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gary
10-12-2010, 04:14 PM
Matt is not playing as well as he played last season that is clear. Might it have something to do with having a new OC? I am not sure but there is a problem right now with the O not being quite the same. Matt forced some passes last week and did not seem to be seeing the whole field. Maybe Kyle did have a lot to do with the progress of Matt Shaub and was a large part the thrills Matt provided in 2009. I still believe in Matt but he just has not regained his 09 form and I am wondering why. The pass blocking is not that great either which is not helping Matt of course.

silvrhand
10-12-2010, 04:19 PM
Matt is not playing as well as he played last season that is clear. Might it have something to do with having a new OC? I am not sure but there is a problem right now with the O not being quite the same. Matt forced some passes last week and did not seem to be seeing the whole field. Maybe Kyle did have a lot to do with the progress of Matt Shaub and was a large part the thrills Matt provided in 2009. I still believe in Matt but he just has not regained his 09 form and I am wondering why. The pass blocking is not that great either which is not helping Matt of course.

Could be, I'm sure someone should ask Kubiak this, but you know how that goes.

thunderkyss
10-12-2010, 04:34 PM
Before the Washington game, I didn't give lil Shanahan much credit at all for our offense. I always thought he was Kubiak's puppet. After the plays Washington put on us, I was wondering if Kubiak was holding the little guy back.

I think this year, the issue may be that Kubiak has even less influence on offense than before, because he has a Coordinator he trusts. I don't know if Kubiak should take the reigns on offense just yet, he's the HC now, and he's got issues on the other side of the ball that needs his attention.

I still have faith in GK, but he's got his work cut out for him this season.

gary
10-12-2010, 04:41 PM
I will be frank with everyone I do not have faith in Kubiak.

Hervoyel
10-12-2010, 04:48 PM
I think we all know what the Texans are missing.

http://i215.photobucket.com/albums/cc272/Hervoyel/bull_balls.jpg

gary
10-12-2010, 04:53 PM
I think we all know what the Texans are missing.

http://i215.photobucket.com/albums/cc272/Hervoyel/bull_balls.jpg
I have to agree with this.

awtysst
10-12-2010, 04:57 PM
I think we all know what the Texans are missing.

http://i215.photobucket.com/albums/cc272/Hervoyel/bull_balls.jpg

http://phoenix.fanster.com/diamondbacks/files/2009/05/tanaka.jpg

Kaiser Toro
10-12-2010, 05:04 PM
We do not miss Shanahan, I am 100% certain.

gary
10-12-2010, 05:33 PM
We do not miss Shanahan, I am 100% certain.
Yhea, but you are not going to tell me everything is the same.

Texecutioner
10-12-2010, 05:37 PM
No, the Texans are not missing Shanny.

These are the same Texans we saw over the last two seasons. A team that is inconsistent that will play for one good half and one bad half. A team that lacks toughness and grit against physical teams with a good pass rush. These same problems were here when Shanny was here.

gary
10-12-2010, 05:42 PM
No, the Texans are not missing Shanny.

These are the same Texans we saw over the last two seasons. A team that is inconsistent that will play for one good half and one bad half. A team that lacks toughness and grit against physical teams with a good pass rush. These same problems were here when Shanny was here.
Well, in both losses both the D and the O has played poorly.

scourge
10-12-2010, 05:52 PM
http://phoenix.fanster.com/diamondbacks/files/2009/05/tanaka.jpg

You have no... mawwbews!

Double Barrel
10-12-2010, 05:53 PM
No, the Texans are not missing Shanny.

These are the same Texans we saw over the last two seasons. A team that is inconsistent that will play for one good half and one bad half. A team that lacks toughness and grit against physical teams with a good pass rush. These same problems were here when Shanny was here.

yep. Kubiball at it's finest.

Teams take the personae of their head coach. This has been true in football for a long time with few exceptions. Kubiak has an "awe shucks" demeanor and the team reflects that attitude.

I like the man, but I just want to see more fire in this team on a consistent basis, and that, in my humble opinion, starts at the top.

HJam72
10-12-2010, 06:01 PM
Schaub does look bad, but I think a lot of that is big NFC East DLs getting too close way too often. How do you stop it? You motivate your freaking offense before the game and run the frickin' ball! Maybe we can't pass block worth a darn against NFC East teams, but we should be able to run it, with some EFFORT!

dtran04
10-12-2010, 06:05 PM
Funny a couple weeks ago, people thought Dennison was the savior of the offense and fixed the running game.....hmm :)

gary
10-12-2010, 06:15 PM
The running game is not the everything in football and that was not working so much on Sunday either.

ATXtexanfan
10-12-2010, 06:16 PM
No, the Texans are not missing Shanny.

These are the same Texans we saw over the last two seasons. A team that is inconsistent that will play for one good half and one bad half. A team that lacks toughness and grit against physical teams with a good pass rush. These same problems were here when Shanny was here.

yup

HJam72
10-12-2010, 06:28 PM
Well, the running game is better, but it's gonna take some extra effort against certain teams. Our offense saw how hard it was to block those guys, realized it was a non-conference game, and laid down. It ticks me off.

'Course they gotta put up with a D that's setting a record for pass yardage...

Kaiser Toro
10-12-2010, 06:31 PM
Funny a couple weeks ago, people thought Dennison was the savior of the offense and fixed the running game.....hmm :)

I saw some things the first couple of games that were eerily similar to the old Bronco teams. I think he has had a big impact on the running game, and am beginning to feel that Brown's suspension is having a significant impact on the running game as well.

Since our 2-0 start this has happened:
- Brown suspended
- AJ is injured
- Jacoby is injured
- Foster is disciplined

Significant hits to our offense - personnel and timing of our passing routes. Unfortunately, we are not like solid teams where one unit can take up the slack for the other. Shanwow would not be able to help us on that side of the ball.

He is going to be in this league for a long while, but at this place in time losing him is way down the list of our collective troubles.

HJam72
10-12-2010, 06:35 PM
One thing I haven't said yet is that our receivers, etc. dropping passes (although I ragged the Hell out of them for it) MAY be partly because Schaub MIGHT have been throwing them too soon in their routes when they weren't expecting it, because of the pressure. We needed to establish the run in this game, and we should be able to run at least decently against every team in the NFL, and we just didn't (lack of heart). It's not like we don't have a RB who can find the lanes. We sure can't use that excuse anymore.

And yeah, not having Brown is hurting the running game some as far as called plays to the left side. I think we can still get cut-backs to the left though.

Texecutioner
10-12-2010, 06:37 PM
Schaub does look bad, but I think a lot of that is big NFC East DLs getting too close way too often. How do you stop it? You motivate your freaking offense before the game and run the frickin' ball! Maybe we can't pass block worth a darn against NFC East teams, but we should be able to run it, with some EFFORT!

Schaub isn't looking near as bad as many people think. What people have to understand about Matt Schaub is that he's a carbon copy of Kurt Warner. Both of them are only effective QB's that can play well if they have great pass blocking. Schaub is slow as hell and pretty soft just like Warner was, but has a pretty nice arm that can get his guys the ball if he has protection. In both losses this season Schaub was blitzed and was hit a all day long, and Schaub is like a deer in headlights when the blitz is coming. He just panicks and tries to get rid of it if he can, because the guy has cement shoes and can't out run defensive players.

If the Texans can't protect Schaub and give him ample time to find his receivers, then you can expect to see some very ****ty play from our QB. He's not mobile one bit, and he's a one dimensional pocket passer. He has to have great protection. If you give it to him, then he'll put up huge numbers. If you don't then he'll be very inconsistent and will most likely have a lot of fumbles and forced throws.

HJam72
10-12-2010, 06:40 PM
Schaub isn't looking near as bad as many people think. What people have to understand about Matt Schaub is that he's a carbon copy of Kurt Warner. Both of them are only effective QB's that can play well if they have great pass blocking. Schaub is slow as hell and pretty soft just like Warner was, but has a pretty nice arm that can get his guys the ball if he has protection. In both losses this season Schaub was blitzed and was hit a all day long, and Schaub is like a deer in headlights when the blitz is coming. He just panicks and tries to get rid of it if he can, because the guy has cement shoes and can't out run defensive players.

If the Texans can't protect Schaub and give him ample time to find his receivers, then you can expect to see some very ****ty play from our QB. He's not mobile one bit, and he's a one dimensional pocket passer. He has to have great protection. If you give it to him, then he'll put up huge numbers. If you don't then he'll be very inconsistent and will most likely have a lot of fumbles and forced throws.

All of that is why we needed to man up and run the ball a lot, starting early. You're right and Schaub isn't perfect, but we are supposed to be a team that can run against anybody, because we are a ZBS team and have a RB now. Heck, we've got 2 decent ones backing him up. If Kubiaks team can't run even with a good RB, his whole system is a joke.

