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Vinny
10-14-2009, 11:48 PM
Did any of you guys catch him tonight? He said that an anonymous player told him after the game that "too many first round players on the D-line are apathetic", and that is why the play of the D swings wildly from good to bad. Not verbatim, but you get the point. Don't shoot the messenger. :wild:

silvrhand
10-14-2009, 11:50 PM
Did any of you guys catch him tonight? He said that an anonymous player told him that "too many first round players on the D-line are apathetic". Not verbatim, but you get the point. Don't shoot the messenger. :wild:

Is he wrong though? What type of emotion or anger do we see coming off of our defensive line? Most of our emotion/leadership comes from the second level.

DiehardChris
10-14-2009, 11:51 PM
Oh, I absolutely believe that. Winning cures everything, though.

infantrycak
10-14-2009, 11:53 PM
Well with TJ gone, there are only two on the DL. Take a stab at which one.

Vinny
10-14-2009, 11:55 PM
Is he wrong though? What type of emotion or anger do we see coming off of our defensive line? Most of our emotion/leadership comes from the second level.
Wrong about what? He was reporting what he heard and wasn't speculating. Take it fwiw and throw a pinch of salt over the shoulder for good vibes, karma or whatever makes you happy.

m5kwatts
10-14-2009, 11:56 PM
Well there's only 2 first rounders on the line right now. And if you didn't catch Amobi's post-game reaction, he wouldn't even discuss his recent progress here the past few games because we lost. So this has to be directed at Mario then right? If thats true, wow, I hate hearing that.

Goatcheese
10-15-2009, 12:05 AM
Well with TJ gone, there are only two on the DL. Take a stab at which one.

I would say both(Okoye more than Williams).

Mario and Amobi have both played really well at times, then kind of gotten into a rut and disappeared.

When they're fired up and attacking the defense is kicking butt. When they slack off the defense gets pushed around.

I don't see why the anonymous player would say they are the problem though. Williams overall has played fantastic despite not getting the big sack numbers, and Okoye has solidified himself as a quality starter at this point.

New_Texans
10-15-2009, 12:08 AM
I would say both(Okoye more than Williams).

Mario and Amobi have both played really well at times, then kind of gotten into a rut and disappeared.

When they're fired up and attacking the defense is kicking butt. When they slack off the defense gets pushed around.

I don't see why the anonymous player would say they are the problem though. Williams overall has played fantastic despite not getting the big sack numbers, and Okoye has solidified himself as a quality starter at this point.

Yeah exactly, those two have played well this year.

Vinny
10-15-2009, 12:10 AM
I don't see why the anonymous player would say they are the problem though. Williams overall has played fantastic despite not getting the big sack numbers, and Okoye has solidified himself as a quality starter at this point.Allen was asking players why they thought the difference in the first half defense and second half defense. The player in question didn't just offer it up out of the blue. It's gonna be big news tomorrow I bet.

New_Texans
10-15-2009, 12:18 AM
Allen was asking players why they thought the difference in the first half defense and second half defense. The player in question didn't just offer it up out of the blue. It's gonna be big news tomorrow I bet.

That 'answer' by whomever it was seems more so like an excuse honestly...and the worst kind at that.

Vinny
10-15-2009, 12:22 AM
That 'answer' by whomever it was seems more so like an excuse honestly...and the worst kind at that.
to be specific, it was 'pointing fingers". This kind of stuff doesn't go down in a respectful, disciplined locker room. It reeks of poor leadership.

TexansFanatic
10-15-2009, 12:25 AM
I know Antonio Smith wasn't a first rounder, but he was a high dollar free agent.


My finger is pointed at him.

This is why college football is a better product than pro football in my opinion. Too many pro players are just collecting a paycheck and lack a real passion for the game.

infantrycak
10-15-2009, 12:27 AM
to be specific, it was 'pointing fingers". This kind of stuff doesn't go down in a respectful, disciplined locker room. It reeks of poor leadership.

What it reeks of to me is excuse making by someone in the back seven. Let me see who it wouldn't be - DeMeco, Cushing or any of the other rookies, Reeves, can't see it being Pollard or glad to get his job back lucky to have it as a 7th rounder Diles. That pretty much leaves Dunta and Wilson - one trying to stay a couple more years in the league and one looking for a big payday. Hmmm?

This is why college football is a better product than pro football in my opinion. Too many pro players are just collecting a paycheck and lack a real passion for the game.

And why I dislike college ball is it is a few guys with the talent to go on to the NFL dominating lessor athletes without really having to study the game. I can give examples - there is one up in possum holler.

m5kwatts
10-15-2009, 12:37 AM
I know Antonio Smith wasn't a first rounder, but he was a high dollar free agent.


My finger is pointed at him.

This is why college football is a better product than pro football in my opinion. Too many pro players are just collecting a paycheck and lack a real passion for the game.

This is one of the dumbest sports myths. College players play for future NFL paychecks. They coddle injuries because of their NFL future and juniors go back to school to up their draft status and in turn their future paycheck. Furthermore, one of the main incentives of going to college if you're any person not just an athlete is to earn more money as opposed to having no college degree.

Goatcheese
10-15-2009, 12:43 AM
I know Antonio Smith wasn't a first rounder, but he was a high dollar free agent.


My finger is pointed at him.

This is why college football is a better product than pro football in my opinion. Too many pro players are just collecting a paycheck and lack a real passion for the game.

He has been pretty weak against the run so far(kind of surprising given his size and FA hype), but we weren't exactly getting run on. He did get a few good pressures this week though.

Overall we didn't get much out of our DEs last Sunday. Mario had 1 QB pressure, Smith had 3 and a tackle, Barwin had 1 and a tackle, and Bulman had 2 tackles. Not exactly making Warner uncomfortable.

silvrhand
10-15-2009, 12:52 AM
Allen was asking players why they thought the difference in the first half defense and second half defense. The player in question didn't just offer it up out of the blue. It's gonna be big news tomorrow I bet.

spill the beans? Or do you know who the player was?

GP
10-15-2009, 12:54 AM
Antonio Smith or Dunta Robinson.

Dunta has a history of calling people out.

Antonio runs his mouth pretty good, as well.

It isn't Okoye (duh). It isn't Mario (duh). That leaves Antonio and the rotational guys, which I don't see any of the rotational guys being the culprit.

It isn't going to be a linebacker, though 'Meco does speak bluntly at times.

None of the secondary guys are good enough to be able to take a cheap shot like this, even if it's anonymous. Dunta would be the exception due to prior history of such comments.

Antonio or Dunta, take your pick and lay down your bets.

GP
10-15-2009, 12:57 AM
I'd be OK with Okoye getting cut anytime this season. Preferably this week.

Sometimes you have to have a sacrificial lamb to make a point. The guy is subpar. Yeah, yeah...I know: "Then he'll go somewhere and play really well."

Bullcrap.

The guy isn't fit for the role in the NFL.

And I think the comments are zeroed in on OKOYE specifically.

m5kwatts
10-15-2009, 01:00 AM
I'd be OK with Okoye getting cut anytime this season. Preferably this week.

