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EllisUnit
08-04-2011, 09:34 AM
http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/sports/fb/texansfront/7682660.html#ixzz1U3fcQo00

Kareem Jackson squared up in front of Kevin Walter, mirroring the wide receiver's short burst of steps off the line of scrimmage with a quick backpedal of his own. When Walter broke right on the slant route, Jackson dug his feet into the turf and drove forward.

The pass was incomplete.

"That's beautiful, K-Jack! Beautiful," Texans first-year secondary coach Vance Joseph said.

Just as quickly, though, Jackson resembled the rookie cornerback who was victimized so often last year. Undrafted rookie free agent Jeff Maehl, a productive player during collegiate days at Oregon, unleashed a hitch-and-go pattern so convincing that Jackson bit, stumbled and never really recovered, beaten badly for a long touchdown.

This, seen too many times during the 2010 season, was familiar. But the reaction was not.

"Great route, man," Joseph said to Maehl as Jackson ran by. "Great route."

Welcome to the attitude readjustment portion of Texans training camp, where Jackson and the rest of the defensive backs are receiving extra attention. Blamed for most of the defense's ills, the secondary could use some positive reinforcement which Joseph is all too happy to provide.

"When you coach defensive backs, confidence is everything," he said. "Even if they're not doing something right, you always want to find something positive to give them because it's a hard job.

"I want to be positive so I can give him confidence. He can play well for us."

But Jackson hasn't.

Not yet, anyway.

It's telling that Jackson, when asked about the criticism and the chatter about his uneven play last year, didn't turn defensive Wednesday.

"Regardless of what you do in this world, everybody is going to have something to say about it," Jackson said. "This is the job I chose."

He left Alabama following his junior year, drafted by the Texans with the 20th overall pick.

But Jackson's rookie season wasn't remotely close to what he expected. He admitted that everything was a blur last year. But this year has been better so far because the scheme is similar to what he learned at Alabama.

The game has slowed, and maybe last year was an aberration. He didn't seem too concerned Wednesday.

"I never doubted myself. ... I know I can play this game, so I just come out every day and work," he said.

Asked what he tweaked this summer, when he said he watched film and worked out on his own, Jackson said, "I just corrected little things in my press technique. ... Hand placement, late in games getting tired, so running and working on my wind, and that's about it."

That's the confidence Joseph needs to see from his second-year cornerback, who, after the free-agent signings of cornerback Johnathan Joseph and safety Danieal Manning and the shift of Glover Quin to safety, represents the unit's largest question mark.

But the secondary coach craves even more.

"He's doing well and he knows what to do, but he has to do it better from a technique perspective," Joseph said. "He has to want to be the best. That's the key with great corners. In this league, it's not about height, ability or speed. It's guys who want to be the best.

"Once he gets that, he's going to be fine."

Read more: http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/sports/fb/texansfront/7682660.html#ixzz1U4DIEeB5

HOU-TEX
08-04-2011, 10:03 AM
Just as quickly, though, Jackson resembled the rookie cornerback who was victimized so often last year. Undrafted rookie free agent Jeff Maehl, a productive player during collegiate days at Oregon, unleashed a hitch-and-go pattern so convincing that Jackson bit, stumbled and never really recovered, beaten badly for a long touchdown.

No?! Reallty?! :wadepalm:

Wolf
08-04-2011, 10:08 AM
glad to not to see the word "shuffle"

Gibbs:kubepalm:

but agree with you Hou-Tex:wadepalm:

EllisUnit
08-04-2011, 10:08 AM
No?! Reallty?! :wadepalm:

Couldn't be, not K-Jac :roast:

ThaJokaa
08-04-2011, 10:09 AM
Kareem Jackson squared up in front of Kevin Walter, mirroring the wide receiver's short burst of steps off the line of scrimmage with a quick backpedal of his own. When Walter broke right on the slant route, Jackson dug his feet into the turf and drove forward
The pass was incomplete.

Lets look onto the positve; He's maturing and getting better as a player...

CloakNNNdagger
08-04-2011, 10:10 AM
No?! Reallty?! :wadepalm:

Come on HOU-TEX, he STUMBLED........he didn't FALL DOWN!! Now, THAT'S IMPROVEMENT!!!!!!:wadepalm:

EllisUnit
08-04-2011, 10:11 AM
Lets look onto the positve; He's maturing and getting better as a player...

after a few days of practice :lol:

HJam72
08-04-2011, 10:13 AM
Jackson just has "Zone Coverage Only" written all over him. :kubepalm:

Maybe he'll start figuring it out. I don't know, but I suspect he better start doing it soon if he wants to start.

Errant Hothy
08-04-2011, 10:13 AM
No?! Reallty?! :wadepalm:

Reallty? Really? :wadepalm:

I still have hope for K Jackson, but I wont be bothered if he gets beaten out in camp.

