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View Full Version : Maybe we will get something for Sharper now.


Grid
03-22-2005, 12:24 AM
With the compensatory picks handed out (http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=1771484) and the Bengals getting a 3rd rounder.. maybe this will highten their interest in sharper and make them more likely to give us that 3rd or 4th rounder for him.

just a thought

Grid
03-22-2005, 12:38 AM
bleh.. ok now im confused.. apparently that is an old news post.. but in the other thread on this a recent news post has been posted.. and the bengals dont have a compensatory pick in it.

(but didnt they lose Corey Dillon? is that news post accurate?)

D-ReK
03-22-2005, 12:41 AM
Cincy doesn't have a compensatory pick, but Seattle does :hmmm:...

Weren't they rumored to be interested in Sharper?

Grid
03-22-2005, 12:46 AM
ah hah... yes they were rumored to be interested :)

Vinny
03-22-2005, 01:16 AM
You cannot trade those picks. You have to use them.

texan_fan
03-22-2005, 01:17 AM
Why can't we just KEEP JAMIE?!?!?!?

thetexanator
03-22-2005, 01:34 AM
i agree, lets keep jamie, but its likely were not do to the excess at ilb.

ledzeppelin229
03-22-2005, 01:39 AM
You cannot trade those picks. You have to use them.

Yes, but that could make them more likely to trade an original pick if they know they'll still have a 3rd at some point.

Grid
03-22-2005, 02:28 AM
:thumbup yah that

Negative Jesus
03-22-2005, 02:32 AM
I just hope that we can work out a way to keep the guy . He has been the most consistent defensive player we have had . :thumbup

rittenhouserobz
03-22-2005, 07:17 AM
I was hoping he would shop around and start to realize the Texans long-term offer was not that far off-base. Sharper has one more year on the contract. Six possible scenarios.

1. He is traded and we get some value
2. He is released and we get nothing.
3. He plays well for us next year (contract year) and gets a big contract from us.
4. He plays well and signs with another team the following year
5. He plays poorly next year and we resign him to a contract that reflects his current play.
6. He plays poorly next year and we don't resign.

The way I see it is we have a 50/50 chance of getting something.

pittbull
03-22-2005, 09:49 AM
To me it's better to trade or release a guy after he already knows how much you want, need, or will pay for him. Jamie has never been labeled a locker room disruption by anybody, but when it comes down to $$$, power, & respect, it has a way of ruffling a mans' feathers! UNLESS HIS CHARACTER IS UNREAL! :thumbup

D-ReK
03-22-2005, 10:07 AM
I wouldn't mind keeoing him for another year, but I still think it's likely that he'll be included in a draft day deal (either for a third rounder or packaged with our second rounder to move back up into the first)...

Mr Shush
03-22-2005, 11:14 AM
I just hope we don't release him, because I have a horrible fear he might end up at Indy. Freeney+Sharper=a defense of sorts. Not what we want.

D-ReK
03-22-2005, 11:16 AM
Your fears won't be realized...Indy doesn't have the money to sign Sharper if we released him (unless Jamie was just Hell-bent on playing for them and took the vet minimum)...

The Preacher
03-22-2005, 11:41 AM
If we let Sharper go we would have a bunch of cash under the cap right. I saw how the Vikings found a loophole in the system where they gave a guy an incentive worth millions that he could never reach and since he didn't get it that amount of money went towards this years cap. That's partly how I think they had $31 mil to sign guys with. Pretty slick maybe since we are probably another year away from making a championship run we could do something similar and sign a huge free agent next year that could put us over the top and count a chunk of his signing bonus against next year's cap if we wanted to and avoid cap trouble down the road. Sound like a decent idea or did I read something way wrong?

TexansTrueFan
03-22-2005, 01:58 PM
id like to keep sharper, but i find that very unlikly since we have greenwood, and have picked up 2 other ILB ! Jamie is a play maker and i'll miss him if he goes :( !!!

TheOgre
03-22-2005, 02:23 PM
The Vikings are known for their "bogus" bonuses.

