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BullNation4Life
02-22-2012, 12:48 PM
Could sign Mike Wallace from Pittsburgh but give up their first rounder?

Wallace is only 25, proven and there is not a DB in the NFL that can match his speed. Having him on the other side of AJ would absolutely be devastating to NFL defenses BUT may mean you have to let Mario Williams walk to sign Wallace, Foster and the others...

Thoughts…

Playoffs
02-22-2012, 12:53 PM
Would love to have Wallace.

Don't want to lose Mario.

But can you imagine a sign & trade deal for the two -- Mario would be ( and look like ) the second coming of Mean Joe Green in a Steelers uniform.

nero THE zero
02-22-2012, 12:57 PM
If we could fit him reasonably under the cap, I would forgo signing Mario and our first round draft pick for Wallace.

But, given the reports regarding our salary cap situation ATM, and the number of free agents we have next year, I do not see a long term contract for Wallace as a feasible option for us.

Trail.Blazr
02-22-2012, 01:04 PM
Would love to have Wallace.

Don't want to lose Mario.

But can you imagine a sign & trade deal for the two -- Mario would be ( and look like ) the second coming of Mean Joe Green in a Steelers uniform.


Mario and Mean in the same sentence? :laughjump:

Playoffs
02-22-2012, 01:39 PM
Evan Silva @evansilva Reply Retweet Favorite · Open
On SportsCenter, ESPN's Adam Schefter mentioned the "#Ravens, #Bengals, #Patriots, #49ers" as teams that might pursue RFA WR Mike Wallace.

Dutchrudder
02-22-2012, 02:01 PM
Would love to have Wallace.

Don't want to lose Mario.

But can you imagine a sign & trade deal for the two -- Mario would be ( and look like ) the second coming of Mean Joe Green in a Steelers uniform.

If the Steelers could sign Mario, then they would just keep Wallace. They don't have the cap room to sign either, their only hope is Wallace stays using the RFA 1st round tender.

Playoffs
02-22-2012, 02:26 PM
If the Steelers could sign Mario, then they would just keep Wallace. They don't have the cap room to sign either, their only hope is Wallace stays using the RFA 1st round tender.Yeah, it was fantasy.

Fili
02-22-2012, 04:35 PM
I wouldn't mind Wallace because he is guaranteed to be a solid receiver.

rush2112mn
02-22-2012, 07:46 PM
Hell yeah.....that guy would be perfect opposite Andre.......
He can catch and has speed.......watched some games with him playing this year for the Steelers......he is real good.....

thunderkyss
02-22-2012, 08:02 PM
Could sign Mike Wallace from Pittsburgh but give up their first rounder?

Wallace is only 25, proven and there is not a DB in the NFL that can match his speed. Having him on the other side of AJ would absolutely be devastating to NFL defenses BUT may mean you have to let Mario Williams walk to sign Wallace, Foster and the others...

Thoughts…

Pick a better receiver. Percy Harvey, Sidney Rice..... I need to see someone a little more complete, even sacrificing speed. We simply do not have the kind of QB that can/will get the ball out ahead of a speed receiver on a consistent basis.

We need someone who can catch the ball, then make a play.

TdotTexas2Step
02-22-2012, 09:21 PM
Doubt Pittsburgh lets Wallace go, they're like to let the ball fly these days, and with all this talk about Hines Ward possibly moving on, Todd Haley will want to work with a trio of Wallace-Brown-Sanders.

mussop
02-22-2012, 09:29 PM
Doubt Pittsburgh lets Wallace go, they're like to let the ball fly these days, and with all this talk about Hines Ward possibly moving on, Todd Haley will want to work with a trio of Wallace-Brown-Sanders.

Its not that they want to let him go, its that they don't have a lot of money left under the cap. That's why they aren't franchising him.

PapaL
02-22-2012, 09:45 PM
Speed WRs need a QB that can get them the ball deep and on time. A guy like Wallace and an arm like Schaub, I fear Wallace would out run Schaub's deep ball. Hell AJ learned to slow down for it.

kiwitexansfan
02-22-2012, 11:22 PM
Speed WRs need a QB that can get them the ball deep and on time. A guy like Wallace and an arm like Schaub, I fear Wallace would out run Schaub's deep ball. Hell AJ learned to slow down for it.

