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View Full Version : IS Okoye that much better than Mitchell/Sheppard ?


newtexan
11-16-2010, 08:24 PM
No he's not, neither is Cody ,but the Texans are trying to show commitment to these starters,i'm not sure Smith is better than Anderson, the D-line needs to be shuffled so these young players can show what they have, not a play here or a play there ,... Mitchell/Sheppard/Anderson will soon force the hand of the Texans def. cord .

TexCanada
11-16-2010, 08:26 PM
No he's not, neither is Cody ,but the Texans are trying to show commitment to these starters,i'm not sure Smith is better than Anderson, the D-line needs to be shuffled so these young players can show what they have, not a play here or a play there ,... Mitchell/Sheppard/Anderson will soon force the hand of the Texans def. cord .

Anderson is a completely one-dimensional player. Smith is leaps and bounds better then him.

newtexan
11-16-2010, 08:37 PM
I somewhat agree,...but anderson seems to be alot faster off the ball, and sometimes these type players becomes very disruptive and creates plays for other defensive players, it's not happening now.

Corrosion
11-16-2010, 08:52 PM
Is 0k0ye better than those guy's .... slightly.


Thats not the problem , its what they are asked to do thats the problem along with their inability to do things they arent asked to do.

They are asked to penetrate and shoot gaps rather than tie up guy's or push the pocket .... They have the ability to beat a guy with quickness at times but they dont have the ability to push the pocket.

If you look at when they tend to get beat deep (relative), its when the opposing QB is able to step up or out away from the pressure of a DE who has been washed past the play.

Often the 0k0ye is beaten at the point of attack and pushed back into a LB .... creating more problems.

I dont care who's back there in coverage , if a QB is given comfortable time in the pocket he's going to pick a defense apart.


Its the players , its their ability , its the scheme ..... all fail .

CretorFrigg
11-16-2010, 08:57 PM
Newtexan (Sheppard) now has 106 posts about himself. :foottap:

I don't think Mitchell or Sheppard has outperformed Okoye yet. The fact is that Okoye is a mediocre player, but he's the best that we have. Okoye's constant criticism is a result of where he was drafted—in the first round.

Sheppard and Mitchell have shown flashes in preseason when playing against 2nd and 3rd stringers that probably aren't even on the team anymore. Mitchell, however, has gotten a few snaps in during the regular season, and he seems to be able to hold his own ground. His pass rushing abilities appear to be superior to Okoye's pass rushing skills. The problem is that Mitchell is particularly susceptible to the run (especially the draw play) due to his style of play.

Brisco_County
11-16-2010, 09:08 PM
Is newtexan going to change his name after he's been here a year?

Mitchell has a hamstring pull that he's just now getting over, but I wouldn't expect him to be starter quality until year 2.5, or year 3 if there's a lockout.

We'll never know how good Okoye could've been because he had a coach that allowed him to regress after his rookie season, which was his best. Now he has a chronic back injury, so who knows where his ceiling is now.

Honoring Earl 34
11-16-2010, 09:16 PM
I'd take Terrance Knighton over any of them .

Hagar
11-16-2010, 10:18 PM
My problem is that he doesn't do anything well. He doesn't occupy/beat double teams, he doesn't shoot the gap, he doesn't push the pocket back.

Usually, you see him either arrive at the QB a second after he releases the ball or get blocked 5 yards back into the LB.

I don't know if either Mitchell or Sheppard or Anderson are any better, but they should at least get the opportunity to play.

The Cush
11-17-2010, 12:02 AM
I somewhat agree,...but anderson seems to be alot faster off the ball, and sometimes these type players becomes very disruptive and creates plays for other defensive players, it's not happening now.

Anderson gets completely taken out on run plays

Norg
11-17-2010, 12:12 AM
well if things keep up like this

expect

Smith gone which is sad because at times i think he out performs mario but u know damm well this team aint dropping mario unless some team is dumb enough to give us a sweet deal

Cody and hopefully Amobi gone

and prob Bullman and anderson gone

rmartin65
11-17-2010, 08:26 AM
well if things keep up like this

expect

Smith gone which is sad because at times i think he out performs mario but u know damm well this team aint dropping mario unless some team is dumb enough to give us a sweet deal

Cody and hopefully Amobi gone

and prob Bullman and anderson gone

Posts like this are asinine. Ok, so you eliminated just about every DL on the roster? How are you going to fill that?

Street FA? Do you see anyone better right now?

