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View Full Version : Did Mario show up in the Stat sheet today?


4x4tx
09-25-2011, 03:36 PM
I didnt see him do diddly poo as jim mora would say. Other than smiths one sack there was virtually no pressure today.

ATXtexanfan
09-25-2011, 03:36 PM
I didnt see him do diddly poo as jim mora would say. Other than smiths one sack there was virtually no pressure today.

defense played well, red zone O lost it

VTexan
09-25-2011, 03:36 PM
Would have like to see Brooks Reed on the field some after seeing us struggle so much.

BullNation4Life
09-25-2011, 03:38 PM
I didnt see him do diddly poo as jim mora would say. Other than smiths one sack there was virtually no pressure today.

2 sacks and QB pressure that caused 2 ints..... What game were you watching?

Maddict5
09-25-2011, 03:39 PM
defense played well, red zone O lost it

ya swell.... 30 pts in second half/ 23 pts in 4th q. enough blame to go around to both sides today

Would have like to see Brooks Reed on the field some after seeing us struggle so much.

ummm.... you did

dinkatoid
09-25-2011, 03:40 PM
Reed was on the field a decent amount after the mario injury - He really didn't do much either...

4x4tx
09-25-2011, 03:48 PM
2 sacks and QB pressure that caused 2 ints..... What game were you watching?


Brees ints were not the result of pressure there buddy, one looked like the TE ran the wrong route and the other joseph made a good play on. The only time I saw mario do anything was on his knees and after someone else got to the QB he showed up a few secs late as usual. I dont think he had a tackle.


Who said the Defense played well? wtf were you watching...the D got torched. In the first half the saints had two drops on 3rd down that saved our @ss. We got picked apart because there was very little pressure. Blitzes were picked up and eaten alive with short passes over the middle. Brees got hit hard maybe twice.

BattleRedToro
09-25-2011, 03:56 PM
I would say quick slant routes were killing the Texans, today.

Surreal McCoy
09-25-2011, 04:11 PM
defense played well, red zone O lost it


Wow. Just, wow is all I can say...

The Cush
09-25-2011, 04:16 PM
The Saints have an elite O-line littered with pro-bowlers. It was tough getting to Brees

CretorFrigg
09-25-2011, 04:19 PM
Our D-line, most of the game, coudn't get to Brees. He had all the time in the world to throw. Their O-line, for the most part, won their individual match-ups.

I'm surprised Wade didn't take a gamble and throw in some creative blitzes. It felt like we were playing quite conservatively when it came to defense. But then again, there were many times when Brees was going to be sacked, but his instinct and quick reaction converted those into positive plays.

Hervoyel
09-25-2011, 04:23 PM
defense played well, red zone O lost it

Gave up 40 points and 454 yards. I define "played well" a little differently.

They had their moments (interceptions and some great stops) and the offense clearly hurt us by not scoring TD's when they had the chance BUT... I'd call this more of a complete team effort than a failure of just one side of the ball.

If the offense scores TD's and puts the Saints in a deeper hole then Wade's defense has an easier time defending as New Orleans is forced to abandon most of its running game.

It will get better.

digitalswim
09-25-2011, 04:24 PM
I didnt see him do diddly poo as jim mora would say. Other than smiths one sack there was virtually no pressure today.

He may not have shown up on the stat sheet but there was a noticeable drop in D-line pressure in the 2nd half when he was injured.

fiasco west
09-25-2011, 04:26 PM
He may not have shown up on the stat sheet but there was a noticeable drop in D-line pressure in the 2nd half when he was injured.

This.

I think the defense took a huge downturn when he got hurt even when he came back in. It didn't look like the same Mario to me.

gary
09-25-2011, 04:32 PM
They just did a good job on Mario but he was trying all game long.

utahmark
09-25-2011, 04:33 PM
This.

I think the defense took a huge downturn when he got hurt even when he came back in. It didn't look like the same Mario to me.

I'm not sure Mario going out had a lot to do with it. Saints are going to score. Our 4 man rush was'nt getting to him. When it did it was people other than Mario. Not a great game for him imo.

dalemurphy
09-25-2011, 04:44 PM
They just did a good job on Mario but he was trying all game long.

Mario had an utterly horrific game. He really sucked today. Watch the first Saints TD. The sweep by Sproles is sealed by a one on one block by Robert freakin' Meachem on Mario. It is one of the worst games I've seen from a player who has made a habit of disappointing performances since the 2008 season. Thank God for real playmakers like Antonio Smith and J.J. Watt.

digitalswim
09-25-2011, 04:46 PM
I'm not sure Mario going out had a lot to do with it. Saints are going to score. Our 4 man rush was'nt getting to him. When it did it was people other than Mario. Not a great game for him imo.

Yeah but its a team game. If one of your lineman (ie Mario) is requiring more attention, that frees up the other guys. Not saying he was a monster or anything but he creates match up problems our backups do not.

dalemurphy
09-25-2011, 04:56 PM
Yeah but its a team game. If one of your lineman (ie Mario) is requiring more attention, that frees up the other guys. Not saying he was a monster or anything but he creates match up problems our backups do not.

That's a nice thought, but it isn't true. Barwin has received more attention than Mario has. Part of that is because the coaching staff is determined to put him a position to make a play, keeping him on the weakside of the defense. However, that's also because he's not capable of dropping into coverage, so he needs to be on the side without the TE or slot WR. Regardless, he gets 1 on 1's all the time, and he usually loses the battles. Today was pathetic!

The Cush
09-25-2011, 05:14 PM
That's a nice thought, but it isn't true. Barwin has received more attention than Mario has. Part of that is because the coaching staff is determined to put him a position to make a play, keeping him on the weakside of the defense. However, that's also because he's not capable of dropping into coverage, so he needs to be on the side without the TE or slot WR. Regardless, he gets 1 on 1's all the time, and he usually loses the battles. Today was pathetic!

You will always hate Mario, where was your criticism weeks 1 and 2? He was getting doubled and chipped quite a bit today but the whole line failed to get pressure.

gary
09-25-2011, 05:15 PM
When I saw Mario he looked to be at least trying but I did not zone in on him on every play.

NitroGSXR
09-25-2011, 05:21 PM
Mario had an utterly horrific game. He really sucked today. Watch the first Saints TD. The sweep by Sproles is sealed by a one on one block by Robert freakin' Meachem on Mario. It is one of the worst games I've seen from a player who has made a habit of disappointing performances since the 2008 season. Thank God for real playmakers like Antonio Smith and J.J. Watt.

You truly have an agenda with Mario which is why I don't read your blog as often as others anymore. The loose message conveyed from it often is that... Mario can't do good no matter what. Mario was key last week and two weeks ago. He got beat today. That Saints offensive line just killed the entire defensive line all day and when one blew by, Brees was there to masterfully elude. Instead of ragging on Mario, I will give props to the Saints o-line. Both Watt and Smith struggled today. Blitzing the secondary would have been a dangerous consideration so I can somewhat understand the conservative defensive play-calling in general. Continue to hate on Mario though. I have players that I unreasonably hate on myself so I think its okay that you do the same.

Surreal McCoy
09-25-2011, 05:22 PM
Mario had an utterly horrific game. He really sucked today. Watch the first Saints TD. The sweep by Sproles is sealed by a one on one block by Robert freakin' Meachem on Mario. It is one of the worst games I've seen from a player who has made a habit of disappointing performances since the 2008 season. Thank God for real playmakers like Antonio Smith and J.J. Watt.

Finally some common sense. Don't worry, somone will be along shortly to claim Mario was double and triple teamed all game :clap:

The Cush
09-25-2011, 05:38 PM
That's a nice thought, but it isn't true. Barwin has received more attention than Mario has. Part of that is because the coaching staff is determined to put him a position to make a play, keeping him on the weakside of the defense. However, that's also because he's not capable of dropping into coverage, so he needs to be on the side without the TE or slot WR. Regardless, he gets 1 on 1's all the time, and he usually loses the battles. Today was pathetic!

You act like Meachem stands Mario up for a good 3 seconds when in reality he holds that block for not even a full second. Yea he get doesnt make the play but Sproles runs a sub 4.4, he turned that corner so fast I don't know who you think can just turn to his left, demolish the wide receiver in under .85 seconds and then tackle a guy that fast. I'm sure though if Mario has a good game next week we won't hear from you, not even a "good game Mario", just dead silence till another game like today when the whole front 7 was getting stone walled

digitalswim
09-25-2011, 06:47 PM
If you don't believe in Mario (which is totally fine by me), who do you suggest the Texans replace him with on the current squad? Who can do a better job? Brooks Reed? No way is he more effective (especially against the run). To me that is what this really boils down to. You go with the best you've got. It's not like we had the perfect roster for a change to 3-4.

dalemurphy
09-25-2011, 08:20 PM
If you don't believe in Mario (which is totally fine by me), who do you suggest the Texans replace him with on the current squad? Who can do a better job? Brooks Reed? No way is he more effective (especially against the run). To me that is what this really boils down to. You go with the best you've got. It's not like we had the perfect roster for a change to 3-4.

Look, I don't hate the guy. I was a defender of his from draft day in 2006 until about 6 weeks into last season. He has not been a consistent force since 2008. That is an unbiased statement. I agree that there are mitigating factors: injuries, poor defensive coaching. Still, I have seen him handled too often in one on one situations. He has not developed elite pass rushing moves, disappears from games to often, and can be a bit of a prima donna.

What really struck me last year is his lazy motor, relative to Antonio Smith. Board members ridiculed my argument last year that Antonio Smith was our best defensive player last year. They even argued that he had a better motor (who has the agenda?).

I don't want Mario cut. His salary/signing bonus prohibit that. Still, I will be grateful to get out from under his $14 million cap figure after this season and use that money more wisely. I would argue that he is the fifth most disruptive force on our front seven right now, behind: Antonio Smith, J.J. Watt, Brian Cushing, and Connor Barwin.

For those of you who assume Mario is being double teamed every time he doesn't make a play, you should go through the game and keep track of who gets more double teams between Barwin and Mario... It's Barwin by a significant amount, FYI. Check it out.

hradhak
09-25-2011, 08:29 PM
Teams seem to focus on Mario. I saw him get doubled more than a few times. The failure doesn't lie with him but with the entire D line. The saints have a great O line and something I didn't appreciate until I saw it today. Brees had a lot of time to throw and our secondary had a few times where they covered for several seconds but we weren't able to get a sack.

NitroGSXR
09-25-2011, 08:30 PM
I agree that Mario isnt being double teamed all that much but disagree sonewhat about Barwin. I have noticed the interior DL being doubled by far more than anyone else. JJ Watt, Smith, and yes... Shaun Cody.

dalemurphy
09-25-2011, 08:41 PM
You act like Meachem stands Mario up for a good 3 seconds when in reality he holds that block for not even a full second. Yea he get doesnt make the play but Sproles runs a sub 4.4, he turned that corner so fast I don't know who you think can just turn to his left, demolish the wide receiver in under .85 seconds and then tackle a guy that fast. I'm sure though if Mario has a good game next week we won't hear from you, not even a "good game Mario", just dead silence till another game like today when the whole front 7 was getting stone walled


I'm unrealistic?: Sproles is too fast and Meachem is too good a blocker to expect Mario to set the edge and prevent a 30yd TD run.. Okay, and I am the one with the agenda?

Mario was good in week one. Just a note though: Both sacks came in one on one matchups against Dallas Clark. Last week I thought he played okay... nothing special. Believe me, when he has a great game, I will be shouting it from the rooftops. I root for every Texan player. I prefer some over others and it usually comes down to things like effort and attitude.

hradhak
09-25-2011, 08:48 PM
I'm unrealistic?: Sproles is too fast and Meachem is too good a blocker to expect Mario to set the edge and prevent a 30yd TD run.. Okay, and I am the one with the agenda?

Mario was good in week one. Just a note though: Both sacks came in one on one matchups against Dallas Clark. Last week I thought he played okay... nothing special. Believe me, when he has a great game, I will be shouting it from the rooftops. I root for every Texan player. I prefer some over others and it usually comes down to things like effort and attitude.

Last week he tipped the pass that JoJo intercepted. I agree this was not his best game, however.

The Cush
09-25-2011, 09:03 PM
I'm unrealistic?: Sproles is too fast and Meachem is too good a blocker to expect Mario to set the edge and prevent a 30yd TD run.. Okay, and I am the one with the agenda?

Mario was good in week one. Just a note though: Both sacks came in one on one matchups against Dallas Clark. Last week I thought he played okay... nothing special. Believe me, when he has a great game, I will be shouting it from the rooftops. I root for every Texan player. I prefer some over others and it usually comes down to things like effort and attitude.

I've watched that play a million times and if you think Mario or any other linebacker for that matter can single handedly stop that play from where he is lined up then yes you are unrealistic. By the time Sproles controls the ball from the pitch he is already outside of Mario, not beyond Mario, but he is outside and it just takes a small block to get Sproles up the field. I point this out because you make it seem like Mario got manhandled by a receiver when in reality, Meachem was lined up wider to Mario's left and blocks him from the side, a block that Mario sheds in under a second. Maybe if Manning and Nolan don't run into each other while not even being blocked and make a tackle that would have been more like a 7 yard gain.

dalemurphy
09-25-2011, 09:19 PM
I've watched that play a million times and if you think Mario or any other linebacker for that matter can single handedly stop that play from where he is lined up then yes you are unrealistic. By the time Sproles controls the ball from the pitch he is already outside of Mario, not beyond Mario, but he is outside and it just takes a small block to get Sproles up the field. I point this out because you make it seem like Mario got manhandled by a receiver when in reality, Meachem was lined up wider to Mario's left and blocks him from the side, a block that Mario sheds in under a second. Maybe if Manning and Nolan don't run into each other while not even being blocked and make a tackle that would have been more like a 7 yard gain.


Yeah, Nolan didn't have a very good game either. He looked sloppy on a couple tackle attempts. Still, when one person consumes close to 15% of the cap space for a team (Mario), he may draw more attention for poor play than a backup safety whose salary is so insignificant it may not count anything against the cap.

According to you, if we just line up a slot WR on James Harrison's side next week and crackback block on him, we will make 7 yards a pop, even if the rest of the Steelers do their job? awesome.

gary
09-25-2011, 09:28 PM
Sproles is freaking fast and it does not take a huge block to get him going in the open field.

The Cush
09-25-2011, 09:31 PM
Yeah, Nolan didn't have a very good game either. He looked sloppy on a couple tackle attempts. Still, when one person consumes close to 15% of the cap space for a team (Mario), he may draw more attention for poor play than a backup safety whose salary is so insignificant it may not count anything against the cap.

According to you, if we just line up a slot WR on James Harrison's side next week and crackback block on him, we will make 7 yards a pop, even if the rest of the Steelers do their job? awesome.

I'm not really understanding the point you are trying to make. Sometimes an offensive play call trumps a defensive one. Its 3rd and 3 and we trot out 2 down linemen (Watt and Smith) and 3 linebackers, Mario and Barwin lined up on the outside and Cushing lined up to Barwins left on the LOS (over the Saints left side), and 6 defensive backs. The Saints have a wide receiver and a tight end lined up close to the right and call a sweep play to the right with a pulling guard. Now who do you think is going to win this one? Not only are we outnumbered on the right hand side but we have a defensive package out there catered to stopping the pass. And who on the Texans did their job on that play? Watt gets stone walled, Allen gets eaten up by the guard, Smith shoots straight up the field its too late for him, and Manning and Nolan run into each other while Cushing and Barwin have no chance due to where they were

Surreal McCoy
09-25-2011, 10:11 PM
For those of you who assume Mario is being double teamed every time he doesn't make a play, you should go through the game and keep track of who gets more double teams between Barwin and Mario... It's Barwin by a significant amount, FYI. Check it out.

I have just re-watched every defensive play until halfway into the 3rd Qtr. So far I have Mario being double-teamed zero times and chipped by a RB/TE three times. Note that I'm using a very liberal interpretation of the word 'chip' to include even barely grazing Mario in passing. Otherwise it's him against the OTs...and it's not pretty. There is also the time you mentioned when Meachem blocked him (not a cut block either) and another when Ingram blocked him, again, no cut.

