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m5kwatts
12-03-2009, 03:17 PM
http://podcast.footballguys.com/2009/Footballguys-Audible-2009-Vol298a.mp3

Former NFL scout Daniel Jeremiah ( http:www.twitter.com/MoveTheSticks ) does this weekly podcast... the Texans are the 3rd topic discussed if you don't wanna hear the whole thing

When a scout says the team lacks mental toughness I'll listen... I know fans have been saying it for awhile and I've denied it but its become apparent now. And thats a head coach's responsibility.

Texecutioner
12-03-2009, 03:22 PM
http://podcast.footballguys.com/2009/Footballguys-Audible-2009-Vol298a.mp3

Former NFL scout Daniel Jeremiah ( http:www.twitter.com/MoveTheSticks ) does this weekly podcast... the Texans are the 3rd topic discussed if you don't wanna hear the whole thing

When a scout says the team lacks mental toughness I'll listen... I know fans have been saying it for awhile and I've denied it but its become apparent now. And thats a head coach's responsibility.

Just about everywhere I've looked or listened to where analysts or reporters from other cities have talked about the Texans they've all basically said this exact same thing and blamed the Texans failures on coaching.

Double Barrel
12-03-2009, 03:27 PM
The team is a reflection of our powder puff owner, who I have the deepest gratitude for bringing an NFL franchise to Houston, btw. But he's still a powder puff until he proves otherwise. 31 NFL owners agree. ;)

m5kwatts
12-03-2009, 03:32 PM
Just about everywhere I've looked or listened to where analysts or reporters from other cities have talked about the Texans they've all basically said this exact same thing and blamed the Texans failures on coaching.

I'm more apt to listen to a scout than some reporter or radio host though so this was more of a wake up call for me because I always denied it but I can't anymore. This team lacks the toughness to close out games. We continue to think that just because we dominate a 1st 2nd or 3rd quarter that its over. This is the reason why I think the season is over and we need a new head coach that can install a close out the game attitude. It wouldn't surprise me one bit if we jumped out on Jacksonville this weekend and so on and we see this same pattern.

Mr. White
12-03-2009, 03:43 PM
Interesting stuff.

They start talking about the Texans at 5:05.

spurstexanstros
12-03-2009, 04:08 PM
The team is a reflection of our powder puff owner, who I have the deepest gratitude for bringing an NFL franchise to Houston, btw. But he's still a powder puff until he proves otherwise. 31 NFL owners agree. ;)

You sound like you have lost faith.
dont let the frustration get to you my friend.....drink some battle red koolaid.

granted I understand the frustration...but take a drink or two or a hundred and get back to the good ole fashioned DB.

Double Barrel
12-03-2009, 04:42 PM
You sound like you have lost faith.
dont let the frustration get to you my friend.....drink some battle red koolaid.

granted I understand the frustration...but take a drink or two or a hundred and get back to the good ole fashioned DB.

yeah, you're right, bro'. Unfortunately, it's the result of high expectations being deflated at this point.

But I'm still with ya', rooting every Sunday and hoping that the football gods bestow a miraculous and unprecedented 5 game win streak on us along with the losses we need from other teams to squeak into the playoffs!

How's that for some battle red koolaide for ya'! :redtowel: GO TEXANS!!

ArlingtonTexan
12-03-2009, 04:48 PM
I know Michael Lombardi has said this repeatedly over the last year, but everytime someone mentions his name we spend most of thread hearing how he is not a credible source. the perception that the Texans are soft, especially mentally is not new.

dalemurphy
12-03-2009, 07:11 PM
I know Michael Lombardi has said this repeatedly over the last year, but everytime someone mentions his name we spend most of thread hearing how he is not a credible source. the perception that the Texans are soft, especially mentally is not new.

What they call "mental softness", I call "youth". None of the high impact players on this team, other than Antonio Smith, have any real experience winning in the NFL. So, it's taking a little more time than we'd like. On the bright side, with the wealth of young talent in place, time is something this organization may have. TexanChick has been ahead of this issue all season... even her current article about Schaub sheds light on it as well. Other than A. Rodgers, none of the top throwing QBs have fewer starts than he does. Interestingly, Rodgers has also taken a lot of heat for losing games even when his numbers are good.

steelbtexan
12-04-2009, 10:42 AM
This team is a reflection of Bob McNair.

Goatcheese
12-04-2009, 11:51 AM
This team is a reflection of Bob McNair.

I don't think that old, bald and ugly is the way I would describe the Texans. :thinking:

steelbtexan
12-04-2009, 04:48 PM
I don't think that old, bald and ugly is the way I would describe the Texans. :thinking:

I would describe them as vanilla, unwilling to take risks and a corporate team.

How would you describe them?

HJam72
12-04-2009, 05:16 PM
I would describe them as vanilla, unwilling to take risks and a corporate team.

How would you describe them?

Peaches and cream.

axman40
12-04-2009, 05:47 PM
Put the coffee down! Coffee is for closers!
ABC,A always, B be ,C Closing!
Gentlemen to win in the NFL you need BRASS BALLS!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TROhlThs9qY&feature=related
Not safe for work
:fans:

steelbtexan
12-04-2009, 05:48 PM
Peaches and cream.

Apt discription

bckey
12-04-2009, 06:30 PM
I like all the lowered expectations and excuses this time of year. :wheel:

Goatcheese
12-04-2009, 06:58 PM
I would describe them as vanilla, unwilling to take risks and a corporate team.

How would you describe them?

Young, mistake prone, and unmotivated.

