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Texans_Chick
01-21-2010, 10:12 AM
Decided to put various thoughts together on the Center/Guards position for the Texans.

Texans nightmare fuel (enter at your own risk) (http://blogs.chron.com/texanschick/2010/01/texans_nightmare_fuel_enter_at.html).

I'm not sure if any of this is particularly revolutionary, but it is attempt to wrap my head around the issues....in a fair way.

(Just trying to encourage non-bombthrowing, potstirring writing about the Texans over at the Chronic esp in the offseason, and any thoughtful comments you can add can help encourage more of that sort of thing.)

TimeKiller
01-21-2010, 01:00 PM
So it's likely to see a Brown - F/A - Myers - Caldwell - Winston OL starting next year?

Better be a damn good free agent. I don't have much to say non-bombthrowing about Myers playing C so I guess this is where the post ends.

The Pencil Neck
01-21-2010, 01:07 PM
How about this:

Brown - Caldwell - F/A - Myers - Winston

Myers played RG at Denver, iirc. Maybe he would be better as a G than a C.

I'm not sayin, I'm just asking.

nero THE zero
01-21-2010, 01:08 PM
So it's likely to see a Brown - F/A - Myers - Caldwell - Winston OL starting next year?

Better be a damn good free agent. I don't have much to say non-bombthrowing about Myers playing C so I guess this is where the post ends.

I doubt that, personally. Briesel is disliked by a lot of fans, but the more knowledgeable talking heads around town think he's one of the best OL on the team. He's RFA so I can't imagine a scenario in which he won't be back with the team.

HOU-TEX
01-21-2010, 01:19 PM
I doubt that, personally. Briesel is disliked by a lot of fans, but the more knowledgeable talking heads around town think he's one of the best OL on the team. He's RFA so I can't imagine a scenario in which he won't be back with the team.

Brisiel is decent, but we can definitely do better. From the sounds of things, it doesn't sound like his injury rehab is going to well. It's possible he won't even be ready come TC. Plus, the fact he'd have to work himself back into shape before even attempting to come back by then.

Either way, we're in dire need of int Oline help. Especially if Pitts is done with the Texans.

nero THE zero
01-21-2010, 01:42 PM
From the sounds of things, it doesn't sound like his injury rehab is going to well.
Link?

Not that I don't believe you, I just hadn't heard that.

Bull
01-21-2010, 03:03 PM
Interesting??
The way I see it is Brown Studdard ------- Caldwell Winston. I think they would love to have a free agent guy come in and play center but who? You see we need to be in a win mode in 2010! Draft a young yes! But,get a exp strong domianting guy thats 30-32 and lets win . Justin Hartwig? The Steelers problems where not up the middle this year!:fans:

Texan4Ever
01-21-2010, 03:06 PM
How about this? Duane Brown, Logan Mankins, FA/Draft, FA/Draft, Winston with everyone else as a backup until they outperform a starter?

Bull
01-21-2010, 03:12 PM
Didn't the Pats have interior line problems?

HOU-TEX
01-21-2010, 03:16 PM
Link?

Not that I don't believe you, I just hadn't heard that.

McClain mentioned it on one of his queer little videos. Mentioned something about seeing him gimping around in a boot with screws still in place. Plus, a lisfranc injury as severe as the one Brisiel suffered can be career ending. Especially in an Olineman weighing over 300 lbs.

Take it with a grain of salt coming from McClain, but still doesn't look good.

LonerATO
01-21-2010, 03:50 PM
Decided to put various thoughts together on the Center/Guards position for the Texans.

Texans nightmare fuel (enter at your own risk) (http://blogs.chron.com/texanschick/2010/01/texans_nightmare_fuel_enter_at.html).

I'm not sure if any of this is particularly revolutionary, but it is attempt to wrap my head around the issues....in a fair way.

(Just trying to encourage non-bombthrowing, potstirring writing about the Texans over at the Chronic esp in the offseason, and any thoughtful comments you can add can help encourage more of that sort of thing.)

