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CloakNNNdagger
08-23-2010, 03:11 PM
I don't know that I've seen this article posted (if so, please merge), but it's worth reading in total. It makes Winston's remarks about (paraphrase) "I'm sure we'll go back and review tapes, and find some good things we did" pretty sad.

Kubiak wants immediate improvement
Defense's inability to stop Saints on downs perturbs Texans coach
By JOHN McCLAIN
Copyright 2010 Houston Chronicle
Aug. 23, 2010, 12:15AM

If the Texans' objective in New Orleans was to make the Dallas Cowboys overconfident, it was a job well done.

There's no way the Cowboys can watch tape of the Saints' 38-20 victory and take the Texans seriously entering Saturday's nationally televised game at Reliant Stadium.

A second consecutive wretched performance against the Saints has left a lot of Texans fans on the ledge because they believe it's a harbinger of what's in store when the regular season arrives.

Even though it's still preseason, the third exhibition is the most important. Coaches treat it like the regular season before resting most of their starters in the last preseason game.

A victory over the Cowboys would reverse the despair of being a Texans fan this week.

"I better not have to appeal to them on anything," coach Gary Kubiak said Sunday. "If they watch this film and feel good about what we were doing, then something's wrong.

"We're going to spend a lot of time (Monday) in this (meeting) room and talk about some issues that we have — talk about preparing to play games, talk about doing the little things to win.

"We've got the right guys, and they'll come back and play better this week."

The Texans couldn't play worse on defense. Not only did they allow 409 yards, including 198 rushing, they let New Orleans convert 50 percent of its third-down plays and 100 percent of its fourth-down attempts. The Saints controlled the ball for 40 minutes.

The Saints are the Super Bowl champions. The Cowboys are Super Bowl contenders coming off a victory at San Diego.

"We're going to play an excellent team, and our (starters) are going to play at least three quarters," Kubiak said. "Most everybody in the league approaches the first three quarters of this game like it's regular season. We'll see where we're at. We need to respond. We need to play a lot better."

Kubiak mentioned a few defensive players - second-year free safety Troy Nolan, rookie cornerback Kareem Jackson and rookie defensive tackle Earl Mitchell - in a positive light.

Nolan had five unassisted tackles and a sack on a blitz. Mitchell was part of the inside rotation and had two tackles.

Unlike some of his players who pointed out that as bad as the New Orleans performance was, it was still just a preseason game, Kubiak doesn't make excuses.

"I never look at it that way," Kubiak said. "It wasn't good. We got pushed around. Some of the things that went on in that game, it wasn't good. Our attention to detail, our effort at times -it's not near what it needs to be for us to get ready to play Indianapolis (in the regular-season opener). Obviously, we've got some things to fix and some issues to attend to, and we'll do that."

The turnaround better start with the defense.

"We have to stop the run," Kubiak said. "That was the biggest regression.

"And we couldn't get off the field (on third down). I don't think we tackled very well in space. It was just too easy for them to stay on the field. I don't think we were doing anything wrong scheme-wise. I just don't think we executed what we were supposed to be doing very well."

TimeKiller
08-23-2010, 03:12 PM
I just want to see the "it's only preseason" line used because we killed some team 50-0.

gary
08-23-2010, 03:42 PM
Gary is upset the team was killed by Drew Brees and some third string QB neither one of which is as good as Manning. Who would have thought?

Norg
08-23-2010, 03:47 PM
COWGIRLS BETTER BE RDY !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :kingkong::kingkong:

Texan_Bill
08-23-2010, 03:49 PM
Gary is upset the team was killed by Drew Brees and some third string QB neither one of which is as good as Manning. Who would have thought?

Brees had a terrible game. 5 of 10 for 36 yards and a QB rating of 58.8...

JB
08-23-2010, 03:51 PM
Brees had a terrible game. 5 of 10 for 36 yards and a QB rating of 58.8...

yeah, but I think all 5 completions were on third downs.

No More 8-8's
08-23-2010, 03:53 PM
Brees had a terrible game. 5 of 10 for 36 yards and a QB rating of 58.8...
he played far better than the stats showed. He also barely threw the ball too, considering they were running down our throats. And one of those passes was a clutch 3rd conversion near the end zone, while he was falling down. It was a pretty awesome play.

That of course led to him hurrying up the line and getting an easy rushing "David Carr" type TD.

steelbtexan
08-23-2010, 03:56 PM
After Saturday nights fiasco,if Kubes didn't want the title of this thread he should be fired immediately.

More lip srevice,the proof will be in the substance not just in Kubes words.

THE NFL
08-23-2010, 04:05 PM
But wait a minute... I didnt think anything was wrong? Why is Kubiak so upset? Its just pre-season.

Double Barrel
08-23-2010, 04:06 PM
Sorry y'all, but this is just another typical Kubiak team. I wish I felt differently about the matter, but I've lost confidence in our head coach. I hope I am proven wrong many times over this season, but last Saturday did not surprise me at all. Kubiak has been and remains a milquetoast head coach in my mind.

gary
08-23-2010, 04:07 PM
The Saints ran the ball a lot more and Drew played better than it looked like he did no stats tell the whole story.

hookinreds
08-23-2010, 04:13 PM
Lose the wet paper bag run defense is all that I hope for this week.

Texan_Bill
08-23-2010, 04:15 PM
he played far better than the stats showed. He also barely threw the ball too, considering they were running down our throats. And one of those passes was a clutch 3rd conversion near the end zone, while he was falling down. It was a pretty awesome play.

That of course led to him hurrying up the line and getting an easy rushing "David Carr" type TD.

Understood. That said, the Texans were fairly lucky that they caught Brees not playing at his normal standard. That was my point to Gary.

Dutchrudder
08-23-2010, 04:16 PM
I'm sure the defense and offense will improve once the season is underway and it's too late to make the playoffs... :(

JB
08-23-2010, 04:21 PM
I'm sure the defense and offense will improve once the season is underway and it's too late to make the playoffs... :(

Ahh geez!! Don't get that started again! :facepalm:

Ole Miss Texan
08-23-2010, 04:25 PM
We don't need to be talking about Drew Brees. Chase freakin Daniel was beating our 1st string Defense.

Texan_Bill
08-23-2010, 04:28 PM
We don't need to be talking about Drew Brees. Chase freakin Daniel was beating our 1st string Defense.

YUP!! Chase ate our freakin' lunch: 15-21 for 182 yards and 3 TD's (against one pick)... :yikes:

Hardcore Texan
08-23-2010, 04:36 PM
It's funny when you destroy someone in pre-season you can't feel good about it because it's preseason but when you get destroyed (like we did against the Saints) it's time to panic.

Oh, how I loathe you, preseason. And I kind of like you some too. :kitten:

gary
08-23-2010, 04:37 PM
The Saints just did very well with both QB's in the game as a team.

Brando
08-23-2010, 04:40 PM
We don't need to be talking about Drew Brees. Chase freakin Daniel was beating our 1st string Defense.

The way he looked I hope he gets cut and we pick him up to be our 2nd string QB. He probably doesn't get cut though. He looked better than Patrick Ramsey, the Saints current 2nd string QB.

Texan_Bill
08-23-2010, 04:41 PM
I'm not nearly concerned about what their QB's did against us. I'm more worried about the 198 rushing yards we gave up.... That's much more alarming.

It's never good when your leading tacklers are your FS and SS (both in double digit tackles).

beerlover
08-23-2010, 04:43 PM
Alan Burge did a nice spread in the Examiner http://www.examiner.com/houston-texans-in-houston/kubiak-presser-reading-between-the-lines-1

But I don't think its quite time, maybe close, but not yet to pushing eject or :panic:

afterall the Saints won the Superbowl last year while the Texans didn't even make the playoffs. The Saints are healthy, the Texans have lost key players via injury, rehab or suspension. The fact this preseason is on the road, meaning travel & away games only compounds the issues. I get the frustration, I'm just going to let it bring me down, yet :)

Honoring Earl 34
08-23-2010, 04:46 PM
The way he looked I hope he gets cut and we pick him up to be our 2nd string QB. He probably doesn't get cut though. He looked better than Patrick Ramsey, the Saints current 2nd string QB.

Him or Nate Davis from San Fransisco .

gary
08-23-2010, 04:46 PM
The way he looked I hope he gets cut and we pick him up to be our 2nd string QB. He probably doesn't get cut though. He looked better than Patrick Ramsey, the Saints current 2nd string QB.
I wish but I think he'll make the team.

Brando
08-23-2010, 04:48 PM
Him or Nate Davis from San Fransisco .

That guy has a cannon. The one pass from the endzone was like 60 yards in the air.

gary
08-23-2010, 04:51 PM
I wish but I think he'll make the team.
All of the injuries are yet another reason I am concerned.

Ole Miss Texan
08-23-2010, 04:56 PM
The way he looked I hope he gets cut and we pick him up to be our 2nd string QB. He probably doesn't get cut though. He looked better than Patrick Ramsey, the Saints current 2nd string QB.

You know, I was thinking the same thing. It's going to be tough to narrow down the roster to 53 and I think we have to carry only 2 QB's. With that said, if the Saints put Daniel on the PS I would think long and hard about picking him up even though we'd have to activate him.

He's clearly better the Jonny-D Booty and would probably challenge Orlavsky for #2. With Kubiak being the QB Guru he is, it seems Daniel could do pretty well in this offense. Dan-O hasn't shown me the 'poise' that a 5 year veteran should have by now. I'm just saysin it likes I sees it - I was actually a fan of signing him after we traded Sage.

Thorn
08-23-2010, 05:00 PM
meh......I'm waiting for Saturday to see if we're just getting bullshitted again, or if the team actually shows up.

76Texan
08-23-2010, 05:01 PM
You know, I was thinking the same thing. It's going to be tough to narrow down the roster to 53 and I think we have to carry only 2 QB's. With that said, if the Saints put Daniel on the PS I would think long and hard about picking him up even though we'd have to activate him.

He's clearly better the Jonny-D Booty and would probably challenge Orlavsky for #2. With Kubiak being the QB Guru he is, it seems Daniel could do pretty well in this offense. Dan-O hasn't shown me the 'poise' that a 5 year veteran should have by now. I'm just saysin it likes I sees it - I was actually a fan of signing him after we traded Sage.

Their fans want Holliday ?

Wolf6151
08-23-2010, 05:08 PM
If Kubiak wants immediate improvement he should resign.

devo-x
08-23-2010, 05:17 PM
Is it the Texans conditioning level? There were rumors that most of the team appeared tired and fatigued during the game

Dutchrudder
08-23-2010, 05:20 PM
You know, I was thinking the same thing. It's going to be tough to narrow down the roster to 53 and I think we have to carry only 2 QB's. With that said, if the Saints put Daniel on the PS I would think long and hard about picking him up even though we'd have to activate him.

He's clearly better the Jonny-D Booty and would probably challenge Orlavsky for #2. With Kubiak being the QB Guru he is, it seems Daniel could do pretty well in this offense. Dan-O hasn't shown me the 'poise' that a 5 year veteran should have by now. I'm just saysin it likes I sees it - I was actually a fan of signing him after we traded Sage.

Somehow I don't believe Chase Daniel would anywhere near as well with our O-line playing against some of the teams we have on the schedule. I think he shined for more reasons than his personal talent.

Yankee_In_TX
08-23-2010, 05:22 PM
YUP!! Chase ate our freakin' lunch: 15-21 for 182 yards and 3 TD's (against one pick)... :yikes:

I was hoping as their 3rd stringer they cut him and we can pick him up :kitten:

JB
08-23-2010, 05:23 PM
Somehow I don't believe Chase Daniel would anywhere near as well with our O-line playing against some of the teams we have on the schedule. I think he shined for more reasons than his personal talent.

I agree with this! Small qb behind a small OL = not good!

Yankee_In_TX
08-23-2010, 05:23 PM
Is it the Texans conditioning level? There were rumors that most of the team appeared tired and fatigued during the game

Again, according to Eric Winston and some other players - they missed their families, were tired and wanted to go home. wtf

JB
08-23-2010, 05:26 PM
Again, according to Eric Winston and some other players - they missed their families, were tired and wanted to go home. wtf

Winston say's he never said what was being reported.

cuppacoffee
08-23-2010, 05:34 PM
Somehow I don't believe Chase Daniel would anywhere near as well with our O-line playing against some of the teams we have on the schedule. I think he shined for more reasons than his personal talent.


The Texans have a habit of making mediocre quarterbacks look like all pro's.

Been doing it for years.

The lone exception being David Carr.


:coffee:

CloakNNNdagger
08-23-2010, 05:35 PM
YUP!! Chase ate our freakin' lunch: 15-21 for 182 yards and 3 TD's (against one pick)... :yikes:

He's so short, all the Saints had to do was roll him out or just have him take a few more steps back, and he would just disappear into the crowd or out of sight.:thinking: Our Dmen were looking straight ahead........not down to find the little mutha..........that must have been our problem..............Gosh, if we only had a smaller D:kitten:

CloakNNNdagger
08-23-2010, 05:50 PM
Winston say's he never said what was being reported.

Here's the Winston post game interview with Rich Lord (http://kilt.cbslocal.com/2010/08/21/eric-winston-2/#more-13812). Make the call yourself.

DexmanC
08-23-2010, 05:56 PM
Winston say's he never said what was being reported.

That's good 'ol Eric trying to back off of what he said on live, recorded
radio. There's no taking it back. He said it.

GP
08-23-2010, 05:59 PM
That's good 'ol Eric trying to back off of what he said on live, recorded
radio. There's no taking it back. He said it.

If he said THAT, then we're absolutely screwed. Period.

Don't nobody try to tell me any different.

When you post that junk, you reveal your team's nature. You just showed complete softness. Utterly mindless for what these guys get paid and for what they're trying to do (Win a title, supposedly).

Man, I wish I had not read all of this. Just makes me angry.

CloakNNNdagger
08-23-2010, 06:08 PM
That's good 'ol Eric trying to back off of what he said on live, recorded
radio. There's no taking it back. He said it.

Well, there are worse things than sticking your foot in your mouth.

http://www.nataliedee.com/012909/eeeew-gross.jpg

GP
08-23-2010, 06:11 PM
I know a place I'd like to stick that pen. Up someone's urethra.

God love Eric Winston, but if he said what he said then that's a classic example of utter stupidity. Kubiak should take that quote and RUN with it this week.

But he won't. He's just cruisin' along the highway, feeling the breeze in his hair.

JB
08-23-2010, 06:15 PM
Here's the Winston post game interview with Rich Lord (http://kilt.cbslocal.com/2010/08/21/eric-winston-2/#more-13812). Make the call yourself.

That's good 'ol Eric trying to back off of what he said on live, recorded
radio. There's no taking it back. He said it.

Okay, I listened to it for the first time. He responded to the question of if the travel of the Cards game and the the practices were tiring to the team and he said Yeah, the guys wanted to just play a good game and go home. I see nothing defeatist in that or that they were taking the game lightly.

infantrycak
08-23-2010, 06:20 PM
Geez some folks need hyperventilation bags around here. Winston said zilch that was offensive. Basically said the team was looking forward to an ordinary schedule.

gary
08-23-2010, 06:22 PM
Won't anyone get the qoute correct? LOL

DexmanC
08-23-2010, 06:23 PM
Geez some folks need hyperventilation bags around here. Winston said zilch that was offensive. Basically said the team was looking forward to an ordinary schedule.

....and when they open up lax against the Colts, it'll be because
training camp was too tough, and they were tired.

We haven't seen anything "new" about 2010 yet.
Maybe it's opening day...

infantrycak
08-23-2010, 06:28 PM
....and when they open up lax against the Colts, it'll be because
training camp was too tough, and they were tired.

We haven't seen anything "new" about 2010 yet.
Maybe it's opening day...

I have no problem with folks who are disappointed with the Saints game but that doesn't justify trying to make an innocent comment into something it was not. There are enough things to piss and moan about without making things up.

DexmanC
08-23-2010, 06:36 PM
I have no problem with folks who are disappointed with the Saints game but that doesn't justify trying to make an innocent comment into something it was not. There are enough things to piss and moan about without making things up.

I think "making things up" is a little strong of a phrase.
It seems more like "making an inference" from his words
and tone of voice. Doesn't seem "made out of whole cloth"
to me.

Texecutioner
08-23-2010, 06:46 PM
I was out of town so I didn't get to watch this game, but I heard that it was so bad that it wasn't even worth watching. I was at the pre season game vs NO last season though, and remembered feeling like what many are describing today after watching our defense that year. You can't expect to get better though without making any real moves to fill holes in free agency with quality proven players. This only build through the draft mentality drives me up the wall. I didn't watch the game though, so I won't comment to much about it, but it sure as hell sounds like the same old Texans under Kubiak. A lot of talented guys that are unprepared and lack a lot of fire and intensity. Anyone who thinks that are secondary isn't going to get killed this year is up for a rude awakening.

Brando
08-23-2010, 06:50 PM
I was hoping as their 3rd stringer they cut him and we can pick him up :kitten:

He impressed me. I'm hoping it was his performance rather than ours as defensive unit. Like TB pointed out, it's our run defense is what concerns me the most. Hopefully, since we are home cookin this Saturday, we come out strong against the Cowboys.

DexmanC
08-23-2010, 07:06 PM
I was hoping as their 3rd stringer they cut him and we can pick him up :kitten:

Isn't that how we got Dan Orlovsky? He lit the Texans up with
that bomb he threw to Calvin Johnson from his own endzone and
the coaches rushed to sign him.

thunderkyss
08-23-2010, 07:25 PM
meh......I'm waiting for Saturday to see if we're just getting bullshitted again, or if the team actually shows up.

Stop it. Please, for the love of God... stop it.

Remember three years ago, the Cowboys came to Reliant in the preseason. If you were at Reliant, I'm sure you remember that (preseason) game. We kicked their ass. At one time, our 2s were kicking their 1s butt.

We went 8-8 that season, the Cowboys went 13-3.

thunderkyss
08-23-2010, 07:39 PM
Kubiak wants immediate improvement
Defense's inability to stop Saints on downs perturbs Texans coach
By JOHN McCLAIN
Copyright 2010 Houston Chronicle
Aug. 23, 2010, 12:15AM
"Our attention to detail, our effort at times -it's not near what it needs to be for us to get ready to play Indianapolis (in the regular-season opener). Obviously, we've got some things to fix and some issues to attend to, and we'll do that."


This was my favorite part of the article. The only part really worth the paper it is written on.

This is practice. The 1st preseason game, the 2nd preseason game, the 3rd preseason game... practice. We're getting ready for Indy,



Period.

CloakNNNdagger
08-23-2010, 08:13 PM
Winston stated that "the lag of not being around Houston, I think really hit us about yesterday. You know, where everyone was like, you know, let's play a good game, and let's go home, you know."

"Yesterday" referred to Friday since this interview was on Saturday. I guess I have somewhat of a question why this team would be thinking about let alone experiencing "lag" before this game.

ESAD2-14
08-23-2010, 08:22 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CmSCh5ZkMqk&feature=related

Someone posted this before here at TT.

I thought maybe the Saints spiked the Texans Gatorade with something before the game (not really), as they looked lackadaisical and discombobulated from the get go. Hope they get it (whatever "it" is) out of their system before the season kicks off for real.

ATXtexanfan
08-23-2010, 08:25 PM
It's funny when you destroy someone in pre-season you can't feel good about it because it's preseason but when you get destroyed (like we did against the Saints) it's time to panic.

Oh, how I loathe you, preseason. And I kind of like you some too. :kitten:

amen brother

CloakNNNdagger
08-23-2010, 08:27 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CmSCh5ZkMqk&feature=related

Someone posted this before here at TT.

I thought maybe the Saints spiked the Texans Gatorade with something before the game (not really), as they looked lackadaisical and discombobulated from the get go. Hope they get it (whatever "it" is) out of their system before the season kicks off for real.

That was I, for the Jamarcus Russell Purple Drank thread. I guess that's also how "lag" can be described, though.

The Pencil Neck
08-23-2010, 08:58 PM
yeah, but I think all 5 completions were on third downs.

But he didn't convert all his third downs and had to punt. It's easy to forget that since Holliday fumbled that punt.

Ole Miss Texan
08-23-2010, 09:30 PM
Isn't that how we got Dan Orlovsky? He lit the Texans up with
that bomb he threw to Calvin Johnson from his own endzone and
the coaches rushed to sign him.

If by "rushed to sign him" you mean signing him 4 1/2 months later in the offseason after we traded away Sage? Then yes.

JB
08-23-2010, 09:40 PM
If by "rushed to sign him" you mean signing him 4 1/2 months later in the offseason after we traded away Sage? Then yes.

Hindsight is whatever you want it to be.

beerlover
08-23-2010, 10:16 PM
If by "rushed to sign him" you mean signing him 4 1/2 months later in the offseason after we traded away Sage? Then yes.

Sage may soon be available without paying any draft pick(s) in return?

Ole Miss Texan
08-23-2010, 10:21 PM
Hindsight is whatever you want it to be.
Just clarifying what the timeline actually was. I was actually in favor of trading Sage (particularly a year earlier) and was supportive of bringing in Dan-O (even though he was/is winless).
Sage may soon be available without paying any draft pick(s) in return?
I wonder if he would sign with us? I'd love to have him back. Good person and a good backup.

beerlover
08-23-2010, 10:25 PM
Just clarifying what the timeline actually was. I was actually in favor of trading Sage (particularly a year earlier) and was supportive of bringing in Dan-O (even though he was/is winless).

I wonder if he would sign with us? I'd love to have him back. Good person and a good backup.

ask yourself who you would rather have Dan Orlovsky or Sage backing up Schaub?

DexmanC
08-23-2010, 10:28 PM
If by "rushed to sign him" you mean signing him 4 1/2 months later in the offseason after we traded away Sage? Then yes.

Uh... Players become free agents in the OFFSEASON.

CloakNNNdagger
08-23-2010, 10:40 PM
ask yourself who you would rather have Dan Orlovsky or Sage backing up Schaub?