Sometimes you have to have a sacrificial lamb to make a point. The guy is subpar. Yeah, yeah...I know: "Then he'll go somewhere and play really well."

Bullcrap.

The guy isn't fit for the role in the NFL.

And I think the comments are zeroed in on OKOYE specifically.

WTF? He's been our best interior pass rush this season and is on a hot streak right now. What games have you been watching? Only difference between him and Mario this year is 1 tackle and 0.5 sack.

JCTexan
10-15-2009, 01:13 AM
Did any of you guys catch him tonight? He said that an anonymous player told him after the game that "too many first round players on the D-line are apathetic", and that is why the play of the D swings wildly from good to bad. Not verbatim, but you get the point. Don't shoot the messenger. :wild:

Since Houston only has two first round players on the D-line, does that mean somebody is calling out Mario? If that's the case it has to be Ryans. He's the only player besides Mario to have earned the right to call Mario out. Besides those two has anybody else on the defense made the pro-bowl or earned the right to call Mario out?

Carr Bombed
10-15-2009, 01:34 AM
I'd be OK with Okoye getting cut anytime this season. Preferably this week.

Sometimes you have to have a sacrificial lamb to make a point. The guy is subpar. Yeah, yeah...I know: "Then he'll go somewhere and play really well."

Bullcrap.

The guy isn't fit for the role in the NFL.

Normally this is where I'd come in and bag on Amobi......but I just can't do it. The guy is improving under Kollar and I don't think he's the problem. (which is something I never thought I'd be saying this season)..we've played well against the run the past few weeks (so his weakness hasn't hurt us there) and we struggled to get to Warner (which he was in on one of the few times we did get to him). He seems to be getter better ever week this season.

Check this out, I just took a look at his stats/production that he's put up so far this year..

http://www.nfl.com/players/amobiokoye/profile?id=OKO541722

Through 5 games, the guy has pretty much all ready matched the entire production totals he put up all of last season (which is crazy and makes me ask....what the hell was he doing last season? Maybe he just couldn't play in that system). I think if Amobi keeps his nose to the ground and keeps making solid improvement like he has been doing this season under Kollar, he might turn out to be a pretty good DT after all...the guy is still only 22 years old and this new defensive philosophy seems to fit him well. (however we still need to find a big DT to put next to him).

The main problem with the Dline is the same problem we've had since Mario got here..........WE DON'T HAVE A PASS RUSHER OPPOSITE MARIO. We keep signing undersized DTs to be our DE threat opposite Mario....we NEED a guy like Robert Mathis who can actually get to the QB, that and we need a big run stuffing DT to put next to Amobi. Cutting Amobi will not make us better upfront, believe it or not....it'd make us worse. The guy could be on the brink of a breakout season this year.


However the finger pointing that Bob talked about above still can't be tolerated and it screams of a player who didn't want to be here to begin with.......otherwise known as Dunta Robinson. They should've moved his overrated ass before the season started. HE'S the one who needs to look in the mirror, because he's not nearly as good as he thinks he is. (and he **** himself out of millions of dollars, because NOBODY is going to offer him a contract like the one he reportedly turned down, the guy is nothing more than a #2 corner). I'm so glad he turned down what ever contract Rick offered him, because that would've just been a bad contract that we would had to be stuck with. He'll be gone next season and all I've got to say is good riddance....don't let the door hit your punk ass shoes on your way out.

Hookem Horns
10-15-2009, 01:44 AM
This is why college football is a better product than pro football in my opinion. Too many pro players are just collecting a paycheck and lack a real passion for the game.

In college football too many big time schools are collecting huge paychecks from bowls and lack enough passion for the game to create a legitimate playoff system.

As long as college football is determining it's champion by votes in a beauty contest and not on the field it will never be as good of a product as the NFL IMO.

JCTexan
10-15-2009, 01:51 AM
However the finger pointing that Bob talked about above still can't be tolerated and it screams of a player who didn't want to be here to begin with.......otherwise known as Dunta Robinson.

I agree 100%. Finger pointing can't be tolerated. Robinson, IMO, hasn't earned the right to finger point at Amobi, much less Mario. Neither has anybody else on the defense really, which has me shocked that somebody is calling out MW.

Goatcheese
10-15-2009, 02:04 AM
While we're on the subject of finger pointing, who do you pin the blame on for the defensive struggles so far?

QBP = pressure
Stops = the cumulative number of solo defensive tackles made which constitute an offensive failure(includes sacks)

DE

Mario Williams 2 sacks, 12 QBP, 14 stops
Antonio Smith 12 QBP, 6 Stops
Tim Bulman 1 QBP, 3 stop
Connor Barwin 3 QBP, 2 stops

DT

Amobi Okoye 1.5 sacks, 8 QBP, 11 stops
Jeff Zgonina 2 QBP, 7 stops
Deljuan Robinson 1 QBP, 2 stops
Frank Okam ....
Shaun Cody 1 stop in 4 starts...

LB
Democo Ryans 3 QBP, 16 stops
Brian Cushing 1 sack, 4 QBP, 15 stops
Zach Diles 1 QBP, 11 stops

FS
Eugene Wilson 1 Stop, Thrown at 5 times, 1 reception, 1 INT

SS
Disasters

Corners covered in another thread.

So far I would cross Williams, Ryans, Cushing, Diles, Okoye, Wilson, Smith, and Reeves off my **** list.

Malloy
10-15-2009, 02:18 AM
Do we even know that the finger pointer is on the defense? or still on the team?

TJ?

Carr Bombed
10-15-2009, 02:28 AM
Do we even know that the finger pointer is on the defense? or still on the team?

TJ?

It all makes sense now... TJ pointed the finger, but since he had 3 fingers pointing back at his 300+ pounds of suckiness he got shipped out. :)


Seriously though, I think it's Dunta. That guy has never been afraid to bump his gums. Plus with how bad the offense has played in stretches the last couple of weeks, I don't think ANYBODY could talk bad about a player on the other side of the ball. Andre is the only guy who could have that right and we all know he wouldn't throw a teammate under the bus....even after David Carr left town and people in the media set him up for clean shots at his old QB...he still wouldn't take them, instead took the high road.

nunusguy
10-15-2009, 07:32 AM
I saw and heard Allens story (I usually watch 13), and I'd bet the "anonymous source" is Robinson, but of coures I dunno for sure ? As somebody mentioned earlier in the thread, he's got a history of calling people out and he's readily accessible for the local media and apperars often in interviews.
Even though Smith isn't a top pick, he's a top FA pick-up and most would agree he's the one of the starters who's most underperforming this year. Okoye has been a disappointment over his career, but not so much this year as he's stepped it up and Mario is usually given good marks for his efforts.

gtexan02
10-15-2009, 07:45 AM
No way it could be Robinson. The guy wasn't there all of training camp and then he goes out and says people lack passion? If it is, I'd be happy to cut him tomorrow

Thorn
10-15-2009, 07:46 AM
Just what the Texans need, internal strife. LOL

BigBull17
10-15-2009, 07:58 AM
While we're on the subject of finger pointing, who do you pin the blame on for the defensive struggles so far?

QBP = pressure
Stops = the cumulative number of solo defensive tackles made which constitute an offensive failure(includes sacks)

DE

Mario Williams 2 sacks, 12 QBP, 14 stops
Antonio Smith 12 QBP, 6 Stops
Tim Bulman 1 QBP, 3 stop
Connor Barwin 3 QBP, 2 stops

DT

Amobi Okoye 1.5 sacks, 8 QBP, 11 stops
Jeff Zgonina 2 QBP, 7 stops
Deljuan Robinson 1 QBP, 2 stops
Frank Okam ....
Shaun Cody 1 stop in 4 starts...

LB
Democo Ryans 3 QBP, 16 stops
Brian Cushing 1 sack, 4 QBP, 15 stops
Zach Diles 1 QBP, 11 stops

FS
Eugene Wilson 1 Stop, Thrown at 5 times, 1 reception, 1 INT

SS
Disasters

Corners covered in another thread.

So far I would cross Williams, Ryans, Cushing, Diles, Okoye, Wilson, Smith, and Reeves off my **** list.

We don't do the two things you need to do to win. Stop the run, and pressure the QB. That puts most blame on the D line. It's almost like we run a 1-6-4. Everyone gets blown off the line, turning them into slow Linebackers. Very disappointed with the Defensive play. More disappointed in the D line play.

El Tejano
10-15-2009, 08:13 AM
While we're on the subject of finger pointing, who do you pin the blame on for the defensive struggles so far?

QBP = pressure
Stops = the cumulative number of solo defensive tackles made which constitute an offensive failure(includes sacks)

DE

Mario Williams 2 sacks, 12 QBP, 14 stops
Antonio Smith 12 QBP, 6 Stops
Tim Bulman 1 QBP, 3 stop
Connor Barwin 3 QBP, 2 stops

DT

Amobi Okoye 1.5 sacks, 8 QBP, 11 stops
Jeff Zgonina 2 QBP, 7 stops
Deljuan Robinson 1 QBP, 2 stops
Frank Okam ....
Shaun Cody 1 stop in 4 starts...

LB
Democo Ryans 3 QBP, 16 stops
Brian Cushing 1 sack, 4 QBP, 15 stops
Zach Diles 1 QBP, 11 stops

FS
Eugene Wilson 1 Stop, Thrown at 5 times, 1 reception, 1 INT

SS
Disasters

Corners covered in another thread.

So far I would cross Williams, Ryans, Cushing, Diles, Okoye, Wilson, Smith, and Reeves off my **** list.

When I see that many QB pressures coming from our DEs and OLBs, then that tells me the secondary is not making the QB hold on to the ball enough. Don't you ever notice that Mario is rounding the LT like a express train but he always arrives just one second later. That's coverage man. We need better coverage.

HoustonFrog
10-15-2009, 08:14 AM
I thought finger pointing wasn't supposed to take place on "good guy" teams. (rolling eyes)

Anyways, my money is on Antonio Smith who talked. Screamed down a coach. Talks alot of junk. Plays next to these guys. As for the D-line, Tennessee has shown me a very valuable lesson this year. Without that interior push your DEs and to some extent secondary have to do a little extra and that hasn't happened there and it never really has happened here.

Mr. White
10-15-2009, 08:23 AM
FYI

they're talking about this on 1560 right now.

Wonder who sent the email? :stirpot:

Mr. White
10-15-2009, 08:40 AM
They tried to get Bob Allen on the air, but he was getting on a plane.

Not sure that it really matters, though. Doesn't matter who talked. Good organizations keep everybody on the same page.

The point of the story to me is poor leadership, like Vinny said. This kind of **** doesn't happen on a Belichick or Tomlin team.

El Tejano
10-15-2009, 08:45 AM
The point of the story to me is poor leadership, like Vinny said. This kind of **** doesn't happen on a Belichick or Tomlin team.

They haven't had the losing seasons that we've had.

TimeKiller
10-15-2009, 08:45 AM
Is Dunta talking about himself?

His play is erratic at best. Sure, he CAN make a superstar play....about once a game. The rest of the time he looks like a #2 guy. Enjoy the paychecks you get now Dunta, you won't be seeing anything of that sort ever again.

mussop
10-15-2009, 09:19 AM
Man you know the expectation level here has really dropped when you start hearing hearing people say anyone on our DL has been playing good. Even Mario needs to play better.

Texans 2-3
total defense # 23
passing defense # 16
rushing defense # 26
Combined opponent W L record ( 8 - 16)
given up 120 points or 24 ppg # 24

NY JETS 3-2
# 24 total offense
# 26 passing
# 7 rushing
scored 24
avg 20.2

Tennessee 0-5
# 17 total offense
# 21 passing
# 8 rushing
scored 31
avg 16.8

Jacksonville 2-3
# 20 total offense
# 18 passing
# 13 rushing
scored 31
avg 19.4

Oakland 1-4
# 32 total offense
# 32 passing
# 28 rushing
scored 6
avg 9.8

Arizona 2-2
# 16 total offense
# 3 passing
# 31 rushing
scored 28
avg 21.2

:thinking:

The best offense we have played is ranked 16th and we are giving up 20 ppg.

The only team we have held below their average was the Raiders.
Got to go, more later.

Blake
10-15-2009, 09:36 AM
Did any of you guys catch him tonight? He said that an anonymous player told him after the game that "too many first round players on the D-line are apathetic", and that is why the play of the D swings wildly from good to bad. Not verbatim, but you get the point. Don't shoot the messenger. :wild:

So I am assuming it is a veteran on the defense.

Dunta Robinson
Eugene Wilson
Nick Ferguson
DeMeco Ryans

Outside shot: Eric Winston

hookinreds
10-15-2009, 09:46 AM
This kind of **** doesn't happen on a Belichick or Tomlin team.

Either do losing seasons, coincidence? I think not!

Mr. White
10-15-2009, 09:59 AM
Either do losing seasons, coincidence? I think not!

There's also a case to be made that they win because they have great leadership.

Maybe we have so many losing seasons because we haven't had good leadership.

Belichick and Tomlin are extreme examples. There's plenty of losing coaches that are effective enough to keep their dirty laundry in-house.

HTown2ATX
10-15-2009, 10:24 AM
And why I dislike college ball is it is a few guys with the talent to go on to the NFL dominating lessor athletes without really having to study the game. I can give examples - there is one up in possum holler.


Agreed. And to add to that, until college ball gets a playoff system in it's a joke in the end IMHO. If you are going to keep out teams that are not "BIG" schools from a championship despite a better record, you need to have either:

A) Playoffs
B) Eliminate the 90+ "Smaller" schools from D1 and let the "Big" schools play each other every week. No more cream puff games against "Saint Mary and the Blind University" and crap like that.

And yes, it is possible to have a playoff system just like NCAA Basketball as far as travel, etc...

The NCAA is just as bad when it comes to money. That's why they will never put in a playoff and disrupt their BCS cash cow and why they keep the small schools around to get smacked but then at least give them some $$ from being on TV. And you are wrong if you think these players don't get some under the table money. Check out some of the players at a university who come from poor families in the "hood", have no job while they play college ball, yet sport all their platinum "bling" while still in school. I'm not even saying I have some big issue with that, but I get tired of the money aspect when comparing NCAA to NFL ball.

Double Barrel
10-15-2009, 11:16 AM
This is the kind of crap that you hear from teams on the verge of meltdown, not on the verge of greatness. And it shows me what kind of mediocre .500 team this is right there, and which side of average this team will most likely end up at the end of the season.

This is just sucktastic all the way around. Now that it's on the news via Bob Allen, and the source remains anonymous, the players can start wondering who it is and who they were talking about. Trust has been broken, locker room guts spilled to the public, and somebody just started marching Kubiak & Co. to the guillotine room.

TheRealJoker
10-15-2009, 11:18 AM
There's enough blame to go around on defense. Nobody has been playing well enough where they are absolved of all blame. As for the 1st rounders:

Mario: He's been getting good pressure and is still a force against the run. BUT he's only gotten 2 sacks. For one of the premier players at his position he needs to start making more game changing plays if we want to start getting some wins. I'm sure a sack/forced fumble against Jax/AZ would've helped us get some wins that we didn't. For a normal player he's playing good, but for a franchise player he's not doing good enough. You see AJ out there putting the team on his shoulders running over multiple DBs to get in the endzone. We need to start seeing that same "one man wrecking crew" level of play from Mario this season if we want to make the playoffs.

Amobi: He's improving but still not playing like a top 10 pick. We need him to collapse the pocket consistently and make QBs unable to step up into the pocket to avoid the edge rush and deliver accurate throws.

Yankee_In_TX
10-15-2009, 11:22 AM
Good organizations keep everybody on the same page.

The point of the story to me is poor leadership, like Vinny said. This kind of **** doesn't happen on a Belichick or Tomlin team.

I bet it would if the Steelers or Pats went 7 years without a winning season.

TheRealJoker
10-15-2009, 11:22 AM
I bet it would if the Steelers or Pats went 7 years without a winning season.

If that were to happen, there would be new leadership in place.

Jackie Chiles
10-15-2009, 11:51 AM
Now that it's on the news via Bob Allen, and the source remains anonymous, the players can start wondering who it is and who they were talking about. Trust has been broken, locker room guts spilled to the public, and somebody just started marching Kubiak & Co. to the guillotine room.

So maybe something positive can come from this after all?

GP
10-15-2009, 11:58 AM
LOL. This isn't the beginning of the end for anybody but Okoye.

This is about the Nigerian Daydream, and nobody else.

But everyone already knows it, so it's no big deal. This is just letting fans know that the players know Okoye is not hacking it.

Maddict5
10-15-2009, 11:59 AM
This is just sucktastic all the way around. Now that it's on the news via Bob Allen, and the source remains anonymous, the players can start wondering who it is and who they were talking about. Trust has been broken, locker room guts spilled to the public, and somebody just started marching Kubiak & Co. to the guillotine room.

...or it could light a fire under said apathetic players. everybody on the texans D always talks about accountability so now that they're being held to it publicly, we'll see how they react

fwiw, ive read sports autobiographies where these sort of media comments of thing has sparked clear-the-air meetings among teams that arent performing fully, which in turn has lead to bigger & better things.

like i said, il wait to see the reaction before deciding whether this has been a good or bad thing

Maddict5
10-15-2009, 12:00 PM
also btw could cody be one og the players that is being talked about. he was actually a high second rounder but it could apply to him

badboy
10-15-2009, 12:06 PM
If it isn't AJ, Ryans, Cushing or Schaub no one else including Mario should say anything.

ObsiWan
10-15-2009, 12:08 PM
This is just sucktastic all the way around. Now that it's on the news via Bob Allen, and the source remains anonymous, the players can start wondering who it is and who they were talking about. Trust has been broken, locker room guts spilled to the public, and somebody just started marching Kubiak & Co. to the guillotine room.

This ain't on the coaches, this is on the team.
The reason you don't see this on the Pats or the Steelers is because there's Brady or Polomalu-types to keep that kind of crap in check - plus they're winning.
The coaches don't need to do it.
The locker room leaders do it.

So if the team implodes like this then they don't have what it takes to be winners anyway. Someone, DeMeco, Mario, hell, Eugene Wilson (he's an "old head") or one of the rookies (probably Cushing), needs to call a defensive squad meeting and get to the bottom of this. If someone on the defense has a beef with a teammate's output (or lack of) then he ought to be man enough to step up to said teammate and "encourage" him to step it up.

Personally, I find it rather chicken-sh!+ to use the press to call someone out who you see in practice every damned day.

silvrhand
10-15-2009, 12:16 PM
I'd be OK with Okoye getting cut anytime this season. Preferably this week.

Sometimes you have to have a sacrificial lamb to make a point. The guy is subpar. Yeah, yeah...I know: "Then he'll go somewhere and play really well."

Bullcrap.

The guy isn't fit for the role in the NFL.

And I think the comments are zeroed in on OKOYE specifically.

He has started to improve, don't get me wrong he was getting shoved all over the place earlier but looks like he's waking up FINALLY.

NitroGSXR
10-15-2009, 12:45 PM
LOL. This isn't the beginning of the end for anybody but Okoye.

This is about the Nigerian Daydream, and nobody else.

But everyone already knows it, so it's no big deal. This is just letting fans know that the players know Okoye is not hacking it.

I'm probably in agreement here with you but I picked up the newspaper today and there was an article about Okoye. He's been getting a lot of praise. A lot. I think McClain wrote it so take that for what its worth. Considering that, I think he's done very well these last few games. He's causing a ruckus among offensive lines right now.

I don't know who started this rumor but I hope it gets out there! This team is SOFT and I expect players to get ticked off here. Play some football! The Houston Texans are Pillsbury doughboy S-O-F-T! I'm ready to sign a criminal. An especially violent criminal. Maybe in addition to a samurai warrior? I'd enjoy seeing opponents get karate chopped in the nether regions. I'm ready to see somebody get punched in the mouth. How many of you all enjoyed the Andre Johnson/Courtland ruckus? DON'T LIE! It's okay. I know I did.

Personally? My eyes are on Connor Barwin here. I know he's not a first rounder but he's pretty high up (2nd plus a lot of money). He's done nothing this year outside of his deflected passes. So much hope and so much promise during preseason but he's been a complete dud since. He's fast but he keeps getting pushed in a different direction. He needs to learn to take shorter routes to the QB and you do that by getting bulk so you can push the blocker back. Okoye's had some decent production this season, Barwin has not.

Double Barrel
10-15-2009, 12:58 PM
LOL. This isn't the beginning of the end for anybody but Okoye.

This is about the Nigerian Daydream, and nobody else.

But everyone already knows it, so it's no big deal. This is just letting fans know that the players know Okoye is not hacking it.

Perhaps you're right...but who used a first round pick on this project player? :hmmm:

...or it could light a fire under said apathetic players. everybody on the texans D always talks about accountability so now that they're being held to it publicly, we'll see how they react

fwiw, ive read sports autobiographies where these sort of media comments of thing has sparked clear-the-air meetings among teams that arent performing fully, which in turn has lead to bigger & better things.

like i said, il wait to see the reaction before deciding whether this has been a good or bad thing

yeah, we won't know until we've got hindsight if this is a sign of bad things or a turning point that lit a fire in our defense.

However, based upon the history of this franchise, we have yet to see any spark that ignites the blaze of a winning season. Stuff like this is usually indicative of internal strife and foundational problems of a losing franchise.

You speak of accountability, yet this comes from an ANONYMOUS source within the locker room. That is a paradox in and of itself.

This ain't on the coaches, this is on the team.
The reason you don't see this on the Pats or the Steelers is because there's Brady or Polomalu-types to keep that kind of crap in check - plus they're winning.
The coaches don't need to do it.
The locker room leaders do it.

So if the team implodes like this then they don't have what it takes to be winners anyway. Someone, DeMeco, Mario, hell, Eugene Wilson (he's an "old head") or one of the rookies (probably Cushing), needs to call a defensive squad meeting and get to the bottom of this. If someone on the defense has a beef with a teammate's output (or lack of) then he ought to be man enough to step up to said teammate and "encourage" him to step it up.

Personally, I find it rather chicken-sh!+ to use the press to call someone out who you see in practice every damned day.

Straight up! Good post, man, and we are in complete agreement. I do not find this inspirational when it comes from an unknown player and it involved an ambiguous finger point to throw someone under the bus.

Strong teams can overcome this kind of adversity, but the Texans are not one of those teams at this point in time. It remains to be seen if this will galvanize them into a unit of steel or melt them like marshmallows over a roasting fire.

dtran04
10-15-2009, 01:14 PM
Dunta normally goes through Jerome Solomon so it might not be him that is throwing guys under the bus. It could even be an offensive player so who knows.

I did notice that Mario didn't start the second half last game (could be wrong though). I beleive Bulman was in for him. It could have been because of his injury but who knows.

BuffaloglennTX
10-15-2009, 01:37 PM
In college football too many big time schools are collecting huge paychecks from bowls and lack enough passion for the game to create a legitimate playoff system.

As long as college football is determining it's champion by votes in a beauty contest and not on the field it will never be as good of a product as the NFL IMO.


Agreed X 1000. College football is fun at times, and the atmosphere can be good for some of the big games, but, in the end, it is a beauty contest determined by biased voters. All the money flows to the big schools, there is no draft and realistically no opportunity for smaller schools to make any real splash.

Carr Bombed
10-15-2009, 01:38 PM
Man you know the expectation level here has really dropped when you start hearing hearing people say anyone on our DL has been playing good. Even Mario needs to play better.

Umm....individual players have been playing well.

:rolleyes: You can have decent individual play and still suck ass as a team defense. The problem is, they aren't playing well as a team.

Marcus
10-15-2009, 02:19 PM
Personally? My eyes are on Connor Barwin here. I know he's not a first rounder but he's pretty high up (2nd plus a lot of money). He's done nothing this year outside of his deflected passes. So much hope and so much promise during preseason but he's been a complete dud since. He's fast but he keeps getting pushed in a different direction. He needs to learn to take shorter routes to the QB and you do that by getting bulk so you can push the blocker back. Okoye's had some decent production this season, Barwin has not.

He's a ROOKIE. Mario didn't do much either his rookie season. As a matter of fact, there was a number of kneejerks here who called him a bust. And he was the first pick in the entire draft.

I'd look back on that, and reconsider if you want to pass premature judgement on Connor Barwin.

NitroGSXR
10-15-2009, 02:24 PM
He's a ROOKIE. Mario didn't do much either his rookie season. As a matter of fact, there was a number of kneejerks here who called him a bust. And he was the first pick in the entire draft.

I'd look back on that, and reconsider if you want to pass premature judgement on Connor Barwin.

I'm not calling ANYONE a bust. I'm referring to who the source may be pointing to. We have Mario and Okoye who were first rounders. Barwin isn't too far off from that level. He was taken in the second.

Barwin was whiffed thus far but just because I state that doesn't mean I'm giving up on him! I think he's going to be a superstar once he gets his wheels in motion.

:fans:

Mr. White
10-15-2009, 02:24 PM
FWIW, here's Antonio Smith talking to Bob Allen (http://abclocal.go.com/ktrk/video?id=7061093) after the game about the inconsistency of the D.

Pretty good chance they were talking off the record before the interview.

BTW, I'll always have the utmost respect for Bob Allen. I'll never forget him calling for Ladd Herzeg to step down on the 6:00 news when I was a kid.

michaelm
10-15-2009, 02:40 PM
This is the kind of crap that you hear from teams on the verge of meltdown, not on the verge of greatness. And it shows me what kind of mediocre .500 team this is right there, and which side of average this team will most likely end up at the end of the season.

This is just sucktastic all the way around. Now that it's on the news via Bob Allen, and the source remains anonymous, the players can start wondering who it is and who they were talking about. Trust has been broken, locker room guts spilled to the public, and somebody just started marching Kubiak & Co. to the guillotine room.

You're wrong on one count DB.
The guillotine isn't in a room. It's outside in the town square. The mob demands blood.

badboy
10-15-2009, 03:11 PM
He's a ROOKIE. Mario didn't do much either his rookie season. As a matter of fact, there was a number of kneejerks here who called him a bust. And he was the first pick in the entire draft.

I'd look back on that, and reconsider if you want to pass premature judgement on Connor Barwin.Yeah, I call for no premature ejac er judgement on any player or near them for that matter!

mussop
10-15-2009, 08:02 PM
Umm....individual players have been playing well.

:rolleyes: You can have decent individual play and still suck ass as a team defense. The problem is, they aren't playing well as a team.

:rolleyes: If you say so.

GP
10-15-2009, 09:41 PM
:rolleyes: If you say so.

I just realized your screen name (mussop) is possum spelled backward.

Are you cixelsyd?

jppaul
10-16-2009, 01:29 AM
It occurs to me that apathetic is a big word, so in looking at who used the word properly in an interview, you would probably look at the education of each defensive player, assuming of course it is a defensive player. Look past the fact that they went to a school but the additional information that you have learned. Okoye graduated early with a good GPA in a respectable major, Okam dreams of law school, both sound possible, and of course there is always the prospect of a veteran who has been around a while and Zgnonia would fill that bill.

Just a thought

jppaul
10-16-2009, 01:31 AM
I just realized your screen name (mussop) is possum spelled backward.

Are you cixelsyd?

or might he be gniyalp it?

Carr Bombed
10-16-2009, 01:34 AM
Not every football player is dumb as rocks...(there's probably quite a few players that know what the word means)

ObsiWan
10-16-2009, 02:51 AM
never mind

beerlover
10-16-2009, 03:11 AM
"too many first round players on the D-line are apathetic" wow :turtle:

utahmark
10-16-2009, 08:59 AM
ok guys, he said first round player on the d-line. he also said to many which means more than one. we only have two, so i'm guessing whoever was talking is refering to ................ mario and amobi. just a hunch:pop:

Texans_Chick
10-16-2009, 09:18 AM
FWIW, here's Antonio Smith talking to Bob Allen (http://abclocal.go.com/ktrk/video?id=7061093) after the game about the inconsistency of the D.

Pretty good chance they were talking off the record before the interview.

BTW, I'll always have the utmost respect for Bob Allen. I'll never forget him calling for Ladd Herzeg to step down on the 6:00 news when I was a kid.

Hard to say. In a blog post, he wrote this in the preseason about Smith:

http://sportsblog.abc13.com/2009/09/a-few-texans-changes.html

Sept 20:

Gary Kubiak may not admit it but he's taken away much of the play calling from Kyle Shanahan. Antonio Smith the 35 million dollar free agent is no longer starting. Tim Bulman starts in his place. Ever since his run in with D line coach Bill Kollar he's been pouting and not giving much effort. Andre Davis is out and Jacoby Jones starts for him.

This is a recent blog post from Tim Melton (http://sportsblog.abc13.com/2009/10/lack-of-attitude.html):

LACK OF ATTITUDE

Or should I say, poor attitude. Talking about the Texans. Each week I have walked into the locker room and heard them talk about a lack of consistency. Well the bottom line is this. Consistency is attitude or the appraoch to your job. If you pay attention, study your playbook, focus and care, your performance will be consistent. Obviously some Texans have not done that. A leader on the team told me that he and others have jumped on their teammates everytime the performance has begun to head south. Some, he says, respond quickly. Others take longer. The result is a 2-3 record and another .500 team. Gary Kubiak has to see the same thing and he and his staff need to take control. Unfortunately, I have been told that some of the most inconsistent are also the most talented.

Personally, I think it is chicken sheet to do blind items without naming names. If teammates are calling out Mario etc, they should just say it.

Nobody on this team knows how to be a leader because they are just all babies themselves. Babies leading babies. Don't have a single 30+ year old starter.

Being a leader means keeping it in house and not running to Tim Melton or Bob Allen to prove how much of a leader you are.

We don't hear this story if they win.

Double Barrel
10-16-2009, 09:38 AM
I'm starting to think that if this year's team actually achieves a winning record at the end of the season it will be the case of a blind squirrel finally finding a nut.

We don't seem to have the leadership to push these players and make them fish or cut bait.

Honoring Earl 34
10-16-2009, 09:51 AM
Hard to say. In a blog post, he wrote this in the preseason about Smith:

http://sportsblog.abc13.com/2009/09/a-few-texans-changes.html

Sept 20:


This is a recent blog post from Tim Melton (http://sportsblog.abc13.com/2009/10/lack-of-attitude.html):



Personally, I think it is chicken sheet to do blind items without naming names. If teammates are calling out Mario etc, they should just say it.

Nobody on this team knows how to be a leader because they are just all babies themselves. Babies leading babies. Don't have a single 30+ year old starter.

Being a leader means keeping it in house and not running to Tim Melton or Bob Allen to prove how much of a leader you are.

We don't hear this story if they win.

I see it as the expectations are still fairly low for a pro football team . Up 45 , if they don't go or win the super bowl , then the seasons a failure . The Texans are just trying to get above 500 and make the playoffs . Until they realize that every ... play , possession , quarter , half , game , is meaningful and you can't take anything for granted no matter how much talent you have ... they'll be average .

Mario is a talented guy but has been streaky . Last year he started out ranked the 6th best player in the league by Prisco because they expected him to be unstoppable like Jared Allen . He didn't get there but still made the pro bowl . I'm not sure Okoye has ever streaked more less been streaky .

The addition of Cushing has given Demeco another player who can show emotion on the front seven . They need the same guy for the front four .

Texans_Chick
10-16-2009, 10:09 AM
I'm starting to think that if this year's team actually achieves a winning record at the end of the season it will be the case of a blind squirrel finally finding a nut.

We don't seem to have the leadership to push these players and make them fish or cut bait.

They have never had truly great players to show them how it is done. I talked about this some in this blog post in May (http://blogs.chron.com/texanschick/2009/05/houston_texans_defense_and_boo.html). In that post, I talk some about Strahan and how he grew up through the Giants system and had great old guys tell him how it was going to be. And then he served that role as a vet.

Ray Lewis is a great leader but he has been on that Ravens team longer than the NFL contemplated giving Houston a team.

Hard to get great leaders on your team when they are still great with the way the salary cap structure works in this league. We can look at the 5-0 Broncos and say that Brian Dawkins has made a big difference, though I would suggest that if the Texans would have signed 36 yo Dawkins to that contract (http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=3942161) people would flip out and he would probably get a knee bone bruise and never play a regular season day.

The Texans can't say they have any real team leaders. Dunta Robinson hasn't won squat and showed up to work not ready to go. DeMeco Ryans has been in the league only since 2006. Matt Schaub doesn't have two seasons of game starts yet, though the local media couldn't write enough stories about what a leader he was prior to his first season. Andre Johnson is a bad ass deluxe but he is more of a EF Hutton sorta leader.

The Texans have drafted a ton of guys who were leaders on their college teams, but it is extremely difficult to be a good leader early in your career when you are still learning and goofing up your own self and needing guidance. It is just the nature of leadership

The Cowboys have issues of leadership as well, but their issues relate more to Jerrah Jones being the face of the franchise.

badboy
10-16-2009, 10:12 AM
Hard to say. In a blog post, he wrote this in the preseason about Smith:

http://sportsblog.abc13.com/2009/09/a-few-texans-changes.html

Sept 20:


This is a recent blog post from Tim Melton (http://sportsblog.abc13.com/2009/10/lack-of-attitude.html):



Personally, I think it is chicken sheet to do blind items without naming names. If teammates are calling out Mario etc, they should just say it.

Nobody on this team knows how to be a leader because they are just all babies themselves. Babies leading babies. Don't have a single 30+ year old starter.
Being a leader means keeping it in house and not running to Tim Melton or Bob Allen to prove how much of a leader you are.

We don't hear this story if they win.I keep telling them to follow me but they don't. signed Turk.

Mr. White
10-16-2009, 10:17 AM
Looks like some clarification is starting to come in. From LZ's blog (http://blogs.chron.com/fantasyfootball/2009/10/texans_prediction_i_think_they.html) yesterday....

I heard about it, but I didn't catch it live. Bob Allen told us that the quote was that they have 1st rounders "up front" rather than defensive line. Those three players would be Mario, Amobi and D. Brown. I'm pretty sure Mario ain't one of them so that leaves....

HoustonFrog
10-16-2009, 10:20 AM
They have never had truly great players to show them how it is done. I talked about this some in this blog post in May (http://blogs.chron.com/texanschick/2009/05/houston_texans_defense_and_boo.html). In that post, I talk some about Strahan and how he grew up through the Giants system and had great old guys tell him how it was going to be. And then he served that role as a vet.

Ray Lewis is a great leader but he has been on that Ravens team longer than the NFL contemplated giving Houston a team.

Hard to get great leaders on your team when they are still great with the way the salary cap structure works in this league. We can look at the 5-0 Broncos and say that Brian Dawkins has made a big difference, though I would suggest that if the Texans would have signed 36 yo Dawkins to that contract (http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=3942161) people would flip out and he would probably get a knee bone bruise and never play a regular season day.

The Texans can't say they have any real team leaders. Dunta Robinson hasn't won squat and showed up to work not ready to go. DeMeco Ryans has been in the league only since 2006. Matt Schaub doesn't have two seasons of game starts yet, though the local media couldn't write enough stories about what a leader he was prior to his first season. Andre Johnson is a bad ass deluxe but he is more of a EF Hutton sorta leader.

The Texans have drafted a ton of guys who were leaders on their college teams, but it is extremely difficult to be a good leader early in your career when you are still learning and goofing up your own self and needing guidance. It is just the nature of leadership

The Cowboys have issues of leadership as well, but their issues relate more to Jerrah Jones being the face of the franchise.

I like that Brooking was brought in at LB though. He has turned into a very vocal leader. Something they have lacked on D. They still have a long way to go but I like vets like that on a team.

Texans_Chick
10-16-2009, 10:24 AM
I keep telling them to follow me but they don't. signed Turk.

Sorry, offensive or defensive starter. :texflag:

Texans_Chick
10-16-2009, 10:28 AM
It occurs to me that apathetic is a big word, so in looking at who used the word properly in an interview, you would probably look at the education of each defensive player, assuming of course it is a defensive player. Look past the fact that they went to a school but the additional information that you have learned. Okoye graduated early with a good GPA in a respectable major, Okam dreams of law school, both sound possible, and of course there is always the prospect of a veteran who has been around a while and Zgnonia would fill that bill.

Just a thought


Zgonina wouldn't surprise me. When I was at camp, I overheard an interview he was giving. If only you could give that guy's heart and intensity to the younger players.

He talked about how there wasn't any cell phones around when he first came into the league.

One of the topics he talked about was young players not knowing how well they have it, and not knowing how to prepare. That some players are very much interested in the subject, but some not so much. That there is so much money in the game these days.

El Tejano
10-16-2009, 10:39 AM
I keep telling them to follow me but they don't. signed Turk.

Hilarious!!!!!:lol:

silvrhand
10-16-2009, 10:45 AM
I keep telling them to follow me but they don't. signed Turk.

If our punter is the team leader I'm not feeling so hot..

silvrhand
10-16-2009, 10:49 AM
The Texans can't say they have any real team leaders. Dunta Robinson hasn't won squat and showed up to work not ready to go. DeMeco Ryans has been in the league only since 2006. Matt Schaub doesn't have two seasons of game starts yet, though the local media couldn't write enough stories about what a leader he was prior to his first season. Andre Johnson is a bad ass deluxe but he is more of a EF Hutton sorta leader.



I couldn't agree 100% more, we have no real leaders on this team, the closest we have is DeMeco. During one of the games, during a commercial timeout they had interviews from the players about what they expected out of the season, only a single player IMHO had a valid answer:

DeMeco - Superbowl and nothing less.

Winners strive for perfection not "have a winning season" until that changes on this team, we'll never be anything but mediocre. We need a Ray Lewis type leader in the same way..

jppaul
10-16-2009, 11:17 AM
Zgonina wouldn't surprise me. When I was at camp, I overheard an interview he was giving. If only you could give that guy's heart and intensity to the younger players.

He talked about how there wasn't any cell phones around when he first came into the league.

One of the topics he talked about was young players not knowing how well they have it, and not knowing how to prepare. That some players are very much interested in the subject, but some not so much. That there is so much money in the game these days.

After hearing that he certainly seems the most likely

Goldensilence
10-16-2009, 11:52 AM
He's a ROOKIE. Mario didn't do much either his rookie season. As a matter of fact, there was a number of kneejerks here who called him a bust. And he was the first pick in the entire draft.

I'd look back on that, and reconsider if you want to pass premature judgement on Connor Barwin.

Nice hyperbole. Mario still got 5 sacks on a one foot. What Barwin shown? Maybe down the stretch he'll match Mario's rookie number, based on what I've seen so far I'm not counting on it. At all.

I'm not calling him a bust, but the pick in itself is a whiff. We could've used the pick on a starter instead, we're set to wait for Barwin's game to evolve to the point that he looks like he was worth a second round pick.

If you're cool with that fine, but I'm not. Don't bust my chops because you're ok with moving at glacial speed.

infantrycak
10-16-2009, 12:03 PM
I'm not calling him a bust, but the pick in itself is a whiff. We could've used the pick on a starter instead, we're set to wait for Barwin's game to evolve to the point that he looks like he was worth a second round pick.

Who are the top 3 guys who were available and you wanted instead?

gtexan02
10-16-2009, 12:28 PM
I wanted William Moore or Saun Smith

JB
10-16-2009, 12:31 PM
Or McBath, Unger, or McCoy

Wolf6151
10-16-2009, 12:33 PM
Who are the top 3 guys who were available and you wanted instead?

I'll give you 2, Andy Levitre and Max Unger both are starting OG's for their respective teams as a rookie. There was lots of starter level talent available when we took Barwin. I'd rather have a starting OG taking 100% of the offensive snaps than a project player taking 10-15% of the defensive snaps who we have to wait 3 yrs. for him to turn into the player worthy of a second round pick. Project players in the 2nd round when everyone else are picking starters is just stupid.

Honoring Earl 34
10-16-2009, 12:41 PM
Who are the top 3 guys who were available and you wanted instead?

The problem with the Texans is right when they think a position is a strength ... it plummets .

mussop
10-16-2009, 12:44 PM
Who are the top 3 guys who were available and you wanted instead?

My take!

Max Unger (starting), Andy Levitre (starting), LeSean McCoy (looking good).

I was and still am not satified with our OL. I didnt agree with taking Cushing over Oher but understood. I dont understand taking Barwin over Mack or Levitre. Especially after we just signed A Smith.

Goldensilence
10-16-2009, 12:46 PM
Who are the top 3 guys who were available and you wanted instead?

Top 6.

Guard/Center - Max Unger

Guard - Andy Levitre

William Moore would've helped in the secondary.

CB- Sean Smith

RB Shonn Green - Man wouldn't help with the running game be nice?

Finally Micheal Johnson was a more prototypical 4-3 DE. Had some questions about taking plays off etc...but so did Mario.


Of those 6 :

Starting Andy Levitre Buffalo

Starting Max Unger Seattle

Not starting but Looks like he might be getting more looks - Shonn Greene
http://www.nj.com/jets/index.ssf/2009/10/shonn_greene_forcing_ny_jets_t.html

William Moore not starting- but could've used something much better to start the season then Dom. Barber. I think he would've started at SS possibly to start the season.

Sean Smith - Not starting, but I still think better prospect then McCain and Quinn overall.

Micheal Johnson - I'll be honest so far Johnson has the same # of tackles as Barwin, but has less passes defended and doesn't have the fumble recovery that Barwin does. Not starting. Essentially would be the same role as Barwin. Less of a project IMO.

Runner
10-16-2009, 01:00 PM
Neither this "calling out in the press" nor the "sleeping in meetings" things bother me very much. I guess I feel like it's about par for the course.

Goatcheese
10-16-2009, 01:25 PM
Top 6.

Guard/Center - Max Unger

Guard - Andy Levitre

William Moore would've helped in the secondary.

CB- Sean Smith

RB Shonn Green - Man wouldn't help with the running game be nice?

Finally Micheal Johnson was a more prototypical 4-3 DE. Had some questions about taking plays off etc...but so did Mario.


Of those 6 :

Starting Andy Levitre Buffalo

Starting Max Unger Seattle

Not starting but Looks like he might be getting more looks - Shonn Greene
http://www.nj.com/jets/index.ssf/2009/10/shonn_greene_forcing_ny_jets_t.html

William Moore not starting- but could've used something much better to start the season then Dom. Barber. I think he would've started at SS possibly to start the season.

Sean Smith - Not starting, but I still think better prospect then McCain and Quinn overall.

Micheal Johnson - I'll be honest so far Johnson has the same # of tackles as Barwin, but has less passes defended and doesn't have the fumble recovery that Barwin does. Not starting. Essentially would be the same role as Barwin. Less of a project IMO.

Sean Smith has been playing really well except for the Chargers game, where he got burned like Cortland Mcburnedagain. He's been starting and playing a lot more than Vontae Davis.

Second Honeymoon
10-16-2009, 01:47 PM
I wanted William Moore or Saun Smith

Unger or Moore would have filled blatant needs but Barwin is still intriguing and not a fail pick.

He looks a little lost out there but I wouldn't close the book on his career 5 games in.

As for this charge of players not caring and sleeping in meetings. i am not surprised and its not par for the course around the league. good coaches don't put up with that stuff and if its a motivated team they aren't gonna let each other sleep in film study or meetings.

What Cushing said really stood out to me. Is Kubiak that freaking boring that people are going to sleep. Even a guy like Cushing is having to move to the front row so he doesn't fall asleep. Its not surprising especially when you listen to Kubiak 'aww shucks, im from houston' his way through another interview or post game presser.

Silver Oak
10-16-2009, 03:51 PM
I may have stumbled on to something pretty good.

After a loss, take the week off from Texans Talk. Return on Thursday/Friday, miss all the post-loss drama, and get ready for a new game.

:fans:

Vinny
10-16-2009, 03:55 PM
William Moore not starting- but could've used something much better to start the season then Dom. Barber. I think he would've started at SS possibly to start the season.
Moore has been injured (http://www.ajc.com/sports/atlanta-falcons/falcons-moore-ready-to-158018.html), but made his debut this week.

GP
10-16-2009, 04:36 PM
The two culprits have been caught. Apparently, they also catch some R&R during halftimes and even post-game. (Link to security footage of culprits) (http://www.texanstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=65894)

Marcus
10-16-2009, 06:43 PM
Nice hyperbole. Mario still got 5 sacks on a one foot. What Barwin shown? Maybe down the stretch he'll match Mario's rookie number, based on what I've seen so far I'm not counting on it. At all.

I'm not calling him a bust, but the pick in itself is a whiff. We could've used the pick on a starter instead, we're set to wait for Barwin's game to evolve to the point that he looks like he was worth a second round pick.

If you're cool with that fine, but I'm not. Don't bust my chops because you're ok with moving at glacial speed.

I'll be sure to bust your chops at the end of the season when you're gagging on all the crow from Barwin getting his name called a lot. Count on it.

bckey
10-16-2009, 06:52 PM
I was pimpimg Alex Mack. I'm not sure how he is doing. I have to admit though I am extremely happy with Cushing. So I would sort of agree with some others that instead of Barwin we should have gone with a center like Unger. I know its hindsite but we all knew center was a big problem. Thats not to say I don't like Barwin.

eriadoc
10-16-2009, 08:40 PM
What Cushing said really stood out to me. Is Kubiak that freaking boring that people are going to sleep. Even a guy like Cushing is having to move to the front row so he doesn't fall asleep.

Did anyone say it was Kubiak's meetings? As far as I know, the HC doesn't hold as many team meetings as the position coaches and coordinators. If you heard it was specifically Kubiak's meetings that people were sleeping in, I'd be interested in reading more about that.

edo783
10-16-2009, 10:39 PM
As I understand it, they fall asleep at/on every team in the league. No real news here IMO. Yes, they get paid million, but that has almost zero effect on if they do/do not fall asleep.

GP
10-17-2009, 11:26 AM
What about throwing Barwin in there as a linebacker?

I think his skills are more suited for patrolling the middle of the field and stalking down screen passes and keeping a QB honest on QB keepers and bootlegs.

He also has the speed to cover TEs.

kcdoubleeagle
10-17-2009, 12:19 PM
I think it's great they got called out in the media......if they aren't giving 100% then they absolutely need to be called out....good move anonymous player:clap:

TheRealJoker
10-17-2009, 12:32 PM
What about throwing Barwin in there as a linebacker?

I think his skills are more suited for patrolling the middle of the field and stalking down screen passes and keeping a QB honest on QB keepers and bootlegs.

He also has the speed to cover TEs.

He was thought of as a 3-4 OLB prospect before the draft. If this season ends poorly and we could hire someone like Cowher who would bring over a 3-4 defense I think Barwin would do well for himself as one of the rush backers.

I think Mario would excel in a 3-4 as a hybrid DE/standup LBer. Dumervil is doing very good as a 3-4 OLB right now but I think Mario could do even better because he's got the size to drop down to DE and the speed to play OLB in that scheme. He'd cause even more matchup problems than he already does in a 3-4 imo.

Joe Texan
10-17-2009, 04:47 PM
This is exactly the type of **** that gets a young team screwed up and Bob is the reason. Bob Allen should have every credential the texans have given him removed. He should be fired fron channel 13 for costing them press rights .

Goldensilence
10-17-2009, 04:50 PM
I'll be sure to bust your chops at the end of the season when you're gagging on all the crow from Barwin getting his name called a lot. Count on it.

As you can see. Noted.

Guess we'll see.

Texans#1Fan
10-17-2009, 07:29 PM
Despite Mario's numbers on sacks. He has played very well. The defense did play fairly well last week in the second half. They just need to be consistent. Dunta as far as I am concerned can just leave. We don't need him he is not that good of a player and he opens his mouth too much. We need to draft a good safety this draft or go after free agency FS this year and open the money book for the good players.