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dalemurphy
01-03-2011, 05:55 PM
I don't think the boards will like this too much, but I think it is almost surely one of two guys and I'm not sure where the smart money should go.

1. Wade Phillips
2. Greg Robinson

Here's our story with the reasoning and references to the Kubes' presser. Also, a number of other interesting tidbits from the presser:


Texans Bull Blog (http://www.texansbullblog.com/sleeper-prediction-texan-dc-greg-robinson/featured-articles/)

Wolf
01-03-2011, 05:57 PM
How about John Fox?

I can't remember how he was as a Giants coordinator

Double Barrel
01-03-2011, 05:59 PM
Man, I just get tingles thinking about all the exciting changes coming...to the Cleveland Browns, of course.

As far as potential Texans DCs...'eh, move along, nothing to see here, folks. :winky:

dalemurphy
01-03-2011, 05:59 PM
How about John Fox?

I can't remember how he was as a Giants coordinator

Yeah, I should add him to the list. I'm still researching names and connections between coaches. It just seems obvious to me that it is going to be one of these two guys. I would like Fox, though, and he fits some of the criteria: head coach experience, success as DC... I'll do some diligence on him now.

drewmar74
01-03-2011, 05:59 PM
2. Greg Robinson

I'm shocked. Someone else from Denver.....

Section516
01-03-2011, 05:59 PM
Wonder if Marvin Lewis if fired would have a chance, with his penchant for questionable character players..

MFG16
01-03-2011, 06:00 PM
I don't think the boards will like this too much, but I think it is almost surely one of two guys and I'm not sure where the smart money should go.

1. Wade Phillips
2. Greg Robinson

Here's our story with the reasoning and references to the Kubes' presser. Also, a number of other interesting tidbits from the presser:


Texans Bull Blog (http://www.texansbullblog.com/sleeper-prediction-texan-dc-greg-robinson/featured-articles/)

Was the DC for the Broncos from '95-'00. Im shocked! :kubepalm:

GP
01-03-2011, 06:03 PM
Man, I just get tingles thinking about all the exciting changes coming...to the Cleveland Browns, of course.

As far as potential Texans DCs...'eh, move along, nothing to see here, folks. :winky:

Cowher to the Browns. Bank on it.

Cold city, outdoor stadium, gritty fans, a history (he was there once)....

It's the perfect recipe.

Second Honeymoon
01-03-2011, 06:05 PM
Isn't Greg Robinson DC at Michigan and is about to get fired for being a crap DC?

That would be in line with the Texans though
Hiring failures from Denver or just about anywhere
This owner is a joke and I have said it forever

No more crap sandwich

Hervoyel
01-03-2011, 06:05 PM
Cowher to the Browns. Bank on it.

Cold city, outdoor stadium, gritty fans, a history (he was there once)....

It's the perfect recipe.

Bank on something else. He'll be beating the Texans asses in short order.

dalemurphy
01-03-2011, 06:07 PM
Was the DC for the Broncos from '95-'00. Im shocked! :kubepalm:

It's that connection, among others, that has me believing he is a possibility. I don't have any special knowledge that Kubiak is actually lobbying for the guy... just an educated guess based on his cryptic answers at the presser and his tendencies.

Errant Hothy
01-03-2011, 06:08 PM
Wonder if Marvin Lewis if fired would have a chance, with his penchant for questionable character players..

Lewis would be on of the few hires that would excite me (if he becomes available).

ChampionTexan
01-03-2011, 06:21 PM
Oh lord, if this guy gets in a room with McNair, he is so hired...

LINK (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_ydiZMflsnU)

But seriously, no. Wade - maybe, I guess, under the circumstances, but Robinson? No.

pappy
01-03-2011, 06:22 PM
Don't forget Eric Mangini A past kubiak fav. :smiliepalm:

thunderkyss
01-03-2011, 06:22 PM
How 'bout Mangini??

Wolf
01-03-2011, 06:25 PM
Kubiak just said,(surprise) yes, we will talk to Wade but they do have a few others but won't say until it is official

Maddict5
01-03-2011, 06:26 PM
i think i can garauntee it wont be greg robinson. kubiaks said it would be a highly respected DC. imo, its wade (90%) or otherwise maybe marvin lewis (unlikely imo)

Carr Bombed
01-03-2011, 06:27 PM
How 'bout Mangini??

http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb263/slimkid_buckeye/stewie-guy-puke.gif

Carr Bombed
01-03-2011, 06:28 PM
Don't forget Eric Mangini A past kubiak fav. :smiliepalm:

http://mirror.servut.us/kuvat/meinung/family_guy_puke.gif

Austrian
01-03-2011, 06:29 PM
I'd be intrigued by Marvin Lewis. I mean he coached the 2000 Ravens. I'd pull the trigger if he was available.

michaelm
01-03-2011, 06:33 PM
I just had a waking nightmare that they retained Kollar to promote him to DC.

alphajoker
01-03-2011, 06:40 PM
How about this for a dark horse...Monte Kiffin? I would love if he were on the list.

rmartin65
01-03-2011, 06:40 PM
I just had a waking nightmare that they retained Kollar to promote him to DC.

In-house hires rule!

Seriously though, it looks like the new DC will be Wade Phillips. Meh. I just cant get myself fired up either way.

Mr. White
01-03-2011, 06:55 PM
Don't forget Eric Mangini A past kubiak fav. :smiliepalm:

How 'bout Mangini??

Mangini's never been a DC.

Just been an offensive assistant and a DB coach.

Double Barrel
01-03-2011, 06:58 PM
Mangini's never been a DC.

Just been an offensive assistant and a DB coach.


Well, then, I think we have found our perfect candidate for a Texans DC! :thinking:

The1ApplePie
01-03-2011, 06:58 PM
Mangini's never been a DC.

Just been an offensive assistant and a DB coach.

He was the Pat's DC in 2005, and has a hot up-and-coming DC prospect.

At least, according to old-reliable wiki:kitten:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eric_Mangini#Assistant_coach

ChampionTexan
01-03-2011, 07:08 PM
He was the Pat's DC in 2005, and has a hot up-and-coming DC prospect.

At least, according to old-reliable wiki:kitten:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eric_Mangini#Assistant_coach

The article on ESPN about his hire as Jets HC said the same thing:

Despite his youth and relative inexperience, the organization hired Mangini as its coach Tuesday. The former Patriots defensive coordinator, who turns 35 on Thursday, becomes the youngest head coach in the league.

LINK (http://www.texanstalk.com/forums/newreply.php?do=newreply&p=1626876)

dalemurphy
01-03-2011, 07:15 PM
He was the Pat's DC in 2005, and has a hot up-and-coming DC prospect.

At least, according to old-reliable wiki:kitten:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eric_Mangini#Assistant_coach

I can not imagine Mangini as a Texan coach. I would be shocked!

drs23
01-03-2011, 07:18 PM
I can not imagine Mangini as a Texan coach. I would be shocked!

Have you not been shocked prior by moves made by this org.?

dalemurphy
01-03-2011, 07:18 PM
i think i can garauntee it wont be greg robinson. kubiaks said it would be a highly respected DC. imo, its wade (90%) or otherwise maybe marvin lewis (unlikely imo)

Robinson would qualify as a respected DC. I'm not saying that you respect him or that many fans wouldn't be disappointed, but he has a resume that can certainly be defended by the Texan brass. He has 2 Superbowl victories as a coordinator, for instance.

dalemurphy
01-03-2011, 07:19 PM
Have you not been shocked prior by moves made by this org.?

Not really. I've been surprised by some draft picks... but, I can't recall any big hirings/firings that have surprised me.

drs23
01-03-2011, 07:23 PM
Not really. I've been surprised by some draft picks... but, I can't recall any big hirings/firings that have surprised me.

Gottcha. I can respect that answer.

Kaiser Toro
01-03-2011, 07:32 PM
My short list:
Wade Phillips
Ron Meeks
Rob Ryan
Jerry Gray

Lucky
01-03-2011, 07:38 PM
The Texans List for Defensive Coordinator

1. Wade Phillips
2. No one else
3. That's it, just Wade
4. You know, the guy who was fired from the Cowboys
5. Bum Phillips' son
6. Are you still reading this? I told you it was Wade.

This is a farce. Just like there was zero chance Kubiak would be fired. Bush is the fall guy and Phillips is the placebo. That McNair puts on this charade is a slap in the face of every Texan fan. Just hire Wade and be done with it.

2slik4u
01-03-2011, 07:48 PM
Cowher to the Browns. Bank on it.

Cold city, outdoor stadium, gritty fans, a history (he was there once)....

It's the perfect recipe.

Dont forget the "Bettis" like work horse he would get in Hillis. Smash mouth, power running. Although I would be shocked if he went to another team within their conference.

2slik4u
01-03-2011, 07:51 PM
Robinson would qualify as a respected DC. I'm not saying that you respect him or that many fans wouldn't be disappointed, but he has a resume that can certainly be defended by the Texan brass. He has 2 Superbowl victories as a coordinator, for instance.

I see the future DC to be the eventual successor to Kubiak unfortunately. I would rather take a chance with Robinson than Phillips.

I loathe Phillips as a HC.

2slik4u
01-03-2011, 07:52 PM
I would take Singletary as our LB coach and Mangini as our DB coach. Throw in a little John Fox/Phillips/Lewis (one of the three) to head the def staff and we may have something here.......

GP
01-03-2011, 09:06 PM
My short list:
Wade Phillips
Ron Meeks
Rob Ryan
Jerry Gray

My short list:

Danny Devito
Martin Short
Hobbits
McNair's testicles

GP
01-03-2011, 09:08 PM
I would take Singletary as our LB coach and Mangini as our DB coach. Throw in a little John Fox/Phillips/Lewis (one of the three) to head the def staff and we may have something here.......

LOL.

Yeah, all of them can have a Battle Royale, WWF style, to determine who gets to be HC of the Texans when Kubiak is canned next year.

My money is on Mangini, via a "foreign object" hidden in his wrestling tights. BLAM! a roll of nickels right to the forehead of Singletary, and the ref (Hochuli, of course) never saw it and lifts Mangini's hand as the victor.

Wrestling is for real.

Texan4Ever
01-03-2011, 09:46 PM
If by Greg Robinson you mean the current (and soon to be fired) DC of the Michigan football team then I would much rather have Wade than that teddy-bear carrying fool!

:smiliepalm:

Thorn
01-03-2011, 09:52 PM
Here's a couple out of work candidates we should consider for helping with our defense.

http://laughingsquid.com/wp-content/uploads/alien-vs-predator-chess-20090426-124300.jpg

TexansFanatic
01-03-2011, 09:52 PM
The Texans List for Defensive Coordinator

1. Wade Phillips
2. No one else
3. That's it, just Wade
4. You know, the guy who was fired from the Cowboys
5. Bum Phillips' son
6. Are you still reading this? I told you it was Wade.

This is a farce. Just like there was zero chance Kubiak would be fired. Bush is the fall guy and Phillips is the placebo. That McNair puts on this charade is a slap in the face of every Texan fan. Just hire Wade and be done with it.


Nailed it.

I don't mind McNair doing what he wants with his team.

I do mind being treated like I'm an *****.

For God's sake, Bob, just make the moves we all know you're going to make and stop the ridiculous charade.

Corrosion
01-03-2011, 09:59 PM
Mangini's never been a DC.

Just been an offensive assistant and a DB coach.

Well, then, I think we have found our perfect candidate for a Texans DC! :thinking:



McNair stated in no uncertain terms that he wants a DC who is experienced , not someone who has never called the shots before.

michaelm
01-03-2011, 10:05 PM
McNair stated in no uncertain terms that he wants a DC who is experienced , not someone who has never called the shots before.

I wonder what will happen if none of the experienced DCs want the Texans....

I'm trying to be optimistic here, and the best ray of sunshine I can find is that it appears to me that Bob has told Kubiak to find a DC capable of completely controlling the defense from personnel to play calling, and GTFO of the defensive kitchen.
At least that's my take.

STEEL BLUE TEXANS
01-03-2011, 10:09 PM
We are completely screwed if Wade decides to take a job elsewhere. What established DC is going to come to Houston knowing it could be, and very likely will be, a 1 year gig.

GP
01-03-2011, 10:10 PM
Coming to a theatre near you, in 2011....

http://i159.photobucket.com/albums/t128/gpshafer_1976/wary.jpg

SAMURAITEXAN
01-03-2011, 10:11 PM
Isn't Wade set yet? Hope, we can hire DC ASAP in order to proceed with other D side coaches hiring and be ready for coming draft and FA.

Ooops! This will be my 1000th post.

DexmanC
01-03-2011, 10:13 PM
Get Marvin Lewis in here. The man can coach a defense, and he's
a natural leader. We don't have any of those at Reliant.

Pantherstang84
01-03-2011, 10:14 PM
Oh lord, if this guy gets in a room with McNair, he is so hired...

LINK (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_ydiZMflsnU)

But seriously, no. Wade - maybe, I guess, under the circumstances, but Robinson? No.

Oh this guy will fit right in. When is the official announcement? :mariopalm:

Wolf
01-03-2011, 10:16 PM
Kubiak said" yes,we are talking to wade and it will be a short talk. We are going to talk to a couple of more coaches but I won't make it known until it is official"

Just the standard talk

Wolf
01-03-2011, 10:17 PM
Get Marvin Lewis in here. The man can coach a defense, and he's
a natural leader. We don't have any of those at Reliant.

And he knows a thing or two about linebackers ..

Doesn't he run a 3-4 also?

Lucky
01-03-2011, 10:22 PM
...Bob has told Kubiak to find a DC capable of completely controlling the defense from personnel to play calling, and GTFO of the defensive kitchen.
At least that's my take.
Why do you think Coach Teflon has been near the defense? He runs away from any responsibility for the defense when it's time to pay the piper. Coach Teflon is the Head Coach of the Houston Texans offense.

The defense and special teams? That's not on him.

TEXANRED
01-03-2011, 10:24 PM
Guess I am the only one excited about all this.

Kubiak has nailed down the offensive side of the ball and Phillips will nail down the defensive side of the ball.

And the best part? Both are Houstonians. Both were here during the Luv Ya days and knows how important football is to this town.

Pantherstang84
01-03-2011, 10:25 PM
Guess I am the only one excited about all this.

Kubiak has nailed down the offensive side of the ball and Phillips will nail down the defensive side of the ball.

And the best part? Both are Houstonians. Both were here during the Luv Ya days and knows how important football is to this town.

I think you are.

DexmanC
01-03-2011, 10:30 PM
And he knows a thing or two about linebackers (Marvin Lewis) ..

Doesn't he run a 3-4 also?

I know his Ravens had the most ferocious 4-3 I'd ever seen in a Superbowl.

Lucky
01-03-2011, 10:31 PM
And the best part? Both are Houstonians.
I love Houston and I'm proud of the accomplishments of its natives. There's no doubt that Kubiak and Phillips would love to win here.

But, that's not the point. Who is the best man for the job? I don't care if the guy is from New York or New Caney. There's no way in hell or Dallas you can convince me after watching his team for 5 years that Gary Kubiak is the best man for the job.

Koolaid Time
01-03-2011, 10:31 PM
Wade: But Gary, can't we at least TRY a 3-4 next year? You know things couldn't get any worse.

Gary: Practice saying this Wade.... "It's all on me" "It's all on me"

Wolf
01-03-2011, 10:31 PM
Guess I am the only one excited about all this.

Kubiak has nailed down the offensive side of the ball and Phillips will nail down the defensive side of the ball.

And the best part? Both are Houstonians. Both were here during the Luv Ya days and knows how important football is to this town.

I have seen a couple of people happy and a few that are ok with it.

I am ok with it as long as they get a good DC.

Besides. It is water under the bridge and I am not going to waste too much energy on it unless we start losing again

Wolf
01-03-2011, 10:33 PM
I know his Ravens had the most ferocious 4-3 I'd ever seen in a Superbowl.

Gotcha, for some reason, I was thinking the ravens had. 3-4 :mariopalm:

Pantherstang84
01-03-2011, 10:34 PM
I love Houston and I'm proud of the accomplishments of its natives. There's no doubt that Kubiak and Phillips would love to win here.

But, that's not the point. Who is the best man for the job? I don't care if the guy is from New York or New Caney. There's no way in hell or Dallas you can convince me after watching his team for 5 years that Gary Kubiak is the best man for the job.

Aren't they the same place?

michaelm
01-03-2011, 10:35 PM
Why do you think Coach Teflon has been near the defense? He runs away from any responsibility for the defense when it's time to pay the piper. Coach Teflon is the Head Coach of the Houston Texans offense.

The defense and special teams? That's not on him.

I'm pretty sure Gary is largely responsible for most of the major decisions regarding personnel, both offensively and defensively. I'm hopeful that we end up with a DC who is basically a co-head coach, in charge of the defense, and who will control defensive personnel decisions.
Smithiak has shown to be clueless on that side of the ball.

dalemurphy
01-03-2011, 10:37 PM
I have now convinced myself that Greg Robinson is Kubiak's 1st choice and that it is a matter of him convincing Rick and Bob to jump on board. I did some more research on Robinson, looking at his NFL career. Guess who was the defensive coordinator of the Broncos during the first 6 years of Kubiak's tenure there? Oh, and both of them started in '95 as guys with relatively little experience... then, of course, they celebrated two Superbowl championships together.... yeah, I think this could happen. Here's some statistics and info on Robinson that I compiled:

http://www.texansbullblog.com/analysis-greg-robinsons-defensive-coordinating-career-nfl-argument-dc/featured-articles/

TEXANRED
01-03-2011, 10:39 PM
I'm pretty sure Gary is largely responsible for most of the major decisions regarding personnel, both offensively and defensively. I'm hopeful that we end up with a DC who is basically a co-head coach, in charge of the defense, and who will control defensive personnel decisions.
Smithiak has shown to be clueless on that side of the ball.

It worked for Ditka.

DX-TEX
01-03-2011, 10:41 PM
http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/sports/7364384.html

Wade Phillips is interested in becoming the Texans' new defensive coordinator.

After he fired defensive coordinator Frank Bush on Monday, coach Gary Kubiak said Phillips was a candidate to replace him. Kubiak said he planned to interview Phillips.

Owner Bob McNair also praised Phillips.

"Yes, I am interested," Phillips said Monday night. "I know the owner and coach. I like them, and they're guys I'd like to work for."

Kubiak plans to interview Phillips.

"I will be talking to people (candidates) as soon as I can," Kubiak said. "I've known Wade a long time. I've competed against him. I have a lot of respect for him. I think it's safe to say that Wade will be a candidate."

McNair also is a fan of Phillips.

“I think Wade’s a terrific coach," McNair said. "We'll have to sit down and visit with him."

Kubiak also fired linebackers coach Johnny Holland, assistant linebackers coach Robert Saleh and defensive backs coach David Gibbs.

Kubiak said the new defensive coordinator will have input in the hiring of assistants and personnel on that side of the ball.

If Phillips gets the job, he'd be returning to Houston. He played and coached at the the University of Houston. He also coached the Oilers' defensive line under his father, Bum Phillips, before they were fired after the 1980 season.

"Coming home to Houston would be an added bonus," Phillips said. "I've got family, friends and classmates there."

Phillips prefers a 3-4 defense. Kubiak said he would have no problem with a switch in systems if the new defensive coordinator thought it was best for the team.

john.mcclain@chron.com



:mariopalm:


LMFAO!!!!! Its all part of the plan!

Pollardized
01-03-2011, 10:41 PM
Phillips interested in Texans job

http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/sports/7364384.html

The1ApplePie
01-03-2011, 10:46 PM
I'd take the Mangeinus over Wade.

He has never been a great head coach, but he can make chicken salad out of chicken shit

Goatcheese
01-04-2011, 08:15 AM
My top choice is John Fox.

http://whodatdish.com/files/2010/07/John-Fox.jpg

In Carolina
Top 10 Passing yards per attempt defense 6 times
Top 10 defense 5 times
Top 10 passing defense 5 times
Top 10 fumble recovery 5 times
Top 10 total takeaways 4 times
Top 10 scoring defense 4 times
Top 10 rushing yards per attempt defense 4 times
Top 10 INTs defense 3 times
Top 10 rushing defense 2 times
Never ran a defense ranked worse than 20th
Didn't have a defense ranked worse than 15th in scoring until 2010

otisbean
01-04-2011, 08:27 AM
Lewis: would be awesome, and you would definitely have a coach that could step in if Kubiak faltered in '11

Monte Kiffin: would also be awesome but I think age may be an issue

Phillips: Has had good success as a DC, HC - not so much

Mike Zimmer: if Lewis isn't retained he may be available

J. Fox: Would be a great choice, again someone that could step in if needed if we falter early in '11

Rob Ryan: if he isn't retained in Cleveland

There are definitely some good DCs that are or could be available.

El Tejano
01-04-2011, 09:08 AM
And he knows a thing or two about linebackers ..

Doesn't he run a 3-4 also?

I always thought he ran a 4-6 defense.

El Tejano
01-04-2011, 09:21 AM
I think there are some interesting candidates out there to say the least.

Marvin Lewis, Mike Zimmer, John Fox, Rob Ryan, Wade Phillips.

If I were making a decision, I know that tenure would kind of be out the window. So the next thing I would go with is, who does this DC already have on board as far as position coaches - guys that are ready to sign today. Then I would see who has the greatest potential to bring in key Free Agents from other teams they coached for and who are those players.

Who do you think would come with those above named coaches?

HuttoKarl
01-04-2011, 09:24 AM
My short list:

Danny Devito
Martin Short
Hobbits
McNair's testicles

Must spread rep before giving it to GP again.

HuttoKarl
01-04-2011, 09:26 AM
Phillips interested in Texans job

http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/sports/7364384.html

SHOCKING!!!

:mcnugget:

phantom17
01-04-2011, 09:35 AM
Give me John Fox! No more friends, or a friend of a friend!

dalemurphy
01-04-2011, 10:38 AM
Give me John Fox! No more friends, or a friend of a friend!

To summarize: at least 3 degrees of separation from Bill Walsh and Kevin Bacon... good luck with that!

thunderkyss
01-04-2011, 10:46 AM
I think there are some interesting candidates out there to say the least.

Marvin Lewis, Mike Zimmer, John Fox, Rob Ryan, Wade Phillips.

If I were making a decision, I know that tenure would kind of be out the window. So the next thing I would go with is, who does this DC already have on board as far as position coaches - guys that are ready to sign today. Then I would see who has the greatest potential to bring in key Free Agents from other teams they coached for and who are those players.

Who do you think would come with those above named coaches?

I like the way you think.

HOU-TEX
01-04-2011, 11:07 AM
My personal preference would be Marvin Lewis...but what the hell do I know.

HuttoKarl
01-04-2011, 11:10 AM
My personal preference would be Marvin Lewis...but what the hell do I know.

It's being reported that he'll probably return to Cincy.

Texas T
01-04-2011, 01:24 PM
Guess I am the only one excited about all this.

Kubiak has nailed down the offensive side of the ball and Phillips will nail down the defensive side of the ball.

And the best part? Both are Houstonians. Both were here during the Luv Ya days and knows how important football is to this town.

I don't know about excited...I'm in the okay with this group.
I figured that Kubs was staying-this team is in better shape than when he took over...not great but definately better.
If Phillips comes in, takes control of hiring coaches and picking players, and has full control of the D-we will be better.
I think Kubs will no longer have much control over the D, and this will be good.

Solely my opinion of course. We'll all see how it goes next year!

nero THE zero
01-04-2011, 01:48 PM
The Texans List for Defensive Coordinator

1. Wade Phillips
2. No one else
3. That's it, just Wade
4. You know, the guy who was fired from the Cowboys
5. Bum Phillips' son
6. Are you still reading this? I told you it was Wade.

This is a farce. Just like there was zero chance Kubiak would be fired. Bush is the fall guy and Phillips is the placebo. That McNair puts on this charade is a slap in the face of every Texan fan. Just hire Wade and be done with it.
Yep. And, not only will we be getting Phillips, I think we'll be getting Phillips running a 4-3 instead of his customary and successful 3-4.

I know the word right now is that Kubiak will allow him to run whatever system he wants. But, if you listened to Kubiak on 610 on Monday, I'm sure you got the same impression that I did; that he will do whatever he can to influence Phillips to run the 4-3.

When asked about the scheme of Bush's succesor, he stated that he would hire the best coach regardless of scheme. Then, when asked subsequent questions regarding the potential for a 3-4, he repeated that asnwer and followed it with a caveat about his preference for the 4-3. For example, when talking about Phillips, he made sure to note that he does have experience in a 4-3. He also mentioned that this is a "4-3 division" and that is what our offense is used to practicing against. Whatever that means.

So, not only do I expect Phillips to come in here, I expect him to come in here and continue with our 4-3.

Thorn
01-04-2011, 01:54 PM
So, not only do I expect Phillips to come in here, I expect him to come in here and continue with our 4-3.

Unless you have a legitimate NT, which we don't, you shouldn't be lining up in a 3-4 much anyway. I'm sure if the Texans can get a decent NT Wade will want to run a lot of 3-4 formations, which I'm sure will probably be allowed. Wade will have more leeway that Bush did.

Dutchrudder
01-04-2011, 02:00 PM
FYI, Marvin Lewis (HC of the Bengals) has not been fired nor retained. His status is still in limbo.

TexansBull
01-04-2011, 02:38 PM
My top choice is John Fox.

http://whodatdish.com/files/2010/07/John-Fox.jpg

In Carolina
Top 10 Passing yards per attempt defense 6 times
Top 10 defense 5 times
Top 10 passing defense 5 times
Top 10 fumble recovery 5 times
Top 10 total takeaways 4 times
Top 10 scoring defense 4 times
Top 10 rushing yards per attempt defense 4 times
Top 10 INTs defense 3 times
Top 10 rushing defense 2 times
Never ran a defense ranked worse than 20th
Didn't have a defense ranked worse than 15th in scoring until 2010

This.

I don't know why he isn't on more lists, and it will be stupid to only interview wade and not him or lewis. Plus, Fox is someone who could take over for gary if he is fired? Who would you have take over - fox or wade? Fox may be inconsistent in his year to year performance records, but that guy has atleast turned a bad team to a superbowl contender...another victim of belicheat. Also, doesn't he run a 4-3? Doesn't Lewis too? Not as much change then even though we still need a NT, corner, safety, and LB.

GP
01-04-2011, 02:45 PM
OK, so here's a new theory I have to propose:

WHAT IF.......

Bum and Wade got wind of the Texans' plans to fire the defensive staff and go looking for new d-coord, etc.?

AND...what if they heard that Wade wasn't on the short list to begin with.

AND....what if this bit of gossip made Bum go meet with McNair and pull the "I'm a legend and you need to listen to me" card?

It very well might be that Wade Phillips is no more the shoe-in candidate than we think he is. If Kubiak is sweating bullets, and he's got an owner and a GM breathing down his neck, it might be Gary's time to move on from the Hire-A-Friend system and go to someone like John Fox.

And what's going to happen is that McNair will have laid all responsibility for the d-coord hire at Kubiak's feet. Which means that Bum can pout and be angry at KUBIAK for not hiring Wade. This absolves McNair of guilt, and he can say that he went and hired the best person that Kubiak had on the list.

In essence, Kubiak survived the cut...but he's now going to pay a whole 'nuther price than the price of gettig fired. He's going to be scape-goated, somehow, and at sometime, by this franchise. It's just that he got a one-year stay of "execution." :caperspalm:

GP
01-04-2011, 02:51 PM
Then again. it makes you wonder this:

Why in the world would McNair--just days from the final reg season game--allow a meeting with Bum Phillips in the first place?

Wouldn't McNair have stiff-armed Bum and said "Look, I can't entertain you at this time...I would love to, you know that...but it would not be fair to anybody to see us together and sharing a few laughs here."

It seems entirely incongruent with McNair's stance of "Making sure this team has the best character and image in all of the NFL" (paraphrased).

Bob McNair met with the father (a Houston football icon) of the out-of-work son (who would easily appear to be a short-list candidate) just days before the final game of the reg season? That's not, in my book, a really "professional" thing to do. The timing of it, and the circumstances surrounding it, do not exude class and character to me.

365 days to sit down and talk. Pick another day, and preferably one after Sunday January 2nd, 2011. It's the most honorable thing to do. If you're into "honor" and stuff. Oh well.

J_R
01-04-2011, 02:52 PM
AdamSchefter (http://twitter.com/AdamSchefter)
1/2 On a day when a person in the meetings said Bengals HC Marvin Lewis would return to Cincinnati, talks later broke off. Lewis left the Bengals complex when the two sides could not agree on franchise's direction and his future there is in serious jeopardy.

GP
01-04-2011, 02:54 PM
AdamSchefter (http://twitter.com/AdamSchefter)
1/2 On a day when a person in the meetings said Bengals HC Marvin Lewis would return to Cincinnati, talks later broke off. Lewis left the Bengals complex when the two sides could not agree on franchise's direction and his future there is in serious jeopardy.

Sounds like Lewis wanted Frank Bush and ownership told him "No."

It's so hard to get the guy you want, isn't it?

HuttoKarl
01-04-2011, 02:56 PM
Sounds like Lewis wanted Frank Bush and ownership told him "No."

It's so hard to get the guy you want, isn't it?

He probably asked the skinflint owner to pay for a legit scouting staff.

J_R
01-04-2011, 03:02 PM
Haha

Many throw out the name John Fox for obvious reasons, and not to promote Jerome Solomon and his (usually bad) work but he threw out Fox's DC of one time --Mike Trgovac -- who is currently the Packers D-line coach.

You can go read the article (http://blogs.chron.com/jeromesolomon/2011/01/is_wade_phillips_the_guy_1.html) if you wish.

nero THE zero
01-04-2011, 03:05 PM
Unless you have a legitimate NT, which we don't, you shouldn't be lining up in a 3-4 much anyway. I'm sure if the Texans can get a decent NT Wade will want to run a lot of 3-4 formations, which I'm sure will probably be allowed. Wade will have more leeway that Bush did.

I don't know what you mean by "legitimate NT," but if you mean "extremely large NT" note that Phillips' NT is DAL was only 300 lbs.

Regarding John Fox, he's a legitimate HC candidate. Doubt he'd settle for a DC position this offseason.

Texan_Bill
01-04-2011, 03:10 PM
Unless you have a legitimate NT, which we don't, you shouldn't be lining up in a 3-4 much anyway. I'm sure if the Texans can get a decent NT Wade will want to run a lot of 3-4 formations, which I'm sure will probably be allowed. Wade will have more leeway that Bush did.

Just a big space eating FAT guy.

infantrycak
01-04-2011, 03:11 PM
I don't know what you mean by "legitimate NT," but if you mean "extremely large NT" note that Phillips' NT is DAL was only 300 lbs.

I posted in another thread - of the top 5 3-4 D's only one had a 325+lb NT.

michaelm
01-04-2011, 03:21 PM
.



He also mentioned that this is a "4-3 division" and that is what our offense is used to practicing against. Whatever that means.



That may be true, but it works two ways. If we are in a 4-3 division, then the other teams aren't used to practicing against a 3-4.
And them we got 'em exactly where we want 'em. (not really sure what that last part even means, but it was amusing to me, so it stays in the post)

Thorn
01-04-2011, 03:28 PM
That may be true, but it works two ways. If we are in a 4-3 division, then the other teams aren't used to practicing against a 3-4.
And them we got 'em exactly where we want 'em. (not really sure what that last part even means, but it was amusing to me, so it stays in the post)

A team doesn't have to be one or the other all the time, there were times last season where the defense lined up in a 3-4. If Wade comes in, in all likely hood all that means right away is a probable higher number of times they line up in a 3-4. But that's just speculation anyway until it's official who our new DC is.

Dutchrudder
01-04-2011, 03:34 PM
I don't know what you mean by "legitimate NT," but if you mean "extremely large NT" note that Phillips' NT is DAL was only 300 lbs.

Regarding John Fox, he's a legitimate HC candidate. Doubt he'd settle for a DC position this offseason.

Yep, Jay Ratliff is 6-4 303 pounds.

For comparison, the size of some other good DTs around the league per ESPN:

3-4 NTs:

Haoli Ngata - 6-4 350

Vince Wilfork - 6-2 325

BJ Raji - 6-2 337 - Packers

Casey Hampton - 6-1 325 - Steelers

Sione Pouha - 6-3 325 - Jets

4-3 DTs:

Ndamukong Suh - 6-4 307

Kevin Williams - 6-5 311

Pat Williams - 6-3 317

Chris Canty - 6-7 304 - Giants

Barry Cofield - 6-4 306 - Giants

Jonathan Babineaux - 6-2 296 - Falcons

Darnell Dockett - 6-4 290 (I think Arizona is a 4-3, but when they do a 3-4 formation he plays DE)


And our guys:

Okoye - 6-2 315

Cody - 6-4 310


I don't think size is everything, but >300 pounds and you're probably not getting what's needed for a 3-4 DT.

gary
01-04-2011, 03:57 PM
I hope they inter a few guys in the field.

ChampionTexan
01-04-2011, 04:03 PM
Yep, Jay Ratliff is 6-4 303 pounds.

For comparison, the size of some other good DTs around the league per ESPN:

3-4 NTs:

Haoli Ngata - 6-4 350

Vince Wilfork - 6-2 325

BJ Raji - 6-2 337 - Packers

Casey Hampton - 6-1 325 - Steelers

Sione Pouha - 6-3 325 - Jets

4-3 DTs:

Ndamukong Suh - 6-4 307

Kevin Williams - 6-5 311

Pat Williams - 6-3 317

Chris Canty - 6-7 304 - Giants

Barry Cofield - 6-4 306 - Giants

Jonathan Babineaux - 6-2 296 - Falcons

Darnell Dockett - 6-4 290 (I think Arizona is a 4-3, but when they do a 3-4 formation he plays DE)


And our guys:

Okoye - 6-2 315

Cody - 6-4 310


I don't think size is everything, but >300 pounds and you're probably not getting what's needed for a 3-4 DT.

Kelly Gregg (320 lbs) is the Ravens NT. Ngata is a DE.

Dutchrudder
01-04-2011, 04:08 PM
Kelly Gregg (320 lbs) is the Ravens NT. Ngata is a DE.

Odd, he is on the pro-bowl roster as an 'interior linemen' along with Wilfork and Richard Seymour, but Wilfork and Ngata are listed as 'DE' and Seymour is listed as 'DT'...

J_R
01-04-2011, 04:08 PM
Amobi closer to 280-285(283 to be precise)

gary
01-04-2011, 04:08 PM
I get the feeling that Phillips is the first and only one on the list and Kubiak knows it. I hope I am wrong though.

Section516
01-04-2011, 04:11 PM
Leiws back as Bengals HC.

charterTexanfan
01-04-2011, 05:15 PM
how about Bill Cowher as DC. He'll know going in he'll probably have the HC job by the 5th game.

dalemurphy
01-04-2011, 05:20 PM
how about Bill Cowher as DC. He'll know going in he'll probably have the HC job by the 5th game.

according to Pat Kirwin (who's pretty tight with Cowher), he thinks Cowher wants to wait one more year. Also, it is pretty clear that they have already settled on Wade. There is an interview of Bob McNair, from today, at houstontexans.com, that makes it fairly obvious they have settled on him...

http://www.houstontexans.com/tv-media/videos/McNair-discusses-changes-future/d8788e78-ec94-4467-97ab-61aa9b3a9e69

DonnyMost
01-04-2011, 05:27 PM
Well, one good thing about Wade is that if we well next year, Cowboys fans' heads will explode.

HoustonFrog
01-04-2011, 05:42 PM
Well, one good thing about Wade is that if we well next year, Cowboys fans' heads will explode.

Not really. The guy is a good D Coordinator. He is not a good HC overall. The Cowboy D was fine until players quit on him this year. Alot of "talent" regressed too. I will be interested to see how he does. He isn't inspiring, I'll tell you that much.

DonnyMost
01-04-2011, 05:46 PM
Not really. The guy is a good D Coordinator. He is not a good HC overall. The Cowboy D was fin until players quit on him this year. Alot of "talent" regressed too. I will be interested to see how he does. He isn't inspiring, I'll tell you that much.

So if Gary Kubiak went to Dallas and took them to the playoffs, people here wouldn't be flipping their collective s**t?

Kinda doubt it.

Wade taking the Texans further than the Cowboys would make a lot of blood pressures rise in Dallas.

Double Barrel
01-04-2011, 06:03 PM
Well, one good thing about Wade is that if we well next year, Cowboys fans' heads will explode.

I'd say that 95% of the Cowboys fans that I know and have met root for the Texans as their second team.

They do not have the hate in their hearts for our team the way that many Houstonians have for their team. Of course, most of the hate comes from envy and jealousy if people are honest about it, and the Texans have absolutely nothing to envy or be jealous about at the end of the day.

thunderkyss
01-04-2011, 10:03 PM
Yep. And, not only will we be getting Phillips, I think we'll be getting Phillips running a 4-3 instead of his customary and successful 3-4.

I know the word right now is that Kubiak will allow him to run whatever system he wants. But, if you listened to Kubiak on 610 on Monday, I'm sure you got the same impression that I did; that he will do whatever he can to influence Phillips to run the 4-3.

When asked about the scheme of Bush's succesor, he stated that he would hire the best coach regardless of scheme. Then, when asked subsequent questions regarding the potential for a 3-4, he repeated that asnwer and followed it with a caveat about his preference for the 4-3. For example, when talking about Phillips, he made sure to note that he does have experience in a 4-3. He also mentioned that this is a "4-3 division" and that is what our offense is used to practicing against. Whatever that means.

So, not only do I expect Phillips to come in here, I expect him to come in here and continue with our 4-3.

Frank Bush had us in several 3-4 fronts. Kubiak likes Mario's ability to play with a hand down, or standing up.... & I really don't see why Gary should care.

I don't see how Wade or anyone, if Wade gets a HC job somewhere, looking at our team can think we've got what it takes to run a 3-4.

Sure, they'll have FA & the draft to get the right people in here, but if we get Wade running a 4-3 & we still suck.... I don't even want to think about it.

thunderkyss
01-04-2011, 10:06 PM
Unless you have a legitimate NT, which we don't, you shouldn't be lining up in a 3-4 much anyway. I'm sure if the Texans can get a decent NT Wade will want to run a lot of 3-4 formations, which I'm sure will probably be allowed. Wade will have more leeway that Bush did.

I wonder if Wade can get Amobi to play like Jay Ratliff

thunderkyss
01-04-2011, 10:10 PM
OK, so here's a new theory I have to propose:

WHAT IF.......

Bum and Wade got wind of the Texans' plans to fire the defensive staff and go looking for new d-coord, etc.?

AND...what if they heard that Wade wasn't on the short list to begin with.

AND....what if this bit of gossip made Bum go meet with McNair and pull the "I'm a legend and you need to listen to me" card?


AND what if Kubiak hires Fischer??

dalemurphy
01-04-2011, 10:18 PM
I wonder if Wade can get Amobi to play like Jay Ratliff


Sure, it's as likely as Kubiak getting David Carr to play like John Elway. Wait... we tried that one already didn't we?

DerekLee1
01-04-2011, 10:45 PM
according to Pat Kirwin (who's pretty tight with Cowher), he thinks Cowher wants to wait one more year.

THIS would be awesome. I could live with Kubiak/Phillips for a year, knowing that Cowher was still out there. If WARY gets it done, great. Everyone shuts up. If not, Cowher's still out there after Kubiak gets fired.

HoustonFrog
01-05-2011, 11:46 AM
So if Gary Kubiak went to Dallas and took them to the playoffs, people here wouldn't be flipping their collective s**t?

Kinda doubt it.

Wade taking the Texans further than the Cowboys would make a lot of blood pressures rise in Dallas.

No, it won't. Gary is a head coach. Wade WAS a head coach. People would flip here if Gary did it as head coach, not a coordinator, where he is better suited. And people here hate Dallas, not vice versa. Wade's team completely quit on him. The players admit it. It isn't like they got rid of their D coordinator to come here. Wade is known as a better D Coordinator. Wade wouldn't be taking the Texans to the playoffs. He would be doing what he does better than HC. Everyone acknowledges he is a better D Coordinator than HC, even in Dallas. The fact is though he had players quit and after 3 years his defense didn't work and the players went backwards. Most people in Dallas don't care about the Texans and probably wish Wade well. Glad he is gone but wish him well.

ChampionTexan
01-05-2011, 11:59 AM
So if Gary Kubiak went to Dallas and took them to the playoffs, people here wouldn't be flipping their collective s**t?

Kinda doubt it.

Wade taking the Texans further than the Cowboys would make a lot of blood pressures rise in Dallas.

No, it won't. Gary is a head coach. Wade WAS a head coach. People would flip here if Gary did it as head coach, not a coordinator, where he is better suited. And people here hate Dallas, not vice versa. Wade's team completely quit on him. The players admit it. It isn't like they got rid of their D coordinator to come here. Wade is known as a better D Coordinator. Wade wouldn't be taking the Texans to the playoffs. He would be doing what he does better than HC. Everyone acknowledges he is a better D Coordinator than HC, even in Dallas. The fact is though he had players quit and after 3 years his defense didn't work and the players went backwards. Most people in Dallas don't care about the Texans and probably wish Wade well. Glad he is gone but wish him well.

Yep - hard evidence is the complete lack of complaining about, or even acknowledging the fact that Dom Capers headed up a defense in Green Bay that has gone to the playoffs both years he's been there, and finished 7th in points allowed last year, and 2nd in points allowed this year.

Unless we feel like they screwed us by leaving (Capers clearly didn't, nor would Kubes be perceived as doing so (To put it mildly)), I believe that vast majority of folks would either wish them well, or be 100% apathetic about their future success.

TheCD
01-05-2011, 12:05 PM
THIS would be awesome. I could live with Kubiak/Phillips for a year, knowing that Cowher was still out there. If WARY gets it done, great. Everyone shuts up. If not, Cowher's still out there after Kubiak gets fired.

At that point I would also be excited but extremely nervous. Hasn't it been 4/5 years since Cowher has coached in the NFL? I know Vermeil had a lot of success taking time off, but that much time would make me nervous as to whether he was still the same coach.

nero THE zero
01-05-2011, 12:06 PM
THIS would be awesome. I could live with Kubiak/Phillips for a year, knowing that Cowher was still out there. If WARY gets it done, great. Everyone shuts up. If not, Cowher's still out there after Kubiak gets fired.

What gives you any confidence that this would happen, even if Kubiak fails in '11?

Not only has McNair stuck with Kubiak through 5 years of no results, he's prompted Kubiak to hire a local guy with substantial HC experience as one of his assistants.

Cowher's a pipe dream.

El Tejano
01-05-2011, 12:10 PM
THIS would be awesome. I could live with Kubiak/Phillips for a year, knowing that Cowher was still out there. If WARY gets it done, great. Everyone shuts up. If not, Cowher's still out there after Kubiak gets fired.

And he would have a coach already on board that runs the 3-4 D.

El Tejano
01-05-2011, 12:12 PM
I'd say that 95% of the Cowboys fans that I know and have met root for the Texans as their second team.

They do not have the hate in their hearts for our team the way that many Houstonians have for their team. Of course, most of the hate comes from envy and jealousy if people are honest about it, and the Texans have absolutely nothing to envy or be jealous about at the end of the day.

That's only because we aren't taking their precious limelight right now. Trust me, there was a time when the Oilers were the only winning team in Texas and Dallas fans hated us.

infantrycak
01-05-2011, 12:37 PM
What gives you any confidence that this would happen, even if Kubiak fails in '11?

Not only has McNair stuck with Kubiak through 5 years of no results, he's prompted Kubiak to hire a local guy with substantial HC experience as one of his assistants.

This local guy stuff is so inappropriate in this case. Wade is undeniably one of the top 3 DC's available this off-season regardless of where he is from.

That's only because we aren't taking their precious limelight right now. Trust me, there was a time when the Oilers were the only winning team in Texas and Dallas fans hated us.

What time period was that? If you are talking the Landry to Johnson transition you are way off base as Dallas fans were concentrated on new ownership, new coaching, the controversy and rebuilding. Houston was the last thing on Dallas fans' minds at the time.

GP
01-05-2011, 12:53 PM
No, it won't. Gary is a head coach. Wade WAS a head coach. People would flip here if Gary did it as head coach, not a coordinator, where he is better suited. And people here hate Dallas, not vice versa. Wade's team completely quit on him. The players admit it. It isn't like they got rid of their D coordinator to come here. Wade is known as a better D Coordinator. Wade wouldn't be taking the Texans to the playoffs. He would be doing what he does better than HC. Everyone acknowledges he is a better D Coordinator than HC, even in Dallas. The fact is though he had players quit and after 3 years his defense didn't work and the players went backwards. Most people in Dallas don't care about the Texans and probably wish Wade well. Glad he is gone but wish him well.

What's interesting, to me, is that Wade is a defensive coach. His Dallas team, unless I am wrong here, wasn't exactly a great defense while he was there. I haven't scanned any stats that posters might have put up here, though, so I can't say for sure. It just SEEMS that the thing Wade does best (defense) wasn't done well in Dallas. Which begs the question:

If Kubiak's thang (offense) was done well here, why couldn't Wade produce better results in Dallas with his defense? You'd think that you play to your strengths as a HC...the thing you are strong at, in this case Wade is a defense guy, wasn't exactly phenomenal in Dallas. Why? I thought Dallas had pretty much built a 3-4 defense there. They tore us a new one, that's for sure.

I am scared that the bloom is off the Wade Phillips rose, as it pertains to him building a good defense.

Just not going to believe a single freaking thing, no matter what the players might say (i.e., "Aw man, it's like night and day here, man. So exciting. This defense is going to be SCARY next year" -- Texans player). Not buying it.

I will believe it when I see our seeding for the playoffs. And not a minute sooner.

HoustonFrog
01-05-2011, 01:13 PM
That's only because we aren't taking their precious limelight right now. Trust me, there was a time when the Oilers were the only winning team in Texas and Dallas fans hated us.

No, this didn't happen. I lived there from 71-93...Ft. Worth. As a kid/teen/young adult, football fan, and massive Cowboy fan I loved the Oilers as a secondary team. I remember distinctly the Renfro bad call and the Oiler/Steeler games. I remember the run and shoot days. At no point did anyone in the DFW area decide to hate Houston or have anything but good to ambivalent feelings. The Cowboys had a winning record for 20 years straight...up until 1986. So basically there were a few bad Cowboy years and then the transition. Nothing in there sparked Houston hate. As Cak said, the debate was whether Landrys time was up and what ownership was doing with him.

infantrycak
01-05-2011, 01:14 PM
What's interesting, to me, is that Wade is a defensive coach. His Dallas team, unless I am wrong here, wasn't exactly a great defense while he was there.

Top 10 D his first 3 years in Dallas. 20 something this year.

GP
01-05-2011, 01:17 PM
Top 10 D his first 3 years in Dallas. 20 something this year.

His overall winning/losing record fell, too, didn't it?

I think I remember seeing the record stats. Started out well, then tanked this year.

Just very very very skeptical that Wade Phillips can rebound after being a bad HC and come here and turn this thing around.

I know his history says he's capable. But this is now. Not the past.

HoustonFrog
01-05-2011, 01:25 PM
What's interesting, to me, is that Wade is a defensive coach. His Dallas team, unless I am wrong here, wasn't exactly a great defense while he was there. I haven't scanned any stats that posters might have put up here, though, so I can't say for sure. It just SEEMS that the thing Wade does best (defense) wasn't done well in Dallas. Which begs the question:

If Kubiak's thang (offense) was done well here, why couldn't Wade produce better results in Dallas with his defense? You'd think that you play to your strengths as a HC...the thing you are strong at, in this case Wade is a defense guy, wasn't exactly phenomenal in Dallas. Why? I thought Dallas had pretty much built a 3-4 defense there. They tore us a new one, that's for sure.

I am scared that the bloom is off the Wade Phillips rose, as it pertains to him building a good defense.

Just not going to believe a single freaking thing, no matter what the players might say (i.e., "Aw man, it's like night and day here, man. So exciting. This defense is going to be SCARY next year" -- Texans player). Not buying it.

I will believe it when I see our seeding for the playoffs. And not a minute sooner.

2007--9th overall

2008-8th overall

2009-9th overall

2010-23rd

There was some issue though. Take for example the 2008 season. They looked like world beaters for stretches and then basically blew late season games....particularly the Baltimore game that was the last at Texas Stadium. They also weren't consistent in 2009 and then starting with New Orleans they went on a tear that ended badly against Minny. They had almost the anti-Texans thing where they were strong in games and gave up late leads at times.

What would scare me as a Texans fan would be these things 1) Wade's demeanor and message. Wade isn't an ass kicker. He isn't going to pull you to the side and ***** you out. You will see alot of confused faces from Wade. He knows the 3-4. He can run a good 3-4 but there is definitely a Kubiak feel to him where he has them kicking ass and then you are wondering what is going on. Not sure if the Texans wouldn't be better to have a yang to Kubiaks Ying instead of two Yings 2) Player development/relations. The Cowboys did what some considered well drafting D from Parcells on through Wade. Jenkins, Scandrick, the D line and backers for the most part. But between 2009 and 2010 guys regressed. Young guys like Scandrick and Jenkins fell WAY off. Of course Ware did great and guys likes Spencer came around but you wonder why they regressed. Also, Bradie James, one guy who was always a hard worker and leader is now saying that most of the guys knew there were things wrong in 2009 but their win against the Saints covered it up. He said guys weren't accountable and it was matter of time before the team and defense blew up. Maybe Wade does better as D Coordinator and is hands on since he isn't running the whole show. But all of this makes me wonder how much he cultivates young players who aren't studs and how much discipline he can instill.

leebigeztx
01-05-2011, 01:25 PM
What's interesting, to me, is that Wade is a defensive coach. His Dallas team, unless I am wrong here, wasn't exactly a great defense while he was there. I haven't scanned any stats that posters might have put up here, though, so I can't say for sure. It just SEEMS that the thing Wade does best (defense) wasn't done well in Dallas. Which begs the question:

If Kubiak's thang (offense) was done well here, why couldn't Wade produce better results in Dallas with his defense? You'd think that you play to your strengths as a HC...the thing you are strong at, in this case Wade is a defense guy, wasn't exactly phenomenal in Dallas. Why? I thought Dallas had pretty much built a 3-4 defense there. They tore us a new one, that's for sure.

I am scared that the bloom is off the Wade Phillips rose, as it pertains to him building a good defense.

Just not going to believe a single freaking thing, no matter what the players might say (i.e., "Aw man, it's like night and day here, man. So exciting. This defense is going to be SCARY next year" -- Texans player). Not buying it.

I will believe it when I see our seeding for the playoffs. And not a minute sooner.

I understand what you're saying, but in the nfl today, there are no great defenses. The rules have really restricted what teams can do defensively, but what a team must do is create to's and limit points. They gave up over 420 pts through the year, but if they can get that down to 300 which is middle of the pack, those 24 ppg will do it. I also think the poor starting position from the poor special teams and the poor defense worked against the offense also. They just need to get in the middle defensively and they will be ok. The chiefs went from last to top 10 in 1 season with just adding romeo.

infantrycak
01-05-2011, 01:28 PM
His overall winning/losing record fell, too, didn't it?

Nope. He had a .607 in Dallas on a career .573. Clearly this year went bad in Dallas though.

Just very very very skeptical that Wade Phillips can rebound after being a bad HC and come here and turn this thing around.

I know his history says he's capable. But this is now. Not the past.

Other than disappointment over Kubiak being retained, why?

By the way, you suggested Fisher as a DC. His HC record is .542. Other names which have been bandied about - Gruden .540, Fox .507, Lewis (off the table) .472.

There was some issue though. Take for example the 2008 season. They looked like world beaters for stretches and then basically blew late season games....

The team did yes, but let's keep in mind Romo was developing a reputation as a guy that crumbled in December.

2006 6 picks last 4 weeks, 3 losses.
2007 5 picks last 4 weeks, 2 losses.
2008 6 picks last 4 weeks, 3 losses.
2009 finally started to shed the reputation.

leebigeztx
01-05-2011, 01:34 PM
Nope. He had a .607 in Dallas on a career .573. Clearly this year went bad in Dallas though.



Other than disappointment over Kubiak being retained, why?

By the way, you suggested Fisher as a DC. His HC record is .542. Other names which have been bandied about - Gruden .540, Fox .507, Lewis (off the table) .472.



The team did yes, but let's keep in mind Romo was developing a reputation as a guy that crumbled in December.

I think a guy like wade,capers,romeo as well as others are just meant to be coordinators. Lebaeu was a teriible as a head coach, but is one of the greatest dc's ever.

nero THE zero
01-05-2011, 01:40 PM
This local guy stuff is so inappropriate in this case. Wade is undeniably one of the top 3 DC's available this off-season regardless of where he is from.
It's obviously conjecture on my part, but given the team's history and tendencies I feel like him being a local guy had a lot to do with his (imminent) hiring.

The Bum visit last week doesn't do much to quell that for me.

infantrycak
01-05-2011, 02:05 PM
It's obviously conjecture on my part, but given the team's history and tendencies I feel like him being a local guy had a lot to do with his (imminent) hiring.

The Bum visit last week doesn't do much to quell that for me.

Well so what if they do use connections/familiarity to get a top DC? One of the things people have been listing as a positive for Cowher is him being able to use his contacts to get people here. If the net result is a top guy being here I don't care how he got here.

nero THE zero
01-05-2011, 02:15 PM
Well so what if they do use connections/familiarity to get a top DC? One of the things people have been listing as a positive for Cowher is him being able to use his contacts to get people here. If the net result is a top guy being here I don't care how he got here.

Well, my problem isn't that they used "connections/familiarity to get a top DC."

My problem is that they not only kept Smithiak, but hired a guy who's a potential replacement for Kubiak who I feel is inferior to other possible options and is/will be/would be sold to me based on his ties to the city rather than his merits.

infantrycak
01-05-2011, 02:43 PM
My problem is that they not only kept Smithiak

There's the real problem.

but hired a guy who's a potential replacement for Kubiak

So you would prefer they hire a DC with no potential to be HC?

who I feel is inferior to other possible options and is/will be/would be sold to me based on his ties to the city rather than his merits.

Who are the superior DC options?

Ole Miss Texan
01-05-2011, 03:27 PM
McNair obviously doesn't want to fire Rick Smith and/or Gary Kubiak. He wants to give them every opportunity to succeed. Because of that, I think Wade Smith was the best possible hire we could of had of the people available or even from those rumored to maybe be fired.

nero THE zero
01-05-2011, 04:02 PM
So you would prefer they hire a DC with no potential to be HC?
Yes. Maybe I'm being naive, but it makes me uneasy that there's a guy on staff that McNair could look at as a potential to replace Kubiak within the current structure of this organization.

Who are the superior DC options?
It's not that I want a superior DC, I think Phillips is a fine choice, rather there are superior HC choices. Maybe I'm misguided, but I'm seeing Phillips as Kubiak-insurance as much as I am our new DC.

infantrycak
01-05-2011, 04:07 PM
Yes. Maybe I'm being naive, but it makes me uneasy that there's a guy on staff that McNair could look at as a potential to replace Kubiak within the current structure of this organization.

It's not that I want a superior DC, I think Phillips is a fine choice, rather there are superior HC choices. Maybe I'm misguided, but I'm seeing Phillips as Kubiak-insurance as much as I am our new DC.

You're mad about Kubiak and building an impossible standard. You I would assume want a great DC if that is who is going to be replaced right? Well a great DC is going to be a potential HC replacement.

HoustonFrog
01-05-2011, 04:26 PM
Solomon the other day said the GB D-Line coach was a guy out there people liked the most. It could be mentioned in the 7 pages here but I'm not going back :)...stats enclosed

http://blogs.chron.com/jeromesolomon/2011/01/is_wade_phillips_the_guy_1.html

A former NFL coach told me that if the Texans don't talk to Green Bay defensive line coach Mike Trgovac, they are missing out on perhaps the best candidate available.

I don't know him, but I have heard some good things.

And for you fans who like this sort of thing, Trgovac is one of those high-energy nuts who thinks defense is about vicious attitude and technique as much as it is about scheme. Yeah, he's crazy like that. A near-perfect defensive coach.

Let's look at the defenses Phillips and Trgovac have been involved with since 2002, after Phillips took a year off when he was fired from Buffalo. Yards aren't as important as points, and points are affected by offense and special teams, but these raw numbers generally tell you what type defense a team has.

Of course interviewing this guy would take time and doing things the right way.

beerlover
01-05-2011, 04:31 PM
Solomon the other day saus the GB D-Line coach was a guy out there people liked the most. It could be mentioned in the 7 pages here but I'm not going back :)...stats enclosed

http://blogs.chron.com/jeromesolomon/2011/01/is_wade_phillips_the_guy_1.html

Trgovac would be outstanding get, that would make next season very interesting :)

Double Barrel
01-05-2011, 04:43 PM
Trgovac is one of those high-energy nuts who thinks defense is about vicious attitude and technique as much as it is about scheme.

I'm sorry, 'frog, but this attitude does not fit into the vision of niiiiiice that Bob has for his franchise.

nero THE zero
01-05-2011, 05:57 PM
This local guy stuff is so inappropriate in this case.
Heh.

Text from the Texans:
"The Texans have hired NFL coaching veteran and Orange, Texas, native Wade Phillips..."

J_R
01-05-2011, 06:07 PM
The list consisted of Wade Phillips and.....Wade Phillips.