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View Full Version : Fumble, well in the real world an incomplete pass.


Big Lou
12-04-2011, 11:42 PM
This was discussed extensively in the game day thread, but I wanted some feedback. I'm sure there isn't one fan on this board that thinks that TJ fumbled the ball today due to the obvious combined with a little homerism.

My reason for the post is have you ever seen a fumble where the ball goes 10 yards past the LOS? I'm being serious when I ask this.

You can get in to the tuck rule and all that but I can't say I've ever a 10 yard forward fumble, I mean ever.

That has to be in the top 50 stupidest calls ever. Any person with. Ommon sense could tell you Yates arm was moving forward or the ball would have been in Yate's vecenity. Am I missing something?

ThaJokaa
12-04-2011, 11:48 PM
I agree n said the same thing about the ball going that far. Someone was at BW3s sayin this game would be great if...

The Pencil Neck
12-04-2011, 11:51 PM
To elucidate on what I said in another thread about this...

It's a mystery. One of the grand mysteries of the universe. Don't even try to understand it.

GP
12-05-2011, 12:05 AM
What was the best was this:

Mike Pereira, who was the NFL's Vice President of Officiating from 2004-09, was on the phone DURING the booth review--He was speaking with the two Fox commentators (Moose Johnston and Kenny Albert)--and he told Moose and Albert that it was clearly an incomplete pass by Yates. The hand was moving forward, he said, and it's the hand moving forward and not the position of the elbow that matters. Then the head ref announces that the ruling would stand...and Mike Pereira says, "Wow. That's wrong. They got it wrong there. It wasn't a fumble." If Mike Pereira says the ref got it wrong, then it was an OBVIOUS wrong call, folks. I'm just sayin'.....

----------------------

So just like I said earlier in another thread: THIS ref crew had a head ref who was not going to overturn one of his guys' calls today. Whatever happened on the field, however it was that HIS ref crew saw the play happen, is how it was going to REMAIN.

The one caveat is when they picked up the flag for the hit on a Falcons WR that was at first deemed helmet-to-helmet but the flag was picked up after the refs conversed. Still, the booth reviews were not going to get overturned today IMO.

I was in utter SHOCK when the head ref stated that the ruling on the field was going to stand. I expected thousands of fans to flood the field and complete mayhem to ensue. I honestly did. After all this team and its fans have been through, for the refs to completely ignore EASY evidence of a hand moving forward, I reckoned this would be the first ever NFL game where a city's fans killed and ate the carcasses of all the refs working that game.

TexansFanatic
12-05-2011, 12:06 AM
The Holy Roller (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holy_Roller_%28American_football%29) managed to go 10 yards beyond the line of scrimmage. But it had some help.

The Holy Roller (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yUuOqUIHBZc)

Stemp
12-05-2011, 12:14 AM
As horrible as they are, there should be no way this crew works a playoff game. They should go back to reffing division 3 games.

clutch
12-05-2011, 12:36 AM
it was as simple as the ball going forward makes it an incomplete pass..seriously can refs get fined for blowing calls???

HJam72
12-05-2011, 03:27 AM
it was as simple as the ball going forward makes it an incomplete pass..seriously can refs get fined for blowing calls???

That's a novel idea. :specnatz:

GlassHalfFull
12-05-2011, 06:09 AM
I was in utter SHOCK when the head ref stated that the ruling on the field was going to stand. I expected thousands of fans to flood the field and complete mayhem to ensue. I honestly did. After all this team and its fans have been through, for the refs to completely ignore EASY evidence of a hand moving forward, I reckoned this would be the first ever NFL game where a city's fans killed and ate the carcasses of all the refs working that game.

After that call and then the non calls where our players were hit late out of bounds, I told my husband if we lost the game, the refs better have a police escort out of town. They were NOT popular yesterday.

Grams
12-05-2011, 06:24 AM
We get a flag if our guy hits a player with a toenail on the white sideline but there were at lease 3 late hits on Foster where his entire body was on the white sideline.

I an just glad our team now has the maturity to not lose focus when stupid penalties/rulings are called against us.

b0ng
12-05-2011, 06:27 AM
The roughing the passer call that happened was a terrible call as well.

