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TEXANRED
03-03-2012, 06:27 PM
Matt Schaub will make 7.15 million this year and become a free agent in 2013 unless the Texans sign him to an extension.

My question is this, should/will the Texans extend Matt Schaub? Should/will the Texans start TJ Yates ahead of Schaub for the 2012 season?

I pose this question because IMO I think Matt may have found himself in no man's land unless he stays healthy all year and guides the Texans to an AFC South title. I say this because in 2013 he turns 32 and what kind of deal would you give a 32 year old NFL player? The current average age for a starting NFL QB is 27.65 and this number may drop further after this years draft.

Out of the 32 teams there are 12 QB's currently in there 30's. Matt Schaub turns 31 before the start of this season, Brees 33, Manning 35, Romo 31, Cassel 30, Brady 34, the other Manning 31, Big Ben 30, Rivers 30, Grossman 31, Vick 31, Palmer 32.

Out of this group of 30yo there are only a few I can say will continue to perform at a high level getting you to a Superbowl. Brady, Eli, and Big Ben. The other aforementioned QB's, IMO, are seeing the twilight of their careers. Brees just got the franchise tag and compiled with all the offseason distractions I expect them to have a bad year and he will be 34 next year. I think last year was Brees' window and he missed it, P. Manning may never play again, Romo is over-rated, Vick can't stay healthy (Schaub), Palmer is over-rated, Rivers is over-rated, Grossman sux, Cassel is a back up.

So what do you do with a 32yo Schaub? Up to this year he had played 5 season from 2007-2011. In 2007, 2008, and 2011 he has finished the season on IR. Only 2009 and 2010 has he completed a full season. He has won 31 games and lost 32, he is also 8-14 in the division. The only good thing I can say about Schaub is his home record is 20-11. http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/S/SchaMa00/gamelog/

I think Kubiak and Smith need to sit down with one another and make a decision on Schaub before the season gets under way. Is Schaub the future? Are you going to extend his contract? What does Schaub offer the Texans that TJ Yates does not? I also think you have to take into account that the Texans are about to play a brutal schedule.

I personally would take Yates and start him over Schaub this year. This is why. He is younger, more athletic and mobile, has a stronger arm, and shows up in big games. Schaub was never mobile to begin with and now will play with a screw in his foot. What Schaub brings to the table over TJ is his years of experience, and accuracy.

IMO in big time games Schaub has reverted back to being a back up QB. I don't think Schaub would have won that game against the Bengals last year to win the division. And I say this based on his prime time record (it's an O'fer) and his division record (every division game is huge. The amendment to that being you have already won the division and you are not playing for anything).

This is a perfect time to find out what we have in TJ. A tough schedule is perfect to evaluate him. Does he have the stones to hang? You know we are going to get some prime time games, how does he react to the pressure of the nation watching? At worse we still win the division but see enough of TJ and his abilities to know he is not the future so we are drafting a QB in 2013.

So what would you do with an aging QB that has started 64 out of 80 games missing 20% of his starts? He couldn't stay healthy in his 20's I don't see him suddenly getting better with age and a screw in his foot.

Rey
03-03-2012, 06:56 PM
If Schaub is healthy, he should start.

Corrosion
03-03-2012, 07:12 PM
If Schaub is healthy, he should start.

If Schaub is healthy Schaub will start. No doubt about that.

While Yates has a lot of good qualities and skill , he has a long way to go to become the type of QB that could displace Schaub.

If it were up to me , I'd likely extend Schaub 2-3 years giving Yates plenty of time to hone his craft .... and then re-evaluate the situation.

Yates at this point in his career is a hell of a backup plan .... should disaster happen.

thetexanator
03-03-2012, 07:29 PM
schaub should start AND we need a veteran qb. tj can wait.

Playoffs
03-03-2012, 07:40 PM
Uhhh, huh? :kitten:

EllisUnit
03-03-2012, 08:28 PM
Matt Schaub will make 7.15 million this year and become a free agent in 2013 unless the Texans sign him to an extension.

My question is this, should/will the Texans extend Matt Schaub? Should/will the Texans start TJ Yates ahead of Schaub for the 2012 season?

I pose this question because IMO I think Matt may have found himself in no man's land unless he stays healthy all year and guides the Texans to an AFC South title. I say this because in 2013 he turns 32 and what kind of deal would you give a 32 year old NFL player? The current average age for a starting NFL QB is 27.65 and this number may drop further after this years draft.

Out of the 32 teams there are 12 QB's currently in there 30's. Matt Schaub turns 31 before the start of this season, Brees 33, Manning 35, Romo 31, Cassel 30, Brady 34, the other Manning 31, Big Ben 30, Rivers 30, Grossman 31, Vick 31, Palmer 32.

Out of this group of 30yo there are only a few I can say will continue to perform at a high level getting you to a Superbowl. Brady, Eli, and Big Ben. The other aforementioned QB's, IMO, are seeing the twilight of their careers. Brees just got the franchise tag and compiled with all the offseason distractions I expect them to have a bad year and he will be 34 next year. I think last year was Brees' window and he missed it, P. Manning may never play again, Romo is over-rated, Vick can't stay healthy (Schaub), Palmer is over-rated, Rivers is over-rated, Grossman sux, Cassel is a back up.

So what do you do with a 32yo Schaub? Up to this year he had played 5 season from 2007-2011. In 2007, 2008, and 2011 he has finished the season on IR. Only 2009 and 2010 has he completed a full season. He has won 31 games and lost 32, he is also 8-14 in the division. The only good thing I can say about Schaub is his home record is 20-11. http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/S/SchaMa00/gamelog/

I think Kubiak and Smith need to sit down with one another and make a decision on Schaub before the season gets under way. Is Schaub the future? Are you going to extend his contract? What does Schaub offer the Texans that TJ Yates does not? I also think you have to take into account that the Texans are about to play a brutal schedule.

I personally would take Yates and start him over Schaub this year. This is why. He is younger, more athletic and mobile, has a stronger arm, and shows up in big games. Schaub was never mobile to begin with and now will play with a screw in his foot. What Schaub brings to the table over TJ is his years of experience, and accuracy.

IMO in big time games Schaub has reverted back to being a back up QB. I don't think Schaub would have won that game against the Bengals last year to win the division. And I say this based on his prime time record (it's an O'fer) and his division record (every division game is huge. The amendment to that being you have already won the division and you are not playing for anything).

This is a perfect time to find out what we have in TJ. A tough schedule is perfect to evaluate him. Does he have the stones to hang? You know we are going to get some prime time games, how does he react to the pressure of the nation watching? At worse we still win the division but see enough of TJ and his abilities to know he is not the future so we are drafting a QB in 2013.

So what would you do with an aging QB that has started 64 out of 80 games missing 20% of his starts? He couldn't stay healthy in his 20's I don't see him suddenly getting better with age and a screw in his foot.

i agree with most of ur argument except this last part. He showed up in one big game for us, that was against the bengals to secure the AFC south. The first play-off game at home we can say Arian foster carried the team to victory and then the biggest game against baltimore he threw 4 ints. So that statment to me is a little far fetched with all things considered.

badboy
03-03-2012, 08:44 PM
There is a chasm between the two. Texans are not going to come this close to SB and go with Yates. Ain't happening. I like Matt but am not his biggest fan. Problem there is not a FA or a draft pick that can replace Matt. I'm seeing an extension as team has no choice.

They might look at EJ Manual but that still does not effect Schaub imo.

Texans Pride
03-03-2012, 08:48 PM
To me, there's no question:

The Texans are poised to make their biggest run than they ever have and Matt Schaub is our best option at this current time. We can go further with Matt's experience and football IQ than we can with Yates.

If we were in a rebuilding phase then I think the argument could be made that paying Schaub isn't in the team's best interest, however, with where we are, and the run we can make, I'd much rather have Schaub under helm.

NastyNate
03-03-2012, 08:56 PM
Matt Schaub will make 7.15 million this year and become a free agent in 2013 unless the Texans sign him to an extension.

My question is this, should/will the Texans extend Matt Schaub? Should/will the Texans start TJ Yates ahead of Schaub for the 2012 season?

I pose this question because IMO I think Matt may have found himself in no man's land unless he stays healthy all year and guides the Texans to an AFC South title. I say this because in 2013 he turns 32 and what kind of deal would you give a 32 year old NFL player? The current average age for a starting NFL QB is 27.65 and this number may drop further after this years draft.

Out of the 32 teams there are 12 QB's currently in there 30's. Matt Schaub turns 31 before the start of this season, Brees 33, Manning 35, Romo 31, Cassel 30, Brady 34, the other Manning 31, Big Ben 30, Rivers 30, Grossman 31, Vick 31, Palmer 32.

Out of this group of 30yo there are only a few I can say will continue to perform at a high level getting you to a Superbowl. Brady, Eli, and Big Ben. The other aforementioned QB's, IMO, are seeing the twilight of their careers. Brees just got the franchise tag and compiled with all the offseason distractions I expect them to have a bad year and he will be 34 next year. I think last year was Brees' window and he missed it, P. Manning may never play again, Romo is over-rated, Vick can't stay healthy (Schaub), Palmer is over-rated, Rivers is over-rated, Grossman sux, Cassel is a back up.

So what do you do with a 32yo Schaub? Up to this year he had played 5 season from 2007-2011. In 2007, 2008, and 2011 he has finished the season on IR. Only 2009 and 2010 has he completed a full season. He has won 31 games and lost 32, he is also 8-14 in the division. The only good thing I can say about Schaub is his home record is 20-11. http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/S/SchaMa00/gamelog/

I think Kubiak and Smith need to sit down with one another and make a decision on Schaub before the season gets under way. Is Schaub the future? Are you going to extend his contract? What does Schaub offer the Texans that TJ Yates does not? I also think you have to take into account that the Texans are about to play a brutal schedule.

I personally would take Yates and start him over Schaub this year. This is why. He is younger, more athletic and mobile, has a stronger arm, and shows up in big games. Schaub was never mobile to begin with and now will play with a screw in his foot. What Schaub brings to the table over TJ is his years of experience, and accuracy.

IMO in big time games Schaub has reverted back to being a back up QB. I don't think Schaub would have won that game against the Bengals last year to win the division. And I say this based on his prime time record (it's an O'fer) and his division record (every division game is huge. The amendment to that being you have already won the division and you are not playing for anything).

This is a perfect time to find out what we have in TJ. A tough schedule is perfect to evaluate him. Does he have the stones to hang? You know we are going to get some prime time games, how does he react to the pressure of the nation watching? At worse we still win the division but see enough of TJ and his abilities to know he is not the future so we are drafting a QB in 2013.

So what would you do with an aging QB that has started 64 out of 80 games missing 20% of his starts? He couldn't stay healthy in his 20's I don't see him suddenly getting better with age and a screw in his foot.

Schaub playing his best season in his career (don't feed me numbers, watch the tape) and you're calling him washed up/unable to perform? Pass the pipe man. Schaub is our starter once healthy, not even a question.

incubry
03-03-2012, 09:00 PM
Really....you went there. I know the forums are slow due to the offseason and lack of activity...but c'mon. :foottap::foottap::foottap:

Lucky
03-03-2012, 09:32 PM
My question is this, should/will the Texans extend Matt Schaub? Should/will the Texans start TJ Yates ahead of Schaub for the 2012 season?
Two very different questions. The latter has an obvious answer: No, you don't start Yates unless Schaub is not healthy.