This. Wallace makes plays by beating people deep. AJ just pwns people.

There is a difference.

ckhouston
02-22-2012, 11:29 PM
Wallace would be a great addition, but not at the expense of losing Mario. Our team is built on a staunch defense, and a run first offense. If we were a "sling it everywhere and outscore the opponent" offense it might be different.

Scooter
02-23-2012, 12:19 AM
i've written and re-written several replies on why i wouldnt look at wallace, instead focusing on a bigger target like bowe or colston who fit our system ... and then it hit me that we already have that. i hate to be the one to say it, but andre obviously didnt have the same wheels when he came back, and may not ever find that top end. we might not be looking for a compliment to andre, we may need a replacement for several situations.

we do need someone able to take the top off of coverages and wallace can certainly do that. he runs our favored routes well (slant, cross, post), but i worry that schaub wont "like" him. wallace isnt known for his ability to squat, nor get past a press cleanly. his zone awareness leaves a lot to be desired as well and goes towards not being trustworthy within the route. in the scenario however, wallace would be our #1. he would take a lot of andre's release routes, and 'dre would get a bigger dose of out and long release looks that walter was running.

there are pros and cons, but WR is our biggest weakness (assuming we resign everyone) going into 2012, a first for a 25 year old proven stud is certainly a bargain depending on his contract.

Bulls on Parade
02-23-2012, 01:34 AM
No thanks. I'm okay with Kevin Walter and Jacoby Jones if it means keeping Mario Williams. I'll take a pass on Mike Wallace. Would rather draft a young and speedy receiver in the draft (late first or second round). I also want to see that young kid Jeff Maehl continue to develop. The guy has a lot of heart and talent.

bckey
02-23-2012, 01:48 AM
Could sign Mike Wallace from Pittsburgh but give up their first rounder?

Wallace is only 25, proven and there is not a DB in the NFL that can match his speed. Having him on the other side of AJ would absolutely be devastating to NFL defenses BUT may mean you have to let Mario Williams walk to sign Wallace, Foster and the others...

Thoughts…

Please stop with the.....

Thoughts......

Just put a title on your thread. Please I'm begging you. Stop the insanity.

thunderkyss
02-23-2012, 09:52 AM
No thanks. I'm okay with Kevin Walter and Jacoby Jones if it means keeping Mario Williams. I'll take a pass on Mike Wallace. Would rather draft a young and speedy receiver in the draft (late first or second round). I also want to see that young kid Jeff Maehl continue to develop. The guy has a lot of heart and talent.

Both Jj & K Dub can be replaced with a cheap FA, late round draft pick, or UDFA player.

I understand wanting experience, I understand the value of knowing the system. With that said, I'd only want to get rid of one of the two. Personally, I say dump KDub.

What we get from Walters, we can & do get out of our TEs. Good hands, short intermediate, across the middle catches. Run blocking. etc. But if you're going to split somebody out wide, get some one who can go deep, or make a play out in space. I've seen two 60+ yard TD plays from Jj in 2011 alone. Not one from KDub. I've seen Jacoby make people miss or flat out run past defenders.... never from KDub.

I want play-makers on the field & Jacoby is more of a play-maker than Walters ever will be.

If you want hands on the field, gotta make that first down..... split Aj & Jj wide, put two TEs on the field & motion Casey to the slot. JJ might not catch the ball, but he will create space for everyone else on the field.

BullNation4Life
02-23-2012, 11:04 AM
Please stop with the.....

Thoughts......

Just put a title on your thread. Please I'm begging you. Stop the insanity.

Yeeeah ok Pop,

Thread Police, what a :clown:

Double Barrel
02-23-2012, 04:53 PM
Please stop with the.....

Thoughts......

Just put a title on your thread. Please I'm begging you. Stop the insanity.

Understand your perspective, but I just hover my mouse over a thread title to see what it's about when the title is less than forthcoming.

DocBar
02-23-2012, 05:23 PM
Both Jj & K Dub can be replaced with a cheap FA, late round draft pick, or UDFA player.

I understand wanting experience, I understand the value of knowing the system. With that said, I'd only want to get rid of one of the two. Personally, I say dump KDub.

