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El Tejano
09-01-2010, 07:31 AM
Ok so I'm hearing alot from my Cowboys friends at work that you could tell Dallas was playing very vanilla on both offense and defense and that we were really scheming more than they were. I told them that going 3 wide and doing play action is what we do. I did notice us going with different formations on defense though.

Then I look at the game again and Phil Simms mentions that Dallas is going very vanilla with not crossing any of the dlineman and no moving of wrs.

Do you think we may have showed our hand to Dallas and it will affect the next time we play them?

Malloy
09-01-2010, 07:57 AM
Hm... not really. I believe that our plays were for the benefit of us, to get some things tried out in a 'game-like' situation and see how players react. I'm assuming that we might have seen an indication of what is to come, but honestly I think we only saw, and showed, the top of the iceberg.

I'm not too worried, and if we should lose I'm absolutely sure it won't be because of what we showed out opponents in pre-season. After all, all they have to do is to look at what we do the first couple of weeks in the season. :)

nero THE zero
09-01-2010, 08:07 AM
There's a difference between scheming for a team and playing vanilla.

Just because we were running stunts and blitzes doesn't mean that we were running the stunts and blitzes we feel would be most effective against Dallas' weaknesses (re: scheming).

The point of the preseason is to get a look at different packages, personnel, and wrinkles and to get those ironed out before the season starts. You can't really do that if you're playing vanilla. Obviously some teams, like the Cowboys or Richard Smith's defenses, are comfortable enough with their playbook that they'd rather not show anything on film. Others, OTOH, like to get a look at a variety of stuff in the preseason to make adjustments before the games that matter start.

TimeKiller
09-01-2010, 08:17 AM
The Texans were being tricky little bastards and the boys just laid there and took it? Vanilla or not, at some point PRIDE has to work it's way in. I guess that point (or points, SEVEN of them) was after all the players that mattered exited the game. This is just ridiculous to me, how can you get SHUT THE **** OUT and then excuse it by saying "oh we weren't trying hard"? You take that domination Cowboy fan, you take it and you LOVE it. Except that this stinks to high heaven of Richard Smith Defense "Oops we just got our asses handed to us" Vanilla. One compadre told me they didn't have Dez Bryant and he'll set us on fire....sure. You send ol' Dezzy boy across the middle to meet Mr. Pollard, he's the welcome wagon.

b0ng
09-01-2010, 08:20 AM
Did New Orleans just scheme us or did we play like crap? Is it possible that the Cowboys just played like crap or are they just playing possum? Hmmm...

ChampionTexan
09-01-2010, 08:22 AM
Ok so I'm hearing alot from my Cowboys friends at work that you could tell Dallas was playing very vanilla on both offense and defense and that we were really scheming more than they were. I told them that going 3 wide and doing play action is what we do. I did notice us going with different formations on defense though.

Then I look at the game again and Phil Simms mentions that Dallas is going very vanilla with not crossing any of the dlineman and no moving of wrs.

Do you think we may have showed our hand to Dallas and it will affect the next time we play them?

Because when you can't do vanilla very well, it's a pretty good bet that making things more complicated will fix everything.

Stemp
09-01-2010, 08:33 AM
Because when you can't do vanilla very well, it's a pretty good bet that making things more complicated will fix everything.

I agree with your sarcasm.
Good execution with vanilla playcalling will have better results than poor execution and exotic playcalling. Cowboys didn't execute and getting tricky or exotic probably wouldn't have helped much.

I still can't believe people are picking them to win the SB.

IDEXAN
09-01-2010, 08:38 AM
It's a preseason game which is now over, finished, ancient history ? Understand ? If impressing your Cowboy buddies at work is so important to you, you may really want to be a member of their group whether or not you realize it ? Otherwise forgetaboutit and start thinking about what is really important and relevant to the Texans - Peyton Manning/Indy Colts on 9/12.

GP
09-01-2010, 08:38 AM
I have a theory about this.

1. There's not much, outside of a very very "new" play that you've drawn up and practiced that nobody has seen yet, that you're going to do in the NFL that is going to make coordinators lose sleep at night.

2. Why not go out there, preseason or scrimmage or whatever, and just do what you're going to do and make the other team stop you from doing it?

3. We were not playing vanilla offense or defense against the Saints, IMO. We were just out of it and never really cared. I suspect Dallas was the same way, because Tony Romo looked mad and his sideline interview reflected that he was frustrated. Point blank: They didn't get up for the game, they walked into our house (like we walked into the Saints' house) and got their rears handed to them (like we got ours handed to us a week prior).

Dallas, with Romo at QB, is going to be mediocre. He's one of the most erratic QBs out there. Whe he's on, he's on. When he's off, he's way off. The fluctuation between being on and being off, with a guy like Schaub at QB, is a lot less severe than it is with Romo. IMO.

BigBull17
09-01-2010, 09:01 AM
Because when you can't do vanilla very well, it's a pretty good bet that making things more complicated will fix everything.

Yeah. It's not that they were vanilla, they were getting blown off the ball. On the 2nd TD, they were getting drove toward the back of the end zone. Even if you're keeping it simple, that should NEVER happen. That is man on man beat down.

GP
09-01-2010, 09:27 AM
Yeah. It's not that they were vanilla, they were getting blown off the ball. On the 2nd TD, they were getting drove toward the back of the end zone. Even if you're keeping it simple, that should NEVER happen. That is man on man beat down.

And this is the problem I have with Cowboys fans as a group.

They think because of their past, they never have to face the reality of the present.

There are some Cowboys fans that this doesn't apply to...but let me ask people this: "Do you think MOST Cowboys fans are legitimate fans who see the faults of their team, or are they the fans that know their owner is rich, will spend an enormous amount of money every year, do things bigger and better, and have had a history of winning titles?"

I think the majority of Cowboys fans live in a bubble. Texans fans don't because we have a history of blowing 35-3 leads with a Super Bowl bid on the line. We have a history, in terms of the Texans franchise, of being ragged on for passing on Reggie Bush (man oh man! how dumb are those Texans!) and for not having a good offensive line that killed David Carr's supposed chances of being a Pro Bowl QB.

The point is that they live in a bubble. Had they done to us what we did to them, they would have made fun of us and said "That's alright, Texans fans. You just saw how a real team does things," etc. Instead, on Monday it was "Yeah, but we weren't doing anything to tip our hand to you guys."

It's comical. And it makes the beatdown even better for this fan.

Texan_Bill
09-01-2010, 09:29 AM
Ok so I'm hearing alot from my Cowboys friends at work that you could tell Dallas was playing very vanilla on both offense and defense and that we were really scheming more than they were. I told them that going 3 wide and doing play action is what we do. I did notice us going with different formations on defense though.

Then I look at the game again and Phil Simms mentions that Dallas is going very vanilla with not crossing any of the dlineman and no moving of wrs.

Do you think we may have showed our hand to Dallas and it will affect the next time we play them?

Sounds to me like losers making excuses. Did they game plan for us? No. I seriously doubt we did for them either. What was so game planned about punching Dallas in the mouth as it relates to the running game?? Nada! We had certain plays that we wanted to run and vice versa.

Look, the third game of the preseason is the most important for everyone and while specific game planning for the other team may not be that prevelant, rest assured, there were certain things Dallas wanted to do and / or accomplish. Ask you Dallas friends if Romo pitching the ball when the RB was expecting a hand-off is part of that "vanilla" game plan...

I'm not going to talk trash because I fully expect a different Gurls team here in week 3. That said, Cryboy fan needs to quit making excuses and also just look forward to the game that will count in a few weeks...

Rey
09-01-2010, 09:34 AM
The Cowboys may have been playing Vanilla but it's not like the Texans were playing Cookies and cream.

Texan_Bill
09-01-2010, 09:37 AM
The Cowboys may have been playing Vanilla but it's not like the Texans were playing Cookies and cream.

Nice.... Spot on too.

ArlingtonTexan
09-01-2010, 09:38 AM
Fumbling snaps, dropping passes, and missing handoffs is not vanilla scheming, but poor play. Dallas' offense scored only 1 TD during the entire pre-season on an eight yard drive.

Ole Miss Texan
09-01-2010, 09:47 AM
1. I could care less if we "showed our hand". If we lose to Dallas or many other teams because we "showed our hand", it just means we weren't that good to begin with and don't deserve to make the playoffs. Your a great team when the other team knows your going to run the ball and you run it and still make the 1st down. That's where we need to be.

2. Dallas played terribly - nothing vanilla about that. An offensive line doesn't "play vanilla" and let the Defensive Line blow through them and get to their pro bowl quarter back.

The Pencil Neck
09-01-2010, 09:51 AM
Sounds to me like losers making excuses. Did they game plan for us? No. I seriously doubt we did for them either.

I went to a couple of Dallas sites after the game to take a look at the comments and according to some of those fans (who were REALLY pissed off), Romo and Phillips said that they WERE going to game plan for this game prior to the game and then flip flopped and said they didn't AFTER the game.

Most teams treat the 3rd preseason game as a dress rehearsal for the season. They install some special things for the team they're playing and check a little film. I don't know if Dallas did that or not but in the Cowboy game, we did the same things we've been doing all pre-season.

If they had watched any of our games, they would have known what to expect.

Dallas just came out flat and couldn't get it together. That's not the team we're going to face the 3rd week of the season. Probably.

Pantherstang84
09-01-2010, 10:24 AM
1. I could care less if we "showed our hand". If we lose to Dallas or many other teams because we "showed our hand", it just means we weren't that good to begin with and don't deserve to make the playoffs. Your a great team when the other team knows your going to run the ball and you run it and still make the 1st down. That's where we need to be.

2. Dallas played terribly - nothing vanilla about that. An offensive line doesn't "play vanilla" and let the Defensive Line blow through them and get to their pro bowl quarter back.

I've got to rep you based on those two sentences alone.

Texan_Bill
09-01-2010, 10:31 AM
I went to a couple of Dallas sites after the game to take a look at the comments and according to some of those fans (who were REALLY pissed off), Romo and Phillips said that they WERE going to game plan for this game prior to the game and then flip flopped and said they didn't AFTER the game.

There's a surprise! :rolleyes: Damage control!! Calling damage control!!!

Most teams treat the 3rd preseason game as a dress rehearsal for the season. They install some special things for the team they're playing and check a little film. I don't know if Dallas did that or not but in the Cowboy game, we did the same things we've been doing all pre-season.

If they had watched any of our games, they would have known what to expect.

Exactly. Whether you specifically game plan for a team doesn't matter. The third preseason game is meant for you to come out sharp and at least execute (God, I feel dirty in Dom Capers sorta way) your plays, irrespective of what the defense is trying to do against you. Fumbling balls away or making bad pitches, what have you is completely irrelevant to "game planning" a team.

Dallas just came out flat and couldn't get it together. That's not the team we're going to face the 3rd week of the season. Probably.

Who knows? Maybe that is the Cowboys this season. Again, the 3rd preseason game is when you should be your sharpest. If they were that lost last Saturday night, who's to say that they will be much better in week 3... (although I have a hunch they will be a lot better come week 3). ;)

BigBull17
09-01-2010, 10:43 AM
And this is the problem I have with Cowboys fans as a group.

They think because of their past, they never have to face the reality of the present.

There are some Cowboys fans that this doesn't apply to...but let me ask people this: "Do you think MOST Cowboys fans are legitimate fans who see the faults of their team, or are they the fans that know their owner is rich, will spend an enormous amount of money every year, do things bigger and better, and have had a history of winning titles?"

I think the majority of Cowboys fans live in a bubble. Texans fans don't because we have a history of blowing 35-3 leads with a Super Bowl bid on the line. We have a history, in terms of the Texans franchise, of being ragged on for passing on Reggie Bush (man oh man! how dumb are those Texans!) and for not having a good offensive line that killed David Carr's supposed chances of being a Pro Bowl QB.

The point is that they live in a bubble. Had they done to us what we did to them, they would have made fun of us and said "That's alright, Texans fans. You just saw how a real team does things," etc. Instead, on Monday it was "Yeah, but we weren't doing anything to tip our hand to you guys."

It's comical. And it makes the beatdown even better for this fan.

You cant hear it, but I'm giving you a slow clap.

sbalderrama
09-01-2010, 11:54 AM
what struck me was Wades post game comments http://www.houstontexans.com/news/Story.asp?story_id=6315


Defensively, it looked like they knew we weren't going to come after them at all on any of their three wide stuff, which we didn't, and they took advantage of that and then they had four wides and empty sets that we hadn't worked on and that's my fault. We weren't really prepared for that and they did a good job of executing....

They got a blitz on us that we didn't prepare for and that's our fault, my fault. ...


Can you imagine the uproar here if Kubiak said that stuff? So Wade, its almost the end of preseason and your defense hasn't been taught how to deal with 4 wides yet? Really? Shoudn't some of the veterans at least remember some of the stuff they learned last year?

El Tejano
09-01-2010, 12:00 PM
Fumbling snaps, dropping passes, and missing handoffs is not vanilla scheming, but poor play. Dallas' offense scored only 1 TD during the entire pre-season on an eight yard drive.

That's what I told him. I was saying "hey I'm not even talking crap here bro, but your team doesn't look like they are ready. Vanilla or not, nothing can erase that your 1s only scored 1 TD in preseason and it came after you got the ball at like the 15. Even your coach is frustrated because he's thinking of playing the ones in the last preseason game. You can't tell me you aren't worried about that number."

He basically was like, 'well we'll just turn it on when the real bullets fly'

I told him that once upon a time, The Texans ended the 2004 season 7-9 and we thought 2005 would bring us 9-7 because of what we did last year. However, in our preseason our offense struggled really bad. Everyone said Vanilla this Vanilla that. Then all of a sudden we saw in reg season what we saw in preseason.

Stemp
09-01-2010, 12:07 PM
That's what I told him. I was saying "hey I'm not even talking crap here bro, but your team doesn't look like they are ready. Vanilla or not, nothing can erase that your 1s only scored 1 TD in preseason and it came after you got the ball at like the 15. Even your coach is frustrated because he's thinking of playing the ones in the last preseason game. You can't tell me you aren't worried about that number."

He basically was like, 'well we'll just turn it on when the real bullets fly'

I told him that once upon a time, The Texans ended the 2004 season 7-9 and we thought 2005 would bring us 9-7 because of what we did last year. However, in our preseason our offense struggled really bad. Everyone said Vanilla this Vanilla that. Then all of a sudden we saw in reg season what we saw in preseason.

"But we're Dallas. We won Super Bowls 2 decades ago! Don't you understand that?!"

El Tejano
09-01-2010, 12:23 PM
what struck me was Wades post game comments http://www.houstontexans.com/news/Story.asp?story_id=6315



Can you imagine the uproar here if Kubiak said that stuff? So Wade, its almost the end of preseason and your defense hasn't been taught how to deal with 4 wides yet? Really? Shoudn't some of the veterans at least remember some of the stuff they learned last year?

No crap man. So Wade, thanks for letting us know that you will be preparing for that now. Since you are preparing for that, we'll get prepared to be a smash mouth team to suprise you yet again. Oh by the way Wade, Schaub is pretty decent at picking up blitzes...thus they knew you weren't coming after them.

El Tejano
09-01-2010, 12:25 PM
"But we're Dallas. We won Super Bowls 2 decades ago! Don't you understand that?!"

That's pretty much the response. Noone even wants to say ' Man Andre is a beast or we couldn't tackle Foster.' The real cowboy fans are worried though.

Hervoyel
09-01-2010, 12:25 PM
I view the results of the Dallas preseason game the same way I see the Saints preseason game. One team (Dallas in this case, us the previous week in New Orleans) had "one of those games". You know the kind of game where you screw up simple things and can't get out of your own way? That was Dallas Sunday. The previous week we'd start to get a little drive going and screw up and kill it. Yes, the Saints played lights out but they didn't do anything incredibly complicated or dynamic. they just lined up their offense and played. We didn't tackle. We didn't cover. We didn't take care of the ball and turned it over. We didn't put ourselves in a position to win.

The Dallas game was the exact opposite. They killed as many of their drives with boneheaded mistakes as we stopped. We played great and didn't have those kinds of problems but the game was as lopsided as it was because of their mistakes.

The game in week three will more than likely in no way resemble the one we saw last Sunday. That isn't because the Cowboys weren't trying or because the Texans emptied their box of tricks against a vanilla Cowboys team that was just trying to get home. It's because the teams will both base their game plans on the two previous weeks of film and what they see from last season.

thunderkyss
09-01-2010, 12:27 PM
Did New Orleans just scheme us or did we play like crap? Is it possible that the Cowboys just played like crap or are they just playing possum? Hmmm...

I think the Saints wanted to put on a show for their home crowd. We wanted to practice.

Same as we wanted to put on a show for our home crowd, and they wanted to practice.

I wasn't at all worried about this team after the Saints game. However, it was no secret that our coaches were, and I can't imagine what McNair's face looked like.

But I did see Jerry's face at Reliant, and he looked concerned to me. The word is they haven't looked good all preseason long. It was something they said they were going to fix. But we've seen no evidence that they've got a handle on the "problem."

If I were a Cowboy fan, even though I would never say it, I would be a little concerned.

Texan_Bill
09-01-2010, 12:31 PM
You cant hear it, but I'm giving you a slow clap.

This guy came to mind:

http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z213/LittleLady718/gifs/applause.gif

CloakNNNdagger
09-01-2010, 12:44 PM
I think the Saints wanted to put on a show for their home crowd. We wanted to practice.

Same as we wanted to put on a show for our home crowd, and they wanted to practice.

I wasn't at all worried about this team after the Saints game. However, it was no secret that our coaches were, and I can't imagine what McNair's face looked like.

But I did see Jerry's face at Reliant, and he looked concerned to me. The word is they haven't looked good all preseason long. It was something they said they were going to fix. But we've seen no evidence that they've got a handle on the "problem."

If I were a Cowboy fan, even though I would never say it, I would be a little concerned.

Some interesting comments (http://sports.espn.go.com/dallas/nfl/columns/story?columnist=mosley_matt&id=5519063).

If there's any carryover effect once the regular-season starts, rest assured that owner Jerry Jones will be criticized for holding one of the longest training camps in league history.

"I understand our fans' concern," Jones said Tuesday. "I really do understand everyone's concern," Jones said. "It's as understandable as it can be, but I look back at the experience we've had in preseason and it hasn't impacted how successful we've been in the regular season. I think our best seasons have been when we traveled the most, and those kinds of things."

BESIDES a team that doesn't look so great NOW, quite of few injured players......sceduled to return for the regular season. Will they play well right after reinsertion? Will they be held back because of residual injury effects? Will their not playing for a while with the rest of the girls make a difference?
Will they re-injure easily once on the field again?

There are enough reasons to be concerned about what the real season will bring the Girls.

For sure, we should get a better idea by the time we face them in Week 3.

ChampionTexan
09-01-2010, 12:51 PM
I view the results of the Dallas preseason game the same way I see the Saints preseason game. One team (Dallas in this case, us the previous week in New Orleans) had "one of those games". You know the kind of game where you screw up simple things and can't get out of your own way? That was Dallas Sunday. The previous week we'd start to get a little drive going and screw up and kill it. Yes, the Saints played lights out but they didn't do anything incredibly complicated or dynamic. they just lined up their offense and played. We didn't tackle. We didn't cover. We didn't take care of the ball and turned it over. We didn't put ourselves in a position to win.

The Dallas game was the exact opposite. They killed as many of their drives with boneheaded mistakes as we stopped. We played great and didn't have those kinds of problems but the game was as lopsided as it was because of their mistakes.

The game in week three will more than likely in no way resemble the one we saw last Sunday. That isn't because the Cowboys weren't trying or because the Texans emptied their box of tricks against a vanilla Cowboys team that was just trying to get home. It's because the teams will both base their game plans on the two previous weeks of film and what they see from last season.

Yeah, but a potential difference is that the Texans have two other games that make the third look like it might be the exception. The Cowboys have three other games that make the fourth look like it might be part of a pattern.

We'll know more in week 3, but I know if our high-powered offense had looked bad in every game we played, I'd be concerned.

GuerillaBlack
09-01-2010, 01:55 PM
I think the Saints wanted to put on a show for their home crowd. We wanted to practice.

Same as we wanted to put on a show for our home crowd, and they wanted to practice.

I wasn't at all worried about this team after the Saints game. However, it was no secret that our coaches were, and I can't imagine what McNair's face looked like.

But I did see Jerry's face at Reliant, and he looked concerned to me. The word is they haven't looked good all preseason long. It was something they said they were going to fix. But we've seen no evidence that they've got a handle on the "problem."

If I were a Cowboy fan, even though I would never say it, I would be a little concerned.

I thought you were a Cowboys fan? You post at Cowboys-Forum don't you?

hookinreds
09-01-2010, 02:59 PM
Vanilla and piss poor play is a good recipe for staters playing more minutes in the 4th preseason game...that's smart football.

DexmanC
09-01-2010, 03:08 PM
I think the Saints wanted to put on a show for their home crowd. We wanted to practice.

Same as we wanted to put on a show for our home crowd, and they wanted to practice.

I wasn't at all worried about this team after the Saints game. However, it was no secret that our coaches were, and I can't imagine what McNair's face looked like.

But I did see Jerry's face at Reliant, and he looked concerned to me. The word is they haven't looked good all preseason long. It was something they said they were going to fix. But we've seen no evidence that they've got a handle on the "problem."

If I were a Cowboy fan, even though I would never say it, I would be a little concerned.


I'm soooo tempted to make a GIF of Jerry swiggin' after that Foster
touchdown. I think I'll wait 'till week 3.

Mr teX
09-01-2010, 03:12 PM
this is all irrelevant from the standpoint that we play them in week 3.....not week 1. Therefore, if they were playing vanilla so as not to show us anything, what, so they won't show anything to washington in week 1 or chicago in week 2 when the games matter? There will invariably be stuff on tape from the previous 2 weeks in the regular season we will be able to gameplan for come week 3...so wade (& phil simms for that matter) STFU with that nonsense. they just guys got smacked around......period.

If he would've just came out & said that they just weren't up for the game for any other reason than this.....i probably would've accepted it. I think we all know that wasn't dallas' best but to act like there was some master plan in the works is just insulting everyone's intelligence.....inlcuding his own fan base.

HJam72
09-01-2010, 03:15 PM
Never insult your base, 'cuz if it leaves, you'll fall over.

GP
09-01-2010, 03:37 PM
I'm soooo tempted to make a GIF of Jerry swiggin' after that Foster
touchdown. I think I'll wait 'till week 3.

I think it was vodka, not water. LOL.

He was swiggin' with intensity.

Ole Miss Texan
09-01-2010, 03:38 PM
I'm soooo tempted to make a GIF of Jerry swiggin' after that Foster
touchdown. I think I'll wait 'till week 3.

I didn't see it. Do it nowww!!!

CloakNNNdagger
09-01-2010, 04:38 PM
http://i295.photobucket.com/albums/mm159/jmccutchan/jerryboohoo.jpg

Dear Lord, if you just let me win one game, I'll never make another decision for you again.

thunderkyss
09-01-2010, 06:35 PM
I thought you were a Cowboys fan? You post at Cowboys-Forum don't you?

I vote for all Texas teams. UT, UH, TT, A&M, Astros, Rangers, Rockets, Spurs, Mavs, Cowboys

I'm a Texan.

I post on their forum, because I like Football. I post on the Colts forum, and one of the Titan's forums as well.

I do not consider myself a Cowboy fan. I do not follow the team like I follow the Texans, there's no emotional connection.