ThaJokaa
08-04-2011, 10:26 AM
after a few days of practice :lol:

when he said he watched film and worked out on his own, Jackson said, "I just corrected little things in my press technique. ... Hand placement, late in games getting tired, so running and working on my wind, and that's about it."

and working on it on his own thru the lock out...

dalemurphy
08-04-2011, 10:33 AM
http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/sports/fb/texansfront/7682660.html#ixzz1U3fcQo00

Kareem Jackson squared up in front of Kevin Walter, mirroring the wide receiver's short burst of steps off the line of scrimmage with a quick backpedal of his own.

Read more: http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/sports/fb/texansfront/7682660.html#ixzz1U4DIEeB5


Here's the real story!: K. Walter had a "burst" off the line of scrimmage! That's the biggest NFL story since the lockout ended.

EllisUnit
08-04-2011, 10:34 AM
and working on it on his own thru the lock out...

his problems last season weren't hand placement, he needs to work on foot work and he stumbled and gave up a long TD, so obviously he didn't work on that.

DocBar
08-04-2011, 10:35 AM
Here's the real story!: K. Walter had a "burst" off the line of scrimmage! That's the biggest NFL story since the lockout ended.Any video proof of this? Inadmissable with out it. LOL

CloakNNNdagger
08-04-2011, 10:42 AM
Here's the real story!: K. Walter had a "burst" off the line of scrimmage! That's the biggest NFL story since the lockout ended.

Sounds like the Texans have added psychologists to coach the coaches on "feel good" techniques.

HOU-TEX
08-04-2011, 10:43 AM
Come on HOU-TEX, he STUMBLED........he didn't FALL DOWN!! Now, THAT'S IMPROVEMENT!!!!!!:wadepalm:

Ha, true. However, "the field" still won.

Here's the real story!: K. Walter had a "burst" off the line of scrimmage! That's the biggest NFL story since the lockout ended.

Walter has always been quick off the line and in his breaks, he's just not fast. Very good route running has gotten him this far

DocBar
08-04-2011, 10:46 AM
Sounds like the Texans have added psychologists to coach the coaches on "feel good" techniques.That's the way of the world these days, to its detriment. I'm a firm believer of pats on the back for good jobs and kicks to the @ss for bad ones.

El Tejano
08-04-2011, 10:48 AM
Here's the real story!: K. Walter had a "burst" off the line of scrimmage! That's the biggest NFL story since the lockout ended.

The problem is, even with that burst of the line, even Kareem Jackson was still able to cover him.

DocBar
08-04-2011, 10:52 AM
:spit:The problem is, even with that burst of the line, even Kareem Jackson was still able to cover him.

The Pencil Neck
08-04-2011, 10:55 AM
Here's the real story!: K. Walter had a "burst" off the line of scrimmage! That's the biggest NFL story since the lockout ended.

That was poetic license on the part of the writer.

midgetonadonkey
08-04-2011, 11:14 AM
That's the way of the world these days, to its detriment. I'm a firm believer of pats on the back for good jobs and kicks to the @ss for bad ones.

The problem with that is that this generation of kids doesn't respond well to kicks in the ass. They are so used to positive reinforcement that it's necessary to treat them this way to get the best of out of them.

GP
08-04-2011, 11:14 AM
We're going to trot KJ out there as CB2 over and over and over this year.

No matter how bad he does, we're going to let him start at CB2. He was our first round pick, and for some reason first round picks get a pass for their first year or two. In reality, this guy should be a nickel CB at BEST. At worst, he should be cut from the team.

He just doesn't have the reaction and gut instinct skills. Seems like he's over thinking and trying too hard...rather than just going with the flow.

I also think Walter took it easy on him. He's a senior, he doesn't have to embarrass the sophomore. Meanwhile, the UDFA guy most definitely wants to embarrass KJ because he's trying to gain a roster spot for himself.

Nickel back.

Malloy
08-04-2011, 11:17 AM
Surprised no-one sported to owl yet :)

dalemurphy
08-04-2011, 11:28 AM
We're going to trot KJ out there as CB2 over and over and over this year.

No matter how bad he does, we're going to let him start at CB2. He was our first round pick, and for some reason first round picks get a pass for their first year or two. In reality, this guy should be a nickel CB at BEST. At worst, he should be cut from the team.

He just doesn't have the reaction and gut instinct skills. Seems like he's over thinking and trying too hard...rather than just going with the flow.

I also think Walter took it easy on him. He's a senior, he doesn't have to embarrass the sophomore. Meanwhile, the UDFA guy most definitely wants to embarrass KJ because he's trying to gain a roster spot for himself.

Nickel back.

GP, Maybe not. New defensive staff with autonomy. Phillips and company may not operate that way. After all, Okoye has finally been thrown out.

DocBar
08-04-2011, 11:34 AM
We're going to trot KJ out there as CB2 over and over and over this year.

No matter how bad he does, we're going to let him start at CB2. He was our first round pick, and for some reason first round picks get a pass for their first year or two. In reality, this guy should be a nickel CB at BEST. At worst, he should be cut from the team.

He just doesn't have the reaction and gut instinct skills. Seems like he's over thinking and trying too hard...rather than just going with the flow.

I also think Walter took it easy on him. He's a senior, he doesn't have to embarrass the sophomore. Meanwhile, the UDFA guy most definitely wants to embarrass KJ because he's trying to gain a roster spot for himself.

Nickel back.

GP, Maybe not. New defensive staff with autonomy. Phillips and company may not operate that way. After all, Okoye has finally been thrown out.I'm gonna hold off on this. Until we see the 3rd preseason game, we very well might not have a clue who's going to be our #2CB. With the lockout, our D staff has only had film to work with. I would think they're trying out every combination they have to see what works.
I agree with GP that KW doesn't have a lot to prove and is probably just trying to work through this without getting injured.

The Pencil Neck
08-04-2011, 11:43 AM
We're going to trot KJ out there as CB2 over and over and over this year.

No matter how bad he does, we're going to let him start at CB2. He was our first round pick, and for some reason first round picks get a pass for their first year or two. In reality, this guy should be a nickel CB at BEST. At worst, he should be cut from the team.

He just doesn't have the reaction and gut instinct skills. Seems like he's over thinking and trying too hard...rather than just going with the flow.

I also think Walter took it easy on him. He's a senior, he doesn't have to embarrass the sophomore. Meanwhile, the UDFA guy most definitely wants to embarrass KJ because he's trying to gain a roster spot for himself.

Nickel back.

Personally...

KJ isn't Wade's guy. Harris and Carmichael are Wade's guys. I'd be surprised if Harris isn't at least the nickel and possibly the CB2. And I wouldn't be shocked if Carmichael snuck up into the rotation, too.

From what Joseph said, I would expect them to try to protect KJ by putting him into zone coverages when he's on the field to take advantage of those things that KJ did well last season.

UNLESS... KJ improves and excels with the new training. (Which I don't expect.)

I don't expect KJ to be given the CB2.

Wolf
08-04-2011, 11:59 AM
http://www.addletters.com/pictures/warning-sign-generator/warning-sign-generator.php?symbol=2&fg=%23FFFFFF&bg=%23FF0033&border=%230000CC&words=Warning%21+Kareem+Jackson+at+work+

DocBar
08-04-2011, 12:03 PM
http://www.addletters.com/pictures/warning-sign-generator/warning-sign-generator.php?symbol=2&fg=%23ffffff&bg=%23ff0033&border=%230000cc&words=warning%21+kareem+jackson+at+work+rep!!

CloakNNNdagger
08-04-2011, 12:14 PM
The problem with that is that this generation of kids doesn't respond well to kicks in the ass. They are so used to positive reinforcement that it's necessary to treat them this way to get the best of out of them.

GOOD JOB!

http://dailyfun.us/wp-content/uploads/2010/03/job-interview.jpg


http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_gQ1MlsTiCbc/SsJwHoGtP8I/AAAAAAAAAKg/NbT-lhfJZDM/s320/DSC_0002.jpg

HOU-TEX
08-04-2011, 12:27 PM
Personally...

KJ isn't Wade's guy. Harris and Carmichael are Wade's guys. I'd be surprised if Harris isn't at least the nickel and possibly the CB2. And I wouldn't be shocked if Carmichael snuck up into the rotation, too.

From what Joseph said, I would expect them to try to protect KJ by putting him into zone coverages when he's on the field to take advantage of those things that KJ did well last season.

UNLESS... KJ improves and excels with the new training. (Which I don't expect.)

I don't expect KJ to be given the CB2.

What's sad is that he was supposedly the most NFL ready CB who was best at bump and run.

GP
08-04-2011, 12:35 PM
What's sad is that he was supposedly the most NFL ready CB who was best at bump and run.

Someone said at a press conference or some sort of media event where Saban was quoted for an article (when a few guys from 'Bama were declaring), that Saban was asked about each guy...and Saban was eerily silent or at least not very vocal--in a positive way--about Kareem Jackson's declaration.

Meaning this: Saban felt KJ wasn't ready to enter the NFL at that time.

Why does this feel like KJ getting cut and then crying to the media like David Carr did? If he is used as a nickel or zone guy, and excels, then fine by me. If that's money to be saved and given to someone else? Fine by me.

I just don't want to see him at CB2. That ship has sailed. This is a dog-eat-dog sports league here, as Bob McNair has finally figured out. Now let's hope that nobody is given anything without truly earning it first (I'm looking at you Okoye).

Errant Hothy
08-04-2011, 12:41 PM
Don't get your hope too high

NNick Scurfield
Kubiak said Kareem Jackson has taken to new DB coach Vance Joseph & looks more comfortable in a system very similar to what he had at 'Bama

GP
08-04-2011, 12:43 PM
Faaaantastic. The old "Gotta' protect my 1st round draft pick" game by Kubiak & Company.