Whether the Texans should extend Schaub or not is more difficult. Extending Schaub would lower his cap number and allow the Texans more flexibility this offseason. It could also net the Texans a bargain, if Matt has a big season in 2012. Plus, Schaub would not be under the pressure of having to play for a contract.

But, extending Schaub could backfire. If his foot doesn't heal properly, Matt's lack of mobility could restrict the Texans ability to rollout on playaction. It could possibly even affect his throwing accuracy. Extending the contract could anchor the Texans to a QB they may have to bench. It's a worse case scenario, but possible.

I would allow Schaub to play out his last year on the contract. If he has a big year, great. Re-sign him or franchise tag him in 2013. If not, move on with Yates or find another QB. This might hurt the team's chances at re-signing Mario or possibly picking up a vet wideout in free agency. I just think it's too risky to tie Schaub to this franchise, with what we know.

redwhiteblue
03-03-2012, 09:39 PM
IMO in big time games Schaub has reverted back to being a back up QB. I don't think Schaub would have won that game against the Bengals last year to win the division.

If Schaub was starting that bengals game he doesn't need to come back in the 4th quarter because it would have been another blow out and we would have
put 30+ points up

badboy
03-03-2012, 09:47 PM
Two very different questions. The latter has an obvious answer: No, you don't start Yates unless Schaub is not healthy.

Whether the Texans should extend Schaub or not is more difficult. Extending Schaub would lower his cap number and allow the Texans more flexibility this offseason. It could also net the Texans a bargain, if Matt has a big season in 2012. Plus, Schaub would not be under the pressure of having to play for a contract.

But, extending Schaub could backfire. If his foot doesn't heal properly, Matt's lack of mobility could restrict the Texans ability to rollout on playaction. It could possibly even affect his throwing accuracy. Extending the contract could anchor the Texans to a QB they may have to bench. It's a worse case scenario, but possible.

I would allow Schaub to play out his last year on the contract. If he has a big year, great. Re-sign him or franchise tag him in 2013. If not, move on with Yates or find another QB. This might hurt the team's chances at re-signing Mario or possibly picking up a vet wideout in free agency. I just think it's too risky to tie Schaub to this franchise, with what we know.why could not a contract be worked that protects Texans if Schaub's foot is a hindrance?

dalemurphy
03-03-2012, 09:51 PM
It's worth noting that Schaub did not end the season on the I.R. in 2008. He came back in December and played some great football.

I have no idea whether he can come back from this or not. I hope he does because we can win a Superbowl with a healthy Matt Schaub. I have no doubt about that.

ckhouston
03-03-2012, 10:03 PM
Yates no doubt. Give him an off-season and camp with the starters and he will be the best product the Texans have put on the field at QB in the history of the franchise. Kid has fire, and is hungry, and wants to make up for what happened last year. Schaub is injury prone and coming off a tough heal. I think he has seen his last days as a starter unless the Skins take a flyer. Matt did ok here but didnt get us there. Thanks dude, but Yates is the future for now. Matt will end up like Carr, a career back-up.

Corrosion
03-03-2012, 10:08 PM
Two very different questions. The latter has an obvious answer: No, you don't start Yates unless Schaub is not healthy.

Whether the Texans should extend Schaub or not is more difficult. Extending Schaub would lower his cap number and allow the Texans more flexibility this offseason. It could also net the Texans a bargain, if Matt has a big season in 2012. Plus, Schaub would not be under the pressure of having to play for a contract.

But, extending Schaub could backfire. If his foot doesn't heal properly, Matt's lack of mobility could restrict the Texans ability to rollout on playaction. It could possibly even affect his throwing accuracy. Extending the contract could anchor the Texans to a QB they may have to bench. It's a worse case scenario, but possible.

I would allow Schaub to play out his last year on the contract. If he has a big year, great. Re-sign him or franchise tag him in 2013. If not, move on with Yates or find another QB. This might hurt the team's chances at re-signing Mario or possibly picking up a vet wideout in free agency. I just think it's too risky to tie Schaub to this franchise, with what we know.

You have to factor in that this team is a Superbowl Contender with Schaub (and Foster) .... without him , they are what they were in the second half of last season and the playoffs ....

The window of opportunity for this team is likely ~3 years with AJ , Foster , Antonio Smith , D.Manning , J.Jo & others playing at their peaks. I think with the Texans medical staff .... they can evaluate Schaub and project the health of his foot going forward .... Prior to that injury he was playing the best football of his career .... If your medical staff is confident he can recover completely .... Its likely wise to extend him now if it allows you to free up capspace for additional pieces.

Its a gamble .... but one worth taking when a Lombardi trophy is within reach.

ckhouston
03-03-2012, 10:11 PM
You have to factor in that this team is a Superbowl Contender with Schaub (and Foster) .... without him , they are what they were in the second half of last season and the playoffs ....

The window of opportunity for this team is likely ~3 years with AJ , Foster , Antonio Smith , D.Manning , J.Jo & others playing at their peaks. I think with the Texans medical staff .... they can evaluate Schaub and project the health of his foot going forward .... Prior to that injury he was playing the best football of his career .... If your medical staff is confident he can recover completely .... Its likely wise to extend him now if it allows you to free up capspace for additional pieces.

Its a gamble .... but one worth taking when a Lombardi trophy is within reach.

They were SB champs if JarJarBinks doesnt muff.

We are a defense and run first team.

Schaub isnt needed.

WolverineFan
03-03-2012, 10:22 PM
They were SB champs if JarJarBinks doesnt muff.

We are a defense and run first team.

Schaub isnt needed.

The team was unbeatable in the middle of the season when the offense was clicking (run and pass).

I think Kubiak calls plays better when Yates is in, which is to say he actually leans on the running game. When Schaub is in he gets pass happy.

That said, Schaub gives us the best chance to win. I'm not his biggest fan, but with this defense and running game he can take us places. When his contract is up you maybe extend him another year and then see what Yates can do. He'd be in his 4th year by then I believe.

Corrosion
03-03-2012, 10:25 PM
:kitten:

Fili
03-03-2012, 10:26 PM
Okay now I know it's REALLY the offseason...

b0ng
03-03-2012, 10:26 PM
They were SB champs if JarJarBinks doesnt muff.

We are a defense and run first team.

Schaub isnt needed.


If the deciding point in a game comes in the first quarter, then your team has much more serious problems than just punt returns. Could easily put Schaub's name in that sentence and it has just as much merit.

Schaub needs to play, and play well in order for me to think he has earned an extension. If Yates beats Schaub out in camp then obviously don't extend Schaub, I just don't see that happening right now.

Corrosion
03-03-2012, 10:30 PM
They were SB champs if JarJarBinks doesnt muff.

We are a defense and run first team.

Schaub isnt needed.



If the queen had balls .... she'd be the king.


, Schaub gives us the best chance to win. .

There is no QB controversy....



/END THREAD.

ArlingtonTexan
03-03-2012, 10:35 PM
Two very different questions. The latter has an obvious answer: No, you don't start Yates unless Schaub is not healthy.

Whether the Texans should extend Schaub or not is more difficult. Extending Schaub would lower his cap number and allow the Texans more flexibility this offseason. It could also net the Texans a bargain, if Matt has a big season in 2012. Plus, Schaub would not be under the pressure of having to play for a contract.

But, extending Schaub could backfire. If his foot doesn't heal properly, Matt's lack of mobility could restrict the Texans ability to rollout on playaction. It could possibly even affect his throwing accuracy. Extending the contract could anchor the Texans to a QB they may have to bench. It's a worse case scenario, but possible.

I would allow Schaub to play out his last year on the contract. If he has a big year, great. Re-sign him or franchise tag him in 2013. If not, move on with Yates or find another QB. This might hurt the team's chances at re-signing Mario or possibly picking up a vet wideout in free agency. I just think it's too risky to tie Schaub to this franchise, with what we know.

Lucky's post is probably going to be the best answer in this thread. Schuab is not an all-time NFL great and has question surrounding him, but he is easily the best rostered QB option for the team in 2012.

Yates played well above what was expected of him, but the offense merely functioned with him at QB and was largley average or less in his starts. Could Yates develop into a real NFL starter at some point? yes, but has TJ even truly proven he is a better or than Leinert? Not really (he at least cheaper though).

TexanSam
03-03-2012, 10:52 PM
You play the players who give you the best chance of winning. Schaub is a pretty obvious choice there. Unless his injury is worse than originally reported, Schaub will be the starting QB next year. If not, then we're probably in trouble. Yates did admirably coming in after Schaub and Leinart got hurt, but the guy never looked like a first string QB. I'd rather him develop on the bench, learning from the vets, because I don't think he could come in here next season and lead the team to a winning record.

krocket
03-03-2012, 11:43 PM
The best solution for the Texans if they want a SB is to dump MattS and hire PManning. That is if Kubiak can take letting him make the calls. Peyton has never had a running game like Foster, Tate and Ward and never had a defense like ours was either for that matter. With AJ and maybe a FA, WR Peyton would shred opposing defenses.

That is if you want to win now! He wanted to come here so let him!

Premier
03-04-2012, 12:45 AM
If Schaub was starting that bengals game he doesn't need to come back in the 4th quarter because it would have been another blow out and we would have
put 30+ points up

i stand by my opinion that the game in cincy is the exact type of game schaub historically loses... there were some huge drops, key turnovers, including 1 at the goalline by tate, and a missed FG that lead to points for cincy.. even with all the mistakes, the texans found themselves in a position to win the game and yates lead his team downfield and won the game. not to mention without the guy who has been the common denominator to the few schaub GW/GT drives, andre johnson. im almost certain the only thing schaub has over yates at this point, is experience.

Corrosion
03-04-2012, 01:20 AM
i stand by my opinion that the game in cincy is the exact type of game schaub historically loses... there were some huge drops, key turnovers, including 1 at the goalline by tate, and a missed FG that lead to points for cincy.. even with all the mistakes, the texans found themselves in a position to win the game and yates lead his team downfield and won the game. not to mention without the guy who has been the common denominator to the few schaub GW/GT drives, andre johnson. im almost certain the only thing schaub has over yates at this point, is experience.

The difference in those types of games this season and in previous seasons ....



DEFENSE


/opinion refuted

NastyNate
03-04-2012, 05:26 AM
Yates no doubt. Give him an off-season and camp with the starters and he will be the best product the Texans have put on the field at QB in the history of the franchise. Kid has fire, and is hungry, and wants to make up for what happened last year. Schaub is injury prone and coming off a tough heal. I think he has seen his last days as a starter unless the Skins take a flyer. Matt did ok here but didnt get us there. Thanks dude, but Yates is the future for now. Matt will end up like Carr, a career back-up.

They were SB champs if JarJarBinks doesnt muff.

We are a defense and run first team.

Schaub isnt needed.

So we need not worry about throwing 3 INT's in a single playoff game? Yates has hit his full potential, he isn't a starter. If you're even questioning Schaub starting versus Yates you're drunk.

