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76Texan
07-16-2012, 01:35 PM
Let me go ahead and create a separate thread for this position.

Let's start a list of players to watch in 2013. Make a list of players by position that you think will be great or that you think are currently underrated and by position as you think they will apply to Texans needs.
Example, I think WR will be a big need again regardless of what we did in this years draft and I think it will be a 1st or 2nd round pick. The guys I like at WR are:
WR:
Justin Hunter, DaRick Rogers, Cobi Hamilton, Marquess Wilson, and Ryan Swope, Terrance Williams but they both might have QB issues this year.


Let's see some of the guys you'll be keeping an eye on.

I'm gonna move my posts regarding the WRs over to this thread as well,
I think it will be easier to keep track of the players.

76Texan
07-16-2012, 01:36 PM
I think Baylor has more than just Terrance Williams; the other two guys look pretty good, too. (Lanear Thompson and Tevin Reese - Reese is an underclassman and may stay in school unless he has a monster year.)

Mark your calendar for Elon's Aaron Mellette.
They have only 2 games on TV (UNC - ACC Network and another game on ESPN3). This guy looks pretty good on the videos I've found so far.
His production is outstanding. Will probably go in the first 3 rounds, maybe on day 1.

Clemson's Sam Watkins might come out early. Remember his name.

Watch W. Virginia for the QB Geno Smith, but also for their 2 WRs Bailey and Austin; they are small but they are both playmakers.
It will be interesting to see how they do in the Big 12 this year.

There are a few more that I want to keep an eye on but I don't have enough info on them yet.

76Texan
07-16-2012, 01:36 PM
When you watch USC next year for Barkley, the QB, you will have to watch his receivers.
Robert Woods will be a Jr, and he might come out early as a good route runner and an overall guy who gets the job done.

But you will also have to look at Marqise Lee, who will be a Sophomore.
This guy alreay made a lot of big plays as a Freshman. If he continues his growth, there's a good chance that he'll declare.

Depending on how some of the younger guys perform, the next receiver draft might rival this last one in term of depth or in term of relative quality.

76Texan
07-16-2012, 01:38 PM
Then there's Keenan Allen (California) who appeared to be better than Marvin Jones (Bengals 5th round pick).
Some scouting sites had him in the first round, others in the second.

And the other guy besides Nick Toon whom Wilson threw the ball to:
Jared Abbrederis. He actually had a better ypc than Toon.
He caught my attention while I was scouting Nick Toon.
I saw 2nd and 3rd round grade on him from various sites.

76Texan
07-16-2012, 01:52 PM
A little-known prospect is a receiver from Marshall: Aaron Dobson.

There was very little game tape on Marshall football as we know it.


Here's some tidbids I've learned about Dobson:


6'2 - 205
4.49 speed per NFL Draftscout.

http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings/dsprofile.php?pyid=92694&draftyear=2013&genpos=WR

....

Production:

2011: 49 catches - 668 yards - 12 TDs
He was playing with a Freshman QB

2010:
44 catches - 689 yards - 5 TDs
He led the teams in these categories as a Sophmore

2009:
15 - 362 - 4 as a Freshman
(24.13 ypc)


....

July 9, 2012
HUNTINGTON, W.Va.-Marshall's Aaron Dobson has been selected to the 2012 College Football Performance Awards (CFPA) Wide Receiver Watch List.

http://www.herdzone.com/sports/m-footbl/spec-rel/070912aaf.html

.....

Catch vs S. Miss.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5jeMfvA9pZU

.....

TD vs Miami Ohio on a post route vs Cover 1/3

http://espn.go.com/ncf/video?gameId=312600195

....

Aaron Dobson 29 Yd Pass From Rakeem Cato vs Vtech

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AN9dbKjREZEAaron

.....

The catch vs ECU:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YCdFFFAxLz0&feature=results_video&playnext=1&list=PLF157890311C08D3C

....

vs FIU Beef O Brady Bowl
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0AhUAgSqy-U

....

2011 Highlights:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=spj4V4NvvLc&feature=related

Wolf6151
07-16-2012, 02:24 PM
What do you think of Quinton Patton-WR from Louisiana Tech? He seems to have good size and very good productivity last season.

76Texan
07-16-2012, 04:09 PM
What do you think of Quinton Patton-WR from Louisiana Tech? He seems to have good size and very good productivity last season.

Since you're already on him, can you do a recap similar to what I did for Dobson?

Here are what I can pull up on him:


This highlight tape from 2010 should be taken with a grain of salt since it was in Community College; there are certain good traits that can be seen here, nonetheless.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GMI2V_cBHoY

....

The rest are better samples:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cxBvWx3z3UI

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=endscreen&v=9SoSrRGKIp0&NR=1



Central Ark
Forget about this game; Central Arkansas is a bad defense in the minor league FCS

vs houston

http://espn.go.com/ncf/video?gameId=312602348

vs Miss St
http://espn.go.com/ncf/video?gameId=312670344


FRESNO St. isn't so hot either, but let's go ahead and include the highlights in here:

http://espn.go.com/ncf/video?gameId=313090278

http://espn.go.com/ncf/video?gameId=313090278

....

Overall, I see a fluid athlete with good measurable, definitely having a draftable grade.

He has much better lateral agility than Josh Gordon.

Where he end up will depend on how much more he can improve over the next year.

He's one of the reasons why I'm not sure next year receiver class is not as good as the one we just had.

We'll just have to wait and see how many guys continue with their development and how many underclassmen declare.

There are still more guys under my radar (that I've haven't gotten to or haven't studied enough about.)

steelbtexan
07-16-2012, 11:08 PM
Dobson is a stud.

I've got Rodgers and Dobson rated 1-2 WR's in the draft.

Even though I haven't done any research yet.

Even though Hunter had ACL surgery, How do you guys have him rated in comparison to his teammate Rodgers?

Wolf6151
07-17-2012, 12:58 AM
76Texan, when I watch the youtube video's you posted on Patton I see a guy with good speed but not great, very good quickness/agility but not great, very good athleticism, very good field awareness on sideline routes, catches with his hands, and seems to have good concentration on the ball. It also looks like he's not afraid to go across the middle, and not afraid of contact. He seems to have many of the basic tools to become a good WR. What's impossible to see in highlight video's is his route running ability and whether the separation he gets on big plays are the result of his quality play or blown coverage. Also the level of competition is suspect but he looks to have some potential if he continues to grow, stay healthy, and improve. He's definitely worth keeping an eye on, and I hope that our scouts are doing just that.

SteelB, I like Hunter better than Rodgers. Hunter is more athletic, graceful, smooth, looks faster, and catches with his hands. I think Rodgers catches way to many balls with his body and just lacks that smooth graceful movement that comes from great athleticism. If Hunter proves he's over the ACL injury and has a great year, which he should, he should go before Rodgers in the draft and could go top 10.

steelbtexan
07-17-2012, 09:38 AM
Thanks for the info Wolf.

I will keep an eye out for Hunter.

76Texan
07-23-2012, 10:21 AM
I've been watching a bunch of Vols game in both 2010 and 2011 (too many), and Yeah, Hunter is taller and faster and smoother.
Some already put him in the same class as AJ Green as Julio Jones.
I'm not ready to do that yet.

In 2010, he was a Freshman and the Vols had Seniors in front of him so Hunter wasn't a starter. When he came into games; he saw single coverage exclusively.
His big plays were basically against lesser known quantity.

Yes, he did have a 37-yd catch against Mathieu, but this guy is at most 5'9 (I kinda doubt he's even that "tall"). Mathieu is a good CB, but when the ball is well-thrown over a short CB, there wasn't much the guy can do.

He does have great potential though, and will probably be a first rounder.

Don't go to sleep on Rogers; however.
He's the more physical of the two, but unless he can improve on his long speed and get rid of his "drops", he won't be a first rounder, maybe not even a second rounder.

What he's right now is a guy that can stick his foot in the ground and make a good cut. He also has a good double move to run the deep route (he hasn't ran many of them, however).

He got seperation from Mathieu a couple of times and we know that Mathieu is a very quick cover corner.
He was in a few good battles with the likes of Kirkpatrick, Claiborne, and Gilmore.

His production was very good for a guy who had faced many top defenders and defenses. The quality of defenses he Vols faced went through the roof after Hunter got injured last year. Even so, Rogers saw double coverage at times.

The Vols also got a new guy, a previous 5-star recruit who was the best receiver in the JUCO rank last year - Cordarrelle Patterson.
This guy is another monster. Tall, fast, and smooth. He has very good lateral movement, especially for a big guy.
Watch out for him.

Last year, their line was young (only one Jr).
With a more experienced QB in Bray, I see an explosive offense this year.

badboy
07-23-2012, 10:34 AM
My review from my May mock for 2013:

1. WR Da'Rick Rogers Tennesse (junior) 6'3" 215 He is noted to have "issues" but facts are the 2010 disorderly conduct & resisting arrest after a cop was knocked out were dismissed. He had a run in with strength coach & threatened him & was banned from off season activities for two weeks. Never suspended. Coach McKeefery was in his first year with Tenn & is a former Army performance coordinator Special Forces so may be a tad gung ho. Also note that Tenn Vols hired 7 new assistants. I think Rogers will do fine but expect him to enter draft after this season. He might be better than any WR in 2012 draft.

See this link on his 40 speed: http://www.eagleseyeblog.com/2012-ar...at-counts.html

Back in 2009, as expected, several prospects stood out. One of these young men, wide receiver Da'Rick Rogers, ran a blistering 4.34 40-yard dash at a mind boggling 6'2, 197-lbs. *Note this is a hand held device.

76Texan
07-23-2012, 08:07 PM
My review from my May mock for 2013:

1. WR Da'Rick Rogers Tennesse (junior) 6'3" 215 He is noted to have "issues" but facts are the 2010 disorderly conduct & resisting arrest after a cop was knocked out were dismissed. He had a run in with strength coach & threatened him & was banned from off season activities for two weeks. Never suspended. Coach McKeefery was in his first year with Tenn & is a former Army performance coordinator Special Forces so may be a tad gung ho. Also note that Tenn Vols hired 7 new assistants. I think Rogers will do fine but expect him to enter draft after this season. He might be better than any WR in 2012 draft.

See this link on his 40 speed: http://www.eagleseyeblog.com/2012-ar...at-counts.html

Back in 2009, as expected, several prospects stood out. One of these young men, wide receiver Da'Rick Rogers, ran a blistering 4.34 40-yard dash at a mind boggling 6'2, 197-lbs. *Note this is a hand held device.I don't know how much stock we can put into those time.
It just seems like so many guys were timed in the 4.3s in college only to disappoint during combine. Even their pro-day results might be questionable (some tracks are faster then others, for one.)

He's currently listed at 6'3 - 215. So the weight gained may have some effect.
I definitely don't see 4.34.

I normally try to check out guys running deep routes; let's say a straight go route (free release, no double move).

I look at the clock when the ball is snapped and stopped the tape at different intervals on the field.

I compare that with all the receivers that I've timed over the years.

The more routes I can time them, the more I'm comfortable with their playing speed.

...

You think quite highly of him, as in "better than any receiver in the last draft - 2012", which means you like him even better than Blackmon and the rest.

Me, I don't think I'd go there yet.

badboy
07-23-2012, 08:48 PM
I don't know how much stock we can put into those time.
It just seems like so many guys were timed in the 4.3s in college only to disappoint during combine. Even their pro-day results might be questionable (some tracks are faster then others, for one.)

He's currently listed at 6'3 - 215. So the weight gained may have some effect.
I definitely don't see 4.34.

I normally try to check out guys running deep routes; let's say a straight go route (free release, no double move).

I look at the clock when the ball is snapped and stopped the tape at different intervals on the field.

I compare that with all the receivers that I've timed over the years.

The more routes I can time them, the more I'm comfortable with their playing speed.

...

You think quite highly of him, as in "better than any receiver in the last draft - 2012", which means you like him even better than Blackmon and the rest.

Me, I don't think I'd go there yet.Understand your comments but the last two combines have put some focus on the 40 times and it was not positive. We can refer to Kendall Wright's time when several hand held devices had him faster than the official time. If Rogers runs 4.50 at that size he will be good enough.

steelbtexan
07-23-2012, 10:03 PM
I don't know how much stock we can put into those time.
It just seems like so many guys were timed in the 4.3s in college only to disappoint during combine. Even their pro-day results might be questionable (some tracks are faster then others, for one.)

He's currently listed at 6'3 - 215. So the weight gained may have some effect.
I definitely don't see 4.34.

I normally try to check out guys running deep routes; let's say a straight go route (free release, no double move).

I look at the clock when the ball is snapped and stopped the tape at different intervals on the field.

I compare that with all the receivers that I've timed over the years.

The more routes I can time them, the more I'm comfortable with their playing speed.

...

You think quite highly of him, as in "better than any receiver in the last draft - 2012", which means you like him even better than Blackmon and the rest.

Me, I don't think I'd go there yet.

I saw Rodgers play last yr and I'm not ready to go there either. Rodgers does have the potential to be as good as people think if he's willing to work at it. IMHO

What is your opinion of Bray? I think he was the best QB I saw last yr.

76Texan
07-24-2012, 11:18 AM
I saw Rodgers play last yr and I'm not ready to go there either. Rodgers does have the potential to be as good as people think if he's willing to work at it. IMHO

What is your opinion of Bray? I think he was the best QB I saw last yr.

Best QB you saw last year, including RG III and Russell Wilson?

I have to disagree on that.

The best 3 QBs I saw last year was Wilson, Keenum, and RG III.

These 3 guys performed the best under pressure, which is what one would expect in the NFL.

Bray is a good prospect that is on schedule in his development, as I see it.

He plays well when he has time to throw the ball.
The Cincinnati game, for example, saw Hunter and Rogers getting open at will (on the same plays) quickly.

Bray didn't play terrible under pressure, but he played poorly as compared to the three I mentioned.
He accumulated his stats against weaker opponents on the schedule.

