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View Full Version : An interesting theory on VY, Jeff Fisher, and Bud Adams


gtexan02
11-11-2009, 09:42 AM
I was talking to a friend of mine the other day, and he had an interesting thought about the VY, Jeff Fisher, Bud Adams strangeness.

His thought was that VY was significantly more depressed than he or the media let on, and that Fisher benched him because he was legimately afraid that another bad performance by VY could actually lead to suicide.

By waiting until the Titans were 0-6, Adams felt like the pressure was off and forced Fisher to play VY, despite Fishers objections on the basis of VYs mental health.

So far so good for that plan, but I guess we'll have to wait and see what happens if he gets booed again.

WWJD
11-11-2009, 11:16 AM
Who knows but that could be true...

I was just reading a story about Germany's top goalie committing suicide by stepping in front of a train (yikes!).

He was severely depressed over some family issues concerning his children.

Who knows what state Vince was in other than perhaps his family and closest friends?

Double Barrel
11-11-2009, 11:37 AM
Watch out, gtex, you're tip-toeing the line here. VY's #1 fan could find you in the forum and wish bad things for your long-term health. You'd better add a "VY IS AWESOME" disclaimer to your post.

Second Honeymoon
11-12-2009, 10:56 AM
Watch out, gtex, you're tip-toeing the line here. VY's #1 fan could find you in the forum and wish bad things for your long-term health. You'd better add a "VY IS AWESOME" disclaimer to your post.

youre not talking about me are you?

MojoMan
11-12-2009, 11:00 AM
I have a very different theory about these three guys that I have been considering.

Perhaps part of the reason that Vince Young does not have much in the way of passing statistics is that Bud Adams forced Young on Fisher against his will. Perhaps Fisher does not have a lot of confidence in Vince and is using a more conservative offense to hide Vince's shortcomings.

Just a thought.

Double Barrel
11-12-2009, 11:10 AM
youre not talking about me are you?

Of course not, man! Check your PM. :)

TitanFan
11-12-2009, 02:18 PM
Bud wanted Vince and Fisher didnt. Fish has held that grudge ever since, never fully embracing VY even after he took an 0-5 team to 8-8 (just look at his post game interviews after the texans or nyg's game of vince's rookie season. he doesn't even bring vince up--he couldn't admit being wrong, just like so many fans and analysts out there) and then the playoffs the next year. The thought that he has held Vince on the bench for his mental health is interesting but ultimately laughable. Common guys, Vince is getting paid millions to play. Furthermore, sitting on the bench would be much tougher on the psyche than playing football for a run first team.

I think what mojo failed to say was that Fisher has been proven wrong about Vince. Fisher should lose his job for this 0-6 start and deserves 0 credit for the 2-0 turnaround since Vince took over.

Fish is Vince's and the Titans' biggest problem. Watch out for the Titans to dominate the clock when they come to Houston. Vince and CJ leading the titans on long first down drives.

we're coming

jaayteetx
11-12-2009, 02:24 PM
Bud wanted Vince and Fisher didnt. Fish has held that grudge ever since, never fully embracing VY even after he took an 0-5 team to 8-8 (just look at his post game interviews after the texans or nyg's game of vince's rookie season. he doesn't even bring vince up--he couldn't admit being wrong, just like so many fans and analysts out there) and then the playoffs the next year. The thought that he has held Vince on the bench for his mental health is interesting but ultimately laughable. Common guys, Vince is getting paid millions to play. Furthermore, sitting on the bench would be much tougher on the psyche than playing football for a run first team.

I think what mojo failed to say was that Fisher has been proven wrong about Vince. Fisher should lose his job for this 0-6 start and deserves 0 credit for the 2-0 turnaround since Vince took over.

Fish is Vince's and the Titans' biggest problem. Watch out for the Titans to dominate the clock when they come to Houston. Vince and CJ leading the titans on long first down drives.

we're coming

Watch for the Texans defense to shut down the Titans one dimensional offense this time around, Titans winning streak ends in Houston. If they win this week that is.

Double Barrel
11-12-2009, 02:32 PM
Bud wanted Vince and Fisher didnt. Fish has held that grudge ever since,...

Source, please. Otherwise it is speculation and conjecture.

Hardcore Texan
11-12-2009, 02:41 PM
I remember the good ole days when players where benched because of their sucky ass performance......:truck:

spurstexanstros
11-12-2009, 06:46 PM
I remember the good ole days when players where benched because of their sucky ass performance......:truck:

I thought that was why he was benched...that or the sausage party photo.

Honoring Earl 34
11-12-2009, 07:07 PM
Bud wanted Vince and Fisher didnt. Fish has held that grudge ever since, never fully embracing VY even after he took an 0-5 team to 8-8 (just look at his post game interviews after the texans or nyg's game of vince's rookie season. he doesn't even bring vince up--he couldn't admit being wrong, just like so many fans and analysts out there) and then the playoffs the next year. The thought that he has held Vince on the bench for his mental health is interesting but ultimately laughable. Common guys, Vince is getting paid millions to play. Furthermore, sitting on the bench would be much tougher on the psyche than playing football for a run first team.

I think what mojo failed to say was that Fisher has been proven wrong about Vince. Fisher should lose his job for this 0-6 start and deserves 0 credit for the 2-0 turnaround since Vince took over.

Fish is Vince's and the Titans' biggest problem. Watch out for the Titans to dominate the clock when they come to Houston. Vince and CJ leading the titans on long first down drives.

we're coming

The Titans started out 0-6 because of Fat Albert and the DC leaving . The next most valuable player/coach is Chris Johnson and if he gets hurt , it won't matter who the QB is . Last year Collins protected the ball and got in field goal range and the defense protected the lead . This year the defense stinks and teams pushed the bully back and now the swagger is gone .

How has Fisher been proven wrong ? It's two games and Texan fans have seen plenty of high percentage dink and dunk passes to know ... they don't win you games .

Sideline
11-12-2009, 07:28 PM
Last year Collins protected the ball and got in field goal range and the defense protected the lead . This year the defense stinks and teams pushed the bully back and now the swagger is gone .



I actually saw some numbers on Collins recently which compared this year and last year and his numbers were virtually all the same, marginally better and worse in some areas but on a whole the same. Collin's job was to manage the game i.e dont lose it.

It's the Titans D that is responsible for their drop off clearly, as the O never had to get much done anyway in order to win.

Hardcore Texan
11-12-2009, 09:08 PM
I thought that was why he was benched...that or the sausage party photo.

Precisely! That's why he was benched not because of his fragile ego or whatever the theory was, he sucked ass and he rode the pine. Hope to see more of Sir Wonderlic on the bench in the near future.

Texan4Ever
11-12-2009, 09:21 PM
No offense to Vince Young (and I hope him the best) but Iv'e believed he was always overrated and that he was hyped up by the media and didn't turn out to be the player everyone thought he would be.

I'll admit it, I thought David Carr would still be around and been to multiple Pro Bowl trips (no one could have had as high of hopes as I did). Carr was another player hyped up and turned out to be a weakling who just wanted to sit on the bench and get a tan.

TitanFan
11-12-2009, 10:13 PM
it is speculation more than fact, but from every insider account i have read, it defitely seems like fisher didn't like vinces game while bud adams and floyd reese, the former gm were huge fans. Bud has been quoted as saying "Vince is my guy", after he was drafted and multiple times since.

if u had watched the titans the last 2 weeks you would know that their defense is anything but one dimensional, even if that one dimension is the best in the league. Vince is going to surprise people with hsi near 70% completion %.

weve got nothing to lose, but everything to take. sorry guys, i support the texans 87.5% of their regular season games, but MNF is not going to be a good night for you.

TitanFan
11-12-2009, 10:19 PM
ill hear the argument that vince wont be a great nfl qb even tho itll hurt my ears, but to say that vy hasnt proven himself to be the better qb between collins and himself is ludicrous; ie, fisher has been proven wrong

21-11


21 and freaking 11

half of the guys wins have come for teams that lost every other single game they played with another qb. kc 0-5 in 2006 and 0-6 in 2009.

proven

what can he do to show you? winning here im sure still wont be enough

Hookem Horns
11-13-2009, 02:08 AM
That's sad about the German goalie stepping in front of that train. Unfortunately on MNF VY will be stepping in front of a train also, the 56 Express.

infantrycak
11-13-2009, 02:16 AM
it is speculation more than fact, but from every insider account i have read, it defitely seems like fisher didn't like vinces game while bud adams and floyd reese, the former gm were huge fans. Bud has been quoted as saying "Vince is my guy", after he was drafted and multiple times since.

It's kind of funny to see a VY fan come in here and claim Fisher didn't want VY (which I believe) after a few years of having VY fans come in after the draft saying all those reports are BS when they were high on him.

Vince is going to surprise people with hsi near 70% completion %.

LOL - barking up the wrong tree. We had a QB tie the NFL record for completions in a row. He sucked too while throwing 2 yard passes to his RB and praying something would happen.

Double Barrel
11-13-2009, 11:25 AM
21-11



Wow, he did that all by himself. You're right, he's amaaaaaaaazing. He can win without the other 21 players...well, except for 11 of them.

W/L stats for QBs is lame. No other position is judged on that stat for a team sport, and it should be no different for QBs.

TitanFan
11-13-2009, 11:27 AM
car really set the record for completions in a row? i dont know what to think if thats true.....he was and is horrible

vince runs for first downs and make completions on third down. his teammates love him (he has an 0-6 team playing each game like its the superbowl--with the offense yelling for the defense and vice vera; a rarity in pro sports)

jeff fisher was my favorite coach of all time until about a year ago. he let his anti vy bias finally get the best of them. sure kc won at lot of games last year, but couldn't win the big ones. in fact our only tough win all of last year was over pittsburg, and thats because big ben made a ton of turnovers. fisher was great, and now hell be gone

anybody read to face john gruden or bill cower?

infantrycak
11-13-2009, 11:33 AM
car really set the record for completions in a row? i dont know what to think if thats true.....he was and is horrible

Carr tied the then existing record which was broken by one pass shortly thereafter by the illustrious Mark Bruenell in his last year of play.

In Carr's last ignominious year with the Texans he had a completion % of 68.3 which would be 4% better than VY's best current year. Completion % means jack when the YPA are low.

vince runs for first downs and make completions on third down.

VY does have an ability to pull rabbits. Problem is he also puts teams in a position to have to pull rabbits.

anybody read to face john gruden or bill cower?

I'd rather face Gruden and you're never getting Cowher.

TitanFan
11-13-2009, 11:34 AM
Wow, he did that all by himself. You're right, he's amaaaaaaaazing. He can win without the other 21 players...well, except for 11 of them.

W/L stats for QBs is lame. No other position is judged on that stat for a team sport, and it should be no different for QBs.

spoken like a true texan fan
if vy was hear, houston wouldve made the playoffs by now, garantee

and obviously he didnt do it by himeself. for half of them he did it with a team that was 0-5 before he took over and 0-6 before he took over another year.

the simple truth is, he makes others around him play better for a myriad of reasons. the two most obvious: vince is a 24/7 motivator whose confidence is infectious, and 2nd and most importantly, he just burns clock, giving everyone more energy (especially our defense)

Double Barrel
11-13-2009, 11:58 AM
Carr tied the then existing record which was broken by one pass shortly thereafter by the illustrious Mark Bruenell in his last year of play.

Actually, Brunell and Carr are tied for that record.

Brunell set it at Reliant on September 24, 2006, in a win over the Texans. Link (http://sports-att.espn.go.com/nfl/recap?gameId=260924034)

Carr tied the record at Reliant on November 19, 2006 in a loss to the Bills. Link (http://blogs.chron.com/nfl/2006/11/carr_ties_mark_brunells_record_1.html)

spoken like a true texan fan

I spoke like an NFL fan. Nobody but myopic VY-fanboys believe the crap that you're spewing. Even many (if not most) Titans fans don't buy it.

if vy was hear, houston wouldve made the playoffs by now, garantee

"guarantee"....? :rolleyes:

That's just a silly statement.

and obviously he didnt do it by himeself.