What we get from Walters, we can & do get out of our TEs. Good hands, short intermediate, across the middle catches. Run blocking. etc. But if you're going to split somebody out wide, get some one who can go deep, or make a play out in space. I've seen two 60+ yard TD plays from Jj in 2011 alone. Not one from KDub. I've seen Jacoby make people miss or flat out run past defenders.... never from KDub.

I want play-makers on the field & Jacoby is more of a play-maker than Walters ever will be.

If you want hands on the field, gotta make that first down..... split Aj & Jj wide, put two TEs on the field & motion Casey to the slot. JJ might not catch the ball, but he will create space for everyone else on the field.Jones is more of a liability than anything else. His PR duties are more of what's kept him on the roster than anything else. Whether it's KW or Jones, we don't want to just replace them, we want pretty significant upgrades.
As Scooter posted, AJ may never be "AJ" again. We need to look for a replacement for him. Not hating on AJ at all, but the reality is staring the team and us fans in the face. He's getting up there in age and his hamstring injuries could very well be career limiting.
I have absolutely no problem at all letting MW walk if we could sign Wallace. I DO have an issue with losing our 1st round pick due to anything other than trading abck for multiple picks or (hopefully not) trading up for a targeted player.
The team showed it could excel without MW. It also showed that the passing game suffered greatly when AJ went down. There's not a much easier conclusion to come to, when faced with those facts, that a #1a WR is much more needed than an overpaid "brand name" at DE/WOLB.

thunderkyss
02-23-2012, 07:59 PM
Jones is more of a liability than anything else. His PR duties are more of what's kept him on the roster than anything else. Whether it's KW or Jones, we don't want to just replace them, we want pretty significant upgrades.

Agree. I'm just saying I don't want to try to replace both of them in one offseason. Sign a good/great FA WR or draft a talent in the first round.... not a project WR with a late second (may as well be a third) or later. We don't need that guy to start as the #2 receiver right away. He'll get his minutes, his reps & work his way up to #2... not counting Jacoby, we've got a team full of receiving options.

As Scooter posted, AJ may never be "AJ" again. We need to look for a replacement for him. Not hating on AJ at all, but the reality is staring the team and us fans in the face. He's getting up there in age and his hamstring injuries could very well be career limiting.

I agree.

I have absolutely no problem at all letting MW walk if we could sign Wallace.

Not Wallace, he'll be wasted here. We don't have the talent under center to get the ball to Wallace. You'll be asking him to be something he is not... he is not an Aj replacement in the making.

Vincent Jackson, Dwayne Bowe.... I'll even go so far as Mario Manningham. But Mike Wallace.. not for us. I like the guy, he's talented.... but he is not a #1 WR.

The team showed it could excel without MW. It also showed that the passing game suffered greatly when AJ went down. There's not a much easier conclusion to come to, when faced with those facts, that a #1a WR is much more needed than an overpaid "brand name" at DE/WOLB.

Not exactly. Schaub was on track to throw for 3500+ yards again. Losing Schaub hurt us more than anything else this season.

Texecutioner
02-23-2012, 08:18 PM
I'll never understand why people put so much stock in "1st rounders" when the discussion is about a proven commodity in this league at a young age or a ripe age of their prime. That's always better than a 1st rounder any day of the week if it fills a need. People seem to ignore how many busts their are in the first round every year. Hell it's probably like 50% of them or at least close to it.

Trading a 1st rounder for Mike Wallace would be a no brainer. It would take more than a 1st rounder though. It would take a 1st and a 4th probably.

BullNation4Life
02-23-2012, 10:12 PM
I'll never understand why people put so much stock in "1st rounders" when the discussion is about a proven commodity in this league at a young age or a ripe age of their prime. That's always better than a 1st rounder any day of the week if it fills a need. People seem to ignore how many busts their are in the first round every year. Hell it's probably like 50% of them or at least close to it.

Trading a 1st rounder for Mike Wallace would be a no brainer. It would take more than a 1st rounder though. It would take a 1st and a 4th probably.

From what I heard, it use to be a 1st and 3rd but now with the new CBA for restricted FA, it's a 1st that goes to the team. I totally agree especially if you have a late round pick like 26th.