NastyNate
03-04-2012, 05:28 AM
The difference in those types of games this season and in previous seasons ....



DEFENSE


/opinion refuted

You speak truth. End of thread.

EllisUnit
03-04-2012, 05:37 AM
The difference in those types of games this season and in previous seasons ....



DEFENSE


/opinion refuted

AGREE, in the past Schaub would bring us back, then the Defense would give the other team no challenge and let them score at will and Schaub would have to bring us back again and again, funny how people seem to forget that and just like to blame the guy saying he isnt clutch.

NastyNate
03-04-2012, 05:43 AM
i stand by my opinion that the game in cincy is the exact type of game schaub historically loses... there were some huge drops, key turnovers, including 1 at the goalline by tate, and a missed FG that lead to points for cincy.. even with all the mistakes, the texans found themselves in a position to win the game and yates lead his team downfield and won the game. not to mention without the guy who has been the common denominator to the few schaub GW/GT drives, andre johnson. im almost certain the only thing schaub has over yates at this point, is experience.

No, not even close. Schaub doesn't hit the Safety wide open with no receiver in site. Schaub doesn't play the checkdown dance leading to the Arian Foster "fumble". Schaub murders their weak zone defense and would have had us up by 20 and Tate and Foster would have taken over by the third quarter.

ckhouston
03-04-2012, 07:00 AM
Yates has hit his full potential

Ridiculous statement.

ckhouston
03-04-2012, 07:01 AM
No, not even close. Schaub doesn't hit the Safety wide open with no receiver in site. Schaub doesn't play the checkdown dance leading to the Arian Foster "fumble". Schaub murders their weak zone defense and would have had us up by 20 and Tate and Foster would have taken over by the third quarter.

Matt? Is that you?

Grams
03-04-2012, 07:35 AM
AGREE, in the past Schaub would bring us back, then the Defense would give the other team no challenge and let them score at will and Schaub would have to bring us back again and again, funny how people seem to forget that and just like to blame the guy saying he isnt clutch.

Amen!!

thunderkyss
03-04-2012, 08:44 AM
The best solution for the Texans if they want a SB is to dump MattS and hire PManning. That is if Kubiak can take letting him make the calls. Peyton has never had a running game like Foster, Tate and Ward and never had a defense like ours was either for that matter. With AJ and maybe a FA, WR Peyton would shred opposing defenses.

That is if you want to win now! He wanted to come here so let him!

I love this kind of thinking.

Tj may very well start for the Texans because Schaub may not be healthy enough to start the season. So, we cut Schaub & bring in Peyton Manning.... a guy who may never play football again.

I do agree, the powers that be need to plan for a healthy Schaub, a Schaub that won't be ready to play week 1, & a Schaub that will never play again.

That option should be cheap, with a relatively fair chance of success.

We didn't make the AFC Championship game, because our QB threw 3 Interceptions & our defense did not create 1. Had Jj not fumbled that punt, we still would have lost if those two stats weren't changed.

I think the Texans have thought about our future & Matt Leinart is our answer. Not that Leinart is our future, he's our insurance. Leinart will compete with Yates for the job behind Schaub, just like Kubiak said.

Depending how the season turns out, Schaub takes us to the Promised land (this is a do or die season for Schaub), Leinart takes us, Tj takes us....... or we make moves in the 2013 offseason to find our starting QB.

ArlingtonTexan
03-04-2012, 09:15 AM
The best solution for the Texans if they want a SB is to dump MattS and hire PManning. That is if Kubiak can take letting him make the calls. Peyton has never had a running game like Foster, Tate and Ward and never had a defense like ours was either for that matter. With AJ and maybe a FA, WR Peyton would shred opposing defenses.

That is if you want to win now! He wanted to come here so let him!

Name the last short-term hired gun QB to win a Super Bowl.

Lucky
03-04-2012, 10:24 AM
I think with the Texans medical staff .... they can evaluate Schaub and project the health of his foot going forward ....
I guess that's the issue I left unsaid. I have zero confidence in the Texans medical staff in determining Schaub's long term prognosis. That's based upon case histories of Boselli, Domanick Davis, Charles Spencer, Jason Babin, etc. I don't know if they are even using the same doctors.

And while the largest component of leaning against extending Schaub is health issues, there is some questions about performance. Specifically, how will he handle playoff pressure. Though he was set to QB his first playoff game with a 7-3 record, Matt still is a playoff neophyte. We can assume how Schaub will perform. But, we don't know. Playoff pressure. The pressure of playing for a contract. The pressure of expectations. The pressure of returning from injury. Matt Schaub has a lot to prove this season. I'd like to see him prove it prior to giving him another long term deal.

Honoring Earl 34
03-04-2012, 10:52 AM
Of the two Schaub is the better choice now . In two years I'm not sure I think either one are the type to be an elite QB .

1. Matt has average physical tools at best and he does get injured .

2. TJ has better tools than Matt physically but that's not saying much . The jury is still out on TJ .

At the end of the day neither will make you forget about the top tier QBs but they just have to be Phil Simms the way this teams built .

ckhouston
03-04-2012, 11:46 AM
We didn't make the AFC Championship game, because our QB threw 3 Interceptions & our defense did not create 1. Had Jj not fumbled that punt, we still would have lost if those two stats weren't changed.

JJ muff = 7 points for Ravens and 0 points for a drive that should have been for the Texans. Take the 7 away and we are tied and go into OT, but who is to say we would not have ran the ball down their throat and scored, at least a FG. Texans win. JJ catches the ball clean and we win. Not only did it hand the opponent a TD, but completely changed the momentum of the game. Thats my opinion.

ckhouston
03-04-2012, 11:52 AM
Of the two Schaub is the better choice now . In two years I'm not sure I think either one are the type to be an elite QB .

1. Matt has average physical tools at best and he does get injured .

2. TJ has better tools than Matt physically but that's not saying much . The jury is still out on TJ .

At the end of the day neither will make you forget about the top tier QBs but they just have to be Phil Simms the way this teams built .

I agree with most of that.

I think Yates mistakes were mental and came from lack of NFL in-game experience, so would hope that with a full camp with the first team and an off-season to work on his deficiencies, he would be a better QB. Couple that with him being a superior athelete and having better physical tools, I would have to give him the slight edge.

I would hate to hang my hat on a QB that could go down at any time just from being in the general area of a gnat fart. (See Matt Schaub).

I like the Simms analogy, but think Dilfer would be more accurate. Just manage the game and hand-off to the RB's ... Wade and the boys will do the rest.

Corrosion
03-04-2012, 01:38 PM
I guess that's the issue I left unsaid. I have zero confidence in the Texans medical staff in determining Schaub's long term prognosis. That's based upon case histories of Boselli, Domanick Davis, Charles Spencer, Jason Babin, etc. I don't know if they are even using the same doctors.

Hard to argue against this with their past performance (or at least what was let out to the media / fans) ofthe Texans medical staff , especially that of the Casserly Capers era .... Im not sure if they have the same staff or not. Thats a real good question. I'll do some digging on this one and get back to you ifI can come up with an answer.

The one thing about Schaub's injury is that it isnt as "bad" as many of those you list above. Its a bone injury rather than one to ligaments ... It should be relatively easy for them to determine the recovery of that bone.


And while the largest component of leaning against extending Schaub is health issues, there is some questions about performance. Specifically, how will he handle playoff pressure. Though he was set to QB his first playoff game with a 7-3 record, Matt still is a playoff neophyte. We can assume how Schaub will perform. But, we don't know. Playoff pressure. The pressure of playing for a contract. The pressure of expectations. The pressure of returning from injury. Matt Schaub has a lot to prove this season. I'd like to see him prove it prior to giving him another long term deal.

I cant argue with any of that ....



The best solution for the Texans if they want a SB is to dump MattS and hire PManning. That is if Kubiak can take letting him make the calls. Peyton has never had a running game like Foster, Tate and Ward and never had a defense like ours was either for that matter. With AJ and maybe a FA, WR Peyton would shred opposing defenses.

That is if you want to win now! He wanted to come here so let him!

Its unknown if Peyton can throw with any velocity at this point in his recovery .... Im not willing to spend the money on that gamble much less the gamble that a single hit to a fragile and already injured area ends his season (and likely career) again ....

AGREE, in the past Schaub would bring us back, then the Defense would give the other team no challenge and let them score at will and Schaub would have to bring us back again and again, funny how people seem to forget that and just like to blame the guy saying he isnt clutch.

Damnit EU .... You arent suppose to agree with me , then I dont have anyone to argue with.

JJ muff = 7 points for Ravens and 0 points for a drive that should have been for the Texans. Take the 7 away and we are tied and go into OT, but who is to say we would not have ran the ball down their throat and scored, at least a FG. Texans win. JJ catches the ball clean and we win. Not only did it hand the opponent a TD, but completely changed the momentum of the game. Thats my opinion.

Its hard to say a game goes differently removing one play .... who's to say that the Ravens dont get a turnover in the subsequent series and score anyway ... especially considering how many takeaways the Ravens generated thruout that game.

Jones mistake was a huge one and did have a great impact upon the game but you just cant look at a single play or event under a microscope ....

If a frog had wings he wouldnt bump his ass when he hops .....

Yates has hit his full potential, he isn't a starter. If you're even questioning Schaub starting versus Yates you're drunk.

I dont think Yates has come close to his full potential .... He came in as a rookie 5th round pick with no OTA's or a training camp and was "Ready" when his name was called. He also got better each week after he did become the starter.
He's also spent the offseason working very hard to get better .... I think his ceiling is much higher than his performance last season.

That said , a healthy Schaub is your starter /end thread.

NastyNate
03-04-2012, 10:09 PM
Matt? Is that you?

Ignore all my accurate statements with the old bait and switch. Nice. You're delusional or trolling. Here's a quick comparison:

Schaub 2011= 8.5 YPA, 2.5:1 TD to INT ratio, 96.8 QB Rating

TJ Yates 2011=7 YPA, 1:1 TD to INT ratio, 80.7 QB Rating

ckhouston
03-04-2012, 10:27 PM
Ignore all my accurate statements with the old bait and switch. Nice. You're delusional or trolling. Here's a quick comparison:

Schaub 2011= 8.5 YPA, 2.5:1 TD to INT ratio, 96.8 QB Rating

TJ Yates 2011=7 YPA, 1:1 TD to INT ratio, 80.7 QB Rating

LMFAO at you comparing a rookies stats to someone who has been in the league for 8 years and failed. Nice.

NastyNate
03-04-2012, 10:30 PM
LMFAO at you comparing a rookies stats to someone who has been in the league for 8 years and failed. Nice.

Failed? How has Schaub failed? Did I call him an All-pro or the greatest thing since Warner? I stated that there's no way Yates should start ahead of him based on performance. Yates doesn't have it, he's a great backup plan if Schaub goes down, but he's not a starter and has proven as such.

ckhouston
03-04-2012, 10:33 PM
Failed? How has Schaub failed? Did I call him an All-pro or the greatest thing since Warner? I stated that there's no way Yates should start ahead of him based on performance. Yates doesn't have it, he's a great backup plan if Schaub goes down, but he's not a starter and has proven as such.

