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View Full Version : This game (Miami) will show what this team and coach is made of.


mussop
12-26-2009, 07:42 PM
Since the birth of this franchise we have never had a chance at making the playoffs this late in the season. I know there is very little chance of us actually making it but we have to aproach this game like its a playoff game.

I have been on the fire Kubiak bandwagon for awhile now but I will back off if we come out and play at a high intensity with a good game plan and Kubiak calls a solid game. Win or loose I want to see how this team is prepared for this type of atmosphere and how well Kubiak handles managing the game and the pressure.

I really hope we do well and Kubiak proves me wrong.

mariowillshine15
12-26-2009, 07:46 PM
Nice post. We play our first meaningful game this late in the season in franchise history.

No matter what our playoff chances are if we win we give ourselves a chance.

The dominoes can fall our way we just have to make sure we take care of business.

euro-Texan
12-26-2009, 07:56 PM
First and foremost I'm obviously on the Pro-Kubiak bandwagon. Irrigardless of our record, this is the best this team has ever played. I agree with you that this is where I will decide whether Kubes keeps my support or not. If our Texans show up ready to WIN like they did for about half the season, I will be happy playoffs or not. If we show up beaten before the first snap ala the Jets or second Jags game than my support of Kubiak will drop like a football out of Steve Slaton's hands. I'm keeping my fingers crossed that our team realizes what's at stake and plays 60 minutes of football at 100%

Norg
12-26-2009, 07:59 PM
@INDy-L
bye
vs Tenn-L
vs Indy-L
@jags- L



this pretty much shows us what are team is made of

we cant win more then 1 divison game r u SERIOUS !!!!!!!!!!

houstonspartan
12-26-2009, 08:03 PM
What worries me is that when we get into these situations with other teams, the other team always seem to "want it more" and steps up and snatches the win. The sense I get is that the Dolphins really need this win. If so, they might claw and scratch to get it.

We'll see. I hope I'm wrong. I'll be rooting for the Texans regardless.

J_R
12-26-2009, 08:04 PM
(Not directed at the OP but in general) So is this the biggest game in franchise history or biggest game of the season? What about a statement game?


Where have I heard that before? Every week seemed to be statement week or the biggest game in/of the franichse/season. I think we toss those terms around a little too much.


So what are we going to call it when we one day make the playoffs and lord willing the super bowl one day. Then those will become the biggest games in season AND franchise history, right? ;) :rolleyes:

TEXANRED
12-26-2009, 08:06 PM
Since the birth of this franchise we have never had a chance at making the playoffs this late in the season. I know there is very little chance of us actually making it but we have to aproach this game like its a playoff game.

I have been on the fire Kubiak bandwagon for awhile now but I will back off if we come out and play at a high intensity with a good game plan and Kubiak calls a solid game. Win or loose I want to see how this team is prepared for this type of atmosphere and how well Kubiak handles managing the game and the pressure.

I really hope we do well and Kubiak proves me wrong.

I don't wanna be the Debbie downer but this team showed us what they were made of in the month of November.

ATXtexanfan
12-26-2009, 08:10 PM
@INDy-L
bye
vs Tenn-L
vs Indy-L
@jags- L



this pretty much shows us what are team is made of

we cant win more then 1 divison game r u SERIOUS !!!!!!!!!!
Seriously, our division is a *****. we are held to a greater standard by our fans and our division rivals. Don't know which is worse.

TEXANRED
12-26-2009, 08:11 PM
Seriously, our division is a *****. we are held to a greater standard by our fans and our division rivals. Don't know which is worse.

A tough division is no excuse. Look at the NFC East.

Thorn
12-26-2009, 08:12 PM
I don't wanna be the Debbie downer but this team showed us what they were made of in the month of November.

Also, I believe I read this post last year if I'm not mistaken.

Not that there's anything wrong with rootin' for the Texans. I know I do.

CloakNNNdagger
12-26-2009, 08:15 PM
The HC, coaches and players should be playing this game (and the next) as though their jobs depended on it. Unfortunately, most of them, including the HC pretty well KNOW that THEY AREN'T.:mcnugget:

Showtime100
12-26-2009, 08:17 PM
This game (Miami) will show what this team and coach is made of.

Kidding, right? Everything the Texans currently are hinged on a Monday night vs Tennessee. I thought that was a given. If you need more proof as a Texan fan I hope you don't get it...lol.

ATXtexanfan
12-26-2009, 08:22 PM
A tough division is no excuse. Look at the NFC East.
Wasn't making an excuse at all. You play the cards your dealt. We will see the NFC east soon enough. Say we go 3-1 against the nfc east and 2-4 against our division? Will you say our division is a ***** then? Our division is still one step ahead of us in terms of talent and coaching. When we top our division we will be elite because our division is elite. Jax, ind, and tenn are better us. All there is too it.

Thorn
12-26-2009, 08:27 PM
The HC, coaches and players should be playing this game (and the next) as though their jobs depended on it. Unfortunately, most of them, including the HC pretty well KNOW that THEY AREN'T.:mcnugget:

Reality is like asking the aliens to their face if they actually exist. Unless you ask them on their spaceship, it’s rather pointless.

euro-Texan
12-26-2009, 08:41 PM
I don't wanna be the Debbie downer but this team showed us what they were made of in the month of November.

Yeah so did the Steelers and they won a superbowl last year. Hell how many teams in the AFC are under 9 wins? We are missing some important peices and still playing. I think we can pull this one out. Go TEXANS!

houstonspartan
12-26-2009, 08:45 PM
Kidding, right? Everything the Texans currently are hinged on a Monday night vs Tennessee. I thought that was a given. If you need more proof as a Texan fan I hope you don't get it...lol.

You are correct. The Monday night game was the biggest game this year, hands down. That loss really sucked the life out of a lot of fans.

mariowillshine15
12-26-2009, 08:46 PM
You are correct. The Monday night game was the biggest game this year, hands down. That loss really sucked the life out of a lot of fans.

Yea it was a heartwrenching loss but if fans stopped watching and supporting the Texans because of it then good riddance bandwagon fans.

TEXANRED
12-26-2009, 08:48 PM
Wasn't making an excuse at all. You play the cards your dealt. We will see the NFC east soon enough. Say we go 3-1 against the nfc east and 2-4 against our division? Will you say our division is a ***** then? Our division is still one step ahead of us in terms of talent and coaching. When we top our division we will be elite because our division is elite. Jax, ind, and tenn are better us. All there is too it.

If we don't toughen up our interior line and get a run game we could be going 6-10 next year.

Showtime100
12-26-2009, 08:49 PM
Yeah so did the Steelers and they won a superbowl last year. Hell how many teams in the AFC are under 9 wins? We are missing some important peices and still playing. I think we can pull this one out. Go TEXANS!

BFD. I don't see what that matters. If you ask me this season hurts more BECAUSE the playoffs won't take 11 wins like many people thought.

Agreed on the GO TEXANS rah rah, but the rest of it is rationalization HOF material.

houstonspartan
12-26-2009, 08:51 PM
Wasn't making an excuse at all. You play the cards your dealt. We will see the NFC east soon enough. Say we go 3-1 against the nfc east and 2-4 against our division? Will you say our division is a ***** then? Our division is still one step ahead of us in terms of talent and coaching. When we top our division we will be elite because our division is elite. Jax, ind, and tenn are better us. All there is too it.

Bullshit. No, that's not all there is to it.

First, no way do we go 3-1 against the NFC East. Do you know what teams are in that division? Dallas, Philly, Washington, and NY Giants. That is a VERY TOUGH DIVISION. Those teams are extremely competitive and tough, and we are going to struggle against them.

Secondly, Jax and Tenn are not better than us. Especially not this year. I am SICK AND TIRED of the "our division is tough" excuse. Ok, it's tough. So freaking what? And it is not the toughest in the NFL, as it has been in the past.

The attitude of "Jax, Ind and Tenn are better than us" is why we're last in the division every year. It's not true that we're the worst team in the division, and yet we think we are, and that's how we play.

houstonspartan
12-26-2009, 08:55 PM
Yea it was a heartwrenching loss but if fans stopped watching and supporting the Texans because of it then good riddance bandwagon fans.

It's not that simple. It's not black and white. I know someone who has been a season ticket holder from day one of this franchise, and has always been mr, rah, rah. That loss really destroyed him. Yes, he kept going to the games and kept supporting the team, but his energy was a lot less positive than it was before.

As has been said numerous times, you can't have a bandwagon if the team has never been successful. Sure, we should support our team, but the Texans have to start giving back the investment many of us have made in them.

euro-Texan
12-26-2009, 08:56 PM
BFD. I don't see what that matters. If you ask me this season hurts more BECAUSE the playoffs won't take 11 wins like many people thought.

Agreed on the GO TEXANS rah rah, but the rest of it is Rationalization HOF material.

I doubt I'm the first person to compare us to another team. I suppose it's okay if it's to a looser though. Truth is W/L records mean little as Arizona went to the play offs with 9 wins while NE didn't with 11 wins last year. If you were to look at the quality of play alone, we are a much better team half the time and a revisited version of our 2004 team the rest of the time. NFL teams historicaly do play hot or cold. It's just the way it is. I'm not happy about it either, but if we are able to play well over the next two weeks and certain cards fall our way than I will be very happy. rah rah Go Texans!

Showtime100
12-26-2009, 08:56 PM
Bullshit. No, that's not all there is to it.

First, no way do we go 3-1 against the NFC East. Do you know what teams are in that division? Dallas, Philly, Washington, and NY Giants. That is a VERY TOUGH DIVISION. Those teams are extremely competitive and tough, and we are going to struggle against them.

Secondly, Jax and Tenn are not better than us. Especially not this year. I am SICK AND TIRED of the "our division is tough" excuse. Ok, it's tough. So freaking what? And it is not the toughest in the NFL, as it has been in the past.

The attitude of "Jax, Ind and Tenn are better than us" is why we're last in the division every year. It's not true that we're the worst team in the division, and yet we think we are, and that's how we play.

This is where some of you lose me. we have the worst division record in the AFC South, yet we are not the worst.(?)

We all are tired of hearing this, but you seem to want others to quit saying it. I want the Texans to do something about it.

BTW, the NFC East isn't all that scary in comparison to the rest of the league, IMO.

euro-Texan
12-26-2009, 09:01 PM
This is where some of you lose me. we have the worst division record in the AFC South, yet we are not the worst.(?)

We all are tired of hearing this, but you seem to want others to quit saying it. I want the Texans to do something about it.

BTW, the NFC East isn't all that scary in comparison to the rest of the league, IMO.

AFC South toughest division in the NFL hands down.

houstonspartan
12-26-2009, 09:04 PM
This is where some of you lose me. we have the worst division record in the AFC South, yet we are not the worst.(?)

We all are tired of hearing this, but you seem to want others to quit saying it. I want the Texans to do something about it.

BTW, the NFC East isn't all that scary in comparison to the rest of the league, IMO.

Most of us can agree that our division record doesn't reflect the true talent of this team. It's one reason why a lot of us are so angry. We're underachieving.

My point, just to be clear, was that we're a better team, especially this year, than Tenn and Jax. But, we blew all of those games, and we're back at the bottom yet again, even though we have more talent than a last place team. I refuse to believe that Jax is a better team than we are.

As for the NFC East, I can easily see our team getting intimidated by those teams and folding.

euro-Texan
12-26-2009, 09:07 PM
Most of us can agree that our division record doesn't reflect the true talent of this team. It's one reason why a lot of us are so angry. We're underachieving.

My point, just to be clear, was that we're a better team, especially this year, than Tenn and Jax. But, we blew all of those games, and we're back at the bottom yet again, even though we have more talent than a last place team. I refuse to believe that Jax is a better team than we are.

As for the NFC East, I can easily see our team getting intimidated by those teams and folding.

If our team is intimidated by Washington then they no longer rate my support.
I believe they will be more intimidated by us than we of them.

houstonspartan
12-26-2009, 09:09 PM
I doubt I'm the first person to compare us to another team. I suppose it's okay if it's to a looser though. Truth is W/L records mean little as Arizona went to the play offs with 9 wins while NE didn't with 11 wins last year. If you were to look at the quality of play alone, we are a much better team half the time and a revisited version of our 2004 team the rest of the time. NFL teams historicaly do play hot or cold. It's just the way it is. I'm not happy about it either, but if we are able to play well over the next two weeks and certain cards fall our way than I will be very happy. rah rah Go Texans!

