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EllisUnit
10-09-2011, 03:01 PM
Conservative. In the 1st half we have a shot for a 48 yard field goal, and we punt, we had the ball 3 and 1 2 times in their territory and we punt. We are so predictable on play calling it gets a little disturbing at times.

I like Kubiak and what he can do with an offense, BUT to never take any risks, to never go for it and to just go pure flat on playing and play calling is unexcusable.

and these refs are being slightly biased.

tedr
10-09-2011, 03:05 PM
Not sure where Kubiak gets the reputation of being an offensive genius. This half has been absolutely pathetic, even taking into accout not having Andre. The defense has been pretty shabby as well.

ziggy29
10-09-2011, 03:05 PM
I like Kubiak and what he can do with an offense, BUT to never take any risks, to never go for it and to just go pure flat on playing and play calling is unexcusable.

You just perfectly described the Kubiak philosophy in the 2nd half when leading at halftime -- "play not to lose". That's a good way to get beat in the NFL. You can justify "playing not to lose" in the Indy game, but when the game is still close you should not be deviating from your first half game plan. But Gary Kubiak teams almost always do. This is, by *far*, my greatest criticism of his coaching and if he could overcome this tendency I think he'd be a very good one.

Ckw
10-09-2011, 03:08 PM
I long for the day we finally fire this piece of shit. I have never wanted to see someone lose their job so bad in my entire life. Offensive genius my ass.

Kubiak is a fraud that got his name because of Mike Shanahan, Steve Young, and John Elway. Without those guys, Kubiak would be a nobody.

EllisUnit
10-09-2011, 03:10 PM
well finally a smart call. wow that was tough

ziggy29
10-09-2011, 03:11 PM
I long for the day we finally fire this piece of shit. I have never wanted to see someone lose their job so bad in my entire life. Offensive genius my ass.

I don't think it's that he can't coach an offense per se. I think it's a matter of ripping out all the higher risk/higher reward plays from the playbook when "nursing" a second half lead. (The type of plays that helped them to a strong first half.) By now every head coach and DC in the NFL knows the type of conservative game Kubes will call in such a situation, and they can pin their ears back and concentrate on stopping that stuff.

Mr. Texan
10-09-2011, 03:11 PM
http://i.imgur.com/7jmaX.gif

TexanSam
10-09-2011, 03:12 PM
I don't think it's that he can't coach an offense per se. I think it's a matter of ripping out all the higher risk/higher reward plays from the playbook when "nursing" a second half lead. (The type of plays that helped them to a strong first half.) By now every head coach and DC in the NFL knows the type of conservative game Kubes will call in such a situation, and they can pin their ears back and concentrate on stopping that stuff.

This. I think Kubiak knows how to design good offensive plays, but he doesn't know how to manage a game.

Ckw
10-09-2011, 03:14 PM
I don't think it's that he can't coach an offense per se. I think it's a matter of ripping out all the higher risk/higher reward plays from the playbook when "nursing" a second half lead. (The type of plays that helped them to a strong first half.) By now every head coach and DC in the NFL knows the type of conservative game Kubes will call in such a situation, and they can pin their ears back and concentrate on stopping that stuff.

Which is why I say he can't coach an offense. If defensive coordinators are figuring him out this easily, then he is far from an offensive genius.

You can't be this predictable and be considered a good NFL coach.

Runner
10-09-2011, 03:17 PM
Why would Kubes' job be in danger? He is the same as he's always been. He may get an extension this week. :)

EllisUnit
10-09-2011, 03:19 PM
see why, a short simple pass to get yards maybe a draw, to get close but that, a sack

Texecutioner
10-09-2011, 03:19 PM
I long for the day we finally fire this piece of shit. I have never wanted to see someone lose their job so bad in my entire life. Offensive genius my ass.

Kubiak is a fraud that got his name because of Mike Shanahan, Steve Young, and John Elway. Without those guys, Kubiak would be a nobody.

I've been saying this for years when people have proclaimed this guy as this offensive guru of the league. He's been a great stat guy from a yard standpoint with his offenses, but has never been a great game day decision coach in my eyes and his teams always seem to lack that killer instinct. If the Texans lose they're still 3-2 at least for now though. The season isn't in jeapordy just yet.

ziggy29
10-09-2011, 03:21 PM
If the Texans lose they're still 3-2 at least for now though. The season isn't in jeapordy just yet.

At least since all the other teams in the division already lost. But what a possibly squandered opportunity to gain ground, unless this team can pull out a highly improbable finish.

TexanSam
10-09-2011, 03:25 PM
I've been saying this for years when people have proclaimed this guy as this offensive guru of the league. He's been a great stat guy from a yard standpoint with his offenses, but has never been a great game day decision coach in my eyes and his teams always seem to lack that killer instinct. If the Texans lose they're still 3-2 at least for now though. The season isn't in jeapordy just yet.

He's the Wade Phillips of offense. We have two good coordinators on the team. Unfortunately one is the head coach.

Texecutioner
10-09-2011, 03:30 PM
He's the Wade Phillips of offense. We have two good coordinators on the team. Unfortunately one is the head coach.

Yep, but Wade can at least say that he's head coached a team that went 13-3 and achieved a bye in the playoffs first round and also coached an 11-5 team that went to the 2nd round of the playoffs before. Kubiak hasn't came close to anything like that as HC. I think this season we'll do no worse than 10-6 though. I'm not to worried at this stage just yet.

ziggy29
10-09-2011, 03:31 PM
I think this season we'll do no worse than 10-6 though. I'm not to worried at this stage just yet.
Though that depends on AJ, Mario and no one else going down.

TexanSam
10-09-2011, 03:34 PM
Oh my god.

EllisUnit
10-09-2011, 03:37 PM
Oh my god.

i dont know how much longer my heart can take this shit...........

Texecutioner
10-09-2011, 03:39 PM
Oh my god.

http://i40.photobucket.com/albums/e220/nickms/mudman.jpg

DexmanC
10-09-2011, 03:39 PM
Dude panicked while the team was down only 8, with more than ten
minutes to play. He just stopped running the ball, and decided
to pass-scheme the team to victory. He costs the team at least
two wins a year.

Today was #1.

Surreal McCoy
10-09-2011, 03:41 PM
Not sure where Kubiak gets the reputation of being an offensive genius. This half has been absolutely pathetic, even taking into accout not having Andre. The defense has been pretty shabby as well.

Two Super Bowls rings as a play caller (yes he was calling the plays for Shanny Sr) say otherwise. But then again, don't let the facts get int he way of a good moan ;)

utahmark
10-09-2011, 03:42 PM
We couldn't run the ball. Tried for 3 quarters. Their defensive line outplayed our offensive line. That's why we lost..... period!

MojoX
10-09-2011, 03:44 PM
If the ball was thrown more in front of receivers rather than behind them, might have been a different outcome.

DexmanC
10-09-2011, 03:45 PM
Al Davis died, and "just win baby" was Al's swansong.

So, the Texans got their stats, because fans love to see
what their offensive/defensive rank is. Kubiak was so nice
to give the Raiders a "win."

Most Texans fans don't care much about those, right?

Maddict5
10-09-2011, 03:45 PM
the run game was shit today so i have no problem with not wasting plays on it

EllisUnit
10-09-2011, 03:47 PM
i would have called a screen on that last play. Foster is our best weapon u need to go to him in the clutch, our just a quick pass over the middle to foster. But no hell no shaub throws a pick, that was one crazy ass game. I am gonna die really young because of this team.

TexCanada
10-09-2011, 03:48 PM
Kubiak is great at drawing up those cute plays like the Dreesen touchdown. That was a great play-call that resulted in a TD.

However, that is all that he is good at.

dtran04
10-09-2011, 03:49 PM
What's funny was I was expecting a thread about Kubiak running it TOO much......

ziggy29
10-09-2011, 03:50 PM
Kubiak is great at drawing up those cute plays like the Dreesen touchdown. That was a great play-call that resulted in a TD.

However, that is all that he is good at.
And it's not a call he'd ever make late in a close game. That's part of the problem.

Ranger Tom
10-09-2011, 03:50 PM
I broke my rule. I came into this game expecting the Texans to win. Expecting them to lose is my defense mechanism--armor for my heart, a balm for my throat. I must not abandon it again.

HJam72
10-09-2011, 03:51 PM
It wasn't playcalling that lost this game. In fact, the short pass attempt to Vickers was genius, if the bum would just catch the ball.

Our D would be the best in the business with another GOOD CB.

Our offense's pass blocking is not as good (in the middle) as it's been getting credit for.

stingray
10-09-2011, 03:51 PM
Dude panicked while the team was down only 8, with more than ten
minutes to play. He just stopped running the ball, and decided
to pass-scheme the team to victory. He costs the team at least
two wins a year.

Today was #1.

Huh? The running game was non existent. You think it was all of sudden going to appear?

cdollaz
10-09-2011, 03:52 PM
We have 5+ years of evidence as to Gary's coaching. Why anyone would think he would suddenly become anything more than an average coach is puzzling.

EllisUnit
10-09-2011, 03:52 PM
I broke my rule. I came into this game expecting the Texans to win. Expecting them to lose is my defense mechanism--armor for my heart, a balm for my throat. I must not abandon it again.

agree man i swear one day i am just gonna fall over dead because of this team.

TexanSam
10-09-2011, 03:52 PM
We couldn't run the ball. Tried for 3 quarters. Their defensive line outplayed our offensive line. That's why we lost..... period!

Did we try running it in the 3rd quarter? I don't remember.

TheMatrix31
10-09-2011, 03:53 PM
Kubiak's playcalling was not very good today. However, the execution by Schaub, the OL, and Jacoby Jones was awful. JUST AWFUL.

EllisUnit
10-09-2011, 03:55 PM
how big was that miss by rackers ?

Norg
10-09-2011, 03:57 PM
http://i.imgur.com/7jmaX.gif

Dont worry its almost over ........ teh 6 year nightmare is almost over :toropalm:

80tothezone
10-09-2011, 03:58 PM
yeh just watched the last play like 15 times raiders played awesome D no one open schaub chased by a lb JJ making the wro g cut, daniels did not cut back. .... just bad on us good on them..... sux ass....

ziggy29
10-09-2011, 03:59 PM
how big was that miss by rackers ?

Seems huge. But really, if it were 25-23 instead of 25-20, I don't think the Raiders defense plays that soft almost all the way down to the goal line, knowing it only took an FG to beat them.

ziggy29
10-09-2011, 04:00 PM
Kubiak's playcalling was not very good today. However, the execution by Schaub, the OL, and Jacoby Jones was awful. JUST AWFUL.
Yeah, but I still part of that "execution fail" is on the coaching staff.

EllisUnit
10-09-2011, 04:02 PM
Seems huge. But really, if it were 25-23 instead of 25-20, I don't think the Raiders defense plays that soft almost all the way down to the goal line, knowing it only took an FG to beat them.

that would of cost them as well let foster have a lil open field he would of got us into range, out the coaching staff would of tried 4 hail marys, so yeah i'm sure we woulda messed it up.

Norg
10-09-2011, 04:03 PM
Teh thing is Foster isnt that good and we cant run teh football when we want 2

TheMatrix31
10-09-2011, 04:06 PM
Yeah, but I still part of that "execution fail" is on the coaching staff.

The coaches arent the ones throwing right at the OL and letting the ball get tipped. The coaches arent the ones dropping easy catches or not running proper routes. The coaches aren't the ones fumbling snaps and being shitty blockers.

Norg
10-09-2011, 04:08 PM
The coaches arent the ones throwing right at the OL and letting the ball get tipped. The coaches arent the ones dropping easy catches or not running proper routes. The coaches aren't the ones fumbling snaps and being shitty blockers.


But teh coaches are calling the dreaded

Run run Pass in teh 3rd qtr

All week long they say stay on sechudle and avoid 3rd and long WELL THEY ARE ALWAYS IN 3rd in long !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

EllisUnit
10-09-2011, 04:08 PM
The coaches arent the ones throwing right at the OL and letting the ball get tipped. The coaches arent the ones dropping easy catches or not running proper routes. The coaches aren't the ones fumbling snaps and being shitty blockers.

NO but in the 1st half we had a shot at a 48 yard field goal and we punted, i would like to hear kubiaks explanation on that, but the later we attempt a 54 yarder ????

ziggy29
10-09-2011, 04:11 PM
The coaches arent the ones throwing right at the OL and letting the ball get tipped. The coaches arent the ones dropping easy catches or not running proper routes. The coaches aren't the ones fumbling snaps and being shitty blockers.

The coaches are the ones who have to teach execution. Of the ones you mentioned, the tipped balls, running routes and blocking poorly are *all* aspects of team execution that fall heavily on the coaching staff. And having a predictable game-calling scheme that defenses know to expect (especially predictable in the second half with Kubiak teams) doesn't make it easier for the players to execute, either.

You can't really "coach" good hands as much as the others, but you still have the bench as an option. (Admittedly harder to do when thin at WR, but still.)

Mr. Texan
10-09-2011, 04:13 PM
another 2nd half collapse by the texans.

if the same thing keeps happening you should start to look in the direction of coaching.

TheMatrix31
10-09-2011, 04:14 PM
Playcalling was a massive, frustrating issue with coaching today. Horrible play by the players, however, is not. I don't buy it. The players have executed before, but not today. It happens.

houstonspartan
10-09-2011, 04:15 PM
Al Davis died, and "just win baby" was Al's swansong.

So, the Texans got their stats, because fans love to see
what their offensive/defensive rank is. Kubiak was so nice
to give the Raiders a "win."

Most Texans fans don't care much about those, right?

I was just telling someone the other day that Texans fans, for some reason, seem to settle on stats instead of wins. It's our wall that we have hidden behind.

HJam72
10-09-2011, 04:16 PM
If Vickers (the bum) catches that short pass and runs it in for a TD, then we win this game (remember the field goal later) and all of you are praising Kubiak. We played a good team without AJ, and mostly without Williams.

A LOT of you are overreacting. Yes, I know this game was very important and we could easily lose the next two, but I'm telling you now we are gonna ROLL the second half of this season. It's not Kubiak's or Schaub's fault that Jacoby Jones sucks and Vickers is a bum.

While we're all wanting Kubiak fired, let's remember that we beat Pittsburgh last week....and they just STOMPED the Titans.

nero THE zero
10-09-2011, 04:16 PM
I long for the day we finally fire this piece of shit. I have never wanted to see someone lose their job so bad in my entire life. Offensive genius my ass.

Kubiak is a fraud that got his name because of Mike Shanahan, Steve Young, and John Elway. Without those guys, Kubiak would be a nobody.

Way to keep it classy.

Ckw
10-09-2011, 04:16 PM
Kubiak's playcalling was not very good today. However, the execution by Schaub, the OL, and Jacoby Jones was awful. JUST AWFUL.

Agreed. Schaub and Jacoby (especially) were horrendous today.

Ckw
10-09-2011, 04:17 PM
Way to keep it classy.

I always do.

ziggy29
10-09-2011, 04:17 PM
If Vickers (the bum) catches that short pass and runs it in for a TD, then we win this game (remember the field goal later) and all of you are praising Kubiak. We played a good team without AJ, and mostly without Williams.

A LOT of you are overreacting. Yes, I know this game was very important and we could easily lose the next two, but I'm telling you now we are gonna ROLL the second half of this season. It's not Kubiak's or Schaub's fault that Jacoby Jones sucks and Vickers is a bum.

While we're all wanting Kubiak fired, let's remember that we beat Pittsburgh last week....and they just STOMPED the Titans.
You *may* be right. All I know is that I don't think fans of ANY team have so regularly endured a very heavy dose of these heartbreaking losses and second half woes than Texans fans. For *years*. And every time we think it might be different, this happens and makes you wonder if it ever will be.

EllisUnit
10-09-2011, 04:18 PM
If Vickers (the bum) catches that short pass and runs it in for a TD, then we win this game (remember the field goal later) and all of you are praising Kubiak. We played a good team without AJ, and mostly without Williams.

A LOT of you are overreacting. Yes, I know this game was very important and we could easily lose the next two, but I'm telling you now we are gonna ROLL the second half of this season. It's not Kubiak's or Schaub's fault that Jacoby Jones sucks and Vickers is a bum.

While we're all wanting Kubiak fired, let's remember that we beat Pittsburgh last week....and they just STOMPED the Titans.

i agree with this, i still think we are a good team and that we will end the season no worse than 11-5

Mr. Texan
10-09-2011, 04:19 PM
if ifs and buts were candy and nuts we'd all have a merry christmas.

Dishman
10-09-2011, 04:19 PM
Teh thing is Foster isnt that good and we cant run teh football when we want 2

I mean, really, yall. People are talking like we had Samkon Gado sitting in the backfield.

brakos82
10-09-2011, 04:20 PM
I mean, really, yall. People are talking like we had Samkon Gado sitting in the backfield.

And you're talking like our OL was actually doing something good today. :nolisten:

Texecutioner
10-09-2011, 04:20 PM
If Vickers (the bum) catches that short pass and runs it in for a TD, then we win this game (remember the field goal later) and all of you are praising Kubiak. We played a good team without AJ, and mostly without Williams.

A LOT of you are overreacting. Yes, I know this game was very important and we could easily lose the next two, but I'm telling you now we are gonna ROLL the second half of this season. It's not Kubiak's or Schaub's fault that Jacoby Jones sucks and Vickers is a bum.


It's directly Kubiak's fault for not getting rid of Jacoby Jones this off season or last off season and getting a viable replacement for him. THe confidence that he has instilled in this guy that has never shown consistency in his career has been mind boggling. The fact that we're still somehow having to depend on Jacoby Jones for anything other than an occasional KR still haunts us apparently. That's on Kubiak for neglecting to take care of that problem. :cutthroat:

CloakNNNdagger
10-09-2011, 04:21 PM
It wasn't playcalling that lost this game. In fact, the short pass attempt to Vickers was genius, if the bum would just catch the ball.

Our D would be the best in the business with another GOOD CB.

Our offense's pass blocking is not as good (in the middle) as it's been getting credit for.


The question you have to ask is "Why wouldn't you choose to run that play with Vickers, and not Casey who has hands of gold?"

HTown2ATX
10-09-2011, 04:22 PM
I mean, really, yall. People are talking like we had Samkon Gado sitting in the backfield.

LMFAO......haven't heard that name in a while. Remember Edimiche Echimondu (or something like that)??

stingray
10-09-2011, 04:22 PM
I mean, really, yall. People are talking like we had Samkon Gado sitting in the backfield.

Foster was averaging three yards a run. It just wasn't his day today.

Kimmy
10-09-2011, 04:22 PM
It's directly Kubiak's fault for not getting rid of Jacoby Jones this off season or last off season and getting a viable replacement for him. THe confidence that he has instilled in this guy that has never shown consistency in his career has been mind boggling. The fact that we're still somehow having to depend on Jacoby Jones for anything other than an occasional KR still haunts us apparently. That's on Kubiak for neglecting to take care of that problem. :cutthroat:

This. And more! We MUST be prepared for a post AJ era. Look how bad the Colts are suffering because of not being prepared.

I'm sick of Kubiak "falling all in love with these kids". Does he really think we can't do any better than Jacoby?

houstonspartan
10-09-2011, 04:23 PM
If Vickers (the bum) catches that short pass and runs it in for a TD, then we win this game (remember the field goal later) and all of you are praising Kubiak. We played a good team without AJ, and mostly without Williams.

A LOT of you are overreacting. Yes, I know this game was very important and we could easily lose the next two, but I'm telling you now we are gonna ROLL the second half of this season. It's not Kubiak's or Schaub's fault that Jacoby Jones sucks and Vickers is a bum.

While we're all wanting Kubiak fired, let's remember that we beat Pittsburgh last week....and they just STOMPED the Titans.

Question: Who signed Jacoby Jones to a new contract? The Contract Fairy?

Give me a f-----g break.

HJam72
10-09-2011, 04:25 PM
The running game wasn't there. They were kicking our O-Lines butts the whole game.

Honestly, I think Kubiak and/or our OC called an excellent game. If Vickers could catch or J. Jones didn't suck, we'd be praising the offensive play-calling.

Besides that, where's the blame for Jason Allen? How many 15 yard out-patterns are you gonna give up? How 'bout just giving up a long TD because you're tired of it? When are we gonna get two starting CBs instead of none or (now) one and a bunch of miscreants?

nytexan
10-09-2011, 04:31 PM
The question you have to ask is "Why wouldn't you choose to run that play with Vickers, and not Casey who has hands of gold?"

Casey was hurt at that point of the game and was in street clothes

Ckw
10-09-2011, 04:34 PM
It's directly Kubiak's fault for not getting rid of Jacoby Jones this off season or last off season and getting a viable replacement for him. THe confidence that he has instilled in this guy that has never shown consistency in his career has been mind boggling. The fact that we're still somehow having to depend on Jacoby Jones for anything other than an occasional KR still haunts us apparently. That's on Kubiak for neglecting to take care of that problem. :cutthroat:

Agree completely.

Jacoby Jones is a joke of an NFL player. The fact that this bum is making millions while 10% of Americans can't find a job is infuriating. Same can be said for Gary. I despise both of these losers.

Ckw
10-09-2011, 04:37 PM
This. And more! We MUST be prepared for a post AJ era. Look how bad the Colts are suffering because of not being prepared.

I'm sick of Kubiak "falling all in love with these kids". Does he really think we can't do any better than Jacoby?

Good post as well.

Kubiak needs to get his ass over to college football if he wants to fall in love with his "kids" and become an honorary father. These guys are grown men, and this is a business. Kubiak, you aren't their daddy, and they aren't your kids.

Man, I hate this guy...

utahmark
10-09-2011, 04:42 PM
There is nothing wrong with Kubiaks playcalling. He exploited the only area's we had an advantage in. te's and rb's out of the backfield.

His problems is that he let the defense be coached by idiots for 5 years and spent draft after draft and offseason after offseason spending all of our picks trying to upgrade a crappy defense while overlooking his offense because he feels he can move the ball with ave talent on offense. Now we get our big guy injured and anytime we play a team with a big physical line we have problems. Now he is out of chances, lets see what happens.

steelbtexan
10-09-2011, 04:45 PM
Playcalling was a massive, frustrating issue with coaching today. Horrible play by the players, however, is not. I don't buy it. The players have executed before, but not today. It happens.

Look, this is all on Gary.

He's the one who is in charge of not only the offense. He's in charge of the whole team. He is the one who handpicked the players that are not executing on offense.

He's right after 6 yrs of fail, this is all on him.

TheMatrix31
10-09-2011, 04:48 PM
Look, this is all on Gary.

He's the one who is in charge of not only the offense. He's in charge of the whole team. He is the one who handpicked the players that are not executing on offense.

He's right after 6 yrs of fail, this is all on him.

So was it his fault when we executed in three wins this year? I'm not absolving him of blame. His playcalling was terrible today. But it was a shortened playbook, since the best WR in football was out. I know, I know, it's Kubiak's and management's fault for no offensive depth.

EllisUnit
10-09-2011, 04:49 PM
So was it his fault when we executed in three wins this year?

please no logic in this thread :kingkong:

Ckw
10-09-2011, 04:53 PM
There is nothing wrong with Kubiaks playcalling. He exploited the only area's we had an advantage in. te's and rb's out of the backfield.

His problems is that he let the defense be coached by idiots for 5 years and spent draft after draft and offseason after offseason spending all of our picks trying to upgrade a crappy defense while overlooking his offense because he feels he can move the ball with ave talent on offense. Now we get our big guy injured and anytime we play a team with a big physical line we have problems. Now he is out of chances, lets see what happens.

There is something wrong with playcalling when you consistently can't score in the 2nd half and can never seem to put your foot on the gas and beat a team into the ground.

There is also something wrong with playcalling when in the 1st quarter, we were moving the ball efficiently and effectively by constantly getting the ball to OD, then suddenly we move away from him. I saw him on more than few occasions open, but we just flat out quit designing the offense around him when he and Foster were the only two guys on offense making plays.

Finally, there is something wrong with playcalling when you aren't getting the ball to one of your best mismatches in James Casey. The guy should have exploded today, yet we did nothing to try and get him the ball. He wasn't even a factor out there. We saw what he could do in the Saints game when we had him running the ball, blocking, going out wide, and just moving him all over the place. We seemed to do none of that today.

I strongly believe Kubiak's biggest problem is arrogance. I think the guy truly sees himself as an offensive genius that can't be stopped and is the best at what he does. I believe he thinks he can just run any play he wants to and because he was the one that designed it, it will work. Instead of going with what has been proven to work, much like Sean Payton does, and continue being aggressive, Kubiak likes to get cute.

But I'm also a little biased as I have gotten to the point that I despise Kubiak. I want us in the playoffs more than I want him fired but at the same time, I don't believe we will ever win it all with Kubiak at the helm.

Ckw
10-09-2011, 04:57 PM
So was it his fault when we executed in three wins this year? I'm not absolving him of blame. His playcalling was terrible today. But it was a shortened playbook, since the best WR in football was out. I know, I know, it's Kubiak's and management's fault for no offensive depth.

Man, come on. Stop trumpeting wins against the Dolphins and Colts as some quality victory. Our talent so far exceeds both of those teams that with or without Kubiak, both of those games should have been, and were, victories. No, I don't give him credit for those two games.

The Steelers game was a quality win. But when you have as few quality wins as Kubiak has and hardly any games in which your team put together 4 quality quarters of football, then you simply aren't a good coach.

Dishman
10-09-2011, 04:57 PM
What's the average margin of victory (points) under Kubiak?

TheMatrix31
10-09-2011, 05:00 PM
Casey got hurt, lol.

TheMatrix31
10-09-2011, 05:01 PM
Man, come on. Stop trumpeting wins against the Dolphins and Colts as some quality victory. Our talent so far exceeds both of those teams that with or without Kubiak, both of those games should have been, and were, victories. No, I don't give him credit for those two games.

The Steelers game was a quality win. But when you have as few quality wins as Kubiak has and hardly any games in which your team put together 4 quality quarters of football, then you simply aren't a good coach.

Wins are wins, I don't give a ****.

But you hate Kubiak and you won't rest until he's gone. I don't care much for him either but your mind is completely made up, so it's worthless to even talk to you about it.

ziggy29
10-09-2011, 05:06 PM
So was it his fault when we executed in three wins this year? I'm not absolving him of blame. His playcalling was terrible today. But it was a shortened playbook, since the best WR in football was out. I know, I know, it's Kubiak's and management's fault for no offensive depth.
It's not all on Kubes, of course not -- but I think almost anyone can see that this "shortened playbook" is something the Texans under Kubiak have almost always done going into the second half with a lead, year in and year out -- even with a healthy AJ in the game.

If you have to have AJ in the game in order to be imaginative and unpredictable in the play calling, I think it's pretty sad. Yes, the loss of AJ makes it harder for the rest of the team (I sure wish he was in on the last play -- I'll bet a TE or RB has a MUCH better chance of working open with the defense keying on AJ) -- but I still think the team played into its usual tendencies, with *or* without AJ on the field. Just a few extra blown-up plays because the defense predicted it can make the difference in such a close game.

steelbtexan
10-09-2011, 05:10 PM
So was it his fault when we executed in three wins this year? I'm not absolving him of blame. His playcalling was terrible today. But it was a shortened playbook, since the best WR in football was out. I know, I know, it's Kubiak's and management's fault for no offensive depth.

Is it not?

He's the one who's put this team together.

cain78749
10-09-2011, 05:16 PM
I was just telling someone the other day that Texans fans, for some reason, seem to settle on stats instead of wins. It's our wall that we have hidden behind.

Yep. It's the moral victory excuse that losers make. And as much as I blame Kubiak and Schaub, McNair is a loser always reaching for a moral victory after every unsuccessful season (every one to this point). Cultures of failure are created at the top.

TheMatrix31
10-09-2011, 05:17 PM
Is it not?

He's the one who's put this team together.


No, it is.

Ckw
10-09-2011, 05:21 PM
Wins are wins, I don't give a ****.

But you hate Kubiak and you won't rest until he's gone. I don't care much for him either but your mind is completely made up, so it's worthless to even talk to you about it.

You sure seem to know me well for someone that I've never even met.

Actually, I did exactly what I have done every year and had high hopes for Gary to begin the season. I felt like maybe we could get by with basically having a coordinator at head coach since we had another elite coordinator coaching the defense.

Where my hatred has started to build up once again is that the same problem still exists: we are a team that can't play 4 good quarters of football. We always suck it up in one half or another. Lately, it has been the second half that has been our doom. A few years ago, it was the first half.

Sure, a win is a win. But just like I was concerned in the Miami game about the red zone issues even though we won, I am concerned about our inability to play 4 quarters of football. The red zone issues bit us in the ass against New Orleans. Our suckitude in the second half bit us in the ass today against the Raiders.

I want the team to be better than they have ever been. I want us to be a contender. I expect us to get to a place where we can compete, and beat, the Packers, Saints, and Patriots of the world. But it won't happen (or at least it won't happen consistently) if we don't exorcise some of these demons we have namely our red zone woes (which aren't quite as bad with Arian back) and our piss poor second half performances.

But yeah, it is probably worthless for us to talk about it.

IlliniJen
10-09-2011, 05:22 PM
I long for the day we finally fire this piece of shit. I have never wanted to see someone lose their job so bad in my entire life. Offensive genius my ass.

Kubiak is a fraud that got his name because of Mike Shanahan, Steve Young, and John Elway. Without those guys, Kubiak would be a nobody.

Preach, brother.

But McNair doesn't care...he'll just blame it on AJ being hurt or some other such BS to retain this guy.

Kimmy
10-09-2011, 05:24 PM
Preach, brother.

But McNair doesn't care...he'll just blame it on AJ being hurt or some other such BS to retain this guy.

Don't forget the lockout!

EllisUnit
10-09-2011, 05:37 PM
You sure seem to know me well for someone that I've never even met.

Actually, I did exactly what I have done every year and had high hopes for Gary to begin the season. I felt like maybe we could get by with basically having a coordinator at head coach since we had another elite coordinator coaching the defense.

Where my hatred has started to build up once again is that the same problem still exists: we are a team that can't play 4 good quarters of football. We always suck it up in one half or another. Lately, it has been the second half that has been our doom. A few years ago, it was the first half.

Sure, a win is a win. But just like I was concerned in the Miami game about the red zone issues even though we won, I am concerned about our inability to play 4 quarters of football. The red zone issues bit us in the ass against New Orleans. Our suckitude in the second half bit us in the ass today against the Raiders.

I want the team to be better than they have ever been. I want us to be a contender. I expect us to get to a place where we can compete, and beat, the Packers, Saints, and Patriots of the world. But it won't happen (or at least it won't happen consistently) if we don't exorcise some of these demons we have namely our red zone woes (which aren't quite as bad with Arian back) and our piss poor second half performances.

But yeah, it is probably worthless for us to talk about it.

you cant blame him for the losses and give him no credit for the wins, it dont work that way home boy.

Texecutioner
10-09-2011, 05:40 PM
you cant blame him for the losses and give him no credit for the wins, it dont work that way home boy.

He hasn't had a lot of wins to give him credit for though. That's why he is complaining to the degree that he is. We've never had a winning season other than that half ass 9-7 one where the Pats took a lot of their starters out and Brady came out of the game on their last drive. Just a lot of poor football mixed in with some mediocre football.

I'm not sweating things to much for the time being though personally. We're stuck with Kubiak this season either way, and I think we make the playoffs because our division is shit this year. The downfall of that though is that Kubiak will see an extension because of that and I fear that happening the most.

Ckw
10-09-2011, 05:42 PM
you cant blame him for the losses and give him no credit for the wins, it dont work that way home boy.

I gave him credit for the Steelers win. It was a good victory. Home boy...

EllisUnit
10-09-2011, 05:51 PM
He hasn't had a lot of wins to give him credit for though. That's why he is complaining to the degree that he is. We've never had a winning season other than that half ass 9-7 one where the Pats took a lot of their starters out and Brady came out of the game on their last drive. Just a lot of poor football mixed in with some mediocre football.

I'm not sweating things to much for the time being though personally. We're stuck with Kubiak this season either way, and I think we make the playoffs because our division is shit this year. The downfall of that though is that Kubiak will see an extension because of that and I fear that happening the most.

well 40-45 he has about just as many wins as losses so. I think we have a solid team, we do need to get another GOOD WR though, our offense is built around and for AJ, when he goes out we have noone to step up and take his spot. We need to address that but as far as overall talent goes i think we are up there.

houstonspartan
10-09-2011, 06:25 PM
well 40-45 he has about just as many wins as losses so. I think we have a solid team, we do need to get another GOOD WR though, our offense is built around and for AJ, when he goes out we have noone to step up and take his spot. We need to address that but as far as overall talent goes i think we are up there.

So, in other words, let's give Kubiak another pass for this season with the stipulation that we get another WR?

EllisUnit
10-09-2011, 06:27 PM
So, in other words, let's give Kubiak another pass for this season with the stipulation that we get another WR?

No not at all, ALL i am saying is that we are to dependant on 1 player on offense.

houstonspartan
10-09-2011, 06:29 PM
In all seriousness, can someone explain to me how Detroit was able to go from 0-16 a few years ago to where they are now, and we're still struggling after more than half a decade of the same staff?

I'm serious. I'm lost here.

Kimmy
10-09-2011, 06:30 PM
http://www.burygary.com/resources/Vote%20of%20Confidence.JPG

"Here you go Gary, run her into the ground!"

EllisUnit
10-09-2011, 06:31 PM
In all seriousness, can someone explain to me how Detroit was able to go from 0-16 a few years ago to where they are now, and we're still struggling after more than half a decade of the same staff?

I'm serious. I'm lost here.

Stafford has been healthy all season, i guess he is that good. plus they have a pretty good defense.

cdollaz
10-09-2011, 06:31 PM
If the fact that he is 40-45 is an argument FOR him, then that's pretty sad.

EllisUnit
10-09-2011, 06:33 PM
If the fact that he is 40-45 is an argument FOR him, then that's pretty sad.

its not an argument for him, but someone said he dont have many wins to account for i just pointed out he has about as many wins as losses. not making it sound like he is the most winningest coach in the nfl

Dishman
10-09-2011, 06:39 PM
http://www.burygary.com/resources/Vote%20of%20Confidence.JPG

"Here you go Gary, run her into the ground!"

is it just me or are the horns placed just perfectly over McNair's head? I think this is the root of all of our celollective Texans suffering.

Dishman
10-09-2011, 06:40 PM
its not an argument for him, but someone said he dont have many wins to account for i just pointed out he has about as many wins as losses. not making it sound like he is the most winningest coach in the nfl

just most mediocre.

Texanmike02
10-09-2011, 06:43 PM
Chicken littles friends called. They want their reaction back. The ol got handed their ASAP over and over

Mike

gary
10-09-2011, 07:36 PM
I am done calling for anyone to go it just does not do any good to beat a broken bush.

EllisUnit
10-09-2011, 07:38 PM
I am done calling for anyone to go it just does not do any good to beat a broken bush.

i agree....i'm not calling for kubiaks head.

I just dont see how you punt the ball when your on the opponents 37 yard line and then attempt a 54 yarder. Saw the same thing last season against the redskins in overtime. We had a chance to win with the ball on the 39 yard line and he punts.

utahmark
10-09-2011, 07:42 PM
i agree....i'm not calling for kubiaks head.

I just dont see how you punt the ball when your on the opponents 37 yard line and then attempt a 54 yarder. Saw the same thing last season against the redskins in overtime. We had a chance to win with the ball on the 39 yard line and he punts.

That would of been a 55 yarder in Washington. What was the wind doing?

bye the way, we won that game.

EllisUnit
10-09-2011, 07:44 PM
That would of been a 55 yarder in Washington. What was the wind doing?

bye the way, we won that game.

yeah but come on the way our defense was playing, and remeber the kicker for the skins made the first attempt we called time out and he missed the 2nd.

gary
10-09-2011, 07:46 PM
i agree....i'm not calling for kubiaks head.

I just dont see how you punt the ball when your on the opponents 37 yard line and then attempt a 54 yarder. Saw the same thing last season against the redskins in overtime. We had a chance to win with the ball on the 39 yard line and he punts.Just the beautiful work of Gary Kubiak.

utahmark
10-09-2011, 07:47 PM
yeah but come on the way our defense was playing, and remeber the kicker for the skins made the first attempt we called time out and he missed the 2nd.

You got a point about our defense.:shades: I would'nt of punted the ball more than three or four times all last year.

DexmanC
10-09-2011, 07:52 PM
i agree....i'm not calling for kubiaks head.

I just dont see how you punt the ball when your on the opponents 37 yard line and then attempt a 54 yarder. Saw the same thing last season against the redskins in overtime. We had a chance to win with the ball on the 39 yard line and he punts.

Wins/Losses have proven NOT to be an accurate barometer when
assessing whether Kubiak stays or goes. I said he should've
been fired 2 years ago (the 9-7 year.) But I'll just continue to watch
and take note.

Kimmy
10-09-2011, 08:07 PM
Wins/Losses have proven NOT to be an accurate barometer when
assessing whether Kubiak stays or goes. I said he should've
been fired 2 years ago (the 9-7 year.) But I'll just continue to watch
and take note.

I work in sales, with a quota every month. If I failed to meet my quota and do the job they are paying me to do, I wouldn't have lasted six months let alone six years.

How do others (and I'm looking at you McNair) not see that he was hired to do a job and has failed. Consecutively.

DX-TEX
10-09-2011, 08:08 PM
I work in sales, with a quota every month. If I failed to meet my quota and do the job they are paying me to do, I wouldn't have lasted six months let alone six years.

How do others (and I'm looking at you McNair) not see that he was hired to do a job and has failed. Consecutively.


EXACTLY!

Rep +1

gafftop
10-09-2011, 08:17 PM
But teh coaches are calling the dreaded

Run run Pass in teh 3rd qtr

All week long they say stay on sechudle and avoid 3rd and long WELL THEY ARE ALWAYS IN 3rd in long !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Look back Run, run, pass" started in first half.

"Another problem and the one that may/will cost us games is the way the coaching staff calls the game. If we were in a race, this staff would slow down if we were ahead and only would run as hard as they could if they were behind. The talent level in the NFL is too close to not try your hardest all the time."

I posted the above in Jan 2010. Nothing has changed. Kubiak has said all he wants is a chance to win in the 4th quarter. That is the WRONG goal. Based on his desire of " just wanting a chance" to win leads you to a final record of around 50% or 8-8 surprise just where Kubiak ends up every rear. If you just have a chance to win in the 4th then you win some you lose some and end up at 50%.

Kubiak gives up way to many offensive series playing it conservative. Now that we have a defense it will become evident to all.

Sad thing is I am not too sure he will change. Is it a lack on confidence in Schaub's judgement that causes him to be this way or his twisted sense of how to win a game.

EllisUnit
10-09-2011, 08:19 PM
Look back Run, run, pass" started in first half.

"Another problem and the one that may/will cost us games is the way the coaching staff calls the game. If we were in a race, this staff would slow down if we were ahead and only would run as hard as they could if they were behind. The talent level in the NFL is too close to not try your hardest all the time."

I posted the above in Jan 2010. Nothing has changed. Kubiak has said all he wants is a chance to win in the 4th quarter. That is the WRONG goal. Based on his desire of " just wanting a chance" to win leads you to a final record of around 50% or 8-8 surprise just where Kubiak ends up every rear. If you just have a chance to win in the 4th then you win some you lose some and end up at 50%.

Kubiak gives up way to many offensive series playing it conservative. Now that we have a defense it will become evident to all.

Sad thing is I am not too sure he will change. Is it a lack on confidence in Schaub's judgement that causes him to be this way or his twisted sense of how to win a game.

actually to start the game we had 3 consecutive passes, and on the next drive our first play was a pass.

houstonspartan
10-09-2011, 08:20 PM
I work in sales, with a quota every month. If I failed to meet my quota and do the job they are paying me to do, I wouldn't have lasted six months let alone six years.

How do others (and I'm looking at you McNair) not see that he was hired to do a job and has failed. Consecutively.

To add to that: this guy has had four offensive coordinators, three defensive coordinators, two quarterbacks and hundreds of millions of dollars spent on staff, coaches and players.

gafftop
10-09-2011, 08:23 PM
actually to start the game we had 3 consecutive passes, and on the next drive our first play was a pass.

Look at the play selection when we got the lead.

EllisUnit
10-09-2011, 08:25 PM
Look at the play selection when we got the lead.

i know this we always change up what is working when we got the lead, but thats not what i was referring to. Look at the play selection in the first, run, run, pass. When infact it was the other way around.

DexmanC
10-09-2011, 08:28 PM
Do the Detroit Lions have more talent than the Texans, or a better coach?

EllisUnit
10-09-2011, 08:29 PM
Do the Detroit Lions have more talent than the Texans, or a better coach?

i dont think its talent, they are one QB injury away from going 0-11 the rest of the season.

HTown2ATX
10-09-2011, 08:36 PM
i dont think its talent, they are one QB injury away from going 0-11 the rest of the season.

Yeah, but that could be any team...see Colts

EllisUnit
10-09-2011, 08:40 PM
Yeah, but that could be any team...see Colts

BUT how many QBs in the NFL are as good as peyton, that team has been getting old and losing talent for a while. Manning is just good enough to make them all look good. If they draft Luck that still wont be enough to adress all the weaknesses they have.

steelbtexan
10-09-2011, 08:47 PM
i dont think its talent, they are one QB injury away from going 0-11 the rest of the season.

Doubtful

They won 4 in a row with the famous duo of Shaun Hill and Drew Stanton at QB to end last yr.

How many do you think the Texans would win with Lienhart at QB? If you think Gary is conservative now imagine the offense with Lienhart at QB.

EllisUnit
10-09-2011, 08:49 PM
Doubtful

They won 4 in a row with the famous duo of Shaun Hill and Drew Stanton at QB to end last yr.

How many do you think the Texans would win with Lienhart at QB? If you think Gary is conservative now imagine the offense with Lienhart at QB.

ok and what was their overall record ???? They have had stafford for 3 years and this is his first healthy season you dont think thats a coinsidence ?

thunderkyss
10-09-2011, 09:00 PM
While we're all wanting Kubiak fired, let's remember that we beat Pittsburgh last week....and they just STOMPED the Titans.

This.

Every team wins.. every team loses. The good teams come back next week & stomp a hole in somebody's ass.

Let's see what we do next week.

EllisUnit
10-09-2011, 09:04 PM
This.

Every team wins.. every team loses. The good teams come back next week & stomp a hole in somebody's ass.

Let's see what we do next week.

agree, i just pray they dont let us down.

silvrhand
10-09-2011, 09:12 PM
Cowher in 2012.. make it happen..

Kimmy
10-09-2011, 09:17 PM
Cowher in 2012.. make it happen..

We already have the defense he wanted ...

One thing though ... he's on the HOF ballot for this year. They don't get voted in if there's a chance they could still coach.

Wonder what's more important to him? A yellow jacket or another ring?

Runner
10-09-2011, 09:21 PM
This.

Every team wins.. every team loses. The good teams come back next week & stomp a hole in somebody's ass.

Let's see what we do next week.

Yep. Next week is always the game that counts for this team. The big losses are just opportunities to show what they are made of next week.

DX-TEX
10-09-2011, 09:23 PM
We already have the defense he wanted ...

One thing though ... he's on the HOF ballot for this year. They don't get voted in if there's a chance they could still coach.

Wonder what's more important to him? A yellow jacket or another ring?

He wont get in this year. But come on people, we all KNOW this gig is Wade's when/if Kubiak gets canned.

Death, taxes and the Texans having a marshmallow for a HC.

Lucky
10-09-2011, 09:28 PM
He wont get in this year. But come on people, we all KNOW this gig is Wade's when/if Kubiak gets canned.

Can this happen before the season is blown?

Yep. Next week is always the game that counts for this team. The big losses are just opportunities to show what they are made of next week.
"Let's see what happens next week/year" is the Texans motivational slogan.

"Just win, baby" - Al Davis

"We're on the right track" - Bob McNair

steelbtexan
10-09-2011, 09:30 PM
ok and what was their overall record ???? They have had stafford for 3 years and this is his first healthy season you dont think thats a coinsidence ?

No I dont think it's a coincidence.

I was just proving the fallacy in your previous post.

Do you think the Texans could win 4 games in a row with Gary at HC and Lienhart at QB? I'm not sure right now they could win 4 in a row with Schaub and without AJ.

DX-TEX
10-09-2011, 09:31 PM
Can this happen before the season is blown?


"Let's see what happens next week/year" is the Texans motivational slogan.

"Just win, baby" - Al Davis

"We're on the right track" - Bob McNair



Why not? Wade wouldnt change anything but maybe tell Dennison to be more aggressive. Give Rick a shot to call the plays.

lol @ the team motto comment.

Hervoyel
10-09-2011, 09:34 PM
Doubtful

They won 4 in a row with the famous duo of Shaun Hill and Drew Stanton at QB to end last yr.

How many do you think the Texans would win with Lienhart at QB? If you think Gary is conservative now imagine the offense with Lienhart at QB.

I'd be interested in taking a look at the Texans with Leinart starting. I understand that he's no upgrade to Schaub as far as arm strength is concerned but I'd like to see what his decision making looks like and not just while playing with a bunch of second and third string guys in a preseason game.

Seriously, I'd just like to know if he's ready to live up to all that "potential" he's supposed to have.

DX-TEX
10-09-2011, 09:36 PM
I'd be interested in taking a look at the Texans with Leinart starting. I understand that he's no upgrade to Schaub as far as arm strength is concerned but I'd like to see what his decision making looks like and not just while playing with a bunch of second and third string guys in a preseason game.

Seriously, I'd just like to know if he's ready to live up to all that "potential" he's supposed to have.

Would still be conceding the season and as pissed as I am right now I refuse to do that. Now if our O line plays next week like they did today Mr Lewis & Co. may just kill him and we will find out.

bo orlando
10-09-2011, 09:40 PM
I don't think it's that he can't coach an offense per se. I think it's a matter of ripping out all the higher risk/higher reward plays from the playbook when "nursing" a second half lead. (The type of plays that helped them to a strong first half.) By now every head coach and DC in the NFL knows the type of conservative game Kubes will call in such a situation, and they can pin their ears back and concentrate on stopping that stuff.

This is so stupid. With the game on the line today Kubiak went for a misdirection pass to a FB who hadn't been thrown to all year. Last week Kubiak threw deep to Jacoby in an attempt to ice the game, the game before that he went for a post to Casey.

The armchair QB's bring it from both sides. Kubiak calls throws that fail and it's "why aren't we RUNNING????" He calls runs that fail and it's "why are we SO PREDICTABLE?" Kubiak calls an effective play that leads to a big gain and it's "that's what we SHOULD be doing!"

EVOLVIST
10-09-2011, 09:45 PM
Kubiak gives up way to many offensive series playing it conservative. Now that we have a defense it will become evident to all.

Sad thing is I am not too sure he will change. Is it a lack on confidence in Schaub's judgement that causes him to be this way or his twisted sense of how to win a game.

Its a little bit of both.

Remember, Kubiak served as a backup quarterback in his NFL career as a player, which I believe, in turn, has translated into a backup quarterback mentality as a head coach. Its this very same oblique mindset that has disallowed Matt Schaub to grow as a mature QB. Instead of full or even partial play-call-sharing, instead, Kubiak has installed very little latitude to command the game as Schaub should; hence, a progressive worsening in Schaubs play, despite working with the same offensive weapons. Audibles are almost nonexistent. The plays are one route reads, with a series of check downs, as opposed to scanning the whole field and one of the most telling aspects of the Schaub/Kubiak connections happens off the field, as they both share the same demeanor and often use identical verbiage.

In short, not only is Kubiak responsible for retarding the growth of the Texans, as a unit, but also, he has hamstrung his quarterback, by a philosophically inept view of how the game is played today.

In this league, Kubiak would have been better off straight up copying Shanahan, instead of mimicking his own shortcomings as a career backup.

Hervoyel
10-09-2011, 09:50 PM
This is so stupid. With the game on the line today Kubiak went for a misdirection pass to a FB who hadn't been thrown to all year. Last week Kubiak threw deep to Jacoby in an attempt to ice the game, the game before that he went for a post to Casey.

The armchair QB's bring it from both sides. Kubiak calls throws that fail and it's "why aren't we RUNNING????" He calls runs that fail and it's "why are we SO PREDICTABLE?" Kubiak calls an effective play that leads to a big gain and it's "that's what we SHOULD be doing!"

The FB screwed the pooch on that and should have caught the ball and run it in. He had a TD in his hands and blew it which is ironically the thing he seemingly wants to be known for. He's a "Gimmie the ball!" kind of FB who Cleveland fans mocked for thinking he was a RB. Well, we saw what Lawrence Vickers can do with the ball today didn't we?

Kubiak called some good plays. He also did his usual turtle impersonation when we were up 14-3. His offense has problems and they were apparent to many people even as we watched the defense sporting bigger problems. The offense is predicated on one player, Andre Johnson. Behind him are a bunch of WR's who get cut on other teams and there's no excuse for that. Jacoby Jones? Kevin Walters? These are role players not #2 wideouts. Sure, we've got TE's but they're no substitute for a top starting NFL WR. Never will be no matter how creatively they are used.

Today the Raiders said basically "You're not running the football" and they meant it. 8 men in the box most of the time and no seams or creases to cut back into. We did what we could and came up short. Kubiak isn't the reason specific mistakes were made. He's the reason we found ourselves with no one to go to besides TE's and Foster out of the backfield for most of the day.

I don't know what board the real QB's ***** on so you're stuck with the armchair QB's.

Lucky
10-09-2011, 09:51 PM
...Kubiak has installed very little latitude to command the game as Schaub should; hence, a progressive worsening in Schaub’s play...
Schaub 2009 > Schaub 2010 > Schaub 2011. He's not getting better.

http://www.texanstalk.com/forums/image.php?u=39000&dateline=1317433101

WFL FTW!

Texecutioner
10-09-2011, 09:53 PM
I don't know what board the real QB's ***** on so you're stuck with the armchair QB's.

This was a ridiculously funny statement. Lol!

hradhak
10-09-2011, 09:54 PM
There were mistakes from all levels.

The O Line couldn't run block or pass protect.

Schaub was errant with most of his throws.

Jacoby played like Jacoby.

Vickers couldn't catch an easy TD.

Rackers misses a FG that would have put us within 3 at the end of the game.

Jason Allen made a play and then looked like Kareem Jackson.

Kubes stuck with the run for far too long, and didn't get the ball to Foster in space (enough).

The special teams was atrocious. On every play.

Despite all of that, we had the game in our hands on the last play of the game. Fix anyone of the above (O line first please!) and we win this game.

To say that Schaub was the problem here just ignores so much, but he needs to take his share of the blame.

houstonspartan
10-09-2011, 09:57 PM
Its a little bit of both.

Remember, Kubiak served as a backup quarterback in his NFL career as a player, which I believe, in turn, has translated into a backup quarterback mentality as a head coach. Its this very same oblique mindset that has disallowed Matt Schaub to grow as a mature QB. Instead of full or even partial play-call-sharing, instead, Kubiak has installed very little latitude to command the game as Schaub should; hence, a progressive worsening in Schaubs play, despite working with the same offensive weapons. Audibles are almost nonexistent. The plays are one route reads, with a series of check downs, as opposed to scanning the whole field and one of the most telling aspects of the Schaub/Kubiak connections happens off the field, as they both share the same demeanor and often use identical verbiage.

In short, not only is Kubiak responsible for retarding the growth of the Texans, as a unit, but also, he has hamstrung his quarterback, by a philosophically inept view of how the game is played today.

In this league, Kubiak would have been better off straight up copying Shanahan, instead of mimicking his own shortcomings as a career backup.

Hmm. Well, two things.

1) Mike Shanahan is not nice. Dude would eat his kid if he had to in order to win a game. When the Broncos won those two Super Bowls back to back, their offense was "foot on throat" full throttle. Which leads to my next point...

2) John Elway. Kubiak still thinks he has John Elway. He doesn't. Shanahan's meanness and John Elway's talent is what drove the Broncos.

EVOLVIST
10-09-2011, 10:07 PM
Hmm. Well, two things.

1) Mike Shanahan is not nice. Dude would eat his kid if he had to in order to win a game. When the Broncos won those two Super Bowls back to back, their offense was "foot on throat" full throttle. Which leads to my next point...

2) John Elway. Kubiak still thinks he has John Elway. He doesn't. Shanahan's meanness and John Elway's talent is what drove the Broncos.

Exactly. The whole reason Kubiak was hired is because McNair had a hard on for those ol' Denver days, thinking that would spill over into Houston. Kubiak came with glowing recommendations. What McNair didn't know, however, was that Shanahan's rough hewn midwestern upbringing in no ways translates over into Kubes' "Ah shucks," mediocrity.

gary
10-09-2011, 10:14 PM
There were mistakes from all levels.

The O Line couldn't run block or pass protect.

Schaub was errant with most of his throws.

Jacoby played like Jacoby.

Vickers couldn't catch an easy TD.

Rackers misses a FG that would have put us within 3 at the end of the game.

Jason Allen made a play and then looked like Kareem Jackson.

Kubes stuck with the run for far too long, and didn't get the ball to Foster in space (enough).

The special teams was atrocious. On every play.

Despite all of that, we had the game in our hands on the last play of the game. Fix anyone of the above (O line first please!) and we win this game.

To say that Schaub was the problem here just ignores so much, but he needs to take his share of the blame.Sorry, but if this is still going on after almost five and half seasons under Kubiak then it is on him. This is his sixth season already.

Texecutioner
10-09-2011, 10:17 PM
Hmm. Well, two things.

1) Mike Shanahan is not nice. Dude would eat his kid if he had to in order to win a game. When the Broncos won those two Super Bowls back to back, their offense was "foot on throat" full throttle. Which leads to my next point...

2) John Elway. Kubiak still thinks he has John Elway. He doesn't. Shanahan's meanness and John Elway's talent is what drove the Broncos.

I think all of that had to do with John Elway's greatness more than anything. You and I have always agreed on Kubiak going on several years now, but I also have always thought that Shanny built his reputation off of Elway's greatness as well. I think Shanhan is a good coach, but not some great one that some people believe because they see 2 SB's on paper. Elway was just that unbelievable "it factor" QB that could make things happen in the clutch and in crucial moments with limited talent. I've always put Elway in my top 3 QB's of all time, because he was just to unpredictable when it came to holding a lead against that guy. I hated him more than any other QB growing up. He reminds me so much of Manning and Brady now with him being Manning and Brady being Joe Montana. As great as Elway always could be there was always Joe Montana who was simply a cut above him no matter how great he could be. Either way, they were both once in a lifetime QB's.

HTown2ATX
10-09-2011, 10:18 PM
Exactly. The whole reason Kubiak was hired is because McNair had a hard on for those ol' Denver days, thinking that would spill over into Houston. Kubiak came with glowing recommendations. What McNair didn't know, however, was that Shanahan's rough hewn midwestern upbringing in no ways translates over into Kubes' "Ah shucks," mediocrity.


Also, he can tap on a podium pretty well during interviews after a loss. FWIW

:clown:

silvrhand
10-09-2011, 10:25 PM
http://www.nypost.com/rw/nypost/2010/01/15/sports/photos_stories/cropped/086_bill_cowher--300x300.jpg

steelbtexan
10-09-2011, 10:28 PM
http://www.nypost.com/rw/nypost/2010/01/15/sports/photos_stories/cropped/086_bill_cowher--300x300.jpg

Love it, where/when did you come up with this idea? We're probably dreaming if we think BoBBy would give up control to a guy like Cowher/Gruden etc....

LOL

Ckw
10-09-2011, 10:31 PM
It’s a little bit of both.

Remember, Kubiak served as a backup quarterback in his NFL career as a player, which I believe, in turn, has translated into a backup quarterback mentality as a head coach. It’s this very same oblique mindset that has disallowed Matt Schaub to grow as a mature QB. Instead of full – or even partial – play-call-sharing, instead, Kubiak has installed very little latitude to command the game as Schaub should; hence, a progressive worsening in Schaub’s play, despite working with the same offensive weapons. Audibles are almost nonexistent. The plays are one route reads, with a series of check downs, as opposed to scanning the whole field – and one of the most telling aspects of the Schaub/Kubiak connections happens off the field, as they both share the same demeanor and often use identical verbiage.

In short, not only is Kubiak responsible for retarding the growth of the Texans, as a unit, but also, he has hamstrung his quarterback, by a philosophically inept view of how the game is played today.

“In this league,” Kubiak would have been better off straight up copying Shanahan, instead of mimicking his own shortcomings as a career backup.

That was a stellar post. Very well put. I'm on my phone using tapatalk so I can't rep you but once I am back at my pc, I will try to remember to do so.

Great summary. I was thinking the same thing today when I was watching Schaub, looking at his demeanor, etc. It reminded me so much of Kubiak it made me want to puke. I think that is what had me so pissed at Schaub today. I can't stand having one Kubiak on our team let alone two.

It's really sad that you may be right that rather than truly make Schaub a better QB, Gary has handcuffed him by not allowing him to truly learn to read defenses, audible out of plays, and truly be a field general.

hradhak
10-09-2011, 10:33 PM
Sorry, but if this is still going on after almost five and half seasons under Kubiak then it is on him. This is his sixth season already.

I'm not giving Kubes a pass. The fact that our offense looked atrocious was all on him. I'm trying to say that Schaub was not completely the problem here, the execution was terrible.

Hervoyel
10-09-2011, 10:34 PM
Love it, where/when did you come up with this idea? We're probably dreaming if we think BoBBy would give up control to a guy like Cowher/Gruden etc....

LOL

I prefer this one

http://i215.photobucket.com/albums/cc272/Hervoyel/TexanCowher.gif

silvrhand
10-09-2011, 10:37 PM
I prefer this one

http://i215.photobucket.com/albums/cc272/Hervoyel/TexanCowher.gif

Nice, was being lazy.. no voice and headache.. was being cheap and lazy +rep for having the time/patience to do that tonight :)

EllisUnit
10-09-2011, 11:20 PM
lets not start with the Coach C talk just yet. This game is not fully kubiaks fault. See how i said FULLY. 4 50+ yard FGs. 2 of them without the raiders even gaining a first down. Vickers Droping a wide open pass that was an easy TD. Matt Schaub playing QB for the raiders and throwing a perfect pass to beat the texans :kingkong:. See its not all on Kubiak but everything else i didnt mention is.

GP
10-09-2011, 11:28 PM
how big was that miss by rackers ?

Vickers screwed up. Cost us.

Rackers screwed up. Cost us.

Dreessen dropped an easy pass that Kubiak challenged. Cost us.

O-line acted like they had never run blocked before. Cost us.

The two most productive plays for Arian Foster were both, IIRC, the little swing pass to him as he headed out of the backfield and toward sideline. The old "pass play that's like a running play when your running game isn't working" play. Yet we only did that twice, IIRC. THAT cost us.

Jacoby Jones, IMO, is running his routes too deep before making his cut, which means Schaub's passes that look like Schaub is underthrowing and hitting the dirt in from of JJ is more JJ's fault than anything. I have been thinking about it. I sat there in the stadium and thought, "Why is this same scenario--the ball being thrown to JJ too high or too low all the time--continuing to happen so much? Maybe JJ is not running SHARP, CLEAN, ACCURATE routes and Schaub is subsequently throwing it higher than where JJ is at that moment in the route or Schaub is throwing it too shallow. Know what I mean? That sort of stuff cost us today. Multiple times.

Joe Marciano's team not being ready for a fake punt? Cost us.

Putting Danieal Manning all the way up into the box and leaving CBs on an island against big, fast WRs of the Raiders? Cost us. I just sat there and shook my head. Manning is a ball hawk, you get him roaming the secondary and making catches out there.

Outside of Cushing and Johnathan Joseph, nobody on defense did anything consistently GOOD today.

This game was like a fog. I sat there, in the stadium, and just shook my head. My head shaking and my sour mood began in the 2nd quarter when it became apparent that for some reason the Texans were destined to lose this game. I think when Mario went out, the rest of our team's fire and confidence did too. As if "Well, we could survive until AJ gets back...but now that Mario is gone? Eff it. We're screwed."

I had a bad feeling in the 2nd quarter when we would hold them to FG attempts and The Janitor was nailing his long kicks on us. We're SCREWED. All they have to do is FG us to death, and they did. They knew we'd bend and then tighten up near FG range...and they knew all they had to do was just get the oompa loompa in tight silver pants within 60 yards of the posts.

Game over. Raiders game plan > Texans non-game plan.

EllisUnit
10-09-2011, 11:31 PM
Vickers screwed up. Cost us.

Rackers screwed up. Cost us.

Dreessen dropped an easy pass that Kubiak challenged. Cost us.

O-line acted like they had never run blocked before. Cost us.

The two most productive plays for Arian Foster were both, IIRC, the little swing pass to him as he headed out of the backfield and toward sideline. The old "pass play that's like a running play when your running game isn't working" play. Yet we only did that twice, IIRC. THAT cost us.

Jacoby Jones, IMO, is running his routes too deep before making his cut, which means Schaub's passes that look like Schaub is underthrowing and hitting the dirt in from of JJ is more JJ's fault than anything. I have been thinking about it. I sat there in the stadium and thought, "Why is this same scenario--the ball being thrown to JJ too high or too low all the time--continuing to happen so much? Maybe JJ is not running SHARP, CLEAN, ACCURATE routes and Schaub is subsequently throwing it higher than where JJ is at that moment in the route or Schaub is throwing it too shallow. Know what I mean? That sort of stuff cost us today. Multiple times.

Joe Marciano's team not being ready for a fake punt? Cost us.

Putting Danieal Manning all the way up into the box and leaving CBs on an island against big, fast WRs of the Raiders? Cost us. I just sat there and shook my head. Manning is a ball hawk, you get him roaming the secondary and making catches out there.

Outside of Cushing and Johnathan Joseph, nobody on defense did anything consistently GOOD today.

This game was like a fog. I sat there, in the stadium, and just shook my head. My head shaking and my sour mood began in the 2nd quarter when it became apparent that for some reason the Texans were destined to lose this game. I think when Mario went out, the rest of our team's fire and confidence did too. As if "Well, we could survive until AJ gets back...but now that Mario is gone? Eff it. We're screwed."

I had a bad feeling in the 2nd quarter when we would hold them to FG attempts and The Janitor was nailing his long kicks on us. We're SCREWED. All they have to do is FG us to death, and they did. They knew we'd bend and then tighten up near FG range...and they knew all they had to do was just get the oompa loompa in tight silver pants within 60 yards of the posts.

Game over. Raiders game plan > Texans non-game plan.

haha yeah all this as well

silvrhand
10-09-2011, 11:32 PM
lets not start with the Coach C talk just yet. This game is not fully kubiaks fault. See how i said FULLY. 4 50+ yard FGs. 2 of them without the raiders even gaining a first down. Vickers Droping a wide open pass that was an easy TD. Matt Schaub playing QB for the raiders and throwing a perfect pass to beat the texans :kingkong:. See its not all on Kubiak but everything else i didnt mention is.

This is Kubiak's team over 6 years now.. even if the players are not performing it's his fault.. he's been able to pick and choose now and had time to figure out where people need to play to get the best from his team..

Sorry, time for Cowher power, it was last year too...

EllisUnit
10-09-2011, 11:36 PM
This is Kubiak's team over 6 years now.. even if the players are not performing it's his fault.. he's been able to pick and choose now and had time to figure out where people need to play to get the best from his team..

Sorry, time for Cowher power, it was last year too...

i can hire the best damn hit man in the world, if he dont deliver is that on me our on him ? I do place some of today's loss on Kubiak but to say he is the main and only reason we lost is a little much. How come you didn't say this after we beat the steelers ? Cause he obviously didnt help us win right. Oh he didnt help us win but he had everything to do with us losing today, ok i got it now :toropalm:

MojoX
10-09-2011, 11:43 PM
Jacoby Jones, IMO, is running his routes too deep before making his cut, which means Schaub's passes that look like Schaub is underthrowing and hitting the dirt in from of JJ is more JJ's fault than anything. I have been thinking about it. I sat there in the stadium and thought, "Why is this same scenario--the ball being thrown to JJ too high or too low all the time--continuing to happen so much? Maybe JJ is not running SHARP, CLEAN, ACCURATE routes and Schaub is subsequently throwing it higher than where JJ is at that moment in the route or Schaub is throwing it too shallow. Know what I mean? That sort of stuff cost us today. Multiple times.
I am with you here. On a CBS replay of one of those throws the color guy noted that Jones was slow coming out of his break. Instead of a sharp cut, he came out in a long curve which threw off the timing, leaving the pass to hit the dirt wide.

But those too high throws and behind the receiver throws to the other cats are on Schaub. I think that is one thing that separates passers like Manning from the pack: hitting receivers in stride. I like Schaub, but that Vickers drop is, to me, shared between the two. Schaub should know better than to throw a ball like that to a fullback, but since he got his hands on it, Vickers' job is to reel it in.

cdollaz
10-09-2011, 11:44 PM
Some of the blame for Vickers' drop is on whoever called the play. If he is known as not having good hands, then they shouldn't have called his number. The coaching staff should be putting players into positions where they can succeed, not fail. I wouldn't put an introvert from my accounting dept. In front of a customer to close a deal or train them. I would not be putting them in a position to be successful. Similarly, this coaching staff should know their players and what they can do. If he is not good at catching the ball, then don't throw to him.

silvrhand
10-09-2011, 11:46 PM
i can hire the best damn hit man in the world, if he dont deliver is that on me our on him ? I do place some of today's loss on Kubiak but to say he is the main and only reason we lost is a little much. How come you didn't say this after we beat the steelers ? Cause he obviously didnt help us win right. Oh he didnt help us win but he had everything to do with us losing today, ok i got it now :toropalm:

I haven't been a kubiak fan for years now this is nothing new for me. He's a backup quarterback that's a mediocre coach. Sorry don't think he's the right guy to get our franchise where we want it to be.

EllisUnit
10-09-2011, 11:48 PM
I haven't been a kubiak fan for years now this is nothing new for me. He's a backup quarterback that's a mediocre coach. Sorry don't think he's the right guy to get our franchise where we want it to be.

Go back and look at how MANY QBS and COACHES who were terrible that have won super bowls. And why because of defense. They are competent enough to win us a Superbowl, they just arent good enough to do it alone.

thunderkyss
10-09-2011, 11:57 PM
In all seriousness, can someone explain to me how Detroit was able to go from 0-16 a few years ago to where they are now, and we're still struggling after more than half a decade of the same staff?

I'm serious. I'm lost here.

& just where the heck are the Detroit Lions?

Media Darlings? Is that what you want?

They were 6-10 last season. 6 & 10...

We don't get credit for beating the Colts or Miami, but we put the Lions on a pedestal because they beat Tampa Bay (3-2), Kansas City (2-3), Minnesota (1-4), & Dallas (2-2)?

I'm not buying it. That's just haterade.

& they damn sure didn't play 4 full quarters against the Cowboys.

GP
10-10-2011, 12:39 AM
haha yeah all this as well

I know, right?

The massive amount of dumbshit things that happened in the 2nd, 3rd, and 4th Quarters of the game completely erased an entire 1st Quarter of football that was spotless by the Texans.

In the 2nd Quarter, and I mean EARLY in the 2nd Quarter, I just knew we were done. My wife was all into the game, and I sat there picking through my soggy nachos and trying to make designs out of the cheese and peppers.

Only Toro using the slingshot to toss t-shirts into the stands made me smile today. Toro is underpaid.

hot pickle
10-10-2011, 01:18 AM
i think theres a good chance this is kubes last year. and the scary thing is i see mcnair making wade the head coach

Dan B.
10-10-2011, 03:27 AM
& just where the heck are the Detroit Lions?

Media Darlings? Is that what you want?

They were 6-10 last season. 6 & 10...

We don't get credit for beating the Colts or Miami, but we put the Lions on a pedestal because they beat Tampa Bay (3-2), Kansas City (2-3), Minnesota (1-4), & Dallas (2-2)?

I'm not buying it. That's just haterade.

& they damn sure didn't play 4 full quarters against the Cowboys.

Tell me you are kidding.

The Lions have looked immeasurably better than the Texans this year.

Especially when it matters.

HTown2ATX
10-10-2011, 07:11 AM
i think theres a good chance this is kubes last year. and the scary thing is i see mcnair making wade the head coach


^^^^^^^^^^^^THIS^^^^^^^^ Is my greatest fear that I and others have voiced since he was hired.

Thorn
10-10-2011, 07:51 AM
All those disappointments from the Oilers, and now we have this to put up with. WTF did Houston ever do to deserve this crap?

Will someone please explain to me how much worse Wade is as a head coach than Kubiak? I'm moving quickly back to the Fire Kubiak bandwagon if we end up losing the next two games, which now seems likely.

HTown2ATX
10-10-2011, 08:07 AM
Will someone please explain to me how much worse Wade is as a head coach than Kubiak? I'm moving quickly back to the Fire Kubiak bandwagon if we end up losing the next two games, which now seems likely.

It's not that he would be worse per say.......but I don't see him as doing any better. That is the issue. (and judging by how coddled Kubiak has been by McNair, Wade being coach would probably be minimum 5 years regardless of W-L record....eg Kubiak)

I think a lot of us would like to see a coach like Cowher, Gruden, etc, someone who has a bad attitude and rings to back it up.


FWIW

:cowboy1:

Marcus
10-10-2011, 08:24 AM
When are some of you ever gonna get it through your ********* heads that Cowher is never gonna be the next head coach?

They lose, and senseless pipedreams just goes flying everywhere.

Some of you flat out don't deserve a winning football team.

Mr teX
10-10-2011, 08:41 AM
Screw it then, lets just hire Rich Kotite.

DexmanC
10-10-2011, 09:00 AM
Jim Schwarz is well on his way to building in Detroit what he built
in Tennessee (that damn DEFENSE,) and they have a Franchise QB,
Franchize WR, and a 4-0 record with THREE WINS ON THE ROAD.

This is only his SECOND YEAR after inheriting an 0-16 TEAM.
He's already accomplished more than Gary Kubiak has, just
by the start of his 2011 season. Why is Kubiak TOLERATED
HERE FOR SO FRICKIN' LONG???

The offense LOOKS powerful. The defense LOOKS good, but they
HAVE NEVER BEEN THREE GAMES OVER .500

If ya'll feel me, just breathe deep, and watch this team crawl to mediocrity
or fall off. That's been 5 straight years under Kubiak, will year SIX be
any different?

Insanity = consistently doing the same thing while hoping for a different
result (perfectly describes the tenure of Gary Kubiak)

Hervoyel
10-10-2011, 09:18 AM
When are some of you ever gonna get it through your ********* heads that Cowher is never gonna be the next head coach?

They lose, and senseless pipedreams just goes flying everywhere.

Some of you flat out don't deserve a winning football team.

You're right. Some of you don't.

Hervoyel
10-10-2011, 09:20 AM
All those disappointments from the Oilers, and now we have this to put up with. WTF did Houston ever do to deserve this crap?

Will someone please explain to me how much worse Wade is as a head coach than Kubiak? I'm moving quickly back to the Fire Kubiak bandwagon if we end up losing the next two games, which now seems likely.


We find ourselves at 3-4 and Kubiak will think he's being burned at the stake the heat will get so bad.

houstonspartan
10-10-2011, 09:31 AM
Jim Schwarz is well on his way to building in Detroit what he built
in Tennessee (that damn DEFENSE,) and they have a Franchise QB,
Franchize WR, and a 4-0 record with THREE WINS ON THE ROAD.

This is only his SECOND YEAR after inheriting an 0-16 TEAM.
He's already accomplished more than Gary Kubiak has, just
by the start of his 2011 season. Why is Kubiak TOLERATED
HERE FOR SO FRICKIN' LONG???

The offense LOOKS powerful. The defense LOOKS good, but they
HAVE NEVER BEEN THREE GAMES OVER .500

If ya'll feel me, just breathe deep, and watch this team crawl to mediocrity
or fall off. That's been 5 straight years under Kubiak, will year SIX be
any different?

Insanity = consistently doing the same thing while hoping for a different
result (perfectly describes the tenure of Gary Kubiak)



Kubiak's defense has always been "Well, he took over a terrible team and had to re-build. They were 2-14."

Fine, but, it doesn't get much worse than 0-16, folks. The Lions were TERRIBLE a few years ago.

The way the NFL is structured now, it takes three, maybe four, years to re-build a team. And if a team is REALLY bad, I'll give them a longer leash, and say four, maybe five years.

Technically, the Lions shouldn't be as good as their are. But, they are.

Meanwhile, we wait.

houstonspartan
10-10-2011, 09:49 AM
Also, what's really head-banging about this whole thing is that we could have been, should have been, in like, year 3 of a new coach's system. Ugh.

Thorn
10-10-2011, 11:29 AM
We find ourselves at 3-4 and Kubiak will think he's being burned at the stake the heat will get so bad.

And now with all the injuries, he might get a flyer from Uncle Bob.

:toropalm:

beerlover
10-10-2011, 11:37 AM
If Texans don't make the playoffs in weakest AFC South since franchise inception will force termination regardless of whatever love affair exists with it's Head Coach :pop:

Carr Bombed
10-10-2011, 11:37 AM
Conservative. In the 1st half we have a shot for a 48 yard field goal, and we punt, we had the ball 3 and 1 2 times in their territory and we punt. We are so predictable on play calling it gets a little disturbing at times.

I like Kubiak and what he can do with an offense, BUT to never take any risks, to never go for it and to just go pure flat on playing and play calling is inexcusable.

and these refs are being slightly biased.

It's called Aggie football.....have you watched them play at all. Gary Kubiak is a "aggie man" and he coaches like one too. :toropalm: However the dumbest thing he did yesterday was challenge that Joel Dreessen catch.. I was begging him not to throw that flag and as soon as I saw the red flag come out, I started cursing at my T.V. Nobody pisses away timeouts better than Gary "I couldn't manage a clock if my life depended on it" Kubiak. That play had 0 chance of getting overturned and the only thing he was doing there was pissing away a crucial second half timeout....which might've cost us the game.

Double Barrel
10-10-2011, 12:02 PM
Hmm. Well, two things.

1) Mike Shanahan is not nice. Dude would eat his kid if he had to in order to win a game. When the Broncos won those two Super Bowls back to back, their offense was "foot on throat" full throttle. Which leads to my next point...

2) John Elway. Kubiak still thinks he has John Elway. He doesn't. Shanahan's meanness and John Elway's talent is what drove the Broncos.

3) Terrell Davis - Even Elway couldn't win a Super Bowl without a good running back.

And now with all the injuries, he might get a flyer from Uncle Bob.

:toropalm:

Don't forget the lock-out! :rake:

Texecutioner
10-10-2011, 12:31 PM
When are some of you ever gonna get it through your ********* heads that Cowher is never gonna be the next head coach?

They lose, and senseless pipedreams just goes flying everywhere.

Some of you flat out don't deserve a winning football team.

Your bravado of lashing out at fans for wanting a winning regime is so tiring and old at this point. Show me a regime of a HC/GM that have a history of winning here or that could put up back to back seasons of winning or title contention in this city, and then you'll stop hearing about a HC change. But for you sit back and act like fans are so irrational in year 6 of a regime that should have been axed last off season is pretty old at this stage.

We'll make the playoffs this season though, and your boy Gary will get his extension due to being in a terrible division where Manning sat out.

Runner
10-10-2011, 12:31 PM
Also, what's really head-banging about this whole thing is that we could have been, should have been, in like, year 3 of a new coach's system. Ugh.

No doubt. All the consternation about change being disruptive seems misplaced. Something needs to knock this team off the right path and onto the path to improvement.

thunderkyss
10-10-2011, 01:14 PM
We find ourselves at 3-4 and Kubiak will think he's being burned at the stake the heat will get so bad.

Would anyone be surprised if McNair fires Kubiak after a three game losing streak?

Texecutioner
10-10-2011, 01:17 PM
Would anyone be surprised if McNair fires Kubiak after a three game losing streak?

Kubiak would never get fired by Mcnair in mid season. At this point though, it's hard to even gauge what it would take for Bob to ever pull the cord on Gary since a 6-10 season in year 5 didn't even do it when he was already on his 2nd DC.

Carr Bombed
10-10-2011, 01:21 PM
When are some of you ever gonna get it through your ********* heads that Cowher is never gonna be the next head coach?

They lose, and senseless pipedreams just goes flying everywhere.

Some of you flat out don't deserve a winning football team.

