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View Full Version : Is our improved Pass D a mirage?


Maddict5
11-04-2011, 08:09 PM
saw this on grantland earlier this week (and even posted it here)

Meanwhile, a fun trick with stats that you'll probably hear an announcer employ this weekend: Did you know Cleveland has allowed the second-fewest passing yards in football? Does that sound impressive? It isn't. The Browns have also faced the fewest pass attempts in football, and that's because of who they've played. Here are the starting quarterbacks they've faced this season: Andy Dalton, Kerry Collins, Chad Henne. Matt Hasselbeck, Jason Campbell, Charlie Whitehurst, Alex Smith. The only quarterback on your fantasy league's waiver wire missing from this list, coincidentally, is Browns starter Colt McCoy.

i noticed we've also played the majority of those same weak qbs.. not inc on that list that we've played flacco (who looks terrible too but had a decent game against us), gabbert (david carr v2), big ben (playing with a decimated line but have to say we did a good job) and brees (who lit us up for 40 pts)

granted, i know our talent and coaching is hugely upgraded but by the end of the season when we face some talented qbs, will our D turn out to be average and was made to look great in the early part of the season by a creampuff early sched of qbs?

srrono
11-04-2011, 08:21 PM
Our pass defense is not a mirage, because if you remeber last year it did not matter who the QB was the Texans gave up career or season highs for that QB.

thunderkyss
11-04-2011, 08:24 PM
granted, i know our talent and coaching is hugely upgraded but by the end of the season when we face some talented qbs, will our D turn out to be average and was made to look great in the early part of the season by a creampuff early sched of qbs?

I think our coaching staff is watching our players & correcting what they see & not coaching from the stat-sheet.

On AFC Playbook, they actually showed a couple of good shots of the tight coverage behind the pass rush. It looked really good. I know from watching the games from the stand, it isn't always that good, but most plays it's pretty good. It's rare that a WR gets wide open on what we've got going now.

Granted, we haven't faced any fantasy team 1st round picks either. But, for this team to "practice" they seem to be doing fine, understanding what they are supposed to be doing & getting it done.

They are also doing a lot of communicating in the backfield. It's very encouraging.

Maddict5
11-04-2011, 08:26 PM
probably bad wording in the thread title using 'improved'... because that is undeniable.

what i meant was is our D not even really a top 10-15 despite being currently ranked in top 5 right now?

will good qbs still put us to the sword later in the season/playoffs?

Lucky
11-04-2011, 08:32 PM
granted, i know our talent and coaching is hugely upgraded but by the end of the season when we face some talented qbs, will our D turn out to be average and was made to look great in the early part of the season by a creampuff early sched of qbs?
I think it was acknowledged prior to the season that the Texans would catch a break playing against weak QBs. The important point is that they've taken advantage of this. Mario & Manning are out, and Kareem Jackson is still in. That means that the Texans will likely move back some in the pass defense rankings. But, the pass defense is not the sieve it was in previous seasons.

So top 5 pass defense? Probably not. League's worst pass defense? Not even close. Yes, the Texans should be able to win with this.

kiwitexansfan
11-04-2011, 08:38 PM
Our pass defense is not a mirage, because if you remeber last year it did not matter who the QB was the Texans gave up career or season highs for that QB.

QFT.

We are much improved, but not stellar.... yet.

TheMatrix31
11-04-2011, 08:46 PM
What good QBs are there to skewer us in the AFC playoffs? Brady's the only one. Rivers? Rivers is having a ****ty year so far. Maybe he'll figure it out by then. We've already played Ben and Flacco. Nobody else is even a blip on my radar, quite frankly. Who do we have remaining on our schedule? Josh Freeman with all his plentiful weapons? Matt Ryan who might be the most overrated QB in football?

I think our pass and rush D is fine. I have complete and utter faith in Wade Phillips. Would be nice if Danieal Manning is back sooner rather than later.

Lucky
11-04-2011, 08:48 PM
So top 5 pass defense? Probably not. League's worst pass defense? Not even close. Yes, the Texans should be able to win with this.
Just did a little research, and found that the Texans opponents thus far have averaged 224 ypg passing. That would rank between the 16th and 17th pass offense. Against the Texans, these same opponents have averaged 189 ypg. That would rank between the 27th and 28th pass offense.

Basically, the Texans pass defense has made the opposition (collectively) play 11 spots lower than their average. That's a pretty good pass defense, I'd have to say.

Speedy
11-04-2011, 10:22 PM
Yeah, Brees did end up putting 40 points on them but they held him to 17 points through 3 quarters and did pick him off twice. A couple more 1st downs by the offense in that 4th quarter, and the D just might have ended up looking as good as they did the first 3 quarters.

bo orlando
11-04-2011, 10:51 PM
It's not a mirage but I worry about, if not expect, the defense getting shredded in the playoffs if/when it faces a wide open passing attack like the Bills, Patriots, and probably Chargers. The 2nd half against the Saints is still the blueprint to beat this D-- spread the Texans out and force them to rely on their weak secondary depth. Even with a healthy Mario, I don't think this team would be able to get to a good QB with good protection enough to thwart such a strategy.