Yates won a playoff game. His resume already owns Schaubs.

NastyNate
03-04-2012, 10:35 PM
Yates won a playoff game. His resume already owns Schaubs.

And he lost one too, badly. If not for our defense it would have been very ugly.

ckhouston
03-04-2012, 10:40 PM
And he lost one too, badly. If not for our defense it would have been very ugly.

If not for JJ it would have been a win and a SB trophy.

NastyNate
03-04-2012, 10:41 PM
If not for JJ it would have been a win and a SB trophy.

3 Interceptions (which realistically should have been even higher) does not a superbowl winner make. Your logic is flawed, if you lose a game 6 minutes in then you have much bigger problems than punt returner. Pull the blinders off.

dalemurphy
03-04-2012, 10:53 PM
Yates won a playoff game. His resume already owns Schaubs.

That's silly. I love the kid. However, the Texans were threading a needle winning the games it did with Yates. Yates' presence limited the ways in which the Texans could win. With Schaub, the Texans could air it out and come from behind if needed. Not so with Yates. Not yet, at least. With Schaub, I believe the Texans beat Baltimore rather convincingly, even with the JJ fumble.

ckhouston
03-04-2012, 10:58 PM
3 Interceptions (which realistically should have been even higher) does not a superbowl winner make. Your logic is flawed, if you lose a game 6 minutes in then you have much bigger problems than punt returner. Pull the blinders off.

If we arent behind, we arent throwing.

ckhouston
03-04-2012, 11:00 PM
With Schaub, the Texans could air it out and come from behind if needed. .

Hell yeah with Schaubs 30 yard bombs.

NastyNate
03-04-2012, 11:30 PM
If we arent behind, we arent throwing.

If a single player doesn't account for 75% of our turnovers, we aren't throwing.

Corrosion
03-04-2012, 11:54 PM
The "class of 2011" isnt our best ....:specnatz:

dalemurphy
03-05-2012, 12:00 AM
Hell yeah with Schaubs 30 yard bombs.

Not much to say in retort to this. Wow. Al Davis?... is that you?

Premier
03-05-2012, 12:01 AM
schaub era needs to be over...

Corrosion
03-05-2012, 12:17 AM
the schaub love is sickening.. blind homers, smh. the schaub era needs to be over soon; he isnt the answer.. he is one of the weak links on this team, but it holds more weight than the others because its such an important position..

Texans offense with Schaub 27.3ppg @ a 7-3 record. (.700)

Texans offense without Schaub 18ppg @ a 3-3 (.500) record with losses to Both Indy and Carolina who combined for 8 total wins .... two less than the Texans and only one more than the Schaub led Texans thru 10 games.


You people crack me up .... Just because Schaub isnt Aaron Rogers , Drew Brees or Tom Brady you want to replace him ... well I got news for ya , only three teams have those QB's and Yates isnt in their league. Its not even close.

Premier
03-05-2012, 12:24 AM
Texans offense with Schaub 27.3ppg @ a 7-3 record. (.700)

Texans offense without Schaub 18ppg @ a 3-3 (.500) record with losses to Both Indy and Carolina who combined for 8 total wins .... two less than the Texans and only one more than the Schaub led Texans thru 10 games.


You people crack me up .... Just because Schaub isnt Aaron Rogers , Drew Brees or Tom Brady you want to replace him ... well I got news for ya , only three teams have those QB's and Yates isnt in their league. Its not even close.

i could care less about schaubs PPG against all those bum ass teams the texans were beating up. schaub isnt putting up 33 PPG in the playoffs.. it amazes me how you folks seem to think that schaub some how grew a pair of nuts and would have "convincingly beat the ravens".. this guy is a scared QB, keep trying to deny that he tuns into a midget when the game gets tough..

schaub career 2 minute rating is <50 with more INTs than TDs...

infantrycak
03-05-2012, 12:43 AM
Texans offense with Schaub 27.3ppg @ a 7-3 record. (.700)

Texans offense without Schaub 18ppg @ a 3-3 (.500) record with losses to Both Indy and Carolina who combined for 8 total wins .... two less than the Texans and only one more than the Schaub led Texans thru 10 games.


You people crack me up .... Just because Schaub isnt Aaron Rogers , Drew Brees or Tom Brady you want to replace him ... well I got news for ya , only three teams have those QB's and Yates isnt in their league. Its not even close.

Dude, it isn't worth the keystrokes with some of these folks.

NastyNate
03-05-2012, 01:02 AM
Dude, it isn't worth the keystrokes with some of these folks.

Indeed. I can't believe some of the responses in this thread. Ghost of Al Davis in here.

Corrosion
03-05-2012, 01:55 AM
i could care less about schaubs PPG against all those bum ass teams the texans were beating up. schaub isnt putting up 33 PPG in the playoffs.. it amazes me how you folks seem to think that schaub some how grew a pair of nuts and would have "convincingly beat the ravens".. this guy is a scared QB, keep trying to deny that he tuns into a midget when the game gets tough..

schaub career 2 minute rating is <50 with more INTs than TDs...

You are entitled to your opinion .... But I got news for ya , your opinion sucks.

Oh by the way .... 33 points against the Aints on the road ....even if it was a loss ....

41 against the Tits in their place. They finished 9-7 , I hardly call them bum ass no matter how much I hate that team.

24 against the Jags .... who had a hell of a defense.

A win over a tough as nails Steelers team .... sure they only scored 17 but .... that steelers defense finished the season #1 is scoring defense allowing only 14.2ppg.


Dude, it isn't worth the keystrokes with some of these folks.

Yeah , kinda like tellin people in the NSZ anything .... their mind is made up even if its based off of bull****.

Threads like this give us a good guage as to who's posts to read .... and who's to just skip over and move on. I feel dumber just having read some of this stuff .... :texanbill:

KA4Texan
03-05-2012, 04:30 AM
IMO, you keep what got you there.

TJ did a great job for a rookie but let us not forget the last time we hung our franchise on a rookie QB far to soon.

Schaub did the bulk of the work, TJ did what needed to be done to make sure it wasn't in vein. IMO to hand it all over to him so soon would be foolish.

Texan_Bill
03-05-2012, 08:23 AM
:facepalm: OP!!

thunderkyss
03-05-2012, 09:22 AM
i could care less about schaubs PPG against all those bum ass teams the texans were beating up. schaub isnt putting up 33 PPG in the playoffs.. it amazes me how you folks seem to think that schaub some how grew a pair of nuts and would have "convincingly beat the ravens".. this guy is a scared QB, keep trying to deny that he tuns into a midget when the game gets tough..

schaub career 2 minute rating is <50 with more INTs than TDs...

I think you make some good points about Schaub's weaknesses. However, he is definitely the best thing we've got going at the QB position. It's hard to say we would have beat Baltimore if Schaub was playing, but after watching the game several times & seeing open receivers Tj did not, it is a plausible theory.

Again, you're points about Schaub (imo) is dead on & I don't see how anyone watching the game can not see this.

What you fail to see.... at least in appearance, is that Tj had his opportunity. He didn't "WOW" anyone. He played admirably, but not at the level of a QB that can/will replace Matt Schaub. Cam Newton..... if he looked like Cam Newton, you'd be right on.

Even in Cincinnati's loss, Dalton did not look as bad as Tj did versus Carolina, Tennessee, & Baltimore.



Oh by the way .... 33 points against the Aints on the road ....even if it was a loss ....

Sorry, it doesn't work that way.

We had two possessions where we could have pressed the Saints & extended our lead, putting them in a bad position of having to throw the ball... Didn't happen, Schaub & the offense folded. Our defense couldn't hold up as Brees Marched the Saints down the field & took over the game.



Threads like this give us a good guage as to who's posts to read .... and who's to just skip over and move on. I feel dumber just having read some of this stuff .... :texanbill:

Sounds like you're a little closed minded. For the most part he wasn't offensive, presented his points. You chose not to agree with his take... nothing wrong with that, that's why we're here.

:chef:

thunderkyss
03-05-2012, 09:24 AM
IMO, you keep what got you there.

TJ did a great job for a rookie but let us not forget the last time we hung our franchise on a rookie QB far to soon.

Schaub did the bulk of the work, TJ did what needed to be done to make sure it wasn't in vein. IMO to hand it all over to him so soon would be foolish.

So what's your plan if Schaub isn't ready week 1?

What if we have to P.U.P. him?

Who starts for that 9 weeks?

HJam72
03-05-2012, 09:30 AM
Only way I would even consider starting Yates over a healthy Schaub is if someone somehow convinced me that our D kept getting better because Yates playing QB somehow improved it.

Yates will need at least of couple of more years before he's better than a healthy Schaub, and that's if it ever happens. I appreciate his efforts, but I don't see any current QB controversy at all.

Texan_Bill
03-05-2012, 09:31 AM
Let's throw "Commander Cody" into the mix!! :texanbill:



:smiliepalm:

ckhouston
03-05-2012, 09:36 AM
So what's your plan if Schaub isn't ready week 1?

What if we have to P.U.P. him?

Who starts for that 9 weeks?

Yates is my plan day one. Matt is trade bait only.

badboy
03-05-2012, 09:39 AM
Yates is my plan day one. Matt is trade bait only.Thought you said in another thread that since Foster signed, Peyton Manning was coming here? :kitten:

Rey
03-05-2012, 09:48 AM
If I were the Texans (and if the lisfranc stuff I've read on the board is accurate), I'd seriously consider Peyton Manning...

That, or trading up for RG3 via a series of moves...

Right now, I don't feel great with Yates, Leinart or Schaub (because he may not be healthy)...

2012Champs
03-05-2012, 10:37 AM
JJ muff = 7 points for Ravens and 0 points for a drive that should have been for the Texans. Take the 7 away and we are tied and go into OT, but who is to say we would not have ran the ball down their throat and scored, at least a FG. Texans win. JJ catches the ball clean and we win. Not only did it hand the opponent a TD, but completely changed the momentum of the game. Thats my opinion.

If not for JJ it would have been a win and a SB trophy.

If we arent behind, we arent throwing.



If your QB or team cant come back from being down 4 points only 5 minutes into the game you were never going to make it to the big show. Further Yates pick forcing the ball to Dre right after this fumble was FAR from the point in which we were forced to be throwing. Truth is Yates was at best "okay" for us this past season and your hate boner for Schaub is pulling your eyelids shut and you cant see how meh Yates was

b0ng
03-05-2012, 10:47 AM
Yates won a playoff game. His resume already owns Schaubs.

Talk about a distinction for individual performance.

Schaub is a good, quality starter in a middle-high tier.

For all these stats 100 is average.

102 CMP%+ (16th)
130 Y/A+ (3rd)
109 TD%+ (6th)
113 INT%+ (10th)
116 Rate+ (5th)
124 Adjusted Yards Per Attempt (4th)
126 Net Yards Per Attempt (4th)
125 Adjusted Net Yards Per Attempt (4th)

His completion percentage could be better, but generally he's a productive passer who keeps his INT% respectable despite putting the ball up almost 30 times a game. That's pretty good.

Basically anybody can pretty much ignore your opinion on Schaub since it's based in a fantasy world and not reality.

