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Ryan
08-29-2010, 01:24 AM
During the postgame interview, as well as the info on Slaton, Kubiak also mentioned that Kris Brown got injured in this game. He said it was plantar fascitis. Not sure how much of an effect it can have on him but it is something to take note of.

Brisco_County
08-29-2010, 01:33 AM
During the postgame interview, as well as the info on Slaton, Kubiak also mentioned that Kris Brown got injured in this game. He said it was plantar fascitis. Not sure how much of an effect it can have on him but it is something to take note of.

If this is true, Neil Rackers is our new kicker.

I understand plantar fasciitis to be a condition, not an injury. The plantar fascia is connective tissue between the heal and the sole of the foot. It becomes inflamed and makes it painful to bear weight on that foot. It usually requires surgery.

Texans fans should be familiar with this condition. Mario Williams played his entire rookie season with it.

Carr Bombed
08-29-2010, 01:36 AM
Kicker competition over.....

If everything is equal, you got to take the guy who's healthy. This injury could actually be a blessing....makes that decision MUCH easier.

Brisco_County
08-29-2010, 01:46 AM
Kicker competition over.....

If everything is equal, you got to take the guy who's healthy. This injury could actually be a blessing....makes that decision MUCH easier.

Very true. I thought Rackers had the edge anyway, but this closes the case for Kubiak and an FO that can be loyal to a fault.

Kris Brown said last year that he couldn't figure out why his kicks were pulling left. Maybe tight fascia in your planted foot could be the reason.

Dutchrudder
08-29-2010, 01:48 AM
If they do go with Rackers, I hope KB gets a chance to retire rather than being cut. He deserves it after all these years with the team.

The Pencil Neck
08-29-2010, 01:49 AM
If they do go with Rackers, I hope KB gets a chance to retire rather than being cut. He deserves it after all these years with the team.

No way he's going to retire.

If they don't IR him, he'll be kicking for somebody.

TexanSam
08-29-2010, 02:29 AM
If they do go with Rackers, I hope KB gets a chance to retire rather than being cut. He deserves it after all these years with the team.

Why would he retire though? Unless he thinks this injury will prevent him from ever kicking again (at least at a high level) I would assume he would take time off to let the injury heal and sign with a team next year.

BullNation4Life
08-29-2010, 07:26 AM
KB injured, that sucks. I am not convinced Rackers is the answer. His leg power from 50+ is severely lacking....

You guys better be careful what you wish for because the first time Rackers comes up short on a 53 yarder, you're gonna wish you had Kris Brown back...

Thorn
08-29-2010, 08:09 AM
I'd rather this be decieded on talent and not injury. I hate to see this.

CloakNNNdagger
08-29-2010, 08:37 AM
Very true. I thought Rackers had the edge anyway, but this closes the case for Kubiak and an FO that can be loyal to a fault.

Kris Brown said last year that he couldn't figure out why his kicks were pulling left. Maybe tight fascia in your planted foot could be the reason.

Last year, Brown was battling this same plantar fasciitis problem.

Here is a simple explaination of what plantar fasciitis, how it's caused, and what it's implications are. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sur2nGM_5Cg) In this explanation, Eli Manning is used as the example, but the need for repeated "planting" of the foot and "push off" is easily extrapolated to Brown's case.

And here are examples of its most common treatments (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pnithn4EYQk&NR=1).

Nine-five percent of cases can be treated without surgery. One of the other common treatments not mentioned in the video, is injection of corticosteroids into the plantar fascia to decrease its inflammation. These injections, though, can weaken the fascia and increase its chance of rupture, and hence require surgical repair.

If the condition still persists after six months of conservative treatment, a technique of extra-corporeal shock wave therapy has been found to have some surprisingly good results. This is the use of a high frequency shock wave (much like breaking up kidney stones with sonic shock lithotripsy) to stimulate healing.

If problems still continue for a prolonged period of time and are unresponsive to the above treatments, surgery may be needed to release (lengthen) the fascia. Return to play success following surgery has been reported anywhere from 70-90%.

The problem with this condition is that it is easily aggravated, and the most important part of the treatment requires that the player returns to activity as pain has been shown to resolve...........most players try to play or are made to play through their injury and end up re-injuring and reinflaming the fascia.

SheTexan
08-29-2010, 09:08 AM
Just proof that no one on this board reads what I write. KB has suffered from this since the 2008 season. He bought his own hyperbaric chamber to help with the healing. Not only that, he had a severe staph infection in his leg that required IV antibiotics. I saw him limp before the game started last night, and was wondering if this was still giving him problems. Most members of this board are to hell bent on crusifying him than trying to understand why he had a lousy season last year.

Understand something!! I am not a homer! If this is still a problem for Kris then he needs to be replaced. He would be the first one to tell you that!! I hope the Texans puts him on IR simply because I do NOT think Rackers is the final answer. Did anyone pay attention to his warmups at halftime?? If not, you should have. Give Rackers this year to PROVE what he can do and give Kris a year to heal. If this is long term for Kris, then please God, let him retire a Texan!!

Dwade
08-29-2010, 09:11 AM
KB injured, that sucks. I am not convinced Rackers is the answer. His leg power from 50+ is severely lacking....

You guys better be careful what you wish for because the first time Rackers comes up short on a 53 yarder, you're gonna wish you had Kris Brown back...

I don't expect kicks from 50+ to land each time, however I do expect 20-40 yarders every time, and Kris Brown missed a lot of those last year. I'll take the accurate kicker in Rackers over KB.

And if he's injured, that makes it that much easier.

eriadoc
08-29-2010, 09:42 AM
KB injured, that sucks. I am not convinced Rackers is the answer. His leg power from 50+ is severely lacking....

You guys better be careful what you wish for because the first time Rackers comes up short on a 53 yarder, you're gonna wish you had Kris Brown back...

The first time he comes up short on a 53 yarder, I'm just going to assume that Kris Brown would have kicked it 60 yards outside the uprights.