I like all the lowered expectations and excuses this time of year. :wheel:

I predicted 7-9 in the offseason, so I guess I'm ahead of the trend. :breakdance:

beerlover
12-05-2009, 09:13 AM
snakebit & spine-less :pop:

Mr. White
12-05-2009, 11:38 AM
Seems to me that the road to mental toughness starts in training camp with tackling and hitting drills.

Have any of you guys that have been to TC sessions actually seen these drills?

awtysst
12-05-2009, 12:32 PM
What they call "mental softness", I call "youth". None of the high impact players on this team, other than Antonio Smith, have any real experience winning in the NFL. So, it's taking a little more time than we'd like. On the bright side, with the wealth of young talent in place, time is something this organization may have. TexanChick has been ahead of this issue all season... even her current article about Schaub sheds light on it as well. Other than A. Rodgers, none of the top throwing QBs have fewer starts than he does. Interestingly, Rodgers has also taken a lot of heat for losing games even when his numbers are good.

Yeah, but young players who do not win can become old players that do not win. I mean how many times can we point to the old Saints who had lots of youthful teams that went absolutely nowhere. How about the pre/post Barry Sanders Detroit Lions. We have players on our team that have expierenced winning at College and below levels. Just to name a few: Cush(USC), AJ(Miami), Meco(Bama), Caldwell(Bama), Studdard(Texas), Winston (Miami), etc. They have experienced winning before. All of these guys (and lots of others on the team) came from schools that routinely won more games than they lost. Many of them came from schools that competed for division or Natl Championships each year. They may not have won at the NFL level, but they know what winning is like.

BattleRedToro
12-05-2009, 12:51 PM
I would describe them as vanilla, unwilling to take risks and a corporate team.

How would you describe them?

That may be your opinion, and an attempt at describing Bob McNair, but it shows how little you know about Bob McNair more than anything else. If you did a little research on Mr. McNair instead of making assumptions you'd find out that Mr. McNair made his fortune being a risk taker.

Honoring Earl 34
12-05-2009, 12:59 PM
This picture reminds me of something the Texans could use .

http://www.elated.com/res/Image/imagekits/136/church-bells.jpg

steelbtexan
12-05-2009, 01:09 PM
Well maybe in business that he is familiar with.

Not with a business that he admitted he didn't know much about when he bought the team.

This explains why the Texans are a sucessful franchise $ wise but not on the field.

Bob knows the corporate side of the NFL and is willing to take risks. He doesn't know the on the field product and has now hired 2 regimes to help him in his understanding.

He lets those people call the shots except when it comes to laying out big contracts.

I believe the combination of getting burned on the Carr extention and getting burned with the crappy FA signings by the CC and Smithiak regimes has made McNair gun shy and rightfully so might I add.

This attitude however is hurting the Texans in the process of putting a winning team on the field. You have to be a risk taker to win in the NFL. IMO (Talent wins out ove character in some cases,see Randy Moss for ex.)

houstonspartan
12-05-2009, 01:32 PM
Well maybe in business that he is familiar with.

Not with a business that he admitted he didn't know much about when he bought the team.

This explains why the Texans are a sucessful franchise $ wise but not on the field.

Bob knows the corporate side of the NFL and is willing to take risks. He doesn't know the on the field product and has now hired 2 regimes to help him in his understanding.

He lets those people call the shots except when it comes to laying out big contracts.

I believe the combination of getting burned on the Carr extention and getting burned with the crappy FA signings by the CC and Smithiak regimes has made McNair gun shy and rightfully so might I add.

This attitude however is hurting the Texans in the process of putting a winning team on the field. You have to be a risk taker to win in the NFL. IMO (Talent wins out ove character in some cases,see Randy Moss for ex.)

I think that might have been the case back in the day when he first started the team, but I think McNair is a LOT more savvy now than he was then. You can even tell by the interviews he gives. He's a lot more in control and up to date on things now than he was before. I think the Casserly/Capers era burned him and he realized he needed to take a more active role.

And, if I'm not mistaken, he sold his interests in race horses - a major passion of his - to focus on the football team.

If you think Rick Smith and Gary Kubiak don't get taken to the woodshed by Bob McNair, you're kidding yourself. I saw the look on his face after the game last week. He is not playing around.

Also, McNair knows that more wins = more $$$. It's a fact.

Mr. White
12-05-2009, 03:47 PM
If you did a little research on Mr. McNair instead of making assumptions you'd find out that Mr. McNair made his fortune being a risk taker.


Him and every other billionaire.

His history as an owner shows that he'd rather protect a profit than take risks.

steelbtexan
12-05-2009, 04:07 PM
I think that might have been the case back in the day when he first started the team, but I think McNair is a LOT more savvy now than he was then. You can even tell by the interviews he gives. He's a lot more in control and up to date on things now than he was before. I think the Casserly/Capers era burned him and he realized he needed to take a more active role.

And, if I'm not mistaken, he sold his interests in race horses - a major passion of his - to focus on the football team.

If you think Rick Smith and Gary Kubiak don't get taken to the woodshed by Bob McNair, you're kidding yourself. I saw the look on his face after the game last week. He is not playing around.

Also, McNair knows that more wins = more $$$. It's a fact.

I hope you're right as they say the proofs in the pudding. So far the pudding has tasted like crap. Winning doesn't always translate to more $$$$.

steelbtexan
12-05-2009, 04:10 PM
Him and every other billionaire.

His history as an owner shows that he'd rather protect a profit than take risks.