HOU-TEX
03-05-2012, 10:52 AM
:facepalm: OP!!

Not just the OP, bro. Are we having an influx from the HT board? It's getting really similar to the type of logic that we used to see over there.

Texan_Bill
03-05-2012, 10:52 AM
Talk about a distinction for individual performance.

Schaub is a good, quality starter in a middle-high tier.

For all these stats 100 is average.

102 CMP%+ (16th)
130 Y/A+ (3rd)
109 TD%+ (6th)
113 INT%+ (10th)
116 Rate+ (5th)
124 Adjusted Yards Per Attempt (4th)
126 Net Yards Per Attempt (4th)
125 Adjusted Net Yards Per Attempt (4th)

His completion percentage could be better, but generally he's a productive passer who keeps his INT% respectable despite putting the ball up almost 30 times a game. That's pretty good.

Basically anybody can pretty much ignore your opinion on Schaub since it's based in a fantasy world and not reality.

I read posts like that (not yours - the ones suggests Yates is a better QB than Schaub) and want to punch myself in the junk...

b0ng
03-05-2012, 10:56 AM
I read posts like that (not yours - the ones suggests Yates is a better QB than Schaub) and want to punch myself in the junk...

I imagine most of these people also root for the Cowboys and regularly make dumb remarks on the internet about how Tony Romo is the problem with that team. Apparently fans of pro football teams in Texas hate their QB's unless they are

A. A backup

B. Roger Staubach

Rey
03-05-2012, 10:56 AM
If your QB or team cant come back from being down 4 points only 5 minutes into the game you were never going to make it to the big show. Further Yates pick forcing the ball to Dre right after this fumble was FAR from the point in which we were forced to be throwing. Truth is Yates was at best "okay" for us this past season and your hate boner for Schaub is pulling your eyelids shut and you cant see how meh Yates was


I'm big on momentum...That Jacoby fumble was a huge momentum swing...

We came out put up points, stopped them and then they get the ball right there basically on the goal line.

Yates was a rookie...He should get better...

Also, if I'm not mistaken Tom Brady threw 2 picks and had a 50 something QB rating against the Ravens and he was at Home...Patriots needed some serious fortune to go their way to win that game...

Earlier in the year when Matt played in Baltimore it wasn't all that pretty either...He didn't have any picks but he was sacked a few times and he only averaged about 6 YPC...

I agree that a healthy Matt gives us a better chance to win than TJ Yates though...

2012Champs
03-05-2012, 11:03 AM
I'm big on momentum...That Jacoby fumble was a huge momentum swing...

We came out put up points, stopped them and then they get the ball right there basically on the goal line.

Yates was a rookie...He should get better...

Also, if I'm not mistaken Tom Brady threw 2 picks and had a 50 something QB rating against the Ravens and he was at Home...Patriots needed some serious fortune to go their way to win that game...

Earlier in the year when Matt played in Baltimore it wasn't all that pretty either...He didn't have any picks but he was sacked a few times and he only averaged about 6 YPC...

I agree that a healthy Matt gives us a better chance to win than TJ Yates though...



Yates will never be Brady so lets stop with the absurd comments about the two. Huge momentum? We gave Yates a very very short field and we ended up with 3points. Like I said if being down 4 after 5 minutes of play ends your chances of winning your chances werent really good in the first place. Yates was a momentum killer all day, 3 ints and another 2-3 that should have been ints but the Ravens were not expecting balls to be hitting them in the chest/hands as often as the chances were coming in.

Texan_Bill
03-05-2012, 11:11 AM
Not just the OP, bro. Are we having an influx from the HT board? It's getting really similar to the type of logic that we used to see over there.

Right!!! That's exactly what it seems like.

thunderkyss
03-05-2012, 12:14 PM
Yates will never be Brady so lets stop with the absurd comments about the two.

Let's pull up on the "reading comprehensive knee jerk reactions". He didn't make a comparison of Yates to Brady. He mentioned Brady in the same paragraph... not the same thing.

2012Champs
03-05-2012, 12:33 PM
Let's pull up on the "reading comprehensive knee jerk reactions". He didn't make a comparison of Yates to Brady. He mentioned Brady in the same paragraph... not the same thing.



Its something the yates homers certainly cling to

Corrosion
03-05-2012, 12:51 PM
We had two possessions where we could have pressed the Saints & extended our lead, putting them in a bad position of having to throw the ball... Didn't happen, Schaub & the offense folded. Our defense couldn't hold up as Brees Marched the Saints down the field & took over the game.

Yep , they got FG's instead of TD's on a couple of those early drives that could have put the game away .... but they still put up 33 against a solid defensive team on the road. Also dont forget that the Texans #1 offensive option (Foster) was on the sidelines for this game.


And Brees had a whale of a game , especially in the second half .... multiple times he avoided sacks that would likely have crushed any chance of them coming away with a W ..... the other guy's get paid too and the defense didnt do them any favors giving up 23 points in the 4th quarter alone.

You score 33 , you expect to win .....




Sounds like you're a little closed minded. For the most part he wasn't offensive, presented his points. You chose not to agree with his take... nothing wrong with that, that's why we're here.

:chef:

I may be a bit closed minded (sure I am - no sarcasm intended). No, he wasnt offensive ... but he completely disregarded any statistical comparison between the two and rather than presenting a point , I think he stated an opinion .... with no stats to back it up. .700 & .500 speak for themselves.

Schaub has his faults .... No , he's no Brady , Rogers or Brees .... but he's a much better QB at this point in his career than TJ Yates .... and long term , I think Yates can be the starter.

Every teams fans want their "Brady , Rogers or Brees" .... there are just so few of that calibur to go around .... and because Schaub is a notch or two below those guy's .... some are always looking to replace him with the next hot name. We would be more likely to end up with the next ..... Commander Cody than the next Joe Montana.


So what's your plan if Schaub isn't ready week 1?

What if we have to P.U.P. him?

Who starts for that 9 weeks?

Likely Yates unless they bring in another player at the position .... and there isnt much out there on the scrap heap that can beat Yates out of that #2 spot.

Goatcheese
03-05-2012, 01:08 PM
http://images.icanhascheezburger.com/completestore/2008/3/16/srslyyouguys128502044592500000.jpg

Hookem Horns
03-05-2012, 03:26 PM
Before I even make my comment I apologize, I have been extremely busy and don't have time to read the entire thread.

TJ did great for a 5th round rookie however after a few games he played as would be expected for a 5th round rookie. It's no knock on him all things considered. I strongly feel we would have beaten the Ravens with a competent QB like Schaub.

I am not a huge Shaub fan however personally I didn't see enough in TJ Yates to feel he should take over this team, at least not next season.

For one to be saying ditch Schaub and let's go with Yates is crazy IMO, especially because the team is so close.

HOU-TEX
03-05-2012, 03:46 PM
Before I even make my comment I apologize, I have been extremely busy and don't have time to read the entire thread.

TJ did great for a 5th round rookie however after a few games he played as would be expected for a 5th round rookie. It's no knock on him all things considered. I strongly feel we would have beaten the Ravens with a competent QB like Schaub.

I am not a huge Shaub fan however personally I didn't see enough in TJ Yates to feel he should take over this team, at least not next season.

For one to be saying ditch Schaub and let's go with Yates is crazy IMO, especially because the team is so close.

100% agreed, HH

Perki-Perk
03-05-2012, 04:14 PM
This thread is crazy in my opinion. I've said time and again, were Shaub in that game, there is a high probability we would of been playing and subsequently beating the Patriots and landing ourselves in the Super Bowl. With our team on the cusp of great things, some of you would throw TJ to the wolves and rid yourselves of Shaub. I'm not a big fan (of Shaub), don't even own a Shaub jersey, but I certainly don't believe that TJ Yates is the answer....this year. Nor is Manning (Kubes and Head would bump heads and kill the chemistry on this team, also, imo) Shaub, if healthy, can get us there.

TEXANRED
03-05-2012, 05:11 PM
This thread is crazy in my opinion. I've said time and again, were Shaub in that game, there is a high probability we would of been playing and subsequently beating the Patriots and landing ourselves in the Super Bowl. With our team on the cusp of great things, some of you would throw TJ to the wolves and rid yourselves of Shaub. I'm not a big fan (of Shaub), don't even own a Shaub jersey, but I certainly don't believe that TJ Yates is the answer....this year. Nor is Manning (Kubes and Head would bump heads and kill the chemistry on this team, also, imo) Shaub, if healthy, can get us there.

I can't go with you on this one cus Schaub has never won against the Ravens and lost to them earlier in the year. While Schaub may not have thrown 3 INT's he may have been sacked a whole heck of a lot. I don't think the Texans win if they do have Schaub at QB.

NastyNate
03-05-2012, 05:14 PM
I can't go with you on this one cus Schaub has never won against the Ravens and lost to them earlier in the year. While Schaub may not have thrown 3 INT's he may have been sacked a whole heck of a lot. I don't think the Texans win if they do have Schaub at QB.

Schaub was sacked 16 times this year in 10 full games, and we passed a lot more in those games. TJ was sacked 15 times in 6 games. You do the math.

TEXANRED
03-05-2012, 05:25 PM
Schaub was sacked 16 times this year in 10 full games, and we passed a lot more in those games. TJ was sacked 15 times in 6 games. You do the math.

My point was Schaub's lack of mobility compared to TJ's and the pass rush the Ravens provide.

infantrycak
03-05-2012, 09:50 PM
My point was Schaub's lack of mobility compared to TJ's and the pass rush the Ravens provide.

But athleticism is only one piece of the puzzle. Schaub makes smarter movements within the pocket and feels the pressure better. TJ is definitely more slippery but if you move in the wrong direction or realize you are going to need to move too late you're still taking as many if not more sacks.

Lucky
03-05-2012, 10:26 PM
Schaub makes smarter movements within the pocket and feels the pressure better.
That's never really been a strong point of Matt's game. Let's say this: Schaub does a better job of throwing the ball away. That's something TJ really needs to work on.

b0ng
03-05-2012, 11:39 PM
I think the defense played a way better game the second time around, seconded by the oline and run game. It's not a foregone conclusion that Schaub would've won the game; don't think it would have hurt us.

infantrycak
03-06-2012, 12:10 AM
That's never really been a strong point of Matt's game. Let's say this: Schaub does a better job of throwing the ball away. That's something TJ really needs to work on.

As opposed to play fake where I will compare Schaub to the top in the league, in this instance I only said better than TJ. Didn't say it was something he was great at, only better than the current competition in this discussion. And I will stand by that. Schaub senses the pressure and reacts to it better than TJ although less athletic. Now that additional athleticism absolutely saves TJ some sacks as well - of course that gets back to the age old question, would he have needed to move so fast if he had moved earlier or smarter.

KA4Texan
03-06-2012, 10:08 AM
So what's your plan if Schaub isn't ready week 1?

What if we have to P.U.P. him?

Who starts for that 9 weeks?

Likely Yates unless they bring in another player at the position .... and there isnt much out there on the scrap heap that can beat Yates out of that #2 spot.

^This, there is a difference between Yates (or anyone else) filling in for Schaub and replacing Schaub altogether.

