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View Full Version : Texans defensive scheme varies with different CB in the line-up (Jackson/Allen)


76Texan
12-11-2011, 01:10 AM
I had mentioned since early in the season that Wade schemes differently when KJ was in the line-up as opposed to Allen.

With KJ, the Texans are quite clear-cut; they don't scheme to give KJ any more help than JJo.
(I wanted to say, overall JJo might have gotten a little more help (since he normally cover the opponent #1 receiver, but it will take a lot of time to show that so just take this with a grain of salt.)

On the other hand, when Allen entered the game, the scheme changes.
It doesn't happen on every play, but overall, Allen receives more help (one way or another).
Before I get to this part (and I don't even know if I have any time next week), let me just a handful of plays with KJ in the game.

I randomly pick up the second half of the Falcons game, but you can check for yourself on other instances.

76Texan
12-11-2011, 01:16 AM
Atlanta Falcons at 12:53
1-10-ATL 20 (12:53) M.Turner right tackle to ATL 20 for no gain (B.Reed).
PENALTY on ATL-T.Clabo, Offensive Holding, 10 yards, enforced at ATL 20 - No Play.

http://i1217.photobucket.com/albums/dd384/76Texan/2011%20Week%2013%20vs%20Falcons/KJ%20%20Half%202/101.jpg

Here, we see the O in single backfield.
There's a lone receiver on JJo's side while there are 5 defenders.
On KJ's side, there are 3 offensive threats and 6 defenders.

It seems like the D is a little heavy on JJo's side, but since Ryans took on the RB after the snap, it evens out to man-under with 2 safeties over the top for a balance defensive scheme.

76Texan
12-11-2011, 01:25 AM
1-20-ATL 10 (12:24) M.Ryan pass incomplete short right to T.Gonzalez.

http://i1217.photobucket.com/albums/dd384/76Texan/2011%20Week%2013%20vs%20Falcons/KJ%20%20Half%202/102.jpg

On this play, both receivers are on the same side, with JJo and KJ covering.
Manning plays deep middle safety while Quin plays cover 2 to help the two LBs on their TEs.

Cushing jams Gonzalez and plays underneath with Quin over the top.

I won't get into details since it has nothing to do with the CBs.

76Texan
12-11-2011, 01:31 AM
2-20-ATL 10 (12:18) M.Ryan pass short right to R.White to ATL 25 for 15 yards (K.Jackson).

http://i1217.photobucket.com/albums/dd384/76Texan/2011%20Week%2013%20vs%20Falcons/KJ%20%20Half%202/103.jpg

Here, the Falcons sends a TE to the left; we have a safety shifted over to back up the LB.

KJ came off his man to put a hit on White, who got some seperation from JJo.

76Texan
12-11-2011, 01:41 AM
3-5-ATL 25 (12:18) (Shotgun) PENALTY on ATL-T.Clabo, False Start, 5 yards, enforced at ATL 25 - No Play.

http://i1217.photobucket.com/albums/dd384/76Texan/2011%20Week%2013%20vs%20Falcons/KJ%20%20Half%202/104a.jpg

http://i1217.photobucket.com/albums/dd384/76Texan/2011%20Week%2013%20vs%20Falcons/KJ%20%20Half%202/104b.jpg

On this play, pre-snap, there were five defenders on each side even though there were 3 offensive threats on JJo's side.
However, after the snap, Nolan moved to the middle while Quin shifted to take on the RB.

The D played man under with a single safety deep in the middle while sending Cushing in on a blitz.

There were 3 rushers on JJo's side as opposed to 2 on the other side (this helps JJo as the passing lanes get more clogged up on his side.)

76Texan
12-11-2011, 01:52 AM
3-10-ATL 20 (11:31) (Shotgun) M.Ryan sacked at ATL 15 for -5 yards (C.Barwin). FUMBLES (C.Barwin), RECOVERED by HST-J.Watt at ATL 15. J.Watt to ATL 15 for no gain (J.Hawley).
PENALTY on HST-B.McCain, Defensive Holding, 5 yards, enforced at ATL 20 - No Play.


http://i1217.photobucket.com/albums/dd384/76Texan/2011%20Week%2013%20vs%20Falcons/KJ%20%20Half%202/105.jpg

On this play, there are 3 offensive threats on JJo's side, corresponding to 6 defenders, which is normal standard.

Texn4life
12-11-2011, 03:11 AM
Man, this is getting sooooooo freaking old. Everyone knows how you feel about KJ. We get it ok!!!!!! These screen shots don't prove a thing and its getting a little tired in my opinion. You don't know what coverage they were in and what the defensive game plan was so you can't speak on what they're thinking. I can only tell you that you're getting on "my" nerves. Not speaking for anyone else but myself. Did this really require another thread?

