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View Full Version : If David DeCastro falls...


WolverineFan
03-24-2012, 01:31 PM
Would you be willing to trade up for him?

Let's say he gets past Dallas at #14. Would you be willing to trade up to #16 with the Jets? It would likely take a swap of this year's 1st round picks and our 1st next year. I would definitely take that deal. Two 1st round picks (both in the 20's) for probably the best OG to come out since Hutchinson? Yes please.

If you're not for that, we could probably work out a trade involving a swap of 1st's, a 2nd next year, and our 3rd this year. We avoid losing the 1st this way, but I think our picks are a necessity this year since we need to fill some holes on the roster.

Brandon420tx
03-24-2012, 01:43 PM
I doubt he falls, but still ...

well, even though he is an elite prospect at G, I still wouldn't trade up for him, Guard is actually one of the strongest positions in this draft and theres alot of of "later" round prospects I like.

Only person I can see maybe falling I'd trade up for is Floyd

kiwitexansfan
03-24-2012, 01:51 PM
I am very much in the never trade picks away, always trade to add picks camp.

In football no one prospect is worth mortgaging the future on.

WolverineFan
03-24-2012, 02:08 PM
I am very much in the never trade picks away, always trade to add picks camp.

In football no one prospect is worth mortgaging the future on.

I disagree. NYG mortgaged a hell of a lot for Eli Manning. 2 Super Bowl's later...

Lucky
03-24-2012, 02:20 PM
I disagree. NYG mortgaged a hell of a lot for Eli Manning. 2 Super Bowl's later...
If DeCastro were a QB, and the Texans needed one, then trading up should be a consideration. For a guard? I don't think so. The difference between the top rated guard and one the Texans could take at their own pick is not worth the potential players given up. It would take the Texans 2nd round pick, or their 3rd + 4th, to move from #26 to #16.

Rey
03-24-2012, 02:27 PM
Yeah I'd take him if he fell to us.

WolverineFan
03-24-2012, 02:36 PM
If DeCastro were a QB, and the Texans needed one, then trading up should be a consideration. For a guard? I don't think so. The difference between the top rated guard and one the Texans could take at their own pick is not worth the potential players given up. It would take the Texans 2nd round pick, or their 3rd + 4th, to move from #26 to #16.

I agree about him being an OG versus being a QB. However, the difference between DeCastro and the next best OG is immense. He's a once in a decade OG prospect.

If you're saying the OG position is not worth giving up picks then okay that's fine. Many would agree with you.

kiwitexansfan
03-24-2012, 02:43 PM
Maybe you do it for a franchise QB but you best get it right. And the Giants won superbowls as much by their commitment to drafting pass rushers as anything.

Lucky
03-24-2012, 02:51 PM
He's a once in a decade OG prospect.
DeCastro's not a super athlete, like a Larry Allen. He's considered a technician, more than a power blocker. His value is that he's "pro ready" and plug and play. Bruce Matthews was a once in a decade prospect. DeCastro's nowhere near than level of a dominating athlete.

WolverineFan
03-24-2012, 02:53 PM
Maybe you do it for a franchise QB but you best get it right. And the Giants won superbowls as much by their commitment to drafting pass rushers as anything.

They still wouldn't have won those SB's without Manning. They didn't add many of those pass rushers until after Manning was in the fold.

WolverineFan
03-24-2012, 02:59 PM
DeCastro's not a super athlete, like a Larry Allen. He's considered a technician, more than a power blocker. His value is that he's "pro ready" and plug and play. Bruce Matthews was a once in a decade prospect. DeCastro's nowhere near than level of a dominating athlete.

I'm sorry what? Since when do you have to be a super athlete to be an elite prospect?

He's a tremendous run blocker and an excellent pass blocker. He can pull as well as he can road-grade. He's as much a technician as much as a power blocker, that's why he's so dominant. He dominated the PAC for the last few years. Have you seen his film?

mussop
03-24-2012, 03:17 PM
If he fell to where it wouldn't take more than a fourth combined with our 1st I wouldn't hesitate. He is a plug and play G for the next 10 to 12 years that will play at a high level. Not to mention I have never been a Caldwell fan and Smith is 31 this year.

The better OL you put in front of Foster the better results you will get out of him. It didn't do any good signing him to a long term deal for all that money if he is going to be getting hit in the backfield all the time.

Edit: I would also like to add that even though we resigned Myers he is also 31 and Decastro is capable of playing C. Having said all this I'm still thinking it may be more beneficial to slightly trade down and draft Kevin Zeilter who also is also versatile enough to play C. Don't really see too much difference between the two.

Lucky
03-24-2012, 03:19 PM
I'm sorry what? Since when do you have to be a super athlete to be an elite prospect?
DeCastro "dominated" in college football because of his skill level and technique. In the NFL, he will find highly skilled players with outstanding technique that are also superior athletes. That doesn't mean he won't be effective if he continues to hone his skills. But he's not going to be dominant, because he will be facing off against better athletes.

Look going to the "have you seen his film?" card is weak. Why would I comment if I hadn't seen Stanford play? I've enjoyed watching Andrew Luck since his Stratford days. Granted that this might not be great tape on DeCastro, and he does show some ability, but these clips versus UCLA (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1LF1QtW67wE)hardly display a "once in a decade prospect". DeCastro often looks clumsy and slow. Much more like a 2nd round pick than a "once in a decade" prospect. That he's considered a mid-1st pick in this draft has more to do with the lack of top talent after the 2 elite QBs than anything DeCastro has done. I'm not suggesting that DeCastro wouldn't be value for the Texans at #26. Just that he's not worth throwing picks away to acquire him.

WolverineFan
03-24-2012, 03:53 PM
DeCastro "dominated" in college football because of his skill level and technique. In the NFL, he will find highly skilled players with outstanding technique that are also superior athletes.

Don't really understand where you're going here. Every college player faces better competition at the next level.

That doesn't mean he won't be effective if he continues to hone his skills. But he's not going to be dominant, because he will be facing off against better athletes.

You could say this about any OL who's ever entered the draft.

Look going to the "have you seen his film?" card is weak. Why would I comment if I hadn't seen Stanford play? I've enjoyed watching Andrew Luck since his Stratford days. Granted that this might not be great tape on DeCastro, and he does show some ability, but these clips versus UCLA (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1LF1QtW67wE)hardly display a "once in a decade prospect".

1st play of that clip he pancakes his man. 2nd play he drives his guy back 5 yards. 3rd play gets stood up at the line by his guy but fights through and makes the block. 4th play he plows through the guy in front of him and gets to the LB on a short yardage iso play. 5th play he pulls and gets his guy in space and makes the block. Quit watching after that...

DeCastro often looks clumsy and slow. Much more like a 2nd round pick than a "once in a decade" prospect.

I don't see that at all.

That he's considered a mid-1st pick in this draft has more to do with the lack of top talent after the 2 elite QBs than anything DeCastro has done.

I don't buy that for a second.

I'm not suggesting that DeCastro wouldn't be value for the Texans at #26. Just that he's not worth throwing picks away to acquire him.

There's nothing wrong with that opinion, I just happen to disagree.


^^^

Brandon420tx
03-24-2012, 04:05 PM
The term "elite prospect" is thrown around alot. In this case, I used "elite" earlier in the sense that he is hands down the best OG in this draft.

But I overstated DeCastro's value. To really be considered "elite" to me as a draft prospect, you have to have above average physical talent as well as above average technique and understanding of your position. There are very few "elite" prospects in NFL history despite the high amount the word is thrown around. I'd consider Deion Sanders to be the standard when it comes to determining an elite prospect.

DeCastro is actually very close to being considered that by me, he has above average physical ability in my opinion. The only other athletes I have in this draft that come close to that consideration are Andrew Luck, Robert Griffin, and Morris Claiborne. I feel Luck didn't face enough very good defenses, I'd need to see Griffin in a more pro style offense, and if Claiborne was just 2 inches taller or a smidge faster I'd consider him elite hands down

Dutchrudder
03-24-2012, 04:27 PM
I like Decastro a lot and would seriously consider him if he's there at 26, but I would never trade up for a guard. The position just isn't that important to me and doesn't warrant first round trade ups. We can get an OG in the mid rounds that will outdo Caldwell.

Guys that I would trade up for are Floyd, Blackmon, Keuchly, Ingram and maybe Upshaw.

WolverineFan
03-24-2012, 04:31 PM
I like Decastro a lot and would seriously consider him if he's there at 26, but I would never trade up for a guard. The position just isn't that important to me and doesn't warrant first round trade ups. We can get an OG in the mid rounds that will outdo Caldwell.

Guys that I would trade up for are Floyd, Blackmon, Keuchly, Ingram and maybe Upshaw.

This is how I thought most people would feel. OG doesn't carry a big value with most football people. My infatuation with DeCastro is due to my belief that he's the best OG to come out in quite some time and is future multiple all-pro.

QB, WR, LT, and pass rushers are the ones that teams trade up for.

Playoffs
03-24-2012, 05:37 PM
Too muchy money.

Rey
03-24-2012, 08:32 PM
I just watched some Decastro and Zeitler clips and I think Zeitler is the better player...

Wolf6151
03-24-2012, 08:38 PM
I like Decastro a lot and would seriously consider him if he's there at 26, but I would never trade up for a guard. The position just isn't that important to me and doesn't warrant first round trade ups. We can get an OG in the mid rounds that will outdo Caldwell.


My sentiments exactly.

Dutchrudder
03-24-2012, 10:35 PM
I just watched some Decastro and Zeitler clips and I think Zeitler is the better player...

When you consider value of the pick against the talent, Zeitler is the obvious choice. We could trade back to the early 2nd round, pick up a 3rd or 4th and get Zeitler instead of trading away our 2nd to move up to get Decastro. I would be thrilled with a move like that and I would be happy if that was the case. It would be a great value for what appears to be not much of a difference in players.

mussop
03-25-2012, 12:13 AM
I like Decastro a lot and would seriously consider him if he's there at 26, but I would never trade up for a guard. The position just isn't that important to me and doesn't warrant first round trade ups. We can get an OG in the mid rounds that will outdo Caldwell.

Guys that I would trade up for are Floyd, Blackmon, Keuchly, Ingram and maybe Upshaw.

We will see how important the G position is if Caldwell doesn't improve from his play last year. He was getting blown off the line alot.

bah007
03-25-2012, 10:41 PM
I think DeCastro is a hell of a prospect but I just don't think I would agree with mortgaging our draft for an OG.

I don't an elite OG is the one missing piece on this team. So I would rather save those other picks to help out the team in other ways.

beerlover
03-25-2012, 10:51 PM
I think DeCastro is a hell of a prospect but I just don't think I would agree with mortgaging our draft for an OG.

I don't an elite OG is the one missing piece on this team. So I would rather save those other picks to help out the team in other ways.

Texans will not only be without their starting RG but RT as well. kinda scary isn't it :kubepalm:

bah007
03-25-2012, 10:57 PM
Texans will not only be without their starting RG but RT as well. kinda scary isn't it :kubepalm:

Very scary.

I'm actually hopeful that Butler can play about as well as Winston did. Maybe he isn't as talented but we will certainly have less penalties with Winston gone.

The real problem on the OL is RG. I loved when we drafted Caldwell but the guy just doesn't do it for me. He didn't turn out like I thought he would. Maybe this is his final chance?

Despite that, I still don't think I would feel good about trading multiple picks for DeCastro. But drafting DeCastro isn't exactly the worst possible scenario that could play out..

Brisco_County
03-25-2012, 11:20 PM
Isn't one of the benefits of the ZBS that you don't have to pay a premium for your linemen? We did for Brown, but that was an exception that Gibbs wanted for LT. We shouldn't need a 1st rounder for guard. We'll likely be using that pick for OLB.

Yaky
03-26-2012, 12:33 AM
Isn't one of the benefits of the ZBS that you don't have to pay a premium for your linemen? We did for Brown, but that was an exception that Gibbs wanted for LT. We shouldn't need a 1st rounder for guard. We'll likely be using that pick for OLB.

Waste a 1st round pick on an OLB? That OLB would ride the bench most of the time. Better to draft Fleener, or a guard like Zeitler, both of them would be starters from day one.

b0ng
03-26-2012, 06:51 AM
Doubt we pick an OL in the first round under Kubiak ever again, and they probably still wouldn't have if 7 LT prospects didn't go before Brown was picked.

Blake
03-26-2012, 07:28 AM
If David DeCastro falls...

Would you be willing to trade up for him?

As long as there was no injury sustained during the fall I might draft him.

Seriously though, I cant imagine even picking him @ 26. We took our LT @ 26. LG FA, C 6th round, RG UDFA, RT 3rd round.

RG is one of the easiest spots to fill on a roster. I think the Texans will target someone in the late rounds to back up Caldwell.