don't always turnout to be dominate football players: Michael Westbrook, David Boston, Tony Mandrich... I thought he was going to be a very good WR, but then I watched him play last year.

fastest WR in the league? who?

I'd put about even odds on one of the Jags/Texans being able to overtake the Colts for the division. It's going to be a fun season. Do us both a favor, though. When you play INDY, make sure those big nasties on your DL cheap shot Manning like they do Carr.

throwANDREtheBALL
05-26-2005, 03:05 PM
Its nice to see a team building around the players rather than forcing them to change how they play the game. I hope for Jagbych sake that the offense does explode under the new OC. And I think that if we had more Texans fans like this that we'd all be able to call ourselves Texansbychez.

throwANDREtheBALL
05-26-2005, 03:08 PM
But why would we want to ?


I'm no ones bee-y-atch.

Jagsbch
05-26-2005, 03:16 PM
Quote:
Crushing opponents is hardly the Patsies trait, that is why I am hardpressed to consider them a dynasty.


i can't believe everyone missed this gem...

all i can say is...

WOW

i mean it's actually easier to put on teal glasses and see the jimmy is better than AJ *cough*LOLOLOLlDlOTLOLOL*cough* right now in jags homer vision than try and see any part of this perspective. note to Jagsbch: WINNING is WINNING. not only is this what the patriots have done to solidify themselves as a dynasty, in the era of free agency mind you, but it's also what the jaguars have lacked doing against the texans in our short history. also, "playing down" to a team is not a trait asscociated with excellence, in fact it's far worse than not having enough talent to win. "playing down" to a team means you have the upper hand/advantage

Bill Musgrave is not with the team for a reason, His inanability to utilize the talent of the offense ans well as attack teams weakness' rather than stregnths cost him his Job. One more thing you have to consider about last season is that the Jags were not going to break the tradition of being in the SB so their home town could loose out on the 50 Million another teams fan base could bring into town~!! Texans came in and scored 21 unanswered points at Alltel... Think about it, this was a game that decided our play off appearance~!! :rolleyes:

Regarding the Patsies, remember back in the day when a team that was considered a dynasty was considered that because of their , performances that put teams two and three lapse behind.

The Jaguars are going to take us back to the day when a team was considered a Dynasty not because of photo finishes week in and week out, but by putting teams two and three scoring lapse behind. Thats how you establish a dynasty, Not trying to take anything away from the draft, cap and coaching management that breeds winners in NE, but I absolutely refuse to call them a dynasty.

Jagsbch
05-26-2005, 03:20 PM
But why would we want to ?


I'm no ones bee-y-atch.

Its Beach...

I lived in Jax bch long before the Jaguars came to town, now you can hardly recognize the place, I now call it Jags Bch rather than Jax Bch hense the name.

throwANDREtheBALL
05-26-2005, 03:31 PM
Sorry buddy, I didn't know.

AND I am with you now, I hope that Byron has a great season and that Jack Del Rio doesn't lose his cool again in the dressing room, pulling a hissy fit. Jack takes a lot of flack, but, he's got the potential to be a good motivator.

Jagsbch
05-26-2005, 03:38 PM
Jack is a great motivator, I think he is a great guy myself. Having a coach like Jack allows not only players to be all they can be, but also a guy like me to be all the homer he can be. :drool:

THEFUTURE
05-26-2005, 03:41 PM
what i dont get any comments regarding my earlier post jagsbch, i figured as much.. i am a highly regarded jag killa.. so its smart of you just to ignore my post, cuz you definatly cant touch me on my posts... as for not calling the Pats a dynasty... :dangit: ... and for you to believe your kitties can be one you :homer: ... what are you thinking, you claim to be a dynasty, but as you say you play down to weaker opponents, which is still a lame reason for losing games, Dynasties dont play down to teams either, and how many games have the jags blown opponents out by, ummm none i can remember... now on to your OC, its hard to utilize talent, when you dont have any... Not going to break tradition and go to superbowl in own town... LAME LAME LAME dont hand me that stuff

jr0ck
05-26-2005, 06:27 PM
The Jaguars are going to take us back to the day when a team was considered a Dynasty not because of photo finishes week in and week out, but by putting teams two and three scoring lapse behind.

from dictionary.com

dynasty (http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=dynasty)-
1. A succession of rulers from the same family or line.
2. A family or group that maintains power for several generations: a political dynasty controlling the state

clearly refering to longevity, with no mention of the disparity between ruler/victor and the subjects/opponent. an analogous political term for how you define dynasty is probably totalitarian (http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=totalitarian) or dictatorship (http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=dictatorship) ; and for the record the jags have never resembled either.

YodAa
05-26-2005, 06:29 PM
If your asking for QB
I want Carr

if your asking OL
I want Byron
lol:

TheOgre
05-26-2005, 06:54 PM
not only is this what the patriots have done to solidify themselves as a dynasty, in the era of free agency mind you, but it's also what the jaguars have lacked doing against the texans in our short history.

I consider the Patriots the weakest dynasty in football (and perhaps all professional sports) history. There is no denying they won 3 Super Bowls. You also have to realize, though, that they won them by the seat of their pants. In all three games, they seemed to be holding on for dear life after having good leads in all of them. The first two even took last second FG's to win them. There is no way I clump them in the same category as the 70's Steelers, 80's 49ers, or 90's Cowboys.

I really cannot fault someone for not considering them a dynasty, because they are riding on the fence for me at this time.

Porky
05-26-2005, 07:01 PM
I consider the Patriots the weakest dynasty in football (and perhaps all professional sports) history. There is no denying they won 3 Super Bowls. You also have to realize, though, that they won them by the seat of their pants. In all three games, they seemed to be holding on for dear life after having good leads in all of them. The first two even took last second FG's to win them. There is no way I clump them in the same category as the 70's Steelers, 80's 49ers, or 90's Cowboys.

I really cannot fault someone for not considering them a dynasty, because they are riding on the fence for me at this time.

I totally disagree, but unfortetely, I don't have much time to expound. Let me leave you with one thought - Free Agency :dangit:

gwallaia
05-26-2005, 08:26 PM
The Jaguars are going to take us back to the day when a team was considered a Dynasty not because of photo finishes week in and week out, but by putting teams two and three scoring lapse behind..

This is the
BIGGEST HOMER remark I've read since, well since your typical Titan fan ever opened their mouth.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v155/gwallaia/homer.gif

jr0ck
05-26-2005, 08:28 PM
I consider the Patriots the weakest dynasty in football (and perhaps all professional sports) history. There is no denying they won 3 Super Bowls. You also have to realize, though, that they won them by the seat of their pants. In all three games, they seemed to be holding on for dear life after having good leads in all of them. The first two even took last second FG's to win them. There is no way I clump them in the same category as the 70's Steelers, 80's 49ers, or 90's Cowboys.

personally, i consider a team who consistantly wins close games just as impressive as a team that blows out opponents. like i said above, winning is winning. and not to mention the patriots barely won their way to the longest winning streak in NFL history. it's hard not to consider the patriots with the dynasty's mentioned above because the football landscape has been overhauled so much since the last time any of those teams hit the field. don't take this the wrong way, this is my opinoin and my intent is not to change yours, just needed to expound a little more on my POV :cool:

Jwwillis
05-26-2005, 09:46 PM
Look the Jaguars have always been known for their playing down to teams, Texans pretty much proven this Reality. For some reason the Jags have had a rough time getting it up for the Texans, Maybe we feel sorry about how the whoel Tony deal went down, or we just want to make our division look tough, or who knows, but I suspect this reality will be a thing of the past. I just love how you all gloat about us playing down to you, I guess I won't feel bad smacking you all around when we sweep you all this season, but don't feel bad we will be sweeping the entire division. :drool:


How do you play down to a team that consistantly beats you?? Sounds more like stupidity or denial.