IF someone comes in to fill in for Schaub and gets it done better than Schaub consistency fine, discuss moving forward, BUT to scream replace with such a limited resume as Yates has right now in the NFL is as I stated in my opinion is foolish.

You don't hang your hat on a guy that did a good job "for a rookie" you hang your hat on the guy that did a good job. (without the "consideration" by that) and Schaub does a good job, is he the best, no, but all things considered we don't need a Manning or Brady. (insert any other QB that floats your boat) it would be nice sure, but not a necessity.

If he hadn't been a rookie thrown into the grinder so soon then I would have been just as angry with TJ as I was Jacoby. (If not more so)

Corrosion
03-06-2012, 04:17 PM
As opposed to play fake where I will compare Schaub to the top in the league, in this instance I only said better than TJ. Didn't say it was something he was great at, only better than the current competition in this discussion. And I will stand by that. Schaub senses the pressure and reacts to it better than TJ although less athletic. Now that additional athleticism absolutely saves TJ some sacks as well - of course that gets back to the age old question, would he have needed to move so fast if he had moved earlier or smarter.

I think there is only one guy better in the league right now .... and there is no guarantee that guy plays another down in the NFL. There was a time not too long ago I thought Schaub could do a better job hiding the ball ... but after you pointed it out the last time , I went back and reviewed those plays .... I came away with a new opinion.

Schaubs play fakes are a big part of how Kubiak & Co's scheme's get guy's like #80 .... lost in space open.
I mean .... how else does a guy with three defenders having responsibility on him end up with no one within 10 yards of him ? Schaubs sells it well ....

2012Champs
03-06-2012, 06:45 PM
My point was Schaub's lack of mobility compared to TJ's and the pass rush the Ravens provide.


I'd rather take a sack or throwing the ball away vs 3 ints

I love the people who talk about Yates' great mobility vs schaub's poor mobility but Yates was taking more sacks than schaub lol

Texan_Bill
03-06-2012, 07:03 PM
Likely Yates unless they bring in another player at the position .... and there isnt much out there on the scrap heap that can beat Yates out of that #2 spot.

Come tomorrow, Yates will be back in the third string position... After all, Peyton Manning will be released so he'll be our #1 with Lienart at the #2, while Matty "the Foot" continues to rehab!

:stirpot:

TexanSam
03-06-2012, 07:10 PM
My point was Schaub's lack of mobility compared to TJ's and the pass rush the Ravens provide.

IIIRC, the Texans offensive line absolutely dominated the Ravens pass rush. They couldn't get any pressure on TJ. It was their secondary that did him in that game. If Schaub were in there and had that same type of protection there's no doubt in my mind we would have won that game.

Wolf
03-06-2012, 07:20 PM
IF I recall, the Texans averaged about 26 or so points a game with Schaub.

with TJ (understandably so as a rookie) what did we average? about 16 pr 17?

TJ needs some more seasoning

2012Champs
03-06-2012, 07:44 PM
IF I recall, the Texans averaged about 26 or so points a game with Schaub.

with TJ (understandably so as a rookie) what did we average? about 16 pr 17?

TJ needs some more seasoning



The spread was just over 10 between the two iirc

Corrosion
03-06-2012, 08:12 PM
IF I recall, the Texans averaged about 26 or so points a game with Schaub.

with TJ (understandably so as a rookie) what did we average? about 16 pr 17?

TJ needs some more seasoning


The spread was just over 10 between the two iirc

Texans offense with Schaub 27.3ppg @ a 7-3 record. (.700)

Texans offense without Schaub 18ppg @ a 3-3 (.500) record.



:truck:

Norg
03-06-2012, 08:23 PM
Schaub is our starter unless he starts to really suck and costs us games then i think TJ should jump in


But yeah if schaub sucks this year like going 1-4 or 3-8 then year nothing matters anymore since we wont be making the playoffs if that happens

ObsiWan
03-07-2012, 03:17 AM
If the deciding point in a game comes in the first quarter, then your team has much more serious problems than just punt returns. Could easily put Schaub's name in that sentence and it has just as much merit.

Schaub needs to play, and play well in order for me to think he has earned an extension. If Yates beats Schaub out in camp then obviously don't extend Schaub, I just don't see that happening right now.

Must Spread Rep.

Damn, I'm tired of that fumbled punt excuse. I totally agree that if you lose a game due to a mistake that you have FIFTY-FIVE MINUTES to overcome, then you have a sad little team.

We lost to the Ravens because T.J. Yates couldn't see anyone else to throw to except A.J. and the Ravens' D (mainly Ed Reed) suckered him all game long to the tune of three INTs.

Yates is NOT ready to start.

ObsiWan
03-07-2012, 03:19 AM
Come tomorrow, Yates will be back in the third string position... After all, Peyton Manning will be released so he'll be our #1 with Lienart at the #2, while Matty "the Foot" continues to rehab!

:stirpot:

Now just cut THAT OUT!
:foottap:

Texan_Bill
03-07-2012, 07:25 AM
Now just cut THAT OUT!
:foottap:


It's what I live for!! :D

DonnyMost
03-07-2012, 07:28 AM
Schaub is getting his extension and he's going to start for us for another 5-6 years. Deal with it.

The only way that changes is if his foot falls off or he's hit by an asteroid, and even in the 1st circumstance I'm not entirely sure.

ckhouston
03-07-2012, 08:28 AM
Schaub is getting his extension and he's going to start for us for another 5-6 years. Deal with it.

I would hope the organization is smarter than that.

thunderkyss
03-07-2012, 09:14 AM
Schaub is getting his extension and he's going to start for us for another 5-6 years. Deal with it.

The only way that changes is if his foot falls off or he's hit by an asteroid, and even in the 1st circumstance I'm not entirely sure.

As far as the Tj Yates vs Schabu debate goes, I think we're all in agreement here. I don't think anyone has said that Tj should start over a healthy Matt Schaub (I'll go back & look though).

What I believe the discussion now is, what to do if Schaub is not healthy week 1.

I personally don't believe Tj needs to be out there at the beginning of the season. I still think he needs to come in, if our play-off chances are gone, or due to injury.

I think Tj Yates is a #2 QB right now. So without a healthy Schaub, I propose we go with Leinart & see what happens. I'm not concerned with Leinart failing under the pressure of having to win. Or proving that he is not a Starter in this league. Tj, I think, still has a high ceiling & I don't want to screw that up.

If Schaub is healthy, then Leinart's gone & Tj is still our #2. But that's just me.

b0ng
03-07-2012, 10:34 AM
As far as the Tj Yates vs Schabu debate goes, I think we're all in agreement here. I don't think anyone has said that Tj should start over a healthy Matt Schaub (I'll go back & look though).

What I believe the discussion now is, what to do if Schaub is not healthy week 1.

I personally don't believe Tj needs to be out there at the beginning of the season. I still think he needs to come in, if our play-off chances are gone, or due to injury.

I think Tj Yates is a #2 QB right now. So without a healthy Schaub, I propose we go with Leinart & see what happens. I'm not concerned with Leinart failing under the pressure of having to win. Or proving that he is not a Starter in this league. Tj, I think, still has a high ceiling & I don't want to screw that up.

If Schaub is healthy, then Leinart's gone & Tj is still our #2. But that's just me.

If Schaub isn't healthy week 1 I'm way more confident in TJ Yates than I am Matt Leinart. I don't even know why Leinart is still on the roster, to me TJ played himself into the backup spot. Maybe it's not fair to Leinart but everything about TJ Yates rookie had "Decent backup" written all over him.

If Schaub does get extended I hope it's after having a spectacular 2012 season. He's not completely proven himself to be a guy that we can stand behind the next 5 or 6 years.

DonnyMost
03-07-2012, 10:37 AM
As far as the Tj Yates vs Schabu debate goes, I think we're all in agreement here. I don't think anyone has said that Tj should start over a healthy Matt Schaub (I'll go back & look though).

What I believe the discussion now is, what to do if Schaub is not healthy week 1.

I personally don't believe Tj needs to be out there at the beginning of the season. I still think he needs to come in, if our play-off chances are gone, or due to injury.

I think Tj Yates is a #2 QB right now. So without a healthy Schaub, I propose we go with Leinart & see what happens. I'm not concerned with Leinart failing under the pressure of having to win. Or proving that he is not a Starter in this league. Tj, I think, still has a high ceiling & I don't want to screw that up.

If Schaub is healthy, then Leinart's gone & Tj is still our #2. But that's just me.

I have no reason to believe Schaub won't be ready come week 1, and until I hear otherwise from a doctor, I'm not going to waste time or effort thinking about it.

And yes, Leinart is toast.

drs23
03-07-2012, 11:35 AM
I have no reason to believe Schaub won't be ready come week 1, and until I hear otherwise from a doctor, I'm not going to waste time or effort thinking about it.

And yes, Leinart is toast.

OK, here's what a pretty good doctor had to say about it:


As GP alluded to, Marcus has the unfortunate experience of having gained his experience first hand. Trying to help redirect him from a surgeon who apparently had poor knowledge and a poor approach to his Lisfranc situation to the physician who ultimately performed the difficult repair, is when I first "met" Marcus. As bad as it has been, Marcus is quite modest in relating the long and traumatic road that he has travelled. All my respect to you, Marcus. You never gave up........or let up.

Now, let's look at where we may be with Schaub.

This is where the most crucial stabilizing ligament in a Lisfanc injury is torn.


http://healthtips24h.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/11/Lisfranc-Injury.jpg


For the the foot to regain stability, this connection must be restabilized with hardware until it has an opportunity to heal and regain strength.. In Schaub's case this was reportedly performed with the use of screws.


Below is an example of a Lisfranc stabilization. Note the diagonal screw that follows the course of the Lisfranc ligament shown above.


http://www.footankleinstitute.com/Portals/14171/images/Fracture010.jpg


Because the plates or screws will be placed across joints that normally are expected to have some motion, this hardware is usually removed somewhere between 3 and 6 months after surgery at the surgeon's discretion and according to the healing progress. The hardware removal is performed because when stresses are placed on them, they can break. Just as a paperclip will fail if bent repeatedly, hardware metal (in this case, screws) can fatigue and fail under stress conditions further comlicating the "recovery." It has been reported that anywhere between 25% to 50% of these hardware-repaired patients may fail and go on to require permanent bone fusion of the joint(s) resulting in the entire loss of joint mobility. In fact, as high as 75% reoperation rate for reasons other than hardware removal has been reported

Furthermore, the goal of any surgery addressing a Lisfranc injury is not only to restore the patient's anatomy, but also to preserve the involved joints. There are numerous studies implicating traumatic impact as sources of cartilage death. Transarticular (through the joint) screw placement requires drilling across an intact cartilage layer that has already sustained traumatic insult. This “second hit” may exacerbate an already complicated problem, and, potentially, accelerate the posttraumatic arthritic process. Extra-articular (outside the joint) bridge plate fixation (see below) offers a means of addressing these Lisfranc injuries without joint violation........i.e., without the screws going the the joints). But there is no mention of plates being utilized in Schaub's case.


http://www.stratmed.co.za/sites/default/files/imagecache/Product-Large-Width-600/product-images/image-6.png


Of course, Schaub could have a perfectly functional recovery. No one can say positively otherwise at this point. But all of the stars will have to be in very accomodating alignment. He has quite a number of obstacles he must overcome. Regaining movement. Overcoming usually significant pain.......sometimes chronic, permanent and debilitating. Avoiding the fear of re-injury. Avoiding re-injury.......even when not playing against Haynesworth. Being able to maximize stress on his back plant leg while passing. Pushing off during play action or avoiding the rush.

