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Fox
10-25-2009, 07:36 PM
Stats thus far:
Receptions: 39, 2nd in the NFL among TE's (H. Miller first with 40)
Yards: 497, 1st in the NFL among TE's (D. Clark second with 485)
TD's: 5, T-2nd in the NFL with Shiancoe among TE's (V. Davis has 6 after today)

Not to mention if you've been watching the games you know how incredibly clutch his play has been this season. He's a complete TE and in this offense he's a top 5 player at his position, not to mention he seems like a great locker room guy and team player.

Can we re-sign him soon, please?

Pantherstang84
10-25-2009, 07:38 PM
Stats thus far:
Receptions: 39, 2nd in the NFL among TE's (H. Miller first with 40)
Yards: 497, 1st in the NFL among TE's (D. Clark second with 485)
TD's: 5, T-2nd in the NFL with Shiancoe among TE's (V. Davis has 6 after today)

Not to mention if you've been watching the games you know how incredibly clutch his play has been this season. He's a complete TE and in this offense he's a top 5 player at his position, not to mention he seems like a great locker room guy and team player.

Can we re-sign him soon, please?

in other words, "Pay me Rick!" and it's not even written on his shoes.

Goatcheese
10-25-2009, 07:39 PM
If only I could watch him throw a block without cringing. :heart:

Carr Bombed
10-25-2009, 07:42 PM
Houston made a mistake by not resigning him this past offseason...

Now he's going to demand rediculous money.

Houston will probably franchise him and then we'll lose him after another year. I just don't see them spending that kinda coin on that position when we have alot of players that we also have to sign.

False Start
10-25-2009, 07:59 PM
Houston made a mistake by not resigning him this past offseason...

Now he's going to demand rediculous money.

Houston will probably franchise him and then we'll lose him after another year. I just don't see them spending that kinda coin on that position when we have alot of players that we also have to sign.

Exactly, especially if he keeps this pace up.

infantrycak
10-25-2009, 08:02 PM
Yeah, cuz it was just sooooo foolhardy of the Texans to offer him top 3 TE money.

BSofA04
10-25-2009, 08:04 PM
in other words, "Pay me Rick!" and it's not even written on his shoes.

X 2 Owen, Demeco and MAYBE Robinson will get paid. We will win, they will get paid. Hollar.

DexmanC
10-25-2009, 08:09 PM
Stats thus far:
Receptions: 39, 2nd in the NFL among TE's (H. Miller first with 40)
Yards: 497, 1st in the NFL among TE's (D. Clark second with 485)
TD's: 5, T-2nd in the NFL with Shiancoe among TE's (V. Davis has 6 after today)

Not to mention if you've been watching the games you know how incredibly clutch his play has been this season. He's a complete TE and in this offense he's a top 5 player at his position, not to mention he seems like a great locker room guy and team player.

Can we re-sign him soon, please?



Bob Mcnair, and I agree with him on this, has told his players:
"Win, THEN you'll get payed."

Mr. Mcnair does NOT appear to be a "Drayton Mcclain" type owner. He
genuinely will pay to win, not just to fill the seats. The players get the
message. If they win, they will get payed. No more long-term deals
for mediocrity.

Carr Bombed
10-25-2009, 08:12 PM
Yeah, cuz it was just sooooo foolhardy of the Texans to offer him top 3 TE money.

He would've been a hell of alot easier to negotiate with last offseason (instead of pretty much cutting off all talks), than it will be this offseason.....when we won't be able to talk him off top 3 TE money. He's going to cost more money now, that can't even be argued.

Jackie Chiles
10-25-2009, 08:49 PM
He would've been a hell of alot easier to negotiate with last offseason (instead of pretty much cutting off all talks), than it will be this offseason.....when we won't be able to talk him off top 3 TE money. He's going to cost more money now, that can't even be argued.

No need to argue about it now at all, I agree. He is worth it and we have to pay him, no way we let him walk if he keeps up this kind of production. Would have been nice to have gotten something worked out before this season started but the cats outta the bag now, he is one of the best TEs in the league.

qman_tx
10-25-2009, 09:20 PM
I now understand McNair's agenda, but Daniels is commited! He is spending extra time learning special teams? His performance this year and last year. Doesn't that count to give him his deal?

ArlingtonTexan
10-25-2009, 09:23 PM
I am willing to admit that I was in the Owen Daniels is not a Top 5 TE club.

:secret::backsout::embarrass

Fox
10-25-2009, 09:28 PM
I am willing to admit that I was in the Owen Daniels is not a Top 5 TE club.

:secret::backsout::embarrass

I'm with ya. I was in the wait and see - 1. how Daniels plays, 2. if Casey can make an immediate impact and show signs of being a great pass catching TE.

I waited, I saw, now it's time to re-sign Daniels... ;)

infantrycak
10-25-2009, 09:32 PM
He would've been a hell of alot easier to negotiate with last offseason (instead of pretty much cutting off all talks), than it will be this offseason.....when we won't be able to talk him off top 3 TE money. He's going to cost more money now, that can't even be argued.

I understand wanting to sign him. Great. At least one report was he was offered #2 in the league TE money when everyone around thought the #1 in the league money was stupid. Seriously, other than the result of having him signed what would you have had them do? I mean other than whatever OD wanted is there an acceptable answer?

Norg
10-25-2009, 11:36 PM
i deff think we should resign hmmm but will they ????? after getting like two TE in the draft last year

should we think about resigning Kevin walter or Dunta instead ????

AnthonyE
10-25-2009, 11:43 PM
I hope to God we sign this guy. He's been my favorite player since 2006. And he's making my signature look goooooooood.

barrett
10-26-2009, 02:25 AM
Bob Mcnair, and I agree with him on this, has told his players:
"Win, THEN you'll get payed."

Mr. Mcnair does NOT appear to be a "Drayton Mcclain" type owner. He
genuinely will pay to win, not just to fill the seats. The players get the
message. If they win, they will get payed. No more long-term deals
for mediocrity.

When I first read about McNair saying that I was really impressed. On so many levels I love that this is his approach. Not only does it motivate the players to perform at a high level but it motivates them to raise the play of those around them as well.

I think it's a brilliant move that will cost this team dearly from a dollars and sense stand point but that will pay off magnificently from a success stand point.

Marcus
10-26-2009, 02:51 AM
I don't mind opening the vault for Owen Daniels. He's turned into a top 5 (even top 3) TE. Not bad for 4th round Casserly pick. :)

Owen Daniels is worth it. Dunta's not.

SF49erFaithful
10-26-2009, 03:14 AM
He's not bad.

Air Canada
10-26-2009, 04:40 AM
He's not bad.

He's a top 5 or even top 3 TE in this league....Yeah, he's not bad...not bad AT ALL!:chickendance:

dalemurphy
10-26-2009, 06:01 AM
He would've been a hell of alot easier to negotiate with last offseason (instead of pretty much cutting off all talks), than it will be this offseason.....when we won't be able to talk him off top 3 TE money. He's going to cost more money now, that can't even be argued.

Not true... There's clearly not going to be a collective bargaining agreement which means he'll be a RFA again this season. So, he'll be compelled to sign a moderate deal or risk another season making only $3 million and then heading into possible work stoppage in 2011. Texans have the leverage.

76Texan
10-26-2009, 09:02 AM
It seems to me like Kubiak is giving OD the chance to show Mr McNair something!

Kaiser Toro
10-26-2009, 09:03 AM
I am ready to join the chorus, pay the kid.

Runner
10-26-2009, 09:53 AM
He would've been a hell of alot easier to negotiate with last offseason (instead of pretty much cutting off all talks), than it will be this offseason.....when we won't be able to talk him off top 3 TE money. He's going to cost more money now, that can't even be argued.

Not true... There's clearly not going to be a collective bargaining agreement which means he'll be a RFA again this season. So, he'll be compelled to sign a moderate deal or risk another season making only $3 million and then heading into possible work stoppage in 2011. Texans have the leverage.

I'd much prefer a GM who can successfully negotiate contracts to one who must resort to "compelling" players to do something. Contract negotiation is an important part of a GM's duties.

infantrycak
10-26-2009, 10:11 AM
I'd much prefer a GM who can successfully negotiate contracts to one who must resort to "compelling" players to do something. Contract negotiation is an important part of a GM's duties.

Sure but doesn't any responsible GM also have to set an upper limit on the cost? Heck even without a cap that is only good business. Seems like some folks around here are in a pay OD anything he wants mode. I'd like to see him get paid like a top TE but if he is demanding to be the #1 TE then I would work the rules or let him walk and I think he is a great TE.

NitroGSXR
10-26-2009, 10:52 AM
Sure but doesn't any responsible GM also have to set an upper limit on the cost? Heck even without a cap that is only good business. Seems like some folks around here are in a pay OD anything he wants mode. I'd like to see him get paid like a top TE but if he is demanding to be the #1 TE then I would work the rules or let him walk and I think he is a great TE.

Yup. We have a roster of 53 to field and only so much money to do it with. A good GM would get his backup and trade him while his value is obscene but what the heck do I know about that. I'm a huge Owen Daniels fan myself but I want a complete football team more than anything else.

Throw Momma from the Train is all I can think of when it comes to us fans calling for OWEN!

Runner
10-26-2009, 11:17 AM
I'd much prefer a GM who can successfully negotiate contracts to one who must resort to "compelling" players to do something. Contract negotiation is an important part of a GM's duties.

