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View Full Version : Watt looks good. What do you think we could get for Mario?


gafftop
08-15-2011, 08:01 PM
Just asking. Mario isn't going to cut it. Not just basing on performance tonight. Basied on watching him for years.

jaayteetx
08-15-2011, 08:06 PM
What u smoking?

gafftop
08-15-2011, 08:12 PM
LOL No smoking inhaling pure oxygen clears the mind, let's you see clearly. LOL

TexanSam
08-15-2011, 08:13 PM
It's the first preseason game. The starters played 1 quarter and you're already thinking of trading Mario?

gafftop
08-15-2011, 08:19 PM
No actually I thought he should have been traded earlier. At end of this season I don't think he will have any value. Just my opinion. And believe me I hope I am WRONG.

Wolf
08-15-2011, 08:22 PM
Mario looked lost today .. learning curve that I hope he picks up within 3 weeks

badboy
08-15-2011, 08:26 PM
You simply float that Mario could be had for the right offer. If it is sweet you do it. Reed has looked good but we need to see more of him and Barwin before you give up Mario. Let's see how WIlliams looks by game one and we should know more.

GuerillaBlack
08-15-2011, 08:30 PM
Watt does look pretty good, but we shouldn't trade Mario. He's a little confused right now, but he'll get better.

gafftop
08-15-2011, 08:34 PM
Mario looked lost today .. learning curve that I hope he picks up within 3 weeks

I am afraid it is not mental. Just not the right abilities to play the position.

gafftop
08-15-2011, 08:39 PM
Love Mario, but if he isn't capable of playing in a 3-4, Reed is plenty talented enough to do so

With that said, it's the 1st pre-season game, smart guy

LOL I know. I just can't imagine him being our best option at THAT position, therefore if we can substantially improve in another area by trade I think it needs to be considered.

Nawzer
08-15-2011, 08:40 PM
How can Mario get lost, when his only job is to rush the qb? What's the confusion there?

fiasco west
08-15-2011, 08:40 PM
Sigh......just sad.

EllisUnit
08-15-2011, 08:43 PM
ok watt is a DE, Mario is now an OLB, who do u propose take marios spot ? Brooks reed ? Mario is a top tier player and our FO would be crazy to trade him. :wadepalm:

badboy
08-15-2011, 08:46 PM
Watt does look pretty good, but we shouldn't trade Mario. He's a little confused right now, but he'll get better.Not being hateful but there is nothing to base that on.

badboy
08-15-2011, 08:51 PM
ok watt is a DE, Mario is now an OLB, who do u propose take marios spot ? Brooks reed ? Mario is a top tier player and our FO would be crazy to trade him. :wadepalm:Mario is a top tier END, he has done zero as an OLB. I'm willing to give him time but let's stick to facts. Watt has replaced him at DE so either Mario goes back to end (if he does not get better) and we rotate Smith/Watt & Mario & I'm ok with that if Reed & Barwin can hold the starter roles as OLB or we trade Mario to a 4-3 team like Pats for two second round picks.

RTP2110
08-15-2011, 08:51 PM
Why trade him? If he can't play OLB, then just move him back to DE.

ATXtexanfan
08-15-2011, 08:57 PM
what could we get for schaub and mario? both aren't going to cut it

badboy
08-15-2011, 08:57 PM
Why trade him? If he can't play OLB, then just move him back to DE.Because Watt looks good enough to be an every down player @DE & Mario's $14million is too much to be a rotational guy. I could be ok with it but hate to see that. I would take two 2nds right now but get more later in season.

DocBar
08-15-2011, 08:58 PM
I disremember Watt's number being called. What do you mean by looking good?

gafftop
08-15-2011, 09:00 PM
Mario is a top tier END, he has done zero as an OLB. I'm willing to give him time but let's stick to facts. Watt has replaced him at DE so either Mario goes back to end (if he does not get better) and we rotate Smith/Watt & Mario & I'm ok with that if Reed & Barwin can hold the starter roles as OLB or we trade Mario to a 4-3 team like Pats for two second round picks.

Can't you trade him for a REAL OLB that can help this year and maybe get draft choice or another quality player?

HJam72
08-15-2011, 09:00 PM
How can Mario get lost, when his only job is to rush the qb? What's the confusion there?


Run coverage....and maybe just a little short pass coverage.

Mario has been nails at stopping the run (in 4-3), but now he isn't doing it at all. There's gonna be a learning curve.

badboy
08-15-2011, 09:03 PM
I disremember Watt's number being called. What do you mean by looking good?In this defense, the DT and DEs will prob not get their number called much. You just have to watch their play and see if they are taking up the blocks and tying up the Oline allowing LBs to disrupt the QB. I'd say the line is doing their job very well.

gafftop
08-15-2011, 09:06 PM
Everything is dependent on his cap number. If it is 13 million you could improve the team this year. If it is only 2 million then not as big a deal. I really don't care if I save McNair money, I only care if it makes the Texans more competitive.

DocBar
08-15-2011, 09:09 PM
Everything is dependent on his cap number. If it is 13 million you could improve the team this year. If it is only 2 million then not as big a deal. I really don't care if I save McNair money, I only care if it makes the Texans more competitive.That is almost as dumb as something Dex would say.

badboy
08-15-2011, 09:10 PM
Can't you trade him for a REAL OLB that can help this year and maybe get draft choice or another quality player?Sure if the other team is OLB heavy, but we need to reduce costs next season. Remember, Mario is gonna want a big old contract re-newal if he gets any sacks this season.

badboy
08-15-2011, 09:11 PM
That is almost as dumb as something Dex would say.I don't understand your comment?

gafftop
08-15-2011, 09:18 PM
Sure if the other team is OLB heavy, but we need to reduce costs next season. Remember, Mario is gonna want a big old contract re-newal if he gets any sacks this season.

That is exactly why we trade him now. He won't be worth a big contract from us so we end up losing him and get whatever. I think we got a seventh or something when we lost Dunta. Right now we improve our team if we trade, later we get much less. Maybe during season would work too.

BigBull17
08-15-2011, 09:18 PM
Boy, this thread didn't take long. Shocker...

DocBar
08-15-2011, 09:20 PM
I don't understand your comment?I'm sorry.

Heath Shuler
08-15-2011, 09:26 PM
Schaub looks good. What do you think we could get for Andre?

badboy
08-15-2011, 09:27 PM
That is exactly why we trade him now. He won't be worth a big contract from us so we end up losing him and get whatever. I think we got a seventh or something when we lost Dunta. Right now we improve our team if we trade, later we get much less. Maybe during season would work too.OK, here is where I'll probably vote against you. I have to be a gambling man now. Wade Phillips (I trust his eval) says Williams will be good OLB. Even though I said earlier I'd take two 2nds now, I misspoke. I'll gamble Willams will get better especially as D gets better acclimated. I am not against a trade but think deal gets better after say regular game 6 and he has 5-6 sacks and is blowing up the run as he usually does.
Or if SMith thinks Mario will extend contract without testing free agency with a reasonable deal, we wrap him up. We probably come out ahead by holding onto Mario a while yet.

WolverineFan
08-15-2011, 10:03 PM
FO is trying to make Mario happy, not effective. He's not an OLB in any system, he's too big. He would be an excellent 3-4 DE, but he's such a good pass rusher that it would be a waste.

We need to trade him for some top picks and add to the defense with some good young talent that is an ideal fit for the system.

BSofA04
08-15-2011, 10:06 PM
This thread is ridiculous. It's preseason.

Pretty damn close to negative rep for stupidity.

WolverineFan
08-15-2011, 10:12 PM
This thread is ridiculous. It's preseason.

Pretty damn close to negative rep for stupidity.

You know nothing about football if you think Mario will make an effective OLB, preseason or not. You have to plan ahead and for the future and if you don't think Mario will cut it then you need to deal him and get something for him before he hits FA.

He's too big to be out there, he gets cut left and right. He has a great 1st step for a DE, but it's average for an OLB. He's not cut out to be out there in a 2 point stance.

IMO, they should play him at DE and get Antonio Smith off the field, but Mario is not going to re-sign if he's going to be playing 5' technique. Therefore, you gotta deal him before he hits the market.

b0ng
08-15-2011, 10:12 PM
gafftop hating on Mario, well I am just shocked I tells ya. Shocked.

Mario gets more than a single preseason game to show his worth, calling it now.

badboy
08-15-2011, 10:14 PM
This thread is ridiculous. It's preseason.

Pretty damn close to negative rep for stupidity.If you negative rep someone for stating their opinion, you should be banned from the board. That is the entire purpose of this site to talk about what we want not what you think is ridiculous.

fiasco west
08-15-2011, 10:28 PM
Schaub looks good. What do you think we could get for Andre?

Pfft Schaub looked pretty bad out there. 2 for 8.

I say we get rid of him and just start the other Matt. His value is high right now and we'd get a ton for Schaub.

stingray
08-15-2011, 10:29 PM
Great Thread... Judging Mario in his first game in a new 3-4 defense.. And in a pre-season game to top it off!!!

/FAIL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

BullNation4Life
08-15-2011, 10:45 PM
Sorry doubting Thomas' gotta give Mario the benefit of the doubt for the pre-season. New system, new position is gonna take some getting use to, don't care how great of an athlete you are.

If you are going to base your opinion on one pre-season game than you are a moron, that simple:mariopalm:...Mario did look lost but it's expected the first time out. I am more interested in the 3rd game where they play for 3 quarters or so...

Watt is what he was expected, a beast...

SAMURAITEXAN
08-15-2011, 10:48 PM
Trade Mario Whaaaat!!!!

BSofA04
08-15-2011, 10:49 PM
If you negative rep someone for stating their opinion, you should be banned from the board. That is the entire purpose of this site to talk about what we want not what you think is ridiculous.
Chill out man, I'm not the one starting a thread to trade Mario after 15 minutes of preseason football. We all shouldn't get too high or too down over one preseason game. I think this is just overkill and I rarely use that word.

It is a message board but common sense should account for something here. We're supposed to be educated fans. It's one freaking preseason game!

playa465
08-15-2011, 10:55 PM
Watt did look ok...but as far as Mario its to soon to judge, but if I was a gambling man I'd say get him back to DE...which is what I thought he would be when we first signed Wade...who cares if his feelings are hurt, if he pouts who cares...can't we put the franchise tag on him for next year? I remember an analyst saying in Mario's 1st year that the Texans should leave him at 1 DE spot so he can learn and master it instead of going from back n forth from RDE to LDE...now he not only is learning a new defense but a new position as well. And he can be a very good player at DE in the 34 just like those listed below:

Jack Youngblood
Bruce Smith
Howie Long
Fred Dean (49ers)
Lee Roy Selmon

b0ng
08-15-2011, 10:56 PM
If you negative rep someone for stating their opinion, you should be banned from the board. That is the entire purpose of this to talk about what we want not what you think is ridiculous.

A shitty post is still a shitty post even if it does happen to be an opinion. Should we discuss what each player could possibly get us in a trade? We might be here for awhil3.

If hardtop gave actual logical analysis beyond "I watched him for years" people wouldn't be 4esponding in such a negative light.

ObsiWan
08-15-2011, 11:04 PM
Boy, this thread didn't take long. Shocker...

no, unfortunately it didn't.
the first team D had, what, a ten snaps?

And the ESPN talking heads asked Antonio Pierce about those run plays to Mario's side. He said - and he played the position that Mario is trying to learn - that Mario did his job by sealing the outside and forcing the RB back inside. Unfortunately, the INSIDE LBs who have inside run responsibility - were no where to be found. "That's on the inside LBs, they got to be a little bit more stout inside".

Speaking of ILBs did anyone hear DeMeco's name called tonight? I didn't.
Guess we should trade him too.

badboy
08-15-2011, 11:05 PM
Chill out man, I'm not the one starting a thread to trade Mario after 15 minutes of preseason football. We all shouldn't get too high or too down over one preseason game. I think this is just overkill and I rarely use that word.

It is a message board but common sense should account for something here. We're supposed to be educated fans. It's one freaking preseason game!

The issue is the person starting the thread is voicing his opinion and you call him stupid and ridiculous. Come hard with your opinions on Mario's worth to team & I'll support you. Educated fans have debated Mario's worth since he was drafted. Probably only Okoye and Carr have been debated more so your comments are objectionable much more so than the opinion of the thread. Anyway, do your thing. I am off to sleepy land.

badboy
08-15-2011, 11:08 PM
A shitty post is still a shitty post even if it does happen to be an opinion. Should we discuss what each player could possibly get us in a trade? We might be here for awhil3.

If hardtop gave actual logical analysis beyond "I watched him for years" people wouldn't be 4esponding in such a negative light.Yes, if someone want to discuss each player's trade value, why not? We discuss what we want to see from almost every player. If you don't want to play, go home. And who are you to say what post is shitty? Just because you disagree? Why can we give our pros and cons rather than attack someone?

Ryan
08-15-2011, 11:09 PM
Andre Johnson looked horrible today, it's like he wasn't even playing!!!! Let's trade him too while we're at it. Foster as well.

BSofA04
08-15-2011, 11:09 PM
The issue is the person starting the thread is voicing his opinion and you call him stupid and ridiculous. Come hard with your opinions on Mario's worth to team & I'll support you. Educated fans have debated Mario's worth since he was drafted. Probably only Okoye and Carr have been debated more so your comments are objectionable much more so than the opinion of the thread. Anyway, do your thing. I am off to sleepy land.
We're all allowed to voice our opinions and I simply voiced mine. I really don't care if you support me or not.

I know my football man, and threads like this make Texan fans sound ridiculous. Most everyone on this board can see past this.

TimeKiller
08-15-2011, 11:11 PM
At the risk of posting in this thread....

My goodness. At worst you drop him down to DE, where he probably should be anyway.

Trade Mario. Y'all sound like the front office for the Astros....selling off good players....

Dutchrudder
08-15-2011, 11:24 PM
I would entertain the idea of trading him for a healthy Dumerville. The Broncos switched to a 43 this offseason, so his OLB talents will be somewhat wasted up there. Ditto for Mario as a DE here.

silvrhand
08-15-2011, 11:42 PM
This thread will be epic...

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-2pYBMH8GpBA/TWQse5KEPTI/AAAAAAAAAFE/4RAdUuIodgw/s1600/homer_eating_popcorn.jpg

Norg
08-15-2011, 11:46 PM
Yeah i seen him with my bonoics today he just seem like its was all new two him but he wast going aganist a good tackle today the jets have pretty good tackles


but two answer your question on what we could get for him we would want a 2 but most team will prob say a 3

maybe a player trade would be a better idea IMO

Rey
08-15-2011, 11:50 PM
Mario wasn't bad in his snaps.

Perki-Perk
08-15-2011, 11:55 PM
Man, that Ogbanaya sure looks good!! What do you guys think we can get for Foster?!?!?! http://www.texanstalk.com/forums/images/smilies/k_anticipation.gif

LOL ^^ Newb doesn't know how to post smilies. What a rookie!

Scooter
08-16-2011, 12:17 AM
jokes are being made, but i think the thread has merit. as i've said before, i believe mario is most ideal as a 3-4 defensive end and we're doing the team a disservice by not using him as "bruce smith" as originally suggested. if used opposite the "unblockable" jj watt i think we'd have a defense that would look a lot like the superbowl patriots. smith wont be happy as a backup, but the rotation of those 3 at end and tackle through 4 quarters is nasty. mario's size, strength (mario is impossibly strong from all reports), and skill-set are a freakish richard seymore (not demarcus ware and not even julius peppers who are both much much more fluid). he'll be able to overwhelm tightends and tackles into 10-15 sacks this season as an OLB, but he's removed entirely from his strength in the run game and is WAAAYYY too easily schemed for being that far away from the ball - especially with an undersized defensive line. mario could realistically get 5-10 sacks from the 3-4 end/4-3 end position and be a dominant force inside ... at OLB he's nothing more than pretty numbers.

in a contract year, i would definitely shop mario. he is an absolute monster and it's insane to lose that type of talent, but i think players and picks could produce more overall value for our defense than mario at OLB will.

The Pencil Neck
08-16-2011, 12:52 AM
If Mario can "get it", he could be amazing as an OLB in this defense. He's still got to "get it", though.

His natural position is at DE, I think.

Watt -- Cody/Mitchell -- Mario

Barwin -- Ryans -- Cushing -- Braman

With Antonio Smith in the DE rotation and Adibi, Sharpton, Reed, and Nading in the LB rotation... That's not a bad front 7.

Texecutioner
08-16-2011, 01:04 AM
jokes are being made, but i think the thread has merit. as i've said before, i believe mario is most ideal as a 3-4 defensive end and we're doing the team a disservice by not using him as "bruce smith" as originally suggested. if used opposite the "unblockable" jj watt i think we'd have a defense that would look a lot like the superbowl patriots. smith wont be happy as a backup, but the rotation of those 3 at end and tackle through 4 quarters is nasty. mario's size, strength, and skill-set are a freakish richard seymore (not demarcus ware and not even julius peppers). he'll be able to overwhelm tightends and tackles into 10-15 sacks this season as an OLB, but he's removed entirely from his strength in the run game and is WAAAYYY too easily schemed for being that far away from the ball - especially with an undersized defensive line. mario could realistically get 5-10 sacks from the 3-4 end/4-3 end position and be a dominant force inside ... at OLB he's nothing more than pretty numbers.

in a contract year, i would definitely shop mario. he is an absolute monster and it's insane to lose that type of talent, but i think players and picks could produce more overall value for our defense than mario at OLB will.

Agreed. I don't understand why everyone is jumping all over the OP just for giving his opinion. It's not like this idea hasn't been discussed many times before. Mario has been overrated going on two years now to me. He's good, but he isn't great. Shopping him before a contract year would be smart in my eyes. We can continue to go after pass rushers as well and with Watt, Reed, Barwin, Cushing, and other players to bring in I think we'd be just fine. Mario is only a game breaker in like 4 games a year.

80tothezone
08-16-2011, 01:05 AM
Yeh mario was badd so was schaub we really should see what we can get for both of them... Arian and Dre were invisible lets throw that Garbage on the block as well. I mean shit we lost 20 to 16 right? same deal different day.... Who else we got ... daniels and walter dropped some passes might see about getting them replaced too... Oh and Wade's D sucked 6 sacks is not near enough in the NFL we need at least 32 a game fire that cowgirl and bring in someone who knows what he is doing.... Garbage showing... From a Garbage Team and Garbage players.... way to go houston way to evaporate your chances at the playoffs before the season has even started....

michaelm
08-16-2011, 01:06 AM
I agree with many of you that Mario should be given more than a partial preseason game to prove himself in the new system. However, I agree with the opinion that he won't become a good 3-4 OLB.
I stated the same opinion in another thread.
So basically, I think it's too early to come to any conclusions at this point, but I think eventually, the original post will prove to be accurate.

80tothezone
08-16-2011, 01:31 AM
I agree with many of you that Mario should be given more than a partial preseason game to prove himself in the new system. However, I agree with the opinion that he won't become a good 3-4 OLB.
I stated the same opinion in another thread.
So basically, I think it's too early to come to any conclusions at this point, but I think eventually, the original post will prove to be accurate.

I think it will take longer for him to adjust than others, DE to OLB is a big transition. All I am saying with my other post is really 3 things albeit as sarcastically as I could muster... a) give mario a break he will come around, b) relax guys it is pre season our D had 7 sacks against a team that doesn't throw much, C) we just put the D in 2 weeks ago and we had 7 SACKS!!!

Wolf6151
08-16-2011, 01:33 AM
Although I wasn't happy with Mario's performance tonight either, it's way to early to be writing him off at OLB. He only played one quarter, let's give him some time. Also remember that most DC's don't show their entire defense in the preseason, they hold back and only play a very vanilla version. Mario still has time to learn and prove himself, but if by game 5 of the regular season he's still looking like he did tonight then I'd have Rick Smith burning up the phones with trade offers. I also agree with some of you that say what's there to learn, it's called rush the QB as fast and hard as you can, it's not rocket science. We'll know more after next weeks game.

I would imagine that Phillips will breaking his foot off in several players ass this next week in TC.

Allstar
08-16-2011, 02:03 AM
Sanchez did nothing but 3 step drops. No one is going to get to him on those quick plays. The couple times Sanched did drop back a little longer, he was sacked. Mario was not put in a position to shine. His grade is just a big fat incomplete.

Scooter
08-16-2011, 02:10 AM
edit.

fiasco west
08-16-2011, 02:51 AM
Sanchez did nothing but 3 step drops. No one is going to get to him on those quick plays. The couple times Sanched did drop back a little longer, he was sacked. Mario was not put in a position to shine. His grade is just a big fat incomplete.

Rep coming your way. The Jets whole thing tonight was working on quick passes and NOT getting their QB hit.

I think people are overreacting. Lets watch him for the season If he does bad this year he loses no trade value, because teams will just think of him as a 4-3 DE. Franchise Tag...Trade. If he leaves we'll have a bunch of cap room any ways, no reason to just give up on him right now. None at all.

He's 26 and is about to hit his prime. That's the equivalent to just trading Foster because we fired Kubiak and he has no more ZBS to run behind. Let players prove themselves in the new system.

I don't see anyone trying to trade Meco. He was very quiet today and they were picking up chunks of 4-5 yards in that 1st qtr.

I understand the concern but you just don't give away players like Mario.

Thorn
08-16-2011, 08:03 AM
You know, after only two weeks of practice, you'd think the Texans could beat the Jets at least 73-0 or something. Mario, Cushing and Ryans should be traded immediatly, it's obvious their backups are better. And that damn Schaub, trade him. Just cut our loses and go with Leinhart, it's obvious he our new QB anyway.

And AJ and Foster are on my shit list as well because of their horrible performance last night. :smiliepalm:

False Start
08-16-2011, 08:05 AM
I think with time we can get a pretty bad ass OLB from Mario.

El Tejano
08-16-2011, 08:06 AM
Can someone post a replay of the first Xavier Adibi sack? I believe Mario ran a stunt and that freed up Adibi, due to Watt also manhandling his guy. To me, this is where Mario is going to be awesome at OLB. We might see these other guys make plays due to the attention Mario would get in these stunts.

kingh99
08-16-2011, 08:28 AM
Can someone post a replay of the first Xavier Adibi sack? I believe Mario ran a stunt and that freed up Adibi, due to Watt also manhandling his guy. To me, this is where Mario is going to be awesome at OLB. We might see these other guys make plays due to the attention Mario would get in these stunts.

I don't recall Lawrence Taylor being a decoy.

IDEXAN
08-16-2011, 08:29 AM
FO is trying to make Mario happy, not effective. He's not an OLB in any system, he's too big. He would be an excellent 3-4 DE, but he's such a good pass rusher that it would be a waste.


Mario and rook Watt would be an awesome DE pairing, and pass-rushing is important for DEs in the 3-4 but certainly not to the degree it is in the 4-3.
But Mario is a square peg at the 3-4 OLB position, just like one look at this Braman kid tells you he's a real fit as a 3-4 OLB.

TEXANRED
08-16-2011, 08:32 AM
Watt and Mario don't even play the same position.

Thats like asking what could we get for Schaub cus Quin looked good.

BetaV1
08-16-2011, 08:55 AM
I only got through the first page and a half of this thread and then I just couldn't take it anymore. I came extremely close to busting out the negative reps. This is supposed to be the smarter Texans forum. :kubepalm:

Blake
08-16-2011, 09:06 AM
I like basing personnel decisions off of 1 pre-season game too. The fact that Mario changed positions after an entire off-season lockout means nothing. Lets trade him to New England for Tom Brady. I hear he didn't even complete a single pass.

GP
08-16-2011, 09:24 AM
Sanchez did nothing but 3 step drops. No one is going to get to him on those quick plays. The couple times Sanched did drop back a little longer, he was sacked. Mario was not put in a position to shine. His grade is just a big fat incomplete.

Definitely protecting Sanchez by using 3-step drops and slant routes out there.

Tailgate
08-16-2011, 09:26 AM
Mario moving to OLB was the whole reason we even drafted "Watts" in the first place.

badboy
08-16-2011, 09:30 AM
We're all allowed to voice our opinions and I simply voiced mine. I really don't care if you support me or not.

I know my football man, and threads like this make Texan fans sound ridiculous. Most everyone on this board can see past this.My reaction was not about your opinion but rather that you said you would negatively rep thread starter for his opinion.

Goatcheese
08-16-2011, 09:31 AM
Oh FFS

http://ironicsurrealism.com/files/2009/03/not-this-shit-again.gif

WolverineFan
08-16-2011, 09:32 AM
Can someone post a replay of the first Xavier Adibi sack? I believe Mario ran a stunt and that freed up Adibi, due to Watt also manhandling his guy. To me, this is where Mario is going to be awesome at OLB. We might see these other guys make plays due to the attention Mario would get in these stunts.