Then why do you seem to give him all the credit with W/L records? Did he play defense, too? I must have missed those highlights.

the simple truth is, he makes others around him play better for a myriad of reasons. the two most obvious: vince is a 24/7 motivator whose confidence is infectious, and 2nd and most importantly, he just burns clock, giving everyone more energy (especially our defense)

Spoken like a true VY-fanboy. :loser

Honoring Earl 34
11-13-2009, 12:09 PM
spoken like a true texan fan
if vy was hear, houston wouldve made the playoffs by now, garanteeand obviously he didnt do it by himeself. for half of them he did it with a team that was 0-5 before he took over and 0-6 before he took over another year.

the simple truth is, he makes others around him play better for a myriad of reasons. the two most obvious: vince is a 24/7 motivator whose confidence is infectious, and 2nd and most importantly, he just burns clock, giving everyone more energy (especially our defense)

Ok ... now your acting like VY is an all-time great . Dink and dunk passers dink and dunk cause A their scared of throwing it down the field because most of the time you have a small window to throw it through or you have to anticipate him coming open or B an NFL defense is Greek to them so they take the easiest route .

If Vince can move the chains with his legs then that's temporary because he'll get injured . The two best QBs ( Manning and Brees ) right now don't run they throw and miss very few games .

TitanFan
11-13-2009, 12:20 PM
career winning % for QB's with atleast 30 starts. check the list.

but if you had actually read my post u would have understood that he does not get whole credit for the defense and running game, but he certainly gets part of the credit, and i have said why too.

a defense plays better when they get to rest. vy does nothing but move and move and move the ball some more

as far as completion % record, well obviously its not everything, but when his accuracu as a qb is the thing he is most oftened questioned over than his improving completion percentage and already high number serves to disprove the doubters.

why cant you all admit he is good, and that u hope you are able to beat a good qb who comes into town with extra motivation?

the whole world has gone mad! i feel like a 2004 voter after george w bush had imploded the world and was going back for more.

lets play a hypothetical game: what will u say when the titans dominate the ball, and vince leads another 4th quarter winning drive (his 7th in less than 2 full seasons, which would put him ahead of elway's pace for 4th quarter comebacks per start)??? probably that CJ is the reason we dominated clock and then point out a couple of lucky plays on the final drive. theis convo is going no where

vince could be superbowl mvp and u people would still rip on him. its disgusting and classless.

you better watch out, you better not cry, bc vy is coming to town. his town and his stadium

BOOM

TitanFan
11-13-2009, 12:23 PM
minmum 30 starts:

1.otto graham,
2.tom brady,
3.joe montana
4.VINCE YOUNG

until his record season, tom brady and joe manatana got ALL their credit for winning. ALL

TitanFan
11-13-2009, 12:27 PM
ill agree that without running, vince is not a great qb, but when he runs for tds on long 3rd downs or goes 10 yrds before going out of bounds to extend a drive on third down, or when he breaks a couple of tackles and makes an amzing rollout to pinpoint someone down field with a lazer to the sideline to complete yet a nother first down, then yes he is GREAT

trade schaub for VY today and the texans make the playoffs THIS YEAR. Trade for him in the offseason and the texans are a one seed in next years playoffs. schaub is an avg qb in a system just like cutler was. he chokes with the game on the line and will never be a winner.

Houston needs VY...we really really do. I promise to change my name from titanfan to texanfanatic if it happens

jaayteetx
11-13-2009, 12:30 PM
ill agree that without running, vince is not a great qb, but when he runs for tds on long 3rd downs or goes 10 yrds before going out of bounds to extend a drive on third down, or when he breaks a couple of tackles and makes an amzing rollout to pinpoint someone down field with a lazer to the sideline to complete yet a nother first down, then yes he is GREAT

trade schaub for VY today and the texans make the playoffs THIS YEAR. Trade for him in the offseason and the texans are a one seed in next years playoffs. schaub is an avg qb in a system just like cutler was. he chokes with the game on the line and will never be a winner.

Houston needs VY...we really really do. I promise to change my name from titanfan to texanfanatic if it happens

I think I speak for most posters here, we just assume you keep the name titanfan.

infantrycak
11-13-2009, 12:37 PM
minmum 30 starts:

1.otto graham,
2.tom brady,
3.joe montana
4.VINCE YOUNG

until his record season, tom brady and joe manatana got ALL their credit for winning. ALL

What did you use for a calculator, a monkey with some dice? Notice anybody obviously missing from beating out VY's .645 winning %? Like say Peyton and his .767 winning %. I guess you just forgot what a real QB looks like so blocked him out.

Bulluck53
11-13-2009, 12:37 PM
After two games, it seems that VY is what Collins was last year. He might be a little more effective in the grand scheme, but he can't be much more. Last year Collins wasn't asked to win games by himself and he controlled the game by taking care of the ball and picking up the occasional 3rd down. This season when the defense went away Collins was called upon to make up the defecit and he's just not capable anymore.

So far VY has done the same this year that Collins did last year. Until CJ is shut down or the defense starts playing like they did earlier in the season we won't see if he truly is that much of an upgrade.

TitanFan
11-13-2009, 12:43 PM
but you all have assumed a lot of things over the years and cant get a 2 win team any better than 8-8. vy is about to do it for the second time in 3 seasons

its ok, i dont let other dictate my fandom. i wanna support this city, but they crapped in my mouth when they passed on vince. redneck piece of texas a and m aggie trash that kubiak is.

guys too dumb to even know when to call timeouts. he just tooks shanihans system, brought in shanihans kid and is standing around holding his package taking credit

Double Barrel
11-13-2009, 12:48 PM
vince could be superbowl mvp and u people would still rip on him. its disgusting and classless.

Should that happen, I will be the first to eat crow. I'm not a blind NFL fan that views everything through Texans glasses. If VY makes that kind of turnaround, from being an athlete with sub-par QB skills and great running ability to an actual Super Bowl MVP QB, I'll call it like I see it.

You, on the other hand, need to be objective and quit acting like it has already happened. Otherwise, you have absolutely no credibility around these parts and are perceived as nothing more than a delusional VY-fanboy.

until his record season, tom brady and joe manatana got ALL their credit for winning. ALL

Two of the greatest QBs in NFL history. One already in the HoF and the other in the middle of a HoF career.

You aren't serious, are you? If so, backtrack to my previous paragraph about stop acting like it's already happened. I'm trying to do you a favor here.

Houston needs VY...we really really do. I promise to change my name from titanfan to texanfanatic if it happens

Honestly, man, the Texans do not need bandwagon fans like you. You are the fan of an individual player, not the team. We had the Fresno Mafia in here for years defending the sorry QB now known as HWNSNBM (or other variations), and the last thing we need is the Austin Tea-bagging crowd invading our space.

VY will end up on some other NFL team, and then you can buy his jersey in that team's colors and pester that team's message boards. It is disingenuous to say that you are rooting for a team 87.5% of the time. It is one of the examples in the dictionary of "chump (http://www.thefreedictionary.com/chump)".

Stemp
11-13-2009, 12:48 PM
In the last 2 games Chris Johnson has 363 Rushing with 4 TDs and Young has only 297 yards passing with 2 TDs (1 rushing 1 passing) against 2 teams with losing records.

By comparision in the last 2 games Alex Smith has 404 yards passing with 2 passing TDs also against 2 teams with losing records, but only had 194 yards rushing from Gore and STILL managed to go 1-1.

You REALLY THINK Young is the reason they are winning, not because of the big numbers Johnson is putting up? Shut down the running game and the Titans lose.

Mr. White
11-13-2009, 12:48 PM
but you all have assumed a lot of things over the years and cant get a 2 win team any better than 8-8. vy is about to do it for the second time in 3 seasons

its ok, i dont let other dictate my fandom. i wanna support this city, but they crapped in my mouth when they passed on vince. redneck piece of texas a and m aggie trash that kubiak is.

guys too dumb to even know when to call timeouts. he just tooks shanihans system, brought in shanihans kid and is standing around holding his package taking credit

2006 just called and wants it's talking points back.

Double Barrel
11-13-2009, 12:51 PM
but you all have assumed a lot of things over the years and cant get a 2 win team any better than 8-8. vy is about to do it for the second time in 3 seasons

its ok, i dont let other dictate my fandom. i wanna support this city, but they crapped in my mouth when they passed on vince. redneck piece of texas a and m aggie trash that kubiak is.

guys too dumb to even know when to call timeouts. he just tooks shanihans system, brought in shanihans kid and is standing around holding his package taking credit

Now you've left the chump cocoon and become the wonderful Troll Butterfly that you were destined to be. Flap on home, boy. :butterfly:

Stemp
11-13-2009, 12:53 PM
but you all have assumed a lot of things over the years and cant get a 2 win team any better than 8-8. vy is about to do it for the second time in 3 seasons


Wow, win 2 games and all of sudden the Titans are going to 7-1 to close out the season.

Dude, pass over whatever it is you are smoking.

Honoring Earl 34
11-13-2009, 12:58 PM
but you all have assumed a lot of things over the years and cant get a 2 win team any better than 8-8. vy is about to do it for the second time in 3 seasons

its ok, i dont let other dictate my fandom. i wanna support this city, but they crapped in my mouth when they passed on vince. redneck piece of texas a and m aggie trash that kubiak is.

guys too dumb to even know when to call timeouts. he just tooks shanihans system, brought in shanihans kid and is standing around holding his package taking credit

I'll take Mario and Schaub anyday over VY and whoever . I'd take Mario over VY and the whoever .

ps. I guess now there were two folks dumb enough to think Houston was taking VY ... here's a clue ... one was VY .

TitanFan
11-13-2009, 01:13 PM
i went to sleep everyday from the moment the texans got the number one pick till the day they took mario with my last little prayer before going to sleep, being that we take vince. mcnair wanted vince, kubiak didnt, they had just hried kubiak and had to let him pick his own qb. it really is a shame

have some sympathy for me.....i love sports. i love them. and i loved the oilers more than any sport team ever. I LOVED them. and then they left. and it was hard on all of us. instead of giving into my bitterness, i turned the tv on and watched my boys eddie and steve mcnair create a winning organization. and more importantly my uncontrollable joy would erupt everytime they won. Dont you see, you dont pick the sports team, they pick you. FURTHERMORE, there isn't a man on this board that lives and breathes his football team like i do. or atleast i hope not, its really a sad and pathetic existance

i compared vince to brady and montana only bc they are 2 of 3 qbs in NFL HISTORY, with a batter career record than vince with a minimum of 30 starts. thats a fact, thats all. obviously hes not as good as the two greatest qbs to ever live

as far as 87.5% of the time. well, its pretty simple. im a TITAN FAN. BUT, the texans only play the titans 12.5% of the time. i casually support the texans and want you all to do well, just not at the expense of my titans.

when and if vince leaves in the offseason i will definitely be faced with a tough decision. sadly ill probably become a texan fan if only bc my anger towards the titans will be palpable.

the truth is, my nfl life is a lonely existance where i go to sports bars every sunday for the last 6 years by myself to watch a team in tenn that no one in the world ever seems to care about. my houston friends wont support me, my father wont support me...im all alone. alteast i have vince, and as long as he keeps winning at a joe montana pace, ill defend him with every ounce of energy i have.

btw, i was run off the message board at tennessean.com because i kept calling for the papers three main writers to be fired for their anti vy sentiments.

i jsut wanna win guys. i wish you all the best, but everything i have believed since 2001 tells me that Vince Young is going to win this game in the fourth quarter. who will eat crow when it happens? i promise to eat mine if vince gets worked over by the texans defense. I PROMISE

TitanFan
11-13-2009, 01:16 PM
double barrel posts with all the eloquence of a man sporting his moniker. so clever too

infantrycak
11-13-2009, 01:19 PM
i compared vince to brady and montana only bc they are 2 of 3 qbs in NFL HISTORY, with a batter career record than vince with a minimum of 30 starts. thats a fact, thats all. obviously hes not as good as the two greatest qbs to ever live

It's not a fact. It took me all of a few seconds to find one you left out and hell you should be pretty familiar with him.

TitanFan
11-13-2009, 01:37 PM
according to wikipedia manning has a reg winning % of 66%, which drops when u include his 7-6 playoff record.

VY's official starting record is 21-11, so your right, that is less than 66%, however, many do not count his first game comming in against the nfls best team without having practiced with the starters at all. so i guess youre right, however, if u take that first game out, he is 21-10, which without doing the match has to be just under 70%.

but, i guess youre right....the fact that he is in the conversation is everything.

the guy wins....and that includes every single game hes played against houston
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9acRrOEleC8

"'i like this, put him in the shotgun, let him throw. if its not there, let him run it. get it closer.......here come the blitzers. vince young...on the run! vince young inside the 30. off he goes. vince young inside the 20, the 10. IT. IS. OVER! Vince young has done it again. a 39 yard touch down run to end the game in over time.''vince young has a flare for the dramatic and he has done it again!''what vince young can do, this is the most exciting player in the national football league'"

this video is even better:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dn_FuCrf4D4&feature=related

-tears of joy that day

TitanFan
11-13-2009, 01:49 PM
bullick53, you can't be serious? vince already has a 4th quarter comeback in one of the 2 games. kerry had 3 golden opportunities to complete just one of those and he couldnt do it.

you obviously have not been watching these games. vince wouldve thrown for 300 yards against jville completing 30-36 passes if we didnt hand the ball off every single possession. vince is doing it all and hes doing it with the exact same offense KC has just a month ago.

DENIAL is a funny thing

Double Barrel
11-13-2009, 01:50 PM
have some sympathy for me.....i love sports. i love them. and i loved the oilers more than any sport team ever. I LOVED them. and then they left. and it was hard on all of us. instead of giving into my bitterness, i turned the tv on and watched my boys eddie and steve mcnair create a winning organization. and more importantly my uncontrollable joy would erupt everytime they won. Dont you see, you dont pick the sports team, they pick you.

Dude, you've got lots of old Oilers fans on this board that understand your pain. People in Houston lived the Oilers, and if it wasn't for one fat bastard's decision, they would be celebrating their 50th anniversary in H-town.

But, we do have a choice. You decided to follow a franchise. The Houston Oilers died, and the franchise changed the name, logo, and location. Have you ever lived in Tennessee? Heck, I've never even visited there, so I have absolutely no connection to the place.

I understand you being a fan of VY, especially as a Houstonian and Texan (the state, not the team). Dude is a sports legend in this city for his high school career and a legend in the state for his college legacy. I cannot fault anyone for liking the guy for those reasons.

However, he's a Tennessee Titan now, which is not just the former Houston franchise, but a division rival of our home team.

If the team picks you, as you stated, then you will remain a Titans fan if/when VY is not on the team. This is the only way that you can be consistent with that logic. If you stop being a Titans fan to follow VY where he goes, then your statement is false and you pick your team out of freewill.

An example: did you see the reception that Brett Favre had in Green Bay a week or so ago? Those people loved him for 16+ years, but now he's a division rival Viking. They booed like they have never booed, because they are Packers fans, not Favre fans. For many (maybe most) NFL fans, team and hometown loyalty are paramount to being the essence of a fanatic.

gwallaia
11-13-2009, 01:57 PM
An example: did you see the reception that Brett Favre had in Green Bay a week or so ago? Those people loved him for 16+ years, but now he's a division rival Viking. They booed like they have never booed, because they are Packers fans, not Favre fans. For many (maybe most) NFL fans, team and hometown loyalty are paramount to being the essence of a fanatic.

Piss poor example DB. Farve is merely human while VY is a God.

Stemp
11-13-2009, 01:57 PM
vince wouldve thrown for 300 yards against jville completing 30-36 passes if we didnt hand the ball off every single possession.

http://i193.photobucket.com/albums/z9/crazycraker42069/crack_pipe.jpg

infantrycak
11-13-2009, 02:03 PM
bullick53, you can't be serious? vince already has a 4th quarter comeback in one of the 2 games. kerry had 3 golden opportunities to complete just one of those and he couldnt do it.

you obviously have not been watching these games. vince wouldve thrown for 300 yards against jville completing 30-36 passes if we didnt hand the ball off every single possession. vince is doing it all and hes doing it with the exact same offense KC has just a month ago.

DENIAL is a funny thing

LOL - Bulluck is a hard core Titan fan and one who has been very reasonable on an opposing team's MB for years.

You asking VY if you can hold his sack while he packs your bag is what can't be serious.

TitanFan
11-13-2009, 02:44 PM
db, i apologize for earlier post, thats a great response (eloquent as well!), but when i say you cant help who you support i mean it in a different sense. Subconciously when u feel as much passion for sports as im sure most of us do you cant control the emotion that comes out while watching.

i love love love the titans, but im so so so conflicted. to address youre brett favre comment, being a houstonian titan fan is not exactly like being born in bred in wisconsin with a team that never left. my heart is divided. i want houston to succeed in everything! this is the greatest city on earth. shoot, i have a hospital visit to my name following game 2 in chicagos south side. but having been away from houston for seven years ive lnever lived with the texans. they are less this city than i am, so in my opinion they owe me, not the other way around.

they owed me vince young, and they betrayed me. they didnt just betray me but they betrayed themselves and all of you who i care so deeply about. like i said, to watch the titans ive been going to sports bars every sunday since i turned 21 (usually alone bc no one gives a dam), so ive been watching the texans. i know the pain youre going through. the colts comebacks, the vy pain from 2006, the coaching and draftng failures mostly from the casserly era, all the goal line stands and redzone turnovers...i know its tough. i have the cure. hes houstons home grown hero and he was ready to do it on a third level for the locals.

passing on vince was like bud taking the oilers away. he was ticket in, and ive been dealing with my anger ever since. I CANT GET OVER IT, but i AM trying. im trying. goodluck next monday, because you really really really are gonna need it against vince (we had cj the first time, so dont tell me thats why u lose 2 weeks from nwo)

as far as bullick goes, he may be a good oilertitan fan, and i love him for that, but if he doubts vince young and voices these doubts and undercuts vince with comparisons to a loser like KC, then he stands in the way of Titan GLORY.

TitanFan
11-13-2009, 02:51 PM
vy is a god. or atleast the closest one to hakeem olajuwon ive ever seen

infantrycak
11-13-2009, 02:58 PM
vy is a god. or atleast the closest one to hakeem olajuwon ive ever seen

Here, you can play with his nipples:

http://media.sacbee.com/static/weblogs/raiders/vince-young-shirtless.jpg

Double Barrel
11-13-2009, 03:11 PM
mcnair wanted vince, kubiak didnt, they had just hried kubiak and had to let him pick his own qb.


I meant to ask earlier, but where did you get the idea that Bob McNair wanted VY? McNair is the one who picked a new HC on the condition of keeping HWNSNBM (the former #8 on the Texans). I have never heard anyone - until now - make the case that McNair wanted VY in any capacity. If anything, he would have wanted "the next Gayle Sayers", as that is the other player offered a contract pre-draft. Mario signed on the dotted line first, and the rest, as they say, is history.

DENIAL is a funny thing

As clearly evidenced by a certain Titans/VY fan in this thread. ;)

db, i apologize for earlier post, thats a great response (eloquent as well!), but when i say you cant help who you support i mean it in a different sense. Subconciously when u feel as much passion for sports as im sure most of us do you cant control the emotion that comes out while watching.

Well, I appreciate the thoughts, but no need to apologize in the smack forum.

As far as the rest of your post, I certainly respect your passion. I cannot say that I admire it, simply because I root for my roots, the city of my youth, the place where my family calls home. Slug Adams betrayed this city out of greed, so it is simply a matter of honor that I despise him and his new team. He back-stabbed the football fans of this city, and these are my brethren, my brothers in arms as fans.

No offense, but you have a misplaced sense of loyalty. JMO, though, so don't let me or anyone else steal your joy in life. It's all just chosen perspective at the end of the day. My own mother harbors the same delusions about VY and the Titans, and it won't be until the Texans make the playoffs that she might actually jump on the bandwagon (if only they had won the Bironas 8 FG game that I took her to! lol).

p.s. please do return to these pages when the Titans get humiliated on the national stage in a little over a week.

texanhead08
11-13-2009, 03:50 PM
I have a very different theory about these three guys that I have been considering.

Perhaps part of the reason that Vince Young does not have much in the way of passing statistics is that Bud Adams forced Young on Fisher against his will. Perhaps Fisher does not have a lot of confidence in Vince and is using a more conservative offense to hide Vince's shortcomings.

Just a thought.



The only way to be more conservative than a normal Jeff Fisher offense would be to punt on 3rd down.

Bulluck53
11-13-2009, 04:06 PM
bullick53, you can't be serious? vince already has a 4th quarter comeback in one of the 2 games. kerry had 3 golden opportunities to complete just one of those and he couldnt do it.

you obviously have not been watching these games. vince wouldve thrown for 300 yards against jville completing 30-36 passes if we didnt hand the ball off every single possession. vince is doing it all and hes doing it with the exact same offense KC has just a month ago.

DENIAL is a funny thing

Remember when Merril Hoge ran up and down ESPN saying the Titans were "hiding their QB, not highlighting him?" As much as I hated him for that he is and was right. I have watched every snap VY has taken as a Titan, and the only thing has changed is his reduction of bad decisions lately. The play calling is not giving a chance to mess up. I want him to do well just like you, but that is obvious.

He may have gone for 300 vs Jax, but he didn't need to. The defense played well outside of two plays and CJ couldn't be stopped. Same thing last week. Collins may have had the same offense, but he didn't have the same defense. The offense seems to be running a little better with VY in there, almost like everyone plays harder (receivers catching balls and blocking down field, line has been playing better even without David Stewart, even Ahmard Hall has been seen more often, VY widens already huge lanes for CJ.) None of those things happened when Collins was in the game, and he gets the blame.

Texan_Bill
11-13-2009, 04:13 PM
http://i193.photobucket.com/albums/z9/crazycraker42069/crack_pipe.jpg

:spit:

spurstexanstros
11-13-2009, 04:58 PM
Titan fan all you are going to hear is:


"Here Vincy...Vincy.... Vincy..." Mario Williams as he hunts for the sausageman.


"Boom"- Brian Cushing followed by "Mommy" -VY

JDizzle
11-13-2009, 09:18 PM
Putting Vince Dilfer in the same sentence or same post as Olajuwon should be punishable by a group drop-kick to the face and chest.

Blazing Arrow
11-13-2009, 09:55 PM
Young will be lucky to pass for 300 yards in 3 games. Seriously the guy is not a passer. I dred him having 50 passes in a game. He would have more turnovers then a French baker!

TitanFan
11-13-2009, 11:43 PM
this message board is now a home page. i promise i will be back. but most likely to brag and antagonize.

that 8 field goal game was almost a terrible terrible day. almost. kerry collins almost cost us, yet he gets credit for that game. turnover, redzone failures....kerry collins is awful

Honoring Earl 34
11-13-2009, 11:48 PM
this message board is now a home page. i promise i will be back. but most likely to brag and antagonize.

that 8 field goal game was almost a terrible terrible day. almost. kerry collins almost cost us, yet he gets credit for that game. turnover, redzone failures....kerry collins is awful

Yep ... it was 35 - 7 at halftime ( I think ) and Collins almost killed y'all . idonno:

Texecutioner
11-14-2009, 12:03 AM
Okay Titan Fan are you really serious with half this stuff you've been spewing out in this thread about VY?????

I mean, hell I went to watch VY and was a huge fan of him way before he went to my favorite school that I adore in Texas, and him going there and winning a championship was just the icing on the cake for me as a fan, but come on man, you've got to be smoking some serious crack to be saying just half the stuff that you have regarding VY in this thread unless you were just joking.

VY has been really awful going back to the last two seasons man. He played okay in the last two games and all, but he was nothing close to spectacular. I root for the guy individually as well, but come on man, you have got to be joking about half of this stuff that you're saying.

TitanFan
11-14-2009, 12:40 AM
well if you could address one detail ive brought up then i could talk with you. i most certainly believe everything ive said and i say it after watching every single titan snap for the last 3 and a half years....
u could have addressed how he converts first downs, eats clock, takes pressure off his rb's and opens the game up for them (eg cutback runs from linebackers and def ends who cant over pursue bc f vince's running ability, or how he forces a defensive player to man him every single third down which opens up passing lanes, or how he plays his best in the second half and 4th quarter when games are on the line (see his 6, thats right, 6! 4th quarter comebacks in 32 games started)

the titans went 10-6 the year everyone refers to him as being a "horrible" qb. obviously his numbers werent good, but he made things happen when he ahd to. if u watch titans games you know that.

so yes, i def mean what ive been saying

did u see him break a tackle and roll to the left 2 weeks ago only to throw a bullet to the sideline at full speed across his body 18 yards down field? no one in the league could have made that throw and he made it pinpoint.

if you are a fan, which i doubt, just sit back and watch

infantrycak
11-14-2009, 09:50 AM
well if you could address one detail ive brought up then i could talk with you. i most certainly believe everything ive said and i say it after watching every single titan snap for the last 3 and a half years....

You mean like your incorrect winning % stat?

u could have addressed how he converts first downs, eats clock, takes pressure off his rb's and opens the game up for them (eg cutback runs from linebackers and def ends who cant over pursue bc f vince's running ability, or how he forces a defensive player to man him every single third down which opens up passing lanes,

VY's presence does help the running game. Of course the running game was going well already so that isn't all that special.

or how he plays his best in the second half and 4th quarter when games are on the line (see his 6, thats right, 6! 4th quarter comebacks in 32 games started)

Ya sure he does. He is 2 of 8 in the 4th so far this year. Wow what an observant fan you are as a VY worshiper. VY has his worst stats in the 4th.

Career - 52.4 completion %, 9 TD's, 11 INT's, 5.7 ypa, 61.8 QB rating. Good call.

did u see him break a tackle and roll to the left 2 weeks ago only to throw a bullet to the sideline at full speed across his body 18 yards down field? no one in the league could have made that throw and he made it pinpoint.

I know you are already mayonnaising yourself up for a manwhich with Young but bullet? - nobody in the league? LOL - yeah buddy, any other NFL QB is incapable of making an 18 yd throw.

What part of town do you live in? - maybe somebody can direct you to the nearest credibility store.

ObsiWan
11-15-2009, 01:56 AM
After two games, it seems that VY is what Collins was last year. He might be a little more effective in the grand scheme, but he can't be much more. Last year Collins wasn't asked to win games by himself and he controlled the game by taking care of the ball and picking up the occasional 3rd down. This season when the defense went away Collins was called upon to make up the defecit and he's just not capable anymore.

So far VY has done the same this year that Collins did last year. Until CJ is shut down or the defense starts playing like they did earlier in the season we won't see if he truly is that much of an upgrade.

Aaaah... Logic. It's sooo refreshing.
rep for you my good man

Second Honeymoon
11-15-2009, 02:27 AM
VY is doing well for the Titans. Quite well. This is going to be tough decision time in Inbredville this offseason.

I have always been a fan of VY, sausage party and all. He did a lot for Texas football and has been pretty classy.

The Patron pics are classic but its not like it was a Village People concert. It wasn't was it? :)

I hope VY leaves the division myself. If they let VY go, then they have to start over at the QB position. That is music to my Texans fan ears. The fact is that Vince could start showing some of the playmaking ability he showed at Texas and Madison. He could start taking to coaching and put his time in the filmroom. I am worried about that as a Texans fan. I want him gone and playing for like Miami or Carolina or even poor ole Cleveland. Too much upside to mess with.

Let them draft some scrub like we did with Carr and the Chargers did with Leaf. Ask the Steelers how important QB play is and how hard it is to find one who can help you win. They tried to nickel and dime it for almost 3 decades before they went out and spent a 1st Round pick on a real QB prospect. Now look at them. Screw the Titans...let them overpay to draft a scrub.

My problem with VY is football related and that is that he has looked slow and does not look to have the speed to get around the end. He still has some moves though. He also looks a little overweight and STILL displays poor body language on the field. The guy is helping his team win but he needs to take the next step. Here is hoping that its not in a Titans jersey in 2010.

TitanFan
11-15-2009, 02:36 AM
i cant deal with you haters anymore. i thought coming on here would be fun, defending vince from the hating trash of the world. but i cant. too much anger. too much frustration. its like arguing with a republican about the economy after they screwed the economy up.

either watch his brilliance or ***** without seeing. either way...next monday is ours and there aint a thing you can do about it. im sick of justifying a 700 winning% QB

sick of it.. watch and obey

vince is god, u r heathens...blasphemy gets u a ticket to hell. right chrsitians?

champs like us/????? baby we were born to run

TitanFan
11-15-2009, 02:43 AM
i need a job...republicans fuc ked it up

i need a titan team to win...vince haters are getting in my way

violent revolution

the only answer

?

:'(

imatexan
11-15-2009, 03:18 AM
i need a job...republicans fuc ked it up

i need a titan team to win...vince haters are getting in my way

violent revolution

the only answer

?

:'(

No you need a job because you are a very sad person not because of the Republicans.

You will be even more sad after Monday Night since you are soo sure the titans are going to win!

TitanFan
11-15-2009, 03:29 AM
hahahahahahahahaha

we shall see

we shall see

infantrycak
11-15-2009, 10:54 AM
i cant deal with you haters anymore. i thought coming on here would be fun, defending vince from the hating trash of the world. but i cant. too much anger. too much frustration. its like arguing with a republican about the economy after they screwed the economy up.

either watch his brilliance or ***** without seeing. either way...next monday is ours and there aint a thing you can do about it. im sick of justifying a 700 winning% QB

sick of it.. watch and obey

vince is god, u r heathens...blasphemy gets u a ticket to hell. right chrsitians?

champs like us/????? baby we were born to run

Awe shucks. Now I feel so bad.

Pull the thong out of your butt, blow the candle out, light some incense and have your moment with your battery powered VY doll. It will work out for you. Well other than the good QB part. But otherwise you will be OK...well not OK but functionally abnormal.

eriadoc
11-15-2009, 11:17 AM
i cant deal with you haters anymore. i thought coming on here would be fun, defending vince from the hating trash of the world. but i cant. too much anger. too much frustration. its like arguing with a republican about the economy after they screwed the economy up.

either watch his brilliance or ***** without seeing. either way...next monday is ours and there aint a thing you can do about it. im sick of justifying a 700 winning% QB

sick of it.. watch and obey

vince is god, u r heathens...blasphemy gets u a ticket to hell. right chrsitians?

champs like us/????? baby we were born to run

i need a job...republicans fuc ked it up

i need a titan team to win...vince haters are getting in my way

violent revolution

the only answer

?

:'(

Proof of the stereotype.

gtexan02
11-15-2009, 04:10 PM
Wow, Titans demolish Bills.

Watching VY is weird. He's a poor QB. He makes bad decisions. And yet they're 3-0 since his return. Im not a VY fan, but I can't argue with the results so far. They appear to be a much better team with him in the game than without him.

I think they're out for playoffs this year at 3-6, they'd have to run the table, but i think thtats why they are playing so well. Nothing to lose

Wolf
11-15-2009, 06:09 PM
one thing (just going by stats)

titans passing defense

Ben Roethlisberger 363 Yds
Matt Schaub 357 Yds
Mark Sanchez 171 Yds
David Garrard 323 Yds
Peyton Manning 309 Yds
Tom Brady380 Yds
Bye
David Garrard 139 Yds
Alex Smith 286 Yds
T. Edwards 185 Yds

They have cleaned some things up (well against those QB's atleast)

http://www.nfl.com/teams/tennesseetitans/schedule?team=TEN

axman40
11-15-2009, 10:29 PM
Bud wanted Vince and Fisher didnt. Fish has held that grudge ever since, never fully embracing VY even after he took an 0-5 team to 8-8 (just look at his post game interviews after the texans or nyg's game of vince's rookie season. he doesn't even bring vince up--he couldn't admit being wrong, just like so many fans and analysts out there) and then the playoffs the next year. The thought that he has held Vince on the bench for his mental health is interesting but ultimately laughable. Common guys, Vince is getting paid millions to play. Furthermore, sitting on the bench would be much tougher on the psyche than playing football for a run first team.

I think what mojo failed to say was that Fisher has been proven wrong about Vince. Fisher should lose his job for this 0-6 start and deserves 0 credit for the 2-0 turnaround since Vince took over.

Fish is Vince's and the Titans' biggest problem. Watch out for the Titans to dominate the clock when they come to Houston. Vince and CJ leading the titans on long first down drives.

we're coming
Then, as one, they begin to speak with the same voice, announcing to the world the imminent arrival of a new alien threat. 'We are coming, we are coming'.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3yTD8OVHj9U
the horror!
:fans:

Blazing Arrow
11-16-2009, 12:14 AM
Wow I don't think I have seen a guy with 4 red blocks on the rep bar before ...

I think this will be a pretty tough game for a team that has nothing to lose playing a team that is pretty much a must win. On top of that we have a D that seems to have found itself and the league leader in rushing looking to be the 4th player in history to reach the 2k mark.

Glad it it MNF. Win or loss it should be a great game!

Blazing Arrow
11-16-2009, 12:21 AM
one thing (just going by stats)

titans passing defense

Ben Roethlisberger 363 Yds
Matt Schaub 357 Yds
Mark Sanchez 171 Yds
David Garrard 323 Yds
Peyton Manning 309 Yds
Tom Brady380 Yds
Bye
David Garrard 139 Yds
Alex Smith 286 Yds
T. Edwards 185 Yds

They have cleaned some things up (well against those QB's atleast)

http://www.nfl.com/teams/tennesseetitans/schedule?team=TEN

Interesting you do not bring up the rushing yards ...

imatexan
11-16-2009, 12:35 AM
You thought Texans fans were bad talking playoffs in past years?

Go check out gotitans!

They are thinking after winning 3 games in a row after losing 6 they still have a shot at the playoffs.

:spit:

We really do need to get this win next Monday to bring the titans fans back to reality!

Blazing Arrow
11-16-2009, 12:41 AM
You thought Texans fans were bad talking playoffs in past years?

Go check out gotitans!

They are thinking after winning 3 games in a row after losing 6 they still have a shot at the playoffs.

:spit:

We really do need to get this win next Monday to bring the titans fans back to reality!

Funny thing is if you lose you basically give up any shot at the playoffs and you are in our position ... dreaming.

Though we have actuallly made the playoffs so it is not really a dream more of remembering the good times.

BTW: when you make the playoffs you get to play more then 16 games. Just saying. :spin:

imatexan
11-16-2009, 01:04 AM
Funny thing is if you lose you basically give up any shot at the playoffs and you are in our position ... dreaming.

Though we have actuallly made the playoffs so it is not really a dream more of remembering the good times.

BTW: when you make the playoffs you get to play more then 16 games. Just saying. :spin:

Come on BA you have been saying that for a few years now come up with some new material.

Luckily the Texans will shut you up themself this year.

Blazing Arrow
11-16-2009, 11:28 AM
Come on BA you have been saying that for a few years now come up with some new material.

Luckily the Texans will shut you up themself this year.

If Slaton is on the field will our D be called for 12 men?

Double Barrel
11-16-2009, 12:23 PM
I hope VY leaves the division myself.

Me, too. I might actually wish good things for the guy if he wasn't a Titan. (Although I would continue to push back against the "VY IS GOD" fanboys, because that's how I roll.)

infantrycak
11-16-2009, 01:14 PM
http://media.sacbee.com/static/weblogs/raiders/vince-young-shirtless.jpg

Doesn't the guy behind VY have that "yeah, just snuck it in look?" And VY has the "there you go" look. Just sayin'

Boris
11-16-2009, 05:34 PM
et tu, erratic_assassin?