(Sigh)

:clown:

DocBar
08-04-2011, 12:44 PM
The problem with that is that this generation of kids doesn't respond well to kicks in the ass. They are so used to positive reinforcement that it's necessary to treat them this way to get the best of out of them.How can you tell if you're getting anything remotely near their best if you can't challenge them or critique them in anything less than a positive manner? I take this as an indictment of our society, no a recommendation for it.

DocBar
08-04-2011, 12:46 PM
What's sad is that he was supposedly the most NFL ready CB who was best at bump and run.:faildetector:

EllisUnit
08-04-2011, 12:49 PM
What's sad is that he was supposedly the most ready CB who was best at bump and run.

who said that ? Kubiak our Smith

DocBar
08-04-2011, 12:59 PM
who said that ? Kubiak our SmithKubiak IIRC

EllisUnit
08-04-2011, 01:04 PM
Kubiak IIRC

Well we all know Kubiak knows nothing about Defense our Defensive players :wadepalm: now poor wade has to work with this NFL ready CB

bo orlando
08-04-2011, 01:06 PM
How can you tell if you're getting anything remotely near their best if you can't challenge them or critique them in anything less than a positive manner? I take this as an indictment of our society, no a recommendation for it.

challenging kids is different than kicking them in the ass when they mess up. kicking somebody when they're down is the easiest way to make them not want to do what you're trying to teach them. positive reinforcement is not the same as coddling.

badboy
08-04-2011, 01:15 PM
As Jackson's biggest critic since he was drafted and as a fan of Harris, I'm still gonna give coaches time to re-train him. We are starting to pile on KJ.

The Pencil Neck
08-04-2011, 01:18 PM
I don't think KJ is a lost cause.

But I want to see what Harris and Carmichael can do.

TimeKiller
08-04-2011, 01:39 PM
I don't think it's time for shit flinging threads just yet.

DocBar
08-04-2011, 01:45 PM
challenging kids is different than kicking them in the ass when they mess up. kicking somebody when they're down is the easiest way to make them not want to do what you're trying to teach them. positive reinforcement is not the same as coddling.Jeez...We're talking about football players here, not kindergarten. All I was saying is that you have to have balance. Praise the hell out out of them when they do good, get on their ass when they screw the pooch. It's just a figure of speech.

Dutchrudder
08-04-2011, 01:46 PM
Faaaantastic. The old "Gotta' protect my 1st round draft pick" game by Kubiak & Company.

(Sigh)

:clown:

Oh come on GP! We haven't seen anything yet to indicate whether or not KJ will improve within the new system or not. At least wait until we see him in a couple preseason games before you start criticizing any positive comments about him. I doubt he's going to become the cornerback we all wish he could be, but at least let him perform before the bashing starts.

Dutchrudder
08-04-2011, 01:47 PM
I don't think it's time for shit flinging threads just yet.

I agree with this guy. Let's hold off on the criticism until we actually see something.

EllisUnit
08-04-2011, 01:48 PM
Oh come on GP! We haven't seen anything yet to indicate whether or not KJ will improve within the new system or not. At least wait until we see him in a couple preseason before you start criticizing any positive comments about him. I doubt he's going to become the cornerback we all wish he could be, but at least let him perform before the bashing starts.

i think most are going off of last seasons performance which we all know how that went.

Wolf
08-04-2011, 01:50 PM
Good thing is that Joseph and manning should be practicing today. I am curious on how they will look

Ole Miss Texan
08-04-2011, 01:52 PM
I'm hoping Jackson really bounces back this year and benefits from Joseph and Manning. The thing about this fanbase (myself included) is that when a player gets on our 'bad side' it's awfully tough for us to 'forgive' him. Dunta Robinson, a fan favorite, basically turned into public enemy number one. I fear that even if Jackson improves some and becomes a solid #2 corner, it may never be enough for us to forget his rookie season.:kitten:

DocBar
08-04-2011, 01:55 PM
I'm hoping Jackson really bounces back this year and benefits from Joseph and Manning. The thing about this fanbase (myself included) is that when a player gets on our 'bad side' it's awfully tough for us to 'forgive' him. Dunta Robinson, a fan favorite, basically turned into public enemy number one. I fear that even if Jackson improves some and becomes a solid #2 corner, it may never be enough for us to forget his rookie season.:kitten:That's a good point. I'm trying to come up with an example of a player that started bad, who got markedly better and we quit criticizing. The closest ones I can come up with are Brown at LT and Myers at C. They still get their fair share of criticism.

michaelm
08-04-2011, 01:56 PM
Hopefully, Wade isn't using that ridiculous shuffle-step that Bush was re-training the DBs to do last year.

I'm surprised it isn't mentioned more.

I've always suspected that the shuffle-step technique was responsible for a large number of slips, trips and falls by our secondary.


