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DRIFTAWAY
04-21-2005, 07:33 PM
If you had to choose between Pollack or Ware who would you choose, and than say who you think the Texans will choose and why.

I personally would want Pollack. He has been far more proven so far than Ware.

I think the Texans would be torn between the two. Pollack would be the ideal pick but they are really interested in Ware as well.

Grid
04-21-2005, 07:35 PM
I would take Pollack.

We have a difficult defensive scheme, and Pollack is a smart guy.

He doesnt have the SPEED that Ware does, but he has alot of quickness and is the more versatile player (Capers likes versatility)

I think he is the better fit at 3-4 OLB, and the better fit in our system. Heck.. hes an all around better football player.

I would not be disappointed in either pick, but I think Pollack has the better chance of coming in and being a pro bowler some day.

texasguy346
04-21-2005, 07:37 PM
I'd pick Pollack (BTW on the ESPN Draft Special Merrill just picked Pollack for the Texans at 13). I really like the way Pollack plays, and he seems to have a good feel for the game. I'm not sure I'd want him at 13, but somewhere in the high teens or low 20s wouldn't be too bad. Both Ware and Pollack are terrific talents, but I'm just a bit more partial to Pollack.

D-ReK
04-21-2005, 07:39 PM
Everything we've done this offseason has been to add speed to our defense and Pollack ran a 4.8 at the combine...He has good quickness, but he doesn't have the top end speed to be good in coverage...He is a great player, but I think he'd be better suited as a 4-3 DE...

Ware isn't near as polished as Pollack, but he has the speed that Pollack doesn't, and, as the cliche goes, you can't teach speed...I trust our staff could turn him into a dominant rush backer, so I choose him...

Panther5407
04-21-2005, 08:06 PM
Ware, for some reason I just like him better and I keep hearing better things more often. I'd like to have him.

edo783
04-21-2005, 09:08 PM
Ware.....it's the speed thing.

outofhnd
04-21-2005, 09:13 PM
Ware Not only is he fast he has an incredible vertical, and just the same attitude as pollack. He has exceptional tools, big wing span fiery competitor. Demarcus is pretty darn smart as well. can we edit this and make it a 3 man race with Merriman as well? Merriman is my 2nd pick after Ware.

Blake
04-21-2005, 09:19 PM
Ware. He has the size, the speed, and the good personality. That is why the Texans would take him.

F-minus67
04-21-2005, 09:26 PM
Pollack, you cannot over look a guy who made that may plays in his college career against top competion.

beerlover
04-21-2005, 09:33 PM
Demarcus Ware is rated as the 13th best draft prospect by ourlads with a culminative score of 9.24. David Pollack ranks 23rd with a score of 9.07. for what its worth.

watching NFL live (sorry but I really enjoyed the program and the guys making their OWN picks) it is obvious to me that Mel needs to stick to his draft board and a reason why his Mock Draft's are not the best because he cannot comprehend REAL NFL team needs and projecting prospects accordingly. anyway back to Ware & Pollack.

in the beginning Pollack would have a bigger impact because of his experience and mental toughness. he will be a core player for the team who drafts him. in the right situation like New England, because of the people around him, the system and his versatility. therefore I could see them try and trade up to draft him, they would give up a lot to do this so I would have to listen, not because of picks we've traded away but a player who should be available with the 32nd pick David Baas.

if the Texans drafted Ware they would have to patient and Peek would probably start along with Babin. Ware would be a situational pass rusher and be on a fast track to learn the scheme, the players and NFL environment. but given time he has not only the skills but the character to become a tremendous NFL football player, he has unlimited upside as a 3-4 OLB.

both players are great human beings & very talented football prospects the Texans would do well to use both to help bring a Championship to Houston.

awtysst
04-21-2005, 10:06 PM
If you had to choose between Pollack or Ware who would you choose, and than say who you think the Texans will choose and why.

I personally would want Pollack. He has been far more proven so far than Ware.

I think the Texans would be torn between the two. Pollack would be the ideal pick but they are really interested in Ware as well.


i say Pollack becuase we can trade down to STL and still get him. If we do that we can pick up a 2 and 3 along with STL's 19. With 19 we get Pollack, at Rams second is Reggie Brown, and with their third we can get Wilkerson or another center or guard.

If we stay at 13 we only get Ware.

I say trade down for Pollack and address more areas! :thumbup

Though if we stay and draft Ware I wont be dissapointed :thumbup

outofhnd
04-21-2005, 10:38 PM
I think Casserly will shock the world and draft that kicker from Ohio st with the 13th pick. :crazy:

Demarcus Ware at 13

The question wasnt would you trade down to 19 to get pollack....

the question waswith the 13th pick would you pick Ware or Pollack...

I still think we should add merriman just in case dallas takes Ware which would suck.

Youngstown Colt
04-21-2005, 10:56 PM
I don't know how much more Pollack needs to do to convince people he's at least better than Ware (who was a no one untill combine buzz)

Dominating the SEC OR dominating the Sun Belt?

outofhnd
04-21-2005, 11:07 PM
lol thats fabulous,

Ken Dorsey Dominated all conferences and won the title hes scrubbing floors for SF now.

Ellis Johnson Was DT that dominated the SEC Looking for a 1 yr minimum
Eric Curry DE of Alabama Dominated the SEC Retired mediocre
John Copeland DE Alabama Dominated SEC retired mediocre

Its not how you dominate your collegiate conference that tells how good an athlete you will be Just ask Jerry Rice who dominated at Miss Valley State, vs Eddie Brown WR who dominated college football.

Demarcus Ware has better pure athleticism, Hes proven he can learn new systems and still be effective. not to mention he is a heads up ballplayer as well. Yea That is true of every small college player the only time i ever knew about a huge star at a small time college was Marshall Faulk out of SD St.

Give me Ware today and in 5 years if im wrong, then ill digress

Youngstown Colt
04-21-2005, 11:10 PM
I simply will not put that much stock into numbers, I've never been one to do that.

I'll let you know in 5 years who was better.

beerlover
04-22-2005, 08:38 AM
upon listening to Casserly it would seem that if Merriman is available he would be the pick & the next Houston Texan. why? because of his measureables and the fact he has experience playing OLB in a 3-4. you might imagine him over the DT inside blitzing, then playing off in coverage & back pass rushing on a delay.

guess I was wrong about Demarcus converting because of the projection (not ever played LB & level of competition) and Pollack less than ideal size /speed and lack of experience @ OLB for the Texans, other than a trade down, my apologies :bag:

TheOgre
04-22-2005, 08:42 AM
Just say no to OLB. I want to see Peek start and get another offensive playmaker.

cadahnic
04-22-2005, 09:24 AM
I would like for Peek to move to ILB so he can replace Wong next season. He is built for the posisiton and he started playing the pass much better around the end of the season. To the quesion though I think Ware likely has the more upside as far as talent and athleticism, but Pollack provides versatility and would be more of a fit for our team.

texansalltheway
04-22-2005, 09:26 AM
About small school and big school, there are going to be gems and players that make it big in the NFL, but chances are you are more likely to find pro bowlers at a major university than a smaller school. Look at the current pro bowl, how many are from big schools compared to small schools. And it is not always about athleticism, using your example Jerry Rice wasn't considered the best athlete but was a great football player. Pollack doesn't have the athletiscm of Ware but he will still make an impact because he is a high energy guy that works extremely hard and was a team leader on a squard full of good players. I would go for Pollack because he seems like the type that could be the emotional and firery team leader that this defense needs now that Sharper is gone and Walker and Glenn are on the downside of their careers. Either way Ware and Pollack would be good choices for the Texans but my personal choice is for Pollack.

Porky
04-22-2005, 10:04 AM
I would like for Peek to move to ILB so he can replace Wong next season. He is built for the posisiton and he started playing the pass much better around the end of the season. To the quesion though I think Ware likely has the more upside as far as talent and athleticism, but Pollack provides versatility and would be more of a fit for our team.

Peek at ILB? Ummm, don't think so. Thanks for playing.

