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View Full Version : We arent taking Barron


Grid
03-06-2005, 07:50 PM
Ill put money on it if you want :). We will not take an Olineman in the first round.

There is no reason to..this whole alex barron thing is a knee jerk reaction by people who know we need to improve our pass blocking. Fact of the matter is we are set at RT and have only given Wand ONE YEAR. We arent giving up on either of our Tackles at this point and drafting a guard in the first round is just stupid.

on top of that.. we have said repeatedly that we want defensive playmakers in our front 7.. the BEST time to get a defensive playmaker is in the first round.

on top of THAT.. the best time to get Olinemen who arent going to start immediatly is in the 3rd and 4th round..possibly 2nd. Heck.. the best time to get interior olinemen who CAN start immediatly is in the 2nd 3rd and 4th round.

geez.. where does this come from.. look at the two "big name" olinemen in last years draft.. Robert Gallery and that really big fat dude whos name I cant remember. Gallery ended up moving to RT cause he couldnt handle LT immediatly and the big guy got injured and sat out the season.

First round pick will be a defensive BPA (unless something ungodly falls in our laps). Barron would be a reach at #13.

Vinny
03-06-2005, 07:55 PM
This gives me a chance to clarify my thoughts on this. I think there is an outside chance we take him (or whomever is the highest rated tackle on the board) because we have never drafted an O-lineman early. Even though we have Carr, AJ and Robinson people complain that we "don't draft linemen early", but that is nonsense. No sense in taking Jordan Gross over AJ, Bryant McKinney over David Carr, or Shawn Andrews over Dunta Robinson, but this year there is no real 'no-brainer' pick.

I don't like Barron because he has shoulder issues in the past and I am deeply cynical about him being all that much better in the long run than Wand, but that doesn't mean he will not be taken high, or by us if we like him (and we may).

Grid
03-06-2005, 07:59 PM
i still think the chances are very slim. this is a deep draft for interior linemen and I dont see us "wasting" our first rounder on a guy who isnt really head and shoulders above the guys that will be available two rounds later.



*EDIT* sorry I probably should have specified that I think if we drafted him he would more than likely end up as a guard.. which is why I compared him to interior linemen instead of tackles.

Dionysus22
03-06-2005, 08:14 PM
Just reading all of these makes me feel a whole lot better. I was kinda down when I heard DJ would be most likely wearing either a Browns or Cardinals jersey next year. Then I really got down when they said we would pick an O-lineman with our first pick. I totally agree, there is no "big-name" o-lineman this year. So we have no business picking a lineman that early. I also agree we make that pick in the second or possibly third round. I'm totally stoked with picking the defensive BPA.

Lucky
03-06-2005, 08:19 PM
Ill put money on it if you want :). We will not take an Olineman in the first round.
Well, what kind of odds are you giving. :) :jk:

As far as the "knee jerk reaction" is concerned, it wasn't Texan fans that pulled Wand on passing downs in the Bear game. That was Dom Capers. I'll also point out that Casserly took a trip this fall to watch FSU practice. Maybe he was there looking at guys like Travis Johnson & Bryant McFadden. But Barron was there, so who knows?

Grid
03-06-2005, 08:23 PM
*shrug*

like I said.. they may draft an olinemen or three.. but they wont do it at #13.

and im not giving odds.. hehe.. honestly I wouldnt put money on it.. not with Casserly doing the picking.. you never know what he is going to pull. But I would say it is alot less likely than many people on here are making it out to be.

Blake
03-06-2005, 08:40 PM
geez.. where does this come from.. look at the two "big name" olinemen in last years draft.. Robert Gallery and that really big fat dude whos name I cant remember. Gallery ended up moving to RT cause he couldnt handle LT immediatly and the big guy got injured and sat out the season.

This is a poor example. You cannot use guys who got injured as a reason to not pick a Tackle in the 1st round.

1st round draft picks who did not play because of injury:
TE Kellen Winslow
T Shawn Andrews
QB J.P. Losman
RB Chris Perry
TE Ben Watson

So are you saying its a bad idea to take a TE in round one as well? I mean look, every Tight End in the first round got injured and didnt play all season.

And Robert got beat out by Simms, who won the teams offensive player Commitment to Excellence Award, in pre-season while Robert was battling a groin injury. Award Link (http://www.raiders.com/newsroom/newsroomNewsDetail.jsp?id=17192)

I will agree that Barrons past shoulder injury bothers me. But I dont think its reason to pass on a player that IMO has a huge upside.

Hottoddie
03-06-2005, 08:44 PM
I'd add McCune to the mix. If we do trade Sharper, McCune might just be the perfect replacement. He's a fast, strong, very athletic, disciplined, high character MLB with a military background. He sounds like the kind of player that the Texans would love to have on their roster. Other than his age (26 y/o), he sounds perfect to me & he's climbing the charts. By the way, his pro day is tomorrow.

Honoring Earl 34
03-06-2005, 10:15 PM
:woot I would think a shoulder injury would send the Texans running . I've read where Marcus Johnson was a higher rated tackle than Barron .

dirty steve
03-07-2005, 11:39 PM
didn't we have a OT who had to retire b/c of a pre-existing shoulder injury? not to say this is a reason not to take barron...

nunusguy
03-08-2005, 08:53 AM
.. look at the two "big name" olinemen in last years draft.. Robert Gallery and that really big fat dude whos name I cant remember. Gallery ended up moving to RT cause he couldnt handle LT immediatly and the big guy got injured and sat out the season.

The "big fat dude" was probably Shawn Andrews out of Arkansas and drafted
by the Eagles.
But Gallery is an interesting story and I'm thinking his reputation as a legendary lineman and destined to be the next Bosseli was another figment of the news medias herd mentality imagination. I never heard of the guy before his senior year and then he became a darling of the press but ultimately when drafted by the Raiders couldn't even beat out an average veteran @ LT for the starting nod. Then he tried guard but wasn't good enough to displace the starter there either and I'm thinking they just gave him the RT slot out of desperation because he was so high profile being the #2 overall in the draft.

TheOgre
03-08-2005, 09:29 AM
I would love to see us go WR. I hope one of the top three falls into our lap.

beerlover
03-08-2005, 09:35 AM
Robert Gallery is a phenomenal offensive lineman talent & was hyped with good reason. i think he has strugled with the mental aspects of being a nfl tackle in the raiders system, kinda like comparing Eli Manning's 1st year to Ben Rothelisbergers, one was in a good situation the other not that does'nt mean that as the Giants put the peices around Eli that he doesn' end up being the top QB as rated coming out of College, just more a by product of the system and the tools around him.

Since I have not had the chance to watch as much of Barron I'm not sure what he would bring to the table if the Texans selected him. I have watched Jammal Brown and he would be a huge upgrade for the RG position, he is great with assingments, is physical enough to impact his first year & smart. LT only as a back-up or as needed (if Seth Wand gets hurt) I think he would struggle with the speed rushers on the end. Barron would probably be the best fit for LT but are we ready to give up on Wand?

the money for both free agent OT's & CB's in the NFL is huge, I don't think the Texans could go wrong at #13 by picking one of these two positions to fill. I doubt that Barron is still there but even if he was Jammal might be the better fit. BPA would look something like this-

Adam Pac Man Jones
Troy Williamson
Alex Barron
Justin Miller
Carlos Rogers
Jammal Brown
Thomas Davis

infantrycak
03-08-2005, 09:50 AM
Jordan Gross (2003 draft # 8 pick) and Robert Gallery (2004 draft #2 pick), both much more highly regarded than the tackles in this draft, each played RT their rookie year. Gross shifted to LT, as Gallery may do, for his 2nd year and allowed 6.5 sacks. Drafting a LT to be an immediate upgrade this year at LT doesn't seem very realistic.

Honoring Earl 34
03-08-2005, 09:54 AM
:thumbup Gallery dislocated his elbow in camp . That is the reason given as to why he struggled .

beerlover
03-08-2005, 10:07 AM
Jordan Gross (2003 draft # 8 pick) and Robert Gallery (2004 draft #2 pick), both much more highly regarded than the tackles in this draft, each played RT their rookie year. Gross shifted to LT, as Gallery may do, for his 2nd year and allowed 6.5 sacks. Drafting a LT to be an immediate upgrade this year at LT doesn't seem very realistic.

if I remember correctly (2003 was my 1st year getting into the draft seriously) the Texans where rumored to be seriously considering taking Jordan Gross with the 3rd pick, but once AJ was still on the board those fears abated and the rest is history. now some people want to talk about this years draft being weak all you have to do is go back two years and check out that stinker.

Vinny
03-08-2005, 10:21 AM
I don't think that the Texans ever serioulsy considered Gross at the 3 overall. I think the guys they considered sans trade down were Charles Rogers, Dewayne Robertson, and Terence Newman.

Youngstown Colt
03-08-2005, 10:36 AM
I will say this, Barron IS the best tackle in this draft, he's better on the field, and he has the body to develop into a monster.

I want the browns to take and O-lineman, but #3 is waaaay to early. number 13, however, is IMO the perfect spot to take him

Lucky
03-08-2005, 11:40 AM
if I remember correctly (2003 was my 1st year getting into the draft seriously) the Texans where rumored to be seriously considering taking Jordan Gross with the 3rd pick...
The Texans brought these top guys into Houston for visits in '03:

AJ
Rogers
Newman
Robertson
Gross
Suggs
Kennedy

After the draft, Casserly said on his TV show that the Texans had AJ #1 & Robertson #2 on their draft board. There were rumors that the Texans were looking at Gross or Suggs had they traded down. I think Gross hurt himself regarding the Texans by not participating in the Senior Bowl (Texans would have coached him). We'll never know for sure.

wags
03-08-2005, 11:43 AM
The Texans brought these top guys into Houston for visits in '03:

How long before the draft did they do this? Did they do the same last year, and can you remember who they brought in? Just curious.

Lucky
03-08-2005, 12:15 PM
How long before the draft did they do this?
They brought those guys in between the pro days & the draft. Late March-early April? If you're a Chronic subscriber, you can look up the articles. I don't remember the Texans notifying the media on last year’s visits.

infantrycak
03-08-2005, 01:02 PM
if I remember correctly (2003 was my 1st year getting into the draft seriously) the Texans where rumored to be seriously considering taking Jordan Gross with the 3rd pick,

Other than the visit mentioned by Lucky, I don't recall any such rumors/evidence of interest in Gross by the Texans but I do recall a ton of fans and MB argument aka discussion with people wanting Gross before AJ as the cornerstone of the OL, Pitts sucks, WR won't get the ball anyway, etc.

nunusguy
03-08-2005, 01:48 PM
I think the Texans were intensly interested in Suggs but he disappointed in
his workouts. Then he had a second round of workouts, claiming the first
workout performance was a fluke and he still didn't improve his performances
the second time around. I remember even the old man (BM), went to AZ
and remarked after the workouts that Suggs was apparently "a little faster than he showed". His strength test were also poor. Just goes to show when it comes to sprint times and pumping iron
drills, the results don't necessarily mean squat when it comes to identifying a
stud edge rusher. Anyway, we're still looking for that stud edge rusher, but
I know all agree the guy we took instead of Suggs worked out pretty good.