---

Ole Miss Texan
08-04-2011, 01:58 PM
That's a good point. I'm trying to come up with an example of a player that started bad, who got markedly better and we quit criticizing. The closest ones I can come up with are Brown at LT and Myers at C. They still get their fair share of criticism.
Yea really good examples, particularly Chris Myers. Jenkins throwing him out of the way will forever be etched into our brains... poor guy. I've actually thought Myers has been pretty good for us overall and a really good trade, what was it like a 6th round pick for him?

DocBar
08-04-2011, 02:02 PM
Yea really good examples, particularly Chris Myers. Jenkins throwing him out of the way will forever be etched into our brains... poor guy. I've actually thought Myers has been pretty good for us overall and a really good trade, what was it like a 6th round pick for him?I'm not sure what we gave for him. I'm just glad we've had some continuity on the OL. I'm also :pissed: that we've had so many players that started bad and stayed bad. That's a leading cause for all the KJ criticism. We're accustomed to what ya see is what ya get.

Dutchrudder
08-04-2011, 02:05 PM
i think most are going off of last seasons performance which we all know how that went.

Well, duh. That does not mean there is absolutely no way that Kareem Jackson could improve this offseason. It's just Kubiak giving his thoughts to a sportswriter. Does anyone expect Kubiak or any other coach to say 'Well gee, I think KJ has gotten worse since last year and probably should have gone undrafted'. It's just asinine to criticize this stuff before we have any idea what his production in 2011 will be. Preseason is only two weeks away, and we should get a much better idea of how he will perform after that.

Go look at the way Elway and the Broncos are protecting Tim Tebow's feelings despite his inability to hit moving targets with a football.

And just for the hell of it, here's what Rex Ryan said about Gholston when he came to the Jets:
"I'm looking forward to meeting Vernon and seeing what makes him tick...if the guy's got it in him, we're (going to) get it out of him."

No bullshit, he didn't need to tear him down but rather left it out there in potential despite knowing full well that he was worthless the year before. A couple years later after Vernon was off the team Ryan ripped him in his book calling him a phony. Kubiak's not doing anything special here. If anyone can find a quote of a current NFL head coach ripping down on a recent 1st round draft pick I'd love to hear it.

The Pencil Neck
08-04-2011, 02:05 PM
Hopefully, Wade isn't using that ridiculous shuffle-step that Bush was re-training the DBs to do last year.

I'm surprised it isn't mentioned more.

I've always suspected that the shuffle-step technique was responsible for a large number of slips, trips and falls by our secondary.


---

Yeah, they've scrapped that crap. And I agree, I think that was a huge fail.

They've talked about how this is more like what KJ learned in Alabama and I think that's a LOT of what they're referring to when they say that.

EllisUnit
08-04-2011, 02:06 PM
I'm not sure what we gave for him. I'm just glad we've had some continuity on the OL. I'm also :pissed: that we've had so many players that started bad and stayed bad. That's a leading cause for all the KJ criticism. We're accustomed to what ya see is what ya get.

TRUE. I cannot think of one player who started that bad who turned out to be pretty good. Not one not on our team anyways.

nytexan
08-04-2011, 02:07 PM
As Jackson's biggest critic since he was drafted and as a fan of Harris, I'm still gonna give coaches time to re-train him. We are starting to pile on KJ.

Good post, someone please rep him for me. I'm sure KJ had a 100+ reps in practice yesterday and the story for effect mentioned 2 of them on the opposite extremes. Give the kid a break and lets see how he looks in the preseason before we bury this guy for good.

I also agree with Ol Miss T, his rookie season is over, forgive and forget, if my wife had some of the attitudes on this board, I never would have gotten thru the first month of marriage. The defensive coaching staff has no ties to this kid or anybody else, he'll either earn the job in practice, sit or get cut. It's as simple as that.

EllisUnit
08-04-2011, 02:08 PM
Well, duh. That does not mean there is absolutely no way that Kareem Jackson could improve this offseason. It's just Kubiak giving his thoughts to a sportswriter. Does anyone expect Kubiak or any other coach to say 'Well gee, I think KJ has gotten worse since last year and probably should have gone undrafted'. It's just asinine to criticize this stuff before we have any idea what his production in 2011 will be. Preseason is only two weeks away, and we should get a much better idea of how he will perform after that.

Go look at the way Elway and the Broncos are protecting Tim Tebow's feelings despite his inability to hit moving targets with a football.

And just for the hell of it, here's what Rex Ryan said about Gholston when he came to the Jets:


No bullshit, he didn't need to tear him down but rather left it out there in potential despite knowing full well that he was worthless the year before. A couple years later after Vernon was off the team Ryan ripped him in his book calling him a phony. Kubiak's not doing anything special here. If anyone can find a quote of a current head coach ripping down on a recent 1st round draft pick I'd love to hear it.

i agree but honesty is always the best way to go :bender:

The Pencil Neck
08-04-2011, 02:10 PM
TRUE. I cannot think of one player who started that bad who turned out to be pretty good. Not one not on our team anyways.

IIRC, Jerry Rice and Nnamdi Asomugha didn't have good rookie seasons. Rice dropped a lot of passes. And Nnamdi wasn't even a starter. I'm sure there are a lot of other examples.

With our team? Yeah, not so much. Maybe Arian who has stated publicly that he wasn't doing the right things at the beginning of his rookie season and didn't start to get his head straight until midway through.

Dutchrudder
08-04-2011, 02:10 PM
Good post, someone please rep him for me. I'm sure KJ had a 100+ reps in practice yesterday and the story for effect mentioned 2 of them on the opposite extremes. Give the kid a break and lets see how he looks in the preseason before we bury this guy for good.

I also agree with Ol Miss T, his rookie season is over, forgive and forget, if my wife had some of the attitudes on this board, I never would have gotten thru the first month of marriage. The defensive coaching staff has no ties to this kid or anybody else, he'll either earn the job in practice, sit or get cut. It's as simple as that.

Well he's definitely not getting cut. The Texans are at/above the cap and a cut to a 1st round pick from last year would drop the remainder of his signing bonus into 2011, which would kill our cap. He will definitely be with the team through next year to avoid cap obligations, but that doesn't necessarily mean he earned the spot.

CloakNNNdagger
08-04-2011, 02:11 PM
Well we all know Kubiak knows nothing about Defense our Defensive players :wadepalm: now poor wade has to work with this NFL ready CB

What Wade would have probably recognized had he been here last year is that KJ may have come from an NFL-ready-like pro set D..........but he was NOT NFL READY.......not unlike many Juniors whose unrealistic egos bump heads with their NFL reality.

DocBar
08-04-2011, 02:11 PM
Hopefully, Wade isn't using that ridiculous shuffle-step that Bush was re-training the DBs to do last year.

I'm surprised it isn't mentioned more.

I've always suspected that the shuffle-step technique was responsible for a large number of slips, trips and falls by our secondary.


---Excellent point. I had completely forgotten about that.

Errant Hothy
08-04-2011, 02:11 PM
I'm hoping Jackson really bounces back this year and benefits from Joseph and Manning. The thing about this fanbase (myself included) is that when a player gets on our 'bad side' it's awfully tough for us to 'forgive' him. Dunta Robinson, a fan favorite, basically turned into public enemy number one. I fear that even if Jackson improves some and becomes a solid #2 corner, it may never be enough for us to forget his rookie season.:kitten:

Unless he is holding out for money or leaving over a contract issuse ala Dunta, the opposite also tends to hold true. Pollard is a perfect example over this. Cushing played almost as bad as KJ last year, but catches nowhere near the same amount of heat over it.

Dutchrudder
08-04-2011, 02:14 PM
TRUE. I cannot think of one player who started that bad who turned out to be pretty good. Not one not on our team anyways.

Matt Schaub anyone? He was doing so poorly that half the city wanted Sage Rosenfels to start against Indy. And then he lost all his support once he evolved into the Rosencopter.

Some guys just take time to learn the position or get the right coaching and given the revolving door of defensive coordinators we have had, I can only hope KJ gets the right instruction this year to turn into at least a decent #2 CB.

EllisUnit
08-04-2011, 02:14 PM
Unless he is holding out for money or leaving over a contract issuse ala Dunta, the opposite also tends to hold true. Pollard is a perfect example over this. Cushing played almost as bad as KJ last year, but catches nowhere near the same amount of heat over it.

Cushing was no where close to being half as bad as K.J was.

Errant Hothy
08-04-2011, 02:18 PM
Cushing was no where close to being half as bad as K.J was.

If you say so. The weeks Cush had to play MLB he looked bad, there is a reason they moved him back outside. Or in other words Sharpton played the middle better then Cush.

DocBar
08-04-2011, 02:18 PM
IIRC, Jerry Rice and Nnamdi Asomugha didn't have good rookie seasons. Rice dropped a lot of passes. And Nnamdi wasn't even a starter. I'm sure there are a lot of other examples.

With our team? Yeah, not so much. Maybe Arian who has stated publicly that he wasn't doing the right things at the beginning of his rookie season and didn't start to get his head straight until midway through.It's my opinion that since the Texans have had so little talent and/or depth the first 9 yrs, we've had to rely on higher draft picks to step up and rety to play like superstars from the word go. This is the 1st year where we've been able to even think about red-shirting a lot of our rookies. Watt is about the only one we really, really need to step up this season. If any of the other rooks really shine in camp, they have a shot at starting. If they don't, they can sit back and get coached up.

CloakNNNdagger
08-04-2011, 02:18 PM
May KJ get better by the season opener? Maybe. But continued reports like this are not what I would call encouraging.
From this morning's practice:
• Cornerback Kareem Jackson was burned on two long players by receivers Kevin Walter and Paul Williams, who was injured on the play. Williams was helped off the field with a lower leg injury.

PS......Maybe now KJ can stay up with Paul Williams.:wadepalm:

TheCD
08-04-2011, 02:20 PM
Edit, oops wrong post.

EllisUnit
08-04-2011, 02:21 PM
Matt Schaub anyone? He was doing so poorly that half the city wanted Sage Rosenfels to start against Indy. And then he lost all his support once he evolved into the Rosencopter.

Some guys just take time to learn the position or get the right coaching and given the revolving door of defensive coordinators we have had, I can only hope KJ gets the right instruction this year to turn into at least a decent #2 CB.

Schaub wasnt bad his first season with us. I remember his first game him and AJ hooking up for a 70+ yard TD against the Chiefs. I was syked

Austrian
08-04-2011, 02:28 PM
Wow KJ is now getting burned by Paul Williams. He wasn't even good enough to stick with the Titans. Not good news.

HOU-TEX
08-04-2011, 02:29 PM
In the end, I don't think Wade gives a rats ass where these cats were drafted. Nor do I think he'll take personel advise from anyone not coaching on the defensive side of the ball. I have no doubt that he's going to play the best at the position.

KJ, Allen, Roc, Harris, Mouldon, McCain, etc., I don't think he cares

EllisUnit
08-04-2011, 02:34 PM
Wow KJ is now getting burned by Paul Williams. He wasn't even good enough to stick with the Titans. Not good news.

no surprise what was that WRs name who K. Jac made look like A.J. The guy had like 150 yards receiving and was un heard of until that game, and then not heard of again after that game haha

Austrian
08-04-2011, 02:36 PM
no surprise what was that WRs name who K. Jac made look like A.J. The guy had like 150 yards receiving and was un heard of until that game, and then not heard of again after that game haha

Ajirototu. I guess. Or something like that. Paul Williams has a grand total of 7 career receiving yards. Just saying.

edit: It's Seyi Ajiritotu.

BrandonLwowski
08-04-2011, 02:40 PM
Sad to say but the **** fighting he attended during the offseason sure isnt gonna help him cover recievers

GP
08-04-2011, 03:05 PM
Fantasy Football Insider Scoop from GP:

If Kareem Jackson is the CB facing your WR on Sunday, regardless of how that WR performed prior to this game, then you 100% START the WR vs. Kareem Jackson.

You've been given proper notification. No whining if you fail to heed the advice.

bo orlando
08-04-2011, 03:07 PM
IIRC, Jerry Rice and Nnamdi Asomugha didn't have good rookie seasons. Rice dropped a lot of passes. And Nnamdi wasn't even a starter. I'm sure there are a lot of other examples.

With our team? Yeah, not so much. Maybe Arian who has stated publicly that he wasn't doing the right things at the beginning of his rookie season and didn't start to get his head straight until midway through.


Rice had a 240-yard game as a rookie. I have no idea how Nnamdi did his first year, but I'd bet a few billion $$ that when he did play he didn't have anything close to the disastrous performances that KJ had.

Again, I don't see how people can make these assumptions that he will be good BECAUSE he was bad his rookie year. It's far more likely that bad players will continue to be bad. Maybe he'll be less bad, but he's got a long long way to go before he becomes a solid starter. The only evidence I've seen on his behalf is that the entire team sucked, and a few clips that show him to not be awful at everything all the time.

EllisUnit
08-04-2011, 03:07 PM
Fantasy Football Insider Scoop from GP:

If Kareem Jackson is the CB facing your WR on Sunday, regardless of how that WR performed prior to this game, then you 100% START the WR vs. Kareem Jackson.

You've been given proper notification. No whining if you fail to heed the advice.

:bravo:

Rey
08-04-2011, 03:22 PM
I still want to see kj in a game situation.

I wonder if he's the only player getting burned on occasion or if it's just more noteworthy because he's Kareem.

Kareem was awful last year. From what I'm hearing he's been pretty bad at practice. They are even talking about him getting beat by Williams and Walters at practice.

Kareem is on a very thin leash. I thought he would be able to take the starting spot, but I would not be surprised if he is not even a nickel by the time the season ends. He's just not been that good.

Kareem needs to let his past mistakes go and just play football.

The Pencil Neck
08-04-2011, 03:56 PM
Rice had a 240-yard game as a rookie.

In the 13th game of the season and it was the first game where he had more than 4 receptions and it was only 1 of 2 games where he had more than 100 yards. He "flashed" at the end of the season but he was inconsistent early on and had a lot of drops.


I have no idea how Nnamdi did his first year, but I'd bet a few billion $$ that when he did play he didn't have anything close to the disastrous performances that KJ had.

Again, I don't see how people can make these assumptions that he will be good BECAUSE he was bad his rookie year. It's far more likely that bad players will continue to be bad. Maybe he'll be less bad, but he's got a long long way to go before he becomes a solid starter. The only evidence I've seen on his behalf is that the entire team sucked, and a few clips that show him to not be awful at everything all the time.

I don't think people are saying he's going to be good BECAUSE he was bad, people are saying that just because he was bad his first year that doesn't mean he's going to be bad his second year.

