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View Full Version : What are you willing to give up to improve D?


TexansBull
10-17-2010, 04:35 PM
Kubiak and co not an option.

Seriously though. Matt Cassell was good today. We need to do something. The D needs to improve, and all options need to be put on the table. Tuesday is the trade deadline. This coach and GM and organization need to build the defense. You cannot just build through the draft. You cannot just build through the free agency. Guess what you can do both. You passed up free agency, so know you have to start trading some draft picks and players. So this is what I am willing to give up:
Draft picks: any of next year except 1 and 2 unless you feel the need postion witha quality player.
Players: Slaton, and if you can get Nmandi, daniels. I know Nmandi contract is outrageous, but playoffs. Sign him to an extension is an uncapped year.

But you need to get a veternan corner, a pass rushing DT, and a safety. Even if that means Albert haynesworth. I know he may be a cancer, but one and done if need be. It doesn't matter. Rick, pick up the phone and don't stop dialing. This Front Office needs to deliver or they are going to be doing the players and fans a disservice. We need to make the playoffs this year, and you need to realize that is what the fans and players want.

Memo to Gary and coaching staff: the room is getting warm.

I am sorry if this maybe emotional and illogical, but I think you guys now what I am driving at. The trade deadline is Tuesday, we have the bye, time to help the players and fans out. Show us what you can do front office. I still have faith.

And question to the board, what so you think this board should do and give up for this season?

Marcus
10-17-2010, 04:45 PM
I don't know what you guys are willing to give up, but THEY will demand Andre Johnson.

Do you see how ridiculous this is?

tedr
10-17-2010, 04:49 PM
I don't know what you guys are willing to give up, but THEY will demand Andre Johnson.

Do you see how ridiculous this is?

I think we could get some immediate help that can significantly contribute if we're willing to part with some high draft choices and some decent (NOT Andre caliber) players. Andre Johnson, in my opinion, is TOTALLY off limits.

brakos82
10-17-2010, 04:52 PM
Somebody said 2011 1st and 2nd for Aso.

:thinking:

LikeMike
10-17-2010, 04:53 PM
IŽd be willing to give up draft picks and Steve Slaton. A first and a second for Aso? Sure. A 2nd for Champ Bailey? You bet.

tedr
10-17-2010, 04:54 PM
Somebody said 2011 1st and 2nd for Aso.

:thinking:

I'd go for that.

Rey
10-17-2010, 04:54 PM
Raiders have pretty much gone on record saying any of their players are in play.

I'd seriously consider putting together a package for Aso.

TexCanada
10-17-2010, 04:54 PM
I'd go 2011 1st and 2012 3rd for Aso.

Pantherstang84
10-17-2010, 04:55 PM
I don't know what you guys are willing to give up, but THEY will demand Andre Johnson.

Do you see how ridiculous this is?

Not ridiculous at all. Any demands for AJ would be a short conversation. We have draft picks and I would be willing to part with some to shore up the defense. Sooner or later this season the magic rabbit's foot theTexans have been rubbing will lose its magic.

eriadoc
10-17-2010, 04:57 PM
Seriously though. Matt Cassell was good today.

Every single week, an opposing offensive player has a career day. Manning had one of his five best performances in his career against us in a loss. McNabb had his third best game ever against us. Roy Williams had a career game against us in Week 3. Zach Miller had a career day against us in Week 4, and I bet if I look it up, it was probably one of Gradkowski's best games ever as well. Hakeem Nicks wishes he could face us every week. And one of the league's worst passers came in here today and had what is probably one of his best games ever.

So NO - Cassel was not good today.

GP
10-17-2010, 05:05 PM
Raiders have pretty much gone on record saying any of their players are in play.

I'd seriously consider putting together a package for Aso.

I have really been diggin' your posts this pas few weeks.

And I dig this one, too.

ONE awesome cover corner can potentially change things here. If not this season, it would change things NEXT season. If there is one. And if it is an uncapped year, why not?

ONE awesome cover corner could have helped shut down Nicks. Unless, of course, Nicks is going to bud into the next biggest thing this side of #80 in Houston. Because I think that dude is not a fluke. He looks almost uncoverable. Seriously he does.

I'd give up a 1 and a 3. Because Kareem Jackson is a nickel corner you use for EXTRA coverage and run support. He ain't a cover corner. Period. And so if you see a true cover corner out there, you say "You know what? It's worth a 1 and a 3 for that. It really is."

If some General Manager in Texas right now doesn't understand this, and doesn't try to convince McNair of it, then we're screwed. This is where the financial side of things makes me put on the tin foil hat.

ObsiWan
10-17-2010, 05:14 PM
The move I would have made - and would still make if possible - would be to get Richard Seymour. Al Davis is not going to give up Asomugha at any reasonable price.

TimeKiller
10-17-2010, 05:14 PM
We spent a 1st on CB this year. Why not spend a 1st on Asomugha? Throw in anything below another 3rd or Jacoby or Slaton.

Brisco_County
10-17-2010, 05:19 PM
Asomugha is too high of a cap room price.

wagonhed
10-17-2010, 05:21 PM
Considering that I put most of the blame on our scheme, I wouldn't trade much to improve the D but I would have no problem bringing in an experienced DC.

ObsiWan
10-17-2010, 05:29 PM
We spent a 1st on CB this year. Why not spend a 1st on Asomugha? Throw in anything below another 3rd or Jacoby or Slaton.

I could see a first for Asomugha straight up. No other picks. No other players. If the Vikes can get Moss for a 3rd - and he's got HoF numbers - then Asomugha is worth no more than a 1st.

Unless you think we're REEEEEEEALLY desperate.

Besides, with McFadden, Bush, and Michael Bennett on their roster, the Raiders are really fat at RB so throwing in Slaton won't be much of an enticement. I don't think J.J. is either since he's not real polished and the last thing the Raiders need is a project WR to go with their project QBs.

brakos82
10-17-2010, 05:30 PM
Asomugha is too high of a cap room price.

What cap? :kitten:

ObsiWan
10-17-2010, 05:31 PM
What cap? :kitten:

good point.
there probably won't even be a season in 2011.

Hottoddie
10-17-2010, 05:47 PM
The move I would have made - and would still make if possible - would be to get Richard Seymour. Al Davis is not going to give up Asomugha at any reasonable price.


This is the smartest post in this thread. I couldn't agree with you more.

The majority on this board wants to blame our young CB's for all the defensive problems when in fact, they should be blaming the D'Line. We all knew that the CB's were going to be exploited this season & would get burned. The best way to cover up that flaw is to put more pressure up front. When we've done that (take a look at the second half of the Washington game) we've been very successful at forcing mistakes & 3 & outs.

If Seymour could be had for a reasonable price, I'd do it in a heartbeat.

I hate to beat a dead horse, but the Texans might want to revisit the Schobel signing & just pay the guy what he wants. That would allow us to move Smith inside to DT where he's been very successful & would benefit the team greatly.

fiasco west
10-17-2010, 05:51 PM
Whatever we do this player needs to make a difference. Not make a horrible defense look great...but just make a horrible defense look average. That's all we need.

I think Aso could do that. I would not worry about the cap right now. I think Haynesworth is a realistic possibility...it's just a matter is if he will come here and give a damn. If he does that I think he makes a huge difference, line him up next to Mario and reap your rewards.

TexansBull
10-17-2010, 05:51 PM
I would never offer AJ. I don't think anyone on this board would too. If anyone does, they need to be suspended.


We don't even have to get Nmandi. See who the top ten corners are, and go after the one you can get for a reasonable price. Then get a DT for another draft pick. Then a safety. If you can get a safety before the DT, no complaints. Do something though. Don't just stand pat and think that after the bye everything is gonna click. Just someone do something. I say that if the FO doesn't, then its playoffs or your job. Simple.

Rey
10-17-2010, 05:51 PM
I could see a first for Asomugha straight up. No other picks. No other players. If the Vikes can get Moss for a 3rd - and he's got HoF numbers - then Asomugha is worth no more than a 1st.

Unless you think we're REEEEEEEALLY desperate.

Besides, with McFadden, Bush, and Michael Bennett on their roster, the Raiders are really fat at RB so throwing in Slaton won't be much of an enticement. I don't think J.J. is either since he's not real polished and the last thing the Raiders need is a project WR to go with their project QBs.

Aso was not too long ago signed to one of the most lucrative contracts ever (albeit by the raiders) and Moss has been traded around like a skanky cheerleader by a football team.

I think Aso is much more valuable than Moss. I don't know what "much more" translates into, but I would not be surprised if he commanded more than a first round pick, which is what the Raiders paid to get Seymour.

Rey
10-17-2010, 05:53 PM
I'd give up a 1 and a 3. Because Kareem Jackson is a nickel corner you use for EXTRA coverage and run support. He ain't a cover corner. Period. And so if you see a true cover corner out there, you say "You know what? It's worth a 1 and a 3 for that. It really is."


I all they wanted was a first and a third, I'd jump on that in a heart beat.

Cjeremy635
10-17-2010, 05:54 PM
I have really been diggin' your posts this pas few weeks.

And I dig this one, too.

ONE awesome cover corner can potentially change things here. If not this season, it would change things NEXT season. If there is one. And if it is an uncapped year, why not?

ONE awesome cover corner could have helped shut down Nicks. Unless, of course, Nicks is going to bud into the next biggest thing this side of #80 in Houston. Because I think that dude is not a fluke. He looks almost uncoverable. Seriously he does.

I'd give up a 1 and a 3. Because Kareem Jackson is a nickel corner you use for EXTRA coverage and run support. He ain't a cover corner. Period. And so if you see a true cover corner out there, you say "You know what? It's worth a 1 and a 3 for that. It really is."

If some General Manager in Texas right now doesn't understand this, and doesn't try to convince McNair of it, then we're screwed. This is where the financial side of things makes me put on the tin foil hat.

I really don't think he'd be good in run support. I know there's a post on here about Kareem leading rookie CBs in tackles, but that kid seems scared to tackle anyone to me. I watched him hard today and he tackles like crap. Sure, he may make a decent one now and then, but he seems like he just ducks his head and makes a half ass attempt. I can't just knock him for that though, the tackling on this whole defense is horrendous. Whoever is the hitting/tackling coach needs to be beat with the ol' bar of soap wrapped in a towel....you know, the scene from Full Metal Jacket. Either that or a can of beans stuck in a tube sock. That would probably get his attention really quick.

HJam72
10-17-2010, 05:55 PM
We only gave up 200 yards passing today. I don't know why you guys are looking for DBs. :sarcasm:

TexansBull
10-17-2010, 05:59 PM
Every single week, an opposing offensive player has a career day. Manning had one of his five best performances in his career against us in a loss. McNabb had his third best game ever against us. Roy Williams had a career game against us in Week 3. Zach Miller had a career day against us in Week 4, and I bet if I look it up, it was probably one of Gradkowski's best games ever as well. Hakeem Nicks wishes he could face us every week. And one of the league's worst passers came in here today and had what is probably one of his best games ever.

So NO - Cassel was not good today.

I think we are saying the same thing. Cassel, one of the worst QBs right now had a good to great day for himself. He scored, I think, his first TD today of the season. Our D is giving medicore player and great players career days. That's why the FO needs to smile and dial. Start the wheeling and dealing.

ObsiWan
10-17-2010, 06:02 PM
I would never offer AJ. I don't think anyone on this board would too. If anyone does, they need to be suspended.


We don't even have to get Nmandi. See who the top ten corners are, and go after the one you can get for a reasonable price. Then get a DT for another draft pick. Then a safety. If you can get a safety before the DT, no complaints. Do something though. Don't just stand pat and think that after the bye everything is gonna click. Just someone do something. I say that if the FO doesn't, then its playoffs or your job. Simple.

That might just be crazy enough to work.
:D
Might want to shop around for a MLB too.

Scooter
10-17-2010, 06:05 PM
give a first for Aso or two 2's straight up. he's the defensive version of andre johnson (too big, too strong, too fast, too smart - too good) and has atleast 4-7 years in him with the way he plays. we're simply not going to find a better player in the draft, so use a pick on BPA who's also at a need position.

honestly we're at the point where i'd like to see us start trading picks for players. for as often as the raiders miss by drafting athletes, they have hit a couple of homeruns. i'd see if i could dazzle al davis with several picks for studs like aso, huff, and others. then turn around and try to recoup some picks from our offense with daniels, jacoby, and slaton.

PockyAF
10-17-2010, 06:06 PM
My virginity.

Cjeremy635
10-17-2010, 06:09 PM
My virginity.

TheRealJoker would gladly give up his celibacy pact!

DerekLee1
10-17-2010, 06:11 PM
A 1st and a 2nd, preferably not in the same year.

Goatcheese
10-17-2010, 06:15 PM
A 1st and a 2nd, preferably not in the same year.

As long as they're the 32nd picks in their respective rounds I think it would be worth it.

Rey
10-17-2010, 06:22 PM
If we are willing to spend a 1st round pick on Kareem Jackson then I can't imagine us being stingy giving up a first for Aso.

Raiders probably want a lot more.

Livid13
10-17-2010, 06:38 PM
Kubiak and co not an option.

Seriously though. Matt Cassell was good today. We need to do something. The D needs to improve, and all options need to be put on the table. Tuesday is the trade deadline. This coach and GM and organization need to build the defense. You cannot just build through the draft. You cannot just build through the free agency. Guess what you can do both. You passed up free agency, so know you have to start trading some draft picks and players. So this is what I am willing to give up:
Draft picks: any of next year except 1 and 2 unless you feel the need postion witha quality player.
Players: Slaton, and if you can get Nmandi, daniels. I know Nmandi contract is outrageous, but playoffs. Sign him to an extension is an uncapped year.

But you need to get a veternan corner, a pass rushing DT, and a safety. Even if that means Albert haynesworth. I know he may be a cancer, but one and done if need be. It doesn't matter. Rick, pick up the phone and don't stop dialing. This Front Office needs to deliver or they are going to be doing the players and fans a disservice. We need to make the playoffs this year, and you need to realize that is what the fans and players want.

Memo to Gary and coaching staff: the room is getting warm.

I am sorry if this maybe emotional and illogical, but I think you guys now what I am driving at. The trade deadline is Tuesday, we have the bye, time to help the players and fans out. Show us what you can do front office. I still have faith.

And question to the board, what so you think this board should do and give up for this season?

I'm sorry, but Albert is not only a "cancer", but plays at his own tempo (one play on, teo plays off). No, no, no, Fat Albert is NOT an option, imo.

Gymrat2005
10-17-2010, 07:14 PM
The Raiders are going to want AJ for aso, BUT i would strive and strive to get a deal done that looked like this.

The Raiders are kinda full at RB, but bush just had a 20 att- 47 yard performance today, and mcfadden has been plagued with injuries.

I would trade Slaton, OD, and a 2nd for aso. And i would trade Slaton and a Second For Seymour.

OR

I would trade SLaton and a 3rd for Huff.

jshabang
10-17-2010, 07:29 PM
I'm sorry, but Albert is not only a "cancer", but plays at his own tempo (one play on, teo plays off). No, no, no, Fat Albert is NOT an option, imo.

puhhh lease with this plays at his own tempo stuff

note: so does mario williams....i have rewatched all the games.....mario takes more plays off then on

secondly like I have said 1000 times haynesworth at 50% is lightyears better than cody and okoye put together....cody and okoye are glorified backups who dont strat on other NFL teams......no push whatsoever

albert commands a doubleteam if he steps on the field period!!!!!......that can not hurt us......and untill we fix that line we are doomed

plus albert can be had fairly cheap.....u take the guy...he comes in u dont like what u see....cut his butt....that simple

LikeMike
10-17-2010, 07:34 PM
The problem with albert is his contract... when the cap is back you have zero flexibility... he is not worth the money he is getting.

Hervoyel
10-17-2010, 07:37 PM
I don't know what you guys are willing to give up, but THEY will demand Andre Johnson.

Do you see how ridiculous this is?

No they will not. They will demand draft picks and high ones. The prospect of trading away the farm the way the Raiders are talking about doing is focused on a wholesale rebuilding of the team. They'll want first day picks and frankly we're in a position to start dealing some of those away for players we simply must have and appear to have not been able to develop.

Namdi, he's a 1 and a 2 or maybe a 1 and a young player like Jacoby Jones. Maybe a pair of 1's if the Raiders are very greedy and they may be but they aren't going to want our 8 year veteran star receiver. They'll take him if we were stupid enough to throw him in there but what they have and what we need can be had for picks and players who make up our depth at the moment.

The Texans need to make a move to finish building this team. We need a DT and Richard Seymour is available. He's gone to the Pro Bowl as a 4-3 DT and he still plays at a high level. We need a shut-down corner like nobody's business and Namdi Asomugha is available. We are across the board one of the youngest teams in the NFL so right now we can afford to send draft picks to someone rebuilding for veteran starters who can help us.

Koolaid Time
10-17-2010, 07:37 PM
By week 6, given the circumstances, I would have expected at least one "Gee I miss Dunta Robinson" post.

But I haven't seen one so far.:hurrah:

Pantherstang84
10-17-2010, 07:39 PM
By week 6, given the circumstances, I would have expected at least one "Gee I miss Dunta Robinson" post.

But I haven't seen one so far.:hurrah:

Sorry. They were in the game day thread but I don't miss him.

Hervoyel
10-17-2010, 07:40 PM
By week 6, given the circumstances, I would have expected at least one "Gee I miss Dunta Robinson" post.

But I haven't seen one so far.:hurrah:

What does that tell you about the feelings Dunta left the average Texans fan with?

gtexan02
10-17-2010, 07:41 PM
As depressing as this is, I really dont think ASO would fluorish here. No matter how good your player is, in a scheme like ours, you're going to look like garbage

Has anyone else noticed how horrible DBs are once theyve spent a few seasons with us?

Demps was a probowl alternate. Where is he now?
F Bennett was the darling of the NFL CB scouts. FO predicted him as THE up and coming guy. Now?
Reeves had an excellent season statistically (by houston standards) his first year with us. Now?
Pollard was the best thing since sliced bread. etc, etc

TexCanada
10-17-2010, 07:52 PM
As depressing as this is, I really dont think ASO would fluorish here. No matter how good your player is, in a scheme like ours, you're going to look like garbage

Has anyone else noticed how horrible DBs are once theyve spent a few seasons with us?

Demps was a probowl alternate. Where is he now?
F Bennett was the darling of the NFL CB scouts. FO predicted him as THE up and coming guy. Now?
Reeves had an excellent season statistically (by houston standards) his first year with us. Now?
Pollard was the best thing since sliced bread. etc, etc

Aso doesn't need a scheme. He IS a scheme. If we had Aso we would just send him out in single man to man coverage against the best WR all game.

Hervoyel
10-17-2010, 08:11 PM
I think if you ad Aso without something being done about the dismal state of our defensive tackles he will have the worst year he's ever seen. Nobody can cover forever and we give opposing QB's literally forever.

Seymour and Asomugha for draft picks and maybe Slaton/Jacoby or hey I dunno Studdard? :)

kiwitexansfan
10-17-2010, 08:13 PM
Aso doesn't need a scheme. He IS a scheme. If we had Aso we would just send him out in single man to man coverage against the best WR all game.

No he wouldn't be. Our coaches believe in their schemes more than in player talents, they would try to force him into a box.

Norg
10-17-2010, 08:14 PM
Shit to fix this D im willing to give up Draft picks MIllions of dollars and PLayers that we have Depth with LIKE Tight ends and others etc etc etc

off the top of my head

Jocbey Jones

David anderson

Owen D .... yes that would sting tho

Kasey Studdered

Butler

TexCanada
10-17-2010, 08:27 PM
No he wouldn't be. Our coaches believe in their schemes more than in player talents, they would try to force him into a box.

If that is the case then trading for Aso would be a terrible move. I don't imagine they would trade for him if that is how they would use him.

Scooter
10-17-2010, 08:36 PM
any coach that cant figure out how to use Aso shouldnt be part of football. even with the raiders using him on a side most years, they've been able to eliminate 1/3 of the field.

wagonhed
10-17-2010, 08:42 PM
Are we seriously talking about trading for Nnamdi Asomugha? What? How is that even remotely possible, or likely?

NitroGSXR
10-17-2010, 08:52 PM
I'll tell you the truth. I'd like them to dangle Cushing out there and see what bites. He has looked very pedestrian thus far this season. Sell before him value drops. Shawnee Merriman v.2 looming after two rather disappointing showings.

Now we lost DeMeco so that won't happen.

Scooter
10-17-2010, 09:03 PM
I'll tell you the truth. I'd like them to dangle Cushing out there and see what bites. He has looked very pedestrian thus far this season. Sell before him value drops. Shawnee Merriman v.2 looming after two rather disappointing showings.

Now we lost DeMeco so that won't happen.

unlike merriman, cushing is a workout warrior and by accounts is actually bigger, stronger, and faster with the added time off to work out. rusty sure, but as i understood it his failed test was before last season and wouldnt have affected his performance anyways.

ObsiWan
10-17-2010, 09:05 PM
No they will not. They will demand draft picks and high ones. The prospect of trading away the farm the way the Raiders are talking about doing is focused on a wholesale rebuilding of the team. They'll want first day picks and frankly we're in a position to start dealing some of those away for players we simply must have and appear to have not been able to develop.

Namdi, he's a 1 and a 2 or maybe a 1 and a young player like Jacoby Jones. Maybe a pair of 1's if the Raiders are very greedy and they may be but they aren't going to want our 8 year veteran star receiver. They'll take him if we were stupid enough to throw him in there but what they have and what we need can be had for picks and players who make up our depth at the moment.

The Texans need to make a move to finish building this team. We need a DT and Richard Seymour is available. He's gone to the Pro Bowl as a 4-3 DT and he still plays at a high level. We need a shut-down corner like nobody's business and Namdi Asomugha is available. We are across the board one of the youngest teams in the NFL so right now we can afford to send draft picks to someone rebuilding for veteran starters who can help us.

Where did you read/see this? They gave up a 1st for Seymour (and trust me, I'd LOVE to have him) and just gave Asomugha a new contract (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nnamdi_Asomugha)
On February 19, 2009 the Raiders re-signed Asomugha to a complex three-year deal that makes him the highest paid defensive back in NFL history. The first two years, worth $28.5 million, are fully guaranteed. In the third year of the contract, if Oakland wants to keep Asomugha, it must pay him the average of the top five highest-paid quarterbacks or $16.875 million, whichever is higher. If the Raiders fail to pick up the option, Asomugha will become a free agent with Oakland not having the ability to tag him again
so where did you (or anyone else) read/see that either guy is on the trading block??

Kulluminatii
10-17-2010, 09:07 PM
Are we seriously talking about trading for Nnamdi Asomugha? What? How is that even remotely possible, or likely?

http://www.sbreport.net/raider_news/008/5010.html

Its been reported that Oakland is having a firesale...again. Last year Al pulled this stunt as well, and I don't believe we were able to trade anyone. I'm hoping Nnamdi is off-limits, but if someone offers something outrageous...Al would be stupid to not at least consider it. If we were to trade Aso, I'd want a first this year & a 4th/5th and a second next year at the least.

midway
10-17-2010, 09:16 PM
If we were to trade Aso, I'd want a first this year & a 4th/5th and a second next year at the least.

