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Wolf
02-02-2011, 04:27 PM
If you wonder how the Texans' draft process works and how responsibility is divided among coaches/scouts etc., Texans owner Bob McNair explains that and more in this interview



http://www.houstontexans.com/news/article-3/Town-Hall-Conference-Call-Bob-McNair/ec842d6f-8adf-4ebe-b0ed-a4fc9e208afd

didn't see this posted, but if so, please merge

this was posted on facebook

Wolf
02-02-2011, 04:35 PM
McNair: The way we’re organized is that Rick is responsible for the personnel. He has the scouting department – I forget exactly what we have, 14 scouts, I think, something like that – and they’re out scouting in colleges all during the year. Plus, we have four pro scouts that scout all the other teams in the league, the other 31 teams. And so, they have been working on this all along. They’ll start preparing their draft board. And what I mean by that is, they’ll start ranking all of the players and put them up on the board in our war room, and we’ll have every player that’s going to be in the draft, at the end of the day we’ll have every one of them ranked. And then we’ll also have them ranked by position.

Then we have the coaches come in, and we have them look at the cut-ups on the players. Then they’ll determine what they view to be the best players at the different positions. Then the two groups come together and then we have a discussion and a debate and reach an agreement.

And even though Rick has the authority and the responsibility for personnel, he knows that he can’t go out and select players that coaches don’t want, because if he does, they’re not going to play them, and that doesn’t help us win. So he’s got to get players that the coaches want.

So one of the things they try to do is they try to get the coaches to describe the player that they want. (For example), Bill Kollar, ‘Bill, what do you want for your defensive tackle? Describe the defensive tackle that you want us to look for. What do you want in the way of the defensive end?’ And then linebackers, Reggie Herring will tell ‘em what he wants and what he looks for in an (outside linebacker) and the things that are important to him and the things that aren’t so important. So we try to do that so the scouts have a good idea not only of the players that are out there, but what the coaches prefer and what they’re looking for in the player.

So once we go through that whole process and we get our board set, then we have the draft day. On draft day, Rick leads the draft, but basically he and Gary are working (together) as players come off the board…There will be 10 players taken off the board before we have a chance to pick. Now, will those be the 10 players that we had ranked 1-10? I doubt it. There will always be some surprises in there. There always are. So there will be somebody still left on the board that we weren’t expecting, and there will be somebody that we thought that would be available on the board that won’t be there.

So we will then have all of our people in the room, our coaches and our scouts, and we’ll look at the board and the best player that’s available and we have several positions, not just one, but several positions, primarily on the defensive side of the ball, that we’re most interested in. And we’ll determine who is the best player available at any one of those positions and we’ll have a debate in the room.

We’ll ask people to show their preference and have a show of hands one player versus another one and listen to what they have to say. Why do you want this guy? Why do you think he’s better than the other guy? And Rick will listen to that and he’ll lead that discussion and then he’ll get Gary to express his view after hearing everything. And Rick will tell him either he agrees with him or he doesn’t. And if he doesn’t agree, he’ll tell him why. And they’ll talk about that some more and then reach an agreement as to who we’re going to pick. And that’s the process. It’s an open process in which everyone has a chance to voice their opinion.


from the link

Malloy
02-02-2011, 04:46 PM
Nice find, thanks!

18 scouts, wow, that seems like alot, cool nonetheless :)

steelbtexan
02-02-2011, 04:51 PM
from the link

Sounds to me Gary gets his choice on picks and Rick runs the draft board.

Of all of the hands/voices in the war room I hope Phillips carries the most weight.

Hopefully Phillips says look Gary/Rick, BoB hired me to fix the defense and I need these 3-4 guys to do the job I was hired to do.

Trade up or trade down,trade players already on the roster it really matter how Phillips ends up with the guys he wants. Just as long as he gets who he needs to improve this putrid defense.

GP
02-02-2011, 05:52 PM
So, in the span of just a few minutes....when it's our turn to pick....there's a conversation, and a show of hands on who each person wants, and then a yes or no by Rick Smith, and an answer from Rick as to why, and then Gary gets to have a rebuttal, and everyone gets a say in the matter, and the pick is made?

That's a lot to happen in just a few minutes of time, IMO.

I don't know, guys. Why would he reveal this information? What, in the history of this team, has ever led us to think they would openly share their process? I'm not saying the whole thing is fake, but I have doubts about key pieces of information in it.

1. We would all "expect" that the coach gets his players, since a GM grabbing players might end up backfiring if the coach doesn't want those GM-chosen players.

2. We would all "expect" that they prepare a draft board in the manner described. No shocker there.

3. I just wonder how the ACTUAL pick, when it's being decided upon during our turn on the clock, is handled. The description given just seems too picture-perfect to me. "Everyone gets a chance to add their input, a show of hands is made, Rick shares his opinion, Gary his, etc., and the player is picked."

Not nitpicking the whole thing here, but just a bit distrusting of the last part of it pertaining to making the actual pick. I guess it shows that Gary is likely to be able to pick the player he wants, when it's all said and done, and the GM is there to play devil's advocate? If so, then Rick Smith is not nearly as important on draft day as he's been made out to be by certain people here.

steelbtexan
02-02-2011, 07:18 PM
So, in the span of just a few minutes....when it's our turn to pick....there's a conversation, and a show of hands on who each person wants, and then a yes or no by Rick Smith, and an answer from Rick as to why, and then Gary gets to have a rebuttal, and everyone gets a say in the matter, and the pick is made?

That's a lot to happen in just a few minutes of time, IMO.

I don't know, guys. Why would he reveal this information? What, in the history of this team, has ever led us to think they would openly share their process? I'm not saying the whole thing is fake, but I have doubts about key pieces of information in it.

1. We would all "expect" that the coach gets his players, since a GM grabbing players might end up backfiring if the coach doesn't want those GM-chosen players.

2. We would all "expect" that they prepare a draft board in the manner described. No shocker there.

3. I just wonder how the ACTUAL pick, when it's being decided upon during our turn on the clock, is handled. The description given just seems too picture-perfect to me. "Everyone gets a chance to add their input, a show of hands is made, Rick shares his opinion, Gary his, etc., and the player is picked."

Not nitpicking the whole thing here, but just a bit distrusting of the last part of it pertaining to making the actual pick. I guess it shows that Gary is likely to be able to pick the player he wants, when it's all said and done, and the GM is there to play devil's advocate? If so, then Rick Smith is not nearly as important on draft day as he's been made out to be by certain people here.

Yeah, I could see the process playing out this way in the 1st rd. (What about a trade up/down scenerio) But I dont believe it works the way BoB describes it in rds 3-7. There's not enough time for the consensus war room pick.

If I'm wrong and they do the consensus pick thing in rds 3-7. That helps explain the reason the Texans have done such a poor job of drafting.

Texanmike02
02-02-2011, 07:41 PM
And, of course, Gary Kubiak, everybody in the league will tell you, if you talk to any of the coaches or the people that really know what’s going on, that he has got one of the best offensive minds in the league. They all respected our offense and knew it was very explosive. And to be able to match him up with Wade Phillips, I think is the right combination. And Gary has a lot of confidence in Wade, as I do. And he’s going to let Wade design the defense.

So anyone who wants to know why we kept Gary?

Mike

drs23
02-02-2011, 07:53 PM
So, in the span of just a few minutes....when it's our turn to pick....there's a conversation, and a show of hands on who each person wants, and then a yes or no by Rick Smith, and an answer from Rick as to why, and then Gary gets to have a rebuttal, and everyone gets a say in the matter, and the pick is made?

That's a lot to happen in just a few minutes of time, IMO.

I don't know, guys. Why would he reveal this information? What, in the history of this team, has ever led us to think they would openly share their process? I'm not saying the whole thing is fake, but I have doubts about key pieces of information in it.

1. We would all "expect" that the coach gets his players, since a GM grabbing players might end up backfiring if the coach doesn't want those GM-chosen players.

2. We would all "expect" that they prepare a draft board in the manner described. No shocker there.

3. I just wonder how the ACTUAL pick, when it's being decided upon during our turn on the clock, is handled. The description given just seems too picture-perfect to me. "Everyone gets a chance to add their input, a show of hands is made, Rick shares his opinion, Gary his, etc., and the player is picked."

Not nitpicking the whole thing here, but just a bit distrusting of the last part of it pertaining to making the actual pick. I guess it shows that Gary is likely to be able to pick the player he wants, when it's all said and done, and the GM is there to play devil's advocate? If so, then Rick Smith is not nearly as important on draft day as he's been made out to be by certain people here.

I dunno GP. Kinda sounds like nitpicking to me. I thought McNair's explanation of how things were run in the war room was a very direct answer to questions posed by many here on numerous occasions. I think he answered the "I just wonder how the ACTUAL pick" question honestly. I personally didn't perceive any deception there. Is that what your implying?

thunderkyss
02-02-2011, 08:00 PM
Sounds to me like McNair has learned a lot about football.

GP
02-02-2011, 08:09 PM
So anyone who wants to know why we kept Gary?

Mike

One of the greatest offensive minds has got a lot of explaining to do, in terms of consistently failing to get his offense "in gear" until Quarter 4 of each game.

One of the greatest offensive minds needs to explain why he takes the ball out of Foster's hands at crucial times at the end of games. And I don't want any of the speculative bullhonkie about how "the opposing defense was shutting the run down and Gary began exploiting the defense's secondary." Bull. Foster is arguably unstoppable right now.

One of the greatest offensive minds kept Chris Brown & Kris Brown, with the most glaring retention being KRIS Brown who tanked it and crashed and burned at the end of the 2009 season...only to have one of the greatest offensive minds actually produce a REAL kicker's competition? He should have benched his ass and brought in Joe Street to finish out the rest of the season. Kris Brown freaking shanked an EXTRA POINT at the end of the season, for crying out loud. Then, he should have handed Rackers the job outright--No shenanigans. But the loyal-to-a-fault head coach couldn't bring himself to do it that way. There had to be the appearance of utmost gentile gamesmanship extended...because Kris was here for so long (cue the violins).

I could go on, the point is that designing an offense and carrying it to its fullest potential are two different things entirely. Yes, Gary Kubiak has designed a good offense. Is it where it should be, after having five full years of implementing it and securing the players he wants for it? I don't think so. It ought to be starting strong and finishing strong, I'm talking about Peyton Manning-type of start-to-finish domination where we never let off the pedal and we are blowing teams out early.

If he's one of the greatest offensive minds right now, he needs to get that offense playing consistently GREAT. I'm a hardass that way. In year 10, this team needs to do something different--Not do the same thing differently.

If Wade's defense comes together, but the offense is still brainfarting through three quarters of football...then his legacy will be "Great designer of offenses, lousy game day coach."

thunderkyss
02-02-2011, 08:37 PM
If he's one of the greatest offensive minds right now, he needs to get that offense playing consistently GREAT. I'm a hardass that way. In year 10, this team needs to do something different--Not do the same thing differently.


I do agree with this. Since Kubiak came, I thought our offense would be averaging in the upper 20s... over 25 ppg. I thought our best defense would be our offense, get to an early lead, put pressure on the other team to score, take away their run game.....

Take away the Patriots offensive efficiency, I'd like to see how many points that defense would allow.

EllisUnit
02-02-2011, 08:42 PM
I do agree with this. Since Kubiak came, I thought our offense would be averaging in the upper 20s... over 25 ppg. I thought our best defense would be our offense, get to an early lead, put pressure on the other team to score, take away their run game.....

Take away the Patriots offensive efficiency, I'd like to see how many points that defense would allow.

This is the first season i remember our offense starting off so slow under Kubiak, i could be wrong but i never remember it being as bad as it was last season.

thunderkyss
02-02-2011, 08:53 PM
This is the first season i remember our offense starting off so slow under Kubiak, i could be wrong but i never remember it being as bad as it was last season.

Last year, too many turnovers.

I'm not saying what we saw in 2010 was the norm. Just saying that offense had issues.

The defense, definitely the biggest problem. Not the only problem.

EllisUnit
02-02-2011, 09:00 PM
Last year, too many turnovers.

I'm not saying what we saw in 2010 was the norm. Just saying that offense had issues.

The defense, definitely the biggest problem. Not the only problem.

yeah we had issuse, but even with the same offense as last year and a D ranked in the low 20s we should be able to make a splash in the play-offs. A few good CBs, maybe a Safety and i can see our D going from dead last to atleast in the 12-18 range.

Dishman
02-02-2011, 09:12 PM
yeah we had issuse, but even with the same offense as last year and a D ranked in the low 20s we should be able to make a splash in the play-offs. A few good CBs, maybe a Safety and i can see our D going from dead last to atleast in the 12-18 range.

Take a look at the offensive and defensive rankings for 2009. If what you say is true then we should have already made that splash in the playoffs.

Lucky
02-02-2011, 10:44 PM
That's a lot to happen in just a few minutes of time, IMO.
No kidding. It looks like the Texans indecisiveness spills over from the field into the war room. BTW, who is working the phones?

Sounds to me like McNair has learned a lot about football.
It's not evident in the product.

CloakNNNdagger
02-02-2011, 10:56 PM
This is the first season i remember our offense starting off so slow under Kubiak, i could be wrong but i never remember it being as bad as it was last season.

The year before, the Texans were commonly playing half a game, whether the D or the O. We never knew for sure who would show up which half.

CloakNNNdagger
02-02-2011, 11:09 PM
I wonder how proud McNair would be if he were graded on his field-related performance using similar parameters that GMs, coaches and players are graded. (........And I would have to exclude OUR Gm, coaches and players from the usual evaluation process, because it has not followed very classic system logic thus far.)

VTexan
02-02-2011, 11:23 PM
at least andre johnson was a good pick

ChampionTexan
02-02-2011, 11:39 PM
Last year, too many turnovers.



Very poorly timed turnovers perhaps, but too many? We were tied for fourth fewest turnovers in the league last year with 18.

Two of the biggest problems we had (and they're somewhat inter-related) were not forcing turnovers (we had the 4th fewest turnovers in the league and wound up at net -0- for the year), and giving a short field too often and not getting one often enough.

The second one is partially a result of the first one, but also, a result of a below average punter, below average coverage teams, and below average return teams. Basically, with the exception of Rackers, our ST totally sucked in everything they did!

And I agree that the offense wasn't perfect, but it was definitely superior to the other two phases of the game. We've essentially assigned Wade the job of fixing the Defense, and hopefully via draft and free agency (when and if there is free agency) will give him the resources he needs to do so. I'm still waiting to find out why I'm even supposed to think the special teams are going to get better.

I hope we replace Turk, and get coach Joe to show us last year was an aberration, and not a signal that he's losing his touch.

TEXANRED
02-03-2011, 12:33 AM
from the link

That is why if anyone should get fired it's Smith for his craptastic scouting.

I remember saying this a while back and people on here told me I didn't know what I was talking about and how Gary picked all the players.

Texecutioner
02-03-2011, 12:39 AM
I laugh every time people act like Gary Kubiak is this great offensive guru. He's by far one of the dumbest offensive coaches I've ever witnessed. First off it wasn't until like season 4 that this offense improved a lot under Gary Kubiak and he had Andre freaking Johnson here.

* Great offensive gurus have their offenses playing well for 4 quarters. Not two.

* Great offenses don't have a good running game 1 out of 5 seasons.

* A great offensive coach doesn't single handily blow his team's chances out of the playoffs by trusting an incompetent guy at the GL who has never proven that he was any type of GL back and then let that same back attempt TD passes to win a game.

* An offensive Guru doesn't find the most epic ways to lose games year after year.

* A great offensive Guru doesn't neglect the running game the way Gary did in several games last season when it worked great in the first half and forget about his stud horse play maker.

Sorry, but the Texans may put up a lot of yards in games and pad their stats here and there in certain categories, but one thing that's been consistent more than anything is Kubiak's ineptitude to win games with his offense and to not have his offenses making the epic mistake that determines whether he wins or loses. Sure it's the players on the field that have to make the plays, but Gary's offenses are more consistent than any team at the "epic fail" moments that are embarrassing. One season of that is one thing. It's Gary's MO, and he's no kind of offensive guru at all.

Scooter
02-03-2011, 12:43 AM
One of the greatest offensive minds has got a lot of explaining to do, in terms of consistently failing to get his offense "in gear" until Quarter 4 of each game.

according to football outsiders' stats we averaged more yards per drive than any other team in 2010. according to announcers and my failing memory, we lead the league in longest scoring drives and scoring drives of 80 or more yards. since we were still an overall dominant offense despite our defense and obviously despite average field position (league leading rusher, 92 passer rating, 9th in points scored), i dont know if the "offensive mind" is an area i'd criticize too heavily. especially since it's been argued that the offensive playcalling (and it's at worst 22ppg+ in kubiak's time) has contually been adjusted to compensate for our entire lack of defense. similar to keeping peyton off the field, we tried to keep our defense off the field ... but apparently 55 seconds is plenty of time for them to lose games.

dont get me wrong, we've got areas to improve on offense (which would be helped with my following arguement), but we'd be doing a whole lot better if our average 36 yards per drive ended up in atleast fieldgoals instead of punts from midfield. i'm also aware that all support of kubiak's offense (or atleast his decisions) is rendered null by our second game against indy last year.

Is it where it should be, after having five full years of implementing it and securing the players he wants for it?

i know i'm biased, but ... dang. securing the players he wants for it? as far as i can tell we have 5 players on offense who were drafted on the first day (6 if you count tate) ... and we've got more than that many on the defensive line alone - along with first rounders at linebacker (and 33rd pick demeco) as well as in the secondary. we've sent most of our resources towards the defense - as evidenced by individual results (including 2 D-ROY's and arguably the most complete DE), but without the coaching to make a whole out of the great parts. to say kubiak is playing with a full compliment of players on offense is just absurd ... he's making lemonade (both all-pro's for the texans this season went undrafted) while leaving as much cap space to pass apples to the defense as possible ... short of 7 yearing andre of course, twice.

TEXANRED
02-03-2011, 12:46 AM
I laugh every time people act like Gary Kubiak is this great offensive guru. He's by far one of the dumbest offensive coaches I've ever witnessed. First off it wasn't until like season 4 that this offense improved a lot under Gary Kubiak and he had Andre freaking Johnson here.

* Great offensive gurus have their offenses playing well for 4 quarters. Not two.

* Great offenses don't have a good running game 1 out of 5 seasons.

* A great offensive coach doesn't single handily blow his team's chances out of the playoffs by trusting an incompetent guy at the GL who has never proven that he was any type of GL back and then let that same back attempt TD passes to win a game.

* An offensive Guru doesn't find the most epic ways to lose games year after year.

* A great offensive Guru doesn't neglect the running game the way Gary did in several games last season when it worked great in the first half and forget about his stud horse play maker.

Sorry, but the Texans may put up a lot of yards in games and pad their stats here and there in certain categories, but one thing that's been consistent more than anything is Kubiak's ineptitude to win games with his offense and to not have his offenses making the epic mistake that determines whether he wins or loses. Sure it's the players on the field that have to make the plays, but Gary's offenses are more consistent than any team at the "epic fail" moments that are embarrassing. One season of that is one thing. It's Gary's MO, and he's no kind of offensive guru at all.

:vincepalm:

2008 3rd in offense
2009 4th in offense
2010 3rd in offense

Yeah that Kubiak guy sucks when it comes to the offense.
:vincepalm:

Texecutioner
02-03-2011, 01:07 AM
:vincepalm:

2008 3rd in offense
2009 4th in offense
2010 3rd in offense

Yeah that Kubiak guy sucks when it comes to the offense.
:vincepalm:

Talk about making yourself look dumb with those facepalms.

You don't even know how to properly analyze an offense. I could care less about NFL rankings on random offensive statistics that mean zilch at the end of the day. NFL rankings don't mean squat. In case you haven't noticed, points scored is what "wins games". The SD Chargers were #1 in offense and #1 in defense throughout half the season last year and their record looked like shit. NFL rankings of categories like yards, minutes of possession, and a ton of other things that they use are about as meaningless as back loaded NFL contracts with how misleading they are.

2008 3rd in offense? - They were a whopping 17th in offense in PPG.

2009 4th in offense? - They were a whopping 10th in offense in PPG.

2010 3rd in offense? - They were a whopping 9th in offense in PPG.


Next time educate yourself before throwing that tired facepalm around. If anything those statistics prove my point, which is regardless of how many stats Gary's offenses can pick up and paint a pretty picture with they don't amount to many wins and the furthest he's cracked in PPG is 9th in 5 years of building an offense where he already had Andre Johnson. Lol! Thanks for proving my point even further.

JCTexan
02-03-2011, 01:12 AM
Take a look at the offensive and defensive rankings for 2009. If what you say is true then we should have already made that splash in the playoffs.

The Texans were right there in the hunt for the last playoff spot in 2009. If it wasn't for the 30th ranked running game not being able to pick up a yard in two games and a horrid kicker missing two game tying field goals things could have been different. Those problems looked fixed in 2010, though, so if the offense doesn't regress and the defense improves to the mid teens this team could make the playoffs.

I say 'could' because I'm not truly convinced myself that this team won't find new ways to lose games next year. :vincepalm:

Texecutioner
02-03-2011, 01:18 AM
according to football outsiders' stats we averaged more yards per drive than any other team in 2010. according to announcers and my failing memory, we lead the league in longest scoring drives and scoring drives of 80 or more yards. since we were still an overall dominant offense despite our defense and obviously despite average field position (league leading rusher, 92 passer rating, 9th in points scored), i dont know if the "offensive mind" is an area i'd criticize too heavily. especially since it's been argued that the offensive playcalling (and it's at worst 22ppg+ in kubiak's time) has conintually been adjusted to compensate for our entire lack of defense. similar to keeping peyton off the field, we tried to keep our defense off the field ... but apparently 55 seconds is plenty of time for them to lose games.

And this whole stat game you're playing with here is exactly what I was talking about in my last post. What does this prove? It proves that with all of the pretty stats that make an offense seem great under Kubiak his offense either fails to out score the other team in the first half or the 2nd half or has some sort of epic fail at the end of a game.

I could take just about any team in the league and find some sort of stats about their offense or their defense and make it seem like they were effective somehow at doing their job, but at the end of the day it's about what you score or what you don't allow the other team to score.

I remember years ago one of those Eagles teams that lost in the NFC championship had horrible stats as far as how many yards they gave up to other teams, yet they were one of the best defensive units in the league. You know why? They were either in the top 3 or they were the best defense in the league in the "red zone". Teams couldn't score TD's on them for nothing. It was nothing but FG's that teams scored on them, and that same unit was one of the best defenses in the league for years. At the end of the day they had "discipline" and they did their job which was to stop the other team from putting up a lot of points.

Gary's offenses over the last 3 seasons may have put up nice stats when you try to tell a story with them, but they've lacked more discipline than than anything I've ever seen.

Texecutioner
02-03-2011, 01:22 AM
The Texans were right there in the hunt for the last playoff spot in 2009. If it wasn't for the 30th ranked running game not being able to pick up a yard in two games and a horrid kicker missing two game tying field goals things could have been different. Those problems looked fixed in 2010, though, so if the offense doesn't regress and the defense improves to the mid teens this team could make the playoffs.

I say 'could' because I'm not truly convinced myself that this team won't find new ways to lose games next year. :vincepalm:

And that offensive guru was the moron that thought Chris Brown could punch the ball in win the game for us in those games where Brown fumbled and gave the game away twice on those plays and he threw a pick that gave another game away. That was Gary Kubiak's decision to "ride with that guy". That's 3 games! Hell, take just two of those bad decisions out of the equation and the Texans go 11-5 and make the post season. Sorry, but that's not the act of an offensive guru of a coach. He cost this team a playoff spot.

JCTexan
02-03-2011, 01:27 AM
Talk about making yourself look dumb with those facepalms.

You don't even know how to properly analyze an offense. I could care less about NFL rankings on random offensive statistics that mean zilch at the end of the day. NFL rankings don't mean squat. In case you haven't noticed, points scored is what "wins games". The SD Chargers were #1 in offense and #1 in defense throughout half the season last year and their record looked like shit. NFL rankings of categories like yards, minutes of possession, and a ton of other things that they use are about as meaningless as back loaded NFL contracts with how misleading they are.

2008 3rd in offense? - They were a whopping 17th in offense in PPG.

2009 4th in offense? - They were a whopping 10th in offense in PPG.

2010 3rd in offense? - They were a whopping 9th in offense in PPG.


Next time educate yourself before throwing that tired facepalm around. If anything those statistics prove my point, which is regardless of how many stats Gary's offenses can pick up and paint a pretty picture with they don't amount to many wins and the furthest he's cracked in PPG is 9th in 5 years of building an offense where he already had Andre Johnson. Lol! Thanks for proving my point even further.

Maybe it wasn't the offenses fault that Houston didn't have more wins? You realize the Texans had more PPG than either team in the Super Bowl, right? Sometimes it's about how many points the defense gives up.

Offenses:
Houston was 9th in PPG (24.4)
Green Bay was 10th in PPG (24.2)
Pittsburgh was 12th in PPG (23.4)

Defenses:
Steelers gave up 14.5 PPG (1st in the NFL)
Green Bay gave up 15.0 PPG (2nd in the NFL)
Houston gave up 26.7 PPG (29th in the NFL)

JCTexan
02-03-2011, 01:37 AM
And that offensive guru was the moron that thought Chris Brown could punch the ball in win the game for us in those games where Brown fumbled and gave the game away twice on those plays and he threw a pick that gave another game away. That was Gary Kubiak's decision to "ride with that guy". That's 3 games! Hell, take just two of those bad decisions out of the equation and the Texans go 11-5 and make the post season. Sorry, but that's not the act of an offensive guru of a coach. He cost this team a playoff spot.

Personally I think Houston has a good offense. It has been in the top ten the past 2 years. It's the defense that needs to be fixed and I hope Wade gets the job done.

I was hoping Mcnair fired Kubiak this off-season. Why? Kubiak could have coached the #1 ranked offense, but he's not the offensive coordinator for the Texans, he's the Head Coach, and as the coach he has coached this team for five years and still hasn't gotten them to the playoffs. I've gotten over Mcnair keeping him this offseason though, and am hoping for the best in 2011. With that said if Phillips can get this defense to be respectable this team should make the playoffs next year if their offense doesn't regress.

Texecutioner
02-03-2011, 01:39 AM
Maybe it wasn't the offenses fault that Houston didn't have more wins? You realize the Texans had more PPG than either team in the Super Bowl, right? Sometimes it's about how many points the defense gives up.

Offenses:
Houston was 9th in PPG (24.4)
Green Bay was 10th in PPG (24.2)
Pittsburgh was 12th in PPG (23.4)

Defenses:
Steelers gave up 14.5 PPG (1st in the NFL)
Green Bay gave up 15.0 PPG (2nd in the NFL)
Houston gave up 26.7 PPG (29th in the NFL)

You're doing exactly what I keep talking about. you're looking for ways to paint a better picture. Those offenses you just mentioned are right there with the Texans at 10th and 12th and GB was .2 away from them. Pittsburgh has never been known for having a great offense and Ben was out for the first 4 games of the season. Would anyone really call Pitt a great offense?

It's no secret that the Texans defense was by far the biggest reason why they lost most games. No would argue that, but how many games were lost where people all over town were highly criticizing Gary's play calling at the end of a close game where he just couldn't get it done when it counted? That's what an offensive GURU does. He gets his players prepared for those situations, where the epic fail doesn't happen as often as it does and has when this offense is on the field. How many times now under Kubiak has our QB in Schaub thrown a pick to lose the game or some RB made some awful fumble or a Rosencoptor episode type of deal? It's all to often and after while that's not on the players. That's on the coaching staff when it's consistent. It's a reason why the Steelers, the Patriots, and the Colts win so many games every year and it's not just defense. When games are on the line and their offenses need to execute they don't have the constant epic fails. Those offenses are prepared.

And what's so crazy about all of the wonderful stats you can seek out about the Texans offense is that the majority of those stats come in 2 quarters of a game!!! Imagine what would happen if a real offensive guru could get this team to play 4 great quarters of offense instead of Gary's "epic 2nd half."

JCTexan
02-03-2011, 02:22 AM
You're doing exactly what I keep talking about. you're looking for ways to paint a better picture. Those offenses you just mentioned are right there with the Texans at 10th and 12th and GB was .2 away from them. Pittsburgh has never been known for having a great offense and Ben was out for the first 4 games of the season. Would anyone really call Pitt a great offense?

I'm not trying to paint a better picture of the Texans team. You mentioned that 'points scored is what wins games". I was merely pointing out that Houston scored more points than either Pittsburgh or Green Bay this year. The biggest reason they're both in the Super Bowl instead of Houston is that they are #1 & #2 in giving up the fewest points in the entire league, while Houston is 29th.

but how many games were lost where people all over town were highly criticizing Gary's play calling at the end of a close game where he just couldn't get it done when it counted? That's what an offensive GURU does. He gets his players prepared for those situations, where the epic fail doesn't happen as often as it does and has when this offense is on the field.

I agree. I was right there criticizing Kubiak for going away from the running game when it seemed to be working in the game @Indy. I'm not arguing Kubiak being some sort of offensive guru, but merely pointing out that Houston's offense is a top ten unit.

TEXANRED
02-03-2011, 08:04 AM
Talk about making yourself look dumb with those facepalms.

You don't even know how to properly analyze an offense. I could care less about NFL rankings on random offensive statistics that mean zilch at the end of the day. NFL rankings don't mean squat. In case you haven't noticed, points scored is what "wins games". The SD Chargers were #1 in offense and #1 in defense throughout half the season last year and their record looked like shit. NFL rankings of categories like yards, minutes of possession, and a ton of other things that they use are about as meaningless as back loaded NFL contracts with how misleading they are.

2008 3rd in offense? - They were a whopping 17th in offense in PPG.

2009 4th in offense? - They were a whopping 10th in offense in PPG.

2010 3rd in offense? - They were a whopping 9th in offense in PPG.


Next time educate yourself before throwing that tired facepalm around. If anything those statistics prove my point, which is regardless of how many stats Gary's offenses can pick up and paint a pretty picture with they don't amount to many wins and the furthest he's cracked in PPG is 9th in 5 years of building an offense where he already had Andre Johnson. Lol! Thanks for proving my point even further.

I was being nice and responding only to the post and not you on a personal level.

However if you are going to act like and 8 year old girl I can do the same as well.:vincepalm:

If you despise this team as much as you do why don't you go route for another team b/c I am tired of reading your senseless dribble and out right trollish nature. Go pull your head out of your keaster and realize the sky's not falling Chicken Little.

And before you go off and tell me to educate myself why don't you do the same and realize there is a difference between PPG and overall offense. :vincepalm:

Isn't there a Cowboy chat board you could be visiting right now?

b0ng
02-03-2011, 08:21 AM
I find it hilarious that so many of you spend so much time and energy to explain how "smart" you are by telling us "sheeple" that the offense is actually terrible and since Kubiak is also terrible they have been terrible always.

Fix the defense then ***** about the stupid nitpicky shit that most fans come up with during the offseason (like the new meme that Schaub is a terrible QB). It'd be one thing if we were doing good things on both sides of the ball but we were just being picky about the offense. But No! We have one of the worst defenses and have had one of the worst defenses no matter what statistic you use in the league for the last 4 years. But what do I get to read? Some asshole trying to "educate" me on how really the best side of the Texans football is actually the worse because they don't perform perfectly every single time and don't use that stat use this stat see when you use this stat then Kubiak is stupid and it proves my point ha!

I really don't think anybody on the board should be allowed to ***** about how awful they think the offense is with the defense still giving up more than 25 points a game.

El Tejano
02-03-2011, 08:52 AM
What Mcnair failed to include in his draft process quotes is that after the team looks over who and where they have a player ranked, they then unscramble that positioning and rank according to who can be the easiest to sign.

That's what they said were the reasons for signing David Carr and Mario Williams.

GP
02-03-2011, 10:21 AM
Take away the Patriots offensive efficiency, I'd like to see how many points that defense would allow.

Bingo.

EllisUnit
02-03-2011, 10:26 AM
Take a look at the offensive and defensive rankings for 2009. If what you say is true then we should have already made that splash in the playoffs.

Well i'll say this we were still in the hunt evenafter our last game, the jets lose 1 of last 2 games and we were in. instead the colts and bengals both lay down and play their reserves. the pats played MOST of their starters. I could taste the play offs last year, it was still one of our better years.

steelbtexan
02-03-2011, 11:44 AM
The defense needs to be fixed 1st and foremost. Good news is there's no way a Phillips coached defense is going to be historically bad.

The offense isn't bad but their not as good as their stats look. Part of the reason for this is after the Rosencopter game Gary lost his agressiveness late in games when the Texans have a lead. I expected this to happen it's human nature. The Texans are only agressive when they're behind in the 4th qtr. Staying agressive throughout the game regardless of the outcome is the mark of a great HC. The god awful defense may also be part of the reason Gary fails to stay agressive late in games. (You cant really blame Gary for this thought process) Of course Garys the one that advocated hiring R.Smith and F.Bush. So you can really blame him for getting inexperienced guys in positions they were unqualified for. (But that's a story for another post.)

The Rosencopter ruined Gary as a HC and that's sad. Because I really like the guy. I'm hoping just like after 2009 Gary can get his team to play 4qtrs.

History says he wont be able to get his team to play hard for 4qtrs and the Texans will remain a 7-9,8-8 team.

steelbtexan
02-03-2011, 11:46 AM
Well i'll say this we were still in the hunt evenafter our last game, the jets lose 1 of last 2 games and we were in. instead the colts and bengals both lay down and play their reserves. the pats played MOST of their starters. I could taste the play offs last year, it was still one of our better years.

Ifs=no playoffs=Fail

EllisUnit
02-03-2011, 11:57 AM
Ifs=no playoffs=Fail

i agree we shouldn't have put ourselves in position to need help, but even though we didn't make the play-offs it was still a pretty exciting time for us fans. Considering we haven't had much to be excited about.

texanchris
02-03-2011, 12:29 PM
The offense is to blame almost as much as the defense. In more than a couple games the defense came up with some early stops and the offense came out flat like it usually does and went 3 and out. The Defense would actually play pretty good for the first couple quarters but then get tired because the offense couldnt stay on the field.

gary
02-03-2011, 02:00 PM
Blame who you want but the fact is both the defense and offense were at fault. There were some games where the offense showed up for only one half which was either the first or the second half. And on top of that there were many games where the Texans had the football last but did something stupid to give it away. The defense almost never showed up for sixty minutes of a football game to save their lifes let alone just thirty. This is team game and the whole TEAM has failed thus far including the coaching staff. The fact is the end results are still the same and does not matter how you spin them that is all that counts.

thunderkyss
02-03-2011, 02:33 PM
You're doing exactly what I keep talking about. you're looking for ways to paint a better picture. Those offenses you just mentioned are right there with the Texans at 10th and 12th and GB was .2 away from them. Pittsburgh has never been known for having a great offense and Ben was out for the first 4 games of the season. Would anyone really call Pitt a great offense?


But that's what you get when you use ppg as the end all be all. I agree, ppg wins games. But as you've illustrated it doesn't in anyway reflect how good or bad the offense is.

We had the worse starting position of any team in the league, yet only 8 teams scored more points.

thunderkyss
02-03-2011, 02:45 PM
The Rosencopter ruined Gary as a HC and that's sad. Because I really like the guy. I'm hoping just like after 2009 Gary can get his team to play 4qtrs.


I agree with much of this post. However, I disagree with this statement, in that Rosencopter was just one of the many that broke Gary Kubiak.


Anytime this team got in too big of a hurry, we'd turn the ball over in some of the most insane ways. Schaub, Andre, Slaton, Moats, Quin, Jameel Cook, etc.. etc.. etc...

I think that is the reason we haven't done any 2 minute drills until this year. & why we came out slow in every game, then turned it on when our backs were against the wall.

IMO, you can't coach/play that way.

Mr teX
02-03-2011, 03:00 PM
Sounds to me Gary gets his choice on picks and Rick runs the draft board.

Of all of the hands/voices in the war room I hope Phillips carries the most weight.

Hopefully Phillips says look Gary/Rick, BoB hired me to fix the defense and I need these 3-4 guys to do the job I was hired to do.

Trade up or trade down,trade players already on the roster it really matter how Phillips ends up with the guys he wants. Just as long as he gets who he needs to improve this putrid defense.


Should go rather smoothly to be honest. In years past we had rookie DC's who's position coaches didn't necessarily "come" with those guys..a kind of disjointed approach where guys don't know how well certain players will fit into the DC's scheme. On the other hand, most experienced DC's usually have a group of position coaches brought in that they've worked with & had success with before & those guys know exactly how to select players that will fit into the scheme the DC wants to run.

I say all that to say that when these "votes" come up in the war room, all the defensive guys will likely be on the same page regarding defensive players. If gary wants to disagree with all them regarding a defensive guy, not only will he look like a fool after they give him the :rolleyes: face, smith will likely be swayed by the solidarity of the defensive guys to go against Gary.

Texecutioner
02-03-2011, 03:10 PM
I was being nice and responding only to the post and not you on a personal level.

Oh, you were being nice? Lol!

So much for that. You've already resulted to insults and tid fits instead of debating the real issues that have to do with the team.

However if you are going to act like and 8 year old girl I can do the same as well.:vincepalm:

The facepalms are all you seem to have, because I've yet to see you throw out any reasonable argument or response that warrants any type of usefulness towards the discussion other than some offensive rankings that haven't amounted to squat in the grand scheme of things. Stop being lazy and do some real research.

If you despise this team as much as you do why don't you go route for another team b/c I am tired of reading your senseless dribble and out right trollish nature. Go pull your head out of your keaster and realize the sky's not falling Chicken Little.

Troll? you might want to look in the mirror while you're lashing out without any substantial evidence towards your claims. I'm not the one spewing out insults like a baby. I've been a Houston fan my entire life, but that doesn't mean that I won't say things like they are and have been. You can hide your head into the sand all you want and act like we haven't been an embarrassment and an under achieving franchise all that you want, but for discussion sake I'll speak the truth as I see it, and Kubiak has yet to prove me wrong. I've heard this song and dance and the tempor tantrums from many Kubiak apologists for over 3 years.

And before you go off and tell me to educate myself why don't you do the same and realize there is a difference between PPG and overall offense. :vincepalm:.

Yes, there is and that's exactly why I brought that up genius. Points are what determine who wins and loses which actually matter. All the yards passing, FG % rates, 4th quarter TD's, and every other little offensive gem you want to throw out as a persuasive argument won't work when the best this team has ever done was 9-7 with that and we're 5 years into a regime of this supposed offensive guru. Give me a freaking break.

Isn't there a Cowboy chat board you could be visiting right now?

And this post explains you to a T. You haven't addressed one point I made or even tried to make any type of explanation for it. You've just came back with some insults, some tid fit facepalms that are lame as hell at this point with how over used they are. And get off the Cowboys for god sakes. Stick to the real subject and the issues instead of making this an "Uber fan" dick measuring contest.

gary
02-03-2011, 03:25 PM
Just because some of us are not Kool Aid drinkers does not mean we are not fans.

infantrycak
02-03-2011, 03:40 PM
Just because some of us are not Kool Aid drinkers does not mean we are not fans.

Not directed at you gary, just a spin off.

Very true. Equally true is that just because some folks don't see every intent and act of the Texans as bad doesn't mean they are not realistic. The number of true koolaid drinkers out there is a lot smaller than the use of the moniker by some around here.

gary
02-03-2011, 03:50 PM
Not directed at you gary, just a spin off.

Very true. Equally true is that just because some folks don't see every intent and act of the Texans as bad doesn't mean they are not realistic. The number of true koolaid drinkers out there is a lot smaller than the use of the moniker by some around here.Whatever you think that's your call but I think you'd agree with me that both sides of the football suffered either a little or a lot last season.

infantrycak
02-03-2011, 03:57 PM
Whatever you think that's your call but I think you'd agree with me that both sides of the football suffered either a little or a lot last season.

The coaches and gm's of both super bowl teams would tell you they could improve on both sides of the ball. But that wasn't the point. Some around here have taken to the position everything about the Texans is bad and any position that maybe they did something even OK or even something as simple as yeah they would actually like to win more games is unrealistic koolaid drinking. That position is no more realistic than asserting the Texans haven't made mistakes.

Mr teX
02-03-2011, 04:04 PM
The coaches and gm's of both super bowl teams would tell you they could improve on both sides of the ball. But that wasn't the point. Some around here have taken to the position everything about the Texans is bad and any position that maybe they did something even OK or even something as simple as yeah they would actually like to win more games is unrealistic koolaid drinking. That position is no more realistic than asserting the Texans haven't made mistakes.

repped....Many here take the approach that if you're not wholeheartedly in agreement with them, you're a koolaid drinker or a soaper & its just not black or white like that...there is a gray area.

EllisUnit
02-03-2011, 04:11 PM
i think the offense should be the least of our worries. We have Foster, AJ, Schaub, Walter, Leach. We will score points. If we dont do whatever it takes to fix the defense then we'll be in the same boat next season. Fix the D the O is good enough to where we can get by and win games. Leave well enough alone.

gary
02-03-2011, 04:16 PM
The coaches and gm's of both super bowl teams would tell you they could improve on both sides of the ball. But that wasn't the point. Some around here have taken to the position everything about the Texans is bad and any position that maybe they did something even OK or even something as simple as yeah they would actually like to win more games is unrealistic koolaid drinking. That position is no more realistic than asserting the Texans haven't made mistakes.They want win but they still should try different things like making some noise with a young free agent with a lot of years left. I understand you'll tell me they have spent with Smith and some others but they should have some more chances this year and they ought to make some hey out of it. I hope they do. We shall see.

thunderkyss
02-03-2011, 06:14 PM
The coaches and gm's of both super bowl teams would tell you they could improve on both sides of the ball. But that wasn't the point. Some around here have taken to the position everything about the Texans is bad and any position that maybe they did something even OK or even something as simple as yeah they would actually like to win more games is unrealistic koolaid drinking. That position is no more realistic than asserting the Texans haven't made mistakes.

I think it's even worse than that. Some fans can find something to be happy about, even proud..... AJ another pro bowl bid. Top 5 offense Again. Leach at the Beach. Foster at the Pro Bowl, rushing title, 2200 total yards.

Then you have those fans that it's not good enough to have their whole offseasons ruined, they have to bring those fans. tell them their accepting mediocrity is the reason we'll never have a good team in Houston.

If you find a sliver of a silver lining out of the 2010 season, as a Houston Texans fan... you're part of the problem.

Dishman
02-03-2011, 06:25 PM
Not directed at you gary, just a spin off.

Very true. Equally true is that just because some folks don't see every intent and act of the Texans as bad doesn't mean they are not realistic. The number of true koolaid drinkers out there is a lot smaller than the use of the moniker by some around here.


With the exception that those few remaining Kool-aiders are drunk out of their effin' gourds.

thunderkyss
02-03-2011, 06:30 PM
i think the offense should be the least of our worries. We have Foster, AJ, Schaub, Walter, Leach. We will score points. If we dont do whatever it takes to fix the defense then we'll be in the same boat next season. Fix the D the O is good enough to where we can get by and win games. Leave well enough alone.

I pray that Kubiak doesn't feel this way. There is always room for improvement.

A big improvement I'd like to see, is a running game that's creative & innovative. Think about how Brandon Jacobs, Ahmad Bradshaw, & Derrick Ward were used in New York a few years ago.

There were plays designed to take advantage of each one of their strengths. They were unstoppable.

Think about Allstot & Dunn from the Bucaneers a while back.

Foster's a monster, I'm not doubting that at all. But with Ward averaging over 4 ypc, Slaton over 4 ypc, how can anyone have ever stopped us?

We've got some talent on this team..... Studdard is no starter, but why can't we send out a package or two, with an extra guard or tackle like other teams do (the Chiefs for one) and maul some people over? Butler's also a good player who doesn't see playing time unless someone is injured? Two TE packages????? PUt Butler & Studdard in there.

Casey. There should be plays designed to put the ball in that guys hands, & not try to make him a TE or a fullback. McCluster, Harvin..... less time in the league, much bigger impact..... same possibilities.

Anyway...... I'm just saying.

Wolf
02-03-2011, 06:43 PM
as semi efficient as the offense was (ranked fairly well throughout (mostly top 10 in things that you want to see)) the defense was the yang to the ying and countered that
http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/team/houston-texans/stats/67071

add to that .. ST was horrible (less than 20 yards a kick return and no TD's and PR was a dismal 6.7 yards a punt return and no TDs

2 out of 3 phases of the game stunk

steelbtexan
02-03-2011, 07:07 PM
The coaches and gm's of both super bowl teams would tell you they could improve on both sides of the ball. But that wasn't the point. Some around here have taken to the position everything about the Texans is bad and any position that maybe they did something even OK or even something as simple as yeah they would actually like to win more games is unrealistic koolaid drinking. That position is no more realistic than asserting the Texans haven't made mistakes.

Oh, they would like to win. So would 31 other owners.

McNair appears to be one of the kind of owners where image is more important than winning. That and he failed to fire Kubiak after Garys utter failure last yr because he wasn't willing to eat Garys extention. Makes more than a few fans question BoB's comittment to winning.

People spin thing however they want positive and negative. But there's no getting aroung the fact that BoB's team has stunk for almost a decade and counting.

With that said hopefully Phillips will build a much improved defense and he can help Gary with some in game decisions.

JB
02-03-2011, 07:36 PM
With the exception that those few remaining Kool-aiders are drunk out of their effin' gourds.

I try to stay drunk out of my gourd every chance I get. Statements like this just reek of asshattery.

drs23
02-03-2011, 07:40 PM
I try to stay drunk out of my gourd every chance I get. Statements like this just reek of asshattery.

And somewhat T-total uppidy..:D

BHTEXAN
02-05-2011, 10:20 AM
Now that Phillips is running the defensive show, the one thing I don’t want to hear Bob say is that it’s going to take a while (couple of years) for his style to gel with the players. There have been too many teams (in recent times, notably the Dolphins going from worst to a playoff team in one year) that have been able to make adjustment/changes in a single season. NO EXCUSES!

Wolf
02-05-2011, 11:05 AM
"We absolutely have to see better results next season. There's no way we can tolerate having this kind of season again. Everyone should know that. I'm confident it's not going to happen. We're taking steps to see it won't happen. Everyone understands what's expected of them." -- Owner Bob McNair, who asked about bringing back coach Gary Kubiak, who has posted one winning record and no playoff appearances in his first five seasons.


http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/teams/report/HOU/14636479/texans-report-notes-quotes

Yankee_In_TX
02-05-2011, 11:55 AM
http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/teams/report/HOU/14636479/texans-report-notes-quotes

Yeah, until we go 7-9 or worse. Then I'd like the press to ask McNair to define 'no way we can tolerate' when no one gets fired.

Wolf
02-05-2011, 12:04 PM
Well, we have heard Bob say the same thing year after year, but with seeing how Kubiak's press conference went. Kubiak knows that he is lucky and it showed. I guess why I feel this is the do or die year for Kubiak.

Now it may be a year late but with wade coming in, there are no excuses. The team now needs to step up get some FA and make a run

steelbtexan
02-05-2011, 12:22 PM
Texans=BoB=losing=excuses

That is all.

Mr. White
02-05-2011, 12:42 PM
Back to the point of the original post in the thread....

I've been hearing for years that McNair have a real corporate approach when it comes to making football decisions. This article is proof positive. Sounds like a good way to vote on a merger, but not deciding on a draft pick.

I'd have a hard time believing that other teams do it this way....at least not the successful ones.

thunderkyss
02-05-2011, 12:46 PM
Back to the point of the original post in the thread....

I've been hearing for years that McNair have a real corporate approach when it comes to making football decisions. This article is proof positive. Sounds like a good way to vote on a merger, but not deciding on a draft pick.

I'd have a hard time believing that other teams do it this way....at least the successful ones.

From what I've seen of other war rooms, I'm sure it's pretty similar. Sometimes, the GM has the final say, sometimes the HC. Sometimes, the owner trumps everyone, like the Tacks picking Vince Young in '06.

But it's pretty similar I'm sure.

Dishman
02-05-2011, 01:16 PM
From what I've seen of other war rooms, I'm sure it's pretty similar. Sometimes, the GM has the final say, sometimes the HC. Sometimes, the owner trumps everyone, like the Tacks picking Vince Young in '06.

But it's pretty similar I'm sure.

Seen many NFL war rooms in your day?

Wolf
02-05-2011, 01:26 PM
Seen many NFL war rooms in your day?

I know that it wasn't directed toward me but thanks to nfL network, I have seen a couple

:scarygirl: :runaway:

thunderkyss
02-05-2011, 03:26 PM
Seen many NFL war rooms in your day?

I never sat in the middle of one, to figure out who does what or anything like that. But from reading & listening to other coaches, GMs, & owners I've got a pretty good idea.


Besides, what do you think all those people are doing in that room? Waiting for the GM to declare the gospel?

GP
02-05-2011, 04:09 PM
"We absolutely have to see better results next season. There's no way we can tolerate having this kind of season again. Everyone should know that. I'm confident it's not going to happen. We're taking steps to see it won't happen. Everyone understands what's expected of them." -- Owner Bob McNair, who asked about bringing back coach Gary Kubiak, who has posted one winning record and no playoff appearances in his first five seasons.

This is the sort of stuff that tells me McNair values style over substance.

Instead of saying something along the lines of "You know, the easy thing would be to sit here and make ultimatums and produce a literal timeline on things. I've done that in the past, and what I have realized is that there is so much that goes into getting a team in position to win a title that it rests upon more than just the head coach. We are constantly trying to add to whatever incremental successes we've had, whether it's a first winning season in our history or having a league-leading offense and multiple other successes. We think we have been able to add to our team by acquiring a veteran d-coord in Wade Phillips whom we think can do for our defense what Gary and his coaches have done for the offense."

I know he has said something to that effect before, but it needs to be the mantra. It needs to be the ONLY thing he says in regards to the decision to retain Kubiak, and in relation to the future and the expectations by him and by fans.

Because this stuff of absolutes, such as "Playoffs or bust," or "Super Bowl is the bottom line," and now "There's no way we can tolerate having this kind of season again. Everyone should know that" is just not helping anybody. It's what you'd think the fans want to hear, but it's not. What we want is some blatantly obvious transparency, instead of saying the "Rah! Rah!" pep rally stuff that rings hollow.

We know you're committed to a marathon and not a sprint, Bob. So just stick with that and tell the fans to understand this is the approach you're taking and you want the fans to support it. Explain that you're shooting for legacy-type results instead of quick turnarounds that might last 2-3 years and be gone one day out of the blue.

I think the guy is feeling the heat as it relates to watching other teams' owners make "traumatic" changes and he's not doing it that way...so it renders him as potentially being perceived as not having the guts to make quick moves. If so, then he should embrace it 100% and throw caution to the wind and declare that he doesn't want to have a 3-year, one-hit-wonder team like maybe the Falcons are.

The more I read of McNair, the less I am optimistic about this teams chances at any point in the future. I've said we're going to need the blind squirrel effect to take place before seeing playoffs and a chance at a title, and I still believe that.

I'm also a bit worried about the ability to maintain cohesiveness and unity between an independently-led Wade Phillips defense and an independently-led Gary Kubiak offense. All of the best designed plans for battle go right out the door when the bullets and bombs start flying through the air. Will the plan work out as expected, or will it only create two men with two factions of players vowing allegiance to their respective leaders and having an us vs. them atmosphere brewing the whole time?

The move to bring in Wade, IMO, was just another example of McNair thinking he can tinker with existing parts and get total victory out of it. From what I remember of the 1990s-era Cowboys, Jimmy Johnson was the chief captain commander leader president and Wannstedt (sp?) was a d-coord and Turner was an o-coord and both guys were just that: Strictly coordinators, not men who were ever going to sniff head coaching for the Cowboys during or shortly after Jimmy's departure. What WE have, is the very real possibility that Wade will take over if Kubiak is ousted. And it doesn't take much to oust a guy if his successor is already in the house. Just needs a slight nudge, at this point.

Human psychology is funny that way. Sharks aren't the only creatures who can smell blood in the water, and I fear that there will be repercussions with this "grand plan" of bringing in Wade. It had to have been a blow to Gary, because up until now...Gary has been the smartest guy in the room, and I think he did that by design (no challengers to the throne, so to speak).

Wolf
02-05-2011, 04:12 PM
The move to bring in Wade, IMO, was just another example of McNair thinking he can tinker with existing parts and get total victory out of it.

very true


signed
Tom Benson

GP
02-05-2011, 04:22 PM
very true


signed
Tom Benson

Not sure what you're saying.

I don't think Tom tinkered. He gave Sean Payton the reins, at the same time Kubiak was given the reins of the Texans team, and they've seen different results.

On the Saints end, the tinkering is done under circumstances of consistent playoff appearances and a Super Bowl victory.

On our end, the tinkering is done under circumstances of one 9-7 season, no playoff appearances, and multiple losing seasons.

Sort of a big difference. In one sense, the tinkering is justified. In the other team, you get to where you question the structure of the foundation altogether.

Wolf
02-05-2011, 04:34 PM
I was talking about Sean was smart enough to realize that adding Gregg Williams to the mix on the defensive side of the ball

GP
02-05-2011, 04:36 PM
I was talking about Sean was smart enough to realize that adding Gregg Williams to the mix on the defensive side of the ball

Ah, you left a lot of ground for me to cover. Wasn't sure on your direction there.

I see.

Lucky
02-05-2011, 04:47 PM
very true


signed
Tom Benson

Not sure what you're saying.

I think he is referring to the Saints bringing in Gregg Williams as DC prior to the '09 season. Which became the Saints Super Bowl year.

What people seem to forget is that Williams was Payton's 2nd DC. His first, Gary Gibbs, put together the 11th ranked defense in 2006 and the Saints got to the NFC title game. Two mediocre seasons with poor defensive efforts led Payton to give Gibbs the axe. Did he go out and hire a buddy? A coach who had never before been a DC? Nope, he found the best DC on the market. And when ownership balked at the new DC's $price tag, Payton took a pay cut to make the deal happen. Championship.

This is Kubiak's third attempt. This is probably McNair's hire and Kubiak is just going along. Like he has a choice. So Wolf is half correct in that this is McNair's attempt to replicate the Saints' '09 move. Except it was Payton, not Benson, that brought Gregg Williams into the mix and turned around the Saints fortunes.

steelbtexan
02-05-2011, 05:12 PM
Not sure what you're saying.

I don't think Tom tinkered. He gave Sean Payton the reins, at the same time Kubiak was given the reins of the Texans team, and they've seen different results.

On the Saints end, the tinkering is done under circumstances of consistent playoff appearances and a Super Bowl victory.

On our end, the tinkering is done under circumstances of one 9-7 season, no playoff appearances, and multiple losing seasons.

Sort of a big difference. In one sense, the tinkering is justified. In the other team, you get to where you question the structure of the foundation altogether.

BoB doesn't want anything traumatic in his organization.

Well 6-10 was ppredictable and traumatic.

BoB doesn't understand that a traumatic yr. Should be followed by traumatic effect of blowing the thing up and getting a proven winner. That will excite his loyal fan base.

Either that or BoB doesn't want to pay for having to blow up the organization in a lockout yr. Anyway tinkering isn't enough to turn this oorganization around. The way his loyal fan base wants. IMHO

steelbtexan
02-05-2011, 05:23 PM
I think he is referring to the Saints bringing in Gregg Williams as DC prior to the '09 season. Which became the Saints Super Bowl year.

What people seem to forget is that Williams was Payton's 2nd DC. His first, Gary Gibbs, put together the 11th ranked defense in 2006 and the Saints got to the NFC title game. Two mediocre seasons with poor defensive efforts led Payton to give Gibbs the axe. Did he go out and hire a buddy? A coach who had never before been a DC? Nope, he found the best DC on the market. And when ownership balked at the new DC's $price tag, Payton took a pay cut to make the deal happen. Championship.

This is Kubiak's third attempt. This is probably McNair's hire and Kubiak is just going along. Like he has a choice. So Wolf is half correct in that this is McNair's attempt to replicate the Saints' '09 move. Except it was Payton, not Benson, that brought Gregg Williams into the mix and turned around the Saints fortunes.

I really wonder if Gary got the choice to hire another DC what loser buddy of his he would've brought in this time.

Gary's freinds were terribly overmatched in their jobs. This will be Gary's downfall. Bob's just trying to fit the square peg in the round hole at this point.

thunderkyss
02-05-2011, 07:33 PM
I think the guy is feeling the heat as it relates to watching other teams' owners make "traumatic" changes and he's not doing it that way...so it renders him as potentially being perceived as not having the guts to make quick moves.

I wear my Texans' gear year round. I'll be jerseyed, jacketed, hated, and towel hanging out of my back pocket at our Super Bowl party tomorrow.

I never know what I'm going to get. Some people sympathize, some people are optomistic about the future (I don't get it either), some people are down right mean.

I can hold my own.

But I wonder how McNair feels when he walks into that room with the other 31 owners. I'm sure he gets some of the same thing.

But he can actually do something about it, where I can't.

Wolf
02-05-2011, 08:48 PM
I really wonder if Gary got the choice to hire another DC what loser buddy of his he would've brought in this time.

Gary's freinds were terribly overmatched in their jobs. This will be Gary's downfall. Bob's just trying to fit the square peg in the round hole at this point.

Seems to be working for the offense, but don't let the full blown hate cloud your judgment .

Defensively, yes, gary's pipeline of friends have failed him on that side of the ball

Btw wade was also in Denver when Kubiak was there :shades:

GP
02-05-2011, 09:02 PM
I wear my Texans' gear year round. I'll be jerseyed, jacketed, hated, and towel hanging out of my back pocket at our Super Bowl party tomorrow.

I never know what I'm going to get. Some people sympathize, some people are optomistic about the future (I don't get it either), some people are down right mean.

I can hold my own.

But I wonder how McNair feels when he walks into that room with the other 31 owners. I'm sure he gets some of the same thing.

But he can actually do something about it, where I can't.

I think as long as the Texans are not making the news for strip club shootings, drug busts (hardcore drugs, btw, not roids), dog fighting, high speed police chases, etc., then he considers it a great day for the Texans.

Anything else is gravy on top.

I, too, will be sticking around to see how this plays out. I don't particularly think it's "just the defense" that needs more help. While the defense was atrocious, the offense (despite what the stats say otherwise) is in need of help too--Gary hasn't had his offense clicking until Quarter 4 on a consistent basis, and that bothers me.

It bothers me that Matt Schaub and our offense look more in rhythm in 2-minute drives--Because guess who is calling the shots in those situations?--than they do at other spots in the game. I am hoping it gets to the point that Schaub just starts taking over on his own, throughout games, and acting like his headset isn't working anymore. Because as much as Gary is known for his "genius offensive mind," Matt Schaub (to me) shows an ability to be one of those QBs in the NFL who can call the plays all the way down the field. However, it strikes me that Kubiak is living his life vicariously through the starting QB.

And I haven't even mentioned the other things about Kubiak that are nagging problems for the past 5 years. I'm choosing to stop, and I am sure the board applauds my generosity.

steelbtexan
02-05-2011, 09:30 PM
Seems to be working for the offense, but don't let the full blown hate cloud your judgment .

Defensively, yes, gary's pipeline of friends have failed him on that side of the ball

Btw wade was also in Denver when Kubiak was there :shades:

Not hate just wanted to point out how in over his head Gary is.

I'm well aware of Phillips connection to Gary. Unless the Texans have a 2006 draft in a down draft yr without the benefit of having the 1st pick in each rd. (I dont see this happening.) Not with the mess BoB described going on in the war room.

I dont see the Texans improving much past 8-8 and the excuse merry go round PR spin starts all over again. That's not hate. IMHO

That's just crapping in somebody's koolaid. I said this before the extention and TK,TB,JB,The matrix I believe said lets see how the season plays out before you pass judgement.

I did this until everybody could see how the 2010 season was going to turn out.

Question should I wait until the 2011 season turns out before I start stating the obvious? (Gary's in over his head as a HC) I hope BoB's best laid plans work out. But after 5 yrs you can understand my skeptisism no?

BTW, I will be wearing my Texans gear at our SB party. I may not be a Koolaid drinking Kubiak fan. But my Texan fandom is always on display.

steelbtexan
02-05-2011, 09:43 PM
I think as long as the Texans are not making the news for strip club shootings, drug busts (hardcore drugs, btw, not roids), dog fighting, high speed police chases, etc., then he considers it a great day for the Texans.

Anything else is gravy on top.

I, too, will be sticking around to see how this plays out. I don't particularly think it's "just the defense" that needs more help. While the defense was atrocious, the offense (despite what the stats say otherwise) is in need of help too--Gary hasn't had his offense clicking until Quarter 4 on a consistent basis, and that bothers me.

It bothers me that Matt Schaub and our offense look more in rhythm in 2-minute drives--Because guess who is calling the shots in those situations?--than they do at other spots in the game. I am hoping it gets to the point that Schaub just starts taking over on his own, throughout games, and acting like his headset isn't working anymore. Because as much as Gary is known for his "genius offensive mind," Matt Schaub (to me) shows an ability to be one of those QBs in the NFL who can call the plays all the way down the field. However, it strikes me that Kubiak is living his life vicariously through the starting QB.

And I haven't even mentioned the other things about Kubiak that are nagging problems for the past 5 years. I'm choosing to stop, and I am sure the board applauds my generosity.

Schaub needs to do like Manning does, 4th down, Dungy send punt team on field. Manning waves them off.

Schaub needs to do this, when Garry calls a HB pass on the goal line of a game that means playoffs or no playoffs, laugh and call another play. That's what real leaders like Manning and Brady do and it's what Schaub needs to do to get over the hump and become the QB that he can be.

Are you saying Gary's insecue in his hiring of asst. coaches and play calling responsibities? That could never be. IMHO LOL

Wolf
02-05-2011, 09:45 PM
Wow, just wow

Lol

infantrycak
02-06-2011, 10:29 AM
Schaub needs to do like Manning does, 4th down, Dungy send punt team on field. Manning waves them off.

Schaub needs to do this, when Garry calls a HB pass on the goal line of a game that means playoffs or no playoffs, laugh and call another play. That's what real leaders like Manning and Brady do and it's what Schaub needs to do to get over the hump and become the QB that he can be.

Are you saying Gary's insecue in his hiring of asst. coaches and play calling responsibities? That could never be. IMHO LOL

Story of my favorite coach and QB. Landry had Staubach subbing in and out even down to on each down at times (worst decision Landry ever made but putting that aside). Staubach goes in on 4th and goal from the 2 or 3, gets the call, doesn't like it and changes it in the huddle. He scores a TD to win the game and have that be part of Captain Comeback. Landry without any histrionics tells him OK, you're the starting QB. You can call your own plays when you are a 40 year old QB. Staubach still bucked calls at times and they were some of Landry's most animated sideline moments.

Lucky
02-06-2011, 01:16 PM
Story of my favorite coach and QB. Landry had Staubach subbing in and out even down to on each down at times (worst decision Landry ever made but putting that aside).
Here's the Wiki version (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roger_Staubach), and pretty much how I remember it.

In 1971 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1971_NFL_season), Craig Morton (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Craig_Morton) began the season as the starter, but after a loss to the New Orleans Saints (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Orleans_Saints), Staubach assumed the role. However, in a game against the Chicago Bears (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chicago_Bears) in the seventh week of that season, coach Tom Landry alternated Staubach and Morton on each play, sending in the quarterbacks with the play call from the sideline. Dallas gained more than 500 yards of offense, but suffered a 23–19 loss to a mediocre Bears squad that dropped the Cowboys to 4–3 on the season, two games behind the Washington Redskins (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Washington_Redskins) in the NFC East race.

Staubach assumed the full-time quarterbacking duties in a week eight victory over the St. Louis Cardinals (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arizona_Cardinals) and led the Cowboys to ten consecutive victories, including their first Super Bowl victory, 24–3 over the Miami Dolphins (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Miami_Dolphins). He led the Cowboys to their first Super Bowl win and was named MVP (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Super_Bowl_Most_Valuable_Player_Award) of Super Bowl VI (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Super_Bowl_VI) on January 16, 1972, completing 12 out of 19 passes for 119 yards and two touchdowns, and rushing for 18 yards. In 1972 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1972_NFL_season), he missed most of the season with a separated shoulder (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Separated_shoulder), but he relieved Morton in a divisional playoff against the San Francisco 49ers (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/San_Francisco_49ers) and threw two touchdown passes in the last 90 seconds to win the game 30-28. With that performance, he won back his regular job and did not relinquish it again during his career.
The Cowboys always called the plays from the sideline by bringing in a substitute. Be it a WR, TE, or FB. This was the one game that Landry tried it with the QBs, and he never did it again. Lesson learned.

What I find ironic is that the 3 of the 5 QBs I consider to have been the most intelligent on the field (Montana, Staubach, & Kosar) had plays brought in from the sideline. But Terry Bradshaw called his own plays? Really?

Still not sure why Staubach retired. He had his best statistical season in his last year (1979). He was still in great shape. My guess is that he felt it was Danny White's time. Pretty selfless move on Roger's part, IMO. Easily one of the top 10 QBs I've ever seen.

steelbtexan
02-06-2011, 02:26 PM
Here's the Wiki version (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roger_Staubach), and pretty much how I remember it.

The Cowboys always called the plays from the sideline by bringing in a substitute. Be it a WR, TE, or FB. This was the one game that Landry tried it with the QBs, and he never did it again. Lesson learned.

What I find ironic is that the 3 of the 5 QBs I consider to have been the most intelligent on the field (Montana, Staubach, & Kosar) had plays brought in from the sideline. But Terry Bradshaw called his own plays? Really?

Still not sure why Staubach retired. He had his best statistical season in his last year (1979). He was still in great shape. My guess is that he felt it was Danny White's time. Pretty selfless move on Roger's part, IMO. Easily one of the top 10 QBs I've ever seen.

Multiple concussions

Staubach wanted to have a quality life after football.

Lucky
02-06-2011, 02:57 PM
Multiple concussions

Staubach wanted to have a quality life after football.
That makes sense. He had a great (if not short for a QB) career. Heisman. 2 Super Bowl rings. It's so uncommon to see these guys not being dragged out of the game kicking and screaming. I guess Staubach was able to envision challenges outside the gridiron the others can't see.

thunderkyss
02-06-2011, 04:09 PM
Here's the Wiki version (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roger_Staubach), and pretty much how I remember it.


Damn y'all are old.....

:kitten:

drs23
02-06-2011, 04:17 PM
I think as long as the Texans are not making the news for strip club shootings, drug busts (hardcore drugs, btw, not roids), dog fighting, high speed police chases, etc., then he considers it a great day for the Texans.

Anything else is gravy on top.

I, too, will be sticking around to see how this plays out. I don't particularly think it's "just the defense" that needs more help. While the defense was atrocious, the offense (despite what the stats say otherwise) is in need of help too--Gary hasn't had his offense clicking until Quarter 4 on a consistent basis, and that bothers me.

It bothers me that Matt Schaub and our offense look more in rhythm in 2-minute drives--Because guess who is calling the shots in those situations?--than they do at other spots in the game. I am hoping it gets to the point that Schaub just starts taking over on his own, throughout games, and acting like his headset isn't working anymore. Because as much as Gary is known for his "genius offensive mind," Matt Schaub (to me) shows an ability to be one of those QBs in the NFL who can call the plays all the way down the field. However, it strikes me that Kubiak is living his life vicariously through the starting QB.

And I haven't even mentioned the other things about Kubiak that are nagging problems for the past 5 years. I'm choosing to stop, and I am sure the board applauds my generosity.

:clap: :D

GP
02-07-2011, 12:21 AM
:clap: :D

LOL. I had you, and about three others, in mind when I stopped short and added that last little line.

I was thinking, "I bet I can pinpoint about 3 people who might see the humor in it and reply with an 'applause' smiley..."

Am I good, or what?

HuttoKarl
02-07-2011, 09:43 AM
How does Bob explain all the draft picks that we don't play then....like our 14 TE's???

GP
02-07-2011, 09:55 AM
How does Bob explain all the draft picks that we don't play then....like our 14 TE's???

That position is snakebit. I'm kinda' glad we DO draft so many TEs.

Can you imagine if we didn't? I think Dreesen was the only guy there, consistently, this year. Graham was hurt. OD in and out all year. Then that other guy who is always hurt. Seriously, Dreesen was essentially our main TE all year. Everyone else was always on the bicycle.

infantrycak
02-07-2011, 10:55 AM
Still not sure why Staubach retired. He had his best statistical season in his last year (1979). He was still in great shape. My guess is that he felt it was Danny White's time. Pretty selfless move on Roger's part, IMO. Easily one of the top 10 QBs I've ever seen.

Multiple concussions

Staubach wanted to have a quality life after football.

I think it was both those things. He had his rings and he also had a vision for life after football and the firm he was going to build. I mean heck he delayed his football career to serve his country. He loved it and was great at it but it wasn't the center of his universe. He had worked for years in the off-seasons to get experience prior to starting his company which he did a couple of seasons or so before quitting football.

Texanmike02
02-07-2011, 04:45 PM
....like our 14 TE's???

A crystal ball?

Mike

Double Barrel
02-07-2011, 05:15 PM
I think it was both those things. He had his rings and he also had a vision for life after football and the firm he was going to build. I mean heck he delayed his football career to serve his country. He loved it and was great at it but it wasn't the center of his universe. He had worked for years in the off-seasons to get experience prior to starting his company which he did a couple of seasons or so before quitting football.

Truly one of the legends of the sport. Although my folks greatly disliked the Cowboys, they always had tremendous respect for Landry and Staubach. One of my uncles was a huge Cowboys fan and always called me little Roger (because of my wavy hair) when we'd play street football with him.

About a decade ago the talking tv heads were making a big deal about "running QBs". I never understood this, because Roger Staubach and Fran Tarkenton were fantastic runners. But, then I realized that these two greats ran to pass the ball, staying behind the LOS. The prototype "running QBs" (i.e. Culpepper, Vick, McNabb) were north/south runners and not so much "scramblers" like Tarkenton and Staubach, although McNabb did change his game up to become a somewhat decent scrambler later in his career.

infantrycak
02-07-2011, 06:55 PM
About a decade ago the talking tv heads were making a big deal about "running QBs". I never understood this, because Roger Staubach and Fran Tarkenton were fantastic runners. But, then I realized that these two greats ran to pass the ball, staying behind the LOS. The prototype "running QBs" (i.e. Culpepper, Vick, McNabb) were north/south runners and not so much "scramblers" like Tarkenton and Staubach, although McNabb did change his game up to become a somewhat decent scrambler later in his career.

Yup, huge difference between running QB and scrambling QB. We just saw a scrambler win the SB against another pretty good scrambler. It was funny every so often watching Landry chew Staubach a new sphincter for not sliding after making a 1st down or going in head first.

Double Barrel
02-07-2011, 07:18 PM
Yup, huge difference between running QB and scrambling QB. We just saw a scrambler win the SB against another pretty good scrambler. It was funny every so often watching Landry chew Staubach a new sphincter for not sliding after making a 1st down or going in head first.

What is interesting is that the scrambling QBs that we're talking about were QBs first and foremost. They were able to scramble due to great athleticism, but it was also out of survival than actual game planning. They'd run 50 yards behind the LOS in order to allow enough time for a receiver to finally get open, and I still marvel at some of those plays when NFL Films shows them.

The running QBs seemed like they were athletes first and QBs second. Vick and McNabb are developing their QB skills over time, because throwing the ball 50 yards is a lot easier than running those same 50 yards through NFL defenses.

I found it humorous that the "prototype running QBs" (as the talking tv heads were prone to call them a decade ago) were supposed to redefine the NFL, to the point that new rules would be implemented and the fundamental nature of the sport would be vastly different in the coming years. However, when you look at the last 10 Super Bowl winning QBs, most of them have been pocket passers (and none of them "running QBs"). "Redefine the league...", yeah riiiight.

Wolf
02-07-2011, 07:53 PM
The board resembles a life-size spreadsheet with the positions listed across the top. On the left hand side of the board is a column which is separated by the grades listed in the grading scale. The evaluation scale varies according to team but the grades correlate to the expectations associated with a prospect’s talent and potential. For example, on a grading scale that ranges from 3.5 (NFL reject) to 8.0 (Hall of Fame-caliber), a prospect who receives a grade in the 7.0-7.9 range is a first-round talent and expected to be a starter in his first season. Players graded in the 6.5-6.9 range (second round) are viewed as borderline first-year starters with the potential to become solid starters in time. The grades and expectations continue down the scale until they reach the bottom of the board.

The players are listed and ranked by position on the big board. In addition, the players are ranked on a separate board from 1-125, based solely on their talent. This is an overall ranking of all of the prospects available in the draft and is used extensively to determine the best available prospect. In theory, the “vertical board” is the board that general managers use to pick prospects on draft day. If they subscribe to the theory of taking the best player available, then the process should be simple as they work off the vertical board on draft day.

The vertical board is crafted after the general manager and scouts work through the various scenarios involving possible prospects being available at the same time. For example, if cornerback Malcolm Jenkins and defensive end Everette Brown are available, which one would we take with our first-round pick? By working through these situations in the days leading up to the draft, the general manager has no reason to deviate from the established order on draft day. He simply picks the best available prospect regardless of position, and moves on.

It sounds simple in theory, but general managers must avoid numerous temptations to make the tactic work; one of those persuasions is drafting solely for a need. Therefore, a team in desperate need of a middle linebacker may place the best available prospects at the position in a higher round to guarantee that they have one available at their pick. This process is called “reaching”, and teams that fall for the practice often make huge mistakes in the draft.

Another common error made by scouts is letting a prospect’s workout push him up the board. Too often, scouts and coaches fall in love with a prospect after watching him perform at the scouting combine or his pro day. Players who look great in shorts dazzle evaluators with their agility and explosiveness in drills. Their impressive display of athleticism causes scouts to ignore the holes in their game that repeatedly show up on tape. Coaches suggest that they can get the unseen production out of them, and are often tempted to take a chance on “workout warriors” due to their untapped potential.

Thus, it is up to the general manager to keep the coaches and scouts focused on taking the best “football player” on the board, not the best athlete.

The draft begins and ends with the draft board, but scouts and coaches must stay true to it for it to yield quality results.



Character, which can be split into two categories: Moral character and football character, is heavily scrutinized by evaluators throughout the pre-draft process. Scouts talk to numerous coaches and administrators on school visits to properly assess the reputations of draft hopefuls. Hours upon hours are spent researching the pasts of each individual listed on draft boards. Teams call middle and high school teachers to see how these young men were as adolescents. Some teams have been known to deploy scouts to the respective hometowns of certain prospects on fact-finding missions.

Teams hire security firms to run extensive background checks on players to see if there are any unreported arrests or warrants associated with the prospect. Sometimes these searches reveal more information than the official background checks conducted by the league, and their revelations allow teams to remove “high risk” individuals from their board.

In addition, some teams follow mandates issued from ownership on what types of transgressions are deemed unacceptable by a franchise. These misbehaviors can range from domestic disputes to various drug-related offenses, including drunk-driving arrests or charges. Whatever is perceived by ownership to be a “hot-button” issue could cause public backlash or ridicule.


Not everyone gets a vote

While most outsiders assume that the war room is buzzing with scouts exchanging various opinions on draft day, it would surprise many that some teams don’t include their scouts in conversations once the draft has begun.


Some organizations only allow their decision makers (owner, head coach, general manager and college scouting director) into the war room during the draft, and request that their scouts sit in another room during the event. Organization leaders are fearful of scouts sharing too much information with their cohorts, and believe restricting their access to the draft board and to private conversations will prevent an inadvertent slip of the tongue.

Though scouts occasionally are asked to enter the room to read a report or answer a question on a prospect from their assigned region, they are quickly dismissed after relaying the necessary information.

The exclusion of scouts from the war room often results in an unappreciated feeling in the other room, but the desire to maintain a high level of confidentiality outweighs bruised egos in the minds of some decision makers



http://www.nfl.com/draft/story/09000d5d80fdd012/article/what-goes-on-inside-draft-war-rooms-shapes-the-nfl-landscape

thunderkyss
02-07-2011, 08:04 PM
http://a.espncdn.com/photo/2010/0422/pg2_e_draft_576.jpg

Wolf
02-07-2011, 08:05 PM
:lol: MSR

drs23
02-08-2011, 02:51 PM
Great read Wolf. Thanks for posting.