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tacoman_j
04-18-2005, 04:01 PM
I think if you really want to be prepared for Saturday, read Paul Zimmerman's mock draft in this week's SI and check out Rick Gosselin's online in the Dallas Morning News. Both men are brilliant dissectors of the draft.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2005/writers/peter_king/04/18/mmqb.draft.smith/3.html

Hey, Vin, according to Peter King, he also endorses your view of Rick Gosselin as draft prognosticator.

Vinny
04-18-2005, 04:03 PM
Yeah, I have been following the NFL draft closely for decades. I used to buy the late Joel Bushbaum's draft guide before most of the average fans ever heard of him years and years ago. He used to do a radio show from his apartment in NY that aired here in Houston (740am) before the internet.

Gosselin has quite a reputation for his contacts. Nobody should just blow off his comments. I think if you really want to be prepared for Saturday, read Paul Zimmerman's mock draft in this week's SI and check out Rick Gosselin's online in the Dallas Morning News. Both men are brilliant dissectors of the draft.

Vinny
04-18-2005, 08:20 PM
Click link for his linebacker rating and his entire article. The article is on tweeners but I took this copy-n-paste from the bottom of the article. THE BEST

Demarcus Ware, Troy

It's a coin toss between Johnson and Ware. Johnson is an elite playmaker with nine career interceptions and 11 forced fumbles. But Ware has a skill that is in short supply in this draft. He's the one pure speed pass rusher on the board, and that will drive up his stock. Ware used his 4.51 speed to make 11 sacks in 2004 and 28 in his career. An end at Troy, he projects as an outside linebacker in a 3-4 NFL scheme.

All-Americans: Derrick Johnson, Mike Boley.

Award winners: Johnson (Butkus, Nagurski), Beck (Buchanan, best defensive player in I-AA).

Best underclassman: Thurman.

Potential 1s: Demarcus Ware, Derrick Johnson, Odell Thurman, Kevin Burnett.

SLEEPER

Nick Speegle, New Mexico

Speegle has the size (6-4, 252), speed (4.50 40-yard dash) and brains to play middle linebacker in the NFL. He was a three-time academic All-Mountain West who carded only three Bs in college on the way to a 3.97 grade-point average. He's also a leader, having served as team captain in 2004, and a productive player, amassing 309 tackles in his three seasons as a starter.

http://www.dallasnews.com/s/dws/spt/football/nfl/draft/stories/041705dnspodraftseries.1a6e94e1.html

WildBlackBear32
04-18-2005, 08:29 PM
So he's got Ware as a Tweener but not Merriman...Unless he totally hates the guy, as he's not even listed as a potential #1...

Vinny
04-18-2005, 08:31 PM
I think more people see him as a 4-3 end. He is already over 270 and he is supposed to have the body to get bigger. Here is his list of DL's. Pollack is on this one.

THE TOP 15 (STRENGTH: 5 OUT OF 10)
Pos. Player School Ht. Wt. Noteworthy
E Erasmus James Wisconsin 6-4 266 Two-year starter
E Shawne Merriman Maryland 6-4 272 40-inch vertical jump
E Marcus Spears LSU 6-4 307 Converted tight end
E David Pollack Georgia 6-2 265 Three-time All-SEC
T Travis Johnson Florida St. 6-3 305 161 career tackles
T Shaun Cody USC 6-4 293 4-year starter
E Matt Roth Iowa 6-3 278 42 career tackles for loss
T Luis Castillo Northwestern 6-3 303 Academic All-America
T Jonathan Babineaux Iowa 6-2 286 10 sacks in 2004
E Justin Tuck Notre Dame 6-5 268 13 sacks in 2003
T Mike Patterson USC 5-11 292 4.9 speed in the 40
E Dan Cody Oklahoma 6-5 254 Big 12 sack leader
T Atiyyah Ellison Missouri 6-4 305 Junior college transfer
E Bill Swancutt Oregon St. 6-4 270 11 sacks in 2004
T Anttaj Hawthorne Wisconsin 6-3 321 2-time All-Big Ten http://www.dallasnews.com/s/sports/broadwire/041105ccwcSportsNFLdmndraftdl.1ce9691a3.html

WildBlackBear32
04-18-2005, 08:39 PM
I think more people see him as a 4-3 end. He is already over 270 and he is supposed to have the body to get bigger. Here is his list of DL's. Pollack is on this one.

http://www.dallasnews.com/s/sports/broadwire/041105ccwcSportsNFLdmndraftdl.1ce9691a3.html

Is that actually RANKED or just a list? I cant see some of those guys being ahead of Hawthorne and D.Cody.

Vinny
04-18-2005, 08:42 PM
I believe that is his ranking.

nunusguy
04-18-2005, 09:56 PM
Talk about marching to your own drummer, this Gosselin guy is out there by himself on several of his position ratings. More power to him, he's not afraid to stick his neck out. Check out this ranking of OL:
********************
1. T Jammal Brown Oklahoma 6-5 1/2 316 Allowed no sacks in 2004
2. T Alex Barron Fla. St. 6-7 1/2 320 Almost 38-inch arms
This is the first time I've seen Brown (or anyone for that matter), rated ahead of Barron
********************
And check these ratings for DL: the "Ourlads" guy on 610 the other night said
James is still on the Board after all the 1st round picks are complete. That's
pretty extreme, but Gosselin says just the opposite: he's got James rated
higher than everybodys freek this year - Shawne Merriman. Somebody is gonna have a lot of egg on their face come Saturday night.
*********************
THE TOP 15 (STRENGTH: 5 OUT OF 10)
Pos. Player School Ht. Wt. Noteworthy
E Erasmus James Wisconsin 6-4 266 Two-year starter
E Shawne Merriman Maryland 6-4 272 40-inch vertical jump
E Marcus Spears LSU 6-4 307 Converted tight end
E David Pollack Georgia 6-2 265 Three-time All-SEC

texansfan88
04-18-2005, 10:43 PM
Talk about marching to your own drummer, this Gosselin guy is out there by himself on several of his position ratings. More power to him, he's not afraid to stick his neck out. Check out this ranking of OL:
********************
1. T Jammal Brown Oklahoma 6-5 1/2 316 Allowed no sacks in 2004
2. T Alex Barron Fla. St. 6-7 1/2 320 Almost 38-inch arms
This is the first time I've seen Brown (or anyone for that matter), rated ahead of Barron
********************
And check these ratings for DL: the "Ourlads" guy on 610 the other night said
James is still on the Board after all the 1st round picks are complete. That's
pretty extreme, but Gosselin says just the opposite: he's got James rated
higher than everybodys freek this year - Shawne Merriman. Somebody is gonna have a lot of egg on their face come Saturday night.
*********************
THE TOP 15 (STRENGTH: 5 OUT OF 10)
Pos. Player School Ht. Wt. Noteworthy
E Erasmus James Wisconsin 6-4 266 Two-year starter
E Shawne Merriman Maryland 6-4 272 40-inch vertical jump
E Marcus Spears LSU 6-4 307 Converted tight end
E David Pollack Georgia 6-2 265 Three-time All-SEC
it may surprise you, but there are a fairly good amount of teams that do not have Barron as the #1 OT on the board, including a team of high interest to most on this board.

nunusguy
04-18-2005, 11:05 PM
it may surprise you, but there are a fairly good amount of teams that do not have Barron as the #1 OT on the board, including a team of high interest to most on this board.
And you're saying that you're privy to the insider/internal rankings of the players in this years NFL Draft of "a team of high interest to most on this board" ?

texansfan88
04-18-2005, 11:22 PM
And you're saying that you're privy to the insider/internal rankings of the players in this years NFL Draft of "a team of high interest to most on this board" ?
SIGH...we go over this every time...I dont, my boss does, NL Scouting services is one of the most respected services around, not like any of these draft sites.

D-ReK
04-19-2005, 12:40 AM
Is that actually RANKED or just a list? I cant see some of those guys being ahead of Hawthorne and D.Cody.

The thing that's driving Cody's stock so low is his depression problems...Teams fear he could end up like Barrett Robbins, and if he were to get injured, teams aren't sure what the adverse effects to him taking pain medication and depression medication would be...

edo783
04-19-2005, 11:03 AM
There is a BIG differense between straight depression and a bi-polar manic/depressive which is what Robbins is. If the guy is a , I hate to use the term, regular depressive, it is very likely he can controll it really well with medication and never have a problem. Bi-polar folks on the other hand have HUGE swings in emotions and while that can be controlled with medications, they tend to believe on their up-swing sessions that they are cured and then not take the medications causing all sorts of unpleasent things to happen. The short answer is, I wouldn't be too worried about a person on regular anti-depresents.

Errant Hothy
04-19-2005, 11:25 AM
Gosselin is currently on the radio here in Dallas, and just said that Pollack will be a an average player in the NFL, a good average player but not a star nor will he produce near anything like he did in college. Station is 1310AM.

threetoedpete
04-19-2005, 11:35 AM
There is a BIG differense between straight depression and a bi-polar manic/depressive which is what Robbins is. If the guy is a , I hate to use the term, regular depressive, it is very likely he can controll it really well with medication and never have a problem. Bi-polar folks on the other hand have HUGE swings in emotions and while that can be controlled with medications, they tend to believe on their up-swing sessions that they are cured and then not take the medications causing all sorts of unpleasent things to happen. The short answer is, I wouldn't be too worried about a person on regular anti-depresents.

Funny stuff. We've all become capologist, psychchiatrits and amature desk sargents. Funny 'ol world.


Look I don't have a thing against Barron or Merriman for that matter. We may well take one of these guys or Pollack. Barron plays soft, Merriman gets himself out of position, and Pollard has short arms. But Hey Mills just passed. Lot of guys ended up with eggs on their faces over him for sure. If they take one of them I'll back the team 100%. I mean my guy DJ is no sure thing. From sideline to sideline he is the bomb. But at the point of attack, that's another thing. He's got work to do, no doubt. .


Yep I miss Joel too. Orioles beat the Yankees bad the other day. I thought about him. Bet he loved it.

bckey
04-19-2005, 12:01 PM
SIGH...we go over this every time...I dont, my boss does, NL Scouting services is one of the most respected services around, not like any of these draft sites.

A scouting service turns over their evaluations to the team paying for their service not vice versa. Capers and Casserly aren't going to let your boss know what their final rankings are. Too risky and there is no reason to do it.

texansfan88
04-19-2005, 03:55 PM
A scouting service turns over their evaluations to the team paying for their service not vice versa. Capers and Casserly aren't going to let your boss know what their final rankings are. Too risky and there is no reason to do it.
Of course not, but scouts aren't as quiet sometimes...you really don't have to believe it. No one is holding a gun to your head. This is just what is being said.

Porky
04-19-2005, 05:21 PM
Of course not, but scouts aren't as quiet sometimes...you really don't have to believe it. No one is holding a gun to your head. This is just what is being said.

FWIW, I have read elsewhere that the Texans have Barnes rated higher than Barron.

I have a Buschbaum draft guide from around 1984. It is probably one of his first. I may still have it. I bought them every year therafter until I got married in 1990. For some starnge reason, my wife thought there were higher priorites for my 10 or 15 dollars then an NFL draft guide written by a nerdy looking guy. Or at least that's what she told me. It's hell to be married and try to have a football jones, unless your wife is Michelle Tafoya. :heh: