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texan279
06-15-2004, 09:52 PM
Look at #48 on the list... (http://www.sportsline.com/nfl/story/7423842)


:woot:

jags98
06-15-2004, 10:07 PM
Jamie Sharper should have been on that list over Andre Johnson :twocents:

texan279
06-15-2004, 10:09 PM
I didn't agree with a lot of the list anyways... :twocents:

J-Man
06-16-2004, 08:19 AM
I would have like to have seen Jamie Sharper on the list in fact...not sure of what the guy's criteria is. Seems like he was looking at potential and expected preformance...he did say that he was looking at it like a flat out draft.

Panther5407
06-17-2004, 08:39 PM
1. Peyton Manning, QB, Colts: He has been the best quarterback, and now he's clearly the best player. The only thing missing is a Super Bowl victory.

2. Ray Lewis, LB, Ravens: This is the best middle linebacker to play the game, which is high praise. Some said Lewis' play tailed off some last season when a shoulder injury forced him to change his tackling some. But he still gets to the football better than any middle/inside linebacker in history.

3. Steve McNair, QB, Titans: The co-MVP from last season has made major strides the past two years because of his ability to stay in the pocket. He can carry a team: and he does.

4. Priest Holmes, RB, Chiefs: The numbers he puts up are simply amazing, especially when you consider he was not drafted. So much for that hip injury slowing him down.

5. LaDainian Tomlinson, RB, Chargers: He is a special player on a not-so-special team. He may never get his due playing for the Chargers, which isn't right.



6. Randy Moss, WR, Vikings: His statistics don't make him the best in the league, but ask most personnel guys and most defensive backs and they'll say Moss is the best. On this list, he is the highest-ranked receiver.

7. Marvin Harrison, WR, Colts: He didn't put up the same numbers as he did in 2002, but still put up some impressive numbers. Manning spread the ball more last season, which helped the Colts offense, but hurt Harrison's numbers.

8. Kris Jenkins, DT, Panthers: The best inside player in the game, a force who can play the run and also get pressure on the quarterback. The argument about Warren Sapp or Jenkins is over now. This may seem high, but ask the offensive coordinators who face him.

9. Champ Bailey, CB, Broncos: Bailey and Charles Woodson of the Raiders are the two best corners in the game (sorry, Ty Law). Some scouts said Bailey tailed off some last year, but others say he remains the league's best.

10. Jonathan Ogden, T, Ravens: Remains the best tackle in the game, a dominant run blocker who also is one heck of a pass protector. Only downside is a lack of a mean streak.

11. Clinton Portis, RB, Redskins: He may be the best pure runner in the game, and now he can show that he wasn't just a product of the Denver system. Joe Gibbs will love this guy.

12. Tom Brady, QB, Patriots: He has made a believer out of us. He's perfect for what the Patriots want him to do, which is to be effective in the high-percentage passing game. Two Super Bowls in three years. Wow.

13. Jamal Lewis, RB, Ravens: His legal issues aside, this is a player coming off a 2,000-yard rushing season, playing for a team that didn't throw it that well, either. He's a powerful runner.

14. Richard Seymour, DE, Patriots: Can dominate at end and tackle, depending on the scheme being used. Really came on late last season to dominate after a slow start.

15. Ahman Green, RB, Packers: In a league where the running backs are king, he is among the best. Green can run with it and catch, making him a duel threat.

16. Chris McAlister, CB, Ravens: A physical corner who can beat up a receiver, yet still turn and run with them. Coming off his best season.

17. Mike Strahan, DE, Giants: Quietly had one heck of a season in 2003, but now must deal with playing for a coach he obviously cares little about.

18. Brett Favre, QB, Packers: He's still one heck of a gunslinger, owning the big arm and demeanor to be great. His skills have eroded a bit, but not much.

19. Michael Vick, QB, Falcons: The leg injury set him back a bunch last year, but he has the skills to move into the top five next year. He does have to grow as a pocket passer.

20. Deuce McAllister, RB, Saints: A big-play threat who can also get the tough yards. He is another undervalued player who doesn't get his due.

21. Charles Woodson, CB, Raiders: Battled through injuries last season, but still played at a high level. Teams did pick on him a little more than in the past, but he still is a shut-down corner.

22. Al Wilson, MLB, Broncos: The Broncos did the right thing signing him to a long-term deal. Wilson plays the game with an attitude and he has the speed to chase down backs and play the pass.

23. Ty Law, CB, Patriots: He was outstanding last year in helping the Patriots win the Super Bowl. Has wonderful man cover skills, but also has a knack for playing the ball in zone coverage.



24. Brian Dawkins, S, Eagles: The hard-hitting safety will have to play even better with the loss of the two starting corners. Can impact the game from the safety spot, which is rare.

25. Derrick Brooks, LB, Bucs: With Warren Sapp and John Lynch gone, this is clearly Brooks' defense -- if it wasn't already. Brooks topped this list last year, but he falls a bit this time around.

26. Orlando Pace, T, Rams: He doesn't always seem to care about the game, reflecting a lack of passion. But he has the tools to dominate when he wants to do so. Has amazing feet for a man his size.

27. Julian Peterson, LB, 49ers: His multi-dimensional skills shined last year, but a nasty contract situation could impact his season. When he's on the field, he's an all-round player and key to the 49ers defense.

28. Tony Gonzalez, TE, Chiefs: He still rates as the best pass-catching tight end in the game, a weapon who helps offset the fact the Chiefs do not have big-play receivers.

29. Torry Holt, WR, Rams: No matter who plays quarterback, Holt is a consistent threat down the field. Holt's skills have improved each year, and he's now in his prime.

30. Brian Urlacher, LB, Bears: The trendy talk is that he didn't play that well last season, that he tends to run around blocks. He's not the power linebacker **** Butkus was when he played for the Bears, but he's a playmaker, which is why he's one of the best. Not in the Lewis' class.

31. LaVar Arrington, LB, Redskins: He isn't as good as people rate him, in large part because he freelances too much. But he has all the tools. Gregg Williams will make him a better player.

32. Terrell Owens, WR, Eagles: This is a hard-working player who takes far too much grief for his antics. He's a big-play receiver who will help change the Eagles offense.

33. Marcus Stroud, DT, Jaguars: A riser on this board, Stroud went to his first Pro Bowl last season. It won't be his last as he moves near the top of the defensive tackle ratings.

34. Jason Taylor, DE, Dolphins: Even though there's a perception that Adewale Ogunleye is the better end on the Miami defense, more scouts would still take Taylor.

35. Jeremy Shockey, TE, Giants: He hasn't lived up to the hype, but every single team would take him in a minute. He has to stay healthy, and that's questionable now.

36. Walter Jones, T, Seahawks: He excels in pass protection, but, like Pace and Ogden, he doesn't play with a nasty streak.

37. Ed Reed, S, Ravens: Reed had a break-out year in his second season, showing outstanding cover skills and the ability to come up and thump against the run.

38. Donovan McNabb, QB, Eagles: After a slow start last season, McNabb bounced back to play well. Now the pressure is on even more with the no-receivers excuse gone with the signing of Terrell Owens.

39. Fred Taylor, RB, Jaguars: Two years without a missed game has helped him throw away the "Fragile Fred" label. He is the most underrated player in the league.

40. Todd Heap, TE, Ravens: His numbers are stunted by the offense he plays in, but he has the same type of tools as Shockey. As Kyle Boller grows this season, look for Heap to put up better numbers.

41. Takeo Spikes, LB, Bills: Had his best season last year, his first with the Bills. Has the speed coaches love, and has learned to harness it and play under control more.

42. Simeon Rice, DE, Bucs: His play tailed off some from 2002, but he still remains a threat off the corner. Look for a bounce-back year from Rice.

43. Roy Williams, S, Cowboys: This will be the season where his skills really shine now that he is comfortable with the defense. He has amazing ability for a safety his size.

44. Patrick Surtain, CB, Dolphins: In the past two years, he has clearly moved way past teammate Sam Madison in terms of coverage ability.

45. Keith Bulluck, LB, Titans: Another of the more underrated players in the league. Bulluck is an active player who always seems to be around the ball.

46. Chad Johnson, WR, Bengals: There is no more doubting that he is better than his more heralded cousin, Keyshawn. This is a big-play receiver. Just ask him.

47. Ricky Williams, RB, Dolphins: Miami's poor line play last season hurt Williams, but he also didn't have the same burst to the hole as he did in 2002. The alleged failed drug test is hanging over this season already.

48. Andre Johnson, WR, Texans: The leap for receivers going from their first to second seasons is usually a big one. That doesn't bode well for defensive backs readying to face Johnson.

49. Jevon Kearse, DE, Eagles: If his foot injury holds up, he is capable of a 15-sack season. That's a big if, though. Would be higher if he had been healthy last season.

50. Steve Hutchinson, G, Seahawks: He is the best guard in the league, which is why he's on this list. Has great athletic ability, but he's also a mauler when need be.
CNS.SportsLine.com

Only one Texan on the fifty. Let me know who else you think should be up there.

infantrycak
06-17-2004, 09:02 PM
Love AJ, and think he will be a pro-bowler at some point, but ahead of him on any top whatever list at this point need to be Jamie Sharper, Aaron Glenn and Gary Walker. Potential to be top 50 in the NFL, AJ no doubt has that, but hard to rank a guy arguably 16th at his position last year, top 50 in the NFL.

Ibar_Harry
06-17-2004, 09:09 PM
Its interesting to see AJ being touted this high. Remember a year ago we had our choice of Gross or AJ. Some of the NFL types rate Gross quite high and he appears to be making the move to LT. Looks like we had a safe pick based on what both young men have done. Physically AJ is very impressive, but is he really that good? It will be interesting to see what happens this year. Will David really have the O-line that allows him to seek out his targets? Can AJ handle the missels fired at him? How well will the other receivers handle the ball? All interesting questions to be answered when the training camp starts. Once again it seems like our team is quietly preparing itself for the upcoming season. The words out of David seem to indicate the team may have some lofty goals like some of us have. I like the spirit of not wanting to be average. Its amazing what an additional 2 or 3 seconds means to an NFL QB. How effective will the new line blocking schemes be? How good will our defensive unit be? I think we feel very positive about all of these questions, but answers are going to be hard to come by until we see our team perform in the preseason games. Even then, its hard to sometimes determine what the team is doing with a particular preseason game. May be it won't be until the 1st game of the season that we have an idea of what our team is going to be. DD certainly had a very good first year. I think his second year is going to be a function of how well our receivers do. I think that, because it was obvious we went to DD at the end of the season. He is now the target of every team. The word out on the street will be stop DD and you stop the Texans. However, if they have to worry about our receivers and DD, then we become a nightmare to defend. A factor not often talked about is our kicking game. We have a good one, and if Carr can get us a little closer on average, then we are going to put a lot of pressure on the other team. All in all, I think this could be a very interesting year and I think we could surprise a lot of people. I like the talk I'm hearing out of the players at the mini camps. They are very positive. Oh, bye the way, shouldn't DD be on the list?

Fiddy
06-17-2004, 09:13 PM
no way DD should have made the list, I would take AJ and Sharper over DD anyday so if you have a problem with AJ on the list, DD cant be on it. I take all those players plus Aquain Boldin and a couple others.

texan279
06-17-2004, 09:24 PM
Ibar, imo, Dom Davis is not one of the top 50 players in the NFL. He had a nice year for a late pick but most of the starting backs in the NFL could have done the same.

Agreed V, even Eddie George got 1,000 yards last year...I am not saying that Davis was horrible last year but IMO rushing for 1,000 yards in a season is not as big of a deal as it used to be...but it was awesome watching DD gain every yard of it last year...

B.Diddy
06-17-2004, 09:32 PM
Is the best player in the NFL really Peyton Manning... idonno: ..........uh no he isn't even the best quarterback Steve McNair is, he is a soldier he plays hurt he is a monster to take down and has proven himself time and time again. If he was rating on talent pure and simple like he stated McNair would be at the top of the list.
:twocents:

Fiddy
06-17-2004, 09:45 PM
I'd take Manning over McNair, just my opinion.

mes311
06-17-2004, 09:47 PM
........uh no he isn't even the best quarterback Steve McNair is, he is a soldier he plays hurt he is a monster to take down and has proven himself time and time again. If he was rating on talent pure and simple like he stated McNair would be at the top of the list.
:twocents:

I agree McNair is tough, but is he really the most talented in the NFL? He is a great leader and field general, but IMO, he isn't as talented as Farve, P. Manning, and some of the others, although he does have a unique skill set for a quaterback and a good track record.

B.Diddy
06-17-2004, 09:47 PM
i also have a problem with Dante Hall not being on the list

texan279
06-17-2004, 09:48 PM
McNair and Favre are #1 and #2 but not in that order, I do not know how I could break that tie...

B.Diddy
06-17-2004, 09:51 PM
If anything how can you even put Peyton on top when he has Harrison When Tom Brady won two super bowls without a pro bowl reciver.

MoBlack
06-17-2004, 09:54 PM
Is the best player in the NFL really Peyton Manning... idonno: ..........uh no he isn't even the best quarterback Steve McNair is, he is a soldier he plays hurt he is a monster to take down and has proven himself time and time again. If he was rating on talent pure and simple like he stated McNair would be at the top of the list.
:twocents:


Agreed with B. Diddy if you have manning there mcnair should be rated right there cuase they were co-mvp. this listing is biased cause manning is the last great "white" hope QB america can have. people are realizing there are being great strides in the nfl towards the black Qb who is just as smart in reading defenses and is way faster and quicker. need me to make a list? hmm there some of the highest paid qb's and the highest to go on the market. mannign is all hype. put him with some average wr's and he's nothing. now mcnair has average wr's and his gameplay is way better. he's a dual threat guy who can do it all and has mobility to scramble if in trouble. mannign doesn't he just has to look stupid when he gets sacked or throws a int. remember the cham game against the pats. manning was exposed. forget tough db play. manning was exposed as nothing. thanks for your time and cheers.

B.Diddy
06-17-2004, 09:55 PM
I'd take Manning over McNair, just my opinion.
I respect your opinion i just disagree i think tom brady is the best QB Steve McNair is the second best (maybe there is a second place tie with Brett Farve) But thats how I see it :hmmm:

texan279
06-17-2004, 09:56 PM
Alright I thought about it for awhile and I think McNair is best QB in the league. He can do everything Manning can do but is faster and can run with the ball if he has to, which Manning can't do well. I think McNair is also tougher than Manning. :twocents:

B.Diddy
06-17-2004, 10:07 PM
Warren Moon pretty much put the "black QB" issue to bed a couple of decades ago. Frankly a running QB has yet to capture the big crown for many reasons and one of them is that they take more hits and have a hard time staying healthy in a NFL season. I would take McNair over Manning myself but not because he is black or a better athlete. I think he is a better clutch player.
Thanks Vinny thats exactly i was trying to get across this is why Tom Brady and Steve McNair are the best at what they do if its one min in the game your team is up by three and either of these quarterbacks has possesion of the ball you are instantly transformed into a nervous breakdown eek: until there's all zero's on the clock these qb's can hurt you

Fiddy
06-17-2004, 10:13 PM
Manning is also more durable because he doesnt run. He has never missed a game in his career, McNair missed around 3 last year.

I think Brady is a top 5 QB, but not number 1. For me it would be something like:
1) Manning
2 & 3) McNair/Brady
4) Favre
5) McNabb/Culpepper


McNair and Brady are switchable, but I give the edge to the co-MVP.

Favre is still Favre and McNabb may have lost in the NFC championship game 3 times, but the fact is he has gotten there three times with no help from his WRs.

Culpepper was 6th on the all time passer rating chart before 04, maybe it is because he has Moss, but you cant deny that he puts the ball in the right places. I'd take McNabb and Culpepper over Vick any day to win a game.

MoBlack
06-17-2004, 10:17 PM
Warren Moon pretty much put the "black QB" issue to bed a couple of decades ago. Frankly a running QB has yet to capture the big crown for many reasons and one of them is that they take more hits and have a hard time staying healthy in a NFL season. I would take McNair over Manning myself but not because he is black or a better athlete. I think he is a better clutch player.


nah Moon didn't calm that down. there were a few Qb's who were passed over after him. black players are still saying when they go to college with there speed and athleticm coaches are wanting them to switch to a better position suited for them such as wr's and db's. notice how qb's such as seneca wallace have been picked over cause of height. ell roberson.this list could go on. it's known that vick isn't even 6ft but couldnt be picked over cause of his arm. what nfl gm's and coaches fail to realize these mobile qb's don't have to be in the 6'2 to 6'5 range cause they move outside the pocket where height isn't needed. shoot look at payton manning all that arm and no mobility. what can he do if you put pressure on him. nothing at all. need some examples:jason white at out put some pressure on him and that gimp can't do anything, look at drew bledsoe has one of the best arms put him on the run he can't think straight with pressure, look at umm any pocket qb they cant' think str8 with pressure. heck with the way DE 's are getting faster. the pocket qb's days are dwindling. like i said the day of the black qb will come when people realize players are faster and quicker. heck DT running 4.9 and 4.8 is crazy. heck you got lb's running 4.5 now!! what can a pocket qb do to offset that. NOTHING.

MoBlack
06-17-2004, 10:19 PM
Manning is also more durable because he doesnt run. He has never missed a game in his career, McNair missed around 3 last year.

I think Brady is a top 5 QB, but not number 1. For me it would be something like:
1) Manning
2 & 3) McNair/Brady
4) Favre
5) McNabb/Culpepper


McNair and Brady are switchable, but I give the edge to the co-MVP.

Favre is still Favre and McNabb may have lost in the NFC championship game 3 times, but the fact is he has gotten there three times with no help from his WRs.

Culpepper was 6th on the all time passer rating chart before 04, maybe it is because he has Moss, but you cant deny that he puts the ball in the right places. I'd take McNabb and Culpepper over Vick any day to win a game.

cullpeper is good but forces the ball the alot to moss. umm manning isn't number 1 what has he done? he has one of the best wr's in the league and one of the best rb's and your saying he's all that. brady has won 2 super bowls with average at best qb's and below par running game. heck i'd take brady any day over manning. heck wait and see what he can do when he has a rb to take the pressure off of him. cheers.

Fiddy
06-17-2004, 10:21 PM
like i said the day of the black qb will come when people realize players are faster and quicker. heck DT running 4.9 and 4.8 is crazy. heck you got lb's running 4.5 now!! what can a pocket qb do to offset that. NOTHING.You offset it with quick throws, reading defenses, knowing what the defense might run.Manning has put up 4,000 yards in each of his NFL seasons passing the ball and he is slow but he studies and knows what the defense is going to do and how to counter that. Tom Brady is as slow as Manning and just won a superbowl. You dont need to be fast to play any position, you need to be smart.

B.Diddy
06-17-2004, 10:23 PM
ok ok i did leave McNabb off my new list looks like this

1. McNair
Co #1. Tom Brady
2. McNabb
3. Farve
4. Manning
5.Culpeper

McNabb just like Brady and Mcnair don't have all star recievers but they find a way to make it happen in the clutch

wags
06-17-2004, 10:26 PM
. brady has won 2 super bowls with average at best qb's and below par running game. heck i'd take brady any day over manning. heck wait and see what he can do when he has a rb to take the pressure off of him. cheers.

I would also say that Brady has had a pretty good defense to help win those 2 super bowls. What help has Peyton had on defense?

Fiddy
06-17-2004, 10:29 PM
umm manning isn't number 1 what has he done? he has one of the best wr's in the league and one of the best rb's and your saying he's all that. brady has won 2 super bowls with average at best qb's and below par running game. heck i'd take brady any day over manning. heck wait and see what he can do when he has a rb to take the pressure off of him. cheers.So if Ryan Leaf went to the Colts and had Harrison and James we would be taking about him right now. All Manning has done is start and play in ever game of his career and re-written the record books with 5 straight season of 4000 yards or more passing. It is not his fault Manning's defense has had to play catch-up from day one.

Brady has the superior defense on his side, not all credit should be given to Brady when they win the superbowl. Against the Rams in the superbowl 3 years back, the Pats secondary tore up Kurt Warner.

Manning may have the better offensive supporting cast, but Brady has the better all-around supporting cast.

B.Diddy
06-17-2004, 10:31 PM
I would also say that Brady has had a pretty good defense to help win those 2 super bowls. What help has Peyton had on defense?
The colts didn't lose the to the pats on defense they lost when they offense got exposed :hehe:

infantrycak
06-17-2004, 10:31 PM
Physically AJ is very impressive, but is he really that good?

Umm?--yeah he is. He was in the top ten rookie WR's ever despite being on a poor team, playing with hurt QB's or 2nd and 3rd string QB's last year--he is that good.

put him with some average wr's and he's nothing.

Making a statement like this about Manning destroys any credibility to your argument. Manning is a fantastic QB, period--will he be worth the gigantic contract they gave him is another question.

shoot look at payton manning all that arm and no mobility. what can he do if you put pressure on him.

Every team that played them last year put the best pressure they could on him--the answer is he put 4300 yds back. Vick's best year is 2900. Care for another argument?

ccdude730
06-17-2004, 10:34 PM
i think all you have to do is have a little patience and trust with your receiver. also, the only reason im not a big fan of manning, even though he is a great student of the game, is that he doesnt have the ability to buy more time. he tried it against the pats, and it didnt work too good...he is a pocket passer and when he starts on the run he doesnt have that kind of instinct i guess to be able to feel like field like others can. IMO -i hope that makes sense

and here i am talkin about him not scrambling when we pretty much lost the game because of a manning run.

Fiddy
06-17-2004, 10:34 PM
The colts didn't lose the to the pats on defense they lost when they offense got exposed :hehe:It wasnt like the defense was much better that day, one of the corners for the colts got destroyed on a pump and go screen play. And early in the game it was 4th and 3 and the Pats went for it and got it. Also wasnt Manning's fault when Marvin Harrison fumbled the ball. And if memory serves correctly, 1 of the picks wasnt his fault.

MoBlack
06-17-2004, 10:45 PM
hey have you guys ever heard of another guy named DAn Marinoe?

wags
06-17-2004, 10:45 PM
The colts didn't lose the to the pats on defense they lost when they offense got exposed :hehe:

Yes. Exactly. The Pats defense did plague Manning because they have such a good defense. The Pats defense totally outplayed the Colts D. Imagine if Peyton had a good D like the Pats have.

MoBlack
06-18-2004, 10:59 AM
I agree McNair is tough, but is he really the most talented in the NFL? He is a great leader and field general, but IMO, he isn't as talented as Farve, P. Manning, and some of the others, although he does have a unique skill set for a quaterback and a good track record.


how is manning a great QB he hasn't won a freaking championship. how the .... can you say he's better than mcnair when they share the mvp crown. gosh some of you guys are so biased on here. heck mcnair has been to the super bowl and lost bye what a yard!!!!!!!!!!!! manning hasn't even gotten to the super bowl cuase that passing attack was exposed!!!!

Panther5407
06-18-2004, 11:28 AM
Panther5407, make sure you provide a source for your copy and paste articles please. Since 279 has already posted it we are fine in this case but keep this in mind down the road.

Ibar, imo, Dom Davis is not one of the top 50 players in the NFL. He had a nice year for a late pick but most of the starting backs in the NFL could have done the same.


I did provide a source, its right under the #50 on the list. Did I not do it right?

wags
06-18-2004, 12:19 PM
how is manning a great QB he hasn't won a freaking championship. !!!

I consider Dan Marino to be a pretty good QB and he never won a championship. Try telling number 13 he isn't great because he never won a championship.

MoBlack
06-18-2004, 12:52 PM
I consider Dan Marino to be a pretty good QB and he never won a championship. Try telling number 13 he isn't great because he never won a championship.


take brady over manning any day. people need to stop looking at last name and look at acomplishments. and what they do on the field.

B.Diddy
06-18-2004, 01:06 PM
take brady over manning any day. people need to stop looking at last name and look at acomplishments. and what they do on the field.
Thank u thats all ive been trying to say

MoBlack
06-18-2004, 01:08 PM
Thank u thats all ive been trying to say
people are biased. hey didn't manning father never win a championship? family of talent but can't get over the hump.

Porky
06-18-2004, 02:34 PM
All I have to say is that if you think Manning isn't a HOL calibur QB, your not too astute. Brady is excellent, but is a system QB. He is in the perfect place for his talents. Both Mcnair and Manning would be successful anywhere imo. I would take Manning because of Mcnair's lack of durability, but it isn't as if one is pure gold, and the other tinfoil. When you make arguments like that, and mix in obvious racial bias, you're asking for people to simply ignore you as an ignorant fool. Gee, I think I will. :D

Doug
06-18-2004, 03:35 PM
Talk about biased MOBLACK.......you sound like you just flat out hate Manning. Barry Sanders never won a Super Bowl or even went to one for that matter so does that make Antoine Smith a better running back? You make it sound like you can't be a great football player if you've never been to the big game.

MoBlack
06-19-2004, 04:56 PM
Talk about biased MOBLACK.......you sound like you just flat out hate Manning. Barry Sanders never won a Super Bowl or even went to one for that matter so does that make Antoine Smith a better running back? You make it sound like you can't be a great football player if you've never been to the big game.


Barry Sanders clearly never had a squad around him dude


All I have to say is that if you think Manning isn't a HOL calibur QB, your not too astute. Brady is excellent, but is a system QB. He is in the perfect place for his talents. Both Mcnair and Manning would be successful anywhere imo. I would take Manning because of Mcnair's lack of durability, but it isn't as if one is pure gold, and the other tinfoil. When you make arguments like that, and mix in obvious racial bias, you're asking for people to simply ignore you as an ignorant fool. Gee, I think I will.


hey if you can't except the facts thats your problem. anyone with common sense knows thats how some of these votes are. be real about it. if manning was a black QB some writer the same night would be saying see it's true they cant run an offense which as been said numerous times. look at how writers degrade Vick's style of play. he has no pocket presense this and that. ever heard of things evolving. that person said that brady is a system QB all teams have a system dude. they get the person that fits there system. cotls have a system to. they love to run the play action pass cause of manning inability to buy time with his feet.

WWJD
06-19-2004, 06:08 PM
Manning is great.

Brady is great.

McNair is great.

It depends on the team though. They can't do it alone. I think the Manning/Harrison hookup is special.

Brady is a winner. He just finds a way to get the job done.

McNair is the toughest guy in football. He plays so hard and is just fun to watch.

B.Diddy
06-19-2004, 06:31 PM
I would take Manning because of Mcnair's lack of durability

What lack of durability........apparently you don't watch to much football :twocents:

B.Diddy
06-19-2004, 06:33 PM
Manning is great.

Brady is great.

McNair is great.

It depends on the team though. They can't do it alone. I think the Manning/Harrison hookup is special.

Brady is a winner. He just finds a way to get the job done.

McNair is the toughest guy in football. He plays so hard and is just fun to watch.


I agree with you but we can't forget McNabb he finds a way to get to the championship game every year with cruddy recivers

DominatorDavis
06-19-2004, 10:17 PM
The senior writer from Sportsline.com, Pete Prisco rated the top 50 players in the NFL. Texan receiver Andre Johnson made the list beating out Jevon Kearse and Steve Hutchinson from Seattle for the 48th spot. Johnson was the last reciever on the list and is sitting pretty with some high caliber company. Some wide receivers of note chosen before AJ:

Chad Johnson #46
Terrell Owens #32
Torry Holt #29
Marvin Harrison #7
Randy Moss #6

Now of those 6 receivers (our man included) I rate them (1 through 6) as follows:

Harrision.......#1
Moss...........#2
Holt............#3
Owens........#4
A Johnson...#5
C Johnson...#6

For me it really is a toss up between Holt and Owens at 3 and 4. Holt wins because he does it without the show.

Here is the article by Prisco: http://www.sportsline.com/nfl/story/7423842

Nawzer
06-20-2004, 02:09 PM
Andre Johnson is ahead of Chad Johnson?! I don't know about that..