D-ReK
03-22-2005, 02:31 PM
id like to keep sharper, but i find that very unlikly since we have greenwood, and have picked up 2 other ILB ! Jamie is a play maker and i'll miss him if he goes :( !!!

Just curious, but why does every one of your posts have at least one exclamation point in it?

Oh, and IMO the chance of Jamie Sharper still being a Houston Texan on the night of 4/23/2005 is about 1/100...Anyone care to take bets?

THEFUTURE
03-22-2005, 03:01 PM
all i know is that we wont release him, it would be a huge hit against us in the cap, and we would get nothin except losing one of our best defenders. i dont want him to go, but if he does, then get something, anything for him

infantrycak
03-22-2005, 03:27 PM
all i know is that we wont release him, it would be a huge hit against us in the cap, and we would get nothin except losing one of our best defenders. i dont want him to go, but if he does, then get something, anything for him

Actually releasing Sharper would result in freeing up $4.75 mil of cap space--$6.1 mil cap charge if retained-$1.325 of remaining prorated signing bonus. Personally I don't think allowing him to look for a trade means he will be released if no trade is forthcoming, but it does free up a sizeable piece of cap room.

rittenhouserobz
03-22-2005, 04:14 PM
I think he will be a draft day trade. I would like to keep him, but the benefit-cost does not seem to match to the Texans. So I hope we get some kind of compensation.

done88
03-22-2005, 04:23 PM
They can't be dissappointed in his performance. We need more production out of the rest the linebackers. Now they have signed few linebackes paired with Peek should increase production out of the rest the linebackes. However the additional performance will be nullified when they remove Sharper. The Texans are not is salary cap hell or anything. I just do not understand why they are begging to get rid of him?

D-ReK
03-22-2005, 04:28 PM
They can't be dissappointed in his performance. We need more production out of the rest the linebackers. Now they have signed few linebackes paired with Peek should increase production out of the rest the linebackes. However the additional performance will be nullified when they remove Sharper. The Texans are not is salary cap hell or anything. I just do not understand why they are begging to get rid of him?

He's on the wrongside of 30 and has lost a step...We want to add speed to our LB corps and Sharper, while still solid against the run, Sharper's coverage skills may wane as he gets older...He's been good while he's been here, there's no denying that, but it just seems like the organization wants to go in a separate direction...

Grid
03-22-2005, 05:01 PM
The fact of the matter is he has said he does not want to be here next season. He wants to either be released or traded. He has said this in interviews.

Now.. is he just saying that and doesnt really feel that way? I dont know.. but personally id rather find someone who will take him for a 3rd or 4th rounder.. even a 5th rounder. Get something for him now because we will lose him anyway next season and I think we can get by without him this season.

FILO_girl
03-22-2005, 06:36 PM
Why can't we just KEEP JAMIE?!?!?!?

:thumbup

KEEP JAMIE SHARPER!!

Dunta_23
03-22-2005, 06:38 PM
I traded him for a 2nd rounder in a mock that I am in :thumbup

texan279
03-22-2005, 07:41 PM
What is with all of the people saying "KEEP JAMIE"...if he does not want to play here why would we want him here. Fact is we will probably get next to nothing for him and that is IF we don't have to release him...

Wolf
03-22-2005, 09:32 PM
I'll say this.. year 4 the Texans want to reach the playoffs.. If we don't have an equal or upgrade of Jamie Sharper (which I don't think has slipped as far as most people make out ..not like Walker)...sharper stays... It isn't like we are in Cap Hades here.. esp for one more year.. Yes, I don't wan't to see him leave for nothing.. We find a decent trade for him this year... I think we trade him..if not he stays.. I will be suprised if we just release him. Maybe he said he doesn't want to be here.. but he still works for the Texans and not vice versa.
and I think he has enough professionalism not to "dog it" this season

texan279
03-22-2005, 09:34 PM
I agree I hate to see him go, he has been here since the beginning and always seems to give 110%, but I am having doubts he will be with us next season..

