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RagingBull
01-13-2011, 10:56 PM
The Denver broncos are now supposedly switching back to the 4-3. The Texans are switching to the 3-4.

Would you trade Mario Williams for Elvis Dumervil straight up.

Both will be coming off of injuries; Dumervil had a torn pectoralis if you do not recall.

What say you?

Carr Bombed
01-13-2011, 11:00 PM
yes

JB
01-13-2011, 11:01 PM
No.

steelbtexan
01-13-2011, 11:01 PM
The Denver broncos are now supposedly switching back to the 4-3. The Texans are switching to the 3-4.

Would you trade Mario Williams for Elvis Dumervil straight up.

Both will be coming off of injuries; Dumervil had a torn pectoralis if you do not recall.

What say you?

No way

If the Broncos wanted to trade the #2 pick for Mario. I would be all over that.

2slik4u
01-13-2011, 11:08 PM
No.

I say no, just because JB's profile pic conviced me to side with him.

:yikes:

JB
01-13-2011, 11:13 PM
I say no, just because JB's profile pic conviced me to side with him.

:yikes:

:tiphat:


My TT friends gifted me on my birthday with that lovely pair...

RagingBull
01-13-2011, 11:14 PM
Dumervils Sack #s:

2006 8.5 (Rookie)
2007 12.5
2008 5
2009 17
2010 Did not play.

Career Total: 43 Sacks, 129 Tackles, 1 Interception, 10 forced fumbles

Mario:
2006: 4.5 (Rookie)
2007: 14
2008: 12
2009: 9
2010: 8.5

Career Total: 48 Sacks, 230 Tackles, 0 Interceptions, 10 forced fumbles
39.5 Sacks, 209 Tackles, 0 Interceptions,

2slik4u
01-13-2011, 11:14 PM
:tiphat:


My TT friends gifted me on my birthday with that lovely pair...

Hopefully not just the picture but the actual.....

JB
01-13-2011, 11:17 PM
Hopefully not just the picture but the actual.....

:pissed: Dammit! I should have known I was getting shortchanged!

machineo
01-14-2011, 01:17 AM
Elvis has come from a more volatile system in Denver. They switched to 3-4 with McD and even worse he's had a different DC every season he's been playing. All but one of those seasons he's produced admirably, and really broke out last season. Not high tackle totals so maybe he doesnt play the run as well, but DJ Williams is as much of a tackle magnet as Demeco is.

The guy's tiny though, he's not even 6' tall.

Wolf6151
01-14-2011, 04:06 AM
No way

If the Broncos wanted to trade the #2 pick for Mario. I would be all over that.


^^^^^This^^^^^

beerlover
01-14-2011, 04:16 AM
#2 pick & Elvis :)

IDEXAN
01-14-2011, 07:42 AM
If say Dallas were going 4-3, I'd hop all over a trade even up for Demarcus Ware, but I'd need some "boot" with Dummerville. Plus isn't the Elvis injury more serious, more uncertain re his recovery than Marios ?

TEXANRED
01-14-2011, 08:38 AM
No.

While we are at it why don't we trade AJ for Eddie Royal.

nero THE zero
01-14-2011, 09:21 AM
I was thinking yesterday about how I'd trade Mario to them for the 2nd pick plus a 2nd or 3rd.

You'd get Fairley or Peterson with that second pick plus an OLB or DE with our pick.

And, Denver's line would be nasty with Mario and Dumervill on the ends.

Blake
01-14-2011, 09:40 AM
Only if they throw in their 3rd string TE for Foster. Then I say pull the trigger.

Texan_Bill
01-14-2011, 09:40 AM
No.

Not no.......... But **** NO!!!!!!!

Texan_Bill
01-14-2011, 09:41 AM
Only if they throw in their 3rd string TE for Foster. Then I say pull the trigger.

:spit: I might sign off on that.



:facepalm:

El Tejano
01-14-2011, 09:56 AM
Okay, my brother and I were talking about this the other day. I was talking about how certain players (specificly Mario and Antonio) didn't look very happy about the move to a 3-4 defense. When I said that, what I thought was a knee jerk response, his reaction was "just put Mario on the trade block". After hearing him out and several times saying he was crazy I came to realize that he made alot of sense. Here were some things I argued why you don't and here are the responses he mentioned:

1. Mario is a premier pass rusher and you don't get those often

Yes, while Mario is a great pass rusher, Mario was brought in to make our team a better pass rushing team - 4 years later we are still at the bottom in that category. Him being a premiere pass rusher is going to get people to bring in some big time trades.

2. He never had a real defensive Coordinator that played to his strengths.

True, but let's take a look at Mario's strengths. Sacking the QB, that's probably not going to be something he does alot of in the new defense. Mario would get stopped alot one on one with a decent OT. In the new defense he's going to have to fight off a triple team almost every snap, sure that will free up someone but in the 3-4 that can be done with alot of DEs. Even a guy like Gary Walker was successful in a 3-4 scheme.
Stopping the run, if anything, is the one strength that would allow Mario to shine in that stat. But do you want one guy on the defense to stop the run or would you rather get rid of one player who can bring you a 3-4 DE that stops the run and possibly a LB or CB or Safety?

3. Mario has never had the "guy on the other side".

I know that. We have to ask why though. Seems like every pass rusher who is someone in the league always has a "guy on the other side" though, so we have to ask why? You can easily point blame on the organization because they won't spend money, however, look at the face of our franchise - Andre Johnson. They haven't spent too much money on the WR corp and while Kevin Walter is a good player, he isn't forcing any double teams away from Andre Johnson yet Andre still plays at a high level pretty much every game. The reason why Mario doesn't have that guy on the other side is because more often than not, Mario is being contained rather easily. You said yourself that Mario's sacks only come when he wants to play hard.

4. You can't say he doesn't care because he plays injured.

And that right there is the number one reason why I feel Mario has no room to be upset about the scheme change and if he is we should put him on the trade block. Let see, 2006 plantar fascitus, 2007 Shoulder injuries 2008 Hip Pointers, 2009 Groin Injury, 2010 Sports Hernia. DE is a tough position and noone is questioning his toughness because if anything, you can count on Mario to play every Sunday and as a fan that wanted Vince, I can say that I was dead wrong and the team made the right choice on just his toughness alone. However, that's too many injuries for my liking and a unhealthy Mario probably is the reason why he's being contained alot more than other standout DEs in the league. An unhealthy Mario, is probably the reason for a few losses that were because of a lack of pass rush.
I'm a big fan of Mario. When I saw how he was getting dissed around in the media, I took offense and when I saw him overcome all that, I was very proud. However if losing Mario brings us a draft or players like The Cowboys obtained when they traded Herschel Walker, you gotta do what's best for the team.
Now if Mario can be a team player and give W.Phillips a chance to see if he can make him a player like Bruce Smith was under his tutaledge, then Mario has to stay.

Ole Miss Texan
01-14-2011, 10:18 AM
I actually wanted us to trade for Dumervil when we ran the 4-3 and have him as a pass rush specialist. But no way do I trade Mario for him.

Wade has said he's going to play Mario to his strengths and let him get after the QB. He's not going to be asket to take on triple teams. He's going to play farther outside than a typical 3-4 DE.

Now, if some team was offering up the farm for him I think we'd be fools not to consider it. But I think Mario can really excel with Phillips.

BigBull17
01-14-2011, 10:29 AM
No way

If the Broncos wanted to trade the #2 pick for Mario. I would be all over that.

Really? An unproven, grossly overpaid draft pick for Mario? I bet they would do that in a heart beat. Awful trade for us, IMO.

steelbtexan
01-14-2011, 11:46 AM
Really? An unproven, grossly overpaid draft pick for Mario? I bet they would do that in a heart beat. Awful trade for us, IMO.

For the reasons listed in ET's post.

Plus Mario is a party boy. If he's going to be on this team he's going to have to grow up. Work on conditioning so that he quits getting hurt every year and put what's good for the team above his personal stats. Even in a contract yr.

ET, you're brother is a smart man.

I'll take the unproven over what has been proven MW is a really good player who's injury prone and appears to be a stats 1st kinda guy.

Yes, give Denvers #2 and I will take Peterson. Sign a CB in FA and fix the atrocity that's been the Texans secondary for the last 9 yrs.

You can always draft a 3-4 DE like McPhee in the 3rd and/or sign Spears in FA.

Now if MW wants to get on board and do the hard work to become great like Bruce Smith then he stays. He as the ability. It's about the effort he wants to put in to become great.

Joe Texan
01-14-2011, 12:33 PM
Trade Mario, you got to be a VY lover:wadepalm:

Carr Bombed
01-14-2011, 06:09 PM
No.

While we are at it why don't we trade AJ for Eddie Royal.

:rolleyes:


Yeah, because Elvis Dumervil is on the same level as Eddie Royal.


The truth of the matter is, Mario and Elvis aren't that far apart in production and as far as getting to the passer goes, I'd even say Elvis Dumervil is a better "pass rusher". He has freakishly long arms so his short stature doesn't hurt him, it helps him.

We don't know what Mario can do in this defense.....we do know what Dumervil can do (He was a elite OLB, more elite at his position than Mario was the last year they both played.) Elvis Dumervil isn't some scrub, he's a damn good player.

Norg
01-14-2011, 07:23 PM
I would love to have BOth but ill say yeah why not at least he knows a 3-4 and we know what we have cant say that with mario

steelbtexan
01-15-2011, 12:08 AM
:rolleyes:


Yeah, because Elvis Dumervil is on the same level as Eddie Royal.


The truth of the matter is, Mario and Elvis aren't that far apart in production (as far as getting to the passer goes) and I'd even say Elvis Dumervil is a better "pass rusher". He has freakishly long arms so his short stature doesn't hurt him, it helps him.

We don't know what Mario can do in this defense.....we do know what Dumervil can do (He was a elite OLB, more elite at his position than Mario was at his the last year they both played.) Elvis Dumervil isn't some scrub, he's a damn good player.

Dont let facts get in the way of the MW love.

With that said I wouldn't trade Elvis for MW. But it's alot closer than people on this MB want to admit.

Goatcheese
01-15-2011, 06:57 AM
So you want to trade the most complete DE in the NFL for a pass rush specialist?

:facepalm::kubepalm::wadepalm:

There are better rushers and there are better run defenders, but there isn't one guy in the NFL that does both as well as Mario.

His only problem is getting healthy. He's not the same guy when he can't use all of his physical gifts.

There's no way I trade a once in a decade elite talent for just-a-guy passrusher #847.

Bubbajwp
01-15-2011, 07:35 AM
So you want to trade the most complete DE in the NFL for a pass rush specialist?

:facepalm::kubepalm::wadepalm:

There are better rushers and there are better run defenders, but there isn't one guy in the NFL that does both as well as Mario.

His only problem is getting healthy. He's not the same guy when he can't use all of his physical gifts.

There's no way I trade a once in a decade elite talent for just-a-guy passrusher #847.

If you think Dumervil is just-a-guy passrusher you are seriously mistaken. This guy healthy is a top 5 OLB. Also without looking I would guess that he doesnt disappear for weeks at a time like mario. Im not saying this is a no brainer but its alot closer to 50/50 than some of you guys are acting.

Bubbajwp
01-15-2011, 07:35 AM
BTW Justin Tuck is probably the most complete DE in the league.

Lucky
01-15-2011, 09:07 AM
Would you trade Mario Williams for Elvis Dumervil straight up.

Um, no. There's not a team in the NFL that would give up Mario for Elvis. Not even Casserly would do this if he were to miraculously get another GM gig. Athletes like Mario are rare. Athletes like Elvis are much more common. Mario can do more than Elvis.

Regarding the switch to the 3-4, you're making a long term decision on what could be a short-lived schematic change. We don't know if the Kubiak-Phillips marriage will work. If not, and McNair comes to his senses and cans Kubiak, we don't know what defense the next head coach will employ. If the 3-4 defense doesn't work, we don't know that Kubiak doesn't get another chance at hiring a defensive coordinator, and who knows what defense he would bring.

In other words....:kubepalm:

Carr Bombed
01-15-2011, 12:11 PM
Um, no. There's not a team in the NFL that would give up Mario for Elvis. Not even Casserly would do this if he were to miraculously get another GM gig. Athletes like Mario are rare. Athletes like Elvis are much more common. Mario can do more than Elvis.

Regarding the switch to the 3-4, you're making a long term decision on what could be a short-lived schematic change. We don't know if the Kubiak-Phillips marriage will work. If not, and McNair comes to his senses and cans Kubiak, we don't know what defense the next head coach will employ. If the 3-4 defense doesn't work, we don't know that Kubiak doesn't get another chance at hiring a defensive coordinator, and who knows what defense he would bring.

In other words....:kubepalm:

Well this is all fine and dandy, but I fear if Kubiak fails next season Bob McNair is going to promote Wade to HC anyway.....so I think the 3-4 will be here to stay.

P.S.

Is it just me or is anyone else getting annoyed and burned out on all the :Fail: responses? LOL, just look at the above posts... Every counter opinion has to be meant with a FAIL emoticon, like people FAILED at something, because they have a different opinion. It's beyond played out now.

Lucky
01-15-2011, 04:17 PM
Is it just me or is anyone else getting annoyed and burned out on all the :Fail: responses?
If you think it's bad now, wait until the Texans struggle in 2011.

TEXANRED
01-15-2011, 04:44 PM
BTW Justin Tuck is probably the most complete DE in the league.

Justin Tuck would agree with you.

PHAROAH
01-17-2011, 12:03 AM
I would but they would have to throw in more than just Elvis due to Mario being able to play in any defense with his size & speed. I would take Elvis & 2nd round pick to do that deal.

badboy
01-19-2011, 01:08 PM
I am open to trading Mario (see my thread) but have to vote no. I would trade for the #2 pick. Draft Fairley or Peterson.