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CloakNNNdagger
06-20-2010, 09:33 PM
It has always amazed me how so many NFL players end up destitute. This article I came across and its 2 contained links give an eye-opening insight into the "rags to riches and back to rags" story.

Why do so many NFL players go bankrupt? (http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/blog/shutdown_corner/post/Why-do-so-many-NFL-players-go-bankrupt-?urn=nfl,190555)

Within two years of retirement, 78 percent of NFL players are bankrupt or in severe financial distress. (http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/vault/article/magazine/MAG1153364/1/index.htm) Unlike Rocket Ismail, most of those players can't blame it on the negative karma associated with getting a bear hug from Michael Irvin.

How is this possible? The minimum salary for rookies in 2009 is $310,000. That jumps to $460,000 for two year veterans. How can men who earn so much have so little after retirement?

The Business Insider looked at that question today and listed 10 ways that sports stars destroy their finances (http://www.businessinsider.com/10-ways-sports-stars-destroy-their-finances-2009-9#put-cash-in-a-ponzi-scheme-1).

Most of the reasons fall under the umbrella of one of the ways, "Act Dumb". (These include "Do Drugs", "Fight Dogs" and "Have Too Many Children". Two outta three ain't bad, Michael Vick(notes).)

Other paths to financial ruin like "Put Money in a Ponzi Scheme" or "Invest Too Much In Real Estate" can be more about bad luck than anything, but never underestimate the power of habitually poor judgment. (Or stupidity. Tomato/Tomahto.) Case in point, here's a blurb from the "Making Bad Investments" entry:

Rocket Ismail also squandered a fortune funding an inspirational movie; the music label COZ Records; a cosmetics procedure whereby oxygen was absorbed into the skin; a plan to create nationwide phone-card dispensers; a Rock N' Roll Café, a theme restaurant in New England; and recently, three shops dubbed It's in the Name, where tourists could buy framed calligraphy of names or proverbs of their choice.

That sounds like the business plan of Kramerica Industries. Any one (or two) of those things by themselves would qualify as bad investments. Put them all together and you can understand how Ismail blew through $20 million in salary. (Of the calligraphy store, Ismail says its failure can be blamed on Hurricane Katrina. The cosmetics procedure: "sharks in the beauty industry". The Rock N' Roll Cafe: It being a Rock N' Roll Cafe.)

Ismail's case is more the exception than the rule though. The 78 percent number is buoyed by the fact that the average NFL career lasts just three years. So, figure a player gets drafted in 2009, signs for the minimum and lasts three years in the league: He will have earned about $1.2 million in salary. Factor in taxes, cost of living and the misguided belief that there will be more years and bigger paydays down the road, and it becomes a lot easier to see how so many players struggle with money after their careers end. Nobody plans on playing just three years in the NFL, you know?

JB
06-20-2010, 10:12 PM
It has always amazed me how so many NFL players end up destitute. This article I came across and its 2 contained links give an eye-opening insight into the "rags to riches and back to rags" story.

Why do so many NFL players go bankrupt? (http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/blog/shutdown_corner/post/Why-do-so-many-NFL-players-go-bankrupt-?urn=nfl,190555)

Within two years of retirement, 78 percent of NFL players are bankrupt or in severe financial distress. (http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/vault/article/magazine/MAG1153364/1/index.htm) Unlike Rocket Ismail, most of those players can't blame it on the negative karma associated with getting a bear hug from Michael Irvin.

How is this possible? The minimum salary for rookies in 2009 is $310,000. That jumps to $460,000 for two year veterans. How can men who earn so much have so little after retirement?

The Business Insider looked at that question today and listed 10 ways that sports stars destroy their finances (http://www.businessinsider.com/10-ways-sports-stars-destroy-their-finances-2009-9#put-cash-in-a-ponzi-scheme-1).

Most of the reasons fall under the umbrella of one of the ways, "Act Dumb". (These include "Do Drugs", "Fight Dogs" and "Have Too Many Children". Two outta three ain't bad, Michael Vick(notes).)

Other paths to financial ruin like "Put Money in a Ponzi Scheme" or "Invest Too Much In Real Estate" can be more about bad luck than anything, but never underestimate the power of habitually poor judgment. (Or stupidity. Tomato/Tomahto.) Case in point, here's a blurb from the "Making Bad Investments" entry:

Rocket Ismail also squandered a fortune funding an inspirational movie; the music label COZ Records; a cosmetics procedure whereby oxygen was absorbed into the skin; a plan to create nationwide phone-card dispensers; a Rock N' Roll Café, a theme restaurant in New England; and recently, three shops dubbed It's in the Name, where tourists could buy framed calligraphy of names or proverbs of their choice.