Obviously, he's still young.
If he continues to improve, he can have a bright future.
He has the tools and the size.
He has weapons.
His O-line should improve with experience.
Everything lines up for him to have a good year.
He should be able to take advantage of it.

I haven't paid close attention to Tyler Wilson; the guy I've seen enough is Matt Barkley and he was better than Bray last year (but of course, Barkley has a year on Bray.)

76Texan
07-24-2012, 11:41 AM
Next up is Marcus Davis, VTech.

6'4 - 228

40 time: 4.44 ave.;
as low as 4.37 (timed at VTech in 2010)
44" vertical (posted at VTech in 2010)

Production:

30 catches, 510 yards (17 ypc), 5 TDs as a Jr last year.

Had a reception for four yards at Marshall before suffering a foot injury (a sprain that forced him to leave the game) ... Saw action for six plays against Clemson before re-aggravating foot injury from previous week .

The real catch: He was recruited as a QB.

Wolf6151
07-24-2012, 02:58 PM
Next up is Marcus Davis, VTech.

6'4 - 228

40 time: 4.44 ave.;
as low as 4.37 (timed at VTech in 2010)
44" vertical (posted at VTech in 2010)

Production:

30 catches, 510 yards (17 ypc), 5 TDs as a Jr last year.

Had a reception for four yards at Marshall before suffering a foot injury (a sprain that forced him to leave the game) ... Saw action for six plays against Clemson before re-aggravating foot injury from previous week .

The real catch: He was recruited as a QB.


He's not ranked by Walterfootball and CBS has him as an UDFA, so naturally the Texans will be looking at him in the 3rd round.

steelbtexan
07-24-2012, 07:21 PM
He's not ranked by Walterfootball and CBS has him as an UDFA, so naturally the Texans will be looking at him in the 3rd round.

Very funny stuff.

Repped

76Texan
07-25-2012, 08:57 AM
He's not ranked by Walterfootball and CBS has him as an UDFA.

At the moment he should be an UDFA (just as Josh Gordon).

Even though he's a bit more raw than Gordon, he has better measurables and potential, and no red flag (I think).

He has already caught some eyes (not that I necessarily agree with them).

From the Baylor Bears MB:
Mel Kiper recently unveiled his top 5 returning senior players per position and our very own Terrance Williams came in as the #1 receiver:
1. Terrance Williams
2. Denard Robinson
3. Tavon Austin
4. Cobi Hamilton
5. Marcus Davis

If you're an ESPN insider's subscriber (which I'm not), you can get the scoop here:

http://insider.espn.go.com/nfl/story?id=7471665&_slug_=top-5-players-position-returning-seniors-cfb&eleven=twelve&action=login&appRedirect=http%3a%2f%2finsider.espn.go.com%2fnfl %2fstory%3fid%3d7471665%26_slug_%3dtop-5-players-position-returning-seniors-cfb%26eleven%3dtwelve

Chad Reuter (NFL Network) has him at #8 in his list of the top draft-eligible college players for next year.

8. Marcus Davis, 6-4, 228, Virginia Tech
This former quarterback has an elite combination of size and speed, but has only flashed those skills so far with the Hokies (30 catches, 510 yards, five touchdowns in 2011). Successfully stepping into a starring role with the Hokies in 2012, with the help of junior quarterback Logan Thomas, should shoot Davis up draft boards in a hurry.
NFL comparison: Marques Colston

Walter Football Camp Foundation named him on their watch list for the Biletnikoff Award (Presented to the nation's most outstanding receiver).

Wolf6151
07-25-2012, 05:24 PM
I like Terrance Williams but can't help but think his production and draft standing will fall a little due to RGIII and Wright being in the NFL now and a new QB taking over. Maybe we get lucky and can get him in the 2nd round.

Marcus Davis has just the opposite issue, low ranked guy with a very good QB that should help his production level and draft standing. Now in his senior year, with more experience, his production should go up.

The 2013 draft looks to have some good talent in the 1st and 2nd rounds but the talent level seems to drop off after that, not near the depth as this years draft class had. Hopefully some other guys can move up and make this a better draft class.

76Texan, what do you know about Jared Abbrederis-WR from Wisconsin. According to Walter he's got good size, great speed, and very good production last year. He lost his QB and opposite side WR to the NFL as well so his production may drop off but he could be one to keep an eye on.

steelbtexan
07-25-2012, 06:17 PM
This question wasn't directed to me,

But I watched Abbrederis last yr and he looked like Wilsons favorite WR to me.

He appeared to have great speed and really good hands. He also wasn't a one trick pony. While he may not be able to run a full route tree now. He knows how to run fly/outs,curls/short slants.

If my memory serves me correctly.

Wolf6151
07-26-2012, 01:04 AM
I just noticed that Abbrederis is a redshirt sophmore this year and still has 2 yrs. of eligibility left. Also Walterfootball has him listed as 3rd or 4th round pick. Having lost his opposite side WR and also breaking in a new QB, I'm guessing his production would most likely drop and that he'll stay for at least one more year after this one and if he's good probably goes pro in the 2014 draft. A name to keep an eye on though.

I was watching some Keenan Allen-WR from Cal videos earlier today. It's easy to see why he's rated so high. Maybe we get lucky and the draft is deep so he might fall to us in the bottom of the 1st round. Probably wishful thinking.

76Texan
07-27-2012, 03:53 PM
I like everything about Abbrederis, except that he's not a guy who can stretch the field.

Yes, he did have 3 drops in 14 games.
Yes, he did have one fumble on a return (not caused by the opponent.)

But you look at the number of touches he had (counting defensive PIs and catches called back due to holding by the O-line, etc.) as compared to KMart, this guy is evern more sure-handed.

He's not as explosive as Martin; he's not as quick, but he's very deceptive.
Playing in the same conference, his average is better than KMart in every category (ypc, yd per punt return and KO return). And he already had more TD receving than KMart 11/10 while playing quite a bit less.

The main thing is that he's a very smart player who's gifted with a great vision.

He understands coverage scheme (both on defense and special team).
He understands the angle of approach an opponent may take and he works of it very well.
Basically, he knows where the daylight is.

This guy fits the Texans to a T.
Wisconsin's bread and butter is also the play action.
He walked on after playing as a running QB in HS (and defensive back).
He also competed in wrestling and track & field.
He earned a scholarship this past January.
He's really the embodiment of a real college athlete.

He's a type of true All-American guy, very good at a lot of things, but not really a grand master of anything. But he works hard at it and seems to be very humble.

This is what he tweeted when he finally got the scholarship this last January:

"Praise God for blessing me with a scholarship, signed the papers today!" Abbrederis wrote. "All the hard work has paid off!"

http://host.madison.com/sports/college/football/uw-football-abbrederis-lands-long-awaited-scholarship/article_aa574c18-45df-11e1-a47f-0019bb2963f4.html

...
High School: Wisconsin Football Coaches Association first-team all-state quarterback ... conference offensive player of the year as a senior ... first-team all-conference defensive back and quarterback as a senior ... member of WIAA Division IV state championship team as a senior ... second-team all-conference quarterback and first-team all-conference defensive back as a junior ... second-team all-conference quarterback as a sophomore ... threw for 1,657 yards and 19 touchdowns as a senior ... finished his career with 3,014 passing yards and 30 touchdowns ... rushed for 1,490 yards as a senior, averaging 8.4 yards per carry, 106.4 yards per game and had 26 rushing touchdowns ... two-time team captain ... also competed in track and wrestling ... named Gatorade track athlete of the year and BFS Male National Athlete of the Year as a senior ... three-time conference champion 110m high hurdles ... two-time state champion and state record holder in 110m high hurdles ... state champion as a senior in 300m hurdles.
....

76Texan
07-27-2012, 03:58 PM
I just noticed that Abbrederis is a redshirt sophmore this year and still has 2 yrs. of eligibility left. Also Walterfootball has him listed as 3rd or 4th round pick. Having lost his opposite side WR and also breaking in a new QB, I'm guessing his production would most likely drop and that he'll stay for at least one more year after this one and if he's good probably goes pro in the 2014 draft. A name to keep an eye on though.

I was watching some Keenan Allen-WR from Cal videos earlier today. It's easy to see why he's rated so high. Maybe we get lucky and the draft is deep so he might fall to us in the bottom of the 1st round. Probably wishful thinking.

I just started to watch and learn about O'Brien, the FA QB that will replace Wilson next year. He seems to be very inconsistent, not sure how much was his fault and how much was due to cirscumstances (coaching changes).

Good! I see that you agree on Keenan Allen.
Like I said, it will depend on how many underclassmen that choose to declare; this upcoming draft class may end up being deeper and more talented than the last one.

There are other guys I'm still studying (I watched many of them already last year, but haven't dug deep enough yet because I knew it wasn't their time yet).

76Texan
07-31-2012, 02:37 PM
I like everything about Abbrederis, except that he's not a guy who can stretch the field.

Yes, he did have 3 drops in 14 games.
Yes, he did have one fumble on a return (not caused by the opponent.)

But you look at the number of touches he had (counting defensive PIs and catches called back due to holding by the O-line, etc.) as compared to KMart, this guy is evern more sure-handed.

He's not as explosive as Martin; he's not as quick, but he's very deceptive.
Playing in the same conference, his average is better than KMart in every category (ypc, yd per punt return and KO return). And he already had more TD receving than KMart 11/10 while playing quite a bit less.

The main thing is that he's a very smart player who's gifted with a great vision.

He understands coverage scheme (both on defense and special team).
He understands the angle of approach an opponent may take and he works of it very well.
Basically, he knows where the daylight is.

This guy fits the Texans to a T.
Wisconsin's bread and butter is also the play action.
He walked on after playing as a running QB in HS (and defensive back).
He also competed in wrestling and track & field.
He earned a scholarship this past January.
He's really the embodiment of a real college athlete.

He's a type of true All-American guy, very good at a lot of things, but not really a grand master of anything. But he works hard at it and seems to be very humble.

This is what he tweeted when he finally got the scholarship this last January:

"Praise God for blessing me with a scholarship, signed the papers today!" Abbrederis wrote. "All the hard work has paid off!"

http://host.madison.com/sports/college/football/uw-football-abbrederis-lands-long-awaited-scholarship/article_aa574c18-45df-11e1-a47f-0019bb2963f4.html

...
High School: Wisconsin Football Coaches Association first-team all-state quarterback ... conference offensive player of the year as a senior ... first-team all-conference defensive back and quarterback as a senior ... member of WIAA Division IV state championship team as a senior ... second-team all-conference quarterback and first-team all-conference defensive back as a junior ... second-team all-conference quarterback as a sophomore ... threw for 1,657 yards and 19 touchdowns as a senior ... finished his career with 3,014 passing yards and 30 touchdowns ... rushed for 1,490 yards as a senior, averaging 8.4 yards per carry, 106.4 yards per game and had 26 rushing touchdowns ... two-time team captain ... also competed in track and wrestling ... named Gatorade track athlete of the year and BFS Male National Athlete of the Year as a senior ... three-time conference champion 110m high hurdles ... two-time state champion and state record holder in 110m high hurdles ... state champion as a senior in 300m hurdles.
....

BTW, another thing I really like about Acrabadera is that he ALWAYS worked to keep both feet in bound.

He didn't have too, but he did.
That's a very good trait from a receiver (hardly seen) in college.
I was really impressed with that facet of his game.

Oh, and he can make catches like the one Casey made in the New Orleans game, too.

76Texan
12-22-2012, 09:44 PM
Bump

mussop
12-22-2012, 09:57 PM
He's not ranked by Walterfootball and CBS has him as an UDFA, so naturally the Texans will be looking at him in the 3rd round.

he is now. He is ranked 16th (http://walterfootball.com/draft2013WR.php)

76Texan
12-22-2012, 11:28 PM
he is now. He is ranked 16th (http://walterfootball.com/draft2013WR.php)

Yeah, I'm ahead of them. :ant:

Walter projects Marcus Davis betwee round 2 and 4 now.

I currently have him as value in the third round due to the "potential" upside.

All the receivers I had in this thread are doing at least as well as expected.

Playoffs
01-22-2013, 09:56 AM
If Dolphins want a receiver in the draft, there isn’t a clear-cut favorite (http://www.palmbeachpost.com/news/sports/football/if-dolphins-want-a-receiver-in-the-draft-there-isn/nT3s9/)
Unfortunately for the Dolphins, most draft experts agree that this year’s receiver crop is short on elite talent. The draft will feature several solid mid-round players — including many who are showcasing their talents here at the Senior Bowl this week — but no instant stars like a Calvin Johnson, Larry Fitzgerald or Julio Jones.

“There are two problems with this receiver draft — there’s no dominant receiver, and it’s a problem of size,” said Sports Illustrated draft expert Tony Pauline. “Last year, four of the top five guys were all at least 6-3 and 210 pounds. But there’s not a lot of size in this receiver group. You’re basically looking at a bunch of No. 2 or 3 type guys.”

badboy
01-22-2013, 10:29 AM
What is exciting is that we should be able to take care of most if not all our weak areas with a good draft. At first I was wanting a trade up but now a trade down from #27 may be more fruitful. Anyone think we can trade a 3 & 5 for for a second like we did two drafts ago with NE? Pats did have two seconds that year which could make difference. Miami has two in second and two in third IIRC.

76Texan
01-22-2013, 08:30 PM
I agree with srono, Marcus Wheaton looks like another fine player.

Love his ability to start and stop, and restart.

Makes a lot of difficult catches that will translate to the next level.

Nice stutter step and double move.

Good hips to change lanes in traffic for YAC.

Looks pretty explosive and scrambles well on broken play.

Man, it's going to be hard to place all of these guys.

Rey
01-22-2013, 08:33 PM
This looks like a good draft to grab a wr. If I'm the texans I'd consider taking two and letting Walter go.

76Texan
01-22-2013, 08:49 PM
This looks like a good draft to grab a wr. If I'm the texans I'd consider taking two and letting Walter go.

Roll that dice. We certainly have enough picks.

Wolf6151
01-22-2013, 11:03 PM
This looks like a good draft to grab a wr. If I'm the texans I'd consider taking two and letting Walter go.

If we can fill another need position or 2 in FA, then this isn't such a bad idea. A really good WR in the 1st and then a project guy who only needs a little work in the 3B or 4.

SW H-TOWN
01-23-2013, 07:51 AM
I could see us drafting a wr in the 2nd but i think it is anybody's guess who will be there when we pick. The 3 guys who i am pretty damn sure will not be there are deandre hopkins, cordarrelle patterson, and quinton patton. Patton seems to be distinguishing himself from the pack at the senior bowl. Looks like a mid second round pick. Other than that i have no idea. I do believe that there will be a guy there like robert woods, da'rick rogers, justin hunter...i have a feeling there will be a good receiver when we pick in the 2nd. If we go wr in the 1st i could see it being deandre hopkins. Patterson will be long gone imo and i doubt we reach for patton.

76Texan
02-07-2013, 04:53 PM
I agree with srono, Marcus Wheaton looks like another fine player.

Love his ability to start and stop, and restart.

Makes a lot of difficult catches that will translate to the next level.

Nice stutter step and double move.

Good hips to change lanes in traffic for YAC.

Looks pretty explosive and scrambles well on broken play.

Man, it's going to be hard to place all of these guys.
Wheaton vs Trufant (projected 1st to 2nd round).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PrPsnQWU6kA

The lowest production he had in a game this year was against Washington.
He caught two passes early but then was hit (helmet to helmet I think) and missed the rest of the game.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CB7rRmzwJSE

He came back with 2 consecutive 100yd games, a 98yd game, a 99yd game, and another 100yd game.

Then came the Alamo Bowl against Texas.
Oregon St. was without their starting QB (who has been inconsistent all year).
The backup QB went 15-28 (missing 13 throws) for 194 yards and 2 INts.
Wheaton caught 3 passes for 37 yards; he also ran 4 times for 26 yards.
I will try to watch that game tonight to see what happened.

ckhouston
02-07-2013, 04:58 PM
Both ESPN experts have us going WR in the first round.

They also both have Matt Barkley still there I think.

Would Barkley be a good choice?

RT22
02-07-2013, 08:43 PM
I really like Justin Hunter WR Tennessee and I think he will be there in the second round for us. I think we will go BPA on defense up the middle (NT, ILB or S) in round 1.

Wolf6151
02-07-2013, 08:56 PM
I really like Justin Hunter WR Tennessee and I think he will be there in the second round for us. I think we will go BPA on defense up the middle (NT, ILB or S) in round 1.

After the Combine I think Hunter will be considered a 1st round pick and even IF he does fall to the 2nd round he would surely be a very early 2nd round pick. I see no way that he's still available at #57. He needs to bulk up a little, but I think he's worth our #27 pick.

mussop
02-07-2013, 09:28 PM
Both ESPN experts have us going WR in the first round.

They also both have Matt Barkley still there I think.

Would Barkley be a good choice?

They do that every year. Barkley----NO!!!

htownfan32
02-08-2013, 01:04 AM
They do that every year. Barkley----NO!!!

Yep, iirc last year the "experts" had us taking Stephen Hill, Reuben Randle, and some had us with Mohamed Sanu.

beerlover
02-08-2013, 01:47 AM
Yep, iirc last year the "experts" had us taking Stephen Hill, Reuben Randle, and some had us with Mohamed Sanu.

Hill is pretty much what we thought he would be, a project who flashes potential but is injury prone.

Randle looks really good to me. Think Texans should have just selected him in the 2nd. Looks like plus returner (which would soften Jacoby blow) with good hands & ability to stretch the field.

Sanu is physical, always was, could have replaced Walter.

But that was then this is now.

Quinton Patton looks better to me than any of them. Probably early 2nd on Texans board, suggesting a move back once again then taking WR. Three second round picks would be sweet, check this:

2nd Quinton Patton, WR, Louisiana Tech
2nd Khaseem Greene, LB, Rutgers
2nd Brandon Williams, NT, Missouri Southern

that's three starters :wesmantexanfan:

76Texan
02-08-2013, 08:21 AM
Our next QB is already with the team, technically.
But Barkley would be an upgrade over Schaub in the not-so-far distance in the future. He can extend plays with his feet. His range is at least 7 yards deeper than Schaub. He's already familiar with the WCO; only AJ and even Walter wouldn't have to slow down and wait for the ball.

Here are my notes on USC.
They played 2 Sophomores and 2 Freshmen on the Oline.
One of the Sophomore was moved from Guard to LT, and at least for part of the season (that I know of) was rotating with a Freshman.
The C Khalid Holmes injured his ankle in the second game of the season against Syracuse. He missed the next game against Stanford. He tried to come back the following week and reinjured the ankle. He continued to play the rest of the season, but your guess is as good as mine about his effectiveness.

Without Holmes, the Trojans managed 26 yards on 27 rushing attempts against Stanford.

76Texan
02-08-2013, 08:41 AM
5 of Barkley's INTs were not his faults.
2 (and may be 3) more were due to miscommunication with his receivers.
3 more were due to great individual defensive plays.

Yes, there are a few balls he threw that could have been intercepted, but overall it is still less than other QBs, including Geno Smith.

I still rank Smith slightly ahead of Barkley; however, considering that Smith is a pure shotgun spread QB, we don't know how effective he can be under center.

On top of that, I saw more drops by the receivers than all the receivers on other team. There were also more defensive PIs committed against them that affected the numbers on paper for Barkley. His TD numbers would have been much higher (about 10).

All these (and the level of competition) add up to negate any advantage Barkley may have over most if not all QBs in this draft class.

If I was the Texans GM, I would take Barkley over Geno Smith because he fits this system much better.

76Texan
02-08-2013, 11:56 AM
There are a lot of playmakers in this draft class.

Tavon Austin is such a weapon that can be used everywhere: as a RB or a receiver, and in both punt and kick return; but it's Stedman Bailey that really impressed me on the W. Virg team.

He's a tough, physical players that can make the tough catch and also block well (shame on you, Justin Hunter.)
He's fast and he can make a lot of tough catches.

If you like Kendall Wright last year, then you should also like Bailey.
Not only that, he's probably a receiver who has the best drop rate the last couple of years, and he almost always managed to keep both feet inbound, unlike all of the receivers that were drafted in the first round last year and any of the receivers in this draft class.

I don't think he will last until the end of the second, but I'm hesitant to put him in the first round.
I think he's better than AJ Jenkins who was drafted in the first by the Niners though.

It's really tough to decide who to draft this year, I just can't make up my mind.

badboy
02-08-2013, 02:54 PM
There are a lot of playmakers in this draft class.

Tavon Austin is such a weapon that can be used everywhere: as a RB or a receiver, and in both punt and kick return; but it's Stedman Bailey that really impressed me on the W. Virg team.

He's a tough, physical players that can make the tough catch and also block well (shame on you, Justin Hunter.)
He's fast and he can make a lot of tough catches.

If you like Kendall Wright last year, then you should also like Bailey.
Not only that, he's probably a receiver who has the best drop rate the last couple of years, and he almost always managed to keep both feet inbound, unlike all of the receivers that were drafted in the first round last year and any of the receivers in this draft class.

I don't think he will last until the end of the second, but I'm hesitant to put him in the first round.
I think he's better than AJ Jenkins who was drafted in the first by the Niners though.

It's really tough to decide who to draft this year, I just can't make up my mind.Yeah I have recently moved to Bailey & should be available in 3rd.

leebigeztx
02-11-2013, 02:31 AM
Our next QB is already with the team, technically.
But Barkley would be an upgrade over Schaub in the not-so-far distance in the future. He can extend plays with his feet. His range is at least 7 yards deeper than Schaub. He's already familiar with the WCO; only AJ and even Walter wouldn't have to slow down and wait for the ball.

Here are my notes on USC.
They played 2 Sophomores and 2 Freshmen on the Oline.
One of the Sophomore was moved from Guard to LT, and at least for part of the season (that I know of) was rotating with a Freshman.
The C Khalid Holmes injured his ankle in the second game of the season against Syracuse. He missed the next game against Stanford. He tried to come back the following week and reinjured the ankle. He continued to play the rest of the season, but your guess is as good as mine about his effectiveness.

Without Holmes, the Trojans managed 26 yards on 27 rushing attempts against Stanford.

Barkley has slow feet and a schaub type arm. I do like the wrs in this draft. My guy in the 3rd or 4th rd is tavaris king of georgia. Explosive guy with great speed and quickness.

mussop
02-11-2013, 01:02 PM
My guy in the 3rd or 4th rd is tavaris king of georgia. Explosive guy with great speed and quickness.

One of my sleepers. Stock should improve at combine.

thunderkyss
02-11-2013, 01:04 PM
Yep, iirc last year the "experts" had us taking Stephen Hill, Reuben Randle, and some had us with Mohamed Sanu.

I think last year was the first year they had us taking a WR in the first, but that was because they saw what we saw. To do it again this year, I guess they're saying we didn't get what we wanted in last year's draft..... when we drafted 2 WRs, one in the third.

I'd like to see a WR in the first, but I wouldn't be surprised (upset maybe, but not surprised) if they don't address WR earlier than the third round again.

Posey will be back. LeStar & Martin are going to pressure Walter for that #3WR spot (not that we have a #2, we've been playing without one for years).

If they think that TE is an upgrade over Daniels.... I wouldn't mind grabbing him.

76Texan
02-12-2013, 11:56 AM
Barkley has slow feet and a schaub type arm. I do like the wrs in this draft. My guy in the 3rd or 4th rd is tavaris king of georgia. Explosive guy with great speed and quickness.

Barkley isn't the most athletic QB out there, but his feet are good enough for the WCO.
And no, he doesn't have an average arm like Schaub. Like I said, his range is about 7 yards deeper than Schaub.

beerlover
02-12-2013, 12:38 PM
Barkley isn't the most athletic QB out there, but his feet are good enough for the WCO.
And no, he doesn't have an average arm like Schaub. Like I said, his range is about 7 yards deeper than Schaub.

I would be interested in how you measure this?

76Texan
02-12-2013, 01:03 PM
I would be interested in how you measure this?I look at all the deep passes.
Deep outs/corner routes and inside post routes or seam routes.

I note where the LOS is and where the QB is; whether it's a seven step drop from under center or a 5 step drop from the gun, or a roll out, etc.; whether the QB has to throw a transcontinental pass or a pass across his body.
I time and note where the ball is at 3 sec, 4 sec, and 5 sec.

If it's a post route on a straight drop back, then the distance is a straight line (basically) downfield. There's the distance from the LOS to where the receiver catches the ball (about chest high), and there's the distance from the QB to that spot.

If it's a deep out or a corner route with the QB in the pocket (in the center or on the hashmarks, wherever), then I note that and adjust the measurement with a simple trigonometry formula.

If it's a transcontinental pass (or any pass that was thrown across the body) then I make a note of it as well.

I have most of the games, and on the fews that I don't have, I look it up on ESPN game highlights and youtube highlights.

Wolf6151
02-12-2013, 01:29 PM
If it's a deep out or a corner route with the QB in the pocket (in the center or on the hashmarks, wherever), then I note that and adjust the measurement with a simple trigonometry formula.




These 2 words should never be used in the same sentence, it's an oxymoron.

badboy
02-12-2013, 02:12 PM
I think last year was the first year they had us taking a WR in the first, but that was because they saw what we saw. To do it again this year, I guess they're saying we didn't get what we wanted in last year's draft..... when we drafted 2 WRs, one in the third.

I'd like to see a WR in the first, but I wouldn't be surprised (upset maybe, but not surprised) if they don't address WR earlier than the third round again.

Posey will be back. LeStar & Martin are going to pressure Walter for that #3WR spot (not that we have a #2, we've been playing without one for years).

If they think that TE is an upgrade over Daniels.... I wouldn't mind grabbing him.Curious as to what makes you think bolded is true?

badboy
02-12-2013, 02:15 PM
These 2 words should never be used in the same sentence, it's an oxymoron.Man was I surprised to find out just because it had "trig" in it, didn't necessarily mean it was some type of gun.:thinking:

thunderkyss
02-12-2013, 02:40 PM
Curious as to what makes you think bolded is true?

I've got to imagine there's pressure on Walter when the Owner says we need to improve at that position. I think what we saw from Martin & Posey was what we should expect from 1st year WR that weren't taken in the top half of the first round.

Martin did a good job of getting open. His biggest problem was his drops. LeStar had issues getting open, but I was surprised by how fast he was. & I was thoroughly impressed with Posey, I think he's going to be a prime time player. The achilles might slow him down some next season, but if Damaryius Thomas can come back from an achilles.... I think Posey will be fine.

76Texan
02-12-2013, 03:15 PM
These 2 words should never be used in the same sentence, it's an oxymoron.

Here are a few examples of complex trigonometric formulas:

http://www.suitcaseofdreams.net/Images/BackGround/asin.gif

arctan(z) = 1/2(ln(1 - iz) - (ln(1 + iz))

:kingkong:

Wolf6151
02-12-2013, 04:13 PM
Here are a few examples of complex trigonometric formulas:

http://www.suitcaseofdreams.net/Images/BackGround/asin.gif

arctan(z) = 1/2(ln(1 - iz) - (ln(1 + iz))

:kingkong:

Those look like ancient pictographs left on cave walls by aliens. In the first formula I'm going to assume that Z = Matt Schaub because the absolute value of Matt Schaub is less than 1. In the 2nd formula does arctan(z) = 0? Do I win anything?

76Texan
02-12-2013, 06:05 PM
Those look like ancient pictographs left on cave walls by aliens. In the first formula I'm going to assume that Z = Matt Schaub because the absolute value of Matt Schaub is less than 1. In the 2nd formula does arctan(z) = 0? Do I win anything?

Sorry, nope!
Since Schaub>VY, Schaub#0
=> Arctan(z) # 0

Good try though :)

leebigeztx
02-13-2013, 03:44 AM
Barkley isn't the most athletic QB out there, but his feet are good enough for the WCO.
And no, he doesn't have an average arm like Schaub. Like I said, his range is about 7 yards deeper than Schaub.

He has slow feet. When defenders are at his feet, he can't pick them up,move,and throw an accurate ball. His arm avg unless he gets a perfect pocket. Even then the ball doesn't explode off his hand.

76Texan
02-13-2013, 11:05 AM
He has slow feet. When defenders are at his feet, he can't pick them up,move,and throw an accurate ball. His arm avg unless he gets a perfect pocket. Even then the ball doesn't explode off his hand.

You have Schaub here and you worry about Barkley's feet? :)

With a pretty good offensive line in 2010, Barkley suffered only 8 sacks.
This past year, with the departure of a couple Senior, the injury to Holmes, the rotation at LT as I had mentioned, and having 3 different guys at LG, Barkley was pressured much more, especially up the A gaps (probably the most of among all the QBs in this class, or at least among the top) and he was sacked only 14 times in 11 games. For a QB in a pro system that is asked to go downfield quite often, that's really good.
No, he doesn't have the best mobility in the world, but he's much better than Schaub in this regard (and he's better in other regards, too).

I don't know whether you were trying to knit pick or what.
Barkley may not be a franchise QB, but he's quite likely to become a better pro QB than Schaub.

The QB has got to be able to reset his feet when going through his progression, and his completion rate shows that he's more accurate than you indicate (and that's with receivers dropping more balls for him than other Receivers did for their QBs).
And we're not talking about a guy like whathisname from Boise St the year before who seldom throw a deep pass.

What's the anatomy of a deep ball?
On a 3-step drop in the shotgun or a 7-step drop from under center, the QB has got to have good footwork to make it work well.
To get the ball downfield some 50-52 yards from the LOS (and 60 yards plus in the air) in some 6 seconds such that the receiver can catch it in stride requires a pretty strong arm. (There are other factors that can compensate: a premium angle, a quick release, good throwing mechanics that involve the legs and the arms - but still, they are all tied up together; and your assertions are scientifically impossible.)
No, Barkley doesn't have the arm strength of Jamarcus Russell or Mike Glennon; but he has plenty to do the job.

leebigeztx
02-14-2013, 02:01 AM
You have Schaub here and you worry about Barkley's feet? :)

With a pretty good offensive line in 2010, Barkley suffered only 8 sacks.
This past year, with the departure of a couple Senior, the injury to Holmes, the rotation at LT as I had mentioned, and having 3 different guys at LG, Barkley was pressured much more, especially up the A gaps (probably the most of among all the QBs in this class, or at least among the top) and he was sacked only 14 times in 11 games. For a QB in a pro system that is asked to go downfield quite often, that's really good.
No, he doesn't have the best mobility in the world, but he's much better than Schaub in this regard (and he's better in other regards, too).

I don't know whether you were trying to knit pick or what.
Barkley may not be a franchise QB, but he's quite likely to become a better pro QB than Schaub.

The QB has got to be able to reset his feet when going through his progression, and his completion rate shows that he's more accurate than you indicate (and that's with receivers dropping more balls for him than other Receivers did for their QBs).
And we're not talking about a guy like whathisname from Boise St the year before who seldom throw a deep pass.

What's the anatomy of a deep ball?
On a 3-step drop in the shotgun or a 7-step drop from under center, the QB has got to have good footwork to make it work well.
To get the ball downfield some 50-52 yards from the LOS (and 60 yards plus in the air) in some 6 seconds such that the receiver can catch it in stride requires a pretty strong arm. (There are other factors that can compensate: a premium angle, a quick release, good throwing mechanics that involve the legs and the arms - but still, they are all tied up together; and your assertions are scientifically impossible.)
No, Barkley doesn't have the arm strength of Jamarcus Russell or Mike Glennon; but he has plenty to do the job.

I've watched enough of barkley even before the foolishness of people talking about him going before rg3. His reset combined with his arm talent leave a lot tobe desired. If we're talking about taking a guy in the 1st rd to be a franchise qb,that's not him. He will need a lot,just as much s schaub to be successful in the nfl. When he gets to the combine and he throws,it will solidify what most people already know about him. He has. 3rd rd arm. His deep ball will be consist on throwing the ball in front way before the route to get it there.

b0ng
02-14-2013, 10:55 AM
USC QB's have some kind of aura of failure around them. Palmer was good until his knee got shredded in the playoffs, but other than that . . . yeesh.

NFLDraft101
02-20-2013, 12:30 PM
Potential WR prospect for the Texans in the 2013 NFL Draft?

Justin Hunter - WO - Tennessee

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mW9_vnIO6nw

Wolf6151
02-20-2013, 06:42 PM
Potential WR prospect for the Texans in the 2013 NFL Draft?

Justin Hunter - WO - Tennessee

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mW9_vnIO6nw

I really like Hunter, his athleticism far exceeds most others but he's not perfect. He doesn't have an NFL body, needs to add some muscle/bulk without losing that athleticism. I also question his route tree, how many routes can he run effectively, and question his explosiveness in and out of his breaks. I'd gladly trade up in the high 2nd round and take him. I think he's one of those guys that 2 yrs. from now could be an excellent NFL #1WR for some team, with some work. He just needs some polishing, but he's got all the raw talent.

b0ng
02-21-2013, 12:29 AM
I've seen Tavon Auston WR, WV given to the Texans in a few mocks

Wolf6151
02-21-2013, 01:14 AM
I've seen Tavon Auston WR, WV given to the Texans in a few mocks

JMO but he's to small and hopefully won't be a Texan. I don't think the Texans would be looking for a small WR in the 1st, if they did I'd be shocked. Those mocks are probably by people who don't follow the Texans closely but know that we need a WR and give him to us when he's the next available one on the list.

76Texan
02-22-2013, 09:37 AM
The more I watch, the more I like this draft class (and I have been high on the class already.)

We may have to draft two or three of them, LOL.

Pull up the recent highlights of Dobson and watch his leaping backhand (one-handed) catch at the end and tell me it's not one of the most impressive catches you've seen.

drs23
02-23-2013, 10:46 AM
I haven't seen anyone mention DeAndre Hopkins yet. I've seen him mocked a few times to HOU. Read up on him yesterday and the reports all seemed consistent in his athleticism, route running, separation and catching abilities. One report said he seemed shy going over the middle but most made it a point to mention he had no problems in the middle of the field. Sorry I didn't think to bookmark anything but all I did was google his name.

He was consistently listed as a late 1st round to early 2nd talent.

What are you guy's thoughts about him?

steelbtexan
02-23-2013, 11:26 AM
I haven't seen anyone mention DeAndre Hopkins yet. I've seen him mocked a few times to HOU. Read up on him yesterday and the reports all seemed consistent in his athleticism, route running, separation and catching abilities. One report said he seemed shy going over the middle but most made it a point to mention he had no problems in the middle of the field. Sorry I didn't think to bookmark anything but all I did was google his name.

He was consistently listed as a late 1st round to early 2nd talent.

What are you guy's thoughts about him?

Really good WR, he wont ever be a #1 but he's better than anythig on the current roster outside of AJ.

I like Hunter/Patton/Rodgers more. (they have upside to eventually become #1's)

Number19
02-23-2013, 11:54 AM
I just found a site ( http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/prospectrankings/2013/WR ) where the receivers "workout" 40 times are posted. Terrance Williams was posted as having run a 4.49, one of the faster times of the top receivers. Has the receivers run their 40's at the combine? Up until now, most of the rankings had Williams roughly in the 5 to 7 area, towards the bottom of the first round, the worry being questions on his speed. He may have just jumped up the boards to the 3 to 5 area, probably just beyond our selection. My biggest concern is his hands, they are really small at 8 3/4". Thoughts?

76Texan
02-23-2013, 12:06 PM
I just found a site ( http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/prospectrankings/2013/WR ) where the receivers "workout" 40 times are posted. Terrance Williams was posted as having run a 4.49, one of the faster times of the top receivers. Has the receivers run their 40's at the combine? Up until now, most of the rankings had Williams roughly in the 5 to 7 area, towards the bottom of the first round, the worry being questions on his speed. He may have just jumped up the boards to the 3 to 5 area, probably just beyond our selection. My biggest concern is his hands, they are really small at 8 3/4". Thoughts?

No. I don't think the receivers will run until tomorrow or Mon.

I didn't see T. Williams having problems with dropped balls or catching them, but you never know when he starts seeing more competed situations in the pros.

I would love to get Sammy Watkins next year. That guy was said to have 10-3/4 hands and he's fast like a cheetah.

RT22
02-23-2013, 02:15 PM
I'm starting to like DeAndre Hopkins WR Clemson 6'-1" 214. The more I watch the more I like. Good play speed, strong hands, physical of the line when challenged and a willing blocker.

drs23
02-23-2013, 02:44 PM
Really good WR, he wont ever be a #1 but he's better than anythig on the current roster outside of AJ.

I like Hunter/Patton/Rodgers more. (they have upside to eventually become #1's)

I've seen Quinton Patton mocked to the Texans a few times. Do you think he'll still be on the board @27?

steelbtexan
02-23-2013, 03:58 PM
I've seen Quinton Patton mocked to the Texans a few times. Do you think he'll still be on the board @27?

Yes,

He probably will be there in the middle of the 2nd rd.

Would you be willing to trade a 3rd/5th to move up to say 47-50 range to pick him?

76Texan
02-23-2013, 04:12 PM
Another sleeper who is likely to see his stock rise is Tyrone Goard who measured in at 6'7 (but only 205 lbs and 8-5/8 hands) instead of the listed 6'4 from the school bio.

I heard that he's pretty fast.
Let's see if he can run in the 4'50.

Note that Eastern Kentucky is a run-first offense, with the QB attempted just some 220 passes all year.

drs23
02-23-2013, 04:30 PM
Yes,

He probably will be there in the middle of the 2nd rd.

Would you be willing to trade a 3rd/5th to move up to say 47-50 range to pick him?

Would giving up picks 81 & 135 be better in the long run than what some would consider reaching in the first? I'm not a draft guru but something says to acquire picks as opposed to trading them away. Serious question.

SW H-TOWN
02-23-2013, 05:00 PM
It's pretty simple, just draft the guy who can go deep and catch the underthrown pass :fingergun:

76Texan
02-24-2013, 09:52 AM
Another sleeper who is likely to see his stock rise is Tyrone Goard who measured in at 6'7 (but only 205 lbs and 8-5/8 hands) instead of the listed 6'4 from the school bio.

I heard that he's pretty fast.
Let's see if he can run in the 4'50.

Note that Eastern Kentucky is a run-first offense, with the QB attempted just some 220 passes all year.

Dang, he ran a 4.44

deucetx
02-24-2013, 10:44 AM
For the love of god all this damn speed out there. Just read an article about Austin and Goodwin's runs. Now that is some killer speed.

http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/blog/rob-rang/21760769/2013-nfl-combine-austin-goodwin-run-425-in-40-yard-dash

The fact some clocked Goodwin at 4.19....yeah I'm glad I told my son to run track to work on his speed more because these kids are getting faster. Whether the Texans are looking at any of these little speedsters remains to be seen but not sure I would be all that disappointed as I felt previously with the idea of Austin. Granted I don't think Schaub could get it to a guy that fast lol.

TexansSeminole
02-24-2013, 11:05 AM
Really good WR, he wont ever be a #1 but he's better than anythig on the current roster outside of AJ.


Why not?

steelbtexan
02-24-2013, 11:17 AM
Why not?

He doesn't have the physical ability to be like these guys,

1. CJ
2.AJ
3. Julio Jones
4. Marshall
5. Wayne
6.AJ Green

These are some of the guys I consider to be true #1's

The only chance he has to become a WR1 would be a guy like Fitzgerald and I dont see Hopkins as a Fitz type of WR. With that said if the Texans draft Hopkins he would immediately become the best WR on the team besides AJ.

TexansSeminole
02-24-2013, 11:23 AM
He doesn't have the physical ability to be like these guys,

1. CJ
2.AJ
3. Julio Jones
4. Marshall
5. Wayne
6.AJ Green

These are some of the guys I consider to be true #1's

The only chance he has to become a WR1 would be a guy like Fitzgerald and I dont see Hopkins as a Fitz type of WR. With that said if the Texans draft Hopkins he would immediately become the best WR on the team besides AJ.

You mean like a superstar receiver? I don't think he will be one of those types either.

I think the comparison to Roddy White is a pretty good one for Hopkins.

steelbtexan
02-24-2013, 11:36 AM
You mean like a superstar receiver? I don't think he will be one of those types either.

I think the comparison to Roddy White is a pretty good one for Hopkins.

I see him as more of a Justin Blackmon/Crabtree kinda guy.

Like I said before, not bad but not a stud.

76Texan
02-24-2013, 12:03 PM
Justin Hunter is just killing it today; pending the gauntlet drill, he might just sneak into the first round. At least I think he will be a mid second rounder.
Too bad for the Texans!

Hagar
02-24-2013, 07:07 PM
The fact some clocked Goodwin at 4.19.

I remember watching the Senior Bowl practices and thinking Goodwin was a speedster, but a sub 4.2 - Daaang!

steelbtexan
02-24-2013, 10:09 PM
Justin Hunter is just killing it today; pending the gauntlet drill, he might just sneak into the first round. At least I think he will be a mid second rounder.
Too bad for the Texans!

If Hunter or Patterson are there at 27 that's my pick.

Future WR1's

badboy
02-24-2013, 10:13 PM
If Hunter or Patterson are there at 27 that's my pick.

Future WR1'sWasn't Hunter one of the last in 3 cone drill?

76Texan
02-24-2013, 10:23 PM
Wasn't Hunter one of the last in 3 cone drill?

I don't think he participated in the 3 - Cone.

I don't think Patterson will last to our spot.
Hunter might, and I'm tempted to take him, though I would feel better slotting him early in the second round.

steelbtexan
02-24-2013, 11:02 PM
I don't think he participated in the 3 - Cone.

I don't think Patterson will last to our spot.
Hunter might, and I'm tempted to take him, though I would feel better slotting him early in the second round.

I forgot to add Rodgers to that group, he really impressed me despite only running a 4.52. He has some of the best hands in this draft and is very physical.

Although I agree with you about Hunter, if I couldn't get over Rodgers character problems I would make a slight reach for Hunter.

He was a 1st rd talent before the ACL and he should be able to get back to that level of play. If he does reach the 2011 level that would make him a top 10 level talent. IMHO (A.J. Green)

aussie_texan
02-25-2013, 12:01 AM
If Hunter or Patterson are there at 27 that's my pick.

Future WR1's

couldnt agree more.

b0ng
02-25-2013, 11:34 AM
If Hunter or Patterson are there at 27 that's my pick.

Future WR1's

Patterson blew a lot of interviews yesterday and had a few problems with the catching drills. I think he'll be there at 27 and there is a decent chance that I think the Texans will pass on him if the interviews are that bad.

This kid being a JUCO transfer because of grades, and then having to declare because of said grades gives him some of those sweet sweet red flags that may make him drop, but will also probably put him lower on the Texans draft board.

EDIT: I think DaRick Rogers could also be a #1 in the NFL if he pans out in the NFL but he also has character issues.

Brisco_County
02-25-2013, 12:13 PM
If Hunter or Patterson are there at 27 that's my pick.

Future WR1's

I like Hunter too, but I don't think we'd take him if he's there. Remember why we're going back to the well in the first place: The #2 WR we drafted last year had a latent injury risk that ended up biting us. That now puts Smith in a position where he can't take that risk again.

b0ng
02-25-2013, 12:36 PM
I like Hunter too, but I don't think we'd take him if he's there. Remember why we're going back to the well in the first place: The #2 WR we drafted last year had a latent injury risk that ended up biting us. That now puts Smith in a position where he can't take that risk again.

If you are talking about DeVier Posey can you explain how he was an injury risk?

Brisco_County
02-25-2013, 12:40 PM
If you are talking about DeVier Posey can you explain how he was an injury risk?

I don't have much time to post since I'm at work, but CnD's post on the subject sums it up:

Achilles tendon rupture is very commonly preceded by an "aura" tendonitis. The continued inflammation eventually breaks down and weakens the tendon until it finally ruptures. Going into the Draft, one of the significant concerns was his size because he seemed to always be dealing with a list of "minor" injuries. Many said that he would have to bulk up to be successful in the NFL.

You may find it interesting to know that throughout his college career, he would wear a patellar tendon band below his knee joint, sometimes on the right, sometimes on the left and sometimes on both sides. Patellar tendon bands are worn by athletes that are having problems due to patellar tendonitis (inflammation/also known as Jumper's or Runner's knee [remember Cushing's patellar tendon rupture]).


http://wac.450f.edgecastcdn.net/80450F/tsminteractive.com/files/2011/10/danherron.jpg

http://cdn.c.photoshelter.com/img-get/I0000zsJHM9q.Wig/s/750/750/DeVier-Posey-Ohio-State-vs-Oregon-Rose-Bowl.jpg

http://www.wosn.tv/btpblog/wp-content/uploads/2011/10/DeVier-Posey-back-to-pass-vs-NMSU-2009.jpg


Link (http://www.texanstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=97846&page=3).

b0ng
02-25-2013, 01:10 PM
Reading that particular post and draft profiles of Posey there's nothing really saying that he was a large injury risk leading up to the draft (Usually it's guys with multiple ACL tears which have you worried). As far as Posey before the draft, his size was the concern because he had minor injuries, but there is nothing really from his draft profiles saying he's a big injury risk. Just got dinged up a lot.

I think the reason we are going back to the well this year is because Martin and Jean both were non-starters in 2012 and the only guy who did look decent (albeit at the end of the season once his playing time increased) had a nasty injury. Pretty unfortunate set of circumstances, but this is a pretty good year to go get a pass catcher or two in the draft.

tru80texan
02-25-2013, 01:42 PM
Reading that particular post and draft profiles of Posey there's nothing really saying that he was a large injury risk leading up to the draft (Usually it's guys with multiple ACL tears which have you worried). As far as Posey before the draft, his size was the concern because he had minor injuries, but there is nothing really from his draft profiles saying he's a big injury risk. Just got dinged up a lot.

I think the reason we are going back to the well this year is because Martin and Jean both were non-starters in 2012 and the only guy who did look decent (albeit at the end of the season once his playing time increased) had a nasty injury. Pretty unfortunate set of circumstances, but this is a pretty good year to go get a pass catcher or two in the draft.

I realize you stated "multiple" ACL injuries should have you worried, but isn't it worth noting that Hunter recently came off of one of his own in 2011. I like Hunter, but you would think that has to be taken into consideration if the Texans are concerned w/ past injuries. OD had multiple ACL injuries in the past, in high school & college, & then eventually had one w/ the Texans. With that being said, would you believe T. Williams or D. Hopkins could offer the same upside w/ less of a injury history. I think thet both have potential. I even like Wheaton out of Oregon St but he's a bit smaller.

One player I've read about but haven't seen much of is Dobson out of Marshall. Everything I've read has been decent on him. Whats the word on him for those that have seen him perform?

b0ng
02-25-2013, 01:58 PM
I realize you stated "multiple" ACL injuries should have you worried, but isn't it worth noting that Hunter recently came off of one of his own in 2011. I like Hunter, but you would think that has to be taken into consideration if the Texans are concerned w/ past injuries. OD had multiple ACL injuries in the past, in high school & college, & then eventually had one w/ the Texans. With that being said, would you believe T. Williams or D. Hopkins could offer the same upside w/ less of a injury history. I think thet both have potential. I even like Wheaton out of Oregon St but he's a bit smaller.

One player I've read about but haven't seen much of is Dobson out of Marshall. Everything I've read has been decent on him. Whats the word on him for those that have seen him perform?

I've only seen him with one ACL tear (Sept, 2011) and nothing before really so it's tough to say that his injury history is more of a flag than his hands. I think out of the guys you listed (Williams, Hopkins, Hunter) Williams looked like he had the most inconsistent hands during the drills and was the slowest so I think he'll drop. Hunter is a guy who was coming off of an ACL tear in 2012 and was pretty good, but he wasn't like he was in 2010, so you worry with that, coupled with him weighing in at a slender 196lbs. Hopkins looked great so far and I have to have him as the top prospect out of the 3 listed. I'd probably put Williams second and Hunter 3rd just based on size and injury history.

I really like Hopkins though so I'm probably very biased. He just looks like an NFL receiver playing for Clemson. Big guy, decent hands, maybe doesn't have a top gear like guys like TY Hilton or Desean Jackson, but the kid can play and make big plays.

Also, I'm willing to bet that the Texans are going to take a very long look at Ryan Swope if he's there in the 3rd around their pick.

TexansSeminole
02-25-2013, 02:09 PM
I really like Hopkins though so I'm probably very biased. He just looks like an NFL receiver playing for Clemson. Big guy, decent hands, maybe doesn't have a top gear like guys like TY Hilton or Desean Jackson, but the kid can play and make big plays.


This is basically where I am with receivers as well. I am probably pretty biased because I just love Hopkins. I have seen him play for years and he just has a knack for beating his man and making big plays. Sometimes you just watch a guy and can tell he can play at a high level. He destroyed Amerson when they played NC State for two years in a row. He had a hell of a battle with Xavier Rhodes when Clemson played FSU early last season. He won that matchup in my opinion and Xavier Rhodes is my favorite FSU player.

Like b0ng said, he isn't overly fast but he really does have a quick and decisive first step. You can see it on his run after catch and in his route running.

Some video of Hopkins in 5 games of 2012: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oTJjRlGOCjk

Also the LSU game: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dCVWGxNjF_k

He killed LSU in that game. It took about 1 quarter for them to figure out that they didn't have a player on their sideline that could cover Hopkins. And they paid for it.

Another: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bVWm9pNiXYY

Another showing him just catch one handers off a machine: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dwB5J11rmdU. Doesn't really mean much but it is kind of cool.

tru80texan
02-25-2013, 02:12 PM
I've only seen him with one ACL tear (Sept, 2011) and nothing before really so it's tough to say that his injury history is more of a flag than his hands. I think out of the guys you listed (Williams, Hopkins, Hunter) Williams looked like he had the most inconsistent hands during the drills and was the slowest so I think he'll drop. Hunter is a guy who was coming off of an ACL tear in 2012 and was pretty good, but he wasn't like he was in 2010, so you worry with that, coupled with him weighing in at a slender 196lbs. Hopkins looked great so far and I have to have him as the top prospect out of the 3 listed. I'd probably put Williams second and Hunter 3rd just based on size and injury history.

I really like Hopkins though so I'm probably very biased. He just looks like an NFL receiver playing for Clemson. Big guy, decent hands, maybe doesn't have a top gear like guys like TY Hilton or Desean Jackson, but the kid can play and make big plays.

Also, I'm willing to bet that the Texans are going to take a very long look at Ryan Swope if he's there in the 3rd around their pick.

Yeah, that weight on Hunter concerns me some because if he attempts to bulk up & his knee becomes an issue then you would think the additional weight would only compound the problem. He definitely needs to gain weight imo.

I like Hopkins as well, but many will knock him because of his speed. I still believe he could be a good player despite that due to his size & hands. The Roddy White comparison seems to be one that is actually fitting of him & I would be elated if that were the case & he was a Texan.

I think plenty of teams are going to take a look at Swope after his combine performance. He definitely raised his stock & he could be that one player that gets taken earlier then most expected. The Texans could be the one. They reached, imo, on Bullock last season so Swope could be the next Aggie reach for them.

tru80texan
02-25-2013, 02:17 PM
So I'm guessing no one has seen much on Dobson out of Marshall? I've read about him, but haven't seen him yet. I watched the Senior Bowl practices but can't remember much about him which is probably not a good thing.

76Texan
02-25-2013, 02:27 PM
So I'm guessing no one has seen much on Dobson out of Marshall? I've read about him, but haven't seen him yet. I watched the Senior Bowl practices but can't remember much about him which is probably not a good thing.

Most of the receivers, including Dobson, have been covered on the WR in this draft class thread.

I've been on them since last year.

Dobson had a good Senior Bowl week.

He's one of the more "physical" receivers who give the QB some room along the side line to operate with (unlike A.J. Jenkins who was drafted in the first round by the Niners last year.)

Go back to page one of this thread.

Dobson was also mentioned in at least one other thread that I remember.

CretorFrigg
02-25-2013, 02:28 PM
What do you guys think about Josh Boyce as a later round WR? He's got the speed and could stretch the field for us.

badboy
02-25-2013, 02:31 PM
So I'm guessing no one has seen much on Dobson out of Marshall? I've read about him, but haven't seen him yet. I watched the Senior Bowl practices but can't remember much about him which is probably not a good thing.Hope this helps:


Dobson lacks Wheaton's rare speed but is a savvy route-runner whose body control and reliable hands made him a standout throughout practice. He made arguably the catch of the day early on, leaping high and contorting his body to haul in a difficult deep pass over tight coverage and came up limping. Dobson was held out of much of the remaining one on one drills but showed his toughness in returning during the 11 on 11 scrimmage towards the end of practice. Dobson hasn't generated as much attention as many of the other receivers in Mobile but impressed me with his attention to detail. He sets up defensive backs well, selling his routes to push defensive backs deep even on running plays and showing off strength and determination as a downfield blocker. He also consistently worked his way back to the quarterback, drawing praise from the Washington staff.
http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/blog/rob-rang/21599268/2013-senior-bowl-trufant-stands-out-at-north-practice-again

badboy
02-25-2013, 02:35 PM
What do you guys think about Josh Boyce as a later round WR? He's got the speed and could stretch the field for us.My 2 cents is we need to get WR2 starter by round three. Use later rounds to fill minor needs or trade up. I would not be opposed to drafting Terrence Williams first then Da'Rick Rogers for slot with Posey out most of year and cutting Walter.

76Texan
02-25-2013, 02:42 PM
What do you guys think about Josh Boyce as a later round WR? He's got the speed and could stretch the field for us.

I've been looking at him since yesterday with mixed thought.
He's one of the few draftable receivers I haven't paid hardly any attention to.

What are we going to do with Martin if we draft a guy in the late round with somewhat similar skill set?

On the other hand, since we have all those extra picks, we can afford to move around to bring in competition if we so choose.

And then again, there are guys who may go undrafted that we can take a look at (Ace Sanders and Reggie Dunn - I hope I get their names right.)

steelbtexan
02-25-2013, 03:01 PM
Due to injury history I would go with Rodgers, but wouldn't be scared to go back to the well for Hunter. Jerry Rice had an ACL and it didn't seem to slow him down. ACL surgeies are common to come back and be able to perform at a high level.

I like Hopkins too be think the Tennessee guys have more WR1 upside.

b0ng
02-25-2013, 03:05 PM
Due to injury history I would go with Rodgers, but wouldn't be scared to go back to the well for Hunter. Jerry Rice had an ACL and it didn't seem to slow him down. ACL surgeies are common to come back and be able to perform at a high level.

I like Hopkins too be think the Tennessee guys have more WR1 upside.

Hunter is so slender though and it doesn't look like he can pack on a ton of muscle to that frame. He doesn't really have a #1 WR body.

tru80texan
02-25-2013, 03:13 PM
Hunter is so slender though and it doesn't look like he can pack on a ton of muscle to that frame. He doesn't really have a #1 WR body.

That's what I'm thinking. My concern is his frame. He has had a knee issue & future knee issues can't be ruled out if he bulks up, which seems to be needed. I like his upside, but you have to wonder what additional weight would not only do to his health but also his speed.

greekdbag
02-25-2013, 03:40 PM
In the first two rounds, I would be fine with Hopkins, Hunter, Rodgers, Patton, Woods, Williams, Dobson, King, Hamilton, and Wheaton. I do not think Allen, Patterson, and Austin will be there when we pick in the first.

aussie_texan
02-25-2013, 06:17 PM
Hunter is so slender though and it doesn't look like he can pack on a ton of muscle to that frame. He doesn't really have a #1 WR body.

Tell that to aj green

steelbtexan
02-25-2013, 06:18 PM
Hunter is so slender though and it doesn't look like he can pack on a ton of muscle to that frame. He doesn't really have a #1 WR body.

His body type reminds me of A.J. Green when he came out of college, 6'4 207 LBS. 4.5

They're comparable, Hunter needs to put on about 10 Lbs. He certainly has the frame to do so.

The ACL bothers me a little, but if Hunter didn't have the ACL, he probably wouldn't be there at 27.

The question for me is do I take Hunter (ACL) or Rodgers (Pot) at 27? I would probably go with Rodgers. Gary will probably take the safest route possible and pick Hopkins, which would be a solid pick. But wouldn't have the upside of a Rodgers/Hunter.

aussie_texan
02-25-2013, 06:21 PM
That's what I'm thinking. My concern is his frame. He has had a knee issue & future knee issues can't be ruled out if he bulks up, which seems to be needed. I like his upside, but you have to wonder what additional weight would not only do to his health but also his speed.

I'm not sure this is entirely true. I'm currently 3 months removed from an acl reconstruction and its highly said to bulk up the muscles around the knee to give it more stability in the future. Especially the quad muscle on the interior on the thigh near the knee. Him adding 20 pounds will not harm him or his knee.
His already put on 16pounds and he got faster. So another 10 won't do him any harm

thunderkyss
02-25-2013, 06:35 PM
I think the reason we are going back to the well this year is because Martin and Jean both were non-starters in 2012 and the only guy who did look decent (albeit at the end of the season once his playing time increased) had a nasty injury. Pretty unfortunate set of circumstances, but this is a pretty good year to go get a pass catcher or two in the draft.

I really liked what we saw out of Martin. But I think he was drafted to be a #3 or slot receiver. I thought he did a heck of a job getting open early in the progression, he just needs to do a better job of holding onto the ball. I think that's fine, for a rookie, & we're going to see that regardless if it's Julio Jones, or Kevin Martin.

Martin doesn't have that big play ability like Julio, but I don't think that's what we're looking for.

I think we're going back to the well, because there's not a lot of reason to believe Posey is going to be able to take the next step in 2013

steelbtexan
02-25-2013, 06:44 PM
I really liked what we saw out of Martin. But I think he was drafted to be a #3 or slot receiver. I thought he did a heck of a job getting open early in the progression, he just needs to do a better job of holding onto the ball. I think that's fine, for a rookie, & we're going to see that regardless if it's Julio Jones, or Kevin Martin.

Martin doesn't have that big play ability like Julio, but I don't think that's what we're looking for.

I think we're going back to the well, because there's not a lot of reason to believe Posey is going to be able to take the next step in 2013

Martin is a JAG on a playoff team. There needs to be competition throughout the WR corps. This is why I hope they take Rodgers/Hunter in the 1st and Swope in the 3rd. Then there will be real weapons/speed at the WR and great competition that will make the WR corps better all around. Which the Texans have never really had since their inception

ralph
02-25-2013, 06:46 PM
I'd rather go S (Matt Elam) 1st then Woods in the 2nd. Woods is a really great receiver.

Wouldn't be too mad about Hunter or Hopkins in the 1st though.

drs23
02-25-2013, 06:51 PM
Martin is a JAG on a playoff team. There needs to be competition throughout the WR corps. This is why I hope they take Rodgers/Hunter in the 1st and Swope in the 3rd. Then there will be real weapons/speed at the WR and great competition that will make the WR corps better all around. Which the Texans have never really had since their inception

Steelb,

Do you think Swope will be there in the 3rd after surprising folks at the combine? I'm not so sure.

TexansSeminole
02-25-2013, 07:38 PM
I'd rather go S (Matt Elam) 1st then Woods in the 2nd. Woods is a really great receiver.

Wouldn't be too mad about Hunter or Hopkins in the 1st though.

If that is possible, I would be all for it. Matt Elam is a great football player. He commands respect and is a proven leader as well.

tru80texan
02-25-2013, 07:57 PM
I'd rather go S (Matt Elam) 1st then Woods in the 2nd. Woods is a really great receiver.

Wouldn't be too mad about Hunter or Hopkins in the 1st though.

Any WR, but a USC WR. They seem to be wayyyyyy more hype then production going back to the highly overrated Keyshawn Johnson.

TexansSeminole
02-25-2013, 09:15 PM
Any WR, but a USC WR. They seem to be wayyyyyy more hype then production going back to the highly overrated Keyshawn Johnson.

Any prediction of a player based off the success of other players from that school that play the same position is not to be taken seriously.

tru80texan
02-26-2013, 06:03 AM
Any prediction of a player based off the success of other players from that school that play the same position is not to be taken seriously.

And how many WR's have come out of USC w/ hype only to disappoint? I realize what you are saying, but its similar to offensive players coming out of the University of Texas. They simply haven't transitioned well to the NFL & very few have had success of late. It's a preference & opinion based on the university's past similar to Penn St being dubbed "LB U", doesn't mean that all their LB's will have success, but they've done well producing some quality ones. I realize that is not the say all end all for a position based on the school, but that was just a opinion & not a rule or standard that I expected be used to set the draft board. :rolleyes: Take a breather, everything is not that serious.:)

thunderkyss
02-26-2013, 08:47 AM
...but its similar to offensive players coming out of the University of Texas.

I thought they did pretty good with runningbacks.

tru80texan
02-26-2013, 08:58 AM
I thought they did pretty good with runningbacks.

Not the big names such as Benson & Williams. The Bears gave up on Benson & Williams couldnt get his head straight after NO's gave up a ton for him. They did ok later in their careers, but nothing near what many envisioned them doing. Charles is doing well & Holmes success was unexpected to most when he came out considering Williams was pushing him in college. Throw in Colt, VY, Roy Williams coupled w/ Benson's & Williams limited success & it doesn't equate to much success for the offensive side of the ball.

TexansSeminole
02-26-2013, 09:35 AM
And how many WR's have come out of USC w/ hype only to disappoint? I realize what you are saying, but its similar to offensive players coming out of the University of Texas. They simply haven't transitioned well to the NFL & very few have had success of late. It's a preference & opinion based on the university's past similar to Penn St being dubbed "LB U", doesn't mean that all their LB's will have success, but they've done well producing some quality ones. I realize that is not the say all end all for a position based on the school, but that was just a opinion & not a rule or standard that I expected be used to set the draft board. :rolleyes: Take a breather, everything is not that serious.:)

You sounded pretty serious to me, as it is the second time I have seen you post it on the board, I was just pointing out that it is not taken seriously.

http://www.texanstalk.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2128619&postcount=8

tru80texan
02-26-2013, 10:38 AM
You sounded pretty serious to me, as it is the second time I have seen you post it on the board, I was just pointing out that it is not taken seriously.

http://www.texanstalk.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2128619&postcount=8

And I stand by what I say, so please read it again along w/ my explanation. It's a "personal preference" & "opinion", but one based on the past performances of former USC WR's having been more hype then production. Some schools are known for producing certain types of players at certain positions. That's why some covet Bama CB's because of Saban's reputation for developing them. Very similar to the Penn St reference I mentioned earlier concerning LB's. Hardly a difficult concept to understand. USC has had multiple highly touted WR's come out, but have yet to produce one that has done anything of significance. So therefore their track record for developing the position is really not that impressive.

If you can't understand that simple explanation, then let's just agree to disagree because I've tried explaining it more then once now & yet you can't seem to grasp that some schools develop certain positions better then others. Doesn't mean that a player can't eventually develop, but USC WR's have had issues over the years & I do have my doubts about them. Once again, its my "opinion" but one based on history. Similar to how some question spread offense QB's being able to adapt & produce in pro offenses. It's an opinion & preference. Not that difficult.

Mine nor your opinions are being used to draft future Texans SO that is ultimately why it is NOT that serious, not that I didn't mean what I said or believe it....for a bit more clarification. Chill out, have a nice day, & try not to kick your dog. Geez...

76Texan
02-26-2013, 10:48 AM
It's like saying Baylor QBs sucked, don't draft RG III.
That's crazy!

Do you know that Baylor had had 8 QBs in the pros before Griffin; two were drafted high in the first, one in the second, and one in the third. They combined to start ten games in the pros.

Is that a good reason for not drafting Robert Griffin III?

TexansSeminole
02-26-2013, 10:48 AM
And I stand by what I say, so please read it again along w/ my explanation. It's a "personal preference" & "opinion", but one based on the past performances of former USC WR's having been more hype then production. Some schools are known for producing certain types of players at certain positions. That's why some covet Bama CB's because of Saban's reputation for developing them. Very similar to the Penn St reference I mentioned earlier concerning LB's. Hardly a difficult concept to understand. USC has had multiple highly touted WR's come out, but have yet to produce one that has done anything of significance. So therefore their track record for developing the position is really not that impressive.

If you can't understand that simple explanation, then let's just agree to disagree because I've tried explaining it more then once now & yet you can't seem to grasp that some schools develop certain positions better then others. Doesn't mean that a player can't eventually develop, but USC WR's have had issues over the years & I do have my doubts about them. Once again, its my "opinion" but one based on history. Similar to how some question spread offense QB's being able to adapt & produce in pro offenses. It's an opinion & preference. Not that difficult.

Mine nor your opinions are being used to draft future Texans SO that is ultimately why it is NOT that serious, not that I didn't mean what I said or believe it....for a bit more clarification. Chill out, have a nice day, & try not to kick your dog. Geez...

It's a different coaching staff, but ok. We will definitely agree to disagree.

steelbtexan
02-26-2013, 11:43 AM
Steelb,

Do you think Swope will be there in the 3rd after surprising folks at the combine? I'm not so sure.

With the depth in this WR class, Swope is more of a slot guy and the fact that he had a poor Sr bowl I think it's a good possibilty he would be there in the 3rd. But it only take 1 team to like you to go in the 1st rd for example and a team like the Rams could fall in love with Swope and pick him before the Texans pick.

If the Texans pick a WR in the 1st and Swope is there in the 3rd would you pick him? I would. Swope is a player and tested much better than I anticipated.

tru80texan
02-26-2013, 12:08 PM
It's a different coaching staff, but ok. We will definitely agree to disagree.

Was not Lane Kiffen a member of the USC coaching staff that produced those WR's? In fact, if I recall he was even the position coach for WR at one time & then eventually progressed to the OC & now the HC. He has been a key member of USC in some capacity excluding 2007-2009. It is a different staff w/ one key member being the same, which may lead some to believe the philosophy on how to develop certain positions may still be very similar to those that existed in 2001 at USC considering Kiffen once led the position & now leads the whole program. That being said...ok, we can agree to disagree.

tru80texan
02-26-2013, 12:29 PM
It's like saying Baylor QBs sucked, don't draft RG III.
That's crazy!

Do you know that Baylor had had 8 QBs in the pros before Griffin; two were drafted high in the first, one in the second, and one in the third. They combined to start ten games in the pros.

Is that a good reason for not drafting Robert Griffin III?

All 8 of those Baylor QB's had the same coaching staff when they entered the NFL?!?! WOW! I don't recall that being the case!! 8 QB's in a league that was started in 1920, what a track record of success! :sarcasm:

You didn't quite get the point & your extreme was far from an accurate portrayal of what was being discussed. Thanks anyways. :toropalm:

greekdbag
02-26-2013, 02:30 PM
All 8 of those Baylor QB's had the same coaching staff when they entered the NFL?!?! WOW! I don't recall that being the case!! 8 QB's in a league that was started in 1920, what a track record of success! :sarcasm:

You didn't quite get the point & your extreme was far from an accurate portrayal of what was being discussed. Thanks anyways. :toropalm:

I understand what you're saying, but this would only be one of the many factors to take into consideration when drafting a player. I never thought Dwayne Jarrett was that good to be honest and Steve Smith had some nice years before he had major knee surgery. Marquise Lee and Robert Woods are both going to be good pro receivers in my opinion.

TexansSeminole
02-26-2013, 02:46 PM
I understand what you're saying, but this would only be one of the many factors to take into consideration when drafting a player. I never thought Dwayne Jarrett was that good to be honest and Steve Smith had some nice years before he had major knee surgery. Marquise Lee and Robert Woods are both going to be good pro receivers in my opinion.

I doubt they will be good, Dwayne Jarrett sucked.

tru80texan
02-26-2013, 02:59 PM
I understand what you're saying, but this would only be one of the many factors to take into consideration when drafting a player. I never thought Dwayne Jarrett was that good to be honest and Steve Smith had some nice years before he had major knee surgery. Marquise Lee and Robert Woods are both going to be good pro receivers in my opinion.

I am speaking English...thank you! LOL! True, it is one factor & as I said earlier its just my opinion & personal preference concerning USC WR's. Having an opinion is frowned upon by some on here & a hard concept to understand. Steve Smith had a decent couple of years, but he hasn't reclaimed that magic since leaving the Giants. Could be a combo of injury & system. Who knows. Woods & Lee may be decent some day...only time will tell. There's more to Woods that I don't care for such as his very slender build & allowing the ball to get body quite often, but that's beside the point because some can't get past my opinion of the coach & school. LOL! What can you do....:)

76Texan
02-26-2013, 03:42 PM
I am speaking English...thank you! LOL! True, it is one factor & as I said earlier its just my opinion & personal preference concerning USC WR's. Having an opinion is frowned upon by some on here & a hard concept to understand. Steve Smith had a decent couple of years, but he hasn't reclaimed that magic since leaving the Giants. Could be a combo of injury & system. Who knows. Woods & Lee may be decent some day...only time will tell. There's more to Woods that I don't care for such as his very slender build & allowing the ball to get body quite often, but that's beside the point because some can't get past my opinion of the coach & school. LOL! What can you do....:)

It is not frowned upon, that you worry about a collegiate program not being good at developing receivers.

What is frowned upon is the fact that you look at it without any regard to each individual case; ie. you came to a conclusion without evaluating the data in depth.

While it is true that it is your personal preference, it is not true that it's a correct method to evaluate future prospects.

Just because Kolb was developed by Art Briles running a "gimmick" offense
and failed at the NFL level doesn't mean that RG III should get a red flag during the draft process.

Just because Kolb accumulated stats in the CUSA doesn't mean that Briles' system wouldn't work in the Big 12.

Just because Keenum ran a similar offense that was continued by Sumlin in the CUSA doesn't mean that the Aggies would have a hard time competing in the SEC.

OK, never mind, I ramble off the topic.
Don't include the second part into this discussion.
I just want to leave it there. :)

tru80texan
02-26-2013, 04:08 PM
It is not frowned upon, that you worry about a collegiate program not being good at developing receivers.

What is frowned upon is the fact that you look at it without any regard to each individual case; ie. you came to a conclusion without evaluating the data in depth.

While it is true that it is your personal preference, it is not true that it's a correct method to evaluate future prospects.

Just because Kolb was developed by Art Briles running a "gimmick" offense
and failed at the NFL level doesn't mean that RG III should get a red flag during the draft process.

Just because Kolb accumulated stats in the CUSA doesn't mean that Briles' system wouldn't work in the Big 12.

Just because Keenum ran a similar offense that was continued by Sumlin in the CUSA doesn't mean that the Aggies would have a hard time competing in the SEC.

OK, never mind, I ramble off the topic.
Don't include the second part into this discussion.
I just want to leave it there. :)

Really...that's why I included in the post that you quoted OTHER reasons why I'm not fond of Woods as a player. So yes, other factors have been considered. Your rebuttal doesn't hold water considering I did state those other factors outside of USC being unable to develop a quality WR w/ Kiffen as a member of the staff in some capacity.

Once again, its my opinion that I don't think highly of WR's coming out of USC because others have faultered in the past despite seeming to have all the physical tools & being touted as such. Whether you frown upon it or not in the end doesn't mean much because it is my opinion. It's not a tough concept to grasp if you think about it. Just think of it as how you choose not to find any fault w/ any aspect of the Texans...its your flawed opinion but in the end it doesnt matter how wrong it is because it is yours & you are entitled to it. Pretty simple if you ask me. Moving on now. :)

TexansSeminole
02-26-2013, 04:27 PM
I didn't mean for this to hijack the thread, I was simply poking for fun.

Anybody think any of the receivers dropped alot because of their combine performance?

76Texan
02-26-2013, 04:30 PM
What are those other factors you talked about except for Kiffin?

Are you talking about hype?
Hype is what you take upon yourself.
Personally, I haven't hyped up any USC receiver ever.


Anyway, I agree to move on.
The only other thing I want to say is that I never take anything personal either.

I simply like to hear an opinion based on keen observation over one based on small glimpses and personal preferences.

thunderkyss
02-26-2013, 04:42 PM
Anybody think any of the receivers dropped alot because of their combine performance?

No, but those USC receivers are dropping like rocks.

76Texan
02-26-2013, 04:52 PM
I didn't mean for this to hijack the thread, I was simply poking for fun.

Anybody think any of the receivers dropped alot because of their combine performance?

I don't know how much is a lot, but Hamilton and Woods didn't show as well as I thought they would in the 40s, SS, 3-cone, long jump and vertical.
(I think Hamilton didn't do the 3-cone.)

Hopkins didn't show as well as I'd like to see either.
I wonder if he's still getting used to the addl' weight.

These guys need to show better at their pro days in those lacking areas.

aussie_texan
02-26-2013, 06:42 PM
the 7 picks following our first, 4 of which have needs at receiver. i think if there is a player we really want at the early part of the 2nd we should just take him at 27 unless we run a large risk of loosing him

steelbtexan
02-26-2013, 07:23 PM
I didn't mean for this to hijack the thread, I was simply poking for fun.

Anybody think any of the receivers dropped alot because of their combine performance?

Hamilton/Williams/Allen.

Williams didn't look like a 1st rd pick to me.

Hamilton didn't run well and there are questions about his hands.

Allen not working out will probably drop him to the bottom of the 1st rd. If he's there at 27 would you pick him?

tru80texan
02-26-2013, 08:04 PM
Hamilton/Williams/Allen.

Williams didn't look like a 1st rd pick to me.

Hamilton didn't run well and there are questions about his hands.

Allen not working out will probably drop him to the bottom of the 1st rd. If he's there at 27 would you pick him?

No on Allen if Hopkins or Hunter are available. Just finished watching some more video of Hunter, Hopkins, Woods, Patton, & Dobson & I was really impressed w/ Hunter, Hopkins, & Dobson. Not sure if Dobson would be 1st round talent, but I do believe Hopkins & Hunter are even w/ Hunter having a past knee injury.

76Texan
02-27-2013, 06:08 PM
All I can say is that long before this draft process, I "promised" a receiver draft class that might be better than the last one in both quality and quantity, despite a run on receivers last year where 13 guys were drafted in the first 3 rounds (4,5,4) and 33 total, not even counting Josh Gordon in the supplemental draft.

In term of talent level, I think there should be more than 13 that should be graded as 3rd rounder or higher; what do you think?

Lucky
02-27-2013, 07:00 PM
In term of talent level, I think there should be more than 13 that should be graded as 3rd rounder or higher; what do you think?
CBSsports.com's draft ranking has (http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/prospectrankings/2013/WR) 13-15 WRs going through 3 rounds. They're as good as any other internet draft site, so that sounds like a safe assumption. 13 or more WRs have gone in the opening 3 rounds in 5 of the past 6 drafts.

Playoffs
03-09-2013, 05:20 PM
Mark your calendar for Elon's Aaron Mellette.
They have only 2 games on TV (UNC - ACC Network and another game on ESPN3). This guy looks pretty good on the videos I've found so far.
His production is outstanding. Will probably go in the first 3 rounds, maybe on day 1...

Greg Cosell is with you on Mellette. All I saw was NC & wasn't impressive & '11 AS where he dominated a small CB. Bad drops in both.

76Texan
03-11-2013, 10:55 AM
Greg Cosell is with you on Mellette. All I saw was NC & wasn't impressive & '11 AS where he dominated a small CB. Bad drops in both.

I didn't get to watch the UNC game, just the short clip on YouTube.
Melette is pretty raw in his route running and he seems to be a bit stiff in the hips (as his 20 SS time indicates).
That might be part of the reasons he doesn't run the short routes very clean.
From what I read and saw during the Senior Bowl week, things seem to point that way.

But overall, his reviews from the Senior Bowl and the combine are quite positive.

I have to rewatch the AS game to see who covered him, but I thought AS has a tall CB that has a draftble grade.
Also, he did well against Casey Heyward (from Vandy) who was drafted in the second round and became a starter for the Packers.

With the depth of this draft, I might have to drop him to the fourth round.
There are other receivers who improved their games more than I thought they would when the season first started.

mussop
03-12-2013, 12:57 PM
Has anyone checked out Josh-Boyce?

76Texan
03-13-2013, 08:03 PM
Has anyone checked out Josh-Boyce?

I think he needs some kind of surgery on his toe.

Until we know about the results, I would rather not mess with him.

He looks pretty good, but we already have KMart.

I don't want another shorty unless he's really talented like Austin or Bailey.

76Texan
03-13-2013, 08:19 PM
Add another guy to the dark horse list for late round or UDFA:

Jaron Brown (Clemson) who played in the shadow of DeAndre Hopins and Sammy Watson.

He's actually the faster receiver (as the announcer claimed in one of the game that I watched.)

He had an excellent pro day.

6'2-3/8, 205

4.4 forty with a 1.57 split
17 bench
35.5 vertical
10'4 vertical
4.07 SS
6.82 3-cone

I had checked him out in about 5 games, and he's a very good blocker who can even take on LB.

Looks pretty good in and out of the break, but can improve.
His 10-yd split, long speed, short shuttle, and three-cone all look very impressive, showing that he does have the tool to improve his route running.

If you watch enough of Clemson tapes, you will see that he does get open his fair share (when either Hopkins or Watkins got the catch.)
I saw him make some tough catches, too.

These are a few highlights on youtube (some were from his sophomore year.)

https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=Jaron+Brown&oq=jaron+b&gs_l=youtube.1.0.35i39j0j0i10j0l7.1013.2357.0.4604 .7.7.0.0.0.0.225.759.3j3j1.7.0...0.0...1ac.1.vGNka 89bUm0

He looks pretty fluid after the catch.
Even though he's not highly explosive like Patterson, but he's not too shabby.

He might even become a number two receiver if he works hard at it; at least he can be a #5; more likely a #4, but a good chance to be a #3.

leebigeztx
03-13-2013, 09:00 PM
Add another guy to the dark horse list for late round or UDFA:

Jaron Brown (Clemson) who played in the shadow of DeAndre Hopins and Sammy Watson.

He's actually the faster receiver (as the announcer claimed in one of the game that I watched.)

He had an excellent pro day.

6'2-3/8, 205

4.4 forty with a 1.57 split
17 bench
35.5 vertical
10'4 vertical
4.07 SS
6.82 3-cone

I had checked him out in about 5 games, and he's a very good blocker who can even take on LB.

Looks pretty good in and out of the break, but can improve.
His 10-yd split, long speed, short shuttle, and three-cone all look very impressive, showing that he does have the tool to improve his route running.

If you watch enough of Clemson tapes, you will see that he does get open his fair share (when either Hopkins or Watkins got the catch.)
I saw him make some tough catches, too.

These are a few highlights on youtube (some were from his sophomore year.)

https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=Jaron+Brown&oq=jaron+b&gs_l=youtube.1.0.35i39j0j0i10j0l7.1013.2357.0.4604 .7.7.0.0.0.0.225.759.3j3j1.7.0...0.0...1ac.1.vGNka 89bUm0

He looks pretty fluid after the catch.
Even though he's not highly explosive like Patterson, but he's not too shabby.

He might even become a number two receiver if he works hard at it; at least he can be a #5; more likely a #4, but a good chance to be a #3.

I like King from Georgia. I also told people this draft was wr rich. Patterson is a boom?bust guy. He didnt dominate juco and that bothers me alot.

Lucky
03-13-2013, 10:19 PM
I like King from Georgia. I also told people this draft was wr rich. Patterson is a boom?bust guy. He didnt dominate juco and that bothers me alot.

Patterson scored 36 TDs in 23 games in JC. Whats not dominant about that?

76Texan
03-13-2013, 10:56 PM
Patterson scored 36 TDs in 23 games in JC. Whats not dominant about that?

24 TDs, which is 50% of total output.
And 42% of total receiving yardage.
Two-time All-American.

That's dominant with a dual-threat QB on the team.

76Texan
03-13-2013, 10:59 PM
I like King from Georgia. I also told people this draft was wr rich. Patterson is a boom?bust guy. He didnt dominate juco and that bothers me alot.

King is a solid receiver with good floor; but his ceiling is probably a #2 receiver.

Patterson is at least a top tier #2, with decent chance to become a #1.
I don't see any bust factor here, to be honest, unless he has off-the-field problems???

steelbtexan
03-13-2013, 11:03 PM
24 TDs, which is 50% of total output.
And 42% of total receiving yardage.
Two-time All-American.

That's dominant with a dual-threat QB on the team.

Facts seem to overcome posters just throwing out a bunch of crap.

Give me Boyce over Mallette if you're looking for a late rd WR.

A guy I like as a Amendola/Welker late rd guy is Zack Rodgers. When I was studying Bray and things got tight, Bray looked for Rodgers more than he looked at Patterson or Hunter. Rodgers would be a great 5-6th rd pick.

Wolf6151
03-14-2013, 02:29 AM
I didn't read back through the previous 3 pages so I'm not sure if this guys name has been brought up or not, what would you guys think of Rodney Smith-WR from Florida St.? He's got the measurables that teams drool over 6'04", 225 lbs., 34 3/4" arms, 10 3/8" hands, and runs a 4.51 in the 40. He's currently listed by CBS as a 6th round prospect and with his measurables I'm thinking he might be worth a late round project pick. He'd be a low risk and possibly high reward player. Opinions?

beerlover
03-14-2013, 03:04 AM
I didn't read back through the previous 3 pages so I'm not sure if this guys name has been brought up or not, what would you guys think of Rodney Smith-WR from Florida St.? He's got the measurables that teams drool over 6'04", 225 lbs., 34 3/4" arms, 10 3/8" hands, and runs a 4.51 in the 40. He's currently listed by CBS as a 6th round prospect and with his measurables I'm thinking he might be worth a late round project pick. He'd be a low risk and possibly high reward player. Opinions?

Pro body but lacks ability to run clean routes, separate & block in space. Very undisciplined, pretty much strictly a deep threat with his size. Good developmental pick but like to see more complete game to fit scheme.

Lucky
03-14-2013, 06:51 AM
24 TDs, which is 50% of total output.

24 receiving TDs, combined with 6 rushing TDs and 6 TDs on returns. A freak.

76Texan
03-14-2013, 10:09 AM
24 receiving TDs, combined with 6 rushing TDs and 6 TDs on returns. A freak.

Dang, I totally forgot about the other parts of his game; the very things that make him more valuable as a draft prospect.

76Texan
03-14-2013, 10:14 AM
Facts seem to overcome posters just throwing out a bunch of crap.

Give me Boyce over Mallette if you're looking for a late rd WR.

A guy I like as a Amendola/Welker late rd guy is Zack Rodgers. When I was studying Bray and things got tight, Bray looked for Rodgers more than he looked at Patterson or Hunter. Rodgers would be a great 5-6th rd pick.

Zack Rogers was a very good college football player.
He runs good route. He's quick in and out of the break.
However, he's a bit small and therefore had problem with press coverage.
Watch the Florida and the Vandy games.

He will have problem with more physical NFL DBs.
Unless he really improves on that physicality part of the game, he's nothing more than just a guy and may not even have the chance to make a roster.

There's a lot to like about him otherwise.
He does have some upside.

76Texan
03-14-2013, 10:21 AM
I didn't read back through the previous 3 pages so I'm not sure if this guys name has been brought up or not, what would you guys think of Rodney Smith-WR from Florida St.? He's got the measurables that teams drool over 6'04", 225 lbs., 34 3/4" arms, 10 3/8" hands, and runs a 4.51 in the 40. He's currently listed by CBS as a 6th round prospect and with his measurables I'm thinking he might be worth a late round project pick. He'd be a low risk and possibly high reward player. Opinions?

I mentioned him before, and then I became even more impressed at the combine.

Look at his 20SS and 3-cone time.
He does have the tools necessary to create seperation.
It's just a matter of having more reps.
Once he learns how to get in and out of break, he'll be a force.
Right now he's inconsistent in several aspects of the game, including playing up to his physique.

Huge upside; definitely worth a late round pick.
I think he might even go higher than the sixth, maybe even the fourth.

He can do pretty much everything, just lack the consistency.

If he works real hard at it, his ceiling is very high, IMO.

steelbtexan
03-14-2013, 12:43 PM
Zack Rogers was a very good college football player.
He runs good route. He's quick in and out of the break.
However, he's a bit small and therefore had problem with press coverage.
Watch the Florida and the Vandy games.

He will have problem with more physical NFL DBs.
Unless he really improves on that physicality part of the game, he's nothing more than just a guy and may not even have the chance to make a roster.

There's a lot to like about him otherwise.
He does have some upside.

These were the same things that were being said about Welker/Amendola prior to the draft. For a 6th rd pick he woukd be worth a shot.

beerlover
03-14-2013, 02:08 PM
Another developmental pick just seems like a luxury right now & that's nothing against him. Immediate impact needed, someone already polished in pro-system like Robert Woods. Ideal #2 fit next to Andre.

76Texan
03-14-2013, 02:51 PM
These were the same things that were being said about Welker/Amendola prior to the draft. For a 6th rd pick he woukd be worth a shot.

I honestly didn't watch Welker at Tech, but going by NFL Draft Scout, he was a tad under 5'9 but weighed 195lbs.

Zack is about 6'0 but only weighs 172.
Big difference.

Welker carried his weight well in the 2 punt returns from the college day still available on YouTube.

The only thing I know is that when the Dolphins didn't seem to want him anymore, I wanted him because of his physical play. You've got to be able to do that when you're a shorter guy; like Kendall Wright or Stedmon Bailey.

Why do I like Bailey more than Rogers?
Because he plays big and never shied from contact.
He wins against bigger and taller DB; Rogers lost big time.

Is he worth a sixth?
Probably, but not until I bring him in for a work-out so he can show me what I'd like to see.
Right now, on tapes, I don't see it.

It doesn't matter how quick you are if they can jam you easily at the line.

Can you say the same thing with Welker, Wright, Bailey, or Austin?

steelbtexan
03-14-2013, 03:37 PM
I honestly didn't watch Welker at Tech, but going by NFL Draft Scout, he was a tad under 5'9 but weighed 195lbs.

Zack is about 6'0 but only weighs 172.
Big difference.

Welker carried his weight well in the 2 punt returns from the college day still available on YouTube.

The only thing I know is that when the Dolphins didn't seem to want him anymore, I wanted him because of his physical play. You've got to be able to do that when you're a shorter guy; like Kendall Wright or Stedmon Bailey.

Why do I like Bailey more than Rogers?
Because he plays big and never shied from contact.
He wins against bigger and taller DB; Rogers lost big time.

Is he worth a sixth?
Probably, but not until I bring him in for a work-out so he can show me what I'd like to see.
Right now, on tapes, I don't see it.

It doesn't matter how quick you are if they can jam you easily at the line.

Can you say the same thing with Welker, Wright, Bailey, or Austin?

No, but those guys are 1st rd picks, Bailey will go in the 3rd at the latest. Welker is a priority FA.

After drafting a WR high 1-2nd rd. I just think Rodgers would be worth a look in the 6-7th rd.

76Texan
03-14-2013, 04:05 PM
No, but those guys are 1st rd picks, Bailey will go in the 3rd at the latest. Welker is a priority FA.

After drafting a WR high 1-2nd rd. I just think Rodgers would be worth a look in the 6-7th rd.

Oh, he's worth a look alright; and I'm not writing him off.
But it looks like there are plenty of late round picks with better floor and ceiling both.
That is unless Rogers wows me with his work-out and shows me that he's capable of beating press (just having the core strength to amplify his potential.)

76Texan
03-14-2013, 04:23 PM
BTW, I did notice Rogers (and I did mention to you that he has a draftable grade.)

While I looked at him closer (when you mentioned him), I think I notice something else about Bray.
This was in the back of my mind, but I think I see it a little clearer now.

You know how QBs are taught to keep both hands on the ball up on the chest area as much as possible for both protection and readiness?
I noticed that Bray has a tendency to forget about it as the game goes on, especially when he sees pressure.

His footwork isn't great to begin with (and yes, I understand that all these QB prospects need improvement - even Joe Montana did) so with any additional faulty in his mechanics, his game gets worse.

He gets into a habit of dropping his hands a little lower than he should, or have them apart a bit too soon; sometimes he completely forgot about it.

He doesn't have an over-the-top release to start with, so it takes him a hair longer to bring his throwing arm into optimum position to throw the ball.
Sometimes, he begins to palm the ball "too much".

Every little thing adds up such that his 3-quarter delivery is extended a hair longer. And I'm talking an eight of a second here.

As with Phil Simms, it's fixable.
And you ought to remember I mentioned Simms saying this in his book; that he didn't get it corrected until later during his career.

I think Bray can be helped tremendously if he can correct this.
His release isn't terrible slow.
He has a live arm.
His delivery isn't as winded as Schaub's (when he first joined the Texans.)

An eight of a second is very important at this level.
IMO, if Bray can correct this, and he should be able to, he can make it in the NFL.

steelbtexan
03-14-2013, 05:13 PM
BTW, I did notice Rogers (and I did mention to you that he has a draftable grade.)

While I looked at him closer (when you mentioned him), I think I notice something else about Bray.
This was in the back of my mind, but I think I see it a little clearer now.

You know how QBs are taught to keep both hands on the ball up on the chest area as much as possible for both protection and readiness?
I noticed that Bray has a tendency to forget about it as the game goes on, especially when he sees pressure.

His footwork isn't great to begin with (and yes, I understand that all these QB prospects need improvement - even Joe Montana did) so with any additional faulty in his mechanics, his game gets worse.

He gets into a habit of dropping his hands a little lower than he should, or have them apart a bit too soon; sometimes he completely forgot about it.

He doesn't have an over-the-top release to start with, so it takes him a hair longer to bring his throwing arm into optimum position to throw the ball.
Sometimes, he begins to palm the ball "too much".

Every little thing adds up such that his 3-quarter delivery is extended a hair longer. And I'm talking an eight of a second here.

As with Phil Simms, it's fixable.
And you ought to remember I mentioned Simms saying this in his book; that he didn't get it corrected until later during his career.

I think Bray can be helped tremendously if he can correct this.
His release isn't terrible slow.
He has a live arm.
His delivery isn't as winded as Schaub's (when he first joined the Texans.)

An eight of a second is very important at this level.
IMO, if Bray can correct this, and he should be able to, he can make it in the NFL.

Like you mentined these are things that can be fixed with proper coaching. That he didn't get from Dooleys staff. Bray has as much talent as any QB in this draft. It's just a matter of how hard he wants to work to fix his flaws. I would love to see Gary get the chance to work with Bray.

Wolf6151
03-14-2013, 05:30 PM
I mentioned him before, and then I became even more impressed at the combine.

Look at his 20SS and 3-cone time.
He does have the tools necessary to create seperation.
It's just a matter of having more reps.
Once he learns how to get in and out of break, he'll be a force.
Right now he's inconsistent in several aspects of the game, including playing up to his physique.

Huge upside; definitely worth a late round pick.
I think he might even go higher than the sixth, maybe even the fourth.

He can do pretty much everything, just lack the consistency.

If he works real hard at it, his ceiling is very high, IMO.

Alot of what I read on CBS and BL evaluations, it sounds like Rodney Smith's route running issues and lack of discipline simply sound like maturity issues and those are usually fixed pretty quick when he leaves his comfort zone at FSU and steps into the real world of the NFL with veteran pros around him. Blocking and separation issues are things that can be taught. I'm thinking he'd be worth one of our comp. 6th rounders and we let him develop while on IR for an aggravated hang nail. Most everything is coachable and learnable, those measurables aren't. Low risk in the comp. 6th and possibly a very high reward in a year or 2.

aussie_texan
03-18-2013, 07:01 AM
John Mcclain :
For those tweeting and asking if Texans are interested in Chad Johnson, the answer is no. They want to get younger and faster opposite AJ.


Please be Justin Hunter

otisbean
03-18-2013, 07:07 AM
Another developmental pick just seems like a luxury right now & that's nothing against him. Immediate impact needed, someone already polished in pro-system like Robert Woods. Ideal #2 fit next to Andre.

I think Woods is an interesting player. Production dropped a bit due to injury, the emergence of another playermaker in Lee, and some spotty QB play. He might be there for us in rd 2.

beerlover
03-18-2013, 10:05 AM
I think Woods is an interesting player. Production dropped a bit due to injury, the emergence of another playermaker in Lee, and some spotty QB play. He might be there for us in rd 2.

my real concern over Woods is from a durability standpoint. he is an underclassman so he is young with time to add core strength, he's not a burner, but has great instincts & pro skill set already. He is a tough one to grade. First round skill set with second round measureables. Not sure if he has had pro-day yet but for me he would need to add some muscle, lift more than 14 times & run a sub 4.5 to be considered, despite College production, as a first round talent. 2nd rd. seems far more likely & probably just a few picks before Texans are on the board again. Therefore not Texan material (& three amigos mocked him to Texans back in October/November). :butterfly:

76Texan
03-18-2013, 11:21 AM
my real concern over Woods is from a durability standpoint. he is an underclassman so he is young with time to add core strength, he's not a burner, but has great instincts & pro skill set already. He is a tough one to grade. First round skill set with second round measureables. Not sure if he has had pro-day yet but for me he would need to add some muscle, lift more than 14 times & run a sub 4.5 to be considered, despite College production, as a first round talent. 2nd rd. seems far more likely & probably just a few picks before Texans are on the board again. Therefore not Texan material (& three amigos mocked him to Texans back in October/November). :butterfly:

Late second round, maybe even third... Unless he impresses at his pro day.

Playoffs
04-10-2013, 01:44 PM
Lance Zierlein ‏@LanceZierlein 29m
According to league source, Cordarrelle Patterson may fall out of the 1st.

Lance Zierlein ‏@LanceZierlein 11m
Wheaton and K. Allen RT @StephStradley: @LanceZierlein OTOH, have a sense of who the football bright/interview-well WRs are?

76Texan
04-23-2013, 05:46 PM
A little-known prospect is a receiver from Marshall: Aaron Dobson.

There was very little game tape on Marshall football as we know it.


Here's some tidbids I've learned about Dobson:


6'2 - 205
4.49 speed per NFL Draftscout.

http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings/dsprofile.php?pyid=92694&draftyear=2013&genpos=WR

....

Production:

2011: 49 catches - 668 yards - 12 TDs
He was playing with a Freshman QB

2010:
44 catches - 689 yards - 5 TDs
He led the teams in these categories as a Sophmore

2009:
15 - 362 - 4 as a Freshman
(24.13 ypc)


....

July 9, 2012
HUNTINGTON, W.Va.-Marshall's Aaron Dobson has been selected to the 2012 College Football Performance Awards (CFPA) Wide Receiver Watch List.

http://www.herdzone.com/sports/m-footbl/spec-rel/070912aaf.html

.....

Catch vs S. Miss.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5jeMfvA9pZU

.....

TD vs Miami Ohio on a post route vs Cover 1/3

http://espn.go.com/ncf/video?gameId=312600195

....

Aaron Dobson 29 Yd Pass From Rakeem Cato vs Vtech

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AN9dbKjREZEAaron

.....

The catch vs ECU:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YCdFFFAxLz0&feature=results_video&playnext=1&list=PLF157890311C08D3C

....

vs FIU Beef O Brady Bowl
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0AhUAgSqy-U

....

2011 Highlights:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=spj4V4NvvLc&feature=related

Bumped from 7/16/12

Dobson has been on the radar for the longest time; he ain't no sleeper.

76Texan
04-23-2013, 05:50 PM
The more I watch, the more I like this draft class (and I have been high on the class already.)

We may have to draft two or three of them, LOL.

Pull up the recent highlights of Dobson and watch his leaping backhand (one-handed) catch at the end and tell me it's not one of the most impressive catches you've seen.

Bumped from 2/22/13

badboy
04-23-2013, 05:52 PM
ANother bit that warms my heart with Dobson, he did not drop a pass in 2012.

76Texan
04-25-2013, 07:59 AM
I can't believe CBS Sports left Mark Harrison completely off their board.
I really want to trade out of the first and take these three guys: Marcus Davis 6th), Rodney Smith (7th) and Mark Harrison (UDFA).
If that's where they really land in the draft, you can have a steal of a draft, IMHO.