OzzO
05-26-2005, 10:12 PM
Well Jack knew he needed to get a guy in here who would help cater to Byron's stle of play rather than bring a guy in who would force byron to be something he is not.

Now, that is an interesting point from Jagsbch as actually, I heard the same thing mentioned on 610 (not about Jags or Texans... actually forget who it was about... I think it was the Pats OC) but they mentioned that's what makes a good coach - one that can adjust their game planning and style to suit the players and the team as a whole that currently is playing. Not one that has such an ego about their style of play that they force the players to work towards the coach's preferred system.

Would y'all think this is POSSIBLY what is causing the Texans demise to this point... or is it still the "newness" of the team?

TexanFanInCC
05-26-2005, 10:34 PM
How else can you explain Jimmy out playing AJ last season? :rolleyes:

Pshh he barely outplayed him. i already told u AJ's stats from the last 4 games of the season. the reason y he wasnt thrown to much was bc our o-line crumbled. AJ could have easily ended with 1400+ yds and 10 tds. i dont remember who, but someone said that if u put byron under our o-line, he would proly have one of the bottom 5 QB ratings in the league and he would surely be sacked waaay more (if he somehow manages to not hurt himself like he did versus the powerful and grand pass rush of the texans last year....lol)

ojthecat
05-26-2005, 11:08 PM
Would y'all think this is POSSIBLY what is causing the Texans demise to this point... or is it still the "newness" of the team?

I dont think it is fair to use the word demise. Look the Texans have improved every year. Where is the "demise"? :confused:

ATX
05-27-2005, 12:25 AM
i'd take carr over leftwich anyday. leftwich is probably the slowest guy on the jags offense and thats sad. and i'd also take AJ over J. Smith too. AJ deserved to be named to the probowl, sorry jags fan, you just don't get to see what we see here in houston. just look at the 2004 highlight reel for AJ, he made some unbelievable catches, something Smith couldn't do. i'm also predicting we sweep the jags once again, if there's one team the texans own in the league its the jags. i love beating the jags, mmmm it feels so good.

OzzO
05-27-2005, 08:48 AM
I dont think it is fair to use the word demise. Look the Texans have improved every year. Where is the "demise"? :confused:
Okay, so demise isn't the best possible word (except you wouldn't know it by some of the posts on the board). I agree, the Texans have improved, I guess my thought process is, would they be further along in the progression if coaches had tweaked their style to better match what type of players we had (have)?

Texan Dave
05-27-2005, 09:10 AM
Actually this poll is going just as I expected... :fishing: :drool:

I think that Having Jimmy to throw too, is a better option than AJ, Jimmy proved that much last year, remember the poll I started? How AJ went to the Pro Bowl ahead of Jimmy is beyond me. It made it all too clear in my eye's that performance on the field is not the criteria the NFL uses to send players to the Pro Bowl~!! :brickwall

I think Byron is far and away a better QB than Carr, I will be willing top go as far as saying that Byron will have a better season than Peyaton this year. Byron is just as tough as Carr, having proved that with a broken leg in college.

Just keep the poll rolling, not that I don't have confidence in Carr, it's just that I hold Byron in the highest esteem. I think that our division has the best QB's of any division in this league. :highfive:

Remember, this is the same person who was talking about the Jags being one of the winningest franchises in NFL history.....roles eyes...

GoPats
05-27-2005, 09:29 AM
Regarding the Patsies, remember back in the day when a team that was considered a dynasty was considered that because of their , performances that put teams two and three lapse behind.

The Jaguars are going to take us back to the day when a team was considered a Dynasty not because of photo finishes week in and week out, but by putting teams two and three scoring lapse behind. Thats how you establish a dynasty, Not trying to take anything away from the draft, cap and coaching management that breeds winners in NE, but I absolutely refuse to call them a dynasty.

No disrespect intended, especially since this is my first post on this message board, but I think your argument lacks any basis of fact or truth -- regardless of whether you take the "winning is winning" approach or believe that a dynasty team has to obliterate everyone in its way.

At least let me explain...

The Patriots are 28-2 over the past two regular seasons, and 34-2 if you count the playoffs. In 2004, they won 11 of those 14 regular season games by 10 or more points, and then beat the best offensive team in the league (the Colts) 20-3 and the best defensive team (the Steelers, who may have been the best all-around, on paper) 41-27. I don't know if you watched either of those games, but neither was ever close. It was pretty much a one-sided affair in both cases.

I'd also point out that during this two-year stretch, the Jags had one shot at the Patriots and lost by 14 points. Not a blowout, but also not really a close game as I remember it.

The NFL is different from how it was back in the days of the 90s Cowboys, the 80s 49ers, the 70s Steelers and so on. You'd have to be blind to not admit that there's more parity. In the 1970s, teams didn't go from 4-12 to 12-4 like the Chargers did last year. It just didn't happen. So winning in today's NFL the way the Patriots have is even more impressive. Jimmy Johnson, a good friend of Belichick, said after the Super Bowl that he thinks the Patriots' achievements in this new era of the NFL are more impressive than what his Cowboys did in the 90s. His words, not mine.

Call it whatever you want, I really don't mind either way... your opinion is your opinion, and it doesn't need to be based in fact for it to be so. But winning three out of four (and, in my opinion, being primed to be 4-for-5) Super Bowls, and carrying a 48-16 record (57-16, again if you count playoffs) in four years is nothing short of dominance.

EDIT/PS - By the way, others have mentioned close Super Bowls... isn't that what's supposed to happen? When the two best teams meet at the end of the year, isn't it supposed to be a hard-fought nail-biter? Maybe we got so used to Super Blow Outs that we can't appreciate the effort that it takes to win a CLOSE, evenly-fought game. Which, if you've ever played a sport, you'd know is harder to do, requires more "clutch" performances, and in the end is more satisfying than sending someone home bruised and battered.

TEXANS84
05-27-2005, 09:41 AM
Good to see you over here GoPats, excellent post.

GoPats
05-27-2005, 09:44 AM
Good to see you over here GoPats, excellent post.

:thumbup

Thanks man!

TEXANS84
05-27-2005, 09:51 AM
GoPats, I'd be curious to see what your opinion on the subject at hand (Carr/Leftwich) is from a "neutral source".

TheOgre
05-27-2005, 10:01 AM
In the 1970s, teams didn't go from 4-12 to 12-4 like the Chargers did last year. It just didn't happen.

1981 isn't that far removed from the 70's and both teams, San Fran. (6-10 to 13-3) and Cinci.(6-10 to 12-4), had losing records the previous year, were the #1 seeds in the playoffs, and met in the Super Bowl.

While mastering free agency is an extra item on the plate, I think it is over-emphasized. The teams the use free agency to build are few and far between. The teams that stay on the top, tend to build primarily through the draft. Just look at Baltimore, Philly, and New England. Pittsburgh could be thrown in there too. They do a pretty good job of reloading through the draft. It is the lifebread of the league much like it was in the 70's, 80's, and 90's.

GoPats
05-27-2005, 10:12 AM
1981 isn't that far removed from the 70's and both teams, San Fran. (6-10 to 13-3) and Cinci.(6-10 to 12-4), had losing records the previous year, were the #1 seeds in the playoffs, and met in the Super Bowl.

While mastering free agency is an extra item on the plate, I think it is over-emphasized. The teams the use free agency to build are few and far between. The teams that stay on the top, tend to build primarily through the draft. Just look at Baltimore, Philly, and New England. Pittsburgh could be thrown in there too. They do a pretty good job of reloading through the draft. It is the lifebread of the league much like it was in the 70's, 80's, and 90's.

True, and good points... since there's no clear definition of "Dynasty" (at least in relation to sports teams), then it's all subjective. I guess the idea I was trying to relay (which I still think is true) is that there was a wider gap between the best and worst teams in the 1970s, 80s, and 90s than there is today.

GoPats
05-27-2005, 10:18 AM
GoPats, I'd be curious to see what your opinion on the subject at hand (Carr/Leftwich) is from a "neutral source".

I picked Carr on this one. I think they should both end up having good years, but Leftwich missed some time in '04 and I believe Carr will progress more quickly. I also think he's got better (younger) weapons around him, especially his RB.

The Texans came damn close to beating NE in 2003 at Reliant... if they'd won that game, the whole playoff scene might've been different. It was a more than respectable effort from the Texans...

Jagsbch
05-27-2005, 11:57 AM
The Patriots are 28-2 over the past two regular seasons, and 34-2 if you count the playoffs. In 2004, they won 11 of those 14 regular season games by 10 or more points, and then beat the best offensive team in the league (the Colts) 20-3 and the best defensive team (the Steelers, who may have been the best all-around, on paper) 41-27. I don't know if you watched either of those games, but neither was ever close. It was pretty much a one-sided affair in both cases.

I'd also point out that during this two-year stretch, the Jags had one shot at the Patriots and lost by 14 points. Not a blowout, but also not really a close game as I remember it.

I'd also like to point out that the Jags were still in the process of coming out of the hell TC put us in with the Cap. Why if it wasn't for the Texans we would probably still be in hell, and Jimmy, Darius and Brady would more than likely been cut.

Beating a team coached by a rookie HC and as well as having a rookie QB at the helm is nothing to brag about. BTW the game was actually close, it was close in the first half, and no one scored in the 3rd quarter, the 2 int's by the rookie QB pretty much cost us the game as it put NE on our 3 yard line. Musgrave was a lousy coordinator he abandoned the run Taylor only had 16 carries...

Why am I rambling? My point is who have the Patriots beat really. Let's look at 11 of their opponents in 04 ~!!


2004
SanFran .125
Browns .250
Miami .250 (beat the patriots)
Arizona .375
Chiefs .438
Bengals .500
Rams .500
Ravens .562
Seattle .562

2003
Giants .250
Was .312
Browns .312
Bills .375
Jets .375
Jags .312
Texans .312

9 games in 03 were played against teams that weren't even .400. WOW the past 2 years 14 games have been against teams that were not even .400. And only 3 of those teams had 6 wins under their belt. :rolleyes:

I* love the spin 28-2??? Get it right it's 28 and 4 the past two seasons.
Bill's .375 and Skins .312 beat you all in 03.
Miami .250 and the Steelers did it in 04.

WOW What a dynasty beaten by three teams no better than .375, oh and a rookie QB~!! :dangit:

Half of the wins came from teams no better than .375. Check that I forgot two of thos teams actually beat the Pats, so I guess you can add the two .500 teams as half. Sorry but no way in hell I consider the Patsies a dynasty. :rolleyes:

GCODE
05-27-2005, 12:02 PM
Carr ........

TexanFanInCC
05-27-2005, 12:14 PM
I'd also like to point out that the Jags were still in the process of coming out of the hell TC put us in with the Cap. Why if it wasn't for the Texans we would probably still be in hell, and Jimmy, Darius and Brady would more than likely been cut.

Beating a team coached by a rookie HC and as well as having a rookie QB at the helm is nothing to brag about. BTW the game was actually close, it was close in the first half, and no one scored in the 3rd quarter, the 2 int's by the rookie QB pretty much cost us the game as it put NE on our 3 yard line. Musgrave was a lousy coordinator he abandoned the run Taylor only had 16 carries...

Why am I rambling? My point is who have the Patriots beat really. Let's look at 11 of their opponents in 04 ~!!


2004
SanFran .125
Browns .250
Miami .250 (beat the patriots)
Arizona .375
Chiefs .438
Bengals .500
Rams .500
Ravens .562
Seattle .562

2003
Giants .250
Was .312
Browns .312
Bills .375
Jets .375
Jags .312
Texans .312

9 games in 03 were played against teams that weren't even .400. WOW the past 2 years 14 games have been against teams that were not even .400. And only 3 of those teams had 6 wins under their belt. :rolleyes:

I* love the spin 28-2??? Get it right it's 28 and 4 the past two seasons.
Bill's .375 and Skins .312 beat you all in 03.
Miami .250 and the Steelers did it in 04.

WOW What a dynasty beaten by three teams no better than .375, oh and a rookie QB~!! :dangit:

Half of the wins came from teams no better than .375. Check that I forgot two of thos teams actually beat the Pats, so I guess you can add the two .500 teams as half. Sorry but no way in hell I consider the Patsies a dynasty. :rolleyes:


forget what they did in the regular season. the pats win when it counts. after losing to pittsburgh in the regular season, they went back to pittsburgh and crushed the steelers on their home turf. they also OWNED the leagues bestg offense and made them look like a 2002 texans offense that couldnt protect the QB. the fact of the matter is, regular season doesnt mean jack. bill billichek has NEVER lost a postseason game with the pats in three trips to the postseason. tom brady has played his best football in the postseason. these guys are clutch. enough said...

Doom Capers
05-27-2005, 12:15 PM
I would rather have a Qb who actually has mobility. So yes, Carr......

FILO_girl
05-27-2005, 12:30 PM
I'd also like to point out that the Jags were still in the process of coming out of the hell TC put us in with the Cap. Why if it wasn't for the Texans we would probably still be in hell, and Jimmy, Darius and Brady would more than likely been cut.

Beating a team coached by a rookie HC and as well as having a rookie QB at the helm is nothing to brag about. BTW the game was actually close, it was close in the first half, and no one scored in the 3rd quarter, the 2 int's by the rookie QB pretty much cost us the game as it put NE on our 3 yard line. Musgrave was a lousy coordinator he abandoned the run Taylor only had 16 carries...

Why am I rambling? My point is who have the Patriots beat really. Let's look at 11 of their opponents in 04 ~!!


2004
SanFran .125
Browns .250
Miami .250 (beat the patriots)
Arizona .375
Chiefs .438
Bengals .500
Rams .500
Ravens .562
Seattle .562

2003
Giants .250
Was .312
Browns .312
Bills .375
Jets .375
Jags .312
Texans .312

9 games in 03 were played against teams that weren't even .400. WOW the past 2 years 14 games have been against teams that were not even .400. And only 3 of those teams had 6 wins under their belt. :rolleyes:

I* love the spin 28-2??? Get it right it's 28 and 4 the past two seasons.
Bill's .375 and Skins .312 beat you all in 03.
Miami .250 and the Steelers did it in 04.