Sure but doesn't any responsible GM also have to set an upper limit on the cost? Heck even without a cap that is only good business. Seems like some folks around here are in a pay OD anything he wants mode. I'd like to see him get paid like a top TE but if he is demanding to be the #1 TE then I would work the rules or let him walk and I think he is a great TE.

No, I don't mean to pay Daniels whatever he wants. A successful negotiation is a give and take between both sides. A good negotiator should be able to get the other side to reduce their demands and reach compromise.

The pattern to Smith's negotiations seems to be a quick impasse followed by the breaking off of talks/tender/franchise.

People may blame each situation 100% on the player/agent, but Smith is a common thread in these negotiations.

Maddict5
10-26-2009, 11:25 AM
No, I don't mean to pay Daniels whatever he wants. A successful negotiation is a give and take between both sides. A good negotiator should be able to get the other side to reduce their demands and reach compromise.

The pattern to Smith's negotiations seems to be a quick impasse followed by the breaking off of talks/tender/franchise.

People may blame each situation 100% on the player/agent, but Smith is a common thread in these negotiations.

it always seems to emerge afterwards that smith made a more than reasonable offer though doesnt it? whether thats the truth or propogenda fed to mcclain is another matter

infantrycak
10-26-2009, 11:27 AM
No, I don't mean to pay Daniels whatever he wants. A successful negotiation is a give and take between both sides. A good negotiator should be able to get the other side to reduce their demands and reach compromise.

The pattern to Smith's negotiations seems to be a quick impasse followed by the breaking off of talks/tender/franchise.

People may blame each situation 100% on the player/agent, but Smith is a common thread in these negotiations.

You know I don't blame things 100% on either side. I have just had too many days negotiating things and sometimes it just doesn't get done. I don't know who is being unreasonable here but the result of no contract doesn't mean the Texans are automatically at fault. That's all I am saying.

Runner
10-26-2009, 11:57 AM
No, I don't mean to pay Daniels whatever he wants. A successful negotiation is a give and take between both sides. A good negotiator should be able to get the other side to reduce their demands and reach compromise.

The pattern to Smith's negotiations seems to be a quick impasse followed by the breaking off of talks/tender/franchise.

People may blame each situation 100% on the player/agent, but Smith is a common thread in these negotiations.

it always seems to emerge afterwards that smith made a more than reasonable offer though doesnt it? whether thats the truth or propogenda fed to mcclain is another matter

And if these offers are true, it might make one wonder what the x-factor is that makes these players turn down such great offers.

=======

Tenders and franchising are adequate short term solutions, but the risk is that players who have many productive years left bolt to other teams when they become free agents. As the Texans have more and more quality players, keeping them on the roster at a fair price before getting in a bidding war with the rest of the league is important for real team improvement.

==========

Had the Texans played such tendering hardball with Dre Johnson rather than extending him, I doubt he'd be on the team now. I'm sure not extending him could have been defensible at the time - early in his career he dropped a lot of balls, he had injuries, anybody getting paid that much should be a vocal leader, he hasn't won anything, whatever. Had the team not knuckled under and paid him though, they might still be looking for that first 8-8 season.

=======

I understand these negotiations aren't easy, but I'd like to see more success. We demand such performance from the players and coaches, it could only help the team long term if the front office can be above average too.

badboy
10-26-2009, 01:58 PM
We seem to be pretty sure DR was offered a very good long term deal. Why would we think Smith low balled OD? Now that Anthony Hill has been injured and Casey has not dethroned Dreesen, maybe Smith is not the hold up but rather OD? Now SMith may be looking at Diles and saying if I can get a starter in 7th, maybe I can franchise Ryans next season and draft a rookie and coach him up to re-place Demeco after next season. I could see DR being franchised again even if he has an outstanding year.

eriadoc
10-26-2009, 02:46 PM
Good points here by Infantrycak and Runner. The only thing I'll add is all the great drafting in the world won't be worth a damn if you don't keep the great ones you've drafted and developed. Otherwise, you're just developing free agents for the rest of the NFL.

El Tejano
10-26-2009, 03:06 PM
After what I saw yesterday, I'm convinced. I'm making a Pay "Open" Owen Daniels song today.

Double Barrel
10-26-2009, 03:08 PM
I don't mind opening the vault for Owen Daniels. He's turned into a top 5 (even top 3) TE. Not bad for 4th round Casserly pick. :)

Owen Daniels is worth it. Dunta's not.

As they say on the street, "word". Pay OD, jettison DR.

Good points here by Infantrycak and Runner. The only thing I'll add is all the great drafting in the world won't be worth a damn if you don't keep the great ones you've drafted and developed. Otherwise, you're just developing free agents for the rest of the NFL.

I agree completely. We have a horrid FA history, so if we are "building through the draft", as they say, then we had better be able to keep the gems that we draft.