PDA

View Full Version : Cowher Thread: Status - Rumored that McNair likes idea of Cowher


Pages : 1 [2]

DexmanC
12-16-2010, 02:59 PM
I vote for Georgie Patton!


Oh, wait...

Has to be someone living right?

Why not R. Lee Ermey?

I just found out he's still alive, by watching him throw a box of
tissue at a wimp, on the latest Geico commercial. HE could
whipped these guys in shape!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hFgiUm4lQig

Mr teX
12-16-2010, 03:13 PM
The bolded above scares the piss out of me when it comes to Cowher. There are very few coaches who can be both a succesful HC and GM. Cowher has no history as being the personnel guy, so that would be introducing a huge unknown in the scenario. I see Cowher as a guy who would need to work with a good GM, not to try and be the GM. He just does not strike me as that kind of guy, ie someone who would be succesful as HC and GM.

I'd be reluctent to give an HC total control over personnel decsions.

Great post.

Most every good HC these days is a guy that ultimately just focuses on coaching the team. He is sure to have input on the players that are brought in, but it is ultimately up to the Owner & GM whether it actually happens or not.

The only coach who i can think of off the top of my head who wore both caps successfully was Parcells. Every other coach who has tried hasn't done too hot...even "proven winners" like Mike Holmgren.

Double Barrel
12-16-2010, 04:09 PM
I like Cowher as a HC candidate, but I'm not big on any HC being a GM. Too many duties and not enough focus on what they are ultimately hired to do as a HC.

However, all that said, I'd still take Cowher as HC/GM over Kubiak and his goofballs.

aussie_texan
12-16-2010, 07:39 PM
guys if you want cowher so bad (or anyone else or just to fire kubiak)

DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT

i live in australia so unfortunately i cant organise or be apart of anything.

how about going down to practice and giving the coach players owners and entire organisation an ear full (about 50 or more should be ok).

You guys are supporters of Houston! not the individual players because players come and go Houston will always be there for you so if their playing badly you have every right to tell them about it.
Same goes for the coaching!

Its time for you guys to organise something. Get the bull pen involved or something bring signs and banners to the game in nashville because you can bet alot of people will be watching it not because of the game but for dre v doofus and this is a great opportunity for you guys to show how you feel.

GO TEXANS!

DocBar
12-16-2010, 08:59 PM
So do we bring Cowher in and make him run a 43 D that he doesn't like or do we let him do his own thing and start all over on the D?
Maybe we can keep Kubes as OC and Cowher can be HC. J/K
Seriously, though, can Cowher live with a 43 D? I'm sick to death of drafting high pick DL and getting no bang for the buck.
What if we get Gruden? Our O is very productive. Will he keep the running game as is? What about the passing game?
I want better production without the revamping of the parts of our team that work or the base schemes we've drafted for.

GuerillaBlack
12-16-2010, 09:53 PM
So do we bring Cowher in and make him run a 43 D that he doesn't like or do we let him do his own thing and start all over on the D?
Maybe we can keep Kubes as OC and Cowher can be HC. J/K
Seriously, though, can Cowher live with a 43 D? I'm sick to death of drafting high pick DL and getting no bang for the buck.
What if we get Gruden? Our O is very productive. Will he keep the running game as is? What about the passing game?
I want better production without the revamping of the parts of our team that work or the base schemes we've drafted for.

Cowher will just switch to the 3-4. No need to keep the 4-3. Hasn't done the Texans any good.

ThaShark316
12-19-2010, 10:48 AM
More teasing...this time from Chris Mortenson...

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/12/19/report-cowher-eyes-three-teams/

As Bill Cowher nears the fourth anniversary of his resignation from the Steelers, Chris Mortensen of ESPN has linked Cowher to a trio of teams.

Cowhers wish list, per Mort, consists of the Dolphins, Texans, and Giants.

Doppelganger
12-19-2010, 11:00 AM
More teasing...this time from Chris Mortenson...

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/12/19/report-cowher-eyes-three-teams/

Oh well. I guess its Miami then.

DX-TEX
12-19-2010, 11:53 AM
More teasing...this time from Chris Mortenson...

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/12/19/report-cowher-eyes-three-teams/

Just coming to post. "If there is smoke there is fire" seems to fit right in. Guy keeps getting linked to the Texans, like he throwing himself at McNair. This just makes this season even more depressing.

gtexan02
12-19-2010, 12:59 PM
Oh well. I guess its Miami then.

If Miami makes the p layoffs, they aren't firing their head coach. Lets cheer for the Dolphins and Giants

NitroGSXR
12-19-2010, 01:12 PM
If Miami makes the p layoffs, they aren't firing their head coach. Lets cheer for the Dolphins and Giants

I'm not saying this is the case with Miami but there have been teams out there where merely making the playoffs wasn't enough...

Hervoyel
12-19-2010, 01:34 PM
If Bill Cowher is watching today and sees a couple more weeks of this mess he's liable to not want the job at any price. We're literally that bad today.

Hookem Horns
12-19-2010, 01:34 PM
If Miami makes the p layoffs, they aren't firing their head coach. Lets cheer for the Dolphins and Giants

Giants are looking real good right now.

Mr teX
12-19-2010, 01:42 PM
Giants are looking real good right now.

The giants go as Manning goes..Got to be frustrating for coughlin watching manning play with his job like that every week.

Hookem Horns
12-19-2010, 02:11 PM
The giants go as Manning goes..Got to be frustrating for coughlin watching manning play with his job like that every week.

You can say that about almost every NFL QB.

JB
12-19-2010, 02:16 PM
Giants are looking real good right now.

Glad I started Manningham in my playoff game...

Hookem Horns
12-19-2010, 03:14 PM
Looks like Cowher is going to the Giants ... they just pulled an Oilers by blowing a 31-10 4th QTR lead.

Sway
12-19-2010, 03:16 PM
I cannot friggin stand this team right now. We couldn't do anything effing thing right today! I think that when our hearts were broken last week vs the ravens, the players gave up, thinking what's the point? I'm done for the season. Won't be in Texas for the last two games at all, and I'm glad. I'm going to just pray, hope, and love the players as much as possible, and wait for next season..... and hopefully we can win some day.

TheMatrix31
12-19-2010, 03:17 PM
Looks like Cowher is going to the Giants ... they just pulled an Oilers by blowing a 31-10 4th QTR lead.

I dont think Coughlin gets fired unless they lose out.

CloakNNNdagger
12-22-2010, 07:00 PM
From the L.A. TIMES: (http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/sports_blog/2010/12/question-of-the-day-what-will-bill-cowher-be-doing-next-season-and-where-.html)

Question of the Day: What will Bill Cowher be doing next season and where? December 22, 2010 | 1:08 pm

Ken Murray, Baltimore Sun

ESPN's Chris Mortensen reported that Bill Cowher has a wish-list of three teams--the Texans, Dolphins and Giants. That strongly suggests Cowher won't be interested in current vacancies at Dallas (under the insufferable Jerry Jones), Minnesota (a stadium fiasco with no end in sight) or Denver (would you want Tim Tebow as your quarterback?).

Smart thinking.

Of the preferred three, the Texans are best situated to make a rapid rise. Their offense is top notch, if their defense is not. But Cowher knows defense; he can solve that. Miami is the team that Bill Parcells built -- and abandoned when he saw it wasn't going to work. The Dolphins have no quarterback because it was more convenient for Parcells to sign tackle Jake Long than try to sign quarterback Matt Ryan. The Giants are tempting because they have Eli Manning and Justin Tuck and are in the Big Apple. Hard to turn that down if Tom Coughlin gets canned.

But barring Coughlin's ouster, my guess is that Cowher resurfaces in Houston, where he can capitalize on the shifting winds of the division. The Colts are vulnerable, Tennessee is in turmoil and Jacksonville is headed to Los Angeles. Cowher is just what the Texans need.

Dan Pompei, Chicago Tribune

Bill Cowher has the luxury of being very selective. He can wait for precisely the right NFL job to open up because he likes being a broadcaster and he can demand exactly what he wants in his contract because he will be the most sought after candidate.

There are not many potential job openings that would appeal to Cowher. Even though he lives in North Carolina, the Panthers likely wouldn't meet his contract requirements. It's unlikely the 49ers would either. The Cowboys' situation might be too messy with Jerry Jones involved.

The strongest possibilities are the Giants, Texans, Dolphins and Broncos, assuming those teams make changes. The Giants could be the best fit for Cowher, but they probably will stick with Tom Coughlin. The most likely place for him to end up then might be Miami.

Dave Hyde, Sun Sentinel

If Bill Cowher wants a cushy job at a good salary, he'll stay beside Dan Marino on the CBS set next year, but if he wants to return to coaching, the Houston Texans are his best fit of the three teams on the short list.

The New York Giants is the best job, but the Mara family won't and shouldn't fire Tom Coughlin. The Dolphins job has too many problems, the most obvious being at quarterback.

Houston and Cowher work, though. Houston has the league's fifth-rated offense with all the necessary parts: good quarterback in Matt Schaub, dynamic playmaker in Andre Johnson and a solid running game.

Where Houston needs reorganization is defense. It has some players. It just needs some good offseason moves and better coaching. And what's Cowher's specialty? Defense. Everything says Houston is the best fit for him.

Sam Farmer, Los Angeles Times

On Sunday's edition of CBS' "The NFL Today," Bill Cowher is going to play sports scientist and go into his "lab" to conduct experiments on ways to improve football. He'll look at everything from re-seeding playoff teams, to widening the field, to looking into why coaches aren't given unlimited replay challenges.

What Cowher isn't going to do is announce he's coming back to coach -- and don't expect that announcement in the next year, either. Cowher likes being a TV analyst, and he doesn't have a burning desire to return to the sideline -- especially it's for a team that's not positioned to win.

Why would he want to go to a franchise that doesn't have a solid answer at quarterback -- Carolina or Denver, for instance -- or a place like Cleveland, which already has a dawg in Mike Holmgren? Dallas is going to keep Jason Garrett, and Minnesota -- which doesn't have a quarterback -- is going to keep Leslie Frasier.

What's more, NFL owners are going to be very careful about making splashy coaching hires while the labor situation is in dispute. You can expect to see Cowher on Sunday's next fall -- but expect to see him in a studio, not holding a clipboard.

Kimmy
12-22-2010, 09:02 PM
From the L.A. TIMES: (http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/sports_blog/2010/12/question-of-the-day-what-will-bill-cowher-be-doing-next-season-and-where-.html)

Why must you torture me with this? :drool: :drool:

DX-TEX
12-22-2010, 09:44 PM
Anyone catch John Claytons Huddle?"

http://espn.go.com/blog/afcsouth

He briefly states that sources state some people in Houston have already been reaching out to Cowher.:bravo:

JB
12-22-2010, 09:49 PM
Anyone catch John Claytons Huddle?"

http://espn.go.com/blog/afcsouth

He briefly states that sources state some people in Houston have already been reaching out to Cowher.:bravo:

That would mean the talk shows & Solomon's article...

DX-TEX
12-22-2010, 10:01 PM
That would mean the talk shows & Solomon's article...

I thought that for a second as well but why would he state "I have heard from sources" if referring to the media? Is it top secret the fans and meia want him here?

NitroGSXR
12-22-2010, 10:46 PM
Anyone catch John Claytons Huddle?"

http://espn.go.com/blog/afcsouth

He briefly states that sources state some people in Houston have already been reaching out to Cowher.:bravo:
I hope not because I think the Texans would be in violation of NFL rules. I don't think we are allowed to officially pursue him yet.