WOW What a dynasty beaten by three teams no better than .375, oh and a rookie QB~!! :dangit:

Half of the wins came from teams no better than .375. Check that I forgot two of thos teams actually beat the Pats, so I guess you can add the two .500 teams as half. Sorry but no way in hell I consider the Patsies a dynasty. :rolleyes:

Why you are on a Texans board and barking about the Pats makes no sense. But in response to your post...

First 2 paragraphs, typical Jaguar whining about "but, but, but!!". But NOTHING. Should rename your team the "Excuses". Why? Because that is all y'all want to whine about.

I do believe that 32 teams have a chance at the Super Bowl every year. 2 make the cut, one takes it all. Now if the Jags (note, no stupid nickname, but I can pull out Jackals again if need be) don't make the cut, whose fault is it? THE JAGS. There are no excuses, you weren't good enough. It is pretty simple. YOU ARE NOT SB CALIBER. GET OVER IT.

While there are alot of folks (me being one) who are not too hip to the Pats and alot of their fan base (Go Pats is cool though), you can't deny that they are a good team and have won consecutive Super Bowls. While it may not meet the criteria of 'dynasty' for alot of people (me included), the media and other fans think they do, but you have to admit this...they do have the right to look down on 31 other teams and say "we OWN you".

A win is a win, is a win. The faster you learn this bch, the better off you will be. You carry that violin with you wherever you go? :violin

gwallaia
05-27-2005, 12:40 PM
Why am I rambling? My point is who have the Patriots beat really. Let's look at 11 of their opponents in 04 ~!!


2004
SanFran .125
Browns .250
Miami .250 (beat the patriots)
Arizona .375
Chiefs .438
Bengals .500
Rams .500
Ravens .562
Seattle .562

2003
Giants .250
Was .312
Browns .312
Bills .375
Jets .375
Jags .312
Texans .312

Good thing the Patriots don't "play down" to their opponents like the Jaguars do.

GoPats
05-27-2005, 12:52 PM
Why am I rambling? My point is who have the Patriots beat really. Let's look at 11 of their opponents in 04 ~!!

2004
SanFran .125
Browns .250
Miami .250 (beat the patriots)
Arizona .375
Chiefs .438
Bengals .500
Rams .500
Ravens .562
Seattle .562

2003
Giants .250
Was .312
Browns .312
Bills .375
Jets .375
Jags .312
Texans .312

9 games in 03 were played against teams that weren't even .400. WOW the past 2 years 14 games have been against teams that were not even .400. And only 3 of those teams had 6 wins under their belt. :rolleyes:

I* love the spin 28-2??? Get it right it's 28 and 4 the past two seasons.
Bill's .375 and Skins .312 beat you all in 03.
Miami .250 and the Steelers did it in 04.

WOW What a dynasty beaten by three teams no better than .375, oh and a rookie QB~!! :dangit:

Half of the wins came from teams no better than .375. Check that I forgot two of thos teams actually beat the Pats, so I guess you can add the two .500 teams as half. Sorry but no way in hell I consider the Patsies a dynasty. :rolleyes:

Hey that's fine... like I said, I don't really care. I just figured I'd see if their overall record (and the "28-2" thing was a mistake, not a "spin") would make any difference to you.

Anyone with an Internet connection, enough time, and a chip on their shoulder can go online and figure this stuff out. I only have one of those three things at this moment, but I would bet if you look at the schedules of past "dynasty" teams, the winning percentage of opponents would be right in line with what the Patriots have faced over the past couple of years.

No need to get all riled up and snippy, by the way. Instead, as a Jags fan, maybe you can wait until midseason when you actually have a reason to be pissed off.

Lucky
05-27-2005, 12:57 PM
...Instead, as a Jags fan, maybe you can wait until midseason when you actually have a reason to be pissed off.
I wish I had said that. :)

aj.
05-27-2005, 01:09 PM
who have the Patriots beat really Only a delusional gags fan could spin it like this when talking about the twice defending Super Bowl champs.

Who have they beat?

In '04 they beat the Colts (12-4), Steelers (15-1), and Eagles (13-3) in their last three games - when it counted.

In '03 they beat the Titans (12-4), Colts (12-4), and Panthers (11-5) in their last three games - when it counted.

Also in '04 with a playoff spot on the line and on their home field, the Jags were shutout by the Texans 21-0 - when it counted.

TEXANS84
05-27-2005, 01:17 PM
No need to get all riled up and snippy, by the way. Instead, as a Jags fan, maybe you can wait until midseason when you actually have a reason to be pissed off.

Also in '04 with a playoff spot on the line and on their home field, the Jags were shutout by the Texans 21-0 - when it counted.

Back to back best quotes I have seen on this board in a long time. :highfive:

THEFUTURE
05-27-2005, 02:08 PM
jagsbch, the only two teams the jags beat last year that were of any good were the Broncos and the Colts...
teams you beat
Buffalo-by 3
Broncos- by 1
Tenn- by 3
Cheifs-by 6
Colts-by 3
Detroit- by 6
Chicago- by 19 (whoo hoo! its chicago)
Green Bay- by 3
Oakland- by 7

its not exactly like the jags were a power house, and crushing teams last year...
teams you lost to
colts-by 7
chargers- by 13
Texans- by 14
Tenn- by 3 (wait you lost to tennessee, hahahaha)
Minn- by 11
Pitt- by 1
Texans- by 21 (with playoffs on the line, you score a big fatty goose egg)

Jags scored a total of 254 points to their opponents 280 points total... just some stats i thought i would through out... so before your little kitties can become a dynasty, in which hell would need to freeze over, they might wants to outscore their opponents, oh and next time you critizice someone on their Championship team, because they win close games, and somehow that makes them not so great... look in the mirror, cuz you didnt exactly demolish anyone last year

El Tejano
05-27-2005, 02:30 PM
How AJ went to the Pro Bowl ahead of Jimmy is beyond me. It made it all too clear in my eye's that performance on the field is not the criteria the NFL uses to send players to the Pro Bowl~!! :brickwall


:

They probably figured since We beat the Jags twice and AJ had alot to do with that, AJ should get the nod.

Don't bang your head over it, just accept!

Nah, really I think JSmith doesn't care about ProBowls anymore, even when he gets voted his stomach starts to spasm.

Vinny
05-27-2005, 02:32 PM
Jimmy Smith is a borderline hall of famer. Andre is young and quite the freak. He can have the old Smith, and I'm fine with the younger AJ.

TopTexanFan16
05-27-2005, 02:38 PM
I wanna know who that Jags fan tallest and fastest reciever is?.....i mean we have mathis hint fastest and im pretty sure they dont have the tallest W/R unless u count in matt jones which i dont count him as a W/R yet and plaus he said he play w/r in the senior bowl.....am i mistaken or wasnt he a QB converted tow/e when he got drafted? j/w i could be wrong.

jr0ck
05-27-2005, 04:59 PM
matt jones was a QB at arkansas in college, and played WR as in the senior bowl because of his crazy athletic ability combined with big questions about his arm (which i didn't see from a casual fans POV). he seemed to be a leader and a gamer as a QB, and i personally think his future would be brightest as a QB, but i hope he succeeds in the NFL (with no game winning catches against my h-town boys).

now onto the re-tar-ded argument from 'ol Jagshmr about the pats not beating quality teams. i ask you this, did the patriots choose their scehdule? did they pad their road to the superbowl with "chalk 'em up, sure fire" victories? is their such thing as a "chalk 'em up, sure fire" victory? what other options did the patriots have when playing the opponents they did? are there more than 32 teams in the NFL to choose from? did they need to play indy, pittsburg, philly, etc repeatedly over 16 games to prove their place in the football dynasty pantheon? the answer to all those questions in a big fat NO, which is why your line of thought has little validity, or even relevance, when discussing the patriots accomplishments. i end with this, winning is winning. i'll take an unbeaten season with nothing but last second 2 point safety victories than a season with record breaking offensive dominance (see colts) that is nothing but offensive records in the end.


