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Cjeremy635
08-14-2010, 02:31 PM
Yeah, because the Green signing didn't work out Smithiak should never sign a vet FA again.

Schobel was a very productive DE last year and didn't get injured. What is it that makes you think Schobel is done? 10 sacks seems to indicate Schobel has alot left.

10 sacks, that would be more sacks in a season than anybody not named MW.

Oh well you're right the Texans couldn't use a guy like Schobel. LOL

I think you're missing his point. He's worth signing, I think everyone agrees to that. It's the "what is he worth" that everyone differs on. To me, he's not an $8 million dollar a year guy. I wouldn't pay him over $4 million. Possibly add in some incentives or something, but no more than $4 million as a base pay.

NitroGSXR
08-14-2010, 02:32 PM
See, I find the above two statement contradictory. Yeah, the Texans should get him as reasonably as they can, but if there's a shot he can bolster your pass rush in a meaningful way, and there's no future cap ramifications, I'm willing to take a chance on looking stupid - it wouldn't be the first time, nor the last (for either the Texans, or me personally).

And for the record, I could argue that Ahman Green still had plenty in the tank, he just couldn't stay healthy. Schoble's had a much better injury history than Green did.

And Schobel won't affect our cap as much as AHHH-man Green.

FWIW, I was onboard with the Ahman Green attempt. His career ended with us miserably but that man tried. He was a footballer who was thin ice. He broke down here but I do NOT regret the signing one iota.

NitroGSXR
08-14-2010, 02:34 PM
I think you're missing his point. He's worth signing, I think everyone agrees to that. It's the "what is he worth" that everyone differs on. To me, he's not an $8 million dollar a year guy. I wouldn't pay him over $4 million. Possibly add in some incentives or something, but no more than $4 million as a base pay.

But what does it matter to you? It's out of your control. McNair has saved himself quite a bit of money this season (Dunta) BECAUSE of the uncapped year.

Cjeremy635
08-14-2010, 02:38 PM
But what does it matter to you? It's out of your control. McNair has saved himself quite a bit of money this season (Dunta) BECAUSE of the uncapped year.

What does it matter to me personally, nothing.

It's the precedence that it sets though, that's the biggest issue to me.

The Pencil Neck
08-14-2010, 03:12 PM
And Schobel won't affect our cap as much as AHHH-man Green.

FWIW, I was onboard with the Ahman Green attempt. His career ended with us miserably but that man tried. He was a footballer who was thin ice. He broke down here but I do NOT regret the signing one iota.

^^^ This.

Ahman gave us a few glimpses of what could have been but wasn't. But he was the highest rated FA running back on the market and we brought him here. Didn't work out but c'est la vie.

In this instance, I would like Schobel here. I think he'd improve us and I think he's got a couple of years left in the tank, at least. Especially used as a rotation/situational player. He's undersized for an every down player for me and I don't see any reason to use him up that way.

BUT... I don't want to pay him an amount that's going to cause problems further down the line. I don't care about McNair's money. We can use it all up as far as I'm concerned and a few million dollars is pocket change for a multi-billionaire. But that's not the problem. The problem comes in the future when we're trying to sign other guys. There's no reason to be dumb and just offer everyone twice what they're worth. We need to figure out about what he'd probably be offered from the other teams interested in his services, and we need to offer him something comparable.

IF he was going to be that one last missing piece that would suddenly transform this team into a dynasty, I wouldn't be so conservative. I just don't think he's that guy.

I want him on the team but I don't want to pay stupid money for him.

ChampionTexan
08-14-2010, 03:18 PM
What does it matter to me personally, nothing.

It's the precedence that it sets though, that's the biggest issue to me.

Well, first much like the AJ contract, in virtually every instance that it possibly could come up, you can tell the player - unless your circumstances are virtually identical, go pound sand.

Besides, what sort of precedence could giving a one year contract realistically set.

Dunta sat out all of the off-season, training camp, and pre-season because one year contracts (even if they're almost 8 figure amounts) are usually despised by NFL players.

The Pencil Neck
08-14-2010, 03:23 PM
Well, first much like the AJ contract, in virtually every instance that it possibly could come up, you can tell the player - unless your circumstances are virtually identical, go pound sand.

Besides, what sort of precedence could giving a one year contract realistically set.

You can tell the players whatever you like... they'll just go somewhere else instead. Players' egos can be very weird and if you don't offer them what they think they're worth, then they'll do all sorts of stupid stuff. And if you give a guy like Schobel a huge 1 year deal, then other guys are going to be thinking that's the going price. They'll start measuring themselves against him and that's going to change the demands they make when they come to you for a contract.

And personally, I doubt he's going to be looking for a 1 year deal no matter what he's been saying.

If they can get a heavily incentivized deal like they did for Andre, then the sky's the limit, though. But Schobel has to agree to that and he might not.

steelbtexan
08-14-2010, 03:34 PM
Well, first much like the AJ contract, in virtually every instance that it possibly could come up, you can tell the player - unless your circumstances are virtually identical, go pound sand.

Besides, what sort of precedence could giving a one year contract realistically set.

Dunta sat out all of the off-season, training camp, and pre-season because one year contracts (even if they're almost 8 figure amounts) are usually despised by NFL players.

This

dream_team
08-14-2010, 04:05 PM
Some of you thankfully understands the business side of football and know overpaying Schoebel isn't a good idea.

Then there's some of you that want to manage this team like it's fantasy football.

michaelm
08-14-2010, 04:11 PM
I know you're just exaggerating, but 100 mil wouldn't benefit anyone but Aaron Schoebel. Mario would instantly hold out, as well as others I'm sure. Then McNair would have to raise ticket prices to help pay that contract. So yes, I would care.

Now I hope I wasn't misunderstood, but I do hope Schoebel signs. I just hope it doesn't come at the expense of team chemistry.

I understand your thinking, but I don't think a large one year contract for Schobel would have that type of effect on team chemistry, nor do I think it would cause any other player to suddenly be unhappy with their own contract.
Maybe in a different (capped) year, or with a different team, but I don't see it having that type of implication this year, with this team.
This is an unusual situation and opportunity for this football team. Yes, I say over pay him (a little) if necessary because we may never again have the opportunity to bring in what might be a missing piece of a playoff puzzle without a negative effect cap-wise.

I honestly believe this team is a small piece or two away from being a serious contender. Opportunity is knocking... answer the damn door Bob.

steelbtexan
08-14-2010, 04:12 PM
Some of you thankfully understands the business side of football and know overpaying Schoebel isn't a good idea.

Then there's some of you that want to manage this team like it's fantasy football.

You do understand having the 10th most profitable franchise in the NFL could give the Texans an advantage in FA?

Uncle BoB just chooses to not take advantage of this situation.

In an uncapped yr a 1 yr deal has absolutely no cap ramifications (as has been stated) and shouldn't effect the ability to re-sign future Texans home grown FA's

michaelm
08-14-2010, 04:23 PM
Some of you thankfully understands the business side of football and know overpaying Schoebel isn't a good idea.

Then there's some of you that want to manage this team like it's fantasy football.

Nobody wants to over pay for him, we just have different ideas of his worth. I do appreciate your blanket statement, however. Did i interpret it correctly? Anyone who doesn't agree with you must be a fantasy football playing moron?
Look, even if we have to pay a small premium to get him (what you'd probably call over paying), I think it's worth the risk.
I actually think that the current players are intelligent enough to understand that this situation is unique. We can't renegotiate every contract based on what Aaron Schobel receives, but do the players want to see management improve the team if possible? Damn right they do.
I personally think that the majority of the players on the team would say to get the man to Houston, and damn the expense. Make the team better, winning cures all of your chicken-little-skies-a-falling hand wringing because of a single player's one-year contract.

dalemurphy
08-14-2010, 05:38 PM
You do understand having the 10th most profitable franchise in the NFL could give the Texans an advantage in FA?

Uncle BoB just chooses to not take advantage of this situation.

In an uncapped yr a 1 yr deal has absolutely no cap ramifications (as has been stated) and shouldn't effect the ability to re-sign future Texans home grown FA's

It has an effect on that very thing when Mario's agent compares the Schobel deal to his old deal in negotiations for his new deal.

dream_team
08-14-2010, 05:52 PM
Nobody wants to over pay for him, we just have different ideas of his worth. I do appreciate your blanket statement, however. Did i interpret it correctly? Anyone who doesn't agree with you must be a fantasy football playing moron?
Look, even if we have to pay a small premium to get him (what you'd probably call over paying), I think it's worth the risk.
I actually think that the current players are intelligent enough to understand that this situation is unique. We can't renegotiate every contract based on what Aaron Schobel receives, but do the players want to see management improve the team if possible? Damn right they do.
I personally think that the majority of the players on the team would say to get the man to Houston, and damn the expense. Make the team better, winning cures all of your chicken-little-skies-a-falling hand wringing because of a single player's one-year contract.

You did misinterpret me a bit. I didn't call anyone a moron or imply that. I'm just stating that the NFL is different to manage as a fantasy football team. In fantasy, it's simple, get and play the best players you can get. In the NFL, you have to understand the ramifications of bringing someone in, and how he may change the dynamics of a team. For example, what if someone like Anquan Boldin wanted to join the team, and he's asking for more money than AJ? Do we do it? Is he better than Walters? Yes! So he would improve the team. But now, how would AJ feel that the #2 receiver is making more than him? We just signed Walters to a long term deal. How will he take his demotion? And what about Jacoby? Here's a young player with potential that's finally going to have a chance to prove his worth, but now he becomes the fourth receiver? So in other words, you have to understand all the risks.

In an ideal world, all of the players will put their egos aside and do anything that will help the team, even if it involves them losing playing time. Unfortunately, I don't think we live in that world.

Now if you read my previous posts, I do hope we bring him in, I just hope its not at the cost of team chemistry. In my ideal situation, Mario, Amobi, Antonio, Shaun, and Connor will all come out and say "do whatever it takes to bring him in!". Then, I'd be all for paying him whatever it takes.

ChampionTexan
08-14-2010, 06:20 PM
It has an effect on that very thing when Mario's agent compares the Schobel deal to his old deal in negotiations for his new deal.

Mario will be looking at the most recent long term contracts given the top defensive ends in the NFL. Julius Peppers signed a 6 year $84 Million contract with $42 Million guaranteed.

I'm thinking nothing we do with Schobel's gonna raise Mario's expectations beyond what they're already going to be.

JB
08-14-2010, 06:28 PM
Mario will be looking at the most recent long term contracts given the top defensive ends in the NFL. Julius Peppers signed a 6 year $84 Million contract with $42 Million guaranteed.

I'm thinking nothing we do with Schobel's gonna raise Mario's expectations beyond what they're already going to be.

Well said! Mario is going to get his money, regardless of a Schobel signing.

NitroGSXR
08-14-2010, 06:56 PM
Some of you thankfully understands the business side of football and know overpaying Schoebel isn't a good idea.

Then there's some of you that want to manage this team like it's fantasy football.

Only one talking about fantasy football is you. If you interpreted my 100 million dollar into me being some cheeto eating internet armchair GM then I don't know what to say.

This IS an uncapped year and McNair has pinched pennies all around despite raising prices. If you're worried about precedent then you must be mortified by the whole contracts thing that Andre Johnson has going on here in Houston? He keeps demanding new ones.

ObsiWan
08-14-2010, 07:03 PM
Has anyone heard what Schobel is asking for? I can't find anything on the money part of this potential signing.

Kubiak basically said (http://www.houstontexans.com/news/Story.asp?story_id=6272) the ball is in Schobel's court....

(on if working out the three defensive ends this morning steps up any urgency with DE Aaron Schoebel) "No, I think nothing has changed with (DE) Aaron (Schoebel). I think we're still in the information process. I've talked to him the other day and had a great visit with him. I think it's just the matter of what Aaron wants to do. So we'll stay a part of that process. As far as when, how, or whatever, I don't know."

"what Aaron wants to do"... wonder what that means?

I also wonder if bringing in Raheem Brock and two other DEs this past week means Smithiak is getting ready in case Schobel signs with the Patriots (http://www.patspulpit.com/2010/8/8/1612124/rumor-patriots-have-strong).

wonder if Schobel is using the Texans to get a better deal out of the Pats.

oh yeah, I'm a conspiracy theorist; haven't you noticed? :D

thunderkyss
08-14-2010, 07:49 PM
I'd like to at least try. We need more production from our defensive line. I mean 10 sacks is plenty more than what we have been getting out of everybody else not named Mario COMBINED! Our defensive line was pathetic. There is NO reason not to think that Schoebel could match Barwin's production last year now. Even if he doesn't match it... his presence and leadership is one that I can gel with.

In 2009, we had 30 sacks as a team. We were 25th in the league, meaning 24 teams had more sacks than we did.

If we would have had just 2 more sacks, we would have had as many as the Jets, and Baltimore.

4 more, we would have had as many as Indy and Cincinnati

I'm not saying our pass rush is fine, I'm very much in the get Schobel camp. But to put it into perspective the #1 defense in the league only had 2 more sacks than we did.

J_R
08-14-2010, 07:53 PM
Has anyone heard what Schobel is asking for? I can't find anything on the money part of this potential signing.

Kubiak basically said (http://www.houstontexans.com/news/Story.asp?story_id=6272) the ball is in Schobel's court....



"what Aaron wants to do"... wonder what that means?

I also wonder if bringing in Raheem Brock and two other DEs this past week means Smithiak is getting ready in case Schobel signs with the Patriots (http://www.patspulpit.com/2010/8/8/1612124/rumor-patriots-have-strong).

wonder if Schobel is using the Texans to get a better deal out of the Pats.

oh yeah, I'm a conspiracy theorist; haven't you noticed? :D

They're short of bodies at DE, with Kubiak basically saying they can get by this game(AZ) with who they have but they may sign a DE(not named Schobel) as a body for camp.

thunderkyss
08-14-2010, 08:04 PM
Even a one year contract in an uncapped year? C'mon now...

The more I think about it... I don't know. I don't know him the way Kollar hopefully does. But we know he is coming home to retire. What are the chances he is even interested in playing a second year?

What if he's just looking for an extra million, then goes into, "don't screw up my knees before I retire clean" mode?

playa465
08-14-2010, 08:27 PM
The more I think about it... I don't know. I don't know him the way Kollar hopefully does. But we know he is coming home to retire. What are the chances he is even interested in playing a second year?

What if he's just looking for an extra million, then goes into, "don't screw up my knees before I retire clean" mode?

Thats my concern...he basically forced the Bills to release him, just so he can get everything he wants? I think he "may help" but a guy looking to come home, to retire after getting paid sounds like a guy not motivated by football.

ThaShark316
08-16-2010, 11:31 AM
McClain_on_NFL

Former Buffalo DE Aaron Schobel told me this morning he's officially retired and won't be playing for the Texans.


McClain_on_NFL

Schobel turns 33 in two weeks. Says he's tired of dieting to weigh in the 240s when he's playing and wants to eat and weigh 270.

McClain_on_NFL

Schobel told me two weeks ago he wanted to play for the Texans because Houston is one hour from his home and he can see his family.

Tailgate
08-16-2010, 11:32 AM
Defensive end Aaron Schobel made it official today: Heís retiring rather than considering returning to play for the Texans.

Schobel walked away from an $8 million base salary with Buffalo this year but said he would like to play for the Texans. Now heís elected to stay retired.

ďObviously, it would have been a great place to play, but at point of my career, Iím not going to sit here and tell you how I would have performed,Ē he said today. ďIím not saying I could or couldnít have played at my best, but Iím just not 100 percent sure.

ďI want to be done with it. Iím going to leave it as is. I wasnít sure if I wanted to play, anyway. Iím going to be 33 in two weeks, and Iím leaving the game on my terms and nobody elseís. Iím just going to leave it alone and retire.Ē

http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/sports/fb/texansfront/7155352.html

NitroGSXR
08-16-2010, 11:35 AM
Mad respect for Schobel's honesty.

keyser
08-16-2010, 11:41 AM
Iím going to be 33 in two weeks, and Iím leaving the game on my terms and nobody elseís. Iím just going to leave it alone and retire.

I've got to say - there was something funny to me in reading this and getting the sense of him saying how he's so old, and it's just best that he retire.... and he's not even 33! It sounds like something you'd hear someone more than twice his age say.

[Yes, I know that 33 is indeed old for a FB player, and his body has taken more abuse in the past 12 years than mine will in my whole life, and he's perfectly reasonable to retire at this time, etc. It just hit me as funny, the way it came across.]

Tailgate
08-16-2010, 11:53 AM
This was just one of those deals where the longer it took, the less likely it became he would sign.

Oh well, its Barwin time. Schobel goes back to being a nobody for me.

hobie
08-16-2010, 12:27 PM
End of story right here !! No further discussion needed... he retired and he never was a Texan....

The Pencil Neck
08-16-2010, 12:32 PM
Until he actually files his papers, this could just be a negotiating ploy.

rmartin65
08-16-2010, 12:35 PM
Until he actually files his papers, this could just be a negotiating ploy.

Totally agree, but isnt it sad that we have to say this?

Ole Miss Texan
08-16-2010, 12:39 PM
Bummer, I was hoping we could get him (and that'd he'd play at a high level for the year).

Can't blame him if he goes through with retirement. Able to end a nice career on a high note (in terms of production), retire a wealthy man and spend lots of time with the family. All with out being riddled with injuries the rest of his life.

OzzO
08-16-2010, 12:44 PM
See Brett - THAT'S how you do it.

ChampionTexan
08-16-2010, 12:59 PM
See Brett - THAT'S how you do it.

Actually, Brett has done exactly what Aaron Schobel did - several times in fact. The part that throws him is not thinking about it and changing his mind (10 or 12 times) immediately after.

As to whether Mr. Schobel has that part down better than Brett - well, time will tell.

Texecutioner
08-16-2010, 01:07 PM
Until he actually files his papers, this could just be a negotiating ploy.

I don't know how good of a negotiating ploy that is when you're saying that you don't even have that much of a passion to play anymore and that you you don't want to have to keep up your diet. Hell, he said he doesn't even know how much he could help a team. If I'm a GM I don't know if that's who I want to bring in any way. It sounds like Schobel is sick of the sacrifices he has to make to be a high level football player and is ready to eat whatever the hell he wants and drink a lot of beer and do some fishing. He's made enough money playing football and he's ready to cash in his chips.

This sucks, but oh well.

BIG TORO
08-16-2010, 01:27 PM
Damn, 27 pages of thread wasted!

TEXANS84
08-16-2010, 01:37 PM
Damn, 27 pages of thread wasted!

Unfortunately never had a chance to reach the Orlando Pace to Houston thread record, and didn't even sniff the 101 pages of Eric Moulds to Houston thread.....such a shame.

281
08-16-2010, 01:40 PM
I believe the "Eric Moulds to Houston or whatever it was called" thread was the biggest one we've had.

edit - you're a fast editor, 84.

ubecool454
08-16-2010, 01:42 PM
Well that is kind of good news...now we can stop wondering. Good news for people like Conner Barwin who tries to bring it every play.

Dutchrudder
08-16-2010, 01:48 PM
I believe the "Eric Moulds to Houston or whatever it was called" thread was the biggest one we've had.

edit - you're a fast editor, 84.

The Last Post thread is pretty long...

Rey
08-16-2010, 01:48 PM
I'm not really upset he's retiring...I think we'll be fine..

But I think that part of the reason this wasn't a done deal is because the Texans wanted to play him a little bit less than he would have liked

Houston_Fanatic
08-16-2010, 02:59 PM
I guess he won't be joining us then. I was hoping we could land him.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=5467981&campaign=rss&source=NFLHeadlines

eriadoc
08-16-2010, 03:03 PM
Good for him. I hope he ends up finding a new path in life that suits him. I was hoping the Texans could land the guy, but if his heart's not in it, then it's better that he retires.

MojoMan
08-16-2010, 03:33 PM
Now Smithiaks initial posture of methodically going through the complete usual process and not getting all carried away about this is looking a lot more sensible. Just saying.

ArlingtonTexan
08-16-2010, 03:41 PM
Until he actually files his papers, this could just be a negotiating ploy.

It is possible that there was a dollar amount that could have made keeping his weight worth it. Probably closer to the 8 million he left in Buffalo than the veteran minimium.

badboy
08-16-2010, 03:58 PM
Ok. Bye Bye. Next?

Ryan
08-16-2010, 06:21 PM
I have plenty of faith in our defense this year with or without him. We might've played a depleted Cardinals team, but i was still enthused.

J_R
08-16-2010, 08:19 PM
Lance Z:


Just got off phone with A. Schobel. While he couldn't get the money right between he and the Texans, the negotiations weren't contentious. Schobel said he was ready to shut it down but would have played for the Texans if the money was right, but he's just fine with retirement. Schobel said he absolutely will not come out of retirement. After speaking with him, I have no longer have issues with how Texans handled it. Schobel also realizes that there would have been tremendous pressure on him from the locals to post the same sack numbers but w/ fewer snaps

imatexan
08-16-2010, 09:27 PM
I guess he won't be joining us then. I was hoping we could land him.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=5467981&campaign=rss&source=NFLHeadlines

What a short career!

Lameeeeee is the best word to describe this whole situation but at least he didn't go to someone else in the AFC.

thunderkyss
08-18-2010, 11:16 AM
Maybe we should send Mario, Demeco, Cushing & Pollard to his house in Bob's private Jet to help change his mind.

J_R
09-04-2010, 11:09 PM
The first time I heard this today I dismissed it. But I just heard the following from one other person who would know.

Former TCU defensive end and the recently "retired" Aaron Schobel of the Buffalo Bills has not ruled out playing this season for the Houston Texans.

A native of Columbus, Texas, Schobel has played for the Bills since he entered the NFL in 2001. But TCU people who know Schobel well said the toll of the game plus the struggles of the Bills forced him to retire. It was widely assumed that if he decided to return it would be for a team close to his home in Columbus; Houston made the most sense.

These same people said the Texans have been rather persistent in their pursuit, and he has told them he would let them know on Monday if he will play again.



Read more: http://sportsblogs.star-telegram.com/colleges/2010/09/nfl-news-aaron-schobel-thinking-of-returning.html#ixzz0ycnO88OC

Revolution
09-04-2010, 11:15 PM
Maybe we should send Mario, Demeco, Cushing & Pollard to his house in Bob's private Jet to help change his mind.

Rep your way!

eriadoc
09-05-2010, 12:55 AM
These same people said the Texans have been rather persistent in their pursuit, and he has told them he would let them know on Monday if he will play again.

Well ... you know, camp is over, the team looks pretty decent, I like my buddy Kollar, it's close to home .... can I skip traveling to road games that I'm not starting in? :D

OzzO
09-05-2010, 04:16 PM
/\ As long as you ain't taking shots in the nether region while your not travelling with the team, Mr Schobel, you can do as you please.