If he's going to win the CB2 job, he's got to improve and he's got to WIN the job. And he might do that. Judging from the TC reports, he's not doing that but let's wait until we see him in a preseason game before we close the door on him.

badboy
08-04-2011, 04:12 PM
I am glad that we got some time to practice before stepping onto game 1 field.

bo orlando
08-04-2011, 04:31 PM
In the 13th game of the season and it was the first game where he had more than 4 receptions and it was only 1 of 2 games where he had more than 100 yards. He "flashed" at the end of the season but he was inconsistent early on and had a lot of drops.




I don't think people are saying he's going to be good BECAUSE he was bad, people are saying that just because he was bad his first year that doesn't mean he's going to be bad his second year.

If he's going to win the CB2 job, he's got to improve and he's got to WIN the job. And he might do that. Judging from the TC reports, he's not doing that but let's wait until we see him in a preseason game before we close the door on him.

If KJ had the cornerback equivalent of a 240-yard game (5 ints?) then he could have fallen down every play of every other game and Texan fans would be erupting in mass orgasms. Heck, even if he had the corner equivalent of a 4-catch game people would be happy.

People do seem to be acting under the assumption that his bad rookie season doesn't matter because bad rookie seasons don't matter. People bring up such and such great player, overstate their rookie year struggles, then use that to suggest KJ will become a good player himself. I'm not giving up on him as a fan, and the team doesn't seem to either, but if you're going to make an assumption then assume the much more likely scenario that he's a bad player whose ceiling is mediocrity.

CloakNNNdagger
08-04-2011, 04:48 PM
If KJ had the cornerback equivalent of a 240-yard game (5 ints?) then he could have fallen down every play of every other game and Texan fans would be erupting in mass orgasms. Heck, even if he had the corner equivalent of a 4-catch game people would be happy.

People do seem to be acting under the assumption that his bad rookie season doesn't matter because bad rookie seasons don't matter. People bring up such and such great player, overstate their rookie year struggles, then use that to suggest KJ will become a good player himself. I'm not giving up on him as a fan, and the team doesn't seem to either, but if you're going to make an assumption then assume the much more likely scenario that he's a bad player whose ceiling is mediocrity.

THIS^^^

Amobi Okoye anyone?:kubepalm::wadepalm:

EllisUnit
08-04-2011, 04:59 PM
If you say so. The weeks Cush had to play MLB he looked bad, there is a reason they moved him back outside. Or in other words Sharpton played the middle better then Cush.

i agree with that but he wasnt terrible at OLB

DocBar
08-04-2011, 10:48 PM
Matt Schaub anyone? He was doing so poorly that half the city wanted Sage Rosenfels to start against Indy. And then he lost all his support once he evolved into the Rosencopter.

Some guys just take time to learn the position or get the right coaching and given the revolving door of defensive coordinators we have had, I can only hope KJ gets the right instruction this year to turn into at least a decent #2 CB.I don't think it was that he did so poorly as a QB as it seemed he was too fragile, especially considering the history of Texan OL's, to play up to the value of the trade that brought him here. We paid a pretty steep price and he missed large portions of his 1st two years. Besides, he still seems to have plenty of detractors on here. 4,000 yd seasons just mostly shut them up.

silvrhand
08-05-2011, 12:24 AM
and the KJ hatorade keeps flowing.. You guys think you would actually pull for him to get better but I think some of us around here just like to pour it on for no real reaon.

The guy had a bad rookie season, with a horrible coaching staff, teaching a new technique, and no safety help...

:kubepalm:

fiasco west
08-05-2011, 01:31 AM
and the KJ hatorade keeps flowing.. You guys think you would actually pull for him to get better but I think some of us around here just like to pour it on for no real reaon.

The guy had a bad rookie season, with a horrible coaching staff, teaching a new technique, and no safety help...

:kubepalm:

Pretty much.

The article linked in this thread says KJ made a good play on Kevin Walter then got burned. What does everyone do? They immediately talk about how he got burned instead of saying "Well he did make a good play..." it was on and on about how he falls down. Besides a few articles does not gauge his talent.

Can someone recall the Mario Williams thread 0 0 0 0 0 0 0?

No one is saying "Oh just because Kareem had a bad rookie season that means he'll get better." at least I am not. I've said that just because someone has had a bad rookie season it does not mean that they can't turn it around.

ObsiWan
08-05-2011, 02:35 AM
That's a good point. I'm trying to come up with an example of a player that started bad, who got markedly better and we quit criticizing. The closest ones I can come up with are Brown at LT and Myers at C. They still get their fair share of criticism.

EDIT:
DutchRudder beat me to it. We were hardly ever on Schaub about his play it was his durability - or lack of.

DocBar
08-05-2011, 10:14 AM
EDIT:
DutchRudder beat me to it. We were hardly ever on Schaub about his play it was his durability - or lack of.Did I miss something? I said that very thing in post #83