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Bigbots_02
12-15-2010, 11:49 AM
Ill Start by saying this...

If you respond and you feel oposite (I ALREADY KNOW YOU DO) Please, have legitimate reasoning as to why. And if you don't... then just say you dont have faith in Kubiak.

You people are irrational. Have any of you ever heard the expression: A PERSON is smart, but PEOPLE are stupid.
I say this because as individuals, you could probably hold a decent conversation but get a group of you that all have a similar objective together, and you can't be reasoned with. Someone would be better off drinking gun powder then lighting a match and swallowing it.:mariopalm: That's what everyone of you that sit and complain about Kubiak remind me of.

You can feel how you do, your entitled to it... but to neglect an obvious truth is completely ridiculous. Here are some facts.

Fact: We had HIGH EXPECTATIONS to become playoff contenders this year

(Response) EVERY FRANCHISE has High expectations the next year! I trult believe we really SHOULD have a record of like 9-4

Fact: We have UNDERACHIEVED as a football team this year

(Response) Once again, should be 9-4, No argument... but en less your at the top of your division, your going to feel that way. (Cleveland and Detroit excluded):barman:

SUPER FACT: Our defense is DREADFUL!!!:mariopalm:(This is a big one)

(Response) ITS TRUE! I can't deny that. However, you want to fire the head coach Kubiak. You gather like a cult and post it countless times a day on almost every thread that has to do with the Houston Texans... That doesn't make any sense to me. However, I DO understand at the end of the day everyone really just wants to win. I personally would go after to the source of our direct problems. I think it's Defensive Coordinator Frank Bush. If it's his coaching that's causing the problem then get him out of there. However, If its the players that aren't capable of executing the designed play, get them out of there. Where your problem is, that's what you fix. This is BASIC problem solving. You don't throw a TV away because your remote is broken! You get a new remote!:headhurts: There is nothing wrong with kubiak! He is very capable and if you throw him away because of THIS you'll regret not having the positive that he DOES bring to the table.

Fact: SOME of the play calling has been questionable

(Response) The keyword in that is SOME. But here is my question... Where YOU in the meetings and in the huddles and listening to the plays being called to truly know who's really at fault? None of us where. However, the people that know the facts still have individuals in the position they are in. THIS applies to Kubiak. If Mcnair KNOWS that kubiak isn't doing his job correctly and isn't making good judgment calls MOST of the time... get him out of there. If Kubiak KNOWS that someone under him isn't performing to expectation after the necessary tools are given, get them out of there.

If you just don't believe in Kubiak fine. But what are you going to more towards? Fire Kubiak if you know what your getting and you like it. But if you don't, why do it? I Wouldn't... Because here is what I believe... Eventually, Kubiak will be gone... but those players who keep falling, and blowing coverages and dropping balls and making bad decisions will still be there. Some of the problems will be fixed. However, Some of the abilities will all take for granted will be lost... Like our offense. IF the incoming coach keeps key players and components of our offense after Kubiak is gone, then the POTENTIAL will still be there. But I doubt he will... And I doubt his offense will be anywhere near as potent.

DexmanC
12-15-2010, 11:55 AM
Ill Start by saying this...

You people are irrational.

This is the short version of your post.

My response to it is, nevermind...



.....I've got more than a season-and-a-half of my rationale in
favor of Kubiak's firing, right here on this board. On record.

Where is yours?

Mr. White
12-15-2010, 11:57 AM
The "Fire Kubiak" gang were a bunch of knee jerkers in 2007. They were irrational back then.

Now it's probably 90% of the fanbase.

TexCanada
12-15-2010, 11:58 AM
What do you do if the TV AND the remote are broken?

cdollaz
12-15-2010, 12:00 PM
Kubiak HIRED Frank Bush and PICKED all of the players who are on our roster.

I discount the opinion of anyone who would actually state "There is nothing wrong with kubiak," as it shows that you have no clue what you are talking about.

TexCanada
12-15-2010, 12:02 PM
Some of the abilities will all take for granted will be lost... Like our offense. IF the incoming coach keeps key players and components of our offense after Kubiak is gone, then the POTENTIAL will still be there. But I doubt he will... And I doubt his offense will be anywhere near as potent.

I think we all fully realize that bringing in a new coach is not necessarily going to make us a better team. It is quite possible that we become worse and end up a total mess again. It is also possible that a new coach can take us to playoffs. All of us in the "Fire Kubiak" club want him gone (and other staff members as well) because this franchise has gone stagnant. I would rather take a risk on a new coach and win 4 games next year then sit through another Kubiak-led 8-8 season.

Thorn
12-15-2010, 12:02 PM
I don't need a reason to explain myself. However, if one is needed, it's that I've been watching the NFL (old AFL) in Houston since the late 60s and I am getting ****ing impatient.

I'm also getting a tad more grumpier in my old age, so add that to the impatient part and I want Kubiak gone and don't need multiple paragraphs to explain it all.

Blake
12-15-2010, 12:04 PM
You don't throw a TV away because your remote is broken! You get a new remote!

We changed the remote already. Even checked the batteries a couple times. Eventually you have to upgrade from a tube TV to a flat panel TV.

What do you do if the TV AND the remote are broken?

You bring the remote down from the booth to the sidelines. :P

Bigbots_02
12-15-2010, 12:08 PM
Kubiak HIRED Frank Bush and PICKED all of the players who are on our roster.

I discount the opinion of anyone who would actually state "There is nothing wrong with kubiak," as it shows that you have no clue what you are talking about.

As far as players go... No one REALLY knows what there getting in the draft... You have to give them the tools they need and the opportunity to suceed. As Far as Frank Bush... Im with you on that one. I DO think hes much to blame... But like I stated earlier, I have no REAL Proof as to whos really to blame. I guess my question for you is, why kill the body by cutting off the head? Your going to have to bring in a new body with no promise that its any better then the last. The last body worked, just not like you hoped... Lets get some body parts

TexCanada
12-15-2010, 12:09 PM
You bring the remote down from the booth to the sidelines. :P

:lol: rep!

houstonspartan
12-15-2010, 12:09 PM
This thread is dumb. It should be merged into one of the 900 other Fire Kubiak threads.

Oh, and your tv analogy was funny. I'm dealing with something along those lines. My tv is working fine, but I've had it for like 15 years. No problems with it. However, all of the programming these days is in widescreen, 16 x 9 dimensions. Even old school re-runs. Even old shows on my screen show up with the edges totally blocked off. I was watching a re-run of The Office the other day. It was a scene where two people were sitting across from each other in an office. On my screen, all I could see was a desk. The two people on the scene were cut off because of my old-school tv.

So, even though my tv works fine, I'm going to have to get rid of it because current programming has moved on.

Kubiak continues to push is ridiculus, small-linemen zone blocking, even though defensive linemen have gotten MUCH bigger since the Broncos won those back-to-back Super Bowls. Shanahan did the same thing, and the Broncos kept going 8-8, and ended up getting fired.

It its time to update our equipment to keep up with the current NFL.

IlliniJen
12-15-2010, 12:10 PM
FACT: Bears eat beets.

Bears. Beets. Battlestar Galatica.

Blake
12-15-2010, 12:11 PM
FACT: Bears eat beets.

Bears. Beets. Battlestar Galatica.

Hey, whats going on, WHAT ARE YOU DOING!

IDENTITY THEFT IS NOT A JOKE JEN!

HoustonFrog
12-15-2010, 12:11 PM
FACT: Gary Kubiak hired Frank Bush. There were other more experienced coordinators out there but he wanted someone that was in his "group" and that he was comfortable with. Bush had no experience as the main guy. That is on Kubiak as much as anyone

FACT: This isn't a one year thing with play calling, etc. For 4 years this team has started 5-7. For most of those years they have finished at .500. During these time periods the team has gone on horrible stretches of losing that tank a season. During those seasons there has ALWAYS been people wondering why Kubiak wasted a timeout. There have been jokes for years about his challenges. They have been notorious for starting games slow..which is all about preparation.

FACT: Kubiak is as much a GM as Rick Smith is. They are together in the evaluation process of players and in drafting. They have decided to bring in the Kareem Jacksons, the Amobis, etc. If you add this to hiring Bush, etc then your theory of bringing in more parts has no merit because they already have shown that they can't successfully evaluate those parts!

FACT: There has been high expectations for 3 years and all of them have not been met. This has never been a 1 year problem.

FACT: Kubiak is the only coach hired at the same time he was to not make the playoffs.

Mr. White
12-15-2010, 12:12 PM
As far as players go... No one REALLY knows what there getting in the draft... You have to give them the tools they need and the opportunity to suceed. As Far as Frank Bush... Im with you on that one. I DO think hes much to blame... But like I stated earlier, I have no REAL Proof as to whos really to blame. I guess my question for you is, why kill the body by cutting off the head? Your going to have to bring in a new body with no promise that its any better then the last. The last body worked, just not like you hoped... Lets get some body parts

Don't forget he also hired Richard Smith.

Frank Bush is his 2nd failed DC hire now. There were plenty of other DC's on the market when both guys got hired. How many more chances should he get to bring in a competent DC?

Bigbots_02
12-15-2010, 12:12 PM
I don't need a reason to explain myself. However, if one is needed, it's that I've been watching the NFL (old AFL) in Houston since the late 60s and I am getting ****ing impatient.

I'm also getting a tad more grumpier in my old age, so add that to the impatient part and I want Kubiak gone and don't need multiple paragraphs to explain it all.

Lmao... That must be your real pic as your avatar. j/k

Bigbots_02
12-15-2010, 12:13 PM
Don't forget he also hired Richard Smith.

Frank Bush is his 2nd failed DC hire now. There were plenty of other DC's on the market when both guys got hired. How many more chances should he get to bring in a competent DC?

Didnt the defense improve the 2nd half of the season last year?... I thought they did but I may have been mistaken.

IlliniJen
12-15-2010, 12:14 PM
The "Fire Kubiak" gang were a bunch of knee jerkers in 2007. They were irrational back then.

Now it's probably 90% of the fanbase.

I've been in this gang since after the 2008 season. I did't see what others did in Kubiak, especially with his lack of instilling any fire, leadership or preparation on this team. It's just gotten more glaring over the years.

A guy with no heart and fire doesn't change; he was the same two years ago, and he's the same this year. Our team has too much talent to allow a dead fish like Kubiak to waste it.

houstonspartan
12-15-2010, 12:15 PM
Also, just for the record, I take no pride in the fact that I was 100 percent correct about this team.

When Kubiak got his extension, I was FURIOUS. It felt wrong, and I told a friend it was going to set us back a year. He told me I was overreacting.

Right before the season, I predicted 7-9. I was called negative.

At the trade deadline a couple of months ago, I said if we didn't make a big trade on defense, the season is over. A buddy of mine told me I was being harsh and that I should have faith.

I predicted we would lose to Jacksonville because they're a better coached team. I was called nuts.

Look, I am upset that I was right about this team. I wanted to be proven wrong, and would have eaten crow 10 times if I were. But this goes back to the old Maya Angelou quote: "If someone shows you who they are, believe them."

TexCanada
12-15-2010, 12:16 PM
Didnt the defense improve the 2nd half of the season last year?... I thought they did but I may have been mistaken.

Yes they did :trophy:

cdollaz
12-15-2010, 12:17 PM
As far as players go... No one REALLY knows what there getting in the draft... You have to give them the tools they need and the opportunity to suceed. As Far as Frank Bush... Im with you on that one. I DO think hes much to blame... But like I stated earlier, I have no REAL Proof as to whos really to blame. I guess my question for you is, why kill the body by cutting off the head? Your going to have to bring in a new body with no promise that its any better then the last. The last body worked, just not like you hoped... Lets get some body parts

:kubepalm:

Whose job do you think it is to give them the tools they need after they are drafted? Wouldn't be the coach, would it?

Goatcheese
12-15-2010, 12:18 PM
I would support keeping Kubiak if he wasn't head over heels in love with nepotism. I just can't take another Friend of Kubiak hiring, or even worse a Friend of Kubiak's kid hiring.

The guy hires/plays his buddies and then just leaves them there for years no matter how miserably they perform. "Maybe if I just give him one more year he can turn it around!" No Gary he can't. He sucks at his job and it's time for you to bury the axe between his shoulder blades before it happens to you.

Kubiak is a talented coach but he has screwed himself and this team by putting incompetent people in important positions.

Being able to make the hard choices is the difference between a good leader and a great one. If he can't make those choices then he needs to GTFO so we can find someone who will.

I'll agree with the op that the soapers are irrational though. "The water boy spilled the gatorade! FIRE KUBIAK!" is about the best argument they can come up with.

cdollaz
12-15-2010, 12:19 PM
Didnt the defense improve the 2nd half of the season last year?... I thought they did but I may have been mistaken.

My sister USED to have a hot ass. You oughta see it now.

Bigbots_02
12-15-2010, 12:20 PM
FACT: Gary Kubiak hired Frank Bush. There were other more experienced coordinators out there but he wanted someone that was in his "group" and that he was comfortable with. Bush had no experience as the main guy. That is on Kubiak as much as anyone

FACT: This isn't a one year thing with play calling, etc. For 4 years this team has started 5-7. For most of those years they have finished at .500. During these time periods the team has gone on horrible stretches of losing that tank a season. During those seasons there has ALWAYS been people wondering why Kubiak wasted a timeout. There have been jokes for years about his challenges. They have been notorious for starting games slow..which is all about preparation.

FACT: Kubiak is as much a GM as Rick Smith is. They are together in the evaluation process of players and in drafting. They have decided to bring in the Kareem Jacksons, the Amobis, etc. If you add this to hiring Bush, etc then your theory of bringing in more parts has no merit because they already have shown that they can't successfully evaluate those parts!

FACT: There has been high expectations for 3 years and all of them have not been met. This has never been a 1 year problem.

FACT: Kubiak is the only coach hired at the same time he was to not make the playoffs.

Thank you... I agree with Most that you said and for what I dont necessarily agree with, I can completely respect. Yes, there have been questionable playing but... (and Im asking) would you say that the PLAY CALLING is bad... or the execution of the play callling? I remember last year trying to run the ball on critical plays and fumbling.. thus... losing the game. we would have went to the playoffs then. Had the execution of the plays been performed properly, Kubiak not going to the playoffs wouldnt be a arguing point. Im not saying he doesnt have his faults... Im simply saying he shouldn't take all the blame.

Bigbots_02
12-15-2010, 12:22 PM
I would support keeping Kubiak if he wasn't head over heels in love with nepotism. I just can't take another Friend of Kubiak hiring, or even worse a Friend of Kubiak's kid hiring.

The guy hires/plays his buddies and then just leaves them there for years no matter how miserably they perform. "Maybe if I just give him one more year he can turn it around!" No Gary he can't. He sucks at his job and it's time for you to bury the axe between his shoulder blades before it happens to you.

Kubiak is a talented coach but he has screwed himself and this team by putting incompetent people in important positions.

Being able to make the hard choices is the difference between a good leader and a great one. If he can't make those choices then he needs to GTFO so we can find someone who will.

I'll agree with the op that the soapers are irrational though. "The water boy spilled the gatorade! FIRE KUBIAK!" is about the best argument they can come up with.

Agreed

TexCanada
12-15-2010, 12:22 PM
I'll agree with the op that the soapers are irrational though. "The water boy spilled the gatorade! FIRE KUBIAK!" is about the best argument they can come up with.

This is hilarious. There are pages and pages of posts on here of rational thought about why Kubiak should be fired. He doesn't win football games! How is that irrational? Don't do your job = fired. Is that rational enough?

IlliniJen
12-15-2010, 12:22 PM
Also, just for the record, I take no pride in the fact that I was 100 percent correct about this team.

When Kubiak got his extension, I was FURIOUS. It felt wrong, and I told a friend it was going to set us back a year. He told me I was overreacting.

Right before the season, I predicted 7-9. I was called negative.

At the trade deadline a couple of months ago, I said if we didn't make a big trade on defense, the season is over. A buddy of mine told me I was being harsh and that I should have faith.

I predicted we would lose to Jacksonville because they're a better coached team. I was called nuts.

Look, I am upset that I was right about this team. I wanted to be proven wrong, and would have eaten crow 10 times if I were. But this goes back to the old Maya Angelou quote: "If someone shows you who they are, believe them."

I had the same bad feeling about this team, that despite expectations, we'd still be a .500 team. After all, what had really changed to make anyone think we'd be better than the last couple of years?

Kubiak is a limp handshake, and he's infected this team with his mentality. There is NO EXCUSE for consistently coming out week after week and only playing one half of football, as if the whole week of preparation consisted of nothing but games of scrabble and bro hugs in the locker room.

mattieuk
12-15-2010, 12:24 PM
I'm also getting a tad more grumpier in my old age, so add that to the impatient part and I want Kubiak gone and don't need multiple paragraphs to explain it all.

You're going to get worse Thorn!?!

:wadepalm:

On topic, I'm not in either 'camp'. I've 3 weeks to figure out what I think the best route would be for the team, as a firing now would be pointless IMO. The glimpses of awesomeness are still there, its just a question of how much crap do you take to get those glimpses.

TexCanada
12-15-2010, 12:24 PM
Thank you... I agree with Most that you said and for what I dont necessarily agree with, I can completely respect. Yes, there have been questionable playing but... (and Im asking) would you say that the PLAY CALLING is bad... or the execution of the play callling? I remember last year trying to run the ball on critical plays and fumbling.. thus... losing the game. we would have went to the playoffs then. Had the execution of the plays been performed properly, Kubiak not going to the playoffs wouldnt be a arguing point. Im not saying he doesnt have his faults... Im simply saying he shouldn't take all the blame.

I agree with this. Not all the blame goes to Kubiak. Now the question is whether you think we should replace the players, the coach or both? Everybody here agrees that something isn't working, so what do we fix? For me, I say coach.

steelbtexan
12-15-2010, 12:25 PM
The "Fire Kubiak" gang were a bunch of knee jerkers in 2007. They were irrational back then.

Now it's probably 90% of the fanbase.

Wrong, we just expect more than mediocrity out of the Texans.

Were we irrational back then? Time has proven my thought process to not be irrational. Kubes wasn't the man for the job back then and he still isn't the man for the job today.

It just took awhile for the sheeple(3 yrs) to get on board.

Bigbots_02
12-15-2010, 12:25 PM
:kubepalm:

Whose job do you think it is to give them the tools they need after they are drafted? Wouldn't be the coach, would it?

Absolutely... You dont know whether a player such as kareem jackson is a failure until you let him fail. If you ask me, I think he's failed plenty. But it IS is rookie year. Some players have it right out the gate and others don't. I dont know if he just needs more time or if this is just him but I do know we had a glaringneed @ CB and they attempted to fill it.

cdollaz
12-15-2010, 12:27 PM
It is very apparant that there are a few on these boards that have zero understanding of the concept of accountability.

Honoring Earl 34
12-15-2010, 12:29 PM
Keep Kubiak because we don't want to make the same mistake of being impatient like we did when we gave up on David Carr to early .

:kubepalm:

houstonspartan
12-15-2010, 12:31 PM
It is very apparant that there are a few on these boards that have zero understanding of the concept of accountability.

Amen. It's sad. Some of our fans don't care, and are happy with losing. It's amazing.

Baltimore Ravens fans have apparently been pissed off at Monday's game. Texans fans have said that they should shut up and be happy they're 9-4. Thing is, Ravens fans are happy they won, but they're pissed that they almost lost. They want a deep playoff run, and they are worried that the Texans were able to re-bound like we did.

I respect that. They think like winners. We don't.

Bigbots_02
12-15-2010, 12:33 PM
This is hilarious. There are pages and pages of posts on here of rational thought about why Kubiak should be fired. He doesn't win football games! How is that irrational? Don't do your job = fired. Is that rational enough?

But just because you lose does that mean your no good? Thats almost like saying you have Berry Sanders @ RB but you cant win so hes no good. Its more then just coaching. Kubiak has his part in the blame game but he's not 100% of the blame.

gary
12-15-2010, 12:34 PM
Record says it all this thread is bogus but if you are like me maybe you have already started to blame Bob. Maybe he just does not know enough.

TexCanada
12-15-2010, 12:34 PM
Amen. It's sad. Some of our fans don't care, and are happy with losing. It's amazing.

Baltimore Ravens fans have apparently been pissed off at Monday's game. Texans fans have said that they should shut up and be happy they're 9-4. Thing is, Ravens fans are happy they won, but they're pissed that they almost lost. They want a deep playoff run, and they are worried that the Texans were able to re-bound like we did.

I respect that. They think like winners. We don't.

I was thinking about that after the game. I was thinking that when the Raven's won, their team and fans were probably glad they won but disappointed with their play. If we had won we would have had many of our players and fans celebrating well into the night. I mean, we lost and we still got a mixed reaction from it.

Bigbots_02
12-15-2010, 12:35 PM
It is very apparant that there are a few on these boards that have zero understanding of the concept of accountability.

I agree... I just think that maybe... just maybe the wrong perosn is going to be fired

Mr. White
12-15-2010, 12:37 PM
Wrong, we just expect more than mediocrity out of the Texans.

Were we irrational back then? Time has proven my thought process to not be irrational. Kubes wasn't the man for the job back then and he still isn't the man for the job today.

It just took awhile for the sheeple(3 yrs) to get on board.

I was happy with mediocrity that particular season. I started bitching after the 2nd 8-8 season and it was obvious that he couldn't get the team over the hump with stellar offensive stats.

I guess Kubiak really showed me. That was during the glorious 9-7 campaign when he dominated the murderer's row that we call the NFC West.

wagonhed
12-15-2010, 12:38 PM
I give this thread a -3 / 10.

TexCanada
12-15-2010, 12:38 PM
I agree with this. Not all the blame goes to Kubiak. Now the question is whether you think we should replace the players, the coach or both? Everybody here agrees that something isn't working, so what do we fix? For me, I say coach.

But just because you lose does that mean your no good? Thats almost like saying you have Berry Sanders @ RB but you cant win so hes no good. Its more then just coaching. Kubiak has his part in the blame game but he's not 100% of the blame.

Yes I already agreed with this and responded with the first quote above. I will stick with that response.

gary
12-15-2010, 12:38 PM
What is up with all of this Kubiak flower on the wall stuff?

cdollaz
12-15-2010, 12:38 PM
I agree... I just think that maybe... just maybe the wrong perosn is going to be fired

It should be "persons", not "person":

Head coach
DC
OC
GM
A handful of players

Blake
12-15-2010, 12:39 PM
What is the saying? You are what your record says you are. And in our case, its losers.

Bigbots_02
12-15-2010, 12:39 PM
Amen. It's sad. Some of our fans don't care, and are happy with losing. It's amazing.

Baltimore Ravens fans have apparently been pissed off at Monday's game. Texans fans have said that they should shut up and be happy they're 9-4. Thing is, Ravens fans are happy they won, but they're pissed that they almost lost. They want a deep playoff run, and they are worried that the Texans were able to re-bound like we did.

I respect that. They think like winners. We don't.

If I were a Ravens fan I would have been mad too. Their SUPPOSE to have all there ducks in line. Their defense is SUPPOSE to be elite. Their offense is SUPPOSE to be better then ours. The fact that they ALMOST with what was SUPPOSE to happen. Yea... But be that as it may... Who do you give credit to for our Offense? I guess thats just going to stay the same when Kubiak gets kicked out.

cdollaz
12-15-2010, 12:41 PM
If I were a Ravens fan I would have been mad too. Their SUPPOSE to have all there ducks in line. Their defense is SUPPOSE to be elite. Their offense is SUPPOSE to be better then ours. The fact that they ALMOST with what was SUPPOSE to happen. Yea... But be that as it may... Who do you give credit to for our Offense? I guess thats just going to stay the same when Kubiak gets kicked out.

Our offense is a paper tiger.

If our offense stays the same, we are screwed, since our lack of offense in the first half routinely spots the other team a double-digit lead.

Bigbots_02
12-15-2010, 12:42 PM
It should be "persons", not "person":

Head coach
DC
OC
GM
A handful of players

Id say DC, A handful of players... maybe GM. The OC just got there but Im thinkin thats most Kubiak

Trail.Blazr
12-15-2010, 12:42 PM
Keep Kubiak because we don't want to make the same mistake of being impatient like we did when we gave up on David Carr to early .

:kubepalm:

I dig that take... In fact, I think, based on historic trends, and what was accomplished so far this season, Gary has well earned himself another opportunity to be rewarded a Contract Extension. :highfive:

TexCanada
12-15-2010, 12:42 PM
If I were a Ravens fan I would have been mad too. Their SUPPOSE to have all there ducks in line. Their defense is SUPPOSE to be elite. Their offense is SUPPOSE to be better then ours. The fact that they ALMOST with what was SUPPOSE to happen. Yea... But be that as it may... Who do you give credit to for our Offense? I guess thats just going to stay the same when Kubiak gets kicked out.

Mostly everyone on here seems to agree that Kubiak is a great OC. Unfortunately, being a HC requires more then just an offensive mind. I think everyone would be thrilled if we could keep Kubes around as our OC, but bring in a new HC who would have the final say in things. A kubes run offense under the watch of Cowher would be brilliant.

Bigbots_02
12-15-2010, 12:43 PM
Our offense is a paper tiger.

If our offense stays the same, we are screwed, since our lack of offense in the first half routinely spots the other team a double-digit lead.

If we could change this 1st half BS... would you want it to stay the same?

Honoring Earl 34
12-15-2010, 12:45 PM
http://pangea.stanford.edu/courses/GES41L/motivation/mediocrity.gif

cdollaz
12-15-2010, 12:45 PM
If we could change this 1st half BS... would you want it to stay the same?

Want what to stay the same?

Mr. White
12-15-2010, 12:48 PM
But just because you lose does that mean your no good? Thats almost like saying you have Berry Sanders @ RB but you cant win so hes no good. Its more then just coaching. Kubiak has his part in the blame game but he's not 100% of the blame.

It's more like saying "you have Arian Foster @ RB but you can't win because the coaching's no good. It's more than the running. Arian has his part in the blame game but he's not 100% of the blame."

If he was really a good RB, we would have won more games. Not to mention, if he was really a good RB, Kubiak would give him more carries.

</sarcasm>

Bigbots_02
12-15-2010, 12:49 PM
Want what to stay the same?

Not scoring... I hate it as much as ANYONE
I would say the defense stoping someone but this season.. that was asking to much

Bigbots_02
12-15-2010, 12:50 PM
It's more like saying "you have Arian Foster @ RB but you can't win because the coaching's no good. It's more than the running. Arian has his part in the blame game but he's not 100% of the blame."

If he was really a good RB, we would have won more games. Not to mention, if he was really a good RB, Kubiak would give him more carries.

</sarcasm>

We also have a REAL GOOD WR in Andre Johnson... Dont you try and but the ball in his hands too

Bigbots_02
12-15-2010, 12:55 PM
But I will say this fellas...

I DO agree with what you guys say as far as Kubiak hiring friends that arent capable... I would say FOR ME... If we lose another season and he hasnt made any changes to the coaching staff... Hes gotta go

Ckw
12-15-2010, 12:59 PM
Welcome to the board, Gary! Glad to see you decided to stop by, but what is the significance of the name bigbot for you?

Let's address some of the points that you have made.

First of all, you are just as idiotic as the "Fire Kubiak gang" to be calling all of us irrational and the like and defining an entire group based on your opinions of a select few. Many of us took YEARS to get this point and debated against the original members of the "Fire Kubiak gang" but finally came to realize it is time to stop blaming everyone else and start looking at the leader of the football team.

You claim we should blame Frank Bush, the defensive coordinator. Okay, I'll bite. Fine, we blame Frank Bush. But what happened when we blamed Dick Smith? Did our defense magically get better once Kubiak brought in HIS guy to coach the defense?!?

Next, you say we should blame the players. Okay, I'll bite. Fine, we blame the players. But what happened when we completely stripped the team and only have ONE player, Andre Johnson, left on the team from before Kubiak got here? Did the players magically start playing better once Kubiak brought in HIS players?!?

Finally, my major issue with Kubiak is this: he simply doesn't know how to win unless his back is against the wall. This team lacks the killer instinct a franchise like the Steelers, Patriots, etc. possess. I have NEVER witnessed a team play so crappy to start games and to start seasons (5-7 through 12 games basically Kubiak's entire time here) yet continue to finish well but never do well enough to make it to the playoffs. When Kubiak's Kids are just "playing for pride" and the game is out of hand or the season is out of hand, suddenly they start playing well. This is evidence of an unprepared and unmotivated team that can only seem to put it together until after they have already embarrassed themselves.

Gary, thanks for visiting the board but :mariopalm:.

Ckw
12-15-2010, 01:07 PM
My sister USED to have a hot ass. You oughta see it now.

Saying your sister has a "hot ass"...

:headhurts:

Hookem Horns
12-15-2010, 01:08 PM
Bigbots, do you have NFL Network? If so you might try catching the documentary "Bill Parcells: Reflections on a Life in Football". I think after watching that you might change your mind about Kubiak.

As Parcells says, this is a results league and the only stat that matters is the W/L record ... anything else is unacceptable.

I am tired of the defeatest, Mr. Nice Guy attitude that this team has had since day 1. "Great efforts", "we played well", stats, etc mean nothing. It started with Dom Capers and has continued to Kubiak.

Here is Kubiak's body of work ...

6-10 (no playoffs)
8-8 (no playoffs)
8-8 (no playoffs)
9-7 (no playoffs)
5-8 (no playoffs)

Over a stretch of 5 years. Unacceptable.

All of your arguments for Kubiak tell me that he is a good OC and nothing more at this point. Maybe he will learn from this and be a better HC in Denver. However no more learning on the job here.

Malloy
12-15-2010, 01:10 PM
You people are irrational

Who are 'you' ?

Ckw
12-15-2010, 01:12 PM
Thank you... I agree with Most that you said and for what I dont necessarily agree with, I can completely respect. Yes, there have been questionable playing but... (and Im asking) would you say that the PLAY CALLING is bad... or the execution of the play callling? I remember last year trying to run the ball on critical plays and fumbling.. thus... losing the game. we would have went to the playoffs then. Had the execution of the plays been performed properly, Kubiak not going to the playoffs wouldnt be a arguing point. Im not saying he doesnt have his faults... Im simply saying he shouldn't take all the blame.

Yes, the play calling has been bad. All one needs to look at is the article that came out on ESPN, if I am not mistaken, that the headset was down in the 4th quarter when we had our historic drives and the play calling was basically all Schaub. But to start overtime, Kubiak brought out the script once again, and Matt even mentioned, with disgust in his voice, the other day on his radio show that it wasn't his decision and he just ran the plays that were called. And Kubiak's play calling with over 10 minutes left in overtime was horrendous. Not running the ball ONE FREAKING TIME in OT was absolutely absurd.

Thorn
12-15-2010, 01:14 PM
Lmao... That must be your real pic as your avatar. j/k

LOL. Actualy it's Vic Morrow from a 1960s TV series called Combat.

cdollaz
12-15-2010, 01:18 PM
Saying your sister has a "hot ass"...

:headhurts:

I just happen to notice when she walked by. It's the second look that's supposed to be wrong, isn't it?

Bigbots_02
12-15-2010, 01:21 PM
Welcome to the board, Gary! Glad to see you decided to stop by, but what is the significance of the name bigbot for you?

Let's address some of the points that you have made.

First of all, you are just as idiotic as the "Fire Kubiak gang" to be calling all of us irrational and the like and defining an entire group based on your opinions of a select few. Many of us took YEARS to get this point and debated against the original members of the "Fire Kubiak gang" but finally came to realize it is time to stop blaming everyone else and start looking at the leader of the football team.

You claim we should blame Frank Bush, the defensive coordinator. Okay, I'll bite. Fine, we blame Frank Bush. But what happened when we blamed Dick Smith? Did our defense magically get better once Kubiak brought in HIS guy to coach the defense?!?

Next, you say we should blame the players. Okay, I'll bite. Fine, we blame the players. But what happened when we completely stripped the team and only have ONE player, Andre Johnson, left on the team from before Kubiak got here? Did the players magically start playing better once Kubiak brought in HIS players?!?

Finally, my major issue with Kubiak is this: he simply doesn't know how to win unless his back is against the wall. This team lacks the killer instinct a franchise like the Steelers, Patriots, etc. possess. I have NEVER witnessed a team play so crappy to start games and to start seasons (5-7 through 12 games basically Kubiak's entire time here) yet continue to finish well but never do well enough to make it to the playoffs. When Kubiak's Kids are just "playing for pride" and the game is out of hand or the season is out of hand, suddenly they start playing well. This is evidence of an unprepared and unmotivated team that can only seem to put it together until after they have already embarrassed themselves.

Gary, thanks for visiting the board but :mariopalm:.

I agree with mostly everything you said. However, its a bit over exaggeration in saying that when kubiak strippes the team. I think everyone here would agree though we may lack in experience... theres definilty talent. As far as Him hiring his "friends", Im not a fan of that and if he doesnt suceed next year because of it... then he made his choice and get him out. I ABSOLUTELY agree with what you say as far as killer instinct. My thing is if your not that type, its only a matter of time until you become that type. Kubiak went 6-10 his 1st season as head coach. Then he went 8-8 TWICE before finally going 9-7. I believe then when his back is on the wall (like you said) after probably going 7-9 or 8-8 this season... He will HAVE to become the hurter. Kill or be killed, but remember... this is his 1st year moving backwards. I guess for me, it would be different if he was never in the game and was just getting blown out all the time. but to each his own

Trail.Blazr
12-15-2010, 01:25 PM
I just happen to notice when she walked by. It's the second look that's supposed to be wrong, isn't it?

Seeing it... you got a point.

Saying it... still wrong, no matter how many times you haven't looked.


And if your saying it, you've looked at it WAY more than 1 time.

Ckw
12-15-2010, 01:25 PM
I agree with mostly everything you said. However, its a bit over exaggeration in saying that when kubiak strippes the team. I think everyone here would agree though we may lack in experience... theres definilty talent. As far as Him hiring his "friends", Im not a fan of that and if he doesnt suceed next year because of it... then he made his choice and get him out. I ABSOLUTELY agree with what you say as far as killer instinct. My thing is if your not that type, its only a matter of time until you become that type. Kubiak went 6-10 his 1st season as head coach. Then he went 8-8 TWICE before finally going 9-7. I believe then when his back is on the wall (like you said) after probably going 7-9 or 8-8 this season... He will HAVE to become the hurter. Kill or be killed, but remember... this is his 1st year moving backwards. I guess for me, it would be different if he was never in the game and was just getting blown out all the time. but to each his own

But when do we stop saying "one more year"? The same damn thing is going to happen next year. We will still suck and still won't make the playoffs but Kubiak deserves another chance because his guys kept on battlin', right? Wrong. As HonoringEarl said, this league is based on results and Kubiak's results reek of fail. If Kubiak hasn't developed the "killer instinct" by year 5 when every other coach that was hired the same time as him has made the playoffs or been fired, then I don't think he ever will. 5 years is enough of a sample size.

Cut the cord, Bob!

Double Barrel
12-15-2010, 01:32 PM
I have been waiting for a solid case to be made for keeping Kubiak as head coach...and I'm still waiting.

Sorry, OP, but there was not even an ounce of credible evidence presented to make a case for Kubiak.

Does four years of 5-7 ring a bell? Is is this the standard that you really set for your team? It is not even mediocre, but clearly the sign of a losing franchise. You simply cannot present a solid argument for happily accepting 5-7 four years in a row.

But just because you lose does that mean your no good?

Are you for real? No offense, this statement is the epitome of accepting the loser mentality.

There is an old saying, Parcells maybe?, that statistics are for losers and scoreboard is for winners. And he also said you are what your record is, and in this case, Gary Kubiak is a losing head coach after five seasons.

But I will say this fellas...

I DO agree with what you guys say as far as Kubiak hiring friends that arent capable... I would say FOR ME... If we lose another season and he hasnt made any changes to the coaching staff... Hes gotta go

So after all your insinuations about those that no longer want Kubiak as our head coach, the only difference between you and the rest of us is that you're patient for another year? Seriously, man, you just torpedoed your entire premise with this confession.

Bigbots, do you have NFL Network? If so you might try catching the documentary "Bill Parcells: Reflections on a Life in Football". I think after watching that you might change your mind about Kubiak.

As Parcells says, this is a results league and the only stat that matters is the W/L record ... anything else is unacceptable.

I am tired of the defeatest, Mr. Nice Guy attitude that this team has had since day 1. "Great efforts", "we played well", stats, etc mean nothing. It started with Dom Capers and has continued to Kubiak.

Here is Kubiak's body of work ...

6-10 (no playoffs)
8-8 (no playoffs)
8-8 (no playoffs)
9-7 (no playoffs)
5-8 (no playoffs)

Over a stretch of 5 years. Unacceptable.

All of your arguments for Kubiak tell me that he is a good OC and nothing more at this point. Maybe he will learn from this and be a better HC in Denver. However no more learning on the job here.

Fantastic post. I have requested, and continue to wait patiently, for ANY convincing argument to be presented on behalf of keeping Kubiak. The simple fact is that his body of work as a head coach overwhelms any attempts to defend the guy's losing record.

Blame the players! Well who picked the players?

Blame the coordinators! Well who picked the assistance coaches?

Blame the GM! Well who picked the GM?

No matter how you slice and dice it, the five years of losing and mediocrity represents one person.

Bigbots_02
12-15-2010, 01:34 PM
But when do we stop saying "one more year"? The same damn thing is going to happen next year. We will still suck and still won't make the playoffs but Kubiak deserves another chance because his guys kept on battlin', right? Wrong. As HonoringEarl said, this league is based on results and Kubiak's results reek of fail. If Kubiak hasn't developed the "killer instinct" by year 5 when every other coach that was hired the same time as him has made the playoffs or been fired, then I don't think he ever will. 5 years is enough of a sample size.

Cut the cord, Bob!

This is a new franchise and kubiak has made progress each and every season with the exception of this one. Thats WHY he's been here as long as he has. Improving talent around his stars, adding position depth of the team and improving the record every year EXCEPT this one. Whatever your scheme, the 1st year you learn it, the second year you execute and inforce it... When your not suceeding as he hoped you bring someone in that fits you scheme and can contribute. Its a learning curve and will slow you down but if the person IS capable, it will show once they stop havinf to learn it and start exectuing

cdollaz
12-15-2010, 01:37 PM
This is a new franchise and kubiak has made progress each and every season with the exception of this one. Thats WHY he's been here as long as he has. Improving talent around his stars, adding position depth of the team and improving the record every year EXCEPT this one. Whatever your scheme, the 1st year you learn it, the second year you execute and inforce it... When your not suceeding as he hoped you bring someone in that fits you scheme and can contribute. Its a learning curve and will slow you down but if the person IS capable, it will show once they stop havinf to learn it and start exectuing

The fans of every other team in recent memory that has turned it around in 1 year would call "bullshit" on your hypothesis.

Hookem Horns
12-15-2010, 01:40 PM
This is a new franchise and kubiak has made progress each and every season with the exception of this one.

Are you serious? That "new franchise" excuse has done sailed. What's the average career span of an NFL player? I can tell you that it's not as long as this team has been around.

There are teams much younger than the Texans that are thriving right now.

Bigbots, don't worry. Kubiak will probably get another chance in Denver. I hear Colorado is a great place to live. Your family should be content there.

HTown2ATX
12-15-2010, 01:42 PM
I think most of the "Fire Kubiak" gang has made really good points and pontificated exponentially the grand failure we are witnessing before us. There are way too many points to bring up and go back over, but I really have not seen many posters just post some garbage that makes no sense as to why we should fire Kubiak.

I have however seen, IMO mind you, crazy stretches of the imagination that try to somehow make everything seem ok. Some of these posts are so whacky you either need to be Tim Burton or Ozzy to understand them and take them to be legit.

Personally I want him fired. I think I have made that obvious in my posts. But, I defended him against the haters last year and a good portion of this year and finally saw the light. I'm not a vehement hater of the man. Personally I think it's funny how everyone is throwing fecal matter at each other. It's better than a good old fashioned craigslist flame war in the rant and rave section. Hell, I even got my first neg rep for posting a picture of a carebear for goodness sakes lol.

Anyway, it kind of came off to me that if we were in the "Fire Kubiak Gang" as opposed to the "Sunshine Guild" we were irrational and probably couldn't hold a conversation or something...... :lol:

Bigbots_02
12-15-2010, 01:48 PM
I have been waiting for a solid case to be made for keeping Kubiak as head coach...and I'm still waiting.

Sorry, OP, but there was not even an ounce of credible evidence presented to make a case for Kubiak.

Does four years of 5-7 ring a bell? Is is this the standard that you really set for your team? It is not even mediocre, but clearly the sign of a losing franchise. You simply cannot present a solid argument for happily accepting 5-7 four years in a row.



Are you for real? No offense, this statement is the epitome of accepting the loser mentality.

There is an old saying, Parcells maybe?, that statistics are for losers and scoreboard is for winners. And he also said you are what your record is, and in this case, Gary Kubiak is a losing head coach after five seasons.



So after all your insinuations about those that no longer want Kubiak as our head coach, the only difference between you and the rest of us is that you're patient for another year? Seriously, man, you just torpedoed your entire premise with this confession.



Fantastic post. I have requested, and continue to wait patiently, for ANY convincing argument to be presented on behalf of keeping Kubiak. The simple fact is that his body of work as a head coach overwhelms any attempts to defend the guy's losing record.

Blame the players! Well who picked the players?

Blame the coordinators! Well who picked the assistance coaches?

Blame the GM! Well who picked the GM?

No matter how you slice and dice it, the five years of losing and mediocrity represents one person.

1st... Kubiak gets one more year from me because this is his 1st season with a record worse then his previous. For me, so long as there was improvement, I can roll with those punches.

2nd... Im not sure but I think it stated on the title read BEFORE you respond. Clearly, you didn't. Any and every arguement that you've brought to the table has already been brought by someone else and I responded already. He might not like it, but its the truth... maybe just my truth

3rd... I dont give a flying F#%& about what Bill Parcells and HIS thoughts of winning, losing, winners or losers. You might not like the speed of the progression but it is what it is and until THIS season, when did Kubiak have a worse one.

4th... Since when did we start judging a season by how they start and not the overall product? Hell, you can go 8 and 0 then take a S^&* and end up 8-8... would you RATHER do that although its the same as 5-7 and ending up 8-8?

This is Chess not Checkers people. Its more to the move then whats right infront of you.

gary
12-15-2010, 01:49 PM
If this team is still new, when do they become old?

Bigbots_02
12-15-2010, 01:53 PM
I think most of the "Fire Kubiak" gang has made really good points and pontificated exponentially the grand failure we are witnessing before us. There are way too many points to bring up and go back over, but I really have not seen many posters just post some garbage that makes no sense as to why we should fire Kubiak.

I have however seen, IMO mind you, crazy stretches of the imagination that try to somehow make everything seem ok. Some of these posts are so whacky you either need to be Tim Burton or Ozzy to understand them and take them to be legit.

Personally I want him fired. I think I have made that obvious in my posts. But, I defended him against the haters last year and a good portion of this year and finally saw the light. I'm not a vehement hater of the man. Personally I think it's funny how everyone is throwing fecal matter at each other. It's better than a good old fashioned craigslist flame war in the rant and rave section. Hell, I even got my first neg rep for posting a picture of a carebear for goodness sakes lol.

Anyway, it kind of came off to me that if we were in the "Fire Kubiak Gang" as opposed to the "Sunshine Guild" we were irrational and probably couldn't hold a conversation or something...... :lol:

For ME... Its next year. Once again, My logic is this is his 1st slump as far as overall record. If we are not at like 10-6 next year and or not in the playoffs... Id be in the club house with you.

Bigbots_02
12-15-2010, 01:54 PM
If this team is still new, when do they become old?

lol, correction... youngest franchise in the league

Hervoyel
12-15-2010, 01:57 PM
Gary Kubiak has failed in his attempt to turn the Houston Texans into a playoff contender and a solid, consistent winner despite being given 5 years and all the control one could reasonably ask for to do so.

That's my reason. It is an undeniable fact.

Now you can take the details of these 5 seasons and spin them into a decent argument for either burning Kubiak at the stake or giving him a lifetime contract depending on your agenda but I don't want to hear that shit at this stage. He's had 5 years and hasn't even sniffed the kind of success that Marvin Lewis in Cincinnati has enjoyed.

He failed. It's over (or will be in 3 more weeks). No playoffs in 5 years means not good enough.

Hookem Horns
12-15-2010, 01:59 PM
I dont give a flying F#%& about what Bill Parcells and HIS thoughts of winning, losing, winners or losers.

Then you're on the wrong site. Here you go.

www.detroitlionsforum.com/forums

Bigbots_02
12-15-2010, 02:01 PM
Then you're on the wrong site. Here you go.

www.detroitlionsforum.com/forums

lmao... now THATS funny

HTown2ATX
12-15-2010, 02:06 PM
Gary Kubiak has failed in his attempt to turn the Houston Texans into a playoff contender and a solid, consistent winner despite being given 5 years and all the control one could reasonably ask for to do so.

That's my reason. It is an undeniable fact.

Now you can take the details of these 5 seasons and spin them into a decent argument for either burning Kubiak at the stake or giving him a lifetime contract depending on your agenda but I don't want to hear that shit at this stage. He's had 5 years and hasn't even sniffed the kind of success that Marvin Lewis in Cincinnati has enjoyed.

He failed. It's over (or will be in 3 more weeks). No playoffs in 5 years means not good enough.


Herv I hear ya man and agree with you....I just would stay away from the Bungles in this one. I know they finally got to the playoffs a couple times but that seems to have just been a little blip on the radar as they are back to being garbage. Totally agree with you and would actually point to the Saints is all I'm saying....SB baby...that's what I want!!!

Hervoyel
12-15-2010, 02:12 PM
I know, I was trying to highlight how slow and plodding the improvement we have seen was. Dick LeBeau left the Bengals following a 2-14 season (sounds familiar) which was preceeded by a 6-10 season so clearly the Bengals sucked. Lewis showed up and hung up 8-8, 8-8, 11-5, 8-8 in that order before Palmer got crunched up and they fell to 7-9, 4-11 (season with Fitz at QB) and then 10-6 with Palmer back. Now they're 2-11 with the Ochocinco-Owens virus infecting their locker room but they'll be back. These events all transpired in a division with the Steelers and the Ravens steadily kicking peoples asses so......

Kubiak can't even hold Marvin Lewis's clipboard. Sean Payton wouldn't even let Gary be the ball boy for the Saints (regardless of his resume and past experience in that position).

Bigbots_02
12-15-2010, 02:15 PM
Gary Kubiak has failed in his attempt to turn the Houston Texans into a playoff contender and a solid, consistent winner despite being given 5 years and all the control one could reasonably ask for to do so.

That's my reason. It is an undeniable fact.

Now you can take the details of these 5 seasons and spin them into a decent argument for either burning Kubiak at the stake or giving him a lifetime contract depending on your agenda but I don't want to hear that shit at this stage. He's had 5 years and hasn't even sniffed the kind of success that Marvin Lewis in Cincinnati has enjoyed.

He failed. It's over (or will be in 3 more weeks). No playoffs in 5 years means not good enough.

I see your point and agree but once again... Its not just gonna happen over night. You cant get to the moon on a bicycle (en less your ET) Im not sure but I thing Kubiak took over with a record of 2-14. Once again, your goal and my goal are the same but the difference is, I see more steps having to be made to get there.

This is Kubiak road

You come in and impliment your system. 1st year they learn it. You dont know who can until you stop trying to learn it and start trying to execute your system. The next season, you keep what you can and bring in others that you feel are able fit your scheme. you have your ups and downs along the way. Later you find out your defense is $#&* and thats why your standing still so you bring someone you think may be able to fill the role. Its not working the 1st half of the season but then clicks the 2nd half. You think your good to go for the next season and move forward. You start off great beating indy and washington only to find out that your D aint it

spurstexanstros
12-15-2010, 02:20 PM
My argument to keep Kubiak was that he made the team better and the team was progressing and moving forward. However the caviat I had for this season was that his regime better not take a step backwards or his job would be on the line. He and Smith made the decisions in the offseason to roll with the young secondary and that decision could cost them their jobs.

I dont think Kubiak will be fired because of the CBA uncertainty and he shouldnt be fired unless they know they can get someone better. ( Cowher, Gruden, Fisher etc etc) I think a billionaire can secretly find that out before firing current HC. I am afraid we will fire Kubes and start out with another inexperianced HC or retread that hasnt had much better luck.

Shoot for Cowher and get Dennis Green....what kinda fortune do you think the Texans will have in that lottery?

Yeah I thought so.
I reserve judgment till season is completely over.

IlliniJen
12-15-2010, 02:21 PM
I'm at the point with the Texans and their fans that if you still think Kubiak can get this team over the hump, you're either being intellectually dishonest or have a slight case of Down's.

TexCanada
12-15-2010, 02:24 PM
I see your point and agree but once again... Its not just gonna happen over night. You cant get to the moon on a bicycle (en less your ET) Im not sure but I thing Kubiak took over with a record of 2-14. Once again, your goal and my goal are the same but the difference is, I see more steps having to be made to get there.

This is Kubiak road

You come in and impliment your system. 1st year they learn it. You dont know who can until you stop trying to learn it and start trying to execute your system. The next season, you keep what you can and bring in others that you feel are able fit your scheme. you have your ups and downs along the way. Later you find out your defense is $#&* and thats why your standing still so you bring someone you think may be able to fill the role. Its not working the 1st half of the season but then clicks the 2nd half. You think your good to go for the next season and move forward. You start off great beating indy and washington only to find out that your D aint it

I think you analogy here is spot on, but your interpretation of it is a little off. The moon is the Superbowl. Kubiak is the bicycle.

Bigbots_02
12-15-2010, 02:27 PM
My argument to keep Kubiak was that he made the team better and the team was progressing and moving forward. However the caviat I had for this season was that his regime better not take a step backwards or his job would be on the line. He and Smith made the decisions in the offseason to roll with the young secondary and that decision could cost them their jobs.

I dont think Kubiak will be fired because of the CBA uncertainty and he shouldnt be fired unless they know they can get someone better. ( Cowher, Gruden, Fisher etc etc) I think a billionaire can secretly find that out before firing current HC. I am afraid we will fire Kubes and start out with another inexperianced HC or retread that hasnt had much better luck.

Shoot for Cowher and get Dennis Green....what kinda fortune do you think the Texans will have in that lottery?

Yeah I thought so.
I reserve judgment till season is completely over.

Well, his team has taken a step back. people that didnt want him say get him outta here... People that dont mind him say, being that this is his 1st year moving backwards, he has 1 more year and if its not what we want he's gone.

I wouldnt mind moving forward with someone else... But I wanna know WHAT I M GETTING before I do it. You know what I mean. It seems like everyone here just wants to move on because there tired of losing and they think any new head coach would be a improvent. I dont

Thorn
12-15-2010, 02:28 PM
The only reason I can think of to keep Kubiak is McNair's track record in hiring head coaches. One could say, depending on who McNair hires next, we were better off with Kubiak, and there is always that possibility that it might be true.

I hope not, but it can happen. This is Houston after all.

I think I just scared myself. I'm shutting up now.

Mr. Texan
12-15-2010, 02:28 PM
another underachieving season under kubiak and more excuses :kubepalm:

HOU-TEX
12-15-2010, 02:29 PM
Ugh, I'm going to look at porn. :brickwall:

Bigbots_02
12-15-2010, 02:31 PM
I think you analogy here is spot on, but your interpretation of it is a little off. The moon is the Superbowl. Kubiak is the bicycle.

Its funny, I was thinking the same thing but didnt think anyone would notice or for that matter, even care to read it. Everyone wants him gone.

Rey
12-15-2010, 02:31 PM
I see your point and agree but once again... Its not just gonna happen over night. You cant get to the moon on a bicycle (en less your ET) Im not sure but I thing Kubiak took over with a record of 2-14. Once again, your goal and my goal are the same but the difference is, I see more steps having to be made to get there.

This is Kubiak road

You come in and impliment your system. 1st year they learn it. You dont know who can until you stop trying to learn it and start trying to execute your system. The next season, you keep what you can and bring in others that you feel are able fit your scheme. you have your ups and downs along the way. Later you find out your defense is $#&* and thats why your standing still so you bring someone you think may be able to fill the role. Its not working the 1st half of the season but then clicks the 2nd half. You think your good to go for the next season and move forward. You start off great beating indy and washington only to find out that your D aint it

I've been a Kubiak supporter since he got here. I defended the guy until after the Cowboys game this season.

I'm not one to hold his early records against him. I think he took over a terrible team that needed a complete overhaul. I don't think he had as many things go his way as some other coaches did.

That said, he has not taken his coaching to the next level and there really is not argument against that.

Kubiak has gotten some better players since he got here, but his coaching has only gotten marginally better. The team still plays the exact same way as they always have.

We still suck against top level teams. We still make crucial mental mistakes. We still fold under pressure. The defense still sucks.

It's beyond the record for me and it always has been.

This team does not consistently play winning football. Even in some of the games that we've won, we have looked awful for the most part.

If you look at the Skins game, we were terrible that day. A few guys stepped up in clutch moments and we were able to win...But as a team, we sucked...And we were kind of fortunate that their kicker missed the second kick...

Too often we come out looking flat and unprepared. Too often we have to dig ourselves out of huge holes because opposing teams come out and jump on our necks.

This stuff is a trend. This stuff has been happening for a while under Kubiak.

Beat up on some of the weaker teams. Look like a step child when going against good teams or other teams on your level.

Enough is enough. At some point you have to look at how the team is playing and ask yourself "why in hell do I believe that Kubiak will have this team playing any differently next season?"

There is absolutely no reason I have heard to make me believe Kubiak will have these guys coming out and tearing up opponents next year or consistently playing good football.

Bigbots_02
12-15-2010, 02:36 PM
Ok ok... So heres a question. Everyone wants something... someone better. My question is simple. WHO? Someone that might actually come.

When you think about this, think about our personell...

Our offensive line, defensive line, secondary, wide outs ect...

Now think how would THAT person use them

I also would like to know if you even think that person COULD use them

And knowing what we have, will they us these people to there potential and ability

Second Honeymoon
12-15-2010, 02:38 PM
Ill Start by saying this...

If you respond and you feel oposite (I ALREADY KNOW YOU DO) Please, have legitimate reasoning as to why. And if you don't... then just say you dont have faith in Kubiak.

You people are irrational. Have any of you ever heard the expression: A PERSON is smart, but PEOPLE are stupid.
I say this because as individuals, you could probably hold a decent conversation but get a group of you that all have a similar objective together, and you can't be reasoned with. Someone would be better off drinking gun powder then lighting a match and swallowing it.:mariopalm: That's what everyone of you that sit and complain about Kubiak remind me of.

You can feel how you do, your entitled to it... but to neglect an obvious truth is completely ridiculous. Here are some facts.

Fact: We had HIGH EXPECTATIONS to become playoff contenders this year

(Response) EVERY FRANCHISE has High expectations the next year! I trult believe we really SHOULD have a record of like 9-4

Fact: We have UNDERACHIEVED as a football team this year

(Response) Once again, should be 9-4, No argument... but en less your at the top of your division, your going to feel that way. (Cleveland and Detroit excluded):barman:

SUPER FACT: Our defense is DREADFUL!!!:mariopalm:(This is a big one)

(Response) ITS TRUE! I can't deny that. However, you want to fire the head coach Kubiak. You gather like a cult and post it countless times a day on almost every thread that has to do with the Houston Texans... That doesn't make any sense to me. However, I DO understand at the end of the day everyone really just wants to win. I personally would go after to the source of our direct problems. I think it's Defensive Coordinator Frank Bush. If it's his coaching that's causing the problem then get him out of there. However, If its the players that aren't capable of executing the designed play, get them out of there. Where your problem is, that's what you fix. This is BASIC problem solving. You don't throw a TV away because your remote is broken! You get a new remote!:headhurts: There is nothing wrong with kubiak! He is very capable and if you throw him away because of THIS you'll regret not having the positive that he DOES bring to the table.

Fact: SOME of the play calling has been questionable

(Response) The keyword in that is SOME. But here is my question... Where YOU in the meetings and in the huddles and listening to the plays being called to truly know who's really at fault? None of us where. However, the people that know the facts still have individuals in the position they are in. THIS applies to Kubiak. If Mcnair KNOWS that kubiak isn't doing his job correctly and isn't making good judgment calls MOST of the time... get him out of there. If Kubiak KNOWS that someone under him isn't performing to expectation after the necessary tools are given, get them out of there.

If you just don't believe in Kubiak fine. But what are you going to more towards? Fire Kubiak if you know what your getting and you like it. But if you don't, why do it? I Wouldn't... Because here is what I believe... Eventually, Kubiak will be gone... but those players who keep falling, and blowing coverages and dropping balls and making bad decisions will still be there. Some of the problems will be fixed. However, Some of the abilities will all take for granted will be lost... Like our offense. IF the incoming coach keeps key players and components of our offense after Kubiak is gone, then the POTENTIAL will still be there. But I doubt he will... And I doubt his offense will be anywhere near as potent.

dude, you suck. just sayin. lemme guess, you thought Carr just needed an offensive line too, huh?

Kubiak sucks and your take does too. You are the epitome of lameo carebear loser Texans fan.

Bigbots_02
12-15-2010, 02:40 PM
I've been a Kubiak supporter since he got here. I defended the guy until after the Cowboys game this season.

I'm not one to hold his early records against him. I think he took over a terrible team that needed a complete overhaul. I don't think he had as many things go his way as some other coaches did.

That said, he has not taken his coaching to the next level and there really is not argument against that.

Kubiak has gotten some better players since he got here, but his coaching has only gotten marginally better. The team still plays the exact same way as they always have.

We still suck against top level teams. We still make crucial mental mistakes. We still fold under pressure. The defense still sucks.

It's beyond the record for me and it always has been.

This team does not consistently play winning football. Even in some of the games that we've won, we have looked awful for the most part.

If you look at the Skins game, we were terrible that day. A few guys stepped up in clutch moments and we were able to win...But as a team, we sucked...And we were kind of fortunate that their kicker missed the second kick...

Too often we come out looking flat and unprepared. Too often we have to dig ourselves out of huge holes because opposing teams come out and jump on our necks.

This stuff is a trend. This stuff has been happening for a while under Kubiak.

Beat up on some of the weaker teams. Look like a step child when going against good teams or other teams on your level.

Enough is enough. At some point you have to look at how the team is playing and ask yourself "why in hell do I believe that Kubiak will have this team playing any differently next season?"

There is absolutely no reason I have heard to make me believe Kubiak will have these guys coming out and tearing up opponents next year or consistently playing good football.

Completly understandable... So I ask again... who do we want for the personell we have.

Texanmike02
12-15-2010, 02:40 PM
This thread is dumb. It should be merged into one of the 900 other Fire Kubiak threads.

Oh, and your tv analogy was funny. I'm dealing with something along those lines. My tv is working fine, but I've had it for like 15 years. No problems with it. However, all of the programming these days is in widescreen, 16 x 9 dimensions. Even old school re-runs. Even old shows on my screen show up with the edges totally blocked off. I was watching a re-run of The Office the other day. It was a scene where two people were sitting across from each other in an office. On my screen, all I could see was a desk. The two people on the scene were cut off because of my old-school tv.

So, even though my tv works fine, I'm going to have to get rid of it because current programming has moved on.



If you're watching it on a cable box you should look at a way to change the format it is presented in. Could save you from getting a new TV. Sure you'll have the black bars on the top and bottom but its better than staring at a desk for 3 minutes straight.

Mike

bckey
12-15-2010, 02:40 PM
I don't need a reason to explain myself. However, if one is needed, it's that I've been watching the NFL (old AFL) in Houston since the late 60s and I am getting ****ing impatient.

I'm also getting a tad more grumpier in my old age, so add that to the impatient part and I want Kubiak gone and don't need multiple paragraphs to explain it all.


This^

HoustonFrog
12-15-2010, 02:42 PM
I see your point and agree but once again... Its not just gonna happen over night. You cant get to the moon on a bicycle (en less your ET) Im not sure but I thing Kubiak took over with a record of 2-14. Once again, your goal and my goal are the same but the difference is, I see more steps having to be made to get there.

This is Kubiak road

You come in and impliment your system. 1st year they learn it. You dont know who can until you stop trying to learn it and start trying to execute your system. The next season, you keep what you can and bring in others that you feel are able fit your scheme. you have your ups and downs along the way. Later you find out your defense is $#&* and thats why your standing still so you bring someone you think may be able to fill the role. Its not working the 1st half of the season but then clicks the 2nd half. You think your good to go for the next season and move forward. You start off great beating indy and washington only to find out that your D aint it

You do know that the Falcons coach came in when Vick was going to jail. They just had a coach quit. They had players who wanted out. The first year after they went to the playoffs. Now many thought that was just luck, an anomoly. However here they are vying for the #1 spot in the NFC. Kubes has the most tenure in the league without a playoff win. The guys hired when he was and many after have been to the playoffs. So this whole notion that he is just finding his groove with the right players is bunk.

disaacks3
12-15-2010, 02:43 PM
I see your point and agree but once again... Its not just gonna happen over night. You cant get to the moon on a bicycle (en less your ET) Im not sure but I thing Kubiak took over with a record of 2-14. Once again, your goal and my goal are the same but the difference is, I see more steps having to be made to get there.

This is Kubiak road

You come in and impliment your system. 1st year they learn it. You dont know who can until you stop trying to learn it and start trying to execute your system. The next season, you keep what you can and bring in others that you feel are able fit your scheme. you have your ups and downs along the way. Later you find out your defense is $#&* and thats why your standing still so you bring someone you think may be able to fill the role. Its not working the 1st half of the season but then clicks the 2nd half. You think your good to go for the next season and move forward. You start off great beating indy and washington only to find out that your D aint it

1. Are you sure you're not Bob McNair?

2. FIVE YEARS - Most coaches get FOUR to get to the playoffs no matter the previous season's record.

3. Kubiak got the people he wanted in the Front Office and as coordinators. As he frequesntly states..."It's on him!"

4. Slow non-motivated play early in games - This shows lack of focus. Who's job is it to motivate the players? That's right... Gary Kubiak!

5. Kubiak DECIDED to "go young" in the Secondary this year - Nobody MADE him / Rick Smith do this.

6. Does anybody think that Jimmy Johnson, Bill Cowher, Bill Parcells, Tony Dungy couldn't get the Texans to the playoffs in 5 years?

TexCanada
12-15-2010, 02:45 PM
I wouldnt mind moving forward with someone else... But I wanna know WHAT I M GETTING before I do it. You know what I mean. It seems like everyone here just wants to move on because there tired of losing and they think any new head coach would be a improvent. I dont


I already answered this question at the beginning of the thread.


I think we all fully realize that bringing in a new coach is not necessarily going to make us a better team. It is quite possible that we become worse and end up a total mess again. It is also possible that a new coach can take us to playoffs. All of us in the "Fire Kubiak" club want him gone (and other staff members as well) because this franchise has gone stagnant. I would rather take a risk on a new coach and win 4 games next year then sit through another Kubiak-led 8-8 season.

Bigbots_02
12-15-2010, 02:45 PM
dude, you suck. just sayin. lemme guess, you thought Carr just needed an offensive line too, huh?

Kubiak sucks and your take does too. You are the epitome of lameo carebear loser Texans fan.

I actually hated carr from the jump... he had his moments but thats all they were... moments. As far as my opinion well...you dont like it you dont like it but judge by your response, yours is the one that really sucks. I bet if you said why you didnt want kubiak it wasnt because of his record it be a matter of opinion... which to you is why mine sucks.

So to you... Who do you want as head coach and why?

Rey
12-15-2010, 02:47 PM
Completly understandable... So I ask again... who do we want for the personell we have.



If I'm being cheated on, I don't worry about finding my next lover until I get rid of my current one.

First step is to fire Kubiak.

Next step is to see who's available and who we can get.

Until we fire Kubiak, I can't even seriously discuss other head coaching possibilities. But that's just me.

Pollardized
12-15-2010, 02:48 PM
My sister USED to have a hot ass. You oughta see it now.

Got any pictures????

gary
12-15-2010, 02:51 PM
I actually hated carr from the jump... he had his moments but thats all they were... moments. As far as my opinion well...you dont like it you dont like it but judge by your response, yours is the one that really sucks. I bet if you said why you didnt want kubiak it wasnt because of his record it be a matter of opinion... which to you is why mine sucks.

So to you... Who do you want as head coach and why?A top HC bcause if you have not gotten the hint this current one has had five seasons of nada and is headed for a sixth.

Pollardized
12-15-2010, 02:53 PM
Ugh, I'm going to look at porn. :brickwall:

I hear cdollaz's sister is hot. trying to score some pics from him.... :mail:

HTown2ATX
12-15-2010, 02:55 PM
I hear cdollaz's sister is hot. trying to score some pics from him.... :mail:


lol...i don't remember who it was but they posted a pic of their sister holding a baby....YEOWZA.....

:bubbles:

Bigbots_02
12-15-2010, 02:57 PM
If I'm being cheated on, I don't worry about finding my next lover until I get rid of my current one.

First step is to fire Kubiak.

Next step is to see who's available and who we can get.

Until we fire Kubiak, I can't even seriously discuss other head coaching possibilities. But that's just me.

And THATS what Im afraidof... not being prepared

Hervoyel
12-15-2010, 02:58 PM
I see your point and agree but once again... Its not just gonna happen over night. You cant get to the moon on a bicycle (en less your ET) Im not sure but I thing Kubiak took over with a record of 2-14. Once again, your goal and my goal are the same but the difference is, I see more steps having to be made to get there.

This is Kubiak road

You come in and impliment your system. 1st year they learn it. You dont know who can until you stop trying to learn it and start trying to execute your system. The next season, you keep what you can and bring in others that you feel are able fit your scheme. you have your ups and downs along the way. Later you find out your defense is $#&* and thats why your standing still so you bring someone you think may be able to fill the role. Its not working the 1st half of the season but then clicks the 2nd half. You think your good to go for the next season and move forward. You start off great beating indy and washington only to find out that your D aint it

In my post just prior to this (responding to HTown2ATX) I pointed out that Marvin Lewis took over a team that was also 2-14 and then proceeded to post records of 8-8, 8-8, and then 11-5 with a playoff trip. In 5 years (not 3, not 4, but now 5 years) Kubiak has not been able to get close to a playoff game without a ticket.

He is the longest tenured coach in the NFL without a trip to the playoffs on his resume if I'm not mistaken. The league is filled with good coaches and bad coaches. Good coaches win more than they lose and go to the playoffs. Sometimes they take their teams all the way to the Super Bowl. Bad coaches get fired or fail to improve their team enough to reach the playoffs. This is a simple question with a simple answer. Has Gary Kubiak improved this team enough to get to the playoffs and compete for a championship?

Take your time, use your lifeline if you need to.

The answer should be "No, he has not" and that's all that matters. 5 years is more than most players get to play in the NFL. We aren't working in a timeless vacuum here. Every year we have Andre Johnson on this team at this point is just plain good luck. Any play, any week could end his career. Any season we begin could find us looking at an AJ who is unfortunately slower and easier to cover than he was the previous year. That's the reality of the NFL for players. Waiting for Kubiak to prove that he can turn this thing around if given..... forever is wasting the best years of Andre Johnson's career. Are we going to waste Arian Fosters best years too? He's got even less time to shine in this sport being a RB.

It's time to bring in a man who knows how to do this to lead this team. It was a nice experiment and if it had worked out we would be set for a long time with our "Holy Grail" home grown franchise coach. It hasn't though and we need to get a proven successful head coach in here while we have solid pieces in place. We're far less appealing a destination once AJ gets old and Arian has a knee surgery or two.

Bigbots_02
12-15-2010, 02:59 PM
A top HC bcause if you have not gotten the hint this current one has had five seasons of nada and is headed for a sixth.

Sure... so who? Anyone can say a better one.

Our average weight as a offensive line in the lightes in the NFL... Who do you think could do something with that?

Pollardized
12-15-2010, 03:00 PM
Sure... so who? Anyone can say a better one.

Our average weight as a offensive line in the lightes in the NFL... Who do you think could do something with that?

I could. Fire their skinny asses and hire new ones with some meat on their bones, passion for the game and balls...

Bigbots_02
12-15-2010, 03:02 PM
In my post just prior to this (responding to HTown2ATX) I pointed out that Marvin Lewis took over a team that was also 2-14 and then proceeded to post records of 8-8, 8-8, and then 11-5 with a playoff trip. In 5 years (not 3, not 4, but now 5 years) Kubiak has not been able to get close to a playoff game without a ticket.

He is the longest tenured coach in the NFL without a trip to the playoffs on his resume if I'm not mistaken. The league is filled with good coaches and bad coaches. Good coaches win more than they lose and go to the playoffs. Sometimes they take their teams all the way to the Super Bowl. Bad coaches get fired or fail to improve their team enough to reach the playoffs. This is a simple question with a simple answer. Has Gary Kubiak improved this team enough to get to the playoffs and compete for a championship?

Take your time, use your lifeline if you need to.

The answer should be "No, he has not" and that's all that matters. 5 years is more than most players get to play in the NFL. We aren't working in a timeless vacuum here. Every year we have Andre Johnson on this team at this point is just plain good luck. Any play, any week could end his career. Any season we begin could find us looking at an AJ who is unfortunately slower and easier to cover than he was the previous year. That's the reality of the NFL for players. Waiting for Kubiak to prove that he can turn this thing around if given..... forever is wasting the best years of Andre Johnson's career. Are we going to waste Arian Fosters best years too? He's got even less time to shine in this sport being a RB.

It's time to bring in a man who knows how to do this to lead this team. It was a nice experiment and if it had worked out we would be set for a long time with our "Holy Grail" home grown franchise coach. It hasn't though and we need to get a proven successful head coach in here while we have solid pieces in place. We're far less appealing a destination once AJ gets old and Arian has a knee surgery or two.

True, Iv thought about that myself. So who can take this team as it is and bring it to the nest level?

gary
12-15-2010, 03:04 PM
Sure... so who? Anyone can say a better one.

Our average weight as a offensive line in the lightes in the NFL... Who do you think could do something with that?Now your just throwing out there the entire staff should go including the strenth and conditioning coach.

HTown2ATX
12-15-2010, 03:05 PM
lameo carebear

Here's what earned my neg rep and got me on someone's ignore list i think.....lol

----------------------

always keep believing Jimmy!!

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/__ykb2FvxfgI/SJ0er6kEQ7I/AAAAAAAABfo/-e_LEelTcQs/s400/carebear.jpg

Oh no Jimmy, here come those posters "blinded by rage" that spout reality that the team is not that good....

http://images-mediawiki-sites.thefullwiki.org/09/1/9/7/52527612146131642.png

Doing this motion now at this....

http://www.cathrynbeeksordeal.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/09/shake_weight_for_men-300x219.jpg

Hookem Horns
12-15-2010, 03:05 PM
True, Iv thought about that myself. So who can take this team as it is and bring it to the nest level?

You obviously would not hire someone you knew could not do it. So why would you keep someone who has already proven they cannot?

So moving on to someone else is kinda of a no brainer if you ask me.

Hervoyel
12-15-2010, 03:06 PM
Sure... so who? Anyone can say a better one.

Our average weight as a offensive line in the lightes in the NFL... Who do you think could do something with that?

Bill Cowher could do something with that. In this hypothetical situation I see him going the Tony Dungy route and keeping Dennison on as his OC for at least a year. Keep the same system in place because it's successful, make it understood that we're not going to be pulling that cute garbage out of our asses all the time or going on throwing binges and forgetting that we have one of the best RB's in the game in our backfield. Imagine this offense with a somewhat less erratic personality in charge.

Obviously his focus following that would then be the defense.

Bigbots_02
12-15-2010, 03:08 PM
I could. Fire their skinny asses and hire new ones with some meat on their bones, passion for the game and balls...

And anwsers like that is why kubiak is still here. As a owner, I would want to know what Im moving forward with... what I have to look forward to. How much money its going to cost me. Maybe he's still here because there are no promises as to whos available... as to whats really going to happen next season... if theres gonna be a hold out. Id rather go into a season with a atleast half way decent one then without one at all.

Kubiaks not a world beater or anoything like that in my eyes... I just think at this time hes still useable... I KNOW... its just me

HTown2ATX
12-15-2010, 03:08 PM
Ugh, I'm going to look at porn. :brickwall:


Build those forearms up Popeye style!!!!!! Eff some spinach...do it the fun way..... :jam:

:lol:

http://www.cathrynbeeksordeal.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/09/shake_weight_for_men-300x219.jpg

scourge
12-15-2010, 03:09 PM
This is a new franchise and kubiak has made progress each and every season with the exception of this one. Thats WHY he's been here as long as he has. Improving talent around his stars, adding position depth of the team and improving the record every year EXCEPT this one. Whatever your scheme, the 1st year you learn it, the second year you execute and inforce it... When your not suceeding as he hoped you bring someone in that fits you scheme and can contribute. Its a learning curve and will slow you down but if the person IS capable, it will show once they stop havinf to learn it and start exectuing


:mariopalm:
New/youngest franchise has nothing to do with it at this point. Just about every player we have is one of his guys. Whether this teams has been around 9 seasons or 30 does not make a difference. Furthermore, 8-8 two consecutive years is NOT progress. 5-7 several consecutive years is NOT progress. Sure, you say 8-0 to 8-8 ends up the same either way, but 8-8 is still 8-8 no matter how you get there. I was a supporter until this year, though I have been questioning his sometimes moronic playcalling/clock management for years. Not utilizing the NFL's leading rusher more often is on him. Calling ridiculous plays during overtime is on him. Not being able to have his players do anything in the 1st half is on him. The Rosencopter fiasco game back on '08 was even on him. Yeah, seriously. Rosencopter was an i*diot during that play, but he shouldn't have been scrambling in the 1st place. That should've been a run play, not a pass. When we get the ball back, we still had the lead. Yet, we pass again. Not knowing when to use/not use a hurry up offense in on him. Hiring back to back failures as DC's is on him. As an offensive coordinator he is good. As a head coach he just doesn't have what it takes. I suppose you would've given Capers another 2 years to hit that 6 year mark you are giving Kubiak, too. Give another HC 4 years to see if he can do any better. 5 years and no playoffs in not acceptable.

gary
12-15-2010, 03:10 PM
A great coach would either figure would to do with the O line or get rid of them all.

Bigbots_02
12-15-2010, 03:12 PM
Bill Cowher could do something with that. In this hypothetical situation I see him going the Tony Dungy route and keeping Dennison on as his OC for at least a year. Keep the same system in place because it's successful, make it understood that we're not going to be pulling that cute garbage out of our asses all the time or going on throwing binges and forgetting that we have one of the best RB's in the game in our backfield. Imagine this offense with a somewhat less erratic personality in charge.

Obviously his focus following that would then be the defense.

I would LOVE this move IF he could make it woke like you say. Personally, when I think of Bill Cowher, I think of the stellers with a HUGE offensive line and simply running the ball non stop. The defense will improve because of the coaching but I personally dont see the offense staying the same... thus, Andre Johnson almost going to waste. Thats just me though but I would LOVE to be wrong.

scourge
12-15-2010, 03:13 PM
True, Iv thought about that myself. So who can take this team as it is and bring it to the nest level?

Cowher
Dungy
Hell, though I'm not all that fond of them even Fisher and Gruden could get us farther than Kubiak in less time than he's had. I think Fox could as well. Keep Dennison in that scenario and let Fox get the defense straightened out.

Second Honeymoon
12-15-2010, 03:17 PM
I actually hated carr from the jump... he had his moments but thats all they were... moments. As far as my opinion well...you dont like it you dont like it but judge by your response, yours is the one that really sucks. I bet if you said why you didnt want kubiak it wasnt because of his record it be a matter of opinion... which to you is why mine sucks.

So to you... Who do you want as head coach and why?

If you think Kubiak deserves to stay, I don't really care to even talk to you.

it's like spitting in the wind bothering with people like yourself.

i haven't liked Kubiak since Day One so put that in your pipe and smoke it

cheap hire, hometown 'hero', and a bad head coach...typical McNair

you know why I don't want Kubiak? because I have eyes. You see i have these things that I use...never mind.

you know why I think Kubiak should be fired? screw his losing record...its because he sucks and I have 5 years of tape to prove it. what else do I need? but whatever, throw a party for the guy....some people these days....

as for who I want...I want the best candidate available. period. but based on our franchise's track record we don't get the best candidate at anything except being mediocre and being a festering boil of embarassment for this city.

now go drink your koolaid and take your posts and go to the 'official' fan forum where myopia and denial are the soup du jour. I am trying to be civil but when I am dealing with this type of drivel, I will just try and not start a flame war.

oh...Kubiak still sucks irregardless of how many excuses or what rationale you use.

He is a LOSER for 5 years running...can you get through that clouded melon? geez. how many games does this guy have to lose before he gets run?

THE GUY COULDN"T EVEN TELL THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN 1/2 YARD AND 1 1/2 YARDS!! ON 4TH DOWN...WITH GAME ON THE LINE!! STOP BEING SUCH A FREAKING MORON.....PLEASE!

scourge
12-15-2010, 03:19 PM
I would LOVE this move IF he could make it woke like you say. Personally, when I think of Bill Cowher, I think of the stellers with a HUGE offensive line and simply running the ball non stop. The defense will improve because of the coaching but I personally dont see the offense staying the same... thus, Andre Johnson almost going to waste. Thats just me though but I would LOVE to be wrong.

Could Kubiak take Cowher's teams and bring in his coordinators and produce the same results? Not freakin' likely.

You're right, Hines Ward sure did suffer under Cowher... :rolleyes:


Also of note, I have been vocal of my stance on NOT wanting to switch to the 3-4, which Cowher would probably want to do. However, at this point I just don't care anymore.

Bigbots_02
12-15-2010, 03:22 PM
:mariopalm:
New/youngest franchise has nothing to do with it at this point. Just about every player we have is one of his guys. Whether this teams has been around 9 seasons or 30 does not make a difference. Furthermore, 8-8 two consecutive years is NOT progress. 5-7 several consecutive years is NOT progress. Sure, you say 8-0 to 8-8 ends up the same either way, but 8-8 is still 8-8 no matter how you get there. I was a supporter until this year, though I have been questioning his sometimes moronic playcalling/clock management for years. Not utilizing the NFL's leading rusher more often is on him. Calling ridiculous plays during overtime is on him. Not being able to have his players do anything in the 1st half is on him. The Rosencopter fiasco game back on '08 was even on him. Yeah, seriously. Rosencopter was an i*diot during that play, but he shouldn't have been scrambling in the 1st place. That should've been a run play, not a pass. When we get the ball back, we still had the lead. Yet, we pass again. Not knowing when to use/not use a hurry up offense in on him. Hiring back to back failures as DC's is on him. As an offensive coordinator he is good. As a head coach he just doesn't have what it takes. I suppose you would've given Capers another 2 years to hit that 6 year mark you are giving Kubiak, too. Give another HC 4 years to see if he can do any better. 5 years and no playoffs in not acceptable.

The funny thing about play calling is... people on have something bad to say when its doesnt work. Yes, the play call was on him. These things are going to happen to ANY coach whether you run or pass. If you fumble on a run when you pass game was doing fine they'll say (you shoulda ran) when you get picked and you where only in the game because of your passing because you fell behind in the score they;ll say (you shoulda ran) But your right, in this instance, they should have slow things down once they got the ball back in OT and ran. HOWEVER... I remember Rosencopter game however... NO ONE told him to JUMP! Now I dont have to be in the huddle or listen to play calling to know that! THAT... is not Kubiaks fault. Personally, Im tired of defending the guy but THAT... I couldnt help but say something.

HTown2ATX
12-15-2010, 03:24 PM
Bigbots_02 I give you credit that at least you are taking it and keep going man. You're getting Pacquiaou'ed in there but you aint going down.....

Lot of other posters would have bailed by now...:goodluck:

Bigbots_02
12-15-2010, 03:25 PM
Now your just throwing out there the entire staff should go including the strenth and conditioning coach.

lmao!.. no, their not light because their weak. Its the scheme

Bigbots_02
12-15-2010, 03:26 PM
Bigbots_02 I give you credit that at least you are taking it and keep going man. You're getting Pacquiaou'ed in there but you aint going down.....

Lot of other posters would have bailed by now...:goodluck:

LMAO... Man, I AM pretty tired but dont worry. Next year if we underachieve. Ill be LEADING the charge!

scourge
12-15-2010, 03:27 PM
The funny thing about play calling is... people on have something bad to say when its doesnt work. Yes, the play call was on him. These things are going to happen to ANY coach whether you run or pass. If you fumble on a run when you pass game was doing fine they'll say (you shoulda ran) when you get picked and you where only in the game because of your passing because you fell behind in the score they;ll say (you shoulda ran) But your right, in this instance, they should have slow things down once they got the ball back in OT and ran. HOWEVER... I remember Rosencopter game however... NO ONE told him to JUMP! Now I dont have to be in the huddle or listen to play calling to know that! THAT... is not Kubiaks fault. Personally, Im tired of defending the guy but THAT... I couldnt help but say something.

With a decent lead towards the end of the game there was NO reason at all to call a pass play. That was Kubiak getting cute. THAT is on Kubiak. I said that Rosencopter was an i*diot for doing that, but he never should have been in that situation. When that failed horribly Kubiak yet again decides to have him pass which ends up being an INT that seals our fate. Sage was at fault, too, but should never have been put into either situation.

Mr. White
12-15-2010, 03:30 PM
I can't believe this thread made it to 7 pages.

Bigbots, I told you that you were arguing with about 90% of Texans fans. These guys can go on forever and there's only one of you.

You're arguing the same points that the "Fire Kubiak Gang" has been arguing against for 3 or 4 years now. You better hope that Thunderkyss comes in pretty soon so you can tag out.

Bigbots_02
12-15-2010, 03:31 PM
Could Kubiak take Cowher's teams and bring in his coordinators and produce the same results? Not freakin' likely.

You're right, Hines Ward sure did suffer under Cowher... :rolleyes:


Also of note, I have been vocal of my stance on NOT wanting to switch to the 3-4, which Cowher would probably want to do. However, at this point I just don't care anymore.

Thats what Im saying man... I understand people want to see change. I DO TOO trust me. We just gotta do it right and have our ducks in line. I believe (and this is just me) the way we're doing things... When we DO make it to the playoffs, its gonna be HARD to get us out AND hard to make us not repeat the next season... (If THIS personell pulls their head out their @$$'$)

HTown2ATX
12-15-2010, 03:33 PM
I can't believe this thread made it to 7 pages.

Bigbots, I told you that you were arguing with about 90% of Texans fans. These guys can go on forever and there's only one of you.

You're arguing the same points that the "Fire Kubiak Gang" has been arguing against for 3 or 4 years now. You better hope that Thunderkyss comes in pretty soon so you can tag out.

LMFAO......no seriously.....at least 3 people here at work looked at me when I laughed and it must have been loud too cause I have my head phones in.

I had the same thought earlier. Usually TK is ALL over this.

scourge
12-15-2010, 03:33 PM
Thats what Im saying man... I understand people want to see change. I DO TOO trust me. We just gotta do it right and have our ducks in line. I believe (and this is just me) the way we're doing things... When we DO make it to the playoffs, its gonna be HARD to get us out AND hard to make us not repeat the next season... (If THIS personell pulls their head out their @$$'$)

They've had 5 seasons to pull their heads out.

Bigbots_02
12-15-2010, 03:35 PM
With a decent lead towards the end of the game there was NO reason at all to call a pass play. That was Kubiak getting cute. THAT is on Kubiak. I said that Rosencopter was an i*diot for doing that, but he never should have been in that situation. When that failed horribly Kubiak yet again decides to have him pass which ends up being an INT that seals our fate. Sage was at fault, too, but should never have been put into either situation.

Mmmm. Sorry man, Im not eating that one. Think of our run game at the time. Now how EASY could it have been a 3 and out just running and giving the ball back to Manning. Sorry, you do BOTH to stay balance and unpredictable. UNFORTUNITLY... We unexpectedly fumbled. Plan and simple.

Mr. White
12-15-2010, 03:39 PM
LMFAO......no seriously.....at least 3 people here at work looked at me when I laughed and it must have been loud too cause I have my head phones in.

I had the same thought earlier. Usually TK is ALL over this.

That guy can argue with about 20 other people and respond with posts longer than a bank statement. I never can keep up.

Too bad I haven't seen him around here for at least a week.

Bigbots_02
12-15-2010, 03:40 PM
LMAO... So heres a question Once Kubiak is gone, what will the "Gang" do as far as Avatars?

gary
12-15-2010, 03:41 PM
The O line has cost us how many games this season?

IlliniJen
12-15-2010, 03:42 PM
LMAO... So heres a question Once Kubiak is gone, what will the "Gang" do as far as Avatars?

I already have my avatar ready for the post-Kubiak years. Please glance to the left.

Double Barrel
12-15-2010, 03:43 PM
1st... Kubiak gets one more year from me because this is his 1st season with a record worse then his previous. For me, so long as there was improvement, I can roll with those punches.


You think he's improving? Swim in the koolaid, bath in it, build your little Kubiak loveboat in the koolaid. You're delusional if you base your entire premise of "improvement" solely on some perceptions of incremental gains.

The results are the same year after year. No playoffs and perpetual mediocrity.

Quit letting the marketing department tell you what to think and use the logic part of your brain. Four straight seasons of 5-7 is indicative of something...hmmm..what could that be....can you even begin to comprehend it?

2nd... Im not sure but I think it stated on the title read BEFORE you respond. Clearly, you didn't. Any and every arguement that you've brought to the table has already been brought by someone else and I responded already. He might not like it, but its the truth... maybe just my truth

Give me a friggin' break. You think that just because you started a thread that you get to control the direction of it?? Not here you don't.

I did not bring any arguments. I brought FACTS, which are things that myopic Pollyanna fans like yourself seem to conveniently overlook when trying to push a goofy little mancrush on the rest of us.

I've figure you out, though. You just don't have an argument and are crying for attention. Congrats, you got what you wanted. :clap:

3rd... I dont give a flying F#%& about what Bill Parcells and HIS thoughts of winning, losing, winners or losers. You might not like the speed of the progression but it is what it is and until THIS season, when did Kubiak have a worse one.

Of course you don't care about Bill Parcells has to say, because he's a winner.

You have obviously cast your lot with losers, so be content with the mediocrity because you embrace it with everything you type.

4th... Since when did we start judging a season by how they start and not the overall product? Hell, you can go 8 and 0 then take a S^&* and end up 8-8... would you RATHER do that although its the same as 5-7 and ending up 8-8?

Overall product? How's this for results:

35-41


This is Chess not Checkers people. Its more to the move then whats right infront of you.

It's not chess or checkers, dude. IT'S FREAKIN' FOOTBALL!!!

They do have something in common, though: you play to win the games!

A concept that seems completely lost on you.

I'm still waiting for a solid debate why we should keep Kubiak. So far, you have provided absolutely NOTHING in that regard. Unfortunately, contrary to your perception, I have read everything that you have written here and I'm no better for wasting my time with any of it.

gary
12-15-2010, 03:44 PM
lmao... So heres a question once kubiak is gone, what will the "gang" do as far as avatars?go away

Bigbots_02
12-15-2010, 03:44 PM
That guy can argue with about 20 other people and respond with posts longer than a bank statement. I never can keep up.

Too bad I haven't seen him around here for at least a week.

lol... Im normally logged on just reading post but every it would seem every damn post I read now days is about FIRING KUBIAK. If everythings about firing him then I what ELSE is there to read about? I think the guys Defense 75% of the time SUCKS ok... But the Offense deserves some credit. thats all.
But if I hadent got tired of the Fire Kubiak threads, Id still be just here and there with comments.

Mr. White
12-15-2010, 03:44 PM
LMAO... So heres a question Once Kubiak is gone, what will the "Gang" do as far as Avatars?

Mine hasn't changed in 5 years. It'll stay the same no matter who's coaching or who's playing.

Thorn
12-15-2010, 03:46 PM
LMAO... So heres a question Once Kubiak is gone, what will the "Gang" do as far as Avatars?

The Sarge disapproves of you questioning him.

Bigbots_02
12-15-2010, 03:46 PM
Mine hasn't changed in 5 years. It'll stay the same no matter who's coaching or who's playing.

I was talkin bout the ones with the Soap "Fire Kubiak"

STEEL BLUE TEXANS
12-15-2010, 03:46 PM
There are still people that want Kubiak to coach the Texans. Here on this board we refer to them as Titans, Colts and Jags fans.

GP
12-15-2010, 03:48 PM
LMFAO......no seriously.....at least 3 people here at work looked at me when I laughed and it must have been loud too cause I have my head phones in.

I had the same thought earlier. Usually TK is ALL over this.

OMG! I also laughed VERY loud.

"You better hope that Thunderkyss comes in pretty soon so you can tag out."
-- Mr. White (perhaps one of the funniest one-liners. ever.)

Bigbots_02
12-15-2010, 03:48 PM
The O line has cost us how many games this season?

Are you asking or telling?

Surreal McCoy
12-15-2010, 03:49 PM
Ill Start by saying this...

If you respond and you feel oposite (I ALREADY KNOW YOU DO) Please, have legitimate reasoning as to why. And if you don't... then just say you dont have faith in Kubiak.

You people are irrational. Have any of you ever heard the expression: A PERSON is smart, but PEOPLE are stupid.
I say this because as individuals, you could probably hold a decent conversation but get a group of you that all have a similar objective together, and you can't be reasoned with. Someone would be better off drinking gun powder then lighting a match and swallowing it.:mariopalm: That's what everyone of you that sit and complain about Kubiak remind me of.

You can feel how you do, your entitled to it... but to neglect an obvious truth is completely ridiculous. Here are some facts.

Fact: We had HIGH EXPECTATIONS to become playoff contenders this year

(Response) EVERY FRANCHISE has High expectations the next year! I trult believe we really SHOULD have a record of like 9-4

Fact: We have UNDERACHIEVED as a football team this year

(Response) Once again, should be 9-4, No argument... but en less your at the top of your division, your going to feel that way. (Cleveland and Detroit excluded):barman:

SUPER FACT: Our defense is DREADFUL!!!:mariopalm:(This is a big one)

(Response) ITS TRUE! I can't deny that. However, you want to fire the head coach Kubiak. You gather like a cult and post it countless times a day on almost every thread that has to do with the Houston Texans... That doesn't make any sense to me. However, I DO understand at the end of the day everyone really just wants to win. I personally would go after to the source of our direct problems. I think it's Defensive Coordinator Frank Bush. If it's his coaching that's causing the problem then get him out of there. However, If its the players that aren't capable of executing the designed play, get them out of there. Where your problem is, that's what you fix. This is BASIC problem solving. You don't throw a TV away because your remote is broken! You get a new remote!:headhurts: There is nothing wrong with kubiak! He is very capable and if you throw him away because of THIS you'll regret not having the positive that he DOES bring to the table.

Fact: SOME of the play calling has been questionable

(Response) The keyword in that is SOME. But here is my question... Where YOU in the meetings and in the huddles and listening to the plays being called to truly know who's really at fault? None of us where. However, the people that know the facts still have individuals in the position they are in. THIS applies to Kubiak. If Mcnair KNOWS that kubiak isn't doing his job correctly and isn't making good judgment calls MOST of the time... get him out of there. If Kubiak KNOWS that someone under him isn't performing to expectation after the necessary tools are given, get them out of there.

If you just don't believe in Kubiak fine. But what are you going to more towards? Fire Kubiak if you know what your getting and you like it. But if you don't, why do it? I Wouldn't... Because here is what I believe... Eventually, Kubiak will be gone... but those players who keep falling, and blowing coverages and dropping balls and making bad decisions will still be there. Some of the problems will be fixed. However, Some of the abilities will all take for granted will be lost... Like our offense. IF the incoming coach keeps key players and components of our offense after Kubiak is gone, then the POTENTIAL will still be there. But I doubt he will... And I doubt his offense will be anywhere near as potent.

Great post, repped, but I'm afraid it's too late, the Football Davidians have won. See also, "squeaky wheel gets the grease".

gary
12-15-2010, 03:50 PM
Big Bots, has to be a Kubiak himself.

GP
12-15-2010, 03:51 PM
There are still people that want Kubiak to coach the Texans. Here on this board we refer to them as Titans, Colts and Jags fans.

ZING!

Ho! It's gettin' warm in here!

GP
12-15-2010, 03:51 PM
Big Bots, has to be a Kubiak himself.

AND AGAIN!!!

LOL. The board is ON FIRE! En Fuego! :doot:

Bigbots_02
12-15-2010, 03:52 PM
There are still people that want Kubiak to coach the Texans. Here on this board we refer to them as Titans, Colts and Jags fans.

Like I said, If we can FIND New HC that can work with our Oline being as light as it is, keep our offense as capable as it is and fix our D. Im down for change. But if there isnt anyone proven to be BETTER thats AVAILABLE. I wouldnt change.

gary
12-15-2010, 03:52 PM
Are you asking or telling?Asking.

Mr. White
12-15-2010, 03:52 PM
Great post, repped, but I'm afraid it's too late, the Football Davidians have won. See also, "squeaky wheel gets the grease".

The Football Davidians are at 1 Reliant Park. They aren't coming out until the FBI raids them.

Bigbots_02
12-15-2010, 03:54 PM
AND AGAIN!!!

LOL. The board is ON FIRE! En Fuego! :doot:

Lol... give me his paycheck so I can get out the military and Ill be anyone you want... Even Frank Bush. LMAO

Double Barrel
12-15-2010, 03:54 PM
Great post, repped, but I'm afraid it's too late, the Football Davidians have won. See also, "squeaky wheel gets the grease".

We've won nothing until the Head Loser on the sideline is gone.

McNair has proven on multiple occasions that he's more than wiling to ignore the squeak when a jackass is pulling the wagon. See, he has convinced himself that the jackass is a Clydesdale.

But the citizens of Myopialand love them some naked emperor, it seems.

:sarcasm:

Bigbots_02
12-15-2010, 03:55 PM
Asking.

Dont know whio said that 1... It wasnt me

Surreal McCoy
12-15-2010, 03:55 PM
The Football Davidians are at 1 Reliant Park. They aren't coming out until the FBI raids them.

No, I think we have conclusive proof they are right here and control this forum. You aren't by chance named David are you? Stranger things have happened...

GP
12-15-2010, 03:56 PM
Great post, repped, but I'm afraid it's too late, the Football Davidians have won. See also, "squeaky wheel gets the grease".

You seriously have ONE post every time.

Have you honestly understood that EVERY post you make is cheering anyone who is pro-Kubiak, and the post always contains your Mission Statement in some form or fashion?

Surreal McCoy Mission Statement: To only post snarky replies, unrelated to the topic and void of any actual input ABOUT the topic, and to high-five others and make a parting comment about how the board is irrational or otherwise incapable of listening to "new thoughts" on things.

And before you say I do the same thing, I am posting replies that contain a LAUNDRY list of actual observations and opinions that are relevant to any topic thread I'm posting in. I take a break from it, every now and then, but your topic-to-nontopic reply ratio is wayyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy off brother.

Surreal McCoy
12-15-2010, 03:59 PM
We've won nothing until the Head Loser on the sideline is gone.

McNair has proven on multiple occasions that he's more than wiling to ignore the squeak when a jackass is pulling the wagon. See, he has convinced himself that the jackass is a Clydesdale.

But the citizens of Myopialand love them some naked emperor, it seems.

:sarcasm:

I am all for getting Cowher in here so it will finally be proven that he was the beneficiary of two of the best GMs in NFL history. Of course, let's not let the facts get in the way of being emotional, eh? ;)

Let's get the Cowher business over with, otherwise you people will wetting your panties about it until he's long dead and buried :p

Blake
12-15-2010, 04:00 PM
LMAO... Man, I AM pretty tired but dont worry. Next year if we underachieve. Ill be LEADING the charge!

And there will be a bigbots_03 leading the Kubiak defenders Klub.

Next year huh? You still biting on that hook?

CretorFrigg
12-15-2010, 04:01 PM
Most of your argument is contingent on what we SHOULD be. We should be 9-4 you say? Well, we SHOULD be 13-0. But the fact of the matter is that we aren't. We're 5-8. Again, it's the standard mediocre performance we've witnessed year in and year out. That's why people are calling for Kubiak's head. We're sick and tired of mediocrity.

Mr. White
12-15-2010, 04:01 PM
No, I think we have conclusive proof they are right here and control this forum. You aren't by chance named David are you? Stranger things have happened...

You seem to think that I'm Chief Soap. You give me way more credit than I deserve.

I'm just a guy that happens to agree with almost every Texans fan on this issue. They aren't just on this board.

Surreal McCoy
12-15-2010, 04:02 PM
You seriously have ONE post every time.

Have you honestly understood that EVERY post you make is cheering anyone who is pro-Kubiak, and the post always contains your Mission Statement in some form or fashion?

Surreal McCoy Mission Statement: To only post snarky replies, unrelated to the topic and void of any actual input ABOUT the topic, and to high-five others and make a parting comment about how the board is irrational or otherwise incapable of listening to "new thoughts" on things.

And before you say I do the same thing, I am posting replies that contain a LAUNDRY list of actual observations and opinions that are relevant to any topic thread I'm posting in. I take a break from it, every now and then, but your topic-to-nontopic reply ratio is wayyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy off brother.

GP, really old buddy, you have some cheek calling out anyone for attacking the poster. Seriously, have a think about that.

I guess I'm not allowed to rep the OP and agree with his post? LOL You take yourself far too seriously sometimes but that's alright - whatever boats yer float...

HOU-TEX
12-15-2010, 04:03 PM
Ugh, I'm going to look at porn. :brickwall:

Ahh, that's better.....now, what were we talking about? Oh yeah.......*clicks back over to porn site*

Ckw
12-15-2010, 04:04 PM
1st... Kubiak gets one more year from me because this is his 1st season with a record worse then his previous. For me, so long as there was improvement, I can roll with those punches.

2nd... Im not sure but I think it stated on the title read BEFORE you respond. Clearly, you didn't. Any and every arguement that you've brought to the table has already been brought by someone else and I responded already. He might not like it, but its the truth... maybe just my truth

3rd... I dont give a flying F#%& about what Bill Parcells and HIS thoughts of winning, losing, winners or losers. You might not like the speed of the progression but it is what it is and until THIS season, when did Kubiak have a worse one.

4th... Since when did we start judging a season by how they start and not the overall product? Hell, you can go 8 and 0 then take a S^&* and end up 8-8... would you RATHER do that although its the same as 5-7 and ending up 8-8?

This is Chess not Checkers people. Its more to the move then whats right infront of you.

Let's use your logic with Capers then. I mean the guy took a new franchise and continued to get better every year except for that 2-14 season. I mean come on guys. It clearly wasn't Capers fault. He had us going in the right direction and if given another year, we surely would have improved from 2-14.

:kubepalm:

Bigbots_02
12-15-2010, 04:05 PM
Most of your argument is contingent on what we SHOULD be. We should be 9-4 you say? Well, we SHOULD be 13-0. But the fact of the matter is that we aren't. We're 5-8. Again, it's the standard mediocre performance we've witnessed year in and year out. That's why people are calling for Kubiak's head. We're sick and tired of mediocrity.

I get ya... I have 1 more season of patients left in me. Mmm or mediocrity, either way... If we lose again, I be LEADING.

scourge
12-15-2010, 04:06 PM
Mmmm. Sorry man, Im not eating that one. Think of our run game at the time. Now how EASY could it have been a 3 and out just running and giving the ball back to Manning. Sorry, you do BOTH to stay balance and unpredictable. UNFORTUNITLY... We unexpectedly fumbled. Plan and simple.

LOL
Do you actually remember that game? Slaton had 93yds and 2 td's that game, and averaging 5.8ypc.

With 8:08 left in the 4th it was 27-10 HOU
With 4:04 left in the 4th is was 27-17 HOU
With 4:04 left in the 4th "Rosencopter" happened for a fumble rec td= 27-24 HOU
With 1:54 left in the 4th Peyton throws the game winning td because of Rosies INT = 27-31 IND

We were up by 10 with less than 4 minutes remaining and decided to pass instead of giving it to Slaton to eat up the clock. ON Kubiak.

Bigbots_02
12-15-2010, 04:08 PM
Let's use your logic with Capers then. I mean the guy took a new franchise and continued to get better every year except for that 2-14 season. I mean come on guys. It clearly wasn't Capers fault. He had us going in the right direction and if given another year, we surely would have improved from 2-14.

:kubepalm:

You CANT use that logic with Capers because He was all over the place with his record. The ONLY thing he wasnt was about .500. Come on... 2-14?

scourge
12-15-2010, 04:10 PM
You CANT use that logic with Capers because He was all over the place with his record. The ONLY thing he wasnt was about .500. Come on... 2-14?

All over the place??? 4-12 5-11 7-9 2-14

That is progress every year until the last one, just like your boy Kubiak.

HTown2ATX
12-15-2010, 04:12 PM
Ahh, that's better.....now, what were we talking about? Oh yeah.......*clicks back over to porn site*


lmao....dude...you were gone a while.....you had to have gone from

http://img.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2007/11_04/SarahRB_468x481.jpg

TO

http://www.unoriginal.co.uk/specials/gregg2.jpg

DexmanC
12-15-2010, 04:12 PM
LMFAO......no seriously.....at least 3 people here at work looked at me when I laughed and it must have been loud too cause I have my head phones in.

I had the same thought earlier. Usually TK is ALL over this.

TK has been MIGHTY quiet over the last couple weeks, and Brando has
been GONE for almost a month now.

The silence of Kubiak's longest and most ardent supporters, is deafening.

I wanted to be sooo wrong about Kubiak. Being right about him doesn't
feel good at all.

Bigbots_02
12-15-2010, 04:18 PM
LOL
Do you actually remember that game? Slaton had 93yds and 2 td's that game, and averaging 5.8ypc.

With 8:08 left in the 4th it was 27-10 HOU
With 4:04 left in the 4th is was 27-17 HOU
With 4:04 left in the 4th "Rosencopter" happened for a fumble rec td= 27-24 HOU
With 1:54 left in the 4th Peyton throws the game winning td because of Rosies INT = 27-31 IND

We were up by 10 with less than 4 minutes remaining and decided to pass instead of giving it to Slaton to eat up the clock. ON Kubiak.
That was in 08 huh... I was thinking 07 but either way who could forget it.
Im PRETTY SURE they didnt JUST throw pass after pass. You have to mix it up en less you have the means to run out the clock. You have to get 1st downs and make them use time outs.

datchapin
12-15-2010, 04:18 PM
To me fear of change is a big reason there are so many problems in society. Bigbot you made a comment I think last page that you didn't want to dump Kubiak because you didn't want to be unprepared. I'm sorry, but that is a horrible excuse not to get out of a relationship. Okay, screw the relationship analogy.

Our team goes out there unprepared each and every single week. Each yr. someone from another team has pointed out glaring weaknesses which we don't seem capable of correcting. Last yr. a DE from the Jags pointed out that D. Brown was giving away the play before the snap count. This yr. E. Manning pointed out that we don't play disciplined coverage. He exploited that as have most other teams we played. Kubiaks response to those things was that they were just going to keep trucking and minimize those mistakes. Other coaches who study game film should see these things and correct them before other teams' players. Yet Kubiak does not. To me this shows that Kubiak does not have an eye for detail.

On the defensive side we don't even have good fundamentals. We have been treated to yr. after yr. of poor tackling. Look I'm not saying that coaching is easy, but if you can't get your fundamentals down you're not gonna succeed. Kubiak should have Bush put the defense through tackling drills as much as possible. He doesn't and I know he doesn't because our team tackling is still garbage. All they need to do to get a marked improvement is emphasize wrapping up and running through the tackle. On offense one of the things we DON'T do is help out the LT by chipping the DEs. Not a big detail, but fundamentally sound teams do this on a regular basis. When we played the Colts we left Brown on an island and suffered for it. Kubiak said they didn't chip because they wanted to open up the passing lanes. If chipping a guy takes away your passing lanes you are not practicing sound football. To me this shows that Kubiak does not emphasize sound fundamentals.

Our offense..... we've boasted one of the best passing offenses since Kubiaks second yr. here. I find that ironic because when he was hired and to this day Kubiak has stated that he wants to emphasize running the ball. For an ex-OC who many considered to be great and came from a system that had success running the ball, our performance on the ground thus far has been garbage. Of his five yrs. here only twice have we had a good running game. This yr. we have the leading rusher in the league and still we don't consistently run the ball. To me this says that Kubiaks actions are not consistent with his words.

Consistency, that's the biggest thing we lack. The Texans have had too few games where they played the whole 4 quarters. Kubiaks always saying its on him. It's true it is on him. He has failed to have our guys prepared and has failed to put them in positions to succeed. This tells me he does not gameplan properly. I MEAN HOW DO YOU NOT RUN ON THE COLTS WHEN THEY'RE PRACTICALLY TELLING YOU TO DO IT!!!!! Sorry, still gets to me.

His clock and time-out management has been well documented so I won't re-hash that.

Overall he has failed in every facet of the game. I have to ask what has he improved? The perceived talent he's brought in? As a coach he has FAIL mastered.

Going back to the relationship analogy. Being with Kubiak is like being with an abusive cheating drunk. Being afraid of moving on for fear of not finding something better is asking for trouble. Hell, being alone is better than being with someone like that. Just my two cents.

Bigbots_02
12-15-2010, 04:20 PM
All over the place??? 4-12 5-11 7-9 2-14

That is progress every year until the last one, just like your boy Kubiak.

Even in his 1st season... he didnt go 2-14. Hell, I dont care who you are. You go 2-14 you NEED to be fired.

GP
12-15-2010, 04:21 PM
GP, really old buddy, you have some cheek calling out anyone for attacking the poster. Seriously, have a think about that.

I guess I'm not allowed to rep the OP and agree with his post? LOL You take yourself far too seriously sometimes but that's alright - whatever boats yer float...

You're just like Kubiak: Predictable, Patterns

If I did a stat sheet on all your posts, and lined them up one on top of another within a post on this board, they would all say the same things and would all be ABOUT THE POSTER and not the topic. Sprinkle one or two in there where you parrot or reference someone else instead of coming up with an original thought.

I have noticed that the pro-Kubiak crowd establishes patterns in their posting just like Kubiak does. I think there's a shared personality style going on there.

Surreal McCoy
12-15-2010, 04:23 PM
You're just like Kubiak: Predictable, Patterns

If I did a stat sheet on all your posts, and lined them up one on top of another within a post on this board, they would all say the same things and would all be ABOUT THE POSTER and not the topic. Sprinkle one or two in there where you parrot or reference someone else instead of coming up with an original thought.

I have noticed that the pro-Kubiak crowd establishes patterns in their posting just like Kubiak does. I think there's a shared personality style going on there.


That's pretty rich coming from the Lemming in Chief ;)

GP
12-15-2010, 04:27 PM
To me fear of change is a big reason there are so many problems in society. Bigbot you made a comment I think last page that you didn't want to dump Kubiak because you didn't want to be unprepared. I'm sorry, but that is a horrible excuse not to get out of a relationship. Okay, screw the relationship analogy.

Our team goes out there unprepared each and every single week. Each yr. someone from another team has pointed out glaring weaknesses which we don't seem capable of correcting. Last yr. a DE from the Jags pointed out that D. Brown was giving away the play before the snap count. This yr. E. Manning pointed out that we don't play disciplined coverage. He exploited that as have most other teams we played. Kubiaks response to those things was that they were just going to keep trucking and minimize those mistakes. Other coaches who study game film should see these things and correct them before other teams' players. Yet Kubiak does not. To me this shows that Kubiak does not have an eye for detail.

On the defensive side we don't even have good fundamentals. We have been treated to yr. after yr. of poor tackling. Look I'm not saying that coaching is easy, but if you can't get your fundamentals down you're not gonna succeed. Kubiak should have Bush put the defense through tackling drills as much as possible. He doesn't and I know he doesn't because our team tackling is still garbage. All they need to do to get a marked improvement is emphasize wrapping up and running through the tackle. On offense one of the things we DON'T do is help out the LT by chipping the DEs. Not a big detail, but fundamentally sound teams do this on a regular basis. When we played the Colts we left Brown on an island and suffered for it. Kubiak said they didn't chip because they wanted to open up the passing lanes. If chipping a guy takes away your passing lanes you are not practicing sound football. To me this shows that Kubiak does not emphasize sound fundamentals.

Our offense..... we've boasted one of the best passing offenses since Kubiaks second yr. here. I find that ironic because when he was hired and to this day Kubiak has stated that he wants to emphasize running the ball. For an ex-OC who many considered to be great and came from a system that had success running the ball, our performance on the ground thus far has been garbage. Of his five yrs. here only twice have we had a good running game. This yr. we have the leading rusher in the league and still we don't consistently run the ball. To me this says that Kubiaks actions are not consistent with his words.

Consistency, that's the biggest thing we lack. The Texans have had too few games where they played the whole 4 quarters. Kubiaks always saying its on him. It's true it is on him. He has failed to have our guys prepared and has failed to put them in positions to succeed. This tells me he does not gameplan properly. I MEAN HOW DO YOU NOT RUN ON THE COLTS WHEN THEY'RE PRACTICALLY TELLING YOU TO DO IT!!!!! Sorry, still gets to me.

His clock and time-out management has been well documented so I won't re-hash that.

Overall he has failed in every facet of the game. I have to ask what has he improved? The perceived talent he's brought in? As a coach he has FAIL mastered.

Going back to the relationship analogy. Being with Kubiak is like being with an abusive cheating drunk. Being afraid of moving on for fear of not finding something better is asking for trouble. Hell, being alone is better than being with someone like that. Just my two cents.

The guy I just quoted, above, notice what he does...he's stating his reasons as to why he thinks the way he thinks. Right or wrong, he's giving it a shot. He's attempting to enter into a discussion of ideas.

Whether I agree with what he says or not, he's entering into a discussion with his opinion and his ideas.

Rep your way.

Mr. White
12-15-2010, 04:28 PM
You're just like Kubiak: Predictable, Patterns

If I did a stat sheet on all your posts, and lined them up one on top of another within a post on this board, they would all say the same things and would all be ABOUT THE POSTER and not the topic. Sprinkle one or two in there where you parrot or reference someone else instead of coming up with an original thought.

I have noticed that the pro-Kubiak crowd establishes patterns in their posting just like Kubiak does. I think there's a shared personality style going on there.

It's not usually about a single poster so much as it is all the posters.

Something to the extent of:

"Nobody likes Kubiak anymore so I'm going to insult the whole board.

In the process I'm going to make some kind of sexual reference about circle jerks or wet panties....etc.

Then when one of them quotes me, I'll call them out for being hypocritical about attacking the poster."

GP
12-15-2010, 04:29 PM
That's pretty rich coming from the Lemming in Chief ;)

Patterns.

Another one-liner with nothing to add but sarcasm.

Bigbots_02
12-15-2010, 04:31 PM
To me fear of change is a big reason there are so many problems in society. Bigbot you made a comment I think last page that you didn't want to dump Kubiak because you didn't want to be unprepared. I'm sorry, but that is a horrible excuse not to get out of a relationship. Okay, screw the relationship analogy.

Our team goes out there unprepared each and every single week. Each yr. someone from another team has pointed out glaring weaknesses which we don't seem capable of correcting. Last yr. a DE from the Jags pointed out that D. Brown was giving away the play before the snap count. This yr. E. Manning pointed out that we don't play disciplined coverage. He exploited that as have most other teams we played. Kubiaks response to those things was that they were just going to keep trucking and minimize those mistakes. Other coaches who study game film should see these things and correct them before other teams' players. Yet Kubiak does not. To me this shows that Kubiak does not have an eye for detail.

On the defensive side we don't even have good fundamentals. We have been treated to yr. after yr. of poor tackling. Look I'm not saying that coaching is easy, but if you can't get your fundamentals down you're not gonna succeed. Kubiak should have Bush put the defense through tackling drills as much as possible. He doesn't and I know he doesn't because our team tackling is still garbage. All they need to do to get a marked improvement is emphasize wrapping up and running through the tackle. On offense one of the things we DON'T do is help out the LT by chipping the DEs. Not a big detail, but fundamentally sound teams do this on a regular basis. When we played the Colts we left Brown on an island and suffered for it. Kubiak said they didn't chip because they wanted to open up the passing lanes. If chipping a guy takes away your passing lanes you are not practicing sound football. To me this shows that Kubiak does not emphasize sound fundamentals.

Our offense..... we've boasted one of the best passing offenses since Kubiaks second yr. here. I find that ironic because when he was hired and to this day Kubiak has stated that he wants to emphasize running the ball. For an ex-OC who many considered to be great and came from a system that had success running the ball, our performance on the ground thus far has been garbage. Of his five yrs. here only twice have we had a good running game. This yr. we have the leading rusher in the league and still we don't consistently run the ball. To me this says that Kubiaks actions are not consistent with his words.

Consistency, that's the biggest thing we lack. The Texans have had too few games where they played the whole 4 quarters. Kubiaks always saying its on him. It's true it is on him. He has failed to have our guys prepared and has failed to put them in positions to succeed. This tells me he does not gameplan properly. I MEAN HOW DO YOU NOT RUN ON THE COLTS WHEN THEY'RE PRACTICALLY TELLING YOU TO DO IT!!!!! Sorry, still gets to me.

His clock and time-out management has been well documented so I won't re-hash that.

Overall he has failed in every facet of the game. I have to ask what has he improved? The perceived talent he's brought in? As a coach he has FAIL mastered.

Going back to the relationship analogy. Being with Kubiak is like being with an abusive cheating drunk. Being afraid of moving on for fear of not finding something better is asking for trouble. Hell, being alone is better than being with someone like that. Just my two cents.

Kubiak was brought here for the very reason that our offense horrible. At the time I believe, among the worst in the league. I was turned that around. You talk about the run game... Its hard to run with Ron Dayne and a old Ahmad Green, a broken Chris brown and a iffy Steve Slaton. I was HUGE on the slaton ban wagon when he came out but he proven me wrong and with his performance at KR... I dont even want to get it to that. Your right in what you say but that statement works BOTH WAYS. Last year, Our Weakness was no ground game or ball security. Not the case this year. As far as Def... You wont here ANY objections about the Def from me... your right

gary
12-15-2010, 04:33 PM
Dont know whio said that 1... It wasnt meI do not think there is a huge problem with the O line this year. Why bring it up?

Bigbots_02
12-15-2010, 04:36 PM
The guy I just quoted, above, notice what he does...he's stating his reasons as to why he thinks the way he thinks. Right or wrong, he's giving it a shot. He's attempting to enter into a discussion of ideas.

Whether I agree with what he says or not, he's entering into a discussion with his opinion and his ideas.

Rep your way.

To me thats what its all about. We dont have to be on the same "sheet of music" so to speak... But I wanna see why your playing the song your playing...

CretorFrigg
12-15-2010, 04:37 PM
I do not think there is a huge problem with the O line this year. Why bring it up?

Matt Schaub has been sacked a total of 28 times this year. Contrast that with last year when Schaub was only sacked 25 times in 16 games.

Now is that a result of Schaub holding the ball too long, poor route running by receivers, or poor blocking? You decide.

Texan_Bill
12-15-2010, 04:38 PM
http://slabbed.files.wordpress.com/2010/08/ah-jeez-not-this-shit-againpicture-copy-2.jpg

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_io3Q-rUp0k0/SMLoGvAhowI/AAAAAAAAAd4/8LGrD79HAtc/s320/aw_jeez_not_this_shit_again.jpg

http://images.cheezburger.com/completestore/2009/12/28/129065226180439461.jpg


:smiliepalm:

Bigbots_02
12-15-2010, 04:39 PM
I do not think there is a huge problem with the O line this year. Why bring it up?

I didnt... I said that if a new coach came in, would be be about to work with it being as light as they are... I think kubiaks scheme is for this type of Oline. could be wrong but its just my guess. ability to move helps ZBS

gary
12-15-2010, 04:41 PM
Matt Schaub has been sacked a total of 28 times this year. Contrast that with last year when Schaub was only sacked 25 times in 16 games.

Now is that a result of Schaub holding the ball too long, poor route running by receivers, or poor blocking? You decide.Wow, have not noticed that number. Probably a combo.

gary
12-15-2010, 04:55 PM
If the zone blocking is working then you keep the OC.

Bigbots_02
12-15-2010, 04:58 PM
If the zone blocking is working then you keep the OC.

True... but Im not sure that its the OC idea... Well fellas. Im gonna step out for a while. Preciate the talk and points of view. Catch up wit ya later.

gary
12-15-2010, 05:03 PM
You fire Gary and Frank they are the main problems.

datchapin
12-15-2010, 05:03 PM
Kubiak was brought here for the very reason that our offense horrible. At the time I believe, among the worst in the league. I was turned that around. You talk about the run game... Its hard to run with Ron Dayne and a old Ahmad Green, a broken Chris brown and a iffy Steve Slaton. I was HUGE on the slaton ban wagon when he came out but he proven me wrong and with his performance at KR... I dont even want to get it to that. Your right in what you say but that statement works BOTH WAYS. Last year, Our Weakness was no ground game or ball security. Not the case this year. As far as Def... You wont here ANY objections about the Def from me... your right

Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't A. Foster on our practice squad.... all of last yr.? If your running back is the problem isn't it logic that dictates you try someone else? Also we beat the Colts with Ron Dayne at RB he ran for a ton of yds. I remember it being close to 200 yds. So while it might be hard it's doable. Also we had shots at bringing in other talent, yet we haven't we could've drafted RBs in the past drafts or signed FA's. To me if a coach says the running game is important, bringing in a healthy capable RB to shoulder the carries would be up on the priority list. Instead we bring in TEs what does that say.

Another thing. The reason that our offense was so horrible the last yr. Capers was here, was because he scrapped the old offense and tried to implement an entire new system. I'm sorry that was a doomed expirement and saying Kubiak improved on that is not exactly a compliment. I mean how hard is it to improve on garbage?

utahmark
12-15-2010, 05:04 PM
If the zone blocking is working then you keep the OC.

I don't see the new coach keeping anyone. coaches like to bring in their own people and their own systems. Thats one of the reasons it took me so long to give up on Gary, Gary. I don't think our o-line is built for anything but zone blocking so I see some offensive lineman being drafted by the new coach. Along with our holes on defense I think it will be at least a year of rebuilding with any coach.

Just maybe a great coach could incorporate his offense over a few seasons and just work on the defense year one. that would be the best scenario I can think of(but don't think it will happen). Maybe thats just because I've been accustomed to our coaches for to long?

Texan_Bill
12-15-2010, 05:07 PM
Matt Schaub has been sacked a total of 28 times this year. Contrast that with last year when Schaub was only sacked 25 times in 16 games.

Now is that a result of Schaub holding the ball too long, poor route running by receivers, or poor blocking? You decide.

Or it could be that we played the NFC East this year and last year we played the NFC West. The four NFC West teams combined for only 2 sacks, conversely the NFC East accounted for 13 of the 28 sacks so far this season.

gary
12-15-2010, 05:09 PM
I don't see the new coach keeping anyone. coaches like to bring in their own people and their own systems. Thats one of the reasons it took me so long to give up on Gary, Gary. I don't think our o-line is built for anything but zone blocking so I see some offensive lineman being drafted by the new coach. Along with our holes on defense I think it will be at least a year of rebuilding with any coach.

Just maybe a great coach could incorporate his offense over a few seasons and just work on the defense year one. that would be the best scenario I can think of(but don't think it will happen). Maybe thats just because I've been accustomed to our coaches for to long?I see, but it would be nice if they could/ would keep some one though.

DexmanC
12-15-2010, 05:12 PM
I don't see the new coach keeping anyone. coaches like to bring in their own people and their own systems. Thats one of the reasons it took me so long to give up on Gary, Gary. I don't think our o-line is built for anything but zone blocking so I see some offensive lineman being drafted by the new coach. Along with our holes on defense I think it will be at least a year of rebuilding with any coach.

Just maybe a great coach could incorporate his offense over a few seasons and just work on the defense year one. that would be the best scenario I can think of(but don't think it will happen). Maybe thats just because I've been accustomed to our coaches for to long?

The Steelers took a center in the first round from Florida, and the
kid just dominates. Young players don't frighten me, if the coaching
is adequate (see Chiefs, Patriots, Steelers, Bears, etc.)

Pollardized
12-15-2010, 05:18 PM
I bet if bigbots, uh I mean Coach Kubiak, put as much time into game preparartion as he has this thread about saving his job, maybe the Texans would be 10-3 right now, maybe they wouldn't start the game in slo-mo.... Wait a second, bigbots, uhhggg I mean Coach Kubiak, spends the first half of the game on here reading what everyone says about his game planning, then takes those notes and makes halftime adjustments! that isn't a freaking Denny's menu, it's the new Imenu Touch he's holding!

Damn I wish I would have known this sooner. I could have given much better gameday advice all season long....

Double Barrel
12-15-2010, 05:20 PM
I am all for getting Cowher in here so it will finally be proven that he was the beneficiary of two of the best GMs in NFL history. Of course, let's not let the facts get in the way of being emotional, eh? ;)

Let's get the Cowher business over with, otherwise you people will wetting your panties about it until he's long dead and buried :p

I like Cowher's resume, but I think there are many HC candidates that are preferable to the mired-in-mediocrity staff that we have at the moment. Setting your rather lame insinuations aside (which is pretty much every post you've written), I still don't see any valid attempt by the myopians to present a decent supporting argument on behalf of Kubiak.

Do you even have one?

As far as your panties comment, you seem like an expert on the subject, so I guess I'll just let your statement speak for your mindset. Strikes me as fitting that a Kubiak supporter would want to talk about panties.

scourge
12-15-2010, 05:20 PM
That was in 08 huh... I was thinking 07 but either way who could forget it.
Im PRETTY SURE they didnt JUST throw pass after pass. You have to mix it up en less you have the means to run out the clock. You have to get 1st downs and make them use time outs.

The interception at the end was nothing but passes, but that shouldn't count because they had already screwed up and lost their lead. Here are the two drives that had the devastating Rosenfumbles

1st and 10 at IND 41 (4:03) A.Green right tackle to IND 40 for 1 yard (J.Thomas).
Timeout #1 by IND at 03:59.
2nd and 9 at IND 40 (3:59) A.Green right tackle to IND 39 for 1 yard (J.Thomas, K.Dawson).
Timeout #2 by IND at 03:54.
3rd and 8 at IND 39 (3:54) S.Rosenfels left end to IND 32 for 7 yards (R.Brock, M.Jackson). FUMBLES (R.Brock), RECOVERED by IND-G.Brackett at IND 32. G.Brackett for 68 yards, TOUCHDOWN.

Sure, on the one above we ran the first two, but iirc the 3rd and 8 was a pass gone bad. Why not eat up clock and put the pressure on them while up by 10 with 3:54 to go?

1st and 10 at HST 20 (3:36) S.Slaton left guard to HST 21 for 1 yard (M.Jackson, M.Bullitt).
2nd and 9 at HST 21 (2:54) S.Rosenfels pass incomplete short left to S.Slaton.
3rd and 9 at HST 21 (2:50) (Shotgun) S.Rosenfels sacked at HST 19 for -2 yards (R.Mathis). FUMBLES (R.Mathis), RECOVERED by IND-R.Mathis at HST 20. R.Mathis to HST 20 for no gain (C.Myers).

Again, ran once and then 2 straight pass attempts. Both incomplete which stops the clock. We were up by 3 at the 2:54 mark when we decided to start passing. Once more, why do that when you have a rb who is performing very well that game with the Colts only having 1 timeout and the 2 minute warning? Yeah, they could've still drove it down the field, but at that point with 0 time outs and the 2 minute warning gone they would have had little time to do so. Our defense had been playing fairly well that game. Those points were because of offensive screwups, not defensive. We did have the means to run out the clock and force them to use their 1 timeout and 2min warning. His name was Slaton. Even Green was averaging 3.9ypc. Just like recently with Foster, he abandons the run when he shouldn't. It's not like only the fans are saying this. Listen to announcers, talking heads, former coaches, etc...


It's stupid that we are debating something from '08 but it just shows that his playcalling has been very suspect for years now.

spurstexanstros
12-15-2010, 05:33 PM
im just glad its not TK and I alone on the Kubiak bench...your waisting your breath bigbots...minds have been made up round here along time.

There was soap for Richard Smith and now Soap for Kubes..chances are there will be soap for the next guy..its par for the course here on TT.

The soapers got their wish regarding DC and now our defense is worse off and now they wish for Kubes head....well becareful what you wish for...

you just might get Dennis Green...

Ckw
12-15-2010, 05:38 PM
im just glad its not TK and I alone on the Kubiak bench...your waisting your breath bigbots...minds have been made up round here along time.

There was soap for Richard Smith and now Soap for Kubes..chances are there will be soap for the next guy..its par for the course here on TT.

The soapers got their wish regarding DC and now our defense is worse off and now they wish for Kubes head....well becareful what you wish for...

you just might get Dennis Green...

Okay, tell me you didn't just insinuate that our defense would be better off with Dick Smith as our DC... :spit:

houstonspartan
12-15-2010, 05:48 PM
im just glad its not TK and I alone on the Kubiak bench...your waisting your breath bigbots...minds have been made up round here along time.

There was soap for Richard Smith and now Soap for Kubes..chances are there will be soap for the next guy..its par for the course here on TT.

The soapers got their wish regarding DC and now our defense is worse off and now they wish for Kubes head....well becareful what you wish for...

you just might get Dennis Green...

Loser talk.

HTown2ATX
12-15-2010, 06:50 PM
The soapers got their wish regarding DC and now our defense is worse off

I'm not a "soaper" as I'm just anti mainstream by nature and that seems to be the mainstream thing to do so I can't...but I am on board with the sentiment.

Serisously man, when the last DC got canned, the Texans did not even TRY to get a proven guy in here. Bush and Kubes are buddies, so they just promoted him.

I'm just baffled that you said that.

:mariopalm:

utahmark
12-15-2010, 06:51 PM
The Steelers took a center in the first round from Florida, and the
kid just dominates. Young players don't frighten me, if the coaching
is adequate (see Chiefs, Patriots, Steelers, Bears, etc.)

It's not so much young players that scare me. It's the fact that if you add 2 or 3 offensive lineman to our defensive needs it's going to take more draft picks than we have to replace everyone. I know free agency can help but there will be some new players that don't work out and it's just a lot of new faces and more chances for stuff to go wrong.

Thats one thing I hate about running a system not many other people use. just like when we finally got rid of the run and shoot.

Dishman
12-15-2010, 07:59 PM
im just glad its not TK and I alone on the Kubiak bench...your waisting your breath bigbots...minds have been made up round here along time.

There was soap for Richard Smith and now Soap for Kubes..chances are there will be soap for the next guy..its par for the course here on TT.

The soapers got their wish regarding DC and now our defense is worse off and now they wish for Kubes head....well becareful what you wish for...

you just might get Dennis Green...
You ignore the fact that KUBIAK promoted from within rather than interviewing people outside of the organization and that many of us were livid with that decision.

It's one on the main reasons he should be gone.

Runner
12-15-2010, 08:36 PM
...I still don't see any valid attempt by the myopians to present a decent supporting argument on behalf of Kubiak.

Do you even have one?



This same debate went on last year, of course. The sunshiners based their arguments on hope and some fantastical "right way". They attacked the soapers then too. A thread was started at that time asking why the Kubiak supporters thought he should stay. Surprisingly I, a glass half empty guy, had to kick it off.

Some may find the entire thread interesting. Here is an excerpt:

What has he shown you that warrants another year?

What will be different next year?

I'd prefer something empirical. Something measurable.

How about from a non-supporter?

1) He has made marked improvement in the team's roster. I think he has had some big misses in a few people he's picked up and missed some opportunities, but this is a team that is talented enough to win. I credit Kubiak at least as much as Rick Smith in this.

2) His ability to lead and inspire is clear. This was especially true the first three seasons, although I think continued mediocrity in the final accounting each season may be reducing this admittedly unmeasurable quality for this particular team. This is one reason I think he may find more personal success if he moves on to his next opportunity.

3) He has raised the level of play that we see during the good times. That has been counteracted by the fact that the bad play is just as bad as it has always been, and that is with superior talent. However, further improvement may be found in correcting mistakes (his as well as the players). It is probably easier to correct mistakes than build new good stuff. I question whether Kubiak has the flexibility of thought to correct the mistakes though. His sticking with the script on game days is a manifestation of his whole approach to coaching, IMO.

I've ended up mixing some of his good qualities with what counters them, but the good qualities exist. I personally don't think he can reach the next level with the Texans at this time, although he might become a great coach.

I also believe he'll be here for his fifth season.

Lucky
12-15-2010, 08:40 PM
The "Fire Kubiak" gang were a bunch of knee jerkers in 2007. They were irrational back then.

Was there a "Fire Kubiak" gang in 2007? I thought it was a pretty positive year. 2008 was when I remember the "Fire Kubiak" threads emerging. I know I was already on dark side at that point.

I guess I'm a member in good standing of Team Irrational.


you just might get Dennis Green...
And if Denny Green came here, you'd love him too.

thunderkyss
12-15-2010, 08:43 PM
SUPER FACT: Our defense is DREADFUL!!!:mariopalm:(This is a big one)

(Response) ITS TRUE! I can't deny that. However, you want to fire the head coach Kubiak.

I've been saying from game one that we have problems on the offensive side of the ball. I've gone so far as to attribute the poor defensive showing in many of our games as a result of our offenses inability to stay on the field.

I've been trying to get people to remember the greatest show on turf & the Indianapolis Colts did not have great defenses, at times, their defenses were worse than what we are seeing. Even the Broncos defenses were not great for many of their play-off years.

Recently there was a thread expounding on the differences between the Patriots with the 31st ranked defense & the Texans with the 32nd rank defense.


If you wish, I can argue, in great detail that the losses we've experienced can (& really should) be attributed to poor game management.... not a poor defense, not clock management, not "being un-prepared", not "sense of urgency"...... it's game management.

Dan Reeves was not wrong back in 2005, that team was good enough to win. I said it in 2006, we were sold a bill of goods, Kubiak wasn't ready to be a head coach........ today, I do not believe his game management has gotten any better.

And that is what separates Kubiak from a Bill Belichick or Tony Dungy, or even a Bill Cowher. Like those coaches, he's done an amazing job building a team & getting them to work together as a team. I could argue a better job than any of those coaches...... I've never seen such control of the locker room, such buy-in by the players, & such cohesiveness on a team (they all say the same thing... the same message, every week).

But the way he manages a game.......... damn.

never got better.

Mr. White
12-15-2010, 09:06 PM
Was there a "Fire Kubiak" gang in 2007?

I think it was just Second Honeymoon back then.

Here's (http://www.texanstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=55407) the first "Fire Kubiak" thread I could find. This one's from 2008.

I know that one exists from the 2006 season. I just can't get the search to go back that far.

HTown2ATX
12-15-2010, 09:33 PM
I've been saying from game one that we have problems on the offensive side of the ball. I've gone so far as to attribute the poor defensive showing in many of our games as a result of our offenses inability to stay on the field.

I've been trying to get people to remember the greatest show on turf & the Indianapolis Colts did not have great defenses, at times, their defenses were worse than what we are seeing. Even the Broncos defenses were not great for many of their play-off years.

Recently there was a thread expounding on the differences between the Patriots with the 31st ranked defense & the Texans with the 32nd rank defense.


If you wish, I can argue, in great detail that the losses we've experienced can (& really should) be attributed to poor game management.... not a poor defense, not clock management, not "being un-prepared", not "sense of urgency"...... it's game management.

Dan Reeves was not wrong back in 2005, that team was good enough to win. I said it in 2006, we were sold a bill of goods, Kubiak wasn't ready to be a head coach........ today, I do not believe his game management has gotten any better.

And that is what separates Kubiak from a Bill Belichick or Tony Dungy, or even a Bill Cowher. Like those coaches, he's done an amazing job building a team & getting them to work together as a team. I could argue a better job than any of those coaches...... I've never seen such control of the locker room, such buy-in by the players, & such cohesiveness on a team (they all say the same thing... the same message, every week).

But the way he manages a game.......... damn.

never got better.

Ahhhhhhh....there's TK.....this thread was sorely missing you bro!

;)

Texecutioner
12-15-2010, 09:46 PM
Ill Start by saying this...

If you respond and you feel oposite (I ALREADY KNOW YOU DO) Please, have legitimate reasoning as to why. And if you don't... then just say you dont have faith in Kubiak.

You people are irrational. Have any of you ever heard the expression: A PERSON is smart, but PEOPLE are stupid.
I say this because as individuals, you could probably hold a decent conversation but get a group of you that all have a similar objective together, and you can't be reasoned with. Someone would be better off drinking gun powder then lighting a match and swallowing it.:mariopalm: That's what everyone of you that sit and complain about Kubiak remind me of.

You can feel how you do, your entitled to it... but to neglect an obvious truth is completely ridiculous. Here are some facts.

Fact: We had HIGH EXPECTATIONS to become playoff contenders this year

(Response) EVERY FRANCHISE has High expectations the next year! I trult believe we really SHOULD have a record of like 9-4

Fact: We have UNDERACHIEVED as a football team this year

(Response) Once again, should be 9-4, No argument... but en less your at the top of your division, your going to feel that way. (Cleveland and Detroit excluded):barman:

SUPER FACT: Our defense is DREADFUL!!!:mariopalm:(This is a big one)

(Response) ITS TRUE! I can't deny that. However, you want to fire the head coach Kubiak. You gather like a cult and post it countless times a day on almost every thread that has to do with the Houston Texans... That doesn't make any sense to me. However, I DO understand at the end of the day everyone really just wants to win. I personally would go after to the source of our direct problems. I think it's Defensive Coordinator Frank Bush. If it's his coaching that's causing the problem then get him out of there. However, If its the players that aren't capable of executing the designed play, get them out of there. Where your problem is, that's what you fix. This is BASIC problem solving. You don't throw a TV away because your remote is broken! You get a new remote!:headhurts: There is nothing wrong with kubiak! He is very capable and if you throw him away because of THIS you'll regret not having the positive that he DOES bring to the table.

Fact: SOME of the play calling has been questionable

(Response) The keyword in that is SOME. But here is my question... Where YOU in the meetings and in the huddles and listening to the plays being called to truly know who's really at fault? None of us where. However, the people that know the facts still have individuals in the position they are in. THIS applies to Kubiak. If Mcnair KNOWS that kubiak isn't doing his job correctly and isn't making good judgment calls MOST of the time... get him out of there. If Kubiak KNOWS that someone under him isn't performing to expectation after the necessary tools are given, get them out of there.

If you just don't believe in Kubiak fine. But what are you going to more towards? Fire Kubiak if you know what your getting and you like it. But if you don't, why do it? I Wouldn't... Because here is what I believe... Eventually, Kubiak will be gone... but those players who keep falling, and blowing coverages and dropping balls and making bad decisions will still be there. Some of the problems will be fixed. However, Some of the abilities will all take for granted will be lost... Like our offense. IF the incoming coach keeps key players and components of our offense after Kubiak is gone, then the POTENTIAL will still be there. But I doubt he will... And I doubt his offense will be anywhere near as potent.

This entire thread is just misinformed from all phases. I can't believe that it even got a full page of responses much less 10 pages. A complete fail. :mariopalm:

And forget about this whole defense failing garbage.

I'm sick to death about hearing about what a great offensive coach Gary Kubiak is. Talk about the biggest urban myth this city has ever seen. Great offensive coaches don't have their teams playing great offense for one half for two straight seasons. Great offensive coaches don't take guys like Amaan Green, Wali Lundi, and Chris Brown and think that they'll become big time players for their teams. Gary Kubiak single handedly killed the Texans in the post season last year by trusting Chris Brown who never did squat on this team to gain any trust. Great offensive coaches don't have all of these problems of not knowing when to pass or when to run where it always ends in epic failures.

Gary Kubiak isn't even close to being this offensive genius that people represent him as.

Texan_Bill
12-15-2010, 10:01 PM
Do you even have one?

I've had many!!

Strikes me as fitting that a Kubiak supporter would want to talk about panties.

That ain't right!! :) As someone that supports Kubes, you know I wouldn't go to the panty card..


That said, I'm okay with Bob ending the Kubiak era. I would also (in lieu of firing Kubiak) support firing Rick Smith and bringing in a real GM... I think McNair's biggest mistake during this regime was giving a first time HC so much decision making power. Way too much stuff on Kubiak's plate (especially for a first time head coach).... McNair should've hired an experienced GM, period. It's a tough road to hoe with a first time HC AND GM....


Blow it out... Blow it up, I don't give a ****!

That said, I'm not stoked on Cowher, only because I like to see AJ work. Under Cowher (or Fisher for that matter), AJ would be wasted. If we were to hire either one of those guys, I'd be willing to part with AJ and let him go to someplace he could continue to be awesome....


*EDIT*
General note:
Those of you posters that continue to insult each other, no matter what side of the fence you're on, here's a message for y'all:

Get over yourselves. You're doing yourself and this message board a great disservice!!!

houstonspartan
12-15-2010, 11:00 PM
I've had many!!



That ain't right!! :) As someone that supports Kubes, you know I wouldn't go to the panty card..


That said, I'm okay with Bob ending the Kubiak era. I would also (in lieu of firing Kubiak) support firing Rick Smith and bringing in a real GM... I think McNair's biggest mistake during this regime was giving a first time HC so much decision making power. Way too much stuff on Kubiak's plate (especially for a first time head coach).... McNair should've hired an experienced GM, period. It's a tough road to hoe with a first time HC AND GM....


Blow it out... Blow it up, I don't give a ****!

That said, I'm not stoked on Cowher, only because I like to see AJ work. Under Cowher (or Fisher for that matter), AJ would be wasted. If we were to hire either one of those guys, I'd be willing to part with AJ and let him go to someplace he could continue to be awesome....


*EDIT*
General note:
Those of you posters that continue to insult each other, no matter what side of the fence you're on, here's a message for y'all:

Get over yourselves. You're doing yourself and this message board a great disservice!!!

Wait, wait, wait.

You honestly think that a coach would come in here, and see Andre freaking Johnson, and not use him?

LOL. Now I have heard everything.

Texan_Bill
12-15-2010, 11:37 PM
Wait, wait, wait.

You honestly think that a coach would come in here, and see Andre freaking Johnson, and not use him?

LOL. Now I have heard everything.

You haven't heard shit, because, you're another reactionary who seems to think that some coach, who has been out of coaching for a few years will all of the sudden change his philosophy??? Really??????
Ummmmmm, yeah okay!! :ok:...

Philosophy is philosophy. If a coach believes that grinding out in a "3 yard a and cloud of dust" coach is employed (whether Spitter, errrrrrrr Cowher or Fisher for that matter), how much do you think they will throw to AJ?? I dunno, let's ask Randy Moss??

:rolleyes:



:gun:

Texecutioner
12-15-2010, 11:55 PM
You haven't heard shit, because, you're another reactionary who seems to think that some coach, who has been out of coaching for a few years will all of the sudden change his philosophy??? Really??????
Ummmmmm, yeah okay!! :ok:...

Philosophy is philosophy. If a coach believes that grinding out in a "3 yard a and cloud of dust" coach is employed (whether Spitter, errrrrrrr Cowher or Fisher for that matter), how much do you think they will throw to AJ?? I dunno, let's ask Randy Moss??

:rolleyes:



:gun:

Is the main focus of an NFL team to make sure that an NFL WR like AJ gets 1,500 yard seasons or is it to make sure that the entire team improves and is able to compete for a SB??

There is nothing in Cowher's history to suggest that Cowher would ignore or put AJ on the back burner. Hines Ward had his best seasons under Bill Cowher and so did Randell Ell. When Maddox became the QB of the Steelers for that short stint after Stewart flamed out the Steelers were a very pass happy team. Cowher certainly liked to run the ball, but he adapted his offensive strategy to what his personal was. That's not the point though. The point is to make sure that your team improves on both sides of the ball and AJ's statistics are not the main focus of what the Texans should ever be. Cowher would use AJ just fine, and there is just as good of a chance that he would have a game plan that utilized him better than Kubiak.

houstonspartan
12-16-2010, 12:08 AM
You haven't heard shit, because, you're another reactionary who seems to think that some coach, who has been out of coaching for a few years will all of the sudden change his philosophy??? Really??????
Ummmmmm, yeah okay!! :ok:...

Philosophy is philosophy. If a coach believes that grinding out in a "3 yard a and cloud of dust" coach is employed (whether Spitter, errrrrrrr Cowher or Fisher for that matter), how much do you think they will throw to AJ?? I dunno, let's ask Randy Moss??

:rolleyes:



:gun:

Uh, No, genius, I don't think any coach is the magic answer. I have said that Cowher is a big risk, but it is one risk I am willing to take.

As I said before, I do not believe - like many people here - that Gary Kubiak is the best coach in the NFL. A lot of people think it, but I don't buy it. We have other options.

And, I stand by my original point: No way in hell does another coach ignore Andre Johnson, regardless of who that person is.

Kaiser Toro
12-16-2010, 12:13 AM
I have been critical of Kubiak for three years, but respectful to the fruits of his competency. But those kids do not quit, and have played with a sense of urgency. They respond, and I see guys getting better week over week - save for that door handle from Alabama.

Consequently, I am not all-in on "Kubiak must go" at this point. But Smith, Bush and Marciano must go.

spurstexanstros
12-16-2010, 12:25 AM
Okay, tell me you didn't just insinuate that our defense would be better off with Dick Smith as our DC... :spit:
no I said our defense is worse now than it was then....I thought that was clear.
Loser talk.
ahemmmm what is that team's name at the front of my sn? Thats what i thought...im not doing loser talk im talking about being consistant. How many of the teams in our division have made multiple coaching changes? None.
Jax fired Coughlin and he went on to win superbowl. Indy had a superficial coaching change but we know who is real coach and he wears #18. Fisher will remain in Tenn and they will be back next year. While the Texans will fire their coach and have to start over again and yet again Texan fan will be suprised when Jim Fossil cant take us from worst to first. His Dc or OC will be blamed they will get fired and he will then get one more shot and 5 years from now we will be back at same spot. It happened under Capers , it happened under Kubiak and it will happen under (insert retread or new kid dynamo)

I wonder what soapers would do if Kubiak goes to Denver and they win Superbowl in two years and we are stuck in same situation..I guess they are willing to take the risk. I hope it pays off in the Texans favor. I really do

We have seen the Defensive minded coach and we hated his offense and we have seen the offensive minded coach and criticized his defense and play calling as well (cause we all love to think we can call plays better)
So who is going to be next? The former db who can run the spread offense?




And if Denny Green came here, you'd love him too.
and we the soapers come out for him...i will say HE WAS WHO WE THOUGHT HE WAS.
*EDIT*
General note:
Those of you posters that continue to insult each other, no matter what side of the fence you're on, here's a message for y'all:

Get over yourselves. You're doing yourself and this message board a great disservice!!!

"Dont you know TB we all are Billionaires and we know how to assemble a franchise, run it GM it and coach it...well you would think that by reading some of the posts on here that some of us have ran successful NFL franchises and if anyone disagrees with us ,we act like they are morons and
they must be content with a mediocre team..those simpletons"

Sincerly the refined posters on TexansTalk.

houstonspartan
12-16-2010, 12:34 AM
I wonder what soapers would do if Kubiak goes to Denver and they win Superbowl in two years and we are stuck in same situation..I guess they are willing to take the risk. I hope it pays off in the Texans favor. I really do





Again: Sorry, but that's loser talk. If Kubiak goes to Denver and wins the Super Bowl, good for him. That just means that he has learned as a coach and matured. It won't mean a thing for us.

You appear to want to give him as much time as he needs to turn into the next Belechick. Nope. Sorry. Not doing it. And, don't forget: Belechick had to be fired to learn.

It's not as if we're firing the guy after a couple of years.

Yes, I'm willing to take the risk on another coach. As I've been saying all day: I do not believe that Gary Kubiak is the best coach in the United States. We have better options.

scourge
12-16-2010, 12:39 AM
You haven't heard shit, because, you're another reactionary who seems to think that some coach, who has been out of coaching for a few years will all of the sudden change his philosophy??? Really??????
Ummmmmm, yeah okay!! :ok:...

Philosophy is philosophy. If a coach believes that grinding out in a "3 yard a and cloud of dust" coach is employed (whether Spitter, errrrrrrr Cowher or Fisher for that matter), how much do you think they will throw to AJ?? I dunno, let's ask Randy Moss??

:rolleyes:



:gun:

... as I mentioned before, Hines Ward didn't seem to suffer and Big Ben seemed to do OK as well. If Ward had AJ's physical attributes those numbers would've been even better. Those aren't all exactly All-Pro numbers, but he still made the probowl 4 times under Cowher and 2nd team All-Pro 3 times. It's crazy to think AJ couldn't accomplish the same in a Cowher ran system

2007 71 732 7
2006 74 975 6
2005 69 975 11
2004 80 1,004 4
2003 95 1,163 10
2002 112 1,329 12
2001 94 1,003 4

Texan_Bill
12-16-2010, 01:01 AM
Is the main focus of an NFL team to make sure that an NFL WR like AJ gets 1,500 yard seasons or is it to make sure that the entire team improves and is able to compete for a SB??

There is nothing in Cowher's history to suggest that Cowher would ignore or put AJ on the back burner. Hines Ward had his best seasons under Bill Cowher and so did Randell Ell. When Maddox became the QB of the Steelers for that short stint after Stewart flamed out the Steelers were a very pass happy team. Cowher certainly liked to run the ball, but he adapted his offensive strategy to what his personal was. That's not the point though. The point is to make sure that your team improves on both sides of the ball and AJ's statistics are not the main focus of what the Texans should ever be. Cowher would use AJ just fine, and there is just as good of a chance that he would have a game plan that utilized him better than Kubiak.

Dude, is that a retarded question? C'mon man, you're better than that (or so I hope).... He completely believes in 3 yards and a cloud of dust. That's always been his MO.. Are you really suggesting that Randle El and / or Hines Ward are even close to the talent that AJ presents. Are you even suggesting that AJ should be played the same way as those two??

:smiliepalm:

As far as improving on both sides of the ball, I totally agree... Well, except for the fact that the offense is already pretty good. The "D" sucks... Sucks ASS!!


Fire Rick Smith and hire a real GM that has more power than Kubiak.... Fire Bush (which I'm completely dissapointed in) and hire a real DC.....


BTW, You're slobbering misplaced chin man, man-crush has forgotten to realize that after 15 years, he's only amassed 2 Super Bowl Appearances, 1 Super Bowl Championship.

Awesome!!! :thumbup




:rolleyes:

Texan_Bill
12-16-2010, 01:02 AM
... as I mentioned before, Hines Ward didn't seem to suffer and Big Ben seemed to do OK as well. If Ward had AJ's physical attributes those numbers would've been even better. Those aren't all exactly All-Pro numbers, but he still made the probowl 4 times under Cowher and 2nd team All-Pro 3 times. It's crazy to think AJ couldn't accomplish the same in a Cowher ran system

2007 71 732 7
2006 74 975 6
2005 69 975 11
2004 80 1,004 4
2003 95 1,163 10
2002 112 1,329 12
2001 94 1,003 4

:gun:

I can't slice my wrists fast enough!

Mr teX
12-16-2010, 01:05 AM
Again: Sorry, but that's loser talk. If Kubiak goes to Denver and wins the Super Bowl, good for him. That just means that he has learned as a coach and matured. It won't mean a thing for us.

You appear to want to give him as much time as he needs to turn into the next Belechick. Nope. Sorry. Not doing it. And, don't forget: Belechick had to be fired to learn.

It's not as if we're firing the guy after a couple of years.

Yes, I'm willing to take the risk on another coach. As I've been saying all day: I do not believe that Gary Kubiak is the best coach in the United States. We have better options.


See this is the thing that ticks me off most about some in here. You guys talk as if everything you say is fact. You, nor anyone in here or even in the organization knows if we have better options simply b/c you don't know what the hell the next coach is going to be able to do once they get here....whomever that may be.

Everyone likes to think they know what goes into making a good head coach but the fact of the matter is they don't know. You say belichick had to be fired before he learned & the truth of the matter is it might've always been there from the jump but the organizational set up might've been trash around him. Better organization set up, better results. It's no accident the Steelers, Colts & Pats have dominated this last decade & it ain't just been b/c of 1 person. Each of these teams have great GMs, great scouting that consequently lead to the Drafting of a great players.

Texecutioner
12-16-2010, 01:28 AM
Dude, is that a retarded question? C'mon man, you're better than that (or so I hope).... He completely believes in 3 yards and a cloud of dust. That's always been his MO.. Are you really suggesting that Randle El and / or Hines Ward are even close to the talent that AJ presents. Are you even suggesting that AJ should be played the same way as those two??

You were the one that suggested that Cowher would just automatically waste AJ and that he would become an afterthought. If you'd like to recant that statement then fine, but don't get all upset with me over questioning you over that when that's exactly what you stated.

Bill Wrote: "AJ would be wasted. "

I don't know how you got confused where you thought I was suggesting that Hines Ward or Randell El was a better WR than AJ. I didn't say anything even close to that. What I said was that Hines Ward and Randell El both had their best statistical seasons under Cowher as HC pointing out that your statement that AJ would be wasted was just crazy talk because other WR's had their best seasons with Cowher there and neither was as good as AJ. I don't know how you didn't understand that, and there is nothing in Cowher's history that would suggest that he would "ignore and waste" a HOF WR like AJ. I never stated how AJ should be played compared to either one of those though.


As far as improving on both sides of the ball, I totally agree... Well, except for the fact that the offense is already pretty good. The "D" sucks... Sucks ASS!!

You mean this same offense that has played one half of football all year long and did the same thing practically all year last year? I'll take a change to that offensive coaching any day of the weak.


Fire Rick Smith and hire a real GM that has more power than Kubiak.... Fire Bush (which I'm completely dissapointed in) and hire a real DC.....

Fire all 3 of them. They've all proven themselves to be incapable of leading this team to the post season much less the promised land. There is no reason why Kubes should be absent of a house clean up in year 5. He's had more than enough time to prove that he could build a winning franchise that would stick around for a long time with the Elites of the AFC.


BTW, You're slobbering misplaced chin man, man-crush has forgotten to realize that after 15 years, he's only amassed 2 Super Bowl Appearances, 1 Super Bowl Championship.

So now SB appearences aren't jack to you? But for some reason you've stated time and time again that Jeff Fisher is a great coach while he's only been to one. That's not really being consistent there. He got a ring though, and led his team to the post season a ton of times over the years. He's a proven winner that has one of the best reputations as a HC whether you want to buy into that or not. This isn't some mystery guy or some unproven commodity that you're placing faith in like you've done with Kubes the past 5 years without any history of leading a team to success. The fact that you're looking for every little "what if" negative point about Cowher as a HC and placing these misplaced judgements on him is very illogical when you've had full confidence in a guy who proved nothing as a HC before coming here and in his last 5 years here he's proven that he's not a capable HC that can lead a competent team. We are in year 5 Bill. At some point, you've got to just let it go and agree that you've placed a lot of trust and faith in someone that never deserved it or earned it in Kubiak. Hell, it's been half a decade now and he's done nothing in his tenure here to prove that he can take this franchise where it needs to go.

Texecutioner
12-16-2010, 01:34 AM
... as I mentioned before, Hines Ward didn't seem to suffer and Big Ben seemed to do OK as well. If Ward had AJ's physical attributes those numbers would've been even better. Those aren't all exactly All-Pro numbers, but he still made the probowl 4 times under Cowher and 2nd team All-Pro 3 times. It's crazy to think AJ couldn't accomplish the same in a Cowher ran system

2007 71 732 7
2006 74 975 6
2005 69 975 11
2004 80 1,004 4
2003 95 1,163 10
2002 112 1,329 12
2001 94 1,003 4

My point exactly here Scourge. If anything Cowher's history with his best WR's that he had to work with suggests that he'd have AJ playing at a very high level when he did the same with talent that was less.

DexmanC
12-16-2010, 02:02 AM
The Texans have improved the running game.

The Texans have improved their red zone efficiency.

The Texans still have the #1 wide receiver, and have gained
the #1 running back in the NFL.

The Texans have improved their divisional record.

The Texans have reduced the number of times they've fumbled.

These are ALL things the Texans sucked at last season, and have
marked improvement in all these areas.

They STILL went 1-6 during a crucial stretch this season, to take
themselves out of playoff contention. The last game was a microcosm
of the Kubiak era. This team will play exciting, pedal-to-the-metal
football, and leave with every stat in the book.


......except WINS

When will the "myopians" (Thanks DB) judge Kubiak's regime on WINS?

If you change EVERY coach BUT Kubiak, the Texans will find yet ANOTHER
reason (excuse) to leave the stadium without THE WIN.

If you haven't seen that in 5 years, tell me how you got Helen Keller's
phone number!

OzzO
12-16-2010, 08:54 AM
...Where your problem is, that's what you fix. This is BASIC problem solving. You don't throw a TV away because your remote is broken! You get a new remote....

That's got to be the longest post I've seen in some time. Was there a question in there? I'll take this one if so.

So, your remote is broken for the family room tv. Since the tv can't talk, you check out the manual. After reading that you come to some conclusions and move forward with how the manual (tv) told you to.

That probably means you should go get that remote from the bedroom tv you like 'cause you're comfortable with it and you think it works well with the bedroom tv even though it's not compatible with the family room tv. Doesn't matter if there's other, better remotes out there. You want the bedroom tv remote cause it makes you feel safe.

You then figure you may as well get a better cable service cause the other one, which is no longer operable anyway, was way overpaying for service - see? That service even thought it was better than all other services, see? So you go with another service you knew of back in the day and figure you liked it then, let's give it a go with today's tv. So, you get it installed and you like that you're comfortable with it and the tv is somewhat operable with it - but you're friends make fun of the brown box with a row of push buttons and scrolling wheel on the side to switch channels. Hopefully you get a good channel and ocasionally you come across one (which is an amazing find) but most channels you acquire are duds.

Finally, of those good channels you do have - you come across some brand new channels with great potential that look like they may have better shows. Well, since you have you're outdated cable service - you can't view multiple channels - so you decide to go with the single new, young, flashy channels and just hope they'll get better by the time the fall season rolls around and you decide to drop the other channels that you know what you get. Some channels want to up their price, so you figure you can do better.

So, you have a remote now that doesn't work (but you didn't want to look at other remotes) a cable service that really isn't providing, and your new channels have been cancelled. All because you followed the manual and did what it (tv) told you to do.

I think you may want to upgrade everything, including the tv and it's manual. Yeah, you may come across an iffy tv that you're really not sure about - but you're already standing in front of a tv that you're truly not satisfied with in the 5 years it's been sitting in your family room. Wouldn't you want to take the gamble on the flatscreen? Couldn't be any worse.

Well, I guess it could. Could come across a tv that has a bottom flap that just hangs open for about 3 hours a day and won't execute the proper commands.


*edit - seems I came close to a long post response. Ah well.

axman40
12-16-2010, 09:09 AM
Have you guys tried changing the batteries before throwing the remote out?
:rake:

IlliniJen
12-16-2010, 10:56 AM
Here's another thread in 2008 where I stated my case back in the day for firing Kubiak:

http://www.texanstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?p=1086133#post1086133

Back then it felt like just a few of us against the world. Now, it's funny to go back and see what everyone's reasoning was (on both sides of the issue). And just for the record, I hate being right in this case. I would much rather be in the playoffs.

thunderkyss
12-16-2010, 11:18 AM
im just glad its not TK and I alone on the Kubiak bench...

Whoa....... when did I say I was on Kubiak's bench? I've always said, 5 years is long enough....... but wait till the end of the 5 years.


We're not at the end yet, but it's not looking very good for Kubiak.

thunderkyss
12-16-2010, 11:26 AM
I'm not a "soaper" as I'm just anti mainstream by nature and that seems to be the mainstream thing to do so I can't...but I am on board with the sentiment.

Serisously man, when the last DC got canned, the Texans did not even TRY to get a proven guy in here. Bush and Kubes are buddies, so they just promoted him.

I'm just baffled that you said that.

:mariopalm:

What I don't understand, is that our defense was "statistically" better last year than any defense we've ever seen from a Houston Texans' squad. This year, it is obvious something happened that Bush & Kubiak couldn't compensate for.

How do we know that next year Kubiak & Bush couldn't make this a top 5 defense?

Honoring Earl 34
12-16-2010, 11:49 AM
I think Bob sent the wrong message during the David Carr days . I think he has sent the wrong message during the Kubiak days . If the product on the field ... which is judged by W's and L's ... is not up to the fans expectations and playoff standards after 3 years , then somebdy has to go .

This is the Texans to me in a nutshell . Bob invites you to his outdoor BBQ and sits you at a nicely set table in a great park . He has a band and pretty gals , beer , and everything you can thing of . He then serves you grilled spam and cheese to go along with fruit cups . :cowboy1:

thunderkyss
12-16-2010, 11:52 AM
Great offensive coaches don't have their teams playing great offense for one half for two straight seasons.

I think it should be noted, that last year there was no rhyme or reason to which half the offense would show up. This year, if the offense showed up, it was in the second half.

So we've gone from consistently playing a half of football, to consistently playing the second half...




Great offensive coaches don't take guys like Amaan Green, Wali Lundi, and Chris Brown and think that they'll become big time players for their teams. Gary Kubiak single handedly killed the Texans in the post season last year by trusting Chris Brown who never did squat on this team to gain any trust.

I could have sworn Chris Brown started the year third on the depth chart...... we picked up two undrafted FAs, both with huge upsides. One was injured, & the other had maturity issues...

Then we also had Chris Henry....

Not a deck of quality cards I admit, but far from expecting Chris Brown to become a big time player. Brown's role was more like a "game managing" QB.... he was just supposed to "not loose" the game.

He may have failed as many game managing QBs have failed, but that's a different argument all together.


Great offensive coaches don't have all of these problems of not knowing when to pass or when to run where it always ends in epic failures.

Gary Kubiak isn't even close to being this offensive genius that people represent him as.

The argument can be made though....

& I'm not making the argument either way, just saying, in the 9 year history of this team, there are only 2 first round picks playing on this offense. This teams' offensive accomplishments have been made with cast-offs & the unwanted.

Rey
12-16-2010, 12:04 PM
& I'm not making the argument either way, just saying, in the 9 year history of this team, there are only 2 first round picks playing on this offense. This teams' offensive accomplishments have been made with cast-offs & the unwanted.

I think you are exaggerating here....

Just because you are not a first round pick does not mean you are unwanted or a cast off...

Jacoby Jones
Eric Winston
Matt Schaub
Antoine Caldwell
Wade Smith
Vonta Leach

These are guys who you spent something of value to get them in here. (or in Vonta's case to retain his services)

Lets not act like our offense has just been neglected and Kubiak is working with crumbs and left overs...

Heck, they even spent resources to keep David Anderson a Texan.

We aren't a whole lot different from other offenses. Many teams are not loaded with 1st round picks on the offensive side of the ball...

Double Barrel
12-16-2010, 12:07 PM
I've had many!!

My two remaining brain cells are short on long-term memory, so please refresh the Case for Kubiak, if you don't mind. And just focus on Kubiak the head coach, not the ancillary arguments about lockouts or other potential HC candidates.

I only ask because I honestly cannot see a valid case to keep the guy after 5 years of mediocre results.

That ain't right!! :) As someone that supports Kubes, you know I wouldn't go to the panty card..

I know, bro'. I was just giving out what I received, but it's all in good fun. I meant nothing personal by it, and if the intent was personal toward me, I did not take it that way.

That said, I'm okay with Bob ending the Kubiak era. I would also (in lieu of firing Kubiak) support firing Rick Smith and bringing in a real GM... I think McNair's biggest mistake during this regime was giving a first time HC so much decision making power. Way too much stuff on Kubiak's plate (especially for a first time head coach).... McNair should've hired an experienced GM, period. It's a tough road to hoe with a first time HC AND GM....

The problem I have with this perspective is that both Smith and Bush are direct reflections of Gary Kubiak. As the head coach, he personally chose both of these key personnel.

That said, I'm not stoked on Cowher, only because I like to see AJ work. Under Cowher (or Fisher for that matter), AJ would be wasted. If we were to hire either one of those guys, I'd be willing to part with AJ and let him go to someplace he could continue to be awesome....


hmmmm...I've never thought of it, but Cowher is a ground and pound kind of coach. I guess it depends on the OC (if Cowher is the guy).

By the same token, AJ under 5 years of Kubiak has been to zero playoffs and had one winning season. I can't really see how a new HC would make it worse, and to be honest, I have no doubt that AJ would trade his personal numbers and records for a chance to play in a post-season game.

*EDIT*
General note:
Those of you posters that continue to insult each other, no matter what side of the fence you're on, here's a message for y'all:

Get over yourselves. You're doing yourself and this message board a great disservice!!!

I think folks take a lot of this stuff way too serious. I equate this forum to a virtual barbershop, where we can all spout our opinions, all have the same degree of control over the product (which is none), and we razz and jazz each other but in the end we are all part of the greater Texans 'family'.

I think words come out in self-defense, and while it's not excusing it, I think it's a "heat of the moment" kind of deal and should have no long-term effects. At least that's the way that I view it. :howdy:

Dishman
12-16-2010, 12:13 PM
What I don't understand, is that our defense was "statistically" better last year than any defense we've ever seen from a Houston Texans' squad. This year, it is obvious something happened that Bush & Kubiak couldn't compensate for.

How do we know that next year Kubiak & Bush couldn't make this a top 5 defense?

The defense has terrible, horribly, epically regressed from a year ago. If they were going to make the defense Top 5 it would have been this year. Instead they made huge gambles that blew up in their faces. Whoever was a party to those decisions needs their nuts held to the fire, not given a 2nd chance based on "what-if's".

I ask you, is this all the Texans are good for? What-ifs and What-could-have-beens? Because that's basically all that goes on around here in support of Kubiak, et al.

gary
12-16-2010, 12:13 PM
There are three different threads on page one of Texans Talk which means no matter what your feelings are the HC job is an important subject to you.

thunderkyss
12-16-2010, 12:13 PM
That said, I'm okay with Bob ending the Kubiak era. I would also (in lieu of firing Kubiak) support firing Rick Smith and bringing in a real GM... I think McNair's biggest mistake during this regime was giving a first time HC so much decision making power. Way too much stuff on Kubiak's plate (especially for a first time head coach).... McNair should've hired an experienced GM, period. It's a tough road to hoe with a first time HC AND GM....



This is closest to my opinion.

I think Kubiak has raised the standards across this franchise. His influence & reach extended way beyond that of a head coach.

It's not that I believe that Rick Smith has done a worse job as a GM than Kubiak has done as a Head Coach, I believe a new GM would establish the balance that an NFL franchise should have.

Replacing the Head Coach "should" establish that same balance..... six in one hand.....

Dishman
12-16-2010, 12:16 PM
I think it should be noted, that last year there was no rhyme or reason to which half the offense would show up. This year, if the offense showed up, it was in the second half.


The point is the offense is consistently inconsistent. Who cares if they showed up in the first or or the second half last year? They carried the same bad habit over to this year.

Surreal McCoy
12-16-2010, 12:25 PM
I think Bob sent the wrong message during the David Carr days . I think he has sent the wrong message during the Kubiak days . If the product on the field ... which is judged by W's and L's ... is not up to the fans expectations and playoff standards after 3 years , then somebdy has to go .

This is the Texans to me in a nutshell . Bob invites you to his outdoor BBQ and sits you at a nicely set table in a great park . He has a band and pretty gals , beer , and everything you can thing of . He then serves you grilled spam and cheese to go along with fruit cups . :cowboy1:

Nothing wrong with pretty girls and beer (even if it is shamefully overpriced)! :beerfunnel:

Blake
12-16-2010, 12:26 PM
I think it was just Second Honeymoon back then.

Here's (http://www.texanstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=55407) the first "Fire Kubiak" thread I could find. This one's from 2008.

I know that one exists from the 2006 season. I just can't get the search to go back that far.

I was still on board with Kubiak as HC back then, unless someone else came to town...

I agree. There was obviously plenty of time to force a three and out. They would have to punt, possibly short, or big return from Jacoby, then medium to short field to get a TD. Onside was a risky move that ended up not paying off.

Im not giving up on Kubiak. I like him as a HC and think he will keep getting better.

***Unless Bill Cowher wants to coach for us, then sorry Gary. :P

Second Honeymoon
12-16-2010, 12:28 PM
TB, I thought you had already moved on from Kubiak. It looks like you STILL think he is a good head coach even though we have 5 years of proof that he isn't.

I know he is an Aggie. I know he is from Houston. It's just that the guy sucks, Bill. And frankly, its been pretty evident since Day One. Poor talent evaluation and even a more horrible ability to bring in quality assistant coaches on the defensive side.

At this point in time its pretty obvious that the players aren't going to buy into what kubiak has to sell them. How many times can you hear the same speech and coachspeak before you tune out.

I fell in line this year and tried to be optimistic but in the back of my mind I knew this was going to happen. You can't let your best corner go in FA and then promote from within a horrible defense to get your new DC and expect to compete. We had nowhere to go but down offensively and nickel and diming your coaching staff and defensive talent didn't help.

I could quote myself and tongue myself by showing that I saw all this coming, but there is no need. it was painfully obvious to anyone not addicted to the kool aid.

We need to start over and there is nowhere to go but up. Kubiak just sucks as a head coach.

Great OC but an inept and pathetic HC. I appreciate what he has done and that he didn't keep Carr around for but one year, but although the team is more competitive it hasn't turned the corner and if he hasn't yet he never will.

i am sick of tired of the guy and I think 75% of the fanbase, especially the hardcore fans, are with me on this. I appreciate the loyalty and candor, Bill, but its not working out and its not going to. Fire the loser and get someone in here who has some credibility, some passion, and some direction....oh and maybe someone who isn't afraid to hire someone with some backbone and experience/pull as their DC.

I am trying to be positive, Bill. However, this season is the swan song for this regime. THE GUY MISREAD DOWN AND DISTANCE ON 4th DOWN AT END OF GAME!! THAT IS UNFORGIVEABLE AND INEXCUSABLE. KUBES MUST GO!!

spurstexanstros
12-16-2010, 12:36 PM
Whoa....... when did I say I was on Kubiak's bench? I've always said, 5 years is long enough....... but wait till the end of the 5 years.


We're not at the end yet, but it's not looking very good for Kubiak.

I agree and thats my point. Ive said thousands of times here wait until end of season and see how they finish..but the Texans could lose out and with the CBA i still dont think Mcnair would fire him.

houstonspartan
12-16-2010, 12:40 PM
TB, I thought you had already moved on from Kubiak. It looks like you STILL think he is a good head coach even though we have 5 years of proof that he isn't.

I know he is an Aggie. I know he is from Houston. It's just that the guy sucks, Bill. And frankly, its been pretty evident since Day One. Poor talent evaluation and even a more horrible ability to bring in quality assistant coaches on the defensive side.

At this point in time its pretty obvious that the players aren't going to buy into what kubiak has to sell them. How many times can you hear the same speech and coachspeak before you tune out.

I fell in line this year and tried to be optimistic but in the back of my mind I knew this was going to happen. You can't let your best corner go in FA and then promote from within a horrible defense to get your new DC and expect to compete. We had nowhere to go but down offensively and nickel and diming your coaching staff and defensive talent didn't help.

I could quote myself and tongue myself by showing that I saw all this coming, but there is no need. it was painfully obvious to anyone not addicted to the kool aid.
We need to start over and there is nowhere to go but up. Kubiak just sucks as a head coach.

Great OC but an inept and pathetic HC. I appreciate what he has done and that he didn't keep Carr around for but one year, but although the team is more competitive it hasn't turned the corner and if he hasn't yet he never will.

i am sick of tired of the guy and I think 75% of the fanbase, especially the hardcore fans, are with me on this. I appreciate the loyalty and candor, Bill, but its not working out and its not going to. Fire the loser and get someone in here who has some credibility, some passion, and some direction....oh and maybe someone who isn't afraid to hire someone with some backbone and experience/pull as their DC.

I am trying to be positive, Bill. However, this season is the swan song for this regime. THE GUY MISREAD DOWN AND DISTANCE ON 4th DOWN AT END OF GAME!! THAT IS UNFORGIVEABLE AND INEXCUSABLE. KUBES MUST GO!!

Agree. A co-worker said to me today: "Wow, everything you predicted about this season was 100 percent correct."

I told him that I wasn't pleased with any of this. I take no pride in being correct. This season has bummed me out like no other. This is a total lost year and the franchise is in disarray.

spurstexanstros
12-16-2010, 12:40 PM
There are three different threads on page one of Texans Talk which means no matter what your feelings are the HC job is an important subject to you.

well at least we dont have the start sage threads or VY is the answer to go along with them...like we did last time there was a coach on the hot seat.

I would go insane.

houstonspartan
12-16-2010, 12:45 PM
I agree and thats my point. Ive said thousands of times here wait until end of season and see how they finish..but the Texans could lose out and with the CBA i still dont think Mcnair would fire him.

Wait until the end of the season? We have three games left! We know for sure that the best we can do is 8-8. We know how this is going to turn out.

I'm guessing during the Jacksonville game Jan 3, with 20 seconds left on the clock in the fourth quarter, people will still be saying "Let's wait until the end of the season to see how Kubiak will do."?

People are waiting for some kind of last-minute mathematical miracle that will put us in the playoffs. That's just sad.

HJam72
12-16-2010, 12:49 PM
Start Sage! :)

Runner
12-16-2010, 12:55 PM
Wait until the end of the season? We have three games left! We know for sure that the best we can do is 8-8. We know how this is going to turn out.

I'm guessing during the Jacksonville game Jan 3, with 20 seconds left on the clock in the fourth quarter, people will still be saying "Let's wait until the end of the season to see how Kubiak will do."?

People are waiting for some kind of last-minute mathematical miracle that will put us in the playoffs. That's just sad.

The next three games will show us what they are made of.*

*If the last sixty or so hasn't already shown that.

Honoring Earl 34
12-16-2010, 01:03 PM
The next three games will show us what they are made of.*

*If the last sixty or so hasn't already shown that.

Yep ... 8-8 isn't going to make me feel any different than 5-11 . In fact ... going into next year , if nothings changed , I still won't be that fired up for the Texans except that football seasons starting . I haven't felt like this since the Carr days when you knew it was a lost cause .

SAY NO TO :koolaid:

Runner
12-16-2010, 01:08 PM
My two remaining brain cells are short on long-term memory, so please refresh the Case for Kubiak, if you don't mind. And just focus on Kubiak the head coach, not the ancillary arguments about lockouts or other potential HC candidates.



In past years the arguments were incremental improvement being the right way of doing things, and a firm belief that Kubiak would "get it" next year.

This season is difficult to spin as an improvement over last, and Kubiak being on the verge has gotten stale.

The most common argument now seems to be "the Texans might get worse if they replace Kubiak (and Smith)".

Two things jump to mind.

1) They might get better. Failing while trying to excel is preferable to languishing in mediocrity because it's determined that it's too risky to try. At least to me.

2) Don't look now, but after breathing the rarified air of 9-7 the Texans are getting worse WITH Kubiak.

gary
12-16-2010, 01:22 PM
In past years the arguments were incremental improvement being the right way of doing things, and a firm belief that Kubiak would "get it" next year.

This season is difficult to spin as an improvement over last, and Kubiak being on the verge has gotten stale.

The most common argument now seems to be "the Texans might get worse if they replace Kubiak (and Smith)".

Two things jump to mind.

1) They might get better. Failing while trying to excel is preferable to languishing in mediocrity because it's determined that it's too risky to try. At least to me.

2) Don't look now, but after breathing the rarified air of 9-7 the Texans are getting worse WITH Kubiak.
Start Carr.

thunderkyss
12-16-2010, 02:24 PM
The point is the offense is consistently inconsistent. Who cares if they showed up in the first or or the second half last year? They carried the same bad habit over to this year.

I don't know the numbers, but I'm sure our offensive turnovers are way down this year.

I think the calm, cool, methodical approach is the reason for both. Less turnovers..... less production. We throw that crap out the window, when the game is on the line..... midway through the third Qtr... we generate more points, but more turnovers as well.

Just watching, & as a fan (what I see & know really don't mean nuth'n)... I believe if our team was uber aggressive for 4 Qtrs, we'll make more positive plays & win more games. It appears (to me) that Kubiak has decided (like Capers before him) to limit mistakes, by hand-cuffing the offense & defense.

But time & time again, at least for the last 13 games, we've seen teams walk all over us when we play timid & we've seen us roll over the best defenses this league has & stymie the average offenses when we are aggressive & pressure the ball.

I can't understand why Kubiak has consistently decided to come out timid....... every game.

F@#k Caution, win games. period.

Rey
12-16-2010, 02:29 PM
How about our offensive turnovers are down because Slaton isn't toting the rock anymore?

thunderkyss
12-16-2010, 02:51 PM
How about our offensive turnovers are down because Slaton isn't toting the rock anymore?

That would be part of it. But last year, it didn't matter who was toting the rock, Slaton, Moats, Brown, Foster...... Slaton had more opportunities than the other guys, that's all.

But we had TEs fumbling, & Schaub throwing to the other team....

We don't "hurry up" like other teams do, especially in the 2 minute warning, because this team has shown time & time again, when things are going too good, it's too good (& an untimely turnover occurs).