Vinny
11-04-2011, 10:59 PM
It's not a mirage but I worry about, if not expect, the defense getting shredded in the playoffs if/when it faces a wide open passing attack like the Bills, Patriots, and probably Chargers. The 2nd half against the Saints is still the blueprint to beat this D-- spread the Texans out and force them to rely on their weak secondary depth. Even with a healthy Mario, I don't think this team would be able to get to a good QB with good protection enough to thwart such a strategy.
yeah, the way to beat most 3-4 teams is to spread them out and get them out of their base defense and attack the bigger linebacker group with slot wr's and backs in the flat and running Texas routes and crosses. I'm a little worried about our lack of an elite edge rusher and a very, very thin back end after Joseph myself...as far as the playoffs go. I think we get there, but I'm worried what happens when we do - but at least that will be a nice thing to worry about for a change.

SAMURAITEXAN
11-04-2011, 11:07 PM
yeah, the way to beat most 3-4 teams is to spread them out and get them out of their base defense and attack the bigger linebacker group with slot wr's and backs in the flat and running Texas routes and crosses. I'm a little worried about our lack of an elite edge rusher and a very, very thin back end after Joseph myself...as far as the playoffs go. I think we get there, but I'm worried what happens when we do - but at least that will be a nice thing to worry about for a change.

You said it. First thing first, get into the playoffs. We worry about the things when we get there.

Go Texans!!!

Marcus
11-05-2011, 12:05 AM
I just don't understand the thinking that the Pass D operates in a vacuum.

This the first year ...... THE VERY FIRST YEAR ..... in the 10 year history of this team..... where they FINALLY..... have a bonified, legitimate pass rush that actually puts pressure on the opposing QB, and doesn't give him all day long to throw the ball.

And yet, we actually wonder why all of a sudden that the Pass D has improved?

Yes.... it's a Mirage with a capital M. They've improved a little, but most of it is due to their job being made easier by the people up front.

The Pencil Neck
11-05-2011, 02:28 AM
yeah, the way to beat most 3-4 teams is to spread them out and get them out of their base defense and attack the bigger linebacker group with slot wr's and backs in the flat and running Texas routes and crosses. I'm a little worried about our lack of an elite edge rusher and a very, very thin back end after Joseph myself...as far as the playoffs go. I think we get there, but I'm worried what happens when we do - but at least that will be a nice thing to worry about for a change.

Well, when we do go into nickel, we shift into a 4 down lineman set where our OLBs convert to DEs. We take the NT off the field and sometimes even the other ILB, leaving Cushing with a bunch of DBs on the back-end. So we don't have that "bigger linebacker" issue as much as some teams do.

But at this point, we really need to see it tested more before we can trust it. I love feasting on weaker teams and boosting all our stats and rankings and what-not. But those times we truly get tested will be interesting to see if the team is progressing as the season goes on.

The Pencil Neck
11-05-2011, 02:31 AM
On AFC Playbook, they actually showed a couple of good shots of the tight coverage behind the pass rush. It looked really good. I know from watching the games from the stand, it isn't always that good, but most plays it's pretty good. It's rare that a WR gets wide open on what we've got going now.

Take a look at that piece again, if you can.

We had great, tight coverage on the receivers and tight ends but the LB blew the coverage on the running back in the flat. I don't think Gabbert really had time to pick and choose his receivers on that play but a more experienced QB might have hit the RB and gotten some good yards out of the play.

noxiousdog
11-05-2011, 03:34 AM
I find rate stats to be much better than totals in this kind of analysis. In that regard, the texans are 4th with 6.2 yards per attempt with bal, pit, and det ahead of them.

Of course we haven't seen too many good passing attacks, but I'd bet we've kept opponents under their averages more often than not.

Sent from my PG06100 using Tapatalk

badboy
11-05-2011, 07:13 PM
Every week allows Wade & coaches to add more to the D. Maybe by playoffs we can handle what is on the other side of ball from us.

hradhak
11-05-2011, 10:44 PM
I think the other factor in this is is that our offense is able to play from ahead and control the clock in our victories. As Wade has said, the defense plays its best when it's on the sidelines.

Iceman16
11-06-2011, 12:37 PM
saw this on grantland earlier this week (and even posted it here)



i noticed we've also played the majority of those same weak qbs.. not inc on that list that we've played flacco (who looks terrible too but had a decent game against us), gabbert (david carr v2), big ben (playing with a decimated line but have to say we did a good job) and brees (who lit us up for 40 pts)

granted, i know our talent and coaching is hugely upgraded but by the end of the season when we face some talented qbs, will our D turn out to be average and was made to look great in the early part of the season by a creampuff early sched of qbs?
The defense only looks good when we're generating a pass rush. When they don't get to the QB, they still light up our secondary.

ADTpaul
11-07-2011, 12:37 AM
#1 pass defense is no mirage! This has been an incrediable turn around from last year's defense. Thank you Wade Phillips and his defensive 3-4

thunderkyss
11-07-2011, 06:50 AM
http://www.chron.com/mediaManager/?controllerName=image&action=get&id=1732911&format=centerpiece

That's our pass defense right there.... don't look like no mirage to me.

El Tejano
11-07-2011, 08:58 AM
I think Wade touched on it a bit when he gave alot of credit to the offense because we are also winning the T.O.P battle. Our offense has been able to put some long drives together.