As for OLB in the first, I think it is a very logical choice. Peek would probably be given every oppotunity to start, but if we don't draft another OLB, can anyone tell me who comes in if there is an injury or Peek just does not perform up to par? Peek has not proven himself to this point. It's not like we are replacing Kevin Greene in his prime. Besides, our depth is non-existant. Are you going to rely on Tim Cheatwood? I wouldn't want to pass up Benson, or someone on that level, for instance, but if it comes down to a WR or LB, in general, I wouldn't hesitiate to pick up the LB. We can still get a darn good receiver in round 3, but there won't be an impact LB available in rd 3.

Right now, at 13, I would rank them Merriman, Ware, and Pollack. But, I would be happy with any of those guys. Some are worried about Merriman's weight, but I think he can play in the 260's, and still be successful. Ware may have the most upside, but will probably need more patience than the other two, so I would see Peek starting, with Ware coming off the bench. Pollack is a high motor guy, and may be the best "football player" of the three. I would love a guy like him on my team. So, all in all, I would be thrilled with ANY of those guys.

infantrycak
04-22-2005, 10:13 AM
Some are worried about Merriman's weight, but I think he can play in the 260's, and still be successful.

Noone should be concerned about Merriman weighting 270+ right now. All the play in college that has gotten him to the top of the 1st round was while he was at 245-255 lbs.

Mr Shush
04-22-2005, 11:55 AM
I still like Pollack better than any other DE in this draft. You can't coach speed, but whatever coaches may kid themselves, you can't coach an attitude like his either. He's the closest thing to a sure thing this draft has, because the guy simply will not allow himself to fail.

Cincinnatikid
04-22-2005, 12:21 PM
Peek at ILB? Ummm, don't think so. Thanks for playing.

As for OLB in the first, I think it is a very logical choice. Peek would probably be given every oppotunity to start, but if we don't draft another OLB, can anyone tell me who comes in if there is an injury or Peek just does not perform up to par? Peek has not proven himself to this point. It's not like we are replacing Kevin Greene in his prime. Besides, our depth is non-existant. Are you going to rely on Tim Cheatwood? I wouldn't want to pass up Benson, or someone on that level, for instance, but if it comes down to a WR or LB, in general, I wouldn't hesitiate to pick up the LB. We can still get a darn good receiver in round 3, but there won't be an impact LB available in rd 3.


You are right he is not kevin greene, or any other start yet. But when has he had a consistent chance of playing yet? Babin was shaky at the beginning of the year many times but by seasons end he was playing much better and people praise that. Peek has taken longer to develop because his chances are 10 plays a game and in practice, which isnt saying much. This team does have a bit of depth on the outside with Anderson and Orr, who when given a few plays have produced. Peek is either going to start this season or his walking papers will be signed for next year. This team has NO depth in the middle. Polk is an average player with not very fast feet. So the real question is who comes in if Greenwood or Wong get hurt or need a break? This is the position that needs to be filled for next seaons when wong may be gone. This team needs a Dlineman or some offensive threat, and that means more so than Bradfod, in the first and then in the second or third you get someone to learn the ILB position this season. This team really isnt a long way off, and the team might as well start acting like they can go to the playoffs and fill the voids that exist ahead of time. This team has the DBs to cover receivers now, so Peek will be able to actually play like a 3-4 rush linebacker where he is involved in a blitz scheme, not just a four or five man rush every play going against 6 blockers. I pass on OLB and go ILB or Dline

Porky
04-22-2005, 01:00 PM
You are right he is not kevin greene, or any other start yet. But when has he had a consistent chance of playing yet? Babin was shaky at the beginning of the year many times but by seasons end he was playing much better and people praise that. Peek has taken longer to develop because his chances are 10 plays a game and in practice, which isnt saying much. This team does have a bit of depth on the outside with Anderson and Orr, who when given a few plays have produced. Peek is either going to start this season or his walking papers will be signed for next year. This team has NO depth in the middle. Polk is an average player with not very fast feet. So the real question is who comes in if Greenwood or Wong get hurt or need a break? This is the position that needs to be filled for next seaons when wong may be gone. This team needs a Dlineman or some offensive threat, and that means more so than Bradfod, in the first and then in the second or third you get someone to learn the ILB position this season. This team really isnt a long way off, and the team might as well start acting like they can go to the playoffs and fill the voids that exist ahead of time. This team has the DBs to cover receivers now, so Peek will be able to actually play like a 3-4 rush linebacker where he is involved in a blitz scheme, not just a four or five man rush every play going against 6 blockers. I pass on OLB and go ILB or Dline


I don't disagree with this, but your making a chicken or egg argument. You are saying the reason Peek hasn't been that successful is because he hasn't played enough, while my argument would be that the reason he hasn't played enough is because he hasn't shown that he deserves it (yet) on the practice fields, pre-season, or that he has totally grasped the position from a mental standpoint. Having said that, from what I can ascertain, they think he is really growing into the position, and I like his upside, and feel he deserves a chance to start. Orr and Anderson are not starters in this league imo, although I will grant you that they do provide some depth.

At ILB, we need help there as well, you are correct. But unless DJ drops to 13, I think we can get decent depth there on day 2 of the draft. The same can be said at dline. Yes, we need a young talent infusion, but 3-4 dlineman can be had on day two. We have a ton of cap money tied up there, and I really think you can get a rotation guy on day two. JMO.

texasguy346
04-22-2005, 01:34 PM
At ILB, we need help there as well, you are correct. But unless DJ drops to 13, I think we can get decent depth there on day 2 of the draft.

Very true. I'd really like to see us take Matt McCoy out of San Diego St if he falls to the 4th or 5th rounds.

D-ReK
04-22-2005, 01:39 PM
Noone should be concerned about Merriman weighting 270+ right now. All the play in college that has gotten him to the top of the 1st round was while he was at 245-255 lbs.

Wasn't Babin listed at around 275 when we took him last year? I think Merriman has been focused on adding bulk so teams would consider him a more viable option as a 4-3 DE...If he were drafted here, he would have to lose some of his bulk, just like Babin did...

infantrycak
04-22-2005, 01:57 PM
Wasn't Babin listed at around 275 when we took him last year? I think Merriman has been focused on adding bulk so teams would consider him a more viable option as a 4-3 DE...If he were drafted here, he would have to lose some of his bulk, just like Babin did...

Babin had bulked up as high as 280 lbs at times in college. It didn't fly for him and by the time the combine had roled around he was down to 260 lbs to prove he could play OLB--kind of the opposite of Merriman player lighter and then gaining weight to prove he could play DE.

infantrycak
04-22-2005, 02:44 PM
There was just a rumor on ESPN that the Bucs may draft Ware at #5 and then trade Simeon Rice to San Diego for their 28th pick. FWIW.

Vinny
04-22-2005, 02:46 PM
I just heard that too. Ware's speed and size combo may just put him out of our reach.

J-Man
04-22-2005, 03:02 PM
I do like both guys for seperate reasons but I have to give the nod to Pollack. I got to see him play a couple times and caught some of his TV games and to be honest you don't notice anything about the kid other than the fact if you want to find him on the field then look for the ball and he's there.

I think he would translate to a great LB for our 3-4...I actually think he might work better as an ILB in the long run as well. He reminds me a lot of Bruschi to be honest; his measurables aren't the best but he flat out makes plays.

I think he is a long term answer to the LB position and he fits the profile for the type of character Casserly looks for.

All that being said I thing Ware has fantastic potential and could be a great pick...I think that barring something drastic Peek is going to be the man this year at least and he is going to have to improve or move.

With the 4 LB positions fairly well locked up (and CC mentioning that their 1st rounder probably won't be a starter) we would be better served picking up Pollack and letting him get some experience at both ILB and OLB. Kid's a playmaker and will be a solid guy for quite a while.

DRIFTAWAY
04-22-2005, 03:36 PM
There was just a rumor on ESPN that the Bucs may draft Ware at #5 and then trade Simeon Rice to San Diego for their 28th pick. FWIW.

What a fun draft this will be.