If that would be all it took I'd jump on that in a heartbeat.

Hervoyel
10-17-2010, 09:16 PM
http://www.sbreport.net/raider_news/008/5010.html

Its been reported that Oakland is having a firesale...again. Last year Al pulled this stunt as well, and I don't believe we were able to trade anyone. I'm hoping Nnamdi is off-limits, but if someone offers something outrageous...Al would be stupid to not at least consider it. If we were to trade Aso, I'd want a first this year & a 4th/5th and a second next year at the least.

Granted you're a fan, not a Raiders executive but this is exactly what I was talking about. If this is indeed a house cleaning and rebuilding then the Raiders will not be wanting players nearly as much as draft picks and their ideal trading partners are young teams that have already finished building but still need a few pieces that the Raiders have. Teams have a collective shelf life and the Texans best player is an eight year veteran WR. Everybody else on this team that truly matters is 2006 draft or newer with the exception of Schaub. QB longevity is generally longer than a lot of other positions so set him aside for a moment and consider that we have a young team with excellent depth at a number of spots but have come up empty in our attempts to get a defensive tackle who was worth a damn. We also have a young secondary that needs a leader who can lock down his side and let whatever passes for a FS on this team help the other corner. The answer is obvious.

Send Al a bunch of picks, fill the two needs, start stopping people instead of giving away (or nearly giving away) games.

Kulluminatii
10-17-2010, 09:25 PM
Granted you're a fan, not a Raiders executive but this is exactly what I was talking about. If this is indeed a house cleaning and rebuilding then the Raiders will not be wanting players nearly as much as draft picks and their ideal trading partners are young teams that have already finished building but still need a few pieces that the Raiders have.

Yup, you've pretty much nailed it. We have pieces of a decent team spread around, but adding aging vets won't help us nearly as much as some draft picks would. I'm sure Al sees it that way too. The Raiders need to blow up their o-line & secondary and build through the draft.

Scooter
10-17-2010, 09:42 PM
that "house cleaning" is why i'd like to see the texans dazzle the raiders with draft picks. we cant sell the farm, but we have the youth and depth in place to where key components for picks over the next 2 years would be almost safer than drafting. aso, huff, seymour, and wimbley (or any combination of) would instantly put the texans into or closer to the more elite teams as well as add the veteran presense we so desperately need.

normally (and for most teams) i'd be against anything so dramatic, but again this is where the texans' youth comes into play. we cant get younger each season, we need to space our replacements and acquiring veterans in exchange for picks is a way to improve in every way. each guy mentioned is under contract, and we still have assets on offense who can be traded if we felt the need to acquire additional picks.

DX-TEX
10-17-2010, 09:46 PM
Slaton and a 3rd round pick for Haynesworth.

TexCanada
10-17-2010, 09:47 PM
Another reason I would be willing to give up the draft picks is because we have Tate and Barwin coming back from injury next year, which is basically like an additional top 2 draft picks coming in and already knowing the playbook. We can survive without top picks next year. Smithiak needs to make something happen or we will have an extremely tough time making the playoffs this year. We need some quality vets on this team to compliment our young talent.

El Tejano
10-17-2010, 09:52 PM
Shit to fix this D im willing to give up Draft picks MIllions of dollars and PLayers that we have Depth with LIKE Tight ends and others etc etc etc

off the top of my head

Jocbey Jones

David anderson

Owen D .... yes that would sting tho

Kasey Studdered

Butler

I'd take Jacoby off the list. Our offense looked so much better with him in there. He didn't have alot of grabs but he really did work the seams and that se Andre free.

Owen was back to his oldself today. Stay tuned with that guy.

TexansBull
10-17-2010, 10:08 PM
http://espn.go.com/blog/afceast/post/_/id/20044/07-draft-class-nearly-purged-from-afc-east

Only six of 30 AFC East draftees from 2007 still are with the team that drafted them: two New York Jets (http://espn.go.com/nfl/team/_/name/nyj/new-york-jets), two Miami Dolphins (http://espn.go.com/nfl/team/_/name/mia/miami-dolphins), one New England Patriot and one Bill. (See chart below.)



