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infantrycak
03-15-2005, 05:27 PM
Sportscenter just had some interesting rules issues.

Sounds as if the competition committee will refine the unnecessary roughness rules to limit some blindside hits away from the play. Chief example was a Warren Sapp hit on Chad Clifton.

They are also consider whether to do anything about horse-collar tackles--think Roy Williams (they said he injured four players this way) and TO.

They said there will not be any changes about cut blocks.

Blake
03-15-2005, 05:43 PM
They are also consider whether to do anything about horse-collar tackles--think Roy Williams (they said he injured four players this way) and TO.

This is rediculous if they do anything about it. Next they are going to say you cant touch a guy if he is in the process of being tackled.

I just dont understand it. I know that guys have gotten hurt by it, but if you are going to take anything away, take away from the o-line and the cut block.

It seems that every year they take something away from the defensive players.

infantrycak
03-15-2005, 05:49 PM
My first thought on the horse collar tackle was stop whining but four injuries by Roy Williams just from that tackle warrants investigation. If that is on 100 horse collar attempts then no problem but if he has only done it 10 times and injured 4 guys then something may need to be done.

Blake
03-15-2005, 06:03 PM
I need to watch those tackles again, but It looks to me like he just grabs anything as he is flying by. I mean he didnt force the players foot, or whatever to stick on the turf/grass and break.

But like I said, I need to watch the tackles again.

infantrycak
03-15-2005, 06:16 PM
Watching the tackles it looks like a non-issue--frankly it looks like an easier takedown than getting head-on but something about it is injuring people. Tyrone Calico was another one injured by it--in his case it tweaked both his knees.

stephen1
03-15-2005, 07:12 PM
the league needs to crack down on offensive pass interference

jr0ck
03-15-2005, 08:29 PM
Sounds as if the competition committee will refine the unnecessary roughness rules to limit some blindside hits away from the play. Chief example was a Warren Sapp hit on Chad Clifton.

if the players can't stand the heat, they need to get out of the kitchen. the player's are wearing pads for 'fricks sake, and it is a contact sport. ever since the first time i suited up, every coach i'd ever had says 'keep your head on swivel' (when in the open field). and it's not like blindside hits have become the scourge of the NFL, or a caused a plauge of injuries. no matter how much they soften the rules, players are always at a relatively high risk of injury because they are always pushing their bodies to it's limits just to compete. i won't be surprised if it's passed but the day any ban on cut blocking happens, the NFL might lose a 'customer'....

i don't know if i'm alone in this thought process, but these players are getting paid millions of dollars to 'entertain' the public correct? i guess they've never heard of 'risk/reward' before...yes you can be a millionare athlete, but athlete's have a little more risk involved in their job's when talking injuries, than say a pizza boy (my current occupation)...bottom line, these guys should have know there is just as much chance for a tragic ending to a career as there is for a successful one. </rant>

AndreJ
03-15-2005, 08:33 PM
These have to be the downright stupidest considerations i have ever heard in my life. :shocked Why dont they just banish contact football and we can all gear up for soem flag football come sundays. How does that sound.

infantrycak
03-15-2005, 10:12 PM
Article on this by ESPN. (http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=2013952)

Huge
03-16-2005, 10:46 AM
How many players have been injured on kick-off/punt returns? Maybe they should just spot the ball at the 20 each time a team scores or just average out the net punt distance and spot it that far downfield after a 4th down.

Just think of all the careers this would save.

gwallaia
03-16-2005, 10:52 AM
Here's a rule I wish the NFL would implement. No more knee touching the ground eliminating a fumble. Too many close calls, if you lose the ball, you lose the ball knee down or not.

Blake
03-16-2005, 10:55 AM
Here's a rule I wish the NFL would implement. No more knee touching the ground eliminating a fumble. Too many close calls, if you lose the ball, you lose the ball knee down or not.

I disagree. When your knee hits the ground, you are down, the play is over. Why would you fumbling the ball after that matter?

gwallaia
03-16-2005, 10:58 AM
I disagree. When your knee hits the ground, you are down, the play is over. Why would you fumbling the ball after that matter?

Mainly because there are so many calls where the instant replay takes too long to make the call.

Hold on to the ball.
In the old days of leather helmets and no facemasks, the player was considered down when he could not get up. In other words, he had to be held down by the opponent. If he was knocked down he could get back up and keep running.

Too many injuries forced that rule change.

Huge
03-24-2005, 11:35 AM
Picture from DallasCowboys.com relating to the rule changes pretty much says it all. Tired of seeing this form of tackling from Williams...

http://www.dallascowboys.com/images/Roy_Cleveland.jpg

TexansTrueFan
03-24-2005, 11:43 AM
ok i have an idea, lets take away all the pads, give em something comfortable to wear, give them some yellow flags to stick in the back of their pants and call it NFL football ! :whew myswell get it over with, cause at this rate thats where the NFL will be in 10-15 yrs !

V Man
03-24-2005, 12:03 PM
Picture from DallasCowboys.com relating to the rule changes pretty much says it all. Tired of seeing this form of tackling from Williams...

http://www.dallascowboys.com/images/Roy_Cleveland.jpg

I guess once you break free of the defense, you score. Can't tackle from behind, might get hurt.

I know there are other ways to tackle from behind, just because a few people got hurt you can't tackle that way. What is next, corners won't be able to tackle a RB at their feet (because I couple of RB's get hurt). Call it the Deon Sanders Rule, so the corners will get hurt by getting run over by big back like the Bus. Then they will change the rules, they will not allow a RB to run outside because that's were CB's are and they might get hurt. When does it stop, it is football a physical sport. People get hurt. You don't see the NBA banning jumping because players are hurting their ankles.

infantrycak
03-24-2005, 12:12 PM
I guess once you break free of the defense, you score. Can't tackle from behind, might get hurt.

This really is the Roy Williams rule. I think what he is doing that is hurting people isn't grabbing the pads, it is that he doesn't use his strength to bring them down he uses his body weight. Once he grabs the collar he pulls his hips up and lets his full body weight bring the guy down--in the process his body lands on their legs. I would be against outlawing letting players grab the pads, but if they could word something properly on the dropping onto peoples' legs then it may be a good idea. And folks need to get over this oh my god why not just put them in skirts attitude. There are lots of rules on how and where you can block and tackle people already--this kind of concern over particular techniques is not new and will not reduce the violence of the game.

TexansTrueFan
03-24-2005, 12:18 PM
like i said in a few years it will be the NFFL (National Flag Football League). And thats when i'll become a hockey fan !

texasguy346
03-24-2005, 12:25 PM
This really is the Roy Williams rule. I think what he is doing that is hurting people isn't grabbing the pads, it is that he doesn't use his strength to bring them down he uses his body weight. Once he grabs the collar he pulls his hips up and lets his full body weight bring the guy down--in the process his body lands on their legs. I would be against outlawing letting players grab the pads, but if they could word something properly on the dropping onto peoples' legs then it may be a good idea. And folks need to get over this oh my god why not just put them in skirts attitude. There are lots of rules on how and where you can block and tackle people already--this kind of concern over particular techniques is not new and will not reduce the violence of the game.

I tend to agree with that. Apparently there were times when Roy Williams actually circled around in order to use the horse collar tackle as opposed to wrapping them up and bringing them down. As far as the NBA banning players from jumping that's a bit of an overstatement. The NBA has rules that keep players from undercutting another player when he jumps, and numerous other rules that are focused on the player's well being. It seems that everytime there's a rule change in the NFL many people feel that it's the start of a slippery slope destined to end up with all the players being wrapped in bubble wrap and the fields to be giant mattresses. Roy Williams will still be able to intimidate opposing WR w/o the horse collar tackling. He can still lower his shoulder into the receivers chest, and he can punish the RB by meeting him at full speed in the hole. Football is a physical sport, and injuries will happen. However, that doesn't mean that the NFL shouldn't do everything in it's power to prevent injuries while still maintaining the integrity of the game.

TexansTrueFan
03-24-2005, 12:55 PM
come on havet ya see the old videos with the guys wearing a leather helmet. no face mask and not to much of any padding, now that was football, and they hardly made anything playing it. I think what people find so intruging about the game is the physicalness about it. There was this foregin exchange student when i went to high school, and i made her watch a game with me. Her first to watch and she asked me how in the world can that sport be legal ??? Its to violent, but i gurantee you she watched every game from there on out with me !! Good way to get women as well :) !

thegr8fan
03-24-2005, 01:04 PM
And folks need to get over this oh my god why not just put them in skirts attitude. There are lots of rules on how and where you can block and tackle people already--this kind of concern over particular techniques is not new and will not reduce the violence of the game. please tell me you were being sarcastic and I just missed the tone. :hmmm:

Tell ya what, you go ahead a list some of those rules on how and where you can block the defender. There aren't that many, other than crashback blocking. Heck O-lineman are injured every year by cutback blocking and yet MYSTERIOUSLY there isn't even a thought or conversation regarding changing that rule. WHY? Cause it doesn't hurt the owners wallets as much. O-lineman salaries compared to QB/WR/RB is laughable. So too bad, the O-lineman loses his career.

Now there are PLENTY of rules regarding tackling, particularly with the QB position. And now they have implemented practically the same rules for Punters/Kickers, just his year. Heck it is already to the point that the QB should have a flag tucked into his belt and the D just go after that. Cause anything else is almost a guaranteed penalty. You get the flag before the QB releases the ball and he is down, AND he doesn't get hurt in the process. Thus saving the owner millions of dollars a year. Both in salary and revenue of selling tickets. And it negates all those arm going forward, last second pump, NE Patriots non existant fumble calls. Flag before ball comes out, no pass. Simple and easy.

Now there are even more rules directly related to protecting the QB. That is really what this no blocking away from the area of the play, even on an interception is about. Everyone who has watched or played football can tell you the QB is target #1 when he throws an INT. It is simply the way it is and has always been done and taught. From Pee wee to College football. You KNOW, without even looking that some D-lineman is going to look up the QB and give them a resounding block.

And I am 100% against the horse collar tackle rule being implemented. If Roy Williams chooses to bring down the defender in this manner, then so be it. It is and should be perfectly legal. Otherwise your going to see some 250 pound fullback being taken head on by a 190 pound CB, or 220 pound safety. So Roy Williams uses his speed and brain to take down someone bigger and probably stronger than him and does so in a manner that does the least injury to himself. That is called smart, not cheap shoots.

I truly hope that the next expansion team in the NFL considers Pink and tu-tu's for an official color and uniform. At least that way there will be some kind of justification for treating them like Ballarina's and not Multi-million dollar athletes.

TexansTrueFan
03-24-2005, 01:17 PM
And I am 100% against the horse collar tackle rule being implemented. If Roy Williams chooses to bring down the defender in this manner, then so be it. It is and should be perfectly legal. Otherwise your going to see some 250 pound fullback being taken head on by a 190 pound CB, or 220 pound safety. So Roy Williams uses his speed and brain to take down someone bigger and probably stronger than him and does so in a manner that does the least injury to himself. That is called smart, not cheap shoots.

I truly hope that the next expansion team in the NFL considers Pink and tu-tu's for an official color and uniform. At least that way there will be some kind of justification for treating them like Ballarina's and not Multi-million dollar athletes.


thats all very true, football gets less and less physical every year it seems over a FEW injuries !

Marcus
03-24-2005, 02:14 PM
I just want them to take the shackles off the cornerbacks and allow them to play cornerback the way cornerback position is supposed to be played. No more of this "no contact past 5 yards" BS.

And I don't care if does lower the scoring.

Blake
03-24-2005, 07:04 PM
I would be against outlawing letting players grab the pads, but if they could word something properly on the dropping onto peoples' legs then it may be a good idea.

Im pretty sure this rule is being made mostly because of TO. And Roy didnt land on his legs. His foot stuck in the grass as it was twisted.

I just dont get it. How can you say a players dreadlocks are ok to tear off because they are part of the uniform, but you cant grab a good chunk of shoulderpad?

wags
03-24-2005, 07:20 PM
I just dont get it. How can you say a players dreadlocks are ok to tear off because they are part of the uniform, but you cant grab a good chunk of shoulderpad?

I don't know, but Williams ended the season of four players with that tackle. I'm pretty sure four is right. :confused:

disaacks3
03-24-2005, 08:03 PM
The only reason this issue arose in the first place is the changes in equipment & jerseys. Today's backs tend to wear specially contoured pads & extremely tight-fitting jerseys. There simply isn't as much to grab on to...compared to the "old days".

Guys get "horse callar" tackled all the time in College, why is it only in the NFL where we've got an injury problem because of it?

IMHO - I'm not so interested in high-scoring games that I think we need to take any more options away from defenders. This particular move hasn't reached anything approaching criticality yet. :shocked