WTF are you talking about with this "we don't deserve a winning football team" nonsense? How about you freaking give us one first and then we'll decide for ourselves if we deserve one or not. :mcnugget:

I do however know something we "don't deserve" though....and that's the crap that we've consistently have had to put up with over the last decade with this team.

thunderkyss
10-10-2011, 01:40 PM
The way the NFL is structured now, it takes three, maybe four, years to re-build a team. And if a team is REALLY bad, I'll give them a longer leash, and say four, maybe five years.

Meanwhile, we wait.

I don't know if we can truly say that. There are too many teams with a decade worth of suck that says different. The 49ers, the Lions, the Bills look good right now, but the season isn't over just yet. Those teams have been at the bottom of the NFL for decades. New Coaches, new QBs, new GMs, you name it.

Once you get to the bottom it's difficult to get back up. Changing coaches out (imo) only makes it more difficult. You have to hope the guy before you was doing the right things (Mike Singletary in San Francisco for instance). W-Ls are everything but when you're at the bottom of the league & been there for a while, you've got to change the mindsets of the organization & that's not an easy task.

I honestly have no idea how long it takes.

houstonspartan
10-10-2011, 01:42 PM
I don't know if we can truly say that. There are too many teams with a decade worth of suck that says different. The 49ers, the Lions, the Bills look good right now, but the season isn't over just yet. Those teams have been at the bottom of the NFL for decades. New Coaches, new QBs, new GMs, you name it.

Once you get to the bottom it's difficult to get back up. Changing coaches out (imo) only makes it more difficult. You have to hope the guy before you was doing the right things (Mike Singletary in San Francisco for instance). W-Ls are everything but when you're at the bottom of the league & been there for a while, you've got to change the mindsets of the organization & that's not an easy task.

I honestly have no idea how long it takes.

Are you drunk?

thunderkyss
10-10-2011, 01:43 PM
It's called Aggie football.....have you watched them play at all. Gary Kubiak is a "aggie man" and he coaches like one too. :toropalm: However the dumbest thing he did yesterday was challenge that Joel Dreessen catch.. I was begging him not to throw that flag and as soon as I saw the red flag come out, I started cursing at my T.V. Nobody pisses away timeouts better than Gary "I couldn't manage a clock if my life depended on it" Kubiak. That play had 0 chance of getting overturned and the only thing he was doing there was pissing away a crucial second half timeout....which might've cost us the game.

It sounded as if everyone in the stands wanted him to throw that flag. I can't knock him for throwing it. I have no idea what the guys in the booth, looking at the replays are telling him. At the very least, he should be tearing those guys a new A-hole this morning.

But it looked like Dressen caught the ball. Even the replays they showed at Reliant.. it looked like a catch. Dressen acted as if he caught it sure as hell. After seeing it on TV last night, I can see where you're coming from.

Naiirb
10-10-2011, 01:43 PM
Hypothetically lets say Kubiak gets canned after the season is over and McNair dosen't hand the reigns over the Wade and hires a new coach. Does Wade stay as the DC?

thunderkyss
10-10-2011, 01:45 PM
Are you drunk?

maybe....

:kitten:

Texecutioner
10-10-2011, 01:48 PM
I don't know if we can truly say that. There are too many teams with a decade worth of suck that says different. The 49ers, the Lions, the Bills look good right now, but the season isn't over just yet. Those teams have been at the bottom of the NFL for decades. New Coaches, new QBs, new GMs, you name it.

Once you get to the bottom it's difficult to get back up. Changing coaches out (imo) only makes it more difficult. You have to hope the guy before you was doing the right things (Mike Singletary in San Francisco for instance). W-Ls are everything but when you're at the bottom of the league & been there for a while, you've got to change the mindsets of the organization & that's not an easy task.

I honestly have no idea how long it takes.


The Bills have been down for a good while because they've had a horrible owner that's been very cheap that held onto Dick Jauron for to long which is similar to what we've done with Kubes. Plus, the Bills haven't been able to find a good QB since Kelly left there and when you don't have a good QB, that makes a big difference in what your franchise can do. Ralph Wilson has been a really bad owner though.

In San Fran they've built some pretty good teams, but again their QB situation is the only thing that's held them back. The last time they had one in Garcia they made a few trips to the post season.

The Lions were awful under Matt Millen and keeping him as the GM for far to long held them back and just like these other teams they never could find that strong QB that could be consistent.

The key factor and common denominator in all of these teams situations has been a lack of a good QB and poor management. That's exactly why I'm not so quick to throw Schaub to the wind like so many others who are mad over this loss, because it could take years to find another guy that's a winner and you never know how long or how many guys you'll have to run through at the QB position to finally find that guy. The 49ers are still being held back by that right now.

Carr Bombed
10-10-2011, 01:53 PM
It sounded as if everyone in the stands wanted him to throw that flag. I can't knock him for throwing it. I have no idea what the guys in the booth, looking at the replays are telling him. At the very least, he should be tearing those guys a new A-hole this morning.

But it looked like Dressen caught the ball. Even the replays they showed at Reliant.. it looked like a catch. Dressen acted as if he caught it sure as hell. After seeing it on TV last night, I can see where you're coming from.

There was absolutely NO reason for that flag to come out. The call on the field was a incomplete catch. In no way shape of form was there ever a angle or shot that showed any remote or conclusive evidence that would've reversed the call on the field. As the head coach he's the one with the final say and his average of success at challenging plays is only 50%. If I'm wrong half the time at my job, I get fired. The T.V. replay always show the best shots..it's their job to get the best shots up there for replay purposes. There was no other shot that looked like he cleanly caught that ball which is what it would've taken to overturn that call and if you recall they didn't say "the play stands"...they said "the play is confirmed". It was a stupid decision, but one of many that we've seen from that man.

bo orlando
10-10-2011, 01:53 PM
& just where the heck are the Detroit Lions?

Media Darlings? Is that what you want?

They were 6-10 last season. 6 & 10...

We don't get credit for beating the Colts or Miami, but we put the Lions on a pedestal because they beat Tampa Bay (3-2), Kansas City (2-3), Minnesota (1-4), & Dallas (2-2)?

I'm not buying it. That's just haterade.

& they damn sure didn't play 4 full quarters against the Cowboys.


Lions are a young team that seem on the verge of exploding into a dominating one either this year or next. Texans have been that "it" young team before, but the long run of mediocrity has correctly geared perception toward "we'll believe it when we see it." Lions will be that way too if they put up a couple of 8-8's.

thunderkyss
10-10-2011, 01:54 PM
The key factor and common denominator in all of these teams situations has been a lack of a good QB and poor management. That's exactly why I'm not so quick to throw Schaub to the wind like so many others who are mad over this loss, because it could take years to find another guy that's a winner and you never know how long or how many guys you'll have to run through at the QB position to finally find that guy. The 49ers are still being held back by that right now.

As difficult as it is to find a good QB, Kubiak struck gold on his second? I find that hard to believe. We lose Kubiak, I think we may as well lose Schaub. Schaub works because of Kubiak, just like Plummer & Griese.....

You put a "special" QB on this team & you'll get Elway/Montana like performance. Matt Schaub (imo) is like Gary Anderson, or even Ben Tate in Kubiak's offense. They aren't TD, Arian Foster, Clinton Portis.... if that makes any sense.

Texecutioner
10-10-2011, 01:58 PM
As difficult as it is to find a good QB, Kubiak struck gold on his second? I find that hard to believe. We lose Kubiak, I think we may as well lose Schaub. Schaub works because of Kubiak, just like Plummer & Griese.....

You put a "special" QB on this team & you'll get Elway/Montana like performance. Matt Schaub (imo) is like Gary Anderson, or even Ben Tate in Kubiak's offense. They aren't TD, Arian Foster, Clinton Portis.... if that makes any sense.

How do we lose Schaub if he is under contract?? We don't lose Schaub at all unless another guy comes in and doesn't believe in Schaub. Most HC would come in and work with Schaub over the latter any day of the week. You guys need to get over this fear of all these things that could happen with a new coaching regime. Kubiak has never proven that he can build a winner, so at least we have seen what he can do already and what he is capable of. With a new regime they couldn't do any worse than 6-10. I'd say that chances are that we'd get an improvement.

Marcus
10-10-2011, 02:19 PM
WTF are you talking about with this "we don't deserve a winning football team" nonsense? How about you freaking give us one first and then we'll decide for ourselves if we deserve one or not. :mcnugget:

I do however know something we "don't deserve" though....and that's the crap that we've consistently have had to put up with over the last decade with this team.

Sorry if I hurt your little feelings, but I'm just calling it as I see it. And the way I see it, you don't deserve a winning football team if you don't really know much about how the game is played.

You're using the loss yesterday as an excuse (which, sadly, is typical) to go running off on another little Kubiak haterade campaign, just because McNair wouldn't give you what you wanted.

It doesn't matter how they lost . . . OK, I get that. Kubiak's in charge. But don't go dreaming up some cockamamie bullshit, like there was conservative playcalling, when there wasn't any, or that there were "bad" play calls when there wasn't any. But turn right around, and ignore the reasons why there was poor execution, where anyone but moron could clearly see why . . . that the Oline got manhandled up front.

But either way, either you're blind as to what really went on, or you just don't want to see, but . . .

thunderkyss
10-10-2011, 02:19 PM
How do we lose Schaub if he is under contract?? We don't lose Schaub at all unless another guy comes in and doesn't believe in Schaub. Most HC would come in and work with Schaub over the latter any day of the week. You guys need to get over this fear of all these things that could happen with a new coaching regime. Kubiak has never proven that he can build a winner, so at least we have seen what he can do already and what he is capable of. With a new regime they couldn't do any worse than 6-10. I'd say that chances are that we'd get an improvement.

It's his system. Schaub is good in this system. Any other system out there makes him ad lib more on his own.... Matt's not going to be throwing for 4000 yards outside of this system, he's not going to have a high completion percentage or QB rating... it's the system man..

2009, I thought different. I thought he was special & made more things happen. I haven't seen that in a while. I saw a flash or two..... that seem pass to Walter out of the end zone, that big play to Dressen to get us to the 5 yard line, that pass to Casey for the TD against New Orleans.... but too far & in between.

I've got no love for Kubiak left. But that TD to the wide open Dressen.... Kubiak. The TD to Walter.... Kubiak. That OL that Ben Tate & Arian Foster takes advantage of.. Kubiak (not saying those guys aren't special.... Arian more so than Tate).. for the most part, we've got a garage sale offense that runs on Kubiak.

I'm not against trying something different right now, just saying I don't know that Schaub is what we need without Kubiak.

Texecutioner
10-10-2011, 02:26 PM
It's his system. Schaub is good in this system. Any other system out there makes him ad lib more on his own.... Matt's not going to be throwing for 4000 yards outside of this system, he's not going to have a high completion percentage or QB rating... it's the system man..

2009, I thought different. I thought he was special & made more things happen. I haven't seen that in a while. I saw a flash or two..... that seem pass to Walter out of the end zone, that big play to Dressen to get us to the 5 yard line, that pass to Casey for the TD against New Orleans.... but too far & in between.

I've got no love for Kubiak left. But that TD to the wide open Dressen.... Kubiak. The TD to Walter.... Kubiak. That OL that Ben Tate & Arian Foster takes advantage of.. Kubiak (not saying those guys aren't special.... Arian more so than Tate).. for the most part, we've got a garage sale offense that runs on Kubiak.

I'm not against trying something different right now, just saying I don't know that Schaub is what we need without Kubiak.

I don't think that you can say that Schaub could only be successful with Kubiak. Kubiak isn't the only offensive minded coach around the league. Schaub was tossing the ball around and having success in ATL way before he ever got here. Schaub has proven that he can play, but he doesn't have any ceiling that's higher than he already has hit at this point. He needs to be on a team with a strong running game and a good defense which is what we have now. Vickers makes that play and we're sitting here at 4-1 right now and no one is bitching.

Double Barrel
10-10-2011, 02:28 PM
WTF are you talking about with this "we don't deserve a winning football team" nonsense? How about you freaking give us one first and then we'll decide for ourselves if we deserve one or not. :mcnugget:

I do however know something we "don't deserve" though....and that's the crap that we've consistently have had to put up with over the last decade with this team.

You just had to take the bait, didn't you? :fishing:

thunderkyss
10-10-2011, 02:32 PM
Vickers makes that play and we're sitting here at 4-1 right now and no one is bitching.

Several people have been picking on Schaub for years. Not me per se... I usually only get involved in the "is Schaub elite" threads.

But there are people out there telling you like it is.

If Schaub puts that ball in front of Vickers, we wouldn't be having this conversation, but i think we'd still be having a Schaub conversation.

Texecutioner
10-10-2011, 02:59 PM
Several people have been picking on Schaub for years. Not me per se... I usually only get involved in the "is Schaub elite" threads.

But there are people out there telling you like it is.

If Schaub puts that ball in front of Vickers, we wouldn't be having this conversation, but i think we'd still be having a Schaub conversation.

He made the pass good enough to catch it. Hell, Schaub's passes are easy to catch because there isn't any velocity on the ball. It was a freaking lob that he dropped. It may not have been perfectly right in front of him, but it was a very catchable ball. He catches that and we end up winning that game. And like I said we'd be 4-1 right now and people are cheering and beating their chests instead of wanting Schaub released.

thunderkyss
10-10-2011, 03:06 PM
He made the pass good enough to catch it. Hell, Schaub's passes are easy to catch because there isn't any velocity on the ball. It was a freaking lob that he dropped. It may not have been perfectly right in front of him, but it was a very catchable ball. He catches that and we end up winning that game. And like I said we'd be 4-1 right now and people are cheering and beating their chests instead of wanting Schaub released.

I disagree. Some people just don't like Schaub & we'd be talking about the wonderful job the defense did to keep us in the game.


When they shouldn't have had to.

Our "elite" offense (416 passing yards!!!) this game shouldn't have been close.

Heck, I'd have started the thread myself if I didn't see one.

Marcus
10-10-2011, 03:08 PM
deleted

Ckw
10-10-2011, 03:42 PM
Sorry if I hurt your little feelings, but I'm just calling it as I see it. And the way I see it, you don't deserve a winning football team if you don't really know much about how the game is played.

You're using the loss yesterday as an excuse (which, sadly, is typical) to go running off on another little Kubiak haterade campaign, just because McNair wouldn't give you what you wanted.

It doesn't matter how they lost . . . OK, I get that. Kubiak's in charge. But don't go dreaming up some cockamamie bullshit, like there was conservative playcalling, when there wasn't any, or that there were "bad" play calls when there wasn't any. But turn right around, and ignore the reasons why there was poor execution, where anyone but moron could clearly see why . . . that the Oline got manhandled up front.

But either way, either you're blind as to what really went on, or you just don't want to see, but . . .

I swear there is not one poster on here as arrogant and as much of a prick as you are. Telling people they don't deserve a winning football team? Saying people don't understand football (as if you do) and don't deserve a winner because of it? If you took your mouth off Kubiak's pecker for just a minute, you'd see that the problems this franchise has been plagued with have been a problem ever since Kubiak got here. Players have changed, assistant coaches have changed, but the problems remain. What's the common denominator? Your boyfriend.

Maybe yesterday wasn't all Kubiak's fault, but there have been plenty of games that have been. And the problem we have had of choking away games in the second half is a Kubiak problem.

Carr Bombed
10-10-2011, 03:50 PM
Sorry if I hurt your little feelings, but I'm just calling it as I see it. And the way I see it, you don't deserve a winning football team if you don't really know much about how the game is played.

You're using the loss yesterday as an excuse (which, sadly, is typical) to go running off on another little Kubiak haterade campaign, just because McNair wouldn't give you what you wanted.