Can someone confirm?

ChampionTexan
12-22-2010, 10:53 PM
I hope not because I think the Texans would be in violation of NFL rules. I don't think we are allowed to officially pursue him yet.

Can someone confirm?

Cowher's not under contract to anyone, so there's no tampering associated with talking to him.

NitroGSXR
12-22-2010, 11:07 PM
Cowher's not under contract to anyone, so there's no tampering associated with talking to him.

But Kubiak is under contract? Are you saying it does not matter?

TexCanada
12-22-2010, 11:28 PM
But Kubiak is under contract? Are you saying it does not matter?

That shouldn't make a difference. We can sign a free agent WR even though we already have a WR under contract on our team.

DoCRoN
12-22-2010, 11:39 PM
But Kubiak is under contract? Are you saying it does not matter?

Just from a general perspective, I'd say by the rules there's no problem here since Cowher isn't with another team. I mean, ultimately, it may be looked at as being kinda crappy to your current coach, but.... I guess if your current coach is kinda crappy, touche..

Norg
12-22-2010, 11:48 PM
if cower comes we will prob switch to a 3-4

how will that work ???? with our current players i guess we will have to draft or get a couple NT and make mario a OLB

DoCRoN
12-23-2010, 12:00 AM
if cower comes we will prob switch to a 3-4

how will that work ???? with our current players i guess we will have to draft or get a couple NT and make mario a OLB

This would concern me more if we had a decent defense. I know our biggest problems right now occur on the back end, but... I'm willing to roll the dice and, if a new HC comes in and wants to run a 3-4, so be it*.

*as long as switching to a 3-4 doesn't give him a built-in excuse for needing more time to turn the defensive production around

michaelm
12-23-2010, 12:23 AM
But Kubiak is under contract? Are you saying it does not matter?

I think it's only tampering if you have communications with a person who is under contract with another team.

Hookem Horns
12-23-2010, 12:40 AM
NY Giants co-owner Jonathon Tisch lit into Coughlin and company after that collapse on Sunday saying things like "that was totally unacceptable for this franchise", etc.

Last season when the Giants finished 8-8 this was the other co-owner's (John Mara) response "Im disappointed at everything. Im unhappy at everybody. Its just not acceptable to perform like that, Mara said after the Giants 2009 campaign ended without a trip to the postseason. Im less than 24 hours after the end of the season, so Im sure Ill cool down at some point and try to make intelligent decisions going forward. But obviously Im not very happy right now. And they know that.

Man, wouldn't it be nice if Bob McNair was more like those guys.

Now with that being said let's say the Giants lose to the Packers and Giants ownership dismisses Coughlin and hires Cowher (personally I like Coughlin and don't want this to happen). What would you think about the Texans hiring Coughlin?

steelbtexan
12-23-2010, 12:51 AM
if cower comes we will prob switch to a 3-4

how will that work ???? with our current players i guess we will have to draft or get a couple NT and make mario a OLB

The DL will look something like this

Williams, FA(Solari,Franklin or P Williams), A.Smith
Bulman, Mitchell, OkOye (If he picks it up)
Low draft pick

LB

Barwin (If healthy), Ryans, Cushing, Draft pick (Herzlich,Miller,Ayers)
Late draft pick, Bentley, Sharpton, Adibi

DB

Jackson , 3rd rd draft pick, Pollard , Quin
McNannis, Cheap FA signing, 4th rd pick, Molden
McCain

Drafting a pass rushing OLB and if Barwin comes back healthy, along with signing a big vet DT and investing in a couple of fast young S (Hill and Black from FLA should be available in the 3/4th rds.)

Mix in a competent defensive staff, (quuality AC's will want to work with Cowher) some good young talent drafted by people who know what to look for to build a great defense and some toughness that Cowher defenses are known for and the future looks bright. As opposed to the disgrace of a defense that THE GREAT FANS of the HOUSTON TEXANS have been subjected too.

Mari-OWNED!
12-23-2010, 12:56 AM
What would you think about the Texans hiring Coughlin?

I don't want Coughlin to be honest. I'd rather keep Kubiak than hire him.

He's .555 for his coaching career, and four of his eight playoff appearances have ended in a loss in the first playoff game. (Houston Oilers much?)

He's not a bad coach, but I don't think he's much of an improvement that most Texans fans are looking for.

BullNation4Life
12-23-2010, 01:00 AM
The DL will look something like this

Williams FA(Solari,Franklin or P Williams) A.Smith
Bulman Mitchell OkOye (If he picks it up)
Low draft pick

LB

Barwin (If healthy) Ryans Cushing Draft pick (Herzlich,Miller,Ayers)
Late draft pick Bentley Sharpton Adibi

DB

Jackson 3rd rd draft pick Pollard Quin
McNannis Cheap FA signing 4th rd pick Molden
McCain

Drafting a pass rushing OLB and if Barwin comes back healthy, along with signing a big vet DT and investing in a couple of fast young S (Hill and Black from FLA should be available in the 3/4th rds.)

Mix in a competent defensive staff, (quuality AC's will want to work with Cowher) some good young talent drafted by people who know what to look for to build a great defense and some toughness that Cowher defenses are known for and the future looks bright. As opposed to the disgrace of a defense that THE GREAT FANS of the HOUSTON TEXANS have been subjected too.

I think it would be easier to move Cushing and a healthy Barwin on the outside as your pass rushing OLBs and find another inside guy to play next to DeMeco. That player doesn't even need to be all star caliber, just decent to play the other MLB spot. Then you got

Mario
Fat Guy X
Smith

Cushing
Demeco
Player X
Barwin

Jackson
Quinn
Pollard
Player X (Maybe Nolan)

Beautiful thing about a 3-4 is your DBs do not have to be pro bowl type players IF your OLBs and DL are getting pressure on the QB, which they should with blitz packages. Most 3-4 defenses play with no name corners and usually have a good safety. This defense would suite Pollard nicely, since he is a "in the box" type of safety.

This defense could be ran in 1 year and could be good, just need a few pieces here and there and DC that knows what the hell he is doing, like a Wade Phillips or Dick Lebeau type of 3-4 coach....

Hookem Horns
12-23-2010, 01:21 AM
He's .555 for his coaching career, and four of his eight playoff appearances have ended in a loss in the first playoff game. (Houston Oilers much?)


Houston Oilers? No ... I mean hell no to that. The Oilers and us fans could have only dreamed of his success.

So basically what you are saying is his teams have made the playoffs 8 out of 14 times and half of those times they have advanced beyond the first round? Oh he has also won a Super Bowl?

Dude would be a legend in Houston if he accomplished all of that here.

http://poweryogaforsports.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/05/tom-coughlin-257x300.jpg

Norg
12-23-2010, 02:09 AM
Has the time gets near to the end of the season i just have this fuzzy feeling i think im like bob i cant pull the trigger

Kubes is our home town boy just like cower was to PA

i think we might just wanna give him 1 more year ......:kitten: what if we fire him and then he goes on to greatness

GNTLEWOLF
12-23-2010, 02:16 AM
Has the time gets near to the end of the season i just have this fuzzy feeling i think im like bob i cant pull the trigger

Kubes is our home town boy just like cower was to PA

i think we might just wanna give him 1 more year ......:kitten: what if we fire him and then he goes on to greatness

Ya know , that could happen, but he would have to get a clue first. I don't think he will ever be anything in Houston except Marvin Lewis II. He will not understand what went wrong until he realizes he has failed and really begins to see himself as part of the proble. Only then will he be able to truthfully address his issues. That can't happen if he isn't fired from here. Sorry bout that... He has to go.

Mike Kerns
12-23-2010, 08:12 AM
I wrote an article yesterday on Battle Red Blog tackling all the issues and concerns against hiring Cowher. It's succeeded in getting a lot of people over there in being okay to good with hiring Cowher now if the opportunity arises.

http://www.battleredblog.com/2010/12/22/1891283/time-for-the-cowher-power-hour

Check it if you got a sec.

Second Honeymoon
12-23-2010, 09:01 AM
Has the time gets near to the end of the season i just have this fuzzy feeling i think im like bob i cant pull the trigger

Kubes is our home town boy just like cower was to PA

i think we might just wanna give him 1 more year ......:kitten: what if we fire him and then he goes on to greatness

hahahahaha

that is a good one

Brisco_County
12-23-2010, 12:22 PM
Cowher has coached 4-3's before.

But I do like the idea of Barwin as a 3-4 OLB. Cushing too.

Ryan
12-23-2010, 12:34 PM
Has the time gets near to the end of the season i just have this fuzzy feeling i think im like bob i cant pull the trigger

Kubes is our home town boy just like cower was to PA

i think we might just wanna give him 1 more year ......:kitten: what if we fire him and then he goes on to greatness


Another classic post by Norg.

Tune in next week to find out his thoughts on David Carr belonging in the Hall of Fame.

TEXANRED
12-23-2010, 01:43 PM
Houston Oilers? No ... I mean hell no to that. The Oilers and us fans could have only dreamed of his success.

So basically what you are saying is his teams have made the playoffs 8 out of 14 times and half of those times they have advanced beyond the first round? Oh he has also won a Super Bowl?

Dude would be a legend in Houston if he accomplished all of that here.

http://poweryogaforsports.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/05/tom-coughlin-257x300.jpg

I hate Tom Cocklund. I would sooner hire Sam Wyche before I hired that jagoff.

NitroGSXR
12-23-2010, 02:50 PM
http://poweryogaforsports.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/05/tom-coughlin-257x300.jpg

Smug-looking bastard. The luck of some people...

Double Barrel
12-23-2010, 02:59 PM
NY Giants co-owner Jonathon Tisch lit into Coughlin and company after that collapse on Sunday saying things like "that was totally unacceptable for this franchise", etc.

Last season when the Giants finished 8-8 this was the other co-owner's (John Mara) response "“I’m disappointed at everything. I’m unhappy at everybody. It’s just not acceptable to perform like that,” Mara said after the Giants’ 2009 campaign ended without a trip to the postseason. “I’m less than 24 hours after the end of the season, so I’m sure I’ll cool down at some point and try to make intelligent decisions going forward. But obviously I’m not very happy right now. And they know that.”

Man, wouldn't it be nice if Bob McNair was more like those guys.

Now with that being said let's say the Giants lose to the Packers and Giants ownership dismisses Coughlin and hires Cowher (personally I like Coughlin and don't want this to happen). What would you think about the Texans hiring Coughlin?

McNair is like the anti-Mara. While Mara is pissed and lets his team know how he feels, McNair would be praising the team for playing hard and telling them you can't win it all.

I'm not dissing McNair, but it's just a fact that his public personae is 180 opposite of Mara. Perhaps he's different behind the scenes, but we have yet to hear of even one instance where he's riled up and pissed off enough to dress down the team.

I don't want Coughlin to be honest. I'd rather keep Kubiak than hire him.

He's .555 for his coaching career, and four of his eight playoff appearances have ended in a loss in the first playoff game. (Houston Oilers much?)

He's not a bad coach, but I don't think he's much of an improvement that most Texans fans are looking for.

This post is funny.

You honestly don't want a coach that has won a Super Bowl, been to two, won eight division titles (one of only six coaches in NFL history to claim at least seven division titles), ten postseason playoff berths, is only the second coach in NFL history to lead his team to the playoffs in each of his first six seasons as head coach, advanced to six AFC Championship games, has a career head coaching record of 161-99-1, and through the Super Bowl, his team had compiled a record of 108–1–1 in games in which they built a lead of at least eleven points (this stat is mind-boggling).

But you'd rather have a head coach whose crowning achievement is...one...winning...season. ONE.

Umm...okay. :ok:

TheMatrix31
12-23-2010, 05:55 PM
This post is funny.

You honestly don't want a coach that has won a Super Bowl, been to two, won eight division titles (one of only six coaches in NFL history to claim at least seven division titles), ten postseason playoff berths, is only the second coach in NFL history to lead his team to the playoffs in each of his first six seasons as head coach, advanced to six AFC Championship games, has a career head coaching record of 161-99-1, and through the Super Bowl, his team had compiled a record of 10811 in games in which they built a lead of at least eleven points (this stat is mind-boggling).

But you'd rather have a head coach whose crowning achievement is...one...winning...season. ONE.

Umm...okay. :ok:


Uhhh.........

CloakNNNdagger
12-23-2010, 06:47 PM
McNair is like the anti-Mara. While Mara is pissed and lets his team know how he feels, McNair would be praising the team for playing hard and telling them you can't win it all.

I'm not dissing McNair, but it's just a fact that his public personae is 180 opposite of Mara. Perhaps he's different behind the scenes, but we have yet to hear of even one instance where he's riled up and pissed off enough to dress down the team.



This post is funny.

You honestly don't want a coach that has won a Super Bowl, been to two, won eight division titles (one of only six coaches in NFL history to claim at least seven division titles), ten postseason playoff berths, is only the second coach in NFL history to lead his team to the playoffs in each of his first six seasons as head coach, advanced to six AFC Championship games, has a career head coaching record of 161-99-1, and through the Super Bowl, his team had compiled a record of 10811 in games in which they built a lead of at least eleven points (this stat is mind-boggling).

But you'd rather have a head coach whose crowning achievement is...one...winning...season. ONE.Umm...okay. :ok:


But THAT win was in Houston. How many winning seasons does Coughlin in Houston?.......NONE. So Kubiak wins hands down. He Da Man. Yeh, He Da Man.:kubepalm:

LikeMike
12-23-2010, 07:48 PM
I think it would be easier to move Cushing and a healthy Barwin on the outside as your pass rushing OLBs and find another inside guy to play next to DeMeco. That player doesn't even need to be all star caliber, just decent to play the other MLB spot. Then you got

Mario
Fat Guy X
Smith

Cushing
Demeco
Player X
Barwin

Jackson
Quinn
Pollard
Player X (Maybe Nolan)

Beautiful thing about a 3-4 is your DBs do not have to be pro bowl type players IF your OLBs and DL are getting pressure on the QB, which they should with blitz packages. Most 3-4 defenses play with no name corners and usually have a good safety. This defense would suite Pollard nicely, since he is a "in the box" type of safety.

This defense could be ran in 1 year and could be good, just need a few pieces here and there and DC that knows what the hell he is doing, like a Wade Phillips or Dick Lebeau type of 3-4 coach....

I like it! With a good veteran DT and a nice FS this defense should be really tough. Add Cowher to the mix and I expect this team to be ready by 2012.

Marcus
12-23-2010, 08:06 PM
If you want to go by their records, who's got a better one, Cowher or Coughlin?

And since when has a successful coach with one team ever gone on to be successful with another?

Name one. I don't even think Vince Lombardi has done that.

You say "proven", I say "retread".

GNTLEWOLF
12-23-2010, 08:16 PM
If you want to go by their records, who's got a better one, Cowher or Coughlin?

And since when has a successful coach with one team ever gone on to be successful with another?

Name one. I don't even think Vince Lombardi has done that.

You say "proven", I say "retread".
Actually, Mike Holmgren took Green Bay and the SEahawks to SuperBowls. He won with GreenBay but not with The SeaHawks. I'd say there was some success there.
Come to think of it...Didn't Dan Reeves take Denver and Atlanta? I know he never won the whole thing with either but he took them and they played.

JB
12-23-2010, 08:18 PM
Actually, Mike Holmgren took Green Bay and the SEahawks to SuperBowls. He won with GreenBay but not with The SeaHawks. I'd say there was some success there.

Vermeil also took two teams to the Super Bowl.

GNTLEWOLF
12-23-2010, 08:26 PM
Vermeil also took two teams to the Super Bowl.

Looks to me like re-treads may not be a bad deal after all.

JB
12-23-2010, 08:27 PM
Looks to me like re-treads may not be a bad deal after all.

Ya just never know! It's a crapshoot, just like most of life.

NitroGSXR
12-23-2010, 08:37 PM
Ya just never know! It's a crapshoot, just like most of life.

Nothing's truer than this but you can improve your odds with good GMing and an owner with solid football IQ.

In the end, it's all a crapshoot. Brad Johnson is an example of a lottery winner and Jim Kelly being a loser.

ChampionTexan
12-23-2010, 08:49 PM
If you want to go by their records, who's got a better one, Cowher or Coughlin?

And since when has a successful coach with one team ever gone on to be successful with another?

Name one. I don't even think Vince Lombardi has done that.

You say "proven", I say "retread".

While you don't define what you consider successful, in no particular order:

Don Shula (Colts - .755, Dolphins - .659)
George Allen (Rams - .691, Redskins - .742)
Tony Dungy (Bucs - .563, Colts - .759)
Marty Schottenheimer (Browns - .620 Chiefs - .635, Redskins - .500, Chargers - .588)
Mike Holmgren (Packers - .670, Seahawks - .538)
Don Coryell (Cardinals - .609 Chargers - .552)
Bill Parcells (Giants - .611, Pats - .500, Jets - .604, Cowboys - .531)
Tom Coughlin (Jags - .531, Giants - .582)

You could also throw in guys like Weeb Ewbank who won NFL championships pre-merger and a Super Bowl - even though their lifetime winning percentages weren't all that impressive. Paul Brown (Browns, Bengals), Dan Reeves has been to a Super Bowl with two different teams, Dick Vermeil won a Super Bowl with one team, went to a Super Bowl with another, and had a pretty decent run at K.C. to end his career.

Now not all of these might meet your definition of successful, but you just asked for one, so hopefully out of the list presented, you might be able to characterize one (or more) of these guys as slightly better than a retread.

drs23
12-23-2010, 11:24 PM
While you don't define what you consider successful, in no particular order:

Don Shula (Colts - .755, Dolphins - .659)
George Allen (Rams - .691, Redskins - .742)
Tony Dungy (Bucs - .563, Colts - .759)
Marty Schottenheimer (Browns - .620 Chiefs - .635, Redskins - .500, Chargers - .588)
Mike Holmgren (Packers - .670, Seahawks - .538)
Don Coryell (Cardinals - .609 Chargers - .552)
Bill Parcells (Giants - .611, Pats - .500, Jets - .604, Cowboys - .531)
Tom Coughlin (Jags - .531, Giants - .582)

You could also throw in guys like Weeb Ewbank who won NFL championships pre-merger and a Super Bowl - even though their lifetime winning percentages weren't all that impressive. Paul Brown (Browns, Bengals), Dan Reeves has been to a Super Bowl with two different teams, Dick Vermeil won a Super Bowl with one team, went to a Super Bowl with another, and had a pretty decent run at K.C. to end his career.

Now not all of these might meet your definition of successful, but you just asked for one, so hopefully out of the list presented, you might be able to characterize one (or more) of these guys as slightly better than a retread.

Great research Champ.

Rep

Hookem Horns
12-23-2010, 11:49 PM
If you want to go by their records, who's got a better one, Cowher or Coughlin?

And since when has a successful coach with one team ever gone on to be successful with another?

Name one. I don't even think Vince Lombardi has done that.

You say "proven", I say "retread".

If successful only means winning a Super Bowl then your point is valid since no coach has ever won a SB with 2 different organizations.

However if success just means taking a team far into the playoffs or even reaching a Super Bowl there are quite a few. See ChampionTexan's research.

Coughlin made the AFC Championship game in only the Jags 2nd year of existence or was it 3rd? He won a SB with the Giants. His record speaks for itself.

Parcells won 2 SB with the Giants, reached one with Pats, reached the AFC Championship game with the Jets, could easily have reached similar heights with the Cowboys without interference from Jerry Jones.

Tony Dungy won SB with the Colts, reached the NFC Championship game with the Bucs.

Dan Reeves reached the SB with 2 different organizations.

Holmgren has already been mentioned.

IMO, someone is due to win a SB for 2 different organizations. To not hire a guy who has won a SB in the past because of that stat is moronic.

Doppelganger
12-24-2010, 08:01 AM
While you don't define what you consider successful, in no particular order:

Don Shula (Colts - .755, Dolphins - .659)
George Allen (Rams - .691, Redskins - .742)
Tony Dungy (Bucs - .563, Colts - .759)
Marty Schottenheimer (Browns - .620 Chiefs - .635, Redskins - .500, Chargers - .588)
Mike Holmgren (Packers - .670, Seahawks - .538)
Don Coryell (Cardinals - .609 Chargers - .552)
Bill Parcells (Giants - .611, Pats - .500, Jets - .604, Cowboys - .531)
Tom Coughlin (Jags - .531, Giants - .582)

You could also throw in guys like Weeb Ewbank who won NFL championships pre-merger and a Super Bowl - even though their lifetime winning percentages weren't all that impressive. Paul Brown (Browns, Bengals), Dan Reeves has been to a Super Bowl with two different teams, Dick Vermeil won a Super Bowl with one team, went to a Super Bowl with another, and had a pretty decent run at K.C. to end his career.

Now not all of these might meet your definition of successful, but you just asked for one, so hopefully out of the list presented, you might be able to characterize one (or more) of these guys as slightly better than a retread.

Excellent post! Rep your way.

To add to your post, the only way to win the Superbowl is to get to the playoffs. In most years you have to have a winning record to get into the playoffs. In 5 years, Kubes has 1 winning year. All of these guys(with the exception of Parcells in NE) were ABOVE .500. That means they won more than they lost and gave their teams a chance at the playoffs. Kubiak is 36-42. You do not get to the playoffs with a .462 winning percentage.

CloakNNNdagger
12-24-2010, 08:30 AM
Excellent post! Rep your way.

To add to your post, the only way to win the Superbowl is to get to the playoffs. In most years you have to have a winning record to get into the playoffs. In 5 years, Kubes has 1 winning year. All of these guys(with the exception of Parcells in NE) were ABOVE .500. That means they won more than they lost and gave their teams a chance at the playoffs. Kubiak is 36-42. You do not get to the playoffs with a .462 winning percentage.

If you carefully look at all those coaches on Champion's list, even though I have not broken it down, I would bet that the near .500-600 records are somewhat deceiving. I would bet that those numbers have been brought down by a few very lean years........followed by some very high-powered years.............as opposed to the experience under Kubiak which entails some very mediocre years with a single mediocre year sprinkled in there.

In the NFL, for every LITTLE TRAIN THAT COULD, there is one that couldn't.

Doppelganger
12-24-2010, 08:40 AM
If you carefully look at all those coaches on Champion's list, even though I have not broken it down, I would bet that the near .500-600 records are somewhat deceiving. I would bet that those numbers have been brought down by a few very lean years........followed by some very high-powered years.............as opposed to the experience under Kubiak which entails some very mediocre years with a single mediocre year sprinkled in there.

In the NFL, for every LITTLE TRAIN THAT COULD, there is one that couldn't.


I don't think I was as clear as I intended. Those coaches got teams to the playoffs becuase they had winning records. With different players in different cities they proved to be winners. My point was that to even get to the playoffs you need a winning record, usually. Kubiak in 5 years has 1 winning record and four losing ones. His absolute best year was 9-7 or one game over .500 and he has a sub .500 coaching record overall.

Therefore (the piece forgot to put in) was that those guys were winners and Kubiak is not a winner. We need a winner to be our coach and that's why I support Bill Cowher.

Cowher Power!

Surreal McCoy
12-24-2010, 11:02 AM
While you don't define what you consider successful, in no particular order:

Don Shula (Colts - .755, Dolphins - .659)
George Allen (Rams - .691, Redskins - .742)
Tony Dungy (Bucs - .563, Colts - .759)
Marty Schottenheimer (Browns - .620 Chiefs - .635, Redskins - .500, Chargers - .588)
Mike Holmgren (Packers - .670, Seahawks - .538)
Don Coryell (Cardinals - .609 Chargers - .552)
Bill Parcells (Giants - .611, Pats - .500, Jets - .604, Cowboys - .531)
Tom Coughlin (Jags - .531, Giants - .582)

You could also throw in guys like Weeb Ewbank who won NFL championships pre-merger and a Super Bowl - even though their lifetime winning percentages weren't all that impressive. Paul Brown (Browns, Bengals), Dan Reeves has been to a Super Bowl with two different teams, Dick Vermeil won a Super Bowl with one team, went to a Super Bowl with another, and had a pretty decent run at K.C. to end his career.

Now not all of these might meet your definition of successful, but you just asked for one, so hopefully out of the list presented, you might be able to characterize one (or more) of these guys as slightly better than a retread.


Now divide that by the total number of HCs to ever coach at least 2 teams and you'll get your success rate.

DonnyMost
12-24-2010, 02:18 PM
While you don't define what you consider successful, in no particular order:

Don Shula (Colts - .755, Dolphins - .659)
George Allen (Rams - .691, Redskins - .742)
Tony Dungy (Bucs - .563, Colts - .759)
Marty Schottenheimer (Browns - .620 Chiefs - .635, Redskins - .500, Chargers - .588)
Mike Holmgren (Packers - .670, Seahawks - .538)
Don Coryell (Cardinals - .609 Chargers - .552)
Bill Parcells (Giants - .611, Pats - .500, Jets - .604, Cowboys - .531)
Tom Coughlin (Jags - .531, Giants - .582)

You could also throw in guys like Weeb Ewbank who won NFL championships pre-merger and a Super Bowl - even though their lifetime winning percentages weren't all that impressive. Paul Brown (Browns, Bengals), Dan Reeves has been to a Super Bowl with two different teams, Dick Vermeil won a Super Bowl with one team, went to a Super Bowl with another, and had a pretty decent run at K.C. to end his career.

Now not all of these might meet your definition of successful, but you just asked for one, so hopefully out of the list presented, you might be able to characterize one (or more) of these guys as slightly better than a retread.

There's two sides to the retread coin, seems that for every repeat success, you have a failure.

Mike Ditka failed in New Orleans.

Jimmy Johnson failed in Miami.

Dan Reeves failed in New York.

Dennis Green failed in Arizona.

Herman Edwards (modest success in NYJ) failed in KC.

Joe Gibbs failed in his second run in Washington.

Art Shell failed in his second run in Oakland.

Steve Mariucci failed in Detroit.

George Siefert failed in Carolina.

Buddy Ryan failed in Arizona.

Mike Shannahan has failed in Washington.

Granted, I'd take Coughlin, Cowher, Dungy, or even Gruden over Kubiak at this point... but we should all realize that success isn't guaranteed with a proven coach anymore than it is with an unproven coach... I'm open to going either route, but I'll try to keep my expectations in check.

gary
12-24-2010, 02:25 PM
This coaching debate is getting old.

ChampionTexan
12-24-2010, 02:38 PM
Now divide that by the total number of HCs to ever coach at least 2 teams and you'll get your success rate.

There's two sides to the retread coin, seems that for every repeat success, you have a failure.

Mike Ditka failed in New Orleans.

Jimmy Johnson failed in Miami.

Dan Reeves failed in New York.

Dennis Green failed in Arizona.

Herman Edwards (modest success in NYJ) failed in KC.

Joe Gibbs failed in his second run in Washington.

Art Shell failed in his second run in Oakland.

Steve Mariucci failed in Detroit.

George Siefert failed in Carolina.

Buddy Ryan failed in Arizona.

Mike Shannahan has failed in Washington.

Granted, I'd take Coughlin, Cowher, Dungy, or even Gruden over Kubiak at this point... but we should all realize that success isn't guaranteed with a proven coach anymore than it is with an unproven coach... I'm open to going either route, but I'll try to keep my expectations in check.

Hey - I want change, but I'm not at all saying it has to be an experienced HC with a successful track record. I've also seen ICAK's post pointing out that right now, 7 of the 8 division leaders have first time HC's. I'll add that if the season ended today (yes - a stupid premise), 10 of the 12 HC's would be first-time HC's. As with most things, there's more than one way to be successful, and the execution (with apologies to those who hate the word) supercedes the method.

If they hire a new HC, I'll have an opinion, and it won't be based on new HC or experienced HC. It also won't be worth diddly. The hiring of Capers didn't do much for me at all, and I was whole-heartedly in support of the Kubiak hiring. Yeah, I'll have an opinion, but I'll also recognize the odds on me being right is about the same as the odds of correctly calling a coin flip (See my sig). Fortunately, my opinion shouldn't and doesn't matter to anyone (me included). Unfortunately, the folks whose opinion does matter are now 0-2 on hires. Let's hope the third times a charm, and that the third time gets here soon.

As to the success rate of first-time as opposed to experienced as opposed to "previously successful" head coaches, I'm sure someone has reams of analysis on that (or if they don't they should). All I (and several other posters) were trying to do was point out that saying there's not one HC out there who's been successful in more than one place is either silliness, laziness, or ignorance.

JB
12-24-2010, 02:42 PM
It's not just a new coach this organization needs. To be successful, they need to get better from top to bottom.

The scouting staff is not good enough.
The medical staff is not good enough.
The coaching staff is not good enough.
The Gm is not good enough.
The players are not good enough.

I think there needs to be a total shakeup across the board.

I don't think you could bring in a Cowher or Gruden or anyone else and be a good team without changes in all areas. Rick Smith has to go if Kubiak does, and the new GM (or preferably a President of Football Operations) needs to bring in his coach and scouts and players.

texanchris
12-24-2010, 03:03 PM
Our season could be harder next year than this year. we play the falcons, saints, steelers, ravens who are all good teams, and the rest of thr NFC South and AFC North are pretty good excluding the panthers. If we have a 5-9 record playing the AFC West and the NFC east then we will probably be in trouble with Kubiak as the texans coach.

gary
12-24-2010, 03:15 PM
I just hope there is football next season.

Mike Kerns
12-27-2010, 02:05 AM
Pretty kick ass picture someone from Clutchfans posted:

http://www.caiocacau.com/popups/mcnair2.jpg

False Start
12-27-2010, 10:51 AM
From Peter King's Twitter.

RT @Sneaky_short: Best coaching vacancy for a new head coach to win right away next season? ... Houston.

DX-TEX
12-27-2010, 10:57 AM
From Peter King's Twitter.

And that me friends is why Houston should have the first shot at all the coaching candidates.

Maddict5
12-27-2010, 10:59 AM
Pros:
-Tough minded
-winning HC
-playoffs in 10/15 yrs as steelers HC
-1 SB

Cons:
-wont have dick lebeau as DC if he comes here
-wont have many suitable 3-4 personnel which leaves quite a ? as the defence has always been a strength in his teams. many of our players prob wouldnt do well in the more complicated 3-4 scheme as evidenced by the annual required dumbing down of the current defence
-questionable personnel decisions, especially in later yrs (92-06) http://www.databasefootball.com/draft/draftteam.htm?tm=PIT&lg=NFL
-offence could easily regress some also as he has always a power running scheme


personally i dont want the guy. his supposed strength doesnt match up with what we have and our strength could be neutralised. if we do hire a new HC, my vote would be for john fox

powda
12-27-2010, 11:01 AM
Holy trinity? =

Cowher as head coach (He'll want GM powers)

Defensive coordinator = Wade Phillps
Offensive coordinator = Brad Childress

Pantherstang84
12-27-2010, 11:04 AM
Pros:
-Tough minded
-winning HC
-playoffs in 10/15 yrs as steelers HC
-1 SB

Cons:
-wont have dick lebeau as DC if he comes here
-wont have many suitable 3-4 personnel which leaves quite a ? as the defence has always been a strength in his teams. not to many may of our players prob wouldnt do well in the more complicated 3-4 scheme as evidenced by the annual required dumbing down of the current defence
-questionable personnel decisions, especially in later yrs (92-06) http://www.databasefootball.com/draft/draftteam.htm?tm=PIT&lg=NFL
-offence could easily regress some also as he has always a power running scheme


personally i dont want the guy. his supposed strength doesnt match up with what we have and our strength could be neutralised. if we do hire a new HC, my vote would be for john fox

Swap one failed HC for another one? Ooooook?

FirstTexansFan
12-27-2010, 11:05 AM
I'm on the "Anybody but who we have" wagon, but, Fox over Cower? No way :) Your argument is valid, I understand our personnel don't fit a 3-4 on defense, but when your #32, does it really matter? As for a DC, there are many options available other than Dick Lebeau, I'd take Wade Phillips in a heart beat.

PHAROAH
12-27-2010, 11:12 AM
I love Bill Cowher but I find it interesting that Tony Dungy's name isn't in this discussion as he ruled this division with an iron fist and he has a super bowl under his belt as well and we wouldn't have to go to the 3-4 defense so I am all for Bill Cowher coming to H-Town but I think we need to start mentioning Tony Dungy who would be a great fit in this divsion and knows how to defend against the colts & Payton Manning.

TheCD
12-27-2010, 11:16 AM
Cons:
-wont have dick lebeau as DC if he comes here
-wont have many suitable 3-4 personnel which leaves quite a ? as the defence has always been a strength in his teams. not to many may of our players prob wouldnt do well in the more complicated 3-4 scheme as evidenced by the annual required dumbing down of the current defence
-questionable personnel decisions, especially in later yrs (92-06) http://www.databasefootball.com/draft/draftteam.htm?tm=PIT&lg=NFL
-offence could easily regress some also as he has always a power running scheme

LeBeau and the Offense are really my only two worries here.

There is no way that any defense, no matter how complicated and how unwilling he is to dumb it down could possibly be worse than our "worst in NFL history" record our guys our fielding now.

Heck...maybe these guys really are more suited for a 3/4 and our coaches are too oblivious to tell...

nero THE zero
12-27-2010, 11:17 AM
My biggest concern is his desire to have personnel control.

I think the biggest failing of this organization is its lack of top-down hierarchy. It has been the biggest contributor to failures in talent evaluation, hirings, and timely response to issues/problems in the organization. If this had been properly arranged prior to Kubiak's hiring, I think his chances at developing a successful team increase tenfold. I think hiring Cowher will only exacerbate that problem within this organization.

So, while I think Cowher could and would have us in the playoffs in 2011, I don't think he's the best choice for the long term success of the Texans' franchise.

TheCD
12-27-2010, 11:18 AM
I love Bill Cowher but I find it interesting that Tony Dungy's name isn't in this discussion as he ruled this division with an iron fist and he has a super bowl under his belt as well and we wouldn't have to go to the 3-4 defense so I am all for Bill Cowher coming to H-Town but I think we need to start mentioning Tony Dungy who would be a great fit in this divsion and knows how to defend against the colts & Payton Manning.

Tony Dungy has repeatedly said he doesn't want to coach again. On top of that, he continues to turn down head coaching opportunities year by year. I'm pretty sure (nothing's ever guaranteed with NFL coaches) that he's serious in not returning.

bckey
12-27-2010, 11:19 AM
From Peter King's Twitter.

RT @Sneaky_short: Best coaching vacancy for a new head coach to win right away next season? ... Houston.


Peter King is a little early with the coaching vacancy in Houston talk.

Double Barrel
12-27-2010, 11:20 AM
While you don't define what you consider successful, in no particular order:

Don Shula (Colts - .755, Dolphins - .659)
George Allen (Rams - .691, Redskins - .742)
Tony Dungy (Bucs - .563, Colts - .759)
Marty Schottenheimer (Browns - .620 Chiefs - .635, Redskins - .500, Chargers - .588)
Mike Holmgren (Packers - .670, Seahawks - .538)
Don Coryell (Cardinals - .609 Chargers - .552)
Bill Parcells (Giants - .611, Pats - .500, Jets - .604, Cowboys - .531)
Tom Coughlin (Jags - .531, Giants - .582)

You could also throw in guys like Weeb Ewbank who won NFL championships pre-merger and a Super Bowl - even though their lifetime winning percentages weren't all that impressive. Paul Brown (Browns, Bengals), Dan Reeves has been to a Super Bowl with two different teams, Dick Vermeil won a Super Bowl with one team, went to a Super Bowl with another, and had a pretty decent run at K.C. to end his career.

Now not all of these might meet your definition of successful, but you just asked for one, so hopefully out of the list presented, you might be able to characterize one (or more) of these guys as slightly better than a retread.

Well done, man.

http://files.sharenator.com/pwned_PWNED_s560x313_77272_580_random_shit-s560x313-102226-580.jpg


If successful only means winning a Super Bowl then your point is valid since no coach has ever won a SB with 2 different organizations.

However if success just means taking a team far into the playoffs or even reaching a Super Bowl there are quite a few. See ChampionTexan's research.

Coughlin made the AFC Championship game in only the Jags 2nd year of existence or was it 3rd? He won a SB with the Giants. His record speaks for itself.

Parcells won 2 SB with the Giants, reached one with Pats, reached the AFC Championship game with the Jets, could easily have reached similar heights with the Cowboys without interference from Jerry Jones.

Tony Dungy won SB with the Colts, reached the NFC Championship game with the Bucs.

Dan Reeves reached the SB with 2 different organizations.

Holmgren has already been mentioned.

IMO, someone is due to win a SB for 2 different organizations. To not hire a guy who has won a SB in the past because of that stat is moronic.

I agree completely. Unfortunately, I'm afraid that "moronic" might be applicable when the owner keeps mediocre in place in spite of the fact of overwhelming evidence that our head coach and his staff are nothing more than losers.

Now divide that by the total number of HCs to ever coach at least 2 teams and you'll get your success rate.

The reply was not about "success rate", but rather to the following question posed by Marcus: "And since when has a successful coach with one team ever gone on to be successful with another?"

Success in our case is simply playoffs at this point. Talk of Super Bowl is idiotic when this team has yet to even sniff a post season game.

Doppelganger
12-27-2010, 11:21 AM
Pros:
-Tough minded
-winning HC
-playoffs in 10/15 yrs as steelers HC
-1 SB

Cons:
-wont have dick lebeau as DC if he comes here
-wont have many suitable 3-4 personnel which leaves quite a ? as the defence has always been a strength in his teams. not to many may of our players prob wouldnt do well in the more complicated 3-4 scheme as evidenced by the annual required dumbing down of the current defence
-questionable personnel decisions, especially in later yrs (92-06) http://www.databasefootball.com/draft/draftteam.htm?tm=PIT&lg=NFL
-offence could easily regress some also as he has always a power running scheme


personally i dont want the guy. his supposed strength doesnt match up with what we have and our strength could be neutralised. if we do hire a new HC, my vote would be for john fox

You are right with your cons. However, I would like to offer this.

Cowher is a well known defense minded coach. There are lots of great 3-4 d line coaches who would love to cut their teeth with him. Plus, he can bring in an established name like a Wade Phillips to be the Defensive coach. Wade, like LeBeau is a great D coordinator who simply cannot be a head coach. Give Cowher the job, let him bring in a Wade Phillips or Rod Ryan to be D coordinator and you have a really good start. Between them they can fill out the coaching staff with younbger hungry coaches and veterans who went beyond their abilities and need a job. So, I would not worry too much about that.

You are right we don't have a lot of 3-4 d players. But we also don't have a lot of 4-3 D players either. Mario, Meco, Cush can play 3-4. Then add in Barwin, and we have the beginning of a D that could play a 3-4. Cowher bring an intensity and demand for excellence that will fire up the team. Rather than half assing it out there, they will give effort. The difference between half assing and effort could mean a couple of games. In the NFL, the difference between a playoff team and a non playoff team can be a couple of hustle plays.

PHAROAH
12-27-2010, 11:21 AM
Tony Dungy has repeatedly said he doesn't want to coach again. On top of that, he continues to turn down head coaching opportunities year by year. I'm pretty sure (nothing's ever guaranteed with NFL coaches) that he's serious in not returning.Look how many coaches have said that in the past and they always come out of retirement it's about control over personel choices I think that Tony Dungy would listen just like the others it all depends on the pursuit of the owner IMO.

Thorn
12-27-2010, 11:26 AM
Pros:
-Tough minded
-winning HC
-playoffs in 10/15 yrs as steelers HC
-1 SB

Cons:
-wont have dick lebeau as DC if he comes here
-wont have many suitable 3-4 personnel which leaves quite a ? as the defence has always been a strength in his teams. many of our players prob wouldnt do well in the more complicated 3-4 scheme as evidenced by the annual required dumbing down of the current defence
-questionable personnel decisions, especially in later yrs (92-06) http://www.databasefootball.com/draft/draftteam.htm?tm=PIT&lg=NFL
-offence could easily regress some also as he has always a power running scheme


personally i dont want the guy. his supposed strength doesnt match up with what we have and our strength could be neutralised. if we do hire a new HC, my vote would be for john fox

Cower did run a power running scheme, he also passed a lot when he had the right personell. Cower is not a fool, he'll use Schaub and AJ effectively. As to the running game, there's not a coach on the planet that wouldn't run a lot if you've got Foster, Tate, and Ward as your RBs, and Leach as your FB.

TheCD
12-27-2010, 11:26 AM
Look how many coaches have said that in the past and they always come out of retirement it's about control over personel choices I think that Tony Dungy would listen just like the others it all depends on the pursuit of the owner IMO.

Perhaps, but if people are going to make the argument that Cowher would be nothing without LeBeau, then I will point out the fact that without Monte Kiffin, Dungy consistently had the worst defenses in the NFL.

No thanks.

TheCD
12-27-2010, 11:27 AM
Cower did run a power running scheme, he also passed a lot when he had the right personell. Cower is not a fool, he'll use Schaub and AJ effectively. As to the running game, there's not a coach on the planet that wouldn't run a lot if you've got Foster, Tate, and Ward as your RBs, and Leach as your FB.

...

Except for Gary Kubiak

...


:kubepalm:

Second Honeymoon
12-27-2010, 11:30 AM
Who is the most qualified HC available?
I think cowher is the most qualified and LeBeau could leave Pittsburgh to come here and some people expect him to join cowher wherever he goes

My list in order of preference would be
1. Jimmy Johnson (not gonna happen)
2. Cowher
3. Gruden
4. Parcells being GM and hiring new HC
4. Fisher
5. Fox
6. Harbaugh

Holmgren isn't going anywhere

NitroGSXR
12-27-2010, 11:31 AM
Getting excited about Cowher or any other prospective HC is fools gold. It all matters none because Gary Kubiak still has control of this team. Until that changes... bleh.

silvrhand
12-27-2010, 11:32 AM
Who is the most qualified HC available?
I think cowher is the most qualified and LeBeau could leave Pittsburgh to come here and some people expect him to join cowher wherever he goes


Whaaa??

I'm sorry if Cowher can pull Dick LeBeau out of Pittsburgh hire the man.. I'd take the best DC in the NFL right now in a heartbeat.

El Tejano
12-27-2010, 11:33 AM
John Fox will get us on Sirius Satelite Radio ALOT. They love him on that station. I can't believe they interview him like he's winning or something.

Maddict5
12-27-2010, 11:37 AM
Swap one failed HC for another one? Ooooook?

imo he matches up to what we have much better- he builds good 4-3 defences. he had good offences until delhomme randomly went off the ledge. hes gotten to as many SB's as cowher in a much shorter timespan. hes been stuck with a cheapskate owner the last couple yrs yet his teams play hard despite a terrible qb situation.

id be way more confident the guy would win here instead of cowher


You are right we don't have a lot of 3-4 d players. But we also don't have a lot of 4-3 D players either. Mario, Meco, Cush can play 3-4. Then add in Barwin, and we have the beginning of a D that could play a 3-4. Cowher bring an intensity and demand for excellence that will fire up the team. Rather than half assing it out there, they will give effort. The difference between half assing and effort could mean a couple of games. In the NFL, the difference between a playoff team and a non playoff team can be a couple of hustle plays.

when i watch our D i dont see a lack of effort- i see a lack of intelligence in most situations. even yest on tebows td run, i knew as did nearly everyone else he was going to run on that play. yet mark anderson still makes an inside move to try and sack him instead of playing containment. he was trying to make a play but it was a stupid thing to do in the situation.

also we'd have no 3-4 DL so most of our draft would go to that... which means little if any decdent picks left for the secondary. btw have any of the 'suitable' 3-4 players you mentioned ever played in a 3-4 defence before...ever?

Maddict5
12-27-2010, 11:40 AM
Perhaps, but if people are going to make the argument that Cowher would be nothing without LeBeau, then I will point out the fact that without Monte Kiffin, Dungy consistently had the worst defenses in the NFL.

No thanks.

on that same point, gruden didnt win a win after kiffin left. 4 games to get into the playoffs. couldnt win one.

Kaiser Toro
12-27-2010, 11:41 AM
When you are tickling the "worst defense ever" tag based on consistent performance it is a perfect time to blow it all up.

Everything is on the table IMO.

Hervoyel
12-27-2010, 11:43 AM
Pros:
-Tough minded
-winning HC
-playoffs in 10/15 yrs as steelers HC
-1 SB

Cons:
-wont have dick lebeau as DC if he comes here
-wont have many suitable 3-4 personnel which leaves quite a ? as the defence has always been a strength in his teams. not to many may of our players prob wouldnt do well in the more complicated 3-4 scheme as evidenced by the annual required dumbing down of the current defence
-questionable personnel decisions, especially in later yrs (92-06) http://www.databasefootball.com/draft/draftteam.htm?tm=PIT&lg=NFL
-offence could easily regress some also as he has always a power running scheme


personally i dont want the guy. his supposed strength doesnt match up with what we have and our strength could be neutralised. if we do hire a new HC, my vote would be for john fox

That's two Super Bowls with one win but why quibble.

1. True, he won't have Dick Lebeau if he comes here. Bill Cowher was the head coach of the Steelers from 1992 to 2006. From 1997 until 2003 Dick Lebeau was with Cincinnati and Buffalo. How did the Steelers do defensively during those years?

In yards they were 6th, 12th, 11th, 7th, 1st, 7th, and 9th.
In points they were 11th, 7th, 12th, 6th, 3rd, 16th, and 15th.

From 2004 until 2006 those more or less very good numbers got much better. In 2004 they were 1st in both, dropped to 4th and 3rd respectively (yards and points) the next year, and in Cowher's last season (with Lebeau) they were 9th in yards and 11th in points.

Consider both the highs and the lows. They're all much better than anything we've become accustomed to here. Lebeau is a heck of a DC but the Steelers didn't become a defensive wasteland when he left.

There's nothing to the "He won't have Dick Lebeau" argument against hiring Cowher.

2. As for our team not having the proper personnel to change over to a 3-4 defense I'm sorry but it's not like they're exactly lighting the world on fire playing in the 4-3 (the defense they're supposedly a better fit for) as things stand. What exactly are we holding on to here?

Mario can't play in a 3-4? Then Mario can net us draft picks or players who can. Brian Cushing damn well can play in a 3-4 and so can DeMeco Ryans. Our secondary (such that it is) can also play in a 3-4 without modification (at least no worse than it plays in our current system so ultimately it needs to be rebuilt no matter what we do).

I saw Capers and Fangio build a better (3-4) defense than we have right now out of expansion draft castoffs. I think Bill Cowher and whoever he chooses to hire as his DC could do as good a job with what we have on hand and what they could find in the draft/free agency.

I really don't see the reason for shunning change when we've watched this same basic group of players attempt to be effective in a very generic 4-3 system for years now with little success. It's time to try something different, "embrace the horror" if you will and see if there's anything they can do well. Bring in a man who knows what he's doing and see if he can get them to perform. If he fails and we have to rebuild almost entirely then what have we lost? If he succeeds in getting them to play well then what do we care how he manages it or what system they run?

JB
12-27-2010, 11:45 AM
When you are tickling the "worst defense ever" tag based on consistent performance it is a perfect time to blow it all up.

Everything is on the table IMO.

Exactly! There is only one direction this defense can go. It can't get worse by switching to a 34, and won't get worse staying a 43.

Dishman
12-27-2010, 11:45 AM
The number of top picks and cash spent on this defense with zero to show for it means to me we can't do much worse than where we sit today. Why all the worry about switching schemes? Afraid we will slip from the 31st worst defense to the 32nd?

Maddict5
12-27-2010, 11:56 AM
Exactly! There is only one direction this defense can go. It can't get worse by switching to a 34, and won't get worse staying a 43.

definitely. but there are quite a few pieces in place to having a very good 4-3 defence. imo it would be smarter to fix the terrible secondary and get a good 4-3 coordinator rather than potentially blowing the whole thing up

kiwitexansfan
12-27-2010, 11:57 AM
As a DC sure.

Porky
12-27-2010, 12:06 PM
I'm sure Cowher would prefer a 3-4 but most good to great coaches play to the strength of the personell. I'm betting that if he thinks a 4-3 is the way to go here, he would run a 4-3..at least in the short term. I realize he has always run a 3-4 and I grant you that is the way he likely would take the team, but I don't think it's a 100% slam dunk he does that in year one. He might even run a hybrid system for a year much like NE does.

bckey
12-27-2010, 12:17 PM
Adam Scheftner was on ESPN talking about coaches on the hot seat. He talked about Bill Cowher as a possible replacement for Sporrano in Miami. The interesting part was Adam mentioned Cowher might want to bring in Carl Peterson to be the gm because they have previously worked together in KC. The point of this is alot of us have been concerned that Cowher wants too much control and this report at least sounds like maybe not so much.

Porky
12-27-2010, 12:26 PM
Adam Scheftner was on ESPN talking about coaches on the hot seat. He talked about Bill Cowher as a possible replacement for Sporrano in Miami. The interesting part was Adam mentioned Cowher might want to bring in Carl Peterson to be the gm because they have previously worked together in KC. The point of this is alot of us have been concerned that Cowher wants too much control and this report at least sounds like maybe not so much.

I've heard he is interested in the Giants, Miami, or Houston. Peterson wasn't all that and a bag of chips in KC, but right now it's a better option than the status quo.

Alot will depend on who is fired. Like Bum said - there are two kinds of coaches. Dem dat's been fired, and those that will be.

97roc
12-27-2010, 12:39 PM
Long Term success starts with who McNair hires as GM. GM is the key here. We don't need Cowher coming in here pulling a Kubiak and basically having his pick of GM. We need someone who knows the inner circles of the NFL and has had success in other previous positions. The new GM can decide how much power the HC is given.

PHAROAH
12-27-2010, 12:39 PM
Perhaps, but if people are going to make the argument that Cowher would be nothing without LeBeau, then I will point out the fact that without Monte Kiffin, Dungy consistently had the worst defenses in the NFL.

No thanks.Really I don't remember when Dungy was in Tampa he put together one of the best defenses in recent history in the NFL and that defense carried John Gruden to a Super Bowl in his first year as Head Coach of the BUCS. Tony went to the COLTS and turned them around a team from a 3-13 season and took them to the playoffs the next season and yes it took him some time to build that defense up but he eventually won a super bowl and he handed that team over to another first year coach and he guided them to a super bowl lost. My point is that Tony Dungy has a history of taking sorry ass teams and changing the culture and building championship caliber teams.

I'm not saying that Cowher isn't a great coach but the Texans need a change in culture and they have a culture of losing historically and my point is no one is mentioning one of the best coaches in recent memory and putting all of their eggs in the Bill Cowher basket. If I can remember Bill Cowher listed the Texans as his 3rd choice so there is a chance the Texans won't get him especially with the Giants tanking their season and he stated that the Giants #1 & Dolphins #2 on his list so I think we need to keep our options open and don't forget that Dungy is a defensive minded coach as well know your facts before you speak!!!!

disaacks3
12-27-2010, 12:47 PM
Look how many coaches have said that in the past and they always come out of retirement it's about control over personel choices I think that Tony Dungy would listen just like the others it all depends on the pursuit of the owner IMO. Dungy left for VERY personal reasons and has vowed not to spend as much time away from his family. I believe him.

Getting excited about Cowher or any other prospective HC is fools gold. It all matters none because Gary Kubiak still has control of this team. Until that changes... bleh. While Gary Kubiak may still be the HC, he's anything BUT "in control".

Every coach you get is a crapshoot, but I'll take that over the just plain crap we're fielding now.

TexansSeminole
12-27-2010, 12:58 PM
definitely. but there are quite a few pieces in place to having a very good 4-3 defence. imo it would be smarter to fix the terrible secondary and get a good 4-3 coordinator rather than potentially blowing the whole thing up

We don't have anything in our 4-3 defense that can't transfer over to a 3-4. Mario could easily play the end position in a 3-4. Same goes for Mitchell/Smith/Okoye. You could even move Mario in at NT on pass rushing situations ala Ratliff for Dallas. We are low on outside backers for a 3-4, but it's either that or low on pass rushing defensive ends. Either way, we need to do something about it.

We need to make changes in order for this defense to be good period. Our needs at pass rusher, DT/NT, and safety are universal despite our defensive scheme.

I don't understand having more faith in John Fox than Cowher. Simply looking at their accomplishments as head coaches is proof enough that Cowher is the better coaching prospect, by far. Fit doesn't really matter at this point as far as personell. I'd rather take a guy who doesn't fit with our personell and is a proven winner than a guy who has a spotty head coaching history. Cowher can mold this team to what he wants pretty quickly.

Doppelganger
12-27-2010, 01:00 PM
imo he matches up to what we have much better- he builds good 4-3 defences. he had good offences until delhomme randomly went off the ledge. hes gotten to as many SB's as cowher in a much shorter timespan. hes been stuck with a cheapskate owner the last couple yrs yet his teams play hard despite a terrible qb situation.

id be way more confident the guy would win here instead of cowher



when i watch our D i dont see a lack of effort- i see a lack of intelligence in most situations. even yest on tebows td run, i knew as did nearly everyone else he was going to run on that play. yet mark anderson still makes an inside move to try and sack him instead of playing containment. he was trying to make a play but it was a stupid thing to do in the situation.

also we'd have no 3-4 DL so most of our draft would go to that... which means little if any decdent picks left for the secondary. btw have any of the 'suitable' 3-4 players you mentioned ever played in a 3-4 defence before...ever?

Most college programs don't run a 3-4, so typically 3-4 teams take players and project them to the 3-4. Building a 3-4 on the fly can happen with this defense. here is what could happen.

Mario to DE. he would be our version of Shaun Ellis.
Meco to ILB. He would be our version of Patrick Willis.
Cushing and Barwin at the OLB spots.
So at this point we need DB help, a NT, an 1 more ILB.

I would sign a 3-4 OLB like Shaun Ellis in FA to compliment Mario. We then could choose a CB Brandon Harris with our first pick. We take NT Jerrell Powe in the second. Oregon ILB Casey Matthews moves into the middle and compliments Meco. In the 4th, I would take Jeron Johnson SS from Boise State to replace Pollard.

So now, this is what our Defense looks like

Mario----Powe----Ellis
Cushing----Meco----Matthews----Barwin

Quin/Jackson---Johnson---Nolan----Harris

Keep in mind we still have 3 additional picks, so we can grab some 3-4 depth such as an additional 3-4 OLB, another NT, and perhaps a punter to replace the Turk. But, going with my scenario, we can make the 3-4 a reality with solid players and have a better defense than this year.

Texanmike02
12-27-2010, 01:03 PM
Really I don't remember when Dungy was in Tampa he put together one of the best defenses in recent history in the NFL and that defense carried John Gruden to a Super Bowl in his first year as Head Coach of the BUCS. Tony went to the COLTS and turned them around a team from a 3-13 season and took them to the playoffs the next season and yes it took him some time to build that defense up but he eventually won a super bowl and he handed that team over to another first year coach and he guided them to a super bowl lost. My point is that Tony Dungy has a history of taking sorry ass teams and changing the culture and building championship caliber teams.


He took over the Colts after Mora got fired. Mora was fired after his Playoffs speech. They had been 13-3 and 10-6, then the wheels fell off (James was out for most of the season and the defense was just terrible) and they went 6-10. They basically under-achieved that year (I was a Colts fan between the Oilers and the Texans).

I'm not saying I wouldn't love Tony, but at least get the story straight.

Mike

TheCD
12-27-2010, 01:20 PM
Really I don't remember when Dungy was in Tampa he put together one of the best defenses in recent history in the NFL and that defense carried John Gruden to a Super Bowl in his first year as Head Coach of the BUCS. Tony went to the COLTS and turned them around a team from a 3-13 season and took them to the playoffs the next season and yes it took him some time to build that defense up but he eventually won a super bowl and he handed that team over to another first year coach and he guided them to a super bowl lost. My point is that Tony Dungy has a history of taking sorry ass teams and changing the culture and building championship caliber teams.

I'm not saying Dungy isn't a good coach, I'm just saying that he's a defensive guru who did nothing for defense after Monte Kiffin. He and Kiffin developed the Tampa 2 system together trying to find a way to utilize their undersized DL and CB's who were below average in man coverage. They did very well with the players they had, but without Kiffin, Dungy's defenses were always hard to watch to say the least.

The only way a Colts-led Dungy defense can prevail is when they have a big lead. Without #18 the defense Dungy built for the Colts is worthless and he would have been fired PDQ. The fact that Jim Caldwell, a rookie head coach, was able to go to the Super Bowl immediately after Dungy left is a sign to me that Peyton and the offense, not Dungy, were the keys to success.

Yesterday
12-27-2010, 01:57 PM
From 1997-2004 Dick Lebeau was not with the Steelers. In that time, the Steelers went to 3 AFC Championship Games. Not worried about it at all.

Kaiser Toro
12-27-2010, 02:04 PM
Merging Cowher threads...

hookinreds
12-27-2010, 02:13 PM
That's two Super Bowls with one win but why quibble.

1. True, he won't have Dick Lebeau if he comes here. Bill Cowher was the head coach of the Steelers from 1992 to 2006. From 1997 until 2003 Dick Lebeau was with Cincinnati and Buffalo. How did the Steelers do defensively during those years?

In yards they were 6th, 12th, 11th, 7th, 1st, 7th, and 9th.
In points they were 11th, 7th, 12th, 6th, 3rd, 16th, and 15th.

From 2004 until 2006 those more or less very good numbers got much better. In 2004 they were 1st in both, dropped to 4th and 3rd respectively (yards and points) the next year, and in Cowher's last season (with Lebeau) they were 9th in yards and 11th in points.

Consider both the highs and the lows. They're all much better than anything we've become accustomed to here. Lebeau is a heck of a DC but the Steelers didn't become a defensive wasteland when he left.

There's nothing to the "He won't have Dick Lebeau" argument against hiring Cowher.

2. As for our team not having the proper personnel to change over to a 3-4 defense I'm sorry but it's not like they're exactly lighting the world on fire playing in the 4-3 (the defense they're supposedly a better fit for) as things stand. What exactly are we holding on to here?

Mario can't play in a 3-4? Then Mario can net us draft picks or players who can. Brian Cushing damn well can play in a 3-4 and so can DeMeco Ryans. Our secondary (such that it is) can also play in a 3-4 without modification (at least no worse than it plays in our current system so ultimately it needs to be rebuilt no matter what we do).

I saw Capers and Fangio build a better (3-4) defense than we have right now out of expansion draft castoffs. I think Bill Cowher and whoever he chooses to hire as his DC could do as good a job with what we have on hand and what they could find in the draft/free agency.

I really don't see the reason for shunning change when we've watched this same basic group of players attempt to be effective in a very generic 4-3 system for years now with little success. It's time to try something different, "embrace the horror" if you will and see if there's anything they can do well. Bring in a man who knows what he's doing and see if he can get them to perform. If he fails and we have to rebuild almost entirely then what have we lost? If he succeeds in getting them to play well then what do we care how he manages it or what system they run?


Good stuff Herv...I'm curious if you happen to run the defensive numbers for W/L points/yds for/against when "hair" is in the game and not in the game? I'd be curious to see if he alone has as much an impact on the D as a good QB has on the offense. In other words, is the Steeler D really that good, or does "hair" make that D really good, and they are an "average" D when he isn't in there?

gary
12-27-2010, 02:28 PM
Everyone who gets fired a week from now will have a job somewhere in the fall more than likely. Not all of them will be head coaches and some of them will have to take downgraded jobs with a new team but somewhere they will have a job. Wether or not the job is a HC, DC, OC, or other is the question. Some of these people will go back to being what they were they became a head coach and others will go on to coach new teams and find glory for the very first time or if they have been there before they will find it once again. At the end of the day life goes on and jobs are reclaimed by these same people it is just the way the NFL works. Just my two cents.

GuerillaBlack
12-29-2010, 06:57 PM
From the worldwide resource...Twitter:

AlbertBreer Hearing that Houston owner Bob McNair likes the idea of having Bill Cowher there, but isn't convinced that Cowher would come to Texans. ...

AlbertBreer Does NOT mean Kubiak's out. In fact, McNair may hesitate to do anything if he can't land him, since he'd then likely turn back to Kubiak

Well obviously. Who wouldn't like Cowher coming here to replace Kubiak?

Kaiser Toro
12-29-2010, 06:59 PM
administrative bump

gary
12-29-2010, 07:04 PM
I am pretty sure Cowher would come here just break out the check book Bob.

Ckw
12-29-2010, 07:15 PM
Pay the man, Bob! If we the people are wrong on Cowher being the answer, we will own up to it. But if you are wrong and keep Kubiak and continue to fail, we just might never forgive you.

Cjeremy635
12-29-2010, 07:17 PM
Pay the man, Bob! If we the people are wrong on Cowher being the answer, we will own up to it. But if you are wrong and keep Kubiak and continue to fail, we just might never forgive you.

Yeah, I just don't see that happening. Maybe some, but the masses would turn on Bob in a heartbeat if it didn't turn out good. Short term memory always seems to plague sports fans.

Shaft75
12-29-2010, 10:59 PM
Who's albert Breer again?

NitroGSXR
12-29-2010, 11:04 PM
Who's albert Breer again?
He's a sports journalist. Currently with NFLN (I think).

J_R
12-29-2010, 11:07 PM
NFL Network reporter; former Patriots, Cowboys beat writer/guy

Asked him earlier(based on those reports above from him) "Do you see Bob interviewing or even talking to Bill Cowher after the season? And why wouldnt Cowher come to Houston? Thanks"

His response: "McNair's walking tightrope. Likely to keep Kubiak if can't get Cowher. So gotta be convinced he lands Cowher before interview. "

NitroGSXR
12-29-2010, 11:13 PM
NFL Network reporter; former Patriots, Cowboys beat writer/guy

Asked him earlier(based on those reports above from him) "Do you see Bob interviewing or even talking to Bill Cowher after the season? And why wouldnt Cowher come to Houston? Thanks"

His response: "McNair's walking tightrope. Likely to keep Kubiak if can't get Cowher. So gotta be convinced he lands Cowher before interview. "
Can you dumb the bolded down for me? I don't understand it? Why even have an interview if he wants a firm commitment from Cowher? Confusing so I'll go ahead and call bullshit on his twit.

Ryan
12-29-2010, 11:17 PM
Just another rumor of the hour, people. Nothing to see here. :backsout:

Let's just wait till next week and find out what happens with Kubiak before we speculate about a new head coach.

J_R
12-29-2010, 11:18 PM
Confused me as well. How is Bob suppose to know Cowher is interested or how is Bob gonna be convinced he can land Cowher without talking or meeting? His gut instinct? Not sure.

Brisco_County
12-29-2010, 11:20 PM
Can you dumb the bolded down for me? I don't understand it? Why even have an interview if he wants a firm commitment from Cowher? Confusing so I'll go ahead and call bullshit on his twit.

Bob needs to know that Cowher is serious about the offer before he makes Kubiak a lame duck by interviewing Cowher.

GuerillaBlack
12-29-2010, 11:21 PM
Confused me as well. How is Bob suppose to know Cowher is interested or how is Bob gonna be convinced he can land Cowher without talking or meeting? His gut instinct? Not sure.

Maybe Bob knows someone that knows Cowher and they could communicate that way? Or something? Not sure if I'm making sense or not.

hookinreds
12-29-2010, 11:23 PM
Can you dumb the bolded down for me? I don't understand it? Why even have an interview if he wants a firm commitment from Cowher? Confusing so I'll go ahead and call bullshit on his twit.

In other words he doesn't want Kubiak to get his feelings hurt if he finds out Bob wants Cower but Cower doesn't want to come here. If Bob can find out that Cower wants to come here now, then he will "interview" him. If Cower might waver...then he doesn't want to piss Kubiak off if Cower decides not to come here after an interview.

Jackie Chiles
12-29-2010, 11:25 PM
In other words he doesn't want Kubiak to get his feelings hurt if he finds out Bob wants Cower but Cower doesn't want to come here. If Bob can find out that Cower wants to come here now, then he will "interview" him. If Cower might waver...then he doesn't want to piss Kubiak off if Cower decides not to come here after an interview.

Not quite. He doesn't want to fire Kubiak if he can't get Cowher. Gary's feelings have nothing to do with it, he just doesn't want to get played by Cowher. According to the rumor at least.

J_R
12-29-2010, 11:25 PM
Bob needs to know that Cowher is serious about the offer before he makes Kubiak a lame duck by interviewing Cowher.

In other words he doesn't want Kubiak to get his feelings hurt if he finds out Bob wants Cower but Cower doesn't want to come here. If Bob can find out that Cower wants to come here now, then he will "interview" him. If Cower might waver...then he doesn't want to piss Kubiak off if Cower decides not to come here after an interview.

Not quite. He doesn't want to fire Kubiak if he can't get Cowher. Gary's feelings have nothing to do with it, he just doesn't want to get played by Cowher. According to the rumor at least.


Makes some sense to me. Thanks.

steelbtexan
12-29-2010, 11:26 PM
If you want to go by their records, who's got a better one, Cowher or Coughlin?

And since when has a successful coach with one team ever gone on to be successful with another?

Name one. I don't even think Vince Lombardi has done that.

You say "proven", I say "retread".

Parcells set up the Belichik era in New England. He made it to a SB with N.E. before leaving for the Jets. BB took over and turned N.E. into a modern day dynasty with alot of help from Brady.

hookinreds
12-29-2010, 11:28 PM
Not quite. He doesn't want to fire Kubiak if he can't get Cowher. Gary's feelings have nothing to do with it, he just doesn't want to get played by Cowher. According to the rumor at least.

Yeah, that too.

GuerillaBlack
12-29-2010, 11:31 PM
Not quite. He doesn't want to fire Kubiak if he can't get Cowher. Gary's feelings have nothing to do with it, he just doesn't want to get played by Cowher. According to the rumor at least.

I see. Makes some sense. There is definitely hope.

DonnyMost
12-29-2010, 11:35 PM
I knew this would happen.

McNair will never have the balls to jettison Kubiak without the ink dry on Cowher's contract.

Which is exactly why we're going to be stuck with Gary.

NitroGSXR
12-29-2010, 11:37 PM
In other words he doesn't want Kubiak to get his feelings hurt if he finds out Bob wants Cower but Cower doesn't want to come here. If Bob can find out that Cower wants to come here now, then he will "interview" him. If Cower might waver...then he doesn't want to piss Kubiak off if Cower decides not to come here after an interview.

*rolls eyes*

And if Cowher accepts an interview... shouldn't that be considered interest by default?

Nah. Just another reporter looking to crash the sensationalization party. I'll continue to patiently wait for Black Monday to get here.

steelbtexan
12-30-2010, 12:06 AM
Anybody else wish a mamby pamby guy like McNair wouldn't have brought football back to Houston?

Before you say no realize somebody else would have.

This city is/was a gold mine. That McNair successfully mined.

Texecutioner
12-30-2010, 12:15 AM
Anybody else wish a mamby pamby guy like McNair wouldn't have brought football back to Houston?

Before you say no realize somebody else would have.

This city is/was a gold mine. That McNair successfully mined.

I certainly do. At this point I put Mcnair right there with Al Davis and Mike Brown of the Bengals. Brown and Davis have been the worst two owners in the NFL to me for a while considering how many wild things they do to keep their teams from being competitive. MCanir isn't like them in that regard, but his lack of action and patience is gut wrenching as a fan and it makes him just as bad of an owner for a fan. I don't consider Bob any better than Bud Adams either. How many people thought Bud Adams was the devil in his 9th year here as an owner. I bet he was loved like crazy back then. At the rate that Mcnair is going he'll have a much worse reputation than Bud Adams in about 5 years.

Seor Stan
12-30-2010, 06:48 AM
Anybody else wish a mamby pamby guy like McNair wouldn't have brought football back to Houston?

Before you say no realize somebody else would have.

This city is/was a gold mine. That McNair successfully mined.


Sincerely,

Los Angeles.

CloakNNNdagger
12-30-2010, 06:59 AM
*rolls eyes*

And if Cowher accepts an interview... shouldn't that be considered interest by default?

Nah. Just another reporter looking to crash the sensationalization party. I'll continue to patiently wait for Black Monday to get here.

Cowher may not want to commit until some of the playoff games are completed to make sure of the "lay of the land."

TheCD
12-30-2010, 09:04 AM
If you want to go by their records, who's got a better one, Cowher or Coughlin?

And since when has a successful coach with one team ever gone on to be successful with another?

Name one. I don't even think Vince Lombardi has done that.

You say "proven", I say "retread".

What's your definition of "success"? If it's Super Bowls, then no, obviously no one has.

However, lots of coaches have been successful elsewhere (by my definition, at least). Dick Vermeil won a SB with the Rams, Schottenheimer (sp?) has always had successful teams. Bill Parcels went on to another SB with the Patriots. Mike Holmgrem had the Seahawks competitive and in another SB after Green Bay. Tony Dungy won one with Indy after Tampa. Dan Reeves consistently had teams deep in the playoffs and in the SB, though he never won one. One could even make an argument that Lombardi was successful in his one season as Redskins HC. However, he fell ill before the following season and passed away before he could continue the success.

NitroGSXR
12-30-2010, 09:10 AM
Cowher may not want to commit until some of the playoff games are completed to make sure of the "lay of the land."

And that's fine but that doesn't explain an owner tiptoeng around a failing employee. Cowher can perfectly decline this interview.

J_R
12-30-2010, 09:27 AM
I think someone else (http://bbs.clutchfans.net/showpost.php?p=5841241&postcount=434) had a pretty good take on it.

I don't see this scenario happening. In order for this to work, McNair has to contact Cowher and get a feel for how much interest Cowher has and how much it will take to get him here and be reasonably certain that he'll accept an offer. This, all while Kubes is still under contract. Knowing how much McNair values loyalty, I can't see him doing that while Gary is still the head coach. Likewise, in light of recent comments by Cowher, I don't think he would meet with McNair as long as Kubiak was still under contract either. He's not going to basically interview for the job, knowing that Kubiak will be fired if he accepts.

I don't know how you work around that. How do you become convinced Cowher will come here without talking to him and without going behind Kubiak's back?

Knowing who these men are, this just seems implausible to me.

I don't know, if McNair can find out if Cowher really does want to coach next year, and can somehow verify if Cowher's "wish list" was legit, and if the Giants and Dolphins don't fire their coaches, AND he's willing to spend the money, then I guess he could be reasonably confident that he could land Cowher.

Porky
12-30-2010, 09:44 AM
Mcnoob is easily one of the worst five owners in the league. Bidwell, Al Davis, the Ford's. Right in that group.

Kubiak, Ricky Smith, and the entire staff deserve to be fired on merit no matter who else is available. Why is he so scared and walking a tightrope? For what purpose. Oh my God, we can't lose Kubiak if Cohwer isn't 100% sure thing. It's like Kubiak shits Golden bricks right into Bob's house or something and Mcnair's hair will catch on fire if he fires him. :firehair:

NitroGSXR
12-30-2010, 09:49 AM
Mcnoob is easily one of the worst five owners in the league. Bidwell, Al Davis, the Ford's. Right in that group.

Kubiak, Ricky Smith, and the entire staff deserve to be fired on merit no matter who else is available. Why is he so scared and walking a tightrope? For what purpose. Oh my God, we can't lose Kubiak if Cohwer isn't 100% sure thing. It's like Kubiak shits Golden bricks right into Bob's house or something and Mcnair's hair will catch on fire if he fires him. :firehair:

:spit:

Porky used god's name in vain.

steelbtexan
12-30-2010, 10:03 AM
Sincerely,

Los Angeles.

LA has a team?

They've had 9 yrs to get their stuff together and it still hasn't happened.

LA is the other shell in the game to get public $$$$ for the owners.

I cant wait for LA to get a team so the foolishness will halt.

Brisco_County
12-30-2010, 10:11 AM
I'm convinced now that the only way that McNair and Cowher would open any sort of dialogue is if Kubiak was already fired.

As hard as it is to believe, I'm certain that Kubiak will be back next season. Bum supporting Kubiak was like Clinton supporting Obama. It's a desperation move that pacifies the mobs.

Mr. White
12-30-2010, 10:19 AM
I'm guessing this is the newest edition of the Daily Smokescreen.

houstonspartan
12-30-2010, 10:44 AM
Oh for Pete's sake. Enough already. Pick up the phone, call Cowher, and offer him the job. If he wants it, hire him. If he doesn't, don't.

This isn't f-----g brain surgery. All of this, "We can't hurt Gary's feelings" stuff is ridiculus. What are these guys, teenagers?

NFL owners are some of the wealthest, most elite people in the United States. Are you telling me they're worried about "feelings"?

Jesus.

infantrycak
12-30-2010, 10:54 AM
NFL owners are some of the wealthest, most elite people in the United States. Are you telling me they're worried about "feelings"?

Jesus.

Yeah cuz all wealthy people are just like Gordon Gecko.

Mr. White
12-30-2010, 10:57 AM
Who's albert Breer again?

He's a sports journalist. Currently with NFLN (I think).

NFL Network reporter; former Patriots, Cowboys beat writer/guy

Asked him earlier(based on those reports above from him) "Do you see Bob interviewing or even talking to Bill Cowher after the season? And why wouldnt Cowher come to Houston? Thanks"

His response: "McNair's walking tightrope. Likely to keep Kubiak if can't get Cowher. So gotta be convinced he lands Cowher before interview. "

http://a2.twimg.com/profile_images/1139012027/albert_breer_twitter_bigger.jpg

I'm also pretty sure that he rides the same bus as my 11 year old daughter. She says he usually plays soccer at recess.

NitroGSXR
12-30-2010, 10:58 AM
Yeah cuz all wealthy people are just like Gordon Gecko.
Momentary hijack... Have you seen the new Wall Street movie? Should we pick it up? I loved the first.

houstonspartan
12-30-2010, 11:01 AM
Yeah cuz all wealthy people are just like Gordon Gecko.

lol. No, I'm not saying that. I'm just saying that this is business, and if McNair wants to bring in a new coach, he should be able to bring in a new coach. There is a way of handling this with class and still be professional. Gary would understand.

Mr teX
12-30-2010, 11:05 AM
Momentary hijack... Have you seen the new Wall Street movie? Should we pick it up? I loved the first.

Nope...its hot garbage.

infantrycak
12-30-2010, 11:06 AM
Momentary hijack... Have you seen the new Wall Street movie? Should we pick it up? I loved the first.

Not yet but plan on it. We loved the first one as well.

lol. No, I'm not saying that. I'm just saying that this is business, and if McNair wants to bring in a new coach, he should be able to bring in a new coach. There is a way of handling this with class and still be professional. Gary would understand.

All I was saying is he will do what he thinks is classy whether that be tell Gary he is done and then call Cowher or waiting until Kubiak is fired.

DonnyMost
12-30-2010, 11:10 AM
Oh for Pete's sake. Enough already. Pick up the phone, call Cowher, and offer him the job. If he wants it, hire him. If he doesn't, don't.

This isn't f-----g brain surgery. All of this, "We can't hurt Gary's feelings" stuff is ridiculus. What are these guys, teenagers?

NFL owners are some of the wealthest, most elite people in the United States. Are you telling me they're worried about "feelings"?

Jesus.

No kidding.

Gary of all people should be expecting Bob to be actively looking for a new coach.

That is what happens when you don't do your damned job.

Mr. White
12-30-2010, 11:14 AM
If you're a "Wall Street" fan, then I recommend the new movie. If you're looking for the next "Citizen Kane," then skip it.

steelbtexan
12-30-2010, 11:15 AM
Yeah cuz all wealthy people are just like Gordon Gecko.

McNair's peachy

It's just his football team that stinks.

Not McNair, but most billionaires are most likely more like Gecko than Mother Theresa.

Most billionaires have cut backroom deals at some point in their lives. It's how they became billionaires.

houstonspartan
12-30-2010, 11:27 AM
If you're a "Wall Street" fan, then I recommend the new movie. If you're looking for the next "Citizen Kane," then skip it.

I wanted to see the new one when it was out a few months ago, but a few people I know didn't like it, so I skipped it. I'll rent it.

I loved the first one.

steelbtexan
12-30-2010, 11:37 AM
I wanted to see the new one when it was out a few months ago, but a few people I know didn't like it, so I skipped it. I'll rent it.

I loved the first one.

1st one was great

2nd one was avg at best.

gary
12-30-2010, 11:39 AM
I think Cowher is there for the taking just have to get him.

Double Barrel
12-30-2010, 11:40 AM
Yeah cuz all wealthy people are just like Gordon Gecko.

I'm afraid that's the problem. McNair doesn't have a Gordon Gecko bone in his body.

J_R
12-30-2010, 11:40 AM
Can post this in any one of the rumor threads but these guys (http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-network-total-access/09000d5d81d4ed2d/Coaches-on-the-hot-seat)think Kubiak back, Phillips in as DC

houstonspartan
12-30-2010, 11:40 AM
I think Cowher is there for the taking just have to get him.

That's what I've always said. Someone asked me what would it take for the Texans to get Cowher. My answer: "An offer."

This really isn't that complicated.

Thorn
12-30-2010, 11:40 AM
These threads are all beginning to look alike to me.

I feel sorry for the mods who have to read through all this shit. LOL

ChampionTexan
12-30-2010, 11:53 AM
lol. No, I'm not saying that. I'm just saying that this is business, and if McNair wants to bring in a new coach, he should be able to bring in a new coach.

And your thoughts if he doesn't want to bring in a new coach?

houstonspartan
12-30-2010, 12:00 PM
And your thoughts if he doesn't want to bring in a new coach?

I disagree with that decision, obviously, but, that's not the discussion here. My point was that IF he wants to bring in a new coach, he needs to grow a pair and do it and not worry about about Gary's feelings.

If he wants to keep Gary, ok. But do it, and don't bring in Bum Phillips and his son to "appease" the fans.

What I'm saying is, regardless of McNair's decision, it's time for him to grow up as an owner.

Dread-Head
12-30-2010, 12:35 PM
McNair doesn't want to hurt Kubiak's FEELINGS?! Damn...Frank Bush is hurting MY feelings! Don't I count?

Kimmy
12-30-2010, 12:42 PM
McNair doesn't want to hurt Kubiak's FEELINGS?! Damn...Frank Bush is hurting MY feelings! Don't I count?

Yes, you do! Bob counts you every time he deposits an NFL Revenue check. Here's your number; $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

Hervoyel
12-30-2010, 12:51 PM
And your thoughts if he doesn't want to bring in a new coach?

I think if McNair doesn't want to bring in a new coach then it's entirely his perogative to stay the course.

Whatever results from that is on him but he needs to understand that nobody is under any sort of obligation to keep following the Texans if they keep stumbling around in the dark like they have been.

I doubt he really cares though if he thinks he's right he'll keep Kubiak, do "something" about the DC and staff on that side of the ball, and get ready for the playoff run in 2011 he imagines this will bring. If he's wrong he'll just fire Gary next year. An NFL team is a perpetual money machine. Even the stupid owners make more money than they can realistically fit inside the "Scrooge McDuck Money Vault (TM)" they get when they buy a team.