Let's see. Orlovsky or Sage? Orlovsky or Sage? Vinegar or hot toddy?

beerlover
08-23-2010, 10:47 PM
Let's see. Orlovsky or Sage? Orlovsky or Sage? Vinegar or hot toddy?

yeah, pick your poison :ahhaha:

however his release is clean, even better than I remember while here, maybe some of Farve has rubbed off, but he knows & can run this offense better than Orlovsky so I would prefer him.

CloakNNNdagger
08-24-2010, 07:07 AM
yeah, pick your poison :ahhaha:

however his release is clean, even better than I remember while here, maybe some of Farve has rubbed off, but he knows & can run this offense better than Orlovsky so I would prefer him.

I know that there are those that cannot put the "Rosencopter" out of their mind and probably never will, but at this point in time, I would take back Sage in a flash. People seem to forget how as a backup he more typically "held" the team in the race. Right now, I would not trust Orlovsky to give us at least that much if Schaub goes down. That's MHO.

SheTexan
08-24-2010, 07:16 AM
I know that there are those that cannot put the "Rosencopter" out of their mind and probably never will, but at this point in time, I would take back Sage in a flash. People seem to forget how as a backup he more typically "held" the team in the race. Right now, I would not trust Orlovsky to give us at least that much if Schaub goes down. That's MHO.

Same here Jean! Gimme Sage anyday over DO! Sage is another Texan who made a booobooo and got creamed by the media and fans in Houston. We got rid of him for someone who is NO better, and probably worst. Ya know the old saying "be careful what you wish for." That wish might come back to bite ya in the gm!!

steelbtexan
08-24-2010, 08:57 AM
Same here Jean! Gimme Sage anyday over DO! Sage is another Texan who made a booobooo and got creamed by the media and fans in Houston. We got rid of him for someone who is NO better, and probably worst. Ya know the old saying "be careful what you wish for." That wish might come back to bite ya in the gm!!

Ditto

Ole Miss Texan
08-24-2010, 09:20 AM
Isn't that how we got Dan Orlovsky? He lit the Texans up with that bomb he threw to Calvin Johnson from his own endzone and the coaches rushed to sign him.

If by "rushed to sign him" you mean signing him 4 1/2 months later in the offseason after we traded away Sage? Then yes.

Uh... Players become free agents in the OFFSEASON.
LOL, yup. They didn't "rush" out and sign him after he threw that TD to Calvin Johnson, a game we still won. They didn't "rush" out and sign him the minute he was a free agent. They signed him because we had traded away Sage, if it wasn't for that Dan-O wouldn't be on this team.
ask yourself who you would rather have Dan Orlovsky or Sage backing up Schaub?
No question I'd rather have Sage backing up Schaub, hands down. Speaking of hindsight, I'm not going to go back on my feelings though that I had wanted to trade Sage for the 3rd rounder the year before we traded him for the 4th (don't know if that 3rd was actually on the table though). We're getting way off topic here but Sage is a very good backup and I'd take him over just about anybody in the league, I've always liked him on this team. It's just ashame the 4th rounder Anthony Hill hasn't worked out. I don't know why we're really talking about it thought bc Sage still has 2 seasons on his contract.

Double Barrel
08-24-2010, 10:46 AM
Stop it. Please, for the love of God... stop it.

Remember three years ago, the Cowboys came to Reliant in the preseason. If you were at Reliant, I'm sure you remember that (preseason) game. We kicked their ass. At one time, our 2s were kicking their 1s butt.

We went 8-8 that season, the Cowboys went 13-3.

yeah, preseason games are meaningless yada yada yada...

However, that being said, I'd still like to see solid fundamentals from our players, and in that regard, many are simply unprepared and sloppy.

GP
08-24-2010, 11:00 AM
yeah, preseason games are meaningless yada yada yada...

However, that being said, I'd still like to see solid fundamentals from our players, and in that regard, many are simply unprepared and sloppy.

Exactly.

But there is such noise being made about how the poor play in the previous game is to be ignored. I truly don't seem to get it.

Not that I have my finger on the Fire Now button. I don't. But the amount of head-in-the-sand attitude is alarming. I don't choose to hype things up. Had we played AS WELL as the Saints, I'm probably easing into the hype zone with the Texans.

But the past performance looked eerily similar to patterns of the past preseason, which led to rust in the first several games of the season. This team is up-and-down. You can tolerate lolligagging when you've seen that it's not a regular attitude. There's nothing about us (our past) that should have led to the team being THAT disinterested and comatose for THAT long. A full two quarters of bumbling and stumbling....with the 2nd quarter facing their 2's mostly.

cuppacoffee
08-24-2010, 11:41 AM
This was my favorite part of the article. The only part really worth the paper it is written on.

This is practice. The 1st preseason game, the 2nd preseason game, the 3rd preseason game... practice. We're getting ready for Indy,



Period.



TK I know you have heard the old saying, " You play like you practice".

Next game tells it all for this coming season, whether it's practice or not.

Third preseason game, coming off an old fashioned ass-whoppin, against dullass.

Gotta be a statement made by this 'new' Texan team.

:coffee:

thunderkyss
08-24-2010, 11:51 AM
But the amount of head-in-the-sand attitude is alarming.

But the past performance looked eerily similar to patterns of the past preseason, which led to rust in the first several games of the season.

We didn't look great those first three games of last year. I don't want to be misunderstood. However, most people believe we turned something around, once Pollard got here. The evidence (the Game tape, the box scores, and the play-by-play) says something totally different.

We looked bad in the preseason last year. But once the regular season started, (Game 1) we were playing some really good defense. If you look at the number of runs against us, you'll see percentage wise, more of those plays went for 3 yards or less, than those that went for more than 3 yards (by a substantial margin). A large number of those plays were for 0 yards, or for a loss of yards.

That's the same team that looked bad in the preseason last year. They look bad again this year, because we are looking for them to "manhandle" the Saints, we are looking for them to blow up the RB, we are looking for them to be "competitive."

I believe in my heart of hearts, that they are working on stuff, that we do not see. We are only seeing little pieces here and there, and not looking at the big picture.

Wax on, Wax off...

I'm saying that, because that is what happened last year. They didn't look like a pro football team against the Vikings, or the Saints. But once the regular season started, we were playing real NFL football.

The effort was there against the Jets... The #1 rushing team couldn't run on our defense for most of the game. That's a fact, check the play-by-play. Week 2, CJ had 16 Carries against us. 4 of those were monsters. I've got it at home, but I think his other 10 carries were for less than 12 yards. Same thing with Jones Drew, there was effort there, they came to play.

Just goofed up here and there (Only one big play to MJD).

The only real defense I can cede to the no effort yap, is that our offense looked dead against the Jets. It didn't help that Kubiak took out half the play book, because Schaub had a boo-boo.

thunderkyss
08-24-2010, 11:54 AM
TK I know you have heard the old saying, " You play like you practice".

Next game tells it all for this coming season, whether it's practice or not.

Third preseason game, coming off an old fashioned ass-whoppin, against dullass.

Gotta be a statement made by this 'new' Texan team.

:coffee:

Why?

Indy loses that game every year, yet they win 12+ every season.

Again, we beat the Cowboys in that very game, in 2007. They went 13-3, we went 8-8.

It doesn't mean what you think it means.

eriadoc
08-24-2010, 12:06 PM
Kubiak wants immediate improvement

Therefore, he cancelled Monday's practice. The kids were tired, I guess.

Look, preseason is practice, we all know that. But you play in the regular season like you practice. Preseason is worthless in a lots of ways, but it does reveal indicators. If this team's practice has resulted in tackles like we saw on Saturday, then the team has problems. If this team's practice has resulted in getting blown off the ball in the trenches on both sides, then this team has problems. And if this team is practicing to come out so lackadaisical and without fire, then this team has problems.

Yes, the preseason is vanilla. Well, tackling is as vanilla as it gets. Heads up beating the guy in front of you is as vanilla as it gets. Coming out with some fire in the belly and a sense of urgency is as vanilla as it gets.

Double Barrel
08-24-2010, 12:22 PM
Therefore, he cancelled Monday's practice. The kids were tired, I guess.

Look, preseason is practice, we all know that. But you play in the regular season like you practice. Preseason is worthless in a lots of ways, but it does reveal indicators. If this team's practice has resulted in tackles like we saw on Saturday, then the team has problems. If this team's practice has resulted in getting blown off the ball in the trenches on both sides, then this team has problems. And if this team is practicing to come out so lackadaisical and without fire, then this team has problems.

Yes, the preseason is vanilla. Well, tackling is as vanilla as it gets. Heads up beating the guy in front of you is as vanilla as it gets. Coming out with some fire in the belly and a sense of urgency is as vanilla as it gets.

My thoughts, as well. Bringing up Indy's preseason records is pointless, because we are not the Colts. They are a proven team that has the ability to turn it on when the games matter. The Texans are not that type of team and never have been. They lack intensity in practice and preseason games, and the resulting sloppy play and flawed fundamentals has no excuse.

I could care less if the Texans went 0-4 in preseason but we saw a team that was focused and taking care of business. If the defense misses tackles against Indy in week one, expect a blowout.

Rey
08-24-2010, 12:28 PM
I could care less if the Texans went 0-4 in preseason but we saw a team that was focused and taking care of business. If the defense misses tackles against Indy in week one, expect a blowout.

Yeah...

I don't think too many people were actually upset about the loss in game one because the starters came out and played well.

Against NO they just looked pitiful...Score be damned...

DexmanC
08-24-2010, 03:43 PM
TK I know you have heard the old saying, " You play like you practice".

Next game tells it all for this coming season, whether it's practice or not.

Third preseason game, coming off an old fashioned ass-whoppin, against dullass.

Gotta be a statement made by this 'new' Texan team.

:coffee:


"Who in the hell treats the third game of the preseason
like it's bullshit? BULLSHIT!

We find out Saturday how to think about the Texans going into
the regular season.

RTP2110
08-24-2010, 04:13 PM
Winston said zilch that was offensive. Basically said the team was looking forward to an ordinary schedule.

I agree, and I may be the only one, but I think there is a bit of legitimacy to what he said. Normally for road games these guys are only out of town two days. They arrive Saturday, and come right back home Sunday after the game. In this case, they were in NO for 5 days. 5 long days of camp and practices that culminated with a meaningless preseason game. I don't doubt that they were a bit fatigued physically and mentally. I can see where some of them probably just wanted to get that game over and get back home. I don't think there's any way they approach the week 1 home opener against a division rival in the same manner they did this preaseason game. At least I sure as hell hope not. The game this Saturday will be very telling, IMO.

CloakNNNdagger
08-24-2010, 04:20 PM
It certainly doesn't give me any more solace that Vince Young and company didn't have too much difficulty putting Arizona away last night.

The Pencil Neck
08-24-2010, 04:30 PM
It certainly doesn't give me any more solace that Vince Young and company didn't have too much difficulty putting Arizona away last night.

Tennessee was only up 10-3 at halftime. We were up more than that after the first quarter AND at halftime.

cuppacoffee
08-24-2010, 06:04 PM
Why?

Indy loses that game every year, yet they win 12+ every season.

Again, we beat the Cowboys in that very game, in 2007. They went 13-3, we went 8-8.

It doesn't mean what you think it means.


We will just have to disagree about this one.

First home game ( even if it is exh.) after just missing the playoffs the previous season, all the talking about how things are going to be different this year. Failing to show up in NO. It's the hated dullass team ( even if it's only the fans who feel that way ). I just don't think this bunch can wait until the first regular season game to show up.

This will be the first game with any game planning to speak of, so Kubiak and Bush will need to show up too.

I still think this game will tell us if this bunch is for real or just a bunch of wannabe/talkers.

We definitely aren't Indy.


:coffee:

thunderkyss
08-24-2010, 06:09 PM
I still think this game will tell us if this bunch is for real or just a bunch of wannabe/talkers.


:coffee:

So what did it tell us in 2007?

We dominated.

DexmanC
08-24-2010, 06:48 PM
We will just have to disagree about this one.

First home game ( even if it is exh.) after just missing the playoffs the previous season, all the talking about how things are going to be different this year. Failing to show up in NO. It's the hated dullass team ( even if it's only the fans who feel that way ). I just don't think this bunch can wait until the first regular season game to show up.

This will be the first game with any game planning to speak of, so Kubiak and Bush will need to show up too.

I still think this game will tell us if this bunch is for real or just a bunch of wannabe/talkers.

We definitely aren't Indy.


:coffee:

Apologists for Saturday night continually try to play the "Indy loses, too"
card. The Texans have YET to demonstrate the focus and maturity
of the Colts. It's truly an apples-to-oranges argument. They must
PRACTICE focus and maturity NOW.

They went to Pittsburgh two years ago, and played at preseason speed
all game long! Casey Hampton even threw Chris Myers INTO Slaton.

They repeated the same shit LAST opening day. They don't have the
track record of a team that starts the season focused and ready to go.
Thus, we fans are in a "wait-'till-I-see-it" mode with this regime. They'd
BETTER show up ready to play Saturday night.

It doesn't matter if they win. It matters how they perform.

b0ng
08-24-2010, 07:06 PM
So I guess the "fans" that don't get all riled up about how the team looked in a preseason loss are apologists? I mean, I could say that they played like shit, or that I don't accept failure or a million other cliche's but in the end, I just really don't care nearly as much as I do in the regular season. I didn't really give a shit that we beat down the Cardinals either, so I guess I'm consistent with my apathy.

I mean, apart from the gameplan not even being "win the game at all costs" like it is in the regular season, it's still up in the air why the defense looked so terrible. Disinterest? Out coached? Subpar technique? You can point to any of these points and say a million things to try to justify your opinion, but in the end, we still don't know why's. Getting all worked up in preseason and posting retarded stuff like "Oh man this team is soft and I hate the coach" is just doing a throwback to your own opinion at the end of the 2009 season for almost everybody here. The pessimists still think this team sucks, and the optimists are still thinking that we are on the right track and everybody is getting in these gay slapfights about it all over this board. For preseason I like looking at individual battles for players that 1) Weren't on the team last year or were injured and 2) Are in a tight position battle.

Mario isn't in a position battle. Neither is Okoye (even though a position battle is pretty warranted at this point). Nor is Cushing or Ryans or Antonio Smith. I'm not expecting the coaching staff to show us everything they've installed or implemented in TC that is new either, because that would just be stupid. I know it's nice to see our 1's crush people, but in the end, they aren't making the same kind of game checks in preseason as they are in the regular season and it doesn't surprise me in the least bit that the guys not fighting for a spot aren't playing like they are. This whole "Oh the 3rd game is the big one" is horseshit too. Again, our 1's might be out there for longer (Hopefully they just tell Andre to stay at home, and maybe Schaub too) but I'm not expecting to see blitz packages or jap plays on the offense.

Basically a lot of people on both sides of the fence are trying to read entirely too much into the preseason and the games that are played. I think your eyes should more be looking for players who look like they will make the 53 that you really didn't think had a shot (Like Troy Nolan, or at least for me it's Nolan), not how hard all the starters are going and what the scheme looks like.

The Pencil Neck
08-24-2010, 07:30 PM
We will just have to disagree about this one.

First home game ( even if it is exh.) after just missing the playoffs the previous season, all the talking about how things are going to be different this year. Failing to show up in NO. It's the hated dullass team ( even if it's only the fans who feel that way ). I just don't think this bunch can wait until the first regular season game to show up.

This will be the first game with any game planning to speak of, so Kubiak and Bush will need to show up too.

I still think this game will tell us if this bunch is for real or just a bunch of wannabe/talkers.

We definitely aren't Indy.


:coffee:

As has been said over and over, this is preseason. The purpose isn't to win games. The purpose is to learn things and to fix things and to determine who your players are.

A lot of you are getting upset because we didn't show up against the Saints.

And then when people point to how won/loss records really don't mean that much when it comes to determining how your team is going to play in the regular season and use the Colts as an example, you come back with the quip "Well, we're not the Colts."

The point isn't about the Colts, it's about winning and losing in the preseason.

Last year, some of the best teams in the preseason were the Seahawks, the Rams, the Lions, the Dolphins, the Bears, the 49ers and the Steelers. None of those teams made the playoffs and some of them didn't win very many games at all.

And the playoff teams last year?
Bengals - 2-2
Cardinals - 0-4
Chargers - 2-2
Colts - 1-3
Cowboys - 2-2
Eagles - 1-3
Jets - 2-2
Packers - 3-1
Patriots - 3-1
Ravens - 4-0
Saints - 3-1
Vikings - 3-1

That's all over the place. Which proves the point. Winning and losing doesn't matter in the preseason. What matters is preparing for the season.

cuppacoffee
08-24-2010, 07:59 PM
So what did it tell us in 2007?

We dominated.

We did go 3-1 against the weaker NFC.


:coffee:

thunderkyss
08-24-2010, 08:53 PM
Apologists for Saturday night continually try to play the "Indy loses, too"
card. The Texans have YET to demonstrate the focus and maturity
of the Colts. It's truly an apples-to-oranges argument. They must
PRACTICE focus and maturity NOW.

They went to Pittsburgh two years ago, and played at preseason speed
all game long! Casey Hampton even threw Chris Myers INTO Slaton.

They repeated the same shit LAST opening day. They don't have the
track record of a team that starts the season focused and ready to go.
Thus, we fans are in a "wait-'till-I-see-it" mode with this regime. They'd
BETTER show up ready to play Saturday night.

It doesn't matter if they win. It matters how they perform.

Super Bowl

JB
08-24-2010, 09:27 PM
Always-quotable safety Bernard Pollard said that Kubiak gave the players a “whoopin’” on Monday when the entire team watched film together. “He put us all in one room,” Pollard said. “We all watched every single play. I think that was enough. When you put up film like that and your teammates see how bad you played and you see how many mistakes were in one play and how many missed tackles there were in one play – I think we missed four tackles on one play – you can’t do that, and Coach Kubiak let us know in a polite way that he don’t want that out of us, and we don’t want that out of ourselves. We have to hold each other accountable.”

Link (http://www.houstontexans.com/blog/index.asp?post_id=1380)


I think that is Bonecrusher's way of saying that Kubiak reamed their collective ass yesterday!

thegr8fan
08-24-2010, 09:32 PM
The Saints are the Super Bowl champions. The Cowboys are Super Bowl contenders coming off a victory at San Diego. when exactly were the Cowboys superbowl contenders? Oh yeah, the 90's. Well they say the memory of yesteryears is what keeps old timers going, eh McLame.

the game Saturday was sloppy, in terms of fundamental football, IMHO. That was the most discouraging part to see as a Texans fan. Then again, ALOT of our games are sloppy fundamental football. That seems to be the Kubiak regime. That kind of play is on the coaching, not the players, IMHO.

Time to fix the problem, bad coaching, and not the sympton, poor play. But Bob McNair isn't the kind to give up on a bad player or a bad coach until it is painfully obvious, to ANYONE who watches football, that it/he just isn't going to work.

cuppacoffee
08-24-2010, 09:41 PM
As has been said over and over, this is preseason. The purpose isn't to win games. The purpose is to learn things and to fix things and to determine who your players are.

A lot of you are getting upset because we didn't show up against the Saints.

And then when people point to how won/loss records really don't mean that much when it comes to determining how your team is going to play in the regular season and use the Colts as an example, you come back with the quip "Well, we're not the Colts."

The point isn't about the Colts, it's about winning and losing in the preseason.

Last year, some of the best teams in the preseason were the Seahawks, the Rams, the Lions, the Dolphins, the Bears, the 49ers and the Steelers. None of those teams made the playoffs and some of them didn't win very many games at all.

And the playoff teams last year?
Bengals - 2-2
Cardinals - 0-4
Chargers - 2-2
Colts - 1-3
Cowboys - 2-2
Eagles - 1-3
Jets - 2-2
Packers - 3-1
Patriots - 3-1
Ravens - 4-0
Saints - 3-1
Vikings - 3-1

That's all over the place. Which proves the point. Winning and losing doesn't matter in the preseason. What matters is preparing for the season.



Exactly what did they do against the Saints that prepared them for the season? ( preparing to be mugged weekly? ). :slapfight:

Is missing tackles preparing for the season?.:foottap:

Is making Reggie (frigging) Bush look like the second coming of Jim Brown preparing for the season?..:hmmm:

Just showing up and going through the motions is not preparing for the season.

What did we learn?

What are we gonna fix?

Name someone who stood out and looked like they belong on a 53 man roster? That is the purpose of the preseason, isn't it?

If the games mean absolutely nothing then why the hell play them. (well, actually, you could make a case that we didn't)

Understand--I don't care that we lost a preseason game.

I care that we forfeited the game without showing up. Forfeit = quitters.

:rant:


:coffee:

The Pencil Neck
08-24-2010, 09:45 PM
Exactly what did they do against the Saints that prepared them for the season? ( preparing to be mugged weekly? ). :slapfight:

Is missing tackles preparing for the season?.:foottap:

Is making Reggie (frigging) Bush look like the second coming of Jim Brown preparing for the season?..:hmmm:

Just showing up and going through the motions is not preparing for the season.

What did we learn?

What are we gonna fix?

Name someone who stood out and looked like they belong on a 53 man roster? That is the purpose of the preseason, isn't it?

If the games mean absolutely nothing then why the hell play them. (well, actually, you could make a case that we didn't)

Understand--I don't care that we lost a preseason game.

I care that we forfeited the game without showing up. Forfeit = quitters.

:rant:


:coffee:

Yes.

DexmanC
08-24-2010, 09:46 PM
Understand--I don't care that we lost a preseason game.

I care that we forfeited the game without showing up. Forfeit = quitters.
:coffee:


Must these two points be pounded into the heads of the Saturday Night
Apologists? Who cares about wins and loses in preseason? You PRACTICE
how you PLAY. The habits you set NOW, determines the effectiveness
of your habits in the season.

Will we have a :d:?

Lucky
08-24-2010, 09:58 PM
the game Saturday was sloppy, in terms of fundamental football, IMHO. That was the most discouraging part to see as a Texans fan.
It seemed to me that the Texans mailed this one in. Doesn't bother me in the preseason so much, as it did in last season's opening game at Reliant.

Gr8 to see you back.