Yes, Schaub will be able to return to the field at one point in time. But for how long and how functional?...........maybe for a couple of days after which he and the coaches decide it isn't going to "happen"...............or for a couple of Super Bowls...............or somewhere in between. Although we have been told that he suffered several fractures in his Lisfranc injury, we don't really have all the details of his injury, which makes predictions that much more difficult to offer. One thing we do know is that ANY Lisfranc injury is very serious injury for all of those that must at least walk around for a living.

DonnyMost
03-07-2012, 01:13 PM
OK, here's what a pretty good doctor had to say about it:

Thanks for finding that, good info. All of the variables, doubts, and unknowns described in that post (it's pretty awesome we have a surgeon on this board, btw) make me feel like I should've clarified myself. I'm not waiting to hear from a doctor, I'm waiting to hear from his doctor.

krocket
03-07-2012, 04:29 PM
I love this kind of thinking.

Tj may very well start for the Texans because Schaub may not be healthy enough to start the season. So, we cut Schaub & bring in Peyton Manning.... a guy who may never play football again.

I do agree, the powers that be need to plan for a healthy Schaub, a Schaub that won't be ready to play week 1, & a Schaub that will never play again.

That option should be cheap, with a relatively fair chance of success.

We didn't make the AFC Championship game, because our QB threw 3 Interceptions & our defense did not create 1. Had Jj not fumbled that punt, we still would have lost if those two stats weren't changed.

I think the Texans have thought about our future & Matt Leinart is our answer. Not that Leinart is our future, he's our insurance. Leinart will compete with Yates for the job behind Schaub, just like Kubiak said.

Depending how the season turns out, Schaub takes us to the Promised land (this is a do or die season for Schaub), Leinart takes us, Tj takes us....... or we make moves in the 2013 off-season to find our starting QB.

I think you meant to be sarcastic in your opening comment. You obviously belief you think better than others on this board.

But, then you go on to lay out the argument for obtaining Peyton Manning. According to my interpretation of what CloaknnnDagger said there is a better than even chance that Schaub may never play again and a better than even chance that Peyton will. So we are on the horns of a dilemma anyway. Anything I said was, of course, predicated on the fact that Peyton is/will be healthy. I would not recommend hiring anyone without knowing whether they can play.

If TJ or Leinart starts the season we will probably have a high draft choice next year so maybe we can find a QB then. That is sarcasm !:lol:

ckhouston
03-07-2012, 06:23 PM
If TJ or Leinart starts the season we will probably have a high draft choice next year

We will win the SB next year with Yates starting unless we sign Peyton and then we go for back to back to back SB's. IMHO.

NastyNate
03-09-2012, 03:05 AM
We will win the SB next year with Yates starting unless we sign Peyton and then we go for back to back to back SB's. IMHO.

Dear lord please just stop. How do you manage to completely give the game to the Ravens repeatedly and then all of a sudden TJ is going to win a SB? You're drunk, high, blinded by homerism, or a combination of all three. I'm almost certain you're from the Colts forum and just lonely or bored.

ckhouston
03-09-2012, 09:53 AM
Dear lord please just stop. How do you manage to completely give the game to the Ravens repeatedly and then all of a sudden TJ is going to win a SB? You're drunk, high, blinded by homerism, or a combination of all three. I'm almost certain you're from the Colts forum and just lonely or bored.

TJ was a rookie thrown to the Wolves. With an off-season, camp, and taking all the first team reps he will be fine. Better athlete and better leader than Matt, so he would be my choice. All Matt has on TJ is experience, so give the kid some experience. Anyway, we don't know if Matt will ever take another snap, so I will go with the sure thing over a maybe any day. Yates would be my starter day one, unless the planets align and we sign Peyton.

thunderkyss
03-09-2012, 10:08 AM
TJ was a rookie thrown to the Wolves. With an off-season, camp, and taking all the first team reps he will be fine. Better athlete and better leader than Matt, so he would be my choice. All Matt has on TJ is experience, so give the kid some experience. Anyway, we don't know if Matt will ever take another snap, so I will go with the sure thing over a maybe any day. Yates would be my starter day one, unless the planets align and we sign Peyton.

Hey CK, you've got something on your chin.

:kubepalm:

HOU-TEX
03-09-2012, 10:11 AM
We will win the SB next year with Yates starting unless we sign Peyton and then we go for back to back to back SB's. IMHO.

I reckon you had quite the childhood with that imagination of yours

ckhouston
03-09-2012, 02:27 PM
Hey CK, you've got something on your chin.

:kubepalm:

:boxing:

:aikido:

ObsiWan
03-09-2012, 03:44 PM
Hey CK, you've got something on your chin.

:kubepalm:

tacky...
funny, but tacky
:D

alicetxjj
03-09-2012, 05:36 PM
Schauby for 2012 until he gets injured again. then i'd like to see TJ earn the starting job by playing great and staying healthy.

Texecutioner
03-09-2012, 05:47 PM
TJ Yates was terrible. He'll be a career back up and if he ever gets a chance to start from the beginning of the season he'll be a mid level QB like Mark Sanchez at best.

The only reason why this guy even remotely is relevant on this board and in this city is because he got to start a few games last season by default since two other QB's in front of him got hurt.

This an entire idea to even question him vs. Schaub is a joke and really disrespectful to a guy like Schaub that has put up great numbers for years on a bad team where he has been around the top 10 of the league at QB for at least around 3 years now.

If Yates didn't play for the Texans and was some guy on the Titans he'd be laughed at in here and held in the same regard Gabbert is in Jacksonville right now. I really really hope that Leinart can restructure his contract and compete to keep his 2nd string job so people can end this delusion that Yates will ever be a great starter in this league or a guy that should lead the Texans.

thunderkyss
03-09-2012, 06:58 PM
If Yates didn't play for the Texans and was some guy on the Titans he'd be laughed at in here and held in the same regard Gabbert is in Jacksonville right now. I really really hope that Leinart can restructure his contract and compete to keep his 2nd string job so people can end this delusion that Yates will ever be a great starter in this league or a guy that should lead the Texans.

I agree going into the season with Yates as our number 1 would be detrimental to his development in this league.

But you don't see a difference between Tj & GAbbert?

Really?

Wolf
03-09-2012, 07:07 PM
but Gabbert has catch phases

:kitten:
http://i265.photobucket.com/albums/ii202/J4103V/bghorse0.jpg

Goatcheese
03-09-2012, 08:26 PM
I agree going into the season with Yates as our number 1 would be detrimental to his development in this league.

But you don't see a difference between Tj & GAbbert?

Really?

It's a little unfair to compare TJ and his supporting cast(top 3 O-Line, AJ, Foster, OD, etc.) to Gabbert and the clown shoes he was playing with.

I'm not saying that he wasn't bad, but it isn't like they gave him any help.

krocket
03-10-2012, 03:42 AM
How would you like to be Kubiak 2 years from now and realize that Manning has taken his team to the SB twice and you missed the playoffs with no QB after Schaub couldn't go on his foot more than a couple of games into this coming season. And, you had the chance to bring Manning here and didn't take it. I realize this is highly theoretical, but could happen. It is evident from the news coming out of NFL.com (no particular link) that a lot of people think Manning will be healthy and ready to go next season from the number of teams pursuing him. A lot of football people on there think Houston is an SB "waiting to happen" with Manning at the helm.

Kubiak and the FO would have a lot of egg on their faces at this point.

Wolf
03-10-2012, 04:34 AM
depends on the price

Manning is a hit and miss for about 29 of 32 GM's
(or so)

same as Drew Brees was with teams a few yeas ago (however Drew was young still)

Corrosion
03-10-2012, 05:02 AM
How would you like to be Kubiak 2 years from now and realize that Manning has taken his team to the SB twice and you missed the playoffs with no QB after Schaub couldn't go on his foot more than a couple of games into this coming season. And, you had the chance to bring Manning here and didn't take it. I realize this is highly theoretical, but could happen. It is evident from the news coming out of NFL.com (no particular link) that a lot of people think Manning will be healthy and ready to go next season from the number of teams pursuing him. A lot of football people on there think Houston is an SB "waiting to happen" with Manning at the helm.

Kubiak and the FO would have a lot of egg on their faces at this point.

Manning has gone to the superbowl twice in 14 years and has a 9-10 record as a starting QB in the playoffs (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peyton_Manning)with four of those coming in his lone superbowl win.

To think he's all the sudden going to go to back to back superbowls at 36 coming off of multiple neck surgeries ... is kinda far fetched.

I'd steer clear of the guy .... What you are getting for your multiple millions isnt likely a Superbowl appearance much less a superbowl win .... You are buying his past accomplishments. Tho many , I dont think he's worth the gamble.


And why the hell is this thread in the Texans section instead of the NFL section .....

Premier
03-10-2012, 05:23 AM
I really really hope that Leinart can restructure his contract and compete to keep his 2nd string job so people can end this delusion

delusion huh??

Premier
03-10-2012, 05:25 AM
And why the hell is this thread in the Texans section instead of the NFL section .....

Thread titled "TJ Yates or Matt Schaub?"

http://i.qkme.me/x39.jpg

Corrosion
03-10-2012, 06:03 AM
Thread titled "TJ Yates or Matt Schaub?"



It was semi-sarcasm .... Since every thread turns into "the latest hot FA (http://www.texanstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=90224)" Go ahead , click the link.

thunderkyss
03-10-2012, 10:53 AM
How would you like to be Kubiak 2 years from now and realize that Manning has taken his team to the SB twice and you missed the playoffs with no QB after Schaub couldn't go on his foot more than a couple of games into this coming season.

How would you like to be Kubiak 2 years from now & realize that Manning never played another down & some team (Miami) wasted a year of their existence thinking he would. In the meantime, You've won two AFC Championship game following the plan that got you to this point.

Rey
03-10-2012, 10:59 AM
How would you like to be Kubiak 2 years from now & realize that Manning never played another down & some team (Miami) wasted a year of their existence thinking he would. In the meantime, You've won two AFC Championship game following the plan that got you to this point.

Honestly, I think the Texans will be picking in the top 15 in next years draft.

jaayteetx
03-10-2012, 11:03 AM
Honestly, I think the Texans will be picking in the top 15 in next years draft.

They must be trading up then!

ObsiWan
03-10-2012, 11:50 AM
Honestly, I think the Texans will be picking in the top 15 in next years draft.

Aww come on man... you can't drop a steamer like that in our koolaid pitcher with absolutely no explanation...

what do you mean??
:shades:

Rey
03-10-2012, 12:04 PM
Aww come on man... you can't drop a steamer like that in our koolaid pitcher with absolutely no explanation...

what do you mean??
:shades:

Well, just based off of what I think will happen...

I think Mario will be gone, I don't think we are going to get a game breaking WR to play alongside AJ, I don't think Schaub will be healthy to start the season and then when he does play I'm not sure how he will play...I think that foot injury will affect his throwing some...

Our schedule is going to be harder...

I'm afraid that we are going to be rather casual or cavalier about this off-season and not aggresively try to get better. I hope (but fear we are) we don't fall into the trap of "well if we'd have just had Matt Schaub we'd have won the ship"...

I am worried about the tougher schedule we will be playing, Matt being out, Brooks Reed development, injuries that will inevitably happen, WR's, re-signing Myers/Briesel...Wade's second year defense stuff...Tennessee will likely be better...

I just hope they are still hungry down at reliant because this past year is just that...in the past and right now it doesn't mean a whole lot and it especially won't mean anything if we don't improve going forward. If you aren't getting better, you are getting worse...especially in the NFL.

krocket
03-10-2012, 12:18 PM
Well, just based off of what I think will happen...

Rey, I agree that this year will be uphill for us, especially if we pass on Manning. They will have game plans aimed at our weaknesses. We may not have much in the way of offense for reasons you have already enumerated. IMO it won't be as easy next season, Homers not withstanding. Manning never had a defense like ours (mostly without Mario). If we are smart, Reggie Wayne will pay us to play with Manning again. TJ was simply a place holder which was exposed against the Ravens. Maybe he will be good in a few years and maybe not, but I am not ready to turn over the reins to a rookie +1 just yet.

ObsiWan
03-10-2012, 12:46 PM
Well, just based off of what I think will happen...

I think Mario will be gone, I don't think we are going to get a game breaking WR to play alongside AJ, I don't think Schaub will be healthy to start the season and then when he does play I'm not sure how he will play...I think that foot injury will affect his throwing some...

Our schedule is going to be harder...

I'm afraid that we are going to be rather casual or cavalier about this off-season and not aggresively try to get better. I hope (but fear we are) we don't fall into the trap of "well if we'd have just had Matt Schaub we'd have won the ship"...

I am worried about the tougher schedule we will be playing, Matt being out, Brooks Reed development, injuries that will inevitably happen, WR's, re-signing Myers/Briesel...Wade's second year defense stuff...Tennessee will likely be better...

I just hope they are still hungry down at reliant because this past year is just that...in the past and right now it doesn't mean a whole lot and it especially won't mean anything if we don't improve going forward. If you aren't getting better, you are getting worse...especially in the NFL.

But I think they ARE still hungry down at Reliant. Andre and Arian got a taste of the playoffs and they liked it. They want more. Schaub is hungry because he missed a chance to get in on the fun. He wants in. They all know how close they were. I think we'll be back as AFCS champs again.

But then, that could be the residual koolaid talking.

drs23
03-10-2012, 02:03 PM
But I think they ARE still hungry down at Reliant. Andre and Arian got a taste of the playoffs and they liked it. They want more. Schaub is hungry because he missed a chance to get in on the fun. He wants in. They all know how close they were. I think we'll be back as AFCS champs again.

I agree completely with this statement, at least that's what I was hearing at the conclusion of last season and I see no reason for this train of thought to derail.

But then, that could be the residual koolaid talking.

Stay away from the koolaid, 'specially since Rey dropped a steamer in it. :D

thunderkyss
03-10-2012, 03:42 PM
But I think they ARE still hungry down at Reliant. Andre and Arian got a taste of the playoffs and they liked it. They want more. Schaub is hungry because he missed a chance to get in on the fun. He wants in. They all know how close they were. I think we'll be back as AFCS champs again.

But then, that could be the residual koolaid talking.

We've yet to see this team build on success to achieve higher success. That, I think, is one of the hardest things for a coach, to get these guys to understand you're never "good enough"

We've got some "quality" character guys, so we'll see how that works out for us. But we've got plenty of good reasons to be concerned.. with a capital K



:kubepalm:

ckhouston
03-12-2012, 01:48 PM
Well, just based off of what I think will happen...

I think Mario will be gone, I don't think we are going to get a game breaking WR to play alongside AJ, I don't think Schaub will be healthy to start the season and then when he does play I'm not sure how he will play...I think that foot injury will affect his throwing some...

Our schedule is going to be harder...

I'm afraid that we are going to be rather casual or cavalier about this off-season and not aggresively try to get better. I hope (but fear we are) we don't fall into the trap of "well if we'd have just had Matt Schaub we'd have won the ship"...

I am worried about the tougher schedule we will be playing, Matt being out, Brooks Reed development, injuries that will inevitably happen, WR's, re-signing Myers/Briesel...Wade's second year defense stuff...Tennessee will likely be better...

I just hope they are still hungry down at reliant because this past year is just that...in the past and right now it doesn't mean a whole lot and it especially won't mean anything if we don't improve going forward. If you aren't getting better, you are getting worse...especially in the NFL.

Ill take it point by point.

1. Mario being gone, while not what I want to see, wont make us any worse than we were on defense last year. I do think if he signs we are better, but for the sake of this argument its a non-event.

2. A running team that already has the best WR in the game doesn't need a "game breaking receiver" to play along side him. We will add depth and it will be fine.

3. Schaub not starting the season may be the best thing that could happen for us. He isn't the future, and I feel with a full camp under his belt TJ will perform very well.

4. We will get better simply by having a full off-season and camp to work with the young players and further develop the defensive scheme. Look for the Texans to have the #1 defense in the league next year hands down.

5. Brooks Reed development is an issue? It will be a bonus.

6. Lastly, the Texans arent concerned with the Tacks, wont need to be for a few years.

ThaShark316
03-12-2012, 02:30 PM
Well, just based off of what I think will happen...

I think Mario will be gone, I don't think we are going to get a game breaking WR to play alongside AJ, I don't think Schaub will be healthy to start the season and then when he does play I'm not sure how he will play...I think that foot injury will affect his throwing some...

Our schedule is going to be harder...

I'm afraid that we are going to be rather casual or cavalier about this off-season and not aggresively try to get better. I hope (but fear we are) we don't fall into the trap of "well if we'd have just had Matt Schaub we'd have won the ship"...

I am worried about the tougher schedule we will be playing, Matt being out, Brooks Reed development, injuries that will inevitably happen, WR's, re-signing Myers/Briesel...Wade's second year defense stuff...Tennessee will likely be better...

I just hope they are still hungry down at reliant because this past year is just that...in the past and right now it doesn't mean a whole lot and it especially won't mean anything if we don't improve going forward. If you aren't getting better, you are getting worse...especially in the NFL.

Told y'all this fanbase can't handle success. A team that DIDN'T win it all will settle for finishing with a heartbreaking loss in the Divisional playoffs? http://img818.imageshack.us/img818/6293/cmonson3.png

Ole Miss Texan
03-12-2012, 02:35 PM
How would you like to be Kubiak 2 years from now and realize that Manning has taken his team to the SB twice and you missed the playoffs with no QB after Schaub couldn't go on his foot more than a couple of games into this coming season. And, you had the chance to bring Manning here and didn't take it. I realize this is highly theoretical, but could happen. It is evident from the news coming out of NFL.com (no particular link) that a lot of people think Manning will be healthy and ready to go next season from the number of teams pursuing him. A lot of football people on there think Houston is an SB "waiting to happen" with Manning at the helm.

Kubiak and the FO would have a lot of egg on their faces at this point.

I don't think Kubiak would notice considering the amount of egg he still has on his face from picking Mario over Reggie Bush. :kitten:

ObsiWan
03-12-2012, 02:48 PM
I don't think Kubiak would notice considering the amount of egg he still has on his face from picking Mario over Reggie Bush. :kitten:
:facepalm:

well at least you didn't say VY

80tothezone
03-12-2012, 03:34 PM
Matt Schaub will make 7.15 million this year and become a free agent in 2013 unless the Texans sign him to an extension.

My question is this, should/will the Texans extend Matt Schaub? Should/will the Texans start TJ Yates ahead of Schaub for the 2012 season?

I pose this question because IMO I think Matt may have found himself in no man's land unless he stays healthy all year and guides the Texans to an AFC South title. I say this because in 2013 he turns 32 and what kind of deal would you give a 32 year old NFL player? The current average age for a starting NFL QB is 27.65 and this number may drop further after this years draft.

Out of the 32 teams there are 12 QB's currently in there 30's. Matt Schaub turns 31 before the start of this season, Brees 33, Manning 35, Romo 31, Cassel 30, Brady 34, the other Manning 31, Big Ben 30, Rivers 30, Grossman 31, Vick 31, Palmer 32.

Out of this group of 30yo there are only a few I can say will continue to perform at a high level getting you to a Superbowl. Brady, Eli, and Big Ben. The other aforementioned QB's, IMO, are seeing the twilight of their careers. Brees just got the franchise tag and compiled with all the offseason distractions I expect them to have a bad year and he will be 34 next year. I think last year was Brees' window and he missed it, P. Manning may never play again, Romo is over-rated, Vick can't stay healthy (Schaub), Palmer is over-rated, Rivers is over-rated, Grossman sux, Cassel is a back up.

So what do you do with a 32yo Schaub? Up to this year he had played 5 season from 2007-2011. In 2007, 2008, and 2011 he has finished the season on IR. Only 2009 and 2010 has he completed a full season. He has won 31 games and lost 32, he is also 8-14 in the division. The only good thing I can say about Schaub is his home record is 20-11. http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/S/SchaMa00/gamelog/

I think Kubiak and Smith need to sit down with one another and make a decision on Schaub before the season gets under way. Is Schaub the future? Are you going to extend his contract? What does Schaub offer the Texans that TJ Yates does not? I also think you have to take into account that the Texans are about to play a brutal schedule.

I personally would take Yates and start him over Schaub this year. This is why. He is younger, more athletic and mobile, has a stronger arm, and shows up in big games. Schaub was never mobile to begin with and now will play with a screw in his foot. What Schaub brings to the table over TJ is his years of experience, and accuracy.

IMO in big time games Schaub has reverted back to being a back up QB. I don't think Schaub would have won that game against the Bengals last year to win the division. And I say this based on his prime time record (it's an O'fer) and his division record (every division game is huge. The amendment to that being you have already won the division and you are not playing for anything).

This is a perfect time to find out what we have in TJ. A tough schedule is perfect to evaluate him. Does he have the stones to hang? You know we are going to get some prime time games, how does he react to the pressure of the nation watching? At worse we still win the division but see enough of TJ and his abilities to know he is not the future so we are drafting a QB in 2013.

So what would you do with an aging QB that has started 64 out of 80 games missing 20% of his starts? He couldn't stay healthy in his 20's I don't see him suddenly getting better with age and a screw in his foot.

did u forget about the three interceptions? The other three that shoulda happened but he got lucky and they didn'? Don't get me wrong I think he could get what it takes but we have a small window here to get to the big show, In my opinion starting schaub is the way to go. Starting Yates... a guy who had 3 decent games out of six and who routinely makes poor decisions would be a mistake. After a yr of reading NFL defenses and getting coached up by schaub and Kubes and others I would say do not resign schaub and let him take the reigns provided he progressed in his ability to read a D.

Ole Miss Texan
03-12-2012, 04:12 PM
:facepalm:

well at least you didn't say VY

:rake: