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CloakNNNdagger
08-07-2011, 07:48 AM
It's good that it will be more of a rebuild.............I don't want to recognize much of anything from last year's D.:wadepalm:

Phillips tears up Houston's defense, putrid last season.
By Dale Robertson

HOUSTON — Not quite a week into training camp, the Texans’ offense — with all of three new faces — is doing post-graduate level work, even with injuries and illness creating some disruptions.

The defense, on the other hand, is barely finishing freshman orientation. In addition to the upheaval in the locker room, the philosophy and the terminology is new for everyone.

This is what happens when a team plays as ineptly as the Texans did last season, finishing last in pass defense and 29th in points allowed as soaring playoff hopes gave way to a sinking 6-10 reality.

“It’s a whole new defense,” said free-agent acquisition Danieal Manning, a safety acquired from the Chicago Bears.

Adds defensive end Antonio Smith: “The calls are different, and the names of things are different. You have to reteach yourself everything you’ve learned over your entire career. But you’ve got to be open-minded. You can’t resist, because we didn’t have much success last year.”

What’s happening in the Texans’ case is a nearly total, top-to-bottom makeover. Just one position coach, the defensive line’s Bill Kollar, kept his job.

This wasn’t a house cleaning. This was a tear-down.

Bush’s replacement, Wade Phillips, began his NFL coaching career in Houston in 1976. He brought with him the 3-4 defense he first deployed 30 years ago this summer as a rookie coordinator under his father, Bum, in New Orleans.

Asked if the Texans are the toughest rehab project he has yet encountered, Phillips smiled.

“You usually get hired because things weren’t going too well before you got there,” he said. “It’s the same kind of challenge here as everywhere else. I think we started five rookies that first season in New Orleans.”

It appears the Texans will start only one, top draft choice J. J. Watt, at left defensive end. But Mario Williams and Connor Barwin are “rookie” outside linebackers and Glover Quin is a “rookie” strong safety. These are major transitions.

Just ask Quin.

“As a corner, you’re mostly just playing your receiver,” he said. “As a safety, you have to play tight ends, you have to read the run game, you have to read the passing game, you have to cover bigger bodies.”

Defensive tackle Earl Mitchell, in turn, is adjusting to being a full-time nose guard, the fulcrum in the 3-4. And outside linebacker Brian Cushing has moved inside, where he’ll be sharing turf with DeMeco Ryans.

Ryans is coming off a nearly lost season after he tore an Achilles tendon early, while Cushing is still rehabbing from offseason knee surgery.

It could be a while before they’re on the field together, although Cushing is expected to be 100 percent for the season opener.

In the interim, Williams is arguably Phillips’ major individual project as he tries to find another quarterback hunter in the mold of Dallas’ DeMarcus Ware.

“The technique things are different,” said Williams, who has spent a good bit of time studying Ware on film. “I’m really excited, but I’ve got to (pay attention) in the classroom and focus on working on the fundamentals.”

Corner Johnathan Joseph and Manning, although proven veterans worthy of big-dollar contracts, were hardly known to their new teammates — or each other — just a week ago.

“I’m kind of coaching and learning at the same time,” Joseph said.

The former Bengal, Joseph, and the former Bear, Manning, are making a strong impression.

“I can already see that they’re going to be a vocal presence out there as well as a physical one,” cornerback Kareem Jackson said. “It’s going to be exciting.”

And, from a results standpoint, very, very different ... hopefully.


http://www.mysanantonio.com/sports/cowboys/article/Texans-D-more-a-rebuild-than-a-remodel-1751818.php#ixzz1ULXAxt9J

EllisUnit
08-07-2011, 08:34 AM
good find :).

noxiousdog
08-07-2011, 12:07 PM
To me, this has the feel of when the saints brought in gregg williams, overhauled their defense and won the superbowl.

they were accompanied by an a absurdly fight turnover margin that they havent gotten since, but theyve still been really good.

Sent from my PG06100 using Tapatalk

Wolf
08-07-2011, 03:47 PM
In the interim, Williams is arguably Phillips’ major individual project as he tries to find another quarterback hunter in the mold of Dallas’ DeMarcus Ware.