Nice Telluride video! I just got back from there even though the snow wasnt that great it is better then Snowmass and Winter Park.

Wolf6151
01-21-2010, 05:02 PM
How about this? Duane Brown, Logan Mankins, FA/Draft, FA/Draft, Winston with everyone else as a backup until they outperform a starter?


I'd love to have Logan Mankins but he's a RFA not UFA, he would cost us a 1st and 3rd round draft pick.

The Pencil Neck
01-21-2010, 05:03 PM
Link?

Not that I don't believe you, I just hadn't heard that.

In his last Tuesday Chat, McClain said he was still limping around.

iirc

Wolf6151
01-21-2010, 05:38 PM
So much for the non-bomb throwing posts. In a nut shell, the Texans O-line stinks. We've got OT's that are decent but not outstanding and an interior that needs to be replaced badly, all 3 of them. Pitts as an injured FA that is due for a pay raise should be gone, Brisiel is injured as well and even when healthy he should be a backup, Studdard isn't very good and should be a backup at most or should be gone. White should be gone, and Myers is tough, has lots of heart, smarts, technique, and calls a good blocking scheme but he lacks size and strength so he's not the total package, he should be a backup at best. I noted at this time last year that Myers was small and getting thrown around and some folks posted that with a good off-season weight lifting program Myers could add 10-20 lbs. of muscle. Obviously Myers doesn't agree because he's was the same size this year as last and still getting thrown around. The Texans need to stop being afraid or slow to make changes or being so faithful to veterans that suck. Just because your a veteran doesn't mean that your a good player. They also need to stop drafting high/mid round project players like Okoye, Molden, or Barwin when we could have had starter level OG/C instead who would have played every down.

Kubiak, feel the heat under your seat and make the changes or someone else will be making them for you.

dalemurphy
01-21-2010, 05:55 PM
So much for the non-bomb throwing posts. In a nut shell, the Texans O-line stinks. We've got OT's that are decent but not outstanding and an interior that needs to be replaced badly, all 3 of them. Pitts as an injured FA that is due for a pay raise should be gone, Brisiel is injured as well and even when healthy he should be a backup, Studdard isn't very good and should be a backup at most or should be gone. White should be gone, and Myers is tough, has lots of heart, smarts, technique, and calls a good blocking scheme but he lacks size and strength so he's not the total package, he should be a backup at best. I noted at this time last year that Myers was small and getting thrown around and some folks posted that with a good off-season weight lifting program Myers could add 10-20 lbs. of muscle. Obviously Myers doesn't agree because he's was the same size this year as last and still getting thrown around. The Texans need to stop being afraid or slow to make changes or being so faithful to veterans that suck. Just because your a veteran doesn't mean that your a good player. They also need to stop drafting high/mid round project players like Okoye, Molden, or Barwin when we could have had starter level OG/C instead who would have played every down.

Kubiak, feel the heat under your seat and make the changes or someone else will be making them for you.


While I wouldn't be as harsh in my characterization, I do generally agree with you that the Texans need to be a little less loyal to some of these incumbents. Of course, it is rather likely that the "faithfulness" that players like Myers, Studdard, and Briesel have received was out of neccessity. In other words, perhaps there were so many freakin' holes to fill on this team that the Texans had little choice but to rely on some fringe players. I think the drafting of Caldwell is a sign that we can expect competition at those weaker spots from here on out. I just think it is hard to try an upgrade a servicable interior line when you have guys like D. Faggins, N. Ferguson, M.Greenwood, T. Bulman getting so many snaps on defense.

I'd like to add that I don't think the OLines stinks. While the running game was poor, that was certainly partly due to poor RB play. And, let's not overlook the fact that Matt Schaub dropped back to pass 600 times and was sacked only 25 times. That's pretty good. It's even better when you consider that Schaub had the sixth most prolific season ever in the NFL in terms of Passing Yards. And, it's not like the guy is elusive. Add to all of that that our 2 starting guards went on the IR in September... I think those guys should be congratulated!