Go get a proven player that can help right away rather take a chance on a 1st round bust....

ObsiWan
02-24-2012, 03:28 AM
While I understand a speedster like Wallace would be a sexy acquisition, but I think it would be a waste.

Our offense does not depend on the #2 WR being a speed guy. He needs to be a dependable possession guy.

Think back to 2007 when Davis stepped in for an injured A.J. after game 8 or 9. He did fairly well. Five plays of 40+ yds, 20 plays of 20+ yds. 19 first downs (only 3 TDs though). So if our offensive philosophy was to stretch the top of the defense, why not put A.D. and A.J. on the field the next year when A.J. returned to full health??

That's because in our offense, the primary responsibility of our #2 WR is to move the chains not get deep. So instead of using the 2nd bonafide speed guy that we had at our disposal by lining him up at #2 WR to have two deep threats on the field, we used K.W. @ #2 and used Davis to give A.J. the occasional blow. I can never recall us using that potential dual deep threat although we had Davis at our disposal for two solid years in 2008 & 2009. And it wasn't because Davis couldn't be productive because he showed he could be when A.J. went down in 2007.

So I don't think our offensive philosophy, with respect to WR responsibility, has changed, or will change. It is now and will be: the #1 WR is our deep threat, the #2 WR is our possession guy and moves the chains.

DocBar
02-24-2012, 04:20 AM
Agree. I'm just saying I don't want to try to replace both of them in one offseason. Sign a good/great FA WR or draft a talent in the first round.... not a project WR with a late second (may as well be a third) or later. We don't need that guy to start as the #2 receiver right away. He'll get his minutes, his reps & work his way up to #2... not counting Jacoby, we've got a team full of receiving options.

I agree.

Not Wallace, he'll be wasted here. We don't have the talent under center to get the ball to Wallace. You'll be asking him to be something he is not... he is not an Aj replacement in the making.

Vincent Jackson, Dwayne Bowe.... I'll even go so far as Mario Manningham. But Mike Wallace.. not for us. I like the guy, he's talented.... but he is not a #1 WR.


Not exactly. Schaub was on track to throw for 3500+ yards again. Losing Schaub hurt us more than anything else this season.I can't argue too hard for Wallace as I just haven't watched him or the Steelers enough, I can concede that point on him.

As far as the offense goes, a 3500 yd season by Schaub is a down year.

Goatcheese
02-24-2012, 04:58 AM
As far as the offense goes, a 3500 yd season by Schaub is a down year.

Schaub was on pace to throw for 4,140 yards and 25 TDs when Fat Assbert fell on him .

BullNation4Life
02-24-2012, 10:40 AM
While I understand a speedster like Wallace would be a sexy acquisition, but I think it would be a waste.

Our offense does not depend on the #2 WR being a speed guy. He needs to be a dependable possession guy.

Think back to 2007 when Davis stepped in for an injured A.J. after game 8 or 9. He did fairly well. Five plays of 40+ yds, 20 plays of 20+ yds. 19 first downs (only 3 TDs though). So if our offensive philosophy was to stretch the top of the defense, why not put A.D. and A.J. on the field the next year when A.J. returned to full health??

That's because in our offense, the primary responsibility of our #2 WR is to move the chains not get deep. So instead of using the 2nd bonafide speed guy that we had at our disposal by lining him up at #2 WR to have two deep threats on the field, we used K.W. @ #2 and used Davis to give A.J. the occasional blow. I can never recall us using that potential dual deep threat although we had Davis at our disposal for two solid years in 2008 & 2009. And it wasn't because Davis couldn't be productive because he showed he could be when A.J. went down in 2007.

So I don't think our offensive philosophy, with respect to WR responsibility, has changed, or will change. It is now and will be: the #1 WR is our deep threat, the #2 WR is our possession guy and moves the chains.

I see what you are saying but, couldn't AJ be that #2 (Not saying he IS a #2) receiver role where he doesn't have to stretch the field and put Wallace int he role that AJ has dominated in? It would be a role reversal without losing the title of #1 and #2 receiver. in police vernacular, AJ is the Chief and he is letting the young ones walk the beat he already did years past. Now he doesn't have to work as hard but can still be very productive.

