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View Full Version : Gregg Williams will not be our next HC


DerekLee1
12-06-2009, 04:29 PM
Cowher wants the Carolina job, and he'll bide his time until it happens and use us as leverage . Gregg Williams is a defensive guru, has some experience behind some GREAT coaches, he learned from a failed first try (see: Bill Belichick), has Houston ties, and would likely keep Kyle Shanahan on - assuming that he doesn't bolt to go coach with his dad somewherep. The knock on him in Buffalo was his conservatism, but I don't think it will be like that the second time around again. He's coaching under one of the smartest and ballsiest playcalling coaches in the NFL right now, and has turned the Saints' defense from worst to (almost) first. He also runs a 4-3, meaning a massive personnel overhaul would not be necessary.

In fact, I'm thinking he may be my TOP preference, even if Cowher WERE available and interested.

houstonspartan
12-06-2009, 04:31 PM
Top choice over Cowher? No.

I'm on the fence about Williams. I really think we need a proven, successful guy who has been a SUCCESSFUL head coach before.

Williams, for the most part, will be starting over, yes?

Big Lou
12-06-2009, 04:32 PM
I think McNair would keep Kubes on before he made that move. The only move I see is McNair making a big splash, he will be going for the biggest names out there.

After seeing his face after the Indy game, I think he's ready to write a check.

treduke
12-06-2009, 04:32 PM
gregg williams
good dc
horrible coach

mussop
12-06-2009, 04:35 PM
Williams burnt alot of bridges in his last HC stint. I dont see him getting another shot anytime soon despite how good a coordinator he is. I dont know why but I truley believe Cowher is our next HC.

I wouldnt be apposed to Shawn McDorment (sp?) though.

DerekLee1
12-06-2009, 04:35 PM
gregg williams
good dc
horrible coach

How many people said that about Belichick after he was fired from Cleveland?

nunusguy
12-06-2009, 04:36 PM
Gregg Williams would work for me.

Wolf
12-06-2009, 04:36 PM
like it or not and I am probably wrong but

way this team's offense is built I wouldn't be surprised if Mike Shanahan gets a serious look

Goldensilence
12-06-2009, 04:37 PM
Put the beer, alcoholic beverage or pipe away.

Seriously you'd want a guy whose best team topped out at 8-8 as opposed to a guy whose lead his team to two Super Bowls and won one?

If I'm Gregg Williams unless I really wanted to be a HC again why would you leave a place that you are in a great position to succeed?

ChampionTexan
12-06-2009, 04:42 PM
How many people said that about Belichick after he was fired from Cleveland?

And how many people said it after other coaches got fired from their first job, and it was completely true?

DerekLee1
12-06-2009, 04:42 PM
Put the beer, alcoholic beverage or pipe away.

Seriously you'd want a guy whose best team topped out at 8-8 as opposed to a guy whose lead his team to two Super Bowls and won one?

If I'm Gregg Williams unless I really wanted to be a HC again why would you leave a place that you are in a great position to succeed?

Bill Belichick's record in Cleveland was 36-44. Capers was a "proven winner" from when he was in Carolina. How'd that work out for ya?

DexmanC
12-06-2009, 04:42 PM
Dom Capers sucked as a HC, and he's now leading the #1 defense in the
NFL. Just sayin...

DerekLee1
12-06-2009, 04:44 PM
And how many people said it after other coaches got fired from their first job, and it was completely true?

How many that were fired went on to be great coordinators again? Not many.

mariowillshine15
12-06-2009, 04:45 PM
like it or not and I am probably wrong but

way this team's offense is built I wouldn't be surprised if Mike Shanahan gets a serious look

Maybe we can pay him in tanning lotion and a tanning bed.

Mr. White
12-06-2009, 04:45 PM
I'd be good with Williams too.

He brought one hell of an attitude change to the New Orleans D. Just what we need here.

treduke
12-06-2009, 04:45 PM
How many people said that about Belichick after he was fired from Cleveland?

yeah but the hoodie did lead them to the playoffs and in his defense was the coach during the lame duck season before the browns moved! since you like defense how about taking a look at leslie frazier the vikings dc
if we dont get cowher or another coach we should'nt go with some re-tread
who had his shot! if this thing is gonna get blown up at least go with some new blood
good day sir

Hookem Horns
12-06-2009, 04:47 PM
How many people said that about Belichick after he was fired from Cleveland?

The way you feel about Williams is how I felt about Capers before we hired him. I really thought he would be a good HC despite what happened to him in Carolina.

Williams has Bud Adams stench on him so I think I will pass.

mussop
12-06-2009, 04:48 PM
This week's column is dedicated to Buffalo Bills Head Coach Greg Williams, who has guided his team to an absolutely horrendous 1-10 record.

Though this is Greg Williams' first year as the Buffalo Bills head coach, he should be immediately dismissed from his duties. He has single-handily turned this once-proud franchise into one of the biggest laughing stocks in the entire NFL.

When hired to lead the Bills this season, Williams spoke about having a playoff-caliber team. He spoke about how solid his defensive unit was. In fact, he told anybody who would listen that this defense would end up breaking the sack record.(Actually Greg, you have to get pressure on the quarterback first, before you are actually credited with a sack). He talked about how impressive QB Rob Johnson looked and how quickly he had learned the West Coast offense.

Well Greg, it would appear that you had absolutely no idea what kind of team you were taking over. The defense was over-hauled during the off-season, losing many quality players to free agency. Your quarterback, who you told the media had quickly learned the new West Coast offense, struggled every single week in that offense, only for you to then acknowledge that it might take him several months to fully understand and fully grasp just exactly everything there is to know about the new schemes implemented.

Not once have I ever heard Mr. Williams put the blame on his shoulders after a loss, and trust me when I tell you, when you are 1-10, you have plenty of opportunities to do so.

Greg Williams, you have no business coaching in the NFL. You surrounded yourself with assistant coaches who knew nothing about the game of football. You made sure that you looked like the most knowledgeable person in the front office, and that was a huge mistake. A good coach surrounds himself with people who he feels are more knowledgeable then he. That way you can learn from them as much as they can learn from you.

You certainly have made everybody aware that this is your team. You have rid yourself of the players you didn't like or didn't fit into your plans. After it's all said and done Greg, you have shown that, without a doubt, you are a FEW TOMATO'S SHORT OF A THICK SAUCE.


Sound familiar? :spin: No thanks.

mariowillshine15
12-06-2009, 04:48 PM
I rather give Vikings D Coord. Leslie Frazier a shot. The last D Coord. from Minnesota(Mike Tomlin) worked out well.

Hardcore Texan
12-06-2009, 04:50 PM
I want Tony Dungy

treduke
12-06-2009, 04:53 PM
I rather give Vikings D Coord. Leslie Frazier a shot. The last D Coord. from Minnesota(Mike Tomlin) worked out well.

i mentioned that in an earlier post glad someone else is thinking what i'm thinking

Mr. White
12-06-2009, 04:55 PM
I rather give Vikings D Coord. Leslie Frazier a shot. The last D Coord. from Minnesota(Mike Tomlin) worked out well.

Tomlin wasn't a DC. I think he was DB coach.

Frazier would be worth a look though.

Redtexan#34
12-06-2009, 04:56 PM
The Texans need a proven winner as their coach which will add some respectability from the national media(east and west cost bias ESPN). He needs to open up the check book for Cowher even though i dont know if that will be enough to steer him away from the Panthers.

Jackie Chiles
12-06-2009, 04:57 PM
Posted this in another thread, here are some guys to look at outside of the dream scenarios:

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/columns/story?columnist=schefter_adam&id=4704338

awtysst
12-06-2009, 05:06 PM
Posted this in another thread, here are some guys to look at outside of the dream scenarios:

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/columns/story?columnist=schefter_adam&id=4704338

Couple interesting names that have not been mentioned would be Russ Grimm and Brian Schottenheimer. The later might bring his dad as a "special assistant" or adviser or something along those lines. The former brings the Cowher pedigree.

CloakNNNdagger
12-06-2009, 05:10 PM
like it or not and I am probably wrong but

way this team's offense is built I wouldn't be surprised if Mike Shanahan gets a serious look

The only way I would seriously entertain a new coach is if that coach would be a "proven" HEAD coach.......AND is willing, for the most part to maintain a semblance of continuity in the present offense and defense systems.......in other words in avoidance of dismantling and overhauling the entire team. Cowher, over the years, has proven his successful versatility as a HC.........in run heavy AND pass heavy offensive schemes, as well as in 3-4 AND 4-3 defensive schemes.

Goldensilence
12-06-2009, 05:13 PM
Bill Belichick's record in Cleveland was 36-44. Capers was a "proven winner" from when he was in Carolina. How'd that work out for ya?

Guess what. Bill lead a Cleveland team to playoff victory and when Modell announced he was moving the team to Baltimore. He resigned.

Does Williams have that on his resume? His team's never had a winning record.

Dom also loaded his team (wisely) with former Steelers players like Kevin Greene and Sam Mills. He also got other vets who knew how to play like former Oiler Lamar Lathon and Eric Davis. He didn't have to build a team(especially his defense) from scratch and he lost the team pretty quickly as well. But those red flags didn't bother a new owner like McNair.

treduke
12-06-2009, 05:15 PM
yeah but the hoodie did lead them to the playoffs and in his defense was the coach during the lame duck season before the browns moved! since you like defense how about taking a look at leslie frazier the vikings dc
if we dont get cowher or another coach we should'nt go with some re-tread
who had his shot! if this thing is gonna get blown up at least go with some new blood
good day sir

what he said

Hervoyel
12-06-2009, 05:21 PM
I think the organization needs a proven winner and not a guy who's already failed at this once before. I think the next head coaching hire either takes or we're really looking at being the 21st century version of the old New Orleans Saints.

I don't see how you hire Greg Williams When Cowher, Gruden, Shanahan, and Holmgren are all out there looking for work. I don't know how Bob McNair stands in front of a podium at a press conference and sells that to the Texans fanbase. It just screams of "I don't have any idea what I'm doing" or "I'm too cheap to spring for a proven coach even though my team has NEVER won" to me.

TexCanada
12-06-2009, 05:25 PM
I think the organization needs a proven winner and not a guy who's already failed at this once before. I think the next head coaching hire either takes or we're really looking at being the 21st century version of the old New Orleans Saints.

I don't see how you hire Greg Williams When Cowher, Gruden, Shanahan, and Holmgren are all out there looking for work. I don't know how Bob McNair stands in front of a podium at a press conference and sells that to the Texans fanbase. It just screams of "I don't have any idea what I'm doing" or "I'm too cheap to spring for a proven coach even though my team has NEVER won" to me.

It sounds as though Holmgren, Gruden and Cowher have all found a home for next year already.

Wolf
12-06-2009, 05:26 PM
I think the organization needs a proven winner and not a guy who's already failed at this once before. I think the next head coaching hire either takes or we're really looking at being the 21st century version of the old New Orleans Saints.

I don't see how you hire Greg Williams When Cowher, Gruden, Shanahan, and Holmgren are all out there looking for work. I don't know how Bob McNair stands in front of a podium at a press conference and sells that to the Texans fanbase. It just screams of "I don't have any idea what I'm doing" or "I'm too cheap to spring for a proven coach even though my team has NEVER won" to me.

exactly Herv.. my friends and I were talking about the Texans yesterday. my friend made a comment about most all the players can play in the NFL.. they all can run (for the most part and there are exceptions) but Coaching is what does it .. It isn't like College where a coach can get by with recruiting blue chip players year after year and their talent can overcome poor coaching from time to time.

DerekLee1
12-06-2009, 05:31 PM
I think the organization needs a proven winner and not a guy who's already failed at this once before. I think the next head coaching hire either takes or we're really looking at being the 21st century version of the old New Orleans Saints.

I don't see how you hire Greg Williams When Cowher, Gruden, Shanahan, and Holmgren are all out there looking for work. I don't know how Bob McNair stands in front of a podium at a press conference and sells that to the Texans fanbase. It just screams of "I don't have any idea what I'm doing" or "I'm too cheap to spring for a proven coach even though my team has NEVER won" to me.

I'm still not convinced Cowher would come here.

I don't want Gruden. He only won a SB with Dungy's team. Then he promptly ruined it.

Holmgren would want too much control. Control a HC shouldn't have.

Shanahan is an interesting thought, and I've always liked him, but the questions with him are can he get a defense to perform, and would we just be getting the same thing we already have?

I don't think Gregg Williams is the same guy he was in Buffalo. I see him being more like Belichick than Mangini. He has the pedigree WAY more so than Capers did.

Leslie Frazier deserves a look, too.

Maddict5
12-06-2009, 05:33 PM
How many people said that about Belichick after he was fired from Cleveland?


im loling cos kubiaks record is better than bill's was in cleveland. i wonder how excited the browns fans were when they got rid of somebody who was clearly a loser HC :rolleyes:

nvm though continue on :brando:

Pantherstang84
12-06-2009, 05:33 PM
I'm still not convinced Cowher would come here.

I don't want Gruden. He only won a SB with Dungy's team. Then he promptly ruined it.

Holmgren would want too much control. Control a HC shouldn't have.

Shanahan is an interesting thought, and I've always liked him, but the questions with him are can he get a defense to perform, and would we just be getting the same thing we already have?

I don't think Gregg Williams is the same guy he was in Buffalo. I see him being more like Belichick than Mangini. He has the pedigree WAY more so than Capers did.

Leslie Frazier deserves a look, too.

I call BS!!!! He won with the team Dungy could not get to the Super Bowl with.

Thorn
12-06-2009, 05:34 PM
I'm still not convinced Cowher would come here.

I don't want Gruden. He only won a SB with Dungy's team. Then he promptly ruined it.

Holmgren would want too much control. Control a HC shouldn't have.

Shanahan is an interesting thought, and I've always liked him, but the questions with him are can he get a defense to perform, and would we just be getting the same thing we already have?

I don't think Gregg Williams is the same guy he was in Buffalo. I see him being more like Belichick than Mangini. He has the pedigree WAY more so than Capers did.

Leslie Frazier deserves a look, too.

About the only really strong feeling I have about any names mentioned is I just DO NOT like Gruden. At all. He irratates the crap out of me for some reason. I'd just hate it if he came here. As to the rest of them, meh....

I'd bet the barn it won't be Cowher, but it would be nice if he did come here.

Goldensilence
12-06-2009, 05:36 PM
I think the organization needs a proven winner and not a guy who's already failed at this once before. I think the next head coaching hire either takes or we're really looking at being the 21st century version of the old New Orleans Saints.

I don't see how you hire Greg Williams When Cowher, Gruden, Shanahan, and Holmgren are all out there looking for work. I don't know how Bob McNair stands in front of a podium at a press conference and sells that to the Texans fanbase. It just screams of "I don't have any idea what I'm doing" or "I'm too cheap to spring for a proven coach even though my team has NEVER won" to me.

I think it'd be tough to pry Gruden way from MNF considering the extension he just signed.

I think we'll be hard pressed to lure Cowher away from Carolina if he wants to get back into coaching.

If we do go after Shanahan I'd expect us to retain a fair amount of the staff we already have. Kubiak goes to OC. Kyle likely goes to a position coaching gig and I'd say it wouldn't be out of the realm that a most of the defensive coaching staff stays as well. No thanks.

If the Gm spot didn't open up in Seattle I think we would've had a fair chance of getting Holmgren. Seeing all of his ties in Seattle already I think he take the job if they offer it up.

I still think Schott would be a good fit.

Hervoyel
12-06-2009, 05:38 PM
I'm still not convinced Cowher would come here.

I don't want Gruden. He only won a SB with Dungy's team. Then he promptly ruined it.

Holmgren would want too much control. Control a HC shouldn't have.

Shanahan is an interesting thought, and I've always liked him, but the questions with him are can he get a defense to perform, and would we just be getting the same thing we already have?

I don't think Gregg Williams is the same guy he was in Buffalo. I see him being more like Belichick than Mangini. He has the pedigree WAY more so than Capers did.

Leslie Frazier deserves a look, too.

I hear what you're saying on this but disagree on a lot of it. The Gruden thing though is just a myth I'm sorry. He is the winningest coach in Tampa Bay history. He won the only Super Bowl in their history. He was fired after a pair of 9-7 seasons. He didn't so much "ruin" Dungy's team as see that dominating defense grow old while he was there. I think he's rather underrated myself. After all Bill Callahan took Jon Grudens Raiders team to a Super Bowl too so it's not like Gruden didn't build a Super Bowl team as well.

He just happened to be in the perfect position to exploit all of their weaknesses.

treduke
12-06-2009, 05:40 PM
so what does everyone think of bringing some martyball to h-town

Pantherstang84
12-06-2009, 05:41 PM
so what does everyone think of bringing some martyball to h-town

No. He can get to the dance, but always leaves his ticket at home.

Goldensilence
12-06-2009, 05:42 PM
I'm still not convinced Cowher would come here.

I don't want Gruden. He only won a SB with Dungy's team. Then he promptly ruined it.

Holmgren would want too much control. Control a HC shouldn't have.

Shanahan is an interesting thought, and I've always liked him, but the questions with him are can he get a defense to perform, and would we just be getting the same thing we already have?

I don't think Gregg Williams is the same guy he was in Buffalo. I see him being more like Belichick than Mangini. He has the pedigree WAY more so than Capers did.

Leslie Frazier deserves a look, too.

What pedigree do you speak of? Was his dad a great coach or coordinator?

im loling cos kubiaks record is better than bill's was in cleveland. i wonder how excited the browns fans were when they got rid of somebody who was clearly a loser HC :rolleyes:

nvm though continue on :brando:

Yeah well they couldn't be too excited because the year Belichek resigned in Cleveland was the same year they were relocated to Baltimore. Nothing like learning your team is being moved to cut the legs out from a season.

treduke
12-06-2009, 05:44 PM
No. He can get to the dance, but always leaves his ticket at home.

that's true but at this point i would be happy with just getting there

hradhak
12-06-2009, 05:45 PM
I think whoever we go after, we need someone who has experience as a HEAD coach and not just as a coordinator. The biggest knock I see with our current team is that the experience for our coordinators and head coach totals less than 10 years combined at their current position.

