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mussop
04-30-2011, 07:01 PM
We couldnt draft Herzlich with the last pick in the draft? Screw you Rick Smith!!!!! Epic fail!!!!! You suck!!!!!!!!!! And this is after I have calmed down.

TimeKiller
04-30-2011, 07:09 PM
Herzlich would've been better than the clown they chose. F. F minus.

CloakNNNdagger
04-30-2011, 07:37 PM
We couldnt draft Herzlich with the last pick in the draft? Screw you Rick Smith!!!!! Epic fail!!!!! You suck!!!!!!!!!! And this is after I have calmed down.

Calm down. Herzlich was diagnosed with a rare form of bone cancer---Ewing's sarcoma.

Virtually all of these I have operated on have been in kids and teenagers (quite uncommon in adults). This is the same distribution reported in the medical literature. The ones I have been involved with have all been on average the size of a medium apple at the time of diagnosis. One third of these have already spread by the time of diagnosis.

The use of chemotherapy has greatly improved survival rates for people with Ewing's sarcoma. If the tumor is small, localized in one area, and can be completely removed, the five-year survival rate is 80 percent, or better when surgery is accompanied by radiation therapy and chemotherapy. If the tumor is small but can't be removed, survival rate is about 70 percent.

However, if the tumor is large and inoperable, the survival rate is less than 60 percent, regardless of how well the bone cancer responds to chemotherapy or radiation therapy. (Keep in mind that all of these survival rates go down after five years.)

Even though reports claim there has been no spread, his age makes me somewhat suspicious. He is scheduled for chemotherapy and there is no mention of definitive surgery.

Chemotherapy of this sort will put him down, from football at least, for 1 year. If surgery can be performed subsequently, count on even longer. If surgery is performed, it is not unusual for the bone from which the tumor is removed ends up very prone to fracture due to compromised structural integrity, especially when exposed to trauma. In addition, if the tumor is large enough, it requires removal of significant amounts of surrounding muscle.
And if radiation therapy is added to the treatment, it would further damage more muscle tissue.

So as you can see, this probably is not a player that a team would feel very comfortable drafting.

Pantherstang84
04-30-2011, 07:40 PM
Calm down. Herzlich was diagnosed with a rare form of bone cancer---Ewing's sarcoma.

Virtually all of these I have operated on have been in kids and teenagers (quite uncommon in adults). This is the same distribution reported in the medical literature. The ones I have been involved with have all been on average the size of a medium apple. One third of these have already spread by the time of diagnosis.

The use of chemotherapy has greatly improved survival rates for people with Ewing's sarcoma. If the tumor is small, localized in one area, and can be completely removed, the five-year survival rate is 80 percent, or better when surgery is accompanied by radiation therapy and chemotherapy. If the tumor is small but can't be removed, survival rate is about 70 percent.

However, if the tumor is large and inoperable, the survival rate is less than 60 percent, regardless of how well the bone cancer responds to chemotherapy or radiation therapy.

Even though reports claim there has been no spread, his age makes me somewhat suspicious. He is scheduled for chemotherapy and there is no mention of definitive surgery.

Chemotherapy of this sort will put him down, from football at least, for 1 year. If surgery can be performed subsequently, count on even longer. If surgery is performed, it is not unusual for the bone from which the tumor is removed ends up very prone to fracture due to compromised structural integrity, especially when exposed to trauma. In addition, if the tumor is large enough, it requires removal of significant amounts of surrounding muscle.
And if radiation therapy is added to the treatment, it would further damage more muscle tissue.

So as you can see, this probably is not a player that a team would feel very comfortable drafting.

How dare you inject logic into the discussion. tsk tsk

Texan_Bill
04-30-2011, 07:45 PM
Calm down. Herzlich was diagnosed with a rare form of bone cancer---Ewing's sarcoma.

Virtually all of these I have operated on have been in kids and teenagers (quite uncommon in adults). This is the same distribution reported in the medical literature. The ones I have been involved with have all been on average the size of a medium apple. One third of these have already spread by the time of diagnosis.

The use of chemotherapy has greatly improved survival rates for people with Ewing's sarcoma. If the tumor is small, localized in one area, and can be completely removed, the five-year survival rate is 80 percent, or better when surgery is accompanied by radiation therapy and chemotherapy. If the tumor is small but can't be removed, survival rate is about 70 percent.

However, if the tumor is large and inoperable, the survival rate is less than 60 percent, regardless of how well the bone cancer responds to chemotherapy or radiation therapy. (Keep in mind that all of these survival rates go down after five years.)

Even though reports claim there has been no spread, his age makes me somewhat suspicious. He is scheduled for chemotherapy and there is no mention of definitive surgery.

Chemotherapy of this sort will put him down, from football at least, for 1 year. If surgery can be performed subsequently, count on even longer. If surgery is performed, it is not unusual for the bone from which the tumor is removed ends up very prone to fracture due to compromised structural integrity, especially when exposed to trauma. In addition, if the tumor is large enough, it requires removal of significant amounts of surrounding muscle.
And if radiation therapy is added to the treatment, it would further damage more muscle tissue.

So as you can see, this probably is not a player that a team would feel very comfortable drafting.

Thanks Doc (again) for having the kowledge, insight and perspective to share to those that have a predisposed hatred for Smith and the front office - AND this is coming from a person that can be hard on Rick Smith.

Brisco_County
04-30-2011, 08:02 PM
Knowledge of his health condition aside, maybe the fact that 31 other teams passed on the guy should've tipped you off that his value was diminished.

Hardcore Texan
04-30-2011, 08:08 PM
Thanks Doc (again) for having the kowledge, insight and perspective to share to those that have a predisposed hatred for Smith and the front office - AND this is coming from a person that can be hard on Rick Smith.

+1 ...thanks Doc!

mussop
04-30-2011, 08:30 PM
Knowledge of his health condition aside, maybe the fact that 31 other teams passed on the guy should've tipped you off that his value was diminished.

My god, this has nothing to do with his value. Do you think the guy we drafted last has any real value? You guys are as clueless as the texans.

b0ng
04-30-2011, 08:33 PM
I don't get it. Are there really people who give a shit about who we draft in the 7th round?

GP
04-30-2011, 08:34 PM
My god, this has nothing to do with his value. Do you think the guy we drafted last has any real value? You guys are as clueless as the texans.

Why are you doing this?

It's obvious that you know you sort of screwed up. I mean, the dude wasn't picked because he's questionable. I bet even HE knows that.

This feels like you won't let go and you're going down swinging.

Just walk away. Everybody here has made the same sort of mistake: Making a strong statement and not having all the important information at the time.

I do it at least twice a day. Minimum. LOL.

BullNation4Life
04-30-2011, 08:37 PM
We couldnt draft Herzlich with the last pick in the draft? Screw you Rick Smith!!!!! Epic fail!!!!! You suck!!!!!!!!!! And this is after I have calmed down.

If you are crying about the last pick of the draft, Epic fail is just the beginning....

Joe Texan
04-30-2011, 08:37 PM
I have a vision that includes many a criticizm of the front office for the next two months then acompanied with couch coaching through the preseason with every last body jumping on my wagon as soon as the season starts:texflag:

Playoffs
04-30-2011, 08:41 PM
Why can't Smithiak get it right and draft more players undergoing chemo?

Epic fail!!! :hankpalm:

awtysst
04-30-2011, 08:44 PM
My god, this has nothing to do with his value. Do you think the guy we drafted last has any real value? You guys are as clueless as the texans.

You are absolutely right. The last pick in the draft aka Mr. Irrelevant has little to no value to the team.

Signed,
2010 Mr. Irrelevant Frank Zombo: 38 total tackles and 4 sacks
2009 Mr. Irrelevant Ryan Succop: 81.8% career fg % and 71/71 on epa
2008 Mr. Irrelevant David Vobora: St Louis Ram Starting SLB in 2009

Allstar
04-30-2011, 08:51 PM
Regardless of recent success, You can't get too upset at who we pick at 254. After all, whoever else you wanted can still be had.

mussop
04-30-2011, 08:55 PM
Why are you doing this?

It's obvious that you know you sort of screwed up. I mean, the dude wasn't picked because he's questionable. I bet even HE knows that.

This feels like you won't let go and you're going down swinging.

Just walk away. Everybody here has made the same sort of mistake: Making a strong statement and not having all the important information at the time.

I do it at least twice a day. Minimum. LOL.


Wow, really? There is a reason they call the pick mr irrelevant. I don't care if he ever played a down for us. Do you think the guy we drafted will?

Oh and thanks doc clueless but I know all about his medical condition and that is the reason we should of drafted him. We could of made his dream of being drafted come true and what would it of cost us? The freaking last meaningless pick in the draft. Obviously none of you have had a life changing event that took away the dreams of someone you cared about.

awtysst
04-30-2011, 09:00 PM
Wow, really? There is a reason they call the pick mr irrelevant. I don't care if he ever played a down for us. Do you think the guy we drafted will?

Oh and thanks doc clueless but I know all about his medical condition and that is the reason we should of drafted him. We could of made his dream of being drafted come true and what would it of cost us? The freaking last meaningless pick in the draft. Obviously none of you have had a life changing event that took away the dreams of someone you cared about.

You don't think we made Cheta Ozougwu's dream come true by drafting him? Besides, why do we even care about making someone's dream come true anyway. If the guy is not medically cleared as Doc CND says, why take him? The GM's job is to field the best football team he can, not worry about making a person's dream come true.

And if you really think Mr. Irrelevant cannot help the team, please look at my previous post in this thread.

Brisco_County
04-30-2011, 09:04 PM
My god, this has nothing to do with his value. Do you think the guy we drafted last has any real value?

Then why did you post a thread about it?

You guys are as clueless as the texans.

Aren't you the one who didn't know your guy had bone cancer?

mussop
04-30-2011, 09:06 PM
Why can't Smithiak get it right and draft more players undergoing chemo?

Epic fail!!! :hankpalm:

Maybe if someone you cared about was diagnosed with a life threatening disease and had there lifes dream taken away from them you would be a little more in tune with reality.

And you mr self proclaimed draft guru, enlighten us to how much our new mr irrelevant will make a difference to this team. Or is your hand to sore to type anymore from patting yourself on the back everytime you half ass guessed at something during the draft?

TheIronDuke
04-30-2011, 09:35 PM
Is this thread for real? Bitching about us not taking a guy with cancer? Seriously?

Pantherstang84
04-30-2011, 09:41 PM
Maybe if someone you cared about was diagnosed with a life threatening disease and had there lifes dream taken away from them you would be a little more in tune with reality.

And you mr self proclaimed draft guru, enlighten us to how much our new mr irrelevant will make a difference to this team. Or is your hand to sore to type anymore from patting yourself on the back everytime you half ass guessed at something during the draft?

Man you just need to back away from the keyboard for a while. Sleep on it. Come back and read this thread in the morning.

gary
04-30-2011, 09:44 PM
This whole thread is just full of bitching. Can't we just state our different opinions instead of bitching about someone we think is bitching? Good grief.

drs23
04-30-2011, 09:55 PM
Man, draft has been over for a few hours and the hatchets are flyin' again! Damn, I love me some Texans Talk! :pirate: :D

gary
04-30-2011, 09:59 PM
Man, draft has been over for a few hours and the hatchets are flyin' again! Damn, I love me some Texans Talk! :pirate: :D
lol

ubecool454
04-30-2011, 10:05 PM
Someone give mussop a brown bag and cut the eye holes out for him.:toropalm:

CloakNNNdagger
04-30-2011, 10:19 PM
There's apparently something significant behind mussop's strong feelings towards this subject. Maybe, everyone should walk away from this subject for now.

FirstTexansFan
04-30-2011, 10:26 PM
Someone give mussop a brown bag and cut the eye holes out for him.:toropalm:

No one gets my bag! :pirate:

Lucky
04-30-2011, 10:34 PM
Even though reports claim there has been no spread, his age makes me somewhat suspicious. He is scheduled for chemotherapy and there is no mention of definitive surgery.
I had heard that Herzlich is in remission after undergoing chemotherapy in 2009. I've heard nothing of additional chemotherapy. Link anyone?

I have heard that Marcus Cannon (TCU OT taken by Pats in the 5th) will undergo chemotherapy.

Mr teX
04-30-2011, 10:45 PM
apparently it was only on us to make this guy's dream come true..shame on you bob mcnair...there were 31 other teams who could've made his dream come true...i hope you started an equivalent thread on all their messageboards as well.

eriadoc
04-30-2011, 10:55 PM
There's apparently something significant behind mussop's strong feelings towards this subject. Maybe, everyone should walk away from this subject for now.

Trust me when I say his situation can't be any more dire than my own on this subject, and yet I find the insults pretty low class. And I told him just that. Doc comes here and shares his knowledge with us for nothing and doesn't deserve anyone calling him Doc Clueless. I, for one, appreciate his willingness to spend a little time with us.

Besides the fact that the guy is better off not being drafted when you get that low in the draft. That way you get to pick and choose your opportunity instead of getting stuck with some crappy 32nd ranked defense.

CloakNNNdagger
04-30-2011, 11:07 PM
I had heard that Herzlich is in remission after undergoing chemotherapy in 2009. I've heard nothing of additional chemotherapy. Link anyone?

I have heard that Marcus Cannon (TCU OT taken by Pats in the 5th) will undergo chemotherapy.

Herzlich is in remission. However, contrary to what his agent Condon has stated, he is not a low risk for recurrence.

Instead of treating it for the greatest possibility of a cure, he chose to go against medical advice opting for chemotherapy only in order to best maintain lower limb structural integrity. Since the chemo was the only avenue chosen, it would have been in higher more toxic dose to the tissues (including normal tissues) and delivered over a longer period of time.

In his case the most effective route for cure would have been for preoperative chemotherapy for shrinkage of the tumor, surgery to remove the tumor and surrounding tissue, postoperative chemotherapy, and postoperative radiation therapy. This would have precluded continuance of his football career.

As I noted in my original post despite good response to chemotherapy, the survival rate will be affected and the muscles and the rest of the body will have taken its toll on his performance as an athlete.

He went against the advice of some doctors by opting for a course of treatment that would offer some hope for a return to the field. The tumor was ultimately eradicated through intensive chemotherapy and radiation treatments. A 12-inch titanium rod was permanently inserted to stabilize his leg.

What about the doctors who pushed for extensive surgery as a safer route, even if it meant he had played his last down?

"I couldn't accept it," he says, "because I would know that cancer would have beaten me. Even if I came back healthy, taking away from me something I love was defeat in my eyes.

"It was a gamble. I guess I was gambling with my own life. But in the end, it was my choice."link (http://www.usatoday.com/sports/football/nfl/2011-04-26-mark-herzlich_N.htm)


Marcus Cannon, on the other hand, has a type of lymphoma, a disease that is not a surgical disease. He underwent chemotherapy, which in this case given alone, should afford him a 95% chance of a full disease free life.

I hope this has answered your questions.

dinkatoid
04-30-2011, 11:28 PM
You do kinda feel for the guy though, he had a lot of talent. After all he had been through, to make it back on the field for BC was pretty amazing, and I would have loved to see him drafted, but after everything doc just said, you can not blame teams for passing on him. If he is one of the lucky ones and manages to stay in remission, I am sure he will get an invite to camp somewhere though

Playoffs
04-30-2011, 11:52 PM
Maybe if someone you cared about was diagnosed with a life threatening disease and had there lifes dream taken away from them you would be a little more in tune with reality.Don't presume to know who/if/how many I've lost to cancer -- or if I've been treated for it myself.

And you mr self proclaimed draft guru, enlighten us to how much our new mr irrelevant will make a difference to this team. Or is your hand to sore to type anymore from patting yourself on the back everytime you half ass guessed at something during the draft?Self proclaimed draft guru? Me? http://www.sportsinferno.com/forums/images/smilies/smilie%20lol2.gif Where's my mock draft posted? Combine grades? Film breakdowns? Don't know who you're talking about, but it's not me. I'm a self proclaimed Houston pro football fan.

Wade thought enough of the guy, a local kid, to coach him up a bit; Kubes commented on his football IQ, he's "really good friends" with James Casey, and Mayock said "he flashed for me" at the East-West practice & has edge-rush ability.

This is a business -- you don't trashcan opportunities/assets.

Old School
04-30-2011, 11:54 PM
My god, this has nothing to do with his value. Do you think the guy we drafted last has any real value? You guys are as clueless as the texans.
Charlie Sheen is that you? Did you jack Mussop's account?

JK bro...take a breath!!

mussop
05-01-2011, 01:50 AM
Why are you doing this?

It's obvious that you know you sort of screwed up. I mean, the dude wasn't picked because he's questionable. I bet even HE knows that.

This feels like you won't let go and you're going down swinging.

Just walk away. Everybody here has made the same sort of mistake: Making a strong statement and not having all the important information at the time.

I do it at least twice a day. Minimum. LOL.

http://www.texanstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?p=1689715#post1689715

mussop
05-01-2011, 01:53 AM
Don't presume to know who/if/how many I've lost to cancer -- or if I've been treated for it myself.

Self proclaimed draft guru? Me? http://www.sportsinferno.com/forums/images/smilies/smilie%20lol2.gif Where's my mock draft posted? Combine grades? Film breakdowns? Don't know who you're talking about, but it's not me. I'm a self proclaimed Houston pro football fan.

Wade thought enough of the guy, a local kid, to coach him up a bit; Kubes commented on his football IQ, he's "really good friends" with James Casey, and Mayock said "he flashed for me" at the East-West practice & has edge-rush ability.

This is a business -- you don't trashcan opportunities/assets.

No not you.

And yes the last pick is is such an important opportunity/asset. Its not like they couldnt of signed the guy as a UFA.

mussop
05-01-2011, 01:54 AM
apparently it was only on us to make this guy's dream come true..shame on you bob mcnair...there were 31 other teams who could've made his dream come true...i hope you started an equivalent thread on all their messageboards as well.

We were his last chance. Sorry you dont understand.

b0ng
05-01-2011, 09:17 AM
We were his last chance. Sorry you dont understand.

Sorry you mistook the Texans for a Make-A-Wish foundation. I'm glad they took a local kid as Mr. Irrelevant instead of some national sob story.

DocBar
05-01-2011, 09:26 AM
Damn. I just feel bad that the kid has cancer. I do find it a bit ironic that some want us to draft a guy who just underwent chemotherapy for bone cancer while others were railing against a team taking Quinn because of a cyst in his skull that needed draining. Quinn was fully cleared for football. Has Herzlich been cleared?

mussop
05-01-2011, 09:49 AM
Damn. I just feel bad that the kid has cancer. I do find it a bit ironic that some want us to draft a guy who just underwent chemotherapy for bone cancer while others were railing against a team taking Quinn because of a cyst in his skull that needed draining. Quinn was fully cleared for football. Has Herzlich been cleared?

There's is a big difference from the 11th pick to the last pick in the draft.

Mr teX
05-01-2011, 09:51 AM
We were his last chance. Sorry you dont understand.

Has zero to do with that. You're basically railroading the Texans FO for not drafting him when other teams also had the same opportunities to draft him. The fact that we had the very last pick is inconsequential.

Besides, you act like the guy still can't get signed by any team as an UFA. His dream is to play football in the NFL, not to get drafted. That is obviously still in tact. You need to relax.

mussop
05-01-2011, 09:57 AM
Sorry you mistook the Texans for a Make-A-Wish foundation. I'm glad they took a local kid as Mr. Irrelevant instead of some national sob story.

And Im glad I know what kind of a person you are now.

mussop
05-01-2011, 09:58 AM
Has zero to do with that. You're basically railroading the Texans FO for not drafting him when other teams also had the same opportunities to draft him. The fact that we had the very last pick is inconsequential.

Besides, you act like the guy still can't get signed by any team as an UFA. His dream is to play football in the NFL, not to get drafted. That is obviously still in tact. You need to relax.

Ok.

mussop
05-01-2011, 10:02 AM
Trust me when I say his situation can't be any more dire than my own on this subject, and yet I find the insults pretty low class. And I told him just that. Doc comes here and shares his knowledge with us for nothing and doesn't deserve anyone calling him Doc Clueless. I, for one, appreciate his willingness to spend a little time with us.

Besides the fact that the guy is better off not being drafted when you get that low in the draft. That way you get to pick and choose your opportunity instead of getting stuck with some crappy 32nd ranked defense.

Not that its any of your biz but I apologized to C&D already. However anything I said to anyone else I meant. The bolded part is the first thing anyone in this thread has said I agree with.

And Im sorry for whatever youre situation is. Hope it gets better.

b0ng
05-01-2011, 10:03 AM
And Im glad I know what kind of a person you are now.

The Jets actually passed over this wonderous cancer patient in order to draft a friend of Mark Sanchez who was expelled from high school for writing graphic sexual death threats to one of his teachers. As part of a class project.

You should go and let the Jets message boards know about this grave injustice immediately.

DocBar
05-01-2011, 10:07 AM
There's is a big difference from the 11th pick to the last pick in the draft.I absolutely agree with that. Some thought
allowing Quinn to play football at all was a risk to his health and well being. I think it's painfully obvious that Herzlich, regardless of his dreams and aspirations, will not be on an NFL roster. It truly is detrimental to his short and long term health. Sometimes the greatest gift we can get is not getting what we want. I wish him the best of luck and a full recovery, but I can't think of a single player with a 10"-12" titanium rod stabilizing a leg bone.

Lucky
05-01-2011, 10:27 AM
I hope this has answered your questions.
It has.

mussop
05-01-2011, 10:32 AM
The Jets actually passed over this wonderous cancer patient in order to draft a friend of Mark Sanchez who was expelled from high school for writing graphic sexual death threats to one of his teachers. As part of a class project.

You should go and let the Jets message boards know about this grave injustice immediately.

"Wonderous cancer patient" The only grave injustice here is that you are allowed to speak publicly. Now go back to smoking pot all alone in youre mothers basement. Stop worrying about the real world outside.

b0ng
05-01-2011, 10:34 AM
"Wonderous cancer patient" The only grave injustice here is that you are allowed to speak publicly. Now go back to smoking pot all alone in youre mothers basement. Stop worrying about the real world outside.

http://files.sharenator.com/Slow_Clap_GIF_Contest-s420x315-140048-580.gif

DocBar
05-01-2011, 10:34 AM
"Wonderous cancer patient" The only grave injustice here is that you are allowed to speak publicly. Now go back to smoking pot all alone in youre mothers basement. Stop worrying about the real world outside.That's funny. Harsh as hell, but funny.

Honoring Earl 34
05-01-2011, 10:37 AM
This just in .... the Texans have redrafted and take Mark Herzlich instead of Amobi Okoye . It's settled . :texflag:

Wolf
05-01-2011, 10:43 AM
when the 7th round started, I thought it would be a nice gesture to draft him as the last pick, but toward the last pick, I was wondering if that is really what the kid would want.. based on the piece on TV, the kid has worked his ass off to get back on the field and it is a real good ,feel good story, but wouldn't be a mockery if we just drafted him , just to draft him for a feel good story? then he gets to spend a week at new port beach and paraded around

at first, I thought it would be good, but then I feel it would have been more insulting to him, besides now he can pick any team he wants to try out for.

I wish him the best in his career but to be pissed at the Texans for not drafting him.. I don't know about that.

mussop
05-01-2011, 10:47 AM
when the 7th round started, I thought it would be a nice gesture to draft him as the last pick, but toward the last pick, I was wondering if that is really what the kid would want.. based on the piece on TV, the kid has worked his ass off to get back on the field and it is a real good ,feel good story, but wouldn't be a mockery if we just drafted him , just to draft him for a feel good story? then he gets to spend a week at new port beach and paraded around

at first, I thought it would be good, but then I feel it would have been more insulting to him, besides now he can pick any team he wants to try out for.

I wish him the best in his career but to be pissed at the Texans for not drafting him.. I don't know about that.

Now that is a response I can respect! Thank you sir.

GP
05-01-2011, 10:50 AM
http://www.texanstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?p=1689715#post1689715

Man, I could care less if YOU had him pegged as being a good pick for us.

You are a 12-year-old fit throwing child about this, using a slash and burn technique to destroy anybody who disagrees with you on it.

You built this idol, and nobody is worshipping it. And you're pissed about it. You just invested too much emotional energy into it, IMO.

This thread should have been deleted the instant you created it. Of all the reasons to actually criticize the Texans FO, this is not even on the radar as a legitimate reason.

And for the record, I've generally supported your opinions until now. But when a bad post is a bad post, it has to be called as such.

mussop
05-01-2011, 11:14 AM
Man, I could care less if YOU had him pegged as being a good pick for us.

You are a 12-year-old fit throwing child about this, using a slash and burn technique to destroy anybody who disagrees with you on it.

You built this idol, and nobody is worshipping it. And you're pissed about it. You just invested too much emotional energy into it, IMO.

This thread should have been deleted the instant you created it. Of all the reasons to actually criticize the Texans FO, this is not even on the radar as a legitimate reason.

And for the record, I've generally supported your opinions until now. But when a bad post is a bad post, it has to be called as such.

Actually that was the wrong link. The link I meant to post showed that I had stated earlier that if he was not drafted because of his medical condition we should draft him with the Mr Irrelevant pick. I was trying to show you that I was aware of his situation because in your previous post you insinuated that I wasnt aware of it.

Thats fine if you dont think its a legitimate reason for criticizing the front office, I can respect that. When I started the thread I was overly emotional and didnt state that I was aware of his condition. Looking back I can see where it all went south. However a couple of posters here have made statements that were a little classless and I let them know about it. And to the people I made classless comments to I have apologized.

CloakNNNdagger
05-01-2011, 11:16 AM
when the 7th round started, I thought it would be a nice gesture to draft him as the last pick, but toward the last pick, I was wondering if that is really what the kid would want.. based on the piece on TV, the kid has worked his ass off to get back on the field and it is a real good ,feel good story, but wouldn't be a mockery if we just drafted him , just to draft him for a feel good story? then he gets to spend a week at new port beach and paraded around

at first, I thought it would be good, but then I feel it would have been more insulting to him, besides now he can pick any team he wants to try out for.

I wish him the best in his career but to be pissed at the Texans for not drafting him.. I don't know about that.

This scenario was probably always the more probable.....and for him, the most fulfilling outcome.

mussop
05-01-2011, 11:20 AM
This scenario was probably always the more probable.....and for him, the most fulfilling outcome.

And with that someone kill this thread! :worldpeace:

GP
05-01-2011, 11:49 AM
Actually that was the wrong link. The link I meant to post showed that I had stated earlier that if he was not drafted because of his medical condition we should draft him with the Mr Irrelevant pick. I was trying to show you that I was aware of his situation because in your previous post you insinuated that I wasnt aware of it.

Thats fine if you dont think its a legitimate reason for criticizing the front office, I can respect that. When I started the thread I was overly emotional and didnt state that I was aware of his condition. Looking back I can see where it all went south. However a couple of posters here have made statements that were a little classless and I let them know about it. And to the people I made classless comments to I have apologized.

I think the ones you called "classless" were using hyperbole to help illustrate what they felt was your irrational take on the situation. Sorta' like using fire to fight fire.

I hate the whole Mr. Irrelevant concept anyways. It's a draft pick like all the other ones that came before it. Anybody past the 5th round is usually not going to make the team or play a significant role on the team anyways, or at least the law of averages says so. Somebody had to be picked last, some dude was selected, and now he's on an NFL team that will cut him in the first round of cuts. Nothing to throw chairs about.

Hottoddie
05-01-2011, 12:25 PM
His dream is to play football in the NFL, not to get drafted.


Actually, that's not all together true. In an interview I saw, he said he realized that he probably wouldn't get drafted, but would love to hear his name called on draft day. Given what he's been through, if that's not a dream I don't know what is.

As the last pick got closer & closer I really started hoping the Texans would take him & give him some time to see if he can beat this thing. Imagine the positive PR the team (and NFL) would've gotten for doing this. The NFL is a business & quite often appears to have no heart. Doing this would've gone a long ways towards dispelling that perception. Also, if he's able to beat it, we would've gotten the steal of the draft.

However, having said all of this, there were several players still available, Deunta Williams (FS), Deandre McDaniel (SS), Jeron Johnson (SS), Mario Harvey (ILB), Tori Gurley (WR), Ian Williams (DT), Brandon Bair (DE) & Blaine Sumner (NT), that could've helped us. With all that talent still on the board, the Texans must see something in the Ozougwu kid that makes them think he can stick.

IlliniJen
05-01-2011, 12:43 PM
I thought I had stumbled on www.theonion.com for a second. Then I realized this is SERIOUS.
:toropalm:

ArlingtonTexan
05-01-2011, 01:34 PM
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/04/30/herzlich-thanks-fans-for-support-after-going-undrafted/


You aren’t supposed to root as a member of the media, but Florio and I were rooting like many others for former Boston College linebacker Mark Herzlich to get drafted at the end of Saturday’s seventh round.

It didn’t happen, and now Herzlich is stuck like so many other potential undrafted free agents in limbo, waiting for the NFL lockout to end to see where they will go next.

Herzlich, who overcame cancer to return to play in 2010, was in New York for draft festivities during the week and was on stage Thursday before the draft started. We heard that he left town on Friday because he knew he wouldn’t be taken until day three at least.

It had to be a big disappointment to Herzlich to go undrafted; after all he was considered a surefire first-round pick in 2009 before cancer struck. He took this latest adversity in stride and with class, as you’d expect.

“Thanking everyone for their support tough times call for perseverance and a tough mind,” Herzlich wrote on Twitter. ”Today sucked for me but everyone needs to pray for all the people in Alabama. They need us more than ever right now.

“I have been told that I can’t play football before. We all know what happened with that. #neverquit.”

Hottoddie
05-01-2011, 05:21 PM
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/04/30/herzlich-thanks-fans-for-support-after-going-undrafted/


You aren’t supposed to root as a member of the media, but Florio and I were rooting like many others for former Boston College linebacker Mark Herzlich to get drafted at the end of Saturday’s seventh round.

It didn’t happen, and now Herzlich is stuck like so many other potential undrafted free agents in limbo, waiting for the NFL lockout to end to see where they will go next.

Herzlich, who overcame cancer to return to play in 2010, was in New York for draft festivities during the week and was on stage Thursday before the draft started. We heard that he left town on Friday because he knew he wouldn’t be taken until day three at least.

It had to be a big disappointment to Herzlich to go undrafted; after all he was considered a surefire first-round pick in 2009 before cancer struck. He took this latest adversity in stride and with class, as you’d expect.

“Thanking everyone for their support tough times call for perseverance and a tough mind,” Herzlich wrote on Twitter. ”Today sucked for me but everyone needs to pray for all the people in Alabama. They need us more than ever right now.

“I have been told that I can’t play football before. We all know what happened with that. #neverquit.”




Nice post.

houstonspartan
05-01-2011, 08:48 PM
Wow, what a mean-spirited thread.

Mussop, your heart is in the right place. But I think you were a bit mean and nasty. I'm rooting for this guy. We are assuming that he won't play in the NFL. He might. Let's think good thoughts about this guy staying healthy enough to realize his dream instead of attacking each other.

And, Cloak, thanks for the medical insight. It adds a lot to the discussions on this message board.

Ndevine7
05-01-2011, 10:18 PM
You are absolutely right. The last pick in the draft aka Mr. Irrelevant has little to no value to the team.

Signed,
2010 Mr. Irrelevant Frank Zombo: 38 total tackles and 4 sacks
2009 Mr. Irrelevant Ryan Succop: 81.8% career fg % and 71/71 on epa
2008 Mr. Irrelevant David Vobora: St Louis Ram Starting SLB in 2009

Frank Zombo wasnt 2010 mr irrelavent Tim Toone WR Det was

El Tejano
05-01-2011, 10:27 PM
If anyone goes in the Mock section and they look up my thread "My Early Wish List", on the last page I listed players I wanted and where I think we should draft them. Cheta Ozougwu is one of them. He's a tweener player who can play with his hand in the dirt or standing up. This is a position of need and the type of player we can use. I think if anything we get a very good Special Team player out of this guy.

GP
05-01-2011, 11:09 PM
If anyone goes in the Mock section and they look up my thread "My Early Wish List", on the last page I listed players I wanted and where I think we should draft them. Cheta Ozougwu is one of them. He's a tweener player who can play with his hand in the dirt or standing up. This is a position of need and the type of player we can use. I think if anything we get a very good Special Team player out of this guy.

Exactly. If he's a gamer on ST, AND he adds depth at LB, then it was a good pick.

Bill Bates of the Cowboys wasn't the best player, technically, but he brought a dimension to that team that I think infused the other players with toughness and attitude.

A great ST player who can double as depth at a needed position on gamedays is a great asset to have.

I had been thinking that this was the most likely reason for taking him as the last pick. All this talk about how other players, or other positions, were still there and would have been a better pick, is just pure speculation. We can use gamers on ST, and the guy can play some LB too. It wasn't a wasted pick, IMO.

I don't even see a real flaw, IMO, to this draft. Yeah, maybe some personal preferences on here were not met...but hey, that's OK when you consider how previous drafts have gone for us.

dgmtexas
05-02-2011, 10:15 AM
We couldnt draft Herzlich with the last pick in the draft? Screw you Rick Smith!!!!! Epic fail!!!!! You suck!!!!!!!!!! And this is after I have calmed down.

I hope in the near future, there are less fans like you.:cowboy1:

BullNation4Life
05-02-2011, 10:27 AM
I don't what worse, the OP blasting the FO for NOT drafting Herzlich or wanting him drafted last and be known as "Mr Irrelevant"

After everything Herzlich as gone through, "irrelevant" shouldn't be the word to describe him...

Kinda sounds like a cruel joke...

HOU-TEX
05-02-2011, 10:44 AM
My Brother in Law and I were kinda rooting for us to draft Hertzlich too. He seemed like an awesome guy and it would've been a win win situation for us. If he eventually got back to the way he played before the cancer he would definitely help this team. If not, he still would've been a positive story for ua and an excellent locker room guy.

However, I don not know the specifics of his situation well enough to call out the Texans or any other team for not drafting him. Therefore, the knee-jerk was kinda over the top. Just my .02

Blake
05-02-2011, 10:54 AM
I am not interested in drafting players to be nice. I want a player that is going to help us win football games. Mark will get a shot in the NFL. And its probably best for him to be able to pick the team he wants to play for.

TimeKiller
05-02-2011, 02:03 PM
Picking Herzlich would've represented much, much more than an OLB. The Texans threw that away for.....an OLB. I can't even begin to type this 3 page rant because it's already getting to me...

I would've picked him up 100/100 times. I would've picked him with both 7th round picks.

"Cheddar Ogzoogwazoogoo" and the project OT they took are my least favorite football players ever.

Grams
05-02-2011, 03:16 PM
There are a lot of perfectly healthy college football players that do not get drafted.

Why are people getting so bent out of shape because 1 of 32 teams did not draft a player with a steel rod in his leg.

Just because he was not drafted, there is always a possibility of getting picked up by an NFL team - just ask A. Foster.

Errant Hothy
05-02-2011, 03:27 PM
We couldnt draft Herzlich with the last pick in the draft? Screw you Rick Smith!!!!! Epic fail!!!!! You suck!!!!!!!!!! And this is after I have calmed down.

ANd once again I cannot express how thankful I am that nobody who posts here is in charge of the Texans.

I do not know of a face palm wothy of this thread.

Mr teX
05-02-2011, 03:42 PM
Actually, that's not all together true. In an interview I saw, he said he realized that he probably wouldn't get drafted, but would love to hear his name called on draft day. Given what he's been through, if that's not a dream I don't know what is.

As the last pick got closer & closer I really started hoping the Texans would take him & give him some time to see if he can beat this thing. Imagine the positive PR the team (and NFL) would've gotten for doing this. The NFL is a business & quite often appears to have no heart. Doing this would've gone a long ways towards dispelling that perception. Also, if he's able to beat it, we would've gotten the steal of the draft.

However, having said all of this, there were several players still available, Deunta Williams (FS), Deandre McDaniel (SS), Jeron Johnson (SS), Mario Harvey (ILB), Tori Gurley (WR), Ian Williams (DT), Brandon Bair (DE) & Blaine Sumner (NT), that could've helped us. With all that talent still on the board, the Texans must see something in the Ozougwu kid that makes them think he can stick.

I see what you're saying....but ultimately, his name being called during the draft was just a means to an end....I'm sure he would've been just as happy if all he got was a phone call from a team saying they wanted him to come to camp.

buddyboy
05-02-2011, 03:45 PM
Picking Herzlich would've represented much, much more than an OLB. The Texans threw that away for.....an OLB. I can't even begin to type this 3 page rant because it's already getting to me...

I would've picked him up 100/100 times. I would've picked him with both 7th round picks.

"Cheddar Ogzoogwazoogoo" and the project OT they took are my least favorite football players ever.

Yeah, great, hate players because they got drafted. It's all their fault.

Ndevine7
05-02-2011, 03:49 PM
Yeah, great, hate players because they got drafted. It's all their fault.

While Herzlich wouldve been a great story, there is a reason why he was passed on by 31 other teams over 7 rounds. Be happy for these two men who were drafted and worked hard to be drafted.

thunderkyss
05-02-2011, 04:36 PM
I understand what mussop is saying. We did have the last pick.

If I were pulling the strings & someone suggested I should draft the kid, I would probably do it.

But, is he the only "feel good" story out there? Where do we draw the line?

If he was/is pretty active in some cancer awareness charity (or something similar) it would be a no brainer, & a done deal. But if being Mr. Irrelevant would be the most significant part of the story, I'm not so sure.......

mussop
05-02-2011, 05:16 PM
I hope in the near future, there are less fans like you.:cowboy1:

And I hope in the near future to see you post something somewhat intelligent with a bit more substance. Judging by you're response here there is a better chance the sea parts, Bin laden comes walking out and dances a jig.

mussop
05-02-2011, 05:37 PM
I am absolutely amazed at the value some of you put on the LAST pick in the draft. Here's my problem with it, once that pick is in the draft is over. That makes the value of that pick no more than than that of a UFA.

And if I have to explain why such gestures that cost you virtually nothing are important in this world then please do yourself a favor and do some volunteer work at a children's hospital or place that cares for the less fortunate and learn something about life and what its like to have you're dreams and future taken away from you before it rightfully should.

Or just keep living in oblivion and prey something like this never happens to you or even worse someone you love.

TexCanada
05-02-2011, 05:49 PM
I am absolutely amazed at the value some of you put on the LAST pick in the draft. Here's my problem with it, once that pick is in the draft is over. That makes the value of that pick no more than than that of a UFA.

And if I have to explain why such gestures that cost you virtually nothing are important in this world then please do yourself a favor and do some volunteer work at a children's hospital or place that cares for the less fortunate and learn something about life and what its like to have you're dreams and future taken away from you before it rightfully should.

Or just keep living in oblivion and prey something like this never happens to you or even worse someone you love.

You make it sound like us fans have to choose between being a good person and having a winning football team. Did you ever stop to think about the amount of volunteer work that some of the people you are berating do?

Texanmike02
05-02-2011, 05:57 PM
I am absolutely amazed at the value some of you put on the LAST pick in the draft. Here's my problem with it, once that pick is in the draft is over. That makes the value of that pick no more than than that of a UFA.

And if I have to explain why such gestures that cost you virtually nothing are important in this world then please do yourself a favor and do some volunteer work at a children's hospital or place that cares for the less fortunate and learn something about life and what its like to have you're dreams and future taken away from you before it rightfully should.

Or just keep living in oblivion and prey something like this never happens to you or even worse someone you love.

Hey asshole. I'm one that thinks that the NFL is NOT the make a wish foundation. I drove from shreveport to houston twice a month to sit through chemo with my mom for two years. Then I kissed her on the forehead as she passed away. Guess what. My mom wouldn't have wanted preferential treatment... I'll send you the biography when I get done writing it.

As for the idea that you would berate people? You are nothing but another internet bad ass. You have joined the ranks of wagon and SWT. That is reserved for the lowest of the low on here. I don't give a damn if you apologized. You berated people for an entire day. I've said something out of line before and apologized a few minutes later... you kept going. Hopefully your internet connection dies and we don't have to hear your drivel again.

Mike

ArlingtonTexan
05-02-2011, 05:59 PM
I am absolutely amazed at the value some of you put on the LAST pick in the draft. Here's my problem with it, once that pick is in the draft is over. That makes the value of that pick no more than than that of a UFA.

And if I have to explain why such gestures that cost you virtually nothing are important in this world then please do yourself a favor and do some volunteer work at a children's hospital or place that cares for the less fortunate and learn something about life and what its like to have you're dreams and future taken away from you before it rightfully should.

Or just keep living in oblivion and prey something like this never happens to you or even worse someone you love.

I am not against your sentiment overall, but you realize that you overplayed your hand and have come off overly moralistic. If you want raise the subject of why the texans (or any other 31 teams) did not draft Herzlich, it is a more than fair (honestly even proper)question. But acting like an organization has a responsibility to be nice, while not even having the ability to discuss the issue with any sort of maturity (ie questioning what other people or their families have been through, etc) comes off as mean-spirited and is counter to what your sentiment should reflect.

I am going to give you some time to response and then will close thread. The general point has made.

mussop
05-02-2011, 06:02 PM
You make it sound like us fans have to choose between being a good person and having a winning football team. Did you ever stop to think about the amount of volunteer work that some of the people you are berating do?

Seriously?you are equating giving up the last pick in the draft to choosing between being a good football team or a good person? Seriously? You realy believe that last pick that we could easily sign as a UFA is going to or could be the difference in this team being good or bad?

mussop
05-02-2011, 06:21 PM
I am not against your sentiment overall, but you realize that you overplayed your hand and have come off overly moralistic. If you want raise the subject of why the texans (or any other 31 teams) did not draft Herzlich, it is a more than fair (honestly even proper)question. But acting like an organization has a responsibility to be nice, while not even having the ability to discuss the issue with any sort of maturity (ie questioning what other people or their families have been through, etc) comes off as mean-spirited and is counter to what your sentiment should reflect.

I am going to give you some time to response and then will close thread. The general point has made.

Again it was the last meaningless pick in the draft and has this team not said from day one that it will be an example of class and morality above all? I think you can read 90% of the post in this thread and use the term mean spirited to describe them. I don't mean to push my morality on anyone but some people here act as though morality has no place in sports as if it's counter productive to winning. Having said that I agree that this thread has reached it's end. Kill it if please I have said my .02.

mussop
05-02-2011, 06:31 PM
Hey asshole. I'm one that thinks that the NFL is NOT the make a wish foundation. I drove from shreveport to houston twice a month to sit through chemo with my mom for two years. Then I kissed her on the forehead as she passed away. Guess what. My mom wouldn't have wanted preferential treatment... I'll send you the biography when I get done writing it.

As for the idea that you would berate people? You are nothing but another internet bad ass. You have joined the ranks of wagon and SWT. That is reserved for the lowest of the low on here. I don't give a damn if you apologized. You berated people for an entire day. I've said something out of line before and apologized a few minutes later... you kept going. Hopefully your internet connection dies and we don't have to hear your drivel again.

Mike

Please you are just pissed because I pm you with what I thought about your neg rep. Your the one acting lime an Internet bad ass. And sorry about your mom.

Texanmike02
05-02-2011, 06:38 PM
Please you are just pissed because I pm you with what I thought about your neg rep. Your the one acting lime an Internet bad ass. And sorry about your mom.

I care if you pm me? I care if you rep me? I'm not acting like anything. I neg repped you in private... then came back to the thread and figured if I would say it in private that I might as well say it in public so I did. I appreciate the feedback though. As for my mother? The only reason I brought it up was because you were telling people (who's stories you don't know) how they needed to go through something. I figured I would head off that at the turn, I wasn't looking for your sympathy.

Mike