FA in the offseason? Who would sign here in Houston? We dont make the playoffs, we have mediocre/terrible coaches, and it seems (I dont have the facts) that Bob does not like to shell out the big bucks.

Draft? Outside of the first and maybe second round, do you think any DL we draft will be better than the guys we currently have?

kiwitexansfan
11-17-2010, 09:31 AM
Let's fact check this.

Okoye = Our best penetrating full time DT. Sad but true.

Cody = Our best run stopping DT.

Mitchell = our chosen 3rd DT, shows flashes of ability to penetrate, not sure on his run stopping.

Sheppard = Complete unknown. Although given how awful our defence is, if he was showing greatness in training he would be on the field now I feel.

kiwitexansfan
11-17-2010, 09:32 AM
Posts like this are asinine. Ok, so you eliminated just about every DL on the roster? How are you going to fill that?

Street FA? Do you see anyone better right now?

FA in the offseason? Who would sign here in Houston? We dont make the playoffs, we have mediocre/terrible coaches, and it seems (I dont have the facts) that Bob does not like to shell out the big bucks.

Draft? Outside of the first and maybe second round, do you think any DL we draft will be better than the guys we currently have?

Good post rmartin. All the guys we have on the line are good enough to be rotational pieces. We just need a stud to go with them and perhaps better schemes.

HOU-TEX
11-17-2010, 10:06 AM
At this point, they all suck. It doesn't matter which DT's are on the field because they've all been the same, which amounts to suckage.

thunderkyss
11-17-2010, 10:29 AM
Often the 0k0ye is beaten at the point of attack and pushed back into a LB .... creating more problems.


If you can produce a video of this happening, I'd love to see it. I've heard it here again & again, & I've watched to see it happen, & I never do.

If Okoye has a problem in pass rush, I think it's that he almost always take an arc very similar to what the DE is doing, which effectively opens the middle allowing the QB to step up.

Ole Miss Texan
11-17-2010, 10:42 AM
That's like asking is Antoine Caldwell that much better than Shelly Smith?

thunderkyss
11-17-2010, 10:48 AM
If you can produce a video of this happening, I'd love to see it. I've heard it here again & again, & I've watched to see it happen, & I never do.

If Okoye has a problem in pass rush, I think it's that he almost always take an arc very similar to what the DE is doing, which effectively opens the middle allowing the QB to step up.

Here's a video (http://www.nfl.com/gamecenter/2010111403/2010/REG10/texans@jaguars#tab:watch) of what I'm talking about.

As an aside, when watching that video, Quin, again, did what he was supposed to do. Look at what Pollard does.... ( I like Pollard, but watch him)...

lazy walk to the line, as soon as the ball is snapped, he runs back as if he's supposed to be the under coverage (whether he is a strong safety, or a WILL, he's got to be able to do this)..... You can see a TE or a FB roll out into the flat.

When looking at the play at full speed, the receiver is wide open when the ball gets to him, so I'm thinking Pollard peeled off his coverage on the deep route, & decided to jump on the guy in the flat.

But watching the replay from the other angle, you see Pollard stayed with the receiver, sort of. He went to wide, & looked as if he was guarding the under of what might have been a come back, or a hook route. The receiver cut in on a slant which makes it an easy toss for Garrard, as he has nothing between him & the receiver. He can put it on a line, doesn't need to worry about touch, or trying to get the ball to drop at a certain spot... arch.

This has been THE main problem of our pass defense for years... even before Kubiak got here. Our LBs & Safeties don't have the football smarts to keep their eyes on the QB & anticipate routes. I think they're athletic enough & fast enough (we're only talking about a small portion of the field that they split up) because all they really need to do is make it difficult for the QB to throw the ball. Make him think about what he needs to do.

Make him pump fake or something that will give us that extra nth of a second our DL needs to finish... especially Amobi & Smith... in that play, Amobi is a hair away from putting a hurt on Garrard. A fraction of a second more, he might not have got a sack, but he could have got a legal hit on him.

Our Corners are good enough to play the under, but our safeties (I know some have been saying it for years) are not good enough to play the over. Hopefully Jason Allen will be moved to safety & be able to handle that, because Nolan hasn't done it & Wilson (I know I defended him last year) can't.

I'm not being negative, I'm just sayin.

Hervoyel
11-17-2010, 01:08 PM
What ever happened to "Charles Jefferson". He was a beast even if he did just fly in for games.

kiwitexansfan
11-17-2010, 01:26 PM
Yes, Yes, a thousand times YES.

Sorry every time I see this thread title it bugs me.