But, after they've been given an award, some applause, etc... It's time to go get some talent so that those guys are competing just to make the roster next season, much less make the starting lineup!

Goldensilence
01-21-2010, 05:57 PM
So much for the non-bomb throwing posts. In a nut shell, the Texans O-line stinks. We've got OT's that are decent but not outstanding and an interior that needs to be replaced badly, all 3 of them. Pitts as an injured FA that is due for a pay raise should be gone, Brisiel is injured as well and even when healthy he should be a backup, Studdard isn't very good and should be a backup at most or should be gone. White should be gone, and Myers is tough, has lots of heart, smarts, technique, and calls a good blocking scheme but he lacks size and strength so he's not the total package, he should be a backup at best. I noted at this time last year that Myers was small and getting thrown around and some folks posted that with a good off-season weight lifting program Myers could add 10-20 lbs. of muscle. Obviously Myers doesn't agree because he's was the same size this year as last and still getting thrown around. The Texans need to stop being afraid or slow to make changes or being so faithful to veterans that suck. Just because your a veteran doesn't mean that your a good player. They also need to stop drafting high/mid round project players like Okoye, Molden, or Barwin when we could have had starter level OG/C instead who would have played every down.

Kubiak, feel the heat under your seat and make the changes or someone else will be making them for you.

Bingo. Has been a problem, but Gary and Rick can't seem to keep the hand out of the cookie jar when it comes to developmental players early.

From what I remember Myers went into last off-season and did put on some weight. I don't remember it helping a whole lot except him losing some flexibility, perhaps that's why he suffered an early season ankle sprain?

Not good news on Brisiel. Not that I thought the guy was an all world starter but, he's better than White or Studdard.

Kubiak's going to have to bite the bullet and look for interior help early and possibly through FA as well.

Big Lou
01-21-2010, 06:02 PM
I'd love to have Logan Mankins but he's a RFA not UFA, he would cost us a 1st and 3rd round draft pick.

I believe that the draft picks are based on the tender offered to the player.

Have they given him a RFA Tender yet? I thought they couldn't do that for a while.....

infantrycak
01-21-2010, 06:05 PM
I believe that the draft picks are based on the tender offered to the player.

Have they given him a RFA Tender yet? I thought they couldn't do that for a while.....

There are four tender levels now and you can rest assured New England will highest tender Mankins. People need to just remove him from the dream list because that's all it is, a dream.

Wolf6151
01-21-2010, 06:13 PM
I believe that the draft picks are based on the tender offered to the player.

Have they given him a RFA Tender yet? I thought they couldn't do that for a while.....


I don't remember where I read it but about a week ago I read that the Patriots plan to tender him for a 1st and 3rd, though I don't think they've actually done it yet. A 1st round all pro like Mankins, they'd be crazy not to tender him with a 1st and 3rd.

Wolf6151
01-21-2010, 06:17 PM
Bingo. Has been a problem, but Gary and Rick can't seem to keep the hand out of the cookie jar when it comes to developmental players early.

From what I remember Myers went into last off-season and did put on some weight. I don't remember it helping a whole lot except him losing some flexibility, perhaps that's why he suffered an early season ankle sprain?

Not good news on Brisiel. Not that I thought the guy was an all world starter but, he's better than White or Studdard.

Kubiak's going to have to bite the bullet and look for interior help early and possibly through FA as well.


You know I don't understand Kubiak and Smith's fascination with trying to find the diamond in the rough with a small school player. Diamond hunters go through tons of rocks before finding a diamond and some hunt their whole life without finding one. Why not just take proven players that fill a need without so much risk.

ArlingtonTexan
01-21-2010, 07:27 PM
You know I don't understand Kubiak and Smith's fascination with trying to find the diamond in the rough with a small school player. Diamond hunters go through tons of rocks before finding a diamond and some hunt their whole life without finding one. Why not just take proven players that fill a need without so much risk.

Not sure where the notion started that rookies not drafted in the 1st round come in and are automatically these instant solid players came from, but I am seeing it in seems like every thread.

Rookie= project player. The vast majority of them, no matter where they went to school.

The draft is more about adding long-term talent than short term we expect (insert position of so-called need)to step in right away. Teams are happy when Grover Quinn's happen, but most rookies are short term flawed, see the "project" Barwin and the "solid "Caldwell."

New_Texans
01-21-2010, 10:25 PM
Not sure where the notion started that rookies not drafted in the 1st round come in and are automatically these instant solid players came from, but I am seeing it in seems like every thread.

Rookie= project player. The vast majority of them, no matter where they went to school.

The draft is more about adding long-term talent than short term we expect (insert position of so-called need)to step in right away. Teams are happy when Grover Quinn's happen, but most rookies are short term flawed, see the "project" Barwin and the "solid "Caldwell."

Jacoby Jones looks like hes starting to shine a bit more often

steelbtexan
01-21-2010, 10:35 PM
My view of the Texans C/G are

They stink, some of the worst in the NFL, They are the main problem with the run game. IMO

Kaiser Toro
01-22-2010, 08:08 AM
Nice Telluride video! I just got back from there even though the snow wasnt that great it is better then Snowmass and Winter Park.

I have been in Telluride since the 16th. The last two days have been great, and today is going to be amazing. :snobord:

HuttoKarl
01-22-2010, 09:25 AM
How about this? Duane Brown, Logan Mankins, FA/Draft, FA/Draft, Winston with everyone else as a backup until they outperform a starter?

I'm with this plan!

badboy
01-22-2010, 04:14 PM
LT: Brown LG: Pitts C: Myers RG: Caldwell RT: Winston
Rahad Butler swing LG: Asamoah or maybe Iupati C Low draft pick or cheap FA RG:Briesel

Giant Tiger
01-22-2010, 08:43 PM
My view of the Texans C/G are

They stink, some of the worst in the NFL, They are the main problem with the run game. IMO

Agreed, that's why I don't want to draft a RB early. Fix the OL first.

The Pencil Neck
01-22-2010, 09:54 PM
Agreed, that's why I don't want to draft a RB early. Fix the OL first.

Why not do both?

Wolf6151
01-23-2010, 03:26 AM
My view of the Texans C/G are

They stink, some of the worst in the NFL, They are the main problem with the run game. IMO


Agreed. I've read that the Texans may be very interested in Chris Kuper-OG from Denver and apparently a very good OG in the ZBS scheme who's having trouble switching to the power blocking scheme that Denver is going to. I've read that Denver intends to tag him with a 5th round draft pick as a RFA and that with our new OC coming from Denver that we stand a good chance of adding Kuper to the squad. I'm not that familiar with Kuper but if he's as good in the ZBS as I've read then I think there's a good chance we pick him up in FA and hopefully add an OG like Jon Asamoah, Mike Johnson, or Mitch Petrus or a C like Maurkice Pouncey or J.D. Walton in the draft.

LonerATO
01-23-2010, 04:37 PM
I have been in Telluride since the 16th. The last two days have been great, and today is going to be amazing. :snobord:

I was there 4th until the 11th and loved it

sbalderrama
01-23-2010, 04:49 PM
The draft is more about adding long-term talent than short term we expect (insert position of so-called need)to step in right away. Teams are happy when Grover Quinn's happen, but most rookies are short term flawed, see the "project" Barwin and the "solid "Caldwell."

for sure... most fans seem to be the "draft for need" types thinking that somehow you are guaranteed that "stud" whatever in the first three rounds. Rick Smith's history seems much more the "best player available" theory based on their draft board, which is where the Barwin's and Casey's come from.

ObsiWan
01-23-2010, 04:55 PM
Decided to put various thoughts together on the Center/Guards position for the Texans.

Texans nightmare fuel (enter at your own risk) (http://blogs.chron.com/texanschick/2010/01/texans_nightmare_fuel_enter_at.html).

I'm not sure if any of this is particularly revolutionary, but it is attempt to wrap my head around the issues....in a fair way.

(Just trying to encourage non-bombthrowing, potstirring writing about the Texans over at the Chronic esp in the offseason, and any thoughtful comments you can add can help encourage more of that sort of thing.)

careful, next you'll be invoking the "L" word.
Logic

leebigeztx
01-23-2010, 05:11 PM
I think with a slow guy like schaub, u need bigger guys in the middle. He has slow feet as much as anything and the line should be very stout up the gut. He really struggles as do most qb's with gut pressure. I like caldwell and his versitility makes him a excellent guard which is what i said predraft. What they need at center is a jamaal jackson type. One of those 330lbs anchors to combat the inside pressure. The reason a team lie the jets and titan can run against any defense is because mawae and mangold can handle the 0 and 3 technique without help and get movement. When you can do that, it helps the run and the pass game. I like caldell next to brown, but a stout center would be golden.

steelbtexan
01-23-2010, 05:55 PM
I think with a slow guy like schaub, u need bigger guys in the middle. He has slow feet as much as anything and the line should be very stout up the gut. He really struggles as do most qb's with gut pressure. I like caldwell and his versitility makes him a excellent guard which is what i said predraft. What they need at center is a jamaal jackson type. One of those 330lbs anchors to combat the inside pressure. The reason a team lie the jets and titan can run against any defense is because mawae and mangold can handle the 0 and 3 technique without help and get movement. When you can do that, it helps the run and the pass game. I like caldell next to brown, but a stout center would be golden.

Mawae is a UFA.

Smithiak could sign him if they wanted.

ObsiWan
01-24-2010, 12:15 AM
Mawae is a UFA.

Smithiak could sign him if they wanted.

Mawae is 39 years old. Is that really where you want to spend your F/A bucks?

steelbtexan
01-24-2010, 12:19 AM
Mawae is 39 years old. Is that really where you want to spend your F/A bucks?

Not really but if Iwere Kubes and my job were on the line next season and Mawae would be a massive upgrade (which is sad BTW) I would consider signing him.

The Tacks signed him at 38 yrs old last year and he had a really good year,much better year than Myers.

infantrycak
01-24-2010, 07:32 AM
Mawae is 39 years old. Is that really where you want to spend your F/A bucks?

IF he would sign a 1 or 2 year deal, yes. Mawae is still a banger and as opposed to all the assume any veteran is a leader kind of posts he is a proven leader. He would get the nasty out of Brown, Winston and Leach. Stick Caldwell on his left shoulder and either Briesel or someone new on his right and watch the running game take off.

Texan in Japan
01-24-2010, 10:27 AM
I'm kind of with Murph's comments, the line did a great job for what we had. Besides keeping Schaub upright, notice how the run game improved with a decent back in the line-up.

However, with that said we need to add at least one stud G in either 1-3 rds of the draft or thru FA. I would also look at another C later in the draft 4-6 rds. Its tough to look at FAs, till we see what becomes available. But the draft...

With a G like Mike Iupati, Vlad Ducasse, John Asamoah or Mitch Petrus from the draft we could add to our interior talent and size. If we add one of those guys and a vet like Kuper, I think our guards would be solid going into the next year.

As for C, while Myers got blown up by big guys, I'm not sure our staff is ready to replace him. If we got some size at guard like Iupati or Ducasse they could scheme to ensure Myers isn't blown back into Schaub against the Fergerson's of the world. However if we traded down in Rd 1 and added a Maurkice Pouncey I wouldn't be disappointed. I think more than likely we add a developmental C through the later rounds of the draft or in FA. Wonder if they would like at Matthews' kid in late rounds or FA?

steelbtexan
01-24-2010, 10:50 AM
IF he would sign a 1 or 2 year deal, yes. Mawae is still a banger and as opposed to all the assume any veteran is a leader kind of posts he is a proven leader. He would get the nasty out of Brown, Winston and Leach. Stick Caldwell on his left shoulder and either Briesel or someone new on his right and watch the running game take off.

Yep and he would be great for teaching Caldwell and whoever they draft the veteran tricks of the trade.

He's a true leader and his knowlege would be worth having to eat the 2nd year of a contract.

Wont happen though Smithiak aren't big on bringing in these kind of guys. Z (cant spell his name) is the exception to this rule. The only reason he was brought in was because Rick Smith played with him at Purdue and knew he wouldn't rock the boat.

McNair said this teams biggest deficiency was the lack of vet. leadership. Signing Mawae would be a good start in rectifying this situation. IMO

thunderkyss
01-24-2010, 11:21 AM
I think with a slow guy like schaub, u need bigger guys in the middle. He has slow feet as much as anything and the line should be very stout up the gut. He really struggles as do most qb's with gut pressure. I like caldwell and his versitility makes him a excellent guard which is what i said predraft. What they need at center is a jamaal jackson type. One of those 330lbs anchors to combat the inside pressure. The reason a team lie the jets and titan can run against any defense is because mawae and mangold can handle the 0 and 3 technique without help and get movement. When you can do that, it helps the run and the pass game. I like caldell next to brown, but a stout center would be golden.

Great post, good analysis, except you didn't take into account what Kubiak wants to do. That isn't going to change. We don't have a 330 lbs center now, simply because Kubiak doesn't want one.

You started your discourse talking about Schaub's weaknesses, and how the OL doesn't complement him. Yet a few posts earlier, another poster lays out a convincing argument that Schaub & this OL works well together.

If our goal is to try to figure out what Smithiak will do to "fix" our OL, we need to address what they may believe the problem to be.

Personally, I would like to see "better talent" on our interior line, but I don't see replacing more than one piece, unless we get a guy like Kuper, then I can see 2 new faces at the most.

Unless you think it's just coach speak, I think Studdard is safe. Kubiak likes the guy. Brown is safe.

I can see him moving Caldwell to Center. Kuper at RG... but that's about it.

ObsiWan
01-24-2010, 11:28 AM
IF he would sign a 1 or 2 year deal, yes. Mawae is still a banger and as opposed to all the assume any veteran is a leader kind of posts he is a proven leader. He would get the nasty out of Brown, Winston and Leach. Stick Caldwell on his left shoulder and either Briesel or someone new on his right and watch the running game take off.

I sorta like that scenario. Let him teach Brown and Caldwell the tricks of the trade (...oh wait, didn't we sign Bruce Matthews for that very reason?) plus it weakens their line and maybe strengthens ours...

I just hope any changes we make to improve the running game don't result in more sacks. We were 5th in the league for fewest sacks allowed this year. I want to see that ranking improve, not get any worse. Interestingly enough 3 out of the top 5 teams regarding fewest sacks were in our division, Indy (#1 w/13) and Tenn (#2 w/15) were the other two.

infantrycak
01-24-2010, 11:38 AM
I sorta like that scenario. Let him teach Brown and Caldwell the tricks of the trade (...oh wait, didn't we sign Bruce Matthews for that very reason?) plus it weakens their line and maybe strengthens ours...

I just hope any changes we make to improve the running game don't result in more sacks. We were 5th in the league for fewest sacks allowed this year. I want to see that ranking improve, not get any worse. Interestingly enough 3 out of the top 5 teams regarding fewest sacks were in our division, Indy (#1 w/13) and Tenn (#2 w/15) were the other two.

For a little different perspective here is sacks as a % of passing attempts.

Colts 2.2%
Titans 3.2%
Patriots 3.0%
Saints 3.6%
Texans 4.2%
Chargers 5.0%
Cardinals 4.3%

steelbtexan
01-24-2010, 12:33 PM
For a little different perspective here is sacks as a % of passing attempts.

Colts 2.2%
Titans 3.2%
Patriots 3.0%
Saints 3.6%
Texans 4.2%
Chargers 5.0%
Cardinals 4.3%

That's anacceptable %.

Mawae was the leader of the Tacks OL that had a better % than the Texans.

Mawae wouldn't hurt the team in pass protection. In fact a case could be made that he could help in pass pro. as well as the run game.

Mawae has got 2 high level years left in him and would be a great FA signing. IMO

thunderkyss
01-24-2010, 12:34 PM
That's anacceptable %.

Mawae was the leader of the Tacks OL that had a better % than the Texans.

Mawae wouldn't hurt the team in pass protection. In fact a case could be made that he could help in pass pro. as well as the run game.

Mawae has got 2 high level years left in him and would be a great FA signing. IMO

I agree.

steelbtexan
01-24-2010, 12:45 PM
[QUOTE=thunderkyss;1354162]Great post, good analysis, except you didn't take into account what Kubiak wants to do. That isn't going to change. We don't have a 330 lbs center now, simply because Kubiak doesn't want one.

You started your discourse talking about Schaub's weaknesses, and how the OL doesn't complement him. Yet a few posts earlier, another poster lays out a convincing argument that Schaub & this OL works well together.

If our goal is to try to figure out what Smithiak will do to "fix" our OL, we need to address what they may believe the problem to be.

Personally, I would like to see "better talent" on our interior line, but I don't see replacing more than one piece, unless we get a guy like Kuper, then I can see 2 new faces at the most.

Unless you think it's just coach speak, I think Studdard is safe. Kubiak likes the guy. Brown is safe.

I wouldn't do it this way but I could see a trade for Kuper and Caldwell starting at the other OG position. This would be an upgrade on the OL. IMO

If it goes down like this Dwyer should be the no.1 pick.

I would draft Iupati in the 1st rd if he's available. Then a RB

Iupati is the best OG in this draft and has a chance to become a pro bowl type guy. I like him more that T.Williams and Okung for the Texans needs.

I can see him moving Caldwell to Center. Kuper at RG... but that's about it.

dalemurphy
01-25-2010, 09:07 AM
[QUOTE=thunderkyss;1354162]Great post, good analysis, except you didn't take into account what Kubiak wants to do. That isn't going to change. We don't have a 330 lbs center now, simply because Kubiak doesn't want one.

You started your discourse talking about Schaub's weaknesses, and how the OL doesn't complement him. Yet a few posts earlier, another poster lays out a convincing argument that Schaub & this OL works well together.

If our goal is to try to figure out what Smithiak will do to "fix" our OL, we need to address what they may believe the problem to be.

Personally, I would like to see "better talent" on our interior line, but I don't see replacing more than one piece, unless we get a guy like Kuper, then I can see 2 new faces at the most.

Unless you think it's just coach speak, I think Studdard is safe. Kubiak likes the guy. Brown is safe.

I wouldn't do it this way but I could see a trade for Kuper and Caldwell starting at the other OG position. This would be an upgrade on the OL. IMO

If it goes down like this Dwyer should be the no.1 pick.

I would draft Iupati in the 1st rd if he's available. Then a RB

Iupati is the best OG in this draft and has a chance to become a pro bowl type guy. I like him more that T.Williams and Okung for the Texans needs.

I can see him moving Caldwell to Center. Kuper at RG... but that's about it.

I've been bothered with Kubiak's affinity toward Studdard. However, as long as he's seen as depth and not depended on as a starter I won't be too critical. I've been livid the past two seasons when he has made the 53 man roster. That being said, he played much better this season than I thought possible.