Wow. The excuse-making in your post is amazing.

And, w's and l's don't matter???

Wow. No words.

houstonspartan
12-26-2009, 09:10 PM
If our team is intimidated by Washington then they no longer rate my support.
I believe they will be more intimidated by us than we of them.

I think Washington might bounce back stronger next year than we think.

And, our team was intimidated by St. Louis, so what does that say?

euro-Texan
12-26-2009, 09:12 PM
Wow. The excuse-making in your post is amazing.

And, w's and l's don't matter???

Wow. No words.

to clarify... W/L DO MATTER. although the difference between 7-9 and 9-7 can be affected by strength of schedule and player losses and are NOT definitive to improvment or regression.

euro-Texan
12-26-2009, 09:13 PM
I think Washington might bounce back stronger next year than we think.

And, our team was intimidated by St. Louis, so what does that say?

Intimidated? I think not sir. Am I on a Cowboys site?

houstonspartan
12-26-2009, 09:14 PM
Intimidated? I think not sir. Am I on a Cowboys site?

LOL. You're right. That whopping 3-point win over St. Louis was a total Texan blow out. We dominated that game from kick off.

LMAO.

Goatcheese
12-26-2009, 09:17 PM
LOL. You're right. That whopping 3-point win over St. Louis was a total Texan blow out. We dominated that game from kick off.

LMAO.

If not for 3 mistakes they would have scored another 10-14 points. The game was much more lopsided than the final score would otherwise indicate.

Showtime100
12-26-2009, 09:20 PM
to clarify... W/L DO MATTER. although the difference between 7-9 and 9-7 can be affected by strength of schedule and player losses and are NOT definitive to improvment or regression.

This probably doesn't go with the flow of this conversation, but I firmly believe Kubiak cost us 10-6 (3 games give or take IMO) and the playoffs so anyone who says the Texans are close or have a good team I don't wish to argue. I like the guy, but just don't like the job he's done.

Showtime100
12-26-2009, 09:22 PM
If not for 3 mistakes they would have scored another 10-14 points. The game was much more lopsided than the final score would otherwise indicate.

Problem is, the 3 happened and usually do. Wuddacuddashudda is a fictitious world.

euro-Texan
12-26-2009, 09:26 PM
This probably doesn't go with the flow of this conversation, but I firmly believe Kubiak cost us 10-6 (3 games give or take IMO) and the playoffs so anyone who says the Texans are close or have a good team I don't wish to argue. I like the guy, but just don't like the job he's done.

So he's responsible for the losses and somehow the texans beat Cincy despite him. I guess I see the fact that we were a part of every game this year (even the Jets) with the chance to win. Unlike Baltimore or Pittsburg last year we have arrived the W/L colum doesn't reflect it but he have taken the next step.

Showtime100
12-26-2009, 09:29 PM
So he's responsible for the losses and somehow the texans beat Cincy despite him. I guess I see the fact that we were a part of every game this year (even the Jets) with the chance to win. Unlike Baltimore or Pittsburg last year we have arrived the W/L colum doesn't reflect it but he have taken the next step.

He's responsible to the extent of three games (as I said, give or take). Wow, we beat Cincy. You DO know for every win you give as testimony I can counter with a loss of the same magnitude, right?

DexmanC
12-26-2009, 09:30 PM
So he's responsible for the losses and somehow the texans beat Cincy despite him. I guess I see the fact that we were a part of every game this year (even the Jets) with the chance to win. Unlike Baltimore or Pittsburg last year we have arrived the W/L colum doesn't reflect it but he have taken the next step.

It would appear that way, but we have been beating non AFC South teams
for the last 3 years. We were 6-4, 7-3, and now 6-2 out of the division.
However, during the same span, we've gone 1-5, 2-4, 1-5 IN The AFC South.
What we have here, are three consecutive years of beating everybody else,
and sucking in our own division. So, WHERE is this mythical "next step" you
speak of?

ATXtexanfan
12-26-2009, 09:31 PM
Bullshit. No, that's not all there is to it.

First, no way do we go 3-1 against the NFC East. Do you know what teams are in that division? Dallas, Philly, Washington, and NY Giants. That is a VERY TOUGH DIVISION. Those teams are extremely competitive and tough, and we are going to struggle against them.

Secondly, Jax and Tenn are not better than us. Especially not this year. I am SICK AND TIRED of the "our division is tough" excuse. Ok, it's tough. So freaking what? And it is not the toughest in the NFL, as it has been in the past.

The attitude of "Jax, Ind and Tenn are better than us" is why we're last in the division every year. It's not true that we're the worst team in the division, and yet we think we are, and that's how we play.
I think our division is better than the nfc east, that's all. The nfc east is media driven.

houstonspartan
12-26-2009, 09:31 PM
This probably doesn't go with the flow of this conversation, but I firmly believe Kubiak cost us 10-6 (3 games give or take IMO) and the playoffs so anyone who says the Texans are close or have a good team I don't wish to argue. I like the guy, but just don't like the job he's done.

Agree 100 percent.

euro-Texan
12-26-2009, 09:33 PM
He's responsible to the extent of three games (as I said, give or take). Wow, we beat Cincy. You DO know for every win you give as testimony I can counter with a loss of the same magnitude, right?

Agreed and the same can be said for about every other team in the league. I know Indy is undefeated, but they did win quite a few by just 3 and wins by 3 don't really count do they, I mean if its the Texans beating St Louis they don't.

Goatcheese
12-26-2009, 09:34 PM
Problem is, the 3 happened and usually do. Wuddacuddashudda is a fictitious world.

And your point is?

They dominated the game, but cost themselves points with stupid mistakes. It was a much more lopsided game than the score would otherwise indicate.

houstonspartan
12-26-2009, 09:34 PM
It would appear that way, but we have been beating non AFC South teams
for the last 3 years. We were 6-4, 7-3, and now 6-2 out of the division.
However, during the same span, we've gone 1-5, 2-4, 1-5 IN The AFC South.
What we have here, are three consecutive years of beating everybody else,
and sucking in our own division. So, WHERE is this mythical "next step" you
speak of?

But wait, Dex, don't forget that we're in the "toughest division in football." We should be ok with losing all of our division games for that reason alone.

lol.

People really don't understand how important division games are, do they?

houstonspartan
12-26-2009, 09:36 PM
And your point is?

They dominated the game, but cost themselves points with stupid mistakes. It was a much more lopsided game than the score would otherwise indicate.

The point is, we're ALWAYS making the SAME mistakes, over and over again.

If it was a more lopsided game than the score indicated, why were most of the fan base, and even some of the players, unhappy with the game?

They did not dominate St. Louis.

euro-Texan
12-26-2009, 09:37 PM
It would appear that way, but we have been beating non AFC South teams
for the last 3 years. We were 6-4, 7-3, and now 6-2 out of the division.
However, during the same span, we've gone 1-5, 2-4, 1-5 IN The AFC South.
What we have here, are three consecutive years of beating everybody else,
and sucking in our own division. So, WHERE is this mythical "next step" you
speak of?

******* it your right we suck! Lets clean house and start over maybe in 4-5 years we will win.

Showtime100
12-26-2009, 09:38 PM
Agreed and the same can be said for about every other team in the league. I know Indy is undefeated, but they did win quite a few by just 3 and wins by 3 don't really count do they, I mean if its the Texans beating St Louis they don't.

OK, all cool. I would rather be in Indy's shoes...lol. I think Houston is that close (to success) given what I've seen. (See my opinion of Kubes in above posts)

Showtime100
12-26-2009, 09:41 PM
And your point is?

They dominated the game, but cost themselves points with stupid mistakes. It was a much more lopsided game than the score would otherwise indicate.

My point is (give me room) that the "if" argument is bogus. Stupid mistakes are reality.

Goatcheese, and I mean this, Happy Hollidays my friend. :)

DexmanC
12-26-2009, 09:46 PM
******* it your right we suck! Lets clean house and start over maybe in 4-5 years we will win.

I'm not saying "clean house." I'm saying get a new coach to steer the ship.
In the MODERN NFL, it's ridiculous to EXPECT a minimum of 5 years to build
a team. This team has the pieces to get 9 or 10 wins a year, but its
LEADERSHIP is very suspect.

Goatcheese
12-26-2009, 09:50 PM
The point is, we're ALWAYS making the SAME mistakes, over and over again.

If it was a more lopsided game than the score indicated, why were most of the fan base, and even some of the players, unhappy with the game?

They did not dominate St. Louis.

Did you even watch the game? I'm guessing no.

My point is (give me room) that the "if" argument is bogus. Stupid mistakes are reality.

Goatcheese, and I mean this, Happy Hollidays my friend. :)

I didn't make an "if" argument. I said they dominated the game and then shot themselves in the foot, costing them 10-14 points.

Missed field goals and dropped TD passes are self inflicted damage.

It was like an MMA match where one guy beats the crap out of the other but keeps falling flat on his face because he's clumsy.

Happy Holidays :worldpeace:

Showtime100
12-26-2009, 09:52 PM
Did you even watch the game? I'm guessing no.



I didn't make an "if" argument. I said they dominated the game and then shot themselves in the foot, costing them 10-14 points.

Missed field goals and dropped TD passes are self inflicted damage.

It was like an MMA match where one guy beats the crap out of the other but keeps falling flat on his face because he's clumsy.

Happy Holidays :worldpeace:

Yes, and so are great plays. That all I'm saying. It is all part of the game.

Hervoyel
12-26-2009, 10:00 PM
This game is going to tell us what we're made of? Right.

If they lose tomorrow we'll be hearing how the New England game will tell us what this coach and team are made of. If they lose that but McNair brings Kubiak back then we'll be hearing how next season will really tell us what's been accomplished. Then if we start slow we'll hear some other excuse for that but as soon as they win a game or two (against some bad teams) they'll all start talking about how they've really, really changed now and the "old Texans" are gone. Then they'll hit a rough patch (at approximately the same time they play a really good team) and we'll get to watch Eric Winston talk about how he doesn't know why this happens but they have to keep battling.....

This record has been skipping in that exact same spot for three years now.

rush2112mn
12-26-2009, 10:06 PM
Good Thread. I was thinking the same thing today.
This is the biggest game in franchise history....at least what I think.
We are going to see how bad this team wants to win the big game. This is it. Win or go home and play another ho hum game next week.

The leaders on this team need to show up tommorrow. Time to "man up". No excuses. Get er done.

It all comes down to who wants it more. Who is going to control the line of scrimmage. Who is going to win the battles in the trenches. Who is going to get the pressure on the other.

euro-Texan
12-26-2009, 10:07 PM
This game is going to tell us what we're made of? Right.

If they lose tomorrow we'll be hearing how the New England game will tell us what this coach and team are made of. If they lose that but McNair brings Kubiak back then we'll be hearing how next season will really tell us what's been accomplished. Then if we start slow we'll hear some other excuse for that but as soon as they win a game or two (against some bad teams) they'll all start talking about how they've really, really changed now and the "old Texans" are gone. Then they'll hit a rough patch (at approximately the same time they play a really good team) and we'll get to watch Eric Winston talk about how he doesn't know why this happens but they have to keep battling.....

This record has been skipping in that exact same spot for three years now.

Seriously? Really? Look, I will whole-heartedly admit we are not where I would have liked us to be, but to suggest that we are in the same spot we were three years ago is rediculous. We are a respected team now for the FIRST time in franchise history. I seriously doubt there is any team in this league that licks their chops at the thought of playing against the Texans. Maybe Indy fans, but even their players realize that we are no pushover and it takes everything they can muster to pull off a win.

houstonspartan
12-26-2009, 10:11 PM
Good Thread. I was thinking the same thing today.
This is the biggest game in franchise history....at least what I think.
We are going to see how bad this team wants to win the big game. This is it. Win or go home and play another ho hum game next week.

The leaders on this team need to show up tommorrow. Time to "man up". No excuses. Get er done.

It all comes down to who wants it more. Who is going to control the line of scrimmage. Who is going to win the battles in the trenches. Who is going to get the pressure on the other.

Yep. This is exactly what I said on page one of this thread. This will come down to who "wants it" more.

houstonspartan
12-26-2009, 10:15 PM
Seriously? Really? Look, I will whole-heartedly admit we are not where I would have liked us to be, but to suggest that we are in the same spot we were three years ago is rediculous. We are a respected team now for the FIRST time in franchise history. I seriously doubt there is any team in this league that licks their chops at the thought of playing against the Texans. Maybe Indy fans, but even their players realize that we are no pushover and it takes everything they can muster to pull off a win.

Yes, we're respected more now than we were a few years ago, but that hasn't translated to W's. And, I think the point he was making was that this team has developed a pattern.

It's not a stretch to predict next season using this teams past performance as a baseline. For example, next year we're looking at at least five division losses. That's five losses right off the bat. Then, the AFC East will bring about two (and I'm being generous). That's seven losses.

Then, there's always a random loss or two thrown in, so that's at least 8, possibly 9 losses next year.

That may seem harsh, but I think based on this team's performance, it's fair.

CloakNNNdagger
12-26-2009, 10:17 PM
This game is going to tell us what we're made of? Right.

If they lose tomorrow we'll be hearing how the New England game will tell us what this coach and team are made of. If they lose that but McNair brings Kubiak back then we'll be hearing how next season will really tell us what's been accomplished. Then if we start slow we'll hear some other excuse for that but as soon as they win a game or two (against some bad teams) they'll all start talking about how they've really, really changed now and the "old Texans" are gone. Then they'll hit a rough patch (at approximately the same time they play a really good team) and we'll get to watch Eric Winston talk about how he doesn't know why this happens but they have to keep battling.....

This record has been skipping in that exact same spot for three years now.

Seriously? Really? Look, I will whole-heartedly admit we are not where I would have liked us to be, but to suggest that we are in the same spot we were three years ago is rediculous. We are a respected team now for the FIRST time in franchise history. I seriously doubt there is any team in this league that licks their chops at the thought of playing against the Texans. Maybe Indy fans, but even their players realize that we are no pushover and it takes everything they can muster to pull off a win.


I need to go more with Hervoyel's take. How many times could you tell YOUR boss "I'll gladly pay you Tuesday for a hamburger today"?:shades:

euro-Texan
12-26-2009, 10:19 PM
While I'm not excited about what could have been, I'm excited about the progress we have made. This is a big game tomorrow. It's the first time we have had one this late in the season. Everyone trashes this team because we've only beaten the teams were suppsed to. That is progress for us. It means we are better than losers. Three years ago we were St Louis, Seattle, Oakland, ect. We now see our players listed on top of the league leaders and we focus on what could/should have been, but make no mistake we are moving forward. The peices are coming together. A win tomorrow will raise the water mark on this franchise and will show the steady progress that leads to dominating this league.

euro-Texan
12-26-2009, 10:23 PM
I need to go more with Hervoyel's take. How many times could you tell YOUR boss "I'll gladly pay you Tuesday for a hamburger today"?:shades:

Say we fire the coach, hire a new one and trim the fat to build his team, how many years do we wait until we deceide it's time for another change?

Lucky
12-26-2009, 10:25 PM
We are a respected team now for the FIRST time in franchise history.
Who needs wins when you have R-E-S-P-E-C-T?

We are "better than losers"? That's the big step the Texans took this season? Seriously? Really?

houstonspartan
12-26-2009, 10:25 PM
While I'm not excited about what could have been, I'm excited about the progress we have made. This is a big game tomorrow. It's the first time we have had one this late in the season. Everyone trashes this team because we've only beaten the teams were suppsed to. That is progress for us. It means we are better than losers. Three years ago we were St Louis, Seattle, Oakland, ect. We now see our players listed on top of the league leaders and we focus on what could/should have been, but make no mistake we are moving forward. The peices are coming together. A win tomorrow will raise the water mark on this franchise and will show the steady progress that leads to dominating this league.

Fair enough. We haven't agreed in this thread, but I like your optimism and attitude.

euro-Texan
12-26-2009, 10:27 PM
Who needs wins when you have R-E-S-P-E-C-T?

We are "better than losers"? That's the big step the Texans took this season? Seriously? Really?

Yep and it's a HUGE step in the right direction.

houstonspartan
12-26-2009, 10:29 PM
Yep and it's a HUGE step in the right direction.

My only concern, though, is that we still have a horrible division record, and a bad record against competitive teams overall.

That's not good.

euro-Texan
12-26-2009, 10:34 PM
My only concern, though, is that we still have a horrible division record, and a bad record against competitive teams overall.

That's not good.

I don't either, but it's the next step. call me an optimist, but I believe that had Kris Brown kicked some damn FG's, had our backs held on to the football, had we not lost one of the best TE's in the game we would have a better record. Everyone loses players to injury, players screw up and great teams go on irregardless (see Colts), we are NOT a great team yet, but don't let the W/L colum blind you we are moving forward.

Showtime100
12-26-2009, 10:34 PM
My only concern, though, is that we still have a horrible division record, and a bad record against competitive teams overall.

That's not good.

Coudn't agree more.

mussop
12-26-2009, 10:35 PM
The HC, coaches and players should be playing this game (and the next) as though their jobs depended on it. Unfortunately, most of them, including the HC pretty well KNOW that THEY AREN'T.:mcnugget:

I dissagree. Despite the fact that we have very little chance at making the playoffs we do have a chance. If you are McNair this is exactly the type of situation you want judge your progress by. I guarantee you Kubiak and the team know this and the owner knows they know it.

Im not saying that we have to win this game but we dam well better come out and show some heart and Kubiak better not make any questionable decisions that contribute to a loss. Personally I think Kubiak has failed as a coach thus far. I dont think he deserves another chance no matter what happens the rest of this year but its not up to me. McNair has already made his feelings known on the situation.

I dont see how McNair could justify keeping Kubiak one more year if the team looks unprepaired or if Kubiak continues to make coaching errors in a playoff elimination game.

Factor all this in and this IS the biggest game of Kubiaks tenure. Its time for him to show what he is made of as a coach or return to a coordinator position.

Hervoyel
12-26-2009, 10:39 PM
I don't either, but it's the next step. call me an optimist, but I believe that had Kris Brown kicked some damn FG's, had our backs held on to the football, had we not lost one of the best TE's in the game we would have a better record. Everyone loses players to injury, players screw up and great teams go on irregardless (see Colts), we are NOT a great team yet, but don't let the W/L colum blind you we are moving forward.


Big Dr. Evil "Riiiiiiiiiiiiiight" for you there. I'll make a point of not letting those pesky losses cloud my opinion of the team.

houstonspartan
12-26-2009, 10:42 PM
Big Dr. Evil "Riiiiiiiiiiiiiight" for you there. I'll make a point of not letting those pesky losses cloud my opinion of the team.

LOL. Co-sign.

Some people don't think w's and l's are important. Not sure what universe they're living in...

euro-Texan
12-26-2009, 10:45 PM
Big Dr. Evil "Riiiiiiiiiiiiiight" for you there. I'll make a point of not letting those pesky losses cloud my opinion of the team.

hahaha. I'm saying a three point loss to a team you should have beat, but lost too because your kicker can't do his job is NOT as bad a 30 point loss to a team that dominates you on every side of the ball.

J_R
12-26-2009, 10:46 PM
Show what the coach is made of? This is a big game towards the slim chances at the playoffs. I thought we already knew how Gary faired in "big games"? ;)

houstonspartan
12-26-2009, 10:55 PM
The guys on the NFL network just had a lightening round where a question was asked and they all had to answer it. One question was: "Who'se more likely to be fired, Jack Del Rio or Gary Kubiak?"

They all said Kubiak. ALL OF THEM.

Del Rio gets a lot of flack, but he knows how to rally his players at the right time to win and turn a season around.

euro-Texan
12-26-2009, 10:56 PM
The guys on the NFL network just had a lightening round where a question was asked and they all had to answer it. One question was: "Who'se more likely to be fired, Jack Del Rio or Gary Kubiak?"

They all said Kubiak. ALL OF THEM.

Del Rio gets a lot of flack, but he knows how to rally his players at the right time to win and turn a season around.

NFL LIGHTNING ROUND???? Well the gods have spoken!

euro-Texan
12-26-2009, 10:57 PM
The guys on the NFL network just had a lightening round where a question was asked and they all had to answer it. One question was: "Who'se more likely to be fired, Jack Del Rio or Gary Kubiak?"

They all said Kubiak. ALL OF THEM.

Del Rio gets a lot of flack, but he knows how to rally his players at the right time to win and turn a season around.

Did they mention which one of the Jonas brother was cuter?

houstonspartan
12-26-2009, 10:57 PM
NFL LIGHTNING ROUND???? Well the gods have spoken!

The point is, Kubiak can't hide behind his record. Everyone knows that four years is more than enough time.

euro-Texan
12-26-2009, 10:58 PM
The guys on the NFL network just had a lightening round where a question was asked and they all had to answer it. One question was: "Who'se more likely to be fired, Jack Del Rio or Gary Kubiak?"

They all said Kubiak. ALL OF THEM.

Del Rio gets a lot of flack, but he knows how to rally his players at the right time to win and turn a season around.

Didn't they pick Pittsburg to win the AFC?

houstonspartan
12-26-2009, 11:00 PM
Didn't they pick Pittsburg to win the AFC?

They also picked us to have 11 wins this season. What is your point?

euro-Texan
12-26-2009, 11:01 PM
They also picked us to have 11 wins this season. What is your point?

ummmmm that is my point

houstonspartan
12-26-2009, 11:03 PM
ummmmm that is my point

Uh, guess why they predicted us at 11 games? Because we are TALENTED. You don't seem to think so, but trust, me, we are.

Look, you keep your low standards and acceptance of shitty football. The rest of us like to win, and we think four years is enough.

Lucky
12-26-2009, 11:04 PM
The guys on the NFL network just had a lightening round where a question was asked and they all had to answer it. One question was: "Who'se more likely to be fired, Jack Del Rio or Gary Kubiak?"

They all said Kubiak. ALL OF THEM.
Kubiak has only one year left on his contract. JDR is under contract through 2012. Wayne Weaver couldn't afford to can Del Rio if he wanted to.

euro-Texan
12-26-2009, 11:06 PM
Uh, guess why they predicted us at 11 games? Because we are TALENTED. You don't seem to think so, but trust, me, we are.

Look, you keep your low standards and acceptance of shitty football. The rest of us like to win, and we think four years is enough.

Ohhh yall like to win? Shit! I was looking for a fan site where we could relish in sub-par performance. I guess I'm in the wrong site. Are you high?

houstonspartan
12-26-2009, 11:07 PM
Kubiak has only one year left on his contract. JDR is under contract through 2012. Wayne Weaver couldn't afford to can Del Rio if he wanted to.

Perhaps, but, Del Rio seems to always get his teams rolling once the season starts. They're really not a better team than we are. Heck, the NFL Network guys even said we've spent a ton of more money on our team. They stumbled out the gate again this year. And yet, there's Jacksonville, in the mix as usual.

Wolf
12-26-2009, 11:10 PM
I have to go with Herv.. how many times do we hear.. "this is the biggest game in franchise history " or" this game will show what we are made of" .. I am not bashing anyone, but we are what we are 7-7 and an inconsistent team still,


it kinda reminds me of someone coming up and saying that I am racist and I say.. " no, I am not not, I have 2 black friends"


what I am getting at is, I wonder if fans of NE or SD or whoever continually view games as the biggest in franchise history?. Texans seem to do it a lot
I tend to lean on that if the fans are wondering what team will show up on Sunday just means it is still an inconsistent team :shades:

euro-Texan
12-26-2009, 11:10 PM
Uh, guess why they predicted us at 11 games? Because we are TALENTED. You don't seem to think so, but trust, me, we are.

Look, you keep your low standards and acceptance of shitty football. The rest of us like to win, and we think four years is enough.