It doesn't matter how they lost . . . OK, I get that. Kubiak's in charge. But don't go dreaming up some cockamamie bullshit, like there was conservative playcalling, when there wasn't any, or that there were "bad" play calls when there wasn't any. But turn right around, and ignore the reasons why there was poor execution, where anyone but moron could clearly see why . . . that the Oline got manhandled up front.

But either way, either you're blind as to what really went on, or you just don't want to see, but . . .

LMAO... :) :toropalm:

coming from someone else, normally a post like this might hurt my feelings, but when it comes from someone like you, it just makes me laugh. Which is usually what you're good for around here...just a good laugh. Mainly, because unlike what you're accusing other people of.. you not only don't have a clue of how the game is played, but you also don't have a clue of anything that you talk about. You're comcical...like our local jester or village i....

LMAO, please tell me where I ever said anything about Kubiak's "conservative playcalling" in this thread? I mean seriously, talk about "dreaming up some cockamamie bullshit". What a moron :laughjump:

EllisUnit
10-10-2011, 04:48 PM
Sorry if I hurt your little feelings, but I'm just calling it as I see it. And the way I see it, you don't deserve a winning football team if you don't really know much about how the game is played.

You're using the loss yesterday as an excuse (which, sadly, is typical) to go running off on another little Kubiak haterade campaign, just because McNair wouldn't give you what you wanted.

It doesn't matter how they lost . . . OK, I get that. Kubiak's in charge. But don't go dreaming up some cockamamie bullshit, like there was conservative playcalling, when there wasn't any, or that there were "bad" play calls when there wasn't any. But turn right around, and ignore the reasons why there was poor execution, where anyone but moron could clearly see why . . . that the Oline got manhandled up front.

But either way, either you're blind as to what really went on, or you just don't want to see, but . . .

SO i guess people with cancer dont deserve to be cured if the dont know how the treatments and therapies are actually performed. Yeah that makes A LOT OF SENSE :toropalm::toropalm:

Marcus
10-10-2011, 06:39 PM
:)

I fully understand I'm outnumbered 50-1 around here, but that makes no difference to me, because I think all this Kubiak bashing is totally irrational.

It was not Kubiak's fault that they lost yesterday. Funny how it took 24 hours before "some" of you started realizing that.

And because I disagree with the sentiment around here, I'm Kubiak's "boyfriend" or whatever.

Kubiak's demise . . . :blah::blah:

Lucky
10-10-2011, 06:48 PM
It was not Kubiak's fault that they lost yesterday.
When has it ever been Kubiak's fault, Marcus? No one is more consistent in defense of Kubiak than you. If you believe that he did an adequate job in preparing this team to win on Sunday, you're looking at a different game than I am.

This team is a rudderless ship. We finally have a leader on defense (Phillips), but that's not enough. Maybe, just maybe this team backs into a playoff spot in the weakest division in the AFC. But they will get there in spite of Gary Kubiak. Not because of him.

EllisUnit
10-10-2011, 07:13 PM
:)

I fully understand I'm outnumbered 50-1 around here, but that makes no difference to me, because I think all this Kubiak bashing is totally irrational.

It was not Kubiak's fault that they lost yesterday. Funny how it took 24 hours before "some" of you started realizing that.

And because I disagree with the sentiment around here, I'm Kubiak's "boyfriend" or whatever.

Kubiak's demise . . . :blah::blah:

Its not that you dont think any of the losses are kubiaks fault, its just how you talk to people. Like you know best and everyone else is just dumb as hell and is always wrong. Can you even juggle the thought of "thinking" about even one loss being Kubiaks ? ASK anyone here i have ALWAYS supported kubiak and often times looked stupid when i did.

I still believe Kubiak can be a good head coach BUT he needs to make some personal changes and grow a pair. When i say Kubiaks demise i simply mean all these things will be the fall of his coaching career in houston IF he dont fix them.

Marcus
10-10-2011, 07:20 PM
When has it ever been Kubiak's fault, Marcus? No one is more consistent in defense of Kubiak than you. If you believe that he did an adequate job in preparing this team to win on Sunday, you're looking at a different game than I am.

This team is a rudderless ship. We finally have a leader on defense (Phillips), but that's not enough. Maybe, just maybe this team backs into a playoff spot in the weakest division in the AFC. But they will get there in spite of Gary Kubiak. Not because of him.

Explain to me how he didn't do an adequate in preparing this team to win, Lucky. I got the game on tape. Give me specifics, so I can go back to that part of the game, and see what it is that you're referring to.

Lucky
10-10-2011, 07:28 PM
Explain to me how he didn't do an adequate in preparing this team to win, Lucky. I got the game on tape. Give me specifics, so I can go back to that part of the game, and see what it is that you're referring to.
* No answer to what the Raider were doing up front to stop the run.

* No answer to clearing or creating passing lanes for Schaub to throw in.

* Another horrible job of clock management in the 4th quarter, allowing the offense to huddle on their 5 minute FG drive.

* Not instructing Schaub that he had to prepare for 2 plays at the end of the game.

I'm not even getting into the special teams blunders. We know he's not responsible for that, right? Accomplish any of the 4 items above, and the Texans likely win against an inferior opponent at home (by the skin of their teeth). But he doesn't. The Texans failed. And your boy Kubiak failed. Again.

EllisUnit
10-10-2011, 07:34 PM
* No answer to what the Raider were doing up front to stop the run.

* No answer to clearing or creating passing lanes for Schaub to throw in.

* Another horrible job of clock management in the 4th quarter, allowing the offense to huddle on their 5 minute FG drive.

* Not instructing Schaub that he had to prepare for 2 plays at the end of the game.

I'm not even getting into the special teams blunders. We know he's not responsible for that, right? Accomplish any of the 4 items above, and the Texans likely win against an inferior opponent at home (by the skin of their teeth). But he doesn't. The Texans failed. And your boy Kubiak failed. Again.

Not kicking a FG when we have it on the opponents 37 yard line :toropalm: and punting instead. Good call, NOT

Dishman
10-10-2011, 07:52 PM
Kubiak's defense has always been "Well, he took over a terrible team and had to re-build. They were 2-14."

Fine, but, it doesn't get much worse than 0-16, folks. The Lions were TERRIBLE a few years ago.

The way the NFL is structured now, it takes three, maybe four, years to re-build a team. And if a team is REALLY bad, I'll give them a longer leash, and say four, maybe five years.

Technically, the Lions shouldn't be as good as their are. But, they are.

Meanwhile, we wait.

Even worse, we took their castoff craptastic in as our own backup and he manages to stick around for more than 1 season at a suspect salary.

ObsiWan
10-10-2011, 07:56 PM
Cowher in 2012.. make it happen..

We already have the defense he wanted ...

One thing though ... he's on the HOF ballot for this year. They don't get voted in if there's a chance they could still coach.

Wonder what's more important to him? A yellow jacket or another ring?

He's got a "all world legacy" with the Steelers; why would he come out of retirement to risk that?

He won't come here. You're hitching your wagon to the wrong star.

thunderkyss
10-10-2011, 08:09 PM
* No answer to what the Raider were doing up front to stop the run.

The Raiders had no answer either. They won the game, so obviously this "answer" isn't really all that important.

* No answer to clearing or creating passing lanes for Schaub to throw in.

I thought he finished with 416 yards. Did he do that in a bubble?

* Another horrible job of clock management in the 4th quarter, allowing the offense to huddle on their 5 minute FG drive.

They huddled?!! :gasp:

* Not instructing Schaub that he had to prepare for 2 plays at the end of the game.

How do we know he didn't send two plays in? How do we know those weren't his exact instructions?

I'm not even getting into the special teams blunders. We know he's not responsible for that, right? Accomplish any of the 4 items above, and the Texans likely win against an inferior opponent at home (by the skin of their teeth). But he doesn't. The Texans failed. And your boy Kubiak failed. Again.

I think Kubiak screwed up by not planning on taking advantage of their 4th string CB..... we should have beat that drum all day long.

We're in week five & the true blocking fullback has seen the field what... 5 times? We run the clock out against the Colts, Miami, & Pittsburgh & we can't get Vickers on the field until that play is called?

I Blame Kubiak for not figuring out why Matt struggles to get started... this goes back to last year.

Rolando McClain was in & out of the game, was there no way for us to take advantage of that?

4th & 2 on their 37 after they've shown no ability to move the ball whatsover..... we don't go for the field goal.. we don't go for it.. we punt?????? What I'd have much rather seen a fake punt there.

We finish the 1st half with 42 yards on 12 carries. How in the hell you going to come out in the second half.... run, run, pass.... really??

Dressen/Daniels had an excellent first half.... what happened to them in the second?

None of those speak to the Texans' preparedness for the game, I think they were prepared... they just didn't adjust.

ObsiWan
10-10-2011, 08:40 PM
Not kicking a FG when we have it on the opponents 37 yard line :toropalm: and punting instead. Good call, NOT

That would have been a 55-56 yd FG. Do you really think that Rackers is dependable from that far out? I don't really think so.

Texan_Bill
10-10-2011, 08:57 PM
LMFAO!!! @ all the "doom and gloom""!!! Some of y'all should do yourselves a favor and refrain from posting for a minimum of 24 hours after a game...



LOVE IT!!! !!! :gamer:

gary
10-10-2011, 09:16 PM
Kubiak supporters, if the Texans finish 8-8 or worse would he still have support with all of you?

Lucky
10-10-2011, 09:34 PM
I thought he finished with 416 yards. Did he do that in a bubble?
That shows how meaningless yards passing has become in the NFL. Schaub threw passes in the game, completing less than 50%. I can't believe anyone who actually watched the game would believe the passing game was on. The seven tipped passes (yes, 7) were costly. One, turned into 3 points for the Raiders.

thunderkyss
10-10-2011, 09:44 PM
That shows how meaningless yards passing has become in the NFL. Schaub threw passes in the game, completing less than 50%. I can't believe anyone who actually watched the game would believe the passing game was on. The seven tipped passes (yes, 7) were costly. One, turned into 3 points for the Raiders.

You said Kubiak couldn't figure out how to open up the passing lanes.

The man threw for 416 yards.

There were 7 tipped passes, but he found a way to open up at least a few lanes for 416 yards. 116 for Foster, I'll give you those & say they were all behind the LOS, that still leaves 300 yards where lanes were open enough for throwing.

TheMatrix31
10-10-2011, 10:41 PM
All the Texans fans bitching about Kubiak and upper management should take a look at tonight's Bears game, Lovie Smith, and Jerry Angelo.

Yeesh.

And, just like it's a union card check or something, let it be known that I'm not very much a Kubiak supporter anymore. But just because I don't care for his game management doesn't mean I'm going to blame every single little thing on him no matter what.

Hervoyel
10-10-2011, 10:48 PM
:)

I fully understand I'm outnumbered 50-1 around here, but that makes no difference to me, because I think all this Kubiak bashing is totally irrational.

It was not Kubiak's fault that they lost yesterday. Funny how it took 24 hours before "some" of you started realizing that.

And because I disagree with the sentiment around here, I'm Kubiak's "boyfriend" or whatever.

Kubiak's demise . . . :blah::blah:

To be honest, I'm pretty sure you get off on it.

It's Kubiak's fault that "they are what they are". He's been the head coach for 6 years. Everything you see out there comes from Gary Kubiak to one degree or another. He's perpetually five games short of .500 and can't explain why things didn't work today..... and he never will.

Texecutioner
10-10-2011, 10:48 PM
All the Texans fans bitching about Kubiak and upper management should take a look at tonight's Bears game, Lovie Smith, and Jerry Angelo.

Yeesh.

And, just like it's a union card check or something, let it be known that I'm not very much a Kubiak supporter anymore. But just because I don't care for his game management doesn't mean I'm going to blame every single little thing on him no matter what.

Are you honestly using a HC that just came off of an NFC championship game and has been to a SB before as some sort of example to suggest that the Kubiak regime hasn't been that bad?? Really??

How about looking at the other team that is playing tonight which is the Detroit Lions who are another team that have turned around faster than we have and this time it's the Lions. The Lions. The Lions. I'll say it one more time. The Lions. :shades:

TheMatrix31
10-10-2011, 10:52 PM
I knew that was going to be the response.

I shouldn't have said anything.

I willingly banned myself from the political forum. Might just ban myself from the football forum outside of gamethreads.

In-sufferable.

bo orlando
10-10-2011, 11:02 PM
* No answer to what the Raider were doing up front to stop the run.

* No answer to clearing or creating passing lanes for Schaub to throw in.

* Another horrible job of clock management in the 4th quarter, allowing the offense to huddle on their 5 minute FG drive.

* Not instructing Schaub that he had to prepare for 2 plays at the end of the game.

I'm not even getting into the special teams blunders. We know he's not responsible for that, right? Accomplish any of the 4 items above, and the Texans likely win against an inferior opponent at home (by the skin of their teeth). But he doesn't. The Texans failed. And your boy Kubiak failed. Again.

Raiders were loading up to stop the run, so Kubiak started going to lots of play-action and bootlegs. Raiders stayed disciplined, blowing up several bootlegs, and Texans had trouble blocking the D-line, resulting in lots of hurries and tipped passes. Raiders covered the tight ends close, and seemed to have a man tight on Foster every time he split the pocket. Receivers seemed open, but Jacoby ran terrible routes and the other ones just aren't very good.

Sometimes you just lose. It doesn't always have to be somebody's "fault."

Bull Pen 1
10-10-2011, 11:10 PM
So was it his fault when we executed in three wins this year? I'm not absolving him of blame. His playcalling was terrible today. But it was a shortened playbook, since the best WR in football was out. I know, I know, it's Kubiak's and management's fault for no offensive depth.

Look at the Texans in weeks 5-8 for the last 2 years. 0-4 each of those years.

Texecutioner
10-11-2011, 12:08 AM
I knew that was going to be the response.

I shouldn't have said anything.

I willingly banned myself from the political forum. Might just ban myself from the football forum outside of gamethreads.

In-sufferable.

Which ought to have told you that it wasn't an intelligent thing to use as an example to defend this current regime that continues to pale in mediocrity. Lovie Smith has gone deep in the playoffs at least twice and been there several times now including last season where they weren't all that good, but found a way to over achieve and go further than they should have. I don't think the Texans will be as bad as many are suggesting right now, but it really doesn't matter to me what they do. The last 5 years were evidence enough to know that Kubiak will always give us reasons to question his leadership.

Lucky
10-11-2011, 12:15 AM
Sometimes you just lose.
Sometimes. Usually about 8 times a season under Kubiak.

houstonspartan
10-11-2011, 12:17 AM
I knew that was going to be the response.

I shouldn't have said anything.

I willingly banned myself from the political forum. Might just ban myself from the football forum outside of gamethreads.

In-sufferable.

The minute you compared Gary Kubiak to a coach that has been to the Super Bowl you pretty much shit and stepped your foot in it.

Lucky
10-11-2011, 12:32 AM
Look at the Texans in weeks 5-8 for the last 2 years. 0-4 each of those years.
Not exactly weeks 5-8, but you're right that the Texans have suffered a 4 game losing streak the past 3 years that wrecked the season. Are the Texans staring into the abyss of another 4 game losing streak? It's just as possible as those who see the Texans finishing 11-5/12-4.

noxiousdog
10-11-2011, 12:39 AM
(especially predictable in the second half with Kubiak teams)

Except last year?

noxiousdog
10-11-2011, 12:43 AM
How about looking at the other team that is playing tonight which is the Detroit Lions who are another team that have turned around faster than we have and this time it's the Lions. The Lions. The Lions. I'll say it one more time. The Lions. :shades:


It's still early, but they haven't turned it around faster. They hadn't won 7 games since 2000. And they are another Stafford injury from missing the playoffs again.

Dishman
10-11-2011, 06:38 AM
It's still early, but they haven't turned it around faster. They hadn't won 7 games since 2000. And they are another Stafford injury from missing the playoffs again.

When you consider that the Texans have yet to turn around at all, the, yes, the Lions are making us look pretty bad. We've had zero to be proud of for a decade.

Texan_Bill
10-11-2011, 07:26 AM
It's still early, but they haven't turned it around faster. They hadn't won 7 games since 2000. And they are another Stafford injury from missing the playoffs again.

42-107 (including this years 5-0 start) over the last 10 years.

Runner
10-11-2011, 07:38 AM
It's still early, but they haven't turned it around faster. They hadn't won 7 games since 2000. And they are another Stafford injury from missing the playoffs again.

If the Texans incrementally improve from 8-8 to 8-8 it's time to celebrate. If the Texans go 9-7 it's a fantastic accomplishment. Texans fans remember where they were the first time the team won three in a row.

If another perennial loser goes 5-0 and looks good doing it, it's nothing.

Taking the Texan colored glasses off and looking around the league might be an informative experience. It certainly might lead to less myopic discussions around here.

silvrhand
10-11-2011, 08:29 AM
Go back and look at how MANY QBS and COACHES who were terrible that have won super bowls. And why because of defense. They are competent enough to win us a Superbowl, they just arent good enough to do it alone.

Kubiak played his entire career for the Broncos as a backup for Elway

So if you are a NFL QB and you are backup for John Elway, do you just sit there ok with it or do you try to get traded to another team to make a start? Me, I'm looking to get traded cause I know that was the only way I would get a shot.

Sorry, again I think Gary is a great coordinator, not a great coach. He's still making huge mistakes that he shouldn't be making at this point in his career.

thunderkyss
10-11-2011, 09:37 AM
When you consider that the Texans have yet to turn around at all, the, yes, the Lions are making us look pretty bad. We've had zero to be proud of for a decade.

I guarantee you no one would be "proud" of the Texans if we beat

Tampa Bay
Kansas City
Minnesota
Dallas
Chicago

Those are quality wins for the Lions, but not for us. Each win would get picked apart for one reason or another.... We were down 24 points to the Cowboys in the first half... weren't prepared for the first half, and were one play away from losing.

Jamal Charles got hurt on the second carry of the game.

McNabb ain't what he used to be.

etc.. etc.. etc...

thunderkyss
10-11-2011, 09:53 AM
If the Texans incrementally improve from 8-8 to 8-8 it's time to celebrate. If the Texans go 9-7 it's a fantastic accomplishment. Texans fans remember where they were the first time the team won three in a row.

You got any pictures from this celebration? I think you guys go out of your way to misrepresent what actually happened there. Everyone here was happy the first time we went 8-8, we expected to be better, but it was what it was & yes, we accepted it. The freak'n Raiders go 8-8 for the first time in how long & they're allowed to celebrate, but we aren't.

The second time, we're still expecting better but it was what it was. Nothing to celebrate about, but nothing to pull your hair out over either.

9-7 was acknowledged as an accomplishment, something this franchise never did. You guys act like there was a parade down Kirby or champagne in the locker room. Were they excited in the locker room, yes & there should have been. For the first time, the season was over & we were still in the hunt. We needed help, but there was hope.



If another perennial loser goes 5-0 and looks good doing it, it's nothing.

Nobody cares how we look playing the Dolphins, the Steelers or the hapless Colts. Those wins are picked apart & excused as if they were no accomplishments at all.

Taking the Texan colored glasses off and looking around the league might be an informative experience. It certainly might lead to less myopic discussions around here.

I agree. We all hold the Texans to a higher standard with reason. But it goes both ways. Super Bowl winning coaches screw up, botch calls, screw the challenge & it's ok... it's understandable that they aren't perfect (I know Andy Reid hasn't won a Super Bowl, but let's put him in this group as well). We expect our coach to be perfect because he doesn't have any accomplishments. That just don't make sense.

The guys who have competed at a high level make mistakes... Kubiak has to be perfect.... just don't make sense.

Vinny
10-11-2011, 09:55 AM
I agree. We all hold the Texans to a higher standard with reason. But it goes both ways. Super Bowl winning coaches screw up, botch calls, screw the challenge & it's ok... it's understandable that they aren't perfect (I know Andy Reid hasn't won a Super Bowl, but let's put him in this group as well). We expect our coach to be perfect because he doesn't have any accomplishments. That just don't make sense.

The guys who have competed at a high level make mistakes... Kubiak has to be perfect.... just don't make sense. higher standard? Sure we hold him to a higher standard than mediocre. We don't need him to be perfect...we just don't want mediocre.

Runner
10-11-2011, 11:16 AM
I think you guys go out of your way to misrepresent what actually happened there.

...

You guys act like there was a parade down Kirby or champagne in the locker room.

TK says I misrepresent. With such an endorsement from an expert, I'm thinking of turning pro as a misrepresenter.


For the record, I was talking about the fans celebrating mediocrity. I have no doubt the players know they haven't accomplished much.

gary
10-11-2011, 11:22 AM
Don't these debates about Kubiak ever get tired some and old? Just let things be the way they are.

Vinny
10-11-2011, 11:25 AM
Don't these debates about Kubiak ever get tired some and old? Just let things be the way they are.
These debates will never end as long as Kubiak puts out a mediocre product. This is what 6 years of .500 looks like...

http://www.afk5min.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/06/treadmill-300x225.gif

Texecutioner
10-11-2011, 12:40 PM
Don't these debates about Kubiak ever get tired some and old? Just let things be the way they are.

So it shouldn't matter what this football team ever does?? We should all just accept who the current coach is no matter what the results are and just let them be what they are and be happy regardless of those results? Winning a SB is an important goal to some fans.

Double Barrel
10-11-2011, 12:48 PM
If the Texans incrementally improve from 8-8 to 8-8 it's time to celebrate. If the Texans go 9-7 it's a fantastic accomplishment. Texans fans remember where they were the first time the team won three in a row.

If another perennial loser goes 5-0 and looks good doing it, it's nothing.

Taking the Texan colored glasses off and looking around the league might be an informative experience. It certainly might lead to less myopic discussions around here.

Myopic is a word that should be in vogue these days. :thumbup

So it shouldn't matter what this football team ever does?? We should all just accept who the current coach is no matter what the results are and just let them be what they are and be happy regardless of those results? Winning a SB is an important goal to some fans.

C'mon, Tex, get with the program!

http://www.pitch.com/imager/studies-in-crap-sticks-up-for-the-care-bears-who-are-totally-not-satanic/b/original/2568925/42f1/CareBears_Star.jpg

gary
10-11-2011, 01:29 PM
So it shouldn't matter what this football team ever does?? We should all just accept who the current coach is no matter what the results are and just let them be what they are and be happy regardless of those results? Winning a SB is an important goal to some fans.Not at all. But, what am I going to do to change anything?

80tothezone
10-11-2011, 01:35 PM
So it shouldn't matter what this football team ever does?? We should all just accept who the current coach is no matter what the results are and just let them be what they are and be happy regardless of those results? Winning a SB is an important goal to some fans.

the results aren't in yet maybe week 12 if we go 5-7 again there is something to say but we a looooooong way from being 5-7 actually we 5 losses from it. Tough loss last week tough game this week but we still leading the devision and got lots of football to play.

Dishman
10-11-2011, 01:38 PM
I guarantee you no one would be "proud" of the Texans if we beat

Tampa Bay
Kansas City
Minnesota
Dallas
Chicago

Those are quality wins for the Lions, but not for us. Each win would get picked apart for one reason or another.... We were down 24 points to the Cowboys in the first half... weren't prepared for the first half, and were one play away from losing.

Jamal Charles got hurt on the second carry of the game.

McNabb ain't what he used to be.

etc.. etc.. etc...

You do realize that the Texans going 5-0 to start the season would be quite the accomplishment, right? We'd have to go on a 7 game losing streak to reach our traditional 12 game 5-7 start. The best the Texans have ever mustered were two 4 game winning streaks and it took them forever to get there. I'm really not sure how you, much less anyone else, can sit here and defend any bit of this organization. They've picked up some talent, but outside of a few players the franchise is riddled with incompetent goons from top to bottom. How else do you explain away the decade of absolute futility? At some point the Lions started cleaning house and you have to wonder if the Texans will ever do the same.

I worry that this team backs in to the playoffs with an 8-8 record or worse, gets punked in the first playoff game for the franchise, and the McNair immediately re-ups Kubiak's contract as if we've made any sort of progression. Even at 9-7 I would still consider the season a huge letdown based on all of the changes. There are injuries, but in reality injuries are a part of the game which every team deals with to some degree. How this team is positioned to step up and arise to the ocassion when injuries occur speaks to how the front office and coaching staff have prepared this team. I have no reason to believe this team won't fold up like a tent and close shop based on the attitudes up top.

Thorn
10-11-2011, 03:26 PM
Even without AJ and Mario this team should still be able to finish with a 10-6 record. Without AJ and Mario a good coach has enough talent on this team to get 10 wins given the state of our division and our remaining schedule.

The question at hand, is our head coach up to that?

DexmanC
10-11-2011, 03:30 PM
Even without AJ and Mario this team should still be able to finish with a 10-6 record. Without AJ and Mario a good coach has enough talent on this team to get 10 wins given the state of our division and our remaining schedule.

The question at hand, is our head coach up to that?

Would you kick Beyonce and Stacy Dash out of the bed for eating
potato chips?

Thorn
10-11-2011, 03:32 PM
Would you kick Beyonce and Stacy Dash out of the bed for eating
potato chips?

That's a loaded question there Dexman. At my age, if they are still breathing......

well, you know the answer to that. :lol:

DexmanC
10-11-2011, 03:39 PM
I guarantee you no one would be "proud" of the Texans if we beat

Tampa Bay
Kansas City
Minnesota
Dallas
Chicago

Those are quality wins for the Lions, but not for us. Each win would get picked apart for one reason or another.... We were down 24 points to the Cowboys in the first half... weren't prepared for the first half, and were one play away from losing.

Jamal Charles got hurt on the second carry of the game.

McNabb ain't what he used to be.


Those are quality wins for the Lions, because two of them
were division wins, and four were conference wins. So that's
5-0 overall, 2-0, in division and 4-0 on conference. I WISH
Kubiak could put up a ledger like that, but a young coordinator
who took over a squad worse than what Kubiak inherited,
has already accomplished more in 1.5 seasons than Kubiak
has in over 5 seasons. You've asked me to remain faithful in
a regime that has not presented any tangible success whatsoever.

Other teams are putting up wins. All Kubiak has to show is
5+ years of excuses.

thunderkyss
10-11-2011, 04:53 PM
Those are quality wins for the Lions, because two of them
were division wins, and four were conference wins. So that's
5-0 overall, 2-0, in division and 4-0 on conference. I WISH
Kubiak could put up a ledger like that, but a young coordinator
who took over a squad worse than what Kubiak inherited,
has already accomplished more in 1.5 seasons than Kubiak
has in over 5 seasons. You've asked me to remain faithful in
a regime that has not presented any tangible success whatsoever.

Other teams are putting up wins. All Kubiak has to show is
5+ years of excuses.

I've asked you no such thing, I don't have any faith in Kubiak or his regime. All I've ever asked is that you stop beating that incessant drum... & the point with that post, was nothing about Kubiak, it was about you. If the Texans had that same 5-0 record against those same teams you'd find some way to belittle it.

We beat the 0-5 Colts... doesn't make a shit to you that it was a division game.. none. The Colts aren't the same without Manning.... you just suck the joy out of that win... never mind that the Vikings is worse than the bad team they fielded last year.

That's a quality win for Detroit, so is the win against the 1-4 Chiefs..... we wouldn't be afforded half a second to enjoy that victory without you reminding us how worthless of a win that is...... that it's not a quality win.

What's the Lions W-L against winning teams on the road since 2002?

Look at the way they beat the Cowboys, they were dominated in that first half & Romo'd their way to a victory. If that was us, you'd be telling us how lucky we were.

Look, I don't give a shit about Gary Kubiak. All I want is to be able to enjoy a win when we win, sympathize with my fellow fans when we lose, & enjoy the freak'n season without reading the same drivel week in & week out.

Hervoyel
10-11-2011, 05:04 PM
I've asked you no such thing, I don't have any faith in Kubiak or his regime. All I've ever asked is that you stop beating that incessant drum... & the point with that post, was nothing about Kubiak, it was about you. If the Texans had that same 5-0 record against those same teams you'd find some way to belittle it.

We beat the 0-5 Colts... doesn't make a shit to you that it was a division game.. none. The Colts aren't the same without Manning.... you just suck the joy out of that win... never mind that the Vikings is worse than the bad team they fielded last year.

That's a quality win for Detroit, so is the win against the 1-4 Chiefs..... we wouldn't be afforded half a second to enjoy that victory without you reminding us how worthless of a win that is...... that it's not a quality win.

What's the Lions W-L against winning teams on the road since 2002?

Look at the way they beat the Cowboys, they were dominated in that first half & Romo'd their way to a victory. If that was us, you'd be telling us how lucky we were.

Look, I don't give a shit about Gary Kubiak. All I want is to be able to enjoy a win when we win, sympathize with my fellow fans when we lose, & enjoy the freak'n season without reading the same drivel week in & week out.

(emphasis mine). Without meaning to put anything at all between the lines here "Perhaps internet message boards are not for you?"

thunderkyss
10-11-2011, 05:12 PM
(emphasis mine). Without meaning to put anything at all between the lines here "Perhaps internet message boards are not for you?"

I'll have to look into that.

ObsiWan
10-12-2011, 07:58 PM
Are you honestly using a HC that just came off of an NFC championship game and has been to a SB before as some sort of example to suggest that the Kubiak regime hasn't been that bad?? Really??

How about looking at the other team that is playing tonight which is the Detroit Lions who are another team that have turned around faster than we have and this time it's the Lions. The Lions. The Lions. I'll say it one more time. The Lions. :shades:

When did you decide to start your clock, yesterday?

How about we go back five years during which time they totally sucked.
take a look at what kind of picks they had during the last five years....

2011 (5-0 ...so far) - One 1st and Two 2nd rd picks
2010 (6-10) - TWO 1st rd picks (Ndamukong Suh and Jahvid Best) and one 3rd (no 2nd rd pick)
2009 (2-14) - Two 1st rd picks (Matt Stafford & TE/Brandon Pettigrew); a 2nd (CB/Louis Delmas); and TWO 3rds.
2008 (0-16) - One 1st (G. Cherilus - I think this is when we got Duane Brown); a 2nd, and three 3rd round picks.
2007 (7-9) - One 1st (Megatron) and three 2nds (one was Drew Stanton)

Now that's TWENTY first day picks (or what used to be first day until they stretched the draft out for damned ratings)

Don't you think you could turn a team around with that many quality picks available to you. And once they got rid of Millen, they started drafting quality players with those picks (although Millen did draft Cherilus and Megatron so he didn't whiff on all his picks).

Twenty first day picks in five years. And I didn't count the second day picks where one might find an occasional steal.

Oh yeah, the Lions turned it around just this year.

EllisUnit
10-12-2011, 08:24 PM
Well to me it looks like Sith and Kubiak are very serious about keeping their jobs, When else have we added a free agent who could truly help us. Hell with Mason and AJ on the field together, this will easily be the most talented WR group we have ever had. Good for them