You are correct sir.

ArlingtonTexan
12-05-2009, 04:11 PM
Him and every other billionaire.

His history as an owner shows that he'd rather protect a profit than take risks.

The texans take risks, but for some reason have an aversion with "name" players/coaches. Rookie QBs, trading picks for Schaub, trading multiple picks for Babin, and Mario williams are actually all risky moves, but move away from "known" quanities versus lesser known ones.

Example, there is very little public risk (only monetary) in spending bunches of money to bring in a name brand coach such as Cowher, Holmgren or Grudden this off season. If one of those guys fail at least you tried, but if you put the franchise in the hands of the next hot coordinator (at a much cheaper cost) it actually a much riskier deal from public perception because you could went with a proven option, even if finding a 40 year old who really gets it could set the franchise up nicely for 10-15 years versus the more experienced guys.

steelbtexan
12-05-2009, 04:42 PM
Co-ordinators that get HC jobs come cheaper than proven SB winning SB caoches. Add that to the fact that getting great asst. coaches cost $$ also your cost goes way up and cuts into the profit.

What do the Colts and Steelers have in common

1. Young HC's
2. Vet Co-ordinators with proven track records. (Pitt. LeBeau,Arians, Colts. Moore and Coyer) both have over 20 yrs exp. but it costs top $$ to keep them.) Compare that to the Texans (F.Bush and K.Shanahan) I thnk you can see where the problems lie with the Texans leadership.

This lack of leadership comes from the top down.

houstonspartan
12-05-2009, 04:46 PM
I hope you're right as they say the proofs in the pudding. So far the pudding has tasted like crap. Winning doesn't always translate to more $$$$.

Yes, it does.

BattleRedToro
12-05-2009, 06:03 PM
I hope you're right as they say the proofs in the pudding. So far the pudding has tasted like crap. Winning doesn't always translate to more $$$$.

The correct phrase is as follows: the proof of the pudding is in the eating.

Goatcheese
12-05-2009, 06:42 PM
Co-ordinators that get HC jobs come cheaper than proven SB winning SB caoches. Add that to the fact that getting great asst. coaches cost $$ also your cost goes way up and cuts into the profit.

What do the Colts and Steelers have in common

1. Young HC's
2. Vet Co-ordinators with proven track records. (Pitt. LeBeau,Arians, Colts. Moore and Coyer) both have over 20 yrs exp. but it costs top $$ to keep them.) Compare that to the Texans (F.Bush and K.Shanahan) I thnk you can see where the problems lie with the Texans leadership.

This lack of leadership comes from the top down.

You do know that the Stealers are 1 game ahead of Houston in the wildcard hunt, and on a 3 game losing spree, right?

ArlingtonTexan
12-05-2009, 06:50 PM
You do know that the Stealers are 1 game ahead of Houston in the wildcard hunt, and on a 3 game losing spree, right?

I think winning the Superbowl last year gives them a mediocrity exemption for 2009.

Runner
12-05-2009, 06:55 PM
I think winning the Superbowl last year gives them a mediocrity exemption for 2009.

I think I can agree with that.

Goatcheese
12-05-2009, 06:58 PM
I think winning the Superbowl last year gives them a mediocrity exemption for 2009.

Not
For
Long

What have you done for me lately?

ArlingtonTexan
12-05-2009, 07:16 PM
Not
For
Long

What have you done for me lately?

As a Texans' fan did you really think about that before you posted it?

Runner
12-05-2009, 07:20 PM
You do know that the Stealers are 1 game ahead of Houston in the wildcard hunt, and on a 3 game losing spree, right?

I think winning the Superbowl last year gives them a mediocrity exemption for 2009.

As a Texans' fan did you really think about that before you posted it?

In Houston (only), you get a pass for mediocrity if it can be spun that there was better mediocrity that year.

DocBar
12-05-2009, 07:40 PM
Want to see a franchise with an owner who takes a risk on every big name FA on the market, Just watch the Redskins. How far has that taken them? All the way to the Toilet Bowl. We have a good organization, a good HC and a good team. We've lost some heartbreakers this season, but all in all, we're on the cusp of being a great team that can whip all comers. If you want to see the Texans go the route of the Cleveland Browns or Washington Redskins, keep calling for a new HC every time you get butt hurt over losing a game we should've won. Pretty soon, we'll be back to every game we manage to win is an upset. Maybe some of you should trade in your jockstraps for Depends if you can't hold your water.

awtysst
12-05-2009, 07:48 PM
Want to see a franchise with an owner who takes a risk on every big name FA on the market, Just watch the Redskins. How far has that taken them? All the way to the Toilet Bowl. We have a good organization, a good HC and a good team. We've lost some heartbreakers this season, but all in all, we're on the cusp of being a great team that can whip all comers. If you want to see the Texans go the route of the Cleveland Browns or Washington Redskins, keep calling for a new HC every time you get butt hurt over losing a game we should've won. Pretty soon, we'll be back to every game we manage to win is an upset. Maybe some of you should trade in your jockstraps for Depends if you can't hold your water.

Redskins have made the playoffs twice since the Texans come into the league. Browns have made it once.

Here is a sobering thought. The only teams that have not had at least one playoff appearence since 2002 are the Houston Texans and the Detroit Lions.

Goatcheese
12-05-2009, 09:09 PM
As a Texans' fan did you really think about that before you posted it?

It's a jab at the knee jerk folks around here who constantly say such inspiring things as "you are what your record says you are." As if nothing matters but the win-loss columns.

We are one game behind Pitt on a similar 3 game slide. They are talking about unleashing hell, and fighting hard to make the playoffs. We are talking about who will be the Texans coach next year.

mussop
12-05-2009, 10:08 PM
Want to see a franchise with an owner who takes a risk on every big name FA on the market, Just watch the Redskins. How far has that taken them? All the way to the Toilet Bowl. We have a good organization, a good HC and a good team. We've lost some heartbreakers this season, but all in all, we're on the cusp of being a great team that can whip all comers. If you want to see the Texans go the route of the Cleveland Browns or Washington Redskins, keep calling for a new HC every time you get butt hurt over losing a game we should've won. Pretty soon, we'll be back to every game we manage to win is an upset. Maybe some of you should trade in your jockstraps for Depends if you can't hold your water.

Want to see a franchise with an owner that doesnt know when to cut his ties and move forward, just watch the Texans. Har far has it taken them? All the way to no where. We have an average organization, and average coach and a average team. We've only won 1 game this year against a good team and all in all were on the cusp of ANOTHER mediocre season. If you want to see the Texans go the route of the Saints or the Colts, demand we go after a real coach that is capable of taking us to the promise land. Pretty soon, we'll be finding ways to win close games instead of loosing them. Maybe some of you should trade in your jockstraps for Depends if you cant hold your water. :roast:

ArlingtonTexan
12-05-2009, 11:12 PM
It's a jab at the knee jerk folks around here who constantly say such inspiring things as "you are what your record says you are." As if nothing matters but the win-loss columns.

We are one game behind Pitt on a similar 3 game slide. They are talking about unleashing hell, and fighting hard to make the playoffs. We are talking about who will be the Texans coach next year.

The context is three potential 8-8 ( or 7-9/9-7 mediocore) seasons where the Texans have not shown any bottom line improvement versus an organization history of winning more Superbowls than any other organization. The Steelers has given their fans a reason to be hopeful, the Texans not so much.

houstonspartan
12-06-2009, 12:05 AM
The context is three potential 8-8 ( or 7-9/9-7 mediocore) seasons where the Texans have not shown any bottom line improvement versus an organization history of winning more Superbowls than any other organization. The Steelers has given their fans a reason to be hopeful, the Texans not so much.

Major rep for you, bro. Totally agree.

Comparing the Steelers struggles this year with the Texans is just dumb. They have way too many Lombardi Trophies to panic about an off year.

houstonspartan
12-06-2009, 12:15 AM
In Houston (only), you get a pass for mediocrity if it can be spun that there was better mediocrity that year.

LOL. True. I'm also sick of the "At least we're not (insert team) a) Detroit; b) St. Louis; c) Kansas City; d) Oakland; e) Buffalo"

GNTLEWOLF
12-06-2009, 12:37 AM
The context is three potential 8-8 ( or 7-9/9-7 mediocore) seasons where the Texans have not shown any bottom line improvement versus an organization history of winning more Superbowls than any other organization. The Steelers has given their fans a reason to be hopeful, the Texans not so much.

The funny thing is.... at the end of the season, there will be people who will try to make the argument that this year's mediocre is better than the previous two year's mediocre, even though this year's schedule was easier and more Texan's friendly than the previous two years. But Somehow, we will have proven to have improved.

Goatcheese
12-06-2009, 01:28 AM
The context is three potential 8-8 ( or 7-9/9-7 mediocore) seasons where the Texans have not shown any bottom line improvement versus an organization history of winning more Superbowls than any other organization. The Steelers has given their fans a reason to be hopeful, the Texans not so much.

So the Steelers take a giant step backward from Super Bowl Champions to fringe playoff team, and it's no big deal. The Texans build a young team from nothing that is in every game right down the the wire, and they suck because they haven't been able to make that one play a game to get over the hump.

You would be the knee jerk fan I'm talking about that can't see anything beyond the win-loss column.

This year they have one(1, single, uno) loss by double digits. Every other game they were competing into the 4th quarter.

Last year they got pooped on by Pittsburgh 38-17, dumped on by Tennessee 31-12, embarrassed by Baltimore 41-13, and choked against Oakland 27-16.

They are scoring more points than they've allowed for the first time in franchise history. They have gone from one of the worst defenses in the NFL to average. They've built the passing offense into one of the leagues best.

Those are huge improvements over last year. The record may turn out the same, but they are not even close to being the same team.

Lucky
12-06-2009, 01:53 AM
The funny thing is.... at the end of the season, there will be people who will try to make the argument that this year's mediocre is better than the previous two year's mediocre, even though this year's schedule was easier and more Texan's friendly than the previous two years. But Somehow, we will have proven to have improved.
You won't even have to wait until the end of the season.
They are scoring more points than they've allowed for the first time in franchise history. They have gone from one of the worst defenses in the NFL to average. They've built the passing offense into one of the leagues best.

Those are huge improvements over last year. The record may turn out the same, but they are not even close to being the same team.
These are quality losses, people.
The Texans build a young team from nothing that is in every game right down the the wire, and they suck because they haven't been able to make that one play a game to get over the hump.
Yes. That's why they suck this year. Last year they sucked because of a hurricane. The year before was because of injuries. The year before was David Carr. Next year it will be due to McNair forcing Kubiak to coach on a lame duck contract year. I guess if he gives Coach Teflon an extension for all of these outstanding .500 seasons, that excuse will go away.

houstonspartan
12-06-2009, 02:16 AM
You won't even have to wait until the end of the season.

These are quality losses, people.

Yes. That's why they suck this year. Last year they sucked because of a hurricane. The year before was because of injuries. The year before was David Carr. Next year it will be due to McNair forcing Kubiak to coach on a lame duck contract year. I guess if he gives Coach Teflon an extension for all of these outstanding .500 seasons, that excuse will go away.

Hey, man! Don't be stealing my ideas! LOL.

No joke, I was just talking about this to someone yesterday. I was wondering that the 2009 excuse would be.

2008 excuse was Hurricane Ike.
2007 excuse was AJ being injured.
2006 excuse was Kubes first year.

It's kind of sad, when you think about it. I mean, we all went through the hurricane and it was crazy, but this team was using the Ike excuse last December when most of us had already cleaned up our yards and moved on.

Thorn
12-06-2009, 07:35 AM
It's a jab at the knee jerk folks around here who constantly say such inspiring things as "you are what your record says you are." As if nothing matters but the win-loss columns.

We are one game behind Pitt on a similar 3 game slide. They are talking about unleashing hell, and fighting hard to make the playoffs. We are talking about who will be the Texans coach next year.

Excellent point on the bolded part. My guess is it's what we have become accustomed to for this team.

ArlingtonTexan
12-06-2009, 09:28 AM
So the Steelers take a giant step backward from Super Bowl Champions to fringe playoff team, and it's no big deal. The Texans build a young team from nothing that is in every game right down the the wire, and they suck because they haven't been able to make that one play a game to get over the hump.

You would be the knee jerk fan I'm talking about that can't see anything beyond the win-loss column.

This year they have one(1, single, uno) loss by double digits. Every other game they were competing into the 4th quarter.

Last year they got pooped on by Pittsburgh 38-17, dumped on by Tennessee 31-12, embarrassed by Baltimore 41-13, and choked against Oakland 27-16.

They are scoring more points than they've allowed for the first time in franchise history. They have gone from one of the worst defenses in the NFL to average. They've built the passing offense into one of the leagues best.

Those are huge improvements over last year. The record may turn out the same, but they are not even close to being the same team.

Okay, great the Texans were a

C- in 2007
C in 2008
C+ in 2009

At the end of the day they are still a C team and 8-8.

Goatcheese
12-06-2009, 10:46 AM
So you would rather see them squeak out 9 wins with incompetent football that requires their opponents to do everything wrong, and then get destroyed and embarrassed 7 times where they can't do anything right, than play 16 quality games and finish 8-8, coming up just 1 play short in their losses?

Again, you're the exact type of fan I'm talking about. Nothing matters to you outside of the win-loss column.

The 2008 Texans got run off the field against quality opponents. They were not competitive at all from the opening kick off to the final whistle. That's a team that deserves a 'C' grade.

The 2009 Texans are a good team that blows out the bad teams, and makes the leagues best teams dig deep down for everything they have to beat them. That's not a 'C+' team.

ArlingtonTexan
12-06-2009, 11:14 AM
So you would rather see them squeak out 9 wins with incompetent football that requires their opponents to do everything wrong, and then get destroyed and embarrassed 7 times where they can't do anything right, than play 16 quality games and finish 8-8, coming up just 1 play short in their losses?

Again, you're the exact type of fan I'm talking about. Nothing matters to you outside of the win-loss column.

The 2008 Texans got run off the field against quality opponents. They were not competitive at all from the opening kick off to the final whistle. That's a team that deserves a 'C' grade.

The 2009 Texans are a good team that blows out the bad teams, and makes the leagues best teams dig deep down for everything they have to beat them. That's not a 'C+' team.

Parcells said it best, You are what your record says you are." The Texans are a mediocore C level team until the records say something else.

When the league stops measuring teams by their won-losss record, I will. The how you get to whatever record is at the end of the day unimportant and insignificant. Makes for nice message board and talk radio discussion, but not much else.

thunderkyss
12-06-2009, 11:14 AM
This explains why the Texans are a sucessful franchise $ wise but not on the field.

The Texans are a successful franchise $ wise, because the City of Houston loves NFL football.

Period

Bob knows the corporate side of the NFL and is willing to take risks. He doesn't know the on the field product and has now hired 2 regimes to help him in his understanding.

He lets those people call the shots except when it comes to laying out big contracts.

No, he lets other people handle the contracts as well.



Co-ordinators that get HC jobs come cheaper than proven SB winning SB caoches. Add that to the fact that getting great asst. coaches cost $$ also your cost goes way up and cuts into the profit.

This lack of leadership comes from the top down.

What in the world makes you think Mr McNair is tight with the purse strings? Nothing he has ever done would even suggest that. Gary Kubiak chose not to bring Greg Williams in. Just like he chose not to bring Larry Johnson in, or to sign Cedric Benson.

Whatever the reason was, I guarantee it wasn't financial

Want to see a franchise with an owner that doesnt know when to cut his ties and move forward, just watch the Texans.

Want to see an owner who got tired of putting up with Prima Donna fans.... look at Bud Adams.

Look at Miami, Look at San Francisco, Look at Seattle, Buffalo, Kansas City...

Look at the fact that this season isn't over yet, and we may very well end up 10-6.

This ain't the powder puff league..

Har far has it taken them? All the way to no where. We have an average organization, and average coach and a average team.

After years of being flat out pathetic, this is a good thing. This is progress.

Maybe some of you should trade in your jockstraps for Depends if you cant hold your water. :roast:

What in the hell does that mean?

The context is three potential 8-8 ( or 7-9/9-7 mediocore) seasons where the Texans have not shown any bottom line improvement versus an organization history of winning more Superbowls than any other organization. The Steelers has given their fans a reason to be hopeful, the Texans not so much.

& what exactly is that bottom line? McNair has said from the beginning, he wants to build a clean family type organization... he doesn't want this to be a "corporation"

He's got a very young team, fresh faces, and he's basically grooming every position, putting the Texans in line for years & years of success, not like these other revolving door franchises.

He's got a young talented GM doing a great job. He's got a Talented head coach who is also doing a very good job. He's got young coaches & scouts learning what it takes to win. & he's got a young team learning what it takes to win.

If you don't think the bottom line on this team has shown marked improvement, you're just looking at the wrong bottom line.


Comparing the Steelers struggles this year with the Texans is just dumb. They have way too many Lombardi Trophies to panic about an off year.

What does a trophy case full of Lombardies have to do with your ability to win a football game today? It's not like Bradshaw is going to sub for Big Ben or anything.

the point is you have successful franchises who have won SuperBowls in the recent past, the Steelers, the Bucs, the Giants struggling to get a win. Like I said, this ain't the powder puff league. This is the NFL. Old coaches, new coaches, experienced Super Bowl winning water boys, it don't matter. This is a tough league.

The funny thing is....

... even though this year's schedule was easier and more Texan's friendly than the previous two years.

NYJ (6-6) L
TEN (5-6) W
JAC (6-5) L
OAK (3-8) W
ARI (7-4) L
CIN (8-3) W
SF (5-6) W
BUF (4-6) W
IND (11-0) L
TEN (5-6) L
IND (11-0) L

We didn't split the games with Indy, like some people believed we would. Tennessee went 13-3 last year, so most everyone had us splitting those games, which we did. We still have a chance to split the game with Jacksonville, which some people thought we would do anyway.

Arizona is proving to be better than they were last year, & so are the Jets... So that's only three games we lost this year, that we weren't supposed to (ARI, NYJ, IND).. other than that, we're right on track.

If you thought at the beginning of the year, that we would finish 10-6, winning those three games..... ARI, NYJ, & IND which of the next 5 games did you think we would lose, but will have to win?

Jax? we already mentioned that we were going to split with them, so we've got to count this one as a must win.

SEA? Did you think this was one that we were going to lose, but now we've got to win? Do you not think it is possible?

STL? They were a better team last year, did you think we would lose this one, and now we've got to do something super spectacular to win?

MIA? Maybe you thought we would lose this one? it's about time, we've kicked their ass for the last three years.... Call me crazy, but I still think we can win this one.

NE? This is the only game I would concede that you may have thought we would have lost.

I know it sucks losing three divisional games in a row. But it isn't unheard of to get swept by the Colts (I hope the Titans get swept), & splitting the games with the Tacks.

Forget about the last 4 weeks, & look at the season. Put your panties on straight, put that other crap behind us, and let's root for some Texans.

mussop
12-06-2009, 11:54 AM
The Texans are a successful franchise $ wise, because the City of Houston loves NFL football.

Period

No, he lets other people handle the contracts as well.





What in the world makes you think Mr McNair is tight with the purse strings? Nothing he has ever done would even suggest that. Gary Kubiak chose not to bring Greg Williams in. Just like he chose not to bring Larry Johnson in, or to sign Cedric Benson.

Whatever the reason was, I guarantee it wasn't financial


Want to see an owner who got tired of putting up with Prima Donna fans.... look at Bud Adams.

Look at Miami, Look at San Francisco, Look at Seattle, Buffalo, Kansas City...

Look at the fact that this season isn't over yet, and we may very well end up 10-6.

This ain't the powder puff league..

After years of being flat out pathetic, this is a good thing. This is progress.


What in the hell does that mean?



& what exactly is that bottom line? McNair has said from the beginning, he wants to build a clean family type organization... he doesn't want this to be a "corporation"

He's got a very young team, fresh faces, and he's basically grooming every position, putting the Texans in line for years & years of success, not like these other revolving door franchises.

He's got a young talented GM doing a great job. He's got a Talented head coach who is also doing a very good job. He's got young coaches & scouts learning what it takes to win. & he's got a young team learning what it takes to win.

If you don't think the bottom line on this team has shown marked improvement, you're just looking at the wrong bottom line.



What does a trophy case full of Lombardies have to do with your ability to win a football game today? It's not like Bradshaw is going to sub for Big Ben or anything.

the point is you have successful franchises who have won SuperBowls in the recent past, the Steelers, the Bucs, the Giants struggling to get a win. Like I said, this ain't the powder puff league. This is the NFL. Old coaches, new coaches, experienced Super Bowl winning water boys, it don't matter. This is a tough league.



NYJ (6-6) L
TEN (5-6) W
JAC (6-5) L
OAK (3-8) W
ARI (7-4) L
CIN (8-3) W
SF (5-6) W
BUF (4-6) W
IND (11-0) L
TEN (5-6) L
IND (11-0) L

We didn't split the games with Indy, like some people believed we would. Tennessee went 13-3 last year, so most everyone had us splitting those games, which we did. We still have a chance to split the game with Jacksonville, which some people thought we would do anyway.

Arizona is proving to be better than they were last year, & so are the Jets... So that's only three games we lost this year, that we weren't supposed to (ARI, NYJ, IND).. other than that, we're right on track.

If you thought at the beginning of the year, that we would finish 10-6, winning those three games..... ARI, NYJ, & IND which of the next 5 games did you think we would lose, but will have to win?

Jax? we already mentioned that we were going to split with them, so we've got to count this one as a must win.

SEA? Did you think this was one that we were going to lose, but now we've got to win? Do you not think it is possible?

STL? They were a better team last year, did you think we would lose this one, and now we've got to do something super spectacular to win?

MIA? Maybe you thought we would lose this one? it's about time, we've kicked their ass for the last three years.... Call me crazy, but I still think we can win this one.

NE? This is the only game I would concede that you may have thought we would have lost.

I know it sucks losing three divisional games in a row. But it isn't unheard of to get swept by the Colts (I hope the Titans get swept), & splitting the games with the Tacks.

Forget about the last 4 weeks, & look at the season. Put your panties on straight, put that other crap behind us, and let's root for some Texans.

First about my previous post. I was just funnin with the poster I was responding too.

Second way to cherry pick the season and keep everything rainbows and butterflies.:snowday: We have beaten 1 quality team this year....1......The only team we have blown out was the Raiders,,,,,,,THE RAIDERS. Of course im going to root for my team but that doesnt mean im going to sit here and act like its Christmas 16 weeks a year jsut because we have a team. I poor my heart and wallet into this franchise which gives me the right to demand more than just a showing every week.

Vinny
12-06-2009, 11:55 AM
It's a jab at the knee jerk folks around here who constantly say such inspiring things as "you are what your record says you are." As if nothing matters but the win-loss columns.

We are one game behind Pitt on a similar 3 game slide. They are talking about unleashing hell, and fighting hard to make the playoffs. We are talking about who will be the Texans coach next year.Their leader aka "head coach" is talking about "unleashing hell". Our leader is talking about how sloppy play is acceptable and how his kids are doing a good job. Comparing the Texans to the Steelers is laughable on so many levels it's ridiculous.

The context is three potential 8-8 ( or 7-9/9-7 mediocore) seasons where the Texans have not shown any bottom line improvement versus an organization history of winning more Superbowls than any other organization. The Steelers has given their fans a reason to be hopeful, the Texans not so much. The Steelers also go out and produce victories for the vast majority of their seasons instead of perpetually talking about how .500 is acceptable as long as the fans are patient enough.

steelbtexan
12-06-2009, 12:15 PM
TK

to your points, I dont know how to split up quotes

1.You're correct, but when the fan base gets tired of paying through the nose for medicore football it isn't going to be pretty. Ask Bud about this.

2. You're telling me Smithiak made the call on Carr? If this is the case Smithiak should be fired. RS has done a good job back loading contracts which is going to save McNair alot of $$ and limits the bust factor in FA somewhat.This philosophy also limits the team from signing top tier FA's.
3. If Kubes isn't willing to hire top co-ordinators or coaches and he has the final say so on the purse strings but is unwilling to hire the best (inferioriy complex) he should be fired.

In business if you can hire the best you may have to pay more in the begining but these employees usually pay for themselves by 10 fold.

thunderkyss
12-06-2009, 01:48 PM
TK

to your points, I dont know how to split up quotes

1.You're correct, but when the fan base gets tired of paying through the nose for medicore football it isn't going to be pretty. Ask Bud about this.

This is really a pretty complicated deal here. not as simple as "fans getting tired of paying"

2. You're telling me Smithiak made the call on Carr? If this is the case Smithiak should be fired. RS has done a good job back loading contracts which is going to save McNair alot of $$ and limits the bust factor in FA somewhat.This philosophy also limits the team from signing top tier FA's.


Rick wasn't here at the time, that was Casserly, & they did fire him....


3. If Kubes isn't willing to hire top co-ordinators or coaches and he has the final say so on the purse strings but is unwilling to hire the best (inferioriy complex) he should be fired.



This is a straw man argument, as in there is nothing to back it up.

How can you blame the Coordinators for this years losses?

This defense needed a few weeks to get up to speed, but once they got it going, they've been pretty good. Defensive coordinator did his job.

We've got a reputable DL coach in Bill Kollar, The LB coach is obviously doing his job, & our secondary coach is also an up & coming. ON top of that, we've got Ray Rhodes as a Senior Defensive Assistant. He was a pretty dang good coach if I remember right.


The offense has been getting it done as well, obviously we've got issues running the ball... while there are issues at running back... the OL has been the biggest part of the problem. We've got 3 OL coaches, one is supposedly the best.

Do you have a problem with our WR coach, or our TE coach? I can't imagine why.

RB Coach.... maybe, who do you want to replace him with?


In business if you can hire the best you may have to pay more in the begining but these employees usually pay for themselves by 10 fold.

help me understand, who is it exactly did you want to get?

steelbtexan
12-06-2009, 02:06 PM
This is really a pretty complicated deal here. not as simple as "fans getting tired of paying"

Rick wasn't here at the time, that was Casserly, & they did fire him....


This is a straw man argument, as in there is nothing to back it up.

How can you blame the Coordinators for this years losses?

This defense needed a few weeks to get up to speed, but once they got it going, they've been pretty good. Defensive coordinator did his job.

We've got a reputable DL coach in Bill Kollar, The LB coach is obviously doing his job, & our secondary coach is also an up & coming. ON top of that, we've got Ray Rhodes as a Senior Defensive Assistant. He was a pretty dang good coach if I remember right.


The offense has been getting it done as well, obviously we've got issues running the ball... while there are issues at running back... the OL has been the biggest part of the problem. We've got 3 OL coaches, one is supposedly the best.

Do you have a problem with our WR coach, or our TE coach? I can't imagine why.

RB Coach.... maybe, who do you want to replace him with?



help me understand, who is it exactly did you want to get?

It's all SUNSHINE

This marvelously talented and well coached team is down 23-9 late in the 3rd qtr.

Gregg Williams would have suited me just fine.

I dont know who was available at the time K.Shanahan was hired but I'm sure he wasn't the most qualified person for the job. If they interviewed anybody at all. Kind of like when they didn't interview anybody and just gave F.Bush the job.

This coaching staff is full of two things.
1. Nepotism
2.Cronyism

DerekLee1
12-06-2009, 02:18 PM
wrong thread. edit...

steelbtexan
12-06-2009, 02:20 PM
The Brits know their Futbol.

Yes their right this will get Kubes fired.

mussop
12-06-2009, 02:58 PM
Kubiak keeps putting them in postion to win and they keep blowing it. :tiphat:

We are so close to being a good team. After years of being flat out pathetic, this is a good thing. This is progress. We've got a very young team, fresh faces, and were basically grooming every position, putting the Texans in line for years & years of success, not like these other revolving door franchises.
We have a young talented GM doing a great job. He's got a Talented head coach who is also doing a very good job. We have young coaches & scouts learning what it takes to win. & he's got a young team learning what it takes to win. If you don't think the bottom line on this team has shown marked improvement, you're just looking at the wrong bottom line.

:photos:

What say ye now? :chef:

steelbtexan
12-06-2009, 03:00 PM
Kubiak keeps putting them in postion to win and they keep blowing it. :tiphat:

We are so close to being a good team. After years of being flat out pathetic, this is a good thing. This is progress. We've got a very young team, fresh faces, and were basically grooming every position, putting the Texans in line for years & years of success, not like these other revolving door franchises.
We have a young talented GM doing a great job. He's got a Talented head coach who is also doing a very good job. We have young coaches & scouts learning what it takes to win. & he's got a young team learning what it takes to win. If you don't think the bottom line on this team has shown marked improvement, you're just looking at the wrong bottom line.

:photos:

What say ye now? :chef:

Yeah lets hear from the SUNSHINE CROWD

Goatcheese
12-06-2009, 03:09 PM
Parcells said it best, You are what your record says you are." The Texans are a mediocore C level team until the records say something else.

When the league stops measuring teams by their won-losss record, I will. The how you get to whatever record is at the end of the day unimportant and insignificant. Makes for nice message board and talk radio discussion, but not much else.

So you are actually saying that if you luck into 9 wins where you play like crap, but the opponent randomly fumbles the ball in the endzone a couple of times, and then get destroyed in 7 losses, you're a better team than if you play great football for 16 games and finish 8-8?

That's just dumb. :gun:

Their leader aka "head coach" is talking about "unleashing hell". Our leader is talking about how sloppy play is acceptable and how his kids are doing a good job. Comparing the Texans to the Steelers is laughable on so many levels it's ridiculous.

The Steelers also go out and produce victories for the vast majority of their seasons instead of perpetually talking about how .500 is acceptable as long as the fans are patient enough.

I thought "you are what your record says you are"?

You and Arlington need to huddle up and get the gameplan straight.

Does this only apply to the Texans? Are the Steelers, who just choked one away against FRIGGIN OAKLAND, just exempt from these clever little rules?

Vinny
12-06-2009, 03:13 PM
So you are actually saying that if you luck into 9 wins where you play like crap, but the opponent randomly fumbles the ball in the endzone a couple of times, and then get destroyed in 7 losses, you're a better team than if you play great football for 16 games and finish 8-8?

That's just dumb. :gun:



I thought "you are what your record says you are"?

You and Arlington need to huddle up and get the gameplan straight.

Does this only apply to the Texans? Are the Steelers, who just choked one away against FRIGGIN OAKLAND, just exempt from these clever little rules?
some people think for themselves. You can argue that the Texans and the Steelers are equal all you want....I won't stop the stupidity.

Mr. White
12-06-2009, 03:15 PM
Does this only apply to the Texans? Are the Steelers, who just choked one away against FRIGGIN OAKLAND, just exempt from these clever little rules?

The Steelers are what their record says they are too. But then again, they just won a Super Bowl.

Goatcheese
12-06-2009, 03:16 PM
some people think for themselves. You can argue that the Texans and the Steelers are equal all you want....I won't stop the stupidity.

Did you not just see them lose to OAKLAND?

nut
12-06-2009, 03:22 PM
LOL. It doesn't take an NFL scout to figure out the Texans are softer than Charmin. A cub scout could figure that one out easily.

Vinny
12-06-2009, 03:23 PM
Did you not just see them lose to OAKLAND? So what? They pay those guys too. Your argument is like saying that since Kazuo Matsui hit the same amount of home runs as Albert Pujols one day, they must both be power hitters.

Goatcheese
12-06-2009, 03:25 PM
So what? They pay those guys too. Your argument is like saying that since Kazuo Matsui hit the same amount of home runs as Albert Pujols one day, they must both be power hitters.

So what you're saying is you are not necessarily what your record says you are.

Am I understanding that correctly?

ArlingtonTexan
12-06-2009, 03:32 PM
The Steelers are what their record says they are too. But then again, they just won a Super Bowl.

Correct. The Steelers and Texans are both having mediocore (at best) seasons. The texans are mediocore at best organization, the Steelers are a model NFL franchise, not playing up to thier normal standards. The Texans are doing business as usual.