Regarding the size issue on the interior oline, Caldwell is on the hefty side for an NFL center and was drafted to play that position. Remember, also, that the first lineman ever drafted by Kubiak was Charles Spencer. He was a giant human being and they were immediately excited about him. All these undersized guys were picked up in late rounds or as UDFA. So, I see no real indication that they want undersized guys. The reality is that when they are filling out their roster and they have limited players to choose from, they will pick an athletic guy over an overweight plodder. Ideally, they want a physical lineman with size and athleticism... ie: Charles Spencer, Winston (drafted to play guard), Caldwell, Duane Brown.

steelbtexan
01-25-2010, 10:11 AM
[QUOTE=steelbtexan;1354235]

I've been bothered with Kubiak's affinity toward Studdard. However, as long as he's seen as depth and not depended on as a starter I won't be too critical. I've been livid the past two seasons when he has made the 53 man roster. That being said, he played much better this season than I thought possible.

Regarding the size issue on the interior oline, Caldwell is on the hefty side for an NFL center and was drafted to play that position. Remember, also, that the first lineman ever drafted by Kubiak was Charles Spencer. He was a giant human being and they were immediately excited about him. All these undersized guys were picked up in late rounds or as UDFA. So, I see no real indication that they want undersized guys. The reality is that when they are filling out their roster and they have limited players to choose from, they will pick an athletic guy over an overweight plodder. Ideally, they want a physical lineman with size and athleticism... ie: Charles Spencer, Winston (drafted to play guard), Caldwell, Duane Brown.

This is why Iupati could be in play at 20. He's a big man that can move his feet.

badboy
01-28-2010, 10:26 AM
[QUOTE=steelbtexan;1354235]

I've been bothered with Kubiak's affinity toward Studdard. However, as long as he's seen as depth and not depended on as a starter I won't be too critical. I've been livid the past two seasons when he has made the 53 man roster. That being said, he played much better this season than I thought possible.

Regarding the size issue on the interior oline, Caldwell is on the hefty side for an NFL center and was drafted to play that position. Remember, also, that the first lineman ever drafted by Kubiak was Charles Spencer. He was a giant human being and they were immediately excited about him. All these undersized guys were picked up in late rounds or as UDFA. So, I see no real indication that they want undersized guys. The reality is that when they are filling out their roster and they have limited players to choose from, they will pick an athletic guy over an overweight plodder. Ideally, they want a physical lineman with size and athleticism... ie: Charles Spencer, Winston (drafted to play guard), Caldwell, Duane Brown.Spencer was LT with good slide movement with feet if I remember and not as agile as Duane Brown. ALso, I think the offensive scheme changed some from when Spencer and Winston came aboard. I don't think Brown is an example of what is wanted as a LT in this ZBS, just the best remaining choice. There is a strong chance imo that our Oline will consist of what is on our roster.

ArlingtonTexan
01-28-2010, 07:18 PM
[QUOTE=dalemurphy;1354829]Spencer was LT with good slide movement with feet if I remember and not as agile as Duane Brown. ALso, I think the offensive scheme changed some from when Spencer and Winston came aboard. I don't think Brown is an example of what is wanted as a LT in this ZBS, just the best remaining choice. There is a strong chance imo that our Oline will consist of what is on our roster.

My sense, no quotes or anything to support this, is that the Texans don't think they have the pure personnel issue in the interior line that many of us think. Maybe after they can objective view tape w/o the pressure of the season, this changes. Hopefully, they at least add at least one player either in FA or the draft, even if not in premium drafts spots or money.

beerlover
01-28-2010, 07:51 PM
My sense, no quotes or anything to support this, is that the Texans don't think they have the pure personnel issue in the interior line that many of us think. Maybe after they can objective view tape w/o the pressure of the season, this changes. Hopefully, they at least add at least one player either in FA or the draft, even if not in premium drafts spots or money.

I'm hoping Dennison has serious, more objective input concerning the OL? My gut feeling is they address OL both early & late via draft picks which fit what the ideal ZBS can be which could use more athletic & dominate execution of assignments. This is not a good year to aquire a premium OG/C via free agency, not alot of depth & collective bargining agreement holding would be free agents hostage :read: