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View Full Version : Rex Ryan - "Kareem Jackson's going to be an outstanding player"


m5kwatts
11-17-2010, 01:51 PM
If you're like me and you've lost all respect for any opinion this coaching staff voices, you've probably ignored any of the press quotes about Kareem. They're usually something like "he's making mistakes now but he'll get better" blah blah blah.

Well when I read this I felt a lot more positively about our 1st rounder.

On the challenges for a rookie corner like Kareem Jackson: “Kareem Jackson’s going to be an outstanding player – an outstanding player… It’s just a different game. The skill level is phenomenal in this league. You may have a guy covered in college, what you think is covered in college, well, that’s open in the NFL… Everybody makes mistakes. They’re all going to get beat. I mean, Darrelle Revis gave up a touchdown this year. You know, those things happen. But the guys that make it are the ones that can learn from it and take coaching.”

Rex Ryan is no BSer. I think if he thought Kareem was a bust or just drafted too high, he would've said it in so many words. I bet if anything he's thinking "if only we could get him in a room with OUR coaches how much better would he be?" Either way, it should make us feel better that when Kubiak and Rick Smith are gone next year (fingers crossed), we won't be left with a 1st round bust on our hands. If Rex believes in Kareem, I believe in Kareem.

drewmar74
11-17-2010, 01:52 PM
Sounds good.

Can we get him some better coaching, please?

Blake
11-17-2010, 01:53 PM
Rex Ryan and his crafty tricks. Trying to get Glover to let down his guard!

TEXANS84
11-17-2010, 01:54 PM
I mean, Darrelle Revis gave up a touchdown this year. You know, those things happen.

Sounded like a back-handed compliment to me.

m5kwatts
11-17-2010, 01:59 PM
Sounded like a back-handed compliment to me.

I don't see it that way. I see how you're seeing it, but I just don't think that's Rex's intention. I think he's just using that as an example to say "even if you're the best in the league you're gonna get beat at times."

Besides I don't think Rex does the whole back-handed compliment thing. He's a straight shooter.

badboy
11-17-2010, 02:03 PM
If you're like me and you've lost all respect for any opinion this coaching staff voices, you've probably ignored any of the press quotes about Kareem. They're usually something like "he's making mistakes now but he'll get better" blah blah blah.

Well when I read this I felt a lot more positively about our 1st rounder.



Rex Ryan is no BSer. I think if he thought Kareem was a bust or just drafted too high, he would've said it in so many words. I bet if anything he's thinking "if only we could get him in a room with OUR coaches how much better would he be?" Either way, it should make us feel better that when Kubiak and Rick Smith are gone next year (fingers crossed), we won't be left with a 1st round bust on our hands. If Rex believes in Kareem, I believe in Kareem.Rex Ryan is a 3-4 coach and sees KJ as a 3-4 corner which he could be with a really good safety over the top as a wingman. Jackson has a long way to go to be a 4-3 CB. Believe what you want.

HOU-TEX
11-17-2010, 02:10 PM
Rex handed out many compliments last year too. Then he commenced to whoopin out asses game 1. So yeah, his words mean little to nothing to me.

m5kwatts
11-17-2010, 02:35 PM
Rex Ryan is a 3-4 coach and sees KJ as a 3-4 corner which he could be with a really good safety over the top as a wingman. Jackson has a long way to go to be a 4-3 CB. Believe what you want.

What do you see in Kareem that lends to him being a better 3-4 CB than 4-3? Or I guess better worded: What weaknesses are preventing him from being a "4-3 CB"?


Rex handed out many compliments last year too. Then he commenced to whoopin out asses game 1. So yeah, his words mean little to nothing to me.

Yeah but Rex doesn't give compliments to players who don't deserve it. Don't you think Rex answers questions honestly? He's not the type to "pay lip service" to anyone.

Dutchrudder
11-17-2010, 02:39 PM
What do you see in Kareem that lends to him being a better 3-4 CB than 4-3? Or I guess better worded: What weaknesses are preventing him from being a "4-3 CB"?




The ability to stay on his feet?

HOU-TEX
11-17-2010, 02:51 PM
What do you see in Kareem that lends to him being a better 3-4 CB than 4-3? Or I guess better worded: What weaknesses are preventing him from being a "4-3 CB"?




Yeah but Rex doesn't give compliments to players who don't deserve it. Don't you think Rex answers questions honestly? He's not the type to "pay lip service" to anyone.

Maybe questions about his own team

m5kwatts
11-17-2010, 02:55 PM
Maybe questions about his own team

I haven't seen anything in Rex's history with the media that would suggest he goes around throwing empty compliments at any random opponent's player even if they don't deserve it. I can't even remember one example of that.

Thorn
11-17-2010, 03:05 PM
Rex Ryan doesn't coach the Texans. Unless he's coaching the Texans or a possible future coach for us, why should we care? At this point he's the enemy, and I wouldn't trust anything he has to say anyway.

Yankee_In_TX
11-17-2010, 03:09 PM
Sounds good.

Can we get him some better coaching, please?

That's what I was thinking!

badboy
11-17-2010, 03:14 PM
What do you see in Kareem that lends to him being a better 3-4 CB than 4-3? Or I guess better worded: What weaknesses are preventing him from being a "4-3 CB"?KJ to be a good 4-3 CB needs fluid hips and hip swivle. If he is back pedaling with WR to either side and WR suddenly goes to the other side, hip swivle allows CB to move accordingly without losing much if any ground. His tendancy as a "bump" the receiver type CB (especially since he misses the bump so often) would not be a negative because corners are often allowed to blitz and I think he would be good at that. I think Jackson would be a pretty good SS.




Yeah but Rex doesn't give compliments to players who don't deserve it. Don't you think Rex answers questions honestly? He's not the type to "pay lip service" to anyone.See bolded.

Ole Miss Texan
11-17-2010, 03:31 PM
Can somebody explain to me how a cornerback could be more suited to play in a 3-4 base defense over a 4-3 base, or vice versa? I can see how one may be better at man coverage or zone coverage or whatever... but I never really understood how the front 7 had that much of an effect.

HTown2ATX
11-17-2010, 03:38 PM
Can somebody explain to me how a cornerback could be more suited to play in a 3-4 base defense over a 4-3 base, or vice versa? I can see how one may be better at man coverage or zone coverage or whatever... but I never really understood how the front 7 had that much of an effect.


It's mostly about scheme and how the system is run. The front 7 responsibilties change for gaps, etc. So you need guys that may be used to that, and typically beefier mountains ont the line. The DB's are on different schemes though.

Either way you slice it, no matter who is complementing it, it doesn't matter. This defense is the football equivalent to the 2 girls, 1 cup video.

It's nasty and just makes you want to vomit.

thunderkyss
11-17-2010, 03:38 PM
KJ to be a good 4-3 CB needs fluid hips and hip swivle. If he is back pedaling with WR to either side and WR suddenly goes to the other side, hip swivle allows CB to move accordingly without losing much if any ground. His tendancy as a "bump" the receiver type CB (especially since he misses the bump so often) would not be a negative because corners are often allowed to blitz and I think he would be good at that. I think Jackson would be a pretty good SS.

I don't see any difference between a 3-4 or a 4-3 corner.

I don't know that his problem in bump coverage is that he misses.... I think he just doesn't know how strong a "physical" receiver in the NFL really is.

He's going to have to learn a lot..... I don't think he's doing any worse than say Rodgers-Cromartie did his rookie year. If he's tough enough, he'll be a good corner.

IDEXAN
11-17-2010, 03:48 PM
It's mostly about scheme and how the system is run. The front 7 responsibilties change for gaps, etc. So you need guys that may be used to that, and typically beefier mountains ont the line. The DB's are on different schemes though.

Either way you slice it, no matter who is complementing it, it doesn't matter. This defense is the football equivalent to the 2 girls, 1 cup video.

It's nasty and just makes you want to vomit.
Sorry not to offend, but I don't think that's a really responsive answer to the origional question.

The1ApplePie
11-17-2010, 03:52 PM
Sorry not to offend, but I don't think that's a really responsive answer to the origional question.

3-4s tend to be man-coverage (with the biggest exception being the Pats).

The SS is usually much more active on the blitz, leaving CBs on islands a lot of the time

The Jets use a lot of man and press.

DexmanC
11-17-2010, 04:09 PM
Larry Izzo was on the Jets when we played them last year. He said
the coaches got a hold of the Texans' offseason training program, and
preached to his guys how much MORE the Jets worked than the Texans
did during the offseason.

....yeah, get us better coaching please.

Ole Miss Texan
11-17-2010, 04:10 PM
3-4s tend to be man-coverage (with the biggest exception being the Pats).

The SS is usually much more active on the blitz, leaving CBs on islands a lot of the time

The Jets use a lot of man and press.

This is what I'm talking about! Having never played organized football, I'm oblivious to a lot of the nuances of the x's and o's.

Man vs. Zone I understand. I wasn't sure if one or the other were generally used to different base schemes like the 4-3 or 3-4.

This is also why I think, we as fans (in general) are so dumb when it comes to blasting the organization for not take this player or that player in FA or the draft. If we're asking our corners to play a certain way, the "pro bowl FA CB" could be a terrible fit for the scheme... yet we're griping that we don't sign him.

What are the Texans doing in the secondary? And don't say "sucking" lol. Do we mostly do man or zone? Or do we mix it up quite a bit?

Ole Miss Texan
11-17-2010, 04:15 PM
Larry Izzo was on the Jets when we played them last year. He said
the coaches got a hold of the Texans' offseason training program, and
preached to his guys how much MORE the Jets worked than the Texans
did during the offseason.

....yeah, get us better coaching please.
As you may recall, after one year being promoted from assistant to head Strength and Conditioning coach, Ray Wright is gone and is now with the Redskins, and has been replaced with Cedric Smith.
At least you got one wish!

http://blogs.chron.com/texanschick/2010/03/texans_strength_and_conditioni_1.html

m5kwatts
11-17-2010, 04:21 PM
This is what I'm talking about! Having never played organized football, I'm oblivious to a lot of the nuances of the x's and o's.

Man vs. Zone I understand. I wasn't sure if one or the other were generally used to different base schemes like the 4-3 or 3-4.

This is also why I think, we as fans (in general) are so dumb when it comes to blasting the organization for not take this player or that player in FA or the draft. If we're asking our corners to play a certain way, the "pro bowl FA CB" could be a terrible fit for the scheme... yet we're griping that we don't sign him.

What are the Texans doing in the secondary? And don't say "sucking" lol. Do we mostly do man or zone? Or do we mix it up quite a bit?

Kareem Jackson was actually asked this in training camp. He said at Alabama it was all man coverage and with the Texans its about 50/50. Funny because the assumption was with him coming from Saban's "pro-style" coaching, he'd make a seamless transition to the NFL. Going from playing exclusive man coverage in college to 50/50 zone/man in the NFL doesn't sound like Saban's "pro-style" coaching prepared him for NFL zone concepts. And whatever "coaching" (if you can even call it that) he's getting now probably confused him even more.

infantrycak
11-17-2010, 04:34 PM
Can somebody explain to me how a cornerback could be more suited to play in a 3-4 base defense over a 4-3 base, or vice versa? I can see how one may be better at man coverage or zone coverage or whatever... but I never really understood how the front 7 had that much of an effect.

No it can't be explained because the back 4 can run whatever they want out of either set. Look at the hip swivel response you got - as if any CB doesn't need good hip swivel.

Double Barrel
11-17-2010, 04:41 PM
Rex Ryan doesn't coach the Texans. Unless he's coaching the Texans or a possible future coach for us, why should we care? At this point he's the enemy, and I wouldn't trust anything he has to say anyway.

He knows there is potential for a head coaching job in Houston to open up, so he's getting the Ryan name in there on behalf of brother Rob.

HuttoKarl
11-17-2010, 04:47 PM
When Kareem takes an INT to the house for a Texans win vs. the Jets, I'll care what Rex Ryan has to say.

badboy
11-17-2010, 05:02 PM
I like corners that line up with the receiver and mirror them down field. In today's NFL, WRs like AJ are too strong to "bump" off their route. I want a CB that has better than 4.5 speed with very fluid hips and good swivle like Kyle Wilson or Devin McCourty last draft and Brandon Harris or Jimmy Smith 2011

badboy
11-17-2010, 05:09 PM
No it can't be explained because the back 4 can run whatever they want out of either set. Look at the hip swivel response you got - as if any CB doesn't need good hip swivel.They definitely need it but some don't have it and Karem Jackson doesn't.

76Texan
11-17-2010, 05:53 PM
"Kareem Jackson helped himself immensely," said David Jeremiah, a former Baltimore Ravens and Cleveland Browns scout who now operates the Web site MovetheSticks.com.

Jackson indeed raised his stock during workouts at Lucas Oil Stadium. He didn't win a gold medal in the 40-yard dash, but his time turned heads. Officially he was clocked at 4.48 seconds, but some stopwatches timed him as low as 4.41. Only four cornerbacks ran faster than 4.48. None was faster than 4.45.

"He has a good tape," Jeremiah said. "There were questions about his deep speed, but he answered those."

Jackson apparently answered other questions well, too.

"He interviewed ex*tremely well," said Phil Savage, the former Cleveland Browns general manager who was hired recently by the Philadelphia Eagles as a part-time player personnel consultant for the 2010 draft. Savage just finished his first season as the color commentator on Alabama football radio broadcasts.

"He impressed teams with his knowledge of the game and his understanding of what they were doing on defense at Alabama."

http://blog.al.com/tide-source/2010/03/nfl_scouting_combine_wrapup_cb.html

steelbtexan
11-17-2010, 06:00 PM
If you're like me and you've lost all respect for any opinion this coaching staff voices, you've probably ignored any of the press quotes about Kareem. They're usually something like "he's making mistakes now but he'll get better" blah blah blah.

Well when I read this I felt a lot more positively about our 1st rounder.



Rex Ryan is no BSer. I think if he thought Kareem was a bust or just drafted too high, he would've said it in so many words. I bet if anything he's thinking "if only we could get him in a room with OUR coaches how much better would he be?" Either way, it should make us feel better that when Kubiak and Rick Smith are gone next year (fingers crossed), we won't be left with a 1st round bust on our hands. If Rex believes in Kareem, I believe in Kareem.

Hopefully, Jackson will be improving for a new coaching staff. That runs the 3/4 defense. If MW isn't going to rush the passer in the 4/3. Then I'm sure the Texans can take advantage of Mario's strength in a 3/4 defense. Which is stopping the run.

76Texan
11-17-2010, 06:09 PM
http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-combine/09000d5d816dcc5f/2010-Combine-workout-Kareem-Jackson

If you can't really tell how smooth his hip action is, at least watch the portion right after the 40yd dash.

In this drill, they make the player backpedal, then turn 360% degree and continue running.

Try go outside and do it yourself.

Now watch McCourty and pay attention just to that drill.
I think you can tell that KJ made a smoother turn out of his backpedal.
http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-combine/09000d5d816dd9ca/2010-Combine-workout-Devin-McCourty

disaacks3
11-17-2010, 06:11 PM
Sounds good.

Can we get him some better coaching, please? Hear hear! Uncle Bob may take till 2012 on that.

Rex Ryan and his crafty tricks. Trying to get Glover to let down his guard! You mean it wasn't ALREADY down?

I like corners that line up with the receiver and mirror them down field. In today's NFL, WRs like AJ are too strong to "bump" off their route. I want a CB that has better than 4.5 speed with very fluid hips and good swivle like Kyle Wilson or Devin McCourty last draft and Brandon Harris or Jimmy Smith 2011 Kyle has been getting torched. He's who I expected the Texans to draft and I can't say that he's nay better than KJ.

Double Barrel
11-17-2010, 06:19 PM
Hopefully, Jackson will be improving for a new coaching staff. That runs the 3/4 defense. If MW isn't going to rush the passer in the 4/3. Then I'm sure the Texans can take advantage of Mario's strength in a 3/4 defense. Which is stopping the run.

I hope so, too, considering that he'll be a third year player by that point! :winky:

texanhead08
11-17-2010, 06:20 PM
I still think the pass coverage of our safeties is a bigger problem than our CB's. Before the SD game Pollard had already given up 7td's and Jackson 4, but everyone is screaming Jackson needs to be benched.

How many times have we seen a WR go deep and our safety is no where to be found. The FS is supposed to keep everything in front of him and Wilson is usually no where to be found on a deep ball.

eriadoc
11-17-2010, 06:38 PM
And Kareem Jackson will fall down.

76Texan
11-17-2010, 06:51 PM
This is what I'm talking about! Having never played organized football, I'm oblivious to a lot of the nuances of the x's and o's.

Man vs. Zone I understand. I wasn't sure if one or the other were generally used to different base schemes like the 4-3 or 3-4.

This is also why I think, we as fans (in general) are so dumb when it comes to blasting the organization for not take this player or that player in FA or the draft. If we're asking our corners to play a certain way, the "pro bowl FA CB" could be a terrible fit for the scheme... yet we're griping that we don't sign him.

What are the Texans doing in the secondary? And don't say "sucking" lol. Do we mostly do man or zone? Or do we mix it up quite a bit?

The Texans mix it up quite a bit, but they do play more zone than man coverage. Sometimes they would disguise it, showing man then dropping into zone (though not very often.)

Whether in a 4-3 a 3-4, you can still play zone coverage.
We were strictly a 4-3 team in the past but had added some 3-4 looks this year.

Rey
11-17-2010, 07:16 PM
This is what I'm talking about! Having never played organized football, I'm oblivious to a lot of the nuances of the x's and o's.

Man vs. Zone I understand. I wasn't sure if one or the other were generally used to different base schemes like the 4-3 or 3-4.

This is also why I think, we as fans (in general) are so dumb when it comes to blasting the organization for not take this player or that player in FA or the draft. If we're asking our corners to play a certain way, the "pro bowl FA CB" could be a terrible fit for the scheme... yet we're griping that we don't sign him.

What are the Texans doing in the secondary? And don't say "sucking" lol. Do we mostly do man or zone? Or do we mix it up quite a bit?

I really don't think it matters much what defense you run. A corner back is a corner back. Whether you are in a 4-3 or a 3-4 you have to be able to play the position.

H.C.4100-Bloc
11-17-2010, 07:23 PM
That mean they are going to pick on him all day long.

DexmanC
11-17-2010, 07:31 PM
Kareem Jackson was actually asked this in training camp. He said at Alabama it was all man coverage and with the Texans its about 50/50. Funny because the assumption was with him coming from Saban's "pro-style" coaching, he'd make a seamless transition to the NFL. Going from playing exclusive man coverage in college to 50/50 zone/man in the NFL doesn't sound like Saban's "pro-style" coaching prepared him for NFL zone concepts. And whatever "coaching" (if you can even call it that) he's getting now probably confused him even more.

In zone, he's expected to pass his receiver off to a safety.
That safety is never there, thus Kareem looks "burned."

m5kwatts
11-17-2010, 11:34 PM
http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-combine/09000d5d816dcc5f/2010-Combine-workout-Kareem-Jackson

If you can't really tell how smooth his hip action is, at least watch the portion right after the 40yd dash.

In this drill, they make the player backpedal, then turn 360% degree and continue running.

Try go outside and do it yourself.

Now watch McCourty and pay attention just to that drill.
I think you can tell that KJ made a smoother turn out of his backpedal.
http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-combine/09000d5d816dd9ca/2010-Combine-workout-Devin-McCourty

I see exactly what you're talking about. And I don't think the flaw here was the evaluation process. I think the problem started when he landed in Houston and this coaching staff got their hands on him.

mattieuk
11-17-2010, 11:50 PM
I think any negative evaluation that Houston fans are making on Kareem are going to be a bit unfair, as he was been thrown in the deep end, with little to no help around him. As I've said before, they're doing the same thing they did to HWWNBN, in just throwing in a rook, and expecting him to stand out, and lead by example.

Norg
11-17-2010, 11:57 PM
How is Kyle WIlson doing ?????? hes not starting right ????

Nawzer
11-18-2010, 12:03 AM
How is Kyle WIlson doing ?????? hes not starting right ????

With Darell Revis and Antonio Cromartie as your starting CBs, it's hard for Kyle Wilson to crack that starting lineup. But I don't know whether or not if he has started any game or how he's played so far. As for Rex Ryan, I hope for our sake KJ is going to be an outstanding player.

Norg
11-18-2010, 12:11 AM
i havent really kept up with the jets but last time i seen Kyle WIlson on the field he was getting burned

and with this few weeks that revis was hurt i call to remember teams scoring 20+ on da jets

76Texan
11-18-2010, 12:28 AM
How is Kyle WIlson doing ?????? hes not starting right ????

Re: Question: Kareem Jackson

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Originally Posted by El Tejano
I believe that Kareem is the kind of player a team like The Ravens could draft. A team that gets so much pressure up front that they could still stick a player in there and he would exceed. Kind of like Kyle Wilson with The Jets. Right now, we don't have the pressure necessary to just trot out a rookie CB like Kareem.

It's only my hope that his confidence has grown over the last bye week.

OK, so I decided to watch me some games of the Jets (all of them).

In their first game against the Ravens, Wilson played strictly nickel and was "torched" (using the same standard many posters here use for KJ) pretty much EVERY single time (about 11 or 12).

If you think KJ is bad then Wilson is utterly worse than garbage.
Those posters who called KJ a bust would call Wilson the biggest bust of all time.
In later games, he was used like McCain (sometimes at nickel, sometimes at CB) with worse results. He would look bad against David Anderson at this rate.
I thought he should be benched... then in the last 2 games, I don't see him in the line-up anymore.
He was still returning kick once in a while.

I wanted to give him benefit of the doubt, checking to see whether he's injured (even though he doesn't look injured on the return team) so I googled and found out that he had indeed been benched.

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/fo...vexes_rex.html

By the way, Cromartie (any CB not named Revis) looked worse than KJ as well. Even Revis got burned a few times.

The KJ bashing seems rather odd, really!

76Texan
11-18-2010, 12:33 AM
Here you can see why I said even Revis got burned from time to time.
His HC Ryan had put it into words if you didn't trust me!

ArlingtonTexan
11-18-2010, 12:37 AM
With Darell Revis and Antonio Cromartie as your starting CBs, it's hard for Kyle Wilson to crack that starting lineup. But I don't know whether or not if he has started any game or how he's played so far. As for Rex Ryan, I hope for our sake KJ is going to be an outstanding player.

Really none of 5 first round corners:

Haden Browns
Jackson texans
McCourty Pats
Wilson Jets
Robinson saints

have actually played well, but the Texans are the only team that thought that a rookie would come in a be the #1 CB. The other dudes, except for McCourty (starting, but not seeing the total time of K. Jackson) are nickel type guys.

76Texan
11-18-2010, 12:40 AM
Really none of 5 first round corners:

Haden Browns
Jackson texans
McCourty Pats
Wilson Jets
Robinson saints

have actually played well, but the Texans are the only team that thought that a rookie would come in a be the #1 CB. The other dudes, except for McCourty (starting, but not seeing the total time of K. Jackson) are nickel type guys.

Kyle Wilson started and was demoted, and then benched!
OK, never mind, I didn't read the "nickel" part.

ArlingtonTexan
11-18-2010, 12:46 AM
Kyle Wilson started and was demoted, and then benched!

and if anything Ryan may have mentally been comparing Jackson starting versus Wilson not handling his job with a legitimate defense and really good other corners around.

That's my Texans' sunshine moment of the week.

76Texan
11-18-2010, 01:04 AM
and if anything Ryan may have mentally been comparing Jackson starting versus Wilson not handling his job with a legitimate defense and really good other corners around.

That's my Texans' sunshine moment of the week.

There you go!

I have been totally honest when I said if the other guys on defense (based on their tenure and where they were drafted or the money they got paid) played as compared as this rookie where he was drafted, this defense would have been better than they showed!

It sounded crazy when quite a few folks think that KJ suck.
It sounded crazy when I defended Chris Myers last year too!

I have no gripe but to keep on begging people to rewind each play and watch all the details as Bill Walsh always wishes that the football fans would do for the love of the game!

76Texan
11-18-2010, 01:19 AM
BTW, Probowler Rashean Mathis suck badly once again in another game against the Texans!

76Texan
11-18-2010, 02:11 AM
Now I don't think McCourty is a bad player.
Just randomly pull up a game.

Pats vs. Ravens (not an explosive pass offense).

1st action. Called for Pass Interference downfield (have got to when you can't stay with the receiver)

2nd action. 3rd and long. Allowed a first down by cushion.

3rd action. On 2nd and 5, 12 yd pass for a first down.

(No run support or anything in between)

1st near-action. Ready for run support, but not involved.

Ravens led 10-7, simply running their offense, not targetting anybody so far!
(To be continued if I have time.)

BullNation4Life
11-18-2010, 08:02 AM
I think this is Rex Ryan speak for " LOL WE ARE GONNA LIGHT KAREEM JACKSON'S ASS UP ON SUNDAY, AND THERE AIN'T A DAMN THING YOU OR THE TEXANS CAN DO ABOUT IT!"

but hey, that is just me reading between the lines....

IDEXAN
11-18-2010, 08:38 AM
Not surprised by FatBoy running his yap like this because this is an obvious trap-game for the Jets, as he probably feels the same way he did last year about the Texans except more so this year - it's a finesse team.
He's gonna say what he can to get his team focused.

TimeKiller
11-18-2010, 08:52 AM
"KJ's going to be an outstanding player" but they left off the last bit of the line, "just not this week lolz"

You know what I've noticed A LOT about the zone coverage of the Texans? They set up shop in one place and don't react until someone has the ball. That's why guys are wide open. 3 seconds....4 seconds....5 seconds sometimes passing and guys aren't commiting to a receiver until he has secured the catch.

It's not even hard to notice, watch KJ release a receiver inside or back to the safety, sit in his zone TO COVER NOBODY while that very receiver comes open for an easy catch. Same for the safety in the same situation. There is no other receiver approaching his zone but he isn't there to receive the WR from KJ's zone and doesn't react until that WR has the ball.

IDEXAN
11-18-2010, 10:09 AM
KJs play can't be evaluated in a vacuum, i.e., without knowing what kind of scheme the entire backend is in in a given snap, there's no way of knowing his responsibilities on that given snap ? For example was he in man all the way, or are they in some form or other of cover 2 where he expects help over top by the safety ? Maybe it looks like he gets beat on a play deep for a TD, but what actually happened was that the safety failed to fulfill his responsibilty of picking up the wide-out ?

El Tejano
11-18-2010, 11:47 AM
Re: Question: Kareem Jackson

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OK, so I decided to watch me some games of the Jets (all of them).

In their first game against the Ravens, Wilson played strictly nickel and was "torched" (using the same standard many posters here use for KJ) pretty much EVERY single time (about 11 or 12).

If you think KJ is bad then Wilson is utterly worse than garbage.
Those posters who called KJ a bust would call Wilson the biggest bust of all time.
In later games, he was used like McCain (sometimes at nickel, sometimes at CB) with worse results. He would look bad against David Anderson at this rate.
I thought he should be benched... then in the last 2 games, I don't see him in the line-up anymore.
He was still returning kick once in a while.

I wanted to give him benefit of the doubt, checking to see whether he's injured (even though he doesn't look injured on the return team) so I googled and found out that he had indeed been benched.

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/fo...vexes_rex.html

By the way, Cromartie (any CB not named Revis) looked worse than KJ as well. Even Revis got burned a few times.

The KJ bashing seems rather odd, really!

Put me on blast why don't you. When did my quote go down, because I think it may have been when Jets played the Ravens in wk 1 and Wilson played pretty well then. However, I see you did your homework and if that is true I gotta say we would've been burned either way we picked.

thunderkyss
11-18-2010, 12:52 PM
I think this is Rex Ryan speak for " LOL WE ARE GONNA LIGHT KAREEM JACKSON'S ASS UP ON SUNDAY, AND THERE AIN'T A DAMN THING YOU OR THE TEXANS CAN DO ABOUT IT!"

but hey, that is just me reading between the lines....

I like Kareem Jackson. I think he's doing a "heck of a job"


But I agree. I think Rex wants to "make sure" Kareem is on the field for a lot of snaps come Sunday.

thunderkyss
11-18-2010, 12:58 PM
"KJ's going to be an outstanding player" but they left off the last bit of the line, "just not this week lolz"

You know what I've noticed A LOT about the zone coverage of the Texans? They set up shop in one place and don't react until someone has the ball. That's why guys are wide open. 3 seconds....4 seconds....5 seconds sometimes passing and guys aren't commiting to a receiver until he has secured the catch.

It's not even hard to notice, watch KJ release a receiver inside or back to the safety, sit in his zone TO COVER NOBODY while that very receiver comes open for an easy catch. Same for the safety in the same situation. There is no other receiver approaching his zone but he isn't there to receive the WR from KJ's zone and doesn't react until that WR has the ball.

I've said exactly the same thing about our LBs.... Sit in "a zone" in the middle of the field against a good LB corp you'll get lit up if the ball comes anywhere near you. Doesn't matter if you catch the ball or not, if your feet are on the ground & the QB looks at you when he raises his arm any LB/Safety worth his salt is going to put a lick on you.

You've got your Laron Landries & Ed Reeds & Troy Palamalus that have speed & can cover huge distances, but being able to watch a QB & anticipate routes is why they (& average safeties) can be there to affect the catch.... make sure you really, really want to catch it.

Against the Texans, we pretty much let anyone catch whatever.... may not allow a lot of YAC..... but if you want to catch it, it's like there is a 5 yard halo around you.

Blake
11-18-2010, 01:05 PM
Here is how I read this. If KJ is going to be an outstanding player, why is he getting beat so badly now? No help? Poor scheming? Poor roster moves?

That all points at Kubiak. Its his job to make sure that KJ doesnt get exposed as the rookie he is. Putting him as our #1 corner with bad support or in poor position to make a play is Kubiak not doing a good enough job.

Texas T
11-18-2010, 01:11 PM
Here is how I read this. If KJ is going to be an outstanding player, why is he getting beat so badly now? No help? Poor scheming? Poor roster moves?

That all points at Kubiak. Its his job to make sure that KJ doesnt get exposed as the rookie he is. Putting him as our #1 corner with bad support or in poor position to make a play is Kubiak not doing a good enough job.

Well Duh!!

All us non-coaching fans out here can see this-what I can't figure out is why our highly payed coaches cannot.

KJ is getting little if any support at this point and who would really expect him to do much better than he's doing (minus the falling)?
I really hope this year doesn't destroy him, like this kind of crap did to the player who will never be named by me.

badboy
11-18-2010, 01:12 PM
Here is how I read this. If KJ is going to be an outstanding player, why is he getting beat so badly now? No help? Poor scheming? Poor roster moves?

That all points at Kubiak. Its his job to make sure that KJ doesnt get exposed as the rookie he is. Putting him as our #1 corner with bad support or in poor position to make a play is Kubiak not doing a good enough job.Agreed. A FS should have been assigned to help KJ out every game.

Blake
11-18-2010, 01:23 PM
Well Duh!!

All us non-coaching fans out here can see this-what I can't figure out is why our highly payed coaches cannot.

KJ is getting little if any support at this point and who would really expect him to do much better than he's doing (minus the falling)?
I really hope this year doesn't destroy him, like this kind of crap did to the player who will never be named by me.

David Carr?

http://cm1.theinsider.com/thumbnail/400/480/cm1.theinsider.com/media/0/68/48/1david_carr.jpg

thunderkyss
11-18-2010, 01:23 PM
Agreed. A FS should have been assigned to help KJ out every game.

I think that has been our problem.

We need to forget fixing our Pass defense, stop the run, get after the QB. Get to doing what made us successful last year.

Texas T
11-18-2010, 01:28 PM
David Carr?

http://cm1.theinsider.com/thumbnail/400/480/cm1.theinsider.com/media/0/68/48/1david_carr.jpg

Great now I have to poke my eyes out with a stick...

Mr teX
11-18-2010, 02:08 PM
KJ's a rook & next to qb, cb is probably the hardest position to make the jump from college. give him time.

thunderkyss
11-18-2010, 03:09 PM
KJ's a rook & next to qb, cb is probably the hardest position to make the jump from college. give him time.

People keep saying give him time, give him time....


But he doesn't look terrible, he is not the worst part of our pass defense. He get's the blame, because he is the new guy, but he is not the biggest problem on pass D.

He's going to get better. That's just the way it is.... the LBs... The safeties.... unless you throw Nolan in there, are about as good as they're going to get.

It's time we stopped trying to cover up our mistakes, & play the football they built this team to play. Stop the run, get after the QB, playing fast, playing downhill.

what happens on the back end will happen, roll with it.

Dutchrudder
11-18-2010, 03:12 PM
Rex is just trying to make Kubiak feel better about the pick. I'll be watching for Kyle Wilson this Sunday, as I am curious to see how he does against Walter or JJ.

Big Lou
11-18-2010, 03:16 PM
Hey Rex if you think Kareem is going to be so good, would you consider a trade?

We send you Kareem, and you send us Revis and a 3rd round pick in 2011. Hey its a good deal, KJ is 2 years younger. Think of all that abuse Revis has had in those two years, hell he started the season hurt, he's washed up!

DO IT!

Blake
11-18-2010, 03:56 PM
Great now I have to poke my eyes out with a stick...

lol must spread rep.

Mr teX
11-18-2010, 04:15 PM
People keep saying give him time, give him time....


But he doesn't look terrible, he is not the worst part of our pass defense. He get's the blame, because he is the new guy, but he is not the biggest problem on pass D.

He's going to get better. That's just the way it is.... the LBs... The safeties.... unless you throw Nolan in there, are about as good as they're going to get.

It's time we stopped trying to cover up our mistakes, & play the football they built this team to play. Stop the run, get after the QB, playing fast, playing downhill.

what happens on the back end will happen, roll with it.

No he gets the blame b/c most people who watch don't really understand anything beyond the fact that he's a cb & cb's cover WR's. So when a 50 yard TD pass is given up to Ajirottuieowpru or whomever & the TV screen angle shows the nearest texan to him is #25 he'll get blamed. Even though his safety help may have been roaming a place he shouldn't have or just flat out to slow to get to the spot....you get the picture.

He'll be fine, its just a tough transition from college to the pros @ the cb spot. Once he gets:
competent safety play
a consistent pass rush
& learns how to stay low & keep his center of gravity over his feet he'll be a solid starter imo. I'll put it like this, I don't worry about him nearly as much as i worry about his counterparts back there with him.

m5kwatts
11-19-2010, 12:02 AM
No he gets the blame b/c most people who watch don't really understand anything beyond the fact that he's a cb & cb's cover WR's. So when a 50 yard TD pass is given up to Ajirottuieowpru or whomever & the TV screen angle shows the nearest texan to him is #25 he'll get blamed. Even though his safety help may have been roaming a place he shouldn't have or just flat out to slow to get to the spot....you get the picture.

He'll be fine, its just a tough transition from college to the pros @ the cb spot. Once he gets:
competent safety play
a consistent pass rush
& learns how to stay low & keep his center of gravity over his feet he'll be a solid starter imo. I'll put it like this, I don't worry about him nearly as much as i worry about his counterparts back there with him.

I think this is pretty spot on.

Grams
11-19-2010, 07:03 AM
I don't think he has been that bad as some are making him out to be. He has made some plays.
One thing - if he does lose his feet, he does get back up to try to make the tackle. He does not just "lie" there. He puts forth an effort all the time.

Everyone was saying how bad Dunta was last year. Now they want him back?? I don't think Jackson is half as bad as some of you guys are saying he is. Some of his problems are the other players being out of position and the coaching he is getting, and being a rookie.

Ole Miss Texan
11-19-2010, 10:01 AM
I don't think he has been that bad as some are making him out to be. He has made some plays.
One thing - if he does lose his feet, he does get back up to try to make the tackle. He does not just "lie" there. He puts forth an effort all the time.

Everyone was saying how bad Dunta was last year. Now they want him back?? I don't think Jackson is half as bad as some of you guys are saying he is. Some of his problems are the other players being out of position and the coaching he is getting, and being a rookie.

Agreed. I think if Dunta was here instead of KJ everyone would want Kubiak/Smith fired because they're paying $10MM this season for a crappy CB that is getting torched (aka no safeties help him either) and that we passed on several 1st round CBs that could have been just as good if not better.

HuttoKarl
11-19-2010, 10:10 AM
Agreed. I think if Dunta was here instead of KJ everyone would want Kubiak/Smith fired because they're paying $10MM this season for a crappy CB that is getting torched (aka no safeties help him either) and that we passed on several 1st round CBs that could have been just as good if not better.

We'd have "I can't believe we kept Dunta...Kareem Jackson leads rookie CB's in tackles" threads. :whip:

TimeKiller
11-19-2010, 01:52 PM
I've said exactly the same thing about our LBs.... Sit in "a zone" in the middle of the field against a good LB corp you'll get lit up if the ball comes anywhere near you. Doesn't matter if you catch the ball or not, if your feet are on the ground & the QB looks at you when he raises his arm any LB/Safety worth his salt is going to put a lick on you.

You've got your Laron Landries & Ed Reeds & Troy Palamalus that have speed & can cover huge distances, but being able to watch a QB & anticipate routes is why they (& average safeties) can be there to affect the catch.... make sure you really, really want to catch it.

Against the Texans, we pretty much let anyone catch whatever.... may not allow a lot of YAC..... but if you want to catch it, it's like there is a 5 yard halo around you.

Yup yup. They react WAY too much to where the ball is rather than the players themselves. Close the space between you and the guy running into your zone, hell, YOU JUST MIGHT be in position to make a play instead of maybe being in position to make a tackle.

beerlover
11-19-2010, 01:59 PM
We'd have "I can't believe we kept Dunta...Kareem Jackson leads rookie CB's in tackles" threads. :whip:

like this - now Kareem is #2 CB in tackles @ 46 to NE CB Devin McCourty w/48 :specnatz:

badboy
11-19-2010, 02:49 PM
like this - now Kareem is #2 CB in tackles @ 46 to NE CB Devin McCourty w/48 :specnatz:I really don't want any corner or FS getting many tackles. I'd rather they have more break ups. If I was the defensive backs coach (David Gibbs) I'd do two things immediately.
First tell Pollard that he is in danger of being cut (Pollard admitted he played so well last season after an awakening when he was cut. Sort of a Mario get him mad thing) and two tell KJ he is never to bump a WR again just mirror them. Jackson has the speed to run with them and another season of working against AJ will improve him immensely. Quin looked pretty good last year. I wonder if he misses having Jacques Reeves? Something is not the same.

Brisco_County
11-19-2010, 03:17 PM
I've said it a million times this year: The mistake made wasn't letting go of Dunta for Kareem, but cutting Reeves for no reason.

I expect Kareem to be a solid CB by next year though.

TimeKiller
11-19-2010, 04:17 PM
How would you feel about a:
Dunta - Quin - Pollard - Jackson
starting secondary?

Oh hell, why do I even keep the hope that they'll move Quin to FS....

scourge
11-19-2010, 04:29 PM
I've said it a million times this year: The mistake made wasn't letting go of Dunta for Kareem, but cutting Reeves for no reason.
I expect Kareem to be a solid CB by next year though.

That's my take on it as well.

Rey
11-19-2010, 04:38 PM
Translation: He sucks right now.

thunderkyss
11-19-2010, 04:51 PM
How would you feel about a:
Dunta - Quin - Pollard - Jackson
starting secondary?

Oh hell, why do I even keep the hope that they'll move Quin to FS....

I'd much rather have had"

Cromartie - Wilson - Pollard - Quin
(with Jackson at nickel)


& I'd much rather we attack the LOS like we did last season.

76Texan
11-20-2010, 03:00 AM
Agreed. A FS should have been assigned to help KJ out every game.

What is the job of a FS?

Badboy, I had challenged you to put up all the plays of all the secondaries that we have faced to compare to ours.

Yet you have never responded.

I really thought that you love the game more than this (what you have shown regarding KJ).

It's fine by me if you decide to be a one-sided critic.
But even so, shouldn't you base your standard against something?

To be honest, I'm quite surprised that you (as I have read you over the years) can be such a harsh critic of KJ's play.

You don't respond to any of my rebuttal but you keep on putting out one-liner like this.
Once gain, I don't think it's fair to the player.

If you don't think he's a good bump and run corner, make all the notes about all the bump and run (from both teams) that we've seen so far.
If you think he slip-slides away too much, bring on your proof about how it hurts the defense as compared to all the CBs (our owns and the ones we have faced so far).

In all honesty, I truly believe that the critics of KJ have been overreaching.

In short, just let me ask you this:
"Is there a safety on this team who can help themselves before attempting to help others?"

hradhak
11-21-2010, 10:12 AM
Last week it seemed like KJ's side of the field didn't get thrown to very often. I can't be sure of the numbers since I didn't rewatch that game, but I've thought that KJ has gotten much better with every game this year.

He still makes mistakes, but every corner in the league does that.

thunderkyss
11-21-2010, 08:33 PM
Last week it seemed like KJ's side of the field didn't get thrown to very often. I can't be sure of the numbers since I didn't rewatch that game, but I've thought that KJ has gotten much better with every game this year.

He still makes mistakes, but every corner in the league does that.

Y'know, I was never worried about KJ's confidence until this game. He seemed to be handling the NFL well, short memory & all that. But to bring a guy off the street & have to split snaps with him?????

I don't dig that.

I don't believe KJ is as bad as being talked about.

McCain IMO needs to have his snaps seriously reduced. Bring McMannis or Molden in the game.

Wilson needs to get off the field, & stay off. Don't feel good with Nolan??? throw Allen in at safety, off the street. Throw Molden in, start him there at practice, put McMannis in there... Move KJ to Safety if you're going to split his time with Allen..

heck, you moved Cushing to Mike... why not?

JB
11-21-2010, 08:54 PM
Y'know, I was never worried about KJ's confidence until this game. He seemed to be handling the NFL well, short memory & all that. But to bring a guy off the street & have to split snaps with him?????

I don't dig that.

I don't believe KJ is as bad as being talked about.

McCain IMO needs to have his snaps seriously reduced. Bring McMannis or Molden in the game.

Wilson needs to get off the field, & stay off. Don't feel good with Nolan??? throw Allen in at safety, off the street. Throw Molden in, start him there at practice, put McMannis in there... Move KJ to Safety if you're going to split his time with Allen..

heck, you moved Cushing to Mike... why not?


McMannis did get a snap or two. No sign of Molden that I recall. I didn't think that KJ had that bad of a game. Quin had some problems.

Oh yeah,



McCain SUCKS!!!

kiwitexansfan
11-21-2010, 08:57 PM
Is McCain the worst player to ever suit up in a Texans jersey?

There has never been a player I have dreaded seeing take the field before.

JB
11-21-2010, 09:37 PM
Is McCain the worst player to ever suit up in a Texans jersey?

There has never been a player I have dreaded seeing take the field before.

McCain makes me long for Petey Faggins and CC Brown. :facepalm:


FML!