Will chart the rest tomorrow.

The Cush
09-25-2011, 10:27 PM
I have just re-watched every defensive play until halfway into the 3rd Qtr. So far I have Mario being double-teamed zero times and chipped by a RB/TE three times. Note that I'm using a very liberal interpretation of the word 'chip' to include even barely grazing Mario in passing. Otherwise it's him against the OTs...and it's not pretty. There is also the time you mentioned when Meachem blocked him (not a cut block either) and another when Ingram blocked him, again, no cut.

Will chart the rest tomorrow.

Just from re-watching the Sproles toss sweep touchdown drive, he gets chipped on the first play by the RB then on the 4th or 5th play they use a two man blocking system where the TE doesn't chip him but actually holds his block then releases while the LT stands behind and picks up Mario after the release. Yes, he is not taking on two guys simultaneously but they were scheming to have multiple guys block him on a play.

Surreal McCoy
09-25-2011, 10:50 PM
Just from re-watching the Sproles toss sweep touchdown drive, he gets chipped on the first play by the RB then on the 4th or 5th play they use a two man blocking system where the TE doesn't chip him but actually holds his block then releases while the LT stands behind and picks up Mario after the release. Yes, he is not taking on two guys simultaneously but they were scheming to have multiple guys block him on a play.

Yes, he was "Chipped" twice on that drive (again, using the term very loosely as he's barely touched either time). He was not double-teamed in any way, shape, or form, and his play on the TD was beyond a joke. That said, I haven't finished charting the rest of the game.

The Cush
09-25-2011, 11:03 PM
Yes, he was "Chipped" twice on that drive (again, using the term very loosely as he's barely touched either time). He was not double-teamed in any way, shape, or form, and his play on the TD was beyond a joke. That said, I haven't finished charting the rest of the game.

Rewatching the game now and just got done with the 1st half, but not really sure what you are looking at.

1st Quarter. 2:17 3rd and 3. Mario takes on the TE with the RT circling right behind him focusing solely on Mario. Double Team
2nd Quarter 13:04 1 and 10. Ingram chips Mario, RG pulls and engages afterwards
2nd Quarter 11:50 1 and 10. TE slides over and puts on a full block then releases with the LT engaging Mario after the release. Saints schemed for multiple blockers
2nd Quarter 3:15 1 and 10. FB chips Mario
2nd Quarter 3:10 2 and 10. Mario is fully engaged with BOTH the RT and the RG

I'm also watching Barwin like dalemurphy suggested. He's straight 1 on 1 the whole time, not even a single chip or graze

Surreal McCoy
09-25-2011, 11:21 PM
Rewatching the game now and just got done with the 1st half, but not really sure what you are looking at.

1st Quarter. 2:17 3rd and 3. Mario takes on the TE with the RT circling right behind him focusing solely on Mario. Double Team
2nd Quarter 13:04 1 and 10. Ingram chips Mario, RG pulls and engages afterwards
2nd Quarter 11:50 1 and 10. TE slides over and puts on a full block then releases with the LT engaging Mario after the release. Saints schemed for multiple blockers
2nd Quarter 3:15 1 and 10. FB chips Mario
2nd Quarter 3:10 2 and 10. Mario is fully engaged with BOTH the RT and the RG

I'm also watching Barwin like dalemurphy suggested. He's straight 1 on 1 the whole time, not even a single chip or graze

LOL You are making it up now man. Sorry, but can't let you get away with that and not call it :p Mario is chipped (there's that word again) three times in the entire first half, otherwise he is straight up against a tackle each play and not contributing much at all.

EDIT: Straight up on the tackles except for the play where he lost contain after getting owned by a guy half his weight and size.

EllisUnit
09-25-2011, 11:24 PM
LOL You are making it up now man. Sorry, but can't let you get away with that and not call it :p Mario is chipped (there's that word again) three times in the entire first half, otherwise he is straight up against a tackle each play and not contributing much at all.

EDIT: Straight up on the tackles except for the play where he lost contain after getting owned by a guy half his weight and size.

ur telling me after his 50 sacks in his 6 seasons he is suddenly unable to handle 1 on 1 coverage ?

silvrhand
09-25-2011, 11:27 PM
Big Game, someone needed to step up, and Mario was nowhere to be seen again. /sigh

Doppelganger
09-25-2011, 11:28 PM
The Saints have an elite O-line littered with pro-bowlers. It was tough getting to Brees

That's the key. The Saints have one of the best if not the best o lines across the board. Bushrod, Evans, and Kreuz are perenial Pro bowlers and Nicks and Strief are solid to above average. Pair that with a quick release QB like Brees and there is little that can be done.

The Cush
09-25-2011, 11:28 PM
LOL You are making it up now man. Sorry, but can't let you get away with that and not call it :p Mario is chipped (there's that word again) three times in the entire first half, otherwise he is straight up against a tackle each play and not contributing much at all.

EDIT: Straight up on the tackles except for the play where he lost contain after getting owned by a guy half his weight and size.

Haha yea you got me! I was pulling all those plays out of my ass there was no double teams at all. Especially not on that play where hes being blocked by both the right tackle and the right guard that's just Mario being pancaked by Darren Sproles with 1 arm :vincepalm:

Surreal McCoy
09-25-2011, 11:29 PM
ur telling me after his 50 sacks in his 6 seasons he is suddenly unable to handle 1 on 1 coverage ?

I don't need to tell you anything, it's all on tape for everyone to see. And it's not ambiguous. I dont want him traded or benched or soemthing, just need his cap number to come in line with his production.

Surreal McCoy
09-25-2011, 11:31 PM
Haha yea you got me! I was pulling all those plays out of my ass there was no double teams at all. Especially not on that play where hes being blocked by both the right tackle and the right guard that's just Mario being pancaked by Darren Sproles with 1 arm :vincepalm:

You know for a fact if you re-watched the plays, as you said, that he wasn't double-teamed at all. That is unless you consider double-teams just having extra players on the field, which of course would explain why our D couldn't get any pressure on Brees because they were ALL being double-teamed

:vincepalm:

Dutchrudder
09-25-2011, 11:45 PM
I'm pretty sure Mario was pressuring Brees on the second INT. Don't have the game to rewatch, but someone else may be able to confirm.

NitroGSXR
09-26-2011, 12:24 AM
I don't need to tell you anything, it's all on tape for everyone to see. And it's not ambiguous. I dont want him traded or benched or soemthing, just need his cap number to come in line with his production.

Yes, you need to tell us to help us understand how you have come to your thoughts. I want to understand. We are all Joe Schlubs who come to talk football.

With Mario averaging 10 sacks per year... he has accounted for nearly half the Texans sacks during his career. Just how much do you think he should get paid? Genuine question.

dalemurphy
09-26-2011, 06:51 AM
Yes, you need to tell us to help us understand how you have come to your thoughts. I want to understand. We are all Joe Schlubs who come to talk football.

With Mario averaging 10 sacks per year... he has accounted for nearly half the Texans sacks during his career. Just how much do you think he should get paid? Genuine question.

If he was producing like he was in 2007 and 2008, I don't think there would be many complaints. Unfortunately, it is 2011. He's in a system designed to pressure the QB and has been placed in the position designed to get the most pressure on the QB, despite his physical limitations to do other things normally expected at the position. I've not said he has/will have a bad season. I said he had a bad game yesterday and a bunch of people flipped out. He played well in week one and reasonably well in week two. This week he was bad. That's it. He could still finish the season with 12 or 13 sacks and be very productive for the Texans' first playoff team. That is highly possible.

4x4tx
09-26-2011, 09:12 AM
i agreee 100%. the guy has a lot of one on ones and doesnt win many matchups. I really think its because he doesnt have a high motor just like schaub isnt fiery compared to a brees. For a guy like that, he is making too much money. Give me 5 watts or smiths that have the drive to give their all every snap.

If he was producing like he was in 2007 and 2008, I don't think there would be many complaints. Unfortunately, it is 2011. He's in a system designed to pressure the QB and has been placed in the position designed to get the most pressure on the QB, despite his physical limitations to do other things normally expected at the position. I've not said he has/will have a bad season. I said he had a bad game yesterday and a bunch of people flipped out. He played well in week one and reasonably well in week two. This week he was bad. That's it. He could still finish the season with 12 or 13 sacks and be very productive for the Texans' first playoff team. That is highly possible.

Texan_Bill
09-26-2011, 09:14 AM
defense played well, red zone O lost it

:mcnugget:

Mr teX
09-26-2011, 09:37 AM
I have just re-watched every defensive play until halfway into the 3rd Qtr. So far I have Mario being double-teamed zero times and chipped by a RB/TE three times. Note that I'm using a very liberal interpretation of the word 'chip' to include even barely grazing Mario in passing. Otherwise it's him against the OTs...and it's not pretty. There is also the time you mentioned when Meachem blocked him (not a cut block either) and another when Ingram blocked him, again, no cut.

Will chart the rest tomorrow.

well someone's lying & just based on this post of yours, im betting it's you.

The Cush
09-26-2011, 11:00 AM
well someone's lying & just based on this post of yours, im betting it's you.

Don't worry, his chart is coming out soon that will show Mario was unblocked the entire game

The Cush
09-26-2011, 11:18 AM
If he was producing like he was in 2007 and 2008, I don't think there would be many complaints. Unfortunately, it is 2011. He's in a system designed to pressure the QB and has been placed in the position designed to get the most pressure on the QB, despite his physical limitations to do other things normally expected at the position. I've not said he has/will have a bad season. I said he had a bad game yesterday and a bunch of people flipped out. He played well in week one and reasonably well in week two. This week he was bad. That's it. He could still finish the season with 12 or 13 sacks and be very productive for the Texans' first playoff team. That is highly possible.

The only reason people flipped out is because you are the cliche hater. The cliche hater waits till whatever they're hating on does something poorly or doesn't perform up to this high standard to come out of the wood work in full force to bash a guy and go on preaching about their hate for them. The cliche hater also disappears when the person they hate on performs well, just like weeks 1 and 2 where the only time you gave Mario half ass praise is when you got called out on it. Just by going back and reading your history of recent posts, its predominantly all about Mario and how you expect him to suck or you think he sucks, while on your blog you make claims like "Connor Barwin is going to be elite" because he had a sack and then you show 3 second clips of him running with wide receivers during the Miami game. Yea he had a bad game yesterday, tons of people did even your boy Barwin did (I'm sure you disagree with that one though). People just realize that when it comes to Mario, you are the cliche hater, we can expect to see dalemurphy rip him a new one after bad games but say nothing after good ones. It's a tired act

badboy
09-26-2011, 02:33 PM
My opinion is that Mario has played OLB at an "average" level for a 3-4 OLB. WHen you throw in his salary and in his final contract year, I expected better play. At what point do we say he has had enough time to "learn" a new position?

BullNation4Life
09-26-2011, 03:22 PM
My opinion is that Mario has played OLB at an "average" level for a 3-4 OLB. WHen you throw in his salary and in his final contract year, I expected better play. At what point do we say he has had enough time to "learn" a new position?

at least half a season, if not a full one...

badboy
09-26-2011, 03:29 PM
at least half a season, if not a full one...Gotta disagree with you on 8 games for Mario. If he was learning to play OG or TE sure many more games but Phillips has stated Mario will not play much different than before maybe a step further off line. On top of that he has Watt in his old spot to benefit from and Wade puts him in the best position each play.

b0ng
09-26-2011, 03:44 PM
My opinion is that Mario has played OLB at an "average" level for a 3-4 OLB. WHen you throw in his salary and in his final contract year, I expected better play. At what point do we say he has had enough time to "learn" a new position?

Since we aren't getting rid of him midseason, and I doubt there is anybody on our current roster that would perform better in that same spot, I'm guessing we'll have 16 games of evaluation tape to decide whether he will be worth re-signing or not.

Love it or hate it, that's probably how it's going to be.

dalemurphy
09-27-2011, 06:24 AM
The only reason people flipped out is because you are the cliche hater. The cliche hater waits till whatever they're hating on does something poorly or doesn't perform up to this high standard to come out of the wood work in full force to bash a guy and go on preaching about their hate for them. The cliche hater also disappears when the person they hate on performs well, just like weeks 1 and 2 where the only time you gave Mario half ass praise is when you got called out on it. Just by going back and reading your history of recent posts, its predominantly all about Mario and how you expect him to suck or you think he sucks, while on your blog you make claims like "Connor Barwin is going to be elite" because he had a sack and then you show 3 second clips of him running with wide receivers during the Miami game. Yea he had a bad game yesterday, tons of people did even your boy Barwin did (I'm sure you disagree with that one though). People just realize that when it comes to Mario, you are the cliche hater, we can expect to see dalemurphy rip him a new one after bad games but say nothing after good ones. It's a tired act


You would be hard-pressed to find me complaining about Mario Williams before October of last year. You may notice how my complaints have increased as his performance has decreased. There is nothing cliche' or intellectually dishonest about that. He has been pitiful since the Texans went 4-2 last season. Part of the problem is his inconsistent motor. I don't like that about him. Throw that variable in, along with his $14 million cap figure... and yes, I will tend to be more critical of him than Troy Nolan or Connor Barwin. Barwin's presence doesn't preclude the Texans from going after an elite pass rusher in free agency. Mario's presence does.

Did Barwin have a good game on Sunday? no. Was it has bad as Mario's? no. Once again, just like it was for most of last year, Antonio Smith is the one Texans defensive player that you can always count on.

HJam72
09-27-2011, 08:35 AM
The interception that J-Jo got on Brees was caused by Mario, who was running toward Brees with his arms going up several times. Brees did not see J-Jo because of Mario or he would not have thrown that ball. That's twice now that J-Jo has gotten a pick specifically because of Mario Williams. Not everything shows up in the stats sheets. For those of you who can, look at the replay. The announcer even said that Brees must not have seen J-Jo before throwing the ball. What he saw was Mario coming at him and what appeared to be an open receiver. There's your production. Mario causes picks.

Mr teX
09-27-2011, 09:25 AM
The interception that J-Jo got on Brees was caused by Mario, who was running toward Brees with his arms going up several times. Brees did not see J-Jo because of Mario or he would not have thrown that ball. That's twice now that J-Jo has gotten a pick specifically because of Mario Williams. Not everything shows up in the stats sheets. For those of you who can, look at the replay. The announcer even said that Brees must not have seen J-Jo before throwing the ball. What he saw was Mario coming at him and what appeared to be an open receiver. There's your production. Mario causes picks.

Anybody who objectively watches the texans on defense can see this..the problem is some don't want to acknowledge his impact on these type of plays b/c they don't like him (or his demeanor) or simply just aren't as astute & do the lazy thing....Look at stats & compare them to what some other guy is doing on another team.

& for the life of me, i still can't see why people keep bringing up how much he's being paid. It has next to nothing to do with anything that's happening on the field. His "pay-to-production" ratio is no where near out of balance like say.............Reggie Bush, Ahman Green, David Carr, or say a Chris Johnson for the titans now.... at the very least i'd say we've broken even. Furthermore, if he has a bad year, some of his contract demands will be tempered by that & the texans will have ground to stand on if he tries to demand outrageous money. If he has a great year we'll have to shell out the bucks but it will also mean that he's likely made the transition to OLB extremely well...a win win for us.

It's not rocket science & this is pretty much standard practice for most franchises in all sports not named the oakland raiders.

BigBull17
09-27-2011, 09:35 AM
Anybody who objectively watches the texans on defense can see this..the problem is some don't want to acknowledge his impact on these type of plays b/c they don't like him (or his demeanor) or simply just aren't as astute & do the lazy thing....Look at stats & compare them to what some other guy is doing on another team.

& for the life of me, i still can't see why people keep bringing up how much he's being paid. It has next to nothing to do with anything that's happening on the field. His "pay-to-production" ratio is no where near out of balance like say.............Reggie Bush, Ahman Green, David Carr, or say a Chris Johnson for the titans now.... at the very least i'd say we've broken even. Furthermore, if he has a bad year, some of his contract demands will be tempered by that & the texans will have ground to stand on if he tries to demand outrageous money. If he has a great year we'll have to shell out the bucks but it will also mean that he's likely made the transition to OLB extremely well...a win win for us.

It's not rocket science & this is pretty much standard practice for most franchises in all sports not named the oakland raiders.

You should know forum rules, no logic allowed! Mario had his worst game of the season, I'm not going to lie, but he was far from invisible. People see no sacks, and one tackle and freak the **** out.

badboy
09-27-2011, 09:52 AM
Since we aren't getting rid of him midseason, and I doubt there is anybody on our current roster that would perform better in that same spot, I'm guessing we'll have 16 games of evaluation tape to decide whether he will be worth re-signing or not.

Love it or hate it, that's probably how it's going to be.Well if we don't trade him it will be difficult to get anything for him after his contract ends even if we tag him because teams will know we will not keep him. He has done little to earn his $14m let alone a long term new deal.

BigBull17
09-27-2011, 09:56 AM
If you want to see 13 games of Brooks Reed, go ahead. You'll be in for a rough season, since he is no where near ready.

badboy
09-27-2011, 10:24 AM
Anybody who objectively watches the texans on defense can see this..the problem is some don't want to acknowledge his impact on these type of plays b/c they don't like him (or his demeanor) or simply just aren't as astute & do the lazy thing....Look at stats & compare them to what some other guy is doing on another team.

& for the life of me, i still can't see why people keep bringing up how much he's being paid. It has next to nothing to do with anything that's happening on the field. His "pay-to-production" ratio is no where near out of balance like say.............Reggie Bush, Ahman Green, David Carr, or say a Chris Johnson for the titans now.... at the very least i'd say we've broken even. Furthermore, if he has a bad year, some of his contract demands will be tempered by that & the texans will have ground to stand on if he tries to demand outrageous money. If he has a great year we'll have to shell out the bucks but it will also mean that he's likely made the transition to OLB extremely well...a win win for us.

It's not rocket science & this is pretty much standard practice for most franchises in all sports not named the oakland raiders.For the life of me I can't see why you do not understand his salary does impact what fans expect. As does his draft position. Compare him to Connor Barwin on the other side and Barwin will catch less heat than Mario. The players you mention do not play for Texans & I could care less how they do unless in a game against us. Your comment reminds me of those who say "price of gasoline is higher in Europe than U.S." I do not live in Europe. If Mario has a bad year at OLB when the entire defense is set up for him to be successful, why in the world would you re-sign him? I think 99% of fans like him and want him to do well but he needs to do better.

4x4tx
09-27-2011, 10:26 AM
The intercetption Joseph got was because brees was a sec late on this throw, the WR was open but he waited one sec too long and joseph made up the ground quickly and made a good play. It had nothing to do with mario, we ran at brees and waved our arms at him plenty and it didnt seem to effect him much. At the min, 6'7" mario should be batting down balls all game with his reach and by reading the QBs eyes.

The interception that J-Jo got on Brees was caused by Mario, who was running toward Brees with his arms going up several times. Brees did not see J-Jo because of Mario or he would not have thrown that ball. That's twice now that J-Jo has gotten a pick specifically because of Mario Williams. Not everything shows up in the stats sheets. For those of you who can, look at the replay. The announcer even said that Brees must not have seen J-Jo before throwing the ball. What he saw was Mario coming at him and what appeared to be an open receiver. There's your production. Mario causes picks.

BigBull17
09-27-2011, 11:31 AM
The intercetption Joseph got was because brees was a sec late on this throw, the WR was open but he waited one sec too long and joseph made up the ground quickly and made a good play. It had nothing to do with mario, we ran at brees and waved our arms at him plenty and it didnt seem to effect him much. At the min, 6'7" mario should be batting down balls all game with his reach and by reading the QBs eyes.

You're one of those guys who will never give credit where it's due. You don't think a 6'7 MArio didn't impact the very unBreesus throw? Whatever.

Mr teX
09-27-2011, 11:57 AM
For the life of me I can't see why you do not understand his salary does impact what fans expect. As does his draft position. Compare him to Connor Barwin on the other side and Barwin will catch less heat than Mario. The players you mention do not play for Texans & I could care less how they do unless in a game against us. Your comment reminds me of those who say "price of gasoline is higher in Europe than U.S." I do not live in Europe. If Mario has a bad year at OLB when the entire defense is set up for him to be successful, why in the world would you re-sign him? I think 99% of fans like him and want him to do well but he needs to do better.

if thats your basis for bringing his salary up then your premise is flawed from the jump. For 1, fanatics expectations of anything are usually out of whack with reality & or what should be reasonably expected. Need an example? Every year at the beginning of the season the NFL, sells fans with the "new season, renewed hope" mantra. & every year like clockwork, most fans bite down on that crap hook, line & sinker...even though reality is staring most of them right in the face about their teams chances of winning the SB that year &/or making a deep playoff run; i.e. it ain't likely.


& 2, ALL OF THESE GUYS ARE OVERPAID WHEN YOU SIT BACK & REALLY LOOK AT IT!!! Peyton Manning is going down at minimum a top 10 qb of all time....you think he deserved to be given a 100 million dollar contract extension at this point in his career to play a frickin' game? What about Mike Vick & the contract he got? How about Peyton's brother Eli with what amounts to basically the same amount in an extension? The answer to all is hell, no....but it's what the market dictates.

& don't confuse this with me saying that he doesn't/couldn't be any better, b/c i think he could. But lets also not go to other end of the spectrum and act like this guy is no where in the ballpark of earning his salary b/c he is IMO. He may not be on your fan pace of 8932740979 sacks & 7890 FF's by week 3, but what he is still on is a track to have a damn good year.

badboy
09-27-2011, 01:02 PM
if thats your basis for bringing his salary up then your premise is flawed from the jump. For 1, fanatics expectations of anything are usually out of whack with reality & or what should be reasonably expected. Need an example? Every year at the beginning of the season the NFL, sells fans with the "new season, renewed hope" mantra. & every year like clockwork, most fans bite down on that crap hook, line & sinker...even though reality is staring most of them right in the face about their teams chances of winning the SB that year &/or making a deep playoff run; i.e. it ain't likely.


& 2, ALL OF THESE GUYS ARE OVERPAID WHEN YOU SIT BACK & REALLY LOOK AT IT!!! Peyton Manning is going down at minimum a top 10 qb of all time....you think he deserved to be given a 100 million dollar contract extension at this point in his career to play a frickin' game? What about Mike Vick & the contract he got? How about Peyton's brother Eli with what amounts to basically the same amount in an extension? The answer to all is hell, no....but it's what the market dictates.

& don't confuse this with me saying that he doesn't/couldn't be any better, b/c i think he could. But lets also not go to other end of the spectrum and act like this guy is no where in the ballpark of earning his salary b/c he is IMO. He may not be on your fan pace of 8932740979 sacks & 7890 FF's by week 3, but what he is still on is a track to have a damn good year.

#1 Nope, fans expectations are imo fairly reasonable. They want to see their team play well and go as far as possible. Sure all want SB winner but fans know odds are against most teams. People want to feel good even when times are rough. Liquor sales are up and fans want to be included in something better than what they perceive they have. Sports, entertainment and other folks (tailgaits, pool parties and Message Boards) are part of that.

#2. Player salaries:a player can justify just about any amount if he is playing at a high level. Mario is not and it is not because he is out with a neck injury. If Williams gets 2 sacks every 3 games, he will get 10 sacks and that is not enough imo to justify a huge new deal. If he was playing DE, maybe but not OLB where every single play is set up for him to disrupt the QB. Now, if he get 15, I'm willing to talk.

I want him to succeed at a very high level. So far, the game clock is ticking down. I can say the same for Kareem Jackson also.

Rey
09-27-2011, 01:49 PM
#2. Player salaries:a player can justify just about any amount if he is playing at a high level. Mario is not and it is not because he is out with a neck injury. If Williams gets 2 sacks every 3 games, he will get 10 sacks and that is not enough imo to justify a huge new deal. If he was playing DE, maybe but not OLB where every single play is set up for him to disrupt the QB. Now, if he get 15, I'm willing to talk.

I don't know if I agree with using sacks and only sacks as the determining factor in giving Mario a new contract.

Freeney may get 14 or 15 sacks in a given year, but he and Mathis don't do much of anything against the run...

In our game against the Colts this year, Freeney was goose egged in the stat column. The Saints have played us, the Packers and the Bears. I don't recall Clay Matthews nor Peppers having good games against them.

While Mario didn't record a sack against the Dolphins, he did cause the INT with pressure and hitting the ball as Henne released it. So while you only give him credit for the 2 sacks against Indy, he has made impact plays in two of three games, with the third game being played against a team that has pretty much shut down Clay Matthews and Peppers who are considered top tier/elite pass rushers.

I don't have a crystal ball. I don't know exactly what will happen. But I think Mario will have more games like the first two than he will like the last one.

JMO.

Mr teX
09-27-2011, 02:38 PM
]#1 Nope, fans expectations are imo fairly reasonable. They want to see their team play well and go as far as possible. Sure all want SB winner but fans know odds are against most teams. People want to feel good even when times are rough. Liquor sales are up and fans want to be included in something better than what they perceive they have. Sports, entertainment and other folks (tailgaits, pool parties and Message Boards) are part of that.

[/B]#2. Player salaries:a player can justify just about any amount if he is playing at a high level. Mario is not and it is not because he is out with a neck injury. If Williams gets 2 sacks every 3 games, he will get 10 sacks and that is not enough imo to justify a huge new deal. If he was playing DE, maybe but not OLB where every single play is set up for him to disrupt the QB. Now, if he get 15, I'm willing to talk.

I want him to succeed at a very high level. So far, the game clock is ticking down. I can say the same for Kareem Jackson also.

You're crazy if you believe the bolded. Doing "well" is unreasonable if you know your team has no qb & your defense is putrid & you've done nothing in the offseason of any significance ....see the raiders, & the redskins the last decade. You also make it seem like fans willingly accept 6-10 records or worse if they know it was as good as the team was ever gonna be....that's simply not the case. Every fan wants a winner no matter the circumstances but if things aren't in place for that to happen, then yes it is unreasonable to expect anything more.

Fans come into the season every year in the NFL thinking that "this is their year" to turn it around & The NFL has sold this "hope" better than Obama sold it during his presidential campaign.

& as far as #2, still doesn't mean that they aren't overpaid for what they do....which at the core of it all, is still just playing a game.

The Cush
10-02-2011, 03:25 PM
I think (I'm not sure I haven't looked at the stat sheet yet LOL) he showed up today....

Front 7 played great getting after Big Ben and that guy is tough to bring down