It'd be interesting to see if we are able to bring Shanahan in if Kubiak would stay on as offensive coordinator. I doubt he would take the step down or that many people would want him to stay, but I think Kubiak is a good O coordinator who just couldn't make the transition to head coach.

Texecutioner
12-06-2009, 05:50 PM
Cowher wants the Carolina job, and he'll bide his time until it happens and use us as leverage . Gregg Williams is a defensive guru, has some experience behind some GREAT coaches, he learned from a failed first try (see: Bill Belichick), has Houston ties, and would likely keep Kyle Shanahan on - assuming that he doesn't bolt to go coach with his dad somewherep. The knock on him in Buffalo was his conservatism, but I don't think it will be like that the second time around again. He's coaching under one of the smartest and ballsiest playcalling coaches in the NFL right now, and has turned the Saints' defense from worst to (almost) first. He also runs a 4-3, meaning a massive personnel overhaul would not be necessary.

In fact, I'm thinking he may be my TOP preference, even if Cowher WERE available and interested.

Haven't you said all year that Kubes was the best man to coach this team?

stingray
12-06-2009, 05:55 PM
Why don't we wait till the end of the year to start speculating who are coach will be. Man, some people wanna hire a coach five minutes after a loss.

redwhiteANDblue
12-06-2009, 05:56 PM
Why don't we wait till the end of the year to start speculating who are coach will be. Man, some people wanna hire a coach five minutes after a loss.


Five minutes after 4 straight losses.

stingray
12-06-2009, 05:59 PM
Five minutes after 4 straight losses.

Yep.. I know. I have seen all of them. And I don't want Kubiak back either, but to pretty much name the coach after week 12 for next year is a bit silly.

awtysst
12-06-2009, 06:04 PM
Yep.. I know. I have seen all of them. And I don't want Kubiak back either, but to pretty much name the coach after week 12 for next year is a bit silly.

Actually if you know you are gonna get rid of a coach, why not get rid of him now. Then you have the leg up on the competition of who you want as a coach. If you can bring that guy in, then he can see the players up close for a month in real football situations and be able to figure out who he wants to keep and who he wants to get rid of. Plus, he will get all kinds of good will for the rest of that season and all of the next one.

Its a win- win situation actually.

False Start
12-06-2009, 06:11 PM
If there is a change, I really don't want to experiment with another first time HC. This team needs someone that has actually had some success, in both winning consistently, and playoff/Superbowl experience.

awtysst
12-06-2009, 06:15 PM
If there is a change, I really don't want to experiment with another first time HC. This team needs someone that has actually had some success, in both winning consistently, and playoff/Superbowl experience.

Sure, problem is how many coaches out there meet those qualifications?
Cowher, Gruden, Holgrim, Shanahan, Marty S, Billik?

gary
12-06-2009, 06:16 PM
Bring back Dick Vermeil or Dan Reevs or if you want to keep going Marv Leavy and just call it a day.

FirstTexansFan
12-06-2009, 06:20 PM
If we don't have a shot at Cowher, I'd like Shottenheimer. I realize he's known for not getting them to the SB, but at this point, I'd prefer a team going 14-2 (i.e. San Diego), than experiencing this year in and year out heartbreak.

False Start
12-06-2009, 07:10 PM
Sure, problem is how many coaches out there meet those qualifications?
Cowher, Gruden, Holgrim, Shanahan, Marty S, Billik?

Exactly, thats what I was getting at, incognito. :tiptoe: :shades:

PHAROAH
12-06-2009, 07:28 PM
I think that Shanahan is #1 on the list of coaches at this point as the general manager has signed his 4 year extension already and the improvement the offense has made over time and his knowledge of the system he has to be #1.


1st. Mike Shanahan
2nd. Tony Dungy
3rd. Bill Cowher
4th. Leslie Frazier
5th. Sean Mcdermott

houstonspartan
12-06-2009, 08:30 PM
Jon Gruden is the biggest fraud the NFL has ever seen. If we hire him, I will not be renewing my season tickets.

Folks, we have to give up the Shanahan dream. No way does he take a job after his friend was fired. Not...going...to...happen.

4Texans
12-06-2009, 08:34 PM
I call BS!!!! He won with the team Dungy could not get to the Super Bowl with.

Gruden also created the team that Oakland got to the SB with, and he beat them.

sayin...

Vinny
12-06-2009, 08:34 PM
Jon Gruden is the biggest fraud the NFL has ever seen. If we hire him, I will not be renewing my season tickets.

Folks, we have to give up the Shanahan dream. No way does he take a job after his friend was fired. Not...going...to...happen.

I keep hearing people say this but this is a league with only 32 HC positions and a handful of openings every year. The coaches understand how this works. Now, I'm not saying that I think Shanny is coming here nor am I saying I want him to come here...I'm just saying I don't think this is a valid argument.

silvrhand
12-06-2009, 08:35 PM
We DO NOT NEED another project coach, give us a WINNER! There is entirely too much hall of fame coaches out there to have us go pick another unknown head coach.

mussop
12-06-2009, 08:48 PM
Actually if you know you are gonna get rid of a coach, why not get rid of him now. Then you have the leg up on the competition of who you want as a coach. If you can bring that guy in, then he can see the players up close for a month in real football situations and be able to figure out who he wants to keep and who he wants to get rid of. Plus, he will get all kinds of good will for the rest of that season and all of the next one.

Its a win- win situation actually.

I agree! There is no downside to getting an early start.

steelbtexan
12-06-2009, 09:21 PM
Gruden also would've made another SB had it not been for the Brady tuck rule.
My Coaching search would look like this because of their ablity to draw great asst. coaches. In addition to their proven winning ways.

Who I think will want the Texans job

1. Gruden
2. Billick
3. Reeves
4. Jim Mora SR.
5. Andy Reid if he gets fired at Philly

gary
12-06-2009, 09:29 PM
Cross Reid off of your list he is close to exstending his contract with Philly.