"YOU PLAY TO WIN THE GAME"

Jagsbch
05-27-2005, 09:51 PM
did they need to play indy, pittsburg, philly, etc repeatedly over 16 games to prove their place in the football dynasty pantheon? the answer to all those questions in a big fat NO, which is why your line of thought has little validity, or even relevance,

Look here pal your entitled to your line of thinking and sobeit, but I base my criteria of a dynasty on higher standards. I think what NE did was impressive no doubt, but the jury is still out on them being a Dynasty in my book.:rolleyes:

It is pretty simple. YOU ARE NOT SB CALIBER. GET OVER IT. Panthers and Ravens were not considered SB CALIBER. GET OVER IT.

No need to get all riled up and snippy, by the way. Instead, as a Jags fan, maybe you can wait until midseason when you actually have a reason to be pissed off. The only reasoned I'd be pissed is if Byron doesn't have at least 20 TDs and 2000 yards. :cool:

jr0ck
05-27-2005, 10:13 PM
but the jury is still out on them being a Dynasty in my book

since your the only member on your jury, what do they have to do? win an unprecedented 4 superbowls in 5 years (which would be even better, believe it or not, than the other dynasty's you have in mind) , or just blow teams out well into the play-offs by a certain marigain?

Jagsbch
05-28-2005, 09:34 AM
since your the only member on your jury,

Wrong again My sentament regarding the Patsies is shared by quite a few people, as a matter of fact there are three us in this thread alone. :dangit: :cool:

jr0ck
05-28-2005, 03:54 PM
you refrenced "the jury(s)" opinoin in "your book". i wasn't meaning you were the only person to have this idea. rather that you are the only one responsible for the contents of "your book", so it's up to you to decide what is in it, and more importantly why. and since you avoided my question, i will give you another chance to answer it. to refresh your memory,

what do they have to do? win an unprecedented 4 superbowls in 5 years (which would be even better, believe it or not, than the other dynasty's you have in mind) , or just blow teams out well into the play-offs by a certain marigain?

and now it is your turn to get hit over the head while i look cool in the background...

:dangit: :cool:

THEFUTURE
05-28-2005, 05:40 PM
you refrenced "the jury(s)" opinoin in "your book". i wasn't meaning you were the only person to have this idea. rather that you are the only one responsible for the contents of "your book", so it's up to you to decide what is in it, and more importantly why. and since you avoided my question, i will give you another chance to answer it. to refresh your memory,



and now it is your turn to get hit over the head while i look cool in the background...

:dangit: :cool:
dont even worry about the guy, he wont give u an answer, he has proven that once he cant win an arguement, he decides to ignore it, until something else pops up he can write about

Jagsbch
05-28-2005, 07:50 PM
What do they have to do?

Well since they have another season with over half the schedule averaging under .500 is make it back to the big show. :pigfly:

TexansTrueFan
05-28-2005, 08:35 PM
ok this is the texans message board who do u think we'll pick ????????????? DAVID !!!

GoPats
05-30-2005, 06:31 AM
since your the only member on your jury, what do they have to do? win an unprecedented 4 superbowls in 5 years (which would be even better, believe it or not, than the other dynasty's you have in mind) , or just blow teams out well into the play-offs by a certain marigain?

If they win 4-out-of-5, we'll probably still be hearing the same kind of stuff from Jagsbch and others... if the facts as they are fail to be convincing enough, I don't think another Lombardi trophy will make any difference. That said, I wouldn't change his opinion if I could. Belichick loves hearing stuff like this... makes for perfect motivational speeches.

Jagsbch
05-30-2005, 03:35 PM
Like I said previously if the Patriots repeat I have problem with calling them a Dynasty. I am just not ready to come to such conclusions. :dangit:

GoPats
05-30-2005, 04:39 PM
Like I said previously if the Patriots repeat I have problem with calling them a Dynasty. I am just not ready to come to such conclusions. :dangit:

Was that supposed to say, "I have NO problem calling them a Dynasty?" Just curious...

Jagsbch
05-30-2005, 05:21 PM
Yes thank you.

Vendetta, R.
09-17-2005, 03:31 AM
who looks better now?

rmartin65
09-17-2005, 09:11 AM
I picked Carr.

Scooter
09-17-2005, 10:20 AM
i voted for byron simply because i think he's got a better team around him. having a defense that'll get him the ball back, to me, is more important than 3 or 4 great receivers who wont get thrown to. and there's no way their o-line is worse than ours.

besides, i prefer arms to legs at the qb position so byron's utter slowness is an asset IMO.

Fldvldog
09-17-2005, 10:29 AM
I'm almost 100% positive that if this poll was posted on ESPN.com, Leftwich would be up by at least 75-80% of the votes.

Leftwich is definately the better QB (and this is an unbiased opinion). Leftwich makes EXCELLENT decisions and rarely turns the ball over. Yes, his protection is better than Carr's, but it is not very good. I admit that Carr is more mobile than Byron, but Byron had some nice "shake and bake" moves on Seattle for nice gains. Leftwich has a better arm, and is more accurate (which he stressed this offseason). Carr simply throws to double coverage too much. He has an AJ crutch bigtime! If everybody is in single coverage, and AJ is double covered, he throws to AJ. I don't understand it. Carr definately needs to improve his turnovers. 3 INT's last game? 70 yards passing? From a no.1 overall pick in '02? The "we are still in expansion mode" does not cut it anymore.

If I were part of the texans organizaation (I'm expecting a "Thank God you're not" from somebody) I would give Carr 1 (2 absolute tops) more game. If he does not produce, and there is another loss in the column, then it's time to try somebody else out at QB. They cannot be much worse than Carr's performance lasst game. Give Ragone a shot. Just think of it that way, and in the '06 draft, you all have a shot to get either Leinart, Jacobs, (or a real fan favorite over here) Vince Young. It is also critical to aid that horrendous O-Line quickly. Why it wasn't fixed this offseason is beyond me.

Leftwich>>>>>Carr

aphia1996
09-17-2005, 11:08 AM
How can you compair J.Smith to A.Johnson? There isn't a comparison. A.J. is a better reciever, PERIOD! Johnson is covered in Trip's all game and His QB doesn't have time to even get him the ball....If David Had the time Byron did this wouldn't even be a question and we would be in the run for a Super Bowl.

GEAUX TEXANS!!!

James H.
Houston, Texas

Vendetta, R.
09-17-2005, 11:19 AM
aj can only hope he'll have a five year stretch like jimmy smith did of having more yards and cathes than anyone in the entire nfl.

what about a signature of game of 291 yards/15 3tds against the 2000 ravens defense. You can't even comprehend 291 yards in a game by a reciever against any defense.. let alone one of the best ever.

Don't be surprised if Jimmy Smith has more yards and as many or more tds than aj this year. he did last season and is already at 7/130 2tds.


Leftwich is about to pass carr in tds, he's 3 back with a full less year! and oh yeah, carr is 19 up on ints!

say the Jaguars offense is bad all you want. they'll be scoring more points than the texans this year. no need to bother with the defense or special teams. that one is very evident.

I'm glad to see Tony Boselli went on to do good things with you guys :yahoo:

Texans86
09-17-2005, 12:24 PM
aj can only hope he'll have a five year stretch like jimmy smith did of having more yards and cathes than anyone in the entire nfl.

what about a signature of game of 291 yards/15 3tds against the 2000 ravens defense. You can't even comprehend 291 yards in a game by a reciever against any defense.. let alone one of the best ever.

Don't be surprised if Jimmy Smith has more yards and as many or more tds than aj this year. he did last season and is already at 7/130 2tds.


Leftwich is about to pass carr in tds, he's 3 back with a full less year! and oh yeah, carr is 19 up on ints!

say the Jaguars offense is bad all you want. they'll be scoring more points than the texans this year. no need to bother with the defense or special teams. that one is very evident.

I'm glad to see Tony Boselli went on to do good things with you guys :yahoo:

1) Byron Leftwich did not come into a brand new franchise and get sacked more than anyone in NFL history in his first season.

2) He has had a dominant reciever like Jimmy Smith his entire career.

3) He has slightly more protection in the pocker, but every second counts.

4) Tony Boselli was arguably one of the top 5 best Left Tackles in the league when we acquired him, and it was unfortunate to see his career cut short. As a football player he was great, but off the field he was a man of integrity, which can't be said for some of the great players. His unfortunate ending is one reason the Texans still have no offensive line.

FILO_girl
09-17-2005, 12:32 PM
aj can only hope he'll have a five year stretch like jimmy smith did of having more yards and cathes than anyone in the entire nfl.

what about a signature of game of 291 yards/15 3tds against the 2000 ravens defense. You can't even comprehend 291 yards in a game by a reciever against any defense.. let alone one of the best ever.

Don't be surprised if Jimmy Smith has more yards and as many or more tds than aj this year. he did last season and is already at 7/130 2tds.


Leftwich is about to pass carr in tds, he's 3 back with a full less year! and oh yeah, carr is 19 up on ints!

say the Jaguars offense is bad all you want. they'll be scoring more points than the texans this year. no need to bother with the defense or special teams. that one is very evident.

I'm glad to see Tony Boselli went on to do good things with you guys :yahoo:

Where are all these feral cats coming from? Some one shut the door!

No one (that I have seen) has said the Jags are that bad. They are a formidable adversary to most teams. While you would like to say that the Jags play DOWN to the level of the opponent, I say they play UP. Except to the Texans. Can't deny our short history, that is one stat you can't spin.
Leftwich has to step it up this year, those royalty checks from Diff'rent Strokes are running out. Plus, he has alot to prove, just like David does. I believe David will prevail in this contest of the QBs because unlike the STATUEesque Leftwich, David is quite mobile. David can develop some composure and assurance in the pocket (hint to Oline, come to work on Sundays!), don't think Lefty can get new legs.

Give AJ the opportunity to use the tools he has, and he will blow Smith out of the water. He is a great player, he just needs the opportunity to shine. He is a Pro Bowler, don't see any Smiths at WR on here...

AFC PRO BOWL ROSTER 2005
OFFENSE (21) STARTERS RESERVES
Wide receivers (4) Marvin Harrison, IND
Chad Johnson, CIN Andre Johnson, HOU
Hines Ward, PIT
Tackles (3) Jonathan Ogden, BAL
Tarik Glenn, IND ## Marvel Smith, PIT ##
Willie Roaf, KC (injured)
Willie Anderson, CIN (injured)
Guards (3) Alan Faneca, PIT
Will Shields, KC Brian Waters, KC
Centers (2) Kevin Mawae, NYJ Jeff Hartings, PIT
Tight ends (2) Antonio Gates, SD Tony Gonzalez, KC
Quarterbacks (3) Peyton Manning, IND Tom Brady, NE
Drew Brees, SD
Running backs (3) LaDainian Tomlinson, SD Jerome Bettis, PIT ##
Rudi Johnson, CIN ##
Corey Dillon, NE ## (injured)
Edgerrin James, IND (injured)
Curtis Martin, NYJ (injured)
Fullback (1) Tony Richardson, KC
Smith has 13 years in the NFL, born in '69. Dre is in his 4th, born in '81. One WR in his twilight, one just beginning to hit his stride. Lets see who goes to the Pro Bowl this year...


I am intrigued by the number of Jaguar faithful have decided to come over to our board lately...we don't play for another 8 or so weeks, are y'all THAT intimidated that you must come over and sniff the enemy so soon? If you think what you smell is weakness, forget it. We are one game into the season, things can change quite dramatically in a week.

Fldvldog
09-17-2005, 12:51 PM
Where are all these feral cats coming from? Some one shut the door!

No one (that I have seen) has said the Jags are that bad. They are a formidable adversary to most teams. While you would like to say that the Jags play DOWN to the level of the opponent, I say they play UP. Except to the Texans. Can't deny our short history, that is one stat you can't spin.
Leftwich has to step it up this year, those royalty checks from Diff'rent Strokes are running out. Plus, he has alot to prove, just like David does. I believe David will prevail in this contest of the QBs because unlike the STATUEesque Leftwich, David is quite mobile. David can develop some composure and assurance in the pocket (hint to Oline, come to work on Sundays!), don't think Lefty can get new legs.

I am intrigued by the number of Jaguar faithful have decided to come over to our board lately...we don't play for another 8 or so weeks, are y'all THAT intimidated that you must come over and sniff the enemy so soon? If you think what you smell is weakness, forget it. We are one game into the season, things can change quite dramatically in a week.

I doubt Jag fans that come here are intimidated, due to the fact that the texans were manhandled by the Bills last week...jk, just a friendly jab :) .Yes, the texans have our number, but that will definately change this year. The texans don't look like the same team as last year. They looked very intimidated when they played Buffalo. Carr looks like he cannot get much better than what he is right now.

I don't think Leftwich has as much to prove as Carr. Leftwich has shown he can get the job done, when the team is down, and they need a score. He is very calm in the pocket. On another note, just because Carr is more mobile, doesn't mean he is the better QB. I would take a pocket passer that makes excellent decisions and rarely turns over the rock, over a mobile QB that turns over the rock at will.

BTW, I don't think that Leftwich will run out of checks anytime soon... :)

FILO_girl
09-17-2005, 02:25 PM
I doubt Jag fans that come here are intimidated, due to the fact that the texans were manhandled by the Bills last week...jk, just a friendly jab :) .Yes, the texans have our number, but that will definately change this year. The texans don't look like the same team as last year. They looked very intimidated when they played Buffalo. Carr looks like he cannot get much better than what he is right now.

I don't think Leftwich has as much to prove as Carr. Leftwich has shown he can get the job done, when the team is down, and they need a score. He is very calm in the pocket. On another note, just because Carr is more mobile, doesn't mean he is the better QB. I would take a pocket passer that makes excellent decisions and rarely turns over the rock, over a mobile QB that turns over the rock at will.

BTW, I don't think that Leftwich will run out of checks anytime soon... :)

Manhandled is an understatement. :embarrass

Neither of our QBs are going to be legendary. This is pretty much on a division rival level. Neither of them compare to Peyton. Titans? While McNair is a fan favorite over there in Titanland, he is far from legendary.

I say Carr, you say Leftwich. Guess that is why I am the Texans fan and you are a Jag fan.
:homer: rules.

run-david-run
09-17-2005, 02:26 PM
i voted for byron simply because i think he's got a better team around him. having a defense that'll get him the ball back, to me, is more important than 3 or 4 great receivers who wont get thrown to. and there's no way their o-line is worse than ours.

besides, i prefer arms to legs at the qb position so byron's utter slowness is an asset IMO.


Texans have given up 2 TDs in the last 19 quarters.... now what was this talk about the Jags D?

run-david-run
09-17-2005, 02:30 PM
aj can only hope he'll have a five year stretch like jimmy smith did of having more yards and cathes than anyone in the entire nfl.

what about a signature of game of 291 yards/15 3tds against the 2000 ravens defense. You can't even comprehend 291 yards in a game by a reciever against any defense.. let alone one of the best ever.

Don't be surprised if Jimmy Smith has more yards and as many or more tds than aj this year. he did last season and is already at 7/130 2tds.


Leftwich is about to pass carr in tds, he's 3 back with a full less year! and oh yeah, carr is 19 up on ints!

say the Jaguars offense is bad all you want. they'll be scoring more points than the texans this year. no need to bother with the defense or special teams. that one is very evident.

I'm glad to see Tony Boselli went on to do good things with you guys :yahoo:

5 years ago... does this really help Byron now? If it does, you guys may consider picking up Chris Carter, Jerry Rice and Tim Brown....

BY the way Carr had 14 Int's last season, hardly a lot of turnovers, Sunday was just an abboration. Also, Carr has a gun, there is no way Leftwhich has a better arm.

Fiddy
09-17-2005, 03:02 PM
i picked leftwich because he doesnt throw an interception every time he drops back to pass :yahoo: I'm wondering if this is TexansNeedRBin05 reincarnated...



I choose Vince Young :tiptoe: :tomato:

kevinjagsfan
09-17-2005, 03:21 PM
5 years ago... does this really help Byron now? If it does, you guys may consider picking up Chris Carter, Jerry Rice and Tim Brown....

BY the way Carr had 14 Int's last season, hardly a lot of turnovers, Sunday was just an abboration. Also, Carr has a gun, there is no way Leftwhich has a better arm.


Sorry to interrupt, but Byron was measured at the Quarterback challenge at 73 yards, more than any other Quarterback there. Carr....well he didn't get invited

Fiddy
09-17-2005, 03:26 PM
Sorry to interrupt, but Byron was measured at the Quarterback challenge at 73 yards, more than any other Quarterback there. Carr....well he didn't get invited Neither did Manning, McNabb or Culpepper.

In its 16th year, the EA SPORTS NFL Quarterback Challenge tests the NFL's premier quarterbacks, which this year include: Drew Brees (San Diego Chargers), Jake Delhomme (Carolina Panthers), Joey Harrington (Detroit Lions), Matt Hasselbeck (Seattle Seahawks), Byron Leftwich (Jacksonville Jaguars), Carson Palmer (Cincinnati Bengals) and Ben Roethlisberger (Pittsburgh Steelers). http://www.nflplayers.com/news/news_release.aspx?id=3714

Hottoddie
09-17-2005, 03:33 PM
Who cares about Byron? Carr is our boy & we'll ride to the big dance with him, if he's capable of getting us there. If not, then we have another QB waiting in the wings by the name of Ragone.

Even the great Dan Marino would've struggled without some consistent OL protection. This is the first year that we've had 80% of the OL remain the same from the previous year. Some of Carr's bad decisions have got to be a result of looking over his shoulder for unblocked 240lb LB's coming at him at full speed. While these guys are highly paid pros, even they get rattled by a 240lb physical specimen driving their d*ck in the dirt.

I say we give Carr & the OL half a season to see if they improve. If not, then I start looking for other options.

You've heard the biblical verse "Thou shalt not covet thy neighbor's wife.". Well, we can modify it to say "Thou shalt not covet thy enemies QB.".

I don't want Byron. I want Carr, because he's here & Byron will never be.

Fldvldog
09-17-2005, 06:21 PM
...I don't want Byron. I want Carr, because he's here & Byron will never be.


Hallelujah to that! Leftwich is a Jag, and I hope that he is a Jag forever...

Vendetta, R.
09-17-2005, 06:22 PM
Who's more likely to go to the Prow Bowl this year? Aj or the Jimmy? Jimmy, he'll have more yards (130 so far) , more tds (2 so far ) and be playing for a team with more wins. You're 0-1 and 0-2 is looking like a good possibility. But who knows what will happen. You might win, we might win.

This is just Lefty's 3rd year.
This is carr's 4th. And was a number #1.
The stats don't lie.
Words on here don't change the truth. This is all for fun. Most of us like Leftwich, he's progressed each year and the reasonable ones support him.

And it's not like the Jaguars O-line is great. The right side of it is, but not overall. I doubt anyone of you would list the Jaguars as top 10 Oline. Now D-line... Things change then.

HoustonFan
09-17-2005, 07:56 PM
Vince Young would be great. But I wonder if he'd shine behind our O-line. I wonder if DC would improve drastically behind an O-line like... what Buffalo had last week, the Colts, the Patriots. :hmmm:

Goldeagle
09-17-2005, 07:56 PM
Byron might have the better season, but Carr is the better QB

Fldvldog
09-17-2005, 09:06 PM
Byron might have the better season, but Carr is the better QB

:crazy:

Scooter
09-18-2005, 07:00 AM
Texans have given up 2 TDs in the last 19 quarters.... now what was this talk about the Jags D?

jacksonville beat the texans in every defensive category last season except for turnovers (27-30), but i think the sacks make up for that (37-24). we got worse this year by exchanging glenn for buchannon & sharper for greenwood. payne, dunta, & coleman are going to have to carry our D.

i'm still fuming from last week so i'm being a little more objective than compared to coming off of a win.

Corrosion
09-18-2005, 07:34 AM
Byron might have the better season, but Carr is the better QB


I agree .... Leftwitch has more to work with thats for certian but I think Carr has better QB skills overall . This is STILL an expansion team .... one that beat the Jags twice last year . :texans:

Fldvldog
09-18-2005, 11:26 AM
I agree .... Leftwitch has more to work with thats for certian but I think Carr has better QB skills overall . This is STILL an expansion team .... one that beat the Jags twice last year . :texans:

Sorry, but this is NOT an expansion team anymore...You cannot be saying that 4 years into existance...

Corrosion
09-18-2005, 11:35 AM
Sorry, but this is NOT an expansion team anymore...You cannot be saying that 4 years into existance...



Count the STARTING players on each team that were drafted by that team .....Compare those rosters to the Texans ..... This IS an Expansion team . I dont expect them to compete for the play-offs for at least 2-3 more seasons . Its just not realistic unless you go out and spend huge on free agents .

Bubbajwp
09-18-2005, 11:56 AM
Count the STARTING players on each team that were drafted by that team .....Compare those rosters to the Texans ..... This IS an Expansion team . I dont expect them to compete for the play-offs for at least 2-3 more seasons . Its just not realistic unless you go out and spend huge on free agents .
:bowdown: :bowdown: To bad its true :crying:

Kaiser Toro
09-25-2005, 05:00 PM
Byron brings them back again. The kid is tough, stays in the pocket, takes a hit and delivers. Nice to see someone actually earning their paycheck.

Why is he able to take a pounding and make things happen and Carr does not?

Elite
09-25-2005, 05:47 PM
Byron is awsome he just has that special leadership in him that no Texans QB has.

Vendetta, R.
09-25-2005, 05:57 PM
The 02 Jaguars had less talent than their expansion team. The 1995 Jaguars. After all the Salary cuts that year, they were basically one.

Henderson didn't even start.
Stroud was considered a bust at the time. It's true.
There was no mike peterson
No boselli anymore
no more keenan
Who was the Jags 2nd reciever..? patrick johnson
no deon gran
no rashean mathis
who was on the Oline?

Basically it was darius, byrant, brunell, taylor and smith.


Anyhow. The first thing Couglin did was try and build and good oline and dline.. his first two draft picks were ot.

next year he went to the dline with brackens then wynn... thats how you build. you fill in the other pieces as you go. it starts up front.

name me good teams that don't either have at least a good dline or Oline? Sure the other players are sexy picks. Oh well. Looks like the texans will get back to basics. hopefully by then drob and aj will still be around.

It comes about breaks too.. The jaguars stumbled upon jimmy smith and keenan mccardell. two damn good finds.

yaboycm
09-25-2005, 05:57 PM
Who is going to have a better season? :bomb:

Are you kidding me, are we even asking this question? P--lease!

The kid from http://www.kellyindustries.com/guitars/images/marshall_1987xl_1960tv_half_stack.jpghttp://www.whitebrook.org/images/thurgood_marshall_1989.jpghttp://www.partylights.com/images/products/novelty/NCAAfootball/Marshall-ThunderingHerd_lg.jpg.






http://espn.starwave.com/media/nfl/2004/0811/photo/w_leftwich_ft.jpg. That's right, .

yaboycm
09-25-2005, 06:40 PM
The 02 Jaguars had less talent than their expansion team. The 1995 Jaguars. After all the Salary cuts that year, they were basically one.

Henderson didn't even start.
Stroud was considered a bust at the time. It's true.
There was no mike peterson
No boselli anymore
no more keenan
Who was the Jags 2nd reciever..? patrick johnson
no deon gran
no rashean mathis
who was on the Oline?

Basically it was darius, byrant, brunell, taylor and smith.


Anyhow. The first thing Couglin did was try and build and good oline and dline.. his first two draft picks were ot.

next year he went to the dline with brackens then wynn... thats how you build. you fill in the other pieces as you go. it starts up front.

name me good teams that don't either have at least a good dline or Oline? Sure the other players are sexy picks. Oh well. Looks like the texans will get back to basics. hopefully by then drob and aj will still be around.

It comes about breaks too.. The jaguars stumbled upon jimmy smith and keenan mccardell. two damn good finds.





While I totally agree with you we need to sure up the line, via Free Agency and the draft.

I wouldn't call that breaks, I would call that scouting. Something http://www.houstontexans.com/team/players/uploadedimages/casserly073103.jpg has lacked since he has been here.

I'm not even going to get into how he should have picked Peppers over Carr, Portis over Pitts, Jason Witten OR LJ Smith over Joppru, or Derrick Johnson, Michael Clayton, or Marcus Spears over Travis Johnson. Or Michael Lewis. Or Lito Sheppard. Or Sheldon Brown.

I'm going to look at his quality picks:
His first NFL draft with the Texans, 2002:
Quality picks here.

Name Round Overall
Carr 1 1
Gafney 2 33
Pitts 2 50
Wells 4 99
Faggins 6 173

Wow! What a draft!!! What great players! And he even had an extra pick a round in the whole draft except 1st round. Plus, is Pitts, Jabar, or Wells quality? Certainly they are on the team but they aren't exactly very important irreplaceable guys. Faggins a very good value pick in the 6th round. Build that team Charles, build that team.

2003
Name Round Overall
Andre 1 3
Peek 3 67
Dom 4 101

This one was actually very good draft. I give him credit. One problem with this draft, not a lot of depth. We could have gone a different direction in mid-late rounds and maybe had a shot at D. Dockery, B. McMullen, A. Boldin, Bethel Johnson, M Doss, J. Witten, Ricky Manning, Chris Brown, S. Wallace, or Rasheed Mathis DL Colts - he's cold and they got him LATE.

One of these DL/LB's had to work eventually

2004
Name Round Overall
Dunta 1 10 - has a chance to be the best of the draft

That's it!! Nothing else. It's like he let his daughter make the picks based on college mascots and cool last names.

Glenn Earl 4 122 if you want to call him a quality pick

This past draft, 2005:
From what I can see so far, this is the worst draft by far.
C.C. Brown is a good pick in the 6th round.
Maybe the M&M's, Morency and Mathis can be good. If Mathis can get healthy. I think he could be a good find.
Johnson is just like a http://www.namedbystrangers.com/blowoff/images/van_broke.jpg on the contraflow lanes when you're trying to get out of town because of a hurricane.

JaguarsFan1
09-25-2005, 09:39 PM
Byron might have the better season, but Carr is the better QB



Whatever your smoking you should stop. It's killing your brain cells.

edo783
09-25-2005, 11:05 PM
Whatever your smoking you should stop. It's killing your brain cells.

Back at ya.

Vendetta, R.
09-25-2005, 11:21 PM
update...

Carr

34tds? , 45int

Leftwich

33tds, 27int


Leftwich is just one behind or so now in tds in one full less year.

metalmike
09-26-2005, 12:31 PM
:texflag: Leftwich hands down will have a better year. Carr has shown less this year than any other. Bring in Vince Young. He'll be better than both of those guys. Pretty boy Carr better be worried about his job.

TexanFanInCC
09-26-2005, 02:06 PM
right now im going to take leftwich...at least until i see how carr performs under pendry's schemes. byron is definitely the better QB bc the jags are winning games and he hasnt turned the ball over much. he is also alot more poise than carr. (maybe carr's mobility isnt quite as good a comodity as i thought.

JaguarsFan1
09-26-2005, 03:00 PM
BL turned the ball over once on Sunday. First t.o. of the year for him.

swtbound07
09-26-2005, 03:36 PM
he also recreated his ''Im hurt, please carry me down the field"moment from college......

jags98
09-26-2005, 03:51 PM
he also recreated his ''Im hurt, please carry me down the field"moment from college......

Atleast Our QB will stay in the pocket and take those bone crunching hits :fishing:

Panther5407
09-26-2005, 04:15 PM
Atleast Our QB will stay in the pocket and take those bone crunching hits :fishing:

Ater 140+ sacks, he might start trying to run but then again, its Byron. I don't think I've ever seen him run.

thunderkyss
01-13-2006, 11:38 AM
:texflag: Leftwich hands down will have a better year. Carr has shown less this year than any other. Bring in Vince Young. He'll be better than both of those guys. Pretty boy Carr better be worried about his job.



It's not exactly hands down..... it's actually too close to call being that Byron missed 5 games.


But good call on Vince, even though you had no idea of knowing he'd be eligible for this years draft, Kudos fella.

Jack Bauer
01-13-2006, 11:40 AM
Atleast Our QB will stay in the pocket and take those bone crunching hits :fishing:

He has too. He doesn't have the speed to get out of the pocket. Garrard will be your 1st team QB before you know it.