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View Full Version : Rackers staying, Brown gone


J_R
09-03-2010, 09:01 AM
@McClain_on_NFL (http://twitter.com/McClain_on_NFL): Texans are keeping kicker Neil Rackers over Kris Brown, who was the last original Texan.

Link: http://www.myfoxhouston.com/dpp/sports/nfl/100903-rackers-wins-texans'-kicking-job

DexmanC
09-03-2010, 09:01 AM
Rackers wins the job. He's a maniac when covering his own kickoffs, and
is far more accurate lately than Brown has been. I was worried the
Texans would fall for the "Brad Lidge Syndrome." Nice move, Kubiak.

infantrycak
09-03-2010, 09:09 AM
There was a little informal kicking competition going on at half time yesterday. Rackers kept backing up until Brown walked away. Looks like Rackers re-found his leg because he hit the last one from 59 yards.

DexmanC
09-03-2010, 09:13 AM
There was a little informal kicking competition going on at half time yesterday. Rackers kept backing up until Brown walked away. Looks like Rackers re-found his leg because he hit the last one from 59 yards.

Thanks for the info, Infantrycak. From what I could see on TV, Rackers
dang-near caused a fumble on one kickoff. He consistently sticks his
head into piles on kickoffs. I'd bet that didn't go unnoticed by Joe
Marciano.

I'm glad they cut Brown, because we should know how tough it is to
have a season like he had and come back. The Astros found that out
with Brad Lidge, and the first kick Brown missed would have been the
most challenging time for his mental stability.

No More 8-8's
09-03-2010, 09:16 AM
Kris Brown did alot for this team in the past, but his time is over. Best of luck to him, most likely as the dallas cowboys place kicker.

silvrhand
09-03-2010, 09:16 AM
Be gone of all your excuses this year, it he misses at least we can all say Kubiak went with another guy and it is what it is. Instead of the "we should have gotten rid of Kris "miss" Brown.

silvrhand
09-03-2010, 09:17 AM
There was a little informal kicking competition going on at half time yesterday. Rackers kept backing up until Brown walked away. Looks like Rackers re-found his leg because he hit the last one from 59 yards.

Saw that was as well, especially when Neil kept kicking and over the top of Kris and Kris walkd away.. Doh someone grew some balls in the kickers department.

Thorn
09-03-2010, 09:18 AM
I wish Kris Brown nothing but the best of luck with his new team.

Except when they're playing us of course. :)

Cjeremy635
09-03-2010, 09:19 AM
There was a little informal kicking competition going on at half time yesterday. Rackers kept backing up until Brown walked away. Looks like Rackers re-found his leg because he hit the last one from 59 yards.

Wow...that's calling him out in front of everyone!

Well, if you want to take the job away from someone, that's what you gotta do I guess. Hopefully he'll be the kicker we need.

HTown2ATX
09-03-2010, 09:20 AM
Just got the 610 text. Wish Brown luck, but now I won't automatically think we are going to miss a kick when we take one, so that is a positive.

What sux is wasn't he the last original Texan?

Pollardized
09-03-2010, 09:23 AM
Kris Brown is a class act and was a great role model for his behavior and community involvement (from what I have read). It's always tough to part with someone who has given as much as he has, but a change is needed. Neil Rackers will do everything he can to show the correct decision was made.

And I loved seeing him stick his helmet in last night and almost cause a fumble. That goes along way with coaches and others running down field to bust their asses on kickoffs.

Gotta go pick him up in my TT fantasy league quickly!

disaacks3
09-03-2010, 09:27 AM
I wish Kris Brown nothing but the best of luck with his new team.

Except when they're playing us of course. :)

Kris Brown is a class act and was a great role model for his behavior and community involvement (from what I have read). It's always tough to part with someone who has given as much as he has, but a change is needed. Neil Rackers will do everything he can to show the correct decision was made.

And I loved seeing him stick his helmet in last night and almost cause a fumble. That goes along way with coaches and others running down field to bust their asses on kickoffs.

Gotta go pick him up in my TT fantasy league quickly!

Kris is indeed a Class Act and I wish him the best. Who knows, if he doesn't get snapped up soon, we may re-sign him if Rackers falters.

Corrosion
09-03-2010, 09:32 AM
Im glad to see some accountability .... its that simple.

Texans34Life
09-03-2010, 09:33 AM
He's a good guy, but I need wins, not misses. I'm glad to see a new kicker on our squad who has the leg and accuracy.

DexmanC
09-03-2010, 09:33 AM
What sux is wasn't he the last original Texan?

We still got Chick Harris and Coach Joe as Original Texans.
Who knows, maybe Kris can retire and come back as a
Texans Ambassador.

Señor Stan
09-03-2010, 09:43 AM
Andre Johnson is now the elder statesman of the Texans. He's got seniority, so he to pick all the best week of vacation now.

Kimmy
09-03-2010, 09:48 AM
I approve this thread! I am VERY happy to read this.

NO EXCUSES! Go get 'em

WWJD
09-03-2010, 09:49 AM
Kris Brown did alot for this team in the past, but his time is over. Best of luck to him, most likely as the dallas cowboys place kicker.

The Cowboys aren't interested. Buehler kicked 4 fg's last night.

gtexan02
09-03-2010, 09:55 AM
Im glad to see some accountability .... its that simple.

What he said.

Thank you for your service Brown, except for last season.
I'll never forget that game winner over the Colts. I was there, and I was excited.
Good luck in your future endeavors, Im just glad they aren't with the Texans.

I dont want to cringe in fear every time I see our kicker trot out there.

chicagotexan2
09-03-2010, 09:55 AM
I wish Kris all the best. He had a bad year last seaon, but before that he was solid and always a good guy. I really hope Rackers works out well. Kris is still a good player and I'm sure he'll find work.

HOUFan
09-03-2010, 09:59 AM
Kris had a good ride while it lasted...he will find a job quickly. You could see him just walking around slowly on the sidewlines yesterday like he knew it was his last game as a Texan. I think Kubiak made up his mind well before yesterdays game.

Houston_Fanatic
09-03-2010, 10:03 AM
I am good with this and think they made the right decision. Will Rackers miss a few? Of course he will, but he will make a few clutch ones, too and as long as he can be depended on to make the shorter kicks when we stall out in the RZ I am happy.

I wish KB the best and thank-you for your winning field goal that beat the Colts - our only win against them. That is gonna change this year!

eriadoc
09-03-2010, 10:04 AM
The man's gone now, so I'll just say good luck. I view this decision as a "best for the team" type of decision regarding "Kris Brown the football player" that really has no bearing on "Kris Brown the man". KB is a great person and I wish the man the best. I hope he lands a job and does well (unless he plays us, LOL).

whiskeyrbl
09-03-2010, 10:13 AM
Congrats to Rackers, Good Luck to Kris Brown I wish him well. Well the last original Texan is gone so let the bad luck and mistakes of the Texans past be gone also. I think Kubes has the team now that he came here to build. He did after all say it would take 4-5 years to build the team he wanted. Welcome to year 5.

Pantherstang84
09-03-2010, 10:15 AM
Just got the 610 text. Wish Brown luck, but now I won't automatically think we are going to miss a kick when we take one, so that is a positive.

What sux is wasn't he the last original Texan?

He was the last original Texas. That can be viewed in two ways.

"Ahh gee. The last original Texan is now gone. *sigh*"

or

"The last vestige of Casserly/Capers is now gone at last. Time for the team to turn the corner at last."

Like others have said. Kris Brown is a nice guy and a class act. But when class acts miss game tying/winning field goals, you have to hold them accountable.

ThaShark316
09-03-2010, 10:16 AM
Good luck to Kris Brown...but Rackers isn't the guy. He's not clutch at all. Y'all will see...Rackers is AWFUL in the clutch. This goes back years down the line...Brown had one awful season, Rackers is great til the chips are down.

HOU-TEX
09-03-2010, 10:16 AM
Personally, I don't think the Texans had a choice. If they stuck with Brown they would've been ripped apart by the fans each FG miss there after.

Good luck, Kris. You should get a new gig pretty quick.

LonerATO
09-03-2010, 10:20 AM
I wonder if this decision will mirror the one the Ravens made last year with Stover. I have no loyalty to any players on any team, but I always worry that sometimes things come back to bite you in the butt. No matter who is kicking they better make the kicks and that its that.

Ryan
09-03-2010, 10:22 AM
I wish KB the best. I think he's going to bounce back strong on another team.


But we start out the new decade with no original Texans left that only produced 1 winning season in 8 years. Maybe it's time for a fresh start.

SheTexan
09-03-2010, 10:23 AM
Good luck to Kris Brown...but Rackers isn't the guy. He's not clutch at all. Y'all will see...Rackers is AWFUL in the clutch. This goes back years down the line...Brown had one awful season, Rackers is great til the chips are down.


Exactly!! This is a move that will come back to bite them in the ass, just wait and see! Mark it, book it, do whatever, because at the end of the season I'm gonna be around to say I TOLD YOU SO!!!

What's done is done, and Rackers will have my TEXAN support! Above all, I hope at the end of the season I am proven wrong!!!

Porky
09-03-2010, 10:25 AM
Posted this in the other thread, so I'll duplicate it here.

I've been pulling for Rackers so for me I am happy as a lark. I love Kris Brown the person, but I was about to throw something thru my TV last year in regards to Kris Brown the football player. Class guy, class player, and he will be deeply missed in the community....but frankly after Kris cost us the playoffs last year it was time to move on and Racker's isn't chopped liver by any means. I like the decision.

As to the person who stated RAckers was awful in the clutch, I would like to see some proof of that. I believe it was Mr. Brown who failed in the clutch lat year - consistently.

TEXANS84
09-03-2010, 10:27 AM
Well, gotta wish Kris the best. Everyone remembers a few games he lost for us, but he also won us a lot of games as well. I'll never forget the Dolphins game a few years ago, Kansas City back in 2004, Colts in 2006, Green Bay in 2008, etc...

Extremely classy guy, I will be his fan wherever he goes and wish him luck on any team not playing against us.

Texans34Life
09-03-2010, 10:31 AM
http://www.myfoxhouston.com/dpp/sports/nfl/100903-rackers-wins-texans%27-kicking-job

Rackers Wins Texans Kicking Job

HOUSTON - FOX 26 Sports has learned the Houston Texans are releasing Kris Brown, the only kicker in franchise history. Neil Rackers will kick for the Texans in 2010.

Brown is also the only player to participate in all 128 games in Texans history. He had his worst season as a pro last year, but in 2008, he had best year in the NFL.

The Texans brought in Rackers to compete for the job and the former All-Pro kicker with Arizona will kick for Houston.

In 10 years in the NFL, Rackers has made 205 of 262 career field goal attempts.

In 2005 with the Cardinals, Rackers set an NFL record for most field goals in a season with 42 and was named All-Pro.

"I can walk away with my head held high," Brown said in an interview with FOX 26 Sports. I handled, and Neil handled, everything as best we could. As I have said before this (competition) has made be a better player.

"I had a very good camp and I did everything that I could, but I knew the decision was out of my hands. That's life.

"I have a beautiful wife and three awesome children. I love them dearly and that's what it's all about.

"We'll be fine. A lot of people in this world have more dire situations that what I am going through."

Rackers was very gracious in reflecting on his relationship with Brown and what the Texans' decision means to him.

"I'm excited," Rackers said in an interview Friday with FOX 26 Sports. "I said all along I was excited to be with the Texans when I saw what they did in the second half of last year.

"It means a lot to me. Kris has been a great role model and did a great job in the community. I have to make Coach (Gary) Kubiak right in making the decision to go with me."

In leaving the Texans after nine years, Brown offered some parting thoughts to the thousands of Texans fans who have followed him.

"I appreciate what they have done for me," Brown said. "The fans have been fantastic.

"Houston will always hold a special place for Amy and I. Our kids were born here for cyring out loud.

"I want to thank the fans for their support. It has been a great ride."

eriadoc
09-03-2010, 10:31 AM
Good luck to Kris Brown...but Rackers isn't the guy. He's not clutch at all. Y'all will see...Rackers is AWFUL in the clutch. This goes back years down the line...Brown had one awful season, Rackers is great til the chips are down.

Brown had one awful season (well, really a couple), and several bad seasons. You need to check your history. People in this town seem to have no context for what a good kicker does. KB's '07 and '08 seasons were good, not over-the-top great. Before that, he was well below average. For his career, he's well below average. That KB is a good kicker over the course of his career is a myth.

mattieuk
09-03-2010, 10:33 AM
I'm pretty gutted that KB is no longer a Texan. He's been a model professional during his time in Houston, and a superb rolemodel for his off the field actions.

That said, I'm pretty excited about Rackers now - I've been hearing from his fans that he is automatic within 40 yards - so it'll be nice to only have to worry about missing the really long kicks.

El Tejano
09-03-2010, 10:34 AM
Thanks Kris for the kick that beat Miami in Miami in 03, the kicks against KC in KC when they were a good team, the game winner against Miami in 2007, the game winner in Green Bay in 2008.

I wish I could've said the same for 2009 but that's football. Either way you did contribute to all our wins we had up to this point. However we must move on.

Errant Hothy
09-03-2010, 10:35 AM
Good luck to Kris Brown...but Rackers isn't the guy. He's not clutch at all. Y'all will see...Rackers is AWFUL in the clutch. This goes back years down the line...Brown had one awful season, Rackers is great til the chips are down.

And Kris Brown is/was?

texasguy346
09-03-2010, 10:35 AM
The man's gone now, so I'll just say good luck. I view this decision as a "best for the team" type of decision regarding "Kris Brown the football player" that really has no bearing on "Kris Brown the man". KB is a great person and I wish the man the best. I hope he lands a job and does well (unless he plays us, LOL).

Well said and I absolutely agree. I'll always remember the big kicks he hit for us in the past, and I'm sure he'll latch on with another team soon.

CloakNNNdagger
09-03-2010, 10:38 AM
One thing I'll say at this point. No matter how your allegiance falls, Brown deserved a better send off than the chorus of "boos" he received for not converting a 57 yard FG.

eriadoc
09-03-2010, 10:39 AM
One thing I'll say at this point. No matter how your allegiance falls, Brown deserved a better send off than the chorus of "boos" he received for not converting a 57 yard FG.

Wow, he was booed? Now that's messed up. I wasn't even disappointed with that miss. 57 yards is a long FG, and he was on target, just short. Wow, that's harsh. I had no idea the "fans" did that.

281
09-03-2010, 10:43 AM
damn, this is crazy for me, seeing as he was the last original texan... any semblance we had of being an expansion team is now officially gone. i wish kris brown well... great guy. hopefully, rackers won't make us regret this.

hobie
09-03-2010, 10:44 AM
Wow, he was booed? Now that's messed up. I wasn't even disappointed with that miss. 57 yards is a long FG, and he was on target, just short. Wow, that's harsh. I had no idea the "fans" did that.

I'm pretty sure that a good portion of "fans" there last night were ones who bought/given tickets to the game last night who normally do not go.. Most fans know that a 57yd'r is not a high percentage kick anyway, and I for one would not have booed regardless of a preseason/postseason kick, and I would bet most season ticket holders unless they flat out hated KB would not have either.

El Tejano
09-03-2010, 10:48 AM
Wow, he was booed? Now that's messed up. I wasn't even disappointed with that miss. 57 yards is a long FG, and he was on target, just short. Wow, that's harsh. I had no idea the "fans" did that.

And to think he could possibly wind up on a team like Dallas and stick it back to them.

hobie
09-03-2010, 10:52 AM
And to think he could possibly wind up on a team like Dallas and stick it back to them.

He wouldn't look right with the "star" on his head...and that would suck if it did happen !
JJ would have a sh*t eating grin too !

eriadoc
09-03-2010, 10:55 AM
Well, there's certainly no reason to boo the man. I thought he competed well, but I think the team did the right thing in keeping Rackers. I actually wish they would have just let KB go earlier so he could pursue a job elsewhere.

Texan_Bill
09-03-2010, 10:59 AM
One thing I'll say at this point. No matter how your allegiance falls, Brown deserved a better send off than the chorus of "boos" he received for not converting a 57 yard FG.

Doc, some people are just jackasses!!

hobie
09-03-2010, 11:02 AM
Doc, some people are just jackasses!!

Hey, I take offense to that !! :foottap:

HOU-TEX
09-03-2010, 11:14 AM
Doc, some people are just jackasses!!

My wife's brother made a post on Facebook saying something like "competition over, Rackers made FG, Brown misses FG". I basically reamed him out for making such a decisive comment on a 57 yard FG. He's a good dude and normally knows his sports, but that was just moronic to say such a thing. I'd say the same for all who booed him when he missed.

Joe Texan
09-03-2010, 11:17 AM
I wish you well Kris, thank you for your service. Now Rackers, let's go Rackem.

gwallaia
09-03-2010, 11:17 AM
I was not at the game last night but I am embarrassed as a Texan fan that Kris Brown was booed.

houstonspartan
09-03-2010, 11:38 AM
My wife's brother made a post on Facebook saying something like "competition over, Rackers made FG, Brown misses FG". I basically reamed him out for making such a decisive comment on a 57 yard FG. He's a good dude and normally knows his sports, but that was just moronic to say such a thing. I'd say the same for all who booed him when he missed.

Why was it moronic for your brother in law to say that? Most fans felt the same way. I know I did. Granted, I thought the decision had been made before the game last night. But, still, him missing that kick didn't help.

Agree about the booing. I'm not a fan of booing players at all.

Mr. White
09-03-2010, 11:39 AM
Good luck to Kris Brown...but Rackers isn't the guy. He's not clutch at all. Y'all will see...Rackers is AWFUL in the clutch. This goes back years down the line...Brown had one awful season, Rackers is great til the chips are down.

I don't think any other kicker in the league has as many fans as Kris Brown has here. It's almost unhealthy. I'm pretty sure McNair was a fan too. That's why he stayed here until he outlived his usefulness.

The nature of the position is that it's totally expendable. Unless your name is Vinatieri or Gostkowski, you need to be looking over your shoulder. KB just isn't at their level.

When one guy loses his mojo, you bring in another guy and hope he's got some mojo.

Mike Kerns
09-03-2010, 11:44 AM
Didn't want to start another thread (and sorry if it's been posted), but Chris Henry is gone, too.

@caplannfl: #Texans RB Chris Henry has been told he's going to be waived, so that means Jeremiah Johnson is likely to make the team.

Mr. White
09-03-2010, 11:47 AM
Wow, he was booed? Now that's messed up. I wasn't even disappointed with that miss. 57 yards is a long FG, and he was on target, just short. Wow, that's harsh. I had no idea the "fans" did that.

I tend to think the boos were more about his misses when the game was on the line last year.

When it comes to boos, the mob rules.

HOU-TEX
09-03-2010, 11:49 AM
Why was it moronic for your brother in law to say that? Most fans felt the same way. I know I did. Granted, I thought the decision had been made before the game last night. But, still, him missing that kick didn't help.

Agree about the booing. I'm not a fan of booing players at all.

He was basing the competition on a 57 yard FG. Which is pretty moronic, if you asked me.

I've already said I thought the Texans were hamstrung and didn't have much of a choice but to go with Rackers.

silvrhand
09-03-2010, 12:12 PM
One thing I'll say at this point. No matter how your allegiance falls, Brown deserved a better send off than the chorus of "boos" he received for not converting a 57 yard FG.

I didn't hear the boos at all and I was at the game? Maybe it was your section?

badboy
09-03-2010, 12:13 PM
When Kris missed the long FG attempt and came off field it appeared he ran right by Rackers who had his hand out. I remember thinking uh, oh.

DexmanC
09-03-2010, 12:17 PM
I don't think any other kicker in the league has as many fans as Kris Brown has here. It's almost unhealthy. I'm pretty sure McNair was a fan too. That's why he stayed here until he outlived his usefulness.

The nature of the position is that it's totally expendable. Unless your name is Vinatieri or Gostkowski, you need to be looking over your shoulder. KB just isn't at their level.

When one guy loses his mojo, you bring in another guy and hope he's got some mojo.

Add Janikowski to that list. He's probably the only kicker I've seen a team
spend a first round pick on, and Sebastian is STILL a Raider!

Gotta admit he still has the strongest leg in the game right now.

TexanSam
09-03-2010, 12:17 PM
Weird not to have any original Texans on the roster anymore.

HTown2ATX
09-03-2010, 12:19 PM
What sux is wasn't he the last original Texan?


Wait, is Turk our original punter? I can't remember who else we may have had....(at work no time to double check...)

I know we still have a coach or 2, but player wise, I thought KB was the last original Texan, but now I wonder if Turk is??

Grams
09-03-2010, 12:27 PM
Wait, is Turk our original punter? I can't remember who else we may have had....(at work no time to double check...)

I know we still have a coach or 2, but player wise, I thought KB was the last original Texan, but now I wonder if Turk is??

No - Stanley was the punter befor Turk.

Brown was the last of the original's.

Errant Hothy
09-03-2010, 12:28 PM
Wait, is Turk our original punter? I can't remember who else we may have had....(at work no time to double check...)

I know we still have a coach or 2, but player wise, I thought KB was the last original Texan, but now I wonder if Turk is??

Chad Stanley was the original punter.

Rey
09-03-2010, 12:30 PM
Chad Stanley was the original punter.

Yep.

axman40
09-03-2010, 12:30 PM
Rackers!
:logo:

steelbtexan
09-03-2010, 12:45 PM
Im glad to see some accountability .... its that simple.

About time

steelbtexan
09-03-2010, 12:49 PM
Well, there's certainly no reason to boo the man. I thought he competed well, but I think the team did the right thing in keeping Rackers. I actually wish they would have just let KB go earlier so he could pursue a job elsewhere.

This would've been the right thing to do. IMHO

I didn't boo him, but it was time for Brown to go.

houstonspartan
09-03-2010, 12:51 PM
About time

Not only is there accountability, but it proves that even someone who is highly thought of by the owner is held accountable. A lot of people were worried that Brown would stay because McNair likes him so much. But, McNair clearly let Kubiak do what he needed to do.


I think if this had been a couple of years ago, the thinking would have been "Aw, shucks. Let's go ahead and give him one more year. He's a good guy."

Now, the attitude appears to be that they will put the best players who they think will help them win, everything else be damned.

ThaShark316
09-03-2010, 12:59 PM
Brown had one awful season (well, really a couple), and several bad seasons. You need to check your history. People in this town seem to have no context for what a good kicker does. KB's '07 and '08 seasons were good, not over-the-top great. Before that, he was well below average. For his career, he's well below average. That KB is a good kicker over the course of his career is a myth.

Brown > Rackers in the clutch. Find me a big kick that Rackers made. You can't do it. :breakdance:

spurstexanstros
09-03-2010, 01:09 PM
Thank You Kris brown for working hard for the team. You had a rough year, best of luck.
I think Kubiak made this decision because of last year he had to ..otherwise the media and fans would have ripped him if KB cost us more games. I think it was the mon night Tenn game that did it. ( fastest I have ever heard 70,000 go quiet.)

I hope rackers can deliver, I like his enthusiasm about covering kickoffs, but we dont need our kicker injured and KB being on another team.

DexmanC
09-03-2010, 01:13 PM
Brown > Rackers in the clutch. Find me a big kick that Rackers made. You can't do it. :breakdance:

Nor can you find one for Brown. The Texans "first winning season" was
last year. Kris Brown was not a major contributor. Brown had his
chance to make clutch kicks, and blew it. He's gone. Just like Sage is.

GP
09-03-2010, 01:16 PM
Reading the story with Brown's quotes made me feel sorry for him.

Which is why I really commend McNair, Smith and Kubiak for having the sack to waive him. If I felt a little sorry for him, think about how much the Big Three felt having to (a) bring in Rackers in the first place, and (b) actually going through with the cut.

You know, I was one of the biggest critics of Kris Brown last season. I was one of the most excited when we brought in Rackers. I just never really allowed myself to think/believe that they'd have the stones to cut Kris Brown. In my mind, it was always going to end up with KB pulling off the magic trick and keeping his locker.

I sit here, a little dazed and stunned, because they CUT him. They went through with it. LOL. I never dreamed, honestly, that they'd let him go. I figured he'd stay here this season and have some bad kicks and get cut in the middle of the season.

Kubiak isn't messin' around anymore. It's no longer the same old Texans. If you don't fit, you're gone. Wow.

GP
09-03-2010, 01:18 PM
My wife is thrilled.

Because even though we cut a "handsome" kicker, we added an equally "handsome" kicker.

This is why she roots for Roger Huerta and Georges St. Pierre, too, by the way.

It's all about the intangibles to her. LOL.

TexansBull
09-03-2010, 01:21 PM
Do you think there was a moment of hesitation to cut Brown before trying him out as a backup qb after the interceptions? Kidding...maybe...

ObsiWan
09-03-2010, 01:27 PM
One thing I'll say at this point. No matter how your allegiance falls, Brown deserved a better send off than the chorus of "boos" he received for not converting a 57 yard FG.

I guess I must have been asleep. I was at the game in endzone seats where he was kicking. I don't really remember hearing any boos. Actually I was shocked to see him out on the field even trying to make a kick after all that talk about his PF issues.

imatexan
09-03-2010, 02:11 PM
Nor can you find one for Brown. The Texans "first winning season" was
last year. Kris Brown was not a major contributor. Brown had his
chance to make clutch kicks, and blew it. He's gone. Just like Sage is.

Here are a few:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t8b6gCAXG60

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IDuN0gkF5p0&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hVXqptaGQWg&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=moWgMsYpk9s

False Start
09-03-2010, 02:15 PM
Best of luck to KB. He was a great guy, and had many great seasons for this team. My most memorable moment of him was when he nailed all those the FGs in the Miami game. It's kind of sad to see him go, but I think a change was needed. I really hope he can latch on with another team, and have great success. :clap:

beerlover
09-03-2010, 02:28 PM
the ability of Kubiak & Co. to put a player into a position to fail is really quite amazing. Kris had a very low probablity making that kick from 57/56 he's not even 100% seemed like it was straight down the middle & would have been good from 45-50?

which brings me to why I was so pissed about not getting Rackers that 52 yd. FG attempt in Arizona against his former team for the tie. We'll never know but their decision process when it comes to scoring points continues to be problematic.

I have little doubt, that if Neil struggles or gets hurt, Kris Brown could be right back here kicking for the Texans.

DexmanC
09-03-2010, 02:43 PM
Here are a few:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t8b6gCAXG60
We clinch 6-10!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IDuN0gkF5p0&feature=related
No Division title on the line here! We had already started the year 0-4

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hVXqptaGQWg&feature=related
We'd gone 5-7, and eliminated ourselves from postseason contention.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=moWgMsYpk9s
Again. We'd gone 5-7, and eliminated ourselves from going
to the post season.

My Comments in bold. LAST YEAR was Brown's first opportunity to kick in
THE CLUTCH. Every game he missed "The Big One" was an opportunity
at a division championship or playoff seed. He BLEW EVERY SINGLE ONE.
He even choked away extra points in the Patriots game, so they had to
hand the ball to Foster. Fortunately, Arian was able to score touchdowns.
The fans booed him mercilessly when he attempted extra points.

Kris Brown would have become the Texans' version of Brad Lidge.
Get my point?

CloakNNNdagger
09-03-2010, 02:45 PM
Not only is there accountability, but it proves that even someone who is highly thought of by the owner is held accountable. A lot of people were worried that Brown would stay because McNair likes him so much. But, McNair clearly let Kubiak do what he needed to do.


I think if this had been a couple of years ago, the thinking would have been "Aw, shucks. Let's go ahead and give him one more year. He's a good guy."

Now, the attitude appears to be that they will put the best players who they think will help them win, everything else be damned.

Do you not think that rather than only "accountability," the resultant move might have been taken in order for the coach and owner to avoid being ridden out on a rail the first FG Brown would have missed? I hate to be cynical, but............

DexmanC
09-03-2010, 02:47 PM
Do you not think that rather than only "accountability," the resultant move might have been taken in order for the coach and owner to avoid being ridden out on a rail the first FG Brown would have missed? I hate to be cynical, but............

Gary Kubiak would never admit it, but they saw what happened
when HWSNBN started messin' up.

Ole Miss Texan
09-03-2010, 02:49 PM
Do you not think that rather than only "accountability," the resultant move might have been taken in order for the coach and owner to avoid being ridden out on a rail the first FG Brown would have missed? I hate to be cynical, but............
I think McNair and Kubiak have some pretty thick skin and will do what's right for the football team. See selecting Mario Williams over Reggie Bush and Vince Young.

With that said, I totally agree with you. I hate to think that this may have been part of a reason (albeit a small one) to get rid of Brown. If Brown stayed and missed ANY field goal, the fans would boo than that would be detrimental to his psyche everytime he's out there plus it would really deflate the entire team. I was embarrassed last year that the fanbase would boo him... I understand the frustration but it really does hit ALL the players hard. If there was the same reaction from the fanbase this season... it would do more harm to the team than the 3 points we didn't get.

Dwade
09-03-2010, 02:56 PM
Finally, the cancer that is Kris Brown is gone! :kingkong:

I feel a lot better about the season now.

JB
09-03-2010, 02:59 PM
Finally, the cancer that is Kris Brown is gone! :kingkong:

I feel a lot better about the season now.


Wtf??? Kris Brown never was a cancer in the locker room or in the community. Yes, he struggled last year, but calling him a cancer is just wrong and shows a total lack of class.

edit: If I was going to neg rep someone for their opinion, this would probably call for it.

Dread-Head
09-03-2010, 03:04 PM
Brown is a class act. He donated a grand to a local charity for every field goal he made. He shall be missed. Thank you for your service sir.

b0ng
09-03-2010, 03:04 PM
Exactly!! This is a move that will come back to bite them in the ass, just wait and see! Mark it, book it, do whatever, because at the end of the season I'm gonna be around to say I TOLD YOU SO!!!

What's done is done, and Rackers will have my TEXAN support! Above all, I hope at the end of the season I am proven wrong!!!

I'm glad to see that you didn't upend a bottle of Drain-O when Brown got cut. I was worried for a little while :)

infantrycak
09-03-2010, 03:07 PM
If Brown stayed and missed ANY field goal, the fans would boo than that would be detrimental to his psyche everytime he's out there plus it would really deflate the entire team.

That's what I told my wife last night. Probably better for him to leave to a new venue because of crap like below.

Finally, the cancer that is Kris Brown is gone! :kingkong:

I feel a lot better about the season now.

Try not to act like an asshole. Kris Brown has been nothing but an excellent person in the community. Yes I think his kicking possibly cost us the playoffs last year but there is no reason to attack him in this fashion.

Ole Miss Texan
09-03-2010, 03:10 PM
http://www.blogcdn.com/nfl.fanhouse.com/media/2009/06/kris-brown-celebrates-contr.jpg

"Kris Brown - Thanks for the 7 good seasons."

houstonspartan
09-03-2010, 03:11 PM
Finally, the cancer that is Kris Brown is gone! :kingkong:

I feel a lot better about the season now.

Uh, you may want to think about the phrase "cancer" as it relates to sports and locker rooms. Kris Brown missed a lot of goals last year and likely cost us a few games, but I wouldn't call him a cancer.

Ole Miss Texan
09-03-2010, 03:11 PM
That's what I told my wife last night. Probably better for him to leave to a new venue because of crap like below.



Try not to act like an asshole. Kris Brown has been nothing but an excellent person in the community. Yes I think his kicking possibly cost us the playoffs last year but there is no reason to attack him in this fashion.

Case in point. :gun:

Dread-Head
09-03-2010, 03:14 PM
If you winning or losing a football game ULTIMATELY depends on your kicker, then you need to check out your game film and figure out what you did earlier in the game that DIDN'T allow you to have a decent lead going into the 2 minute warning.

infantrycak
09-03-2010, 03:21 PM
If you winning or losing a football game ULTIMATELY depends on your kicker, then you need to check out your game film and figure out what you did earlier in the game that DIDN'T allow you to have a decent lead going into the 2 minute warning.

Umm, ask the Patriots about their three championships and that theory. Two of the three were won by 3 points.

JB
09-03-2010, 03:23 PM
Umm, ask the Patriots about their three championships and that theory.

Yep, the kicker was a vital component to all 3.

El Tejano
09-03-2010, 03:23 PM
I forgot to say this earlier and I don't know how I could forget but...

Kris Brown, thanks for the last second FG to give us our only win against Indianapolis...so far.

Dwade
09-03-2010, 03:23 PM
Wtf??? Kris Brown never was a cancer in the locker room or in the community. Yes, he struggled last year, but calling him a cancer is just wrong and shows a total lack of class.

edit: If I was going to neg rep someone for their opinion, this would probably call for it.

I mean a cancer to winning.

He's a good guy, but last year he sucked.

houstonspartan
09-03-2010, 03:28 PM
I mean a cancer to winning.

He's a good guy, but last year he sucked.

Nope. Try again. I wouldn't even call him a "cancer to winning." Yes, he sucked last year, and yes he deserved to lose his job, but, using the term cancer to describe a player usually means he was a destructable, one-man wrecking ball (did I just mix my metaphors?) on a team, on or off the field.

Kris did cost us some games last year, but he wasn't the only one responsible. Chris Brown and Gary Kubiak, for starters, were major players.

MannyFresh
09-03-2010, 03:28 PM
I don't think any other kicker in the league has as many fans as Kris Brown has here. It's almost unhealthy. I'm pretty sure McNair was a fan too. That's why he stayed here until he outlived his usefulness.

The nature of the position is that it's totally expendable. Unless your name is Vinatieri or Gostkowski, you need to be looking over your shoulder. KB just isn't at their level.

When one guy loses his mojo, you bring in another guy and hope he's got some mojo.

Rackers should be able to handle the job... though I heard there is some young Gramatica and Zendejas boys looking good in college right now.

Dwade
09-03-2010, 03:34 PM
Nope. Try again. I wouldn't even call him a "cancer to winning." Yes, he sucked last year, and yes he deserved to lose his job, but, using the term cancer to describe a player usually means he was a destructable, one-man wrecking ball (did I just mix my metaphors?) on a team, on or off the field.

Kris did cost us some games last year, but he wasn't the only one responsible. Chris Brown and Gary Kubiak, for starters, were major players.

They were also cancers to winning. Chris Brown is gone, Kris Brown is gone.....do you see where I'm going with this? :kitten:

If we want to go deep in the playoffs, Kubes has gotta go. If he doesn't make the playoffs this year he needs to leave.

infantrycak
09-03-2010, 03:38 PM
They were also cancers to winning. Chris Brown is gone, Kris Brown is gone.....do you see where I'm going with this? :kitten:

If we want to go deep in the playoffs, Kubes has gotta go. If he doesn't make the playoffs this year he needs to leave.

No because none of them deserve to be called cancers. Chris Brown makes a good throw and Kubiak is a genius for calling that half back pass. It's asinine the way people make that out as some sort of example of his stupidity. But people don't judge the call honestly and just criticize the result. Bill Parcells made exactly the same call in the playoffs and he's in the hall of fame.

Dwade
09-03-2010, 03:48 PM
No because none of them deserve to be called cancers. Chris Brown makes a good throw and Kubiak is a genius for calling that half back pass. It's asinine the way people make that out as some sort of example of his stupidity. But people don't judge the call honestly and just criticize the result. Bill Parcells made exactly the same call in the playoffs and he's in the hall of fame.

Well maybe if Kubiak can make the playoffs I will give him the benefit of the doubt.

Parcells has won Super Bowls.

hobie
09-03-2010, 03:50 PM
No because none of them deserve to be called cancers. Chris Brown makes a good throw and Kubiak is a genius for calling that half back pass. It's asinine the way people make that out as some sort of example of his stupidity. But people don't judge the call honestly and just criticize the result. Bill Parcells made exactly the same call in the playoffs and he's in the hall of fame.

He also has 2 SB victories.. :peek:

CloakNNNdagger
09-03-2010, 03:53 PM
Wtf??? Kris Brown never was a cancer in the locker room or in the community. Yes, he struggled last year, but calling him a cancer is just wrong and shows a total lack of class.

edit: If I was going to neg rep someone for their opinion, this would probably call for it.

I won't neg rep anyone. So to I'll turn a negative into a positive. Somebody rep JB because I must spread it.

DexmanC
09-03-2010, 03:55 PM
He also has 2 SB victories.. :peek:

Parcells took 3 teams to the Superbowl, but only won 1 of them.

Dwade
09-03-2010, 03:57 PM
Parcells took 3 teams to the Superbowl, but only won 1 of them.

I would be happy with Kubiak doing that...I'd prefer 3 for 3 but beggars can't be choosers :)

C Madd
09-03-2010, 03:57 PM
Although I was personally pulling for Rackers, I am still sad to see KB go. He was a stand up guy and did many good things for the Texans and the community. Good luck to you, sir, wherever you end up.

Also, I still remember this like it was yesterday. Many thanks for this. (Skip to 2:17):texflag:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t8b6gCAXG60

houstonspartan
09-03-2010, 03:57 PM
I won't neg rep anyone. So to I'll turn a negative into a positive. Somebody rep JB because I must spread it.

Done.

And agree with turning a negative into a positive. Good call.

Ole Miss Texan
09-03-2010, 03:58 PM
Well maybe if Kubiak can make the playoffs I will give him the benefit of the doubt.

Parcells has won Super Bowls.

I still liked that call to this day. Brown just did the very worst thing he could have done in that situation. Every coach will tell you that if the throw isn't there, then throw it out of the back of the endzone. If you're going to miss, miss long... NOT short.

In any case... if Brown completes that pass Kubes could have had his 1st Super Bowl. :)

Hervoyel
09-03-2010, 04:01 PM
I have a pretty simple view of the kicking position. You go try and find the best one you can with the understanding that the vast majority of them are about equal. They have good years and they have bad years. That's true for all of them. You try to get one of the ones who has more good than bad but any of them can miss a kick at any time. It's an inexact science.

In short you try to find the best kicker you can and then do everything in your power to make sure the outcome is never in their hands. If your kicker is always having to make a kick (let alone a long kick) to get you into overtime or in the win column then you need to improve your offense in general and your red zone performance in particular.

hobie
09-03-2010, 04:05 PM
Parcells took 3 teams to the Superbowl, but only won 1 of them.

Only won 1 SB??? I beg to differ...

# 1- Broncos
# 2- Bills

I know he also took NE to a SB, but I do not recall any other team he took...So if I am missing one, please do tell...

eriadoc
09-03-2010, 04:08 PM
Only won 1 SB??? I beg to differ...

# 1- Broncos
# 2- Bills

I know he also took NE to a SB, but I do not recall any other team he took...So if I am missing one, please do tell...

LOL, what?

infantrycak
09-03-2010, 04:16 PM
He also has 2 SB victories.. :peek:

Broncos? - wtf.

He also had twenty years of coaching.

C Madd
09-03-2010, 04:18 PM
I think he is trying to say that Parcells coached 2 Giants Super Bowl teams, one which defeated the Broncos in 1986 and one which defeated the Bills in 1990.

hobie
09-03-2010, 04:25 PM
Broncos? - wtf.

He also had twenty years of coaching.

I hear you on the coaching, trust me, I am a Giants fan to the hilt... Not going to derail the thread, but I know he is the first coach to take 4 teams to the playoffs, I know he has basically turned every team he took over into legit teams.....

If Kubiak stays here for close to that long, then that means he has taken this team to a real good place !!!

The Pencil Neck
09-03-2010, 04:25 PM
Parcells took 3 teams to the Superbowl, but only won 1 of them.

No.

He took 2 different teams to the SB (Giants and Patriots). Those two teams played in 3 different Super Bowls and one 2 of them.

He took the Jets to the Conference Championship. And took the Cowboys to the Playoffs.

Dwade
09-03-2010, 04:33 PM
No.

He took 2 different teams to the SB (Giants and Patriots). Those two teams played in 3 different Super Bowls and one 2 of them.

He took the Jets to the Conference Championship. And took the Cowboys to the Playoffs.

Parcells was a great coach.

The Pencil Neck
09-03-2010, 04:37 PM
Parcells was a great coach.

If I'm not mistaken, he's also the only coach to take 2 different teams to the Super Bowl.

jaayteetx
09-03-2010, 04:37 PM
Parcells was a really good coach.

Thats better, IMO. I think you gotta reserve great for guys who excelled above and beyond their peers and won multiple championships or who instituted new ways to play the game. Like Lombardi or Walsh.

The Pencil Neck
09-03-2010, 04:40 PM
Thats better, IMO. I think you gotta reserve great for guys who excelled above and beyond their peers and won multiple championships or who instituted new ways to play the game. Like Lombardi or Walsh.

Parcells won 2 Super Bowls. He's the only coach to win a Super Bowl with one team and then take another team to the Super Bowl. (Although Vermeil did it the other way around. He lost a Super Bowl and then took the Rams to the SB and won. And then Vermeil did wonders with the Chiefs.)

Very few coaches have been as successful coaching as many different teams as Parcells has.

Dwade
09-03-2010, 04:53 PM
Parcells won 2 Super Bowls. He's the only coach to win a Super Bowl with one team and then take another team to the Super Bowl. (Although Vermeil did it the other way around. He lost a Super Bowl and then took the Rams to the SB and won. And then Vermeil did wonders with the Chiefs.)

Very few coaches have been as successful coaching as many different teams as Parcells has.

Yes I think he is the only one to win a Super Bowl with 2 different teams.

Parcells is easily top 10 coaches of all time, IMO

rmartin65
09-03-2010, 05:25 PM
One thing I just remembered, Rackers was a FA acquisition. This probably knocks our Comp. pick from a 3rd/4th to a 6th/7th (if I remember what people were saying properly). Will be well worth it if he pans out, but it is something to keep an eye on.

The Pencil Neck
09-03-2010, 05:43 PM
Yes I think he is the only one to win a Super Bowl with 2 different teams.

Parcells is easily top 10 coaches of all time, IMO

He didn't win with 2 different teams. He won with the same team 2 times. He's not the only coach to do that by a long shot.

Dutchrudder
09-03-2010, 05:57 PM
Farewell Kris Brown, good luck with the Cowboys/Jets/Bucs or whoever you end up with!

TheMatrix31
09-03-2010, 09:58 PM
As said...it's great to see some accountability. Thanks Kris, for all your service. You sucked (and may have cost us playoffs) last year but at the end of the day, what can ya do. Good guy, original Texan and all that. I wonder if he'd come back if Rackers ends up sucking?

dalemurphy
09-03-2010, 10:02 PM
As said...it's great to see some accountability. Thanks Kris, for all your service. You sucked (and may have cost us playoffs) last year but at the end of the day, what can ya do. Good guy, original Texan and all that. I wonder if he'd come back if Rackers ends up sucking?

The cut isn't about revenge or even accountability. It speaks to the unavoidable reality that they couldn't recreate a preseason environment that emulated the pressure he wilted under last season. As a result, regardless of how he looked in preseason, the coaches and even the players would be playing big games late in the season doubting whether their kicker would be reliable even for an extra point. All Rackers had to do is not lose the job. And, he didn't.

houstonspartan
09-03-2010, 10:08 PM
The cut isn't about revenge or even accountability. It speaks to the unavoidable reality that they couldn't recreate a preseason environment that emulated the pressure he wilted under last season. As a result, regardless of how he looked in preseason, the coaches and even the players would be playing big games late in the season doubting whether their kicker would be reliable even for an extra point. All Rackers had to do is not lose the job. And, he didn't.

Very good points. And very true.

It's also why I felt that they should have simply cut him at the end of the season and called it a day.

Texan_Bill
09-03-2010, 11:01 PM
Very good points. And very true.

It's also why I felt that they should have simply cut him at the end of the season and called it a day.

No they shouldn't have cut at the end of the season. The Texans actually did the right thing by keeping Kris and bringing in Neil to compete. Kris got cut, not based on his performance in this preseason, but more of a PR move, because if he were to miss a big field goal this season.... and not having been challenged, the natives would be restless.... Personally, I think Kris was better this presason. That said, it would be a PR nightmare if he missed a big kick this season....


Love ya Kris, Amy, Marcie and the kids!! Y'all will always be in my heart.

Neil, you're the man, now..... Make us proud!!!

JB
09-03-2010, 11:23 PM
No they shouldn't have cut at the end of the season. The Texans actually did the right thing by keeping Kris and bringing in Neil to compete. Kris got cut, not based on his performance in this preseason, but more of a PR move, because if he were to miss a big field goal this season.... and not having been challenged, the natives would be restless.... Personally, I think Kris was better this presason. That said, it would be a PR nightmare if he missed a big kick this season....


Love ya Kris, Amy, Marcie and the kids!! Y'all will always be in my heart.

Neil, you're the man, now..... Make us proud!!!

Damn well said! Good luck to ya Kris wherever you may go I will root for you, unless you're the enemy! Maybe someday you will return to our family as a Texan Ambassador...

GP
09-03-2010, 11:29 PM
No because none of them deserve to be called cancers. Chris Brown makes a good throw and Kubiak is a genius for calling that half back pass. It's asinine the way people make that out as some sort of example of his stupidity. But people don't judge the call honestly and just criticize the result. Bill Parcells made exactly the same call in the playoffs and he's in the hall of fame.

LOL.

You're wayyyyyyy wrong on this one.

First down, near the end zone, you do NOT call a halfback pass. It was FIRST down. There are just some plays that shouldn't be an option on the table when you're first down and sniffing the end zone.

I don't agree with dwade's analogy of cancer. But on your point, being that people are not judging the call "honestly," I call B.S as well.

You don't make that call right there. This is like having 3rd and 2 and the QB goes 40-yards deep to a WR and the ball is five yards long or five yards too wide, etc., etc. I love "going for the jugular," don't get me wrong, but there's a very small window of availability for those types of out-of-the-box plays.

That was a bad call before it even made it to Schaub's ears.

dalemurphy
09-03-2010, 11:35 PM
LOL.

You're wayyyyyyy wrong on this one.

First down, near the end zone, you do NOT call a halfback pass. It was FIRST down. There are just some plays that shouldn't be an option on the table when you're first down and sniffing the end zone.

I don't agree with dwade's analogy of cancer. But on your point, being that people are not judging the call "honestly," I call B.S as well.

You don't make that call right there. This is like having 3rd and 2 and the QB goes 40-yards deep to a WR and the ball is five yards long or five yards too wide, etc., etc. I love "going for the jugular," don't get me wrong, but there's a very small window of availability for those types of out-of-the-box plays.

That was a bad call before it even made it to Schaub's ears.


PUKE! after we have re-hashed this argument for another hour or so, I have another topic that could be further explored:

*David Carr: was he the problem or did the lack of protection create the problem?

after that, let's talk about:

*Amobi Okoye: we could've drafted Patrick Willis instead!

then, let's break into:

*Travis Johnson! wait, we could've drafted Derrick Johnson.. Idiots!

finally, we can conclude with some more discussion about whether Kubiak should've had Schaub run a play before the 2 minute warning occurred in Indy last season.

(yes, this will be a lot of fun!)

GP
09-03-2010, 11:54 PM
PUKE! after we have re-hashed this argument for another hour or so, I have another topic that could be further explored:

*David Carr: was he the problem or did the lack of protection create the problem?

after that, let's talk about:

*Amobi Okoye: we could've drafted Patrick Willis instead!

then, let's break into:

*Travis Johnson! wait, we could've drafted Derrick Johnson.. Idiots!

finally, we can conclude with some more discussion about whether Kubiak should've had Schaub run a play before the 2 minute warning occurred in Indy last season.

(yes, this will be a lot of fun!)

You don't have to go drama queen on this, Dale.

It's a freaking opinion OK? LOL. You're all kinds of wound up, dude.

Look, halfback passes are dumb in the very FIRST place. They are especially DUMB on first down near the end zone. Would everyone please gather around and let us explore how many TD passes have been thrown, in the entire NFL history, by a halfback running a HB Pass Play. Please?

They are neat in high school. Not in the NFL.

That I even have to belabor this point makes me mad at some of you. Out of the 1,000 plays we have...we call a HB Pass with a guy named Chris Brown. On first down. Near the goal line.

(sigh)

Yeah, Dale, it's all about 20/20 Hindsight stuff isn't it? There are things that are true gambles (drafting Player X instead of Player Y). HB Passes in the NFL are not, IMO, considered to be the best statistical play on first down and a few yards from pay dirt. It reeks LESS of creative playcalling and more like "Oh crap, nothing else we want to do is working...why not. Let's do it."

There are a lot of things that I can see as being tough debates on here. That this is one of them is truly epic. HB Passes are for high school. Keep 'em there where they belong.

powerfuldragon
09-04-2010, 12:43 AM
sad to see brown go, but i guess it's time.

Norg
09-04-2010, 12:48 AM
So was he really the last orginal texan ?????


is Lber Danny clark a orginal texan ????? or he was deff there during the early years right

The Pencil Neck
09-04-2010, 12:50 AM
Look, halfback passes are dumb in the very FIRST place. They are especially DUMB on first down near the end zone. Would everyone please gather around and let us explore how many TD passes have been thrown, in the entire NFL history, by a halfback running a HB Pass Play. Please?

Lots of guys have thrown TD's on HB passes. You usually throw it when you're in a short yardage situation where the defense will sell out against the run. I've usually seen it in a goal line situation.


Last year, the following Running Backs and Wide Receivers threw a pass:
Ricky Williams (interception)
LaDanian Tomlinson (incomplete)
Reggie Wayne (interception)
Clinton Portis (incomplete)
Brian Westbrook (incomplete)
Chris Brown (interception)
Michael Clayton (incomplete)
Mewelde Moore (6 yard TD)
Braylon Edwards (incomplete)
Mark Clayton (the other one, complete for 0 yards)
Mark Bradley (complete for 26 yards)
Santonio Holmes (interception)
Joseph Addai (22 yard TD)
Brad Smith (complete for 27 yards)
Fred Jackson (complete for 27 yards)
Michael Spurlock (incomplete)
Michael Bush (incomplete)
Legedu Naanee (complete for 21 yards)
Tim Castille (incomplete)
Chris Johnson (incomplete)
Ray Rice (incomplete)

Ronnie Brown threw 6 of them, completed 2 of them and one of those was a TD.

That's just this past season. So it's not like this is some weird and unusual thing that no team has in their playbook. Everybody has the play and most teams try it at least once during the season.

It was not a stupid call.

The Pencil Neck
09-04-2010, 12:52 AM
So was he really the last orginal texan ?????


is Lber Danny clark a orginal texan ????? or he was deff there during the early years right

Danny Clark? No. He was only here for a year back in 2007. He started out with Jacksonville back in 2000. Played with them until he went to Oakland in 2004. He was with the Saints in 2006, us in 2007, and then spent 2 years with the Giants.

Brisco_County
09-04-2010, 02:10 AM
I'm sorry to see Kris go. He's an outstanding football player as well as a person.

But what is standing out to me is that cutting the last original Texan will give me closure on that era. We're a different team that isn't haunted or restricted by our past. We'll see it in the 4th quarter against the Colts this year.

Carr, Casserly, TJ... Psychologically, none of that matters anymore.

PockyAF
09-04-2010, 04:20 AM
LOL.

You're wayyyyyyy wrong on this one.

First down, near the end zone, you do NOT call a halfback pass. It was FIRST down. There are just some plays that shouldn't be an option on the table when you're first down and sniffing the end zone.

I don't agree with dwade's analogy of cancer. But on your point, being that people are not judging the call "honestly," I call B.S as well.

You don't make that call right there. This is like having 3rd and 2 and the QB goes 40-yards deep to a WR and the ball is five yards long or five yards too wide, etc., etc. I love "going for the jugular," don't get me wrong, but there's a very small window of availability for those types of out-of-the-box plays.

That was a bad call before it even made it to Schaub's ears.
That's a horrible analogy.

So, what you're trying to say is that the WR is down field and the QB throws it to him but he fails to catch it because it is overthrown? I'm assuming in this scenario that the WR is wide open? I mean, why would the QB go to him if he wasn't, because all they needed was two yards? And beside, the QB decided to go down field, instead to the closes receiver. Wouldn't that just make it a bad play on the part of the QB, and not the play called by the coach?

Maybe I just don't understand what you're trying to say.

Anyways, I agreed with that people are unfairly criticizing that play that was horribly executed by that ultimate game-day choke artist, Chris Brown.

Just curious though, why wouldn't you call a halfback pass in the RZ on first down, in your opinion? HB pass has had success before, albeit, by more talented RB. Obviously, they must have practiced several times and had to be successful at it then, or else they wouldn't had use it at all on game day. And IIRC, there was no one over the WR. The play had a chance to succeed.

Maddict5
09-04-2010, 05:07 AM
That's a horrible analogy.

So, what you're trying to say is that the WR is down field and the QB throws it to him but he fails to catch it because it is overthrown? I'm assuming in this scenario that the WR is wide open? I mean, why would the QB go to him if he wasn't, because all they needed was two yards? And beside, the QB decided to go down field, instead to the closes receiver. Wouldn't that just make it a bad play on the part of the QB, and not the play called by the coach?

Maybe I just don't understand what you're trying to say.

Anyways, I agreed with that people are unfairly criticizing that play that was horribly executed by that ultimate game-day choke artist, Chris Brown.

Just curious though, why wouldn't you call a halfback pass in the RZ on first down, in your opinion? HB pass has had success before, albeit, by more talented RB. Obviously, they must have practiced several times and had to be successful at it then, or else they wouldn't had use it at all on game day. And IIRC, there was no one over the WR. The play had a chance to succeed.

agreed the playcall was working perfectly. it just wasnt executed well and while everybody wants to blame chris brown (& god knows he was to blame for a nice bit last yr) it was actually vonta that really f'ed this play up because he followed gump doubleteaming a guy & leaving the LB'er with a clean hit on brown just as he was throwing meaning he underthrew a wide open casey with a lame duck

thunderkyss
09-04-2010, 06:09 AM
Personally, I don't think the Texans had a choice. If they stuck with Brown they would've been ripped apart by the fans each FG miss there after.

Good luck, Kris. You should get a new gig pretty quick.

I agree.

Another thing, If Rackers miss, and we're calling for him to be replaced... in walks Mr Klutch, Kris Brown.

thunderkyss
09-04-2010, 06:23 AM
Wow, he was booed? Now that's messed up. I wasn't even disappointed with that miss. 57 yards is a long FG, and he was on target, just short. Wow, that's harsh. I had no idea the "fans" did that.

I didn't make the game either, I didn't watch it till yesterday. I can't believe he was booed either.

57 yards.

If he didn't know then, that should have been all Kubiak needed to know. The fans didn't want him to be given a chance.

After reading that interview with Fox26, I can't believe he said, "the fans have been great."

thunderkyss
09-04-2010, 06:29 AM
I'm pretty sure that a good portion of "fans" there last night were ones who bought/given tickets to the game last night who normally do not go.. Most fans know that a 57yd'r is not a high percentage kick anyway, and I for one would not have booed regardless of a preseason/postseason kick, and I would bet most season ticket holders unless they flat out hated KB would not have either.

I might be disappointed in a missed kick, but I feel like we are part of the team, especially at the stadium. I am very disappointed every time the fans boo.

You might see a player telling another player, "c'mon man!!!" after a whiff on a play, but I don't think I've ever seen the equivalent of boos played out by the players, on the field, or the locker room.

Even when Philly got rid of T.O., McNabb didn't sell T.O. out...... he was pretty classy about his attitude towards his teammate.

thunderkyss
09-04-2010, 06:47 AM
Not only is there accountability, but it proves that even someone who is highly thought of by the owner is held accountable. A lot of people were worried that Brown would stay because McNair likes him so much. But, McNair clearly let Kubiak do what he needed to do.


Why is being fired the only measure of accountability recognized by fans?

When I screw up at work (and believe me, they are doozies), I get a good ole fashioned butt chewin, I might get some time off, without pay.

It's not that I'm lobbying for KB, I'm just curious, there are so many other things they can do, to hold a person accountable.

JB
09-04-2010, 07:27 AM
Well, at least you did a credible cut & paste job to get your spam on here.

We still do not want! :pissed:

CloakNNNdagger
09-04-2010, 07:32 AM
Kubiak re. Rackers (this morning's Chronicle):

“The deciding factor was the kickoffs. I really like what Neil does from that standpoint. I think he drives the ball. It was a tough, tough call.”

thunderkyss
09-04-2010, 07:39 AM
If Brown stayed and missed ANY field goal, the fans would boo than that would be detrimental to his psyche everytime he's out there plus it would really deflate the entire team.

... I understand the frustration but it really does hit ALL the players hard...

I never really thought about it, but I wonder how the players felt, after working their butts off, when Kris Brown strutted out on the field to kick a game tying, or game winning field goal.

thunderkyss
09-04-2010, 07:47 AM
If you winning or losing a football game ULTIMATELY depends on your kicker, then you need to check out your game film and figure out what you did earlier in the game that DIDN'T allow you to have a decent lead going into the 2 minute warning.

I would agree if you would add the word "frequently" in there somewhere, which was not the case. 2 out of 16 games, I wouldn't call frequent.

One of those games, he missed two kicks.

Of all the other players on this team, that guy is paid to be clutch, we hope to have the game in hand, and not "rely" on a field goal to win/tie a game. But when we do need him, we need him.

thunderkyss
09-04-2010, 07:51 AM
No because none of them deserve to be called cancers. Chris Brown makes a good throw and Kubiak is a genius for calling that half back pass. It's asinine the way people make that out as some sort of example of his stupidity. But people don't judge the call honestly and just criticize the result. Bill Parcells made exactly the same call in the playoffs and he's in the hall of fame.

Nobody would remember that play, if Chris Brown would have taken a tackle for a loss, giving us 2nd & Goal from the eight yard line.

Nobody called Caldwell an ***** when he had Reggie Wayne toss up a hope and a prayer that Pollard came down with.

thunderkyss
09-04-2010, 07:53 AM
Well maybe if Kubiak can make the playoffs I will give him the benefit of the doubt.

Parcells has won Super Bowls.

What's the difference? If it's a decision that would be made by a Super Bowl winning coach, why is it ridiculous that anyone who never coached a Super Bowl would make the same decision?

thunderkyss
09-04-2010, 09:16 AM
LOL.

You're wayyyyyyy wrong on this one.

First down, near the end zone, you do NOT call a halfback pass. It was FIRST down. There are just some plays that shouldn't be an option on the table when you're first down and sniffing the end zone.

That was a bad call before it even made it to Schaub's ears.

First of all, 1st down is when you want to try your riskiest plays, because you've technically got three more downs, just in case it doesn't work out.

steelbtexan
09-04-2010, 09:27 AM
I dont get all of the K.Brown love. He stunk at his job and was rightfully cut. Sure he is a great guy. But the NFL is a performance based business. Do your job or get cut. This isn't pee wee football. It's good to see Kubes isn't playing to the crowd anymore and has decided to keep the best player. This is a good sign that Kubes is growing as a coach.

The HB pass was stupid because Kubes let that loser C.Brown throw the pass (plain stupidity).

The minuate Dale said he would rather finish 2nd with Kubes than finish 1st with other coaches he lost all creditable objectivity with me. I want to finish 1st and dont really care who thcoaches/players are. The NFL is all about winning. It seems that McNair/Smithiak are finally starting to realize this and are making roster decisions accordingly.

infantrycak
09-04-2010, 09:30 AM
Look, halfback passes are dumb in the very FIRST place. They are especially DUMB on first down near the end zone. Would everyone please gather around and let us explore how many TD passes have been thrown, in the entire NFL history, by a halfback running a HB Pass Play. Please?

Yeah they're stupid, especially near the end zone.

Signed,

LaDanian Tomlinson

12 attempts, 8 receptions, 7 TD's, 0 INT's,

PS - there wouldn't have been a peep from anyone if he threw a TD or as TK pointed out was simply tackled.

DexmanC
09-04-2010, 09:33 AM
I dont get all of the K.Brown love. He stunk at his job and was rightfully cut. Sure he is a great guy. But the NFL is a performance based business. Do your job or get cut. This isn't pee wee football. It's good to see Kubes isn't playing to the crowd anymore and has decided to keep the best player. This is a good sign that Kubes is growing as a coach.


I was shocked Kubes grew the stones to fire Kris. The way he dismissed
Brown was handled with pure class, although there was no way to
keep him unless Rackers completely screwed up. That didn't happen, and
Neil repeatedly kept jumping into piles as a KICKER.

Let's see if this team can play against Indy without going "space cadet."

Houston_Fanatic
09-04-2010, 09:34 AM
Why is being fired the only measure of accountability recognized by fans?


Because we want to win and the NFL only allows 53 players on the roster.


I like KB as a person but I don't feel sorry for someone making $4 million a year losing their job.

Dwade
09-04-2010, 09:34 AM
Yeah they're stupid, especially near the end zone.

Signed,

LaDanian Tomlinson

12 attempts, 8 receptions, 7 TD's, 0 INT's,

PS - there wouldn't have been a peep from anyone if he threw a TD or as TK pointed out was simply tackled.

L.T. is actually very good at it. I thought he used to be a quarterback in high school.

dalemurphy
09-04-2010, 09:36 AM
The minuate Dale said he would rather finish 2nd with Kubes than finish 1st with other coaches he lost all creditable objectivity with me. I want to finish 1st and dont really care who thcoaches/players are. The NFL is all about winning. It seems that McNair/Smithiak are finally starting to realize this and are making roster decisions accordingly.

I am thrilled that Kubiak is making difficult decisions for the betterment of the team. However, I am also happy that these are hard things for him to do. And, I value that... I can not comprehend spending my free time and money on something without weighting the moral/ethical value that it holds. I know for a fact, as a former Cowboy fan, that watching the last Superbowl win in 1996, was far less satisfying a fan experience for me than the Texans win versus New England was last season that gave us a few hours of playoff hopes.

Goatcheese
09-04-2010, 09:38 AM
Grandpa Joe: Mr. Kubiak?
Kubiak: [pointedly ignoring them] I am extraordinarily busy, sir.
Grandpa Joe: [tentatively] I just wanted to ask about the good will - The-the lifetime supply of good will, for Kris. Wh-When does he get it?
Kubiak: He doesn't.
Grandpa Joe: Why not?
Kubiak: Because he missed too many kicks.
Grandpa Joe: What kicks? We didn't see any missed kicks, did we, Kris?
[Kris shakes his head briefly]
Kubiak: [springs up from his chair, angrily] Wrong, sir! Wrong! Under section 37B of the contract signed by him, it states quite clearly that all offers shall become null and void if - and you can read it for yourself in this photostatic copy:
[grabs a magnifying glass and reads]
Kubiak: I, the undersigned, shall forfeit all rights, privileges, and good will herein and herein contained, et cetera, et cetera... Fax mentis incendium gloria cultum, et cetera, et cetera... Memo bis punitor delicatum!
[slams the contract copy and the magnifying glass down, continues shouting]
Kubiak: It's all there, black and white, clear as crystal! You missed game winning or tying kicks! You cheated your teammates which now have to be consoled, so you get nothing! You lose! Good day, sir! (http://wonka.ytmnd.com/)
Grandpa Joe: [shocked] You're a crook. You're a cheat and a swindler! That's what you are!
[angrily]
Grandpa Joe: How could you do something like this, build up a little boy's hopes and then smash all his dreams to pieces? You're an inhuman monster!
Kubiak: [shouts even louder] I said good day!
Grandpa Joe: Come on, Kris, Let's get out of here. I'll get even with him if its the last thing I'll ever do. If Slugworth wants a kick misser, he'll get one.

dalemurphy
09-04-2010, 09:41 AM
You don't have to go drama queen on this, Dale.

It's a freaking opinion OK? LOL. You're all kinds of wound up, dude.

Look, halfback passes are dumb in the very FIRST place. They are especially DUMB on first down near the end zone. Would everyone please gather around and let us explore how many TD passes have been thrown, in the entire NFL history, by a halfback running a HB Pass Play. Please?

They are neat in high school. Not in the NFL.

That I even have to belabor this point makes me mad at some of you. Out of the 1,000 plays we have...we call a HB Pass with a guy named Chris Brown. On first down. Near the goal line.

(sigh)

Yeah, Dale, it's all about 20/20 Hindsight stuff isn't it? There are things that are true gambles (drafting Player X instead of Player Y). HB Passes in the NFL are not, IMO, considered to be the best statistical play on first down and a few yards from pay dirt. It reeks LESS of creative playcalling and more like "Oh crap, nothing else we want to do is working...why not. Let's do it."

There are a lot of things that I can see as being tough debates on here. That this is one of them is truly epic. HB Passes are for high school. Keep 'em there where they belong.


It was an atrocious call! Look back at one of the dozen threads that exhausted this topic last year. I was adamant about what a bonehead call it was.

I just can't understand why you would resurrect that argument now. It's been fully explored and we aren't arguing about another poor playcall. So, it seemed a morbid and peculiar choice. So, I thought it would be fun to pull up another half dozen of those Classic Hits.

JB
09-04-2010, 09:43 AM
Yeah they're stupid, especially near the end zone.

Signed,

LaDanian Tomlinson

12 attempts, 8 receptions, 7 TD's, 0 INT's,

PS - there wouldn't have been a peep from anyone if he threw a TD or as TK pointed out was simply tackled.

If CB would have thrown a TD, or even an incomplete pass, this board would have been raving about the gutsy call.

Dwade
09-04-2010, 09:47 AM
If CB would have thrown a TD, or even an incomplete pass, this board would have been raving about the gutsy call.

If Kris Brown wouldn't have missed some kicks last year, we would have made the playoffs.

The "if" game is entertaining, but it doesn't help.

JB
09-04-2010, 09:48 AM
If Kris Brown wouldn't have missed some kicks last year, we would have made the playoffs.

The "if" game is entertaining, but it doesn't help.

Yes, but the conversation was about the call and if it was a good call or not.

dalemurphy
09-04-2010, 09:50 AM
If CB would have thrown a TD, or even an incomplete pass, this board would have been raving about the gutsy call.

Not me! I hate those kinds of calls. It smacks of over-coaching, either as a result of a massive ego (like Parcells) or it indicates the coach doesn't believe in the ability of the 11 players on the field... Thats why I wouldn't have had a problem with the call if Rex Grossman was still in the game. But, Schaub had returned and was playing well. Awful, awful call... only highlighted by the tragedy that ensued.

b0ng
09-04-2010, 09:54 AM
Not me! I hate those kinds of calls. It smacks of over-coaching, either as a result of a massive ego (like Parcells) or it indicates the coach doesn't believe in the ability of the 11 players on the field... Thats why I wouldn't have had a problem with the call if Rex Grossman was still in the game. But, Schaub had returned and was playing well. Awful, awful call... only highlighted by the tragedy that ensued.

I thought you wanted this line of chatter in this particular thread to die out dale?

For the record, I was fine with the call, the execution was akin to something that comes from my butt.

infantrycak
09-04-2010, 10:02 AM
Not me! I hate those kinds of calls. It smacks of over-coaching, either as a result of a massive ego (like Parcells) or it indicates the coach doesn't believe in the ability of the 11 players on the field... Thats why I wouldn't have had a problem with the call if Rex Grossman was still in the game. But, Schaub had returned and was playing well. Awful, awful call... only highlighted by the tragedy that ensued.

Really? So I guess we either add Shottenheimer and Turner to the massive ego list with Parcells or we believe they didn't have belief in the ability of one of the best goal line backs of all time. It's a play basically every NFL team practices. Heck HB passes are becoming more prominent with all the wild cat stuff going on and yet folks around here act like it is obviously brain dead. The players didn't (oh my god the dreaded but accurate word) execute.

dalemurphy
09-04-2010, 10:40 AM
Really? So I guess we either add Shottenheimer and Turner to the massive ego list with Parcells or we believe they didn't have belief in the ability of one of the best goal line backs of all time. It's a play basically every NFL team practices. Heck HB passes are becoming more prominent with all the wild cat stuff going on and yet folks around here act like it is obviously brain dead. The players didn't (oh my god the dreaded but accurate word) execute.

Shottenheimer had a basic distrust of QBs and the passing game... So, yeah, I think that is true. Norv inherited a special situation with a RB that was excellent at executing that play.

Trusting that baffoon, Chris Brown, with the level of decision-making and ball-handling that they did... particularly in a high pressure situation, was really, really stupid!

( I realize that the derailing of this thread is now entirely my fault )

Norg
09-04-2010, 11:10 AM
will we be seeing some wild Bull plays this year ???????????? LOL

DexmanC
09-04-2010, 11:12 AM
Shottenheimer had a basic distrust of QBs and the passing game... So, yeah, I think that is true. Norv inherited a special situation with a RB that was excellent at executing that play.

Trusting that baffoon, Chris Brown, with the level of decision-making and ball-handling that they did... particularly in a high pressure situation, was really, really stupid!

( I realize that the derailing of this thread is now entirely my fault )

To summarize:

Cak = The play wasn't bad, because other coaches called it. It worked for THEM!

Dale = Playcall in and of itself =/= Always good.

Dex = Playcall + Personnel selected to EXECUTE play + Game Situation
Determines whether the call is good or bad.

dalemurphy
09-04-2010, 12:30 PM
To summarize:

Cak = The play wasn't bad, because other coaches called it. It worked for THEM!

Dale = Playcall in and of itself =/= Always good.

Dex = Playcall + Personnel selected to EXECUTE play + Game Situation
Determines whether the call is good or bad.

If I'm reading that correctly, that may be the worst summary I've ever seen.

I think that playcall is almost always bad. But, I have no idea what "=/=" means.

DexmanC
09-04-2010, 12:43 PM
If I'm reading that correctly, that may be the worst summary I've ever seen.

I think that playcall is almost always bad. But, I have no idea what "=/=" means.

"=/=" = Does not equal

GP
09-04-2010, 12:51 PM
Really? So I guess we either add Shottenheimer and Turner to the massive ego list with Parcells or we believe they didn't have belief in the ability of one of the best goal line backs of all time. It's a play basically every NFL team practices. Heck HB passes are becoming more prominent with all the wild cat stuff going on and yet folks around here act like it is obviously brain dead. The players didn't (oh my god the dreaded but accurate word) execute.

You're reaching.

I see hardly any HB Pass highlights on the weekend wrap-up shows. Just DVR 'em and start posting them to YouTube so I can see this massive amount of HB Pass "action" we're seeing in the NFL.

Aside from field goal kickers determining outcomes of games, I have to rank HB Pass as the dumbest part of NFL football.

And the wildcat is NOT, I repeat NOT, exactly taking the league by storm. Miami establishes it and catches some teams with their pants down, and all of a sudden teams start trying to emulate it. But unfortunately, defenses are no longer unaware. They know there is a certain amount of options based on the personnel being used, and they scheme for it now.

When you have one of the league's BEST offenses, HB Passes and/or Wildcat should honestly be complete no-no for gameday. You have Andre Johnson, Jacoby Jones, Owen Daniels, Matt Schaub, Arian Foster, and some other TEs who are skilled. You don't need gimmicks with that lineup.

The flea-flicker, IMO, is a lot better gimmick play than HB Pass. At least you get the ball BACK into the hands of your QB. You know, the guy whose job is to throw the football. :shades:

houstonspartan
09-04-2010, 01:11 PM
You're reaching.

I see hardly any HB Pass highlights on the weekend wrap-up shows. Just DVR 'em and start posting them to YouTube so I can see this massive amount of HB Pass "action" we're seeing in the NFL.

Aside from field goal kickers determining outcomes of games, I have to rank HB Pass as the dumbest part of NFL football.

And the wildcat is NOT, I repeat NOT, exactly taking the league by storm. Miami establishes it and catches some teams with their pants down, and all of a sudden teams start trying to emulate it. But unfortunately, defenses are no longer unaware. They know there is a certain amount of options based on the personnel being used, and they scheme for it now.

When you have one of the league's BEST offenses, HB Passes and/or Wildcat should honestly be complete no-no for gameday. You have Andre Johnson, Jacoby Jones, Owen Daniels, Matt Schaub, Arian Foster, and some other TEs who are skilled. You don't need gimmicks with that lineup.

The flea-flicker, IMO, is a lot better gimmick play than HB Pass. At least you get the ball BACK into the hands of your QB. You know, the guy whose job is to throw the football. :shades:

Very true. Agree. You don't necessarily need gimmicks when you have a roster like that.

The Pencil Neck
09-04-2010, 01:19 PM
Not me! I hate those kinds of calls. It smacks of over-coaching, either as a result of a massive ego (like Parcells) or it indicates the coach doesn't believe in the ability of the 11 players on the field... Thats why I wouldn't have had a problem with the call if Rex Grossman was still in the game. But, Schaub had returned and was playing well. Awful, awful call... only highlighted by the tragedy that ensued.

Almost every coach in the NFL makes that call from time to time.

This was just Kubiak's time. If it works, it's genius. If he just gets tackled, oh well. If it's an interception, then it's a horrible call.

But really, it's not a horrible call at all. That was just horrible execution.

Brisco_County
09-04-2010, 01:20 PM
The flea-flicker, IMO, is a lot better gimmick play than HB Pass. At least you get the ball BACK into the hands of your QB. You know, the guy whose job is to throw the football. :shades:

I like to consider the flea flicker more of an extended play action fake. I love the flea flicker.

The Pencil Neck
09-04-2010, 01:21 PM
L.T. is actually very good at it. I thought he used to be a quarterback in high school.

Doesn't matter. Look at the list of guys I put up that had tried it last year. Not all of those guys were "great at it." There's actually more of a surprise value if you do it with some guy that they don't expect to throw it.

Guys like LaDanian Tomlinson and Ronnie Brown are special but the play has also been run by "no names" like Chris Brown.

The Pencil Neck
09-04-2010, 01:24 PM
You're reaching.

I see hardly any HB Pass highlights on the weekend wrap-up shows. Just DVR 'em and start posting them to YouTube so I can see this massive amount of HB Pass "action" we're seeing in the NFL.

Aside from field goal kickers determining outcomes of games, I have to rank HB Pass as the dumbest part of NFL football.

And the wildcat is NOT, I repeat NOT, exactly taking the league by storm. Miami establishes it and catches some teams with their pants down, and all of a sudden teams start trying to emulate it. But unfortunately, defenses are no longer unaware. They know there is a certain amount of options based on the personnel being used, and they scheme for it now.

When you have one of the league's BEST offenses, HB Passes and/or Wildcat should honestly be complete no-no for gameday. You have Andre Johnson, Jacoby Jones, Owen Daniels, Matt Schaub, Arian Foster, and some other TEs who are skilled. You don't need gimmicks with that lineup.

The flea-flicker, IMO, is a lot better gimmick play than HB Pass. At least you get the ball BACK into the hands of your QB. You know, the guy whose job is to throw the football. :shades:

Hey, guys. I'm in GP's ignore list. Someone who's not in his ignore list put my list of guys who made the pass last year into a message that he can see cause he's talking out of his ass again.

Judging that the HB pass is dead because he doesn't see the HB pass in the highlights from other games is ridiculous.

steelbtexan
09-04-2010, 01:25 PM
I am thrilled that Kubiak is making difficult decisions for the betterment of the team. However, I am also happy that these are hard things for him to do. And, I value that... I can not comprehend spending my free time and money on something without weighting the moral/ethical value that it holds. I know for a fact, as a former Cowboy fan, that watching the last Superbowl win in 1996, was far less satisfying a fan experience for me than the Texans win versus New England was last season that gave us a few hours of playoff hopes.

This is where we differ. I want a winner and dont really care how/who it happens.

You on the otherhand only want a winner if meets somekind of preconcieved notion of a certain kind of kind of player on the team.

I wish the Texans could give me the opportunity to make a decision of whether I like the team after a SB win.

Hell I would even like that opportunity after a playoff win.

HJam72
09-04-2010, 01:27 PM
Hey, guys. I'm in GP's ignore list. Someone who's not in his ignore list put my list of guys who made the pass last year into a message that he can see cause he's talking out of his ass again.

Judging that the HB pass is dead because he doesn't see the HB pass in the highlights from other games is ridiculous.


I would, but I can't help because I have everyone on my ignore list. :mcnugget:

Wolf
09-04-2010, 01:27 PM
Lots of guys have thrown TD's on HB passes. You usually throw it when you're in a short yardage situation where the defense will sell out against the run. I've usually seen it in a goal line situation.


Last year, the following Running Backs and Wide Receivers threw a pass:
Ricky Williams (interception)
LaDanian Tomlinson (incomplete)
Reggie Wayne (interception)
Clinton Portis (incomplete)
Brian Westbrook (incomplete)
Chris Brown (interception)
Michael Clayton (incomplete)
Mewelde Moore (6 yard TD)
Braylon Edwards (incomplete)
Mark Clayton (the other one, complete for 0 yards)
Mark Bradley (complete for 26 yards)
Santonio Holmes (interception)
Joseph Addai (22 yard TD)
Brad Smith (complete for 27 yards)
Fred Jackson (complete for 27 yards)
Michael Spurlock (incomplete)
Michael Bush (incomplete)
Legedu Naanee (complete for 21 yards)
Tim Castille (incomplete)
Chris Johnson (incomplete)
Ray Rice (incomplete)

Ronnie Brown threw 6 of them, completed 2 of them and one of those was a TD.

That's just this past season. So it's not like this is some weird and unusual thing that no team has in their playbook. Everybody has the play and most teams try it at least once during the season.

It was not a stupid call.

true, it is one of those plays where if it works great, if the worst happens (i.e. INT) people get all up in arms.

like someone said, if he got tackled or threw it away, it would have been a blip on the game day thread

Wolf
09-04-2010, 01:31 PM
you want to talk about really killed the Texans instead of a half back pass?

Houston - 4:01
HOU kicked off, M. Thomas returned kickoff for 9 yards
Jacksonville - 3:57
1st-10, JAC24 3:57 M. Jones-Drew rushed up the middle for no gain
2nd-10, JAC24 3:19 M. Jones-Drew rushed up the middle for 15 yard gain
1st-10, JAC39 3:10 M. Jones-Drew rushed up the middle for 4 yard gain
2nd-6, JAC43 2:29 M. Jones-Drew rushed to the right for 9 yard gain
1st-10, HOU48 2:23 M. Jones-Drew rushed up the middle for no gain
2nd-10, HOU48 2:18 M. Jones-Drew rushed to the right for 7 yard gain
3rd-3, HOU41 2:13 M. Jones-Drew rushed to the right for 3 yard gain
1st-10, HOU38 2:00 D. Garrard rushed up the middle for 1 yard loss
2nd-11, HOU39 1:19 D. Garrard rushed up the middle for 1 yard loss
3rd-12, HOU40 0:38 D. Garrard rushed up the middle for 1 yard loss


http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/boxscore?gid=20091206030&page=plays

this was f'ing pathetic

DexmanC
09-04-2010, 01:34 PM
you want to talk about really killed the Texans instead of a half back pass?


Houston - 4:01
HOU kicked off, M. Thomas returned kickoff for 9 yards
Jacksonville - 3:57
1st-10, JAC24 3:57 M. Jones-Drew rushed up the middle for no gain
2nd-10, JAC24 3:19 M. Jones-Drew rushed up the middle for 15 yard gain
1st-10, JAC39 3:10 M. Jones-Drew rushed up the middle for 4 yard gain
2nd-6, JAC43 2:29 M. Jones-Drew rushed to the right for 9 yard gain
1st-10, HOU48 2:23 M. Jones-Drew rushed up the middle for no gain
2nd-10, HOU48 2:18 M. Jones-Drew rushed to the right for 7 yard gain
3rd-3, HOU41 2:13 M. Jones-Drew rushed to the right for 3 yard gain
1st-10, HOU38 2:00 D. Garrard rushed up the middle for 1 yard loss
2nd-11, HOU39 1:19 D. Garrard rushed up the middle for 1 yard loss
3rd-12, HOU40 0:38 D. Garrard rushed up the middle for 1 yard loss



http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/boxscore?gid=20091206030&page=plays

this was f'ing pathetic

Shhh!!! Don't bring this up! The fans in the "Texans were top 5 in
run-stopping after Game 3" camp won't like it!

HJam72
09-04-2010, 01:34 PM
You're reaching.

I see hardly any flea-flicker Pass highlights on the weekend wrap-up shows. Just DVR 'em and start posting them to YouTube so I can see this massive amount of flea-flicker Pass "action" we're seeing in the NFL.

Aside from field goal kickers determining outcomes of games, I have to rank flea-flicker Pass as the dumbest part of NFL football.

The Hail-Mary to AJ, IMO, is a lot better gimmick play than flea-flicker Pass. At least you get the ball into the hands of a guy in the endzone. You know, the guy whose job is to just freaking score. :goodpost:

Lucky
09-04-2010, 01:36 PM
Someone who's not in his ignore list put my list of guys who made the pass last year into a message that he can see cause he's talking out of his ass again.

Are we really going to rehash this? If you want stats on halfback passes, here you go:

Here are some stats I compiled myself of passes attempted by non-QBs (or wildcat QBs) during the '09 season.

12-28-224 yards 6 TDs 7 INTs 71.1 Passer Rating

A boom or bust play. Then I looked at only RB passes (non-wildcat):

3-12-55 3 TDs 3 INTs 46.1 Passer Rating

So you have a 1 in 4 chance at success. A 1 in 4 chance at total failure. And a 50/50 chance that you'll run another play. Incredibily risky. It's the type of play you want to run with a big lead, and then just to put on film for future opponents to prepare for. An atrocious play call. Which as GP pointed out, Kubiak admitted to. I'm fairly certain that "Stagger Gary" won't find its way back into future game plans.
It's a new season. I hope I don't have to wade through another season of Kubiak apologies. I hope there's nothing to apologize for.

HJam72
09-04-2010, 01:40 PM
I hope I don't have to wade through another season of Kubiak apologies. I hope there's nothing to apologize for.

Just put him in your ignore list. :)

Kaiser Toro
09-04-2010, 01:49 PM
I do not have a real problem with the play call if it is drilled in practice. But Chris Brown had not been a running threat in years, and he had never attempted a HB pass in the pros or in college. The execution may have been there, but that play call was reckless given our personnel and situation IMO.

Kaiser Toro
09-04-2010, 01:49 PM
Just put him in your ignore list. :)

You just made the list.:kitten:

The Pencil Neck
09-04-2010, 02:07 PM
Not me! I hate those kinds of calls. It smacks of over-coaching, either as a result of a massive ego (like Parcells) or it indicates the coach doesn't believe in the ability of the 11 players on the field... Thats why I wouldn't have had a problem with the call if Rex Grossman was still in the game. But, Schaub had returned and was playing well. Awful, awful call... only highlighted by the tragedy that ensued.

Redskins x2
Colts x2
Texans
Raiders
Chiefs
Buccaneers
Ravens x2
Jets x2
Steelers x2
Bills
Titans
Chargers x2
Vikings
Eagles
Dolphins x2
Browns x2

Half the league tried it last year. The (x2) indicates teams that tried it with multiple players.

eriadoc
09-04-2010, 02:10 PM
Uhh ......

Rackers staying, Brown gone

Y'all are talking about the wrong Brown?

dalemurphy
09-04-2010, 02:47 PM
Redskins x2
Colts x2
Texans
Raiders
Chiefs
Buccaneers
Ravens x2
Jets x2
Steelers x2
Bills
Titans
Chargers x2
Vikings
Eagles
Dolphins x2
Browns x2

Half the league tried it last year. The (x2) indicates teams that tried it with multiple players.


Not exactly the A-list for good coaching... By the way, Caldwell didn't look like a genius either when he took the ball out of Peyton Manning's hands and had Reggie Wayne throw an interception to Bernard Pollard in the third quarter of the Texans at Indy.

The Pencil Neck
09-04-2010, 03:47 PM
Not exactly the A-list for good coaching... By the way, Caldwell didn't look like a genius either when he took the ball out of Peyton Manning's hands and had Reggie Wayne throw an interception to Bernard Pollard in the third quarter of the Texans at Indy.

Maybe Caldwell looked dumb with the interception but he looked like a genius on Addai's TD.

And this is just one year's worth of data. I looked at some previous years and there were a lot more teams represented than just those in this list. Like Lucky said, it's a boom or bust play. The stats definitely bear that out but to say that only poorly coached teams do it or it's only done by either bad teams/coaches is wrong. Every team has this in their arsenal and every team brings it out from time to time.

thunderkyss
09-04-2010, 03:55 PM
You're reaching.

Aside from field goal kickers determining outcomes of games, I have to rank HB Pass as the dumbest part of NFL football.


As long as you're consistent, who are we to argue. If you say it's just as dumb if it were successful, cool. If you say it's just as dumb whether it's Parcells, Shottenhiemer, Gibbs, or whoever that calls that play, cool.

I think infantrycak's point, mine as well, is that other coaches have been called geniuses for that same call. Not that we think Kubiak is a genius, or that we would ever call that play ourselves. But we recognize even with AJ, OD, Dressen, Walter, etc, etc... we've had issues in the redzone, we understand the call.

thunderkyss
09-04-2010, 04:06 PM
Shhh!!! Don't bring this up! The fans in the "Texans were top 5 in
run-stopping after Game 3" camp won't like it!

I believe it was top 4.

And for the most part, we are realistic. We understand that same defense we brag about lost a few games for us as well.

The bottom line is that we finished as the 23rd rank run defense in 2008 finishing 10th in 2009 (including the first three games) is an improvement.

That game showed a maturity level we have yet to reach. An area in need of improvement.

We aren't looking at this with blinders, like we are the #1 defense or anything, only that we are on our way. :cow:

thunderkyss
09-04-2010, 04:10 PM
You're reaching.

I see hardly any flea-flicker Pass highlights on the weekend wrap-up shows. Just DVR 'em and start posting them to YouTube so I can see this massive amount of flea-flicker Pass "action" we're seeing in the NFL.

Aside from field goal kickers determining outcomes of games, I have to rank flea-flicker Pass as the dumbest part of NFL football.

The Hail-Mary to AJ, IMO, is a lot better gimmick play than flea-flicker Pass. At least you get the ball into the hands of a guy in the endzone. You know, the guy whose job is to just freaking score. :goodpost:

You're reaching.

I see hardly any Hail-Mary Pass highlights on the weekend wrap-up shows. Just DVR 'em and start posting them to YouTube so I can see this massive amount of Hail-Mary Pass "action" we're seeing in the NFL.

Aside from field goal kickers determining outcomes of games, I have to rank Hail-Mary Pass as the dumbest part of NFL football.

The statue of liberty, IMO, is a lot better gimmick play than Hail-Mary Pass. At least you get the ball into the hands of a guy in the endzone. You know, the guy whose job is to just freaking score.

thunderkyss
09-04-2010, 04:13 PM
It's a new season. I hope I don't have to wade through another season of Kubiak apologies. I hope there's nothing to apologize for.

I'm with you. If the players didn't execute, I wish he would just be honest, and say they didn't execute, instead of always taking the blame for it.

Rey
09-04-2010, 04:18 PM
Maybe Caldwell looked dumb with the interception but he looked like a genius on Addai's TD.

And this is just one year's worth of data. I looked at some previous years and there were a lot more teams represented than just those in this list. Like Lucky said, it's a boom or bust play. The stats definitely bear that out but to say that only poorly coached teams do it or it's only done by either bad teams/coaches is wrong. Every team has this in their arsenal and every team brings it out from time to time.

agreed

GP
09-04-2010, 05:07 PM
As long as you're consistent, who are we to argue. If you say it's just as dumb if it were successful, cool. If you say it's just as dumb whether it's Parcells, Shottenhiemer, Gibbs, or whoever that calls that play, cool.

I think infantrycak's point, mine as well, is that other coaches have been called geniuses for that same call. Not that we think Kubiak is a genius, or that we would ever call that play ourselves. But we recognize even with AJ, OD, Dressen, Walter, etc, etc... we've had issues in the redzone, we understand the call.

I'd be called a genius, too, if I bought a lotto ticket and won. Because I called my same numbers for 20 years and then hit paydirt one day.

For every HB Pass that is successful, there's gotta' be around 345 that are blown up or go wrong.

It's the law of averages on stoopid plays.

GP
09-04-2010, 05:16 PM
Almost every coach in the NFL makes that call from time to time.

This was just Kubiak's time. If it works, it's genius. If he just gets tackled, oh well. If it's an interception, then it's a horrible call.

But really, it's not a horrible call at all. That was just horrible execution.

For the record, TPN, you flow on and off my ignore list. It's like having to make a game-time decision on whether to activate a player or not. You've been off my list for several days, which means you haven't been replying to my posts because you thought I wasn't watching. I watched, and it was awesome to not have to get into a back-and-forth with you. But you came lookin' for me today, so here ya' go....

You continue to ignore the HUGE issue that I continue to keep referencing: DOWN AND DISTANCE.

Where was that play called, and what down was it? We were moving the ball down the field. We didn't all of a sudden lose our guys out there and have to resort to pure gimmickery. Resorting to the HB Pass, when you have a 5-inch notebook binder full of plays, and our roster of guys, is so mindless.

I seriously sit here and try to figure out why this is lost on you. First freaking down, and we call a HB pass. First down. Not 3rd and 2, where the defense is looking for a QB sneak or a rushing play, which obviously helps sell the honorable and glorious HB Pass play.

No, we trot it out on a fresh set of downs and say "Because of poor 'execution' by the player, you really can't fault the playcall itself." Hell yes you can fault the playcall itself. If I am a policeman and stop a car because the child isn't in a booster seat, I ticket the PARENT and not the child. Chris Brown was the child, in both figurative and literal sense. Kubiak the parent. Gary, buckle up your kids already. Be a good daddy and don't let them do things that gets you ticketed.

In response to "Well, if it had succeeded you'd have said it was genius." See there, that's where you guys also miss the mark on what I think. I would have felt the same way about that playcall as I would have felt when I see Jacoby Jones going Willie-Mays-Over-The-Shoulder-Catch on punt returns. I sit there and go "How did we NOT loose the ball right there? I need a heart surgeon." The gamble was not worth the risk. I tend to think Kubiak is a methodical man, and then I see HB Pass on 1st down near the EZ and I wonder if a 12-year-old on his PS3, playing NCAA10, made that call.

The Pencil Neck
09-04-2010, 05:20 PM
You continue to ignore the HUGE issue that I continue to keep referencing: DOWN AND DISTANCE.

Where was that play called, and what down was it? We were moving the ball down the field. We didn't all of a sudden lose our guys out there and have to resort to pure gimmickery. Resorting to the HB Pass, when you have a 5-inch binder full of plays, and our roster of guys, is so mindless.

I seriously sit here and try to figure out why this is lost on you. First freaking down, and we call a HB pass. First down. Not 3rd and 2, where the defense is looking for a QB sneak or a rushing play, which obviously helps sell the honorable and glorious HB Pass play.

No, we trot it out and say "Because of poor 'execution' by the player, you really can't fault the playcall itself." Hell yes you can. If I am a policeman and stop a car because the child isn't in a booster seat, I ticket the PARENT and not the child. Chris Brown was the child, in both figurative and literal sense. Kubiak the parent. Gary, buckle up your kids already. Be a good daddy and don't let them do things that gets you ticketed.

On first down, the defense is expecting a running play. They're going to buy the fake. That's a perfect time to run it.

GP
09-04-2010, 05:29 PM
On first down, the defense is expecting a running play. They're going to buy the fake. That's a perfect time to run it.

Yes, because THAT day we really were running the ball very well weren't we?

Oh, wait. That's right...we amassed 56 yards of rushing between TWO running backs. Our run game was atrocious that game. Would you have mentioned that stat at all? Hmmm?

Hell, Grossman had 9 yards to Chris Brown's 15. Grossman had a higher rushing average that day than Chris Brown. LOL!!!! (link to the stats if you want to look) (http://www.nfl.com/gamecenter/2009120605/2009/REG13/texans@jaguars#tab:analyze)

So let's abandon the pass game, the thing we WERE doing well. Let's do the HB Pass near the EZ. On first down. Because we had been burnin' 'em on the run all day. LOL.

I think the jury knows how to rule on this verdict, TPN. Your client is heading to jail.

J_R
09-04-2010, 05:33 PM
The Texans have placed the following players on the reserve injured list:

André Davis WR Virginia Tech
Kris Brown K Nebraska
NamePos. College

??? Reaching an injury settlement I assume

dalemurphy
09-04-2010, 05:35 PM
Maybe Caldwell looked dumb with the interception but he looked like a genius on Addai's TD.

And this is just one year's worth of data. I looked at some previous years and there were a lot more teams represented than just those in this list. Like Lucky said, it's a boom or bust play. The stats definitely bear that out but to say that only poorly coached teams do it or it's only done by either bad teams/coaches is wrong. Every team has this in their arsenal and every team brings it out from time to time.

As I argued last season, even the greatest coaches make bonehead decisions. We are more sensitive to the Kubiak mistakes because we follow them closer. Last season, for instance, Bill Belichek made a number of horrible decisions, just like the one Kubiak made against Jacksonville.

GP
09-04-2010, 05:36 PM
My main point, in this court case, is that the situation did not call for the HB Pass. And saying the player is to blame is reckless. The player's gotta' do what he was told to do, and my client (Chris Brown) was put in harm's way at the behest of his supervisor.

Furthermore, I would like to call a committee to review the HB Pass to make a determination if this play is an endangerment to both the coach AND the player. We need to review if the play itself is to be stricken from the playbook altogether, in the best interests of all parties.

The Pencil Neck
09-04-2010, 05:38 PM
Yes, because THAT day we really were running the ball very well weren't we?

Oh, wait. That's right...we amassed 56 yards of rushing between TWO running backs. Our run game was atrocious that game. Would you have mentioned that stat at all? Hmmm?

Hell, Grossman had 9 yards to Chris Brown's 15. Grossman had a higher rushing average that day than Chris Brown. LOL!!!! (link to the stats if you want to look) (http://www.nfl.com/gamecenter/2009120605/2009/REG13/texans@jaguars#tab:analyze)

So let's abandon the pass game, the thing we WERE doing well. Let's do the HB Pass near the EZ. On first down. Because we had been burnin' 'em on the run all day. LOL.

I think the jury knows how to rule on this verdict, TPN. Your client is heading to jail.

Let's look at that particular drive.

1 - Pass for 8 yards.
2 - Run for 4 yards.
3 - Pass for 53 yards.
4 - Pass for 6 yards.
5 - Run for 3 yards.
6 - Run for 2 yards and a first down.
7 - HB Pass on First down and goal from the 5.

We had not abandoned the run. The HB pass fake worked perfectly. The play didn't fail because the Jags realized it wasn't a run play, it failed because they were so sold out on the run play that they hit CB as he was throwing so he put up a duck that was intercepted. If he had gotten the throw off cleanly, Dreessen was in the end zone all alone and it would have been a touchdown.

HB passes are frequently thrown in this exact down and distance situation. That's where most of the TD's are made with the play.

It didn't work but that doesn't make it a bad play call.

GP
09-04-2010, 05:41 PM
As I argued last season, even the greatest coaches make bonehead decisions. We are more sensitive to the Kubiak mistakes because we follow them closer. Last season, for instance, Bill Belichek made a number of horrible decisions, just like the one Kubiak made against Jacksonville.

Yeah, but I want us to examine that whole game.

We left Jacoby Jones in Houston because he was LATE to a meeting. Kubiak got all Bug Boy Pants on him, and flew out without him. That's mistake #1. You don't leave talent behind, against a divisional rival and certainly not when you're chasing the playoffs. I have said it over and over: Let him play, then fine his ass so much money that he won't EVER be late to a meeting again. He'll even offer to open up the facility 4 hours early if he can.

Mistake 2 was the HB Pass, and it crushed our momentum. It revived the Jags. It crushed our spirit. Then MJD did his thang later on.

A total disaster, IMO, from before that plane left Houston and until the final whistle of the game. I don't want my head coach to be perfect, but it would be nice if they just got ot of the way every now and then.

Overall, he's a good coach. That playcall was irresponsible for any head coach, considering all factors surrounding it.

The Pencil Neck
09-04-2010, 05:43 PM
My main point, in this court case, is that the situation did not call for the HB Pass. And saying the player is to blame is reckless. The player's gotta' do what he was told to do, and my client (Chris Brown) was put in harm's way at the behest of his supervisor.

Furthermore, I would like to call a committee to review the HB Pass to make a determination if this play is an endangerment to both the coach AND the player. We need to review if the play itself is to be stricken from the playbook altogether, in the best interests of all parties.

The situation did call for the play. The player is not being blamed by me.

The play itself is a dangerous and risky play. It's a boom or bust play. It's an interception as often as it's a touchdown. But every team in the league has the play in their playbook and most teams attempt it from time to time. If you're going to judge Kubiak unfavorably for using the play, then you've got to also judge all the other coaches in the league the same way.

GP
09-04-2010, 05:46 PM
We had not abandoned the run. The HB pass fake worked perfectly. The play didn't fail because the Jags realized it wasn't a run play, it failed because they were so sold out on the run play that they hit CB as he was throwing so he put up a duck that was intercepted. If he had gotten the throw off cleanly, Dreessen was in the end zone all alone and it would have been a touchdown.

HB passes are frequently thrown in this exact down and distance situation. That's where most of the TD's are made with the play.

It didn't work but that doesn't make it a bad play call.

It was not sold well. I watched that play over and over, TPN!

Chris Brown was slowing down and drawing the ball up to a throwing position wayyyyy too early. WAY too early. I remember watching the defense just float sideways, stringing it out to the sideline. The DBs were onto it the whole time, and nobody on our side could make the defense adjust the way we wanted them to.

That was not the "sold play" you're making it out to be.

And look at the game OVERALL. We had 41 yards by Moats and 15 yards by Brown. Grossman pushing Brown's stats, btw, and maybe threatening Brown's depth position at RB.

We gave up. We played to them. Instead of making them stop our passing game, we got careless and tried to experiment. Meanwhile, Del Rio just gave us the same old dose of Garrard and MJD. All day. You didn't see Del Rio start throwing the ball at the end of the game did you? Hell no. Del Rio stuck to what works.

I rest. I think I have laid it out pretty well. At this point, we're in a pissing contest. As usual.

GP
09-04-2010, 05:49 PM
The situation did call for the play. The player is not being blamed by me.

The play itself is a dangerous and risky play. It's a boom or bust play. It's an interception as often as it's a touchdown. But every team in the league has the play in their playbook and most teams attempt it from time to time. If you're going to judge Kubiak unfavorably for using the play, then you've got to also judge all the other coaches in the league the same way.

Gawd you're reeling me back in.

I don't think Kubiak is an awful coach for calling the play. He is, IMO, the guy where the buck stops. It stops with him. He called the play. And for down & distance (just yards from paydirt!!!!!!), the call blew goats.

I hate the call. And just because it's an available play in all coaches' books, doesn't mean it is an awesome play. It's football lotto. I hate it.

thunderkyss
09-04-2010, 05:49 PM
I rest. I think I have laid it out pretty well. At this point, we're in a pissing contest. As usual.

I agree.

I hope it becomes a staple play for us, and we do it at least once every half.

GP
09-04-2010, 05:51 PM
I agree.

I hope it becomes a staple play for us, and we do it at least once every half.

LOL.

TK, if it became a play we use once-per-half, I'm going to need a large bottle of whiskey on gameday.

J_R
09-04-2010, 05:51 PM
Brown has been placed on injured reserve, which means that he's still part of the team and will be paid unless/until released with a settlement agreement.

....

JB
09-04-2010, 05:54 PM
....

It would really help if you posted links with this kinda info...

The Pencil Neck
09-04-2010, 05:54 PM
I agree.

I hope it becomes a staple play for us, and we do it at least once every half.

Just once every 2-3 years like most teams.

J_R
09-04-2010, 06:04 PM
It would really help if you posted links with this kinda info...

Sorry

SportsRadioRH (http://twitter.com/SportsRadioRH)

#Texans (http://twitter.com/search?q=%23Texans) place K Kris Brown on IR, pending injury settlement. He will be released once a settlement is worked out. #nfl (http://twitter.com/search?q=%23nfl) #hounews (http://twitter.com/search?q=%23hounews)

Brando
09-04-2010, 06:05 PM
Texans don't cut kicker Kris Brown, they put him on IR with foot injury.


from Paul Kuharsky Espn

ChampionTexan
09-04-2010, 06:07 PM
Texans don't cut kicker Kris Brown, they put him on IR with foot injury.


from Paul Kuharsky Espn

Keep in mind that you can't release an injured player unless you reach an injury settlement first.

Maybe they want to have him available for next year, maybe they're just working out the details on the settlement.
(and keep it down - 2/3's of this board is probably hungover)

Brando
09-04-2010, 06:11 PM
Keep in mind that you can't release an injured player unless you reach an injury settlement first.

Maybe they want to have him available for next year, maybe they're just working out the details on the settlement.
(and keep it down - 2/3's of this board is probably hungover)

lol

thunderkyss
09-04-2010, 06:14 PM
LOL.

TK, if it became a play we use once-per-half, I'm going to need a large bottle of whiskey on gameday.

That's how I get through away games. At home with a bottle of Crown.

b0ng
09-04-2010, 06:26 PM
You guys are crazy alcohol makes me violent. I prefer. . . Organic compunds to help me through the games and as your attorney I advise you to do the same.

thunderkyss
09-04-2010, 06:27 PM
You guys are crazy alcohol makes me violent. I prefer. . . Organic compunds to help me through the games and as your attorney I advise you to do the same.

Those organic compounds make me paranoid. I'll be watching the game, & I'll swear Kubiak is doing that shit just to piss me off.

The Pencil Neck
09-04-2010, 06:40 PM
Those organic compounds make me paranoid. I'll be watching the game, & I'll swear Kubiak is doing that shit just to piss me off.

Dude.

He is.

JB
09-04-2010, 07:29 PM
You guys are crazy alcohol makes me violent. I prefer. . . Organic compunds to help me through the games and as your attorney I advise you to do the same.

I like both!

Those organic compounds make me paranoid. I'll be watching the game, & I'll swear Kubiak is doing that shit just to piss me off.

I know the feeling well!

Dude.

He is.

:lol:

LMAO!!! Rep to all of you!



edit: TK got the old MSR... will catch you up later!

dalemurphy
09-04-2010, 08:18 PM
Those organic compounds make me paranoid. I'll be watching the game, & I'll swear Kubiak is doing that shit just to piss me off.

That's nothing! I will be completely sober and believe that God is causing this all to happen just to punish me.

GP
09-04-2010, 08:21 PM
The situation did call for the play. The player is not being blamed by me.

The play itself is a dangerous and risky play. It's a boom or bust play. It's an interception as often as it's a touchdown. But every team in the league has the play in their playbook and most teams attempt it from time to time. If you're going to judge Kubiak unfavorably for using the play, then you've got to also judge all the other coaches in the league the same way.

BTW, I never said that only our coach does this stupid play.

And if we're going by the old "Hey, so-and-so does it" routine...then let's talk about jumping off bridges, doing some nose candy, and spray-on tanning.

Some things are just dumb. Mr. HB Pass is dumb.

Onside kicks are fun, too, but you don't see teams doing them 50% of the time. That's because they are situational. Kubiak pulled out a play that was outside the realm of situational. And he paid for it.

But that's the allure of the HB Pass. It tempts you into thinking that it's a great play when 90% of the time...it's not. I hold HB Pass as the ultimate problem here. Then it trickles down to the coach who calls it, and the player who is forced to be a goat or a hero by "executing" the play.

HB Pass belongs on the Island of Misfit Football Plays. Of course, this would rob us all of the old NFL Follies vault of HB Pass blunders.

GP
09-04-2010, 08:41 PM
Now HERE is a trick play that I like: Wake Forest Gets Pwned By Presbyterian (http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=5527327)

ObsiWan
09-04-2010, 09:16 PM
BTW, I never said that only our coach does this stupid play.

And if we're going by the old "Hey, so-and-so does it" routine...then let's talk about jumping off bridges, doing some nose candy, and spray-on tanning.

Some things are just dumb. Mr. HB Pass is dumb.

Onside kicks are fun, too, but you don't see teams doing them 50% of the time. That's because they are situational. Kubiak pulled out a play that was outside the realm of situational. And he paid for it.

But that's the allure of the HB Pass. It tempts you into thinking that it's a great play when 90% of the time...it's not. I hold HB Pass as the ultimate problem here. Then it trickles down to the coach who calls it, and the player who is forced to be a goat or a hero by "executing" the play.

HB Pass belongs on the Island of Misfit Football Plays. Of course, this would rob us all of the old NFL Follies vault of HB Pass blunders.

Lawd! Y'all will still be arguing
:slapfight:
about that danged play in 3010.

For your own sanity...
Let
It
GO!

gary
09-04-2010, 09:18 PM
The HB pass is over and done with. Gary called it hoping and thinking his players would run it perfectly they did not therefore it looked stupid. All coaches to a gamble every now and then and if you convert them you are a hero. If not, you will get called out for it. Everytime a team decides to go for a two point convertion there is a risk involved. For that matter each time the QB throws there is a risk he takes but that does not mean he should stop throwing the football. Gary gave it shot like all coaches take shots during a game but it did not work out due to poor play on the field and I doubt he ever calls that play again surely not on first down for the rest of his career as a HC. When I look back at that game I see lots of mistakes/reasons besides the HB pass why the Texans lost that game. For one thing they just began their come a day late and came up a dollar short but hopefully that play was just a new try that's all but life goes on. Note, I am not defending the play call at all but I am just not as angry as some simply because a chance was taken and the luck of the draw did not go the Texans way on that play. Sorry.

ObsiWan
09-04-2010, 09:22 PM
The HB pass is over and done with. Gary called it hoping and thinking his players would run it perfectly they did not therefore it looked stupid. All coaches to a gamble every now and then and if you convert them you are a hero. If not, you will get called out for it. Everytime a team decides to go for a two point convertion there is a risk involved. For that matter each time the QB throws there is a risk he takes but that does not mean he should stop throwing the football. Gary gave it shot like all coaches take shots during a game but it did not work out due to poor play on the field and I doubt he ever calls that play again surely not on first down for the rest of his career as a HC. When I look back at that game I see lots of mistakes/reasons besides the HB pass why the Texans lost that game. For one thing they just began their come a day late and came up a dollar short but hopefully that play was just a new try that's all but life goes on. Note, I am not defending the play call at all but I am just not as angry as some simply because a chance was taken and the luck of the draw did not go the Texans way on that play. Sorry.

Well said.
[must spread rep....]

gary
09-04-2010, 09:37 PM
Well said.
[must spread rep....]Thank you. That play falls more on Chris Brown IMO. He should have either thown it OB or just gone down with it and try another play/down.

GP
09-04-2010, 09:43 PM
Lawd! Y'all will still be arguing
:slapfight:
about that danged play in 3010.

For your own sanity...
Let
It
GO!

I'm too far gone, doc. I'm terminal.

GuerillaBlack
09-05-2010, 12:48 PM
You guys are crazy alcohol makes me violent. I prefer. . . Organic compunds to help me through the games and as your attorney I advise you to do the same.

I'm right there with you, bong.

Thorn
09-05-2010, 12:50 PM
Now HERE is a trick play that I like: Wake Forest Gets Pwned By Presbyterian (http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=5527327)

LOL, good one!