STEEL BLUE TEXANS
12-11-2011, 04:40 AM
We get it. You like KJ.

dalemurphy
12-11-2011, 08:05 AM
Man, this is getting sooooooo freaking old. Everyone knows how you feel about KJ. We get it ok!!!!!! These screen shots don't prove a thing and its getting a little tired in my opinion. You don't know what coverage they were in and what the defensive game plan was so you can't speak on what they're thinking. I can only tell you that you're getting on "my" nerves. Not speaking for anyone else but myself. Did this really require another thread?

Are all your expressed opinions "fresh"? I often disagree with 76Texan, but I sure won't complain about him putting thought/effort into his posts and attempting to make his point with detailed analysis and video/picture evidence. You saw the thread title and the author. Do you have so little self-discipline that you couldn't avoid clicking? Or, are you that determined to attack someone that you were excited to click on it?

76Texan
12-11-2011, 08:31 AM
Man, this is getting sooooooo freaking old. Everyone knows how you feel about KJ. We get it ok!!!!!! These screen shots don't prove a thing and its getting a little tired in my opinion. You don't know what coverage they were in and what the defensive game plan was so you can't speak on what they're thinking. I can only tell you that you're getting on "my" nerves. Not speaking for anyone else but myself. Did this really require another thread?

Are all your expressed opinions "fresh"? I often disagree with 76Texan, but I sure won't complain about him putting thought/effort into his posts and attempting to make his point with detailed analysis and video/picture evidence. You saw the thread title and the author. Do you have so little self-discipline that you couldn't avoid clicking? Or, are you that determined to attack someone that you were excited to click on it?

Thanks, Dale!

TX4L, after one watches some 300 plus snaps with this in mind, an overall trend can be seen.

When there are more pass rushers on one side, the defense clearly schemes to give him extra help.

When a safety clearly brackets a receiver together with the CB, that's double-teaming, no doubt about it!

76Texan
12-11-2011, 08:35 AM
1-10-ATL 25 (11:13) M.Turner left tackle to ATL 24 for -1 yards (D.Ryans).

http://i1217.photobucket.com/albums/dd384/76Texan/2011%20Week%2013%20vs%20Falcons/KJ%20%20Half%202/106.jpg

Here, Allen spells JJo for a play, there's no comparison to be made.

Manning dropped back to the middle to play single deep safety on this running play.

76Texan
12-11-2011, 08:39 AM
2-11-ATL 24 (10:35) (Shotgun) M.Ryan pass short middle to T.Gonzalez to ATL 37 for 13 yards (G.Quin).

http://i1217.photobucket.com/albums/dd384/76Texan/2011%20Week%2013%20vs%20Falcons/KJ%20%20Half%202/107.jpg

2nd play in a row in which JJo was given a little rest.

Here, Manning and Allen dropped back to play deep 1/4.
Ryans and KJ played underneath.

This is fairly standard for how the outside CB and the inside CB play in a combo zone.

HJam72
12-11-2011, 08:50 AM
I don't know, but I'll just guess that maybe they trust KJ on deep threats a little more than Allen. I believe JK is faster, even if Allen is still a little more sound in learned skills. That's all I got, other than O's trying to pick on KJ, which I would too, and I just hope that Wade keeps having success.

76Texan
12-11-2011, 08:52 AM
1-10-ATL 37 (9:57) M.Ryan pass incomplete short left to J.Jones [D.Ryans].

http://i1217.photobucket.com/albums/dd384/76Texan/2011%20Week%2013%20vs%20Falcons/KJ%20%20Half%202/108/108.jpg

JJo was on the outside receiver who ran a post route.
Manning cut off this deep receiver in the middle.

KJ ran with the slot receiver on the underneath route.

The QB couldn't find anybody open as pressure chased him out of the pocket.
He ended up throwing the ball out of bound.

The sequence can be found here:
http://s1217.photobucket.com/albums/dd384/76Texan/2011%20Week%2013%20vs%20Falcons/KJ%20%20Half%202/108/

76Texan
12-11-2011, 08:54 AM
2-10-ATL 37 (9:49) M.Turner up the middle to ATL 39 for 2 yards (B.Reed).

http://i1217.photobucket.com/albums/dd384/76Texan/2011%20Week%2013%20vs%20Falcons/KJ%20%20Half%202/109.jpg

Another balance look by the D.

76Texan
12-11-2011, 08:57 AM
That's all I got for now since I have to run.