vtech9
03-22-2005, 09:44 PM
one thing to think about is this...If Sharper stays, he might have his best year. The reason why I say this is because he will be an UFA after next season and most vets seem to have their best seasons in contract years. The better they do in a contract year, the more options they will have and the more teams that will be interested in them.

infantrycak
03-22-2005, 10:13 PM
and I think he has enough professionalism not to "dog it" this season

And professionalism aside, his last season here would be a job interview for his last NFL contract. Keep him and disgruntled or not he will play to his best ability because it is for his last pay day.

texan_fan
03-23-2005, 12:38 AM
The fact of the matter is he has said he does not want to be here next season. He wants to either be released or traded. He has said this in interviews.

Now.. is he just saying that and doesnt really feel that way? I dont know.. but personally id rather find someone who will take him for a 3rd or 4th rounder.. even a 5th rounder. Get something for him now because we will lose him anyway next season and I think we can get by without him this season.

WHERE has he said that???? I want a link!

Grid
03-23-2005, 12:57 AM
dont have a link. he said it on the news in a phone interview.

rittenhouserobz
03-23-2005, 07:19 AM
He may not want to, but if he has to then I think he will play his heart out.

FILO_girl
03-23-2005, 11:31 AM
He may not want to, but if he has to then I think he will play his heart out.

On a side note, I was watching Local 2 last night and they were showing the guys working out, except one. Guess Jamie refuses to work out now.

May have to just break down and pay that $6 to get on his website. If nothing else to send him an email and ask WTF? :hmmm:

cadahnic
03-23-2005, 11:35 AM
Walker cost a lot of money and he is really on the downside of his career, I mean when was the last time he led us in something. Yeah I forgot too. I like Sharper, but if he can be used to go up in the second and grab a quality interior LINEMAN or LB. That might be worth it. Naw it likely would not pay off for another 2 years.

jags98
03-23-2005, 10:34 PM
Why would you guys want to trade Jaime Sharper? Why only a 3rd?

Grid
03-23-2005, 11:55 PM
to recap.

hes 6 million against the cap

hes 31 years old

this is the last year he is under contract and he will be an FA next season

if we dont trade him this offseason, he will not be resigned next season and we wont get anything for him

we are rebuilding our LBs to gain more speed and pass rush capability

he doesnt want to play here anymore

D-ReK
03-24-2005, 12:06 AM
Does anyone know what the cap # for a franchise tagged LB is?

I know it's unlikely, but if we keep Sharper and he plays well next year, we could always tag him and maintain our leverage we have with him...

pat
03-24-2005, 01:11 AM
Instead of concentrating on the defense, the Texans need to concentrate on the offense because THEY'RE not doing their job. They are not protecting our QB and someone please please catch the FREAKIN BALL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

And another suggestion..........KEEP JAMIE!!!!!!!!!!!

Grid
03-24-2005, 01:30 AM
The offense is young and still growing. they will be better every year.

the defense is old and deteriorating.. if we dont add new talent now, they will suck for years to come.

dalemurphy
03-24-2005, 04:51 AM
to recap.

hes 6 million against the cap

hes 31 years old

this is the last year he is under contract and he will be an FA next season

if we dont trade him this offseason, he will not be resigned next season and we wont get anything for him

we are rebuilding our LBs to gain more speed and pass rush capability

he doesnt want to play here anymore

Half of the fans in Houston read this and say, "what's his point?"

jags98
03-24-2005, 07:19 AM
to recap.

hes 6 million against the cap

hes 31 years old

this is the last year he is under contract and he will be an FA next season

if we dont trade him this offseason, he will not be resigned next season and we wont get anything for him

we are rebuilding our LBs to gain more speed and pass rush capability

he doesnt want to play here anymore
Sounds a lot like DD.

infantrycak
03-24-2005, 08:49 AM
Does anyone know what the cap # for a franchise tagged LB is?


The 2005 franchise number for LB's is $5.9 mil.

D-ReK
03-24-2005, 11:24 AM
The 2005 franchise number for LB's is $5.9 mil.