HJam72
10-12-2010, 06:43 PM
I just think the O wasn't motivated to start this game and the D wasn't prepped or used properly. The D's problems are somewhat excusable and somewhat not, due to lack of experience, but then how BAD can you be? The O just didn't fight hard enough from the start and that really bugs me. Once they got behind and had to pass a lot....pressure all day long. These NFC East teams have big linemen that don't stunt to get to you. The whole pocket just shrinks 'till they're too freaking close, because they will manhandle your pass blockers. They're somewhat slow, but they're big and you can't stop them. You gotta run it.

gary
10-12-2010, 06:45 PM
In the win over Washington he still was hit for most of the game.

HJam72
10-12-2010, 06:49 PM
In the win over Washington he still was hit for most of the game.

Yeah, I just think it wasn't as bad. The Giants seemed to always be so freaking close and holding arms up in his way. Redskins did get pressure too though.

Plus, we ran better against them. At least better anyway.

HJam72
10-12-2010, 06:51 PM
I think Schaub has improved greatly as far as his toughness, but he still can't run, and of course he can't throw the ball with DLs standing right in front of him holding their arms up. So, he hurries his throws (sometimes, I think, maybe) and hits receivers that maybe aren't expecting it yet. Or maybe they just smoked something before the game like I accused all the skills players. I don't know.

gary
10-12-2010, 06:53 PM
Yeah, I just think it wasn't as bad. The Giants seemed to always be so freaking close and holding arms up in his way. Redskins did get pressure too though.

Plus, we ran better against them. At least better anyway.
Gary is the peice that should change if you care to have my honest opinion.

awtysst
10-12-2010, 06:59 PM
Gary is the peice that should change if you care to have my honest opinion.

No gary, don't get changed, we like having you around here :)

gary
10-12-2010, 07:01 PM
No gary, don't get changed, we like having you around here :)
LOL, I wish I were the coach.

Texecutioner
10-12-2010, 07:04 PM
All of that is why we needed to man up and run the ball a lot, starting early. You're right and Schaub isn't perfect, but we are supposed to be a team that can run against anybody, because we are a ZBS team and have a RB now. Heck, we've got 2 decent ones backing him up. If Kubiaks team can't run even with a good RB, his whole system is a joke.

Well even if you're a good running team that doesn't mean that you'll be able to pound the ball against every team, but I do agree that we should be able to run against the majority of them.

I wasn't trying to knock Schaub either, but I was just trying to state that he's not a mobile QB that can make plays with his feet to buy extra time. He's strictly a pocket passer and he needs really good pass blocking to be effective. When Warner didn't get it after a few years in St. Louis he was horrible. That's also why he stunk it up in NY as well. Warner had to have great pass blocking or he was awful. Schaub is the same way.

gary
10-12-2010, 07:07 PM
Well even if you're a good running team that doesn't mean that you'll be able to pound the ball against every team, but I do agree that we should be able to run against the majority of them.

I wasn't trying to knock Schaub either, but I was just trying to state that he's not a mobile QB that can make plays with his feet to buy extra time. He's strictly a pocket passer and he needs really good pass blocking to be effective. When Warner didn't get it after a few years in St. Louis he was horrible. That's also why he stunk it up in NY as well. Warner had to have great pass blocking or he was awful. Schaub is the same way.
So, you'd say the problem is the pass blocking?

HJam72
10-12-2010, 07:15 PM
We're not built for great pass-blocking. We're built for play-action pass after running a lot. I assume that's part of why you don't like Kubiak.

Texanmike02
10-12-2010, 07:43 PM
One thing I haven't said yet is that our receivers, etc. dropping passes (although I ragged the Hell out of them for it) MAY be partly because Schaub MIGHT have been throwing them too soon in their routes when they weren't expecting it, because of the pressure. We needed to establish the run in this game, and we should be able to run at least decently against every team in the NFL, and we just didn't (lack of heart). It's not like we don't have a RB who can find the lanes. We sure can't use that excuse anymore.

And yeah, not having Brown is hurting the running game some as far as called plays to the left side. I think we can still get cut-backs to the left though.

I will say that the drop that AJ had was on his back shoulder. AJ should have caught that pass but it should have been something that AJ caught and kept running with. Instead he's forced to try to make some awkward back shoulder grab. If Schaub puts it where its supposed to be Andre is cutting across the field at full speed...

That was a bad pass, and quite honestly that has been typical of Schaub this season. There was one to Daniels that was about 2 feet too low... if it gets over the LB (I think) its a 40 yard pass... Instead the LB gets a hand on it and we're looking at 2nd and 10 (or whatever the d/d was at the time)

I think some of this has to do with the pressure but I wonder if mechanically Schaub doesn't have some weird kink to work out. I have no idea but go back and look at the "drops" by the wr... yeah if you get two hands on it you should catch it... that is true... but if you have to jump 3 feet in the air while twisting away from the defender and getting exposed like a blond on prom night...

I'm just saying.

Lol Dale... I'm volunteering you to do another check. I'm so helpful at suggesting articles for others to write :D




Mike

gary
10-12-2010, 08:27 PM
I just notice a difference that's all I'm saying and figured some of you all know more than me about certain blocking and overall play calling. Thanks.

Texan_Bill
10-12-2010, 08:41 PM
Re: Texans Missing Shanny?

Really? I'm not sure Shanny was ever party to a win over the Colts... Just sayin'!!

Hookem Horns
10-13-2010, 12:14 AM
I think we all know what the Texans are missing.

http://i215.photobucket.com/albums/cc272/Hervoyel/bull_balls.jpg

Would that come in the form of this?

http://www.mouthpiecesports.com/blogmedia/2009/11/bill-cowher.jpg

Goatcheese
10-13-2010, 05:45 AM
I don't think they miss little Shanny at all.

If you watch a lot of the replays we have guys running wide open all over the place and Schaub is either missing them or just doesn't have time to find them with all the heat he is taking. When he gets comfortable and builds rhythm he picks a defense apart. He hasn't had that comfort much this season.

Because of the success of our running game in exploiting cutback lanes we're seeing defenses defend the back side to take that away. Ironically the effectiveness of the running game is killing one of our most dangerous weapons in the naked boot that absolutely killed teams last year. Now he fakes the ball to the back and the guy who is assigned to watch the cutback is standing in perfect position to attack Schaub before he's had any time to look over the defense.

Grforces
10-13-2010, 11:15 PM
Do you guys think the offense isent as explosive on the passing side because we lost kyle of Offensive Cordinator?

Norg
10-13-2010, 11:20 PM
Uhhh no


Dennis and Kubes were calling plays when Kyle was in middle school LOL

Wolf6151
10-13-2010, 11:23 PM
No. I didn't think that little Shanny was all that good of an OC. I think our O-line is average at best, we've got some key injuries and suspensions, and Schaub is feeling the pressure due to the lack of a quality O-line and thus getting rid of the ball before passing routes fully develop. I think that Dennison has been good for our run game but he hasn't got the hang of our passing game yet so play calling is suffering.

kiwitexansfan
10-14-2010, 03:25 AM
Already been a thread on this with a huge consensus that he isn't missed.

HJam72
10-14-2010, 05:38 AM
AJ: can't run full speed.

JJ: not playing right now.

AD: on IR.

KW: not a deep threat to begin with.

8 defenders in the box.

Can't run.

WE LOSE.


The End.

BigBull17
10-14-2010, 07:41 AM
AJ: can't run full speed.

JJ: not playing right now.

AD: on IR.

KW: not a deep threat to begin with.

8 defenders in the box.

Can't run.

WE LOSE.


The End.

Add to that OD not 100% and not using Dreessen as much as they should.

drewmar74
10-14-2010, 08:17 AM
AJ: can't run full speed.

JJ: not playing right now.

AD: on IR.

KW: not a deep threat to begin with.

8 defenders in the box.

Can't run.

WE LOSE.


The End.

Add to that OD not 100% and not using Dreessen as much as they should.

IMO, there's your thread. Period. Go get a cup of coffee because this mystery is solved.

Texan_Bill
10-14-2010, 08:19 AM
AJ: can't run full speed.

JJ: not playing right now.

AD: on IR.

KW: not a deep threat to begin with.

8 defenders in the box.

Can't run.

WE LOSE.


The End.

Add to that OD not 100% and not using Dreessen as much as they should.

/End thread!

thunderkyss
10-14-2010, 08:39 AM
AJ: can't run full speed.

JJ: not playing right now.

AD: on IR.

KW: not a deep threat to begin with.

8 defenders in the box.

Can't run.

WE LOSE.


The End.

OD looked very, very good out there Sunday. That should be all we need to beat 8 in the box.