HJam72
12-05-2011, 06:51 AM
The roughing the passer call that happened was a terrible call as well.

Wasn't that call overturned? I don't really blame them for that one as long as it was overturned on review. When I first saw it, I thought it was a head-shot too, but the replay showed it obviously wasn't.

Errant Hothy
12-05-2011, 06:55 AM
Incomplete pass or not, you play to the whistle. Watching everybody stand around and one, only one player (and a Falcon at that) realised that the whistle hadn't gone. Peewee football kids know that the play isn't over till the whistle.

b0ng
12-05-2011, 07:18 AM
Wasn't that call overturned? I don't really blame them for that one as long as it was overturned on review. When I first saw it, I thought it was a head-shot too, but the replay showed it obviously wasn't.

No it was not overturned. Also the defensive holding on 3rd down after what looked like a fumble recovery by the Texans was real bad too. The flags came out very late on that play.

thunderkyss
12-05-2011, 07:22 AM
As awkward as this sounds, I'm glad things worked out the way they did. The more adversity this group overcomes now the better it will be for them come the play-offs.


& I'm good with that.

Trail.Blazr
12-05-2011, 07:43 AM
I was in utter SHOCK when the head ref stated that the ruling on the field was going to stand.


I think the ref was too, because IIRC, when they went on to discuss the offsetting players on the field, he stated "before the incomplete pass"

anyone catch that?

bigbrewster2000
12-05-2011, 07:44 AM
The roughing the passer call that happened was a terrible call as well.

The roughing the passer on Antonio Smith? That was a good call in the sense that it was technically breaking the rules. A defensive player is not allowed to hit a QB in the head with any part of his body. We can discuss if the rule should exist in the ticky tacky form that it is in now in another thread. The refs made the right call but it sucked that it had to be called in the first place

TimeKiller
12-05-2011, 07:52 AM
Incomplete pass or not, you play to the whistle. Watching everybody stand around and one, only one player (and a Falcon at that) realised that the whistle hadn't gone. Peewee football kids know that the play isn't over till the whistle.

To your point, I was at the game. Not being able to hear over the crowd and the announcer isn't exactly a stretch. But I wanted to ask some of you that had a chance to watch the replays at home....did any of the officials toss the little beanbag to indicate a turnover?

Call me a homer if you like, that was clearly an incomplete pass attempt. To see it live, think it wasn't, have to review and STILL think it wasn't a pass? Probably the worst call I will ever see live. Can't really think of a worse call I;ve seen, in any sport no less. Just a hack job by the officiating crew, they oughtta be embarrassed to dress like real zebras.

Think of how many calls the refs made today that took points off the board. That was one, surely would've been at least a field goal if the proper call was made and took a second score, from the falcons, away as well. Then the pick 6 that wasn't, again from the Falcons. I know that there was one more were they officiated the Texans out of another score, just can't quite place it right now. Anyway, refs should never influence a game like that. Or the late hits out of bounds that were ok. Or trying to flag KJ for the most clean big hit of all time. The "roughing the passer" flag, my goodness that was weak. Or the ball placement on TJ's scramble for a first, horrid. We all said, if that was PManning they would've put the ball about 3 yards past the first and said first down. Or how about the holding calls that weren't? Falcons OL got away with murder several times. That crew doesn't deserve to officiate football at the highest level, since their efforts rate among the lowest I've ever seen for anything involving a judge.

Texas T
12-05-2011, 07:58 AM
I was watching the game with some Falcons Fan friends of mine and they told me that it was very obvious that they paid the refs more than we did.

The were even bitching about what a crappy call that was...

Trail.Blazr
12-05-2011, 08:04 AM
To your point, I was at the game. Not being able to hear over the crowd and the announcer isn't exactly a stretch. But I wanted to ask some of you that had a chance to watch the replays at home....did any of the officials toss the little beanbag to indicate a turnover?

Call me a homer if you like, that was clearly an incomplete pass attempt. To see it live, think it wasn't, have to review and STILL think it wasn't a pass? Probably the worst call I will ever see live. Can't really think of a worse call I;ve seen, in any sport no less. Just a hack job by the officiating crew, they oughtta be embarrassed to dress like real zebras.