Enough for what? We were one of the worst teams in football four years ago. There is no magic solution to turn a turd into gold. It takes years to rebuild and we are moving along towards that. to suggest that I don't want this team to succeed is freaking rediculous!

euro-Texan
12-26-2009, 11:13 PM
I have to go with Herv.. how many times do we hear.. "this is the biggest game in franchise history " or" this game will show what we are made of" .. I am not bashing anyone, but we are what we are 7-7 and an inconsistent team still,


it kinda reminds me of someone coming up and saying that I am racist and I say.. " no, I am not not, I have 2 black friends"


what I am getting at is, I wonder if fans of NE or SD or whoever continually view games as the biggest in franchise history?. Texans seem to do it a lot
I tend to lean on that if the fans are wondering what team will show up on Sunday just means it is still an inconsistent team :shades:


I doubt NE or SD have said that in a while, but we are the newest expansion franchise in the league therfore we have a lot of milestones ahead of us. We have had more "biggest games" in the last three years than ever before and all of that without regressing. Always moving forward!

Wolf
12-26-2009, 11:14 PM
Enough for what? We were one of the worst teams in football four years ago. There is no magic solution to turn a turd into gold. It takes years to rebuild and we are moving along towards that. to suggest that I don't want this team to succeed is freaking rediculous!

while I agree it takes some time, but we have seen MANY teams rise and fall within our 8 years of football..(yes I am getting impatient, esp in the free agency period)

euro-Texan
12-26-2009, 11:15 PM
Last year at this time the biggest game in our history was keeping the Bears out of the playoffs. and we did!

euro-Texan
12-26-2009, 11:17 PM
while I agree it takes some time, but we have seen MANY teams rise and fall within our 8 years of football..(yes I am getting impatient, esp in the free agency period)

We were a train wreck with nothing going for us minus AJ. we have consistantly improved our team. MANY other teams had more puzzle peices than we were given when Kubiak took over.

houstonspartan
12-26-2009, 11:19 PM
Enough for what? We were one of the worst teams in football four years ago. There is no magic solution to turn a turd into gold. It takes years to rebuild and we are moving along towards that. to suggest that I don't want this team to succeed is freaking rediculous!

I think you're comfortable with where we are right now. 8-8 is fine with you.

Have you taken a look at Sean Payton's record? He was hired at the same time as Kubiak. His team went undefeated until last week.

Look at Miami's coach, Tony Sporano. He took over a bad 1-15 team, totally overhauled it, and went 11-5 his first year. In his second year, so far, he is 7-7.

7-7 in a coach's second year is acceptable.
7-7 in a coach's fourth year is failure.

euro-Texan
12-26-2009, 11:22 PM
I think you're comfortable with where we are right now. 8-8 is fine with you.

Have you taken a look at Sean Payton's record? He was hired at the same time as Kubiak. His team went undefeated until last week.

Look at Miami's coach, Tony Sporano. He took over a bad 1-15 team, totally overhauled it, and went 11-5 his first year. In his second year, so far, he is 7-7.

7-7 in a coach's second year is acceptable.
7-7 in a coach's fourth year is failure.

Check out Sporano tomorrow after his teams loss and you will see it was all flash in the pan wins with the wildcat (see run and shoot) it's been figuered out! what's left? That's what you want? Maybe we could try the statue of liberty...

Lucky
12-26-2009, 11:25 PM
And yet, there's Jacksonville, in the mix as usual.
That's true. And how many Jags could play for the Texans? MJD and Mathis? Del Rio gets more out of less. I still can't stand the guy.
Last year at this time the biggest game in our history was keeping the Bears out of the playoffs. and we did!
I was more impressed by the win over Jacksonville in 2004, that knocked the Jags out of the playoffs. It's sad that either would be considered our biggest win.

devo-x
12-26-2009, 11:26 PM
Hmm .... I still have my season prediction of 9-7 on the line tomorrow - Will the Texans rise to the occasion? :thinking:

euro-Texan
12-26-2009, 11:31 PM
That's true. And how many Jags could play for the Texans? MJD and Mathis? Del Rio gets more out of less. I still can't stand the guy.

I was more impressed by the win over Jacksonville in 2004, that knocked the Jags out of the playoffs. It's sad that either would be considered our biggest win.

Agreed! I'm just saying that having more "biggest games" is a good thing. I don't think we have a serious contendor line-up yet. We're closer than ever, but we still have holes and to say we should cash out and change directions is idiotic.

Lucky
12-26-2009, 11:41 PM
...to say we should cash out and change directions is idiotic.
Keep it civil. Idiocy is in the eye of the beholder.

euro-Texan
12-26-2009, 11:45 PM
Keep it civil. Idiocy is in the eye of the beholder.

okay, I'm grounded.

mussop
12-27-2009, 12:59 AM
Wow it was not my intention to start another thread to continue the pissing match between the settlers and the soapers. We all know where we stand it is well documented. I just wanted to disscuss the importance of this game in relation to Kubiaks future as our HC.

Whether Kubiak comes back or not is not our choice. And nothing we say is going to change that fact or anyone on this boards mind. WE ALL SHOULD KNOW THAT BY NOW. However this game could have a huge impact on that decision. That is why it is such an important game. Does it mean we are ready and have taken the next step if we win? Hell no!!! But dam sure should show whether or not Kubiak is capable of being the right coach to take this team towards that next step. At least in McNairs mind for one more week.

As long as we have even a minute chance of making the playoffs Kubiak should be under the microscope. This is a very important (winnable) game with playoff implacations. This could be Kubiaks last chance to shine and show everyone that he is the man.

I think he is going to fail misserably but I hope I am wrong. If he shows good in this game I will give him credit. Not because I want to but because I have no choice. And if he continues that good showing into next week then I will be OK with him coming back next year. Not thrilled but willing to except he has done what he needed to and except that I have no choice in the matter.

Without arguing over whether or not he should or shouldnt go (which we have no control over) can we debate the importance of this game? :rant:

DexmanC
12-27-2009, 06:23 AM
hahaha. I'm saying a three point loss to a team you should have beat, but lost too because your kicker can't do his job is NOT as bad a 30 point loss to a team that dominates you on every side of the ball.

EVERY team that doesn't meet its goals has a "CouldaWouldaShoulda" story!
You can NOT let that handcuff you from BECOMING successful. Those teams
SET high standards hand HOLD PEOPLE ACCOUNTABLE FOR NOT REACHING
THEM!

euro-Texan
12-27-2009, 08:00 AM
EVERY team that doesn't meet its goals has a "CouldaWouldaShoulda" story!
You can NOT let that handcuff you from BECOMING successful. Those teams
SET high standards hand HOLD PEOPLE ACCOUNTABLE FOR NOT REACHING
THEM!

Agreed the ones accountable are the Browns and Slatton. Fire 'em

DexmanC
12-27-2009, 08:29 AM
I have to go with Herv.. how many times do we hear.. "this is the biggest game in franchise history " or" this game will show what we are made of" .. I am not bashing anyone, but we are what we are 7-7 and an inconsistent team still,


it kinda reminds me of someone coming up and saying that I am racist and I say.. " no, I am not not, I have 2 black friends"


what I am getting at is, I wonder if fans of NE or SD or whoever continually view games as the biggest in franchise history?. Texans seem to do it a lot
I tend to lean on that if the fans are wondering what team will show up on Sunday just means it is still an inconsistent team :shades:

It's an amazing line by the Texans' Marketing Department. It hypes up
games every other franchise in the league sees as important, but they
are ALL important. This keeps excitement for a 3-7, 7-7, 6-8, 1-14 team
sky high. It's all about selling those seats, baby!

It's just that if Bob keeps this up, and doesn't start delivering winning
seasons, he will lose credibility just like Uncle Drayton has. Les Alexander's
club doesn't overhype itself, and although they are a middle-of-the-road
basketball team, Toyota Center stays full. They play hard EVERY night,
which is more than we can say about the Astros OR Texans.

Lucky
12-27-2009, 09:00 AM
Agreed the ones accountable are the Browns and Slatton. Fire 'em
While you're at it, fire the guys who put them on the team and called plays for them.

CloakNNNdagger
12-27-2009, 09:02 AM
I have to go with Herv.. how many times do we hear.. "this is the biggest game in franchise history " or" this game will show what we are made of" .. I am not bashing anyone, but we are what we are 7-7 and an inconsistent team still,


it kinda reminds me of someone coming up and saying that I am racist and I say.. " no, I am not not, I have 2 black friends"


what I am getting at is, I wonder if fans of NE or SD or whoever continually view games as the biggest in franchise history?. Texans seem to do it a lot
I tend to lean on that if the fans are wondering what team will show up on Sunday just means it is still an inconsistent team :shades:


QFT. Heck, some are still pointing to our FIRST game.......19-10........ as the biggest game. But it seems that the Texans office may have been playing the BIGGEST GAME OF ALL........all along............on the fans................

ATXtexanfan
12-27-2009, 09:20 AM
Hmm .... I still have my season prediction of 9-7 on the line tomorrow - Will the Texans rise to the occasion? :thinking:
I think I went with 10 wins. Reality is we aren't as good as everyone HOPED. Still moving forward though. 9-7 is fine by me. Accept the texans for what they are. They aren't over acheivers. Blame can be spread all around. I hope we play 4 qtrs.

CloakNNNdagger
12-27-2009, 09:39 AM
I think I went with 10 wins. Reality is we aren't as good as everyone HOPED. Still moving forward though. 9-7 is fine by me. Accept the texans for what they are. They aren't over acheivers. Blame can be spread all around. I hope we play 4 qtrs.

This what we have all hoped for all season..........you'd think that this rivals the pursuit of the HOLY GRAIL.

Lucky
12-27-2009, 09:45 AM
How many lines will be drawn in the sand?

This game (Titans) will show what this team and coach is made of...

I mean this game (Indy) will show what this team and coach is made of...

Wait, it's this game (JAX) will show what this team and coach is made of...

Forget that, this game (Fins) will show what this team and coach is made of...

We have a near full season of games that have shown what this team and coach are made of. My opinion won't change much because of this one game. It's one game of 16. How could it possibly trump the stretch of 4 divisional games the Texans choked away?

The Texans should defeat Miami. They have more talent. Miami is missing their starting QB & starting RB. Maybe they wouldn't have been a one year wonder had those guys been available all season?

By next week, New England will have clinched their division and will trot out their junior varsity team. And we will have Texan fans proclaim that game as the definitive contest in team history. After that win, the Texans will finish 9-7 and probably lose the wild card berth on a tiebreak. More fans will point to this as proof that the team is close. On the right track.

No. It will be a bitter reminder of a lost season. A season that should have been the springboard to the multiple playoff appearances so many here have predicted. A season where the Texan actually earn the league wide respect so many pretend is already there.

I already have enough evidence to know what this team and coach are made of. I won't be blinded by the fools gold of a meaningless 9-7 mark. This team will not become a playoff team under the current leadership. And another year with Gary Kubiak at the helm means another season lost.

ArlingtonTexan
12-27-2009, 09:50 AM
I think we already know what thi coach/team is made of...maybe i will be surprised positively, but I am really expecting to see what is already listed above me.

Texaninlild
12-27-2009, 09:59 AM
It is sad to look at the AFC's current playoff picture and think what 'coulda'. It was a year full of missed opportunity. If the Texans win, that will be nice, and expected like has been stated. Of course if we have a lead we will expect to blow it. It has become engrained in all of us to expect another shortcoming, either in a game or a season. We don't think like Indy where if they are winning or losing, they expect to win.

Silver Oak
12-27-2009, 10:09 AM
on the road versus a team fighting for the playoffs just as we are? I expect a good game irregardless of the outcome, but a loss or a win won't sway my opinion of which direction this team is headed.

for the soapers/doubters, check out some stats TC posted in her Chron blog:

Red Zone Production

Remember the big complaint last year about red zone production? Here's something I did not know but ran across and so I thought I'd pass it on. The Texans are tied for 4th in the league with the Giants with the number of red zone scoring attempts per game. Only the Saints, Patriots and Vikings are better. Most of the teams at the top of this list have good records.

The Texans are tied for 7th with the Ravens in red zone scores per game. Teams that are better are Saints, Vikings, Cards, Colts, Dolphins and Patriots.