With OD & Dressen, it should be impossible for the defense to figure out who will release into the pattern. We should be having a field day on LBs... like other teams are having on us.

Double Barrel
10-14-2010, 10:16 AM
AJ: can't run full speed.

JJ: not playing right now.

AD: on IR.

KW: not a deep threat to begin with.

8 defenders in the box.

Can't run.

WE LOSE.


The End.

Well, at least we've got our excuses lined up for mediocrity, lack of heart, and not showing up. That should give McNair plenty of ammo to justify extending the head coach's contract for another decade. :winky:

thunderkyss
10-14-2010, 10:20 AM
Well, at least we've got our excuses lined up for mediocrity, lack of heart, and not showing up. That should give McNair plenty of ammo to justify extending the head coach's contract for another decade. :winky:

I think he's already shown he doesn't need much of a reason at all. just "want to"

HJam72
10-14-2010, 10:21 AM
Well, at least we've got our excuses lined up for mediocrity, lack of heart, and not showing up. That should give McNair plenty of ammo to justify extending the head coach's contract for another decade. :winky:

AJ's supposed to be doing better and JJ may be back for Sunday's game.

Double Barrel
10-14-2010, 10:22 AM
I think he's already shown he doesn't need much of a reason at all. just "want to"

yep, this is true. It's good to be the boss. :bigboss:

scourge
10-14-2010, 11:28 AM
Our offense lit it up last year, passing wise. Schaub's protection was good, but the running production sucked. However, Foster wasn't the feature back until the end of the season and performed well when given the chance. He was given the ability to be more than just a puppet to Kubiak last year, and did well.

The other side is that now our line looks much better at run blocking and Foster appears to have much better vision and patience than our previous backs.

With lil Shanny at least we'd put more points on the board to try and offset the pathetic defense.

I'll give Dennison this year to see what he is capable of doing with time, but as of now I really would rather we kept Shanny.

I'm in the minority, though, so maybe I'm wrong. Against me is the fact that the Skins are 7th in passing yardage to our 14th, but they are 25th in rushing yards compared to our 5th. Total offensive yards they rank 15th while we are 6th, so the stats are visibly against me.

gary
10-14-2010, 12:11 PM
Shanny just was not going to stay once daddy got a new job period.

BigBull17
10-14-2010, 01:39 PM
Our offense lit it up last year, passing wise. Schaub's protection was good, but the running production sucked. However, Foster wasn't the feature back until the end of the season and performed well when given the chance. He was given the ability to be more than just a puppet to Kubiak last year, and did well.

The other side is that now our line looks much better at run blocking and Foster appears to have much better vision and patience than our previous backs.

With lil Shanny at least we'd put more points on the board to try and offset the pathetic defense.

I'll give Dennison this year to see what he is capable of doing with time, but as of now I really would rather we kept Shanny.

I'm in the minority, though, so maybe I'm wrong. Against me is the fact that the Skins are 7th in passing yardage to our 14th, but they are 25th in rushing yards compared to our 5th. Total offensive yards they rank 15th while we are 6th, so the stats are visibly against me.

Our passing yards have dropped off due to our emerging run game. Until last weeks awful game, we were first, I think.

scourge
10-14-2010, 02:21 PM
Our passing yards have dropped off due to our emerging run game. Until last weeks awful game, we were first, I think.

He's been getting hit more this year than last, even with the drop off due to the emerging run game. Just sayin'

BigBull17
10-14-2010, 02:24 PM
He's been getting hit more this year than last, even with the drop off due to the emerging run game. Just sayin'

True.

thunderkyss
10-14-2010, 04:58 PM
Shanny just was not going to stay once daddy got a new job period.

It's not like Shanny had a choice.

Kubiak originally wanted Dennison to be his offensive coordinator back in 2006. Shanahan said no, wouldn't let us talk to him.

Kubiak was holding the cards on this deal. If he didn't want to let him go, Shanahan (neither of them) could have done a damn thing about it.

If I were Kubiak, I would have considered saying no..... just a little payback.

But Kubiak probably saw getting Dennison as a win, and more important than some petty squabble.

thunderkyss
10-14-2010, 05:01 PM
He's been getting hit more this year than last, even with the drop off due to the emerging run game. Just sayin'

We've never had an "elite" offensive line. Matt Schaub was sacked a low 25 times, because he was so good at getting the ball out on time.

gary
10-14-2010, 05:04 PM
The Texans just have to get everyone healthy again and go from there.