“The technique things are different,” said Williams, who has spent a good bit of time studying Ware on film. “I’m really excited, but I’ve got to (pay attention) in the classroom and focus on working on the fundamentals.”



plus there was a quote from Wade somewhere about Mario.. He said he noticed something about when he stood up, he would take a step back first and then go.


something along that lines

IDEXAN
08-07-2011, 04:49 PM
If Phillips can turn the Texans defenders into an effective 3-4 defense by the
time we face Indy in the season-opener, he is for sure a bona fide NFL Defense genius.

TexansFanatic
08-07-2011, 04:52 PM
At the risk of being a buzzkill, the fact that the Texans D is being rebuilt and essentially will be starting four rookies should temper expectations, especially for the first quarter of the season when players are still learning their new roles.

A player like Peyton Manning will be licking his chops in anticipation of picking apart an untested defense.

CloakNNNdagger
08-07-2011, 06:02 PM
At the risk of being a buzzkill, the fact that the Texans D is being rebuilt and essentially will be starting four rookies should temper expectations, especially for the first quarter of the season when players are still learning their new roles.

A player like Peyton Manning will be licking his chops in anticipation of picking apart an untested defense.

Probably not a terribly unrealistic view. But, on the other hand, Manning may be left licking his wounds while the Texans D is licking THEIR chop in anticipation of picking apart an untested Painter offense.

TexansFanatic
08-07-2011, 06:53 PM
Probably not a terribly unrealistic view. But, on the other hand, Manning may be left licking his wounds while the Texans D is licking THEIR chop in anticipation of picking apart an untested Painter offense.

Good Lord, where've I been? Looks like that neck surgery was pretty significant.

Does anyone know when Manning's target return date is?

Will he definitely miss the first game?

Kimmy
08-07-2011, 06:58 PM
Good Lord, where've I been? Looks like that neck surgery was pretty significant.

Does anyone know when Manning's target return date is?

Will he definitely miss the first game?

They are discussing our D over in the Colts forum

http://www.colts.com/forums/index.php?/topic/774-houston-texans/

Kimmy
08-07-2011, 07:01 PM
Good Lord, where've I been? Looks like that neck surgery was pretty significant.

Does anyone know when Manning's target return date is?

Will he definitely miss the first game?

And discussing his return here

http://www.colts.com/forums/index.php?/topic/730-when-will-manning-play/

b0ng
08-07-2011, 07:03 PM
At the risk of being a buzzkill, the fact that the Texans D is being rebuilt and essentially will be starting four rookies should temper expectations, especially for the first quarter of the season when players are still learning their new roles.

A player like Peyton Manning will be licking his chops in anticipation of picking apart an untested defense.

JJ Watt, but I don't think any other rookies are starters. Who do you have as rookie starters?

ObsiWan
08-07-2011, 07:04 PM
yeah, where have you been?
:)
Manning, Peyton is currently on the PUP list...
from RotoWorld (http://www.rotoworld.com/player/nfl/1493/peyton-manning)...

According to the Indianapolis Star, Peyton Manning (neck) was running and throwing with "decent velocity" at Colts practice on Wednesday.
Officially, there's still no timetable for when Manning might come off the PUP list, but this is obviously a sign that he's getting closer. The Star's Phillip Wilson expects Manning's practice participation to ramp up once the Colts break camp, and does not believe the iron man is in any danger of missing regular season action. Aug 3, 6:42 PM

TexansFanatic
08-07-2011, 07:24 PM
JJ Watt, but I don't think any other rookies are starters. Who do you have as rookie starters?

The article in the op mentions that Mario Williams and Connor Barwin are "rookie" outside linebackers and Glover Quin is a "rookie" strong safety. That's why I used the word "essentially."

b0ng
08-07-2011, 07:38 PM
The article in the op mentions that Mario Williams and Connor Barwin are "rookie" outside linebackers and Glover Quin is a "rookie strong safety. That's why I used the word "essentially."

I can buy Barwin and Quinn but Mario is a 5 year veteran and we expect him to have a much better season than especially the last season and most of the others.

Even then, I think the difference between starting actual rookies and just moving players to different yet similar spots is pretty wide and large.

thunderkyss
08-07-2011, 08:12 PM
At the risk of being a buzzkill, the fact that the Texans D is being rebuilt and essentially will be starting four rookies should temper expectations, especially for the first quarter of the season when players are still learning their new roles.

A player like Peyton Manning will be licking his chops in anticipation of picking apart an untested defense.

I think some people are making too big a deal about some of the position changes.

Quin is going to be fine at safety, he's a zone CB.... it's not that big of a transition.

Mario has played standing for us on several occasions, he's also dropped into coverage & looked pretty good doing it, plenty of times.

Connor, yeah, he's essentially a rookie.

I think the defense is going to be much better, much sooner than most people think.

Why?

Because those guys want to get out there & get after the ball. Like they did in 2009. Wade is going to let them do that, let them do what they've trained their whole lives to do.

Not that wait & see crap we've played for most of our existence.

TexansFanatic
08-07-2011, 08:15 PM
I think some people are making too big a deal about some of the position changes.

Quin is going to be fine at safety, he's a zone CB.... it's not that big of a transition.

Mario has played standing for us on several occasions, he's also dropped into coverage & looked pretty good doing it, plenty of times.

Connor, yeah, he's essentially a rookie.

I think the defense is going to be much better, much sooner than most people think.

Why?

Because those guys want to get out there & get after the ball. Like they did in 2009. Wade is going to let them do that, let them do what they've trained their whole lives to do.

Not that wait & see crap we've played for most of our existence.

Solid post. I absolutely despise "read and react." Please, football gods, let's see some attacking D in Houston!

badboy
08-07-2011, 08:20 PM
At the risk of being a buzzkill, the fact that the Texans D is being rebuilt and essentially will be starting four rookies should temper expectations, especially for the first quarter of the season when players are still learning their new roles.

A player like Peyton Manning will be licking his chops in anticipation of picking apart an untested defense.Wade mentioned one of his prior teams(New Orleans, I think) started 4 true rookies. I think KJ will benefit from having Joseph and Manning on field. I also think Quin wil be bettwer than safeties we had last season so KJ will be better. Or maybe not.

badboy
08-07-2011, 08:23 PM
At the risk of being a buzzkill, the fact that the Texans D is being rebuilt and essentially will be starting four rookies should temper expectations, especially for the first quarter of the season when players are still learning their new roles.

A player like Peyton Manning will be licking his chops in anticipation of picking apart an untested defense.Manning will be licking his chops --to get the blood off.

TexansFanatic
08-07-2011, 08:34 PM
Wade mentioned one of his prior teams(New Orleans, I think) started 4 true rookies.

Five.

GuerillaBlack
08-07-2011, 08:58 PM
And discussing his return here

http://www.colts.com/forums/index.php?/topic/730-when-will-manning-play/

LMAO, some of these posters make no sense:

They have those two new CBs, but that's not enough to stop Wayne, Clark, Collie, Garcon, Gonzo, Tamme, White (if needed), Addai...They lost Bernard Pollard which hurts at safety (he was dirty as heck but a good player and hard hitter). I think they'll be better as the season progresses, but not out of the gate. If the Colts actually show up for the opener unlike last year, they win and get off to a good start. The Texans put way too much into last year's opener (Their "Super Bowl") and I think it cost them in the long run as they collapsed after a 4-2 start (I think it was 4-2)

I think they have talent but the qb they have has not shown that he can win pressure games

Better than they were last year, or better than the Colts? No and No. They have to learn a new defense, don't have the talent to consistently stop the Colts offense and it will take more than just Johnson and Foster to outscore the Colts this year. BTW, Foster is starting the season with a hamstring injury. They tend to linger for all you fantasy players planning on him being your guy.

lol, wut.

b0ng
08-07-2011, 09:05 PM
Yes it's going to take more than the best WR and the NFL rushing king to beat the vaunted Colts defense.

GP
08-07-2011, 09:08 PM
Man, those guys posting that stuff are ultimate homers.

LOL. Looking for any little sign they can find.

Guess what? I think the Colts QB will be fine. He will play game 1. He will be as good as he always has been. I don't sit here and go "Ooo! Ooo! Their QB has a broken neck, and he's going to get killed by the Texans!" No, I know full well that our opponents are capable of beating us.

But you read some stuff like what those goobers posted, and you shake your head. They've been so accustomed to having Robo-QB back there that they are going to have a rude awakening one day when he's old and dried up and can't handle it anymore. That place should be fun to watch when he retires. It will be End Times mindset there.

Hopefully, this is the year we take the division. Manhandle our divisional opponents. Make a statement. Hopefully. LOL.

TimeKiller
08-08-2011, 09:13 AM
Wade did a little of everything this defense, thankfully with the stamp of approval from the management. He's taken what he could off the old roster and put a few pieces in better positions to succeed (Williams/Ryans/Cushing/Barwin/Quin) drafted a few pieces (Watt/Reed/Harris) that should make some impact, gotten his men in free agency (Joseph/Manning) and developed a young player (Mitchell). The only positions he hasn't really addressed is CB2 which is a good competition and Antonio Smith's DE who is playing in the wrong defense. That's a lot of fixin' for one year.

badboy
08-08-2011, 11:11 AM
Yes it's going to take more than the best WR and the NFL rushing king to beat the vaunted Colts defense.If I remember correctly last season we stomped Colts game one and was leading in 4th quarter late. I think we should beat our division all 6 games.:wild:

The Pencil Neck
08-08-2011, 11:38 AM
Wade did a little of everything this defense, thankfully with the stamp of approval from the management. He's taken what he could off the old roster and put a few pieces in better positions to succeed (Williams/Ryans/Cushing/Barwin/Quin) drafted a few pieces (Watt/Reed/Harris) that should make some impact, gotten his men in free agency (Joseph/Manning) and developed a young player (Mitchell). The only positions he hasn't really addressed is CB2 which is a good competition and Antonio Smith's DE who is playing in the wrong defense. That's a lot of fixin' for one year.

The only part of that I'll disagree with is Antonio Smith. As a DE/DT in a 4-3, he's a good fit for a 3-4 DE. He left Arizona and came here, in part, because he didn't want to be a 3-4 DE or a 4-3 DT. He wanted to be a 4-3 DE. But he's got the size and skills to excel as a 3-4 DE and I think it's his best position. I think this D will be good for him and judging from his recent comments, he agrees.

Rey
08-08-2011, 11:44 AM
Wade did a little of everything this defense, thankfully with the stamp of approval from the management. He's taken what he could off the old roster and put a few pieces in better positions to succeed (Williams/Ryans/Cushing/Barwin/Quin) drafted a few pieces (Watt/Reed/Harris) that should make some impact, gotten his men in free agency (Joseph/Manning) and developed a young player (Mitchell). The only positions he hasn't really addressed is CB2 which is a good competition and Antonio Smith's DE who is playing in the wrong defense. That's a lot of fixin' for one year.

I think they did address cb2.

By signing Joseph they pushed everyone down the depth chart and they drafted 2 corners, one in the second round.

Someone should emerge as an at least decent player there.

b0ng
08-08-2011, 01:10 PM
If I remember correctly last season we stomped Colts game one and was leading in 4th quarter late. I think we should beat our division all 6 games.:wild:

Shoulda beaten em with ****ing Sage Rosenfels as the QB what the **** I hate that game.

Hervoyel
08-08-2011, 01:36 PM
Defenses come together faster than offenses. That's just the way it happens. The Texans defense in 2002 was made of pieces from all over the league and was ready to play hard by the end of preseason. That was a Vic Fangio coached defense that supposedly employed a system that players described as relatively complex.

By most measures I believe Wade Phillips is considered a very good DC and a good teacher. I expect the defense to be ready to play adequately by opening day and to really hit it's stride by the 5th week of the season.

michaelm
08-08-2011, 02:02 PM
I expect the defense to be ready to play adequately by opening day and to really hit it's stride by the 5th week of the season.

That's about what I'm thinking as well.
I expect 3 out of the first 4 games to be shootouts, or at least fairly high scoring (Indy, NO, Pitt), but then we see Oakland, Baltimore, Tennessee, Jacksonville, Cleveland, Tamp, and Jacksonville again.

I think the D will improve quite a bit though this stretch of games. No scary offenses in that group.
No real quality QBs in that group either, other than possibly Flacco, depending on your opinion of him. My opinion of him is pretty much meh...
Josh Freeman is decent, and could show some improvement by that game. He just might be the better QB out of all of those teams by that time.
Overall, I think the D will do well during that stretch.

badboy
08-08-2011, 02:27 PM
That's about what I'm thinking as well.
I expect 3 out of the first 4 games to be shootouts, or at least fairly high scoring (Indy, NO, Pitt), but then we see Oakland, Baltimore, Tennessee, Jacksonville, Cleveland, Tamp, and Jacksonville again.

I think the D will improve quite a bit though this stretch of games. No scary offenses in that group.
No real quality QBs in that group either, other than possibly Flacco, depending on your opinion of him. My opinion of him is pretty much meh...
Josh Freeman is decent, and could show some improvement by that game. He just might be the better QB out of all of those teams by that time.
Overall, I think the D will do well during that stretch.We can only hope the opposing offense gets the surprise of their lives and our guys intercept a few passes, because I would be throwing at our #2 corner until they stop me. Probably would not let one INT change my mind.

If KJ does start and has some success early, it could really boost his confidence. There is still long way to go before game one.

thunderkyss
08-08-2011, 04:12 PM
Defenses come together faster than offenses. That's just the way it happens. The Texans defense in 2002 was made of pieces from all over the league and was ready to play hard by the end of preseason. That was a Vic Fangio coached defense that supposedly employed a system that players described as relatively complex.

By most measures I believe Wade Phillips is considered a very good DC and a good teacher. I expect the defense to be ready to play adequately by opening day and to really hit it's stride by the 5th week of the season.

Remember Frank Bush's first year.

The preseason & the first three games, our defense looked woefully pathetic. Then over the final 13 games they looked like a real NFL defense.

Double Barrel
08-08-2011, 05:44 PM
Defenses come together faster than offenses. That's just the way it happens. The Texans defense in 2002 was made of pieces from all over the league and was ready to play hard by the end of preseason. That was a Vic Fangio coached defense that supposedly employed a system that players described as relatively complex.


Aaron Glenn played for both Fangio and Wade in a 3-4. He said Fangio's defense was like calculus. Lots of reads and very complex, requiring players to make decisions to react a split second before the ball is hiked.

Glenn said Wade's 3-4, on the other hand, was addition and subtraction. Wade's entire philosophy is focused on getting to the QB and getting turnovers. Glenn said that if players just consistently fulfill their assignments, Wade's defense is the way to go. Glenn said some really positive things about Phillips and loved playing for him.

It is because of Wade that I am allowing some optimism about the Texans into my brain.

DexmanC
08-08-2011, 07:24 PM
Look at the Colts all you want to, but Jacksonville under Del Rio
OWNS Kubiak's Texans. Fisher's no longer in Tennessee, so maybe
they have a shot.

In other words...


I'll believe the Texans can win the division once they ACTUALLY DO IT.

This is the same team that will rack up an 8-2 out of the AFC South,
but go 1-5 IN the division and expect to make the playoffs.

Don't forget....

Kubiak tried to outsmart the world in the second game against the
Colts, when he started the game VERY pass-happy. Everyone and
their GRANDMAMA knew that you pound the rock with Foster till
they PROVE they can stop it. Kubiak CHOKED.

I'll be paying close attention to the first 12 games.

beLEEEEEEEE DAT!!

The Pencil Neck
08-08-2011, 08:31 PM
Look at the Colts all you want to, but Jacksonville under Del Rio
OWNS Kubiak's Texans.

Just a point but Kubiak is 5-5 against Del Rio's Jags and one of those losses was in OT. That's not really my definition of "owned".

The Texans were 3-3 in the division last year and ended up with a 6-10 record. I'd prefer the 1-5 in the division that we had the year before if we end up 9-7 or better.

But we definitely need to start off better than 5-7.

drs23
08-08-2011, 09:15 PM
Just a point but Kubiak is 5-5 against Del Rio's Jags and one of those losses was in OT. That's not really my definition of "owned".

The Texans were 3-3 in the division last year and ended up with a 6-10 record. I'd prefer the 1-5 in the division that we had the year before if we end up 9-7 or better.

But we definitely need to start off better than 5-7.

I agree big time. I bet Dex would love to change his sig. I know I want him to be able to.

Our schedule out of the gate it looks pretty tough. I hope Wade can get this defense ready day 1 but that's a pretty tall order. If they gel in the 4th to 5th week then I think the season's maybe not in great shape, but salvagable. I think it depends on which games we can 'steal' up front. JMO