The Texans could use Wallace for the deep threat, much like Baltimore does with Smith, and use AJ like Baltimore does with Boldin. Boldin is still the #1 WR in Baltimore, they just let the youngling do the hard work down field.

I think if the Texans were to do this, it could add years to AJ career and he be less likely to get hurt stretching the field and be more effective on the plays he can get YAC...

BigBull17
02-24-2012, 10:52 AM
Pick a better receiver. Percy Harvey, Sidney Rice..... I need to see someone a little more complete, even sacrificing speed. We simply do not have the kind of QB that can/will get the ball out ahead of a speed receiver on a consistent basis.

We need someone who can catch the ball, then make a play.

I don't know if Wallace would work here. He needs a Howitzer at QB, not a .22. Schaub could NEVER hit him in stride on a fly. NEVER

DocBar
02-24-2012, 11:59 AM
Schaub was on pace to throw for 4,140 yards and 25 TDs when Fat Assbert fell on him .Thanks to TE's and RB's. It sure wasn't due to WR's not named Andre Johnson.
Maybe Wallace isn't the answer here, but we need to find one because every WR not named Andre Johnson showed their weakness' this past season.
I don't know how you came up with Schaub on pace for 4,140. When I did the math, it came up as 3,966.4. :hmmm:

Goatcheese
02-24-2012, 01:42 PM
Thanks to TE's and RB's. It sure wasn't due to WR's not named Andre Johnson.
Maybe Wallace isn't the answer here, but we need to find one because every WR not named Andre Johnson showed their weakness' this past season.
I don't know how you came up with Schaub on pace for 4,140. When I did the math, it came up as 3,966.4. :hmmm:

Fat Al fell on him at the end of the first half of the TB game, so he effectively played 9.5 games.

steelbtexan
02-24-2012, 04:21 PM
I see what you are saying but, couldn't AJ be that #2 (Not saying he IS a #2) receiver role where he doesn't have to stretch the field and put Wallace int he role that AJ has dominated in? It would be a role reversal without losing the title of #1 and #2 receiver. in police vernacular, AJ is the Chief and he is letting the young ones walk the beat he already did years past. Now he doesn't have to work as hard but can still be very productive.

The Texans could use Wallace for the deep threat, much like Baltimore does with Smith, and use AJ like Baltimore does with Boldin. Boldin is still the #1 WR in Baltimore, they just let the youngling do the hard work down field.

I think if the Texans were to do this, it could add years to AJ career and he be less likely to get hurt stretching the field and be more effective on the plays he can get YAC...

^^^^
This

I bet if you asked Schaub if he wanted Wallace his answer would be yes. If his answer was no I would start looking for another QB. Who wouldn't want a 25 yr old pro bowl caliber WR opposite AJ. Wallace is better than any WR in this draft. He's proven and is worth a 1and a 3rd because of this.

BTW, people who dont want to sign Wallace dont want to draft Randle because he has more deep speed than Schaub has arm supposedly.

steelbtexan
02-24-2012, 04:23 PM
I don't know if Wallace would work here. He needs a Howitzer at QB, not a .22. Schaub could NEVER hit him in stride on a fly. NEVER

Then Gary/Rick should start looking for another QB immediately.

Double Barrel
02-24-2012, 05:07 PM
I don't know if Wallace would work here. He needs a Howitzer at QB, not a .22. Schaub could NEVER hit him in stride on a fly. NEVER

Yates could hit him in stride. :stirpot:

thunderkyss
02-24-2012, 05:46 PM
^^^^
This

I bet if you asked Schaub if he wanted Wallace his answer would be yes. If his answer was no I would start looking for another QB. Who wouldn't want a 25 yr old pro bowl caliber WR opposite AJ. Wallace is better than any WR in this draft. He's proven and is worth a 1and a 3rd because of this.

BTW, people who dont want to sign Wallace dont want to draft Randle because he has more deep speed than Schaub has arm supposedly.

I've got to go find more "film" because what I have seen, he isn't much more than a deep threat. & sorry, I don't think Schaub will do much with a deep threat kind of guy.

Torry Smith.. that's a guy who is more than one dimensional, he's great in space & he's physical.... He's not very good right now, not a #1, but in a few years, he's going to be Baltimore's #1.

Julio Jones... I see him being a possible #1. Victor Cruz.... not so much. I love Victor Cruz, don't get me wrong, but he'll never be a #1.

Nothing wrong with that, but Cruz would never have had a 1000 yard season if he was on our roster. Never.

I don't think Wallace will ever take Aj's place. You can call him a #1 & have him run all the deep routes (that's really not how you define a #1) or whatever, but he is one dimensional (imo) & without another more potent threat on the field, he's easily taken out of the game.

Unless you've got a QB that extends plays & causes defenses to break down.

Edit: I'll recant a bit.... he's not as bad as what I've said, but just not my thing. I still think he needs a different QB than what we've got here.

steelbtexan
02-24-2012, 05:56 PM
Wallce can and has run the entire route tree. He's the #1 on the Steelers but there isn't a true #1 on the Steelers because Ben spreads the ball around, (Wallace/Brown/Sanders/Miller are all threats.) Schaub hasn't had that kind of talent around him. (How would you rate the Texans WR's vs Steelers WR's) I would like to see what Schaub could do with a full compliment of receivers. Schaub would either do well or the Texans should move on. IMHO

Agree with you on Smith and Cruz, the jury is still out on Julio Jones.

thunderkyss
02-24-2012, 06:00 PM
Wallce can and has run the entire route tree. He's the #1 on the Steelers but there isn't a true #1 on the Steelers because Ben spreads the ball around, (Wallace/Brown/Sanders/Miller are all threats.) Schaub hasn't had that kind of talent around him. (How would you rate the Texans WR's vs Steelers WR's) I would like to see what Schaub could do with a full compliment of receivers. Schaub would either do well or the Texans should move on. IMHO

Agree with you on Smith and Cruz, the jury is still out on Julio Jones.

I'll agree that we need to get better receivers around Schaub before we can really say. But watching him underthrow Aj for years.... "on purpose" I just can't imagine a receiver like Wallace having the success here that he's had in Pittsburgh.

b0ng
02-24-2012, 06:53 PM
Wallace isn't just some burner speed guy, he's been very effective being Pittsburgh's WR1, especially this year. Now, I doubt we could afford what it would take to make Wallace happy, and not have Pittsburgh match, but to think that Wallace is only effective on fly and go routes is just straight ignorant.

gary
02-24-2012, 07:30 PM
Free agency starts in a few weeks. Real news. Yay.

redwhiteblue
02-24-2012, 08:29 PM
I'll never understand why people put so much stock in "1st rounders" when the discussion is about a proven commodity in this league at a young age or a ripe age of their prime. That's always better than a 1st rounder any day of the week if it fills a need. People seem to ignore how many busts their are in the first round every year. Hell it's probably like 50% of them or at least close to it.

GMs love 1st and 2nd rounders because they want the chance at getting a talent at a fraction of the cost. To have a successful team that can stay successful, you need cheap talent and the way to do that is the draft. If you trade away all your top of the draft picks for Free Agents or proven commodities, you can't afford to keep that team under the cap and competitive.

b0ng
02-24-2012, 09:34 PM
I'll never understand why people put so much stock in "1st rounders" when the discussion is about a proven commodity in this league at a young age or a ripe age of their prime. That's always better than a 1st rounder any day of the week if it fills a need. People seem to ignore how many busts their are in the first round every year. Hell it's probably like 50% of them or at least close to it.

Trading a 1st rounder for Mike Wallace would be a no brainer. It would take more than a 1st rounder though. It would take a 1st and a 4th probably.

Since 1st rounders are now approximately half or less the cost of what they were a few years ago, their value has (rightfully) skyrocketed.

And Mike Wallace cannot, and will not cost more than a 1st rounder unless the Steelers sign him to a new contract. Franchise and Restricted tenders do not cost more than a 1st rounder to sign to a contract anymore.

Vinny
02-24-2012, 10:56 PM
GMs love 1st and 2nd rounders because they want the chance at getting a talent at a fraction of the cost. To have a successful team that can stay successful, you need cheap talent and the way to do that is the draft. If you trade away all your top of the draft picks for Free Agents or proven commodities, you can't afford to keep that team under the cap and competitive.Sincerely,
Dan Snyder