So, if we feel Sharper plays well enough next year and is worth his $6M, then we could always tag him and either trade him next offseason or have him come back in 2006...

TexansTrueFan
03-24-2005, 11:33 AM
Instead of concentrating on the defense, the Texans need to concentrate on the offense because THEY'RE not doing their job. They are not protecting our QB and someone please please catch the FREAKIN BALL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

And another suggestion..........KEEP JAMIE!!!!!!!!!!!


catch the ball ?? We really had very little drops this season, i mean ya think we're bad you'd die if you were a seahaws fan, they had more dropped passes than hassle back had throwng attemps (sarcasim) ! Our offense is not really that bad, i feel we need to start fixing the defense now, cause if we dont it will be a major weakness in 2-3 years !

dagr8whitehope
03-24-2005, 06:59 PM
i totally agree with you, the offense is only 1 o-lineman and a decent receiver away from being a threat every sunday. The defense, on the other hand has at least 5 starters who are on the wrong side of 30 or getting there, including 2 lineman, a linebacker, and 2 d-backs. the rookies are the bright spots in the defense right now and we need to continue to build upon that talent. I like the addition of greenwood and the other ILB's that have signed. I say if we can get a good draft pick for jamie, then do it. i don't see the Texans using a franchise tag on him or re-signing him at his age. the fact is peek needs to get a chance to play full-time based on what we've seen from him thus far in his career. he could be the playmaker that the defense is missing. Unless of course, D.J. pops up at 13, in which case peek will see another year on the bench. :thumbdown At any rate, this defense could use a playmaker on the d-line and in the linebacking corps, seeing as the majority of them are in the defensive backfield. That's all i have for now, take it easy everybody.

sulli60
03-25-2005, 10:54 AM
I've always like Jamie Sharper and sport his blue #55 jersey at most games (battle red #80 on some), but it may be time to part ways.

I'd love to either get a 3rd round pick or maybe use Jamie on a draft day trade to move up spots in the 2nd round. It may depend on how the draft goes and which teams are ahead of us at certain spots. There are some 3-4 defensive teams ahead of us who could use a veteran ILB. :boxing:

mean mark8
03-25-2005, 03:34 PM
I know I'm likely in the minority here but I've never felt that Sharper has been an impact player. I think he's kind of like Scottie Pippen was with Michael Jordan. Alongside Jordan, Pippen looked great but when he was without him he was simply and overpaid average player. Sharper looked great when he played beside Ray Lewis, but with us he rarely if ever looks great. Our defensive scheme is designed to get all of the tackles for the inside linebackers (3-4), so his getting so many tackles is like a Texas Tech QB throwing for lots of yards. Only thing about Sharper is 85-90% of his tackles occur with the ball-carrier getting at least 5 or so yards. That's why we have been the worst or one of the worst defenses on a yards-per-carry average. He dives at everyone and arm tackles letting the ball-carrier drag him forward everytime. There's a new statistic around for RBs called yards after contact. If you look at Sharper's YAC, tackling, the RB gets at least 2 yards each time; that's after he has waited in the hole 2 yards downfield to try to tackle him. This is the reason Sharper didn't make the Pro Bowl last year. He is simply not a disruptive force and definitely not worth $6+ million. Just look at it, we were trying for O. Pace for $7 million. Who would you rather have on the Texans?

Blake
03-25-2005, 04:03 PM
I know I'm likely in the minority here but I've never felt that Sharper has been an impact player. I think he's kind of like Scottie Pippen was with Michael Jordan. Alongside Jordan, Pippen looked great but when he was without him he was simply and overpaid average player. Sharper looked great when he played beside Ray Lewis, but with us he rarely if ever looks great.

You are right. Sharper is no Ray Lewis. But who is? I love it how everyone is making Sharper the D's scapegoat.

Over the last 3 years Sharper has had 436 total tackles, solo and assisted, 11.5 sacks, 6 forced fumbles, and a TD.

Ray Lewis has had 364 total tackles, solo and assisted, 2.5 sacks, 8 ints, 4 forced fumbles, and zero TD's over the last 3 years.

Our defensive scheme is designed to get all of the tackles for the inside linebackers (3-4), so his getting so many tackles is like a Texas Tech QB throwing for lots of yards. Only thing about Sharper is 85-90% of his tackles occur with the ball-carrier getting at least 5 or so yards. That's why we have been the worst or one of the worst defenses on a yards-per-carry average.

We have been roughly in the middle of the pack with yards per carry. 2002 - 4.1, and 2003, and 2004 with 4.4. And Sharper doesnt make every tackle. So you cant say it was his fault a RB got 4-5 yards every play.

He dives at everyone and arm tackles letting the ball-carrier drag him forward everytime. There's a new statistic around for RBs called yards after contact. If you look at Sharper's YAC, tackling, the RB gets at least 2 yards each time; that's after he has waited in the hole 2 yards downfield to try to tackle him. This is the reason Sharper didn't make the Pro Bowl last year. He is simply not a disruptive force and definitely not worth $6+ million. Just look at it, we were trying for O. Pace for $7 million. Who would you rather have on the Texans?

Where did you get Sharpers YAC tacking stat?

tacoman_j
03-25-2005, 04:44 PM
Those teams (like Cincinnati) waiting for the Houston Texans to simply release veteran linebacker Jamie Sharper might turn blue holding their breath. Yeah, Texans officials have granted Sharper permission to seek possible trade scenarios. No, the Texans won't just give Sharper away. In fact, they might hang on to the eight-year veteran until after the draft, if necessary, because they want something in return for him. Sharper is still a productive, if somewhat limited, defender. He still makes plays against the run and led the Texans in tackles -- his 177 stops were 75 more than the Houston runner-up -- in 2004. Some team would be wise to surrender a middle-round draft choice now for Sharper so that he could participate in minicamps.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/columns/story?columnist=pasquarelli_len&id=2021162&num=0

mean mark8
03-25-2005, 11:57 PM
I'm saying Sharper is like Scottie Pippen was w/ Jordan. He needs a stud to take pressure off of him. BTW, Ray Lewis only played in 5 games in 2002, that's why his total tackles are less than Sharper's; he also had a touchdown in 2003. Here are their numbers:

Ray Lewis: G Tk Solo Ast Sk Int Yd Avg Lg Td PsDf
2002 Baltimore Ravens 5 57 42.0 15 0 2 4 2.0 4 0 1
2003 Baltimore Ravens 16 161 120.0 41 1.5 6 99 16.5 37 1 7
2004 Baltimore Ravens 15 146 100.0 46 1 0 0 0.0 0 0 5
Avg 10.1/G 7.3+2.8/G

Sharper
2002 Houston Texans 16 135 95.0 40 5.5 0 0 0.0 0 0 9
2003 Houston Texans 16 164 105.0 59 4 0 0 0.0 0 0 3
2004 Houston Texans 16 137 96.0 41 2 0 0 0.0 0 0 6
Avg 9.1/G 6.2+2.9/G


There is no official defensive stat for YAC, just watch the difference in how Ray Lewis blows a ball-carrier up and Sharper gets dragged everytime.

I guarantee you that no defense in the league is happy with giving up over 4 yards a carry. The Texans aren't and that's why they are making a change. I'm not saying that Sharper is the sole reason, and note they are likely going to have an entirely different starting LB corp to prove it. If Sharper is such a how commodity, why aren't there any takers for a trade? Why was he over-looked in 2003 for the Pro Bowl? Alan Burge wrote an article (I believe in the Houston Chronicle but I'm having trouble finding a link to it) where he quoted Tony Dungy saying that the Texans defense lacked team speed. Seems to me, the Texans are taking notice.

TexansTrueFan
03-26-2005, 12:01 AM
well i'm hoping GreeWood will give us the speed at ILB to blow holes and dissrupt things a little more than last season !

D-ReK
03-26-2005, 09:18 AM
I'm saying Sharper is like Scottie Pippen was w/ Jordan. He needs a stud to take pressure off of him. BTW, Ray Lewis only played in 5 games in 2002, that's why his total tackles are less than Sharper's; he also had a touchdown in 2003. Here are their numbers...