Buffalo Bills

Round (Pick)PlayerNotes1st (12)RB Marshawn LynchTraded for 2011 4th-rounder2nd (34)LB Paul PoslusznyStill on team3rd (92)QB Trent EdwardsReleased 20104th (111)RB Dwayne WrightReleased 20086th (184)DB John WendlingReleased 20107th (222)TE Derek SchoumanReleased 20107th (239)DE C.J. Ah YouReleased 2007
Miami Dolphins

Round (Pick)PlayerNotes1st (9)WR Ted GinnTraded for 2010 5th-rounder2nd (40)QB John BeckReleased 20092nd (60)C Samson SateleTraded for 2009 6th-rounder3rd (71)RB Lorenzo BookerTraded for 2008 4th-rounder4th (108)DT Paul SoliaiStill on team6th (181)FB Reagan MauiaReleased 20086th (199)G Drew MorminoReleased 20087th (219)LB Kelvin SmithReleased 20097th (225)P Brandon FieldsStill on team7th (238)DE Abraham WrightReleased 2008
New England Patriots

Round (Pick)PlayerNotes1st (24)S Brandon MeriweatherStill on team4th (127)DT Kareem BrownReleased 20075th (171)OT Clint OldenburgReleased 20076th (180)LB Justin RogersReleased 20076th (202)DB Mike RichardsonReleased 20096th (208)RB Justise HairstonReleased 20076th (209)OT Corey HilliardReleased 20077th (211)LB Oscar LuaReleased 20087th (247)G Mike ElginReleased 2007

Jets have Reeves and Sanchez still
That may be an anomaly, or it may not. This is just proof that the draft can be a crap shot, and why not use the picks for veterans at the top of thier game?

I would do this for Namdi:
A one this year, and a four next - thats still rich

Seymore:
A three or four

Some safety out there:
A four or five

We would still have depth and a young team. Give Kareem a year. Hopefully resign a Namdi to a real NFL contract, lock down Seymore, and all is right in the world.

I can dream still right?

NitroGSXR
10-17-2010, 10:20 PM
I'd take Jacoby off the list. Our offense looked so much better with him in there. He didn't have alot of grabs but he really did work the seams and that se Andre free.

Owen was back to his oldself today. Stay tuned with that guy.

I have been pretty anti-Jacoby but I have to say he's turning me around lately. I still wince a little when he gets the ball but I've got a heckuva lot more confidence in him. Today showed that he was sorely missed last week.

El Tejano
10-17-2010, 10:25 PM
I have been pretty anti-Jacoby but I have to say he's turning me around lately. I still wince a little when he gets the ball but I've got a heckuva lot more confidence in him. Today showed that he was sorely missed last week.

Also, watching the game, I saw a player that is part of the solution here. On the sidelines he was the only teammate standing on the bench getting the crowd to stand up and cheer to help our defense. And when we won he rushed the field as if we won the Super Bowl. That's the little things that make me keep players.

Hervoyel
10-17-2010, 11:15 PM
Yup, you've pretty much nailed it. We have pieces of a decent team spread around, but adding aging vets won't help us nearly as much as some draft picks would. I'm sure Al sees it that way too. The Raiders need to blow up their o-line & secondary and build through the draft.

And that also fits the Texans well I think because for a team to not hurt itself badly in a deal like this they have to be young enough and successful enough in the late rounds to not miss those picks. We're seemingly set at positions like LB, WR, RB, TE, OL, and DE and adding a great DT would make us solid at DT, adding Aso would make us set at CB with the best of everybody else plus Aso. We could then spend a couple of years living light on day one of the draft and getting our moneys worth out of Rick Smith on day two. Find those day two gems Rick. You're a genius right? Get to it.

It comes down to "Are you still building or rebuilding? If the answer is "no" then are you a couple of players away from being where you want to be? If that answer is "yes" then go get the damn players and set your sights on the playoffs. If we're still building in the 5th year of Gary Kubiak's reign then I don't expect us to ever finish building or rebuilding or whatever we're doing. It's time to go get players at the positions where we haven't had success finding playmakers. That's not crazy talk, that's what nearly every successful team does. They bring in that guy who can help them and never pay more than they can afford for him. A shutdown corner like Aso is worth his weight in gold because he's the real deal. If someone is fortunate enough to have him and needs to rebuild (i.e. "cash him in for value") then you pay what he costs because he's still young enough to be our starting corner for the remaining time this group of players will be in their prime. He makes your whole secondary better by being back there. Seymour wouldn't cost near what Aso costs but he is the DT we have been missing and failing to draft over and over again. He's 31 but it's not unreasonable to expect him to play at a high level until he is 34-35. Those guys (The truly good ones) play into their mid 30's on a regular basis. Pat Williams is 37 and just now slowing down.

Seymour or someone like him would make Mario and Antoine Smith into monsters. We can't find a DT worth a damn in the draft so I'd trade for one and if Oakland is interested in parting with Seymour then I want to know what he costs.

beerlover
10-17-2010, 11:40 PM
And that also fits the Texans well I think because for a team to not hurt itself badly in a deal like this they have to be young enough and successful enough in the late rounds to not miss those picks. We're seemingly set at positions like LB, WR, RB, TE, OL, and DE and adding a great DT would make us solid at DT, adding Aso would make us set at CB with the best of everybody else plus Aso. We could then spend a couple of years living light on day one of the draft and getting our moneys worth out of Rick Smith on day two. Find those day two gems Rick. You're a genius right? Get to it.

It comes down to "Are you still building or rebuilding? If the answer is "no" then are you a couple of players away from being where you want to be? If that answer is "yes" then go get the damn players and set your sights on the playoffs. If we're still building in the 5th year of Gary Kubiak's reign then I don't expect us to ever finish building or rebuilding or whatever we're doing. It's time to go get players at the positions where we haven't had success finding playmakers. That's not crazy talk, that's what nearly every successful team does. They bring in that guy who can help them and never pay more than they can afford for him. A shutdown corner like Aso is worth his weight in gold because he's the real deal. If someone is fortunate enough to have him and needs to rebuild (i.e. "cash him in for value") then you pay what he costs because he's still young enough to be our starting corner for the remaining time this group of players will be in their prime. He makes your whole secondary better by being back there. Seymour wouldn't cost near what Aso costs but he is the DT we have been missing and failing to draft over and over again. He's 31 but it's not unreasonable to expect him to play at a high level until he is 34-35. Those guys (The truly good ones) play into their mid 30's on a regular basis. Pat Williams is 37 and just now slowing down.

Seymour or someone like him would make Mario and Antoine Smith into monsters. We can't find a DT worth a damn in the draft so I'd trade for one and if Oakland is interested in parting with Seymour then I want to know what he costs.

if you have to ask you probably can't afford it :pirate:

Dash
10-17-2010, 11:43 PM
In this regard, it's also impossible to rule out the Houston Texans. Their pass rush (and thus their pass defense) is lacking firepower, they run a 4-3 defense (Haynesworth's preferred attack), and Redskins coach Mike Shanahan and Texans coach Gary Kubiak have an extensive history of working together. With the Redskins thin at running back and Steve Slaton slipping out of the starting role in Houston, maybe a Haynesworth-for-Slaton-plus-a-pick deal could come together between now and Tuesday.

If nothing else, the possibility of a trade to the Texans should make the Titans even more interested in working something out. Otherwise, Haynesworth could return to the division -- but with another team.

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/10/17/despite-deactivation-haynesworth-thinks-hes-ready-to-play-tonight/

JB
10-17-2010, 11:46 PM
http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2010/10/17/despite-deactivation-haynesworth-thinks-hes-ready-to-play-tonight/

Didn't you just post this exact same thing in another thread?

Dash
10-17-2010, 11:48 PM
Didn't you just post this exact same thing in another thread?

Yeah I didn't know which to post it. =/

BigBull17
10-18-2010, 08:35 AM
The move I would have made - and would still make if possible - would be to get Richard Seymour. Al Davis is not going to give up Asomugha at any reasonable price.

I could see this. Could see Slaton for Haynesworth too. Kyle loves him some Slaton.

TexansFanatic
10-18-2010, 08:58 AM
The Texans have an embarrassment of riches at the TE position.

I don't know whom I'd miss more----OD or Dreessen. But either is expendable.

Slaton's trade value isn't very high. He's almost a forgotten man and other teams aren't going to pay much for a guy the other team barely uses.

Hervoyel
10-18-2010, 09:54 AM
The Texans have an embarrassment of riches at the TE position.

I don't know whom I'd miss more----OD or Dreessen. But either is expendable.

Slaton's trade value isn't very high. He's almost a forgotten man and other teams aren't going to pay much for a guy the other team barely uses.

Plus almost all the recent film of him shows him returning kickoffs. He does this poorly and appears hesitant which makes him look slow. Not the best way to show off your trade-bait running back

Hervoyel
10-18-2010, 09:58 AM
I could see this. Could see Slaton for Haynesworth too. Kyle loves him some Slaton.


Can you imagine a defensive line that consisted of

Mario Williams, Richard Seymour, Albert Haynesworth, and Antonio Smith?

I mean, the cost would be insane and the chances that it would actually end up looking as good as it sounds are slim but the mental picture is almost worth the price of admission alone.

BigBull17
10-18-2010, 09:59 AM
Can you imagine a defensive line that consisted of

Mario Williams, Richard Seymour, Albert Haynesworth, and Antonio Smith?

I mean, the cost would be insane and the chances that it would actually end up looking as good as it sounds are slim but the mental picture is almost worth the price of admission alone.

That would be nasty. Also need to look for a guy who plays will on a bad team that we can give a pick for.