Mario lined up at DE with his hand down on that play. Adibi was the one standing up on the edge. IMO that is where Mario's value is. I think it's a wasted to project to have him at OLB because he will never be as good there as he will be at DE.

badboy
08-16-2011, 09:45 AM
Man, that Ogbanaya sure looks good!! What do you guys think we can get for Foster?!?!?! http://www.texanstalk.com/forums/images/smilies/k_anticipation.gif

LOL ^^ Newb doesn't know how to post smilies. What a rookie!

PP, can you tell us what the differences are between the NFL leading runningback who earns a low salary and Mario Williams? Maybe then your smile will turn upside down? Hey, I'll even give you a hint or two.

badboy
08-16-2011, 09:56 AM
I think it will take longer for him to adjust than others, DE to OLB is a big transition. All I am saying with my other post is really 3 things albeit as sarcastically as I could muster... a) give mario a break he will come around, b) relax guys it is pre season our D had 7 sacks against a team that doesn't throw much, C) we just put the D in 2 weeks ago and we had 7 SACKS!!!Yet none of the sacks were by Mario or contributable to him. I saw one play where he was low blocked off his feet by one guy. I am willing to give him time to learn OLB, but as a final contract year & $14million against cap, I am expecting big things. I see nothing wrong with considering deals if offered. If he adapts and gets sacks that Phillips says he will AND he will negotiate a reasonable deal, I'm ok with bringing him back. I think it is odd when people use AJ in this thread as a comparison.

Ole Miss Texan
08-16-2011, 09:58 AM
His last name is friggin FOUR letters long and we can't spell it right?

JJ WATT!! And he looks beastly!

noxiousdog
08-16-2011, 09:58 AM
IMO, they should play him at DE and get Antonio Smith off the field, but Mario is not going to re-sign if he's going to be playing 5' technique. Therefore, you gotta deal him before he hits the market.


They don't have to worry about him re-signing. They can franchise him, and then trade him if necessary.

TEXANRED
08-16-2011, 09:59 AM
His last name is friggin FOUR letters long and we can't spell it right?

JJ WATT!! And he looks beastly!

Watt?

noxiousdog
08-16-2011, 10:01 AM
Also, this thread makes me laugh.

utahmark
08-16-2011, 10:02 AM
What does Watt's play have to do with Mario? They don't even play the same position.

Chance_C
08-16-2011, 10:04 AM
[QUOTE][Mario moving to OLB was the whole reason we even drafted "Watts" in the first place/QUOTE]

I see what you did there..

Doppelganger
08-16-2011, 10:25 AM
Mario looked lost today .. learning curve that I hope he picks up within 3 weeks

He did look lost, but there were a couple of times he was right at the QB. One was when Watt made his move and chased the QB and Earl cleaned it up. If Earl wasn't there, Mario would have wrapped up the QB as he was a step away.

What Mario did real well before was recognizing the difference between a running play and a passing play. Once he has that down, he will be great. Remember his first year he looked lost for a bit but then it all clicked. I think he is smart enough, athletic enough, and has enough financial incentive to pick it up.

Marcus
08-16-2011, 10:29 AM
You know, after only two weeks of practice, you'd think the Texans could beat the Jets at least 73-0 or something. Mario, Cushing and Ryans should be traded immediatly, it's obvious their backups are better. And that damn Schaub, trade him. Just cut our loses and go with Leinhart, it's obvious he our new QB anyway.

And AJ and Foster are on my shit list as well because of their horrible performance last night. :smiliepalm:

Yeah! John Wayne would love this thread, wouldn't he? :headhurts:

ThaJokaa
08-16-2011, 10:54 AM
what could we get for schaub and mario? both aren't going to cut it

/Sarcasm

Blake
08-16-2011, 11:14 AM
His last name is friggin FOUR letters long and we can't spell it right?

JJ WATT!! And he looks beastly!

Watts the big deal dude? :P

Mr teX
08-16-2011, 11:28 AM
Geez...:mariopalm: I certainly don't miss these threads.

new scheme put in just 2 weeks ago
new position
14 defensive plays
1st preseason game....= vanilla defensive/offensive plays


How on earth can anyone deduct any kind of sound logical analysis on a player of mario's caliber with all of the above factors in play?

This thread is beyond ridiculous not only for the reasons above, but also b/c he didn't even look bad.

cuppacoffee
08-16-2011, 12:03 PM
Geez...:mariopalm: I certainly don't miss these threads.

new scheme put in just 2 weeks ago
new position
14 defensive plays
1st preseason game....= vanilla defensive/offensive plays


How on earth can anyone deduct any kind of sound logical analysis on a player of mario's caliber with all of the above factors in play?

This thread is beyond ridiculous not only for the reasons above, but also b/c he didn't even look bad.



I've never been a Mario fan, but right now I am more concerned with Cushing.

The guy has been pumped up on something since high school, Ray Charles could see that.

He's been injured and is now off of whatever "juice" he was on.

I would explore trade options for him.

Someone flag this thread and prove me wrong at the end of this season.

:coffee:

Texecutioner
08-16-2011, 12:06 PM
I've never been a Mario fan, but right now I am more concerned with Cushing.

The guy has been pumped up on something since high school, Ray Charles could see that.

He's been injured and is now off of whatever "juice" he was on.

I would explore trade options for him.

Someone flag this thread and prove me wrong at the end of this season.

:coffee:

Cushing probably does not have great trade value right now. Not after a non impressive season and having the PED's label attached to him.

Mario most likely still does.

Thorn
08-16-2011, 12:10 PM
Yeah! John Wayne would love this thread, wouldn't he? :headhurts:

John Wayne would ignore this thread. He would find the nearest cheerleader and say "Hi there young lady. I'm thinkin' you should just quit that grinnin', and drop your linen."

leebigeztx
08-16-2011, 01:10 PM
Why trade him? If he can't play OLB, then just move him back to DE.


Nothing else needs to be said in this thread. I don't know how mario looked any lost than barwin. He rushed the passer, they ran away from him and the pass plays were 3 step drops. When the jets got in the red zone and the texans went 4 man front, it was the stunt of williams up the a gap that created the sack by adibi. If all else fail, put mario at 5 tech and find something else to do with smith who has done squat.

beerlover
08-16-2011, 01:17 PM
Nothing else needs to be said in this thread. I don't know how mario looked any lost than barwin. He rushed the passer, they ran away from him and the pass plays were 3 step drops. When the jets got in the red zone and the texans went 4 man front, it was the stunt of williams up the a gap that created the sack by adibi. If all else fail, put mario at 5 tech and find something else to do with smith who has done squat.

This is kinda what I'm thinking too. Wade will shift Mario accordingly, Smith needs to produce. Adibi is looking explosive @ OLB & Braman kid looks like a natural edge rusher.

b0ng
08-16-2011, 01:20 PM
This thread would have way more merit if this were week 4 of the preseason even. We might as well discuss what we could get for anybody in trade on the defense because there's just as much of a chance that Mario gets traded before preseason is over as there is with Schaub going somewhere because Matt Leinart threw a touchdown.

It's silly to start it this early and reminds me of the thread where he recorded no stats in his first preseason game of 2007 and went on to have like 12 sacks that year.

RagingBull
08-16-2011, 02:09 PM
Word on the street was that the Eagles had Asante Samuels on the trading block. Would anyone trade Mario for Asante straight up?

Texecutioner
08-16-2011, 02:12 PM
Word on the street was that the Eagles had Asante Samuels on the trading block. Would anyone trade Mario for Asante straight up?

I'd be more interested in Trent Cole, but I don't think the Eagles would trade Cole for Mario.

Chance_C
08-16-2011, 02:14 PM
Who in the batshit is JJ Watts, Kevin Walters, and Brooks Reeds? Tried my damndest to find them but no luck. Now if that Watts dude is anything like that Watt dude look out. Sorry, but that's like shopping at Wal Marts. I mean they even have a big effin sign that says Wal effin MART. Geez.

Edited to politely ask a moderator to change the title of this thread. I mean what if Mr. Watt himself reads this??

Allstar
08-16-2011, 02:20 PM
Who in the batshit is JJ Watts, Kevin Walters, and Brooks Reeds?

They all have lockers next to Matt Leinhart and Glover Quinn.

Chance_C
08-16-2011, 02:24 PM
They all have lockers next to Matt Leinhart and Glover Quinn.

Oh thanks, Allstars..

Thorn
08-16-2011, 02:30 PM
They all have lockers next to Matt Leinhart and Glover Quinn.

Right next to Schwab?

The Pencil Neck
08-16-2011, 03:59 PM
Right next to Schwab?

No, Schwab is across from them between Demarco Ryans and Shane Cody.

badboy
08-16-2011, 04:05 PM
Who in the batshit is JJ Watts, Kevin Walters, and Brooks Reeds? Tried my damndest to find them but no luck. Now if that Watts dude is anything like that Watt dude look out. Sorry, but that's like shopping at Wal Marts. I mean they even have a big effin sign that says Wal effin MART. Geez.

Edited to politely ask a moderator to change the title of this thread. I mean what if Mr. Watt himself reads this??You actually look at the sign when you go into Wal Mart?

Chance_C
08-16-2011, 04:09 PM
You actually look at the sign when you go into Wal Mart?


Seen it enough to know that it isn't Wal Marts!

gafftop
08-16-2011, 04:38 PM
Maybe a little blunt with my original post. I am not saying Mario is not a good player, he just doesn't fit the position of OLB, I think.

He is possibly the only player that MAY have some trade value that would make any sense to explore the possibility of a trade. His high cap number (if it is high) would allow us to acquire some players that could help us this year. Also since this is his last year of his contract, I am concerned that at the end of the season we could possibly end up getting basically nothing for him but a pick based on us losing him in FA. I guess we could franchise but then we have him at a high cap number and we may not be able to trade him, then what.

Moving him back to end has been brought up and eventually that may happen( I think this is most probable outcome) but I think the body change he made to OLB will be a negative.

Again I know just first preseason game but he doesn't seem to have the speed or the quick change of motion (agility) to play the position.

I would hate to see Mario be Wade's Carr. Right now Mario has VALUE at the end of the season we lose some of our bargaining power. I don't think anything will be done now or needs to be done now but it will be interesting to follow in the coming weeks.

fiasco west
08-16-2011, 04:55 PM
Maybe a little blunt with my original post. I am not saying Mario is not a good player, he just doesn't fit the position of OLB, I think.

He is possibly the only player that MAY have some trade value that would make any sense to explore the possibility of a trade. His high cap number (if it is high) would allow us to acquire some players that could help us this year. Also since this is his last year of his contract, I am concerned that at the end of the season we could possibly end up getting basically nothing for him but a pick based on us losing him in FA. I guess we could franchise but then we have him at a high cap number and we may not be able to trade him, then what.

Moving him back to end has been brought up and eventually that may happen( I think this is most probable outcome) but I think the body change he made to OLB will be a negative.

Again I know just first preseason game but he doesn't seem to have the speed or the quick change of motion (agility) to play the position.

I would hate to see Mario be Wade's Carr. Right now Mario has VALUE at the end of the season we lose some of our bargaining power. I don't think anything will be done now or needs to be done now but it will be interesting to follow in the coming weeks.

Mario is losing no trading value.

If he goes out there and stinks at OLB, 4-3 teams will just say "He sucks at OLB" and still will want the guy on their team.

Guys don't lose trade value because of one bad season playing out of position. The NFL FOs are smarter than that. Also if we did just let him go then we'd get the cap space, we are never getting 'nothing' back for him.

Any ways we can assume what happens...but Mario has proven before that preseason means nothing and by the end of the year we might be begging that McNair gives him his money instead of just franchising him.

ObsiWan
08-16-2011, 06:40 PM
Yet none of the sacks were by Mario or contributable to him. I saw one play where he was low blocked off his feet by one guy. I am willing to give him time to learn OLB, but as a final contract year & $14million against cap, I am expecting big things. I see nothing wrong with considering deals if offered. If he adapts and gets sacks that Phillips says he will AND he will negotiate a reasonable deal, I'm ok with bringing him back. I think it is odd when people use AJ in this thread as a comparison.

I saw that play. It should have been called a leg whip. Watch again and you'll see what I mean.

El Tejano
08-17-2011, 09:27 AM
Okay. On the first Adibi sack, Mario did play a big role in that one. He actually was just about to get to Sanchez but the OLman picked him up at the last second which freed up Adibi. Looks as if they were about to get there at the same time and it was pick your poison for the OLman.

Just saw it this morning!

mussop
08-17-2011, 09:57 AM
In all fairness to the OP, he did say this is not about one preseason game that it's after watching Mario for years. If you all want to get on his case at least do it for the right reason. Sheesh!

gafftop
08-21-2011, 10:43 AM
Ok, just finished reviewing 2nd game. Observations and thoughts

1. A little better than last week but no real change. 2nd and 3rd play Ok bull rush. 4th play pass right over him. Anybody remember Mario knocking down a pass? It seems with his height he would be knocking balls down right and left. Does he not recognize what is going on so therefore doesn't get arms up? 5th play Mario makes tackle as he was on the offside and slid down after being blocke by aWR. 6th play Mario block by TE. Slow recognition
7th play handled by 74 ....... 8th play handled by 74 ..... On fumble 64 had Mario neutralized ENOUGH
2. Mario neutralized pretty much by 64 and 74. Seems an though they are able to engage him and then tie him up and netralize. Maybe just too tall?
3. Mario dropped back in coverage OK. I thought he wasn't going to be doing that but whatever.
4. Mario still able to bull rush effectively, still no other moves. I think maybe a big part of the reason that he has no other moves is that he does not have the quickness/agility/explosion etc to be able to make any of those other moves work so it seems he has no other moves.
5. Mentioned above about recognition. He just doesn't seem to have that instinct to do he right thing at the right time. I think that instinct is the ability to know what is going on, recognition, and then reacting. He sometimes seems to hesitate and I think he is not sure about what to do. You know how some QB's are better about recognition, I am beginning to think maybe that is one of the problems Mario has. He does not know what to do next. That is maybe why his bullrush is Ok is because he just goes.
6. At 1:20 left in 1st half Spencer said " he is a big OLB but he would be an excellent 3-4 defensive end" I agree and said it before that I think he may end up there. I just hope the Texans start preparing him now not later.

Why the hell do I keep bringing up Mario? I guess because I want the Texans to be the best they can be now and in the future. Mario has a certain worth now that I still think will be less at the end of the season. If we want to get better this year because of the cap our only option may be to make a trade. Mario because of his cap number, this being his contract year and the amount he is going to want next year, trade value and value to the Texans in this new scheme I think is the only player that warrants a look as far a a trade goes.

That said you don't make a trade unless it is advantageous to the Texans, but don't expect to get an all[pro and and first rounder either. If a trade is made I want a player that will make the Texans better THIS year not future round draft choices only. Of course to make this deal work you need a partner and I am inclined to think there may be few if any out there. My hope is the Texans are exploring the possibilities or at least listening to the offers if they are out there. And if not look at other possibilities to utilize him on this team this year and start preparing now.

I trust Wade is seeing the same thing.

My rambling is over.

beerlover
08-21-2011, 10:49 AM
Problem with trading Mario is what other team would be willing to absorb that kinda of cap hit? That said, to me he remains best suited as a 5 tech DE. I don't know maybe JJ Watt could play NT in Wade Phillips scheme? Then you have Barwin/Brooks as your starting OLB's. :mariopalm:

MEGA SWATT
08-21-2011, 10:52 AM
Seen it enough to know that it isn't Wal Marts!

Dudes, yous needs tos calms downs as bits!:brando:

gafftop
08-21-2011, 10:55 AM
Problem with trading Mario is what other team would be willing to absorb that kinda of cap hit? That said, to me he remains best suited as a 5 tech DE. I don't know maybe JJ Watt could play NT in Wade Phillips scheme? Then you have Barwin/Brooks as your starting OLB's. :mariopalm:

I agree that there may not be a trading partner out there.

DocBar
08-21-2011, 11:09 AM
Problem with trading Mario is what other team would be willing to absorb that kinda of cap hit? That said, to me he remains best suited as a 5 tech DE. I don't know maybe JJ Watt could play NT in Wade Phillips scheme? Then you have Barwin/Brooks as your starting OLB's. :mariopalm:After the season starts and a team with serious playoff aspirations see a major need or a starter goes down with an injury, a trade could could appear. Otherwise, they'd just wait for the offseason when he leaves via FA and we get a 3rd for him as a comp pick.

mussop
08-21-2011, 11:15 AM
I just dont see Mario figuring out OLB anytime soon and we cant afford to not have the best players on the field who give us our best chance to win. If he cant except playing where its best for the team then we should explore trading him. I still believe this move was made to please an unhappy Mario.

People are going to think Im crazy but if we arent going to put him back at DE I would like to see him and Cushing switch positions for a bit to see if he could handle ILB. At least his size would bulk up the middle a little bit. He and the team would be better served with him trying to split Guards and Centers than sitting outside engaged/locked up or trying to run around Tackles IMO.

Some of you older guys might remember a 300 lbs ILB that played for the Steelers back in the day, Levon Kirkland. Dude was a beast.

ChampionTexan
08-21-2011, 11:27 AM
Problem with trading Mario is what other team would be willing to absorb that kinda of cap hit? That said, to me he remains best suited as a 5 tech DE. I don't know maybe JJ Watt could play NT in Wade Phillips scheme? Then you have Barwin/Brooks as your starting OLB's. :mariopalm:

I'm not a proponent of trading Mario right now, but realistically, if the Texans did try to trade him, it's highly likely that any potential partner would require Mario to restructure and extend his contract rather than exposing themselves to both the cap hit and the risk associated with only one year currently remaining.

The Pencil Neck
08-21-2011, 11:50 AM
I just dont see Mario figuring out OLB anytime soon and we cant afford to not have the best players on the field who give us our best chance to win. If he cant except playing where its best for the team then we should explore trading him. I still believe this move was made to please an unhappy Mario.

People are going to think Im crazy but if we arent going to put him back at DE I would like to see him and Cushing switch positions for a bit to see if he could handle ILB. At least his size would bulk up the middle a little bit. He and the team would be better served with him trying to split Guards and Centers than sitting outside engaged/locked up or trying to run around Tackles IMO.

Some of you older guys might remember a 300 lbs ILB that played for the Steelers back in the day, Levon Kirkland. Dude was a beast.

There was also Jeremiah Trotter playing MLB for the Eagles. Guy was a thumper against the run.

I was actually considering the same thing last night. The problem with Mario at ILB in this particular defense is that the ILBs have more coverage responsibilities than the OLBs. It would actually put Mario in an even more alien position than he's in right now.

So I'm not seeing it.

Hottoddie
08-21-2011, 12:01 PM
Problem with trading Mario is what other team would be willing to absorb that kinda of cap hit? That said, to me he remains best suited as a 5 tech DE. I don't know maybe JJ Watt could play NT in Wade Phillips scheme? Then you have Barwin/Brooks as your starting OLB's. :mariopalm:

This is the scenario that I see happening.

Perhaps the coaches in an attempt to keep Mario happy moved him to OLB knowing that he would struggle & talk himself into accepting the DE role. A lineup of Mario, Watt, Smith on the line with Barwin, DeMeco, Cushing & Reed at linebacker sounds like the best starting lineup we could field at this time.

Lucky
08-21-2011, 12:05 PM
Why the hell do I keep bringing up Mario?
Have you ever posted on any other player?

mussop
08-21-2011, 12:07 PM
There was also Jeremiah Trotter playing MLB for the Eagles. Guy was a thumper against the run.

I was actually considering the same thing last night. The problem with Mario at ILB in this particular defense is that the ILBs have more coverage responsibilities than the OLBs. It would actually put Mario in an even more alien position than he's in right now.

So I'm not seeing it.

The way I understand it is that both ILBs are responsible for runners coming through the A and B gaps with the Weak ILB having more pass coverage duties and the Strong ILB (Where I'm suggesting Mario play) having more of a pass-rush role. Everything I have read about Wades version of the 3/4 suggest this. Of course he will have some coverage responsibilities but there are things that could be done to limit this.

Not saying this would defiantly work but it seems like it has more merit than putting him outside where his size is neutralized 99% of the time.

hradhak
08-21-2011, 12:09 PM
When we drafted Watt my impression was that Mario would be the DE and Watt would be the backup. We'd have Barwin and Reed as the starters.
I don't see trading Mario as an option. No team has that cap room and he's one of the better pass rushers in the game. If he doesn't work at OLB (which I think he will) we move him to DE.

DocBar
08-21-2011, 12:11 PM
I'm not a proponent of trading Mario right now, but realistically, if the Texans did try to trade him, it's highly likely that any potential partner would require Mario to restructure and extend his contract rather than exposing themselves to both the cap hit and the risk associated with only one year currently remaining.Having the team extend the player and rework the current $$ to a cap-friendly # is common during trades. I'm not on the trade MW now bandwagon, but if the opportunity presents itself, strike while the iron is hot.

gafftop
08-21-2011, 01:19 PM
That is almost as dumb as something Dex would say.

Was this a compliment? Glad to have you on board. Also Doc I am more hopeful now. Still concerned about NT, LBs, and 2nd WR. If we could make an improvement in a couple of those areas I would feel a lot better. We may be able to improve some when other teams cut players but to PU quality players I see a trade as the only possibilty. I would hate to see Mario walk and only get the compensation draft pick, but we do PU cap room for next year. That doesn't do us any good this year. I think good teams make decisions that improve their teams. New England is the perfect example. They do not hesitate to trade players if they think they are gaining more value than they are giving. If Mario walks the Texans value goes down. If we are able to make a good trade we help our chances of making playoffs THIS YEAR.

So this brings me to my original question, What do you think we could get for Mario?

JamesBill
08-21-2011, 01:24 PM
I think we could get a 1st round pick but frankly I would not do that. I have no trust in Smithiack to get a player better for our team than Mario no matter what the defensive scheme.

Amobi Okoye
Duane Brown
Brian Cushing
Kareem Jackson

2 busts, one better than average OL, and a roider.

gafftop
08-21-2011, 01:28 PM
What players could we get that would help us this year?
How about a quality NT and 3-4 LB?

PHAROAH
08-21-2011, 02:34 PM
Mario isn't a great fit in a 3-4 scheme but i think he will do pretty decent he will need some time. The issue that I see with mario is that he isn't sudden off the line of scrimmage and he isn't very mobile in space and maybe a trade would be good but I would need a player like Brian Orakpo or Tamba Hali & at least a 2nd round pick in return for Mario if he doesn't pan out in our new scheme.

DocBar
08-21-2011, 07:25 PM
I wouldn't limit myself to only defensive players. I would be open to draft picks or a combination of players and picks. They wouldn't necessarily have to be elite players, either. The only positions I wouldn't be looking at are QB, RB, TE and WR. Everything else would be on the table. We need depth everywhere and I'd rather see us get that depth than see MW walk away at the end of the season and us only get a comp pick that would be, at best, a 3rd.

HJam72
08-21-2011, 08:01 PM
I think we could get a 1st round pick but frankly I would not do that. I have no trust in Smithiack to get a player better for our team than Mario no matter what the defensive scheme.

Amobi Okoye
Duane Brown
Brian Cushing
Kareem Jackson

2 busts, one better than average OL, and a roider.

I don't either, with regards to the D, but Wade can...

gafftop
08-23-2011, 02:07 PM
Have you ever posted on any other player?

LOL You know I have. David Carr was one of the first when i joined along with the drafting of Mario. Chris Brown the RB, Fagins, our ole CB from the Raiders forget his name just to name a few. Man is there a trend here. Also one of my favorites, not a player but Kubiak/Smith. LOL

leebigeztx
08-23-2011, 02:41 PM
When we drafted Watt my impression was that Mario would be the DE and Watt would be the backup. We'd have Barwin and Reed as the starters.
I don't see trading Mario as an option. No team has that cap room and he's one of the better pass rushers in the game. If he doesn't work at OLB (which I think he will) we move him to DE.

I don't know why its so hard for people on this board to understand. He's the best lineman on the team. If push comes to shove, move him back to end like bruce smith, and have him rush from there. Worry about smith later and his hurt feelings. Mario isa known commodity,pro bowler, all pro type. There isn't anyone else on this defense who can make that claim. I thought it was a bad idea to stand him up anyway and said as much on sirius when the whole idea was floated. Bruce smith never stood up and rushed the passer. The bills when wade was there played with wbig ted in the middle, smith and hanson on the ends and those were his best defenses. When he was with the chargers, igor and castillo on the ends, flanked by jamaal williams. I'm not sure how or why the best option wouldn't be to have mario on the line.

Ole Miss Texan
08-23-2011, 03:15 PM
Damione Lewis seems to be a pretty stout guy... how would he be as a 'run stopper' of a Nose Tackle? Mario/Lewis/Watt could be a strong d-line to run occasion if you ask me.

........Mario - Lewis - Watt........
Barwin - Demeco - Cushing - Reed

Corrosion
08-23-2011, 03:16 PM
Damione Lewis seems to be a pretty stout guy... how would he be as a 'run stopper' of a Nose Tackle? Mario/Lewis/Watt could be a strong d-line to run occasion if you ask me.

........Mario - Lewis - Watt........
Barwin - Demeco - Cushing - Reed

I get the impression that MW doesnt want to play as a 34 De.

Ole Miss Texan
08-23-2011, 03:19 PM
I get the impression that MW doesnt want to play as a 34 De.
That's the talk. But Wade is going to have 1,000 different formations. Personally, I really really want to see Mario and Watt playing DE opposite each other in the 3-4 on occasion with Barwin and Reed as our OLBs. Doesn't have to be full time if Mario and Antonio are both gonna get booty hurt.

steelbtexan
08-23-2011, 04:15 PM
That's the talk. But Wade is going to have 1,000 different formations. Personally, I really really want to see Mario and Watt playing DE opposite each other in the 3-4 on occasion with Barwin and Reed as our OLBs. Doesn't have to be full time if Mario and Antonio are both gonna get booty hurt.

This is what I want to see too.

MW could really help put this defense in the top 10 if he was willing to move to DE. But MW is appearing to be a me 1st type guy. Why am I not suprised.

fiasco west
08-23-2011, 04:35 PM
Was this a compliment? Glad to have you on board. Also Doc I am more hopeful now. Still concerned about NT, LBs, and 2nd WR. If we could make an improvement in a couple of those areas I would feel a lot better. We may be able to improve some when other teams cut players but to PU quality players I see a trade as the only possibilty. I would hate to see Mario walk and only get the compensation draft pick, but we do PU cap room for next year. That doesn't do us any good this year. I think good teams make decisions that improve their teams. New England is the perfect example. They do not hesitate to trade players if they think they are gaining more value than they are giving. If Mario walks the Texans value goes down. If we are able to make a good trade we help our chances of making playoffs THIS YEAR.

So this brings me to my original question, What do you think we could get for Mario?

Patriots trade guys that are just right at the end of their prime, the other teams prbly think they are going to get more out of the guy but the Pats know better.

They don't trade away guys just starting to hit their prime.

badboy
08-23-2011, 04:37 PM
This is what I want to see too.

MW could really help put this defense in the top 10 if he was willing to move to DE. But MW is appearing to be a me 1st type guy. Why am I not suprised.What are you saying? Mario played DE & was moved to OLB by Wade. Mario would go back to DE if told to. He could expect more in next contract as a DE than OLB.


MY BAD. I forgot Corrosion's post about 3-4 DE you were refering to. My apology.

mussop
08-23-2011, 07:27 PM
What are you saying? Mario played DE & was moved to OLB by Wade. Mario would go back to DE if told to. He could expect more in next contract as a DE than OLB.


MY BAD. I forgot Corrosion's post about 3-4 DE you were refering to. My apology.

But what was the real reason behind the move? Thats the million dollar question.

badboy
08-23-2011, 09:01 PM
But what was the real reason behind the move? Thats the million dollar question.I think Wade Phillips knew he could get a very good DE in the draft. I think he was gambling on two things at least. One that there was a decent chance that Mario could be converted to an above avg if not Ware type OLB. Second that the DE he would draft @ #11 would be able to replace Mario on the new defensive line. I think Wade's pre-draft evaluation convinced him that there were several options at OLB to act as an insurance policy in case the "experiment" failed. Reed was simply a plum that slid to us. I can picture Wade saying "Mercy!" when he was able to send that card up to commissioner.

leebigeztx
08-23-2011, 10:39 PM
But what was the real reason behind the move? Thats the million dollar question.

Maybe they thought it would incorporate the talent better. There is no way mario wanted to do this because the franchise tag for a de is 2nd only to a qb. The franchise tag for a lb which includes all lbs isn't even close. Mario is a team guy and was told it would be easier, but its harder once you've established yourself. Andre carter tried it twice and failed. Aaron campman tried it and moved on. Bruce smith never stood up in the 3-4 as an outside backer. The team would be a lot better defensively with mario as the rde vs olb. His size and the protection of his legs are a huge issue. Mario coming out of the 3pt stand lower his pad level and allows his explosion in leverage. Mario standing up exposes him a lot.

Rey
08-23-2011, 11:00 PM
Maybe they thought it would incorporate the talent better. There is no way mario wanted to do this because the franchise tag for a de is 2nd only to a qb. The franchise tag for a lb which includes all lbs isn't even close. Mario is a team guy and was told it would be easier, but its harder once you've established yourself. Andre carter tried it twice and failed. Aaron campman tried it and moved on. Bruce smith never stood up in the 3-4 as an outside backer. The team would be a lot better defensively with mario as the rde vs olb. His size and the protection of his legs are a huge issue. Mario coming out of the 3pt stand lower his pad level and allows his explosion in leverage. Mario standing up exposes him a lot.

I disagree with the part about the defense being better with him at de, but when I get a chance I'm going to rep your post.

Just because you don't care for the move doesn't mean Mario getting there involved some kind of whining, back handed behavior or appeasement from the coaches.

I think that your post was very objective and reasonable.

Doppelganger
08-23-2011, 11:04 PM
I wouldn't limit myself to only defensive players. I would be open to draft picks or a combination of players and picks. They wouldn't necessarily have to be elite players, either. The only positions I wouldn't be looking at are QB, RB, TE and WR. Everything else would be on the table. We need depth everywhere and I'd rather see us get that depth than see MW walk away at the end of the season and us only get a comp pick that would be, at best, a 3rd.

He won't just walk. We will slap the franchise tag on him. If we want him, we will sign him to a new deal. If not, we can then engineer a trade. But he won't walk for nothing, that's for sure.

mussop
08-23-2011, 11:09 PM
Maybe they thought it would incorporate the talent better. There is no way mario wanted to do this because the franchise tag for a de is 2nd only to a qb. The franchise tag for a lb which includes all lbs isn't even close. Mario is a team guy and was told it would be easier, but its harder once you've established yourself. Andre carter tried it twice and failed. Aaron campman tried it and moved on. Bruce smith never stood up in the 3-4 as an outside backer. The team would be a lot better defensively with mario as the rde vs olb. His size and the protection of his legs are a huge issue. Mario coming out of the 3pt stand lower his pad level and allows his explosion in leverage. Mario standing up exposes him a lot.

I think you are wrong about that. It was obvious that Mario wasn't happy about the thought of playing DE in a 3/4. Several articles came out talking about how he could be the next Bruce Smith. No doubt trying to convince him that he would still be in a position to get after the QB. Still there were no signs of him happily accepting the role. The next thing you know he's being touted as the next Demarcus Ware / QB killing machine.

Why else would the team not redo his contract? He isn't injured, he is young and been to pro bowls and we are up against the cap and could really use the cap space the new deal would bring. I hope I'm wrong but this is how I see it and I fully expect this to become a bad situation real quick if Mario doesn't start blowing up at OLB.

badboy
08-23-2011, 11:09 PM
He won't just walk. We will slap the franchise tag on him. If we want him, we will sign him to a new deal. If not, we can then engineer a trade. But he won't walk for nothing, that's for sure.

Agreed.

leebigeztx
08-23-2011, 11:19 PM
I disagree with the part about the defense being better with him at de, but when I get a chance I'm going to rep your post.

Just because you don't care for the move doesn't mean Mario getting there involved some kind of whining, back handed behavior or appeasement from the coaches.

I think that your post was very objective and reasonable.

Here is my issue and I've dicussed this on sirius and we all agree. Mario is athletic, but he's not athletic like peppers despite the numbers. Like peppers though, his explosion out of the 3pt stand to get under a players pad level is what makes him special. Standing up, he will never be able to get the kind of leverage he needs. That's why I watched him being blocked by a te vs the saints. He is not playing fast and not using his athleticism which is best asset.

When you look at the prototype as olb, its the 6'3 250lbs guys. Ware is the exception, but he was trained as a raw guy coming out. Look at the steelers,ravens,pats, and the most successful 3-4 guys and you will never see a guy like mario as olb. I will say, he looked better in coverage and made a couple of stops vs the run, but guys are getting on his legs and getting him out of balance. I think when push comes to shove and if reed is actually playing as well in real games like he has in the preseason, it will be a lot easier to move mario back to rde and work smith in as relief for jj and mario.

mussop
08-24-2011, 07:40 AM
If Mario is moved back to DE I would rather see Watt moved inside with Smith on one side and Mario on the other. Let's get our three best D-linemen on the field.

Ole Miss Texan
08-24-2011, 09:05 AM
Why else would the team not redo his contract? He isn't injured, he is young and been to pro bowls and we are up against the cap and could really use the cap space the new deal would bring. I hope I'm wrong but this is how I see it and I fully expect this to become a bad situation real quick if Mario doesn't start blowing up at OLB.
Well for one, the organization couldn't even talk to Mario about redoing his contract during the months of the lockout. And second, they restructured current deals to clear some cap room. You can't restructure a contract with one year left on it... you have to renegotiate and extend it. I think with the players the Texans were talking with and the ones they brought in, they knew what they had to do to "stay under the cap" and it was a fairly easy thing to do. Negotiating a new contract with Mario is going to be very high dollar, time consuming process that they weren't going to get done in 24-48 hours. Lastly, I think the Texans ARE smart in seeing how this year plays out, evaluate him and try and work on a deal. Heck they can even franchise him next season and work on extending him then.

gafftop
08-24-2011, 09:13 AM
Well for one, the organization couldn't even talk to Mario about redoing his contract during the months of the lockout. And second, the restructured current deals to clear some cap room. You can't restructure a contract with one year left on it... you have to renegotiate and extend it. I think with the players the Texans were talking with and the ones they brought in, they knew what they had to do to "stay under the cap" and it was a fairly easy thing to do. Negotiating a new contract with Mario is going to be very high dollar, time consuming process that they weren't going to get done in 24-48 hours. Lastly, I think the Texas ARE smart in seeing how this year plays out, evaluate him and try and work on a deal. Heck they can even franchise him next season and work on extending him then.

The Texans for once are being smart. I take that back they were smart on the Joseph deal also. They see the same thing we see. I put the chances at 33 percent that he is with the Texans next year. I will say that I don't look forward to seeing him because believe me he will be motivated.

gafftop
08-24-2011, 01:45 PM
He won't just walk. We will slap the franchise tag on him. If we want him, we will sign him to a new deal. If not, we can then engineer a trade. But he won't walk for nothing, that's for sure.

My only concern is trying to be the best we can be THIS year. I guess I am still concerned about the LBs and NT positions just to name a couple. IF we could get fair value for him in a trade for actual players that would shore up those areas i think that would be the best option. Maybe not practical I don't know.

I know there is a lot of talk about just moving him back to DE. I don't think Mario will be a happy camper if this happens because that would signal that he failed in moving to LB. If we don't think he is motivated now just wait.

One of my main reasons for trading Mario is his knack for always being hurt. It is not season ending but it always lowers his performance down fron 100 percent. My feeling is a below 100% Mario is no better than his back-ups now. I think the injury will occur or be announced sooner than later.

I am not so sure about the tag him and trade him scenario. What if you tag and no one wants him. You end up tying up a lot of cap space. May end up letting him walk which leaves me filling that we did not get as much as we could have gotten for him.

Who knows the Texans may trade him before the season is over? I have been pleasantly surprised lately by the FO decisions this year.

Anyway makes for an interesting story to watch. I have watched and replayed more preseason action this year than any before. lol

False Start
08-25-2011, 08:12 AM
Trading Mario Williams for Asante Samuel: Would it Make Sense? (http://thexlog.com/201108250801/xtra-point-football/nfl/trading-mario-williams-for-asante-samuel-would-it-make-sense/)

By Jayson Braddock
NFL Scout

It would make sense for Houston because they would have now upgraded the worst secondary in the league to one of the best. The tandem of Johnathan Joseph and Asante Samuel would be a top 5 duo. The loss of Mario Williams wouldn’t affect the team as much as it would have in previous years. Phillips’ system causes havoc and Brooks Reed and Connor Barwin have both shown to be capable of bringing it. The Texans have always struggled with getting interceptions. Samuel is one of, if not the best at getting picks. He’s not going to be the best in coverage or tackling but he doesn’t have to be in the Texans defense. He has a knack of being around the ball. The pressure this defense will get will cause more turnover opportunities and less time in coverage.

DocBar
08-25-2011, 08:25 AM
He won't just walk. We will slap the franchise tag on him. If we want him, we will sign him to a new deal. If not, we can then engineer a trade. But he won't walk for nothing, that's for sure.

If they tag him, at least it will be at lb instead of de pay. That should save the Texans some jingle.

infantrycak
08-25-2011, 08:55 AM
If they tag him, at least it will be at lb instead of de pay. That should save the Texans some jingle.

Unless they changed the rule that won't matter because it is either the franchise number OR 20% above the previous season's salary, whichever is higher.

gafftop
08-25-2011, 09:14 AM
A big assumption is being made that if we franchise, someone is going to want him. I say $16 million(guess) for one year I am not sure you will have a lot of takers. Especially if Mario has some type of injury like the last two years. i agree when Mario is 100 % healthy and 100% motivated he is a factor. My observation though is you can count the number of plays on one hand two at most when this occurs. That is not to say that Phillips may be able to get more out of him.

Would you trade for Asante????

gafftop
08-25-2011, 09:22 AM
Toss in a LB or NT and I think it is a no brainer. That said I think Mario will be better in Philadelphia than he will be in Houston. Mario has been coddled in Houston by the coaches, players, writers, and fans. In Philly that will not be the case. He will be more motivated by outside sources. Plus being traded may wake him up, maybe not.

gafftop
08-28-2011, 02:04 PM
I disremember Watt's number being called. What do you mean by looking good?

I repeat Watt looks good.

noxiousdog
08-28-2011, 03:37 PM
Unless they changed the rule that won't matter because it is either the franchise number OR 20% above the previous season's salary, whichever is higher.

If they franchise him, it would be with the intention of trading him. The salary wouldn't matter because the new team would only trade for him if they were interested in negotiating a long term deal.

Sent from my PG06100 using Tapatalk

infantrycak
08-28-2011, 03:55 PM
If they franchise him, it would be with the intention of trading him. The salary wouldn't matter because the new team would only trade for him if they were interested in negotiating a long term deal.

If you say so. They franchised Dunta, didn't trade him and attempted to work out a deal.

DocBar
08-28-2011, 04:41 PM
If you say so. They franchised Dunta, didn't trade him and attempted to work out a deal.And let him walk away a UFA while we got nothing in return. I hope the FO learned a lesson on that.

infantrycak
08-28-2011, 04:51 PM
And let him walk away a UFA while we got nothing in return. I hope the FO learned a lesson on that.

What lesson should they have learned? - pay anything a decent player demands?

DocBar
08-28-2011, 04:54 PM
What lesson should they have learned? - pay anything a decent player demands?Hell no!! Trade them if you can and get something for them. I know it takes two to tango, but it doesn't seem like the Texans are very good in that department.

Ryan
08-28-2011, 04:54 PM
http://bluntobject.files.wordpress.com/2010/03/not-this-shit-again.jpg?w=300&h=391



I thought this thread died already :vincepalm:

fiasco west
08-28-2011, 05:32 PM
And let him walk away a UFA while we got nothing in return. I hope the FO learned a lesson on that.

We got cap space in return. In that instance the player wasn't worth the amount of cap he wanted to tie up. So let em walk. We have a better CB now, although the FO was very silly starting two young CBs last season. That was a very Houston Texan thing to do.

DocBar
08-28-2011, 09:04 PM
I would contact Seattle and see about getting Adam Curry and Marcus Trufant for MW. They could really use an elite 4-3 DE. :stirpot:

gafftop
08-28-2011, 09:10 PM
http://bluntobject.files.wordpress.com/2010/03/not-this-shit-again.jpg?w=300&h=391



i thought this thread died already :vincepalm:

lol