I don't think anybody has said that Sharper is anywhere near the same level as Ray Lewis...If they did, they need a serious reality check...Replacing Sharper is the best thing for this team...We're trying to add speed, and he just doesn't have it...He doesn't seal up the LOS either...

I guarantee you that no defense in the league is happy with giving up over 4 yards a carry. The Texans aren't and that's why they are making a change. I'm not saying that Sharper is the sole reason, and note they are likely going to have an entirely different starting LB corp to prove it. If Sharper is such a how commodity, why aren't there any takers for a trade? Why was he over-looked in 2003 for the Pro Bowl? Alan Burge wrote an article (I believe in the Houston Chronicle but I'm having trouble finding a link to it) where he quoted Tony Dungy saying that the Texans defense lacked team speed. Seems to me, the Texans are taking notice.

I agree with your points here...It's obvious we want a younger, faster group of LBs and that leaves Jamie out in the cold...Oh and isn't Alan Burge "aj.." from off of these forums?

Vinny
03-26-2005, 10:10 AM
Alan Burge is aj. You can find his stuff here on this site as he writes the, "voice of the fan" articles.

ItsDavidCarr
03-28-2005, 01:56 PM
Forget about Sharper, What about me?!?!?!?!?! I'm handsome and willing to travel. I could learn alot from that Peyton Manning guy. Send me there!

jacquescas
03-28-2005, 02:14 PM
LOOK PEOPLE ITS SIMPLE. Sharper was the steward of the defense through our infancy. He guided us through the murky waters of expansionism now its time to cut the cord and move on. Does anyone truly beliveve his production is going to increase now that he is on the wrong side of 30? I'd like to think so but i doubt it.

Sharper has played his last game as a Texan, lets hope whoever gets the job carries on the tradition.

Blake
03-28-2005, 03:01 PM
Does anyone truly beliveve his production is going to increase now that he is on the wrong side of 30? I'd like to think so but i doubt it.

Age has NOTHING to do with his production right now. So get over the fact that he is 30.

Tedy Bruschi 31
Willie McGinest 33
Rosevelt Colvin 27
Roman Phifer 36

Jamie Sharper 30
Jason Babin 24
Kailee Wong 28
Morlon GreenWood 26

Age is not a factor just yet.

Meloy
03-28-2005, 05:20 PM
Age has NOTHING to do with his production right now. So get over the fact that he is 30.

Tedy Bruschi 31
Willie McGinest 33
Rosevelt Colvin 27
Roman Phifer 36

Jamie Sharper 30
Jason Babin 24
Kailee Wong 28
Morlon GreenWood 26

Age is not a factor just yet.

I think the point is, Sharper will be 31 November 23rd. Evidently Casserly does not think he will earn his cap figure this year. If we don't trade him now, he is gone with nothing to show for it. His comments about needing some one to lead the team probably did not help his cause. IMO

El Tejano
03-28-2005, 05:45 PM
I think the point is, Sharper will be 31 November 23rd. Evidently Casserly does not think he will earn his cap figure this year. If we don't trade him now, he is gone with nothing to show for it. His comments about needing some one to lead the team probably did not help his cause. IMO

That right there is what I think ultimately is causing all this trade talk. Let's face it, some of the veteran guys are going to get mad when they see the team won't win. They know they are getting up there in age and want to play for a winner, so eventually they are going to say things like that. I saw nothing wrong in what Sharper said before, but if that is the case, it is only fair for both sides to part ways.

BornOrange
03-29-2005, 10:42 AM
Age has NOTHING to do with his production right now. So get over the fact that he is 30.

Tedy Bruschi 31
Willie McGinest 33
Rosevelt Colvin 27
Roman Phifer 36

Jamie Sharper 30
Jason Babin 24
Kailee Wong 28
Morlon GreenWood 26

Age is not a factor just yet.
No, age isn't a factor.

His getting slower is a factor.

His looking for a leader except in the mirror is a factor.