Think of how many calls the refs made today that took points off the board. That was one, surely would've been at least a field goal if the proper call was made and took a second score, from the falcons, away as well. Then the pick 6 that wasn't, again from the Falcons. I know that there was one more were they officiated the Texans out of another score, just can't quite place it right now. Anyway, refs should never influence a game like that. Or the late hits out of bounds that were ok. Or trying to flag KJ for the most clean big hit of all time. The "roughing the passer" flag, my goodness that was weak. Or the ball placement on TJ's scramble for a first, horrid. We all said, if that was PManning they would've put the ball about 3 yards past the first and said first down. Or how about the holding calls that weren't? Falcons OL got away with murder several times. That crew doesn't deserve to officiate football at the highest level, since their efforts rate among the lowest I've ever seen for anything involving a judge.

Hats off to the Texans winning despite the ref's trying not to let them :muscles:

BigBull17
12-05-2011, 08:12 AM
What was the best was this:

Mike Pereira, who was the NFL's Vice President of Officiating from 2004-09, was on the phone DURING the booth review--He was speaking with the two Fox commentators (Moose Johnston and Kenny Albert)--and he told Moose and Albert that it was clearly an incomplete pass by Yates. The hand was moving forward, he said, and it's the hand moving forward and not the position of the elbow that matters. Then the head ref announces that the ruling would stand...and Mike Pereira says, "Wow. That's wrong. They got it wrong there. It wasn't a fumble." If Mike Pereira says the ref got it wrong, then it was an OBVIOUS wrong call, folks. I'm just sayin'.....

----------------------

So just like I said earlier in another thread: THIS ref crew had a head ref who was not going to overturn one of his guys' calls today. Whatever happened on the field, however it was that HIS ref crew saw the play happen, is how it was going to REMAIN.

The one caveat is when they picked up the flag for the hit on a Falcons WR that was at first deemed helmet-to-helmet but the flag was picked up after the refs conversed. Still, the booth reviews were not going to get overturned today IMO.

I was in utter SHOCK when the head ref stated that the ruling on the field was going to stand. I expected thousands of fans to flood the field and complete mayhem to ensue. I honestly did. After all this team and its fans have been through, for the refs to completely ignore EASY evidence of a hand moving forward, I reckoned this would be the first ever NFL game where a city's fans killed and ate the carcasses of all the refs working that game.

This is why refs should be vulnerable to a fine. It was painfully obvious that the arm was going forward. At least the players came on the field and cost em a TD. One of the worst calls I have ever seen.

thunderkyss
12-05-2011, 08:27 AM
This is why refs should be vulnerable to a fine. It was painfully obvious that the arm was going forward. At least the players came on the field and cost em a TD. One of the worst calls I have ever seen.

Just because you don't hear about it, doesn't mean the officials aren't held accountable for every call.

Corrosion
12-05-2011, 09:22 AM
The roughing the passer call that happened was a terrible call as well.

Wasn't that call overturned? I don't really blame them for that one as long as it was overturned on review. When I first saw it, I thought it was a head-shot too, but the replay showed it obviously wasn't.

No that call wasnt overturned - they picked up the flag on K-Jax hit that initially was called leading with his helmet , it was obvious it was his shoulder and no helmet to helmet contact involved.


The roughing call on A. Smith was a good call - he hit Ryan in the head / neck ..... and thats a no no , intentional or not.

I dont fault Smith for the play tho .... He cant really compensate for Ryan ducking into his arm.

ChrisG
12-05-2011, 09:34 AM
I dont fault Smith for the play tho .... He cant really compensate for Ryan ducking into his arm.

I cant believe I am saying this but the NFL really needs to look at what the NHL is doing this year with headshots. If the player that gets hit in the head put himself in that position there is supposed to be no penalty called.

For instance if right before the hit the player ducks or dekes which changes the position of his head, the person hitting him is not held liable.

Although this is mostly used when determining if someone will be suspended NFL should start using it.


Also speaking of NHL to NFL changes. Reviews should be done by impartial parties at another location. Just like the NHL. The on ice officals dont review anything. They have a team in Tornoto that reviews anything questionable. That way more than one person ways in on the correct call, and no one is invested in what the call was on the field (ice).

Big Lou
12-05-2011, 09:36 AM
Incomplete pass or not, you play to the whistle. Watching everybody stand around and one, only one player (and a Falcon at that) realised that the whistle hadn't gone. Peewee football kids know that the play isn't over till the whistle.

I believe they called it an interception. That was pretty funny, reminded me of the scene with Cuba Gooding Jr. in the movie Rat Race!!!

The K-Jax call was pretty stupid because IMO they were both Kung Fu Fighting each other so why does he get the call alone.

The roughing the passes call was technically a good call, but that whole head thing is so ticky tacky. If you club a guy I get it, but when you're blocked in to a QB and you graze his head, come on. Also if you want to call that, on one of the sacks of Yates, the Atlanta Player border line left his feet and drilled Yates in to the ground which is a no no.

Corrosion
12-05-2011, 09:39 AM
I believe they called it an interception. That was pretty funny, reminded me of the scene with Cuba Gooding Jr. in the movie Rat Race!!!

The K-Jax call was pretty stupid because IMO they were both Kung Fu Fighting each other so why does he get the call alone.

The roughing the passes call was technically a good call, but that whole head thing is so ticky tacky. If you club a guy I get it, but when you're blocked in to a QB and you graze his head, come on. Also if you want to call that, on one of the sacks of Yates, the Atlanta Player border line left his feet and drilled Yates in to the ground which is a no no.

That play left me holding my breath .... Winston got beat terribly on that one and I really wondered if Yates was gonna get back up.

BlueSteel
12-05-2011, 10:30 AM
Incomplete pass or not, you play to the whistle. Watching everybody stand around and one, only one player (and a Falcon at that) realised that the whistle hadn't gone. Peewee football kids know that the play isn't over till the whistle.

Except that the ref on the sideline signaled it as incomplete and then everyone started to walk away from the ball. The one player that finally picked it up was still looking around confused and then the side ref put his hands down and started watching the player with the ball when he realized that no whistle had sounded.

The reffing yesterday was the worst I have ever seen and it was bad for both teams.

GP
12-05-2011, 10:44 AM
Also if you want to call that, on one of the sacks of Yates, the Atlanta Player border line left his feet and drilled Yates in to the ground which is a no no.

Winston shoved the guy, it was 100% "blocked into the QB." Without the shove, Yates doesn't get pancaked like that.

I'm telling all of you guys, I can screenshot it if you think I'm exaggerating. On the reverse end zone camera (or maybe it was the overhead "wire" camera) Winston was beaten, tried to push the guy past Yates but ended up pushing the lineman smack dab right into Yates. Winston hurt Yates by getting beat AND by shoving the guy into him, even though it was accidental.

Hervoyel
12-05-2011, 11:07 AM
As awkward as this sounds, I'm glad things worked out the way they did. The more adversity this group overcomes now the better it will be for them come the play-offs.


& I'm good with that.

It was a bull**** call but I think you're right. In the long run it turns out to be priceless experieince that Yates got and ultimately it didn't cost us the game. That's good enough for me.

Yankee_In_TX
12-05-2011, 11:11 AM
This was discussed extensively in the game day thread, but I wanted some feedback. I'm sure there isn't one fan on this board that thinks that TJ fumbled the ball today due to the obvious combined with a little homerism.

My reason for the post is have you ever seen a fumble where the ball goes 10 yards past the LOS? I'm being serious when I ask this.

You can get in to the tuck rule and all that but I can't say I've ever a 10 yard forward fumble, I mean ever.

That has to be in the top 50 stupidest calls ever. Any person with. Ommon sense could tell you Yates arm was moving forward or the ball would have been in Yate's vecenity. Am I missing something?

That's ok, I made a running joke in our section. If you were at the game, after the penalty was called for players on the field, the ref referenced the 'interception.'

So everytime something stupid happened I yelled 'interception!'

Playoffs
12-05-2011, 11:16 AM
Poor call, Perreira confirmed that.

Cost us 3 points.

Yankee_In_TX
12-05-2011, 11:39 AM
Poor call, Perreira confirmed that.

Cost us 3 points.

I miss him on NLFN, the new guy totally tows the company line.