DerekLee1
12-06-2009, 09:32 PM
Haven't you said all year that Kubes was the best man to coach this team?

Not exactly. I was just convinced he was the victim of some tough luck and needed one more draft and one more year to get over the hump. Today sealed it for me, though. Packaged with the 3 losses in a row before that, and the unpreparedness against a rookie QB and rookie HC in Week 1, I think he's lost his confidence and is starting to lose his team.

awtysst
12-06-2009, 09:34 PM
Gruden also would've made another SB had it not been for the Brady tuck rule.
My Coaching search would look like this because of their ablity to draw great asst. coaches. In addition to their proven winning ways.

Who I think will want the Texans job

1. Gruden
2. Billick
3. Reeves
4. Jim Mora SR.
5. Andy Reid if he gets fired at Philly

Jim Mora Sr is 74 years old! He has not coached since 2001. PASS

DerekLee1
12-06-2009, 09:39 PM
What pedigree do you speak of? Was his dad a great coach or coordinator?

Not LITERAL pedigree. Coaching pedigree. He's worked under Pardee, Buddy Ryan, Jeff Fisher, Joe Gibbs, and Sean Payton. I think his stint in Buffalo was a fluke.

JMacaroni
12-06-2009, 09:57 PM
we gotta keep kubiak and smith, if we fire one it's gotta be both because kubiak wanted smith here to fit his scheme. will those players work with the same system another coach would be running with the same position coaches we just hired? chances are a new coach is going to run everyone outta here like kubiak did. personally, i'd rather give him "another" year.

m5kwatts
12-06-2009, 10:03 PM
The idea that Kubiak deserves to keep his job because of what he's built is tiresome and running thin. The offense has regressed considerably and his scheme hasn't overcome the injuries (o-line, OD).

We should consider someone like Darrell Bevell, Vikings OC. He's long been touted as having head coaching leadership and head coaching qualifications beyond his scheme. Also he's a west coast offensive mind so the personnel would fit what he does. We could maintain Frank Bush as DC as well.

Of course he'd be a first-time head coach which is exactly what this team doesn't need. So now I'm back to Cowher. Williams would be below him but on the same level as Mike Nolan who I'd also like to see considered.

Either way Kubiak needs to go.

Pantherstang84
12-06-2009, 10:14 PM
Count me in the Gruden crowd. His style of coaching is exactly what is needed.

JMacaroni
12-06-2009, 10:14 PM
kubiak should keep the job, just not to see the growing pains again. we added this much talent with smith at the helm, but granted it hasn't produced. i still have confidence in kubiak for another year, hopefully he learned from his mistakes with a young team that they built. we're not getting cowher, and the offensive system is what works here. bush is putting it together in his first year. we got a good thing going, i'm as frustrated as the rest but don't push reset yet.

eriadoc
12-06-2009, 10:17 PM
Gruden built a very good Raiders team while operating under the second worst owner in the NFL. He took a team that couldn't get over the top to the SB. More than all that, though ......

His last year coaching the Bucs may have been his best coaching job. That team sucked, and he got quite a bit out of them.

I still want Holmgren, but I'd take Chucky over Cowher.

houstonspartan
12-06-2009, 10:21 PM
I keep hearing people say this but this is a league with only 32 HC positions and a handful of openings every year. The coaches understand how this works. Now, I'm not saying that I think Shanny is coming here nor am I saying I want him to come here...I'm just saying I don't think this is a valid argument.

Yes, it is a valid argument. Would you take the job your buddy just got fired from?

Yes, there are only 32 spots, but there's turnover every single year, almost. If nothing works out this year, then there's always next year. No way Shanny is going to take a HC job JUST to have a job. He can be picky.

Using your theory, Shanny would already be packing up for Buffalo.

houstonspartan
12-06-2009, 10:22 PM
Count me in the Gruden crowd. His style of coaching is exactly what is needed.

Scrunching your face up and making people laugh is not coaching.

LonerATO
12-06-2009, 10:25 PM
I'm still not convinced Cowher would come here.

I don't want Gruden. He only won a SB with Dungy's team. Then he promptly ruined it.

Holmgren would want too much control. Control a HC shouldn't have.

Shanahan is an interesting thought, and I've always liked him, but the questions with him are can he get a defense to perform, and would we just be getting the same thing we already have?

I don't think Gregg Williams is the same guy he was in Buffalo. I see him being more like Belichick than Mangini. He has the pedigree WAY more so than Capers did.

Leslie Frazier deserves a look, too.


Holmgren is more than likely going to take over the gm/president job in Seattle

TexCanada
12-06-2009, 10:28 PM
Holmgren is more than likely going to take over the gm/president job in Seattle

And there is talk about him bringing in Gruden to coach for him.

Hookem Horns
12-06-2009, 10:30 PM
Scrunching your face up and making people laugh is not coaching.

Don't worry, the guy isn't go to leave the gravy train of MNF. I don't think he is a bad coach however. Most people forget that he built the team that he beat in the Super Bowl.

The problem with Cowher is that he is a 3-4 coach. Bringing him in means overhauling the defense and getting rid of guys that don't fit the 3-4 like Mario Williams.

steelbtexan
12-06-2009, 10:42 PM
Don't worry, the guy isn't go to leave the gravy train of MNF. I don't think he is a bad coach however. Most people forget that he built the team that he beat in the Super Bowl.

The problem with Cowher is that he is a 3-4 coach. Bringing him in means overhauling the defense and getting rid of guys that don't fit the 3-4 like Mario Williams.

I think a 3-4 front 7 of

A.Smith Fa signee Hampton Mario

Cush Ryans Diles Barwin


This doesn't look bad to me

dalemurphy
12-06-2009, 10:45 PM
we gotta keep kubiak and smith, if we fire one it's gotta be both because kubiak wanted smith here to fit his scheme. will those players work with the same system another coach would be running with the same position coaches we just hired? chances are a new coach is going to run everyone outta here like kubiak did. personally, i'd rather give him "another" year.

I want to keep Smith... but, that means we don't get Cowher. We could get Shanahan with Smith in place or probably G. Williams also, along with a number of other lesser knowns.

dalemurphy
12-06-2009, 10:47 PM
Don't worry, the guy isn't go to leave the gravy train of MNF. I don't think he is a bad coach however. Most people forget that he built the team that he beat in the Super Bowl.

The problem with Cowher is that he is a 3-4 coach. Bringing him in means overhauling the defense and getting rid of guys that don't fit the 3-4 like Mario Williams.

He's a special teams' coach. I don't think he'll be insistent on a 3-4 defense. I think most of his coaching experience as an assistant was under Schottenheimer, who isn't a 3-4 guy. Pittsburgh was a 3-4 team but I don't think that is specificly because of Cowher.

BattleRedToro
12-06-2009, 10:53 PM
... Schottenheimer, who isn't a 3-4 guy.

Marty ran a 3-4 Defense in Cleveland, Kansas City, and San Diego. I don't know what kind of Defense he ran in Washington, but I wouldn't be surprised if it was a 3-4.

TexansFight
12-06-2009, 10:56 PM
so what does everyone think of bringing some martyball to h-town

This is who I want. Marty is a PROVEN commodity who has taken MULTIPLE LOSER FRANCHISES like ours and has turned them into winners. Hire him and bring his son Brian as OC and groom him to be HC 4 years from now if he proves worthy.

I know about his playoff failures but damn it I just want to GET TO THE DAMN PLAYOFFS first. Let's worry about WINNING IN THE PLAYOFFS when we cross that bridge. Maybe he gets his final redemption with us which would be a win/win for us all. I was too young for Luv Ya Blue so my "glory years" are the playoff heartbreaks of the Warren Moon era. We have been subjected to crappy football for so long that I PINE for those days.

michaelm
12-06-2009, 11:03 PM
If Cower were to take a job with Carolina, then John Fox could be added to the list of available head coaches who have at least taken a team to the SB.
I don't want him, but he would be out there, unless he's planning on retiring or something.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

dalemurphy
12-06-2009, 11:23 PM
Marty ran a 3-4 Defense in Cleveland, Kansas City, and San Diego. I don't know what kind of Defense he ran in Washington, but I wouldn't be surprised if it was a 3-4.

I knew that he did in KC, but I didn't know that to be the case in Cleveland... hmmm...

Goldensilence
12-06-2009, 11:32 PM
Don't worry, the guy isn't go to leave the gravy train of MNF. I don't think he is a bad coach however. Most people forget that he built the team that he beat in the Super Bowl.

The problem with Cowher is that he is a 3-4 coach. Bringing him in means overhauling the defense and getting rid of guys that don't fit the 3-4 like Mario Williams.

I think we'd have to rework personnel. It'd suck seeing Mario as a 3-4 lineman but he could easily do it. So could A. Smith. Problem would be getting a legit NT to do the dirty work.

I think we have our best depth at LB and could convert Barwin to what most people predicted his NFL spot would be 3-4 LBer.

If Cower were to take a job with Carolina, then John Fox could be added to the list of available head coaches who have at least taken a team to the SB.
I don't want him, but he would be out there, unless he's planning on retiring or something.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Not sure about HC, but he could do a career rehab stint as a DC here. I'd be fine with that.

Mr. White
12-06-2009, 11:49 PM
If Cower were to take a job with Carolina, then John Fox could be added to the list of available head coaches who have at least taken a team to the SB.
I don't want him, but he would be out there, unless he's planning on retiring or something.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I think Fox is a good coach...HOWEVA....

I think it's his coordinators that have killed him. Dunno the structure over there, but whoever hired those crappy assistants should get fired.

Richard Smith is on that staff for chrissakes.

DerekLee1
12-07-2009, 12:15 AM
Anna-Megan Raley posted on Facebook earlier:

The end of the Gary Kubiak era might be sooner than later. Sad.

I don't know if that's an opinion, or if she has some insight. But I suspect Bob McNair is pretty livid tonight.

I personally don't believe in firing coaches midseason UNLESS you're wanting to take a look at a possible replacement by someone on your staff acting as an interim. BUT if it were to happen, who takes over for the rest of the season? Lil' Shanny? Frank Bush? Alex Gibbs? Ray Rhodes? Joe Marciano? Rick Smith?

Hervoyel
12-07-2009, 12:20 AM
I don't think I see anybody who's ready to step up to be a head coach in that bunch. I think Baby Shanahan is already in over his head, Frank Bush has just convinced me that he was ready for the promotion to DC, Alex Gibbs will retire before he takes the top spot (smart man), Ray Rhodes would probably keel over dead if he got it. Marciano is.... just "no". Rick Smith isn't even a consideration obviously.

I don't think we've even got a good choice for interim head coach here. I'd make it Frank Bush if I had to pick one which would probably be counterproductive in the short term.

houstonspartan
12-07-2009, 12:22 AM
Anna-Megan Raley posted on Facebook earlier:



I don't know if that's an opinion, or if she has some insight. But I suspect Bob McNair is pretty livid tonight.

I personally don't believe in firing coaches midseason UNLESS you're wanting to take a look at a possible replacement by someone on your staff acting as an interim. BUT if it were to happen, who takes over for the rest of the season? Lil' Shanny? Frank Bush? Alex Gibbs? Ray Rhodes? Joe Marciano? Rick Smith?

It could simply mean this year as opposed to next year.

GNTLEWOLF
12-07-2009, 12:33 AM
as bad as I hate to even think this,I honestly don't think McNair is going to can Kubiak. Keeping someone around a year too long just runs in his blood. Therefore, I believe this whole discussion to be moot.

Jackie Chiles
12-07-2009, 12:37 AM
as bad as I hate to even think this,I honestly don't think McNair is going to can Kubiak. Keeping someone around a year too long just runs in his blood. Therefore, I believe this whole discussion to be moot.

If thats the case we might want to borrow some tarps from the Jags because I could foresee some serious potential for blackouts, especially if we stumble out of the gate. No, I think it is pretty much a foregone conclusion that Kubiak is a lame duck.

mussop
12-07-2009, 01:04 AM
as bad as I hate to even think this,I honestly don't think McNair is going to can Kubiak. Keeping someone around a year too long just runs in his blood. Therefore, I believe this whole discussion to be moot.

Some will argue that its already been a year too long.

houstonspartan
12-07-2009, 01:06 AM
as bad as I hate to even think this,I honestly don't think McNair is going to can Kubiak. Keeping someone around a year too long just runs in his blood. Therefore, I believe this whole discussion to be moot.

Not so sure about that. Season ticket holders are FURIOUS.

mussop
12-07-2009, 01:30 AM
It'd suck seeing Mario as a 3-4 lineman but he could easily do it.

As opposed to seeing him run himself out of 9 of every 10 plays in a 4/3? At least he would be more involved in each play as 3/4 end. Right now Mario is basically being used as a speed rusher coming off the edge and his physical presence is being wasted. I actually think he would be one of the better 3/4 ends in the NFL.

Vinny
12-07-2009, 11:56 AM
I keep hearing people say this but this is a league with only 32 HC positions and a handful of openings every year. The coaches understand how this works. Now, I'm not saying that I think Shanny is coming here nor am I saying I want him to come here...I'm just saying I don't think this is a valid argument.Yes, it is a valid argument. Would you take the job your buddy just got fired from?

Yes, there are only 32 spots, but there's turnover every single year, almost. If nothing works out this year, then there's always next year. No way Shanny is going to take a HC job JUST to have a job. He can be picky.

Using your theory, Shanny would already be packing up for Buffalo.
I don't have a theory and yes I have no problem accepting a job regardless of who held it before me. If the guy was "my buddy" he wouldn't have a problem. If he did, he's not "my buddy". I'd never hold it against "my buddy" if he took a job I couldn't handle.

Norg
12-07-2009, 11:58 AM
and ideal would have shanny has HC

and Kubes has OC


but thats wont happen LOL

Porky
12-07-2009, 12:14 PM
I think the organization needs a proven winner and not a guy who's already failed at this once before. I think the next head coaching hire either takes or we're really looking at being the 21st century version of the old New Orleans Saints.

I don't see how you hire Greg Williams When Cowher, Gruden, Shanahan, and Holmgren are all out there looking for work. I don't know how Bob McNair stands in front of a podium at a press conference and sells that to the Texans fanbase. It just screams of "I don't have any idea what I'm doing" or "I'm too cheap to spring for a proven coach even though my team has NEVER won" to me.

I like Gruden but he is not going to leave the booth. Supposedly Holmgren is strongly rumored to be heading back to Seattle maybe more in management/GM type position, and no way in hades does Shanny come here to replace Kubes. Sorry, but that ain't happening. That leaves Cowher who I believe may be using the Texans as leverage with Carolina. My guess is he'll stay at his CBS gig if that job doesn't come thru. That's my guess anyway. So to say that not hiring one of these four poses some type of failure is absurd. Unless you wan't Mcnair to kidnap one of these guys I believe it takes two to tango.

BigBull17
12-07-2009, 02:24 PM
Bring back Dick Vermeil or Dan Reevs or if you want to keep going Marv Leavy and just call it a day.

If Vermeil would do it, I could be on board with it.

DerekLee1
12-07-2009, 05:11 PM
If Vermeil would do it, I could be on board with it.

Is Vermeil still alive? Isn't he like 138 years old?

BattleRedToro
12-07-2009, 09:15 PM
My coaches list in order:

1) Tony Dungy
2) Marty Schottenheimer
3) Bill Cowher

sometexansfan
12-07-2009, 09:40 PM
I say bring in Schottenheimer, have him bring in Wade Phillips as DC when Jerry fires him. I know people are worried about the transition to the 3-4, but I think we could pull it off. This is how the front 7 would fill out with what we have now:

DE - Mario
NT- ?
DE - Smith

OLB - Barwin
ILB - Ryans
ILB - Cushing
OLB - ?

Two big question marks I know. But I'm confident we could find a solid NT in the draft or FA. As for that big question mark at OLB, I'll throw this out. Shawne Merriman is a FA at the end of this season. The Chargers have several players to re-sign and it appears the have drafted his replacement in Larry English. Also, Merriman had his most productive seasons under Schottenheimer/Phillips. I know he'd be pricey most likely, but we have the cap space and with OD coming off of knee surgery, he's likely going to come cheap next season. I know it's a long shot, but I thought I'd throw it out there.

Jackie Chiles
12-07-2009, 09:45 PM
I say bring in Schottenheimer, have him bring in Wade Phillips as DC when Jerry fires him. I know people are worried about the transition to the 3-4, but I think we could pull it off. This is how the front 7 would fill out with what we have now:

DE - Mario
NT- ?
DE - Smith

OLB - Barwin
ILB - Ryans
ILB - Cushing
OLB - ?

Two big question marks I know. But I'm confident we could find a solid NT in the draft or FA. As for that big question mark at OLB, I'll throw this out. Shawne Merriman is a FA at the end of this season. The Chargers have several players to re-sign and it appears the have drafted his replacement in Larry English. Also, Merriman had his most productive seasons under Schottenheimer/Phillips. I know he'd be pricey most likely, but we have the cap space and with OD coming off of knee surgery, he's likely going to come cheap next season. I know it's a long shot, but I thought I'd throw it out there.

Whats the deal with Marty nowadays anyway? Has his name even surfaced in any HC search? I haven't heard a peep about him since his last season with the Chargers. I would be interested because his track record in the regular season is great and at this point I just want a guy that can get us into the playoffs. I get the feeling that he is done though. How old is he like 65?

HoustonFrog
12-07-2009, 10:09 PM
I'm for going hard at a proven guy. Now is the time to do it.

BUT If I did get a D Coordinator I'd rather take a shot with a guy like Mike Zimmer in Cincy. Young, great attitude, has lead top defenses in Dallas and has done great in Cincy. I've mentined him alot.

Redtexan#34
12-07-2009, 10:12 PM
If we can not get Cowher and have to go first time head coach my list looks like this.

1)Russ Grimm
2)Mike Zimmer
3)Leslie Frazier

Russ Grimm would be the best bet to get Power football to houston.

A good fit for our current defense would be Zimmer just lack the big DT who wants mount Cody. He was coach under Bill Parcells for 4 years.

My friend is a Vikings fan and his opinion of Frazier is that when he became the DC the Williams wall was allready there. All the vikings needed was a pass rusher and they traded for J. Allen. We dont have A huge DT let alone 2.

Texans_Chick
12-07-2009, 10:19 PM
Whats the deal with Marty nowadays anyway? Has his name even surfaced in any HC search? I haven't heard a peep about him since his last season with the Chargers. I would be interested because his track record in the regular season is great and at this point I just want a guy that can get us into the playoffs. I get the feeling that he is done though. How old is he like 65?

He old.

I have a hard time seeing Shanahan feeling good about replacing Kubiak given their relationship.

I will note that apparently, Bob McNair tried to convince Dom Capers to stay on with the team as a defensive coordinator, and Dom said no.

Kubiak does very much care about the staff. He's been with some of them a long time. Given Shanahan Sr.'s age and that Shan Jr. is on the staff, and that Kubiak isn't afraid to bring experienced guys on his staff, they might do some coaching name trickery with bringing Shan Sr. on the staff. Like a special superduper assistant/blahditty blah.

Dan Reeves as "consultant" was unusual.

Asking Dom to stay as DC is unusual.

Trying to pay Shan Sr. big bucks to give Kubiak cover I would find less unusual than Shan Sr being comfortable supplanting Kubiak.

I would see it as much more likely that Shan Sr. would say screw you Texans, take Wade's job in Dallas, take all of Jerrah's money, take all the fired Texans staff, and stick it to Bob next year when the Texans play the NFC East.

Texans_Chick
12-07-2009, 10:21 PM
Oh, and the title of this post makes me feel a little vomity.

Do Not Want.

edo783
12-07-2009, 10:32 PM
The game has passed Marty by.

Norg
12-07-2009, 10:40 PM
who is Gregg Williams LOL

some names we might think about

Mike Zimmer -Doing some good things in cincy and there D IMO has bee ngood the last 2 years

Mike Pettine- i dont know how much Rex hands are in the Jets D but who knows ????

Joe Philbin -OC for the packers

Marty Schottenheimer... u know i think he would do some good here

i dont know much about the college scene but iam sure a few coaches from alabama wouldnt hurt ???

Hookem Horns
12-07-2009, 10:51 PM
who is Gregg Williams LOL



http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_t9D_ovmGhQE/SLRUx_eJnuI/AAAAAAAAPNA/Q-mkchpiaWc/s400/Gregg+Williams.jpg

BattleRedToro
12-08-2009, 07:03 AM
The game has passed Marty by.

In what way has the game passed Marty by? His last season as a Head Coach his team was 14-2 in the regular season and then lost a close playoff game to New England. It isn't like his team lost to some bad team. Many good teams have lost to New England in close playoff games. Has the game passed by all of those opposing coaches as well? I think not.

4Texans
12-08-2009, 07:38 AM
My coaches list in order:

1) Tony Dungy
2) Marty Schottenheimer
3) Bill Cowher

I say bring in Schottenheimer, have him bring in Wade Phillips as DC when Jerry fires him. .

Whats the deal with Marty nowadays anyway? Has his name even surfaced in any HC search? I haven't heard a peep about him since his last season with the Chargers. I would be interested because his track record in the regular season is great and at this point I just want a guy that can get us into the playoffs. I get the feeling that he is done though. How old is he like 65?

Marty has said that he has no interest in returning to coaching, so his phone isn't ringing.

BattleRedToro
12-08-2009, 11:31 PM
Marty has said that he has no interest in returning to coaching, so his phone isn't ringing.

This is the first that I have heard that. Do you have a link of him saying that?

stingray
12-09-2009, 07:09 AM
This is the first that I have heard that. Do you have a link of him saying that?

He always says that on his appearances on Sirius NFL Radio.

BattleRedToro
12-09-2009, 07:22 AM
He always says that on his appearances on Sirius NFL Radio.

Oh, OK. Well, I guess a team could still try to convince him by offering him a lot of money.

4Texans
12-09-2009, 07:26 AM
This is the first that I have heard that. Do you have a link of him saying that?

He always says that on his appearances on Sirius NFL Radio. Yes, so no Radio links....


Most recently when his name popped up for the Buffalo opening...

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2009/11/23/schottenheimers-name-surfaces-in-buffalo/

ESPN's Chris Mortensen reports that former Browns, Chiefs, Redskins, and Chargers coach Marty Schottenheimer could land on the list of candidates to coach the Buffalo Bills.

Schottenheimer, who was fired by San Diego in February 2007 following a 14-2 regular season that ended in a first-round playoff loss to the Patriots, has said that he has no plans to coach again.

If he were to return to the game, Schottenheimer surely would need control over the football operation. He didn't have it with the Chargers, and Marty repeatedly clashed with G.M. A.J. Smith.

Then again, Marty negotiated full authority over the roster, draft, etc. in Washington, and he was fired after only one year.

Unless Buffalo or another Franchise were to give Marty the keys to the franchise and a blank check, then he's probably not going to get back into coaching.

mussop
12-09-2009, 12:06 PM
So why did NOT get added to the title of this thread?

El Tejano
12-09-2009, 12:28 PM
If we are thinking Gregg Williams, why are we not including Jerry Gray as an option? Jerry Gray has had some darn good defenses.

BIG TORO
12-09-2009, 12:34 PM
Everybody I figured it out, through our latest medical break through's in genetic cloning we can take DNA samples from the late Vince Lombardi and make our very own head coach and since the Texans our partially owned by Houston sports authority we could use government funding to do it! Eureka!

El Tejano
12-09-2009, 12:56 PM
I will donate.

Silver Oak
12-09-2009, 03:42 PM
If we are thinking Gregg Williams, why are we not including Jerry Gray as an option? Jerry Gray has had some darn good defenses.

I think Jerry Gray gets interviewed frequently, but apparently he hasn't been "ready" to this point. Seem to recall him being in line for the titans def. coordinator job last time this year.