That sounds like the business plan of Kramerica Industries. Any one (or two) of those things by themselves would qualify as bad investments. Put them all together and you can understand how Ismail blew through $20 million in salary. (Of the calligraphy store, Ismail says its failure can be blamed on Hurricane Katrina. The cosmetics procedure: "sharks in the beauty industry". The Rock N' Roll Cafe: It being a Rock N' Roll Cafe.)

Ismail's case is more the exception than the rule though. The 78 percent number is buoyed by the fact that the average NFL career lasts just three years. So, figure a player gets drafted in 2009, signs for the minimum and lasts three years in the league: He will have earned about $1.2 million in salary. Factor in taxes, cost of living and the misguided belief that there will be more years and bigger paydays down the road, and it becomes a lot easier to see how so many players struggle with money after their careers end. Nobody plans on playing just three years in the NFL, you know?

I would say that most of it goes to hiring a lousy agent. The agent is supposed to manage the money. Part of the job.

And then there is the family issue. As soon as these guys make pro, they have relative's they never knew about looking for a piece of the pie.

gg no re
06-20-2010, 10:15 PM
When you come from a lower class background into a lot of money with little education on financial planning, there's no surprise at the rate of failure in most outcomes.

Carr Bombed
06-20-2010, 10:22 PM
When you come from a lower class background into a lot of money with little education on financial planning, there's no surprise at the rate of failure in most outcomes.

What's the old saying? "A fool and his money are soon parted".

Carr Bombed
06-20-2010, 10:27 PM
I heard about this a couple of days ago, but it fits in this thread...

http://www.firstcoastnews.com/news/mostpopular/news-article.aspx?storyid=157412

CloakNNNdagger
06-20-2010, 10:32 PM
I would say that most of it goes to hiring a lousy agent. The agent is supposed to manage the money. Part of the job.

And then there is the family issue. As soon as these guys make pro, they have relative's they never knew about looking for a piece of the pie.

That and the fact that as soon as these guys make pro, they look for every "piece" they never knew about.............relatively all of the time.:thinking:

CloakNNNdagger
06-20-2010, 10:37 PM
I heard about this a couple of days ago, but it fits in this thread...

http://www.firstcoastnews.com/news/mostpopular/news-article.aspx?storyid=157412


On top of the usual reasons, this economy will certainly add to the already sad trend.

edo783
06-20-2010, 11:21 PM
What's the old saying? "A fool and his money are soon parted".

Not fools, but they are naive and not sophisticated in how money works since most never had it and they want to show off how well they are doing, which is OK if not carried to excess. Couple that with people who take advantage of them (agents, family, women etc.) and the sense that they are bulletproof and thing will keep on being good and it is a recipe for disaster. They are just young guys who might have street smarts, but are very naive about business and that is actually what they are.

Second Honeymoon
06-21-2010, 09:53 AM
car addiction
ho addiction
buying way too austentatious houses
bling addiction
and all the hangers ons and family members looking for a handout

and of course being as dumb as a tree stump

badboy
06-21-2010, 11:41 AM
Irene Cara's "I'm gonna live forever.." changed to I'm gonna play forever..

I think many people with money are attracted to "get rich quick" schemes that we read about all the time. I got money and I will use it to make more. I also believe most folks, entertainers or not think they are smarter than they are and so are easily separated from their pay check.

StarStruck
06-21-2010, 02:16 PM
Irene Cara's "I'm gonna live forever.." changed to I'm gonna play forever..

I think many people with money are attracted to "get rich quick" schemes that we read about all the time. I got money and I will use it to make more. I also believe most folks, entertainers or not think they are smarter than they are and so are easily separated from their pay check.

It is amazing the number of schemes out there to separate man from his money and the number of people that buy into them without due diligence.

The family and friends thing is another, a few thousands here, a few thousands there, then seemingly a few thousands everywhere. Again, how are we related?

I don't have a problem with the toys and trinkets within reason as long as there is a sound financial plan that those things will not have a negative impact on their success long term.

I think that the huge contract amounts can be somewhat deceptive in that (1) no matter how great the player, one significant injury can reduce $20million less taxes, agent fees, and assorted other expenses over a lifetime to a reality check. The same could also be said for any profession when it is taken for granted the income will be there until we choose that our future is secure. (2) Of course, as said above horrible business ventures. (3) Living for today. (4) Family and friends that goes beyond those that were instrumental in their development and they sincerely want to show appreciation through gifts, i.e., buying mom the new house. These things should be choice driven, and not trying to appease everyone with a hard luck story. (5) Class could play a role, however, for everyone who blows his fortune, there is someone with a similar background that maintains his wealth. I doubt if many came from a poorer background than Earl Campbell, but it appears that he has done quite well in his finances dispite such humble beginnings.

gwallaia
06-21-2010, 03:03 PM
I would say that most of it goes to hiring a lousy agent. The agent is supposed to manage the money. Part of the job.

And then there is the family issue. As soon as these guys make pro, they have relative's they never knew about looking for a piece of the pie.

I've checked my family tree, but I don't think John Wall is part of it.

JB
06-21-2010, 03:21 PM
I've checked my family tree, but I don't think John Wall is part of it.

Yeah, mine either. Bummer huh?

eriadoc
06-21-2010, 03:47 PM
The answer to this is surprisingly simple - they're dumb. And I don't mean that as disparagingly as it sounds, because all people are dumb at that age. You think you could have intelligently handled millions of dollars at that age? Not that it wouldn't have been fun to try, but no, you would not have. To further exacerbate things, these young men are brought up being told that they are the best thing since sliced bread, so they have no concept of reality or humility, nor do thye have the experience needed to wisely manage money (or lots of other things, judging by the news).

It's not restricted to athletes, though. A significant portion of lottery winners end up broke as well, even though they are older, presumably wiser, and have life experience managing money. However, people who manage their money well don't buy very many lottery tickets, so there is that.

badboy
06-21-2010, 04:12 PM
It is amazing the number of schemes out there to separate man from his money and the number of people that buy into them without due diligence.

The family and friends thing is another, a few thousands here, a few thousands there, then seemingly a few thousands everywhere. Again, how are we related?

I don't have a problem with the toys and trinkets within reason as long as there is a sound financial plan that those things will not have a negative impact on their success long term.

I think that the huge contract amounts can be somewhat deceptive in that (1) no matter how great the player, one significant injury can reduce $20million less taxes, agent fees, and assorted other expenses over a lifetime to a reality check. The same could also be said for any profession when it is taken for granted the income will be there until we choose that our future is secure. (2) Of course, as said above horrible business ventures. (3) Living for today. (4) Family and friends that goes beyond those that were instrumental in their development and they sincerely want to show appreciation through gifts, i.e., buying mom the new house. These things should be choice driven, and not trying to appease everyone with a hard luck story. (5) Class could play a role, however, for everyone who blows his fortune, there is someone with a similar background that maintains his wealth. I doubt if many came from a poorer background than Earl Campbell, but it appears that he has done quite well in his finances dispite such humble beginnings.Earl Cambell trusted his coach Bum Phillips with whom he had an excellent relationship. i could be wrong but I think Bud Adams got Earl in to cattle for a while but he then went with sausage but that may have been after he retired. The NFL has financial experts talk to the players annualy to warn them about scams etc. I think there are some former NFL players whoact as financial advisors for little or no payment.

badboy
06-21-2010, 04:25 PM
The answer to this is surprisingly simple - they're dumb. And I don't mean that as disparagingly as it sounds, because all people are dumb at that age. You think you could have intelligently handled millions of dollars at that age? Not that it wouldn't have been fun to try, but no, you would not have. To further exacerbate things, these young men are brought up being told that they are the best thing since sliced bread, so they have no concept of reality or humility, nor do thye have the experience needed to wisely manage money (or lots of other things, judging by the news).

It's not restricted to athletes, though. A significant portion of lottery winners end up broke as well, even though they are older, presumably wiser, and have life experience managing money. However, people who manage their money well don't buy very many lottery tickets, so there is that.Only problem with the age theory is many mature players in 30s also have little to show for their years in pro sports as could be said about the lottery winners. I think these same people would over spend or spend foolishly at $25k to say $200k just like a rookie at beginning salary wage. It is "I don't know how to spend wisely but I don't have it and I want it and it looks like I can pay for it today. Besides, I know I look good with it."

ArlingtonTexan
06-21-2010, 04:33 PM
The answer to this is surprisingly simple - they're dumb. And I don't mean that as disparagingly as it sounds, because all people are dumb at that age. You think you could have intelligently handled millions of dollars at that age? Not that it wouldn't have been fun to try, but no, you would not have. To further exacerbate things, these young men are brought up being told that they are the best thing since sliced bread, so they have no concept of reality or humility, nor do thye have the experience needed to wisely manage money (or lots of other things, judging by the news).

It's not restricted to athletes, though. A significant portion of lottery winners end up broke as well, even though they are older, presumably wiser, and have life experience managing money. However, people who manage their money well don't buy very many lottery tickets, so there is that.

This is the best answer I have read. These guys get money at the one point that they are the least able to handle it. And even those that are able still have plenty of landmines to avoid that normal people don't. Finally, and while most of America is not in bankrupcy, I would guess that more people than not are in more debt than should be.

eriadoc
06-21-2010, 04:37 PM
Only problem with the age theory is many mature players in 30s also have little to show for their years in pro sports as could be said about the lottery winners. I think these same people would over spend or spend foolishly at $25k to say $200k just like a rookie at beginning salary wage. It is "I don't know how to spend wisely but I don't have it and I want it and it looks like I can pay for it today. Besides, I know I look good with it."

It's not solely based on age, but people at that age are the least prepared to handle money. It seems like most Americans aren't able to handle money wisely, but even those who do weren't fully prepared to do so at age 19-22. I know I wasn't. I earn less money now than I did in my 20s, but I have much more to show for my efforts these days. It took some growing up to get here.

HoustonFrog
06-22-2010, 10:18 AM
I've always wondered this myself. You could take a signing bonus and put it in a basic savings acct with interest and make money that is a yearly salary higher than most people. They just make dumb investments and spend the money before it is even there.

Texan_Bill
06-22-2010, 10:38 AM
I've checked my family tree, but I don't think John Wall is part of it.

I did some checking. You might be kin to the rapper Paul Wall... :turtle:


http://djlightsout.net/wp-content/uploads/2008/12/599px-paul_wall.jpg

Texan_Bill
06-22-2010, 10:42 AM
Back to topic. I'm not making excuses for these guys. You don't need to be a financial genuis to figure out you need to live within' your means. Hell, go on the internet and there are all kinds of retirement calculators to figure out much you need for retirement...

COMMON FREAKIN' SENSE!!!



:stirpot:

badboy
06-22-2010, 11:06 AM
Back to topic. I'm not making excuses for these guys. You don't need to be a financial genuis to figure out you need to live within' your means. Hell, go on the internet and there are all kinds of retirement calculators to figure out much you need for retirement...

COMMON FREAKIN' SENSE!!!



:stirpot:Bill, I think they do live within their means--at first. I think most problems come when the revenue coming in goes down or stops that the debts get out of hand. Sure there are the poster kids who blow it all plus some but I doubt that is the norm.

keyser
06-22-2010, 11:18 AM
Part of the problem is that the expectations for them are probably way above what "living within their means" should be. Really, wouldn't most of you think it was strange if a pro football player moved next door to you (I'm guessing most people here are middle class)? Wouldn't you think: "Why is this person here, when they earn that much money - they should at least be in (pick nearby neighborhood where houses cost twice what yours does)." And yet, for most of these players, something in the range of a standard middle-class house is probably to what they need. It would take a lot of discipline for a person to go against all those expectations and live as they need to to make the football money last.

It's not as though post-football, they are going to be likely to earn anywhere close to what they did. Even if they were wise, and got a "real" degree while they were in college, if they try to work in that field, they'd be starting out at an entry level job, several years behind similar people of similar ages. That would be a huge letdown after years in the spotlight earning large amounts of money, and so I think this is why so many players turn to not-so-great investments - their job options post-football are really limited, unless they are willing to accept a significant loss in prestige (which many aren't).

Koolaid Time
06-22-2010, 11:47 AM
I've always wondered this myself. You could take a signing bonus and put it in a basic savings acct with interest and make money that is a yearly salary higher than most people. They just make dumb investments and buy the money before it is even there.

Add to this the fact that most don't have anything to fall back on after football.

Most didn't graduate from college. And those that did, what can they do with their Degree except maybe Coach a High School team?

Texecutioner
06-22-2010, 12:34 PM
car addiction
ho addiction
buying way too austentatious houses
bling addiction
and all the hangers ons and family members looking for a handout

and of course being as dumb as a tree stump

Bingo!

Why would anyone be surprised by this? Just look at these guys. Hell, just look at the rookies on draft day. All of them that are in the blue room or the green room (whatever you call it) are already sitting there with diamond rolex watches before they've even gotten a pay check. Then they're out there buying $50,000 dollar necklaces and bracelets for themselves. Then comes the cars and the houses and all of the money it takes to party it up in the strip clubs. That stuff can add up really really fast.

Lets face it. These guys put these problems all on themselves. Half of them want to act like rappers in the videos for years until they mature and build a nice family and you just never know when they're careers will take a nose dive. I don't really buy the excuses part about them coming from poor backgrounds and then all of a sudden getting a ton of money and not knowing how to act with it. Sorry, but that's there problem. They all had scholarships in college and got a free ride where they had to take plenty of courses where they learned how to manage money somewhat and how to do some basic budgeting. I think when you come from a poor background it should come a lot easier to manage your money right and not spend it to crazy, because you should be used to being frugal and spending wisely because you've never had a lot of money.

dc_txtech
06-22-2010, 12:37 PM
When you come from a lower class background into a lot of money with little education on financial planning, there's no surprise at the rate of failure in most outcomes.

Little education? Most of these guys went to some of the best Universities in the Nation. Certainly they would have learned something there. :lol:

HJam72
06-22-2010, 01:14 PM
Many things take experience AND education. No matter how poor a kid is, they don't learn how to manage money until they've been a poor adult. These guys get rich right before they'd start actually learning something from their poorness. I mean, wearing worn-down clothes and not having many nice things growing up, maybe even missing some meals--that teaches you a lot, but not about how to manage money. Your poor parents did, but you just learned other things. Matter of fact, it might even cause you to go to clubs and throw wads of money down at the crowd of "poor" people from a balcony...(Mario).

disaacks3
06-22-2010, 01:46 PM
The answer to this is surprisingly simple - they're dumb. And I don't mean that as disparagingly as it sounds, because all people are dumb at that age. You think you could have intelligently handled millions of dollars at that age? Not that it wouldn't have been fun to try, but no, you would not have. To further exacerbate things, these young men are brought up being told that they are the best thing since sliced bread, so they have no concept of reality or humility, nor do thye have the experience needed to wisely manage money (or lots of other things, judging by the news).

It's not restricted to athletes, though. A significant portion of lottery winners end up broke as well, even though they are older, presumably wiser, and have life experience managing money. However, people who manage their money well don't buy very many lottery tickets, so there is that. In general I agree. I think what exacerbates the issue is the lack of good, fundamental education. While many of these players came from accredited colleges, how many really did every assignment, every paper, etc withOUT help?

IMHO - The old stories about pampered athletes who never show up for class are still just as true today. These are guys (in many cases) that have come from poverty and have no idea exactly how to manage money in any large quantity. Add in the sharks out to manipulate those with new-found wealth and you have a group of people setup for failure.

eriadoc
06-22-2010, 02:20 PM
In general I agree. I think what exacerbates the issue is the lack of good, fundamental education. While many of these players came from accredited colleges, how many really did every assignment, every paper, etc withOUT help?

IMHO - The old stories about pampered athletes who never show up for class are still just as true today. These are guys (in many cases) that have come from poverty and have no idea exactly how to manage money in any large quantity. Add in the sharks out to manipulate those with new-found wealth and you have a group of people setup for failure.

No one is getting a good fundamental education as it relates to money. The average college grad walks out of college with $30K in debt. Look at how many Americans carry debt like it's no big deal. Look at the housing bubble crisis recently. Americans have no sense of the concept "Pay As You Go". So when you factor in the other upbringing issues that athletes almost all seem to have, and factor in that they're at that age when everyone is just simply dumb, they're ending up in a situation that is more likely to spiral further out of control than your average American.

DexmanC
06-22-2010, 03:53 PM
No one is getting a good fundamental education as it relates to money. The average college grad walks out of college with $30K in debt. Look at how many Americans carry debt like it's no big deal. Look at the housing bubble crisis recently. Americans have no sense of the concept "Pay As You Go". So when you factor in the other upbringing issues that athletes almost all seem to have, and factor in that they're at that age when everyone is just simply dumb, they're ending up in a situation that is more likely to spiral further out of control than your average American.

Double-bold the "No one." This was a lesson I learned the hard way. When
I payed off that mountain of debt, and cried "Never Again," people look
at me crazy because I don't borrow the money I COULD borrow. Be
frugal, SAVE FOR WHAT YOU WANT, are completely foreign concepts
in modern America. Life with a great car, with no note, makes me
the oddest cat in town.

My grandmother had it right all along. Some of us have to go through "the
fire" to listen to wise counsel.

GlassHalfFull
06-22-2010, 04:02 PM
Keeping up with the Jones - or in this case the Reggies and the TO's. League minimum players come out and feel like they have to spend with their peers

gtexan02
06-22-2010, 04:07 PM
No one is getting a good fundamental education as it relates to money. The average college grad walks out of college with $30K in debt. Look at how many Americans carry debt like it's no big deal. Look at the housing bubble crisis recently. Americans have no sense of the concept "Pay As You Go". So when you factor in the other upbringing issues that athletes almost all seem to have, and factor in that they're at that age when everyone is just simply dumb, they're ending up in a situation that is more likely to spiral further out of control than your average American.

Education is an investment. What 18 year old has 30k lying around to pay for college?

eriadoc
06-22-2010, 04:29 PM
Education is an investment. What 18 year old has 30k lying around to pay for college?

In this country? Not too many. But that doesn't mean jack. First off, the "investment" angle is played way too heavily. If you went $30K into debt for a business admin degree, for instance, then you're not very good at business. College doesn't have to put you $30K in debt. There are actually not that many degrees that warrant that sort of debt.

Second, and this is in direct relation to the education point, learn to save as you're growing up. That means parents teach kids how to save and how to manage money. That means kids mow lots of lawns, wash cars, flip burgers, and walk dogs to save money. As they're able, parents should save what they can to help as well.

Third, go to community college for a couple years while you continue to work a part time job, live at home, and save money. If you don't have the means to go away to school, live in the dorms, and pump out cash, then don't.

Fourth, wen you graduate, put every effort you have into paying off that debt instead of sending off for more new credit cards and buying that shiny new car on payments.

It all goes back to "Pay As You Go". That doesn't mean there aren't exceptions on the education thing, but they're certainly not common enough to be offered up as an excuse. Moreover, it's just a symptom of the larger problem, and that is the fact that Americans think they deserve things now for which they will pay later.

I'm not ignorant to the reality of the situation, nor am I immune. I did my time in credit hell, and I could offer up excuse after excuse as to why it happened and I could justify almost every loan if I wanted. But the hard truth of the matter is I could have done it better. People don't want to admit to themselves when they're taking the easy way out (or what seems easy at the time) and people don't want to take responsibility for screwing up, but it's true. If you really want that education with no debt, you'll find a way. Most people just want the quick way out.

Second Honeymoon
06-24-2010, 03:44 PM
get rich or die trying is the motto a lot of these people live by

its not about being a man or helping your community, its about what you can do for yourself and how you can 'high sign' with the best of them

the future means nothing. its more important to spend all your money on material excesses and to party like a rap/rock star. some are hellbent on making sure everyone knows how much of a success they are, they have to wear it around their neck, their wrist, and drive it down the street.

you don't get to publicize your bank account balance or your investment portfolio, but you can sure get a lot of 'props' for having a Bentley or an overpriced piece of jewelry or a bunch of hood rat chicken heads on your jock.

the funny thing is that there are athletes that get it. athletes like Curtis Martin strive to help their communities and their people. they don't need to wear bling and blow money to feel like they are rich. they are rich in character and they get the real payback by seeing the smile on kid's faces when they help keep their life on a positive path or help a family in need.

I know Okoye gets a lot of blame around here for being pretty average, but he does do some work in his community and in Africa, and although it may be hurting his football career (and it may have already) he is at least trying to do something for his people. He may need to find a better balance (which he claims to have) but I will give him credit for being a positive influence in the community.

infantrycak
06-24-2010, 03:55 PM
I know Okoye gets a lot of blame around here for being pretty average, but he does do some work in his community and in Africa, and although it may be hurting his football career (and it may have already) he is at least trying to do something for his people. He may need to find a better balance (which he claims to have) but I will give him credit for being a positive influence in the community.

Sidetrack comment but I hate that people bag on Okoye for volunteering in Africa as if it hurts his NFL game. It's absurd. Every single NFL player from Manning on down spends several weeks a year on vacation or away from football. Okoye spends his time helping people instead of in the Bahamas or playing golf so it gets reported. How is what he is doing worse for his career than just vacationing and not making the news at all? It's stupid.

Texecutioner
06-24-2010, 04:11 PM
Keeping up with the Jones - or in this case the Reggies and the TO's. League minimum players come out and feel like they have to spend with their peers

Bingo again!!

Texecutioner
06-24-2010, 04:12 PM
get rich or die trying is the motto a lot of these people live by

its not about being a man or helping your community, its about what you can do for yourself and how you can 'high sign' with the best of them

the future means nothing. its more important to spend all your money on material excesses and to party like a rap/rock star. some are hellbent on making sure everyone knows how much of a success they are, they have to wear it around their neck, their wrist, and drive it down the street.

you don't get to publicize your bank account balance or your investment portfolio, but you can sure get a lot of 'props' for having a Bentley or an overpriced piece of jewelry or a bunch of hood rat chicken heads on your jock.

the funny thing is that there are athletes that get it. athletes like Curtis Martin strive to help their communities and their people. they don't need to wear bling and blow money to feel like they are rich. they are rich in character and they get the real payback by seeing the smile on kid's faces when they help keep their life on a positive path or help a family in need.

I know Okoye gets a lot of blame around here for being pretty average, but he does do some work in his community and in Africa, and although it may be hurting his football career (and it may have already) he is at least trying to do something for his people. He may need to find a better balance (which he claims to have) but I will give him credit for being a positive influence in the community.

Great post SH. Rep if I could but I have to spread.

"EDIT"

And another guy to mention along with Okoye and Martin is Warrick Dunn. He's done a lot for people with his charities with houses. Derrick Brooks has done a ton of great stuff with working with the youth and his charities.

StarStruck
06-24-2010, 04:23 PM
Great post SH. Rep if I could but I have to spread.

I will share half of my rep with you.

HuttoKarl
06-24-2010, 05:22 PM
David Eckstein, Shortstop for the Cardinals and World Series MVP (when they won the series anyway) lives in a trailer park and never had a new car until they gave him a Corvette for winning the Series MVP. His teammates teased him about the way he lived but he just said he knew money doesn't last forever and baseball careers are short.

More pros need to think that way...in fact, more everyone needs to think like that.

awtysst
06-24-2010, 07:33 PM
The answer to this is surprisingly simple - they're dumb. And I don't mean that as disparagingly as it sounds, because all people are dumb at that age. You think you could have intelligently handled millions of dollars at that age? Not that it wouldn't have been fun to try, but no, you would not have. To further exacerbate things, these young men are brought up being told that they are the best thing since sliced bread, so they have no concept of reality or humility, nor do thye have the experience needed to wisely manage money (or lots of other things, judging by the news).

It's not restricted to athletes, though. A significant portion of lottery winners end up broke as well, even though they are older, presumably wiser, and have life experience managing money. However, people who manage their money well don't buy very many lottery tickets, so there is that.

I strongly disagree with you. I would have done very well with that kind of money at that age. Ever since I was 18 I have put away the max limit afforded into a ROTH IRA. The I pay my ROTH IRA before I have fun mentality has allowed me to begin to grow a very nice retirement fund. In addition, I was able to take some of my paychecks and by way of scholarships and jobs get myself through undergrad, a masters, and doctorate program with minimal debt. I will be able to pay off my school loans within a couple of years and be able to move my paychecks towards financially sound investments.

I do not think I am alone in this regard. There are many people like me who understand the value of a dollar and know how hard it is to make. So, I do not think it is a matter of age, its a matter of mindset. My parents taught me to value something as small as a dollar when I was 6 years old. I am the man I turned out to be becuase of their lessons.

More parents need to teach their children financial lessons just as mine did.

eriadoc
06-24-2010, 10:01 PM
I strongly disagree with you. I would have done very well with that kind of money at that age. Ever since I was 18 I have put away the max limit afforded into a ROTH IRA. The I pay my ROTH IRA before I have fun mentality has allowed me to begin to grow a very nice retirement fund. In addition, I was able to take some of my paychecks and by way of scholarships and jobs get myself through undergrad, a masters, and doctorate program with minimal debt. I will be able to pay off my school loans within a couple of years and be able to move my paychecks towards financially sound investments.

I do not think I am alone in this regard. There are many people like me who understand the value of a dollar and know how hard it is to make. So, I do not think it is a matter of age, its a matter of mindset. My parents taught me to value something as small as a dollar when I was 6 years old. I am the man I turned out to be becuase of their lessons.

More parents need to teach their children financial lessons just as mine did.

1. Good for you, sincerely.
2. You are alone, relatively speaking.
3. Of course they do. If there were more people like you (like you seem to think), then you wouldn't have felt the need to point this out.

People are dumb when it comes to money in this country.

StarStruck
06-25-2010, 12:42 AM
I think that Intro to Business, Finance, B-Law and such classes should be stressed more at the high school level. Those courses are there, but as an elective. In that case the student has the option of choosing one of those courses or art, floral design and :runaway:similar.

I wouldn't leave it up to the parent to teach any more than I would Geometry. Some parents have the background and can, however there are those that don't, which would put the kid at a disadvantage.

I find it amazing that we have such well rounded curriculums to include history, geography, English, math, science, but very little in gearing students how to do a budget, balance a checkbook (debit card), investments, savings, insurance, and the other kinds of stuff that will play a key roll in everyday life and their future.

infantrycak
06-25-2010, 01:19 PM
From PFT.com

For the second time in less than three years, a former NFL starting quarterback has sought protection not from five offensive linemen, but from the eleventh chapter of the U.S. bankruptcy laws.

The last time around, it was Mike Vick. This time, it's Mark Brunell.

Abel Harding of the Florida Times-Union reports that Brunell plans to make the filing today, despite earning $52 million during his career.

The tipping point seems to be multiple lawsuits resulting from failed business loans for which Brunell and others co-signed. The fact, however, that the total liability under those claims falls in the neighborhood of $3.3 million suggests that Brunell hasn't squirreled away much, if any, of the money he made while playing. To qualify for bankruptcy protection, assets can't exceed debts. Thus, Brunell necessarily has less money than he owes.

Koolaid Time
06-25-2010, 10:27 PM
"For the second time in less than three years, a former NFL starting quarterback has sought protection not from five offensive linemen, but from the eleventh chapter of the U.S. bankruptcy laws.

The last time around, it was Mike Vick. This time, it's Mark Brunell.

Abel Harding of the Florida Times-Union reports that Brunell plans to make the filing today, despite earning $52 million during his career.

The tipping point seems to be multiple lawsuits resulting from failed business loans for which Brunell and others co-signed. The fact, however, that the total liability under those claims falls in the neighborhood of $3.3 million suggests that Brunell hasn't squirreled away much, if any, of the money he made while playing. To qualify for bankruptcy protection, assets can't exceed debts. Thus, Brunell necessarily has less money than he owes."

If its a Chapter 11 he must have some assets to fund a Plan. At least it isn't a 7.. yet.

JB
06-25-2010, 10:39 PM
"For the second time in less than three years, a former NFL starting quarterback has sought protection not from five offensive linemen, but from the eleventh chapter of the U.S. bankruptcy laws.

The last time around, it was Mike Vick. This time, it's Mark Brunell.

Abel Harding of the Florida Times-Union reports that Brunell plans to make the filing today, despite earning $52 million during his career.

The tipping point seems to be multiple lawsuits resulting from failed business loans for which Brunell and others co-signed. The fact, however, that the total liability under those claims falls in the neighborhood of $3.3 million suggests that Brunell hasn't squirreled away much, if any, of the money he made while playing. To qualify for bankruptcy protection, assets can't exceed debts. Thus, Brunell necessarily has less money than he owes."

If its a Chapter 11 he must have some assets to fund a Plan. At least it isn't a 7.. yet.

Even a 7 ain't too bad...at least it's not a 13

Texan_Bill
06-25-2010, 11:02 PM
Even a 7 ain't too bad...at least it's not a 13

I've experienced 13... Not personally mind you, but a company I spent 11 - 12 years with... It amounted to stupidity and greed which equaled FAIL!

JB
06-25-2010, 11:03 PM
I've experienced 13... Not personally mind you, but a company I spent 11 - 12 years with... It amounted to stupidity and greed which equaled FAIL!

Yep. The bad thing about 13 from a creditor's point of view is that it is never closed...

Texan_Bill
06-26-2010, 12:00 AM
Re: Why do so many NFL players go bankrupt?

Because often they are dumbasses......... And I don't wanna hear how they were brought up disadvantaged... **** that, you are now advantaged... seek advice!

The1ApplePie
06-28-2010, 05:46 PM
"What happened to the millions of dollars you made?"

Steven Tyler: "It went up my nose."

Koolaid Time
06-28-2010, 06:14 PM
"What happened to the millions of dollars you made?"

Steven Tyler: "It went up my nose."

Or up his arm...

NitroGSXR
06-28-2010, 09:29 PM
Bill, I think they do live within their means--at first. I think most problems come when the revenue coming in goes down or stops that the debts get out of hand. Sure there are the poster kids who blow it all plus some but I doubt that is the norm.

Speaking of living within their means... DeMeco Ryans drives an older model Ford Explorer with stock rims. He drove himself here from Alabama for the First and Ten youth minicamp in it. Anyway, I asked him about it and he claimed that the Explorer was his daily driver.

I just found that admirable is all.

drs23
06-28-2010, 11:13 PM
Speaking of living within their means... DeMeco Ryans drives an older model Ford Explorer with stock rims. He drove himself here from Alabama for the First and Ten youth minicamp in it. Anyway, I asked him about it and he claimed that the Explorer was his daily driver.

I just found that admirable is all.

I have no doubt, and think that's pretty cool.