At any rate, watch the game today and see if you notice anything different while Allen is in there (an extra pass rusher, a double team, whatever...) here and there.

jtexas
12-11-2011, 09:24 AM
Are all your expressed opinions "fresh"? I often disagree with 76Texan, but I sure won't complain about him putting thought/effort into his posts and attempting to make his point with detailed analysis and video/picture evidence. You saw the thread title and the author. Do you have so little self-discipline that you couldn't avoid clicking? Or, are you that determined to attack someone that you were excited to click on it?

Agreed. On the other hand i think we should be questioning why Wade put Kareem in 1on1 coverage against a receiver that could run circles around him?

hradhak
12-11-2011, 09:44 AM
That's all I got for now since I have to run.

At any rate, watch the game today and see if you notice anything different while Allen is in there (an extra pass rusher, a double team, whatever...) here and there.

I've noticed it on the field as well (we have end zone seats). This wasn't the case early in the season when Allen would get no help at all (the Raiders game when he got burned on those deep outs). KJ can tackle well, Allen let's guys slip through. Allen also makes more plays on the ball.

Interestingly, did you notice that on several series when we were in the nickel that KJ was out? It happened on several consecutive series in the 2nd half, IIRC. I don't know if they were spelling him or Allen went in because of the hurry up and they couldn't put KJ back in.

Lucky
12-11-2011, 09:50 AM
I don't know if they were spelling him or Allen went in because of the hurry up and they couldn't put KJ back in.
The Texans rotate Jackson and Allen. Not sure under what circumstances, but it seems Jackson gets 2/3s of the series. McCain is the nickel, regardless.

EllisUnit
12-11-2011, 11:07 AM
Joseph 4 ints 13 passes defended, Allen 4 ints 10 passes defended

then you have Jackson 1 int 4 passes defensed.

drs23
12-11-2011, 11:34 AM
Joseph 4 ints 13 passes defended, Allen 4 ints 10 passes defended

then you have Jackson 1 int 4 passes defensed.

This IS the NFL remember. The opposing DCs have learned their lesson and are simply not throwing his way. Who can blame them?:kitten:

dalemurphy
12-11-2011, 11:38 AM
This IS the NFL remember. The opposing DCs have learned their lesson and are simply not throwing his way. Who can blame them?:kitten:

It appears to me that Jackson is playing very well except in high stress situations (like the end of the game, last week). He tends to be indecisive and panicky... I'm sure it is simply residuals from last season's fiasco. I've seen enough to be excited about his future and confident in his abilities through the first 40 minutes of most regular season games.

EllisUnit
12-11-2011, 12:30 PM
haha why was this thread even made ? could you of just added it to your other 5 "KJ does no wrong" threads.

EllisUnit
12-11-2011, 12:38 PM
This IS the NFL remember. The opposing DCs have learned their lesson and are simply not throwing his way. Who can blame them?:kitten:

:vincepalm: so they throw at jojo instead. Lord help us.

LikeMike
12-11-2011, 12:39 PM
This IS the NFL remember. The opposing DCs have learned their lesson and are simply not throwing his way. Who can blame them?:kitten:

Way more interesting would be: times targeted, catches allowed and completion % in passes going his ways.

STEEL BLUE TEXANS
12-11-2011, 12:41 PM
:vincepalm: so they throw at jojo instead. Lord help us.



He did say JoJo is the one getting more help over the top. :kitten:

EllisUnit
12-11-2011, 12:41 PM
Way more interesting would be: times targeted, catches allowed and completion % in passes going his ways.

well if he isnt defending the pass, isnt intercepting it, they must be dropping a crap load of balls. Cause i know they are not avoiding him due to his :vincepalm: "amazing coverage skills"

Texn4life
12-11-2011, 12:43 PM
Are all your expressed opinions "fresh"? I often disagree with 76Texan, but I sure won't complain about him putting thought/effort into his posts and attempting to make his point with detailed analysis and video/picture evidence. You saw the thread title and the author. Do you have so little self-discipline that you couldn't avoid clicking? Or, are you that determined to attack someone that you were excited to click on it?

And you're the same guy that tried to say Barwin was better than Mario, and he hasn't even started a full season yet. Your opinion really means squat to me.

jtexas
12-11-2011, 02:14 PM
Another play today where Jackson refuses to turn around and look for the ball. Nothing pisses me off more where the receiver completely stops and waits for the ball and Jackson just waits looking at the receiver. He could do 1080s before the ball lands.

EllisUnit
12-11-2011, 02:52 PM
allen just showed how u play the ball