What is interesting about this is something that Bill Barnwell of Football Outsiders discussed on this subject. That as teams get better moving the ball, eventually their red zone production tends to match the rest of their offense. That they are getting this sort of production despite (extreme understatement alert) struggling with the running game is remarkable to me.

http://blogs.chron.com/texanschick/2009/12/merry_vincemas.html

CloakNNNdagger
12-27-2009, 10:19 AM
on the road versus a team fighting for the playoffs just as we are? I expect a good game irregardless of the outcome, but a loss or a win won't sway my opinion of which direction this team is headed.

for the soapers/doubters, check out some stats TC posted in her Chron blog:

Red Zone Production

Remember the big complaint last year about red zone production? Here's something I did not know but ran across and so I thought I'd pass it on. The Texans are tied for 4th in the league with the Giants with the number of red zone scoring attempts per game. Only the Saints, Patriots and Vikings are better. Most of the teams at the top of this list have good records.

The Texans are tied for 7th with the Ravens in red zone scores per game. Teams that are better are Saints, Vikings, Cards, Colts, Dolphins and Patriots.

What is interesting about this is something that Bill Barnwell of Football Outsiders discussed on this subject. That as teams get better moving the ball, eventually their red zone production tends to match the rest of their offense. That they are getting this sort of production despite (extreme understatement alert) struggling with the running game is remarkable to me.

http://blogs.chron.com/texanschick/2009/12/merry_vincemas.html


This could be an example of stats leading to questionable conclusions. What this analysis leaves out is what percentage of the Red Zone scores are actually TDs rather than FGs.

ObsiWan
12-27-2009, 10:27 AM
@INDy-L
bye
vs Tenn-L
vs Indy-L
@jags- L



this pretty much shows us what are team is made of

we cant win more then 1 divison game r u SERIOUS !!!!!!!!!!

If we had posted that record with both our starting guards healthy, Slaton running as effectively as last year, and O.D. still in the lineup, I might be among the Soapers.
But I can't discount the loss of key personnel like some people seem to.
That's just nuts.
It's like saying your car should still give you the same zero-to-60 time it did when brand new but with two out of the eight spark plugs disconnected. It just won't happen.

DeMarCushPoll
12-27-2009, 10:32 AM
We were a train wreck with nothing going for us minus AJ. we have consistantly improved our team. MANY other teams had more puzzle peices than we were given when Kubiak took over.

I totally agree. When Kubiak took over it was worse than taking over an expansion team because he had to completely build a roster without the benefit of an expansion draft. That's why I say he should get more time. People make comparisons with other HC/teams that are able to turn programs around within a few years, but fail to realize that those teams had at least some talent to build upon. The Texans had nothing, except for AJ IMO.

SheTexan
12-27-2009, 10:44 AM
Screw stats!! It's the score at the end of the game that counts, PERIOD!!!!! Everything else is just fluff!! At the end of the season it's a win/lost STAT, nothing else matters. We have one of the best QBs in the league, according to stats, and probably the best WR EVER, and guess who's going to be sitting in their living rooms watching the playoffs on TV? YEP!! YOU, ME, and the TEXANS football team!!

Kaiser Toro
12-27-2009, 10:44 AM
I have reached a nexus point in my NFL experience this week. For the first time in Texans franchise history, they are alive in the playoff hunt while my fantasy teams are playing Tiger Woods.

Kubiak > my fantasy teams :kitten:

OzzO
12-27-2009, 10:46 AM
This could be an example of stats leading to questionable conclusions. What this analysis leaves out is what percentage of the Red Zone scores are actually TDs rather than FGs.

DING! Exactly.

As this game showing what the Texans are made of - as mentioned above, I think it already has been shown. The only thing this game will show (again as mentioned earlier) is their last chance to show if they can step up in a game that mean something.

This game will defintely put a punctuation on the season, one way or another. Whether that is a exclimation or question mark.

....and the only reason they're still in the playoff hunt this late in the season is because the rest of the AFC is mired in mediocrity, save for a few that excelled. Before Titans / Chargers - wasn't it like only 4 teams were technically eliminated from the playoff race?

infantrycak
12-27-2009, 11:08 AM
This could be an example of stats leading to questionable conclusions. What this analysis leaves out is what percentage of the Red Zone scores are actually TDs rather than FGs.

Well the same site has the Texans tied for 11th on TD's per game so the conclusion isn't really questionable.

Now what is funny at that site is their rankings. The AFC South is the only one with the rankings out of order with the standings. They have the Titans as a top 10 team while in 4th in the division with the Jags ranked behind the Texans although in 2nd ahead of the Texans.

Runner
12-27-2009, 11:46 AM
This could be an example of stats leading to questionable conclusions. What this analysis leaves out is what percentage of the Red Zone scores are actually TDs rather than FGs.

On the other hand, if the stat is accurate we might consider other areas where the team got worse to compensate for that improvement. It is tough to theoretically "get better" across the board and still remain static in the W/L column. Either the Texans are progressing at league average, or progress in one area is being countered by regression in another. Fans have a tendancy to overvalue the former and ignore or find excuses for the latter

infantrycak
12-27-2009, 11:50 AM
On the other hand, if the stat is accurate we might consider other areas where the team got worse to compensate for that improvement. It is tough to theoretically "get better" across the board and still remain static in the W/L column. Either the Texans are progressing at league average, or progress in one area is being countered by regression in another. Fans have a tendancy to overvalue the former and ignore or find excuses for the latter

Despite the multitude of blame threads running around here it is real simple - no running game. Give us last year's running game or any DD season and the Texans are in the playoffs this year.

Runner
12-27-2009, 11:58 AM
On the other hand, if the stat is accurate we might consider other areas where the team got worse to compensate for that improvement. It is tough to theoretically "get better" across the board and still remain static in the W/L column. Either the Texans are progressing at league average, or progress in one area is being countered by regression in another. Fans have a tendancy to overvalue the former and ignore or find excuses for the latter

Despite the multitude of blame threads running around here it is real simple - no running game. Give us last year's running game or any DD season and the Texans are in the playoffs this year.

I agree with that. A decent running game solves a multitude of problems this year. The Texans didn't have one.

thunderkyss
12-27-2009, 12:18 PM
A tough division is no excuse. Look at the NFC East.

NFC East
.. Non-Conf 7-7

AFC South
.. Non-Conf 11-4


The NFC East isn't even close.

houstonspartan
12-27-2009, 12:32 PM
How many lines will be drawn in the sand?

This game (Titans) will show what this team and coach is made of...

I mean this game (Indy) will show what this team and coach is made of...

Wait, it's this game (JAX) will show what this team and coach is made of...

Forget that, this game (Fins) will show what this team and coach is made of...

We have a near full season of games that have shown what this team and coach are made of. My opinion won't change much because of this one game. It's one game of 16. How could it possibly trump the stretch of 4 divisional games the Texans choked away?

The Texans should defeat Miami. They have more talent. Miami is missing their starting QB & starting RB. Maybe they wouldn't have been a one year wonder had those guys been available all season?

By next week, New England will have clinched their division and will trot out their junior varsity team. And we will have Texan fans proclaim that game as the definitive contest in team history. After that win, the Texans will finish 9-7 and probably lose the wild card berth on a tiebreak. More fans will point to this as proof that the team is close. On the right track.

No. It will be a bitter reminder of a lost season. A season that should have been the springboard to the multiple playoff appearances so many here have predicted. A season where the Texan actually earn the league wide respect so many pretend is already there.

I already have enough evidence to know what this team and coach are made of. I won't be blinded by the fools gold of a meaningless 9-7 mark. This team will not become a playoff team under the current leadership. And another year with Gary Kubiak at the helm means another season lost.

Very, very, very well said. Very eloquent and truthful.

We already know exactly what this team is made of.

thunderkyss
12-27-2009, 12:41 PM
Very, very, very well said. Very eloquent and truthful.

We already know exactly what this team is made of.

We know what this team is made of... in your opinion, is that enough to go 9-7? or do you think this is an 8-8 team or worse?

For the rest of us, that don't know, we're going to find out if 9-7 is worth playing for. We'll find out if that is part of this teams make-up.

I'm not arguing your feelings about this team based on our divisional performance this year. Winning those games would have meant one thing.. losing meant something else.

Winning these next to, will also mean something. Not the same thing, not as good, but somehting just the same.

We've got nothing to play for now, but a winning season.

Ryan
12-27-2009, 12:42 PM
JJ using his punt return skills :fans:

ObsiWan
12-27-2009, 02:14 PM
Despite the multitude of blame threads running around here it is real simple - no running game. Give us last year's running game or any DD season and the Texans are in the playoffs this year.

Rep.
Give me ast year's running game and O.D. for the whole year and we don't have that 4 game slide.

And I don't care if you're mad or out of patience or whatever, that's no excuse for suspending logic. You can't lose main cogs to your machine and expect it to perform at a high level - see the Pittsburgh Steelers.

Hervoyel
12-27-2009, 02:19 PM
I enjoyed the first half immensely but it never entered my mind that what we're seeing happen right now wouldn't happen. Half a game of near perfection and half a game of Moe, Curly, and Larry level stupidity is what the Texans are "made of".

Chris Brown is still a major part of this offense despite the fact that Arian Foster is running the ball well. This is the kind of stupid bullshit you get with Kubiak. It defies explanation.

I'm just going to watch the rest out of morbid curiosity. Will they hang on and win or will they lose it at the end and eliminate themselves from playoff contention with their own incompetence?

Lucky
12-27-2009, 02:23 PM
Rep.
Give me (l)ast year's running game...
Why is that not the responsibility of the coaching staff and the front office???

This is why Kubiak is the Teflon Man. Nothing ever sticks to him.

J_R
12-27-2009, 02:40 PM
So what did we learn thus far? They still dont know how to play 60 minutes of ball? Thats not new!

thunderkyss
12-27-2009, 02:45 PM
Rep.
Give me ast year's running game and O.D. for the whole year and we don't have that 4 game slide.

And I don't care if you're mad or out of patience or whatever, that's no excuse for suspending logic. You can't lose main cogs to your machine and expect it to perform at a high level - see the Pittsburgh Steelers.

Must spread rep.

OD was the last straw in a line of injuries that we've tried to ignore all year long.

Yet still remained viable & competitive in every game.

New_Texans
12-27-2009, 02:50 PM
Must spread rep.

OD was the last straw in a line of injuries that we've tried to ignore all year long.

Yet still remained viable & competitive in every game.

We were quite healthy last year, a bit too healthy now this year one can argue that injuries have completely held us back this year. Now we all see how much Pitts meant to the o-line too...we have to hope he comes back 100%

Runner
12-27-2009, 02:54 PM
Rep.
Give me ast year's running game and O.D. for the whole year and we don't have that 4 game slide.

And I don't care if you're mad or out of patience or whatever, that's no excuse for suspending logic. You can't lose main cogs to your machine and expect it to perform at a high level - see the Pittsburgh Steelers.

Must spread rep.

OD was the last straw in a line of injuries that we've tried to ignore all year long.

Yet still remained viable & competitive in every game.

The teams we are competing against had injuries too. It's a level playing field.

New_Texans
12-27-2009, 02:56 PM
The teams we are competing against had injuries too. It's a level playing field.

The only team i can think of having a significant injury to the par of OD being out is Indy with Bob Sanders.

Runner
12-27-2009, 03:04 PM
The teams we are competing against had injuries too. It's a level playing field.

The only team i can think of having a significant injury to the par of OD being out is Indy with Bob Sanders.

There are more than that. The team they are trying to hold off right now had some key injuries.

Ryan
12-27-2009, 03:04 PM
This team is made of Charmin Ultra.

Kubiak is made of....i really don't know. Sometimes he's iron man and the next he's this guy...

http://msnbcmedia2.msn.com/j/msnbc/Components/Photos/050816/050816_animalhouse_vlg_3p.widec.jpg

thunderkyss
12-27-2009, 03:09 PM
Why is that not the responsibility of the coaching staff and the front office???

This is why Kubiak is the Teflon Man. Nothing ever sticks to him.

I blame the coach.

Last year, we did a lot of pulling, and a little power O. This year, Kubiak seems to be adamant to run ZBS.

But I'm OK with that decision.

When did we lose Chester Pitts?

ObsiWan
12-27-2009, 03:13 PM
I blame the coach.

Last year, we did a lot of pulling, and a little power O. This year, Kubiak seems to be adamant to run ZBS.

But I'm OK with that decision.

When did we lose Chester Pitts?

Pitts got hurt in camp, remember? Then he tried to come back for the last preseason game (maybe two..?). He got hurt again in the Tenn. game and was done for the season.

Lucky
12-27-2009, 03:14 PM
When did we lose Chester Pitts?
Why didn't they sign a vet to backup Pitts?

ObsiWan
12-27-2009, 03:15 PM
The only team i can think of having a significant injury to the par of OD being out is Indy with Bob Sanders.

What about the Pittsburgh defense losing Polomalu? The negative effect on that defense was immediate.

Texecutioner
12-27-2009, 03:15 PM
Despite the multitude of blame threads running around here it is real simple - no running game. Give us last year's running game or any DD season and the Texans are in the playoffs this year.

Well you've got to have a HC that actually has a clue what a good running game is.

infantrycak
12-27-2009, 03:19 PM
Well you've got to have a HC that actually has a clue what a good running game is.

Well that's just an ignorant comment if you don't think Kubiak and Gibbs know what is a good running game.

ObsiWan
12-27-2009, 03:27 PM
Why didn't they sign a vet to backup Pitts?

who, on Pitts' level, was available? I assume you want equivalent performance, right?

So, tell me, who was there to pick up?

Runner
12-27-2009, 03:28 PM
When did we lose Chester Pitts?
Why didn't they sign a vet to backup Pitts?

They wasted a big opportunity to build young depth their first year here by carrying Flanagan, Bedell, and the like. Throw away roster spots.

Norg
12-27-2009, 03:30 PM
didnt we throw away one of our picks on ALex brink and A TE we dont even use!!!!!!!!!!


Boggles my mind

Texecutioner
12-27-2009, 03:32 PM
Well that's just an ignorant comment if you don't think Kubiak and Gibbs know what is a good running game.

Ignorant? I think the past 4 years of results speaks for itself. I really don't have to justify it any further than that.

And what makes it even worse is what a train wreck it looked like even before each season started with his bright ideas of Wally Lundi being a work horse and a brittle Amaan Green and then Chris "banged up" Brown. The furthest Kubes has ever gone into trying to get a guy was drafting Slaton in the 3rd who he never thought would be any more than a 3rd down change of pace guy and then benched him this season. And then he completely ignored the RB situation in last off season and the draft as well.

Kubes is a disaster to any team as far as a running game goes and there isn't any "spin" or "twist" you can put on that one.

ATXtexanfan
12-27-2009, 03:32 PM
They wasted a big opportunity to build young depth their first year here by carrying Flanagan, Bedell, and the like. Throw away roster spots.
First year?

Silver Oak
12-27-2009, 03:33 PM
wow...and this after a big road win.

mind boggling really.

Goatcheese
12-27-2009, 03:35 PM
I was impressed that they didn't run the HB option. :ant:

Runner
12-27-2009, 03:35 PM
They wasted a big opportunity to build young depth their first year here by carrying Flanagan, Bedell, and the like. Throw away roster spots.
First year?

Kubiak's first year.

Lucky
12-27-2009, 03:41 PM
who, on Pitts' level, was available? I assume you want equivalent performance, right?

So, tell me, who was there to pick up?
Jeremy Bridges would of been a solid pickup. Now starting at LT in Arizona.

vtech9
12-27-2009, 03:53 PM
Rep.
Give me ast year's running game and O.D. for the whole year and we don't have that 4 game slide.

And I don't care if you're mad or out of patience or whatever, that's no excuse for suspending logic. You can't lose main cogs to your machine and expect it to perform at a high level - see the Pittsburgh Steelers.

I don't care about last years team. I don't even think it matters that OD is out. What I want to see is a complete game. They look like the best team in the league, in the first half, and then it looks like a whole new team comes out in the 2nd half. I have to blame that on coaching. The DC goes to a soft zone, and just wants to keep the ball in front of them, but in the meantime lets the other team march right down the field. The offense starts trying to go with a ball control offense, which only results in 3 & outs, and gives the ball right back to the other team. IMHO, it's time for the coaching staff to go.

I enjoyed the first half immensely but it never entered my mind that what we're seeing happen right now wouldn't happen. Half a game of near perfection and half a game of Moe, Curly, and Larry level stupidity is what the Texans are "made of".

Chris Brown is still a major part of this offense despite the fact that Arian Foster is running the ball well. This is the kind of stupid bullshit you get with Kubiak. It defies explanation.

I'm just going to watch the rest out of morbid curiosity. Will they hang on and win or will they lose it at the end and eliminate themselves from playoff contention with their own incompetence?

I have to agree with Herv here. I knew they were going to let Miami back into the game. I was just hoping 27 points would be enough. It was, and it was fortunate, because they damned sure didn't do anything to help their cause.

This type of play has frustrated me all year, actually, since the start of the Texans. They are successful when they are aggressive. They may have a few setbacks, but overall, they are far more successful when they are aggressive. When they go to that passive Defense, they lose or just barely win after giving up a big lead. When they try to go to "run out the clock mode" on offense, all they do is help the other team win.

vtech9
12-27-2009, 04:00 PM
wow...and this after a big road win.

mind boggling really.

no....this after a 27-0 halftime lead that ended 27-20. The Texans didn't show up in the 2nd half. By my count, there are only two games this season that the Texans were actually beaten. The rest of them, the Texans beat themselves. This was almost another one.

ObsiWan
12-27-2009, 04:02 PM
Jeremy Bridges would of been a solid pickup. Now starting at LT in Arizona.

could he play guard?
Just askin' because I never heard of the guy.

euro-Texan
12-27-2009, 04:04 PM
no....this after a 27-0 halftime lead that ended 27-20. The Texans didn't show up in the 2nd half. By my count, there are only two games this season that the Texans were actually beaten. The rest of them, the Texans beat themselves. This was almost another one.

You would have rather seen a competitive game with us losing?

ObsiWan
12-27-2009, 04:07 PM
I don't care about last years team. I don't even think it matters that OD is out. What I want to see is a complete game. They look like the best team in the league, in the first half, and then it looks like a whole new team comes out in the 2nd half. I have to blame that on coaching.

Wait...
WHAT?!
I'll read the rest of your post in a moment. I can't get past this statement. You don't think losing a pro-bowl quality TE matters in a pass-happy offense. He had 40 catches when he went down. He's still third on the team in receiving yds and fourth in catches and he hasn't played in two months. You don't think losing that level of production matters...????

You cannot be serious.

vtech9
12-27-2009, 04:11 PM
You would have rather seen a competitive game with us losing?

I would rather see the Texans play the same way in the 2nd half as they did in the 1st. I want to see them play a complete game. I want to see them finish a game in dominant fashion, and quit letting teams back into a game they never should have been in.

New_Texans
12-27-2009, 04:14 PM
What about the Pittsburgh defense losing Polomalu? The negative effect on that defense was immediate.

Definitely, but I'm talking about teams the Texans played this year.

Lucky
12-27-2009, 04:16 PM
could he play guard?
Just askin' because I never heard of the guy.
Bridges has played guard most of his NFL career. The type of versatile O-lineman most good teams keep on their roster, just in case.

The running attack should not have been so reliant on one lineman, or there should have been an adequate backup. It has to be one or the other. You can't have the Kubiak Teflon Cake & eat it, too.

vtech9
12-27-2009, 04:16 PM
Wait...
WHAT?!
I'll read the rest of your post in a moment. I can't get past this statement. You don't think losing a pro-bowl quality TE matters in a pass-happy offense. He had 40 catches when he went down. He's still third on the team in receiving yds and fourth in catches and he hasn't played in two months. You don't think losing that level of production matters...????

You cannot be serious.

when they score 27 points in a half without him, they have proven that they can do it without him. Don't get me wrong, I think they would be a much better team with him, but him being out isn't the reason they don't score in the 2nd half of todays game, nor the reason they gave up 20 unanswered points in the 2nd half.

euro-Texan
12-27-2009, 04:17 PM
I would rather see the Texans play the same way in the 2nd half as they did in the 1st. I want to see them play a complete game. I want to see them finish a game in dominant fashion, and quit letting teams back into a game they never should have been in.

But three hours ago before kick off would you have been happy with a 27-20 win on the road?

vtech9
12-27-2009, 04:19 PM
But three hours ago before kick off would you have been happy with a 27-20 win on the road?

I'm happy with the win. I'm disappointed with the way they finished it.

New_Texans
12-27-2009, 04:19 PM
when they score 27 points in a half without him, they have proven that they can do it without him. Don't get me wrong, I think they would be a much better team with him, but him being out isn't the reason they don't score in the 2nd half of todays game, nor the reason they gave up 20 unanswered points in the 2nd half.

It probably does, I mean, if OD were there teams wouldnt be able to slide their D over to AJ's side and if he were there thats just another weapon the texans would have to move the ball. One of the problems i see is the fact that we can't seem to get the simple 3rd down conversions (when its 3 and modest) because David Anderson isnt the answer.

euro-Texan
12-27-2009, 04:20 PM
I think we tied Miami's hands with our 1st half performance and forced them to a position that we could control. We just didn't control them very well. But at the end of the game we won! Now on to week 17 and a chance for a playoff birth.

euro-Texan
12-27-2009, 04:21 PM
It probably does, I mean, if OD were there teams wouldnt be able to slide their D over to AJ's side and if he were there thats just another weapon the texans would have to move the ball. One of the problems i see is the fact that we can't seem to get the simple 3rd down conversions (when its 3 and modest) because David Anderson isnt the answer.

Anderson had a pretty clutch 3rd down catch.

Lucky
12-27-2009, 04:24 PM
You don't think losing a pro-bowl quality TE matters in a pass-happy offense.
I wouldn't say that Daniels wasn't missed. He's an outstanding receiving TE. But, the Texans averaged 282 yards passing in the games Daniels played. 300 yards per game in those that he missed. The Texans passing game adjusted.

The running attack and bone-headed decisions by Kubiak are what will keep the Texans out of the postseason.

ATXtexanfan
12-27-2009, 04:26 PM
I would rather see the Texans play the same way in the 2nd half as they did in the 1st. I want to see them play a complete game. I want to see them finish a game in dominant fashion, and quit letting teams back into a game they never should have been in.
Would you rather them lose them all? Not being an ass but a win is a win. Anything less means your not really a fan.

J_R
12-27-2009, 04:27 PM
That's what worries me about this team if they God willing make the playoffs. You are facing top notch teams where you're gonna be forced to play 60 minutes. Where you may be up 17 at one point but with the relaxed attitude or the attitude we got this game already, the good teams are going to come back on you. Does this team know how to play 60 minutes? They showed me once this season that they know how to. Again, sorta because they were forced to by the opposing team(Cincy) but I'm not exactly sure.

Silver Oak
12-27-2009, 04:30 PM
no....this after a 27-0 halftime lead that ended 27-20. The Texans didn't show up in the 2nd half. By my count, there are only two games this season that the Texans were actually beaten. The rest of them, the Texans beat themselves. This was almost another one.

NE Patriots scored 28 points in the first half, then scored only once the rest of the way.

By your logic, they suck. :thinking:

vtech9
12-27-2009, 04:33 PM
Would you rather them lose them all? Not being an ass but a win is a win. Anything less means your not really a fan.

Don't be stupid. I don't want the Texans to lose any of them, and if they would come out in the 2nd half and put teams away after getting up at halftime, they would probably already have a playoff spot locked up.

A 21-0 halftime lead @ Indy should have been a win as well, but the Texans didn't come out to play in the 2nd half, and therefore, lost.

ATXtexanfan
12-27-2009, 04:36 PM
Don't be stupid. I don't want the Texans to lose any of them, and if they would come out in the 2nd half and put teams away after getting up at halftime, they would probably already have a playoff spot locked up.

A 21-0 halftime lead @ Indy should have been a win as well, but the Texans didn't come out to play in the 2nd half, and therefore, lost.
But that's how these texans roll. No one can figure it out. Let it be. Hopefully we go up 28-0 next week against the pats. Not doubting your fanhood but the texans are what they are.

vtech9
12-27-2009, 04:44 PM
That's what worries me about this team if they God willing make the playoffs. You are facing top notch teams where you're gonna be forced to play 60 minutes. Where you may be up 17 at one point but with the relaxed attitude or the attitude we got this game already, the good teams are going to come back on you. Does this team know how to play 60 minutes? They showed me once this season that they know how to. Again, sorta because they were forced to by the opposing team(Cincy) but I'm not exactly sure.

exactly

thunderkyss
12-27-2009, 04:53 PM
when they score 27 points in a half without him, they have proven that they can do it without him. Don't get me wrong, I think they would be a much better team with him, but him being out isn't the reason they don't score in the 2nd half of todays game, nor the reason they gave up 20 unanswered points in the 2nd half.

I agree with you, that it's pathetic that we didn't score a point in the second half.

I won't put blame on the defense though. They played a good game, from start to finish. After Matt Schaub threw the INT on our first possession of the second half, The Dolphins went 3 & out, losing 3 yards on that drive.

They then forced 2 punts on two other possessions, So the Dolphins only scored on 3 of 6 possessions of the second half. I do believe we'd have played even better, had the offense could have stayed on the field a little more.

As far as this being the norm for the Texans, that just isn't true. Offense only playing one half of football yes, but it hasn't always been the first half. This year, a bigger problem had been Matt Schaub (& the offense) starting slow.

The last few games, it has been the first half, but hopefully that means they figured out the slow start thing, & can move on to working on the second half thing.

But a first possession INT, nobodies fault, then the fumble that wasn't called a fumble, and the INT that wasn't called an INT ( I know he was out of bounds, but he shouldn't have thrown that ball. If that was AJ, maybe, but what has Jacoby done to warrant that throw? He was covered). I don't have a problem with Kubiak calling off the dogs.....

That said, I think Miami stepped it up big time on defense in the second half. Even though we had a good day running, & Arian Foster's 1st down pick-up on the final drive was huge, We know that we can't run the ball when we have to.

Speaking of which, I want to give Kudos to the OL, just like today, they've been playing well enough to run the ball on the teams we've played over the last 5 weeks. We just didn't have a running back, or for whatever reason Kubiak wouldn't play Moats, who could take advantage of it.

edo783
12-27-2009, 04:57 PM
If we manage to back into the play offs, it will likely be a one and out. However, that is OK. We are a young team learning how/what it takes to win in the NFL. Would I like them to go further, dang right I would, but I doubt they can/will....... this year. IIRC, most of the people on this board were talking at the start of the season "Man, I hope we are still talking about games that have meaning at the end of December/Jan". Guess what, we are talking about games that matter to the Texans and we have possibilities, just sit back and enjoy it and don't let your ego or what ever it is rob you of the enjoyment, just because you choose to focus on the negative rather than the positives of the season.

thunderkyss
12-27-2009, 04:59 PM
Don't be stupid. I don't want the Texans to lose any of them, and if they would come out in the 2nd half and put teams away after getting up at halftime, they would probably already have a playoff spot locked up.

A 21-0 halftime lead @ Indy should have been a win as well, but the Texans didn't come out to play in the 2nd half, and therefore, lost.

Is that the game we fumbled the ball away at the end of the half?

Then threw an pic 6 on our first second half possession?

& I'm sure there was another player-made uh-oh in that second half.

it's not that they aren't coming out to play, but it's like they get "big headed" & start screwing up.

thunderkyss
12-27-2009, 05:01 PM
If we manage to back into the play offs, it will likely be a one and out.

Who knows how this group of guys would handle that situation. Who'da thunk the Cardinals would make it to the Super Bowl last year? They didn't have a run game, & their defense was more suspect than ours.

Same thing with the Giants the year before. They didn't start pressuring the QB with their front four, until the play-offs started.

As long as they don't look like they don't belong, I'll be happy.

But first things first.

OzzO
12-27-2009, 05:12 PM
NE Patriots scored 28 points in the first half, then scored only once the rest of the way.

By your logic, they suck. :thinking:

But the Pats won by 28 points, 35-7 - stayed on the Jags throat defensively.

Anyway, nothing new - play for a half and if your ahead, hope it's enough. If your behind, hopefully the Texans didn't spot the opposing team too many points. Glad for the win, not so with the "play 60".

TimeKiller
12-27-2009, 05:24 PM
It showed exactly what this team is made of. On one side it's a monster. Unstoppable. Championship caliber. On the other side it's a ball of fluff. Cute little kittens. Sunshine and rainbows and feeling good about anything.

Dr. Jekyll
Mr. Hyde

Silver Oak
12-27-2009, 05:31 PM
only thing I see is a big freaking "W" in the Win-Loss column. All this talk about halves played/not-played is a useless exercise.

Could it have been prettier...yes. Yet I will take a win on the road against a defending division champion every day of the week.

DexmanC
12-27-2009, 05:39 PM
I posted at halftime that this team was done scoring for the game, and would
have to outlast their production in the first half. The next real good team
we face will make us pay for it. Good win today, but our humiliation is looming.

Wolf
12-27-2009, 07:12 PM
geeze, even the players are saying it now.

“We labeled this game as the biggest game of the franchise’s history,” Texans tackle Duane Brown(notes) said. “We took the wind out of them quick.”



http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/recap;_ylt=AhSZEBULhAib4TOx1X6DQ.I5nYcB?gid=200912 27015

The Third Man
12-27-2009, 09:05 PM
I'm happy with the win. I'm disappointed with the way they finished it.

You can complain about style points, but I am just happy they went on the road and won and are still in the playoffs hunt.

euro-Texan
12-27-2009, 09:07 PM
You can complain about style points, but I am just happy they went on the road and won and are still in the playoffs hunt.

Philly looked worse than us

utahmark
12-28-2009, 12:26 AM
Don't be stupid. I don't want the Texans to lose any of them, and if they would come out in the 2nd half and put teams away after getting up at halftime, they would probably already have a playoff spot locked up.

A 21-0 halftime lead @ Indy should have been a win as well, but the Texans didn't come out to play in the 2nd half, and therefore, lost.

when did we have a 21-0 halftime lead at indy?

houstonspartan
12-28-2009, 12:40 AM
it showed exactly what this team is made of. On one side it's a monster. Unstoppable. Championship caliber. On the other side it's a ball of fluff. Cute little kittens. Sunshine and rainbows and feeling good about anything.

Dr. Jekyll
mr. Hyde

lmao!

Goatcheese
12-28-2009, 12:54 AM
It showed exactly what this team is made of. On one side it's a monster. Unstoppable. Championship caliber. On the other side it's a ball of fluff. Cute little kittens. Sunshine and rainbows and feeling good about anything.

Dr. Jekyll
Mr. Hyde

They just need some confidence. They are an emotional team. Completely unstoppable when they're pumped up, and push overs when the momentum turns against them.

http://www.mitchell.derbycounty.co.uk/lion_cat.jpg

houstonspartan
12-28-2009, 01:38 AM
They just need some confidence. They are an emotional team. Completely unstoppable when they're pumped up, and push overs when the momentum turns against them.

http://www.mitchell.derbycounty.co.uk/lion_cat.jpg

Exactly. I'm tired of people saying "our team isn't as talented as we think it is."

Bullshit. Look at the first half of today's game, and look at the first half of the second Indy game.

We got the talent.
The coaching is another story...

thunderkyss
12-28-2009, 11:51 AM
Exactly. I'm tired of people saying "our team isn't as talented as we think it is."

Bullshit. Look at the first half of today's game, and look at the first half of the second Indy game.

We got the talent.
The coaching is another story...

It's that same talent that fumbles the ball away, & throw un-forced interceptions. I could understand it if we weren't providing a pocket for Schaub, but the protection has been very, very good & he still throws a ball or two that he should know better. You can watch him in the first half of this game, or the 3rd Qtr of that game, & you know he knows better, but he does it anyway.

& the fumbling isn't when they are trying to break a tackle at the LOS, it's after a 10-15 yard gain, & they are in the open field, thinking about a touchdown, or the highlights, or the jumbo-tron, or the big shoe contract they're going to land.

I don't know what Kubiak could've done differently. Experience tells him when it rains, it pours in Houston. It's no surprise to me, that he gets conservative at the first sight of trouble.

How are you going to bench your stars? Your supposed leaders, when he's trying to empower them? You can't bench Schaub... & he tried his darnedest not to bench Slaton. But he went to Moats... fumble. He went to Chris Brown..... fumble. He went to Arian Foster... fumble.

I honestly don't see how you're supposed to blame the coach.

Wasn't a popular decision to end the game the way we did, but playing the way we did the first half could have very easily cost us the game....... see the second Colts game.

DexmanC
12-28-2009, 11:56 AM
It's time this team starts measuring itself by RESULTS. Excuses don't work
when it comes to improvement. RESULTS are the benchmark for success.
You need empirical data for Mr. Kubiak?

Last 55 games Gary Kubiak has coached (INCLUDING Sunday)
2nd half of '06 season: 4-4
ENTIRE 2007 season : 8-8
ENTIRE 2008 season : 8-8
CURRENT 2009 season: 8-7

Total Record: 28-27

Is this good enough? Is being 8-7 o.k.? Is this the standard of excellence
we have for this team? Is this the bar they've set for themselves? There
are too many other teams that have changed coaches, and have had greater
success in ONE season, than Kubiak has done in FOUR. This includes
rookie head coach Rex Ryan, who destroyed Kubiak head-to-head.

utahmark
12-28-2009, 12:19 PM
If we manage to back into the play offs, it will likely be a one and out. However, that is OK. We are a young team learning how/what it takes to win in the NFL. Would I like them to go further, dang right I would, but I doubt they can/will....... this year. IIRC, most of the people on this board were talking at the start of the season "Man, I hope we are still talking about games that have meaning at the end of December/Jan". Guess what, we are talking about games that matter to the Texans and we have possibilities, just sit back and enjoy it and don't let your ego or what ever it is rob you of the enjoyment, just because you choose to focus on the negative rather than the positives of the season.

we'll probably be playing cincy. weve already beaten them once.

thunderkyss
12-28-2009, 04:26 PM
There
are too many other teams that have changed coaches, and have had greater
success in ONE season, than Kubiak has done in FOUR. This includes
rookie head coach Rex Ryan, who destroyed Kubiak head-to-head.

Are the Jets better than 8-7?

I thought the Jets were 9-7 last year. Is going 9-7 in 2009 an improvement? If they go 8-8, would that be a worse team than last years team?

edo783
12-28-2009, 10:08 PM
we'll probably be playing cincy. weve already beaten them once.

True, but just speaking odds, it is unlikely at the play off level to beat the same team twice. Could we..... sure we could, but would you bet your mortgage money we will?

DexmanC
12-28-2009, 10:15 PM
Are the Jets better than 8-7?

I thought the Jets were 9-7 last year. Is going 9-7 in 2009 an improvement? If they go 8-8, would that be a worse team than last years team?

The Jets, with a rookie head coach, and a rookie quarterback, control
THEIR OWN DESTINY in Week 17, towards making the playoffs. In ONE
SEASON, Rex Ryan has bested Kubiak with this feat. You can't deny Kubiak
could go .500 four years in a row, and still keep his job had he been coaching
in New York.

thunderkyss
12-28-2009, 10:54 PM
The Jets, with a rookie head coach, and a rookie quarterback, control
THEIR OWN DESTINY in Week 17, towards making the playoffs. In ONE
SEASON, Rex Ryan has bested Kubiak with this feat. You can't deny Kubiak
could go .500 four years in a row, and still keep his job had he been coaching
in New York.

Rex Ryan took over a 9-7 team & went 9-7 (possibly).... & you think that is a big improvement?


Gary Kubiak took a 2-14 team & went 6-10, 8-8, 8-8, & 9-7 (possibly) & you think that is regression.

I will spend the rest of my time pointing out how much sense your post don't make.

The Jets control their destiny today, because Baltimore lost last week. Has nothing to do with how good the New York Jets (same possible 9-7 W-L record as the lowly Texans) played. Had the Jets lost the last 2 weeks, it would be the Texans who control their own destiny, wtf does that have to do with what Kubiak has/has not done?

The Jets could have sewn up the division, weeks ago, but they choked. Rex Ryan didn't have his team prepared for 7 games (same as Kubiak up to this point) prior to this week, & he's done an outstanding job turning a 9-7 team into a possible 9-7 team.

Are you even listening to your own arguments?

DexmanC
12-29-2009, 09:45 PM
Rex Ryan took over a 9-7 team & went 9-7 (possibly).... & you think that is a big improvement?


Gary Kubiak took a 2-14 team & went 6-10, 8-8, 8-8, & 9-7 (possibly) & you think that is regression.

I will spend the rest of my time pointing out how much sense your post don't make.

The Jets control their destiny today, because Baltimore lost last week. Has nothing to do with how good the New York Jets (same possible 9-7 W-L record as the lowly Texans) played. Had the Jets lost the last 2 weeks, it would be the Texans who control their own destiny, wtf does that have to do with what Kubiak has/has not done?

The Jets could have sewn up the division, weeks ago, but they choked. Rex Ryan didn't have his team prepared for 7 games (same as Kubiak up to this point) prior to this week, & he's done an outstanding job turning a 9-7 team into a possible 9-7 team.

Are you even listening to your own arguments?

Basically, you've got a fourth year coach (Kubiak) making the same
mistakes a rookie head coach (Ryan) is making. What is your argument?
Ryan is making rookie mistakes? Yeah. He's a ROOKIE.

When is Kubiak going to get his squad to focus for 60 FREAKING MINUTES!?

Does it take a 5th year to learn how to do that?

TheRealJoker
12-29-2009, 09:57 PM
Rex Ryan took over a 9-7 team & went 9-7 (possibly).... & you think that is a big improvement?


Gary Kubiak took a 2-14 team & went 6-10, 8-8, 8-8, & 9-7 (possibly) & you think that is regression.

I will spend the rest of my time pointing out how much sense your post don't make.

The Jets control their destiny today, because Baltimore lost last week. Has nothing to do with how good the New York Jets (same possible 9-7 W-L record as the lowly Texans) played. Had the Jets lost the last 2 weeks, it would be the Texans who control their own destiny, wtf does that have to do with what Kubiak has/has not done?

The Jets could have sewn up the division, weeks ago, but they choked. Rex Ryan didn't have his team prepared for 7 games (same as Kubiak up to this point) prior to this week, & he's done an outstanding job turning a 9-7 team into a possible 9-7 team.

Are you even listening to your own arguments?

Actually, the Jets control their own destiny because they beat down the Texans in Reliant Stadium on opening day. A rookie HC and rookie QB came into town and beat the Texans more decisively than any other team has this season. Had Kubiak had his team ready to play (you think he could've had a leg up on the rookie HC in that regard...) then we would be in control of our own destiny right now :(

Joe Texan
12-29-2009, 09:59 PM
Wow it was not my intention to start another thread to continue the pissing match between the settlers and the soapers. We all know where we stand it is well documented. I just wanted to disscuss the importance of this game in relation to Kubiaks future as our HC.

Whether Kubiak comes back or not is not our choice. And nothing we say is going to change that fact or anyone on this boards mind. WE ALL SHOULD KNOW THAT BY NOW. However this game could have a huge impact on that decision. That is why it is such an important game. Does it mean we are ready and have taken the next step if we win? Hell no!!! But dam sure should show whether or not Kubiak is capable of being the right coach to take this team towards that next step. At least in McNairs mind for one more week.

As long as we have even a minute chance of making the playoffs Kubiak should be under the microscope. This is a very important (winnable) game with playoff implacations. This could be Kubiaks last chance to shine and show everyone that he is the man.

I think he is going to fail misserably but I hope I am wrong. If he shows good in this game I will give him credit. Not because I want to but because I have no choice. And if he continues that good showing into next week then I will be OK with him coming back next year. Not thrilled but willing to except he has done what he needed to and except that I have no choice in the matter.

Without arguing over whether or not he should or shouldnt go (which we have no control over) can we debate the importance of this game? :rant:

Mussop I consider this thread as stand up as possible you came out and stated your case and it was well taken by me. Now with the outcome I will state that the second half was a miserable mirror image of the suck ass coaching from a young coach with no experience. I am not on the soap bandwagon but I will admit the coach had some mistakes and miscues in this game and he played not to lose (I hate this ) instead of blow the fish out of the water. We got Andre and we should have smoked the Dolphins but we almost lost to the stinking mamals. The Next Game is the true test of Kubiak can he man up and play a whole game and defeat former Superbowlers or does he tuck tails and run to the showers. LETS GO TEXANS I can assure you Soap Droppers, Band Wagoners, And Die Hards alike will be at Reliant with 200% addrenilin and screaming for a Texan Win, COach do your part and Win the Stinking Game.

vtech9
12-29-2009, 10:12 PM
Mussop I consider this thread as stand up as possible you came out and stated your case and it was well taken by me. Now with the outcome I will state that the second half was a miserable mirror image of the suck ass coaching from a young coach with no experience. I am not on the soap bandwagon but I will admit the coach had some mistakes and miscues in this game and he played not to lose (I hate this ) instead of blow the fish out of the water. We got Andre and we should have smoked the Dolphins but we almost lost to the stinking mamals. The Next Game is the true test of Kubiak can he man up and play a whole game and defeat former Superbowlers or does he tuck tails and run to the showers. LETS GO TEXANS I can assure you Soap Droppers, Band Wagoners, And Die Hards alike will be at Reliant with 200% addrenilin and screaming for a Texan Win, COach do your part and Win the Stinking Game.

That's the part that bothers me the most. We get up big and then play not to lose. The Defense played as well as they could in the 2nd half, but instead of calling the defensive plays that got them the big lead, the DC went to soft zones, and let the 'phins march down the field using runs and short passes. If the tripping penalty wasn't called, I think the Texans would have lost.

If any of you remember the Oilers playoff game against the Bills, you might just understand my disgust over this kind of play. If you don't know which Oilers game I'm talking about, you probably won't understand.

DexmanC
12-29-2009, 10:41 PM
Mussop I consider this thread as stand up as possible you came out and stated your case and it was well taken by me. Now with the outcome I will state that the second half was a miserable mirror image of the suck ass coaching from a young coach with no experience. I am not on the soap bandwagon but I will admit the coach had some mistakes and miscues in this game and he played not to lose (I hate this ) instead of blow the fish out of the water. We got Andre and we should have smoked the Dolphins but we almost lost to the stinking mamals. The Next Game is the true test of Kubiak can he man up and play a whole game and defeat former Superbowlers or does he tuck tails and run to the showers. LETS GO TEXANS I can assure you Soap Droppers, Band Wagoners, And Die Hards alike will be at Reliant with 200% addrenilin and screaming for a Texan Win, COach do your part and Win the Stinking Game.

If you remember the game we came back from 14-0 against the Panthers,
and were blowing them off their own field, Andre Johnson strained his PCL
catching a ball over-the-middle early in the 4th quarter. We lost Dre for
7 games or so that season. Since then, I don't remember us attacking
aggressively when we're up big on folks. Maybe Kube's afraid of getting
guys hurt for blowing them the hell out.

The problem with that tactic is, we open ourselves up to getting beat.

DerekLee1
12-29-2009, 10:56 PM
Rex Ryan took over a 9-7 team & went 9-7 (possibly).... & you think that is a big improvement?


Gary Kubiak took a 2-14 team & went 6-10, 8-8, 8-8, & 9-7 (possibly) & you think that is regression.

I will spend the rest of my time pointing out how much sense your post don't make.

The Jets control their destiny today, because Baltimore lost last week. Has nothing to do with how good the New York Jets (same possible 9-7 W-L record as the lowly Texans) played. Had the Jets lost the last 2 weeks, it would be the Texans who control their own destiny, wtf does that have to do with what Kubiak has/has not done?

The Jets could have sewn up the division, weeks ago, but they choked. Rex Ryan didn't have his team prepared for 7 games (same as Kubiak up to this point) prior to this week, & he's done an outstanding job turning a 9-7 team into a possible 9-7 team.

Are you even listening to your own arguments?

I see the 6-10 and first 8-8 season as over-achieving. I'll cut him some slack this year because of the injuries (OD and the OL hurt more than anyone wants to admit). Kubiak and Smith have built this team as an organization that can compete annually, not as a one-hit wonder. For that, I'll give them at least one more year. A game out of playoff contention? Half the league would give their right nuts for that opportunity.

steelbtexan
12-29-2009, 11:42 PM
If you remember the game we came back from 14-0 against the Panthers,
and were blowing them off their own field, Andre Johnson strained his PCL
catching a ball over-the-middle early in the 4th quarter. We lost Dre for
7 games or so that season. Since then, I don't remember us attacking
aggressively when we're up big on folks. Maybe Kube's afraid of getting
guys hurt for blowing them the hell out.

The problem with that tactic is, we open ourselves up to getting beat.

It was after the Rosencopter game that Kubes adopted this philosopy.

That play changed Kubes and took away what made him special. (agressiveness) IMHO

houstonspartan
12-30-2009, 12:00 AM
Actually, the Jets control their own destiny because they beat down the Texans in Reliant Stadium on opening day. A rookie HC and rookie QB came into town and beat the Texans more decisively than any other team has this season. Had Kubiak had his team ready to play (you think he could've had a leg up on the rookie HC in that regard...) then we would be in control of our own destiny right now :(

Yep. It's really amazing how every single game can count in the NFL. If it comes down to us and the Jets, we are so screwed it's not even funny.

mussop
12-30-2009, 07:43 AM
Mussop I consider this thread as stand up as possible you came out and stated your case and it was well taken by me. Now with the outcome I will state that the second half was a miserable mirror image of the suck ass coaching from a young coach with no experience. I am not on the soap bandwagon but I will admit the coach had some mistakes and miscues in this game and he played not to lose (I hate this ) instead of blow the fish out of the water. We got Andre and we should have smoked the Dolphins but we almost lost to the stinking mamals. The Next Game is the true test of Kubiak can he man up and play a whole game and defeat former Superbowlers or does he tuck tails and run to the showers. LETS GO TEXANS I can assure you Soap Droppers, Band Wagoners, And Die Hards alike will be at Reliant with 200% addrenilin and screaming for a Texan Win, COach do your part and Win the Stinking Game.

:handshake:

thunderkyss
12-31-2009, 08:59 AM
Actually, the Jets control their own destiny because they beat down the Texans in Reliant Stadium on opening day. A rookie HC and rookie QB came into town and beat the Texans more decisively than any other team has this season. Had Kubiak had his team ready to play (you think he could've had a leg up on the rookie HC in that regard...) then we would be in control of our own destiny right now :(

If Baltimore won last week, the Jets wouldn't be in control of anything. Had the Colts not rested their starters with 20 minutes left to play... they wouldn't be in control of anything.

If W-L is the end-all-be-all of a team, the 2008 9-7 Jets were a better team than the 2008 8-8 Texans, & Texans fans should have known we could have lost that game anyway.

That was probably the best defensive team (Titans maybe) We've played all year. A seasoned secondary, a LB core that thought they were better without Jonathan Vilma, and a pretty nice DL. Rookie head coach, yada, yada, yada, but that team has been together for a long time. & Rex Ryan is probably the most creative coordinator to pressure the QB, now that Jim Johnson is gone (RIP).

Our young defense (Most players had been here less than 3 years. Antonio Smith, Glover Quin, Brian Cushing... First year. Brian Cushing & Dunta missed trainging camp, & this was Diles' first real game after season ending injury last year) Held one of the leagues top rushing attacks (inherited by this rookie HC & QB) to something like 70 rushing yards through 3 Qtrs. Thomas Jones had a total of 12 yards to start the 4th Qtr, Leon Washington had 56. Leon Washington had 4 yards total in the 4th Qtr..... Thomas Jones went for 106, but that's a different story. You can't say they weren't prepared when you look at the whole performance.

Then this Rookie HC follows this performance up with a similar performance in New England. Belichick had an extra week to prepare.. but he did no better than Kubiak did... fire them both? 4 time Super Bowl winner my ass.

They did the same thing in Week 3. Jeff Fisher had 2 more weeks than Kubiak had, but his team wasn't "prepared" either. So I guess Fisher doesn't deserve to be a head coach either? Longest tenured HC & get's punk'd by a rookie HC & QB.

thunderkyss
12-31-2009, 09:04 AM
Since then, I don't remember us attacking
aggressively when we're up big on folks. Maybe Kube's afraid of getting
guys hurt for blowing them the hell out.


The play calling was just as aggressive our first two possesions of the 3rd Qtr. Schaub threw an INT in the first one, after 3 or 4 snaps I believe, & Chris Brown Fumbled on a big gain...

Then Kubiak called off the dogs.

But it wasn't because of a big lead.

Think about the last time we ran a 2 minute offense... The play calling is just as aggressive as we've ever been. But the players do something bone-headed.