The Pencil Neck
08-24-2010, 10:02 PM
Must these two points be pounded into the heads of the Saturday Night
Apologists? Who cares about wins and loses in preseason? You PRACTICE
how you PLAY. The habits you set NOW, determines the effectiveness
of your habits in the season.

Will we have a :defense:?

I know that Kubiak believes that you "practice how you play" but personally, I don't. I think it's really kinda dumb to believe that. Everything I've ever experienced in my life says that's not the case.

But, let's say it is the case.

Let's say that Kubiak has totally lost this team. Let's say that this defense is so amazingly bad that it will never tackle another person again, evar. Let's say that we're going to go through an entire season of giving up 450 yards per game. And let's say that our offense is one dimensional and people will now know how to shut down Kubiak's offense.

OK.

Now what?

Do we sit around and whine about it? You want to swap stories about how bad our players are? Or maybe who we'd prefer to have coaching the team? Cowher, Gruden, Frank Bush? How about we all spend our Sundays out hunting or fishing or playing with our kids instead of watching this pathetic excuse for a team? How about we just go and tailgate and wear jersey's with Kubiak's name crossed out and stuff like that?

JB
08-24-2010, 10:04 PM
I know that Kubiak believes that you "practice how you play" but personally, I don't. I think it's really kinda dumb to believe that. Everything I've ever experienced in my life says that's not the case.

But, let's say it is the case.

Let's say that Kubiak has totally lost this team. Let's say that this defense is so amazingly bad that it will never tackle another person again, evar. Let's say that we're going to go through an entire season of giving up 450 yards per game. And let's say that our offense is one dimensional and people will now know how to shut down Kubiak's offense.

OK.

Now what?

Do we sit around and whine about it? You want to swap stories about how bad our players are? Or maybe who we'd prefer to have coaching the team? Cowher, Gruden, Frank Bush? How about we all spend our Sundays out hunting or fishing or playing with our kids instead of watching this pathetic excuse for a team? How about we just go and tailgate and wear jersey's with Kubiak's name crossed out and stuff like that?


http://www.texanstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=74537

DexmanC
08-24-2010, 10:08 PM
I know that Kubiak believes that you "practice how you play" but personally, I don't. I think it's really kinda dumb to believe that. Everything I've ever experienced in my life says that's not the case.

But, let's say it is the case.

Let's say that Kubiak has totally lost this team. Let's say that this defense is so amazingly bad that it will never tackle another person again, evar. Let's say that we're going to go through an entire season of giving up 450 yards per game. And let's say that our offense is one dimensional and people will now know how to shut down Kubiak's offense.

OK.

Now what?

Do we sit around and whine about it? You want to swap stories about how bad our players are? Or maybe who we'd prefer to have coaching the team? Cowher, Gruden, Frank Bush? How about we all spend our Sundays out hunting or fishing or playing with our kids instead of watching this pathetic excuse for a team? How about we just go and tailgate and wear jersey's with Kubiak's name crossed out and stuff like that?

Everything I've said in this thread, is in the context of being a Texans fan,
and addressing what I saw on the field. My posts are not in the exaggerated
context of what you've just stated.

The Pencil Neck
08-24-2010, 10:30 PM
Everything I've said in this thread, is in the context of being a Texans fan,
and addressing what I saw on the field. My posts are not in the exaggerated
context of what you've just stated.

Will we have a defense? (You've said that.)

We're going to go 5-7 to start the season. (You've said that several times.)

We're repeating the same mistakes we made the past two years when we came out and got our asses handed to us by the Steelers and the Jets. (You've said that several times.)

If you don't think Kubiak is teh Suxor, then you're an apologist. (You just said that.)

Just because you don't THINK you're posts are in the exaggerated manner I posted, that doesn't mean they're not.

You're a Texan fan. Great. You think the team has made a mistake. Great. You want to complain about it. Great.

Go ahead.

DexmanC
08-24-2010, 10:42 PM
Will we have a defense? (You've said that.)

Yep. It's a valid question.

We're going to go 5-7 to start the season. (You've said that several times.)

I said we HAVE GONE 5-7 to start the LAST THREE SEASONS.
That's the truth. My question, is "Will 2010 be DIFFERENT?"
Again. It's a valid question.

We're repeating the same mistakes we made the past two years when we came out and got our asses handed to us by the Steelers and the Jets. (You've said that several times.)

Yep. We are on the same path as the earlier seasons. I've NOT
predicted how 2010 will be, only asked about how what we've seen indicates an improvement.


If you don't think Kubiak is teh Suxor, then you're an apologist. (You just said that.)

I used the phrase "SATURDAY NIGHT" before the word "Apologist" as
a reference to the crap we saw live from New Orleans. Again. A valid point.


Just because you don't THINK you're posts are in the exaggerated manner I posted, that doesn't mean they're not.

You're a Texan fan. Great. You think the team has made a mistake. Great. You want to complain about it. Great. Go ahead.

...and you don't like what I have to say about it. Fair enough.
My words here aren't personal to any member of this board. I'm
only expressing my observations, and appreciating the feedback.

cuppacoffee
08-24-2010, 10:51 PM
I know that Kubiak believes that you "practice how you play" but personally, I don't. I think it's really kinda dumb to believe that. Everything I've ever experienced in my life says that's not the case.

But, let's say it is the case.

Let's say that Kubiak has totally lost this team. Let's say that this defense is so amazingly bad that it will never tackle another person again, evar. Let's say that we're going to go through an entire season of giving up 450 yards per game. And let's say that our offense is one dimensional and people will now know how to shut down Kubiak's offense.

OK.

Now what?

Do we sit around and whine about it? You want to swap stories about how bad our players are? Or maybe who we'd prefer to have coaching the team? Cowher, Gruden, Frank Bush? How about we all spend our Sundays out hunting or fishing or playing with our kids instead of watching this pathetic excuse for a team? How about we just go and tailgate and wear jersey's with Kubiak's name crossed out and stuff like that?



I just want our team to show up and perform like an NFL team, exhibition game or not.

"I just want to be happy. Is that too much to ask?"- The Pencil Neck..:D


:coffee:

thunderkyss
08-24-2010, 11:27 PM
Exactly what did they do against the Saints that prepared them for the season? ( preparing to be mugged weekly? ). :slapfight:

Is missing tackles preparing for the season?.:foottap:

I've watched our team go through so many drills, that do not look as though they would translate to the field. But they do it anyway.

I don't believe that what we were looking at, was what we thought it was. You know our team plays better than that.

This was still a preseason game, it's about practice, it's about getting your guys out there, and putting them in unplanned situations.

They don't always tackle in practice, and when they do, it's not like regular season tackling.

I also don't know if they are even looking at the "team" these first couple of games. I wouldn't be surprised if they aren't focused on groups (DL, LB, DBs, etc..) if not the individuals.

This week, will be the first game that is treated like a regular game. This will probably be the first time they look at the Defense, and the Offense as units.



Is making Reggie (frigging) Bush look like the second coming of Jim Brown preparing for the season?..:hmmm:

Again, it's possible they came out preparing to put on a show for their home crowd, and we came out to practice.

Just showing up and going through the motions is not preparing for the season.

I honestly don't know how anyone can think Andre, Winston, Mario, Demeco, Pollard & Cushing are just going to show up and go through the motions. Or even allow the other guys to "just show up"

One minute, we're behind them 100%, giving them all we've got. The next minute we're spitting on them as we're stabbing them in the back. Do you know what the definition of a fair weather fan is?

Blood, sweat, & tears, everything I got behind the Texans 100%.

That play with Antonio Smith with his hands all over Reggie Bush 4 yards in the backfield, that's a tackle in the regular season, that's a loss. How do I know?

Because no matter what you chicken little's say, I've never seen Antonio Smith whiff on a tackle in the regular season. In practice, that's considered a tackle, even though you see the running back running 40 yards down the field afterwards. In practice, that is a tackle.

What did we learn?

What are we gonna fix?

Those are good questions. If we had anyone on this board with some real professional coaching experience, maybe they could tell us.

I don't know. But whipping the Cardinals in week one didn't mean anything. Looking like we did against the Saints, didn't mean anything. Regardless what we look like against the Cowboys, don't mean nothing.

If we lose to the Colts, that will tell us that you guys were right about this game. If we beat the Colts, that means our coaches got what they needed out of these preseason (practice) games to get our guys ready.

If the games mean absolutely nothing then why the hell play them. (well, actually, you could make a case that we didn't)

Nobody said these games were absolutely worthless.

Winning & losing means absolutely nothing.

I honestly don't think not finishing a tackle means anything.

Amobi penetrating through the line to be able to watch Reggie Bush run by without putting his hands on him, that means something to me. Kudos for penetrating, and getting off your blocks... boo for not tackling Reggie Bush.

Understand--I don't care that we lost a preseason game.

I care that we forfeited the game without showing up. Forfeit = quitters.

:rant:


:coffee:

ahyayai.

drs23
08-25-2010, 10:19 AM
So I guess the "fans" that don't get all riled up about how the team looked in a preseason loss are apologists? I mean, I could say that they played like shit, or that I don't accept failure or a million other cliche's but in the end, I just really don't care nearly as much as I do in the regular season. I didn't really give a shit that we beat down the Cardinals either, so I guess I'm consistent with my apathy.

I mean, apart from the gameplan not even being "win the game at all costs" like it is in the regular season, it's still up in the air why the defense looked so terrible. Disinterest? Out coached? Subpar technique? You can point to any of these points and say a million things to try to justify your opinion, but in the end, we still don't know why's. Getting all worked up in preseason and posting retarded stuff like "Oh man this team is soft and I hate the coach" is just doing a throwback to your own opinion at the end of the 2009 season for almost everybody here. The pessimists still think this team sucks, and the optimists are still thinking that we are on the right track and everybody is getting in these gay slapfights about it all over this board. For preseason I like looking at individual battles for players that 1) Weren't on the team last year or were injured and 2) Are in a tight position battle.

Mario isn't in a position battle. Neither is Okoye (even though a position battle is pretty warranted at this point). Nor is Cushing or Ryans or Antonio Smith. I'm not expecting the coaching staff to show us everything they've installed or implemented in TC that is new either, because that would just be stupid. I know it's nice to see our 1's crush people, but in the end, they aren't making the same kind of game checks in preseason as they are in the regular season and it doesn't surprise me in the least bit that the guys not fighting for a spot aren't playing like they are. This whole "Oh the 3rd game is the big one" is horseshit too. Again, our 1's might be out there for longer (Hopefully they just tell Andre to stay at home, and maybe Schaub too) but I'm not expecting to see blitz packages or jap plays on the offense.

Basically a lot of people on both sides of the fence are trying to read entirely too much into the preseason and the games that are played. I think your eyes should more be looking for players who look like they will make the 53 that you really didn't think had a shot (Like Troy Nolan, or at least for me it's Nolan), not how hard all the starters are going and what the scheme looks like.

Damn b0ng, that sounds just entirely too reasonable :kitten:

SteveDeberg
08-25-2010, 10:39 AM
Too early to hit the panic button. I dont enjoy watchign us get our heads handed to us in pre-season but its just that. We started off horrible last year for 3 weeks and plyed well after that. Alot can change between now and the start of the playoffs. I am not sweatign the COWGIRLS as I watched the Chargers minus their #1 wr hand the cowgirls 1st team their heads last week, only a few turnovers kept the girls in it. :texflag:

cuppacoffee
08-25-2010, 12:43 PM
I've watched our team go through so many drills, that do not look as though they would translate to the field. But they do it anyway.

I don't believe that what we were looking at, was what we thought it was. You know our team plays better than that.

This was still a preseason game, it's about practice, it's about getting your guys out there, and putting them in unplanned situations.

They don't always tackle in practice, and when they do, it's not like regular season tackling.

I also don't know if they are even looking at the "team" these first couple of games. I wouldn't be surprised if they aren't focused on groups (DL, LB, DBs, etc..) if not the individuals.

This week, will be the first game that is treated like a regular game. This will probably be the first time they look at the Defense, and the Offense as units.



Again, it's possible they came out preparing to put on a show for their home crowd, and we came out to practice.

I honestly don't know how anyone can think Andre, Winston, Mario, Demeco, Pollard & Cushing are just going to show up and go through the motions. Or even allow the other guys to "just show up"

One minute, we're behind them 100%, giving them all we've got. The next minute we're spitting on them as we're stabbing them in the back. Do you know what the definition of a fair weather fan is?

Blood, sweat, & tears, everything I got behind the Texans 100%.

That play with Antonio Smith with his hands all over Reggie Bush 4 yards in the backfield, that's a tackle in the regular season, that's a loss. How do I know?

Because no matter what you chicken little's say, I've never seen Antonio Smith whiff on a tackle in the regular season. In practice, that's considered a tackle, even though you see the running back running 40 yards down the field afterwards. In practice, that is a tackle.

Those are good questions. If we had anyone on this board with some real professional coaching experience, maybe they could tell us.

I don't know. But whipping the Cardinals in week one didn't mean anything. Looking like we did against the Saints, didn't mean anything. Regardless what we look like against the Cowboys, don't mean nothing.

If we lose to the Colts, that will tell us that you guys were right about this game. If we beat the Colts, that means our coaches got what they needed out of these preseason (practice) games to get our guys ready.

Nobody said these games were absolutely worthless.

Winning & losing means absolutely nothing.

I honestly don't think not finishing a tackle means anything.

Amobi penetrating through the line to be able to watch Reggie Bush run by without putting his hands on him, that means something to me. Kudos for penetrating, and getting off your blocks... boo for not tackling Reggie Bush.


ahyayai


"One minute, we're behind them 100%, giving them all we've got. The next minute we're spitting on them as we're stabbing them in the back. Do you know what the definition of a fair weather fan is?".



You obviously have me confused with someone else.

I have never been behind them 100% if that means not expecting more from them.

Calling out sorry ass play is not "spitting on them or stabbing them in the back." How the world did you come to that conclusion?

"I honestly don't know how anyone can think Andre, Winston, Mario, Demeco, Pollard & Cushing are just going to show up and go through the motions. Or even allow the other guys to "just show up"

The next time Mario shows leadership will be the first time, the guy dogs it too often.

I am happy that you are proud of Antonio and Omobi wiffing on tackles.

If expecting more out of this bunch is being a fair weather fan, then pass me the umbrella. I refuse to applaud mediocrity.

edit: Would you accept/eat a krap sandwich from the deli if they told you the main meal would be better?


:coffee:

thunderkyss
08-25-2010, 04:13 PM
If expecting more out of this bunch is being a fair weather fan, then pass me the umbrella. I refuse to applaud mediocrity.

:coffee:

Nobody is telling you to applaud (or even accept) mediocrity. We're just saying put it in perspective. That's practice. That was a practice game, an exhibition.

We came out like Apollo Creed, expecting to put on a friendly exhibition to "look" at our teams in game-like situations, and they came out like Rocky Balboa, thinking this was a heavy weight fight.

Gary wasn't happy with the way the team look. I'm not happy with the way the team looks. NObody was happy with the way the team looked.

But to start all the "here we go again" crap is ridiculous.

& don't be putting words in my mouth, I didn't say anything about being proud of anybody whiffing on tackles, I said, that's what a tackle looks like in practice, & that game was practice.

I've said it again & again, this team looked like this last year in the preseason. & while everyone wants to focus on the bad parts of those first three games, they totally ignore the good.

The majority of those games, when you're counting snaps... we dominated on the defensive side of the ball.
http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a159/Thunderkyss/vsrushing2009.jpg

That's the #1 rushing team in the league, the #2 rushing team in the league & the #10 rushing team in the league.

We looked bad in the preseason. Again, the argument was that you are only seeing bits and pieces of what they are really doing.

vs the Jets, that's damn good against the run (minus 2 plays)

vs the Titans, damn good against the run (minus 2 plays)

vs the Jags, that's damn good against the run (minus 1 play)

& yes, it would have been nice had those two plays not happened. It would have been nice, if they were perfect. But they did, and we're not & they got Pollard, to make sure it wouldn't happen again.

Except in the preseason.

:slapfight:

HJam72
08-25-2010, 04:17 PM
Well, he just got it....because OD will be ready for game 1. :)

silvrhand
08-25-2010, 05:21 PM
Nobody is telling you to applaud (or even accept) mediocrity. We're just saying put it in perspective. That's practice. That was a practice game, an exhibition.

vs the Jets, that's damn good against the run (minus 2 plays)

vs the Titans, damn good against the run (minus 2 plays)

vs the Jags, that's damn good against the run (minus 1 play)

:slapfight:

... who cares about percentages, percentages don't win games.. points do, and that's 35 points... The worst thing about the saints was they didn't break big runs, they just shoved us all over the field for 6-8 yard chunks, and we again got 0 pass rush..

The main point is not that we lost, it was the way that we lost, we had no fire, no passion, and got it shoved down our throats like a porn star.. Not only that then Chase Daniels comes in and then starts throwing it on us like we are playing back in the Big-12.

Preseason or not that's not the way I expected the Texans to come out, that was the Texans of last year with out schedule this year we don't have time to putz around...

DexmanC
08-25-2010, 05:24 PM
Nobody is telling you to applaud (or even accept) mediocrity. We're just saying put it in perspective. That's practice. That was a practice game, an exhibition.

We came out like Apollo Creed, expecting to put on a friendly exhibition to "look" at our teams in game-like situations, and they came out like Rocky Balboa, thinking this was a heavy weight fight.

Gary wasn't happy with the way the team look. I'm not happy with the way the team looks. NObody was happy with the way the team looked.

But to start all the "here we go again" crap is ridiculous.

& don't be putting words in my mouth, I didn't say anything about being proud of anybody whiffing on tackles, I said, that's what a tackle looks like in practice, & that game was practice.

I've said it again & again, this team looked like this last year in the preseason. & while everyone wants to focus on the bad parts of those first three games, they totally ignore the good.

The majority of those games, when you're counting snaps... we dominated on the defensive side of the ball.
http://i11.photobucket.com/albums/a159/Thunderkyss/vsrushing2009.jpg

That's the #1 rushing team in the league, the #2 rushing team in the league & the #10 rushing team in the league.

We looked bad in the preseason. Again, the argument was that you are only seeing bits and pieces of what they are really doing.

vs the Jets, that's damn good against the run (minus 2 plays)

vs the Titans, damn good against the run (minus 2 plays)

vs the Jags, that's damn good against the run (minus 1 play)

& yes, it would have been nice had those two plays not happened. It would have been nice, if they were perfect. But they did, and we're not & they got Pollard, to make sure it wouldn't happen again.

Except in the preseason.

:slapfight:

Jet's Offensive Touchdowns: 3
Texans' Offensive Touchdowns: 0

Any questions?

steelbtexan
08-25-2010, 05:31 PM
TK

Some posters look at the pattern of the Smithiak regime.

Other posters look at the progress of the Smithiak regime.

But 7-9,8-8,8-8,9-7 doesn't lie. Mediocrity is what it is and some people see the same preseason trends of past seasons. Tell me what you've seen this preseason that is any different than the last 4 preseasons?

steelbtexan
08-25-2010, 05:34 PM
Jet's Offensive Touchdowns: 3
Texans' Offensive Touchdowns: 0

Any questions?

QFT

Dont let facts get in the way of some good old fashion battle red koolaid.

Ole Miss Texan
08-25-2010, 06:18 PM
Jet's Offensive Touchdowns: 3
Texans' Offensive Touchdowns: 0

Any questions?

An ill informed reader may draw the conclusion that our offense is what killed us.

silvrhand
08-25-2010, 06:41 PM
An ill informed reader may draw the conclusion that our offense is what killed us.

Well the Jets did kick the crap out of our offense too, so yah it was both a offensive and defensive failure last year against the Jets.

thunderkyss
08-25-2010, 06:50 PM
... who cares about percentages, percentages don't win games.. points do, and that's 35 points... The worst thing about the saints was they didn't break big runs, they just shoved us all over the field for 6-8 yard chunks, and we again got 0 pass rush..

The main point is not that we lost, it was the way that we lost, we had no fire, no passion, and got it shoved down our throats like a porn star.. Not only that then Chase Daniels comes in and then starts throwing it on us like we are playing back in the Big-12.

Preseason or not that's not the way I expected the Texans to come out, that was the Texans of last year with out schedule this year we don't have time to putz around...

& so we go back to the percentages. You want to say we had no fire, I offer stops and tackles for losses to point out you are wrong. They came to play, the play-by-play shows it the stats show it the percentages show it.

We lost two of those three games. I give you evidence that it wasn't for lack of intensity. I contrast last preseason to this preseason. It's not what you think, looks can be deceiving.

After last years preseason (which looks very similar to this years) preseason we were six or seven plays from being a top five defense.

If it worked for us last season it will work for us this season. That's the way improvements work. Plus we'll have Pollard from game one.

The Pencil Neck
08-25-2010, 06:58 PM
TK

Some posters look at the pattern of the Smithiak regime.

Other posters look at the progress of the Smithiak regime.

But 7-9,8-8,8-8,9-7 doesn't lie. Mediocrity is what it is and some people see the same preseason trends of past seasons. Tell me what you've seen this preseason that is any different than the last 4 preseasons?

First off, "mediocrity" is not really "medium" or "average". The word mediocrity implies something that is substandard and shoddy.

6-10 was bad but better than 2-14.

8-8 and 8-8 was average. Nothing special.

9-7 is a winning season and good enough to get into the playoffs.

You're right. Those records don't lie. They just don't say what you say the say.

And what I've seen this preseason is that our offense is going to be epic and that our defense is improved.

The Pencil Neck
08-25-2010, 07:03 PM
I just want our team to show up and perform like an NFL team, exhibition game or not.

"I just want to be happy. Is that too much to ask?"- The Pencil Neck..:D


:coffee:

And they DID show up like an NFL team in an exhibition game. They were playing hard and over pursuing and then not wrapping up their tackles.

We learned several things in that game. The coaches got some good tape and some good teaching points.

If you look at the teams that made the playoffs last year and total up their records, as a group, they were a little over 500 in the preseason. And the teams that didn't make the playoffs, were a little under 500 in the preseason. We're at 500. There's no need to fire the entire coaching staff over a loss.

thunderkyss
08-25-2010, 07:04 PM
TK

Some posters look at the pattern of the Smithiak regime.

Other posters look at the progress of the Smithiak regime.

But 7-9,8-8,8-8,9-7 doesn't lie. Mediocrity is what it is and some people see the same preseason trends of past seasons. Tell me what you've seen this preseason that is any different than the last 4 preseasons?

Look at my posts again showing total carries and how they worked out for our defense. That's just the first three games after that horrible looking preseason, after those three games, the consensus is we were a very good defense. Six-seven plays takes us out of top five numbers. Four plays takes us out of shutting down the #1 & #2 rushing teams in the league.

I'm going to say it again, because for some reason it isn't getting through.

Four plays kept us from shutting down, shutting down the #1 & #2 rushing offenses in the league.

It's not that I see anything different. It's that I'm seeing them continue to focus on what's important & that is playing good football. I know it don't look like it. But it didn't look like it last year, and look what it got us.

A top 5 offense. The top passing offense. And a defense on the verge of being at the very top of the league. And we are very, very, very young.

The lions focus on winning preseason football games and as a result they never learn how to play good football, winning football.

thunderkyss
08-25-2010, 07:16 PM
QFT

Dont let facts get in the way of some good old fashion battle red koolaid.

You mean other than the facts I'm providing?

Well the Jets did kick the crap out of our offense too, so yah it was both a offensive and defensive failure last year against the Jets.


& don't forget Schaub was gimpy because of a preseason injury suffered the week before.

Half the play book, gone.

Joe Texan
08-25-2010, 07:19 PM
What happens in new Orleans stays in New orleans

steelbtexan
08-25-2010, 07:22 PM
Sorry I'm a results oriented guy.

I really dont care about so called progress.

I do care about wins and losses, and seeing a team that shows up ready to play every week for 4 qtrs. I haven't seen much progress in those areas over the past 4 yrs.

thunderkyss
08-25-2010, 07:26 PM
Sorry I'm a results oriented guy.

I really dont care about so called progress.

I do care about wins and losses, and seeing a team that shows up ready to play every week for 4 qtrs. I haven't seen much progress in those areas over the past 4 yrs.

Well it's a good thing you aren't using a preseason game as the basis of that progress.



Wait a minute....

Basically what you just said is, "I see what you are saying, that makes sense, but I'm still pissed we didn't get into the play-offs last year, and I'm tired of waiting."

& there aint nothing wrong with that.

steelbtexan
08-25-2010, 07:26 PM
Look at my posts again showing total carries and how they worked out for our defense. That's just the first three games after that horrible looking preseason, after those three games, the consensus is we were a very good defense. Six-seven plays takes us out of top five numbers. Four plays takes us out of shutting down the #1 & #2 rushing teams in the league.

I'm going to say it again, because for some reason it isn't getting through.

Four plays kept us from shutting down, shutting down the #1 & #2 rushing offenses in the league.

It's not that I see anything different. It's that I'm seeing them continue to focus on what's important & that is playing good football. I know it don't look like it. But it didn't look like it last year, and look what it got us.

A top 5 offense. The top passing offense. And a defense on the verge of being at the very top of the league. And we are very, very, very young.

The lions focus on winning preseason football games and as a result they never learn how to play good football, winning football.

Ifs and buts

I focus on what should be important to all of the fans and the entire Texans org. W/L's

steelbtexan
08-25-2010, 07:31 PM
Well it's a good thing you aren't using a preseason game as the basis of that progress.



Wait a minute....

Basically what you just said is, "I see what you are saying, that makes sense, but I'm still pissed we didn't get into the play-offs last year, and I'm tired of waiting."

& there aint nothing wrong with that.

Yep

That and the fact that I've lost faith in the Smithiak regime.

That still doesn't mean I wont be rooting on the Texans to win every Sunday. In spite of what I consider to be inept leadership.

thunderkyss
08-25-2010, 07:32 PM
Ifs and buts

I focus on what should be important to all of the fans and the entire Texans org. W/L's

Ain't no ifs & butts about it.

We were the 13th ranked defense. 10th against the run.

We had the 4th ranked offense. 1st in passing.

There was a time, not too long ago that we were 30th in total offense, and 32nd in total defense.

IN 2009, we won more games than we lost.

Staying the course is the way to go, you'd have to be an ***** to think otherwise.

The wins will come. They are a by product of playing good football.

thunderkyss
08-25-2010, 07:37 PM
Yep

That and the fact that I've lost faith in the Smithiak regime.

That still doesn't mean I wont be rooting on the Texans to win every Sunday. In spite of what I consider to be inept leadership.

Our team is improving in every which way possible. yards come first, just like it did for our offense, and then the points.

2010 is the second year of the Frank Bush/David Gibbs regime. It sucks that Kubiak didn't get them when he wanted, but he's got them now, & we are on track.

Think about it. #1 ranked offense. #1 ranked defense. When has that ever happened in the history of this league? That's where we are headed, that's right there on the horizon, that's what Kubiak is bringing.

steelbtexan
08-25-2010, 07:42 PM
Our team is improving in every which way possible. yards come first, just like it did for our offense, and then the points.

2010 is the second year of the Frank Bush/David Gibbs regime. It sucks that Kubiak didn't get them when he wanted, but he's got them now, & we are on track.

Think about it. #1 ranked offense. #1 ranked defense. When has that ever happened in the history of this league? That's where we are headed, that's right there on the horizon, that's what Kubiak is bringing.

Hope your right

DexmanC
08-25-2010, 07:53 PM
Our team is improving in every which way possible. yards come first, just like it did for our offense, and then the points.

2010 is the second year of the Frank Bush/David Gibbs regime. It sucks that Kubiak didn't get them when he wanted, but he's got them now, & we are on track.

Think about it. #1 ranked offense. #1 ranked defense. When has that ever happened in the history of this league? That's where we are headed, that's right there on the horizon, that's what Kubiak is bringing.

Dude is delusional. Gotta love TK. (((:shots:)))<----BattleRed Kool-Aid
................................... ...can't...put....it....down!

houstonspartan
08-25-2010, 08:05 PM
Sorry I'm a results oriented guy.

I really dont care about so called progress.

I do care about wins and losses, and seeing a team that shows up ready to play every week for 4 qtrs. I haven't seen much progress in those areas over the past 4 yrs.

Yep. That's how I am. A buddy and myself have the same issues. He's Mr. "incremental improvement" guy. I'm Mr. "Ok, fine, but where are the results?" guy.

And, we're both season ticket holders, and he has been fine with how things are, and would probably be fine with giving Kubiak a 100-year contract.

I can respect and appreciate giving people time to get the job done or to implement a vision or strategy. Big picture change can sometimes take time. But at some point, you have to show me something. It's how the real world works.

cuppacoffee
08-25-2010, 08:21 PM
And they DID show up like an NFL team in an exhibition game. They were playing hard and over pursuing and then not wrapping up their tackles.

We learned several things in that game. The coaches got some good tape and some good teaching points.

If you look at the teams that made the playoffs last year and total up their records, as a group, they were a little over 500 in the preseason. And the teams that didn't make the playoffs, were a little under 500 in the preseason. We're at 500. There's no need to fire the entire coaching staff over a loss.



Wasn't it an exibition game for NO too.

NO showed up, the Texans did not.

Spin it anyway you want. I know what I saw.

Yeah, we learned something, it just wasn't the same thing for both of us.

Where did I advocate firing anyone?

Research my posting history, the only person I ever wanted fired is obama.



:coffee:

cuppacoffee
08-25-2010, 08:29 PM
Dude is delusional. Gotta love TK. (((:shots:)))<----BattleRed Kool-Aid
................................... ...can't...put....it....down!


I have warned TK several times about drinking the water in PA.:D

I really screws up the kool-aid.


:coffee:

thunderkyss
08-25-2010, 08:41 PM
I can respect and appreciate giving people time to get the job done or to implement a vision or strategy. Big picture change can sometimes take time. But at some point, you have to show me something. It's how the real world works.

How much time is enough time?

I think four years is enough time.

If you give the coach the ability to do things his way from day one. That means he has the freedom to dump any player he wants, and pick up any player he wants.

We all know Kubiak has handcuffed to David Carr, & Charlie Casserly. I'm throwing out that first year.

I know it was there. I know it happened, and & I know most coaches don't get to throw out their first year.

But I am, and I did.

For me, this is year 4. I don't care what the W/L was for years 1, 2 or 3. I want to know if they are getting better at playing this game.

W/L means everything in year 4 (5 for Kubiak). He's shown us he can build an offense. I believe he can put together a defense. Now, he has to show me he can put together a team.

thunderkyss
08-25-2010, 08:49 PM
I have warned TK several times about drinking the water in PA.:D

I really screws up the kool-aid.


:coffee:

One man's screwed up kool-aid is another man's MOJO.

:texflag:

JB
08-25-2010, 08:55 PM
One man's screwed up kool-aid is another man's MOJO.

:texflag:

You been to P.I. also? I <3 MOJO!

The Pencil Neck
08-25-2010, 09:30 PM
Yep

That and the fact that I've lost faith in the Smithiak regime.

That still doesn't mean I wont be rooting on the Texans to win every Sunday. In spite of what I consider to be inept leadership.

That's really all any of this is about. You're jumping at any opportunity that you can get to feel validated in your loss of faith.

Even though this team has improved every year under Kubiak, you've lost faith in him and so you're going to dog him at any opportunity you get... and because of this, you're blinded to anything that looks like the team might actually be good.

After we beat the Pats, I read someone in one of the comments on one of the blogs or something saying that was the worst possible thing the team could have done because by winning that game, the team was cursed with another year or two of the Kubiak regime. I'm not saying you wrote that, but I get the feeling that you'd agree with that. It doesn't matter that the offense and defense is improving, it doesn't matter that we've had our first ever winning season and should be elated because of that... no, none of that matters because it means that Kubiak isn't going to be fired.

That's just sad, man. I mean, you're in a position where you can't really enjoy your team's success. And, a 9-7 record is a success no matter how you want to spin it as mediocre. (And that's not just at you, SteelB, that's at most of the pink soapers.)

Dwade
08-25-2010, 09:41 PM
That's just sad, man. I mean, you're in a position where you can't really enjoy your team's success. And, a 9-7 record is a success no matter how you want to spin it as mediocre. (And that's not just at you, SteelB, that's at most of the pink soapers.)

9-7 with no playoff is not successful in my eyes...I guess I have higher standards.

I'm spoiled by the Longhorns :facepalm:

The Pencil Neck
08-25-2010, 09:57 PM
9-7 with no playoff is not successful in my eyes...I guess I have higher standards.

I'm spoiled by the Longhorns :facepalm:

9-7 is a winning record.

9-7 was good enough to get into the playoffs. We didn't make it in, but 2 9-7 teams made it in. Over the past few years, 2 9-7 teams usually make it in and an occasional 8-8 division winner makes it in.

We were not losers. We were not average. We were not mediocre.

I think a lot of posters on this board are spoiled. I'm not sure what they're spoiled by but a lot of posters seem to think that it's some sort of right to get into the playoffs and win Super Bowls. It's hard work.

Our goal is to become a perennial powerhouse that wins 10+ games every season and makes the playoffs every year and wins multiple Super Bowls. But if you're not going to be happy unless you get that, then you're doomed for letdown no matter who you root for. The teams that have been powerful over the past few years won't continue to be powerful in teh future. Just a few years ago, the Chiefs were a power house. The Rams and Raiders were great.

We'll get there. And in the future we'll be winners and losers and... That's life as a fan.

Dwade
08-25-2010, 10:04 PM
9-7 is a winning record.

9-7 was good enough to get into the playoffs. We didn't make it in, but 2 9-7 teams made it in. Over the past few years, 2 9-7 teams usually make it in and an occasional 8-8 division winner makes it in.

We were not losers. We were not average. We were not mediocre.

I think a lot of posters on this board are spoiled. I'm not sure what they're spoiled by but a lot of posters seem to think that it's some sort of right to get into the playoffs and win Super Bowls. It's hard work.

Our goal is to become a perennial powerhouse that wins 10+ games every season and makes the playoffs every year and wins multiple Super Bowls. But if you're not going to be happy unless you get that, then you're doomed for letdown no matter who you root for. The teams that have been powerful over the past few years won't continue to be powerful in teh future. Just a few years ago, the Chiefs were a power house. The Rams and Raiders were great.

We'll get there. And in the future we'll be winners and losers and... That's life as a fan.

Yes 9-7 made the playoffs for 2 teams last year, but remember when the Patriots were 11-5 and missed the playoffs? 9-7 is not good enough most of the time, the Falcons were 9-7 and missed the playoffs in the NFC.

I'm too competitive to be satisfied with a mediocre season...and yes 9-7 is mediocre. So is 7-9 and 8-8.

The Pencil Neck
08-25-2010, 10:16 PM
Yes 9-7 made the playoffs for 2 teams last year, but remember when the Patriots were 11-5 and missed the playoffs? 9-7 is not good enough most of the time, the Falcons were 9-7 and missed the playoffs in the NFC.

I'm too competitive to be satisfied with a mediocre season...and yes 9-7 is mediocre. So is 7-9 and 8-8.

And the year before 3 teams sub 10-6 made it in. 2007, 2 teams. In 2006, 3 teams and a team made it in that was an 8-8 team that didn't even win its division. In 2005, you had to have 10 wins and even that didn't make it. In 2004, 3 teams under 10 made it and 2 of those were 8-8 teams that didn't win their division.

9-7 isn't mediocre unless you're redefining the word mediocre. We were not substandard. We were better than average. 9-7 is a winning record.

thunderkyss
08-25-2010, 10:20 PM
9-7 with no playoff is not successful in my eyes...I guess I have higher standards.

I'm spoiled by the Longhorns :facepalm:

No you don't have higher standards. You just don't have as much history.

It's a freakin Milestone, just like Andre being 1 of only 2 players to have back to back 1500 yard seasons.

Or the first Texan named the Pro Bowl MVP in Matt Schaub.

The goal wasn't 9-7, that's where we ended up. It just also happened to be our first winning season.

Carr Bombed
08-25-2010, 10:26 PM
9-7 is a winning record.

9-7 was good enough to get into the playoffs. We didn't make it in, but 2 9-7 teams made it in. Over the past few years, 2 9-7 teams usually make it in and an occasional 8-8 division winner makes it in.

We were not losers. We were not average. We were not mediocre.

I think a lot of posters on this board are spoiled. I'm not sure what they're spoiled by but a lot of posters seem to think that it's some sort of right to get into the playoffs and win Super Bowls. It's hard work.

I'm sorry, but just about all of this post is the definition of a "loser's mentality".

"our first winning season"......we should be happy with 9-7? I just about puked when we celebrated it. Teams that have lofty (playoff) goals (which is what we had last season) don't celebrate 9-7....and until we can get past that mentality, we are never going to win crap in this league. Immature teams who don't know what it really means to "win" in this league do crap like that. This team needs to grow the hell up....but it's Kubiak and "the kids". If this team is going to make the playoffs this season, we need to stop "the kid" crap. Men win in the NFL. (Grown *** men, not kids..so Kubiak needs to stop treating them as such) This is exactly why Bullock and the Titans had/have zero respect for us and the main reason why the Colts always feel that they can comeback and beat us no matter how far they're behind. Under Kubiak we've always been too wet behind the ears and "the little brothers" when the (big game/corner turning) pressure is on

P.S.

What the heck do Texan fans have to be spoiled about?.......that's the main reason why so many fans aren't pleased with the maturation of this team. It's hard to win in this league no doubt, but it isn't hard to build a playoff team atleast once in a decade. Just about every single team in this league has made the playoffs in the last decade (I believe the Bills and Lions are the only ones who haven't), yet we're still waiting to "turn the corner" :rolleyes: But "WE'RE FREAKING WINNERS BOB!"

No excuses this year. Don't want to hear about injuries, don't want to hear about the schedule. Win or go home.....or in this case, win or Kubiak needs to find a new home....and by "winning", I'm not talking about a 9-7 year where you go 1-5 in your own division.

Sorry, but the "9-7 lockerroom hoorah" really irritated me.

Dwade
08-25-2010, 10:32 PM
No you don't have higher standards. You just don't have as much history.

It's a freakin Milestone, just like Andre being 1 of only 2 players to have back to back 1500 yard seasons.

Or the first Texan named the Pro Bowl MVP in Matt Schaub.

The goal wasn't 9-7, that's where we ended up. It just also happened to be our first winning season.

I know the history, but 9-7 doesn't make me excited. Especially since we lost about 3 games we should have easily won. It just made me frusturated about what we could have accomplished last year.

@CarrBombed - I agree completely. I refuse to enjoy 9-7

The Pencil Neck
08-25-2010, 11:35 PM
I'm sorry, but just about all of this post is the definition of a "loser's mentality".

"our first winning season"......we should be happy with 9-7? I just about puked when we celebrated it. Teams that have lofty (playoff) goals (which is what we had last season) don't celebrate 9-7....and until we can get past that mentality, we are never going to win crap in this league. Immature teams who don't know what it really means to "win" in this league do crap like that. This team needs to grow the hell up....but it's Kubiak and "the kids". If this team is going to make the playoffs this season, we need to stop "the kid" crap. Men win in the NFL. (Grown *** men, not kids..so Kubiak needs to stop treating them as such) This is exactly why Bullock and the Titans had/have zero respect for us and the main reason why the Colts always feel that they can comeback and beat us no matter how far they're behind.

P.S.

What the heck do Texan fans have to be spoiled about?.......that's the main reason why so many fans aren't pleased with the maturation of this team. It's hard to win in this league no doubt, but it isn't hard to build a playoff team atleast once in a decade. Just about every single team in this league has made the playoffs in the last decade (I believe the Bills and Lions are the only ones who haven't), yet we're still waiting to "turn the corner" :rolleyes: But "WE'RE FREAKING WINNERS BOB!"

No excuses this year. Don't want to hear about injuries, don't want to hear about the schedule. Win or go home.....or in this case, win or Kubiak needs to find a new home....and by "winning", I'm not talking about a 9-7 year where you go 1-5 in your own division.

Sorry, but the "9-7 lockerroom hoorah" really irritated me.

OK. Tell that to the freaking Steelers. One year after winning the playoffs, they celebrated winning the last game of the season and didn't make it into the playoffs.

A winning season is something to be proud of. A winning season is a step in the right direction.

You didn't celebrate it. You had a chance to celebrate something special and you didn't take the opportunity. How sad is that? You were too wrapped up in your own little ball of disgust that you couldn't celebrate a victory.

If you consider a winning season losing, then you've got a problem.

And I don't know why Texans' fans are so spoiled but so many of you seem to think that winning in this league is easy and if you don't make the playoffs this year, you're entitled to making it next year. And if you don't get into the playoffs, all you have to do is fire the coach and the GM and whatever schmo gets hired will get us there.

I've got news, we're probably not winning the Super Bowl this year. We're probably not winning it for the next 10 years. Only 1 team wins it per year and there are only 10 teams that win it per decade and there's usually some duplication. Gary Kubiak is probably not going to win a Super Bowl. Sean Payton will probably not win another Super Bowl. Bill Belichik will probably not win another Super Bowl. Bill Belichik probably won't keep his job for another 6 years. Rex Ryan probably won't win the Super Bowl.

We don't have a "right" to win a Super Bowl. But we've got a good damned team. And a good damned chance. We've got a better chance than the Jaguars and at least as good a chance as the Titans. And that's a damned sight better chance than we had before Kubiak and it's probably a better chance than we'll have if we fire him.

The Pencil Neck
08-25-2010, 11:36 PM
I know the history, but 9-7 doesn't make me excited. Especially since we lost about 3 games we should have easily won. It just made me frusturated about what we could have accomplished last year.

@CarrBombed - I agree completely. I refuse to enjoy 9-7

Then you might as well give up being a fan.

JB
08-25-2010, 11:42 PM
OK. Tell that to the freaking Steelers. One year after winning the playoffs, they celebrated winning the last game of the season and didn't make it into the playoffs.

A winning season is something to be proud of. A winning season is a step in the right direction.

You didn't celebrate it. You had a chance to celebrate something special and you didn't take the opportunity. How sad is that? You were too wrapped up in your own little ball of disgust that you couldn't celebrate a victory.

If you consider a winning season losing, then you've got a problem.

And I don't know why Texans' fans are so spoiled but so many of you seem to think that winning in this league is easy and if you don't make the playoffs this year, you're entitled to making it next year. And if you don't get into the playoffs, all you have to do is fire the coach and the GM and whatever schmo gets hired will get us there.

I've got news, we're probably not winning the Super Bowl this year. We're probably not winning it for the next 10 years. Only 1 team wins it per year and there are only 10 teams that win it per decade and there's usually some duplication. Gary Kubiak is probably not going to win a Super Bowl. Sean Payton will probably not win another Super Bowl. Bill Belichik will probably not win another Super Bowl. Bill Belichik probably won't keep his job for another 6 years. Rex Ryan probably won't win the Super Bowl.

We don't have a "right" to win a Super Bowl. But we've got a good damned team. And a good damned chance. We've got a better chance than the Jaguars and at least as good a chance as the Titans. And that's a damned sight better chance than we had before Kubiak and it's probably a better chance than we'll have if we fire him.

I wish I could rep you for this post. But, msr. If it was so easy, why hasn't Indy won 5 straight? What? They only won one? WTF?

ReliantTexan
08-25-2010, 11:51 PM
I'm sorry, but just about all of this post is the definition of a "loser's mentality".

"our first winning season"......we should be happy with 9-7? I just about puked when we celebrated it. Teams that have lofty (playoff) goals (which is what we had last season) don't celebrate 9-7....and until we can get past that mentality, we are never going to win crap in this league. Immature teams who don't know what it really means to "win" in this league do crap like that. This team needs to grow the hell up....but it's Kubiak and "the kids". If this team is going to make the playoffs this season, we need to stop "the kid" crap. Men win in the NFL. (Grown *** men, not kids..so Kubiak needs to stop treating them as such) This is exactly why Bullock and the Titans had/have zero respect for us and the main reason why the Colts always feel that they can comeback and beat us no matter how far they're behind. Under Kubiak we've always been too wet behind the ears and "the little brothers" when the (big game/corner turning) pressure is on

P.S.

What the heck do Texan fans have to be spoiled about?.......that's the main reason why so many fans aren't pleased with the maturation of this team. It's hard to win in this league no doubt, but it isn't hard to build a playoff team atleast once in a decade. Just about every single team in this league has made the playoffs in the last decade (I believe the Bills and Lions are the only ones who haven't), yet we're still waiting to "turn the corner" :rolleyes: But "WE'RE FREAKING WINNERS BOB!"

No excuses this year. Don't want to hear about injuries, don't want to hear about the schedule. Win or go home.....or in this case, win or Kubiak needs to find a new home....and by "winning", I'm not talking about a 9-7 year where you go 1-5 in your own division.

Sorry, but the "9-7 lockerroom hoorah" really irritated me. I'm still not understanding the problem with the celebration right after the win. They just had a comeback win against a good team which kept them alive in the Wild card hunt,( which was not decided at that point.)

Now looking back I can understand not being satisfied with the season,but if Cincy would have taken care of business later that day, the Texans would have just had a playoff berth, and you wouldn't be making this argument.

steelbtexan
08-25-2010, 11:58 PM
That's really all any of this is about. You're jumping at any opportunity that you can get to feel validated in your loss of faith.

Even though this team has improved every year under Kubiak, you've lost faith in him and so you're going to dog him at any opportunity you get... and because of this, you're blinded to anything that looks like the team might actually be good.

After we beat the Pats, I read someone in one of the comments on one of the blogs or something saying that was the worst possible thing the team could have done because by winning that game, the team was cursed with another year or two of the Kubiak regime. I'm not saying you wrote that, but I get the feeling that you'd agree with that. It doesn't matter that the offense and defense is improving, it doesn't matter that we've had our first ever winning season and should be elated because of that... no, none of that matters because it means that Kubiak isn't going to be fired.

That's just sad, man. I mean, you're in a position where you can't really enjoy your team's success. And, a 9-7 record is a success no matter how you want to spin it as mediocre. (And that's not just at you, SteelB, that's at most of the pink soapers.)

Great to know that you know how I feel. (WRONG)

I've never and will never root for the Texans to lose a game. I hope you understand that.

But also understand that with one of the easiest schedules in the league not making the playoffs made me question the way Texans management goes about their business.

So yes I was very disappointed in last yrs record. i hoped they won that game against the Pats,caught a break and made the playoffs. But unlike you and a bunch of other fans I wasn't celebrating a very medicore 9-7 record.

I get that the Texans aren't going to win the SB every yr. But making the playoffs once a decade shouldn't be an unrealistic expectation.

Fans that disagree with me are probably Cubs fans. LOL

Carr Bombed
08-26-2010, 12:00 AM
OK. Tell that to the freaking Steelers. One year after winning the playoffs, they celebrated winning the last game of the season and didn't make it into the playoffs.

A winning season is something to be proud of. A winning season is a step in the right direction.

You didn't celebrate it. You had a chance to celebrate something special and you didn't take the opportunity. How sad is that? You were too wrapped up in your own little ball of disgust that you couldn't celebrate a victory.

If you consider a winning season losing, then you've got a problem.

And I don't know why Texans' fans are so spoiled but so many of you seem to think that winning in this league is easy and if you don't make the playoffs this year, you're entitled to making it next year. And if you don't get into the playoffs, all you have to do is fire the coach and the GM and whatever schmo gets hired will get us there.

I've got news, we're probably not winning the Super Bowl this year. We're probably not winning it for the next 10 years. Only 1 team wins it per year and there are only 10 teams that win it per decade and there's usually some duplication. Gary Kubiak is probably not going to win a Super Bowl. Sean Payton will probably not win another Super Bowl. Bill Belichick will probably not win another Super Bowl. Bill Belichik probably won't keep his job for another 6 years. Rex Ryan probably won't win the Super Bowl.

We don't have a "right" to win a Super Bowl. But we've got a good damned team. And a good damned chance. We've got a better chance than the Jaguars and at least as good a chance as the Titans. And that's a damned sight better chance than we had before Kubiak and it's probably a better chance than we'll have if we fire him.


LOL!

Again.......loser's mentality. I don't even know how to respond to this post. You just compared the Texans to the Steelers, Bill Belichick, and Rex Ryan.....who took his team to the AFC Championship in his very first season. Yep we have relevance to them with our great "We're freaking WINNERS!" speech. :rolleyes:

I've got news, we're probably not winning the Super Bowl this year. We're probably not winning it for the next 10 years.

Seriously......when the hell did I EVER talk about winning the SB in a decade. I believe I was talking about atleast making the freaking playoffs. LOL, seriously there's a difference in not winning a SB in a decade and not even being in the tournament to compete for one.....apparently you don't care. As long as they eek out a win to put them a notch above mediocre, but still puts them on the couch come January.


Enjoy your memory of the "Texans 9-7 lalapolosa 2009" tour......I'll actually wait until this team does something of substance before I click my heals together and claim VICTORY. Seriously :) After a decade of watching this team, I think I'm atleast entitled to something like that...(and no...it doesn't make me a "spoiled fan" for expecting that)......since you know just about every NFL fan has experienced watching their team do something that we're still waiting for.


Look I'm not a negative Nancy which is something people try to paint me as.......believe it or not (Don't really care if you do) I actually still believe Kubiak can get it done, but I'm not going to sit here and listen to how FANTASTIC 9-7 was last season...because guess what, it wasn't great at all. That was considered a disappointment at the beginning at the start of last season, so just because Kubiak managed to save his ass after dropping 4 straight divisional games...my opinion doesn't change, because that's something that Kubiak always does. The guy coaches a team that starts the season complacent and then ends the season with a sense of urgency when playoff hopes are all but gone, all while losing just about every "BIG WIN/turn the corner" game along the way and guess what.......9-7 didn't change that last season. HE STILL DID THOSE THINGS.

You want to know what the "turning of the corner" is........it's this team growing the hell up and starting the season with urgency and actually competing in the inner divisional games. (and with us opening the season against the Colts, we have a great opportunity to do just that) Finishing 9-7 with a 1-5 divisional record is not something that needs to be praised.

steelbtexan
08-26-2010, 12:02 AM
I'm still not understanding the problem with the celebration right after the win. They just had a comeback win against a good team which kept them alive in the Wild card hunt,( which was not decided at that point.)

Now looking back I can understand not being satisfied with the season,but if Cincy would have taken care of business later that day, the Texans would have just had a playoff berth, and you wouldn't be making this argument.

If the team had showed up against the Jets (starting a rookie QB and missing 2 defensive starters) the Cincy/Jets game would've been a moot point. Oh well that's water under the bridge now.

silvrhand
08-26-2010, 12:04 AM
I just have one thing to say:

:ohsnap:

The Pencil Neck
08-26-2010, 12:16 AM
LOL!

Again.......loser's mentality. I don't even know how to respond to this post.

That's twice you've said I have a loser's mentality. You know, maybe you're right.

The thing is... I'm a successful person. I think one of the reasons I'm successful is because I understand the context of things.

I'm a fan. And as a fan, I get to do a lot of things that players shouldn't. I get to look ahead at the schedule. I get to celebrate moral victories. I get to be happy when my team has its first winning season. I get to be happy when the future looks bright.

I think some fans think that they have to think like players. That their thoughts will somehow help the team win the game or something. If a fan isn't going to accept a winning record that doesn't make it into the playoffs or a fan isn't going to be happy with anything less than a playoff berth or a Super Bowl, then that fan is thinking like a player instead of a fan. Wrong context.

I think you're one of those fans. You think you've got a winner's mentality but all you've really got is a bunch of frustration and I don't care who your team is. Because with that mentality, you could be in the playoffs for 11 consecutive years but if you don't win 11 Super Bowls, then you're a loser and you've been a frustrated, pissed off loser every year you didn't win the Super Bowl. That's what your "winner's mentality" gets you.

steelbtexan
08-26-2010, 12:17 AM
LOL!

Again.......loser's mentality. I don't even know how to respond to this post.



Seriously......when the hell did I EVER talk about winning the SB in a decade. I believe I was talking about atleast making the freaking playoffs.


Enjoy your memory of the "Texans 9-7 lalapolosa 2009" tour......I'll actually wait until this team does something of substance before I click my heals together and claim VICTORY. Seriously :) After a decade of watching this team, I think I'm atleast entitled to something like that.........since you know just about every NFL fan has experienced watching their team do something that we're still waiting for.

Repped

You stated my thoughts much better than I could have. Thanks

The Pencil Neck
08-26-2010, 12:20 AM
I get that the Texans aren't going to win the SB every yr. But making the playoffs once a decade shouldn't be an unrealistic expectation.


Start counting that decade when Kubiak came to the team. THEN you don't have an unrealistic expectation. But if you're counting the first 4 years as part of the 10, then yes, you're being unrealistic.

However, even with the debacle that was C&C, we still had a great shot at the playoffs last year and we'll have another great shot this year. Hopefully, there's football the year after that because we'll have another great shot at it.

stingray
08-26-2010, 12:22 AM
I just want the freaking season to start already. :kingkong:

Carr Bombed
08-26-2010, 12:28 AM
I'm still not understanding the problem with the celebration right after the win. They just had a comeback win against a good team which kept them alive in the Wild card hunt,( which was not decided at that point.)

Now looking back I can understand not being satisfied with the season,but if Cincy would have taken care of business later that day, the Texans would have just had a playoff berth, and you wouldn't be making this argument.

If, If, If...

I'm sick and tired of hearing about IF.. Seriously.


It's nothing, but more excuse making. No more if's. That's the point you're missing. This is the NFL and nobody cares about if's

Results, Results, Results.....how about we start talking about and showing that. This is Kubiak's last shot at results and as a Texan fan I hope he succeeds, but if I had to be honest...I'm not going to throw down big money on it.

Carr Bombed
08-26-2010, 12:30 AM
That's twice you've said I have a loser's mentality. You know, maybe you're right.

The thing is... I'm a successful person. I think one of the reasons I'm successful is because I understand the context of things.

I'm a fan. And as a fan, I get to do a lot of things that players shouldn't. I get to look ahead at the schedule. I get to celebrate moral victories. I get to be happy when my team has its first winning season. I get to be happy when the future looks bright.

I think some fans think that they have to think like players. That their thoughts will somehow help the team win the game or something. If a fan isn't going to accept a winning record that doesn't make it into the playoffs or a fan isn't going to be happy with anything less than a playoff berth or a Super Bowl, then that fan is thinking like a player instead of a fan. Wrong context.

I think you're one of those fans. You think you've got a winner's mentality but all you've really got is a bunch of frustration and I don't care who your team is. Because with that mentality, you could be in the playoffs for 11 consecutive years but if you don't win 11 Super Bowls, then you're a loser and you've been a frustrated, pissed off loser every year you didn't win the Super Bowl. That's what your "winner's mentality" gets you.

LOL, all you do is stick words in people's mouths..

Yep, if my team goes on a 11 year playoff streak, I'm not going to be happy. :rolleyes:

Wow, how about you actually talk about what I really posted. LOL, if this team managed to atleast make the playoffs once (Something I've never seen before) I'd be content for quite awhile.

P.S.

Congrats on your personal success..... I'm happy for you. (I really am)

The Pencil Neck
08-26-2010, 12:44 AM
LOL, all you do is stick words in people's mouths..

Yep, if my team goes on a 11 year playoff streak, I'm not going to be happy. :rolleyes:

Wow, how about you actually talk about what I really posted.

P.S.

Congrats on your personal success..... I'm happy for you.

Did you not tell me twice that I had a loser's mentality for being happy with a 9 win season? Did I stick those words into your mouth?

We are the only team that has not made the playoffs. You're right about that. But there are lots of teams who've gone on 8 year droughts. There are teams who've been out of the playoffs for a lot longer than a measly 8 years. The Bills are at... what... 10 years now? The Browns at 7? The Broncos took 17 years before their first playoffs. The Bears had a 13 year drought. The Saints waited 20 years before their first playoff game. Let alone the Cardinals, the Lions, and the Falcons.

Carr Bombed
08-26-2010, 12:47 AM
Did you not tell me twice that I had a loser's mentality for being happy with a 9 win season? Did I stick those words into your mouth?

We are the only team that has not made the playoffs. You're right about that. But there are lots of teams who've gone on 8 year droughts. There are teams who've been out of the playoffs for a lot longer than a measly 8 years. The Bills are at... what... 10 years now? The Browns at 7? The Broncos took 17 years before their first playoffs. The Bears had a 13 year drought. The Saints waited 20 years before their first playoff game. Let alone the Cardinals, the Lions, and the Falcons.

So we're one of the only teams in the entire league who have not made it to the playoffs since the texans have been in the league....."But there are lots of teams who've gone on 8 year droughts."

Sorry, but that just doesn't compute at all. In today's league, if you do the things that you need to do.....it doesn't take long to field a NFL playoff team.

steelbtexan
08-26-2010, 12:47 AM
Start counting that decade when Kubiak came to the team. THEN you don't have an unrealistic expectation. But if you're counting the first 4 years as part of the 10, then yes, you're being unrealistic.

However, even with the debacle that was C&C, we still had a great shot at the playoffs last year and we'll have another great shot this year. Hopefully, there's football the year after that because we'll have another great shot at it.

I want them to actually make the playoffs. Not just have a great shot at making them yr after yr.

It's a matter of expectations. Mine are higher than yours. Not that yours are wrong.

BTW How many yrs of 7-9/9-7 are you up for until you think a change should be made?

The Pencil Neck
08-26-2010, 12:57 AM
BTW How many yrs of 7-9/9-7 are you up for until you think a change should be made?

Depends on the season and the circumstance.

The thing is that I think Kubiak is a good coach. I think he's done some really good things with this team and I think he can get us a Super Bowl.

7-9 or worse is only OK if we've had a bunch of injuries. I don't think the coach should lose his job if we lose Schaub, AJ, Demeco, Mario, and Pollard for the year. If we go 7-9 without a bunch of major injuries, then Kubiak should be gone.

I'm fine with 8-8 if that gets us into the playoffs or if there's a bunch of injuries. If we've got all our starters healthy and we finish 8-8 and don't make the playoffs, then we need to start over... with the understanding that we're probably going to drop down to a 4-6 win team the following season.

If we go 9-7, I'll be fine whether we make the playoffs or not as long as 9-7 was good enough to get into the playoffs for another AFC team. If 10-6 was the mark to get into the playoffs, then Kubiak needs to be let go but I won't be upset if he's kept.

If we go 10-6 or better and miss the playoffs, I'm fine with Kubiak.

How about you? If we go 8-8 and make the playoffs, do we fire Kubiak? Or is that settling for mediocrity?

Carr Bombed
08-26-2010, 01:01 AM
Sometimes I think people are so scared of another "Dom Capers" that they're afraid to even fathom the idea of moving on without Kubiak if he fails this season.

There was a better life without Capers and they'll be one without Kubiak. (Seriously, the bar hasn't been set that high)

With Capers this team was stuck on blocks inside the garage......with Kubiak, they've been stuck in the mud on the side of the highway so far (Finishing with what has essentially been the same record the past 3 seasons, is exactly that). If he can't get this team headed down the turnpike this season, then we need to hand the keys to someone who can, before Andre starts to fade and alot of this young talent starts to move on in FA.

I hope Kubiak is that guy....but if he's not THIS YEAR. Goodbye, time to give someone else a shot.

Not For Long.

Carr Bombed
08-26-2010, 01:09 AM
Also, it doesn't help that I think that last year was Kubiak's worst coaching job since he's been here.......regardless of the fact that he finished a franchise best 9-7. (which is the main reason why I was never pleased with that record)

I was much more impressed with the 8-8 years despite Schaub missing major time. Last year Schaub had one of the best individual seasons of all time and Kubiak pulls off a 1-5 divisional record which is the main reason why his team was stuck celebrating a non playoff winning season and not a franchise first playoff appearance.

The Pencil Neck
08-26-2010, 01:10 AM
So we're one of the only teams in the entire league who have not made it to the playoffs since the texans have been in the league....."But there are lots of teams who've gone on 8 year droughts."

Sorry, but that just doesn't compute at all. In today's league, if you do the things that you need to do.....it doesn't take long to field a NFL playoff team.

Cardinals had an 8 year drought from '99-07.
Bills and Lions a 10 year drought.
Bengals have only made it to the playoffs 2 times in the past 10 years and had a 14 year drought that was broken in 2005.
The Browns have made it to the playoffs 1 time in the past 10 years.
The Jaguars and Redskins have made it to the playoffs 2 times in the past 10 years.
The Chiefs have made it to the playoffs 2 times in the past 12 years.
Since we've been in the league, the Dolphins, 49ers, and the Raiders have only made it to the playoffs 1 time each.
Since we've been in the league, the Saints and Rams have made it to the playoffs 2 times.

That's 13 teams that haven't been to the playoffs very much in the past 8-10 years.

There are a few teams that are perennial winner. That's where we want to be. But it's not easy to get there. It's not easy to make it to the playoffs.

Carr Bombed
08-26-2010, 01:13 AM
Cardinals had an 8 year drought from '99-07.
Bills and Lions a 10 year drought.
Bengals have only made it to the playoffs 2 times in the past 10 years and had a 14 year drought that was broken in 2005.
The Browns have made it to the playoffs 1 time in the past 10 years.
The Jaguars and Redskins have made it to the playoffs 2 times in the past 10 years.
The Chiefs have made it to the playoffs 2 times in the past 12 years.
Since we've been in the league, the Dolphins, 49ers, and the Raiders have only made it to the playoffs 1 time each.
Since we've been in the league, the Saints and Rams have made it to the playoffs 2 times.

That's 13 teams that haven't been to the playoffs very much in the past 8-10 years.

There are a few teams that are perennial winner. That's where we want to be. But it's not easy to get there. It's not easy to make it to the playoffs.

Great so even the majority of the teams you mentioned have had more success than we've had.......how does that help your argument?

You just went from comparing the Texans to the Steelers, Belichick, and Rex Ryan's Jets to some of the worst franchises in the league.

steelbtexan
08-26-2010, 01:15 AM
Depends on the season and the circumstance.

The thing is that I think Kubiak is a good coach. I think he's done some really good things with this team and I think he can get us a Super Bowl.

7-9 or worse is only OK if we've had a bunch of injuries. I don't think the coach should lose his job if we lose Schaub, AJ, Demeco, Mario, and Pollard for the year. If we go 7-9 without a bunch of major injuries, then Kubiak should be gone.

I'm fine with 8-8 if that gets us into the playoffs or if there's a bunch of injuries. If we've got all our starters healthy and we finish 8-8 and don't make the playoffs, then we need to start over... with the understanding that we're probably going to drop down to a 4-6 win team the following season.

If we go 9-7, I'll be fine whether we make the playoffs or not as long as 9-7 was good enough to get into the playoffs for another AFC team. If 10-6 was the mark to get into the playoffs, then Kubiak needs to be let go but I won't be upset if he's kept.

If we go 10-6 or better and miss the playoffs, I'm fine with Kubiak.

How about you? If we go 8-8 and make the playoffs, do we fire Kubiak? Or is that settling for mediocrity?

Dont care about injuries.

I think the Texans need to go 10-6 for Kubes to keep his job.

While 8-8 and making the playoffs would be good. I would consider that record to be a step back and probably would keep Kubes. But would have to think long and hard about letting Kubes go.

The Pencil Neck
08-26-2010, 01:27 AM
Great so even the majority of the teams you mentioned have had more success than we've had.......how does that help your argument?

You just went from comparing the Texans to the Steelers, Belichick, and Rex Ryan's Jets to some of the worst franchises in the league.


Sorry, but that just doesn't compute at all. In today's league, if you do the things that you need to do.....it doesn't take long to field a NFL playoff team.


In today's league, it's not nearly as easy as you say. If it was that easy, those 13 teams would have a lot more playoff appearances. Those aren't 13 teams of people who are dogging it trying not to win. Winning his hard. Putting together a perennial winner is harder.

Your assertion that it doesn't take long to field an NFL playoff team is obviously wrong. Those numbers prove how hard it is to field a playoff team.

We've only had a decent coach for 4 years coming into this season and he took over a team devoid of talent. He's had to work harder to build something than any of those 13 franchises I mentioned. The fact that the Raiders, Dolphins, and 9ers only have 1 playoff appearance is much more an indictment against them than against us.

Carr Bombed
08-26-2010, 01:33 AM
In today's league, it's not nearly as easy as you say. If it was that easy, those 13 teams would have a lot more playoff appearances. Those aren't 13 teams of people who are dogging it trying not to win. Winning his hard. Putting together a perennial winner is harder.

Your assertion that it doesn't take long to field an NFL playoff team is obviously wrong. Those numbers prove how hard it is to field a playoff team.

We've only had a decent coach for 4 years coming into this season and he took over a team devoid of talent. He's had to work harder to build something than any of those 13 franchises I mentioned. The fact that the Raiders, Dolphins, and 9ers only have 1 playoff appearance is much more an indictment against them than against us.

Those #s don't prove anything.... LOL

SERIOUSLY....

List the teams who have yet to reach the playoffs since the Texans have been in the league. LIST THEM.

Stop making excuses, people are tired of hearing excuses...and all you're doing is trying to find every excuse that you can. Hell just look at the coaches that took over teams the same year Kubiak did. Some of those coaches took over teams just as devoid of talent that the Texans had.

I know this is probably in bad taste to ask, but are you a A&M fan also....I'm just curious.

The Pencil Neck
08-26-2010, 01:48 AM
Those #s don't prove anything.... LOL

SERIOUSLY....

List the teams who have yet to reach the playoffs since the Texans have been in the league. LIST THEM.

Stop making excuses, people are tired of hearing excuses...and all you're doing is trying to find every excuse that you can. Hell just look at the coaches that took over teams the same year Kubiak did. Some of those coaches took over teams just as devoid of talent that the Texans had.

I know this is probably in bad taste to ask, but are you a A&M fan also....I'm just curious.

No, I'm not an Aggie. Are you a Longhorn fan?

The Bills and Lions have not made it to the playoffs since the Texans have been in the league. But that was never the point. That has nothing to do with anything. The point was about playoff droughts. I said that lots of teams go through them and you said that any team that's trying in the modern NFL can make the playoffs in short period of time. Those numbers show that almost half the league hasn't done what you said. All of those teams have struggled to make the playoffs for extended periods of time in the modern NFL.

And no coach took over a team as devoid of talent as the team Kubiak inherited.

But... I'm not going to argue about this any more. I will try to stay out of the "Kubiak Needs To Go" discussions until there's some new data that provides a reason to actually talk about it.

I'm not going to stir this pot any more.

We've got a game with Dallas coming up and that's all I'm concerned about right now.

ReliantTexan
08-26-2010, 02:14 AM
Also, it doesn't help that I think that last year was Kubiak's worst coaching job since he's been here.......regardless of the fact that he finished a franchise best 9-7. (which is the main reason why I was never pleased with that record)

I was much more impressed with the 8-8 years despite Schaub missing major time. Last year Schaub had one of the best individual seasons of all time and Kubiak pulls off a 1-5 divisional record which is the main reason why his team was stuck celebrating a non playoff winning season and not a franchise first playoff appearance.Even you have to admit. That division record looks a whole lot different if any of our backs could gain a damn yard to save their life and hold onto the football, not to mention our Kicker choking his ass off in two of those losses. There's a difference between making excuses and being willing to see that the blame doesn't always fall squarely on the head coach when a team under achieves.

Carr Bombed
08-26-2010, 06:20 AM
Even you have to admit. That division record looks a whole lot different if any of our backs could gain a damn yard to save their life and hold onto the football, not to mention our Kicker choking his ass off in two of those losses. There's a difference between making excuses and being willing to see that the blame doesn't always fall squarely on the head coach when a team under achieves.

Yes, but our coach kept putting the ball in those backs hands (Chris Brown half back pass was epically stupid)

Also who the hell else would've stuck with a kicker like Kris Brown for a entire season? Seriously, he should've been canned before the season was over.

Dwade
08-26-2010, 07:24 AM
Yes, but our coach kept putting the ball in those backs hands (Chris Brown half back pass was epically stupid)

Also who the hell else would've stuck with a kicker like Kris Brown for a entire season? Seriously, he should've been canned before the season was over.

Exactly.

Ole Miss Texan
08-26-2010, 09:53 AM
The players weren't celebrating the fact that we were 9-7 and they were happy with just that. They were celebrating because they went into the last game of the season with it being a "MUST WIN GAME" and they won it. Secondly, because they won that game it kept the team's playoff chances and hopes alive.

I would have despised the team if they DIDN'T celebrate after the victory. They won the game, everyone was excited, we could just taste our first playoff appearance, just a few more hours and we would know if we were going or not.

It wasn't until later that day we found out we didn't make the playoffs. The players weren't satisfied with going 9-7, the celebration was because they put themselves in the position to make the playoffs.

Funny how we can rewrite history and bend the facts to try and support an arguement... :zipit:

(the zipit smiley is in honor of the upcoming game against the cowgirls :))

thunderkyss
08-26-2010, 11:02 AM
A winning season is something to be proud of. A winning season is a step in the right direction.

Especially if it's the first one for your franchise, ever.

And I don't know why Texans' fans are so spoiled but so many of you seem to think that winning in this league is easy and if you don't make the playoffs this year, you're entitled to making it next year.

These are the same people who discounted that we were still basically an expansion team.

I understand after 4 years in the league, you shouldn't be considered an expansion team. But our franchise had been run into the ground for 4 years.

The only way to break the expansion team mindset, is to win more games than you lose.

Then celebrate it.

I totally agree with Carr Bombed, and every body else, if our goal was to get to 9-7, that's just pathetic. But that was not the case.

thunderkyss
08-26-2010, 12:04 PM
But also understand that with one of the easiest schedules in the league not making the playoffs made me question the way Texans management goes about their business.


Is this about the (K)Chris Brown thing?

Totally understandable.

But that shouldn't take away from 9-7 being a milestone worth celebrating.

If we were the Cardinals, Bucs, Lions, Saints, or Colts, who experienced bad seasons for decades, I completely understand.

If this was the Houston Oilers, and they had never left Houston, & Bud Adams was a peach of a man, I can understand not celebrating 9-7.

But this is like your kid learning to ride a bike. I mean I wouldn't celebrate if the kid is already 12 years old. But this is more like a kid learning to ride at 6 years old, instead of 5. Or like learning to walk at 18 months. It's still worth celebrating.

Blake
08-26-2010, 12:11 PM
Even you have to admit. That division record looks a whole lot different if any of our backs could gain a damn yard to save their life and hold onto the football, not to mention our Kicker choking his ass off in two of those losses. There's a difference between making excuses and being willing to see that the blame doesn't always fall squarely on the head coach when a team under achieves.

While everyone might agree that the coaches, players and management all share a piece of the pie of a success season or a season of failure, it is the coaches job to put the players in a position to succeed. And I think Kubiak has been given enough time to show this. A fumble, or missed FG isnt the reason a team loses the game. But it is a part of why.

Kubiaks 5th year is his last chance to make the playoffs. No excuses about a missed FG or fumble. Dont want to hear it. Either coach these players up and put them in a better position to win, or see if Colorado State needs a QB coach. (Obviously the CSU QB coach thing was a joke.)

thunderkyss
08-26-2010, 12:29 PM
LOL!
Finishing 9-7 with a 1-5 divisional record is not something that needs to be praised.

How about finishing the season with a 9-7 record with a 2-4 divisional record? Does that deserve any praise?

thunderkyss
08-26-2010, 12:32 PM
Start counting that decade when Kubiak came to the team. THEN you don't have an unrealistic expectation. But if you're counting the first 4 years as part of the 10, then yes, you're being unrealistic.

However, even with the debacle that was C&C, we still had a great shot at the playoffs last year and we'll have another great shot this year. Hopefully, there's football the year after that because we'll have another great shot at it.

Don't forget, we haven't played the first game of year 9 yet. The decade isn't over.

Blake
08-26-2010, 12:39 PM
Yes, but our coach kept putting the ball in those backs hands (Chris Brown half back pass was epically stupid)

Also who the hell else would've stuck with a kicker like Kris Brown for a entire season? Seriously, he should've been canned before the season was over.

What available kicker would we have brought in? Billy Cundiff and his 73.6% carrer FG rating? I dont think you are gonna get much better out of any available kickers at that time.

thunderkyss
08-26-2010, 12:49 PM
BTW How many yrs of 7-9/9-7 are you up for until you think a change should be made?

The Jets went 9-7 2 years in a row.

If we made it to the play-offs this year, for whatever reason, the Jets were 8-8. Would you be thinking about making a change?

Most people here would say no, "because we made the play-offs, yada, yada, yada"

Then you've got the fans that know what they are talking about.

7-9/9-7 to me, says you don't see a difference, or at least not much difference.

I believe the same thing. 9-7/11-5 same thing.


Even with that 11-5 record getting into the play-offs is still a coin toss. Other things can happen that would knock you out.

For me, the question is did this team play like a 7-9/9-7 team or did they play like a 9-7/11-5 team.

My personal opinion, watching the games I think we played like the 9-7/11-5 team. The stats back that up (IMHO). We missed being 11-5 on a handful of plays.

So for me, it's about how they play. If they played like a 7-9/9-7 team (not able to move the ball, not able to stop anyone, ranked 30th in offense, 32nd in defense), I'd want GK gone now.

But they didn't.

thunderkyss
08-26-2010, 12:52 PM
Sometimes I think people are so scared of another "Dom Capers" that they're afraid to even fathom the idea of moving on without Kubiak if he fails this season.


In this thread, you're pretty much talking to TPN & me.

Both of us have said if he fails, he's got to go.

DexmanC
08-26-2010, 01:00 PM
In this thread, you're pretty much talking to TPN & me.

Both of us have said if he fails, he's got to go.

What's there to argue about, then? Go Texans 2010!!
:fans::fans:

My Signature, in case you can't see it:


RIP EXCUSES (2006-2009)
The First Twelve Games (Where Playoff Teams Are Made):
2007: (5-7) | 2008: (5-7) | 2009: (5-7) | 2010: The Year of Change?

thunderkyss
08-26-2010, 01:03 PM
What available kicker would we have brought in? Billy Cundiff and his 73.6% carrer FG rating? I dont think you are gonna get much better out of any available kickers at that time.

My personal opinion, is that it didn't matter. He should have been gone.

I also don't think it could have hurt to put Moats in more than Brown, or to get Chris Henry in the game, or even Arian Foster early.

That's Kubiak being scared. Going into the Bye with the problems we had at RB, doesn't make any sense not to sign Larry Johnson.

steelbtexan
08-26-2010, 01:04 PM
The Jets went 9-7 2 years in a row.

If we made it to the play-offs this year, for whatever reason, the Jets were 8-8. Would you be thinking about making a change?

Most people here would say no, "because we made the play-offs, yada, yada, yada"

Then you've got the fans that know what they are talking about.

7-9/9-7 to me, says you don't see a difference, or at least not much difference.

I believe the same thing. 9-7/11-5 same thing.


Even with that 11-5 record getting into the play-offs is still a coin toss. Other things can happen that would knock you out.

For me, the question is did this team play like a 7-9/9-7 team or did they play like a 9-7/11-5 team.

My personal opinion, watching the games I think we played like the 9-7/11-5 team. The stats back that up (IMHO). We missed being 11-5 on a handful of plays.

So for me, it's about how they play. If they played like a 7-9/9-7 team (not able to move the ball, not able to stop anyone, ranked 30th in offense, 32nd in defense), I'd want GK gone now.

But they didn't.

I'm just glad that you have a criteria for next yr as making the playoffs. Where we have a difference of opinionis I see last yrs 9-7 as closer to a 7-9 team due to the weak schedule they had last year. You see the 9-7 as closer to an 11-5 team.

Time will tell who's right. One thing I would like to say is go Texans. (where hopefully 10-6,11-5 lives)

thunderkyss
08-26-2010, 01:05 PM
What's there to argue about, then?
:fans::fans:

spilled milk...


It's what we do. :kitten:

Rey
08-26-2010, 01:10 PM
The Jets went 9-7 2 years in a row.

If we made it to the play-offs this year, for whatever reason, the Jets were 8-8. Would you be thinking about making a change?

Most people here would say no, "because we made the play-offs, yada, yada, yada"

Then you've got the fans that know what they are talking about.

7-9/9-7 to me, says you don't see a difference, or at least not much difference.

I believe the same thing. 9-7/11-5 same thing.


Even with that 11-5 record getting into the play-offs is still a coin toss. Other things can happen that would knock you out.

For me, the question is did this team play like a 7-9/9-7 team or did they play like a 9-7/11-5 team.

My personal opinion, watching the games I think we played like the 9-7/11-5 team. The stats back that up (IMHO). We missed being 11-5 on a handful of plays.

So for me, it's about how they play. If they played like a 7-9/9-7 team (not able to move the ball, not able to stop anyone, ranked 30th in offense, 32nd in defense), I'd want GK gone now.

But they didn't.


At this point of Kubiak's tenure, making the play-offs doesn't mean much to me as far as evaluating him as a coach.

Kubiak needs to field a team that can consistently win games that matter. Division games, games that determine seeding, games that determine whether or not we get into the play-offs...And of course teams we are supposed to beat...If all those things happens, then we are a 10-12 win team.

If Kubiak gets into the play-offs this yr. with a 9-7 record and loses in the wild card game then IMO that will reflect poorly on him as a coach.

I wouldn't call for his head, but I don't think that'd be anything to be proud of. If he did the same thing the year after, the I think it'd be time for him to go.

The Pencil Neck
08-26-2010, 01:22 PM
At this point of Kubiak's tenure, making the play-offs doesn't mean much to me as far as evaluating him as a coach.

Kubiak needs to field a team that can consistently win games that matter. Division games, games that determine seeding, games that determine whether or not we get into the play-offs...And of course teams we are supposed to beat...If all those things happens, then we are a 10-12 win team.

If Kubiak gets into the play-offs this yr. with a 9-7 record and loses in the wild card game then IMO that will reflect poorly on him as a coach.

I wouldn't call for his head, but I don't think that'd be anything to be proud of. If he did the same thing the year after, the I think it'd be time for him to go.

Gawd these threads keep pulling me back in...

But yeah. There are ways that Kubiak could get into the playoffs and lose that would have me calling for his head.

To me, making the playoffs is great and one of the goals but making them doesn't exonerate someone for bad coaching. It's not enough to get there and then look like you don't belong there.

I can think of scenarios where we could win 10-11 games this season and I would be of the opinion that Kubiak should be fired. I can think of scenarios where we could win 8 games and I'd be defending him.

The thing for me is that right now, I think this team is really good and getting better and I think it is premature to pull the plug on the coach. Is he the greatest coach that ever lived? No. He's a good coach and he's put together a really good team. And some years, that's enough to win a Super Bowl.

And even if Kubiak is fired, I think we still keep Smith because I think he's had some simply amazing drafts.

Ole Miss Texan
08-26-2010, 01:40 PM
What available kicker would we have brought in? Billy Cundiff and his 73.6% carrer FG rating? I dont think you are gonna get much better out of any available kickers at that time.

That's what nobody ever answers. I understand the criticism of Kris Brown and it was such a let down but if you're going to cut your kicker midway through the season... somebody is going to have to step in. What Kicker do you bring in?

Also, it wasn't until November when Brown started choking. And it was really 2 games in a row that "cost us the win". The Indy and Tennessee games. So my other question is WHEN do you cut a guy? Is it after the 1st game he costs you (Indy)? Do you give him one more chance and cut him after the Tennessee game? If not, there really wasn't a good chance to cut him.

After those two choke job games, the team went 4-2. Brown went 10 of 15 FG's which is BAD... but his 5 missed FG's were in games that we won. The 2 games we lost, he was 3 for 3 and it wasn't his fault. 2 of the missed FGs were in the last game of the season. So going into the last game you have a K that cost you 2 games in November but after that he was 10/13 with the 3 missed FG's in games we won. The team had gone 3-2 but he was not a reason for either loss. Do you have reason to cut your kicker after this going into the last game of the season?

An easy answer is after the Tennessee game on Nov. 23rd after he cost us two games in a row. The two problems with that is (1) we have to replace him with another Kicker... who do we get!? and (2) that kicker would not have made the outcome of our season any better since Brown had Zero responsibility in the 2 remaining losses.

I hate to sound like a Kris Brown apologist/rationalist because those missed field goals made me sick to my stomach, it's just if I was the Head Coach I couldn't see myself cutting him. Now we're in the offseason with stiff competition against Neil Rackers. I love this and think that's the way to go about it. Whether Brown or Rackers win, I'll be cheering for the winner and hope they have a successful season with us.

steelbtexan
08-26-2010, 02:05 PM
What available kicker would we have brought in? Billy Cundiff and his 73.6% carrer FG rating? I dont think you are gonna get much better out of any available kickers at that time.

The Fla.St. K Graham Cano (I believe was his name) was signed by the Redskins during the season and had a great 2nd half of the season for the Redskins.

Blake
08-26-2010, 02:20 PM
The Fla.St. K Graham Cano (I believe was his name) was signed by the Redskins during the season and had a great 2nd half of the season for the Redskins.

I appreciate you at least responding to the question.

Gano was signed in December and kicked 4 FG, and 2 of them were 20 and 25 yards long. I wouldnt call that a "great 2nd half of the season."

I am not saying he was bad. Just that his body of work is too limited to say he was great.

Ole Miss Texan
08-26-2010, 03:31 PM
My Signature, in case you can't see it:


RIP EXCUSES (2006-2009)
The First Twelve Games (Where Playoff Teams Are Made):
2007: (5-7) | 2008: (5-7) | 2009: (5-7) | 2010: The Year of Change?
Pretty interesting stuff. I went back and looked at the records over the first 12 games for each playoff team. All were 7-5 or better with the exception of two teams. The Jets and the Ravens both had a 6-6 record after 12 games... and these were the two AFC teams that received the wild card slots. Texans of course, were 5-7.

I think the Jets got pretty lucky (not to say they're not a good team) because their last two games were against Indy and Cincinnati who both totally layed down b/c they were already in the playoffs. Not really using that as an excuse but actually more to back up your point about the importance of first 12 games. Had they had a 5-7 record like us instead of 6-6, they wouldn't have been in the playoffs.

steelbtexan
08-26-2010, 03:55 PM
Gawd these threads keep pulling me back in...

But yeah. There are ways that Kubiak could get into the playoffs and lose that would have me calling for his head.

To me, making the playoffs is great and one of the goals but making them doesn't exonerate someone for bad coaching. It's not enough to get there and then look like you don't belong there.

I can think of scenarios where we could win 10-11 games this season and I would be of the opinion that Kubiak should be fired. I can think of scenarios where we could win 8 games and I'd be defending him.

The thing for me is that right now, I think this team is really good and getting better and I think it is premature to pull the plug on the coach. Is he the greatest coach that ever lived? No. He's a good coach and he's put together a really good team. And some years, that's enough to win a Super Bowl.

And even if Kubiak is fired, I think we still keep Smith because I think he's had some simply amazing drafts.

Smiths' 1st draft was the OkOye draft was not good

His 2nd draft, the D.Brown/Slaton was O.K.

His 3rd draft the Cushing/Barwin/Caldwell draft was a great draft

His 4th draft the jury is still out on.

Overall I would say Smith has done an O.K. job of drafting and he appears to be improving. So we agree that Smith probably should keep his job regardless of whether Kubes gets fired or not.

Dwade
08-26-2010, 03:55 PM
Pretty interesting stuff. I went back and looked at the records over the first 12 games for each playoff team. All were 7-5 or better with the exception of two teams. The Jets and the Ravens both had a 6-6 record after 12 games... and these were the two AFC teams that received the wild card slots. Texans of course, were 5-7.

I think the Jets got pretty lucky (not to say they're not a good team) because their last two games were against Indy and Cincinnati who both totally layed down b/c they were already in the playoffs. Not really using that as an excuse but actually more to back up your point about the importance of first 12 games. Had they had a 5-7 record like us instead of 6-6, they wouldn't have been in the playoffs.

True, the Jets did get lucky. But once they made the playoffs they kicked ass, and got to the AFC Championship.

I don't like the Jets at all, but I have to respect them for getting that far with a rookie QB.

steelbtexan
08-26-2010, 03:59 PM
I prefer the Buddy Ryan/Singletary type of HC.

To the Shanny/Kubes type of HC.

houstonspartan
08-26-2010, 04:15 PM
I prefer the Buddy Ryan/Singletary type of HC.

To the Shanny/Kubes type of HC.

Actually, I've always like Shanny. I think he's tougher than we think he is. He's one of those "quiet assasin" types that has that mob boss vibe to him. Kubiak not so much.

HOU-TEX
08-26-2010, 04:27 PM
I prefer the Buddy Ryan/Singletary type of HC.

To the Shanny/Kubes type of HC.

I assume you mean personality? Which makes no difference for a HC

Buddy Ryan/Singletary = 68-67-1 record with 0 super bowls

Shanahan/Kubiak = 275-179 record with 2 super bowls

But yeah, I can see why you would prefer the Ryan and Singletary type.

Dwade
08-26-2010, 04:56 PM
I assume you mean personality? Which makes no difference for a HC

Buddy Ryan/Singletary = 68-67-1 record with 0 super bowls

Shanahan/Kubiak = 275-179 record with 2 super bowls

But yeah, I can see why you would prefer the Ryan and Singletary type.

Please don't compare Kubiak to Shanahan...Kubiak hasn't done sh*t

DexmanC
08-26-2010, 05:05 PM
I assume you mean personality? Which makes no difference for a HC

Buddy Ryan/Singletary = 68-67-1 record with 0 super bowls

Shanahan/Kubiak = 275-179 record with 2 super bowls

But yeah, I can see why you would prefer the Ryan and Singletary type.

The coaches who's names were BOLDED were head coaches
who actually won championships WHILE they were THE HEAD COACH

Ole Miss Texan
08-26-2010, 05:15 PM
Please don't compare Kubiak to Shanahan...Kubiak hasn't done sh*t

Well the comparisons are there for a reason. Shanahan had the fortune to go to the Broncos who had John Elway. A team that had made the playoffs 11 of the 12 years prior to Shanny becoming HC. That's a vastly different circumstance than what Kubiak stepped into.

pun not originally intended.... but that's just funny

DexmanC
08-26-2010, 05:19 PM
Well the comparisons are there for a reason. Shanahan had the fortune to go to the Broncos who had John Elway. A team that had made the playoffs 11 of the 12 years prior to Shanny becoming HC. That's a vastly different circumstance than what Kubiak stepped into.

pun not originally intended.... but that's just funny

Poor lil Kubes. Shame on Bob for not giving him a 15-year deal,
so that we REALLY learn what kind of coach we have.

Any more seasons like the last three, and we can dub Kubes
"The Second Coming Of Wayne Fontes (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wayne_Fontes)"

Rey
08-26-2010, 05:21 PM
Gawd these threads keep pulling me back in...

But yeah. There are ways that Kubiak could get into the playoffs and lose that would have me calling for his head.

To me, making the playoffs is great and one of the goals but making them doesn't exonerate someone for bad coaching. It's not enough to get there and then look like you don't belong there.

I can think of scenarios where we could win 10-11 games this season and I would be of the opinion that Kubiak should be fired. I can think of scenarios where we could win 8 games and I'd be defending him.

The thing for me is that right now, I think this team is really good and getting better and I think it is premature to pull the plug on the coach. Is he the greatest coach that ever lived? No. He's a good coach and he's put together a really good team. And some years, that's enough to win a Super Bowl.

And even if Kubiak is fired, I think we still keep Smith because I think he's had some simply amazing drafts.

I agree 100% with your post...

The only thing I think I keep thinking about is Marty Schottenheimer(sp?).

Of course at this point I'd love to be complaining about always making the play-offs and not getting outta the first rd.

If there ever comes a time where, even if we're consistently making the play-offs, but I feel that Kubiak has plateaued as a coach, I'd want him out of here. Much like a player in the early stages of their career, I expect to see improvement out of the head coach.

But my point is that Kubes has improved the team every year IMO. Record be damned, I have seen this team improve. Maybe not at warp speed, but nonetheless they have gotten better. As of right now, I'm good with that.

HOU-TEX
08-26-2010, 05:24 PM
Please don't compare Kubiak to Shanahan...Kubiak hasn't done sh*t

It was a reply to a post, Einstein. Plus, where was I comparing Shanahan and Kubiak?

Ole Miss Texan
08-26-2010, 05:46 PM
Poor lil Kubes. Shame on Bob for not giving him a 15-year deal, so that we REALLY learn what kind of coach we have.

I never said anything about giving him a long term deal or anything. I was only commenting about the Shanahan and Kubiak comparisons. Kubiak spent something like 23 of 26 years before the Texans with the Broncos organization and was with Mike Shanahan for like 15 of them. They both believe in the same offensive philosophy that was instilled with both the 49'ers and Broncos... and now Texans.

There was a comment about "don't compare them"... and that was really based on the fact that Shanny has been a Head Coach longer and has been more successful. I was only pointing out the very very contrasting situations that Shanny and Kubiak both stepped into as Head Coaches.

Shanahan - Broncos: A team that had been around for 35 years, had reached the playoffs 11 of the 12 years before he started as HC and was led by Hall of Fame QB John Elway.

Kubiak - Texans: A team that had been around for 4 years, was in shambles from the previous regime and was led by Hall of Fame QB David Carr.

Dwade
08-26-2010, 05:53 PM
I never said anything about giving him a long term deal or anything. I was only commenting about the Shanahan and Kubiak comparisons. Kubiak spent something like 23 of 26 years before the Texans with the Broncos organization and was with Mike Shanahan for like 15 of them. They both believe in the same offensive philosophy that was instilled with both the 49'ers and Broncos... and now Texans.

There was a comment about "don't compare them"... and that was really based on the fact that Shanny has been a Head Coach longer and has been more successful. I was only pointing out the very very contrasting situations that Shanny and Kubiak both stepped into as Head Coaches.

Shanahan - Broncos: A team that had been around for 35 years, had reached the playoffs 11 of the 12 years before he started as HC and was led by Hall of Fame QB John Elway.

Kubiak - Texans: A team that had been around for 4 years, was in shambles from the previous regime and was led by Hall of Fame QB David Carr.

Yes, Shanahan had a better starting team. Honestly Shanahan wouldn't even make my top 10 coaches of all time, but he is a good coach.

If Kubiak would have taken over that Denver team I doubt they would have done as good...Kubiak is great at not getting the best out of his players...

thunderkyss
08-26-2010, 05:57 PM
If Kubiak gets into the play-offs this yr. with a 9-7 record and loses in the wild card game then IMO that will reflect poorly on him as a coach.

I wouldn't call for his head, but I don't think that'd be anything to be proud of. If he did the same thing the year after, the I think it'd be time for him to go.

I completely agree.

thunderkyss
08-26-2010, 06:38 PM
True, the Jets did get lucky. But once they made the playoffs they kicked ass, and got to the AFC Championship.

I don't like the Jets at all, but I have to respect them for getting that far with a rookie QB.

I've got no problem with the Jets. I just don't like how many here think REx Ryan hung the moon, because they beat us in week 1. They use that to say Kubiak is a bad coach.

Week 2, the Jets do the same thing against the New England Patriots. Does that mean Bill Bellichick is a bad coach? Hell no, and I should be ashamed of myself for comparing Kubiak to Bellichick.

????

They won 9 games. We won 9 games. Ryans is a genius, Kubiak is a dud. I understand he's a rookie. But the team he took over, went 9-7... It's like how much better are they, really? 9-7 in 2008. 9-7 in 2009.. If the Texans aren't any better going 8-8 in 2008, and 9-7 in 2009, how in the hell are the Jets a better team?

Should we look at the stats to prove the Jets are a better team? #1 defense, #1 against the pass, #8 against the run. 32 sacks. 20th ranked offense, #1 rushing, #31 passing team, #17 scoring offense.
In 2008, they had the 17th ranked, total defense


Can we look at Houston's stats? #1 passing team. #30 rushing team. #4 Total Offense. #10 Scoring offense. #13 Total Defense. #18 against the Pass. #10 against the run. 30 sacks.
In 2008, they had the 29th ranked defense.

No, it's just silly to look at stats. REx Ryan is better, period.

Dwade
08-26-2010, 07:35 PM
I've got no problem with the Jets. I just don't like how many here think REx Ryan hung the moon, because they beat us in week 1. They use that to say Kubiak is a bad coach.

Week 2, the Jets do the same thing against the New England Patriots. Does that mean Bill Bellichick is a bad coach? Hell no, and I should be ashamed of myself for comparing Kubiak to Bellichick.

????

They won 9 games. We won 9 games. Ryans is a genius, Kubiak is a dud. I understand he's a rookie. But the team he took over, went 9-7... It's like how much better are they, really? 9-7 in 2008. 9-7 in 2009.. If the Texans aren't any better going 8-8 in 2008, and 9-7 in 2009, how in the hell are the Jets a better team?

Should we look at the stats to prove the Jets are a better team? #1 defense, #1 against the pass, #8 against the run. 32 sacks. 20th ranked offense, #1 rushing, #31 passing team, #17 scoring offense.
In 2008, they had the 17th ranked, total defense


Can we look at Houston's stats? #1 passing team. #30 rushing team. #4 Total Offense. #10 Scoring offense. #13 Total Defense. #18 against the Pass. #10 against the run. 30 sacks.
In 2008, they had the 29th ranked defense.

No, it's just silly to look at stats. REx Ryan is better, period.

Rex turned the 17th defense into the 1st...you got to give him credit for that.

I just believe Kubiak is holding the team back, this team has the talent for 10-6, 11-5 easy.

thunderkyss
08-26-2010, 08:04 PM
Rex turned the 17th defense into the 1st...you got to give him credit for that.

I just believe Kubiak is holding the team back, this team has the talent for 10-6, 11-5 easy.

Does Kubiak get any credit for turning the 29th ranked defense into the 13th?

16 spaces is 16 spaces.

Does Kubiak get any credit for having our team 2 sacks shy of the Jets total, when we don't blitz as often, and we don't have anything like Kris Jenkins?

OH yeah, Kubiak is an offensive guy, and we're talking about his defense.

Carr Bombed
08-26-2010, 08:04 PM
What available kicker would we have brought in? Billy Cundiff and his 73.6% carrer FG rating? I dont think you are gonna get much better out of any available kickers at that time.

It's not about just getting a better kicker........it's about countability. Teams switch kickers all the time when they have a year as bad as Brown had last season.....and alot of times they'll pick up another kicker that was also let go or a FA kicker who might not be any better.

It's about sending a message of countability. When you continue to stick with a guy who's killing your team, you're sending a message that it doesn't matter what they do.....they'll still have a job.

That's what we did last season with Kris Brown. I like Brown, seems like a nice guy, but a move should've been made LAST YEAR regardless. The guy was clearly struggling and when you bring in another guy, you're usually bringing in a hungry player who's looking to take advantage of his new found good fortune.

Carr Bombed
08-26-2010, 08:10 PM
How about finishing the season with a 9-7 record with a 2-4 divisional record? Does that deserve any praise?

Depends........who are we talking about here.

A rookie head coach, with a freaking rookie quarterback or a coach in his 4th year who's shown no improvements against his divisional opponents, despite having a pro bowl QB.

(If that's the team/scenario that you're really comparing Kubiak and the Texans with.......there really is no comparison)

thunderkyss
08-26-2010, 08:18 PM
I just believe Kubiak is holding the team back, this team has the talent for 10-6, 11-5 easy.

I believe we are a 10-12 win team. 2009, I thought we were a 9-11 win team.

But I look at the way we lost games.

Some are on Kubiak, some are on the players. But I like Kubiak.

thunderkyss
08-26-2010, 08:22 PM
Depends........who are we talking about here.

A rookie head coach, with a freaking rookie quarterback or a coach in his 4th year who's shown no improvements against his divisional opponents, despite having a pro bowl QB.

(If that's the team/scenario that you're really comparing Kubiak and the Texans with.......there really is no comparison)

Shouldn't matter. if 9-7 is not praise worthy, 9-7 is not praise worthy.

if 1-5 is not praise worthy, 2-4 is not praise worthy.

Carr Bombed
08-26-2010, 08:32 PM
Shouldn't matter. if 9-7 is not praise worthy, 9-7 is not praise worthy.

if 1-5 is not praise worthy, 2-4 is not praise worthy.

LOL, doesn't matter...(???)

The dude in his first year as head coach with a rookie QB called out the perennial top dog of his division..........and then beat them (a move that gave his team confidence that carried them all season) and then took his team one win away from the SB.


Sorry, but this is just more excuse making

Excuses and more excuses. The season the Jets had last season isn't even remotely comparable to ours..........mainly because they came into our house during our season opener and tossed us around like rag dolls (trust me I was there sitting in section 128....had great seats and saw first hand) It was just another game where Kubiak didn't have his team ready to play and we came out flat..

When are we going to STOP making excuses and start expecting results. Seriously. After 8 years, it's time and we shouldn't be sitting here trying to undersell what was the surprise team of the year in a attempt to mask what was a disappointing season for us.

JB
08-26-2010, 08:46 PM
Rather than start a new thread, I thought I would post this here as ti seems fitting. A great read from LZ!

It is funny how the perspective of Texans fans can vary so much from fan to fan. Let's take a look:


Tommy Positivefan: "Dude, the Saints game was only a preseason game, so who cares anyway? Remember when the Saints beat the Texans last year in the preseason? And what happened? The Texans were only one game away from making the playoffs! If this happened in the regular season that would be one thing, but the Texans didn't even game plan for this game and they kept thing vanilla. Don't forget about how the Texans' starters kicked the Cardinals' butts!"

Billy Angryguy: "Typical Kubiak crap! Once again he didn't have his players ready to play and his red-zone play calling is terrible. How long are we going to keep putting up with losses like this? I am so embarrassed to even show my face to people and call myself a Texans fan. The schedule is so hard this year that I am actually thinking I should be happy with six wins at the most. In fact, if Bob McNair isn't seriously thinking of getting rid of Kubiak if he loses to the Cowboys in Week 3 of the preseason, I will sell my season tickets!"
Personally, it isn't about winning or losing in preseason, it is about seeing your players compete and seeing improvement as camp wears on. This was a preseason game, so I'm not going to freak completely out, but I can tell you that I was very unhappy to see how the defense played against the Saints and you should be, too. Hell, Gary Kubiak was clearly agitated about the performance at his Sunday presser and I didn't hear him say "it's just the preseason."


This describes the Houston Sports fan to a T.

Link (It is funny how the perspective of Texans fans can vary so much from fan to fan. Let's take a look:)

Dwade
08-26-2010, 08:59 PM
Rather than start a new thread, I thought I would post this here as ti seems fitting. A great read from LZ!



This describes the Houston Sports fan to a T.

Link (It is funny how the perspective of Texans fans can vary so much from fan to fan. Let's take a look:)

Link isn't working

Carr Bombed
08-26-2010, 08:59 PM
Rather than start a new thread, I thought I would post this here as ti seems fitting. A great read from LZ!



This describes the Houston Sports fan to a T.

Link (It is funny how the perspective of Texans fans can vary so much from fan to fan. Let's take a look:)

Actually this doesn't just describe "Houston Sports fans". We dog ourselves too much in this town......go live in other cities, we aren't alone.

This describes any fan of a "perennial irrelevant mediocre team". Tempers flair out of frustration. The difference between us and Colts fans is when the Colts look like dead dogs during the preseason, they can point to great regular season success and are unanimously confident that their preseason lackadaisical effort won't carry over to the regular season. Sadly we don't have that track record.

This isn't just about Houston Sports fans. It's systematic for any stuck in the rut team. The only thing that's worse than being horrifically bad is being year in and year out.....consistently mediocre. Atleast when you're horrifically bad everybody is in agreement that major changes need to be made. (So major changes happen fast......see this year's Astros) When you're consistently mediocre, you can be consistently mediocre for years (which is what we've been up to date), because there's factions formed and everybody is sitting on opposite sides of a fence while your team rides the fence year in and year out until they either get over the hump (pray to god that happens) or you continue down the same path until the wheels fall off and it becomes obvious to everyone that a change needs to be made.

Sadly Houston has just had to endure more of these type of teams than most cities.

thunderkyss
08-26-2010, 09:05 PM
When are we going to STOP making excuses and start expecting results. Seriously. After 8 years, it's time and we shouldn't be sitting here trying to undersell what was the surprise team of the year in a attempt to mask what was a disappointing season for us.

First of all, I'm not making excuses. 9-7 is 9-7, whether it's the Pats, the Colts, the Lions, the Bears, or whoever. Doesn't matter that it's a first year head coach, Kubiak beat the Colts in his first year too.

& we need to stop with this 8 year stuff. We were going nowhere after 4 years, and a change was made.

This team has been making improvements year after year ever since.

Not as much as you'd like to see. NOT as much as I'd like to see, but improvements just the same.

Rex Ryan inherited the 9th best rushing team in the league, that went 9-7, and went 9-7.

Kubiak inherited the 31st defense and the 30th ranked offense.

Carr Bombed
08-26-2010, 09:10 PM
First of all, I'm not making excuses. 9-7 is 9-7, whether it's the Pats, the Colts, the Lions, the Bears, or whoever. Doesn't matter that it's a first year head coach, Kubiak beat the Colts in his first year too.

& we need to stop with this 8 year stuff. We were going nowhere after 4 years, and a change was made.

This team has been making improvements year after year ever since.

Not as much as you'd like to see. NOT as much as I'd like to see, but improvements just the same.

Rex Ryan inherited the 9th best rushing team in the league, that went 9-7, and went 9-7.

Kubiak inherited the 31st defense and the 30th ranked offense.

Oh, silly me......I get it. You're a stat guy. So you obviously can't see the difference between their 9-7 and our 9-7, regardless of the expectations :rolleyes:

Sorry, my bad.

You're right.....We obviously had just as good of a year as the Jets.

Also please stop posting on how the Jets went 9-7 the year before......they did that with a HOF QB who was playing out of his mind until he got hurt. The Jets team of '08 was not the same team of '09


And the only improvement this team really made last season was a healthy Matt Schaub, a better defense, and a cupcake schedule.......yet we only improved one game in the standings. I don't chalk that up to good coaching....sorry. Like I said before, I was happy with Kubiak in '07 and '08......last season despite a one game improvement was his worst coaching year IMO.

Kubiak did more with less in '07 and '08.....last season he did less with more. Last season was his year to put the Texans in the playoffs. This year he's staring down the hardest schedule in the NFL and likely won't be playing in a division with a Titans team that's going to start the year off 0-8.

JB
08-26-2010, 09:11 PM
Actually this doesn't just describe "Houston Sports fans".

This describes any fan of a "perennial irrelevant mediocre team". Tempers flair out of frustration. The difference between us and Colts fans are when the Colts look like dead dogs during the preseason, they can point to great regular season success and are confident that their preseason lackadaisical effort won't carry over to the regular season. Sadly we don't have that track record.
This isn't just about Houston Sports fans. It's systematic for any stuck in the rut team. The only thing that's worse than being horrifically bad is being year in and year out.....consistently mediocre. Atleast when you're horrifically bad everybody is in agreement that major changes need to be made. (So major changes happen fast......see this year's Astros) When you're consistently mediocre, you can be consistently mediocre for years (which is what we've been up to date), because there's factions formed and everybody is sitting on opposite sides of a fence while your team rides the fence year in and year out until they either get over the hump (pray to god that happens) or you continue down the same path until the wheels fall off and it becomes obvious to everyone that a change needs to be made.

Sadly Houston has just had to endure more of these type of teams than most cities.

How long has that franchise been in the league? I'm sure when our franchise has been around that long, we will have the track record. How long did it take the Saints? I understand the desire to rooting for a winning team. However, I will be rooting for my team win or lose. If I don't see improvement, I will call for heads to roll. But I also know that there are 31 other teams out there and all of them are after 1 thing. Some of you make it sound like the Texans should just roll over every team they face and be a SB contender every year.

Carr Bombed
08-26-2010, 09:27 PM
How long has that franchise been in the league? I'm sure when our franchise has been around that long, we will have the track record. How long did it take the Saints? I understand the desire to rooting for a winning team. However, I will be rooting for my team win or lose. If I don't see improvement, I will call for heads to roll. But I also know that there are 31 other teams out there and all of them are after 1 thing. Some of you make it sound like the Texans should just roll over every team they face and be a SB contender every year.

We aren't starting in the same league that the Saints started in.....in today's league (FA/cap/revenue sharing) it shouldn't take 20 years to reach the playoffs.

Also, when did I ever say I'm not rooting for this team win or lose? I rooted my butt off when we were going 4-12, 5-11, and 2-14 with David Carr. I rooted my butt off when they got destroyed by the Jets in the home opener last season.

Again, I'm not talking about winning the SB... I'm talking about making the playoffs atleast once in a decade. (I'm not even talking about winning a playoff game...hell just getting there would be nice for a change) Apparently it's not that hard to do, since we're like the only ones who have yet to do it.

It's time to take the training wheels off and raise expectations of this team. We don't suck anymore, we aren't devoid of talent, we have multiple pro bowlers, we have elite players, and most important of all........WE ARE NOT A EXPANSION TEAM.

We need to move on to the next chapter/step of our franchise....it's time and more importantly, it's time to expect that next step. Pretty good is no longer good enough with this team. That's just the way things are now. We NEED to be raising that bar....not settling for the same year in and year out results and if results don't change next season then a change needs to be made.

JB
08-26-2010, 09:39 PM
We aren't starting in the same league that the Saints started in.....in today's league (FA/cap/revenue sharing) it shouldn't take 20 years to reach the playoffs.

Also, when did I ever say I'm not rooting for this team win or lose? I rooted my butt off when we were going 4-12, 5-11, and 2-14 with David Carr.

Again, I'm not talking about winning the SB... I'm talking about making the playoffs atleast once in a decade. (I'm not even talking about winning a playoff game...hell just getting there would be nice) Apparently it's not that hard to do, since we're like the only ones who have yet to do it.

It's time to take the training wheels off and raise expectations of this team. We don't suck anymore, we aren't devoid of talent, we have multiple pro bowlers, we have elite players, and most important of all........WE ARE NOT A EXPANSION TEAM.

We need to move on to the next chapter/step of our franchise....it's time. Pretty good is no longer good enough with this team. That's just the way things are now. We NEED to be raising that bar....not settling for the same year in and year out results.

I really agree with most of what you are saying here...but what is different that the Texans should be able to win faster than the Saints?

Carr Bombed
08-26-2010, 09:46 PM
I really agree with most of what you are saying here...but what is different that the Texans should be able to win faster than the Saints?

There's a level playing field in today's game......the Saints went from having the 2nd pick in the draft to the NFC Championship game and then they later went to the SB....with nothing other than a change at QB and a change at HC. You make the right decisions in this league and you can go from worst to first overnight.

If you need any evidence on how level the playing field is in today's league just look at the amount of teams that have made the playoffs during the time that the Texans have been in the league. It literally speaks for itself.

J_R
08-26-2010, 09:48 PM
There's a level playing field in today's game......the Saints went from having the 2nd pick in the draft to the NFC Championship game and then they later went to the SB....with nothing other than a change at QB and a change at HC. You make the right decisions in this league and you can go from worst to first overnight.

If you need any evidence on how level the playing field is in today's league just look at the amount of teams that have made the playoffs during the time that the Texans have been in the league. It literally speaks for itself.

What, you're not ok with this 5+ year plan?! ;)

:sarcasm:

thunderkyss
08-26-2010, 09:48 PM
Oh, silly me......I get it. You're a stat guy. So you obviously can't see the difference between their 9-7 and our 9-7, regardless of the expectations :rolleyes:

Sorry, my bad.

You're right.....We obviously had just as good of a year as the Jets.

Had the Steelers not cratered, the Jets would have been watching the Post season just like us. 9-7 is 9-7

Also please stop posting on how the Jets went 9-7 the year before......they did that with a HOF QB who was playing out of his mind until he got hurt. The Jets team of '08 was not the same team of '09

They also had the 9th best rushing game, and the 7th best run defense.



And the only improvement this team really made last season was a healthy Matt Schaub, a better defense, and a cupcake schedule.......yet we only improved one game in the standings. I don't chalk that up to good coaching....sorry. Like I said before, I was happy with Kubiak in '07 and '08......last season despite a one game improvement was his worst coaching year IMO.

Kubiak did more with less in '07 and '08.....last season he did less with more.

We lost both our starting guards. Early in the season. Still we have the #1 passing offense. Our starting running back came down with the worst case of fumblitus (from week 1) I have ever seen, we lost him to injury after week 11. Lost our Pro Bowl Tight End (week 8). Still had the 4th best offense in the league.

GK took the 23rd rushing defense, and made it the 10th best. We went from 22nd in total defense to 13th.

But that's just more stats

steelbtexan
08-26-2010, 09:58 PM
I believe we are a 10-12 win team. 2009, I thought we were a 9-11 win team.

But I look at the way we lost games.

Some are on Kubiak, some are on the players. But I like Kubiak.

Why do you like Kubiak?

Have you met him?

Did you go to A&M?

Because he seems like a nice guy

It surely isn't for the hard nosed for 4 qtrs winning brand of football that he"s brought to Houston.

b0ng
08-26-2010, 10:03 PM
All of this talk of "demands" and "consequences" and all of this I want to know, what the hell are most of you guys going to do if we go 10-6\6-10 and miss the playoffs this year, and they retain Kubiak? Are you going to write to Bob McNair and tell him how you feel? Boycott the team? Not post on message boards for the Texans? Tear up your season tickets? I'm genuinely curious what sort of consequences you, the singular lone fan is going to do if the Texans don't perform up to some of you guys's lofty standards and expectations, and I'd love to read some actual threats.

I know what I'm going to do if the Texans go 0-16 this year. Maybe find other things to do on Sundays occasionally, but still watch highlights and possibly dvr'd games if I think they're worth my time. I'll still try to go to my 1 game a year and I'll probably still get a new Texans hat at some point, and that's it.

JB
08-26-2010, 10:11 PM
All of this talk of "demands" and "consequences" and all of this I want to know, what the hell are most of you guys going to do if we go 10-6\6-10 and miss the playoffs this year, and they retain Kubiak? Are you going to write to Bob McNair and tell him how you feel? Boycott the team? Not post on message boards for the Texans? Tear up your season tickets? I'm genuinely curious what sort of consequences you, the singular lone fan is going to do if the Texans don't perform up to some of you guys's lofty standards and expectations, and I'd love to read some actual threats.

I know what I'm going to do if the Texans go 0-16 this year. Maybe find other things to do on Sundays occasionally, but still watch highlights and possibly dvr'd games if I think they're worth my time. I'll still try to go to my 1 game a year and I'll probably still get a new Texans hat at some point, and that's it.

Yep! And most everyone else will continue to follow the same patterns they have followed over the years.

ATXtexanfan
08-26-2010, 10:18 PM
go texans

Carr Bombed
08-26-2010, 10:19 PM
Had the Steelers not cratered, the Jets would have been watching the Post season just like us. 9-7 is 9-7

They also had the 9th best rushing game, and the 7th best run defense.



We lost both our starting guards. Early in the season. Still we have the #1 passing offense. Our starting running back came down with the worst case of fumblitus (from week 1) I have ever seen, we lost him to injury after week 11. Lost our Pro Bowl Tight End (week 8). Still had the 4th best offense in the league.

GK took the 23rd rushing defense, and made it the 10th best. We went from 22nd in total defense to 13th.

But that's just more stats

Every team has injuries.... It's how you deal with them that makes the difference.

Also, Kubiak is to blame for never finding legit viable options at RB, that's on him. Even if you expect Slaton to be just as good as he was his rookie year. You can't tell me that Ryan Moats and Chris freaking Brown are viable #2s in today's league. That's on him and it should've been a lesson he learned after Ahh!!! Man! Green, but instead he had to see act two......luckily he landed a steal as a UDFA.

Carr Bombed
08-26-2010, 10:25 PM
All of this talk of "demands" and "consequences" and all of this I want to know, what the hell are most of you guys going to do if we go 10-6\6-10 and miss the playoffs this year, and they retain Kubiak? Are you going to write to Bob McNair and tell him how you feel? Boycott the team? Not post on message boards for the Texans? Tear up your season tickets? I'm genuinely curious what sort of consequences you, the singular lone fan is going to do if the Texans don't perform up to some of you guys's lofty standards and expectations, and I'd love to read some actual threats.

I know what I'm going to do if the Texans go 0-16 this year. Maybe find other things to do on Sundays occasionally, but still watch highlights and possibly dvr'd games if I think they're worth my time. I'll still try to go to my 1 game a year and I'll probably still get a new Texans hat at some point, and that's it.

Umm.......I don't understand this post at all...

So if we don't agree with EVERYTHING the team does, we're supposed to act like irrational morons and write the owner and rip up tickets?

I don't know.....how about we just post our opinions and open up a dialect with other fans on this board, I thought this was the purpose of this board? You know..debate and discuss. idonno:

Why is it every time someone has a unpopular opinion on this board, their "fanhood" is called into question. I survived the Capers/Carr years....if Kubiak fails this season, I'll survive him too and so on and so on. I'm in it for the long haul. I just hope it's not that long of a haul to postseason success :)

This team is moving at a glacier pace.......sorry some of us aren't as pleased with the rate of improvement as others are. No biggie, it's called a opinion for a reason, no reason to threaten the owner and start a picket line.

P.S.

When did expecting your team to make a playoff appearence with some of the best talent in the league become "lofty standards and expectations" (you lost me there)

Maybe you just have.....http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6xLsRI7-hBs :)

DexmanC
08-26-2010, 10:27 PM
Every team has injuries.... It's how you deal with them that makes the difference.

Also, Kubiak is to blame for never finding legit viable options at RB, that's on him. Even if you expect Slaton to be just as good as he was his rookie year. You can't tell me that Ryan Moats and Chris freaking Brown our viable #2s in today's league. That's on him and it should've been a lesson he learned after Ahh!!! Man! Green, but instead he had to see act two......luckily he landed a steal as a UDFA.

Don't forget, Kubiak was cool with the Safety Tandem going into last season
as well. Chris Brown f-ed up game after game, but he kept getting the rock.
I guess Kubiak felt bad for him, because he cried like a titty-baby for fumbling at the
goalline.

Kris Brown missed kick after kick, yet he got to keep kicking. Even this
year, Kubiak is putting on a Dog-'N-Pony Show when he's gonna keep
Kris Brown all along.

He doesn't hold people accountable during the season, and the players
don't feel any sense of urgency in the games they need to.


RIP EXCUSES (2006-2009)
The First Twelve Games (Where Playoff Teams Are Made):
2007: (5-7) | 2008: (5-7) | 2009: (5-7) | 2010: The Year of Change?

ATXtexanfan
08-26-2010, 10:28 PM
if kubiak wanted immediate improvement wouldn't he have cut kris brown already???

JB
08-26-2010, 10:30 PM
Umm.......I don't understand this post at all...

So if we don't agree with EVERYTHING the team does, we're supposed to act like irrational morons and write the owner and rip up tickets?

I don't know.....how about we just post our opinions and open up a dialect with other fans on this board, I thought this was the purpose of this board? You know..debate and discuss. idonno:

Why is it everytime someone has a unpopular opinion on this board, they're "fan hood" is called into question. I survived the Capers/Carr years....if Kubiak fails this season, I'll survive him too and so on and so on. I'm in it for the long haul. I just hope it's not that long of a haul to postseason success :)



Yeah, but you know us drankers of the kool-aid don't like ya'll pissin' in it! :D

DexmanC
08-26-2010, 10:33 PM
Yeah, but you know us drankers of the kool-aid don't like ya'll pissin' in it! :D

The Pro Kubiak camp have nothing but ad-hominems to bolster their
arguments. It's a clear sign this team, ESPECIALLY KUBIAK, need to step
it up.

J_R
08-26-2010, 10:35 PM
if kubiak wanted immediate improvement wouldn't he have cut kris brown already???

"You know John, Kris is just a good kid. He's really competing with that other kid Rackers for a job on this team. It's a shame we're gonna have to let one of these kids go but it's a business and they know that. One of these kids will probably be kicking against us this season."

Carr Bombed
08-26-2010, 10:37 PM
Yeah, but you know us drankers of the kool-aid don't like ya'll pissin' in it! :D

LMAO...


Sorry, I always end up drinking too much and pissing somewhere I shouldn't at a party. :)

Dwade
08-26-2010, 10:38 PM
"You know John, Kris is just a good kid. He's really competing with that other kid Rackers for a job on this team. It's a shame we're gonna have to let one of these kids go but it's a business and they know that. One of these kids will probably be kicking against us this season."

I've said it before, and I'll say it again.

I really hope we cut Kris Brown, a team we play picks him up, and he shanks a field goal to lose his new team the job against us.

That would make me very happy.

JB
08-26-2010, 10:39 PM
The Pro Kubiak camp have nothing but ad-hominems to bolster their
arguments. It's a clear sign this team, ESPECIALLY KUBIAK, need to step
it up.

Absolutely! Time of the talk of the past is done! This year is our year or this MB will implode like none ever before!

Carr Bombed
08-26-2010, 10:42 PM
Absolutely! Time of the talk of the past is done! This year is our year or this MB will implode like none ever before!

I think the main point here is we all want the same goal......we all hope and pray for that same goal. We all just don't agree on the path that's going to take us to that goal.

And that's fine. If everybody agreed on everything here, this would be a extremely boring website.

JB
08-26-2010, 10:43 PM
I think the main point here is we all want the same goal......we all hope and pray for that same goal. We just don't agree on the path that's going to take us to that goal.

And that's fine. If everybody agreed on everything here, this would be a extremely boring website.

:texflag: :fans:

GP
08-26-2010, 10:57 PM
All of this talk of "demands" and "consequences" and all of this I want to know, what the hell are most of you guys going to do if we go 10-6\6-10 and miss the playoffs this year, and they retain Kubiak? Are you going to write to Bob McNair and tell him how you feel? Boycott the team? Not post on message boards for the Texans? Tear up your season tickets? I'm genuinely curious what sort of consequences you, the singular lone fan is going to do if the Texans don't perform up to some of you guys's lofty standards and expectations, and I'd love to read some actual threats.

I know what I'm going to do if the Texans go 0-16 this year. Maybe find other things to do on Sundays occasionally, but still watch highlights and possibly dvr'd games if I think they're worth my time. I'll still try to go to my 1 game a year and I'll probably still get a new Texans hat at some point, and that's it.

This fan isn't going anywhere. I don't think others will, either.

But I am going to speak my mind on it. I think others will, too. It's cathartic. It's all we got, b0ng.

We rejoice in the good times and we pound our fist on the table in the bad times. This ought to be a good time, but it's frustrating because of old patterns that are seemingly rearing their ugly heads at us. The operative word being "seemingly."

That's all I got, in response to your post. We can't do nothin'.

thunderkyss
08-26-2010, 11:02 PM
Every team has injuries.... It's how you deal with them that makes the difference.


Exactly.

Carr Bombed
08-26-2010, 11:11 PM
That's all I got, in response to your post. We can't do nothin'.

Very sneaky with the double negative GP....


Seriously, what's your secret plan, I'm game. If Kubiak fails to get this team over the hump should we kidnap McNair's racing horse animal house style? What's the plan GP :)

The Pencil Neck
08-26-2010, 11:15 PM
Why do you like Kubiak?

Have you met him?

Did you go to A&M?

Because he seems like a nice guy

It surely isn't for the hard nosed for 4 qtrs winning brand of football that he"s brought to Houston.

I don't like Kubiak as a person. I don't feel for him one way or another.

I like the brand of football he's brought to Houston. I think it's got a chance to win championships.

J_R
08-26-2010, 11:23 PM
Off-topic sidenote: Just heard Jim Caldwell wants immediate improvement too after his team's performance tonight.

Carr Bombed
08-26-2010, 11:28 PM
I don't like Kubiak as a person. I don't feel for him one way or another.

I like the brand of football he's brought to Houston. I think it's got a chance to win championships.

Believe it or not........I like Kubiak as a person and I never even had to meet him. I love what he stands for as a person and love the work that he does with the "wounded warriors", it's why I root for him (and I do....If he succeeds next season, so do the Texans)

I like his offense, the only hangup I have with him is........

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ug75diEyiA0&feature=player_embedded :)

Too much flash and not enough substance.........and his offensive line schemes are outdated in today's game. (hell, even the Broncos franchise dumped it) You can't expect undersized offensive lineman to block 325 pound defensive lineman who now run faster and are more athletic. That's been his biggest downfall here truthfully....

Carr Bombed
08-26-2010, 11:30 PM
Off-topic sidenote: Just heard Jim Caldwell wants immediate improvement too after his team's performance tonight.

And all he has to do is wait a couple of weeks.... The Colts get the benefit of the doubt until proven otherwise.. They do this crap just about every season.

b0ng
08-26-2010, 11:35 PM
No CB, I'm saying that after reading this whole thread (Okay I'm lying, if I read a post and get deja vu, I usually skip it and go to the next) there's an underlying tone of "I'm mad as hell and I'm not going to take it anymore". Well, that's fine and all but I'm posing the question "How are you not going to take it anymore"? I spoke my piece months ago when Kubiak was extended that I thought he had not done enough to warrant it, but I left it at that (even got into a pissing match in that thread). I still don't think it was right, but ain't shit gonna change until next offseason at thr earliest. On the flip side I see a lot of "These are my expectations, this is what needs to happen, IT'S TIME" and we end up with posters who seem perpetually upset (and I'm talking about chest clinching, possible spittle flying towards a computer monitor upset here) at the day to day business of our team no matter how mundane it is. And with this sort of language on the board you get people who dance around the subject of ". . . or else". Of course nobody has said they would do any of the hyperbole I outlined in my previous post, but we get an aura of there being some sort of tangible consequences that we can inflict if one of millions of things don't happen this season.

Sure, I'll usually side with the team more often than not, but it's mostly because there's not huge glaring screw-ups staring me right in the face every other day in the offseason (although it is fun to hear what zany and kooky al davis or dan snyder is up to these days). It's hard to pin this regime down because for everything that you can point to that's really stupid, there seems to be a move of sheer brilliance. Games go the same way with this squad, although the mistakes are more pronounced and the results are way more instantaneous there. I mean for everytime Matt hits 'Dre for 60+, Chris Brown throws a half-back pass or fumbles the ball. I love that they've basically loaded the team with star talent on both sides of the ball, and yet I find myself distraught when they completely let a team they beat on for a half or 3 quarters back in the game for some hilarious collapse. I'll admit that I'll call Kubiak a retard when he reaches for that red hanky 99% of the time, or in other retarded situations he puts us in, but spending a lot of time just straight hating every move this franchise makes except for blatantly great draft picks that just get chalked up to luck. I mean if I disliked the actions of a group of people that much I'll usually just ignore them until heads get some decent gray matter inside that isn't just hops, barley and bong resin (wait. . .). I mean I take action, and message boards are so full of words that it makes me wonder if some of the posters here on any side of an issue are just posting whatever they know will get a response and dragging out the same tired few lines of text without adding a new, interesting thought or idea to the conversation. Basically it's just looking more and more like people are more or less backwards circle-jerking each other while maintaining a relatively low ratio of new arguments/thoughts/ideas:number of posts.

I mean really, how many times are we going going to use thinly veiled questions of intelligence, personal attacks and other tools of argument before just ignoring the other party all together because they are really dumb? That's for the franchise and other posters on the MB. I want to see some action for all these wrong doings of the fans. Some posters seem to feel so slighted and embittered by this franchise that if anybody speaks highly of the Texans they become the enemy by proxy. And I'm not saying you aren't a fan either, even that character than Randy Quaid played in Major League was a fan, I'm just saying that there seems to be about as much hostility about anybody in the front office or on the field as there has been in a really long time. Since we've done better than we ever have before in the previous season it almost seems like there's an even bigger division of fans along a lot of threads on the front page. Calm down a little, and before you type that 473rd iteration of "_____ is cheap" take a step back and realize that new and valuable should be a lot more welcome than tired and old when it comes to arguing.

This post is not meant as a callout to any one specific poster that would be a terrible and hideous troll. Don't be such an ego-maniac, it's not all about you.

eriadoc
08-26-2010, 11:38 PM
I know these types of threads tend to devolve into what we all think is wrong with things, but this was originally about how Kubiak himself called the team soft. Or ... they came out soft. Or uninspired. Or whatever the hell he said, it all basically means they didn't get much out of that preseason game, so it was a waste, for the most part.

Carr Bombed
08-27-2010, 12:01 AM
No CB, I'm saying that after reading this whole thread (Okay I'm lying, if I read a post and get deja vu, I usually skip it and go to the next) there's an underlying tone of "I'm mad as hell and I'm not going to take it anymore". Well, that's fine and all but I'm posing the question "How are you not going to take it anymore"? I spoke my piece months ago when Kubiak was extended that I thought he had not done enough to warrant it, but I left it at that (even got into a pissing match in that thread). I still don't think it was right, but ain't shit gonna change until next offseason at thr earliest. On the flip side I see a lot of "These are my expectations, this is what needs to happen, IT'S TIME" and we end up with posters who seem perpetually upset (and I'm talking about chest clinching, possible spittle flying towards a computer monitor upset here) at the day to day business of our team no matter how mundane it is. And with this sort of language on the board you get people who dance around the subject of ". . . or else". Of course nobody has said they would do any of the hyperbole I outlined in my previous post, but we get an aura of there being some sort of tangible consequences that we can inflict if one of millions of things don't happen this season.

Sure, I'll usually side with the team more often than not, but it's mostly because there's not huge glaring screw-ups staring me right in the face every other day in the offseason (although it is fun to hear what zany and kooky al davis or dan snyder is up to these days). It's hard to pin this regime down because for everything that you can point to that's really stupid, there seems to be a move of sheer brilliance. Games go the same way with this squad, although the mistakes are more pronounced and the results are way more instantaneous there. I mean for everytime Matt hits 'Dre for 60+, Chris Brown throws a half-back pass or fumbles the ball. I love that they've basically loaded the team with star talent on both sides of the ball, and yet I find myself distraught when they completely let a team they beat on for a half or 3 quarters back in the game for some hilarious collapse. I'll admit that I'll call Kubiak a retard when he reaches for that red hanky 99% of the time, or in other retarded situations he puts us in, but spending a lot of time just straight hating every move this franchise makes except for blatantly great draft picks that just get chalked up to luck. I mean if I disliked the actions of a group of people that much I'll usually just ignore them until heads get some decent gray matter inside that isn't just hops, barley and bong resin (wait. . .). I mean I take action, and message boards are so full of words that it makes me wonder if some of the posters here on any side of an issue are just posting whatever they know will get a response and dragging out the same tired few lines of text without adding a new, interesting thought or idea to the conversation. Basically it's just looking more and more like people are more or less backwards circle-jerking each other while maintaining a relatively low ratio of new arguments/thoughts/ideas:number of posts.

I mean really, how many times are we going going to use thinly veiled questions of intelligence, personal attacks and other tools of argument before just ignoring the other party all together because they are really dumb? That's for the franchise and other posters on the MB. I want to see some action for all these wrong doings of the fans. Some posters seem to feel so slighted and embittered by this franchise that if anybody speaks highly of the Texans they become the enemy by proxy. And I'm not saying you aren't a fan either, even that character than Randy Quaid played in Major League was a fan, I'm just saying that there seems to be about as much hostility about anybody in the front office or on the field as there has been in a really long time. Since we've done better than we ever have before in the previous season it almost seems like there's an even bigger division of fans along a lot of threads on the front page. Calm down a little, and before you type that 473rd iteration of "_____ is cheap" take a step back and realize that new and valuable should be a lot more welcome than tired and old when it comes to arguing.

This post is not meant as a callout to any one specific poster that would be a terrible and hideous troll. Don't be such an ego-maniac, it's not all about you.

Umm........again, you lost me.

When the hell did I ever say or act like this was about me. :rolleyes: Yeah, that's fair. (single out one poster who shares the view of many....nice)


Seriously, who the heck is the one being argumentative here?


Your previous post makes no sense, because you know damn well that long time posters like me and GP aren't going anywhere, so what the heck was the premise of your post and what did you expect to accomplish with it? You're talking about fans writing letters, ripping up tickets, and starting picket lines, because they don't agree with the progression of this team or gasp.... your opinion.


Basically what you're trying to say is if we're frustrated with the team we need to either become non fans, disappear, or shut the hell up and get in line.

That's what I got out of it anyway. Sorry if you can't handle the ridicule that comes when a talented team under performs. I was already a HUGE HOMER for this team......(ask the OGs on this board), guess what it got me.....a new ID and a new aspect on the NFL. Just because you hope your team (player) magically overcomes their (his) year in and year out shortcomings/flaws and you lash out at everybody who talks bad about said team (player)...that doesn't mean it's going to happen. I like to be viewed as a realist on this board. Not a "negative Nancy" (I'm sure you've read what I wrote about Arian Foster on the Jags board, isn't it funny how everybody forgets all the positive things I say about this team)...and not a homer. I call it like I see it, if that's too brash for you, do us both a favor and ban me, because I'm not going to change who I am.


By the way, I didn't even read all of that novel that you just wrote...just skimmed, so I probably missed alot. Sorry, but I have to work in the morning, didn't have time.

I'll gladly read through your entire post tomorrow.

b0ng
08-27-2010, 12:33 AM
Basically what you're trying to say is if we're frustrated with the team we need to either become non fans, disappear, or shut the hell up and get in line.

That's what I got out of it anyway. Sorry if you can't handle the ridicule that comes when a talented team under performs. I was already a HUGE HOMER for this team......(ask the OGs on this board), guess what it got me.....a new ID and a new aspect on the NFL. Just because you hope your team (player) magically overcomes their (his) year in and year out shortcomings and you lash out at everybody who talks bad about said team (player)...that doesn't mean it's going to happen. I like to be viewed as a realist on this board. Not a "negative Nancy" (I'm sure you've read what I wrote about Arian Foster on the Jags board, isn't it funny how everybody forgets all the positive things I say about this team)...and not a homer. I call it like I see it, it that's too brash for you, do us both a favor and ban me, because I'm not going to change who I am.


By the way, I didn't even read all of that novel that you just wrote...just skimmed, so I probably missed alot. Sorry, but I have to work in the morning, didn't have time.

I'll gladly read through your entire post tomorrow.

If you're some kind of argumentative posting monster who resides on both sides of every issue facing the Texans who is doing nothing more than saying outrageous things to entice more responses, then basically you're terrible. I don't think GP would want to be lumped in to that group either since it wouldn't really apply to him (or you I thought, but I didn't read through your whole post so maybe you are aptly calling yourself out, it'd surprise me).

In fact it's not meant to be calling out any one particular poster or groups of posters, only the behaviors that almost everybody is exhibiting at some points on this board recently that are repetitive and boring. The hyperbole around here is getting way ridiculous for games of no consequence currently being played (And this is, again, both sides of most arguments). People are just basically trolling each other over many different subjects and not many new ideas, points, or arguments are being brought up at all. Mostly, I'm reading the same verbal fist fights over and over again and it's tiresome. To me it seems pretty silly to take these stands over different arguments and everybody just typing the same lines over and over without bringing something new to the table.

I've said my piece, some of you guys are being silly about all of this stuff going on in the recent offseason/preseason and I think it's sort of degrading all of the discussions currently going on. It doesn't take much brainpower to copy and paste the same arguments that you've been using since January, just to get a response from someone you know will cater to that desire to argue.