PDA

View Full Version : Think the Texans will trade up?


TheRealJoker
03-15-2005, 07:42 PM
I hope so, I would love to see DJ in TEXA$ still!!!

TexansTrueFan
03-15-2005, 07:44 PM
i think the fact that we may be getting pace and giving up 2 draft picks, prolly makes it to where we prolly wont land DJ !!

TheRealJoker
03-15-2005, 07:46 PM
Well the hot rumor now is we wont be getting Pace. So if we dont get Pace, trade up or no?

TexansTrueFan
03-15-2005, 07:54 PM
still wouldnt, from the looks of things we have or LBs, we really need some DL and OL. And DJ cant fill those voids for us !

cadahnic
03-15-2005, 07:55 PM
Look on CBS Sportsline. They have an article stating the Rams have no interest in trading Pace and they have already stated this to the Texans. We really need to trade up using our fourth round pick, decent grade player, and our pick to acquire DJ.

LBblitz
03-15-2005, 08:08 PM
our best bet would be to go for DJ and trade sharper to upgrade Oline. IMO wand will get better but we need to find a better center...if carr has time in the pocket to make reads, the #2 and #3 receivers will flourish.

a solid center = a solid O line

TheRealJoker
03-15-2005, 08:24 PM
still wouldnt, from the looks of things we have or LBs, we really need some DL and OL. And DJ cant fill those voids for us !


True, but I believe we need a playmaker on our defense that can create a pass rush. DJ is the BPA to me as far as what we need the most in this draft. DL and OL are probably bigger needs, but in this particular draft, we are not gonna find anyone that can immediately help us at OL or DL better than DJ can at LB. A playmaker is what I think we need the most. Solve our OL/DL woes with the Sharper trade/Free Agency. Trade up for DJ and use the remaining picks to provide future starters at OL and DL as well as depth in the secondary and at WR. Maybe throw in a kick returner (I really like Antonio Perkins)

Xman
03-16-2005, 07:06 PM
Based on the NFL Draft Pick Value Chart (pasted in below), if we trade up without adding in players (which would be preferable but would be harder to make a deal), then these are a few options I see:

I would try to deal our #13 and a 3rd for #9 -
that way we get one of DJ/Merriman/Edwards/Williams.
[this works under the NFL Draft Pick Value Chart as fair value; 1150 and 200 (or 225 if needed) for 1350]

If I couldn't get one of the top 11, I would trade down: #13 to Philly for #31 and #35 - [again this works under the NFL Draft Pick Value Chart as fair value]

If we could trade down 6-10 spots - then I would go for TE Miller. [maybe down to 19 in a deal with the Rams either giving us 19 and a 3rd and a 4th for #13 or their 1st and 2nd for our first and 3rd - both of these deals are fair value on the NFL Draft Pick Value Chart ]

Other options:
Tenn needs a lot - so maybe they deal: so if 6 is worth 1600 and #13 is worth 1150, we add either a) our 2nd rounder, b) both 3rd rounders (both deals are fair value on the chart).

Hard to tell if the other teams will make fair value trades or try to hold someone up.




For those who want to talk about the value of draft picks:

Draft Pick Value Chart
Round 1 Round 2 Round 3 Round 4 Round 5 Round 6 Round 7 Other
1 3000 33 580 65 265 97 112 129 43 161 28 193 15.2 225 2.9
2 2600 34 560 66 260 98 108 130 42 162 27.6 194 14.8 226 2.8
3 2200 35 550 67 255 99 104 131 41 163 27.2 195 14.4 227 2.7
4 1800 36 540 68 250 100 100 132 40 164 26.8 196 14 228 2.6
5 1700 37 530 69 245 101 96 133 39.5 165 26.4 197 13.6 229 2.5
6 1600 38 520 70 240 102 92 134 39 166 26 198 13.2 230 2.4
7 1500 39 510 71 235 103 88 135 38.5 167 25.6 199 12.8 231 2.3
8 1400 40 500 72 230 104 86 136 38 168 25.2 200 12.4 232 2.2
9 1350 41 490 73 225 105 84 137 37.5 169 24.8 201 12 233 2.1
10 1300 42 480 74 220 106 82 138 37 170 24.4 202 11.6 234 2
11 1250 43 470 75 215 107 80 139 36.5 171 24 203 11.2 235 1.9
12 1200 44 460 76 210 108 78 140 36 172 23.6 204 10.8 236 1.8
13 1150 45 450 77 205 109 76 141 35.5 173 23.2 205 10.4 237 1.7
14 1100 46 440 78 200 110 74 142 35 174 22.8 206 10 238 1.6
15 1050 47 430 79 195 111 72 143 34.5 175 22.4 207 9.6 239 1.5
16 1000 48 420 80 190 112 70 144 34 176 22 208 9.2 240 1.4
17 950 49 410 81 185 113 68 145 33.5 177 21.6 209 8.8 241 1.3
18 900 50 400 82 180 114 66 146 33 178 21.2 210 8.4 242 1.2
19 875 51 390 83 175 115 64 147 32.6 179 20.8 211 8 243 1.1
20 850 52 380 84 170 116 62 148 32.2 180 20.4 212 7.6 244 1
21 800 53 370 85 165 117 60 149 31.8 181 20 213 7.2 245 0.95
22 780 54 360 86 160 118 58 150 31.4 182 19.6 214 6.8 246 0.9
23 760 55 350 87 155 119 56 151 31 183 19.2 215 6.4 247 0.85
24 740 56 340 88 150 120 54 152 31.8 184 18.8 216 6 248 0.8
25 720 57 330 89 145 121 52 153 31.2 185 18.4 217 5.6 249 0.75
26 700 58 320 90 140 122 50 154 30.8 186 18 218 5.2 250 0.7
27 680 59 310 91 136 123 49 155 30.4 187 17.6 219 4.8 251 0.65
28 660 60 300 92 132 124 48 156 30 188 17.2 220 4.4 252 0.6
29 640 61 292 93 128 125 47 157 29.6 189 16.8 221 4 253 0.55
30 620 62 284 94 124 126 46 158 29.2 190 16.4 222 3.6 254 0.5
31 600 63 276 95 120 127 45 159 28.8 191 16 223 3.3 255 0.45
32 590 64 270 96 116 128 44 160 28.4 192 15.6 224 3 256 0.4

Texans Picks
Pick# Point Value
13 1150
47 430
73 225
78 200
108 78
142 35
173 23.2
204 10.8

tiger06
03-16-2005, 07:31 PM
I could see us trading up in the late 1st round like last year and get a guy like David Baas who could play center or guard.

royce1054
03-16-2005, 07:43 PM
If we trade up it would be a 2nd and a 1 3rd for a 1st. I cant see us trading higher than 13

DRIFTAWAY
03-16-2005, 07:51 PM
i say we trade jamie sharper,our first pick, and perhaps a 4th rounder to either San Fran. (1rst overall),Miami (2nd overall), or Cleveland (3rd overall). Than we can trade our 2nd and 3rd for a late first rounder and get David Baas. SO we lose some picks, but finish the first day with DJ,Baas, and who ever we picked up with our extra 3rd round pick. Sounds good to me.

royce1054
03-16-2005, 07:54 PM
i say we trade jamie sharper,our first pick, and perhaps a 4th rounder to either San Fran. (1rst overall),Miami (2nd overall), or Cleveland (3rd overall). Than we can trade our 2nd and 3rd for a late first rounder and get David Baas. SO we lose some picks, but finish the first day with DJ,Baas, and who ever we picked up with our extra 3rd round pick. Sounds good to me.

only problem is we dont need a LB

DRIFTAWAY
03-16-2005, 08:02 PM
Well we want to trade Jamie and his contract, so we get a young promising lb to take his place at a lower cost as well. and remember foreman was released, so if that was to happen we would have a starting core of Wong,Greenwood,DJ,Babin(not listed any order, thats up to capers.)

royce1054
03-16-2005, 08:16 PM
Well we want to trade Jamie and his contract, so we get a young promising lb to take his place at a lower cost as well. and remember foreman was released, so if that was to happen we would have a starting core of Wong,Greenwood,DJ,Babin(not listed any order, thats up to capers.)

What about wong, greenwood inside
Babin, Peek outside

DRIFTAWAY
03-16-2005, 08:24 PM
The texans would rather have Derrick Johnson on the team and starting, and use Peek as the energetic hard hitting confidance bringing player he is off the bench. This would give us depth and keep our linebacking core strong throughout the ga,e

D-ReK
03-16-2005, 09:05 PM
Let's face the harsh reality here...There is a .0001 chance that DJ will be holding up a Texans jersey on April 23rd...

All this talk is way too similar to the thousands of "Get Sean Taylor" threads from last year...

royce1054
03-16-2005, 09:17 PM
Let's face the harsh reality here...There is a .0001 chance that DJ will be holding up a Texans jersey on April 23rd...

All this talk is way too similar to the thousands of "Get Sean Taylor" threads from last year...

I agree my sources tell me the Titans might trade up and take D. Johnson. So i dont think he will be on the board.

infantrycak
03-16-2005, 09:38 PM
I agree my sources tell me the Titans might trade up and take D. Johnson. So i dont think he will be on the board.

Ahh, another set of unidentified sources appears. The Titans have serious cap issues and lots of holes--don't see them trading up.

Carr Bombed
03-16-2005, 09:55 PM
Plus the titans don't have to trade up to get him, he'll be there at thier spot. Second there isn't alot of teams wanting to trade up in this draft since their isn't alot of blue chip players in the 1st round, just a number of solid ones. With this years draft its just to risky. If anything they need to trade down in the 1st round and keep on collecting picks.

cadahnic
03-16-2005, 10:02 PM
If you look at the Value Chart we have an opportunity to jump up to number eight or nine. I think if DJ makes it past 7 then it is worth us trading up even at seven it might be worth it. Look at the calculations which would work for us.

1. Trade to 7- would cost us way more than what we should it would cost us two many draft picks
2. Trade to 8- would cost us our first, third, fourth, and sharper(sharper would bring in a value of a high/mid third)
3. Trade to 9- We could keep sharper and trade a first and bottom third

How nice is BAbin, Greenwood, DJ, Peek/Wong or Babin, Greenwood, Wong, DJ

Damn thats nice

D-ReK
03-16-2005, 10:30 PM
DJ won't get past the Vikings at 7, I guarantee it...

royce1054
03-16-2005, 11:59 PM
i dont think hell get past titans 6

Dionysus22
03-17-2005, 03:25 AM
On Sportsline.com they have an updated mock draft (as of March 14)from three different guys. One hasn't posted his yet but the other two have us picking Alex Barron at #13. As far as Dj is concerned, one has him going to MIN at #7 and another saying he's dropping to #14 to CAR. IMO MIN has plenty of LBs, I think they go after Mike Williams to replace Moss. And there is no way CAR gets their greedy little hands on him at #14 before we do. And since dallas is moving to a 3-4 they're both saying they will pick Shawne Marriman at #11.

http://www.sportsline.com/nfl/draft/mock

outofhnd
03-17-2005, 04:02 AM
Personally Both those Mocks look like BS to me. :confused:

I dont think Barron will be on the board at 13 which is why ive been chanting for a quality DT this year. but if Barron is there I say take him cant have too many Offensive linemen and maybe if Wand is good enough hell feel the heat from this kid.

I found a possible steal pick for a back up NT to Payne on NFL.com an excellent run stopper who is a big boy.

http://www.nfl.com/draft/profiles/2005/means_albert

Texan in Japan
03-17-2005, 05:58 AM
Personally Both those Mocks look like BS to me. :confused:

I dont think Barron will be on the board at 13 which is why ive been chanting for a quality DT this year. but if Barron is there I say take him cant have too many Offensive linemen and maybe if Wand is good enough hell feel the heat from this kid.

I found a possible steal pick for a back up NT to Payne on NFL.com an excellent run stopper who is a big boy.

http://www.nfl.com/draft/profiles/2005/means_albert

Good find, might be worth a look late on the 2nd day.

Dionysus22
03-17-2005, 12:38 PM
I found a possible steal pick for a back up NT to Payne on NFL.com an excellent run stopper who is a big boy.

http://www.nfl.com/draft/profiles/2005/means_albert

Did you look at the bottom of the analysis? It said "Strictly a two-down player with no pass rushing skills and poor explosion off the ball" meaning the kid is fat, slow, out of shape and can only make plays when run directly at him. I'd take Payne over him in a heart beat.

Xman
03-17-2005, 01:06 PM
I think NT is the one posiiton where we need a big fat mound taking up space and not being moved (I beleive having a player that won't be pushed back in front of the LB lanes is more important than the 2 sacks a year you get from Payne) - and it should be a cheap position(in $$ and draft picks), even if it takes 2 players rotating.

IMO, Payne costs too much. I would dump him and go with someone like the guy you pointed out and maybe another like him to keep them fresh. Then spend the $$ on another position.

royce1054
03-17-2005, 01:28 PM
I think NT is the one posiiton where we need a big fat mound taking up space and not being moved (I beleive having a player that won't be pushed back in front of the LB lanes is more important than the 2 sacks a year you get from Payne) - and it should be a cheap position(in $$ and draft picks), even if it takes 2 players rotating.

IMO, Payne costs too much. I would dump him and go with someone like the guy you pointed out and maybe another like him to keep them fresh. Then spend the $$ on another position.

I agree with you. He is there to stop run up the middle and to not let the quarterback step up when he throw I mean to make him throw of his back leg. The NT is not a pash rusher at all. He is there to make room the two ILB i think will be WONG and GREENWOOD. He is doing i great job in my mind. I do think a DL will be drafted on the 2nd day... i dont know if its a nose or DE. Some one needs to push some ones there.

infantrycak
03-17-2005, 01:52 PM
The NT is not a pash rusher at all.

He is not supposed to rack up sacks himself but this just isn't true. It isn't just about holding ground, it is about collapsing the pocket so when the LB's, DE's come in from the edges the QB doesn't have a pocket to step up in--for reference see David Carr. The difference is very noticeable between the two--look at when Payne is healthy and when DeLoach (15 lbs heavier) comes in--Payne is much better at working back into the pocket. The difference isn't just the 2 sacks a year from Payne (although that is an indication of him pushing the pocket back) it is the extra sacks generated by the OLB's.

Also the review above says the guy can't take on double teams--big no no for a 3-4 NT and if he is struggling with that in college it doesn't bode well for the NFL.

royce1054
03-17-2005, 02:02 PM
He is not supposed to rack up sacks himself but this just isn't true. It isn't just about holding ground, it is about collapsing the pocket so when the LB's, DE's come in from the edges the QB doesn't have a pocket to step up in--for reference see David Carr. The difference is very noticeable between the two--look at when Payne is healthy and when DeLoach (15 lbs heavier) comes in--Payne is much better at working back into the pocket. The difference isn't just the 2 sacks a year from Payne (although that is an indication of him pushing the pocket back) it is the extra sacks generated by the OLB's.

Also the review above says the guy can't take on double teams--big no no for a 3-4 NT and if he is struggling with that in college it doesn't bode well for the NFL.

if u re-read what i said... i said to fill the gap, and make the QB throw off his back foot. That means Driving the center into the QB. Its same things u were referenceing to.

keyfro
03-17-2005, 03:54 PM
i just don't see us trading up in the draft...i don't see us trading down either...i think we'll stay at the 13th pick and wait to see who falls to us...that being said i do think that sharper will be part of a draft day trade to gain us another 1st day pick...probably in the 3rd round which we could use to trade back into the 2nd...which wouldn't be bad...probably be going after a ILB, WR, or RB with the pick

Dionysus22
03-18-2005, 02:06 PM
if u re-read what i said... i said to fill the gap, and make the QB throw off his back foot. That means Driving the center into the QB. Its same things u were referenceing to.
I read what you said before, and you said "he's there to make room". What do you think driving the center into the QB is? A bull rush! Aka Pass Rush!

royce1054
03-18-2005, 05:28 PM
Yes, sorry i was a LB my idea of a pass Rush comes from the outside or a LB. In the 3-4 a NT is a run stopper... and his "pass rush" as you call it is to make sure he cant step up in the pocket and give the Smiths, Walkers, Babins, Wongs, Greenwoods, the Peeks of the world to get to the QB. If a nose is successful to me the and the DE/LB are doing their jobs they should have lots of Sacks... We did have 2 underacheiving DE's in Smith and Walker last year. They both need to step it up. Babin is coming along nicely and Peek will get his chance.