I'll take accuracy over distance any day.

TimeKiller
08-29-2010, 09:50 AM
Just proof that no one on this board reads what I write. KB has suffered from this since the 2008 season. He bought his own hyperbaric chamber to help with the healing. Not only that, he had a severe staph infection in his leg that required IV antibiotics. I saw him limp before the game started last night, and was wondering if this was still giving him problems. Most members of this board are to hell bent on crusifying him than trying to understand why he had a lousy season last year.

Understand something!! I am not a homer! If this is still a problem for Kris then he needs to be replaced. He would be the first one to tell you that!! I hope the Texans puts him on IR simply because I do NOT think Rackers is the final answer. Did anyone pay attention to his warmups at halftime?? If not, you should have. Give Rackers this year to PROVE what he can do and give Kris a year to heal. If this is long term for Kris, then please God, let him retire a Texan!!
This certainly isn't the first time I've heard of his PF woes but if you play, you're fair game for criticism. Being just injured enough to play but not do well is the Tracy McGrady way of life. I'm not saying KB is a wuss like Tmac, I mean did you see that tackle last night?! I'm just saying performance matters and if you need to sit to be healthy to give your VERY best performance, you do it for yourself and the team.

I think this pretty much puts a lock on Rackers being the kicker.

gary
08-29-2010, 10:00 AM
Hoping for an injury in or for another player to make the team is not the way to be. If the coaches do not know who the kicker should be without the other being injured then maybe they should go. If Kris is not right then it is serious and I hope the Texans do place him on IR and then let him decide the direction he'd like to go from there JMO.

Scooter
08-29-2010, 10:59 AM
i wonder if that is the extra "hitch in his giddy-up" that i've been criticizing for the past season and a half. any bets on if this began the back half of 2008? kris brown is excessively on his toes (which according to CND's link is a cause) during approach and has become increasingly "bouncy" for lack of a better term - almost skipping. as i've been saying, kris browns problems are entirely in his approach and plantar fasciitis certainly makes sense.

i cant say that rackers is any more aesthetically pleasing as the complete opposite. very squat with short steps and more of a roundhouse than i like, but he's got a much better base and plant, leading to better balance than brown - making it easier for him to be consistant if not all together accurate (not always inclusive), but also accounts for the difference in distance between the two.

i'm hoping rackers is our kicker, but i certainly dont want the decision to be made on injury. with brown's hometown and one of the nicest individuals to ever wear a uniform status, distance, and "athleticism" as evident by his tackles on special teams (a reminder given by potentially saving a touchdown with a great form tackle on the opening kickoff last night) ... i was hoping this to be an earned battle. i dont think we've seen a kick yet that was more than a couple inches off of dead center, the competition was certainly working.

well, bet's off as shetex confirms this began in 08.

houstonspartan
08-29-2010, 11:19 AM
This certainly isn't the first time I've heard of his PF woes but if you play, you're fair game for criticism. Being just injured enough to play but not do well is the Tracy McGrady way of life. I'm not saying KB is a wuss like Tmac, I mean did you see that tackle last night?! I'm just saying performance matters and if you need to sit to be healthy to give your VERY best performance, you do it for yourself and the team.

I think this pretty much puts a lock on Rackers being the kicker.

Agree 10000 percent. Well said.

Regardless of what was wrong with Kris Brown, all I know is whenever he is about to kick I get a knot in my stomach and hold my breath.

Cjeremy635
08-29-2010, 11:21 AM
If a player is put on IR, what does that do to a roster spot on the 53? This could be a blessing in disguise folks. They were pretty much tied in their preseason competition. I was just as aggrevated at Brown last year as the next guy, but he has a stronger leg than Rackers does, IMHO. If we IR him, can we use Rackers, get a feel for him while Kris heals up, and if Rackers ends up sucking, cut him and insert Brown? I'm not saying that Kris isn't hurt, but this is a good way to carry 2 kickers. How long do you have to be out if placed on IR?

drs23
08-29-2010, 11:33 AM
If a player is put on IR, what does that do to a roster spot on the 53? This could be a blessing in disguise folks. They were pretty much tied in their preseason competition. I was just as aggrevated at Brown last year as the next guy, but he has a stronger leg than Rackers does, IMHO. If we IR him, can we use Rackers, get a feel for him while Kris heals up, and if Rackers ends up sucking, cut him and insert Brown? I'm not saying that Kris isn't hurt, but this is a good way to carry 2 kickers. How long do you have to be out if placed on IR?

Currently, all season.

The Pencil Neck
08-29-2010, 12:33 PM
If a player is put on IR, what does that do to a roster spot on the 53? This could be a blessing in disguise folks. They were pretty much tied in their preseason competition. I was just as aggrevated at Brown last year as the next guy, but he has a stronger leg than Rackers does, IMHO. If we IR him, can we use Rackers, get a feel for him while Kris heals up, and if Rackers ends up sucking, cut him and insert Brown? I'm not saying that Kris isn't hurt, but this is a good way to carry 2 kickers. How long do you have to be out if placed on IR?

IR does not count against the roster spot but if a player thinks they can play, they generally request an injury settlement and a release so they can find a team to hook up with and play for.

If we IR'd Kris, he'd probably request a settlement. There's definitely some team that would hire him, PF and all.

Norg
08-29-2010, 12:36 PM
yall need to stop being all nice im not putting down KB but iam sure he knows this is a biz nas has well no hard feelings

gary
08-29-2010, 12:52 PM
No one is being nice or a pansy or anything like that but I never wish or hope for an injury.

Carr Bombed
08-29-2010, 02:33 PM
No one is being nice or a pansy or anything like that but I never wish or hope for an injury.

I don't think anybody was hoping for a injury, but since it has already happened then we can talk about it.

Going into the year, if the kicking competition was tied, I wanted the team to go ahead and move on without Kris Brown (Sorry, but I can no longer trust this guy...a change of scenery is needed for both parties...he might as well be named Brad Lidge), but I was scared they weren't going to make that decision. Let's face it, it sometimes takes Kubiak years to make some decisions and he's loyal to a fault sometimes.

If Brown has been struggling with this condition for a few years, then why the hell did we keep throwing Brown out there last season? Seriously, can someone answer that. We have a kicker with a bad wheel, but we kept putting ball games on that banged up foot, doesn't make any sense.

Oh well, like I said.....the kicking competition is tied and Kris Brown's foot is flaring up again so it'll probably force the team to make the move that they should of made last season, which isn't the worst thing in the world.

Kris Brown is a fantastic human being and I wish him nothing but the best if we do let him go, but what he has sounds like it's developing into a serious chronic injury, on that basis alot (kicking aside) we should be looking for his replacement.

Wolf
08-29-2010, 02:36 PM
if he is gone, he will be the last of the original Texans .. oh how time has flown by

Carr Bombed
08-29-2010, 02:39 PM
if he is gone, he will be the last of the original Texans .. oh how time has flown by

Which is the saddest thing about all of this. Last season Kris Brown was the last original Texan left on the roster and if he was healthy it would've been his "OG" foot that finally put this team into the playoffs, but instead....well we all saw what happened.

Oh well, even though "technically" he's not a original texan......I still look at Andre Johnson as one. He's been here for 99% of the B.S. and heartache that this team has had to deal with on their way up from the celler.

If we do make the playoffs and by some miracle get a home playoff game, I'd love to bring back players like Aaron Glenn, Jamie Sharper, Dommanick Davis (Williams), Gary Walker, Chester Pitts, Petey Faggins (yes...even Petey) ect.

You know the players who busted their butts for this franchise, yet were never able to see the fruits of their labor

ATXtexanfan
08-29-2010, 02:40 PM
damaged goods, end of story.

CloakNNNdagger
08-29-2010, 03:46 PM
Players who are sent to injured reserve by a club receive their full salary unless they signed a "split contract" which designates a base salary for a player if he makes the team and a lower salary if he winds up on injured reserve. Typically the only players signing a split contract are undrafted rookies and a few veterans with severe medical histories.

It may work to KB's benefit to try for complete recovery on IR, and to the Texans' benefit for "insurance" of at least good competition in the 2011 preseason (if there is a 2011 season) if Rackers performs less than stellar this year. The thing is, with KB's big contract extension, this route would not be cheapest route to go for the Texans.

Rey
08-29-2010, 03:51 PM
IR does not count against the roster spot but if a player thinks they can play, they generally request an injury settlement and a release so they can find a team to hook up with and play for.

If we IR'd Kris, he'd probably request a settlement. There's definitely some team that would hire him, PF and all.

I dunno, Kris seems to really likes the Houston area.

If his thought process was "well I'll just get a job somewhere else if I get cut here" then I don't think he would have been as hurt when we brought Rackers in. He's an original Texan so that alone should tell you that Houston is pretty much home to him and his family. I could see him taking th eIR and trying to come back next year and reclaim his job.

You could be absolutely right, because if Rackers does well all season and hits some key kicks competition may not be welcome.

It'd be interesting to see though.

Andrew6
08-29-2010, 08:17 PM
If Texans PUP him can we keep him hidden to check Rackers out in the regular season? This way he still gets paid, still a Texan and if Rackers doesn't pan out we can always have K.Brown after a few games.
Really sucks about K. Brown. Stand up guy who does so much for the fans and kids especially. Heres to a speedy recovery.

CloakNNNdagger
08-29-2010, 08:23 PM
If Texans PUP him can we keep him hidden to check Rackers out in the regular season? This way he still gets paid, still a Texan and if Rackers doesn't pan out we can always have K.Brown after a few games.
Really sucks about K. Brown. Stand up guy who does so much for the fans and kids especially. Heres to a speedy recovery.

In that case, he will count against the roster. Not sure the Texans would go for that.

Cjeremy635
08-29-2010, 08:41 PM
If Texans PUP him can we keep him hidden to check Rackers out in the regular season? This way he still gets paid, still a Texan and if Rackers doesn't pan out we can always have K.Brown after a few games.
Really sucks about K. Brown. Stand up guy who does so much for the fans and kids especially. Heres to a speedy recovery.

This! (regarding the option of testing out Rackers and havig KB as a safety net). I'm not sure if Kris got his head right yet, but I don't get the "warm and fuzzies" with Rackers at all. I just don't think he's the guy for us. He has a weak leg and it's going to hurt us on long field goals and kick offs. He may be accurate from 20-40 yards, but those aren't usually the game winners in a 2 minute drive. I don't know if Kris is our final solution, but I think he'll be better than Rackers.

SheTexan
08-30-2010, 07:10 AM
This! (regarding the option of testing out Rackers and havig KB as a safety net). I'm not sure if Kris got his head right yet, but I don't get the "warm and fuzzies" with Rackers at all. I just don't think he's the guy for us. He has a weak leg and it's going to hurt us on long field goals and kick offs. He may be accurate from 20-40 yards, but those aren't usually the game winners in a 2 minute drive. I don't know if Kris is our final solution, but I think he'll be better than Rackers.

What gives you the idea Kris has anything wrong with his "head?" Just wondering!!

ChampionTexan
08-30-2010, 07:45 AM
If Texans PUP him can we keep him hidden to check Rackers out in the regular season? This way he still gets paid, still a Texan and if Rackers doesn't pan out we can always have K.Brown after a few games.
Really sucks about K. Brown. Stand up guy who does so much for the fans and kids especially. Heres to a speedy recovery.

In that case, he will count against the roster. Not sure the Texans would go for that.

PUP isn't an option.

Players can only be placed on the reserve PUP list (The one that goes the first six weeks of the season) if they have previously been placed on the active PUP list (The preseason PUP list that O.D. just came off of).

Players can only be placed on the active PUP list if they have not participated in any practices. Therefore KB isn't eligible for the active PUP, and because he can't be placed on the active PUP list, he can't be placed on the 2010 reserve PUP list.

Final note - while players on the active PUP list do count against the 80 (or 75) man roster limits, players on the reserve PUP list don't count against the 53 man roster. In fact, once the six week period is up, it's not uncommon for an NFL team to get a one or two week roster exemption while determining whether to add the player back to the roster (which would require cutting someone), or to place him on IR for the remainder of the year.

AJ has done a great summary of the PUP rules the last couple of years - here's this year's summary.

LINK (http://www.examiner.com/houston-texans-in-houston/clarifying-nfl-rules-on-the-physically-unable-to-perform-pup-list-1)

Edit: In re-reading AJ's article, the roster exemption period after the 6 weeks of reserve PUP is up to 3 weeks.

Cjeremy635
08-30-2010, 07:48 AM
What gives you the idea Kris has anything wrong with his "head?" Just wondering!!

Do you really have to ask that question? I think the shanks he had last year were due to mental errors, for whatever reason. The man has all the physical tools and he's proven that he can kick in the NFL, so when it all of a sudden takes a turn for the worse, I chalk that up to mental problems. It's no different than a golfer's swing

ChampionTexan
08-30-2010, 07:55 AM
Do you really have to ask that question? I think the shanks he had last year were due to mental errors, for whatever reason. The man has all the physical tools and he's proven that he can kick in the NFL, so when it all of a sudden takes a turn for the worse, I chalk that up to mental problems. It's no different than a golfer's swing

I think even Kris is on record as saying he's not changing anything about his mechanics, since his mechanics weren't the problem last season.

SheTexan
08-30-2010, 08:24 AM
Do you really have to ask that question? I think the shanks he had last year were due to mental errors, for whatever reason. The man has all the physical tools and he's proven that he can kick in the NFL, so when it all of a sudden takes a turn for the worse, I chalk that up to mental problems. It's no different than a golfer's swing

Those of you who want Kris out for whatever reason you have, will probably get your wish. I believe he had more physical than mental issues, but, that's my opinion.

Cjeremy635
08-30-2010, 08:41 AM
Those of you who want Kris out for whatever reason you have, will probably get your wish. I believe he had more physical than mental issues, but, that's my opinion.

I never said I want him out. If the coaches only thought it was a physical issue, I don't think they would have brought in a kicker for competition. As a coach, you acknowledge that your man is hurt and you give him time to heal, that never happened in this case. I wish Kris the best and I'd like to see him stay if he can get back to his former stats. If he kicks like he did last season, it's in everyone's best interest that they part ways. It's all about winning. Those misses were squarely on his shoulders, for whatever reason, be it mental or physical. It's his responsibility to get right whatever is wrong.

CloakNNNdagger
08-30-2010, 08:47 AM
PUP isn't an option.

Players can only be placed on the reserve PUP list (The one that goes the first six weeks of the season) if they have previously been placed on the active PUP list (The preseason PUP list that O.D. just came off of).

Players can only be placed on the active PUP list if they have not participated in any practices. Therefore KB isn't eligible for the active PUP, and because he can't be placed on the active PUP list, he can't be placed on the 2010 reserve PUP list.

Final note - while players on the active PUP list do count against the 80 (or 75) man roster limits, players on the reserve PUP list don't count against the 53 man roster. In fact, once the six week period is up, it's not uncommon for an NFL team to get a one or two week roster exemption while determining whether to add the player back to the roster (which would require cutting someone), or to place him on IR for the remainder of the year.

AJ has done a great summary of the PUP rules the last couple of years - here's this year's summary.

LINK (http://www.examiner.com/houston-texans-in-houston/clarifying-nfl-rules-on-the-physically-unable-to-perform-pup-list-1)

Edit: In re-reading AJ's article, the roster exemption period after the 6 weeks of reserve PUP is up to 3 weeks.

Appreciate the clarification........and the link

gary
08-30-2010, 04:30 PM
IF the coaches knew or if they had any doubt that Kris was healthy last season or had a problem to check out then they should have just shut him down for the rest of the season. Leaving them to find a new kicker to finish the season once again that would be a huge IF JMO.

CloakNNNdagger
08-31-2010, 11:15 AM
KB was on the sidelines yesterday in a walking boot. Hopefully, this is a means that the Texans are trying to stretch the Achilles tendon while keeping the plantar fascia "stretched" on a 24 hour basis (rather than only wearing a night splint or boot). But this chronically recurring problem cannot help but affect performance, even if intermittently. Let me interject, that if KB's performance has been or is affected, this does by no means make him a "wuss." You might think of yourself hopping on one foot with a huge skin blister in your arch area, while having a 1 inch rock stuck in the arch of your shoe.

eriadoc
08-31-2010, 11:23 AM
Let me interject, that if KB's performance has been or is affected, this does by no means make him a "wuss." You might think of yourself hopping on one foot with a huge skin blister in your arch area, while having a 1 inch rock stuck in the arch of your shoe.

Hell no. Plantar fasciitis sucks. I had it for about 6 months and it's hard to get right.

I've said all along that I like KB, and it's unfortunate that kickers have the situation they have. But it's what he signed on for. If he can't reliably make kicks, for whatever reason, then he needs to be replaced. It's really that simple in the NFL.

Cjeremy635
08-31-2010, 11:24 AM
KB was on the sidelines yesterday in a walking boot. Hopefully, this is a means that the Texans are trying to stretch the Achilles tendon while keeping the plantar fascia "stretched" on a 24 hour basis (rather than only wearing a night splint or boot). But this chronically recurring problem cannot help but affect performance, even if intermittently. Let me interject, that if KB's performance has been or is affected, this does by no means make him a "wuss." You might think of yourself hopping on one foot with a huge skin blister in your arch area, while having a 1 inch rock stuck in the arch of your shoe.

I walk around like that every single day, just for the the fun of it. Why? Because I'm a MAN Cloak. An awesome MAN who rubbed a blister on the bottom of my foot and attached a big rock to it with a rubber band. It's how I roll.....errr....or hobble.

CloakNNNdagger
08-31-2010, 11:51 AM
I walk around like that every single day, just for the the fun of it. Why? Because I'm a MAN Cloak. An awesome MAN who rubbed a blister on the bottom of my foot and attached a big rock to it with a rubber band. It's how I roll.....errr....or hobble.

As Confusius would say, "You belly silly man." I bet you also put rattlesnakes in your jock strap to help you get going in the morning.:pirate:

El Tejano
08-31-2010, 12:09 PM
Well if I punched you in the face you would have to resist the urge to thank me.

Texas T
08-31-2010, 01:00 PM
KB was on the sidelines yesterday in a walking boot. Hopefully, this is a means that the Texans are trying to stretch the Achilles tendon while keeping the plantar fascia "stretched" on a 24 hour basis (rather than only wearing a night splint or boot). But this chronically recurring problem cannot help but affect performance, even if intermittently. Let me interject, that if KB's performance has been or is affected, this does by no means make him a "wuss." You might think of yourself hopping on one foot with a huge skin blister in your arch area, while having a 1 inch rock stuck in the arch of your shoe.

Actually this is a pretty good description. I've had it for a year and a half, did all the non surgery stuff, then had the surgery and it still isn't right.
Turns out mine is nerve damage in my lower back causing the problems.
That being said I could not imagine trying to kick field goals with my foot (either one) feeling like that-much less chaising someone down and tackling them (ala KB vs. Cowboys).
I hope he gets better and this is the cause of his problems.
Great guy and a "MAN" playing like this.

Cjeremy635
08-31-2010, 01:07 PM
I would just like to know what are they planning on doing. My "sceptical alarm" is going off on this thing though. They are saying that he has an injury and this injury may be the reason that he had some miscues last season. If that's the case, why didn't anyone say anything? Why did they bring in a kicker if he was only "off" due to the injury? I'm all for competition, but I don't think Rackers is better than Brown. I think Kris has a stronger leg and will give us the ability to kick a few from 50+, as long as he gets his accuracy back. Rackers barely made the 52 yarder (I think it was a 52 yarder) and needed the help of the cross bar to get it in. Kris has the leg to hit it better than that.

JB
08-31-2010, 01:12 PM
I would just like to know what are they planning on doing. My "sceptical alarm" is going off on this thing though. They are saying that he has an injury and this injury may be the reason that he had some miscues last season. If that's the case, why didn't anyone say anything? Why did they bring in a kicker if he was only "off" due to the injury? I'm all for competition, but I don't think Rackers is better than Brown. I think Kris has a stronger leg and will give us the ability to kick a few from 50+, as long as he gets his accuracy back. Rackers barely made the 52 yarder (I think it was a 52 yarder) and needed the help of the cross bar to get it in. Kris has the leg to hit it better than that.

How could the cross bar help him get it in?

IDEXAN
08-31-2010, 01:15 PM
So does this make what would otherwise be a very difficult decision now an easy, slam-dunk call by Kubiak ?

The Pencil Neck
08-31-2010, 01:25 PM
How could the cross bar help him get it in?

The ball hit the bar and bounced through. (Instead of bouncing out.)

Cjeremy635
08-31-2010, 01:27 PM
The ball hit the bar and bounced through. (Instead of bouncing out.)

Yep. If 52 yards is the "lucky" max for a healthy Rackers, I don't think that's gonna cut it as a kicker I'd feel comfortable with.

hookinreds
08-31-2010, 01:37 PM
The ball hit the bar and bounced through. (Instead of bouncing out.)

I haven't seen any replays but couldn't tell if it hit the cross bar or the back bar becuase I was at the bar (not the cross bar or the back bar, the consumption bar) and couldn't hear anything and probably giving my Romosexual buddy the what for if there was a replay.

JB
08-31-2010, 01:44 PM
The ball hit the bar and bounced through. (Instead of bouncing out.)

What I read is that it cleared the cross bar and bounced off the upright.

Late in the second quarter, Rackers booted a 52-yarder that went just over the crossbar. It was as straight down the middle as can be, bouncing off the curved stanchion that connects the crossbar to the ground.

http://www.houstontexans.com/news/Story.asp?story_id=6301

Cjeremy635
08-31-2010, 01:55 PM
What I read is that it cleared the cross bar and bounced off the upright.



http://www.houstontexans.com/news/Story.asp?story_id=6301

Ehhhh, it looked different to me. Regardless, I honestly feel like I have less confidence in Rackers than I do Brown. Don't ask me why, the guy has hit all of the field goals that he has attempted since he's been here. I just don't think he's the kicker for us. I have no idea why I feel that way, it's just a hunch, and if he stays, I hope like hell that I'm wrong about the guy.

JB
08-31-2010, 01:59 PM
Ehhhh, it looked different to me. Regardless, I honestly feel like I have less confidence in Rackers than I do Brown. Don't ask me why, the guy has hit all of the field goals that he has attempted since he's been here. I just don't think he's the kicker for us. I have no idea why I feel that way, it's just a hunch, and if he stays, I hope like hell that I'm wrong about the guy.

If KB were healthy I think he would be the guy. I know Rackers does not have as strong a leg, but I don't think we will be looking at many 50+ yd fg's. I think rackers is much mor consistent and accurate in the shorter kicks.

I do not care who wins, I just want someone who is going to make the clutch kicks.

Cjeremy635
09-01-2010, 06:35 PM
Does anybody have any info on how well Brown is doing with his foot? I heard a radio clip on the drive home and Kubiak was discussing the kicking competition. He said that he was evaluating everything that they've done during the preseason games, as well as how they've performed in camp, to help them in making a decision. He gave no indication on how he was swaying. I know we have a poster on here who's "in the know" as it pertains to Kris, so any info on how he is doing would be much appreciated. I hope he's well enough to be our kicker because he seems to have his accuracy issues fixed, atleast in the preseason, and I think he will continue to kick about the same during the season.

Houston_Fanatic
09-01-2010, 09:44 PM
I think Kubiak already tipped his hand when he said how hard the decision was going to be on him.

"That's going to be a tough decision, and I'm going to feel bad about it, but it's part of the game," coach Gary Kubiak said.

Do you honestly think he would feel bad about cutting Rackers? I don't think so. I think he would only feel bad if he had to cut KB. We'll know soon enough, I guess.

drs23
09-01-2010, 09:58 PM
I think Kubiak already tipped his hand when he said how hard the decision was going to be on him.

"That's going to be a tough decision, and I'm going to feel bad about it, but it's part of the game," coach Gary Kubiak said.

Do you honestly think he would feel bad about cutting Rackers? I don't think so. I think he would only feel bad if he had to cut KB. We'll know soon enough, I guess.

Yes. I was about to post this same thing..

CloakNNNdagger
09-01-2010, 10:36 PM
I think Kubiak already tipped his hand when he said how hard the decision was going to be on him.

"That's going to be a tough decision, and I'm going to feel bad about it, but it's part of the game," coach Gary Kubiak said.

Do you honestly think he would feel bad about cutting Rackers? I don't think so. I think he would only feel bad if he had to cut KB. We'll know soon enough, I guess.

I could also see him feeling bad about cutting Rackers (after working his butt off and kicking his heart out throughout the preseason) if it is more that it is such a close decision, that the final decision is weighted upon familiarity and nostalgia. Whomever he ultimately choose, I hope later in the season Kubiak is not "going to feel bad about it" again because "it's part of the game."

Goatcheese
09-02-2010, 06:01 AM
I'm not seeing 50+ yard field goals as a reason to keep brown over Rackers. He's 18/33 (54.5%) lifetime and was 2/4 last year.

We have a better than 50/50 shot at just converting a 4th down at those ranges.

J_R
09-02-2010, 07:14 AM
Texans K Kris Brown has been in a walking boot all week because he's dealing with plantar fasciitis.


This will lock in Neil Rackers as Houston's kicker. Coach Gary Kubiak contends that Brown has "kicked with it before," but upper management has been pulling for Rackers all along. Brown will be among Saturday's final cuts.

Source: Houston Chronicle (http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/sports/fb/texansfront/7182651.html?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed:+houstonchronicle/spfbtxfront+(HoustonChronicle.com+--+Houston+Texans+Foo)

http://nbcsports.msnbc.com/id/32398164/ns/sports-nfl/

ChampionTexan
09-02-2010, 07:38 AM
http://nbcsports.msnbc.com/id/32398164/ns/sports-nfl/




Just to clarify - the commentary about Rackers being locked in as the kicker was not from the Chronicle (unless the Chronicle has since deleted the statement), but rather the conclusion drawn by the NBC Sports website.

J_R
09-02-2010, 07:44 AM
Just to clarify - the commentary about Rackers being locked in as the kicker was not from the Chronicle (unless the Chronicle has since deleted the statement), but rather the conclusion drawn by the NBC Sports website.

Yeah I noticed that as well. These fantasy sites like to throw in their 2 cents of what this or that means.

CloakNNNdagger
09-02-2010, 08:47 AM
There's one thing that does bother me watching the preseason. On kickoffs, Rackers seems to have no arc on the ball, even when he shows decent distance (probably a function of a relatively weaker leg). There is no real hang time to let the STs to get to the returner. But having said that, this preseason, Brown's kickoffs haven't been that much better (possibly a function of his plantar fasciitis). All this has resulted in virtually no returns being limited to within the 20 yard line during this preseason. Not inconceivably, this alone could make the difference of winning or losing a game during the regular season.

CloakNNNdagger
09-02-2010, 10:40 AM
This certainly isn't the first time I've heard of his PF woes but if you play, you're fair game for criticism. Being just injured enough to play but not do well is the Tracy McGrady way of life. I'm not saying KB is a wuss like Tmac, I mean did you see that tackle last night?! I'm just saying performance matters and if you need to sit to be healthy to give your VERY best performance, you do it for yourself and the team.

I think this pretty much puts a lock on Rackers being the kicker.

What I also don't think that many realize here is that in Arizona, Rackers was known for his hard play on STs, not in any way afraid to get in there and make the tackle. Not taking anything away from Brown, Rackers was also actually considered one tough "cookie."

Watch this VIDEO (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S44LGarzaYE) to see what Rackers could be like.

eriadoc
09-02-2010, 10:59 AM
People are raving about KB's tackle in the Cowboys game, but if they were paying attention, they'd know that Rackers made one helluva tackle before that, in the middle of the field. Rackers has always been known for his ability to take on a returner.

Ole Miss Texan
09-02-2010, 11:01 AM
There's one thing that does bother me watching the preseason. On kickoffs, Rackers seems to have no arc on the ball, even when he shows decent distance (probably a function of a relatively weaker leg). There is no real hang time to let the STs to get to the returner. But having said that, this preseason, Brown's kickoffs haven't been that much better (possibly a function of his plantar fasciitis). All this has resulted in virtually no returns being limited to within the 20 yard line during this preseason. Not inconceivably, this alone could make the difference of winning or losing a game during the regular season.

I compiled some stats from nfl.com a couple weeks back. Although they may not be completely comparable because they have different ST players running downfield which definitely impacts return yardage. At least its something to take a look at. I was surprised by Rackers' touchback % as compared to Browns.

As I noted below, my main concern was about Rackers' ball flight and what impact this had on the # yards returned. Again this could be skewed by (1) talent of ST, their ability to get downfield and tackle (2) where the ball landed. I didn't see the "average starting drive after kickoff" for opponents, but if Rackers are shorter kicks, even if they have they same return average... it's the field position that truly matters. just something to think about.
I did a quick comparision from nfl.com/stats on both Brown and Rackers regarding Kickoffs.

Analyzed as 2009/Last 4 Years/Career

Kris Brown
Kick Offs: 82/314/802
Touchbacks: 10/40/86
TB%: 12/13/11
Avg KO: 66.2/64.6/62.3

Neil Rackers
Kick Offs: 65/310/635
Touchbacks: 14/63/128
TB%: 22/20/20
Avg KO: 63.4/64.7/63.5

Turns out Rackers has more touchbacks and a higher touchback percentage. Rackers' Avg Kick Off distance as compared to Brown's if marginal as is Avg Return (see below).

An additional aside: Average Return is tough to compare as it's very dependant on the entire special teams' skill/coaching/execution. However, due to the concern that Rackers may kick it low, I thought the different trajectory, landing spot, time in air, etc. could have an effect on the teams ability to get downfield and tackle. Due to the average return comparison, it doesn't appear that it should be a huge concern. (Note that return yards were not found so the 4 year avg is the average of the 4 year averages. if that makes sense! it's a less accurate figure than Total Return Yards/Total Returns)

Brown's Avg Rtn: 22.5/22.9/21.9
Racker's Avg Rtn: 20.5/23.7/23.9

eriadoc
09-02-2010, 11:05 AM
Here's another fun Rackers video.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ehJhpzS9O9M&feature=related

Ole Miss Texan
09-02-2010, 11:18 AM
Kris Brown
Avg KO: 66.2/64.6/62.3
Avg Rtn: 22.5/22.9/21.9

Neil Rackers
Avg KO: 63.4/64.7/63.5
Avg Rtn: 20.5/23.7/23.9
For those statisticians out there: Would it make sense if we did a "Net KO or Net Return Average"? For example - Rackers' avg. KO in '09 was 63.4 yds and the avg return was 20.5 yds which nets to 42.9 yards. If the Kick Off is from 30 yard line, this equates to an Opponents Avg. Starting Field Position of the 27.1 yard line. Is that right? Please note these figures are estimates.

Brown
Opp. Avg. F.P. 2009 = 26.3 yd line
Opp. Avg. F.P. 4 Years = 28.3 yd line
Opp. Avg. F.P. Career = 29.6 yd line

Rackers
Opp. Avg. F.P. 2009 = 27.1 yd line
Opp. Avg. F.P. 4 Years = 29.0 yd line
Opp. Avg. F.P. Career = 30.4 yd line

These "rough estimates" mean the Opponents for Brown generally start with 0.8 yards better field position than Rackers. Not taking into account how good/bad the ST players are.

CloakNNNdagger
09-02-2010, 01:10 PM
Further illustrations of what may not be known widespread about Rackers, but may factor into Kubiak's choice.

If you're worried about DISTANCE and accuracy on FGs.......VIDEO (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y03lSsuKC0g&feature=related) (preseason 2007 Cardinals game-59 yds)

If you're worried about DISTANCE and accuracy on kickoffs........VIDEO (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sZghatdM8mo&feature=fvw) ([from the 50] watch how high up the ball hits on the uprights )

El Tejano
09-02-2010, 04:05 PM
Further illustrations of what may not be known widespread about Rackers, but may factor into Kubiak's choice.

If you're worried about DISTANCE and accuracy on FGs.......VIDEO (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y03lSsuKC0g&feature=related) (preseason 2007 Cardinals game-59 yds)

If you're worried about DISTANCE and accuracy on kickoffs........VIDEO (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sZghatdM8mo&feature=fvw) ([from the 50] watch how high up the ball hits on the uprights )

That was on dirt too.

Cjeremy635
09-02-2010, 05:12 PM
My concern this preseason is how much of a return we are giving up on kickoffs. It appears to me that they both seem to be hitting short this year, regardless of what the previous stats show. Almost every kickoff seems to be short of the goal line, giving it no chance for a touchback. According to the stats though, they both seem to be about even across the board. If their kickoff distances are on par with their previous averages (for the preseason atleast), then we have some serious special teams problems with coverages and tackling. As I stated the other day, it seems like every one of our kickoffs are resulting in the opponents starting at damn near the 30 yard line. That's totally unacceptable for whatever reason and whoever's fault it is. That needs to be addressed this week and fixed before the Colts game. We can't afford to only make teams go 70 yards to score. We'd be shooting ourselves in the foot right off the bat.

HJam72
09-02-2010, 05:33 PM
My concern this preseason is how much of a return we are giving up on kickoffs. It appears to me that they both seem to be hitting short this year, regardless of what the previous stats show. Almost every kickoff seems to be short of the goal line, giving it no chance for a touchback. According to the stats though, they both seem to be about even across the board. If their kickoff distances are on par with their previous averages (for the preseason atleast), then we have some serious special teams problems with coverages and tackling. As I stated the other day, it seems like every one of our kickoffs are resulting in the opponents starting at damn near the 30 yard line. That's totally unacceptable for whatever reason and whoever's fault it is. That needs to be addressed this week and fixed before the Colts game. We can't afford to only make teams go 70 yards to score. We'd be shooting ourselves in the foot right off the bat.

Can't we just let Turk punt it into the endzone? :texanbill:

HJam72
09-02-2010, 05:39 PM
Rackers sucks. He always hits the uprights. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sZghatdM8mo&NR=1&feature=fvwp

See. :foottap:

J_R
09-02-2010, 05:43 PM
Haha^^^

"You need a kicker right? Pick me."

imatexan
09-02-2010, 07:32 PM
That was on dirt too.

It was also pre-season.

I just want the better kicker, either way I think we will be fine.
Leaning towards KB but not going to lie it will make me nervous if he is kicking with the game on the line.

gtexan02
09-03-2010, 08:24 AM
Stats say that brown missed a FG last night. How far? How badly?

Edit: Missed a 56 yard attempt. No shame in that. Had he made it, he may have made the team

hookinreds
09-03-2010, 08:30 AM
They were saying 57 yards on TV. Dead center, but it only went about 52-54 yards.

While I don't think that would specificaly make me cut a kicker, I do think Kubiak will be going with Rackers.

JB
09-03-2010, 08:30 AM
Stats say that brown missed a FG last night. How far? How badly?

Edit: Missed a 56 yard attempt. No shame in that. Had he made it, he may have made the team

His kick was right down the middle, just came up a yd or two short. Probably would have made it from 54.

JB
09-03-2010, 09:00 AM
RT @McClain_on_NFL: Texans are keeping kicker Neil Rackers over Kris Brown, who was the last original Texan.

Link (https://twitter.com/Adam_Schefter)

CloakNNNdagger
09-03-2010, 09:27 AM
Link (https://twitter.com/Adam_Schefter)


Thanks for the heads up JB

Rackers Wins Texans Kicking Job (http://www.myfoxhouston.com/dpp/sports/nfl/100903-rackers-wins-texans'-kicking-job)


Updated: Friday, 03 Sep 2010, 9:21 AM CDT
Published : Friday, 03 Sep 2010, 8:57 AM CDT

MARK BERMAN
Sports Director
Houston - FOX 26 Sports has learned the Houston Texans are releasing Kris Brown, the only kicker in franchise history. Neil Rackers will kick for the Texans in 2010.

Brown is also the only player to participate in all 128 games in Texans history. He had his worst season as a pro last year, but in 2008, he had best year in the NFL.

The Texans brought in Rackers to compete for the job and the former All-Pro kicker with Arizona will kick for Houston.

In 10 years in the NFL, Rackers has made 205 of 262 career field goal attempts.

In 2005 with the Cardinals, Rackers set an NFL record for most field goals in a season with 42 and was named All-Pro.

"I'm excited," Rackers said in an interview Friday with FOX 26 Sports. "I said all along I was excited to be with the Texans when I saw what they did in the second half of last year.

"It means a lot to me. Kris has been a great role model and did a great job in the community. I have to make Coach (Gary) Kubiak right in making the decision to go with me."

Ole Miss Texan
09-03-2010, 09:29 AM
WOW that's huge. A decision I would not wanted to have to make. Best of luck to Kris Brown, classy guy. Let's go Rackers though!!!

CloakNNNdagger
09-03-2010, 09:30 AM
A quote from the Chronicle (McClain)

"Iím excited to be part of a really good team. My mind-set when I came here was to compete with Kris knowing that it would make both of us better kickers. Iím a competitor. Iím a team guy. I play with a lot of heart, and Iíll do anything I can to help my team win."

CloakNNNdagger
09-03-2010, 09:35 AM
WOW that's huge. A decision I would not wanted to have to make. Best of luck to Kris Brown, classy guy. Let's go Rackers though!!!

The change of scenery will probably prove positive for both kickers. I do wish Kris the best. I am sure that when this all blows over, he will be remembered mostly for all the good he stood for here.

eriadoc
09-03-2010, 10:00 AM
The change of scenery will probably prove positive for both kickers. I do wish Kris the best. I am sure that when this all blows over, he will be remembered mostly for all the good he stood for here.

I think so too. I view this decision as a "best for the team" type of decision regarding "Kris Brown the football player" that really has no bearing on "Kris Brown the man". KB is a great person and I wish the man the best. I hope he lands a job and does well (unless he plays us, LOL).

Porky
09-03-2010, 10:10 AM
I've been pulling for Rackers so for me I am happy as a lark. I love Kris Brown the person, but I was about to throw something thru my TV last year in regards to Kris Brown the football player. Class guy, class player, and he will be deeply missed in the community....but frankly after Kris cost us the playoffs last year it was time to move on and Racker's isn't chopped liver by any means. I like the decision.

Yankee_In_TX
09-03-2010, 10:12 AM
I think so too. I view this decision as a "best for the team" type of decision regarding "Kris Brown the football player" that really has no bearing on "Kris Brown the man". KB is a great person and I wish the man the best. I hope he lands a job and does well (unless he plays us, LOL).

I think even my wife, Kris Brown's BIGGEST fan (seriously) is ok with this decision from a football standpoint.

SheTexan
09-03-2010, 10:13 AM
A decision that will come back to bite them in the ass, just like their decision regarding Sage! They let the best man go IMHO! BUT, I'm a TEXAN fan, and I know this crap goes with the in's and out's of the game. SO BE IT, let's move on!!

Porky
09-03-2010, 10:19 AM
A decision that will come back to bite them in the ass, just like their decision regarding Sage! They let the best man go IMHO! BUT, I'm a TEXAN fan, and I know this crap goes with the in's and out's of the game. SO BE IT, let's move on!!

Did you watch the games last year Gma? How many did Kris cost us? Loyalty is fine but it's a two way street.

SheTexan
09-03-2010, 10:30 AM
Did you watch the games last year Gma? How many did Kris cost us? Loyalty is fine but it's a two way street.

You read what I had to say Porky!! Let's move on! This has been debated enough and it's not LOYALTY that makes me think this is a bad decision. Rackers has done nothing YET to prove to me he is any better than Kris!! Kris had a bad year, it cost him his job, that's on him.

The Pencil Neck
09-03-2010, 10:31 AM
I think even my wife, Kris Brown's BIGGEST fan (seriously) is ok with this decision from a football standpoint.

Yeah, same here. My wife is a huge KB fan and has a KB jersey.

And SHE's been saying that KB needed to go.

eriadoc
09-03-2010, 10:34 AM
You read what I had to say Porky!! Let's move on! This has been debated enough and it's not LOYALTY that makes me think this is a bad decision. Rackers has done nothing YET to prove to me he is any better than Kris!! Kris had a bad year, it cost him his job, that's on him.

Hey, I found my new sig! Thanks!